Welcome to the Love, Sex, and Leadership podcast where you can discover simple tantric teachings to embody your true power, awaken your soul's wisdom, and live an inspired life as a natural, intuitive, and heart-centered leader. Let's take a breath. Ah, hm, nice to have you here with us. So welcome everyone to Love Sex and Leadership. I'm here in Bali with uh a dear friend, uh, a lover from many years ago. My, my dear friend Sofia, welcome to the show. Nice to have you here. Thank you. We're both actually here filming for another project that's happening, and, uh, I've been chatting with her for a little bit about bringing her on to the, this, uh, podcast. This first one to honor and appreciate really when I was kind of first coming into this field of tantra, you know, after many years after I'd done my master's degree, um, I met this amazing goddess that really, um, initiated me in many ways and, and opened the door into the, the world of tantra, and Feeling more deeply and yeah, just have a lot of appreciation for the uh impact you had in my life at that time. So, and I, I know I'm not the first man of that nature that you supported in that way. And that was also kind of the Uh, inspiration for reaching out. I, I know Soph had shared a post about, you know, some of the men that you've supported to step into their greatness, step into their boldness, step into their fullness, and I could, you know, recognize that inside of me. So, um, yeah, welcome, welcome. Thank you for being here. Oh my pleasure. It's been such a delight to see you blossom just like from. I remember just now I was telling you that I remember you were kind of figuring out your poetry book or what to do with your life and where to go. You had a couple of clients and you were kind of supporting them and then just from there to where you are now, like some people refer to as a tra king. I don't know about that, but all right. And like just so in demand and like having so many things going on for you. I'm so happy to see that it's just amazing transition you are in in your personal life right now. It's just stunning. Yeah, thank you, thank you. Yeah, I, I'd love to for you to just share like in your, you know, journey with love and with and with men, both working with them professionally as well as personally. Like, what's the, what's your kind of driving force that keeps you moving forward to both help and support, you know, men that are are challenged in this way. And yeah, if you want to share both on a professional context, as well as, like, where you find yourself moving in in some personal, you know, new connections and relationships and things like that. Mhm. Well, what drives me is very simple. It's love. And uh I don't, I never had the idea that I need to help someone actually or even support someone. Uh, even though I do help a lot of people, their relationships change, their relationship to themselves, to God, to, to wealth, to to success, things change. But my incentive is never to help. My incentive is always to be as close to love as I can be and to be as close to the divine as I can be. And through that become as transparent as I can be and so that grace can flow freely in ways that are often mysterious and, uh, puzzle my mind. But that's what happens. And I know that was Every breath was every year, with every deepening into my intention and to my devotion, I become more and more transparent, and that's what I see also happening with people that I work with and and with men and women, there is this That what I see happening is that there is this this. Cleansing that's going on, that there is the grip of the identity is is is lighter and lighter and lighter. And so there's more and more purity and more and more actual, um, power and this kind of power, not the type of power that we have to fight and prove and like, you know, become someone because it feels right, but just because there's this kind of permission, you step into greater permission and then You do things, but first you are that bigger space that you're always meant to be. And what I'm hearing in that is a place of really leading with love, like leading into uh Uh, embodied space of love to almost give permission. For men, which I feel like they almost forget because we live in a very cognitive world, but to to be in a place that invites more of the the the naturalness into our body, would that, would that be how you're trying to Uh, express that. But how will, like a man who's drive, driven and, and wanting to get things done and be a provider and, and do all these things, course there's love that's there, but I feel like sometimes for a lot of men, it's almost an afterthought. Like how do you invite this like softer embrace of love, and it's like, no, I got things to do. I got I got I got things to do. Yeah, but that's a woman's job to envite men there. And um I see quite miraculous things happening when women really occupy their true place of this. Whom of this yoni, of this softness that is the permission in herself. And then when a man actually opens his heart and he has done enough work to, to feel, it's not an intellectual thing that's going on there, but there's a natural, um, dance that starts to take place. Just like it is for you to completely and naturally provide for your beloved and like, you know, not she doesn't have to work, she doesn't have to do anything. It's like you're completely there, like pouring into her why you're doing that. It's not because you're like maybe it does make sense, but I feel like it's there's more like. A a surrender into that that's going on. And then even more so what I what I started to see more and more and everywhere really taking place is that when a man relaxes into this like, yeah, I just want to pour everything into this woman, he expands exponentially he's he actually becomes richer. The more he gives, the richer he becomes because. When there is this depth of safety that's created for her to blossom, when she is invited and she's celebrated in her yes and her opening and her love, and she's being constantly poured into And she just keeps blossoming and blossoming and this overflowing into him which naturally like we're designed like that when this starts to happen and there's this massive acceleration and circulation of energies starts to happen and then this wealth expands like like crazy and these are the things that are like they're not no one necessarily teaching that it's not something that is a common knowledge. I'm sure that when people hear this, there are a lot of intellectual questions, but when we just drop a little bit deeper than the mind and we relax into the in the way nature has built us. And then just try this way of being for real. We just get mesmerized how perfect it is and it's not. It's not about trying. It's not about trying to fit into this. It's not about demanding. It's not about expecting even, but more so relaxing with this natural way of the body, how the body is made beyond polarity even it's like the body. How is it for a woman to be in her body with her hormones, with her changes, with her ability to, to hold so much just in our brain, you know, we're we manage to hold so much as women and men are so good at focusing naturally hormonally. So when we just occupy the natural places and this dance occurs, but of course it requires so much deconditioning because equality, um, emancipation, proving something, fighting, you know, all these wars that we witness on this planet. And do you feel that when a man, you know, pours himself into his woman, which I celebrate, like I, I, I love the devotional essence that can come through from, you know, I feel it with myself and my beloved. I feel, you know, I felt at times when we were together. But I also feel, and I'm curious reflection that if a man doesn't know his own center and he makes his woman, his, his sun, and his moon, and his mercury and his Venus, and he's just like all there, then I, I think sometimes that's what you're saying can almost be misconstrued and and it's like, oh man just has to show up and almost like a Not an old school format, but how would you say to like allow a man to pour himself in but to still hold his center point? perfect. Because these, these things they have to be natural. They, they shouldn't be forced because when he doesn't know his center and he loses himself in a woman, I call this print stage. It's a man who is looking for himself, who is searching for himself, who is trying to understand who he is. He is, uh, following experiences. He wants experiences. He needs, um, experience in life. He's not mature enough, so he in this stage, he won't be able to do that. He can try. But there will always be the sense of like oh what am I getting back kind of thing, you know, it's like in this whole market mentality which which just shows that the state of consciousness is not correct for this kind of uh dance. He's not there yet, but it's when a man chooses to mature into his highest potential and he chooses to mature into the king. Then it's a whole other type of type of consciousness. There he cannot lose himself because he's actually rooted in himself and he understands his value and he understands the value of the woman and he understands what like the world that is way, way bigger than the two of them and how blessed we are to be a part of this grandiose creation. So it's, it's like, it's really about levels of consciousness. On one level, it makes no sense, and you can try to understand it as much as you want, but you won't. Like, I'm sorry, it's just, it's like on a certain level of this you will just not get it. But when you choose to occupy your highest potential, and maybe you're not, you're maybe work in progress, which is OK, we're all work in progress and we forever will be as long as we're in this body. Well, OK, you can be a work in progress, but you still can go to next and you can go like, OK, who am I when I am actually already that? And like, if you have the consciousness to hold your path and where you're actually going or you who you are becoming, then yeah, then you'll find a way and it will feel natural. Yeah, I, I, I like that analogy of the, the prince cause if I, you know, reflect into the time we shared, like, there was a part of me that was what I referenced as like projecting all of my own kind of feminine energy onto you and not knowing my own center. And you know, there's a story I often reference. I remember when we were in Egypt together actually. And I, it was such a shift, it's such a beautiful change in my life because there was this moment where, you know, I had poured all my love and energy and I was like. Oh, I was so broken. And it was in that moment that I felt the spirit of my, what I would say my own inner feminine kind of coming back to, to allow the maturity, to allow the maturity of the inner union, to allow like something else. And from that moment, I went on a, you know, it was at least a 3 plus year journey of deepening an inner union. Like that was my only focus was inner union. And then, you know, soon after that, I I met, you know, my, uh, partner I was with for a while. And when we came together with Raven, it was like there were two interunions uniting in the place of, of love. And it was like, ah, so I felt like there was a maturity to that. So I can really personally reflect and appreciate that. And, and I feel The, the place of the, the prince is almost what like Hollywood and thing is selling. It's like selling this unrealistic way of being. And so I'm not curious any reflections on this. My, my sense is a lot of men, they don't actually know how to show up because they're being sold all of these false pretenses of what they think they're supposed to be. Yeah. Yeah. Hm. Yeah, I think all the love songs, all the Hollywood movies, it's really rare to see any kind of sense of sobriety and all of that because. Um, we live in a society of addicts, like, really like the love addiction is pretty severe, like just this kind of trying to fill the hole that will never be filled, trying to feel it through someone else's validation, someone else's attention, someone else's love, someone else's something, and then we see all these movies where you and the songs that are just about this obsession. You're like I cannot live without you, you are my everything, you are this. Romantic, but you know, you can say these things, play with it, but usually it doesn't end well because people think take it seriously and they take it deep and and these words matter. And then when there is this abandonment of self, where it's like you feel that another person can give you something that actually only God can give you, and then the problems begin. And then the, the jealousy and then the Constant dissatisfaction and constant trying to mold the partner into someone else and trying to get something from them even though they cannot and they're like really giving you everything. This is especially, yeah, I mean that's that's very strong in women but also in men sometimes when it's like you you like you really want your partner to just change a little bit but like they're not meant to. Why do you want to change just to let them be who they are. I, I guess the question in that, and I know this is something you've journeyed with this, and I think a lot of people are challenged with as well is when you're in a relationship, like, where's the point where you know it's time to go? Like it's time to separate because I see a lot of people, you know, I see a lot of this appliances with individuals that are holding on, almost grasping for what love used to be, and there's a new form there. But it requires a certain level of letting go. What, what, what do you what do you have to share with that? Yeah, yeah, I'm sure you have that in my experience. It's time to let go is when you really can accept the other person. And you really, it means you've learned lesson. I find that there are two types of relationships. One is actually a massive blessing and not everyone will be blessed that way, but it's a life partner kind of relationship. Like really this darmic relationship that you're meant to stay together. And then there are those, uh, you know, those, those karmic relationships and, and kind of like, and not in a bad way, but like the relationships that are teaching us something that really came to heal us. And uh there will be multiple of these like I as a child I always wanted to have this one and only relationship. Yeah, and some people get that, you know, they meet their beloved early on and then they stay together and and not and they grow together and it's there's an evolution. But for me it was not meant to be. I was, I was meant to have a lot of partners and every partner is still deep in my heart, and it was really meaningful because with every man I have healed a part of myself, and every man has given me a gift that that is is is incredible. But then when we're trying to hold on and when we try to mold it into the life partner relationship, that's when we really start to hurt ourselves and we try to and we start to really cleanse ourselves also because in this holding on, there's a massive purification going on. There's nothing wrong with that, but it's just a lot of suffering. So some people want to go through the suffering even though they don't think so, they don't choose it. Consciously, but there is this yearning. It's like I need to really suffer and then you suffer through it and then, and then what, what makes you suffer is that you cannot accept what life is showing you. You cannot accept that. This partner will not change. Cannot accept that no, you, you are not meant to be relating someone with someone's potential. No like you cannot make it work. You cannot make love work. You just cannot make love work. You cannot. It either works or it doesn't work. But then if you're trying to prove to yourself that you can and you're holding with your tight little fists. Ah, so much pain. And yet the end of the relationship, what I find is when you actually can really accept that this is who I am, this is who this person is, whatever they is their story, whatever is a problem, is not a problem. It's the perfection of who they are and whatever, wherever it hurts inside of me, that's my problem, and I get to work on that. And then that's what I found in my last long term relationship. That, um, when I really accepted him, that's when it was complete. That's when love took over because the highest love wanted us to separate and when we were holding on for dear life. It was not coming from love. It was coming from. It was coming from this healing need for healing. Yeah, and I see a lot of people that uh hold on way too long and they're they're not actually Willing to, to let go, to allow what natural love wants to flow. Um, I, it's, it's a You know, it's also a a sad and liberating moment, I think when someone, and I've felt this at numerous times where someone can actually You know, look eye to eye with another and recognize, yeah, like you're saying that love is actually inviting us to to take separate paths, and it, it requires a certain maturity of the soul, certain maturity to recognize. I don't know that love is ever gonna go anywhere. Like love is always, it's an omnipotent force, it's all around us, um, and yet it's often that grasping thing that we're we're reaching for. Where, where do you feel like for yourself is your, your, your new adventures into love? What, what, what's alive in in Sofia's world and new adventures into love? What, what's the next evolution? I, I really, I, I feel really ready for a life partner. I feel I'm really ready. There is um like a we can cut this yeah. Oh Oh So So I feel that genuinely in my evolutionary journey, there is like a whole new phase that's coming. And this is unlike anything that I've experienced before. And then I feel that kind of the geometry of my life has to be quite particular for that to happen. And so I really feel that the life partner. It is coming. But this is the, the actual, like, next important step in my life. And so I've actually liberated a lot of space in my life to allow him to come to reveal himself, to be with me. And at the same time, I'm so relaxed. I'm not searching. It's like the first time in my life that I'm actually happy to be single. And, um, and there's no nervousness or anxiety in me. I just know that it's like the, the moment I become really. Open and really ready on every level for this man to fully reveal himself. That's when he will present himself. And what was the shift for you that made you not like searching and and and chasing, not chasing, but wanting love, like, what's the, what shifted in your inner or outer world that's allowed you to feel more what you're sharing, like comfort in in in being single and in in that way. Well, understanding how love addiction works. So that was a really interesting thing for me to see that. Actually, it like this kind of nervousness and kind of wanting and like this craving that. Although there is beauty to it, if we really relax to it and in the tantric approach, you know, you can really go through desire and the ultimate desire for the divine and just rest there. And that has been my practice for so many years to just really go through the desire, even my name, you know, so that is, she, it's, it's the name of a goddess who stands for, uh, the erotic desire, and this, this first. Desire of every human being, this, this beauty, the only beauty that there is, the beauty of the divine. And so through that, that, that's been such a major part of my path to just open to my yearning and through the yearning to, to meet the, the yearning that is, that, that is always answered actually in every moment that I am held that I am met by God and being made love to by the eternal beloved every single moment of my existence. And then, um, you know, it's like, it's such a deep space, and then there are layers on the way. And uh one of the layers I really had to address, which is this love addiction layer, and that gave me so much wisdom. It's incredible. I just, I, I, I never saw it and I see that, uh, my whole life, it was there, you know, there's a way of like. Even the way that I dress, the way that I would get ready to go somewhere, the way that I would go to any party to any event, there would be this kind of You know, this vigilance is like, oh, OK, like checking, am I, am I, am I attractive? Who am I attracted to? What what's gonna happen like in the conversations, like there was no relaxation. It's like, OK, you know, it's just me. It's just that's that's just the truth of the moment. But there was this kind of like, you know, like in the back of my head, there would be like a little like checking, expecting, waiting for something to happen. So, and I thought it's normal and I think most people think it's normal, but uh, yes, I think 95% of the people on the planet are very addicted and um the addiction actually doesn't matter if you're addicted to food or to drugs or to alcohol or to pornography or to gaming or to love, it's actually all the same thing. It really takes us away from truth. And so that on on my path that was a really interesting, very important place to pause and to really work on that. And of course a man helped me because he really revealed to me that I was like, whoa, I really abandoned myself to be with a person like that, like to to experience that edge with him. And then I was like, wow, I'm so grateful because that was exactly the medicine I needed to really see that face to face. And then just to really collect myself and to just fall in love with myself. I knew and just love those places and myself that I've, I've, I've still subconsciously was trying someone else to love for me. You know, like my, my alumnus, for example. I find that that's the, that's the most challenging place. For us to relax and too often because like, you know, why the search for constant romance, constant relationship because we're so scared to be alone. And that's why also doing the previous topic you brought, why people stay too long in relationships because they're so scared to be alone. Why are you so scared to do what's gonna be there? Well, you will meet yourself. That's what I've been trying to avoid. Ah yeah, to meet yourself, what does it mean? It's not all parrots and butterflies. There are some dark places, but actually when you start to hold these dark places, they're so beautiful. So meeting the, the deeper, darker places to actually Know what the the depth of love is. And I'd love to explore even more like the The, the, the definitions of love, cause I hear you saying addicted to love and, and to me, if I looked at love, like, I, I can reference like the human personality part that might be addicted to the form of love that I see it as. But I, if I look at, um, like it forces love addicts in relationship, and maybe that's the reference point you're you're there, where you were at. But Love itself, like it, it is, you know, it's just beautiful divine essence. I can't be personified or quantified in any way. So I guess like maybe a a a clarification of like how, where's the difference between that, like how could I ever be addicted? I am that which uh is everywhere and all things. So. Oh. Because you can't be addicted to that which you are. So if you are addicted to something, then it's like it's, it's, you call it love addiction, of course it's not love. Of course it's just an illusion, of course it's just this kind of hunger to get something, but it's just, yeah, it's a term which is quite limiting. But yeah, it's addiction to romance, better to say addiction to relationships or to sex. And let, let's talk a little bit more about, you know, romance and Men who are providers and the the frameworks of our, you know, relationship formats and, you know, to me it's it's a very natural place to be a provider and supporter and and and take care, you know, the partner I'm with, um, and, you know, with such a rise of the feminism and women's rights and women wanting to really stick up, sometimes it's almost like You know, like I'm often, especially, I mean, I'm not now, but before when I was dating, like always getting the check, and sometimes the woman had to like fight, like, no, I get this, and be like, no, like, you know, and that would almost speak something to like the capacity of their willingness to surrender. So like, I'm I'm curious your thoughts on this, as well as what's been showcased around like equal rights and how in relationship, if there there is a level of polarity that creates chemistry that creates connection. Can that healthy chemistry only be there with these very kind of foundational frameworks, a man's a provider and a woman is, you know, in her expression, or can there be places where a woman can provide and and not lose the polarity of that of that related? Yeah, to me it's, it again boils down deeper than polarity because polarity is like a little bit of a kind of, I don't know if it became a hype concept or something, although originally I do believe that it, it all came from David Dada, who I adore and who has gorgeous teachings around that and who actually brings his teachings from such an, such an. Such a refined state of consciousness where really to understand what he means by polarity originally we have to understand what he means by the third stage of relationship between men and women where actually. It's actually life making love to the void. So yeah, so that's why I kind of like, I'd like to go even kind of to a different place on polarity and how I understand it how I explain it. It's just the biology, yeah, like a woman will always look for a man who may potentially be a father for her children. Same for a man, you know, even if people decide not to be, um, parents, which is, you know, people's choice, but still there is this like, you know, like. Life always wants to create more life. We're always driven by preparation. Like the reason why we are attracted to each other, you know, we can go into like la la land and all the mystical reasons. But actually why we're attracted to each other because of our smell. That's it. Because the smell carries the information about your immune system. And because if your immune system is complementary to mine, then we can have healthy babies. That's simple. I love this stuff. And then, you know, then what's what happens? Like a woman needs to feel safe with this man. So if he is not providing for her, how on earth will he be able to, you know, hold her so she feels fertile and energized to become a mother and then to provide for a child and to provide. So, and again, like for some for people who actually desire that then that's, you know, probably like really clarifies a lot, you know, she looks to be safe, he wants to provide that safe. It's natural and how safe, like say it's like depends. For some people it's enough that OK he just pays on the, the bill in the restaurants for other people it's like, no, you actually have to completely take care of her and uh and then what what does it do to a man and the man is like, oh my gosh, I need to look at my bank account. what to do. Now I have a new investment or what is this? Like, what does it mean and blah blah blah blah blah. And then this freak out is a is a medicine because you get to heal the fear of, of lack and lack there. Because if you exist in fear and in luck, it means you exist outside of God because God is pure abundance. And actually the abundance mentality. It's not necessarily even if you have a lot of money that you have abundance mentality, right, because it can be very wealthy people but very stingy, but the abundance mentality is actually also an advanced state of consciousness where it's like you understand that you are provided for forever because we live in this abundant quantum field where all potentials exist for us all the time. Yeah, that's been such a huge uh journey for me with, you know, I can still at times hear my, my father's voice and it's not enough. And, you know, the bill collectors calling, what's going on, you know, trying to stay away from things and actually keep continuing to surrender into and and know the abundance of, of life itself. You know, I always look at nature for that. I look, I mean, here in Bali in the jungle, there's this abundance all around us. And if I can Symbiotically become connected to that abundance and recognize that that's there, then it just shows up, and that's a lot of, I've seen in the last few years myself, just this flow of abundance, rising and moving through, and then even, you know, in my current relationship recognizing that it's it's helping me up level even more into a deeper state of of You know, into a family, and to, you know, eventually becoming a father and really stepping into this place of, of deep abundance and recognizing and actually feeling cause I for a while, it was like a concept of, oh yeah, yeah, the universe has got my back. I'm good inside I'd be like, no, shit's about to fall apart here, like I could feel that. But now I'm like, oh wow, that that actually I could feel like the embodied reality of that, and there's a resting in my nervous system. It comes from that. It's just allowed everything just blossom and grow and expand. I mean, the last year, I'm now, you know, owner or co-owner and over 3 properties in Bali, and Spain, and, you know, and Portugal and seeing this expanse of of wealth and this expansion and It's actually just coming from the, the light of service, the light of sharing my heart and supporting people. Essentially don't wake the fuck up and remember the love that they are. So, yeah, I can relate a lot. Yeah, yeah. Hmm, yeah, when you're sharing, um, about the smell, I had a moment in memory when we were together, I traveled all the way across the world, and I was coming from like New Zealand to India and I met you. And I was like, uh, I need to go take a shower, and you're like, no. I was like, you sure, babe? And, and I love that moment because I felt like that you were loving a part of me that I had never been loved before. Like that, like, primal, like, what felt like smelly state, but there was there was a bond there that happened of just like, uh, wow, oh my God, like in the reflective nature of love that I felt from that allowed me to love myself even deeper. So that just flashed my awareness as we were chatting. Yeah, and it's uh, it, there's there's something quite remarkable when a soul or a human feels like the true essence of love, and it makes sense why people hold onto it and grasp onto it. It's like I've never been been loved like this before. Like, this is cool. And, you know, I, I, I guess. I'd love to hear like, thoughts on in that place and maybe worked with people in this way when. That Feeling inside like I'm, I'm, you know, never gonna be loved like this before, so why even bother, like, you know, a partner dies or uh a relationship ends and I you see often, you know, when older couples and They've been together and one partner dies, and then soon after the other one goes. It's almost like that love existing in that form shifted and changed. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, but then it's like, because it's true that like an intimacy is just so beautiful, how we can. Uh, represent the divine for each other. But at the same time, it's just so important not to take it too literally, you know, like, yeah, I enjoy that, and that's why like tantra is just so beautiful because it really helps you to, to, to connect with one of the key elements of tantra is transfiguration, you know, where you literally look at the person and you see the divine in them. And then that is just such a gorgeous practice for all the romantics, you know, when I first came across this, this thing like 15 years ago, I was like, wow, but that's exactly you. Oh But then from there you can start to end up relating to someone's potential and to really like try to seek for that divinity out of addiction, out of like, yes, but I feel like, but yes, but, but you really, and it's true. Yes, we can give each other that sense of divine love, but it will never be complete. It's just a taster. It's just, you know, uh, like I always feel with men that I related with it's like. It's another Son of God, you know, God sends me another one of his beloved sons, and he, they give this thing to me. Like they touch me. It's like God touches me through them. But at the same time, I still remember my eternal beloved, which will never be replaced by a, a person, no matter how magnificent the person is. And so that's where it's so important to keep that. That awareness to keep going higher in our own state of consciousness because if you, if you get stuck and you hook into that thing and all, but this relationship is perfect, it needs to make it needs to work. It needs to, we need to make it work we need to da da da and then you know something happens like that for separation or something and then it's like your whole stability gets shaken because you've. Relied so, so entirely on that, but you cannot, you cannot rely on anything external. You know, it's, it happened to me a few times in my life where everything got shaken up. Everything like first death of my best friend, you know, that's kind of started my spiritual path and it was so difficult. But then the whole world opened up. And then, you know, losing my home, losing my sense of stability in the country where I grew up losing my job and going like, OK, I cannot be a lawyer anymore. Should I look for another job or I cannot live in this country. I have to feel horrible there. I go to another place. I don't know where to live, what to do, how to be. And then, and then another separation, another and and then it's like, Every time this happens, of course, something shakes up, but then every time through this shake up, it's like I shared aspects of my identity which we're not serving and then completely new big space opens up where I'm like, wow. Let's done something blossoms open. I, I'd, I'd be curious to hear your um definition or what you speak into in, in Tantra. I feel like this is something in our world, and I know even. Um, from knowing you've had journeys of identifying with it and then not identifying with it, and I've had the same where, you know, there's times where I've kind of stayed away, but then also had a desire to help redefine what it is because so many people don't really get it. And I think oftentimes in a mainstream framework, they hear the word tantra, and they just think, you know, sex parties and orgies and don't actually understand the essence. So Like how would you define tantra, especially to someone who maybe hasn't been in circles that we've been or groups or, you know, has never been to Ubu Bali or, you know, or or just places or or or communities or, you know, just conscious communities because there's. A lot of these, you know, there's play parties and temple nights and tantric events and all these things popping up. And I think it gets, the essence of it gets lost. And, and, you know, I'm about to teach tomorrow, a living tantra retreat. We go into this quite deeply. I'd love to hear it from your side, like, how do you define or share it to someone who doesn't have a lot of frames of reference to really, uh, to, to allow it to lend to their body. Yeah. So the easiest way to explain it is. Meeting God in every instance of your life. This is tantra. So it's a spiritual path, but unlike, like, uh, traditional spiritual paths, which involve removing yourself from the modern world, from society, from all the destructions. Now traditional spiritual path will involve going to monastery or going into the mountains and just removing yourself from this Lila, from this Maya, from this illusion that we live in, you know, this, uh, yeah. But uh it's, it's one approach, and there are monarchs meditating, praying all day long and asceticism and uh it's incredible also massive service to humanity just in a very different way. But this path doesn't fit for everyone. And then there's another path which is the path of tantra which involves being actually in the world, being active, and at the same time. Communing with God and recognizing God through every experience through every moment. So yeah, that that that is. And and how do you, how have you found God in the moments of the, like the, the depth of despair and the difficulty and the the the deep challenges, and I know, you know, you shared that things like that publicly as well, like difficult times of navigating into depression and and challenges and How does someone maybe who's listening right now, or maybe even contemplating taking life or, you know, leaving this world and they're in the dark trenches of their being, uh, you know, where, where is God there? Like how, how does that apply into this field of country? Yeah, yeah, I've, I've had to go through a lot of really dark periods in my life. It was definitely not all fairies and butterflies for me. And uh what I find is that what hurts is the resistance. Yeah. So when there is this kind of state of overwhelm and it feels like there's just so much and and things are not going the right way and, and just life is so demanding and you just don't have capacity to give. The best thing to do here is just not to resist because it's like you can find yourself in this darkness and then you keep trying to get out of it. And then there's shame that you are even there because you may have done so much work on yourself and you're like, I have all the tools why nothing is working. And I've I've literally been in that state. I had quite a, it it coincided with a very big spiritual breakthrough that I was going through. Not that long ago and um and that was like the tools don't work, I'm sorry. This is all baloney. This is not real. And then I all I had to do was just to give myself to this experience. There was like literally nothing works, like all the things, you know, all the morning practices and the embodiment and the training and the discipline, like still like, you know, there was this kind of sense that like, it's just there's a lot of darkness and it's completely dark. I don't see any light at the end of the tunnel. It's just dark. And so I and the shame, yeah, that comes on top where it's like, well, why not, like it can't be enough. Like, can we just take a month and and then we're done with it. But in truth, like when you're really going through the periods of the void and and the stages of awakening. Actually, it's dark, like it's really legit dark and um. Of course, it helps to, to have mentors, to have support, to have people who can support and kind of say like, OK, you know, it's kind of like, it's, it's OK. Like it's OK it's a phase. It's like and you have to give yourself to it. And, and that's what I did. And time and time again, I just saw that the moment I stopped fighting this darkness, the moment I stopped trying to take myself out of it prematurely and just, you know, stop distracting myself with Things to do, places to go, uh, ideas to, to put together or something like that. The moment I stopped distracting myself, that's when actually I found bliss in that darkness. Because bliss is always there because we're always eternally embraced. There's actually nothing to change. There's nowhere to get, you're not going to be closer to God if you're a more successful, if you're more visible, if you have a partner or if you have more money, or you're not gonna be closer to God. You're close, closest you are to God right now. And this is the bliss. And this is the human experience that that we have like to really like give ourselves to this experience, to this embrace this devotion to be loved by the divine, and you are loved always. Like even when your partner is behaving strange and you don't find each other and you keep fighting. Even when you don't have a partner and you're so sick of being single and when your business is not taking off and you had this, you still are embraced. So can you just relax. Can we relax into the embrace? Can we relax into the chaos that's that's happening right now on this planet? Yeah, that's the hardest thing and at the same time without relaxation we cannot create anything because people try to create your own place. You cannot. You need to relax. I'm sorry. Yeah, that, that, that helps that helps a lot. And you know, I, I mentioned this with the world. I feel like the worlds that we're in and the people were impacting and the leaders, like, of course, each one of us is making a difference and sometimes I hear it's like, well then there's all these other beings that are. Making greater decisions and having such an impact on politics, on finance, and there's, you know, it can almost turn to doomsday sometimes and what's Exciting for me to look at, especially in these dialogues, it's like, where from the the leadership that each one of us has, and leadership that you have, how do you feel like your uh leadership of love is is impacting? Like, how is it, um, you know, of course, it's, how is it making an impact not only in your life but the lives of others, not to try to change them, but how do you actually Is there a way to to quantify or to personify that as something that's tangible, or is that just in in the mystery? Mm, yeah, well, I find that the greatest work we can do is to the the work we do within and the purity and transparency that we activate within, because the highest giving we can ever give is to be the totality of who we came here to be. You know, even in the Buddhist teachings of the rainbow body. So rainbow body, like we come into the state of rainbow body, it's a state of kind of ultimate enlightenment, when you actually like gain such a mastery over life that you simply become a rainbow. And these are like really, really ancient teachings that. People actually have have experienced that and entered into that and then what happens is that once one person enters into that state, it radiates everywhere all all across the world and you know, like to the people that are close by. And so for us to enter into a new stage of our evolution as humanity, we need to elevate the state of consciousness because the reason why there are those wars and all this. Horrendous things happening on the planet because we are not focused on what actually matters. We're focused on some, some stupid things and not focusing on actually the real problems and the real thing. Why? Because we don't have the consciousness for that. And the mind is on focus and and the energy is directed like in a scattered ways. So it's only like what I see I'm doing is I'm doing everything I can to serve love, which means to serve the evolution of humanity, which means to serve the evolution of our consciousness. And the more our consciousness rises, the more we come into this purest. Vibration pure as pure as we can be, then it, it emanates from us. So what I see happening to my clients all the time is that they do the work with me and we work on elevating the consciousness and it it looks in so many different ways, you know, we talk about different things, we practice different things, but then what's going on in them is that they start to see reality from a different level of consciousness and people around them change, not doing the work, just they change. Like so often women come and they're like, my partner is doing now, my mama. I don't want to hear about this. I don't want to hear about your ping pong bottles. I want to know what's going on inside of you. And we work on that, and she starts to shift that, and then her man just starts to change and bring her flowers and do a little yoga in the morning that he never done any kind of yoga, doesn't go to classes like where is this coming from? You know, and the children started to change and. Yeah, yeah, so that's what I see, you know, that's the greatest impact. And of course, when we are together with groups, and I know I, I really love those massive big groups. Uh, I'll be teaching the really big festival this year. I'm teaching a boom this year, and I'm, I'm excited about this stuff. Last year I had don't know or tweet at some point in this nonlinear reality at some point in this reality of a group of like 220 people in front of me in my own event and it's like and I really just see that it's like like. We can do big things when we are together. But at the same time, it's really about the individual, what each individual does, what, how, how honest can they be, how transparent can they be? How ready are they to let to let go of all this holding and allow Grace to take over. Yeah, it reminds me when I was first involved in this field, and I was living in LA and I was um quite often speaking to groups, you know, of large quantity, more in the frame of of mindfulness and and consciousness pieces, and, you know, and I can witness now, whether it's a, you know, small group or big group, like the Recognizable impact that can shift when someone's inner reality changes. And really what I'm hearing you say is that when that inner reality changes and the outer reality absolutely, you know, personifies and and shifts with that kind of electromagnetic field that's that's shifting in space and time, and whether it's past, present, or future, we're we're still figuring that out. So what's uh what what's exciting in ahead, uh, moving forward for you, especially in the realms of Um, leadership, you know, that's something I really like to, to look upon at the show is how we're, you know, we're looking at the bigger things as you're discussing, but what's some of the, the practicalities of what you're creating in the realms of leadership? Mm. Good question. Well, I, um, I work with some really long term students and clients of mine, and we're doing some really deep work. We're going to Egypt at the end of the year. It's rare that I do that, but I really believe that when we go to Egypt and we go there with specific mindset and, and readiness and preparation, then we actually can upload all the codes that we left there for ourselves. And um I see quite major transformations happening to people once they go and do that then in terms of leadership actually particularly like in terms of purpose like something it's like. Because it's like many of us remember on a certain level the fall of Egypt. We remember how we were building something so magnificent and then it was just all destroyed. And so then sometimes when people start to take steps on the path of leadership and they start to wobble and be worried and they start to get impacted you know no one is signing up, no one's coming and and all of that is just fluff. And the real thing is like how certain can you be that you get to walk this path that you get to be in the truth, that you get to trust your steps, you get to trust in your integrity. So that that's coming and I'm working deeply with like my close people. But then at the same time, yeah, I'm I'm running, uh, I'm completing to run my retreats, which I've been running for many, many years, which is interesting. And so I'm I'm transitioning from small groups to actually wanting to impact big, big numbers of people and, uh, I see myself on big stages, touching a lot of people and And it's uh it's something that that feels it feels exciting inside of me, but then at the same time I like it, it feels like just like I, I just have to give myself to it and it will be done because I, I just know I have what it takes to to be on the stage and I know what's happening to me and what's happening to people in front of me when I'm there and I feel it's a, it's a it's a, it's a it's like. That's, that's how she wants to. That's how Grace wants to move. Yeah, uh, a transmission of, of loving consciousness that um gives a greater field of permission to come back to really know themselves and to. To expand into what what's truly possible, well. I want to appreciate you for the, the lives that you're impacting and yeah, my own life as well, and it's a it's a pleasure to witness you from, you know, we don't see each other so often, but here and there just to witness uh your own growth and celebrating and honoring your, your way forward and uh pleasure to have you as a friend in my life. Thank you for Yeah, thank you for the deepening of of love and friendship when whenever there's been space and time, and yeah, so thank you. Yeah, my pleasure. I'm, I'm so happy we cultivate this relationship and also to see you across the time and space and to hold each other in our awareness. It's beautiful. I was reflecting for a moment. I was just in Egypt about about 2 years ago and had a profound deep activation, went to a number of like untouched temples and then And flashes of our Egypt trip together, which was a beautifully challenging and loving and celebration and all the ups and downs of life. So I appreciate the humor and the joy that can come with that as well. Do you want to share because you mentioned something before, do you want to share your highlights for the trip? Well, I, I think there was just, uh, uh, witnessing of the, the raw form of of shock. The raw form of Shakti in all of her expressions and it uh humbled me, would be the best way to say it, humbled to a deeper level of appreciation and yeah, just these, these weavings of, of, of energetics and just the, the, the journey both. Esoterically and spiritually as well as physically that I feel like we sort of self-initiated us each other in different various ways on that trip together very. you highlights, would you like to offer a few highlights? Well, I just, I just, I'm just concerned about your listeners. I think it's like it's all always welcome. No, but just, you know, in the way that we speak because you mentioned something before then I thought like maybe to give a little context, um, but, uh, maybe not. But we'll leave it to the mystery. We'll leave it to the mystery. Maybe I'll be uh another episode down the road. Thank you. Thank you for, yeah, I appreciate you. And if you want to find out more about Sofia, your website.com, Instagram and. Great. Thank you all for tuning in. Please like or subscribe to Love, Sex and Leadership and uh see you next time. If you have any questions for either Sofia or I, feel free to comment below or send us a message. Have a beautiful day.