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Welcome to The Crucible, Conversations for the Curious.

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I am Hamish, your host.

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This podcast is for anyone going through awakenings, trying to make sense of life.

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Whether dark nights are the soul, needing to make life -changing decisions, struggling
with addiction or critical illness, or simply realizing that their life as they know it is

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not aligned to values and purpose.

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You are not alone.

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You can get through this, promise you.

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Life is far more beautiful on the other side.

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Hello everybody and welcome to another episode of The Crucible.

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I'm here today with Deborah and she's got a story that you need to sit down to listen to.

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Deborah, thank you so much for turning up.

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Thank you for offering to share your story.

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Can you start by telling me what happened in your 57th year?

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Yes, very happy to because now I'm on a mission to make sure that other people who are
later in life don't feel that there's no hope and that they have to live like they've been

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living for the rest of their lives.

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so midway through my 57th year, I had been asked by a business person where I live to
attend a networking event.

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It turned out that it was an evening with him.

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and I hadn't realised that it was just him and I hadn't realised that he was assuming that
I wanted bottles of wine and dinner and old patterns started to emerge again in me,

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triggers started to emerge again in me.

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I left that evening in floods of tears.

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I literally ran home because it was in running distance.

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I threw myself on the bed and I didn't want to wake up anymore.

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I was completely out of control, weeping, sobbing, fell asleep sobbing, woke up sobbing
and thought, you know what, I don't want to carry on like this.

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Weirdly enough, or not weirdly, but it was at the time, I had some form of divine support
because it led me, my body, I don't think I was there in my mind.

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to open up my laptop and type in counselors near me.

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Of which was a strange thing because for the whole of my life, I'd always thought from
what I'd been through and what I'd had to cope with, that counseling would be the very

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last thing I needed because guess what?

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I thought it would induce a nervous breakdown.

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Interestingly enough, the nervous breakdown was induced by not having the counseling.

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And I smile about it now because of the irony.

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But anyway, there was this entity thinking that the world was going to end then and typed
in that, counsellors near me, got through to a publication called Psychology Today, and

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there was a directory that was in alphabetical order.

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And that's how I met Amy.

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I met her over the phone.

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I never saw her in person.

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And the wonderful thing about Amy that I've later found out

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is that she's never available on the phone because she has back -to -back clients or that
she's on the downtime taking out some time from being with clients.

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So the fact that she actually answered the phone was a minor miracle in itself.

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So thank you, Amy, for saving my life because that's exactly what she did.

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And in this daze and haze of being completely...

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discombobulated, completely disorientated, completely not me.

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Once a week she started to ask me probing questions and once a week I started to open up
and I realised on the first session that I thought I'd just have one and that would be

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enough as you do, that this was going to be a little bit longer and that it was then time.

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to tell my story, not necessarily to her, but allow the words to come from my mouth and to
express them in a way that I'd never done before and to let the demons out so that

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something could replace it.

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This wasn't a conscious decision.

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It was just something that happened.

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Amy was obviously very good at asking the right questions.

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But I think I'd come to a point in time where it was that or oblivion.

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And oblivion, once I'd started talking about my issues, didn't seem the attractive option
that it did at the beginning.

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So that's why I kept on going.

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Very helpful sessions.

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And on the sixth week, I gave birth to my monster.

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It was a physical transformation.

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It was a spiritual metamorphosis.

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I physically felt the pain.

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I thought I was going to have to go to A &E.

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I completely know that what I saw was real as this monster emerged from me.

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Dark, stinking, heavy, horrible, with red eyes, bearing down on me, not wanting to go.

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I won't say the words here, but there were two.

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One began with F and the other one with O.

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of which I shouted at the top of my lungs over and over and over again.

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I live in a terraced house because I think everybody must have heard.

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I don't think it was silent.

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I truly believe that I was saying those words.

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And eventually, eventually, that monster started to go away from me.

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And I was lying on the floor, not even on my bed, because I was in absolute agony.

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was sweating.

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I felt like I was...

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having appendicitis or peritonitis, it felt like that.

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The monster started to rise above me.

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It started to get closer again and I kept on with my whole being telling it to do what I
said.

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And then very quickly, it went out the door of my kitchen.

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It went down the hallway to my front door.

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and it went through the letterbox and it disappeared.

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And I knew then, but it would never come back, that what I had now was a vacuum that I
felt completely empty, completely at peace, completely at one with the world and with

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myself.

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I didn't know what was happening at that point, but now after reading some...

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very interesting material and listening to podcasts about spirituality.

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At that point, I'd found myself, I'd found my essence, I found who I was.

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And I knew at that moment that whatever happened in life afterwards, I had the ability and
the strength and the resilience and the love to be able to take it on my shoulders and

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deal with it without fear, anxiety.

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or depression or victimhood because in that moment I knew that I had changed in a cellular
level.

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That means every cell in my body had changed and even my appearance outwardly after I
started to go out back out into the world again people said you look different have you

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been on holiday?

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Have you got a new skincare regime?

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You look happier.

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Well what's happened?

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Have you got a boyfriend?

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And I knew that I changed completely inside as well.

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At that moment, I forgave my abusers, I forgave my parents.

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I don't say that they were right to do what they did, but I understand that there were
circumstances that they had gone through in their lives that they hadn't unraveled or they

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hadn't thought to look into.

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They hadn't had the experience and the blessing.

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that I had by going through the experience that I did and I was able to forgive.

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And again, in that act of forgiveness, it helped me transcend all of the anxiety, all of
the victimhood, all of the blame, all of the shame and the guilt that I felt from having

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been a child that I always felt had deserved it, attracted it, and that I was the person
that

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that really was that kind of person that these things happened to.

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And that all left me.

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And so I realized that an act of forgiveness was actually more liberating and freeing for
me.

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And both my parents are dead, but I just felt this peace and calm and acceptance.

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And so carrying on through my 57th year,

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I then found that I wanted to listen to uplifting motivational speakers on podcasts, in
books, et cetera.

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I didn't want to, and this just came naturally, I didn't want to expose myself to
mainstream media.

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I didn't want to get involved into negative discussions.

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I wanted

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to hear about those wonderful things that I felt I missed out on all my life.

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Although I heard them, I didn't internalize them.

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I didn't understand them.

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Yeah.

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And so with that came this desire for learning and I'm on my own.

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I have to look after myself.

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So during this process, I still had to work and I still had to earn a living and I have my
own business.

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So I couldn't take any time off.

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So I managed to patch myself up as much as I could and put a brave face on things.

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But actually, you know, once I was going through it, I understood that there was going to
be a wonderful outcome.

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So I knew that I could keep going and get up every day knowing that that was on the
horizon.

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So that spurred me on.

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And interestingly enough, moving on from that, I listened to this type of material from
people like Tony Robbins, Mel Robbins,

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There are a host of those people.

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And I just felt, yes, I can understand this positive thinking, positive talking, but there
must be something more within us that acts as the anchor, that acts as the grounding, that

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acts as the center.

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And so that's when just naturally I started to listen to more things of an esoteric
spiritual nature.

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And that's when I really felt that I'd come home and that I'd felt at one and at peace
with myself.

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And I'm still learning and I'll never stop.

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And it gave me this massive sense of belonging and purpose and truth.

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And there is a different way of coming down the stairs.

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It's not necessarily that you have to go on your head, which I was doing and causing
myself a headache.

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It's actually, you can go on your feet.

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and hold the balusters.

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And it's like, wow, that's incredible because I've been doing it wrong all my life.

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And it just put a different perspective on things.

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And so now I can be in situations which before would have triggered me to the point of
making me want to run away or being scared or lashing out.

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Now I've found I'm much kinder, I'm more patient, I'm more understanding.

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of the fact of me and how wonderful I am, but also that everybody else is on their own
journey and that actually we're just all rubbing together in a wonderful kind of soup of

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human beingness.

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And I don't judge anymore.

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I don't think that I'm right and people are wrong.

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I understand that polarity needs to be there to get the whole frame.

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And actually me thinking that I'm right,

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I used to think I was right a long time ago and I now know how wrong I was.

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So I can't really say that, I'm right, this is the way.

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Because if I change, that changes as well.

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So I've become much less controlling.

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I'm working on that side of things because I do still have a tendency to want to control
things.

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But for me, it's about understanding that we're all here and that wherever

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and however awful things that we do and I've done awful things in my life.

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But we're on this journey and it happened because it happened because it was meant to
happen.

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And that gives us and gives me the opportunity then to say, well, right, how can I learn
from this?

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And thoughts and feelings that I've had over the years, which I thought were coping
mechanisms to serve me to get me through things I've now realized.

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I don't need them anymore.

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And that's a little bit more challenging to try and to understand that there are different
ways of doing things.

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But yeah, I think with that whole idea of being oneness, and for me that took on not from
a religious perspective, but from a universal perspective that I am part of this most

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amazing creation.

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And to be a human being in the first place, the odds are like

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tiny tiny tiny aren't they to become one anyway.

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And so I'm very fortunate to be a human being.

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I now believe that we don't die as our essences as our souls.

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I now believe that we do come back to learn the lessons and give forth the things that we
need to do in each entity that we choose that it is a choice.

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And that made a lot of sense to me.

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when I'm thinking, well, why did I go through these things?

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What happened to me?

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Why did it happen?

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Why was I the one that had to suffer in this way?

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And I heard somebody say, I'm trying to think of who it may have been, but I can't think
exactly.

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But they made the analogy that if you are a mountain climber and you want to do great
things as a mountaineer, you probably wouldn't want to settle.

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for climbing the big hill at the back of your garden.

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You'd probably want to climb something like Mount Everest or Mount Kilimanjaro or one of
the big ones.

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So actually, the things that I've gone through so far in my life are what mountaineers
might call triumphs because I've scaled them and I've seen what they're like, these

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challenges.

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And not that I'm courting more challenge, to be fair, because I think I've quite a lot,
but when things come...

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there I can look at it and go, okay, I've obviously got a lesson in my mountaineering life
that I need to learn.

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And that kind of puts a different perspective on things.

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So the 57th year of my life was, yeah, it was different.

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It was very different from what I'd experienced before.

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And it taught me also not to fear.

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the unknown, not to fear change so much because

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I'll be okay.

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I've always been okay.

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I am okay.

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And I think that is the whole purpose of the fact that now I can understand what surrender
is like.

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To surrender to the bigger force out there that has our best interests at heart and
understands why we were here in the first place.

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And it might sound a bit like, gosh, well, that's all a bit, I don't know, I can't see
this.

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I can't touch it.

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I can't smell it.

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It goes against the kind of human being senses that we've got to try and manifest
something that we can have in 3D.

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But then when I think about all of the radio waves, all of the Wi -Fi that we have, all of
the hearing things that dogs can hear, but we can't.

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all of the things that flies can see but we can't, there's so much more that we can't see
and that we can't touch necessarily that you know a little bacteria in our body will be

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having a different experience of its life because it has different, it's a different size,
it's a different thought process and so from that perspective I'm like there's a lot

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that I don't see, that I know now exists outside of me and outside of my perception.

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And so once I trust that that's okay, I can, I can be more, I can be more solid, I can be
more resilient, I can be more loving, because I haven't got all that protection that I

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needed before.

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I don't know if all this makes sense, but it makes sense to me.

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So I guess that's

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the bit that counts.

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It does make sense because you've, well, first of all, congratulations on removing that
bug -eyed, red -eyed monster.

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I want to come back to that in a minute.

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But I think everything that you've said, how you've made sense of things is wonderful
because we do have two choices.

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We can either live in that fear or we can go, you

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This is way bigger.

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The universe is way bigger.

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Life is bigger.

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So there's got to be more.

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Science proves this.

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20 years ago, science didn't prove that.

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This was right then.

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This is right now.

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Who knows what will be the next discovery from science?

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It may well be something completely different.

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But I think being that curious is wonderful and that accepting.

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And it does allow you to be resilient.

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And it does allow the punches to come.

213
00:18:20,568 --> 00:18:22,229
and you roll them, doesn't it?

214
00:18:23,071 --> 00:18:25,252
I think that's wonderful.

215
00:18:25,814 --> 00:18:31,960
I want to come back to this monster that you eviscerated, that you got rid of.

216
00:18:31,960 --> 00:18:34,753
What was that for you?

217
00:18:34,753 --> 00:18:37,846
What have you attached to it?

218
00:18:38,207 --> 00:18:42,723
What left your body at that time?

219
00:18:42,723 --> 00:18:43,684
Evil.

220
00:18:44,668 --> 00:18:45,720
Evil left my body.

221
00:18:45,720 --> 00:18:46,934
The devil left my body.

222
00:18:46,934 --> 00:18:48,585
I was possessed.

223
00:18:48,925 --> 00:18:52,210
I was possessed by the devil of my own making.

224
00:18:52,210 --> 00:19:00,476
I was possessed by all those little thought processes that I'd had since childhood that
were in my subconscious.

225
00:19:00,917 --> 00:19:05,681
I was possessed by all of the negativity, all of the fear, all of the anxiety.

226
00:19:05,681 --> 00:19:07,001
And I know where they came from.

227
00:19:07,001 --> 00:19:08,764
They did come from a real place.

228
00:19:08,764 --> 00:19:14,432
But unlike, let's say for instance, a wildebeest being chased by a lion.

229
00:19:14,432 --> 00:19:22,364
When that lion hasn't caught them, they've run, they've got over it, and off they go
again.

230
00:19:22,884 --> 00:19:36,988
But for me, and I think for lot of human beings, we then pack that experience into us as a
learning for the future is, don't do that next time because this might happen again.

231
00:19:37,508 --> 00:19:43,270
And once you build these constructs of negativity, fear, anxiety,

232
00:19:43,646 --> 00:19:49,088
Often as coping mechanisms as a child, my own reality was I had to protect myself.

233
00:19:49,088 --> 00:19:51,928
I had to be invisible as much as possible.

234
00:19:51,928 --> 00:19:57,070
I had to be unseen and unheard to be able to be okay.

235
00:19:57,550 --> 00:20:09,513
So every little thing that I did that gave me a voice or everything that gave me an
instance of being noticed, I tried to block out because that wasn't going to keep me safe.

236
00:20:09,513 --> 00:20:10,454
And thank you.

237
00:20:10,454 --> 00:20:12,342
Thank them for everything.

238
00:20:12,342 --> 00:20:18,765
these feelings and these thoughts, thank them, thank them, thank them, because I'm sure at
that point they did help me.

239
00:20:19,285 --> 00:20:29,689
But then when I became an adolescent and an adult and away from that environment, they
were still there, that the perpetrators weren't there.

240
00:20:29,890 --> 00:20:33,851
So the circumstances were different, but I couldn't adapt to them.

241
00:20:33,851 --> 00:20:40,354
So I tried to make false truth into the truth.

242
00:20:40,458 --> 00:20:49,726
and then found that I was getting very bad reactions from people because I wasn't seen, I
wasn't heard, didn't want a voice.

243
00:20:49,726 --> 00:20:52,818
so people would think that of me and then that compounded stuff.

244
00:20:52,818 --> 00:20:56,631
So I then learned that and internalized all of that.

245
00:20:56,812 --> 00:21:05,860
So this monster was the evil that I created within myself, the devil that I created within
myself of taking all this and sucking all this negativity and keeping it in there.

246
00:21:05,860 --> 00:21:08,262
And then once that had gone,

247
00:21:08,924 --> 00:21:13,237
then that left the newborn again.

248
00:21:13,238 --> 00:21:19,143
And that's why I can understand the phrase being born again, because that's literally what
happened.

249
00:21:19,143 --> 00:21:22,206
So yes, in answer to your question, that's what that was.

250
00:21:22,206 --> 00:21:26,330
It was the devil of my own creation and I was possessed by that devil.

251
00:21:26,330 --> 00:21:30,955
And it did tell me what to do and it did control my thoughts and my actions.

252
00:21:30,955 --> 00:21:36,321
And when it had gone, I realized the difference in a nanosecond.

253
00:21:36,321 --> 00:21:43,727
Instantly knew, could feel it, could think it, could see it, could breathe it.

254
00:21:44,269 --> 00:21:46,772
That difference of when it wasn't there.

255
00:21:46,772 --> 00:21:48,153
I think that is remarkable.

256
00:21:48,153 --> 00:21:52,187
mean, as you described it the first time, had goosebumps all over my arms and my back.

257
00:21:52,187 --> 00:22:02,265
It just made me shudder because I have not experienced that, but I know the process of the
coping strategies, keeping yourself small, all that kind of stuff.

258
00:22:02,265 --> 00:22:05,918
And I know it works as a child.

259
00:22:06,699 --> 00:22:08,160
you took it with you to an adult.

260
00:22:08,160 --> 00:22:09,481
I took it through me to an adult.

261
00:22:09,481 --> 00:22:10,962
And most people do.

262
00:22:11,406 --> 00:22:13,778
And then it doesn't because you've got that contradiction.

263
00:22:13,778 --> 00:22:16,080
know, there's Deborah the adult, Deborah the child.

264
00:22:16,080 --> 00:22:18,893
This is running the show and you're going, hang on, I know better.

265
00:22:18,893 --> 00:22:21,254
I see things differently.

266
00:22:21,895 --> 00:22:28,480
So that puking out that monster, that that devil of your making I think is incredible.

267
00:22:28,781 --> 00:22:31,683
I have I haven't done anything like that, but I think.

268
00:22:32,645 --> 00:22:36,297
Yeah, I mean, you said it left you with a with an open space of potential.

269
00:22:36,297 --> 00:22:37,769
How did you fill that?

270
00:22:37,769 --> 00:22:38,221
What?

271
00:22:38,221 --> 00:22:45,784
What were you able to do because that void, could quite easily come back if you're not
able to go, I'm not going to.

272
00:22:45,784 --> 00:22:46,846
So you had to be vigilant.

273
00:22:46,846 --> 00:22:52,855
But what else did you do to make sense of your potential, I suppose?

274
00:22:53,846 --> 00:22:59,369
Well, I'm very familiar with the fact that nature abhors a vacuum, so it's going to be
filled with something.

275
00:22:59,750 --> 00:23:10,787
And I asked the counsellor at this point what needs to be done, because once I described
this event to her, she was concerned about things coming in that weren't going to be

276
00:23:10,787 --> 00:23:13,098
helpful for me moving forward.

277
00:23:13,779 --> 00:23:17,977
Now, at that point, I think I've got enough presence of mind and enough

278
00:23:17,977 --> 00:23:25,780
innate knowledge that had run parallel to the monster but had never been given credence.

279
00:23:25,780 --> 00:23:27,620
That came to the fore.

280
00:23:28,160 --> 00:23:30,721
That was what was filling the gap.

281
00:23:30,721 --> 00:23:35,083
But for two weeks, I was like a newborn baby.

282
00:23:35,923 --> 00:23:36,883
For two weeks.

283
00:23:36,883 --> 00:23:37,864
It was about two weeks.

284
00:23:37,864 --> 00:23:42,915
And I know that that's actually not an uncommon timeframe from when people have had this
kind of

285
00:23:43,025 --> 00:23:45,347
scenario.

286
00:23:46,208 --> 00:23:49,310
And I was walking around going, my goodness.

287
00:23:49,400 --> 00:23:50,111
wow.

288
00:23:50,111 --> 00:23:51,252
This looks incredible.

289
00:23:51,252 --> 00:23:52,853
I've never seen things like this before.

290
00:23:52,853 --> 00:23:56,976
You know, like objects like spoons and vacuum cleaners.

291
00:23:57,057 --> 00:23:57,587
wow.

292
00:23:57,587 --> 00:23:58,898
This is incredible.

293
00:23:58,898 --> 00:24:04,583
And I've never done drugs, but I hear the fact that people who've done mushrooms or
something, everything's like, wow.

294
00:24:04,583 --> 00:24:08,448
Well, I was having my wow moment that came about from that.

295
00:24:08,448 --> 00:24:10,729
So the little things and the knowledge.

296
00:24:10,781 --> 00:24:15,505
of knowing that I now could tread this different path.

297
00:24:15,505 --> 00:24:22,250
And then I think all the things that were in the background, the good things started to
come to the fore.

298
00:24:22,531 --> 00:24:26,155
And it was incredibly empowering feeling.

299
00:24:26,155 --> 00:24:31,359
The counselor, after we left therapy after eight weeks,

300
00:24:32,211 --> 00:24:43,276
I think we got to a point in her level of understanding of these events and circumstances
that she didn't feel comfortable taking on further therapy with me.

301
00:24:43,276 --> 00:24:45,097
And that was completely fine.

302
00:24:45,097 --> 00:24:49,518
And she said she didn't quite know how she was helping me, could help me moving forward.

303
00:24:49,559 --> 00:24:55,181
And I said to her, I don't actually think I need you in that capacity now.

304
00:24:55,181 --> 00:24:57,182
So that was good.

305
00:24:57,262 --> 00:24:59,323
But my own

306
00:25:00,211 --> 00:25:12,439
understanding and my own thirst for the knowledge that I needed to then move forward from,
by Divine download actually came to me.

307
00:25:12,680 --> 00:25:26,829
That wasn't something that the eye of me actually did, it was the download from the
Divine, from the universe, showing me and guiding me what to be involved with and to what

308
00:25:26,829 --> 00:25:29,711
extent and to then when to change things.

309
00:25:29,769 --> 00:25:31,581
And that was not my own influence.

310
00:25:31,581 --> 00:25:33,824
I know that, but I was guided for that.

311
00:25:33,824 --> 00:25:43,305
So I was very blessed and I feel very thankful that the goodness of the universe knew that
the time was right for me to go down that path.

312
00:25:43,305 --> 00:25:46,098
And it led me down that path and I was willing to do it.

313
00:25:46,098 --> 00:25:46,600
So yeah.

314
00:25:46,600 --> 00:25:49,802
I know what you mean by that wow moment.

315
00:25:49,802 --> 00:25:52,824
I left rehab, I felt I had been peeled.

316
00:25:52,824 --> 00:25:55,446
I felt my skin was baby fresh.

317
00:25:55,446 --> 00:25:57,948
I had no mask on and I could breathe.

318
00:25:57,948 --> 00:25:59,649
You know, I had done that.

319
00:25:59,829 --> 00:26:01,530
Held myself so tightly.

320
00:26:01,530 --> 00:26:03,021
So yeah, everything was.

321
00:26:03,021 --> 00:26:07,916
It was like taking your specs off, taking a mask off and it was profound.

322
00:26:07,916 --> 00:26:09,797
It wasn't scary.

323
00:26:09,797 --> 00:26:13,320
was really, yeah, so can completely understand what you said.

324
00:26:13,320 --> 00:26:15,140
It's just living and seeing differently, isn't it?

325
00:26:15,140 --> 00:26:18,203
And believing things differently and understanding things differently.

326
00:26:19,131 --> 00:26:21,802
Yes, and not imposing my will on things.

327
00:26:21,802 --> 00:26:27,223
And that came, I was educated by Catholic nuns for a large part of my education.

328
00:26:27,483 --> 00:26:30,764
And what they used to say is, you know, be the servant of God.

329
00:26:31,324 --> 00:26:34,005
You know, God's will be done.

330
00:26:34,425 --> 00:26:39,927
And from a dogmatic perspective, you know, there's truth in that.

331
00:26:39,927 --> 00:26:48,571
You know, in the spiritual side of things, in the universal side of things, the universe,
the higher powers will

332
00:26:48,571 --> 00:26:49,641
be done.

333
00:26:50,161 --> 00:26:53,265
And I do catch myself on a regular basis.

334
00:26:53,265 --> 00:27:01,929
When I start to feel those feelings of tightness in my chest is probably the best way to
describe it or in my gut.

335
00:27:02,729 --> 00:27:05,910
And as we all know, everything comes from the gut.

336
00:27:06,150 --> 00:27:12,402
And I think of it now I'm much more able to think, okay, that's interesting.

337
00:27:12,874 --> 00:27:13,905
Thank you.

338
00:27:13,905 --> 00:27:15,606
What are you doing here?

339
00:27:15,606 --> 00:27:17,297
And it's like, what are you trying to teach me?

340
00:27:17,297 --> 00:27:19,489
What can I learn from you today?

341
00:27:19,489 --> 00:27:20,769
It's interesting that you're here.

342
00:27:20,769 --> 00:27:22,750
What brought this emotion up?

343
00:27:22,891 --> 00:27:28,234
And that helps enormously to dissolve it anyway.

344
00:27:28,615 --> 00:27:33,738
But interestingly enough, I can work through things a lot better.

345
00:27:33,918 --> 00:27:39,402
And I can see often, often something will happen.

346
00:27:39,402 --> 00:27:41,663
And about a day later, I'll go,

347
00:27:42,960 --> 00:27:45,582
That's I was meant to learn from that.

348
00:27:46,254 --> 00:27:51,691
thank you Because I'm employing the right principles to be able to get the best outcome
that I can

349
00:27:51,691 --> 00:27:55,162
And for me, it's just like, I don't know why that came about.

350
00:27:55,162 --> 00:27:59,453
And then a day later or so, it's like, yeah, I know why now.

351
00:27:59,613 --> 00:28:00,675
It's interesting.

352
00:28:00,675 --> 00:28:13,860
When I know then that the quantum, the field that we can't see where everything is already
created and it's all there, to dip into that, what I've realized is that that can happen

353
00:28:13,860 --> 00:28:15,420
instantaneously.

354
00:28:15,520 --> 00:28:21,688
element of what I had as a construct before doesn't come into play anymore.

355
00:28:21,689 --> 00:28:32,833
It's when I'm in the right zone, if you're thinking about the frequencies and energies
that we all are and everything is, when it clicks, it clicks and it clicks in a

356
00:28:32,833 --> 00:28:33,595
nanosecond.

357
00:28:33,595 --> 00:28:36,957
And that's something which I've always been taught.

358
00:28:37,538 --> 00:28:48,988
And there's some degree of truth in this, that you study hard and long hours and study,
study, study, and then you work hard and you work hard for long hours and work, work,

359
00:28:48,988 --> 00:28:50,248
work, work.

360
00:28:50,489 --> 00:28:53,732
And then you've got to get something else fitted in called sleep.

361
00:28:53,732 --> 00:28:57,575
So you've got to sleep properly and sleep, sleep, sleep, sleep.

362
00:28:57,575 --> 00:28:59,997
And then you've got to play and then you've got to this.

363
00:28:59,997 --> 00:29:02,649
And it's it's all kind of like exhausting.

364
00:29:03,303 --> 00:29:13,764
But now I know that if I'm in what I consider and I'm using these air quotes because I
don't want to give what I say to anybody else, but it's just the way I've constructed it.

365
00:29:13,764 --> 00:29:15,508
When I'm working in a flow state.

366
00:29:15,508 --> 00:29:18,189
When things are right, they go bang.

367
00:29:18,189 --> 00:29:27,334
And I have this energy that it could be hours that I've been concentrating and it feels
like seconds.

368
00:29:27,334 --> 00:29:33,246
And yet when I know I'm not quite in that, my goodness, it's like climbing a marathon of a
mountain.

369
00:29:33,246 --> 00:29:35,717
It's just like so hard.

370
00:29:35,717 --> 00:29:39,439
And then I go, okay, why is this so hard?

371
00:29:39,739 --> 00:29:42,390
Why do I need to be like this now?

372
00:29:42,814 --> 00:29:49,426
and I'm like, okay, just let go, surrender, get back into the state.

373
00:29:49,426 --> 00:29:51,807
Is it the right thing for me to be doing?

374
00:29:52,467 --> 00:29:56,038
Am I choosing an old mechanism as opposed to a new one?

375
00:29:56,038 --> 00:30:02,890
And then leave it for a bit and then come back and if I can get back into that flow state.

376
00:30:02,890 --> 00:30:09,302
But then again, if I pursue a path and I know it's not the right one, or I'm thinking, is
this the right one?

377
00:30:09,302 --> 00:30:13,113
It'll either happen instantaneously or I'm laboring, laboring, laboring.

378
00:30:13,113 --> 00:30:17,915
And I suddenly realize, that's not what I'm meant to be doing here.

379
00:30:17,915 --> 00:30:20,095
This isn't the right way for me.

380
00:30:20,616 --> 00:30:30,841
And so it's much more flow driven and acceptance driven and not trying to force square
pegs into round holes.

381
00:30:30,841 --> 00:30:33,282
And that's life just in general.

382
00:30:33,882 --> 00:30:36,463
But the wonderful thing is money is great.

383
00:30:36,463 --> 00:30:45,567
And we all need to make money to live and have a happy life and make the choices that we
want and give to others, which is fantastic.

384
00:30:45,867 --> 00:30:48,298
So money is exactly the same thing.

385
00:30:48,298 --> 00:30:59,703
When I'm in pursuit of closing deals or in pursuit of getting more areas of finance and
abundance from a money perspective in my life, that now I realize follows the same

386
00:30:59,703 --> 00:31:00,753
patterns.

387
00:31:01,645 --> 00:31:09,387
And it kind of pushes me down a certain pathway where I think, that's gonna, that's gonna
work.

388
00:31:09,387 --> 00:31:15,289
And whereas before I'd be like, chase, chase, chase, chase, you know, close, close, close.

389
00:31:15,289 --> 00:31:18,130
It's just like, if it's meant to be, it's gonna be like that.

390
00:31:18,130 --> 00:31:26,692
And actually I'm getting more now than I did before with less effort, if that makes sense,
I did.

391
00:31:26,692 --> 00:31:29,083
And I'm like, wow, I've got it.

392
00:31:29,083 --> 00:31:30,993
So what I'd love to do is help.

393
00:31:31,395 --> 00:31:42,224
which we do in our business, help corporates to understand that you don't need to fight,
fight, fight, fight, fight, fight all the time for money because when you let it come

394
00:31:42,224 --> 00:31:47,679
naturally, it comes bigger and better and quicker than you could ever imagine.

395
00:31:47,679 --> 00:31:52,743
So, yeah, that's the whole thing about the manifestation for me.

396
00:31:53,004 --> 00:31:56,807
That's another area of my life, which I like manifest.

397
00:31:56,807 --> 00:31:58,148
What are you talking about?

398
00:31:58,148 --> 00:31:59,549
Manifest.

399
00:32:00,141 --> 00:32:13,721
And now I know that as part of the divine creator, because we've all got the part of the
divine in us, we've got copious amounts of creativity and manifestation possibilities in

400
00:32:13,721 --> 00:32:14,492
us.

401
00:32:15,073 --> 00:32:18,265
And sometimes I think, right, what would I like to manifest now?

402
00:32:18,265 --> 00:32:25,401
And I just give it out there with the fact that I will surrender to what I need to do to
do it.

403
00:32:25,401 --> 00:32:34,025
And without really exception, as long as I don't put my own time defined thing in it, it
kind of happens.

404
00:32:34,065 --> 00:32:39,007
And I'm like, I didn't think that was going to happen.

405
00:32:39,007 --> 00:32:39,618
And it did.

406
00:32:39,618 --> 00:32:46,050
And so I'm like, okay, well, if that can happen, let's do this and do this and trust the
process.

407
00:32:46,050 --> 00:32:52,573
So that's kind of like the journey that I'm on now is trusting the process and having the
things that

408
00:32:53,187 --> 00:32:59,610
I know through me should be manifested and manifesting them as part of my journey.

409
00:32:59,610 --> 00:33:01,642
It's so counterintuitive, isn't it?

410
00:33:01,642 --> 00:33:05,384
Slow down, relax, surrender, don't push.

411
00:33:05,404 --> 00:33:10,567
And then everything comes and it's, it's the lesson I'm not learning.

412
00:33:10,628 --> 00:33:11,548
Well, that's not true.

413
00:33:11,548 --> 00:33:17,453
am, but so slowly because I keep on forgetting and keep on going push and then no hitting
that wall and no.

414
00:33:17,453 --> 00:33:23,517
How do you encourage people to slow down and stop and watch and do everything that you've
just said?

415
00:33:23,517 --> 00:33:26,210
Because it sounds deliciously easy.

416
00:33:26,210 --> 00:33:30,390
Well, anything that sounds easy isn't going to be, it?

417
00:33:31,190 --> 00:33:33,030
No, that's by definition, isn't it?

418
00:33:33,030 --> 00:33:34,650
know, nothing's ever easy, is it?

419
00:33:34,650 --> 00:33:35,970
That's worth doing.

420
00:33:37,930 --> 00:33:40,690
Well, this is the whole part of the journey.

421
00:33:40,750 --> 00:33:46,630
It's the whole part of trying to understand ourselves and what our purpose is.

422
00:33:46,770 --> 00:33:55,900
And a purpose doesn't have to be, you know, something where, you you're going to help 2
million people in 5 years to help with climate change or whatever.

423
00:33:56,158 --> 00:34:10,768
Our purpose can be to love and to show compassion and to give and to be the best of the
nanosecond that we're in versions of ourselves and be compassionate.

424
00:34:10,768 --> 00:34:13,390
We don't necessarily need this grand plan.

425
00:34:14,171 --> 00:34:23,647
But when I understood that I was part of something bigger and that I didn't make the
universe, I didn't, I can't make it all happen.

426
00:34:23,647 --> 00:34:25,118
I can't control it.

427
00:34:25,386 --> 00:34:28,990
The idea of control now is actually for me a bit laughable.

428
00:34:28,990 --> 00:34:33,305
But what I can do is be that vessel for what's to come.

429
00:34:33,305 --> 00:34:44,022
So encouraging people to slow down is people like to make the analogy I've found in
business of the devil's in the detail.

430
00:34:44,423 --> 00:34:48,466
And when you're focusing on detail, it makes you slow down.

431
00:34:49,334 --> 00:35:00,303
When you're big picture thinking and you're trying to rush through things or you're
multitasking, that's when the issues happen because we're not really meant to multitask.

432
00:35:00,303 --> 00:35:08,129
We're meant to do little bits at a time and not try and get everything in this melee of
everything else.

433
00:35:08,470 --> 00:35:19,498
And what I say to people is if we can think about the detail of the one thing that they're
looking to get and understand why they want it, what's the purpose behind it.

434
00:35:19,498 --> 00:35:24,381
And a lot of people then realize, well, actually, I don't really want the thing that I'm
going for.

435
00:35:24,842 --> 00:35:28,705
I want the outcome that I think the thing will give me.

436
00:35:28,705 --> 00:35:31,967
But the thing isn't necessarily the thing to get me there.

437
00:35:32,468 --> 00:35:38,162
So when we think about that detail in business, it's about analyzing what do we want?

438
00:35:38,162 --> 00:35:39,573
What do we really, want?

439
00:35:39,573 --> 00:35:41,614
What do we want the outcome to be?

440
00:35:41,614 --> 00:35:47,378
But from a sense of, has that got a purpose in my life?

441
00:35:47,670 --> 00:35:54,343
because I've wanted all sorts of things like fancy clothes and what have you, but that
doesn't necessarily fulfill the purpose of my life.

442
00:35:54,343 --> 00:35:59,675
So the reason why I wasn't getting them is that the universe was going, come on, do you
really want that?

443
00:35:59,675 --> 00:36:01,566
Is that the nature of what you want?

444
00:36:01,566 --> 00:36:03,477
Is it really what you want?

445
00:36:03,676 --> 00:36:10,700
And it's defining people in business with the detail, but what they want, is that really
what they want?

446
00:36:10,700 --> 00:36:14,922
And is the thing that they wanted to get there the right thing?

447
00:36:15,670 --> 00:36:19,451
And once they understand actually, let's open up the mind.

448
00:36:19,451 --> 00:36:21,592
Let's be a little bit more creative.

449
00:36:21,592 --> 00:36:28,913
Let's take some time to let things in and then to flow and to go with that flow.

450
00:36:29,054 --> 00:36:33,275
We all naturally guide us to where we need to be.

451
00:36:34,855 --> 00:36:40,658
And in business, because we give people back their time to be able to do these things.

452
00:36:40,658 --> 00:36:44,339
I always say, be very careful what you fill your time with.

453
00:36:44,935 --> 00:36:48,236
because time is a very, very precious resource.

454
00:36:48,796 --> 00:36:52,838
And once the moment has gone, it will never come back in the same way.

455
00:36:52,838 --> 00:36:57,659
And the fact that we have another moment after that moment is a blessing.

456
00:36:57,859 --> 00:37:09,862
So I always say to people, when you use your time that we give you, give it wisely, make
sure you're putting it into pursuits that are going to be for the benefit of you, of your

457
00:37:09,862 --> 00:37:12,265
loved ones, of humanity.

458
00:37:12,265 --> 00:37:14,277
of the world, of the universe.

459
00:37:14,277 --> 00:37:24,245
And if you put that intention out with that benefit, all of a sudden, all these cogs start
to move, all these incredible things start to happen.

460
00:37:24,245 --> 00:37:28,589
You start meeting the right people, which is miraculous.

461
00:37:28,589 --> 00:37:32,552
You start thinking of an idea which you never had before.

462
00:37:32,552 --> 00:37:39,338
You start maybe going on to a dietary regime that you've never thought that you'd do.

463
00:37:39,338 --> 00:37:41,441
You start to maybe think of

464
00:37:41,441 --> 00:37:45,074
going out into nature in a way that you've never done before.

465
00:37:45,114 --> 00:37:50,799
It's all those things then start to come up and business is no different.

466
00:37:51,120 --> 00:38:03,882
know, spiritualism in business is becoming more accepted because I think people realize if
we keep on doing the same things that we've always done, we won't get a different result.

467
00:38:03,882 --> 00:38:21,401
And so it's that education, it's that awareness of actually not trying to impose our will
on something, but actually have a more softer, gentler approach to allow the will of the

468
00:38:21,401 --> 00:38:24,703
universe to flow through us to do what we need to do.

469
00:38:24,763 --> 00:38:32,968
And that's where I think people have the greatest element of difficulty is thinking, well,
I've got to do something.

470
00:38:32,968 --> 00:38:34,078
I've got to...

471
00:38:34,700 --> 00:38:39,100
do the doing of it because I'm and actually they just don't get it.

472
00:38:39,100 --> 00:38:48,020
I was speaking to a very, very successful businessman just the other day and he said, I
think it's 50 % the universe and 50 % me.

473
00:38:48,020 --> 00:38:50,659
And I said, wait, but you are part of the universe.

474
00:38:50,659 --> 00:38:54,880
So where is that 50 % not connected with the universe then?

475
00:38:54,880 --> 00:38:58,710
And he's like, but I've got to do something.

476
00:38:58,710 --> 00:39:00,400
I've actually physically got to do it.

477
00:39:00,400 --> 00:39:03,606
I said, well, in a way, yeah, but it's directed.

478
00:39:03,606 --> 00:39:05,647
from outside from the universe to throw you?

479
00:39:05,647 --> 00:39:08,500
Are you sure?

480
00:39:09,901 --> 00:39:13,224
Yeah, because how else are you here?

481
00:39:13,264 --> 00:39:14,375
You're a little baby.

482
00:39:14,375 --> 00:39:20,069
You didn't have the knowledge of when you were a kid or a little tiny infant.

483
00:39:21,030 --> 00:39:27,986
I'm going to know how I'm going to feed myself or I'm going to know how I'm going to get
the milk from my mum's breast or I know how I'm going to crawl.

484
00:39:27,986 --> 00:39:28,877
You didn't have that.

485
00:39:28,877 --> 00:39:32,379
That was all divinely given to you as your instinct.

486
00:39:33,068 --> 00:39:42,788
and he's like, yeah, and I said and by three you'd have had three quantum moves in your
life you would have been able to feed yourself you would have been able to walk and you

487
00:39:42,788 --> 00:39:56,808
would have been able to talk but you didn't do that yourself and somewhere others people
get confused and I've done it so long it took me to 57 is to realise that actually us

488
00:39:56,808 --> 00:40:02,329
thinking that we're doing it is completely ridiculous because we're not

489
00:40:02,329 --> 00:40:16,043
It's the universe that guides us and when we get all into this, like I did, this
completely difficult state about I can't exist like this, we'll know because that's how

490
00:40:16,043 --> 00:40:17,746
wrong as human beings we can get it.

491
00:40:17,746 --> 00:40:35,035
And, you know, in a way, wouldn't it be wonderful if people in power in politics or, you
know, positions of influence could actually see this constant circle of fighting, of

492
00:40:35,416 --> 00:40:42,941
insufficiency, of anxiety around the world, but each one of them gets caught up in this
merry -go -round.

493
00:40:42,941 --> 00:40:44,742
And it's like, okay,

494
00:40:45,538 --> 00:40:49,080
But surely what you must see is that it's not working.

495
00:40:49,080 --> 00:40:51,741
So why don't we take a different approach?

496
00:40:52,262 --> 00:40:57,684
But each time they're just like the businessman that said to me the other day, well, I've
got to do something.

497
00:40:58,185 --> 00:40:59,076
And it's like, why?

498
00:40:59,076 --> 00:41:00,606
You haven't.

499
00:41:00,606 --> 00:41:04,588
You're going to be the vessel that then does the thing.

500
00:41:05,349 --> 00:41:08,701
And he was like, I kind of get it, but I don't get it.

501
00:41:08,701 --> 00:41:10,752
I kind of get it, but I don't get it.

502
00:41:11,312 --> 00:41:13,234
You know, it's a difficult concept.

503
00:41:13,234 --> 00:41:14,155
It's not an easy one.

504
00:41:14,155 --> 00:41:15,846
Yeah, needs some thought.

505
00:41:15,846 --> 00:41:19,679
For a long while, I evolved or devolved to be a human doing.

506
00:41:19,779 --> 00:41:31,248
And it is difficult to get out of that mindset, especially when you've been brought up by
it, when your parental things, as you said, work hard, work hard, work harder.

507
00:41:31,248 --> 00:41:35,471
And when you finish work hard, do a bit more and then you might earn some money.

508
00:41:35,471 --> 00:41:39,835
You might deserve the rest, you might deserve, but you have to do all that stuff first.

509
00:41:39,835 --> 00:41:49,110
I want to go back because before you kicked out your demon, what did you learn from all
those experiences?

510
00:41:49,110 --> 00:41:56,215
You've already mentioned that they, I don't want to say defined you, they helped create
you.

511
00:41:56,215 --> 00:42:06,862
those lessons, those traumas, those events, how did they help you comprehend the world and
how much of that do you still use going forwards with your life?

512
00:42:06,862 --> 00:42:11,699
So I liken this to a piece of hard wiring.

513
00:42:11,699 --> 00:42:24,438
So when we have a computer system, every now and again, and our phones as well, they tell
us that we need to reboot because there's been an upgrade or there's been something else.

514
00:42:24,778 --> 00:42:36,104
But when we don't do that, we stick in version one, plus a load of other stuff that we
kind of put in there and think is going to fit.

515
00:42:36,445 --> 00:42:37,305
So.

516
00:42:37,639 --> 00:42:45,875
I would have to say that none of the things that came in that monster were useful to me.

517
00:42:45,875 --> 00:42:48,298
They were all limiting and damaging.

518
00:42:48,298 --> 00:43:02,587
The things that had been going on, and I used the analogy of the quantum field where the
opposite of one exists, good and bad, that was already there.

519
00:43:02,646 --> 00:43:03,260
Mm

520
00:43:03,260 --> 00:43:09,986
compassion, humility, love, joy, peace, resilience, serenity, trust.

521
00:43:09,986 --> 00:43:11,326
It was there.

522
00:43:12,128 --> 00:43:20,174
So I was very fortunate in the sense to have a complete breakdown because it left me with
this massive vacuum.

523
00:43:21,015 --> 00:43:28,781
I couldn't put a plaster on anything to keep it together because there wasn't anything
left.

524
00:43:29,222 --> 00:43:31,327
And that was above and below ground.

525
00:43:31,327 --> 00:43:34,828
It had all gone because I had completely crumbled.

526
00:43:34,828 --> 00:43:37,769
I'd gone as I was before.

527
00:43:38,129 --> 00:43:42,230
So that was the greatest blessing that I could have had in my life, to be honest.

528
00:43:42,450 --> 00:43:47,872
And it could be perceived as the greatest horrible issue ever.

529
00:43:48,792 --> 00:43:49,913
But it wasn't.

530
00:43:49,913 --> 00:43:57,216
For me, it was framed in a way of thank you so much for stripping it all away.

531
00:43:57,216 --> 00:44:02,852
And so then all of the things that came in afterwards were the

532
00:44:02,852 --> 00:44:06,885
polar opposite, positive polar opposite to what left me.

533
00:44:07,866 --> 00:44:27,622
Now I know that there are areas of shadow in myself that, albeit that the, that ball of
evil left me, as always in human beings, we come from imperfection.

534
00:44:28,163 --> 00:44:30,947
So there's always going to be, as I'm now,

535
00:44:30,947 --> 00:44:38,192
living a life with challenge, lots of challenge actually, because that doesn't leave you
once you become awakened.

536
00:44:38,192 --> 00:44:49,130
It doesn't mean that you're living in this feather bed of a brilliant existence with
nothing ever happening that's not brilliant, because let me tell everybody, it still

537
00:44:49,130 --> 00:44:52,282
happens in abundance actually.

538
00:44:52,282 --> 00:44:57,357
But that's probably because you're able now to learn more and take it into a different
realm.

539
00:44:57,357 --> 00:45:03,591
But I still now work on that shadow because basically what happens every now and again is
I can be triggered.

540
00:45:04,373 --> 00:45:13,559
It happened not so long ago, a couple of weeks ago that somebody was talking about an
issue which I felt very strongly about because of my own childhood.

541
00:45:13,700 --> 00:45:18,133
And I could feel this bubbling of emotion coming up.

542
00:45:18,133 --> 00:45:26,530
And whereas before I'd be like suppressing, suppressing, well God don't show anybody that
I'm reacting to this, my God, you know, this is going to be embarrassing, don't cry,

543
00:45:26,530 --> 00:45:28,371
whatever you do, don't cry.

544
00:45:28,672 --> 00:45:30,633
And I could feel it welling up.

545
00:45:31,334 --> 00:45:35,657
And I thought, right, I'm going to thank it, thank the feeling for welling up.

546
00:45:35,817 --> 00:45:38,820
So I was going, thank you, that's great, thank you.

547
00:45:38,820 --> 00:45:44,394
And all of a sudden I realized, I have no control over this now, this is going to take me
over.

548
00:45:44,394 --> 00:45:45,946
This is going to take me over.

549
00:45:45,946 --> 00:45:48,023
And there's a reason why it needs to do that.

550
00:45:48,023 --> 00:45:49,724
because it needs to be released.

551
00:45:50,104 --> 00:45:55,287
And so the people that I was with, I said, I'm going to go now.

552
00:45:55,547 --> 00:45:57,228
And I thank you very much.

553
00:45:57,489 --> 00:45:59,189
I've just been triggered.

554
00:45:59,370 --> 00:46:03,152
I've been triggered for the last half an hour about the things that you've been
discussing.

555
00:46:03,152 --> 00:46:06,114
And the reason why I've been quiet is because I've been triggered.

556
00:46:06,114 --> 00:46:10,356
And now I have to remove myself so that I can handle it.

557
00:46:10,936 --> 00:46:14,038
They're all like, what's going on?

558
00:46:14,038 --> 00:46:15,713
You're a demonstrator wobbly.

559
00:46:15,713 --> 00:46:16,954
And I said, I love you all.

560
00:46:16,954 --> 00:46:18,205
It's got nothing to do with you.

561
00:46:18,205 --> 00:46:24,399
It's got nothing to do with the conversation per se, but the issues that were raised, I
can't face now and I'm going to have to go.

562
00:46:24,399 --> 00:46:28,912
I would appreciate it if nobody came with me because I need to be on my own.

563
00:46:29,473 --> 00:46:34,215
And I suddenly thought, my God, is that me talking?

564
00:46:34,596 --> 00:46:41,281
Is that me saying all of this rather than just getting up and leaving in floods of tears?

565
00:46:41,281 --> 00:46:44,783
I've actually expressed the whole process.

566
00:46:45,249 --> 00:46:47,000
of what's just been happening.

567
00:46:47,441 --> 00:46:52,645
And I took myself out and I literally put my arms around myself and I hugged myself and I
said, thank you.

568
00:46:52,645 --> 00:46:53,946
Well done you.

569
00:46:53,946 --> 00:46:55,487
You did it.

570
00:46:55,868 --> 00:46:56,889
It was brilliant.

571
00:46:56,889 --> 00:46:59,251
The feeling was incredible.

572
00:46:59,251 --> 00:47:13,312
I still felt pretty bad about the trigger, but that whole process of how I went through it
and obviously how I was analyzing what was happening is a real gift because once I could

573
00:47:13,312 --> 00:47:14,523
do that,

574
00:47:14,923 --> 00:47:19,966
and go, okay, I know why I'm reacting like this.

575
00:47:19,966 --> 00:47:22,447
I know why I want to shout at somebody.

576
00:47:22,447 --> 00:47:25,749
I know why I want to feel guilty about something.

577
00:47:25,749 --> 00:47:32,383
I know why I feel feelings of self -loathing and lack and what have I know why.

578
00:47:32,383 --> 00:47:38,276
And once I've got the why, I'm like, okay.

579
00:47:38,797 --> 00:47:40,757
It then dissolves.

580
00:47:40,998 --> 00:47:43,649
Weirdly, it just kind of just dissolves.

581
00:47:44,093 --> 00:47:50,345
And I went out of the restaurant and I walked down the road and I'm, thank you for feeling
like this.

582
00:47:50,345 --> 00:47:52,186
Tell me what I need to learn.

583
00:47:52,186 --> 00:47:53,776
I allow the feelings.

584
00:47:53,776 --> 00:47:57,347
It's all right to cry because I'm a good person.

585
00:47:57,347 --> 00:47:58,628
I've been through shit.

586
00:47:58,628 --> 00:48:00,848
I've, you know, I've, fine.

587
00:48:00,848 --> 00:48:01,348
I'm good.

588
00:48:01,348 --> 00:48:03,589
I'm having all of this experience.

589
00:48:03,589 --> 00:48:07,850
And I get some beeps on my phone, which I knew was from the people saying, you are you
safe?

590
00:48:07,850 --> 00:48:09,190
Are you okay?

591
00:48:09,350 --> 00:48:11,891
And I thought not going to deal with that until

592
00:48:12,087 --> 00:48:14,849
I'm in a point where I can deal with that.

593
00:48:15,190 --> 00:48:29,011
And so very quickly, very quickly, within about five minutes, I got to a point where I'd
congratulated myself on the understanding of what I've just been through, why it was

594
00:48:29,011 --> 00:48:41,275
happening, what was happening, thanking it and saying, you know what, as much as I love
you, little Deborah, we don't need that kind of behavior now because we're safe.

595
00:48:41,275 --> 00:48:44,455
and we're sound and we're going to be like this forever.

596
00:48:44,615 --> 00:48:50,995
So thank you for letting me know about that because for years I suppressed all of that and
told it to go away.

597
00:48:50,995 --> 00:48:52,895
And I said, thank you.

598
00:48:52,895 --> 00:48:54,175
And now we move on.

599
00:48:54,175 --> 00:48:56,525
And then I looked at my phone and they're like, where are you?

600
00:48:56,525 --> 00:48:57,655
You say for you, okay.

601
00:48:57,655 --> 00:49:00,495
And I went back to each one of them and I said, I'm all good.

602
00:49:00,495 --> 00:49:01,945
I'll be back in 10 minutes.

603
00:49:01,945 --> 00:49:02,935
Don't worry about me.

604
00:49:02,935 --> 00:49:03,875
I'm fine.

605
00:49:03,875 --> 00:49:05,215
Go have a good time.

606
00:49:05,215 --> 00:49:06,285
And I'll be back.

607
00:49:06,285 --> 00:49:10,757
And when I'm back, you don't need to ask me about anything.

608
00:49:10,757 --> 00:49:11,927
I'll be cool.

609
00:49:12,808 --> 00:49:20,210
And when I'm back, I was back and everybody went, no, we don't ask her if she's okay,
because she said not to.

610
00:49:20,870 --> 00:49:22,681
And off we go again.

611
00:49:22,681 --> 00:49:34,954
And now somebody else came back to me and they said, wow, that's taught me a lot because
similar stuff I didn't realize had happened to them and they weren't feeling great either.

612
00:49:35,274 --> 00:49:37,716
And I said, it's okay to be not okay.

613
00:49:37,716 --> 00:49:45,639
And so again, this whole journey is helping me to know that we don't have to be okay the
whole time.

614
00:49:45,639 --> 00:49:51,202
But when we're not okay, we can take it and go, what's it trying to teach me?

615
00:49:51,202 --> 00:49:53,022
How can I learn from this?

616
00:49:53,022 --> 00:49:54,723
And then how can I move forward?

617
00:49:54,723 --> 00:49:57,654
And if there is a positive way at that time, great.

618
00:49:57,654 --> 00:50:00,125
And if there's not, that's also great.

619
00:50:00,866 --> 00:50:07,222
But understanding that that will pass, that feeling will pass because everything does pass
in time.

620
00:50:07,222 --> 00:50:11,414
There's a biblical quote again, it's that this too shall pass.

621
00:50:12,014 --> 00:50:13,035
And it does.

622
00:50:13,035 --> 00:50:21,239
And it might take five minutes, it might take five weeks, it might take five months, it
might take five years, but it will pass.

623
00:50:21,239 --> 00:50:29,332
And as soon as I then surrender, the big thing about surrender is I've let go.

624
00:50:29,332 --> 00:50:31,133
I've let go.

625
00:50:31,133 --> 00:50:33,574
In that moment, I've let go.

626
00:50:33,798 --> 00:50:40,357
and usually what happens is then there's a serenity that happens from that surrender.

627
00:50:41,099 --> 00:50:44,585
And it's a beautiful thing to be able to do because I've not been able to do it before.

628
00:50:44,585 --> 00:50:45,245
Thank you.

629
00:50:45,245 --> 00:50:47,957
was beautiful.

630
00:50:47,957 --> 00:50:51,600
I think you've wrapped up the conversation.

631
00:50:51,600 --> 00:50:59,574
That is such a place to leave hope and a lot for people to think about, including me.

632
00:50:59,995 --> 00:51:02,155
Deborah, I think that was spectacular.

633
00:51:03,380 --> 00:51:08,423
We will definitely do another podcast another time, but yeah, that is to leave it for now.

634
00:51:08,423 --> 00:51:09,956
I'm sure there's going to be questions.

635
00:51:09,956 --> 00:51:13,743
I'm sure people are going to be curious about you and what you do.

636
00:51:13,743 --> 00:51:18,001
you know, this conversation, I know I want to continue it.

637
00:51:18,001 --> 00:51:21,597
How can people find out more about you and what you do?

638
00:51:22,564 --> 00:51:23,745
well, thank you very much.

639
00:51:23,745 --> 00:51:28,187
If there is anybody out there, I'd love people to be in touch.

640
00:51:28,187 --> 00:51:31,928
And one thing I say is I'm a great listener.

641
00:51:31,928 --> 00:51:33,289
don't make any judgments.

642
00:51:33,289 --> 00:51:39,232
If anybody wants to talk about something that has maybe triggered in them what I've
discussed, absolutely fine to do so.

643
00:51:39,232 --> 00:51:50,297
I'm on all the usual social media channels and I know that you'll pop those up as well and
I've got a podcast called Sphere of Being which is caring for those who care for others

644
00:51:50,777 --> 00:52:02,662
and so that's talking from my heart as well with a co -host of mine called Norma and we
have guests on that show as well and for me it's all about spreading the word and as I

645
00:52:02,662 --> 00:52:04,423
said right at the beginning.

646
00:52:04,739 --> 00:52:15,348
that there is hope, there is a way of doing things if life isn't easier, as easy as you'd
like it and you think that there's some things that you'd like to sort out, they can be

647
00:52:15,348 --> 00:52:18,791
sorted out, you can have a great time.

648
00:52:18,791 --> 00:52:31,401
But what I would say is, on the face of it, actually, life doesn't change in the sense
that you're with rainbows and bunny rabbits and things like that, you still get

649
00:52:32,202 --> 00:52:41,107
the issues, but it's the way that it's framed, it's the way that we can look at things,
it's the way that we're dealing with things, knowing that they're nourishing us for bigger

650
00:52:41,107 --> 00:52:51,373
and better things, they're giving us stepping stones to be able to move onwards and
upwards, rather than to drag us down and to swamp us and to make us into victims and being

651
00:52:51,373 --> 00:52:52,434
unhappy.

652
00:52:52,434 --> 00:52:59,279
But if you're prepared for that, then I'd say this journey is amazing, and I'd recommend
it to anybody.

653
00:52:59,279 --> 00:52:59,889
Absolutely.

654
00:52:59,889 --> 00:53:04,842
It is worth the bruise and knuckles, the banged head, scratched knees.

655
00:53:04,842 --> 00:53:10,114
It's worth absolutely everything because yeah, the grass is greener on the other side.

656
00:53:10,414 --> 00:53:21,869
You still have to carry wood, you still have to chop water all the other way around, but
you still, you do it with a different perspective and you've really shown me how important

657
00:53:21,869 --> 00:53:22,750
it is to do that.

658
00:53:22,750 --> 00:53:23,580
Yeah.

659
00:53:24,124 --> 00:53:25,128
Well, thank you, Hamish.

660
00:53:25,128 --> 00:53:26,295
It's been a real pleasure.

661
00:53:26,295 --> 00:53:27,377
Thank you.

662
00:53:28,253 --> 00:53:30,655
Then one last question.

663
00:53:31,036 --> 00:53:34,779
What did you learn from your 57th year?

664
00:53:34,779 --> 00:53:40,566
What was the superpower that you gained from that fairly harrowing experience?

665
00:53:40,566 --> 00:53:44,279
I was going to say something and now I've changed my mind.

666
00:53:44,279 --> 00:53:45,261
So thank you.

667
00:53:45,261 --> 00:53:46,163
The oneness.

668
00:53:46,163 --> 00:53:47,685
The oneness with everything.

669
00:53:47,685 --> 00:53:51,869
Being part of this amazing universe.

670
00:53:51,869 --> 00:53:55,833
Yeah, being one, being in the one is just...

671
00:53:55,833 --> 00:53:57,015
It's just awesome.

672
00:53:57,015 --> 00:53:57,746
It really is.

673
00:53:57,746 --> 00:54:01,762
So yeah, it's being in that oneness of the universe.

674
00:54:01,762 --> 00:54:02,535
Beautiful.

675
00:54:02,535 --> 00:54:03,657
Thank you.

676
00:54:03,820 --> 00:54:05,443
Thank you very very much.

677
00:54:06,077 --> 00:54:06,542
Lovely.

678
00:54:06,542 --> 00:54:07,287
Thank you too.

679
00:54:07,965 --> 00:54:12,325
Thank you for listening to this episode of The Crucible: Conversations for the Curious.

680
00:54:12,325 --> 00:54:20,965
If these powerful stories of transformation resonated with you, be sure to like, subscribe
and share this show with anyone who you think could do with a dose of inspiration for

681
00:54:20,965 --> 00:54:21,905
their own journey.

682
00:54:21,905 --> 00:54:28,485
I would really appreciate it if you could make any comments on your favourite podcast
platform as well, that helps me reach more people.

683
00:54:28,485 --> 00:54:31,945
All the important links and information are in the show notes below.

684
00:54:31,945 --> 00:54:34,680
Thank you very much for listening and catch up with you soon.