tyson (00:01.366) This one's a bit fancier. If I go blurry, don't stress, because the post-production, it sort of records locally, so it records you, it records me. So even at the end of this conversation, if I've looked blurry the whole time, the final product comes up crystal clear, which is good. Anyway, wait, before we... Brock (00:02.202) Yeah. Yeah! Yep. Brock (00:09.642) both sides, yeah cool. Brock (00:17.958) Yeah, nice. Nice one. I think I've heard I think I've heard a few posts. I've heard a few podcasters talking about Riverside. So interesting. Yeah. tyson (00:24.51) Man, it's so good. It's really good. I feel like I'm a hard man to please with technology and I can't fault them. I used to use them like two, maybe two years ago. I did a couple and I lost a couple of episodes. They just didn't record. And so I was like, yeah, I give up. But then like the last 12 months or something, they've refired. I don't know what's changed, but yeah, thank God. Brock (00:30.95) Yeah, good. Brock (00:36.954) Yeah, okay. Yep. Brock (00:44.11) sorted themselves out. tyson (00:48.47) I was going to say, before we even officially start, I've got to say, I've just seen an hour ago, a post that you are celebrating eight years with your lady, and I hope that you're not recording a podcast when you should be out for dinner, because I'm going to be in so much trouble. Brock (00:58.949) Yeah. Brock (01:02.618) Nah man, nah, you're all good, you're all good. We were gonna do something tonight but because we spent the whole weekend in the city and a lot of money, we were like, ah, that's our anniversary. So it's fine, it's all good. Now we're just, yeah, just chilling out. It's good actually, yeah, I'm surprised. Like a little bit slow getting up off the chairs and stuff but when I get moving, I'm fine. A little bit sore in the quads but that's about it really, yeah. So it's good. tyson (01:11.478) Yeah. Oh, yeah. Ha ha ha. How's the body today? tyson (01:28.226) That's good man. What did you end up running in? Oh, a Mizuno. Brock (01:34.554) Yeah, then Mizuno... Oh, I can't remember the news. They got one shoes blue, one's yellow. It's a bit fancy. Yeah. tyson (01:42.578) Oh dude, that is fancy. Yeah. And the reason I asked it so it's really interesting just hearing, uh, it's becoming less and less surprising. I reckon hearing from marathon runners or speaking to marathon runners who are, um, who are pulling up really well. So I'm still in a mindset that it's going to take weeks to see full recovery, but I mean, it's, it's so interesting. I don't know how closely you've looked at athletes like Brett Robinson, uh, and other world-class athletes, but the turnaround seems unbelievable for marathons at the moment. Brock (01:50.107) Yeah. Brock (01:55.162) Yeah. Brock (02:04.616) Yep. Brock (02:09.162) quick. Yeah, and I didn't even do the full blown super shoe. I was in the one down. Because I haven't really run in the super shoe yet and I know the stability is a bit of a thing you got to worry about. So I went in the one down and that was super good. They're so quick and yeah, it surprised me. The last time I ran a marathon was not in these sort of shoes and it took the whole week to get real good. Yeah. tyson (02:34.386) Yeah, what year officially was your first marathon? Brock (02:38.926) Uh, my first song was 2014 and that's like yesterday was my sudden day was my sixth. So I've done six now. Yeah. But my, my first two were quick and the others were plagued with injury. Yeah. So I don't count them. Uh, 20, 2015, 2015. Yeah. tyson (02:47.21) Oh, you've done six marathons. tyson (02:55.074) Sure, so when did you run 328? Okay, interesting. Okay, so I reckon as a, I mean, we'll start here. Let's start here and we'll delve into the details of that. So Sunday, Melbourne Marathon, three hours, 21 minutes, and I've got it up on my phone. 30 seconds on the dot. Sure, six and a half minute PB. Brock (03:05.83) Yeah. Okay. Brock (03:12.241) Yes. Brock (03:16.594) 30 seconds. Yeah, give or take, I think, yeah. tyson (03:25.234) I am so interested. I know I spoke to you after the race on Sunday. Let me handball it to you. You walk me through the day before, the morning of, and then let's have a look at the race. You explain to me what's going on. And then I thought it'd be interesting for people to hear a little bit about your lead up. Because I reckon your lead up is really, it's a really good lead up to use as an example of what can be achieved, or what a great result can be achieved through. Because I would say we didn't have the absolute. Brock (03:27.518) Haha. Yeah. Cool. Yep. tyson (03:53.798) smoothest lead up in the end. It turned out to be, it was very smooth for a long time. And then you handled a hiccup well, and then it was very smooth. And then there was a trip to Thailand and then there was a good race result. And so it's a fun conversation to have because I think not only did you handle the actual, that you, you didn't just handle the actual rollercoaster of a marathon build up really well, you ended up running a really big PB off the end of it. And I mean, that's a whole, that's a whole podcast in itself. We'll get to that in a minute. Brock (03:55.912) Nah, certainly not. Brock (04:01.126) Yep. Yep, that was... Yeah, true. It's a wild ride. Brock (04:19.208) Yep. tyson (04:23.126) So it's 24 hours before the race. You and your lady have made your way into Melbourne. You're ready to roll, walk us through it. Brock (04:23.204) Sure, sure. Yep. Brock (04:29.978) Yeah, yeah, well, I kind of wanted to set up really well for this one. So months ago, we booked the Saturday night in the city. Because I'm about an hour train ride out. And I'm so glad we did that because it turns out the trains weren't running the that day. So it would have been a chaotic drive in. So yeah, stayed the night before. Just so I could get up at a nice hour and my I just sort of got dressed, walked down to the start line. It was really quite relaxed. I felt really good. Like it was probably the most relaxed build up before a marathon that I've done. And I think that had a lot to do with it. But yeah, the night before we went out for a token pasta meal, got all the carbs in I possibly could and then ate some of the calves as well. Yeah, just got an early night, had a nice rest. And then, yeah, wandered down. It was quite a nice morning though. Like it got a little bit of drizzle before the start. Um, which was annoying, but, um, yeah, once the status gun went off, it was perfect conditions for running. Yeah, it was really good. Um, but yeah, that. tyson (05:38.058) Yeah, so talk us through, you were saying that the start was interesting as well, because you were surrounded by a whole heap of people who shouldn't have been at the part of the start line where you were, which is always the case when you've got 10,000 runners next to each other, there's always a couple of people going, I'm not really sure where I should be. And you explain, I mean, you can't tell this when you look at your first 5K splits, but that first K was probably a little chaotic by the sound of it. Brock (05:44.439) Yeah. Brock (05:52.087) Yeah. Brock (06:00.022) Yeah, yeah, probably almost like because it goes Batman Avenue, not many people know Melbourne, but it's pretty tight roads all the way through and you go into Flinders Street, which is tight and it's full of tram tracks and then you do another sharp turn and there's more tram tracks and it's just all bottleneck. So the first sort of K and a half. Yeah, there were people that were I don't know. probably should have been way back at the five hour pacer. And that's just the excitement of the day. People want to get up as close to the starting bell and Steve Monaghetty was there ringing the bell. So there was a lot of excitement. So I think everyone just wanted to be part of it. But once that gun went off, it took five to 10 minutes just to get some clear air. There's a lot of dodging and weaving. There were a few people falling over around me. So that was quite intense. And that really hurt the start. That was, I was like, oh no, this is going to be. you know, it's a long marathon. So I didn't panic but I was like, in my head, I was like, geez, 30 seconds when you're chasing PB's, it means everything like 30 seconds here 30 seconds there. It can really get to you. So I was just it was a lot of self talk in that first two case of like, just shut up, it's gonna be okay. You'll get through it. There's some good downhill sections that'll be easy, you'll be fine. So that was a bit of a challenge. But it wasn't unexpected. It was just a bit worse than I thought it would be, I suppose. But, yeah. It was... It's not the worst race I've done before like that. There's some trail runs that are like really bad, because they go to single trail really quick. So there was a bit of room to move, but people were having to jump up on footpaths and sort of ducking and weaving through spectators at points, because it was. It was just a lot of people that were really slow. tyson (07:26.946) How chaotic was it? Brock (07:50.214) And then there were the people who think they're much faster than they are and they were sprinting past. Which I always like because I love seeing them go past and I'm like, righto, take note of your shoes and I'm going to pick you off at about 30 kilometres. I'm going to track you down. So yeah, it's good. It was pretty hectic but it was alright. tyson (08:03.287) Yeah. tyson (08:09.918) A couple of, I guess a couple of just broader questions before we boil down to more specific ones. In terms of the fueling and hydration, you said the night before you got out, had a bowl of pasta. How did you feel the actual fueling part of it went? Were you happy with how you felt sort of energy wise? Did you feel heavy? Did you feel good? Do you think you nailed it? Was there room for improvement? Brock (08:15.998) Yeah. Brock (08:21.735) Yep. Brock (08:32.674) I actually think it was, I can't say perfect, but I felt really, really comfortable with, not only the buildup, the couple of days beforehand, I started to really build up the carb load and then went pretty hammer and tong at it on Saturday. And I was expecting to wake up in the morning feeling real groggy and heavy, because sometimes you do. But I think... I think I got the balance right. So I woke up in the morning feeling like full of energy. My legs were like, had that twitching and that excitement in them, the stomach didn't feel full. So I knew I wasn't going to get like an upset gut about 20 Ks in. Yeah, I felt really comfortable. It was yeah, really awesome. I was stoked with it. So, and then on the race I had my gels and you know, that sort of stuff with me. So that was good too, but I'm sure we'll get to that. tyson (09:24.039) Did you say you had, did you take six gels out with you, did you say? Brock (09:27.706) Yeah, yeah. So six gels. I just had one every half an hour, because that's what I've been sort of doing in training for the last the whole block. And it's pretty much the golden rule of marathons, nothing you want race day. So it was the same boring flavor that I'm used to. It was the same intervals. I think I'm not going to have them for a couple of months now. I think I'll just I might just take a banana out or something if I need to go for a long one, because I'm pretty sick of the flavour, but they got me through, they did the job. Yeah. They definitely pushed the wall out. I didn't hit the wall as early as I have in previous races. So it was a good... tyson (09:57.518) Yeah. tyson (10:01.854) Yeah, for sure. tyson (10:06.674) Yeah, yeah. And in terms of your hydration, were you just using the Melbourne Marathon tables, the ones that they had available? You didn't have anyone out there handing you drinks. Unfortunately, for everyone listening, I couldn't make it in to the Melbourne Marathon. So I would have been the man who ideally would have been passing drinks. I know, what a shame. We've still yet to meet face to face, which is the strangest thing is we've had so much success over the last 12 months and yet, still yet we haven't met each other face to face. Brock (10:13.862) Yeah. Nah. Brock (10:21.162) It's a big shame. Brock (10:25.138) That's okay. Ha ha ha. Yeah. tyson (10:34.146) I've just recently started coaching a bloke who ran the Melbourne marathon, he ran, sorry, the half marathon on the weekend. And he said he's coming up to Ocean Grove in a couple of weeks. So if I meet him after three weeks of coaching him, JR is his name. If I meet him after, it'll be an absolute shame. You're due for a coastal trip. I think Screams eight years is a good place to bring your lady for an anniversary. But anyway, that's just a long tangent to apologize for the fact that I wasn't there by your side. Brock (10:39.495) Yep. Brock (10:43.231) Cool. Brock (10:51.667) I am actually. Brock (10:55.366) Yeah, that's true. That's true. Brock (11:01.691) It's okay. That's all right. Yeah. tyson (11:03.766) You had to rely on the volunteers at the Melbourne Marathon tables handing you waters and gatorades. Brock (11:08.678) Yeah, they're absolute heroes. It was good. There was, it was sort of, I think the first water was three Ks in, which was, and I know in my head that I knew that, but when it came up, I was like, gee, that was quick. So that kind of really like, you know, that makes you pretty comfortable. There's gonna be a lot of water, Gatorade as well was on offer. So I think I've perfected the art of crushing the plastic, the paper cup to make it a funnel. So you don't end up with all of your face. So that's a skill that I've been honing for the last couple of years. So most of the water they offered, I was able to get down, which is good. It was good. Yeah. tyson (11:36.42) at release. That is a win. It's harder to do than it is to say. I actually, I made a YouTube video on this like three years ago, and it's not the most popular one, but I think it's had a few thousand views. And I'm like, that's interesting to me. I thought when I made that, 47 people would watch it. And I thought, it's interesting that a couple of thousand people have at least had that question enough to Google it or to YouTube it or whatever. So yeah, it's funny. I've had my fair share of just breathed in waters and waters that have sort of ended up on the ground. Brock (11:49.769) Yeah. Yeah. Brock (11:57.186) Yeah. Brock (12:02.286) It can... tyson (12:08.79) with me getting about 25 mils. Brock (12:09.026) Yep. Yeah, and that's a nightmare because that coughing fit can really hurt you. So yeah, yeah. tyson (12:14.914) So embarrassing as well. So we went into the race with the plan of, we were a little, not conservative, but we were cautious. Like we were, my only advice to you really was with regard to the actual race was stuff that you knew yourself. I mean, you coach athletes yourself, you've got your own running coaching business. It's not like, it's all news, but sometimes it's nice just to have a. Brock (12:19.813) Yes. Brock (12:24.093) Yeah. tyson (12:38.422) another bloke or another person to bounce ideas off. And my only advice or my only thoughts were, hey, let's just not get caught up too much in the adrenaline, the momentum, the excitement of the race and take out those first couple of Ks in four minutes flat when the pace that we wanna hold for the marathon is four minutes 45. And so with that said, I was an absolute pain in the ass to my wife all Sunday morning. I know we laugh because I woke up, I had the app ready to go. Brock (12:39.55) good. Brock (12:47.422) Mm. Brock (12:52.315) Yep Brock (12:55.783) Yep. tyson (13:04.778) and I was going through your split. So let's go through the splits. So for everyone listening, they're operated, or they're broken down into 5K intervals with a couple of random ones that I'll ask you about in a minute. So the first update came through at, I'll tell you my thoughts as they went through and then you tell me what was going on. The reality, so at 7.01, you've officially started the race. It says you've crossed that line, 7.01 and six seconds. Brock (13:08.362) Sure. Brock (13:13.894) Yeah, real weird ones. Brock (13:20.818) Sure, I'll give you the reality. Yep. Brock (13:29.682) Yep. tyson (13:30.646) Which is interesting, I'm not sure how they work those times, but that suggests that you're across that start line officially a minute and six seconds after the gun actually went. Brock (13:37.862) It's pretty much that I reckon that's exactly what's happened because Monagheti is always on time. So you can set your watch to him. He rang that bell at seven o'clock on the dot. So it took me that long to get through to the start line. So yeah. tyson (13:51.442) and 24 minutes and one second later, which is four minutes and 49 second pace. So four seconds off, but we'll give or take five to 10 seconds these first couple of Ks. We really don't care. The idea is just find your feet, get some rhythm, don't stress, we've got so much time in the, at this stage we still have 37 Ks left to make up anytime. Four 49s, my thoughts were, okay, he's obviously just finding some rhythm, he's finding his feet. I did think a little bit about the fact you might have been dodging and weaving. Brock (13:58.217) Yeah. Brock (14:01.99) Yeah. Brock (14:10.224) Yeah. Brock (14:15.986) Yep. Brock (14:19.593) Yep. tyson (14:19.678) I don't think I realised at that time how far back in that field you were and how much dodging and weaving was going on. But you're feeling good, 4.49, you're happy? Brock (14:26.218) Yeah, I was pretty comfortable like, and I think that's when I noticed a lot of people whizzed past me and I was like, whilst I'm I am trying to get through the crush of the crowd, I also don't want to be that person who ran past me at three minute 20 kilometers, because that's not worth it either. So I had to I had to kind of, you know, sit in that balance of feel comfortable, sit the shoulders down, stop, stop the tension, get it out of your body, and just let the crowd open up. Um, whilst also having that mild panic attack in the back of my mind, thinking 30 seconds could kill me. So yeah, it's a real balance, but yeah, that was, it was just that crush. So, and I, and the five seconds off the, the time that's, I was kind of happy just to sit there. I knew that it was under control. So yeah, pretty accurate. That first couple of kilometers was mostly just the crush of the people. Yeah. tyson (15:19.494) Then we go through 10k and your average for that 5k period from 5k to 10k is 451. I was happy. Brock (15:25.318) Yep. Yeah, that would make sense. Yeah, that's a bit more comfortable. Again, it was just that sort of staying conservative, just letting the body tick over knowing full well that there was room if I needed to push towards the end, I can get that pace back up. So yeah, it was pretty comfortable. There was no danger there. tyson (15:42.39) For sure. Now this is where my conversation started to get a little more interesting because as I said, I was offering running commentary to Jessie who's at her house, could not care less about the sport of distance running, was not interested in any of my commentary, had no concern for you and your wellbeing, just did not care. You'd get along well with her, but your running career, she doesn't care about it. If it makes you feel any better, she didn't care about mine either. But here's where it got interesting. So we knew that 445 was where we wanted to see ya. Brock (15:50.142) Heh heh. Yeah. Haha. Yeah. I'm irrelevant. Nah. Yeah. It's good. Yes. tyson (16:12.466) My commentary here when I saw the next one was like, all right, don't get too excited. This is me speaking to you from Point Lonsdale. You've averaged 440 for the next 5K, which has pretty much brought you back down to around our race pace. But I'm thinking, okay, I have an interesting feeling. I know where this is heading because it's early enough in the race to fool yourself that you're gonna run two hours and three minutes. And it's early enough to feel good and go, yeah, no, I'm back. So 440s, I was happy with that, but I was... Brock (16:16.546) Mm-hmm. Yep. Brock (16:26.398) Yep. tyson (16:42.462) a little asterisk next to it, because I was like, okay, I hope he doesn't get any ideas here and starts running away. But that sounds as though the package just opened up, you'd started to find a real rhythm, you're warm. Brock (16:47.398) Yep. Yeah. Yeah, and I have to admit your voice is in my head for a solid 90% of this run. Particularly when those numbers were rolling down and I was that's okay. And I was thinking, yeah, I'm sitting at 440s. Tais is going to be screaming at me because he knows what the plan is. But once we hit the 10k, it's kind of you run around Albert Park Lake, it's real flat, it's open. I kind of just hit a bit of a zone and tyson (17:01.483) I'm so sorry. Brock (17:20.126) had a little bit of a kick, fully aware that I didn't wanna go overboard, but I think I just cleared that pack and got into my rhythm. And then I was able to scale it back a little bit later on. But I did have you on my head. Yeah, that was, it was exactly right. I felt great. Yeah. tyson (17:29.954) That's all. tyson (17:33.62) And so we. tyson (17:38.374) And so this one was a little deceptive because it took me a minute to get my head around it. So it's 15K, the next split they give you is 16.9K. And I've looked at this and I've said, okay, here we go, he's having an absolute crack. Because the average split went from, so not forgetting the five Ks before your 440 average was 451 and then you've gone from 440 down to 432. So you've just dropped another eight seconds off the average and I've thought, okay, this is. Brock (17:42.192) I.S. Brock (17:49.013) Hahaha Brock (18:02.066) Heh heh heh. Heh heh. Yep. tyson (18:06.306) This is very interesting. I'm looking forward to hearing more about what's going on there. And then at the 20K mark, I'll do these at once because obviously it's like a scattered, I see a 509 and that's the average from 17Ks to 20Ks. And I've said to Jesse, I was like, all right, I'm hoping this is a toilet break because otherwise a drop like that suggests, I had no fear that there was any wall being hit that early because I'd seen how well you're training and how consistent you're training. I knew that wasn't an issue, but I was concerned that either. Brock (18:09.762) Yeah. Okay. Brock (18:27.898) Yeah, nah. Yeah. tyson (18:33.962) The only real concern I had was injury. I was thinking, okay, he's had to run into the loo or he's dealing with some kind of a cramp or an injury or something I don't know about. Cause we saw from 432, you dropped to 509. This was the only concerning part of the race where I was like, what's happened? What? Brock (18:36.179) Yep. Brock (18:44.87) Yeah, yeah, it was tactical. So yeah. Yeah, so I think I think the when it dropped to 440 earlier, I was starting to need a toilet break. I just I just had a bit too much fluid and I was just like the bladder was full. So I was like, all right, I think I've just got to kick. I got to kick maybe five seconds, okay, for the next little bit. And then the 430 I saw a toilet up ahead. So I was like, I'm going to push to that. So that was probably about a 500 meter, not all out, but it was like, you know, I got, I probably was sitting at four, 11, four 15s or whatever, knowing that I was gonna probably blow a minute in the toilet. So I was just banking time. So then that you see that roll over into the five oh nine and the next one, that was the toilets, toilet break. So yeah, the net, yeah, we were okay, but I didn't mean to panic you and I'm sorry about that. tyson (19:26.002) Yeah, yeah, sure. tyson (19:33.922) Beautiful. tyson (19:41.322) I mean, it's bound to be a couple of panic moments throughout a marathon, I'm sure, but that was just the first one. And then you've gone through, so 21.1, Kate, you've hit an hour 41.17. So obviously the goal, well, the old P beat at three hours, 28 minutes. I was very confident that on a good day, you were gonna beat that. I wasn't sure whether it was gonna be by as much as it was, or slightly less. We can get into that later and how much of a good result it was, specifically because of a couple of things that took place. Brock (19:44.021) Yeah. Brock (19:50.57) Mm-hmm. Brock (19:58.736) Yep. Yep. tyson (20:08.638) You're on track here. I thought okay. We want to see you roll home that last 12k especially so 21k You're at a say 322 pace pretty much 25 K's you've bought the average back down to 441 and then 448 to 30 and then let's just have a look at this last 12k so from 30 to 35 K average is 440 and How's the body feeling at this point? Are you thinking? All right, I'm struggling. I can build it up. Where's your head at? Where's your body at? Brock (20:21.801) Yep. Brock (20:30.068) Yep. Brock (20:35.438) Yeah, I was feeling okay. I knew that I was getting close to the limit of pace and I don't know why, but I didn't feel like I had heaps in me, but I felt if I stayed at that pace, I could go for a long time. Like I was confident at that pace, I could just keep going. So that was good to know. I also ran past some people on the side of the track that I wasn't expecting to see, just some sort of people from work who were down supporting someone else. So they gave me a bit of a kick as well. So... And that lasts a couple of k's, that little bit of a buzz. So I felt good, but I knew if I went too far, then I could blow up in that last five. So I was feeling pretty good, but I also, having run Melbourne before, I knew that they trick you. You're on St. Kilda Road. The MCG really is about two kilometres away, but your watch says more. and you know that there's more loops coming and they tend to take you around through like the botanical gardens and up past the Shrine of Remembrance and that's deceptively undulating. So I knew that was coming. So I didn't wanna smash it too hard. So felt good, but I was tactically waiting. At this point, another frustrating moment was when the half marathon sort of joined up with the full. tyson (21:40.038) Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. Were you in a group at this stage or are you running solo? Brock (21:56.774) So at this point I was back to ducking and weaving again. Cause it was kind of the tail end of the half, well not the tail end, but people kind of running at two kilometers in the half, or two hours in the half. So my pace was definitely off with theirs. So I was having to duck and weave again. So I was kinda, I had to pull away from a group that I was running in just to get through the crowd again, to get some clean air again. So a little bit of a tricky one, but that's okay. I expected that, it always happens. tyson (22:20.63) Yeah, yeah, sure. tyson (22:24.978) Yeah, and okay, so that makes sense because from 35 to 38.1K, it says your pace dropped from 440 to 458. So you're still feeling relatively good, just dodging, weaving, little bit of caution, for sure. And then, okay, so you hit 40, and then from 38Ks to 40Ks, this is your fastest average split for these two Ks. It was a 437 average, which I was pumped to see. From this point, I was thinking, all right, he's making a massive run for home. Brock (22:25.962) Thanks for watching! Brock (22:32.026) Yep. Dodging, weaving, going over the undulation as well. Yeah. Brock (22:46.347) Yeah. tyson (22:51.838) Um, it was, was really keen to find out what was going on there. And then that last 2.2 K you hold onto a four 50 to say, as I said, three hours, 21 minutes, 30 seconds, which is a great result. Were you, um, like when you crossed the line, what was the, what was the, were you feeling, were you stoked? Were you happy? Were you thinking that's about where I was at? Where, like, what was your mindset? Brock (23:08.209) yet. Brock (23:11.77) Yeah, I think I think I felt like I felt really great. So I made I made a really conscious effort like, because I was feeling pretty good this time around usually at a marathon. At that point, you're almost gone and you kind of forget to actually just take in the moment. So once I actually came onto the MCG, I actually slowed the pace down quite a lot because I was like, all right, PB is in the bank. I got heaps of time. I wasn't gonna make sub 320, so it was like, what am I sprinting for? So I just really took that last sort of 300 meters around the MCG to just look up, look around, just taking the crowd, because it was probably the biggest I've ever seen it there. And managed to see my partner and my in-laws in the crowd and my best mate Brody came down, which was lovely to see. So I managed to spot them, gave them a wave and finished it off nicely. So that last. That's something that I was really conscious to never try and take for granted and not forget it. So I'm really glad I did that. It meant that I probably finished 30 seconds slower than I would have, but who cares really? Like at the end of the day, it was cool to see that. And I can actually vividly remember it still, pretty much every step of that last lap, which was awesome. So yeah, it was cool. Yeah. So happy with a six and a half minute. tyson (24:25.534) Yeah, that's a cool attitude to take. Yeah, it's very cool. It's one of those situations where, sorry bro. Sorry brother, no you guys, it's the blessing in the curse of these online podcasts. Every now and then I think you've finished and go to jump in. No, no, you've got the baton, it's yours to run with. Brock (24:32.858) No, you're right. Brock (24:37.57) Yeah, that's okay. No, I was just saying it was I was stoked to get a six and a half minute PB that was like that was I've been chasing that for years to be honest, like seven years 2015 was when I ran my fastest. And then for whatever like underprepared and other marathons coming in. like with a little bit of an injury or getting a bit sore mid-race or really hot in 2018 which sucked I think you were there as well. Yeah so it was seven years yeah so many years of just like you know battling it out trying to get a PB. I was pretty damn stoked yeah really happy about it. tyson (25:11.086) Yeah, I don't like to talk about it. tyson (25:21.354) Yeah. And I was, I was really happy too. I was even more happy because I think, uh, even on the day, like there's, I often see it as like, there's different ways you can view it. Obviously we've got the lead up, which we can talk about in a minute, but then you actually have, how the race played out and, um, as good as the race was and as good as the result was, and as much as I was pumped and as much as we should fist pump and, and high five or whatever, um, it's like, okay, you look at the result and you go, oh, there's, there's two and a half minutes there pretty much Brock (25:43.367) Yeah. Brock (25:49.106) Yep. Yeah. tyson (25:50.91) Melbourne's not recognised for being a notoriously fast course. I know Liam Adams didn't have his best day out, but he's a 208 man and he ran, what, 215. I know he sort of burned his bridges towards the last little part, but even Ryan Gregson, I can imagine these boys running faster than what they did. And even just from the history of the course, it's not a course you necessarily go to try and run an absolute belter. So I mean, what we have to work with is obviously, Brock (26:13.626) Nah, it's not conducive. tyson (26:19.042) toilet stops, a little bit over-hydration, the fact that you had to stop there. The actual line up factor, like where you were, the fact that you're having to weave in and out of crowds, the hills and undulation. I mean, just those in themselves is an easy two minutes, which gives us our sub-320, which I've got absolutely no doubt in my mind, especially now you can run. I was saying to you the other day that when you're running six and a half minute PBs in the marathon, it suggests we haven't. Brock (26:21.158) Yep. Brock (26:29.81) Absolutely. Brock (26:37.852) Yeah. tyson (26:48.43) quite fine tune things down to a point where we're like, oh, okay, that's the limit. Like six and a half minutes suggests, okay, well, first of all, we're doing something right. But second of all, okay, we've got plenty more, which is really exciting to me. And I'm sure it was super exciting to you, but for sure, for sure. So, Brock (26:50.299) Yeah. Brock (26:57.075) Yep. Brock (27:00.466) Plenty of ceiling, yeah plenty of ceiling. Absolutely. tyson (27:08.81) The lead up man, the lead up was a very interesting one. And I think I've said this on the podcast before, you're one athlete that I know exactly when we started working together. Cause I was standing in the maternity ward at the Geelong hospital. Jessie had just had our second little guy, Ollie. And I said, hey, excuse me for a minute, babe. You look after little Ollie. I've got a new athlete to look after. Who's speaking half an hour, which went down really well. Actually could have something to do with the fact she's not bothered cheering for you on your marathon. Brock (27:13.736) Yeah. Brock (27:18.034) That's right. The boy, yeah. Brock (27:25.043) Ha ha. Brock (27:28.594) Yep, that's right. Brock (27:35.75) Yeah, fair. Yeah. tyson (27:36.65) race day based on the fact that she still holds grudges against me, very fair. But I would say, I can't remember specific dates, I can't remember, but we had a specific 16 week buildup, but obviously you were well and truly consistent with your running before then. Your, say first eight weeks or maybe seven weeks, we were laughing about the fact you just could not miss a beat. You were just ticking weeks off the list, like it was absolutely nothing. Brock (27:41.826) I apologize. Brock (28:01.06) Yeah, I couldn't break. Yeah. Brock (28:05.79) Yeah. tyson (28:06.194) And then just walk us through what happened, because you had a little bit of a shake up where you were doing a lot of cross-training for sort of probably three, three and a little bit weeks, maybe four, yeah. Brock (28:13.282) Yeah, three weeks, I think. Yeah, I think it was so, I did in the lead up, I had a lead up run just to test myself out at the run Melbourne half marathon. And I got a four minute PB for the half marathon there. Well done everybody, thank you. So that was a huge moment and I really felt confident there like my body was back. So it's been a long two and a half years to get where I'm at. So I was really stoked with that. And then... tyson (28:30.102) Hehehehe Brock (28:43.546) Yeah, the following, so that was the Sunday. And then I had a pretty light sort of Monday, Tuesday, and then the Wednesday, I went out just for an easy run, I think, and just felt a little tweak in the calf, like really low down towards the ankle. And then that was a bit of inflammation that I went straight to the osteo for. It turned out to be. kind of like an alignment with my hip, knee and ankle was a little bit out. So it had caused that in the run. So yeah, we had to back off for a few weeks, which wasn't ideal, but you know, kept it under wraps. Was very diligent. You kept me on the straight and narrow, kept telling me it was gonna be all right, which was good. Yeah. tyson (29:28.255) For sure, for sure. Yeah, so I would say that was one area that, obviously, I mean, this isn't news to you, but for everyone listening, that was one area that I think we had a lot of room for improvement as well. Because unfortunately, where it fell was kind of where I had scheduled a lot of your much longer runs. So we had gradually been building up, you were pretty consistently. Brock (29:38.611) Yeah. Brock (29:46.714) Yeah, the real heavy stuff. tyson (29:49.57) you know, you're ticking over 20, then it was 22s, then it was 24s, then it was 26s. And I like the idea of getting you up well and truly over sort of that 30K mark. I was ideally in a perfect lead up. I was thinking I would have loved for you to get sort of four or five, maybe even six runs, potentially between sort of 32 to 36Ks, not necessarily towards that upper threshold of that. And as a result, we missed a few, you got, you still got, what was it, two? Brock (29:51.666) Yep. Brock (30:09.167) Yep. Yeah. Brock (30:17.774) Yeah, I think I... Yeah, I reckon. tyson (30:17.87) I think maybe three over 30. There was definitely, there was one at 28, one at 30. I remember there was something, yeah. And I was flirting a little bit. I mean, even two weeks out, you just got back from a trip with Kath. Kath or Kath? Yeah. And I mean, you got back and, I mean, two weeks out is probably closer than I'd usually like to give out a run at this distance. But we scheduled you in for like a 30 to 34K run. Brock (30:22.874) 13 and a 32 I think. Yeah. Brock (30:31.49) Yep. Yep, Kath. Not Kath yet. Brock (30:41.852) Yeah. Brock (30:46.94) Yep. tyson (30:47.346) And part of that was because I think psychologically for you, it's nice to have the opportunity to really stretch legs out for what is relatively close to race distance, because always that, that last eight K's a really interesting one, but I mean, I was, I was a little hesitant with that because I was thinking, oh, it's, it's closer than I would like it to be for a run this length, but at the same time, cause we'd missed so much in the buildup and so much of that distance, I thought I'd be the good would outweigh the outweigh the bad. So Brock (30:56.859) Yeah, exactly. Brock (31:07.108) Yep. Brock (31:15.643) Yeah, yeah. tyson (31:15.914) I mean, it seems as though that last, and after that, like we had a relatively light, or maybe the biggest session was on that Tuesday or Wednesday, or even Thursday, we might've pushed it out too. Brock (31:23.57) Yeah, I think we had like, I think, I think we might've had like a 15K sort of tempo-ish one on the Thursday, and then a pretty easy weekend and then backed it right back there last week. But that long run coming back from Thailand didn't feel like it was unachievable or dangerous because I'd had kind of like a mini 10 day taper while in Thailand. So in my mind, the body was actually quite rested. tyson (31:31.926) I think it was the Thursday, yeah. And. tyson (31:47.442) So yeah. Brock (31:51.822) I did some running while I was over there, but nothing huge, just nice easy runs by the beach which was kind of a little bit of paradise for me. So coming back doing 30, the body didn't feel like it was being pushed or it was fatigued. It was actually quite a nice thing to wake up back up again. Yeah, so I felt like that actually helped. Yeah. tyson (32:07.698) sure. Yeah, now that's good news. So post race Sunday night you're sitting there, you're reflecting, celebrating a six and a half minute PB. Like your thoughts on okay, hey what went really well in the lead-up and next time what do we need to what do we need to refine, what do we need to improve? Brock (32:18.217) Yeah. Brock (32:26.554) Yeah, like you said, the first eight weeks, I think, were just pretty much flawless, I think. That was probably the best eight week block of running I've ever done. And it was because we had such a big base before that. It was what, October, November, November last year when I started running under you. So, yeah, so November to like July, that's a fair block of base building. So I felt really good there. That little injury. I don't know, I think unavoidable. I don't think I'm holding myself too accountable to that one, that was just obviously hip alignment. So maybe some more focus in the gym now, and that's kind of where I'm gonna go after, like into the summer, it'll focus back on getting the body back in line, treating it kindly again and building up some strength and mobility and function. So that's definitely something I need to focus on a bit more now in the summer, in the off time I think. But yeah, as far as dealing with the injury, felt pretty good. I think I was tempted to push it, but I didn't. And I really learned that and we got a good result from that. So I think that's a mistake I won't make again. Thank gosh. Because that's why I came to you in the first place. I kept making those darn mistakes. So yeah, that's a big benefit of getting a coach, folks. Just having someone else in your head for a change is quite nice. tyson (33:41.366) Hehehe tyson (33:47.434) Heheheheheheh Heheheheh B**** Brock (33:55.674) Yeah. tyson (33:55.758) Well, yeah, I'm biased obviously, because I mean, maybe you and I both are based on the job title that we both have. I mean, you're doing your coaching, you've got athletes that you're coaching as well. But I don't know how you feel, but I often felt that throughout my running career, it was always, especially towards the end, it was like, okay, I know what training my coach is gonna set me, I know exactly what he's gonna say, I know what the session will be, I know why he's gonna set it, but it was almost, it was more just that mentor role. Like even, it's so funny, isn't it? There's a difference between having the knowledge and actually having the emotional Brock (34:03.73) Yeah. Brock (34:13.639) Yeah. Brock (34:19.795) Absolutely. tyson (34:26.338) control to actually be able to go, okay, well you're dealing with a niggle here. It's so dumb. I mean, perhaps I need to follow my own advice and get some coaching because I was laughing at the fact that I was in a rush to get myself organized. And I was like, there is no way I'll treat any of my athletes the way I'm treating my own body right now. And as a result paid the price. And it's the exact reason I had a coach for so long is because I need someone to go, hey dickhead, stop. You know you're doing the wrong thing. But when it's just you. Brock (34:26.782) Mm. Yep. Brock (34:44.43) Yeah, calves. Yeah. Yeah. tyson (34:54.386) in your own brain, it's so easy to go, nah, I'm sure it'll be right, I'm a machine, I'll get through this. And then the next week you have to post on Strava, okay, there's a calf strain again, I humbly apologize to everyone. But yeah, no, it is really interesting. But yeah, as I said, I'm biased, but that's the benefit I often see. It's just the fact that it's someone to keep you on the straight and narrow when you've got the temptation, which distance runners have the reputation for having to go out and do something crazy. Brock (34:56.902) Yeah, it'll be fine. Yeah. Brock (35:02.067) Ha ha ha! Yeah. Brock (35:10.224) Yeah. Brock (35:17.714) Mm hmm. Yeah, that's true. And sometimes it works the opposite way to like, there was times when I was like, Oh, I think I'm starting to get a bit tired here. But like, if it was just me, I would back off. But you would chuck in just that little bit of extra spice into a session. And I'll be like, Oh, I don't know, it's a bit but I'll give it a go. Trust him. And then doing that session. It kind of clicked and it took me to the next level. So sometimes when you're doing your own plan. whilst you can sometimes go too far, you can also back off at the wrong times too. So it's really good to have that other person that is just looking at the data and your feedback and then not actually in your own head sort of doubting yourself or pushing yourself, which is nice. So that was really good. tyson (36:03.367) That's a good point. Nah, that's good to hear. And for context for everyone listening. So as we said, but you were just, there were weeks where you're just absolutely nailing sessions and I mean, like volume, we had some pretty similar session structures. Like we were dancing through the monopharlex, we were dancing through some thresholds, some slightly more intense thresholds of like 2K reps, 3K reps, and then your intervals of 1Ks and stuff from time to time. And you were just ticking boxes left, right and center. And every now and then I always find it nice just to go, okay, well we've had Brock (36:20.058) Yeah. Brock (36:30.492) Yep. Brock (36:35.786) Hm. Yeah. tyson (36:35.938) four weeks of pretty solid running. Like he's handling this well, which is where I like to sprinkle a little bit of spice in just once and just see how it was handled. And then I always get excited on a Monday morning when I, that's usually the day I go and have a good look at training peaks and click inside the details of training sessions and see what everyone's been up to. And that you are one profile I love clicking on because quite often you scroll through the details, you're like, okay, we're heading in the right direction. But I think one thing that I really... Brock (36:41.254) Yeah. Brock (36:48.946) Yep. Brock (36:58.479) Yeah. tyson (37:03.09) admired about your buildup was just the way you handled yourself throughout that three-week block where things weren't perfect, where you couldn't run. Because it can be quite stressful if you allow it to be, regardless of what level we run at, when you've got this idea of what a perfect preparation looks like, and all of a sudden three weeks of cross-training is thrown at you and you have to acknowledge, okay, this is no longer ideal preparation, but we have to just navigate our way through and make it work. How are you navigating that emotionally? Because every time I spoke to you, you sounded Brock (37:18.186) Absolutely. Brock (37:27.921) Yeah. tyson (37:33.014) Um, you sounded relatively relaxed about the whole thing, which was, which I was for sure, but I mean, it's different from my shoes to yours. Brock (37:36.538) Yeah. Um, to be honest, the first week I felt totally fine. I was like expecting it. I was like it's 16 weeks of flawless preparation is just it never happens. No one ever happens to that like that. Kipchoge doesn't even get there. Right. So, um, in my mind, when I first did the injury, I was like, all right, a week, that's fine. It'll calm down. It's just a little tension, maybe an inflammation. tyson (37:50.862) Hehehehe Brock (38:04.646) It's fine. And then the end of the first week started to roll around. I was like, Okay, this is this is stubborn. And I'm not looking forward to doing another week. So that's when I booked in with the osteo. And then it was that end of that first week, he was like, Oh, yeah, now you'll be back in about two weeks, I'd say. And that's when my heart hit the floor. Because I was like, two weeks, that's then going to be three. That's nearly a month of a buildup. And it's towards the pointy end of that buildup. And tyson (38:09.938) I'm sorry. tyson (38:29.198) See you. Brock (38:34.414) It was a little bit of panic. But then I was like, well, I can still do, still get on the bike, I can still do gym and mobility stuff as long as I don't load that ankle too much. So I knew there was still stuff to do. If I had to just totally stop, that would have freaked me out, no end. So being able to keep busy helped so much, yeah. tyson (38:54.842) Hmm. For sure. And outside of obviously the strength, mobility and things that you just mentioned, what are you, have you got your eyes cast on anything at the moment? Is there any races or marathons in the future you're looking at? I'd say this with an asterisk next to it. I'm flirting with the idea of going up to Gold Coast next year, but I'm also taking a lot more of a slower approach. I'm just gonna get out there and enjoy running for. Brock (39:07.877) off Brock (39:12.274) Yeah right. Brock (39:16.684) Yeah, okay. Yep. Nice. tyson (39:18.59) for a few months and then I'll make decisions. But I like the idea of other half or a full upper gold coast, which I'm trying to entice or I'd like to entice you to come up because speaking of fast courses, I feel like that's one you could do a bit of damage at. And I mean, whether it's the next race or in the next few races, I've got no doubt that three hour barrier is well and truly under threat. You know, when we not necessarily even nail the preparation, but just when we get a bit used to just that long, consistent running, getting it in your legs. Brock (39:24.563) Yep. Brock (39:29.454) Yeah, it's a quick one. Yeah. Brock (39:39.067) Yeah. Brock (39:47.514) Yeah, yeah. tyson (39:48.558) Again, the course, getting you in the right spot, just nailing a few little bits and pieces that we didn't quite nail, but we did relatively well. Brock (39:56.302) Yeah, we learned a lot of lessons. Yeah, I was actually thinking about that. Like any runner, you guys will understand this. But I think I finished the finish got across the finish line on Sunday. And you get the medal, you do the celebration, you kind of cool down. And then it was Sunday night in the hotel. I was like, what next? And I was like, No, get out of that. Like, just sit in this for a little bit. Like, stop trying to race the next race. You've only just you still saw like. So there was a little bit of that. tyson (40:18.086) Yeah. For sure. Yeah. Brock (40:25.882) And then it was kind of like, today I was like, all right, what now, what I've got to talk to Tice tonight. And I know he's probably gonna ask me what's next. And I probably should have an answer. So like, obviously marathons for sure. That's the pet event. That's where I wanna aim at. Well, I don't know when the Gold Coast exactly falls. So I imagine that it'd have to be a fly up, fly back. That'd be a pretty expressed weekend. Because I've got. Got my wedding in April next year. Oh, is it middle of the year? So I got my wedding in April. So that's gonna be a little bit of time off. That's all right. And then I've got my honeymoon in September. So that's time off work that I have to take. So it might have to be, if I'm gonna go out for the weekend, it's gonna be pretty quick. I might be able to take the Monday off. So it's tempting. And then there's the cost. tyson (40:54.69) Yeah, it would. I think it's like Juno. Ah. tyson (41:11.019) That's all. tyson (41:14.326) Heheheheheheh! tyson (41:18.583) We'll talk more, we'll talk more. As you say, while the leagues are still tender, it's probably too early to plan. Yeah, for sure. Brock (41:24.422) Yeah, yeah, absolutely. But as for like what events to go to next, I don't know, it's sort of, I had I had a picture of sort of the summer being hot, I real struggle in the heat. So maybe shortening the distance down and working a bit on speed. Maybe getting up to a quicker 10k and stuff like that really getting like a bit more power and in there and then I know April, the baller at the first baller at marathons on So whether I've been aiming for a half marathon there or something, I'm not sure. I'll have a couple of weeks to think it through, I think. Yeah. tyson (41:56.806) Yeah, sure. Little food for thought. Nah, awesome man. Well, hey, I won't take up your whole evening, but dude, I'm pumped. I was excited to get you on here and break that down because I know it's really interesting, not just for me to ask the questions, but for people to hear about the preparation of a marathon runner, especially when the results are so positive on your end. So yeah, it was a huge plus for me because it makes me look real good as a coach having an athlete run six and a half minute PB, but the credit's all yours. And obviously, as I say, we just... Brock (42:15.815) Yeah. Brock (42:20.062) Ha ha ha! Yep. tyson (42:26.646) Yeah, partnered up on the same mission, which has been fun. So the first 12 months has been awesome. I'm really pumped to see whether it's sort of five or 10K or marathon again in the next 12 months. Yeah, it's gonna be exciting to have this chat in 12 months time and find out where you're at. Brock (42:29.882) Yeah, it's been good. Yeah, big tick. Brock (42:37.747) Yep. Brock (42:41.734) Yeah, it'd be good. Yeah, work on some speed and some strength over the summer and then we'll chase down that elusive sub three one day, for sure. That's the goal, that's the goal. I'm only 33, I've still got a few years to chase it, I reckon. So we'll get there. I know. Yeah, but a 23 year old just smashed him out of the park. So who knows what's going on anymore. It's nuts. Yeah, it's gonna be a good Olympics next year, that's for sure. tyson (42:50.03) Come on, come on, for sure. tyson (42:56.142) Dude, Kipchoge's 57, he's still running 201, you're fine. tyson (43:05.571) Isn't that wild? Yeah, anyway. I know, kip-tum, here we go. Oh, to say the least. All right, man, I'll leave you to it. Thanks so much for jumping on and sharing that with us. All right, see you later. See you everyone. All right, I'll cut that off there. Brock (43:12.354) Yeah. All right, mate. Cheers. Thanks, Taz. Yeah, thanks, mate. Cheers.