WEBVTT
Kind: captions
Language: en-GB

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I'm Travis Bader, and this
is the Silvercore  Podcast.

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Silvercore has been providing its
members with the skills and knowledge

00:00:18.030 --> 00:00:22.800
necessary to be confident and proficient
in the outdoors for over 20 years, and

00:00:22.800 --> 00:00:26.820
we make it easier for people to deepen
their connection to the natural world.

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If you enjoy the positive and educational
content we provide, please let others

00:00:32.975 --> 00:00:37.830
know by sharing, commenting, and
following so that you can join in on

00:00:37.830 --> 00:00:39.630
everything that Silvercore stands for.

00:00:40.710 --> 00:00:43.350
If you'd like to learn more
about becoming a member of the

00:00:43.350 --> 00:00:49.250
Silvercore Club and community,
visit our website at Silvercore.ca.

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I'm sitting down with Trevor Public
over the Vice President of Sales for

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Armament Technology Incorporated.

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They make, according to one very
prominent optical physicist, the best

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rifle glass in the world, and they're
located here in Halifax, Canada.

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Trevor, welcome to the Silvercore Podcast.

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Pleasure

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to be

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here.

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So of course, that prominent
optical physicist, that'd

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be, uh, Ilia, Ilia Kashkin.

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Yes.

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And he is an individual who does not
mince his words, will tell you what

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he thinks, whether you like it or not.

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And when I was exploring different
optics with him and talking about

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different glass that they have
out there, he says, you know what?

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It goes to you guys, you Canadians,
best glass quantifiably in the world at.

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And that's gonna be
your tangent theta line.

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That's correct.

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Yep.

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So that really peaked my curiosity and
uh, I wanted to learn more about ATI and

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Tangent Theta about what you guys do.

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And it's actually a pretty fascinating
story and, uh, you've got some

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interesting stories yourself.

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And I kind of broke a golden rule that
I usually have, which is don't talk

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to the person really ahead of time.

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, don't talk to the person ahead of time.

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And because when you get into the
podcast and you want to talk and

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you want to ask questions, you
want it to be natural and something

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that you don't know the answers to.

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So there's a whole bunch of things
that I've been kind of holding in

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the back of my head, although we
have spent in the last couple days

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together and I got a good tour of
the factory and, and what you guys.

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But, um, why don't I throw it over to
you a little bit and, um, you can tell

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me a little bit about the history of ati.

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Sure.

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Um, I'll be happy to, honored to be here.

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Thank you.

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Um, really appreciate you jumping on
a plane and flying all the way to.

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You know, little old Halifax Nova Scotia
to, to see us and honestly, my pleasure.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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So we are a little
strange for the Maritimes.

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Um, we're unique probably in Canada
and most places of the world, and we

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do have a pretty unique story in it.

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I, I, I think it's a pretty good story.

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Mm-hmm.

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. Um, so Armament technology, uh, was
founded in 1988 by Andrew Weber and Andrew

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Weber is still the single owner of the
company, um, since retired from his day

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to day kind of positions and maintains
our, uh, executive consultant position.

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So he gets to come in when he is not
out enjoying life fishing, hunting, and

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kinda, you know, metal in our business
when, uh, when he is a metal there.

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But it's a good meddling, so, yes.

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Um, it's nice to have him around.

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Um, so Andy back in 1988 was
working out of his basement.

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Making sniper rifles, um, for
the police and the military.

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So he was modifying a 700, um, platform.

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Sorry, Remington.

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Remington, yes, that's the word.

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And uh, that got complicated.

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We, he at the time, was
selling to Australia.

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There was some contracts in the United
States, um, Boston Police Department,

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several Canadian contracts, and it became
very hard to convince a purchasing officer

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why his Remington 700, which was $5,000,
was better than a $800 outta the box.

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Right?

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700 even though his was far superior.

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Right.

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Uh, we, that just kind of changed
one day on the range, um, in Knot.

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Um, cuz Andy was a competitive
shooter, has been all of his

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life, and had a relationship with
Raytheon Elkin Elkin at the time.

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Ernest Lights.

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Corporation.

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Yeah.

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And they made the elk can C 79.

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Right.

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So for all of us Canadians,
it's a very iconic scope.

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It's on every single rifle that
the Canadian military carries.

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Um, it's either the big black
or the big green thing on the

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top of the, on the C7 or the c8.

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And um, back in that time
it was about 90, 91, 92.

00:04:58.919 --> 00:05:03.210
There was a few issues with the C
79 and it wasn't retaining zero.

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Andy being the machinist and the, and the
mind that he was, had figured out a fix

00:05:10.739 --> 00:05:14.820
for that on his own because he was having
problems but was comp, uh, competing in

00:05:14.820 --> 00:05:18.299
service rifle stuff, and was at the range.

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And he was beating all of the
military guys in the competition.

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And there was a group of course
shooters that would travel from here

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and go up to Ontario and, and compete.

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One day, one of the commanders come up and
said, why is it that your group of guys

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using the same equipment that my guys are
using and you're beating us consistently?

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Right?

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And Andy's like, well, it's because
yours is not the same as mine.

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And I found a, you know, a zero retention
issue and I found a way to fix it.

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And at that time, the guy
said, well, can you fix ours?

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And Andy's like, ah, yeah, absolutely

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fix it.

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. 
So that's really when our armament that
you are in today kind of kicked off.

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It was the, the maintenance and repair
and support for every single elk can

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scope that the Canadian military had.

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So that amassed to about 80,000 scopes,
every single one of them, uh, over

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the course of their, now still current
lifespan has come through this office

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in some cases, two or three times.

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So we've maintained that repair,
support, refu, uh, refurbishment

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for the military for the last.

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15 years and still today.

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That's awesome.

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We still do that today.

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So it's a, it's been a
core part of our business.

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Um, we've obviously evolved from that into
multiple other, uh, divisions and brands.

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Uh, the, the story kind of started
first with us representing Acan

00:06:52.875 --> 00:06:56.235
outside of the C 70 high scopes
to a commercial market, right?

00:06:56.294 --> 00:06:57.855
So the Specter Dr.

00:06:57.945 --> 00:07:03.044
Um, the one to four, the one and a half
to six, we were, and we still are the

00:07:03.050 --> 00:07:05.115
master distributor for Alcan, Raytheon.

00:07:05.594 --> 00:07:10.275
And that meant we handled the commercial
business in Canada at the beginning, and

00:07:10.275 --> 00:07:15.075
then we started to evolve that into the
United States and now kind of globally.

00:07:15.105 --> 00:07:19.815
So we are active in about 52
different countries around the world.

00:07:19.995 --> 00:07:23.145
Um, not just for Alcan, but for
all of the products that we do.

00:07:23.655 --> 00:07:24.224
Um, we.

00:07:25.155 --> 00:07:31.364
That really was the beginning of
something different from the C 79 s

00:07:31.364 --> 00:07:34.844
that we did that that supported that
contract was still running strong.

00:07:36.240 --> 00:07:41.940
then, uh, premier Radicals was a
company out of Virginia, right?

00:07:42.000 --> 00:07:42.120
Yeah.

00:07:42.150 --> 00:07:45.450
And they did long range sniper telescopes.

00:07:45.450 --> 00:07:50.640
We were a distributor for
Premier, so we would buy scopes.

00:07:50.875 --> 00:07:53.965
Bring them in, resell them
to our distribution network.

00:07:54.085 --> 00:07:55.585
Took the risk on the inventory.

00:07:56.125 --> 00:07:56.215
Right.

00:07:56.395 --> 00:07:58.795
Which is a familiar theme moving forward.

00:07:59.365 --> 00:08:02.815
Uh, as many people may know, if you're
familiar with the long range shooting

00:08:02.815 --> 00:08:04.765
community, premier had some troubles.

00:08:05.094 --> 00:08:07.914
They went out of business
and they weren't solvent.

00:08:07.975 --> 00:08:12.655
And basically there was several
years where nothing happened and

00:08:12.655 --> 00:08:16.975
Andy wanted to do something different
because he was a competitive shooter.

00:08:16.975 --> 00:08:19.075
He's won medals all around the world.

00:08:19.375 --> 00:08:21.055
Um, he's very accomplished.

00:08:21.085 --> 00:08:25.615
He couldn't find what he was looking
for in the market at that point in time.

00:08:25.765 --> 00:08:25.945
Hmm.

00:08:26.725 --> 00:08:30.145
So he said, you know what,
I can do something myself.

00:08:30.205 --> 00:08:33.865
And we had a relationship with the
people who had previously owned

00:08:33.895 --> 00:08:39.205
Premier and cracked a deal so that
we bought the assets of Premier.

00:08:40.345 --> 00:08:40.855
That was it.

00:08:40.914 --> 00:08:43.255
It was like the machines spare parts.

00:08:43.314 --> 00:08:48.235
Um, we had some inventory here
and Andy set out to design.

00:08:48.594 --> 00:08:52.854
And manufacture and distribute what
we would've considered the best

00:08:52.860 --> 00:08:56.245
scope or what we would want it to
be the best scope on the planet.

00:08:57.505 --> 00:08:58.495
That's a lofty goal.

00:08:58.704 --> 00:09:03.415
It was a lofty goal, and it still
maintains to be a lofty goal, but

00:09:03.415 --> 00:09:06.055
we've come a long way in the last eight

00:09:06.055 --> 00:09:06.474
years.

00:09:06.895 --> 00:09:12.594
Well, a lofty goal from somebody who's
building Remington's 700 s and izing

00:09:12.594 --> 00:09:16.885
them and selling them, and then getting
into the optics world that, I mean,

00:09:17.305 --> 00:09:23.005
there's a entre, entrepreneurial sort
of spirit that goes with all of this,

00:09:23.010 --> 00:09:27.265
which is, uh, something that really
kind of, uh, uh, sat in the back of my

00:09:27.265 --> 00:09:32.005
head and was, uh, reinforced meeting
everybody here and meeting Andy.

00:09:32.785 --> 00:09:34.285
You know, that's saying,
show me your friends.

00:09:34.285 --> 00:09:35.275
I'll show you who you are.

00:09:35.305 --> 00:09:35.605
Right?

00:09:35.814 --> 00:09:36.175
Yeah.

00:09:36.355 --> 00:09:42.265
Well, when you go to a company and,
uh, let's say you go to your local

00:09:42.270 --> 00:09:46.734
subway and the people who are uh,
working there are happy and chipper you.

00:09:47.625 --> 00:09:51.225
Got an idea as to what management's
like and, uh, what work environment

00:09:51.225 --> 00:09:52.305
is, you know, they're gonna spit

00:09:52.305 --> 00:09:53.145
in your sandwich or not

00:09:53.295 --> 00:09:53.565
Right,

00:09:53.565 --> 00:09:54.165
exactly.

00:09:54.285 --> 00:09:54.945
Exactly.

00:09:55.125 --> 00:09:57.345
You go there and everyone's
upset and you're like, okay.

00:09:57.345 --> 00:10:01.185
Or, or they're rude or they're,
they typically kind of will

00:10:01.185 --> 00:10:02.715
mirror what the management's like.

00:10:02.835 --> 00:10:07.785
And um, that was one of the interesting
things here, speaking with you as

00:10:07.785 --> 00:10:10.365
a vice president in your role and.

00:10:11.295 --> 00:10:15.165
All, every, all your coworkers from,
from all different walks of life.

00:10:15.344 --> 00:10:15.525
Yeah.

00:10:16.094 --> 00:10:16.574
Everyone's happy.

00:10:17.055 --> 00:10:17.714
Everyone's smiling.

00:10:18.094 --> 00:10:19.185
Everyone's having a great time.

00:10:19.244 --> 00:10:21.015
And I mean, it's not
like, it's almost Friday.

00:10:21.194 --> 00:10:21.464
It's

00:10:21.464 --> 00:10:21.795
Friday.

00:10:21.795 --> 00:10:22.244
Come on.

00:10:22.484 --> 00:10:23.175
No, it's Thursday.

00:10:23.234 --> 00:10:23.834
Oh, it's Thursday.

00:10:23.834 --> 00:10:24.405
It's Thursday.

00:10:24.410 --> 00:10:24.824
Come on.

00:10:24.915 --> 00:10:25.275
All right.

00:10:25.275 --> 00:10:25.994
So no excuse there.

00:10:26.025 --> 00:10:26.354
Right?

00:10:27.255 --> 00:10:31.214
Um, and before you go on, cause I
want to, I want to hear about how

00:10:31.305 --> 00:10:36.464
tangent theta and, and the goal there,
uh, talking about the, the L can.

00:10:36.464 --> 00:10:41.775
So l can e, l can, so that'd
be Ernst Litz Canada, right?

00:10:41.805 --> 00:10:41.954
Yep.

00:10:42.165 --> 00:10:42.464
Okay.

00:10:42.464 --> 00:10:42.795
You got it.

00:10:42.944 --> 00:10:47.925
So is Ernst Litz the second who kind of
propelled the company forward, from my

00:10:47.954 --> 00:10:53.145
understanding anyways, and they have four
subdivisions under Leica, I think it is.

00:10:53.145 --> 00:10:57.494
So high end camera optics,
solars, I'm sure everyone's.

00:10:58.230 --> 00:11:00.240
Leica if they haven't heard of Elkin.

00:11:00.750 --> 00:11:06.030
Have you, do you know anything about
the, um, the Leica Underground Railroad

00:11:06.030 --> 00:11:08.070
or under, have you heard of this thing?

00:11:08.100 --> 00:11:08.280
I

00:11:08.280 --> 00:11:09.210
have heard of it.

00:11:09.270 --> 00:11:12.480
I don't know if I know
all the details, but, um,

00:11:13.290 --> 00:11:14.760
well, I don't know the details either.

00:11:14.760 --> 00:11:15.490
That's why I was gonna ask.

00:11:15.690 --> 00:11:17.100
But from my understanding, so there

00:11:17.370 --> 00:11:21.240
was a group of people that
came from, if I'm reading this

00:11:21.240 --> 00:11:23.160
right, from Germany into Canada,

00:11:23.670 --> 00:11:30.385
from what I understand, uh,
During, uh, the war, the Holocaust?

00:11:30.390 --> 00:11:32.105
Uh oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:11:32.110 --> 00:11:39.705
Uh, Ernst Litz would hire specifically
people, Jewish people, and then, uh,

00:11:40.215 --> 00:11:43.215
station them in places outside of Germany.

00:11:43.275 --> 00:11:43.455
Right.

00:11:43.455 --> 00:11:48.015
And, and it became a thing where hundreds
and hundreds of people were coming through

00:11:48.015 --> 00:11:51.615
and he would be hiring them and station
'em in other places and he would set them

00:11:51.615 --> 00:11:54.255
up with, uh, funds to get them going.

00:11:54.255 --> 00:11:57.765
And, uh, I think everyone got a
camera as well, if I'm not mistaken.

00:11:57.770 --> 00:11:58.065
You know what,

00:11:58.065 --> 00:12:00.795
I'm gonna have to dig into this cuz
I, I didn't know all that detail.

00:12:00.795 --> 00:12:02.775
I, I heard a little bit, but

00:12:03.345 --> 00:12:05.985
this is, this is something I've heard
the past because what I, from what I

00:12:05.985 --> 00:12:10.395
understand, and his daughter as well was
heavily involved with that and she was,

00:12:10.400 --> 00:12:15.765
um, um, I think something to do with,
uh, Ukrainian slave labor mostly Wow.

00:12:15.975 --> 00:12:18.825
Women and helping to,
uh, uh, empower them.

00:12:18.830 --> 00:12:21.975
Like just some really, really
phenomenal things out of that.

00:12:22.545 --> 00:12:24.225
Out of the, out of that family.

00:12:24.225 --> 00:12:26.235
And apparently nobody
wanted to talk about it.

00:12:26.625 --> 00:12:28.334
Uh, they didn't want it publicized.

00:12:28.334 --> 00:12:30.704
And so after the last one,
I guess passed away, they've

00:12:30.704 --> 00:12:32.145
gone and made a book out of it.

00:12:32.145 --> 00:12:34.605
And I think they made some sort of
a Netflix show or a movie out of it.

00:12:34.605 --> 00:12:35.594
But, uh, really?

00:12:35.775 --> 00:12:36.105
Yeah.

00:12:36.105 --> 00:12:37.334
But, so there's, how did I miss all that?

00:12:37.334 --> 00:12:41.115
There, there's an interesting kind of
heritage thing that goes in line with

00:12:41.115 --> 00:12:44.295
trying to do good, um, taking risks.

00:12:44.355 --> 00:12:45.944
And those are some big risks right?

00:12:46.125 --> 00:12:47.084
At that, at that point in time.

00:12:47.084 --> 00:12:47.535
That's a big

00:12:47.535 --> 00:12:47.985
risk.

00:12:48.074 --> 00:12:48.495
. Oh yeah.

00:12:48.765 --> 00:12:49.964
You know, show me your friends.

00:12:49.969 --> 00:12:50.954
I'll show you who you are.

00:12:51.015 --> 00:12:51.074
Yeah.

00:12:51.074 --> 00:12:56.925
I mean, uh, there's, uh, uh, you guys
working with the er, Litz Corporation

00:12:56.925 --> 00:13:00.765
and you're doing some interesting
things as well, innovating in some

00:13:00.770 --> 00:13:02.535
risky ways within your company.

00:13:02.595 --> 00:13:04.964
I thought that was an interesting
little tidbit of, uh, that's

00:13:04.964 --> 00:13:06.555
interesting of history there.

00:13:06.615 --> 00:13:07.095
Yeah.

00:13:07.099 --> 00:13:07.155
Yeah.

00:13:07.185 --> 00:13:09.855
So, so they're looking, they
say, look, we want to make the

00:13:09.855 --> 00:13:12.285
best rifle optics in the world.

00:13:13.095 --> 00:13:13.845
What does that mean?

00:13:14.295 --> 00:13:15.464
Like, what, what are we looking at?

00:13:16.845 --> 00:13:17.515
Quality?

00:13:18.045 --> 00:13:18.435
Sure.

00:13:18.525 --> 00:13:18.944
Yes.

00:13:19.185 --> 00:13:21.915
Um, The support for it.

00:13:22.215 --> 00:13:27.705
The things that, if you're referring
to what Andy set out in tangent

00:13:27.705 --> 00:13:37.605
data, it was without question
everything that he could find that

00:13:37.610 --> 00:13:39.525
he thought was the best in class.

00:13:39.705 --> 00:13:39.855
Mm-hmm.

00:13:40.095 --> 00:13:44.535
, and we really set out to be the
Rolls Royce of the optics world.

00:13:44.895 --> 00:13:47.295
That was our internal goal.

00:13:47.325 --> 00:13:52.545
We wanted to be the best in
optical quality in clarity.

00:13:52.815 --> 00:13:56.625
We wanted to have the scope
that was the most repeatable.

00:13:56.805 --> 00:13:59.685
So it went out to the extreme ranges.

00:13:59.745 --> 00:14:01.005
It came back to zero.

00:14:01.575 --> 00:14:09.540
We really wanted to have the scope that
was, um, I mean, the quickies clicks

00:14:09.540 --> 00:14:11.040
on the planet, the trickiest clicks.

00:14:11.070 --> 00:14:12.270
We wanted the clique AST clicks.

00:14:12.270 --> 00:14:14.280
You don't want mushy clicks, we
don't want mushy clicks, but we

00:14:14.280 --> 00:14:16.200
wanted it to be very precise.

00:14:16.470 --> 00:14:20.340
And a tangent, theta
scope is an instrument.

00:14:20.460 --> 00:14:24.570
Um, and it's kind of a
self-testing instrument almost.

00:14:24.900 --> 00:14:30.300
Um, it's, it, it has come into
this world and proven itself to all

00:14:30.300 --> 00:14:32.640
of its users just by being good.

00:14:32.730 --> 00:14:38.130
And it's really easy for me, as you
know, the sales guy to Sure talk

00:14:38.130 --> 00:14:41.730
about that stuff and say, yeah, yeah,
we're the best or sure, whatever.

00:14:41.730 --> 00:14:42.840
Nobody really believes me.

00:14:42.840 --> 00:14:47.250
But when you get eyes on the scope,
when you get to go to the range, right?

00:14:47.310 --> 00:14:51.660
When you get to run it to the extreme
extremes, or if you get to come and tour

00:14:51.660 --> 00:14:56.400
through the plant and you see how we test
it, how the design was tested, how every

00:14:56.400 --> 00:14:58.230
single production model gets tested.

00:14:59.220 --> 00:15:04.530
Then you can see maybe how we got to the
best scope in the world, but being the

00:15:04.530 --> 00:15:09.000
best, you know, it, it also means a lot
more than just having a good product.

00:15:09.000 --> 00:15:10.260
You have to stand behind your product.

00:15:10.260 --> 00:15:11.400
You have to support the product.

00:15:11.730 --> 00:15:13.949
We're not immune to issues, right?

00:15:13.954 --> 00:15:14.880
Like everybody else.

00:15:14.880 --> 00:15:15.120
Sure.

00:15:15.480 --> 00:15:16.560
It's a bespoke product.

00:15:16.564 --> 00:15:17.939
These are handcrafted scopes.

00:15:18.079 --> 00:15:19.410
Things go wrong.

00:15:19.500 --> 00:15:20.730
Mm, sorry.

00:15:20.730 --> 00:15:24.960
Things go wrong, . But we like
to think that we stand behind

00:15:25.020 --> 00:15:29.130
everything that happens and uh,
we take it extremely serious.

00:15:29.130 --> 00:15:31.079
If there's an issue and
a customer has a problem.

00:15:31.680 --> 00:15:32.400
Things stop.

00:15:33.300 --> 00:15:34.530
We get the scope back.

00:15:34.830 --> 00:15:37.740
The same people that build the scope are
the same people that repair the scope.

00:15:38.160 --> 00:15:42.690
So, um, we're a fairly lean,
mean operation here, but we're,

00:15:42.695 --> 00:15:44.460
we take all that stuff to heart.

00:15:44.465 --> 00:15:50.820
So being the best means people
will use our products, people, um,

00:15:50.825 --> 00:15:55.470
see the value in what we sell our
products for sure, because we are

00:15:55.470 --> 00:15:56.970
at the very high end of the scale.

00:15:57.450 --> 00:15:59.880
Not absolutely highest,
but we're, we're up there.

00:15:59.910 --> 00:16:00.120
There's

00:16:00.150 --> 00:16:02.940
prier scopes out there,
but you're up there.

00:16:03.000 --> 00:16:03.680
We're up there.

00:16:03.720 --> 00:16:06.720
You know, I remember reading
one place talking about,

00:16:06.720 --> 00:16:09.075
um, It's like Mercedes-Benz.

00:16:09.075 --> 00:16:09.135
Yeah.

00:16:09.165 --> 00:16:12.135
They said, we want to build the best
vehicle, and once it's built, we'll

00:16:12.135 --> 00:16:15.855
take a look at all the costs involved
in order to do this and price it

00:16:15.855 --> 00:16:19.125
accordingly, as opposed to saying, well,
we've got a, we've got a cost bracket

00:16:19.125 --> 00:16:20.895
that we want to be working around.

00:16:21.315 --> 00:16:22.695
What do we have to start culling?

00:16:22.725 --> 00:16:23.505
What do we have to cut?

00:16:23.510 --> 00:16:25.725
And so we can meet that and
still have a good vehicle.

00:16:25.815 --> 00:16:28.905
It sounds like you guys have taken
the approach of let's just build the

00:16:29.295 --> 00:16:30.555
absolute best and then work our way

00:16:30.555 --> 00:16:31.065
backwards.

00:16:31.425 --> 00:16:35.475
We're, I mean, we've been saying this
since the inception of Tangent Theater.

00:16:35.475 --> 00:16:38.985
We're fairly unapologetic about our
price , and we wanted to make sure.

00:16:39.975 --> 00:16:42.525
, the people that spend the
money, they're gonna get that

00:16:42.555 --> 00:16:44.115
value and they're going mm-hmm.

00:16:44.204 --> 00:16:44.535
get what?

00:16:44.535 --> 00:16:46.454
We hope that they see the value in that.

00:16:46.995 --> 00:16:48.255
Um, yeah.

00:16:48.260 --> 00:16:52.725
And we don't, we don't wanna
sacrifice, um, you know, tolerances

00:16:52.725 --> 00:16:54.765
or parts or whatever that might be.

00:16:54.765 --> 00:16:58.845
And that would degrade the
quality of the product.

00:16:58.935 --> 00:16:59.055
Mm-hmm.

00:16:59.564 --> 00:17:03.405
and, uh, as you saw today, there's a lot
of little parts, a lot of little bits

00:17:03.405 --> 00:17:05.325
that go into a sniper rifle telescope.

00:17:05.385 --> 00:17:05.685
Right.

00:17:05.774 --> 00:17:11.295
I think, I'm gonna get this wrong,
it's like 252 individual little parts.

00:17:11.565 --> 00:17:15.225
Some of them have tolerances
of microns and mm-hmm.

00:17:15.704 --> 00:17:20.444
when you're putting that all together
and put it on a shock tester and

00:17:20.895 --> 00:17:25.305
tested at a thousand GS for a thousand
drops or whatever we are doing to

00:17:25.305 --> 00:17:27.105
qualify it, it's gotta hold up.

00:17:27.224 --> 00:17:27.494
Mm-hmm.

00:17:28.065 --> 00:17:29.685
, but it also has to hold up in the field.

00:17:29.685 --> 00:17:31.274
It has to hold up to recoil.

00:17:31.545 --> 00:17:34.995
You know, our scopes are qualified
to 50 calibers and higher,

00:17:35.295 --> 00:17:36.975
but they also have to survive.

00:17:37.305 --> 00:17:41.595
Being, you know, jumped out of a
plane into the water, outta the water,

00:17:41.685 --> 00:17:45.345
into an atmosphere, whatever this,
whatever the situation might provide.

00:17:45.350 --> 00:17:50.515
So we're building scopes for professional
users, and that might be military,

00:17:50.520 --> 00:17:56.475
police, um, professional shooters or
guys who just see the value and, and.

00:17:57.225 --> 00:17:59.024
Spending the money on a good product.

00:17:59.445 --> 00:18:02.655
Well, I, I know I've got some questions
that, uh, we put out through, uh,

00:18:02.655 --> 00:18:06.855
social media just for people who
are interested in learning a bit

00:18:06.860 --> 00:18:08.805
more about the, uh, the scopes.

00:18:09.014 --> 00:18:09.135
Yeah.

00:18:09.165 --> 00:18:12.885
Uh, one of the things that I thought was
pretty neat was, was the shock testing.

00:18:13.274 --> 00:18:15.705
The pressure testing the
temperature testings.

00:18:15.764 --> 00:18:17.895
Like you guys will get these things down.

00:18:17.895 --> 00:18:20.715
Like what, how far below negative

00:18:20.774 --> 00:18:24.284
we go to, we go to the mill spec,
which I think is negative 85.

00:18:24.685 --> 00:18:25.175
Whoa.

00:18:25.180 --> 00:18:28.395
And plus the same, I believe as 85 or 90.

00:18:28.555 --> 00:18:28.975
Wow.

00:18:29.024 --> 00:18:34.335
Um, I, I think maybe it'd be good
to step back a little bit because we

00:18:34.340 --> 00:18:36.585
do a lot of different things here.

00:18:36.705 --> 00:18:36.915
Mm-hmm.

00:18:37.155 --> 00:18:41.325
, um, and maybe we can just take a
minute to explain like, we are the

00:18:41.325 --> 00:18:43.305
master dis distributor for Elkin.

00:18:44.125 --> 00:18:48.085
We have, um, our radical and some
IP in the scopes that we sell.

00:18:48.445 --> 00:18:51.445
We are the OEM manufacturer
of tangent data.

00:18:51.505 --> 00:18:58.585
Yeah, we have several brands, um, that
we make, like sa i optics, zop Tech,

00:18:59.005 --> 00:19:01.015
and then we have Tenter Bricks, right?

00:19:01.285 --> 00:19:06.175
So we're a little confusing to
some and, uh, lines kind of get

00:19:06.395 --> 00:19:10.345
a little skewed sometimes and,
and people get a little confused.

00:19:10.345 --> 00:19:15.115
So the stuff that we test and
we build in here, tangent theta

00:19:15.235 --> 00:19:17.035
are, is our design, our baby.

00:19:17.065 --> 00:19:21.475
And as you saw, we, we run the test and
all that, but we also run all those same

00:19:21.475 --> 00:19:25.075
tests on all of the other scopes that
we sell, even though we don't make 'em.

00:19:25.555 --> 00:19:26.185
Oh, that's awesome.

00:19:26.185 --> 00:19:29.155
So we wanna make sure that everything,
I didn't realize that everything we

00:19:29.155 --> 00:19:32.185
do gets held up to the same standard.

00:19:32.755 --> 00:19:37.045
It may not be the same thing that
we're building in house, but we're

00:19:37.045 --> 00:19:39.595
holding it to the same standard and.

00:19:40.395 --> 00:19:42.525
Sa I optics, which we
can talk about later.

00:19:43.095 --> 00:19:45.645
We've aided in the design.

00:19:46.035 --> 00:19:47.985
We don't make it here,
it's made for us in Japan.

00:19:48.435 --> 00:19:48.465
Mm.

00:19:48.675 --> 00:19:51.435
But we've got a lot of experience.

00:19:51.465 --> 00:19:54.705
We have a lot of smart people, we
have optical engineers, and we have

00:19:54.705 --> 00:19:59.025
a network of people that, um, we've
just developed over the last, you

00:19:59.025 --> 00:20:01.725
know, 34 years of being in business.

00:20:01.815 --> 00:20:07.275
So we've got a pretty deep bench to draw
from, and that goes into our designs,

00:20:07.275 --> 00:20:08.745
whether we make it in house or not.

00:20:09.075 --> 00:20:13.575
Um, but we make sure that
whatever we sell, we wanna be,

00:20:13.695 --> 00:20:15.075
you know, the best in class.

00:20:15.225 --> 00:20:15.525
Right.

00:20:16.245 --> 00:20:18.825
Well, do you wanna jump into a couple
of the questions that people had?

00:20:18.915 --> 00:20:19.125
Yeah.

00:20:19.130 --> 00:20:22.965
I, I got some questions about, uh,
a hunting trip that, uh, needed

00:20:22.965 --> 00:20:26.955
to before, but, but before we get
into that, let's just see, see if

00:20:26.955 --> 00:20:28.185
I can pull it up here on my phone.

00:20:31.245 --> 00:20:31.605
Questions are good.

00:20:31.905 --> 00:20:32.265
Yeah.

00:20:32.565 --> 00:20:35.125
Um, I.

00:20:36.584 --> 00:20:37.995
Ooh, here's an interesting one.

00:20:38.235 --> 00:20:39.645
Release date for a tangent.

00:20:39.645 --> 00:20:40.544
Seven to 35.

00:20:40.604 --> 00:20:40.844
Can't

00:20:41.034 --> 00:20:41.274
tell you.

00:20:41.274 --> 00:20:41.754
Okay.

00:20:41.754 --> 00:20:42.594
No, I didn't tell you.

00:20:43.395 --> 00:20:46.544
. So we are, we've been
working on a seven to 35.

00:20:46.574 --> 00:20:49.094
We've been reluctant to give
a lot of information out.

00:20:49.155 --> 00:20:52.814
Did a podcast a few months ago where
we kind of leaked a little bit of

00:20:52.814 --> 00:20:55.395
it and, um, spread like wildfire.

00:20:55.485 --> 00:20:55.695
Mm-hmm.

00:20:56.475 --> 00:21:02.955
, we are hoping that we'll have
something for a, a demo model for shot.

00:21:02.955 --> 00:21:04.935
It may not be an official
release, but we might have

00:21:04.935 --> 00:21:06.195
something at chat show this year.

00:21:06.254 --> 00:21:10.004
Uh, we're kind of stuck on a
couple components, so supply

00:21:10.004 --> 00:21:11.264
chain's been a bit of an issue.

00:21:11.324 --> 00:21:15.135
Um, why takes out  happened?

00:21:15.195 --> 00:21:15.495
Happened idea.

00:21:15.495 --> 00:21:15.645
Yeah.

00:21:15.824 --> 00:21:21.345
Uh, We're planning and hoping
that it will be in shot timeframe.

00:21:21.675 --> 00:21:23.895
If that doesn't happen, we
will be shortly after that.

00:21:23.895 --> 00:21:27.675
But we're looking at Q1 for a
potential release of seven to 35.

00:21:27.855 --> 00:21:28.004
Wow.

00:21:28.004 --> 00:21:28.125
That's

00:21:28.125 --> 00:21:28.635
pretty soon.

00:21:28.995 --> 00:21:29.715
We're pretty excited.

00:21:29.925 --> 00:21:31.425
Well, and that answers the next one.

00:21:31.425 --> 00:21:34.845
How long till they release a
tan theto, the 35 to 37 top end.

00:21:34.850 --> 00:21:35.895
So they, that would be about the same.

00:21:35.899 --> 00:21:36.195
Yeah.

00:21:36.314 --> 00:21:36.584
Yeah.

00:21:37.485 --> 00:21:41.084
Will they ever make an a i
six with a different radical?

00:21:41.745 --> 00:21:42.014
We

00:21:42.014 --> 00:21:42.465
will.

00:21:42.735 --> 00:21:47.504
Um, so I guess maybe we can
talk a little bit about that.

00:21:47.504 --> 00:21:53.294
So we constantly try to be innovative and
figure out new things, and we get a lot of

00:21:53.324 --> 00:21:57.645
feedback from our customer base and what
they like and what they don't like, and

00:21:58.095 --> 00:22:00.705
we try to kind of fit it into our model.

00:22:00.705 --> 00:22:04.905
So what we're working on now is,
uh, I look on mill based radical.

00:22:04.935 --> 00:22:06.824
So everything that we have in aai.

00:22:07.755 --> 00:22:08.745
Well, there's two options.

00:22:08.865 --> 00:22:13.485
Um, it's our rapid aiming, radical
calibrated in 5 56 or 7 62.

00:22:14.055 --> 00:22:17.505
And it's the same calibrations that
we use for the Elkin one to four.

00:22:17.505 --> 00:22:19.125
So it's very similar ballistics.

00:22:20.295 --> 00:22:23.505
We have had a lot of feedback
that people just wanna have a

00:22:23.505 --> 00:22:27.375
mill just straight up mill tree
radical, so we're working on that.

00:22:27.435 --> 00:22:33.075
Um, we're still multiple months away
from that being a product, um, just with

00:22:33.075 --> 00:22:38.775
kind of the cycles and probably also
looking at a MOA version, um, as well, so,

00:22:39.405 --> 00:22:39.735
okay.

00:22:39.915 --> 00:22:40.485
Very cool.

00:22:40.545 --> 00:22:40.725
Yep.

00:22:41.355 --> 00:22:42.915
Uh, this is my favorite question.

00:22:43.275 --> 00:22:48.495
Uh, so the last one was by, uh, a
gear report key Who asked that one?

00:22:48.885 --> 00:22:49.905
Then we've got a ger dot.

00:22:51.705 --> 00:22:53.655
Who do small circle glass make far away?

00:22:53.655 --> 00:22:55.575
Bigger . Did you see that one?

00:22:55.785 --> 00:22:56.465
Yes, I did.

00:22:56.470 --> 00:22:57.465
I don't know what I think

00:22:57.465 --> 00:22:58.095
the answer was.

00:22:58.095 --> 00:22:59.055
Yes, the answer there is

00:22:59.055 --> 00:22:59.355
yes.

00:23:00.315 --> 00:23:01.905
. Um, what about spotting scopes?

00:23:01.965 --> 00:23:03.555
This is Okanagan precision shooters.

00:23:03.795 --> 00:23:04.485
Good question.

00:23:04.605 --> 00:23:10.215
Uh, we talk about that frequently in our
r and d meetings, and the answer right now

00:23:10.215 --> 00:23:13.455
is no, there's no direct plan for that.

00:23:13.995 --> 00:23:19.425
Um, we have, you know, we have the ability
to do that, but our focus right now

00:23:19.425 --> 00:23:24.345
is on our core business of our primary
models and our new released models.

00:23:24.825 --> 00:23:28.155
Um, we have a, we have a,
a very large back order.

00:23:28.275 --> 00:23:32.955
Um, we we're doing our best to
make them as fast as we can.

00:23:32.985 --> 00:23:33.375
Sure.

00:23:33.495 --> 00:23:38.445
But we're really kind of at capacity in
some regards and we're looking to expand.

00:23:39.375 --> 00:23:42.225
I don't know if we've got room
right now for a spotting scope.

00:23:42.285 --> 00:23:45.735
I'm, it's not off the, not off the table,
but there's no short term plan for it.

00:23:46.095 --> 00:23:46.275
Yeah.

00:23:46.275 --> 00:23:48.825
I guess, you know, building the
company out, you gotta make sure you're

00:23:48.825 --> 00:23:50.295
taking those steps in manageable.

00:23:50.639 --> 00:23:52.530
Manageable steps and manageable steps.

00:23:52.530 --> 00:23:54.360
As growth comes, you
can take bigger steps.

00:23:54.360 --> 00:23:54.570
Yeah.

00:23:55.139 --> 00:23:55.379
Yeah.

00:23:55.439 --> 00:24:00.479
I think we, um, everything
is an option at this point.

00:24:00.540 --> 00:24:03.300
Um, we just wanna make sure we're
doing the right thing and we're

00:24:03.300 --> 00:24:06.659
satisfying the customers that
are, you know, buying from us now.

00:24:06.959 --> 00:24:09.090
And we just, we don't
wanna let anybody down.

00:24:09.179 --> 00:24:09.570
So.

00:24:10.560 --> 00:24:10.739
Yeah.

00:24:10.739 --> 00:24:11.729
No, that makes sense.

00:24:12.479 --> 00:24:15.570
The, um, look, looking.

00:24:17.820 --> 00:24:21.120
You know, the people say, you know,
we punch above earth weight class

00:24:21.120 --> 00:24:22.260
looking what you guys have built.

00:24:22.320 --> 00:24:27.659
Starting from, Hey, I work on Remington
700 actions and I ize them to now I'm

00:24:27.810 --> 00:24:33.270
a distributor working on, uh, optics
for the Canadian military to, I want

00:24:33.270 --> 00:24:34.889
to have the best glass in the world.

00:24:34.889 --> 00:24:38.669
Like, those are some pretty big
steps for, for a company to take.

00:24:38.699 --> 00:24:39.929
I would say, I guess when you

00:24:39.929 --> 00:24:40.560
put it like that,

00:24:41.790 --> 00:24:45.179
, 
and you talked, we've talked before
about it, and you, and you briefly

00:24:45.185 --> 00:24:48.870
brought it up at the, uh, the beginning
about risks, taking risks on ensuring

00:24:48.870 --> 00:24:54.030
that you, you just invest more into the
company on inventory in order to have

00:24:54.030 --> 00:24:57.060
things on hand for whatever eventuality.

00:24:57.240 --> 00:24:57.480
Yeah.

00:24:58.050 --> 00:24:59.040
We realized that early.

00:24:59.129 --> 00:25:02.429
Um, if we don't have the inventory
or we're not planning, you know,

00:25:02.435 --> 00:25:06.149
years in advance, that's, that's been
one of the keys to our success on

00:25:06.149 --> 00:25:10.530
pretty much all of our brands and,
and developments and, uh, we don't.

00:25:10.949 --> 00:25:14.040
Uh, sometimes we miss the mark
and, you know, we'll sell more

00:25:14.040 --> 00:25:17.280
and we get stuck with no inventory
or we can't make it fast enough.

00:25:17.310 --> 00:25:17.590
Mm.

00:25:18.000 --> 00:25:21.750
We, we try to always
have something in stock.

00:25:22.139 --> 00:25:25.230
Tangent data has kind of been
the exception because it's, it's

00:25:25.350 --> 00:25:28.530
been, I mean, it's been great
and it's been very popular.

00:25:28.889 --> 00:25:32.939
We just, we would, we'll get better
at getting them out quicker, but

00:25:32.939 --> 00:25:35.639
right now we're just, we don't wanna
miss out on the quality and we just

00:25:35.639 --> 00:25:37.620
don't want, we don't want rush.

00:25:37.679 --> 00:25:37.980
Right.

00:25:38.340 --> 00:25:40.169
How over quantity, take
the time to get it right or

00:25:40.590 --> 00:25:41.149
Right.

00:25:41.149 --> 00:25:41.270
Yeah.

00:25:41.270 --> 00:25:42.209
Quality over quantity.

00:25:42.750 --> 00:25:43.020
Yeah.

00:25:43.260 --> 00:25:47.970
Have, have there been times, just from
a personal interest, from a sort of like

00:25:47.970 --> 00:25:51.270
business development standpoint, have
there been times when you've taken those

00:25:51.270 --> 00:25:55.290
risks of, uh, stocking extra inventory
and it's really bit you in the butt?

00:25:55.409 --> 00:25:55.949
Of course.

00:25:56.100 --> 00:25:56.459
Yeah.

00:25:56.550 --> 00:25:57.120
Yeah, of course.

00:25:57.120 --> 00:26:04.139
But, you know, we, we manage it, um, in a
way that it doesn't impact the business.

00:26:04.199 --> 00:26:04.290
Mm-hmm.

00:26:04.530 --> 00:26:06.389
, um, and we've been.

00:26:07.215 --> 00:26:11.445
We've been pretty lucky that we, you
know, we, we drive it fairly hard and

00:26:11.445 --> 00:26:16.004
we've got a lot of good connections
and there's a lot what we're stocking

00:26:16.004 --> 00:26:20.955
up on when we get caught in those
situations, it's only usually for a few

00:26:20.955 --> 00:26:22.665
months that we have to, to carry it.

00:26:23.715 --> 00:26:27.825
Generally, it's not because of something
that we've done or a customer's done.

00:26:27.825 --> 00:26:32.055
It's been a market condition or
something changed politically that has,

00:26:32.385 --> 00:26:34.845
you know, has changed a motivation.

00:26:34.905 --> 00:26:37.065
But things usually come back around and

00:26:37.875 --> 00:26:41.504
so if, if a few months down the
line it kind of figures itself out.

00:26:41.504 --> 00:26:44.625
It doesn't sound like it's been
in the hardest bite in the butt.

00:26:44.715 --> 00:26:45.524
No, no.

00:26:45.705 --> 00:26:48.524
It's, it was kind of the answer I
figured it'd come to, and I only

00:26:48.585 --> 00:26:50.415
figured that was a little sting.

00:26:50.745 --> 00:26:53.205
Little sting for a bit, but
we'll figure away because.

00:26:53.820 --> 00:26:59.070
Uh, from the entrepreneur mindset
and really everybody who works here

00:26:59.070 --> 00:27:03.600
seems to have a, uh, the freedom or
ability to be able to make suggestions

00:27:03.605 --> 00:27:07.200
or effect change within the company
in a way that, uh, an owner, an

00:27:07.200 --> 00:27:13.035
entrepreneur could, um, There's always
an answer, there's always a solution.

00:27:13.035 --> 00:27:15.645
There's always a way when you
get to the end and you look back,

00:27:15.645 --> 00:27:17.085
did the ends justify the means?

00:27:17.085 --> 00:27:20.265
Like, did I, like, should have
I just cut bait sooner and,

00:27:20.265 --> 00:27:21.855
and just counted my losses?

00:27:21.860 --> 00:27:24.195
But um, maybe yes, maybe no.

00:27:24.200 --> 00:27:27.735
But it seems to me from talking to
everybody here and yourself, that

00:27:27.735 --> 00:27:33.585
uh, big key to the success that ATI
has seen is in its ability to be, and

00:27:33.585 --> 00:27:35.745
I'm using air brackets here, lucky.

00:27:35.835 --> 00:27:38.505
And of course, you know, the harder
we work, the luckier, luckier we

00:27:38.505 --> 00:27:40.575
get by some weird coincidence.

00:27:40.625 --> 00:27:41.085
Yeah, yeah.

00:27:41.085 --> 00:27:41.505
Thanks.

00:27:41.595 --> 00:27:41.895
Yeah.

00:27:42.105 --> 00:27:47.685
So we are a very entrepreneurial
company and our culture really

00:27:47.955 --> 00:27:49.945
breeds that in all of our employees.

00:27:49.945 --> 00:27:55.275
And I think there's that, um,
that mentality that people

00:27:55.280 --> 00:27:57.285
will do whatever it takes to.

00:27:57.689 --> 00:28:00.360
Get things done when they
need to get them done.

00:28:00.780 --> 00:28:05.280
We did a tour of Tenex earlier today
and you know, you all the, the people

00:28:05.280 --> 00:28:09.179
in the back that are working through
thousands and thousands of flip cover

00:28:09.179 --> 00:28:14.939
kits and ours, and it's not uncommon
that, you know, we've got a production

00:28:14.939 --> 00:28:18.629
schedule that goes out to multiple months,
sometimes straight out over a year.

00:28:18.959 --> 00:28:19.860
A customer will call.

00:28:21.450 --> 00:28:25.590
So listen, I know we're not scheduled
to receive these parts until, you

00:28:25.590 --> 00:28:27.900
know, three months away, but we
really need them next week cuz it's

00:28:27.900 --> 00:28:29.220
holding up a big military order.

00:28:29.400 --> 00:28:29.730
Mm-hmm.

00:28:30.690 --> 00:28:33.600
, there goes nights and weekends for
everybody, but nobody complains,

00:28:33.600 --> 00:28:37.830
everyone drops and does whatever it
needs to do to get that stuff out

00:28:37.830 --> 00:28:39.060
to do our best to help the customer.

00:28:39.065 --> 00:28:40.890
And it, and it's right across the company.

00:28:40.890 --> 00:28:45.900
It's not just in our tenex line,
tangent data operations and support.

00:28:45.900 --> 00:28:48.210
Like we really have a
good group of people here.

00:28:48.450 --> 00:28:49.710
Um, that get her done.

00:28:50.160 --> 00:28:50.910
That get her done.

00:28:51.030 --> 00:28:51.690
That get her done.

00:28:51.870 --> 00:28:52.080
Yeah.

00:28:52.110 --> 00:28:53.880
Lucky air, air quotes here, air quotes

00:28:53.880 --> 00:28:54.210
lucky.

00:28:54.930 --> 00:28:56.310
And we have a very low turnover rate.

00:28:56.610 --> 00:28:57.630
The people that come in.

00:28:58.000 --> 00:29:01.960
Like I said, it breeds that, just the
culture and the mentality and once

00:29:01.960 --> 00:29:04.360
people come in, you know, we take care.

00:29:04.390 --> 00:29:07.090
We like to think we take care of our
people and you know, we hope that

00:29:07.095 --> 00:29:07.870
they stick around.

00:29:07.930 --> 00:29:10.030
Well, I get kind of a
family vibe here, honestly.

00:29:10.030 --> 00:29:12.370
I know you guys aren't all related,
but you get kind of a family

00:29:12.370 --> 00:29:13.600
vibe that everybody is working.

00:29:13.750 --> 00:29:15.160
That's an Atlantic Canadian thing.

00:29:15.165 --> 00:29:16.090
There you go.

00:29:16.095 --> 00:29:17.470
Yeah, it's a maritime thing

00:29:18.910 --> 00:29:19.330
maybe.

00:29:19.360 --> 00:29:23.080
Maybe in some ways, but I'm sure not all
maritime companies are gonna have that.

00:29:24.100 --> 00:29:28.870
Um, Kyle Mack asked, can you
ask him what kind of glass

00:29:28.870 --> 00:29:31.060
they use in the E one to six?

00:29:31.090 --> 00:29:33.460
Is it the same they use
in the Elkin offerings?

00:29:34.020 --> 00:29:36.210
So let's talk about glass for a minute.

00:29:36.510 --> 00:29:36.540
Okay.

00:29:36.540 --> 00:29:38.580
Let's step away and talk
about glass for a second.

00:29:38.580 --> 00:29:38.820
Cause Sure.

00:29:39.150 --> 00:29:40.740
We get that question a lot.

00:29:40.740 --> 00:29:44.610
And it's not just for AAI,
but optics in general.

00:29:45.660 --> 00:29:52.260
There is a few places in the world
where the substrates come from and there

00:29:52.350 --> 00:29:55.710
are many different specs for glass.

00:29:56.190 --> 00:29:59.730
And inside of a scope
there's lots of glass, right?

00:29:59.870 --> 00:30:00.190
Right.

00:30:00.190 --> 00:30:02.460
So it's not just the glass
that's on the objective end.

00:30:02.610 --> 00:30:02.760
Yeah.

00:30:02.790 --> 00:30:05.910
There's multiple lenses and, and
elements that are throughout it.

00:30:05.910 --> 00:30:09.090
And all of them have different
specifications and could

00:30:09.090 --> 00:30:10.620
come from different places.

00:30:11.129 --> 00:30:16.754
So, . We spec and source all of our
glass for tangent data from Germany.

00:30:17.415 --> 00:30:19.335
That can come from multiple sources.

00:30:19.754 --> 00:30:24.675
Um, some are in Asia and others are
in Germany, and others are in Japan.

00:30:25.034 --> 00:30:27.135
And they could all be
mixed in different areas.

00:30:27.135 --> 00:30:29.415
And it's kind of like the secret
sauce that nobody talks about,

00:30:29.715 --> 00:30:31.695
but there is no real good answer.

00:30:31.700 --> 00:30:35.385
But we get all of our stuff
from Germany for tangent data.

00:30:35.985 --> 00:30:38.985
Aai all comes from Japan, right?

00:30:39.075 --> 00:30:40.665
That's where the scopes are manufactured.

00:30:41.835 --> 00:30:44.294
Some of that glass may come from Germany.

00:30:44.325 --> 00:30:46.215
Some of that glass may come from Asia.

00:30:46.220 --> 00:30:51.075
Some of that glass is made in
Japan, but it's all done by the

00:30:51.075 --> 00:30:55.875
speck of the actual element when
it gets designed in the optical,

00:30:55.935 --> 00:30:57.915
um, in the optical design early on.

00:30:57.915 --> 00:31:03.585
So the answer to the question specifically
is it's probably mostly Japanese glass.

00:31:03.885 --> 00:31:03.915
Okay.

00:31:03.915 --> 00:31:07.935
Um, in the sa i, it's not the same
as the glass that's in tangent data.

00:31:08.879 --> 00:31:12.179
Very similar in the quality
and the spec and the design,

00:31:12.570 --> 00:31:14.699
because we got to spec that.

00:31:15.090 --> 00:31:15.270
Right?

00:31:15.270 --> 00:31:19.830
So, um, there's a bunch of different
glass elements inside and they're

00:31:20.220 --> 00:31:21.120
probably all a little bit different.

00:31:21.419 --> 00:31:23.760
It's hard to say where exactly
each one's coming from.

00:31:23.820 --> 00:31:24.449
Depends on the

00:31:24.449 --> 00:31:24.870
spec.

00:31:25.139 --> 00:31:25.860
That's a good point.

00:31:25.919 --> 00:31:28.050
That's something I never
thought about actually, that

00:31:28.649 --> 00:31:29.699
Where does a glass come from?

00:31:29.699 --> 00:31:32.129
Well, not all of it necessarily
comes from the same place.

00:31:32.220 --> 00:31:33.360
No, it doesn't, huh.

00:31:33.449 --> 00:31:39.840
Um, generally speaking, I think there's,
uh, this thing that floats around on the

00:31:39.840 --> 00:31:44.520
internet and people hear one word, like
there's a manufacturer in Germany, and

00:31:44.520 --> 00:31:48.689
if, you know, it's that type of glass and
that just satisfies everyone in there.

00:31:48.689 --> 00:31:48.959
Okay.

00:31:48.959 --> 00:31:49.830
Well that's good marketing.

00:31:50.070 --> 00:31:50.550
It's marketing.

00:31:50.669 --> 00:31:50.909
Yeah.

00:31:50.939 --> 00:31:56.159
Um, but I would say that most of
the manufacturers in the optics

00:31:56.159 --> 00:31:58.110
field probably have the same.

00:31:59.205 --> 00:32:01.395
Dilemma and elements come
from all over the place.

00:32:01.395 --> 00:32:05.835
It just depends on what the
quality is and what the clarity

00:32:05.835 --> 00:32:08.215
is and how the resolution works.

00:32:08.774 --> 00:32:09.554
Makes sense.

00:32:10.004 --> 00:32:13.185
So hopefully that answers the

00:32:13.185 --> 00:32:13.605
question.

00:32:13.605 --> 00:32:14.095
Okay.

00:32:14.095 --> 00:32:18.615
Kack, and he also doubled up here, he
says, uh, and also in another pen tax,

00:32:18.645 --> 00:32:23.715
if they plan on releasing one to eight or
higher magnification scope or a new hybrid

00:32:23.715 --> 00:32:29.955
type site like the L can, one to four and
one to six from sa i l can or TT data.

00:32:30.105 --> 00:32:32.264
So if I just said yes, would
that, would that answer all?

00:32:32.264 --> 00:32:32.294
Okay.

00:32:33.675 --> 00:32:34.095
? 
Yes.

00:32:34.095 --> 00:32:34.635
Next question,

00:32:35.655 --> 00:32:42.555
. 
So, uh, Aai, we are planning
that to be a family of scopes.

00:32:42.945 --> 00:32:49.605
It was always designed to be a
family of optics that was in a

00:32:49.605 --> 00:32:51.285
different space than tangent data.

00:32:51.705 --> 00:32:54.840
Tangent data is at the upper
end of the, of the pyramid.

00:32:55.815 --> 00:33:02.145
There is a, a big market for quality
scopes in the mid-range price.

00:33:02.565 --> 00:33:07.905
Um, and there are some holes in
maybe different magnifications

00:33:08.295 --> 00:33:12.825
that work for different
applications that we've identified.

00:33:13.395 --> 00:33:18.045
Not that it's a big surprise,
but we are working on a family of

00:33:18.045 --> 00:33:24.825
optics to, um, build out our sa eye
line farther than the one to six.

00:33:25.065 --> 00:33:26.895
So we had to start somewhere.

00:33:27.795 --> 00:33:29.145
One to six was where we started.

00:33:29.205 --> 00:33:29.385
Yeah.

00:33:29.385 --> 00:33:32.295
We understand it's a, you know,
it's a pretty competitive market.

00:33:32.295 --> 00:33:33.765
There's lots of great scopes out there.

00:33:34.125 --> 00:33:35.415
We feel like we've got a good.

00:33:35.850 --> 00:33:38.160
Start with Sayi and we're
gonna build on that.

00:33:38.550 --> 00:33:39.720
So the answer is yes,

00:33:39.900 --> 00:33:40.710
answer is yes.

00:33:40.740 --> 00:33:41.730
Hey, good answer.

00:33:42.630 --> 00:33:43.380
Um,

00:33:44.640 --> 00:33:48.630
that I will say we're not gonna
build something that looks like

00:33:48.635 --> 00:33:51.210
an kin one four that's separate.

00:33:51.215 --> 00:33:54.450
Like kin is kins, kin kin's, Alcan, right?

00:33:54.480 --> 00:33:58.320
We're looking at more of the low
power variable stuff, um, in different

00:33:58.325 --> 00:34:00.600
magnifications that will be higher.

00:34:00.960 --> 00:34:04.290
So we've talked about this one before and
that's about the radical on the one to

00:34:04.290 --> 00:34:06.030
six and how it can be a bit polarizing.

00:34:06.510 --> 00:34:06.840
Yeah.

00:34:06.960 --> 00:34:09.600
And this guy says, I want to
get an A one to six, but the

00:34:09.600 --> 00:34:11.310
radical leaves a lot desired.

00:34:11.310 --> 00:34:14.460
It says, we'd love to see other
offerings, also maybe a one to eight.

00:34:14.520 --> 00:34:16.679
So it looks like you've kind of
touched on that a little bit.

00:34:16.739 --> 00:34:19.020
Next guy says, I agree
radical's not for everyone.

00:34:19.020 --> 00:34:19.920
Glass clarity.

00:34:20.384 --> 00:34:23.955
Uh, build quality color
correctness is spot on though.

00:34:24.254 --> 00:34:26.294
And that was by gear report, Caleb.

00:34:27.044 --> 00:34:31.604
So, uh, let's talk about a polarizing
radical cuz we, we had some chats

00:34:31.604 --> 00:34:33.464
about this today about, uh, we did.

00:34:33.554 --> 00:34:36.554
And the, uh, similarity
between my opinion anyways.

00:34:36.554 --> 00:34:37.964
Boots, boots and radicals.

00:34:37.995 --> 00:34:38.294
Yeah,

00:34:38.745 --> 00:34:39.674
it's a bit of a fad.

00:34:39.794 --> 00:34:41.384
Yeah, it's a bit of a thing.

00:34:41.504 --> 00:34:45.044
Um, it's hard for us to, well I
think it's hard for the industry in

00:34:45.044 --> 00:34:48.194
general to keep everything together.

00:34:48.254 --> 00:34:51.134
There's not one radical
that satisfies everyone.

00:34:51.225 --> 00:34:51.375
Mm-hmm.

00:34:51.975 --> 00:34:56.924
. There's some that come close, but there's
a lot of design and the way people

00:34:56.955 --> 00:34:58.694
shoot maybe is evolving a little bit.

00:34:58.725 --> 00:35:02.654
And what they're looking for
is evolving, specifically our

00:35:02.654 --> 00:35:04.845
rapid aiming radical, the.

00:35:06.015 --> 00:35:11.445
We've had it for a long time and
it was designed originally in a

00:35:11.445 --> 00:35:15.884
scope that was to bracket a torso
from shoulder to hip, right?

00:35:15.945 --> 00:35:21.825
And that X-Wing fighter look that some
people call it that's at a hundred meters.

00:35:21.855 --> 00:35:26.654
It's for fast acquisition and
really draws your eye to the

00:35:26.654 --> 00:35:28.154
center of the target, right?

00:35:29.685 --> 00:35:32.895
It's a lot for some people and
we knew that it was gonna be

00:35:32.895 --> 00:35:36.495
polarizing when we put it out,
but a lot of radicals are anyway.

00:35:37.095 --> 00:35:37.365
Sure.

00:35:37.935 --> 00:35:40.245
People just don't like
some things about it.

00:35:40.305 --> 00:35:41.355
Other people love it.

00:35:42.165 --> 00:35:45.825
Most of the time people just have
to get behind it and they have to

00:35:45.825 --> 00:35:47.775
look at it and they have to use it.

00:35:47.775 --> 00:35:51.345
And to see the application and to see
it really draws the eye to the center

00:35:51.705 --> 00:35:55.725
of the aiming point if you're moving,
um, and if you're shooting quick.

00:35:55.995 --> 00:35:57.555
And that was the whole intent.

00:35:58.305 --> 00:36:01.905
You know, I think a lot of people
get stuck in analysis paralysis.

00:36:01.965 --> 00:36:02.175
Yeah.

00:36:02.265 --> 00:36:03.765
As well as social proofing.

00:36:03.945 --> 00:36:04.155
Yeah.

00:36:04.185 --> 00:36:08.985
So like Amazon and social media and
arresting or different forums and

00:36:08.985 --> 00:36:13.035
blogs, uh, people, if they're gonna
make a big purchase or even a little

00:36:13.040 --> 00:36:16.695
purchase, they want to see, they want
to know, am I making the right decision?

00:36:17.415 --> 00:36:20.384
And so they'll go and they'll look
at how many reviews are on and what

00:36:20.384 --> 00:36:21.615
other people are saying about it.

00:36:21.615 --> 00:36:25.365
And that can, that can influence
people's decisions a fair bit.

00:36:25.515 --> 00:36:25.695
Yep.

00:36:26.655 --> 00:36:28.815
And I likened it to Boots.

00:36:28.815 --> 00:36:32.295
I remember I was heading, outing
a hike with a, uh, buddy of mine.

00:36:32.295 --> 00:36:37.305
He just got back out the, uh, British
Army fit and tough as nails and,

00:36:38.025 --> 00:36:39.315
and he's, oh, let's go for a hike.

00:36:39.315 --> 00:36:42.810
We'll just walk up a couple of the hills
around here while they're, Not hills.

00:36:42.810 --> 00:36:45.509
They're, they're mountains,
but, uh, not better.

00:36:45.509 --> 00:36:46.380
Go get a pair of boots.

00:36:46.380 --> 00:36:48.330
Someone's like, oh, those
Dans, you should get these.

00:36:48.330 --> 00:36:49.830
Dans, they're the best boots ever.

00:36:49.830 --> 00:36:50.790
They're so comfortable.

00:36:50.790 --> 00:36:51.480
They work great.

00:36:51.480 --> 00:36:52.560
You never get a blister.

00:36:53.009 --> 00:36:55.830
Oh, Dans completely inappropriate
as a hiking boot, number one.

00:36:55.830 --> 00:37:00.930
But, uh, at, at the time, or at least
the ones that I picked up were, and I

00:37:00.930 --> 00:37:05.339
picked him up and, uh, I couldn't wear
shoes for about three weeks hours.

00:37:05.430 --> 00:37:05.640
Oh, no.

00:37:06.015 --> 00:37:07.049
, I had blisters so bad.

00:37:07.049 --> 00:37:09.660
My, when I poured it, and it was
pouring rain too, when I poured

00:37:09.665 --> 00:37:12.390
it out, it was just red, red
water coming out of these things.

00:37:12.900 --> 00:37:16.020
Um, yeah, maybe they're great for
that person, but until you get

00:37:16.020 --> 00:37:18.660
behind them and use 'em, everyone's
feet are gonna be different.

00:37:18.660 --> 00:37:19.920
Everyone's eyes are gonna be different.

00:37:19.920 --> 00:37:21.150
And we talk about glass.

00:37:21.569 --> 00:37:21.660
I.

00:37:22.425 --> 00:37:28.935
Quantifiably IA can say this is the
best glass ever, um, based on, on

00:37:28.965 --> 00:37:33.555
scientific analysis, but how your
eye sees it and then your brain

00:37:34.065 --> 00:37:37.695
perceives it, is gonna be a certain
level of subjectivity involved here.

00:37:37.695 --> 00:37:40.155
And just like with those radicals,
there's gonna be some radicals that

00:37:40.160 --> 00:37:43.785
some people just swear by and they just
say, this is the best and maybe it's

00:37:43.785 --> 00:37:48.195
really good for them, but you really
have to go and try it for yourself.

00:37:48.195 --> 00:37:48.525
You do.

00:37:48.675 --> 00:37:52.245
And really, I've been shooting
since I've been four years old.

00:37:52.515 --> 00:37:56.925
One thing that I have seen is a cycle
of fads is they come through and they

00:37:56.925 --> 00:37:58.725
go over and it's all brand new again.

00:37:59.405 --> 00:38:03.165
But you can make anything work for you.

00:38:03.585 --> 00:38:06.615
You can, maybe some things you're
tweaking a little bit, but I mean, even

00:38:06.615 --> 00:38:10.395
your duplex radicals you can range with
if you have known, uh, measurements

00:38:10.395 --> 00:38:11.955
on them and you can Exactly right.

00:38:11.960 --> 00:38:13.725
And you can make, uh, calls with it.

00:38:13.725 --> 00:38:18.735
And, uh, just the old school
Hunter, hunter, duplex, um, so.

00:38:19.440 --> 00:38:24.720
I think for people when they're looking
at radicals, it's really important to

00:38:24.750 --> 00:38:29.700
not get tied up in what everybody else
might be saying, but take a look at your

00:38:30.360 --> 00:38:33.600
specific application of what you're hoping
to use it for the majority of the time.

00:38:33.690 --> 00:38:36.299
Yeah, and then work your
way back from there.

00:38:36.305 --> 00:38:38.670
Does this one fit and will it do well and.

00:38:39.120 --> 00:38:39.540
I don't know.

00:38:39.540 --> 00:38:43.650
I, from my perspective, I think
that's a, uh, it's not Gucci and

00:38:43.650 --> 00:38:46.770
sexy and in a marketing thing, like
always putting a new radical out.

00:38:46.770 --> 00:38:50.070
But, uh, we're trying not to be
Gucci and markety and all that

00:38:50.070 --> 00:38:51.480
stuff, but I mean, it, it happens.

00:38:51.480 --> 00:38:56.040
And right when we released the A one
to six with the rapid aiming radical,

00:38:56.040 --> 00:39:01.770
we were really targeting like three
gun shooters, fast moving, quick

00:39:02.700 --> 00:39:04.350
acquisition of the target, right?

00:39:04.410 --> 00:39:08.730
Uh, that was what, you know, it,
it, it brackets an IPSec target

00:39:08.850 --> 00:39:10.470
at hundred meters perfectly.

00:39:10.530 --> 00:39:10.740
Yeah.

00:39:11.160 --> 00:39:12.450
Uh, that was the intent.

00:39:12.510 --> 00:39:17.070
And you know, like you said, you can make
that work for pretty much anything if you,

00:39:17.310 --> 00:39:21.090
if that suits you and it doesn't annoy
you every time you look through the scope.

00:39:21.095 --> 00:39:21.300
But

00:39:22.140 --> 00:39:24.360
I got, I got one more question
I think I can ask in here.

00:39:24.360 --> 00:39:26.730
Then I wanna delve a little
bit just about, uh, more about

00:39:26.730 --> 00:39:27.960
the company, cuz it Sure.

00:39:27.965 --> 00:39:28.830
It does intrigue me.

00:39:28.835 --> 00:39:29.040
Sure.

00:39:29.040 --> 00:39:29.310
Sure.

00:39:29.520 --> 00:39:31.950
Um, uh, here's a good one.

00:39:31.955 --> 00:39:32.500
How do I get a.

00:39:34.785 --> 00:39:35.715
Thanks for all these questions.

00:39:35.715 --> 00:39:36.225
This is great.

00:39:36.705 --> 00:39:37.455
Yeah, no problem.

00:39:37.455 --> 00:39:38.955
I mean, this isn't me.

00:39:38.955 --> 00:39:42.825
This people just written in and,
um, Adam Bach says Adam, I've known

00:39:42.825 --> 00:39:44.505
him since he's been 12 years old.

00:39:44.510 --> 00:39:45.705
Fantastic fellow.

00:39:46.095 --> 00:39:50.565
Um, he's on the range any day that
he can get away and get on the range

00:39:50.565 --> 00:39:51.855
and helping others do the same.

00:39:51.945 --> 00:39:56.055
Nice, uh, good instructor, good
ambassador for, uh, for the,

00:39:56.055 --> 00:39:57.885
uh, the gun world in general.

00:39:58.095 --> 00:40:03.555
Um, he said, I'd like to know about
the scope, price points and durability.

00:40:03.915 --> 00:40:09.345
Is there a diminishing return on
expensive scope when it comes to the

00:40:09.375 --> 00:40:14.085
view that it can take and still function
flawlessly with super high end scopes?

00:40:14.115 --> 00:40:17.985
Does the end user expect better,
build quality to withstand harsher

00:40:17.985 --> 00:40:23.025
punishment, or is it just exact
extracting perfect optical clarity.

00:40:23.670 --> 00:40:27.450
And then he has an also, so this
is actually three questions also.

00:40:27.600 --> 00:40:30.030
Can he physically wear
a scope turt from use?

00:40:30.390 --> 00:40:32.760
So that I'm sure you
maybe got the last one.

00:40:32.760 --> 00:40:34.500
So why don't we just go
through em systematically?

00:40:34.505 --> 00:40:34.770
Sure,

00:40:34.950 --> 00:40:35.670
yeah, yeah, sure.

00:40:36.000 --> 00:40:43.710
So I think going back to making the best
scope on the planet and the quality and

00:40:43.950 --> 00:40:49.620
the support, there is an expectation
that that scope is more ruggedized.

00:40:50.040 --> 00:40:53.070
We're building them for a
military, uh, specification.

00:40:53.075 --> 00:40:57.870
We expect that soldiers would use
them, um, in their day to day taskings

00:40:58.410 --> 00:41:05.310
and everything beneath that, we also
understand, and we weren't the scopes

00:41:05.370 --> 00:41:09.000
against manufacturers, defects for
the life of a tangent, the scope.

00:41:09.005 --> 00:41:14.430
We are designing these things
to last and, you know, to take a

00:41:14.460 --> 00:41:16.050
lick and keep on ticking, right?

00:41:16.050 --> 00:41:17.250
If I'm allowed to say that right?

00:41:17.250 --> 00:41:18.360
It's like, yeah.

00:41:18.360 --> 00:41:20.070
So I think yes.

00:41:20.445 --> 00:41:24.315
If you are paying good money for a scope,
you can expect it, it's gonna last.

00:41:24.855 --> 00:41:31.425
Um, but if you're a guy who falls
and drops the scope on a rock or

00:41:31.425 --> 00:41:36.134
whatever, follow your tree stand or
the things that life put in front

00:41:36.134 --> 00:41:40.634
of you that aren't necessarily
manufacture defects, eh, you know what?

00:41:41.235 --> 00:41:43.755
That may not be the case, but it depends.

00:41:43.785 --> 00:41:45.165
Everything is situational.

00:41:45.255 --> 00:41:45.435
Yeah.

00:41:45.495 --> 00:41:49.905
And for the times that that has happened
in the past, we'll bring a scope back in.

00:41:49.910 --> 00:41:50.805
We'll have a look at it.

00:41:51.105 --> 00:41:52.845
Most cases, if we can
fix it, we'll fix it.

00:41:52.845 --> 00:41:56.235
If there's some minimal cost, like
there's things that we can't fix.

00:41:56.295 --> 00:41:56.595
Sure.

00:41:56.805 --> 00:42:01.950
If you scratch the glass, if you bust
an element, It has to be replaced.

00:42:01.980 --> 00:42:02.279
Right.

00:42:02.279 --> 00:42:04.850
I mean, but we can figure that
out on a case by case basis.

00:42:05.790 --> 00:42:13.529
There is that care of the glass, how you
clean the glass, the lick of the glove

00:42:13.529 --> 00:42:14.730
and the little, but that doesn't work.

00:42:14.730 --> 00:42:15.089
Yeah.

00:42:15.240 --> 00:42:18.649
What I mean, that's the most common
thing that we have, like Yeah.

00:42:18.810 --> 00:42:20.250
What's that little swirly mark thing?

00:42:20.250 --> 00:42:26.730
So yeah, so there is an expectation
of common sense, but generally we

00:42:26.730 --> 00:42:28.200
will stand behind our products.

00:42:28.200 --> 00:42:33.540
But I think going back to the question,
, you should expect your scope to last

00:42:33.540 --> 00:42:37.170
a little bit longer, to take a little
bit more of a, a lick within, you

00:42:37.170 --> 00:42:42.330
know, uh, um, a degree of understanding
that it can only take so much.

00:42:42.360 --> 00:42:44.910
It is really aluminum and glass, right?

00:42:44.915 --> 00:42:53.670
So, uh, inside of that, uh, we test to a
certain, our designs are tested, improved,

00:42:54.090 --> 00:42:59.910
and then our scopes are also tested,
um, individually every single scope that

00:42:59.915 --> 00:43:06.240
leaves this faculty has a thousand rounds
on our drop tester at a thousand Gs.

00:43:06.780 --> 00:43:08.940
And you were lucky enough
to witness that today?

00:43:08.970 --> 00:43:09.090
Yeah.

00:43:09.090 --> 00:43:09.990
That drive being insane.

00:43:10.050 --> 00:43:10.740
Yeah, it's crazy.

00:43:10.740 --> 00:43:11.880
And it's just behind us here.

00:43:11.880 --> 00:43:14.430
So funk fun all day.

00:43:14.490 --> 00:43:18.810
We wanna make sure that the elements
stay together, all the pieces work when

00:43:18.810 --> 00:43:20.700
you're using them in extreme ranges.

00:43:20.705 --> 00:43:25.470
So when the erector tube gets
dialed up to its extreme.

00:43:26.865 --> 00:43:28.035
Ups and downs.

00:43:28.065 --> 00:43:28.155
Yeah.

00:43:28.185 --> 00:43:29.865
Um, and left and right.

00:43:30.015 --> 00:43:30.135
Yeah.

00:43:30.165 --> 00:43:33.525
That it comes back to its optical
center where you've zeroed it

00:43:33.945 --> 00:43:35.805
and has a repeatable function.

00:43:36.345 --> 00:43:42.555
So that's very important and we
test it through multiple phases.

00:43:42.645 --> 00:43:48.165
Um, we leak test each one to make sure
that there's no design flaw in the scope.

00:43:48.555 --> 00:43:51.375
Um, if there is, it goes
back to the drawing board.

00:43:51.495 --> 00:43:51.615
Mm-hmm.

00:43:51.945 --> 00:43:57.675
, we drop test it, all our scopes are filled
with nitrogen, so they're not susceptible

00:43:57.675 --> 00:44:02.205
to the temperature, temperature changes
and build up of, um, condensation inside

00:44:02.205 --> 00:44:04.155
on the glass if something changes.

00:44:04.155 --> 00:44:08.085
So all that's pretty serious
stuff and intended for, you know,

00:44:08.115 --> 00:44:09.435
professional, serious users.

00:44:09.555 --> 00:44:10.005
And

00:44:10.545 --> 00:44:14.475
you know, we were talking before
about a, um, a batch that I was at and

00:44:14.705 --> 00:44:18.525
it rained and like we're in British
Columbia and it rained and rained

00:44:18.525 --> 00:44:20.175
and like it was a multi-day match.

00:44:20.655 --> 00:44:24.765
And day two, there was three people
on the line and they all just so

00:44:24.765 --> 00:44:25.996
happened to be, maybe there were.

00:44:27.404 --> 00:44:31.964
A same batch run or something, but
it was another scope company, not

00:44:31.964 --> 00:44:35.805
an inexpensive scope company, and
they're having fogging issues in there.

00:44:35.805 --> 00:44:42.015
And it struck me that um, now this
company's probably producing a lot more

00:44:42.015 --> 00:44:47.085
and maybe they're not able to, um, test
each in every scope in the same way.

00:44:47.924 --> 00:44:50.815
But the level of confidence that comes
with knowing that you're actually

00:44:50.819 --> 00:44:52.035
gonna be able to see your target.

00:44:52.515 --> 00:44:52.605
Yeah.

00:44:52.634 --> 00:44:58.214
Whether it's just a competition and
it's a, um, uh, and it's sort of

00:44:58.214 --> 00:45:03.315
extreme conditions or you're out
hunting and it's really, uh, cold out.

00:45:03.585 --> 00:45:05.294
I mean, they, they
couldn't see the target.

00:45:05.294 --> 00:45:07.214
The thing's just fogged
completely up on 'em.

00:45:07.415 --> 00:45:07.815
It's problem.

00:45:08.055 --> 00:45:08.325
Yeah.

00:45:08.330 --> 00:45:10.575
Something kept going through and
that pressure testing that was

00:45:10.575 --> 00:45:13.815
just kind of neat cuz you'd, on the
underneath side of the scope that you

00:45:13.815 --> 00:45:16.904
got this thing you can attach before
it's solve fully, fully assembled.

00:45:16.995 --> 00:45:17.085
Yep.

00:45:17.444 --> 00:45:21.975
And it's gotta maintain and have
zero pressure leak in or out.

00:45:21.975 --> 00:45:25.245
And, um, , there's ways, if
there was a leak, they'd be able

00:45:25.245 --> 00:45:26.685
to, uh, determine and find it.

00:45:27.195 --> 00:45:31.425
I mean, that we've talked before on
the podcast about like the Nike effect.

00:45:31.515 --> 00:45:31.725
Yep.

00:45:31.904 --> 00:45:34.395
You put Nikes on, you can
run faster and jump higher.

00:45:34.455 --> 00:45:34.634
Right?

00:45:34.640 --> 00:45:34.815
Yeah.

00:45:35.085 --> 00:45:37.605
And, and that's just a
psychological thing cuz people

00:45:37.605 --> 00:45:39.285
have a confidence in what it is.

00:45:39.285 --> 00:45:41.175
If I look better, I'll do better.

00:45:41.175 --> 00:45:41.355
Right.

00:45:41.355 --> 00:45:43.575
But shooting is such
a psychological thing.

00:45:43.695 --> 00:45:43.965
Yeah.

00:45:44.085 --> 00:45:44.265
Right.

00:45:44.265 --> 00:45:44.865
They say it's 90.

00:45:44.865 --> 00:45:44.925
So

00:45:45.185 --> 00:45:47.085
with tangent, thes, you can
shoot farther and faster.

00:45:47.145 --> 00:45:47.384
Right.

00:45:47.985 --> 00:45:47.986
. 
Right.

00:45:48.315 --> 00:45:51.645
Because you got that psychological
sort of look, I, I have the confidence

00:45:51.645 --> 00:45:55.965
in knowing that it's been drop tests
x amount of times and very annoyingly

00:45:56.415 --> 00:46:00.404
in an office where you keep hearing
these ths where it's got the, um,

00:46:01.125 --> 00:46:04.515
Uh, where it's been pressure tested,
I've, yeah, I thought that was the,

00:46:04.515 --> 00:46:07.815
uh, uh, personally, I, if I were you
guys, I'd be putting that on the whole

00:46:07.815 --> 00:46:09.855
marketing brochure and, uh, and showing

00:46:09.855 --> 00:46:10.395
it out there.

00:46:10.455 --> 00:46:11.175
Yeah, absolutely.

00:46:11.175 --> 00:46:15.045
And that adds to, you know, the,
the build time and that, yeah.

00:46:15.045 --> 00:46:18.525
Again, we don't sacrifice the
quality and we wanna make sure that

00:46:18.530 --> 00:46:23.265
every one of them is tested and,
um, that is super important to us.

00:46:23.325 --> 00:46:27.465
But, you know, to the other guys in the
line that had the fogging issue Yeah.

00:46:27.675 --> 00:46:31.245
Like us, like them, we're not, you
know, immune to all of these issues.

00:46:31.245 --> 00:46:35.115
Sometimes, you know, the Murphy shows
up or there's a, there's a problem.

00:46:35.115 --> 00:46:37.545
But again, it's how you handle
it and how do you deal with it?

00:46:37.685 --> 00:46:38.425
How do you deal with it?

00:46:38.505 --> 00:46:40.515
And that's a very serious
issue around here.

00:46:40.515 --> 00:46:40.815
So,

00:46:42.315 --> 00:46:44.475
So we have a few more questions,
but I'll get into 'em afterwards

00:46:44.475 --> 00:46:47.415
because you were talking a little
bit about, uh, care and maintenance.

00:46:47.475 --> 00:46:50.925
So you're saying I can't spit
on my objective landing anymore?

00:46:50.925 --> 00:46:55.145
Well, I mean, you can, but  and,
uh, and rub it off with steel wolf.

00:46:55.595 --> 00:46:57.825
No, that's, that's, that's probably not

00:46:57.825 --> 00:46:58.515
best practice.

00:46:58.575 --> 00:46:58.935
Okay.

00:46:58.940 --> 00:47:03.645
So, uh, what about, uh, giving a
little, uh, breath and, uh, maybe using

00:47:03.645 --> 00:47:05.355
a microfiber cloth or, that's okay.

00:47:05.355 --> 00:47:05.835
Kleenex.

00:47:05.835 --> 00:47:06.975
That's a Kleenex.

00:47:07.615 --> 00:47:10.125
I, that's a little sketchy.

00:47:10.130 --> 00:47:12.225
Unless you really had to, so, okay.

00:47:12.705 --> 00:47:14.835
Every scope now ships with a lens pen.

00:47:15.165 --> 00:47:17.295
Um, tangent data.

00:47:17.835 --> 00:47:22.395
Um, well, it's actually Tenex
lens pen and a microfiber cloth.

00:47:22.455 --> 00:47:22.725
Okay.

00:47:23.385 --> 00:47:25.995
We had story time.

00:47:26.235 --> 00:47:26.535
Okay.

00:47:26.835 --> 00:47:31.545
So we had a, an instruction sheet on
our website probably five, six years

00:47:31.550 --> 00:47:36.330
ago where, There was this whole detailed
set of instructions where you had like

00:47:36.330 --> 00:47:40.440
canned air and you blew the, all the
dust off the, the glass with the canned.

00:47:40.440 --> 00:47:40.500
Oh.

00:47:40.500 --> 00:47:41.069
Can be careful with that.

00:47:41.750 --> 00:47:43.140
So yeah, I certainly do.

00:47:43.140 --> 00:47:46.140
How do you be blasts well
pressed air and particles

00:47:46.140 --> 00:47:46.560
anyways?

00:47:46.589 --> 00:47:52.529
Well, this particular story was, um,
a bench rush shooter in the desert.

00:47:52.560 --> 00:47:52.799
Was it?

00:47:52.799 --> 00:47:53.490
Upside down?

00:47:53.669 --> 00:47:54.299
Upside down.

00:47:54.750 --> 00:47:56.009
And the glass exploded.

00:47:56.069 --> 00:47:56.339
Okay.

00:47:56.339 --> 00:47:58.470
I'll let you talk it through
for people who don't understand

00:47:58.470 --> 00:47:59.370
what's gonna happen here.

00:47:59.950 --> 00:48:03.029
So he read the instructions and he was
cleaning because it was dusty on the

00:48:03.035 --> 00:48:07.169
desert and, uh, wanted to clear the
glass off before he used the lens pen.

00:48:07.240 --> 00:48:13.529
But, It was 110 degrees in the desert,
took the canned air and instead of

00:48:13.560 --> 00:48:17.520
just blowing it off, turned the canned
air upside down, which kind of turns

00:48:17.520 --> 00:48:19.259
into like this liquid nitrogen right.

00:48:19.265 --> 00:48:20.220
Type thing.

00:48:20.279 --> 00:48:20.490
Yeah.

00:48:20.580 --> 00:48:25.650
And sprayed the objective lens
with the canned air upside down.

00:48:26.100 --> 00:48:27.120
It, it popped.

00:48:27.540 --> 00:48:32.430
So our bad, we shouldn't have
said, don't do that on the desert.

00:48:32.430 --> 00:48:34.440
When it's 110, we help the guy out.

00:48:34.470 --> 00:48:34.680
Sure.

00:48:34.710 --> 00:48:40.230
Uh, so again, back to this whole common
sense, don't put anything that's abrasive.

00:48:40.290 --> 00:48:45.450
Um, your service gloves with a little
leather, you know, that that was a, that

00:48:45.450 --> 00:48:47.220
was a big thing with a lot of the C 79 s.

00:48:47.220 --> 00:48:49.049
We get back, you know,
guys get sand in the lens.

00:48:49.049 --> 00:48:50.310
It's like, I gotta see.

00:48:50.310 --> 00:48:54.150
So the tongue and the thing,
it works for a while, but Sure.

00:48:55.200 --> 00:49:00.240
What we say is, you know, if you have
a lens pen with a brush or there, you

00:49:00.240 --> 00:49:04.259
can buy these little, um, like little
blower tubes that will kind of blow

00:49:04.265 --> 00:49:06.720
some light air clear off the lens.

00:49:07.020 --> 00:49:11.609
You can, um, turn the lens pen
around and there's a little pad,

00:49:11.790 --> 00:49:13.109
right, that has some solution on it.

00:49:13.109 --> 00:49:14.759
So it gets out all the spots.

00:49:15.210 --> 00:49:16.440
Uh, it's pretty slick.

00:49:16.440 --> 00:49:17.220
It's easy.

00:49:17.549 --> 00:49:19.140
Just don't use anything that's abrasive.

00:49:19.140 --> 00:49:21.569
So the stuff that you think is gonna
work, the stuff you'd use on your

00:49:21.569 --> 00:49:23.130
eyeglasses would be the same thing.

00:49:23.339 --> 00:49:23.460
Okay?

00:49:23.460 --> 00:49:29.370
So you can spray, um, some like alcohol,
uh, on the lens to clear it off, but would

00:49:29.370 --> 00:49:31.859
that, would that detract from the
coatings that are on the lens?

00:49:31.859 --> 00:49:33.120
A little No alcohol?

00:49:33.210 --> 00:49:33.540
No.

00:49:33.545 --> 00:49:33.549
No.

00:49:33.900 --> 00:49:34.049
But.

00:49:35.055 --> 00:49:37.484
Particles and scratch as well.

00:49:37.634 --> 00:49:38.055
Okay.

00:49:38.174 --> 00:49:38.505
Yeah.

00:49:38.565 --> 00:49:39.015
So

00:49:40.095 --> 00:49:43.095
you know that compressed air
cans, when I was younger, I used

00:49:43.095 --> 00:49:46.545
to get a fair few letters about
the school to my, to my home.

00:49:47.025 --> 00:49:51.105
And, uh, they weren't always good letters,
not really, but I was able to take that

00:49:51.109 --> 00:49:55.065
compressed air upside down and he can
press down on the paper and spray it and

00:49:55.065 --> 00:49:56.565
it makes a whole thing go translucent.

00:49:56.565 --> 00:49:59.984
So you can read what's actually in the
envelope and then it's shortly after

00:49:59.984 --> 00:50:01.725
it all kind of evaporates and dries up.

00:50:02.085 --> 00:50:02.595
Oh, I like that.

00:50:03.045 --> 00:50:03.255
Yeah.

00:50:03.255 --> 00:50:04.515
That was, that was my little spy

00:50:04.515 --> 00:50:04.845
trick.

00:50:05.205 --> 00:50:05.805
. I like that.

00:50:06.705 --> 00:50:06.855
Yeah.

00:50:06.855 --> 00:50:07.605
So no canned air?

00:50:07.755 --> 00:50:08.234
No canned

00:50:08.234 --> 00:50:09.075
air, no cann air.

00:50:09.134 --> 00:50:09.375
Okay.

00:50:09.375 --> 00:50:11.234
So that's basic cleaning.

00:50:11.355 --> 00:50:12.105
Um,

00:50:12.825 --> 00:50:13.395
straightforward.

00:50:13.395 --> 00:50:16.665
We do have instructions on our
website that don't have canned

00:50:16.665 --> 00:50:17.745
air, that don't have canned air.

00:50:17.805 --> 00:50:19.214
At least I hope they don't
know we took that out.

00:50:19.875 --> 00:50:22.995
Um, there's some detailed stuff
and there's different options

00:50:22.995 --> 00:50:25.515
depending on the level of cleaning,
but just general maintenance is,

00:50:26.475 --> 00:50:28.725
What if someone does get a
scratch on there, can that be like

00:50:28.725 --> 00:50:30.345
polished out or is that the coding?

00:50:30.345 --> 00:50:30.794
That's,

00:50:31.125 --> 00:50:31.754
that's the coding.

00:50:31.935 --> 00:50:36.585
So you're, so if the, if the lens gets
scratched, depending on whether you can

00:50:36.585 --> 00:50:41.835
live with it, um, it means that either
has to be, well, it has to be replaced

00:50:41.835 --> 00:50:44.685
or it's just beyond economical repair.

00:50:45.765 --> 00:50:48.495
Do you, you know, I've seen
scratch lenses, I've looked

00:50:48.495 --> 00:50:49.634
through and they look just fine.

00:50:50.055 --> 00:50:50.444
Right.

00:50:50.714 --> 00:50:52.904
But you look at the lens, they can
have some pretty good scratches.

00:50:52.935 --> 00:50:53.024
Yep.

00:50:53.024 --> 00:50:55.395
Just like with like photography,
you can scratch a lens up

00:50:55.395 --> 00:50:56.504
and it takes great pictures.

00:50:56.955 --> 00:51:01.154
Uh, does it have to be pretty significant
of a scratch for you to have some

00:51:01.154 --> 00:51:04.365
sort of an optical issue or, well,

00:51:04.754 --> 00:51:08.265
I think it's more what
the user can manage.

00:51:08.325 --> 00:51:10.305
Um, so some people just.

00:51:11.055 --> 00:51:15.674
Stand to look through their scope and
see any degradation in the image, whether

00:51:15.674 --> 00:51:20.774
it be a little spot of dirt, um, and
sometimes dirt gets loose inside through

00:51:20.774 --> 00:51:22.515
the, like through the production process.

00:51:22.904 --> 00:51:23.625
It happens.

00:51:23.805 --> 00:51:24.045
Yeah.

00:51:24.194 --> 00:51:25.335
There'll be spots in the glass.

00:51:25.395 --> 00:51:27.105
Some people can live with
it, some people can't.

00:51:27.375 --> 00:51:27.585
Yeah.

00:51:27.615 --> 00:51:31.515
Scratch doesn't really degrade
what it is, except it's an

00:51:31.515 --> 00:51:32.865
obstruction in your line of sight.

00:51:33.345 --> 00:51:33.555
Okay.

00:51:34.095 --> 00:51:35.115
So it

00:51:35.115 --> 00:51:35.774
depends.

00:51:35.924 --> 00:51:38.085
So that clean room that
you guys have upstairs?

00:51:38.174 --> 00:51:38.444
Yep.

00:51:38.504 --> 00:51:39.254
That was pretty cool.

00:51:39.259 --> 00:51:39.734
So you're a little.

00:51:40.575 --> 00:51:43.875
Uh, first thing I noticed when I went in
there is a bit warmer, a bit more humid.

00:51:43.995 --> 00:51:44.265
Yep.

00:51:45.015 --> 00:51:46.365
Tri Lamin Flow benches.

00:51:46.365 --> 00:51:49.995
So there's a positive airflow that
goes through the whole clean room,

00:51:50.325 --> 00:51:53.175
which is meant to keep all the
dust particles and all the dirt.

00:51:53.205 --> 00:51:54.675
That's why they don't
let sales guys in there.

00:51:54.675 --> 00:51:56.805
So we just keep all
that stuff out of that.

00:51:57.225 --> 00:52:00.735
Uh, and sales guys, you know, we have
our, we have our people that work in

00:52:00.735 --> 00:52:05.535
the pods inside and we do our best
to keep the dust and the dirt down

00:52:05.535 --> 00:52:07.845
even throughout the whole office.

00:52:07.845 --> 00:52:11.985
We keep it at a very high humidity
and we just wanna keep all

00:52:11.985 --> 00:52:13.335
that stuff at a, at a minimum

00:52:14.325 --> 00:52:16.005
human arrow bind to the particles.

00:52:16.010 --> 00:52:16.725
Keep it down.

00:52:16.725 --> 00:52:17.085
You got it.

00:52:17.145 --> 00:52:17.565
Smart.

00:52:18.135 --> 00:52:21.555
Um, okay, so got an idea on cleaning.

00:52:21.555 --> 00:52:26.505
How about, uh, what are things I can do
to really, uh, mess up mounting the scope?

00:52:26.565 --> 00:52:27.195
Good question.

00:52:28.125 --> 00:52:31.005
We get it a lot and there are a lot of.

00:52:31.710 --> 00:52:33.000
Ring manufacturers.

00:52:33.360 --> 00:52:38.430
Um, we've pretty much run the
gamut of most of the major ones.

00:52:38.460 --> 00:52:44.910
And we found, uh, kind of the sweet
spot for our five to 20 fives where

00:52:44.915 --> 00:52:51.240
we publish a torque spec for the rings
and it's 25 inch pounds regardless

00:52:51.240 --> 00:52:56.370
of what the ring manufacturer
says is the limit for their rings.

00:52:56.470 --> 00:52:56.790
Mm.

00:52:57.000 --> 00:53:02.670
So we have a lot of experience in history
through our past life with Premier mm-hmm.

00:53:03.180 --> 00:53:05.250
um, dealing with their scopes.

00:53:05.250 --> 00:53:09.330
There were some thin wall scopes
where if you over toed the, the

00:53:09.330 --> 00:53:13.920
rings, it would pinch, um, the
tube which crossed the erector,

00:53:14.100 --> 00:53:16.200
which caused issues with parallax.

00:53:16.680 --> 00:53:21.150
Some cases you could release the
tension on, on the rings, and it

00:53:21.154 --> 00:53:23.339
would go back to what would be normal.

00:53:23.700 --> 00:53:28.859
Other cases it didn't and it had
be erect apart, so, We understood

00:53:28.859 --> 00:53:30.779
that in the design for five to 25.

00:53:30.779 --> 00:53:34.500
So we beefed up the tube a little
bit and we made it more rugged.

00:53:34.920 --> 00:53:40.350
And we published a spec to torque your
rings too, which is 25 inch pounds.

00:53:40.350 --> 00:53:40.830
I just said it.

00:53:40.980 --> 00:53:41.609
Yeah, I Say it again.

00:53:41.640 --> 00:53:42.569
25 inch pounds.

00:53:42.660 --> 00:53:42.900
. Yeah.

00:53:43.350 --> 00:53:47.430
And pretty much all of the major
manufacturers now, you'll have no issues,

00:53:47.670 --> 00:53:53.009
but there are issues that come up if
you, you know, just are mutant sometimes

00:53:53.009 --> 00:53:54.839
and forget and over torque stuff.

00:53:54.839 --> 00:53:55.950
It happens to the best of

00:53:55.950 --> 00:53:56.310
us.

00:53:56.580 --> 00:54:00.000
Well there's, you know, uh,
when I started working on guns,

00:54:00.029 --> 00:54:01.680
nobody talked about torque specs.

00:54:01.799 --> 00:54:01.980
Yep.

00:54:02.130 --> 00:54:04.350
Uh, and then they became all their age.

00:54:04.350 --> 00:54:07.020
Everyone says it's gotta be at
this, otherwise your gun will

00:54:07.020 --> 00:54:08.400
fall apart or it'll blow up.

00:54:08.400 --> 00:54:09.190
It just won't work.

00:54:09.390 --> 00:54:12.900
And I think it's, if you have a feel and
know where to tighten it to, and it's

00:54:12.900 --> 00:54:15.090
not gonna, You're good and you're done.

00:54:15.690 --> 00:54:20.070
Um, some things that I've seen are
people who don't, uh, store their,

00:54:20.130 --> 00:54:21.510
their torque wrenches properly.

00:54:21.630 --> 00:54:22.680
I mean, good point.

00:54:22.680 --> 00:54:26.490
Most have to be taken right back
down to zero and released, and

00:54:26.850 --> 00:54:28.290
they'll have inaccurate readings.

00:54:28.290 --> 00:54:33.120
Or if they start using oil in
there, or lock tight fluid's gonna

00:54:33.120 --> 00:54:34.770
change your, your settings again.

00:54:34.770 --> 00:54:38.190
And they're, oh no, it said 25 when
I did there, or whatever it might be.

00:54:38.760 --> 00:54:42.360
Um, having that feel is
something you can't really teach.

00:54:42.630 --> 00:54:42.810
Yeah.

00:54:42.840 --> 00:54:47.220
I guess over a booklet or, or YouTube,
it might be a difficult thing to teach.

00:54:47.225 --> 00:54:47.330
Yeah.

00:54:47.940 --> 00:54:50.520
And maybe that's why they came up
with the, everyone started getting

00:54:50.520 --> 00:54:52.770
hot and heavy for, uh, torque specs.

00:54:52.770 --> 00:54:53.190
Specs.

00:54:53.310 --> 00:54:53.580
Yeah.

00:54:54.300 --> 00:54:57.810
Uh, it happens and you know,
there's new ring manufacturers

00:54:57.810 --> 00:54:58.770
that come up all the time.

00:54:58.860 --> 00:55:04.020
Uh, we try to work with everyone and
we try to make sure that our stuff is,

00:55:04.530 --> 00:55:05.910
you know, quote unquote bulletproof.

00:55:06.930 --> 00:55:09.990
We're susceptible to all the same
issues that everyone elses, right?

00:55:10.410 --> 00:55:16.020
And, uh, the, yeah, the, the specs right
now are higher than what they were,

00:55:16.169 --> 00:55:21.779
um, lower than what most manufacturers
recommend that their rings are capable of.

00:55:21.899 --> 00:55:21.990
Mm-hmm.

00:55:22.229 --> 00:55:25.439
, but you don't always necessarily need
to have it maxed out and, you know,

00:55:25.439 --> 00:55:29.069
if you do run into an issue and you've
mounted your scope up and you find

00:55:29.069 --> 00:55:34.589
like there's a problem on when, on a
tangent, data parallax doesn't seem

00:55:34.595 --> 00:55:39.330
to be right, first of all, give us
a call, maybe second of all crank it

00:55:39.334 --> 00:55:41.759
down a little bit or just check to
make sure you're at the right spec.

00:55:41.759 --> 00:55:46.049
Maybe, you know, have a do over but um,
you know, give us a call to shop and

00:55:46.049 --> 00:55:48.839
we can walk you through all that stuff
cuz you know, that's pretty important.

00:55:49.140 --> 00:55:49.529
Sure.

00:55:49.799 --> 00:55:50.399
I'd say so.

00:55:51.180 --> 00:55:53.939
What about, um, Let's see.

00:55:54.029 --> 00:55:56.790
Uh, so when you're mounting this
thing, I'm keeping it level.

00:55:56.790 --> 00:55:59.520
Do you have any tips and tricks
for people aside from, uh,

00:56:00.060 --> 00:56:04.259
we have a, we have a whole big
instruction sheet on very detailed,

00:56:04.379 --> 00:56:06.899
uh, procedures to level a scope.

00:56:06.990 --> 00:56:07.350
Okay.

00:56:07.470 --> 00:56:10.470
But I mean, how do you level your scope?

00:56:10.560 --> 00:56:12.629
Do you level your gun use a plum, bob?

00:56:12.870 --> 00:56:13.200
Yeah.

00:56:13.649 --> 00:56:17.310
I mean, it's you, if you don't have all
the tools, you can kind of make it up.

00:56:17.339 --> 00:56:17.399
Yeah.

00:56:17.549 --> 00:56:19.560
Um, and in most cases

00:56:20.339 --> 00:56:21.120
it works.

00:56:21.240 --> 00:56:21.569
Yeah.

00:56:21.779 --> 00:56:23.009
That's what, that's sort of what I found.

00:56:23.009 --> 00:56:24.960
And you know, if you got an
eye for it, you should be able

00:56:24.960 --> 00:56:26.189
to see if it's level or not.

00:56:26.194 --> 00:56:26.310
Yeah.

00:56:26.500 --> 00:56:26.990
Yeah.

00:56:27.029 --> 00:56:31.140
I think if you have a, a stable
base for your gun level, your

00:56:32.009 --> 00:56:34.140
gun derails as best you can.

00:56:34.200 --> 00:56:34.350
Yeah.

00:56:34.529 --> 00:56:35.399
Mount your scope.

00:56:35.759 --> 00:56:37.710
Use a plum bob hanging off the wall.

00:56:37.740 --> 00:56:37.980
Yeah.

00:56:38.970 --> 00:56:40.109
Level your radical.

00:56:41.980 --> 00:56:44.520
I mean, there's a lot of more
detailed stuff that you can go

00:56:44.520 --> 00:56:46.350
through, but it depends on, on,

00:56:47.220 --> 00:56:50.100
well, you know, and some people say
like they'll put a level on top of their

00:56:50.100 --> 00:56:52.500
scope and they'll say, well, this scope.

00:56:52.905 --> 00:56:55.635
Uh, caps might not
necessarily be level Yeah.

00:56:55.635 --> 00:56:56.625
With theoreticals.

00:56:56.655 --> 00:56:57.015
Correct.

00:56:57.285 --> 00:56:58.665
In most cases I don't think they are.

00:56:58.905 --> 00:56:59.205
Okay.

00:56:59.205 --> 00:57:04.155
I don't think like the not a
good procedure for you to set the

00:57:04.215 --> 00:57:07.935
level on top of our scopes or any
scope, cuz it's not necessarily

00:57:07.940 --> 00:57:10.275
the same in line with your rail.

00:57:11.115 --> 00:57:11.465
Um,

00:57:13.845 --> 00:57:14.685
yeah, that's a good point.

00:57:15.225 --> 00:57:18.525
Um, I don't know, did we, did we
answer the last question there

00:57:18.525 --> 00:57:21.315
on the, uh, can you wear out
your, uh, no we didn't turrets.

00:57:21.345 --> 00:57:22.275
No, but let's go back to that.

00:57:22.395 --> 00:57:22.605
Yeah.

00:57:22.605 --> 00:57:23.265
Then we're back.

00:57:23.295 --> 00:57:24.195
Cause that's an important one.

00:57:24.405 --> 00:57:24.555
Okay.

00:57:24.560 --> 00:57:27.315
That's one that we pride ourselves
on and we spent millions of dollars.

00:57:28.620 --> 00:57:29.340
To focus.

00:57:29.400 --> 00:57:31.230
Um, we wanted millions.

00:57:31.470 --> 00:57:32.850
Oh, like hyperbole Easy.

00:57:32.910 --> 00:57:33.330
Yes.

00:57:33.330 --> 00:57:33.810
Easy.

00:57:33.870 --> 00:57:34.770
No, not hyperbole.

00:57:34.830 --> 00:57:35.550
No, no.

00:57:36.150 --> 00:57:41.490
. We spent many years in development to
get to the place where a, we had the

00:57:41.490 --> 00:57:49.470
cliques clicks and that they didn't
degrade over time and use, so we

00:57:49.470 --> 00:57:54.360
set up multiple jigs and the way our
tens work are a little bit different.

00:57:54.360 --> 00:57:56.100
They're not, you know, all tens.

00:57:56.105 --> 00:57:59.760
We have a little special,
special, special thing inside.

00:57:59.790 --> 00:57:59.850
Yeah.

00:57:59.940 --> 00:58:01.860
Um, saw that it pretty cool.

00:58:01.920 --> 00:58:02.730
It is pretty cool.

00:58:03.120 --> 00:58:07.500
We mounted it on a jig and we hooked it
up to, you know, it was pretty basic.

00:58:07.500 --> 00:58:09.830
It was a drill and we let.

00:58:10.395 --> 00:58:16.035
Run for weeks and hundreds of thousands
of rotations, which far exceeded

00:58:16.125 --> 00:58:20.475
what the normal life expectancy would
be, probably of the user of a scope.

00:58:20.535 --> 00:58:20.865
Sure.

00:58:20.925 --> 00:58:26.085
Um, and in most cases, nobody would ever
be adjusting the turrets to that level.

00:58:26.355 --> 00:58:26.625
That's, and

00:58:26.630 --> 00:58:28.095
really ocd, but sure, it could

00:58:28.245 --> 00:58:33.435
happen . So what we wanted to make
sure is that over time those clicks

00:58:33.435 --> 00:58:39.735
didn't get mushy and they stayed
precise and crisp and tactile and

00:58:39.735 --> 00:58:42.225
you could hear every positive click.

00:58:42.615 --> 00:58:47.115
And that was very important in, in the
original design and slowed things down.

00:58:47.475 --> 00:58:48.645
And we maintained that today.

00:58:48.705 --> 00:58:49.904
And you saw it yourself.

00:58:49.935 --> 00:58:50.535
Um, yeah.

00:58:50.985 --> 00:58:56.205
There's people that spend a big
chunk of their day testing the clicks

00:58:56.295 --> 00:58:57.465
and making sure that everything is.

00:58:58.635 --> 00:58:59.175
Very cool.

00:58:59.685 --> 00:59:04.845
So I would say no unless you
go completely crazy, which, uh,

00:59:04.845 --> 00:59:06.285
you'd have to spend a lot of time.

00:59:06.555 --> 00:59:10.815
Those clicks are not, our clicks are
not gonna, um, get worse over time.

00:59:12.165 --> 00:59:13.245
I've got another question here.

00:59:13.245 --> 00:59:17.325
It says, uh, I'd be interested in
a long range scope recommendation

00:59:17.325 --> 00:59:20.175
for a 300 wind, ME 500 yard plus.

00:59:20.655 --> 00:59:26.775
And, uh, this is from a fellow, uh,
Siri 300, and he's a, um, I know

00:59:26.780 --> 00:59:29.775
him to be a hunter, been a waterfowl
hunting with him in the past.

00:59:29.780 --> 00:59:33.075
I'm wondering if he's looking at this
from a precision rifle standpoint

00:59:33.075 --> 00:59:35.805
or a hunting standpoint, but maybe
if that little background gives

00:59:35.895 --> 00:59:38.925
a, uh, uh, flavor to an answer.

00:59:39.525 --> 00:59:40.575
Uh, yep.

00:59:40.605 --> 00:59:45.975
And, uh, I think we have something
that's in between all of that.

00:59:46.165 --> 00:59:46.445
Mm-hmm.

00:59:46.525 --> 00:59:49.665
, where you could cross into
precision rifle and hunting.

00:59:50.145 --> 00:59:52.215
Uh, we have something that.

00:59:53.045 --> 00:59:55.455
It kind of is dedicated
to completely hunting.

00:59:55.455 --> 00:59:59.984
So we have about three to 15 in a
hunter, long range hunter model.

01:00:00.345 --> 01:00:04.424
It has, um, special turrets, which
are, they're kind of locking, but

01:00:04.424 --> 01:00:07.875
you have to click them up to dial
your targets, which I don't think

01:00:07.875 --> 01:00:08.865
we actually get to see today.

01:00:08.865 --> 01:00:10.214
But no, we didn't look at that, didn't we?

01:00:10.214 --> 01:00:13.995
So the three to 15, it's a 30
millimeter tube more than capable

01:00:13.995 --> 01:00:19.995
of, of, of, uh, engaging anything,
you know, 500 plus at that range.

01:00:20.415 --> 01:00:20.475
Yeah.

01:00:20.475 --> 01:00:25.004
And everything that we offer above
that would be, would be suitable.

01:00:25.245 --> 01:00:28.424
It just depends on how much
weight you would like to carry.

01:00:28.725 --> 01:00:34.154
Um, what zoom or what resolution
you wanna see at distance.

01:00:34.395 --> 01:00:37.694
Obviously, a five to 25 is gonna get you
a little bit closer to whatever it is

01:00:37.700 --> 01:00:39.495
you're aiming at, if that's what you want.

01:00:39.555 --> 01:00:39.875
Mm.

01:00:40.275 --> 01:00:45.345
Most people stick around 10 to
12 depending on how far their

01:00:45.345 --> 01:00:49.365
engagements are, and I would say
you'd be comfortable at that level.

01:00:49.425 --> 01:00:53.835
Um, so the answer that depends is
we probably have something that

01:00:53.835 --> 01:00:58.725
would suit either strictly hunting
or in the middle of hunting and

01:00:59.175 --> 01:01:01.545
competition or just competition.

01:01:01.605 --> 01:01:01.755
What

01:01:01.755 --> 01:01:02.685
would the middle one be?

01:01:02.745 --> 01:01:04.185
What, what would you recommend for, uh,

01:01:04.215 --> 01:01:05.745
three to 15 p?

01:01:05.805 --> 01:01:10.845
So it has a 34 mil tube, has, uh,
a little bit more range, so it

01:01:10.845 --> 01:01:14.295
gives you a little bit more, uh,
distance that you could reach out.

01:01:14.655 --> 01:01:19.215
But still in a compact design, it's a
little bit heavier than the 30 mil tube.

01:01:19.545 --> 01:01:22.245
Same beefy turrets as the five to 25.

01:01:22.755 --> 01:01:24.945
Um, not as long, not as heavy.

01:01:25.785 --> 01:01:27.075
Very good, capable scope.

01:01:27.285 --> 01:01:27.525
Okay.

01:01:27.529 --> 01:01:31.875
One thing that we haven't talked
about that we, I got to see firsthand

01:01:31.875 --> 01:01:35.174
today was the toolless re zeroing.

01:01:35.625 --> 01:01:36.045
Yes.

01:01:36.105 --> 01:01:36.525
Yes.

01:01:36.529 --> 01:01:37.845
That was pretty slick.

01:01:38.174 --> 01:01:38.234
Yeah.

01:01:38.240 --> 01:01:39.855
And you know what, sorry, we
forgot to talk about that.

01:01:39.855 --> 01:01:41.654
How the heck, hasn't
anybody done that before?

01:01:42.315 --> 01:01:42.765
I don't know.

01:01:43.005 --> 01:01:43.185
Yeah.

01:01:43.185 --> 01:01:47.265
So we've patented, uh, toolless re
zero and it, uh, it's really easy.

01:01:47.475 --> 01:01:49.755
We have, uh, a screw on the top.

01:01:50.265 --> 01:01:53.295
Um, very tactile, big fat
fingers will fit in there.

01:01:53.625 --> 01:01:58.095
You, once you get your zero as we
did today, yeah, you unwind it.

01:01:58.214 --> 01:02:00.225
Four, five revolutions.

01:02:00.464 --> 01:02:04.815
Pick up your turret, put it back
to zero, tighten it back down.

01:02:05.070 --> 01:02:05.220
You're

01:02:05.220 --> 01:02:05.580
done.

01:02:05.670 --> 01:02:05.820
Yeah.

01:02:05.820 --> 01:02:08.460
And even holds your zero stop for you.

01:02:08.630 --> 01:02:09.300
It does, it

01:02:09.300 --> 01:02:09.540
reset.

01:02:09.670 --> 01:02:10.341
It resets it.

01:02:10.341 --> 01:02:12.420
So you then have, you know,
five clicks past that.

01:02:12.420 --> 01:02:12.750
So

01:02:13.890 --> 01:02:14.940
that's pretty damn

01:02:14.940 --> 01:02:15.390
cool.

01:02:15.510 --> 01:02:16.980
It's pretty damn cool.

01:02:17.070 --> 01:02:17.370
Yeah.

01:02:17.400 --> 01:02:17.550
It

01:02:17.550 --> 01:02:18.180
works very well.

01:02:18.240 --> 01:02:21.750
So if people haven't seen that and
they're interested, uh, I'm gonna

01:02:21.755 --> 01:02:23.700
have something on the, uh, yeah.

01:02:23.700 --> 01:02:23.850
Little

01:02:23.850 --> 01:02:25.530
video that, a little
clip, so that'll be good.

01:02:25.650 --> 01:02:26.100
Yeah.

01:02:26.700 --> 01:02:32.010
Um, I'm looking at a
few notes I took here.

01:02:32.220 --> 01:02:35.310
Um, president on Roster two.

01:02:35.310 --> 01:02:38.400
Clean toilet . Yeah.

01:02:39.360 --> 01:02:40.440
Quick notes taken down.

01:02:40.440 --> 01:02:40.740
Right.

01:02:40.800 --> 01:02:41.250
Nice work.

01:02:41.255 --> 01:02:42.270
Make sure not to mention

01:02:43.050 --> 01:02:43.410
. 
Whoops.

01:02:43.620 --> 01:02:44.490
We're gonna bring it up anyway.

01:02:45.390 --> 01:02:46.800
. I, yeah.

01:02:47.715 --> 01:02:50.325
I just passed my 10 year
mark with the company.

01:02:50.415 --> 01:02:54.255
Um, feels like you, it was
just yesterday, like, so.

01:02:54.345 --> 01:02:55.275
It's been great.

01:02:55.965 --> 01:03:00.165
My previous life, I came from a large
defense contractor, um, was based outta

01:03:00.165 --> 01:03:06.825
the UK kind of more corporate environment
and culture and kind of get tired of being

01:03:06.825 --> 01:03:11.475
on the road, want to spend time with my
family and wasn't quite sure where to go.

01:03:11.535 --> 01:03:18.735
And just by strike of luck, I found
this place and met with Ted and

01:03:18.740 --> 01:03:21.855
Andy and came out with the company.

01:03:22.275 --> 01:03:26.805
And within the first couple weeks I
went to the bathroom and there was a

01:03:26.805 --> 01:03:30.285
duty roster on the back with a bunch
of names and a cleaning schedule.

01:03:30.285 --> 01:03:31.845
And I'm like, what's this?

01:03:32.175 --> 01:03:32.595
And.

01:03:33.525 --> 01:03:34.365
Why's my name on that

01:03:35.055 --> 01:03:37.995
It's like, well, you're up on Friday
for cleaning the bathroom, buddy.

01:03:38.445 --> 01:03:41.205
Um, so it speaks to the
culture of our company.

01:03:41.265 --> 01:03:43.125
And I was like, ah, you
gotta be kidding me.

01:03:43.185 --> 01:03:46.485
And looking back now, it's pretty cool.

01:03:46.545 --> 01:03:48.585
I mean, it's, it's super cool.

01:03:48.615 --> 01:03:53.385
The president, the owner, there's nobody
that got excluded from cleaning the

01:03:53.385 --> 01:03:55.695
toilet duty or scrubbing the floors.

01:03:55.965 --> 01:03:57.195
We all took part in that.

01:03:57.525 --> 01:04:01.815
I was, I believe, employee number
five or six when I, when I came on.

01:04:02.175 --> 01:04:04.905
So, uh, it was entrepreneurial.

01:04:04.910 --> 01:04:05.655
It still is.

01:04:06.195 --> 01:04:07.575
We don't have to clean the toilets now.

01:04:07.580 --> 01:04:11.065
We actually have somebody comes in
to do that, thank God, . Uh, we have

01:04:11.065 --> 01:04:13.605
a lot more people too, so, yeah.

01:04:13.695 --> 01:04:14.715
Uh, well, it

01:04:14.715 --> 01:04:17.805
speaks to the, uh, to the business.

01:04:17.805 --> 01:04:18.945
Like I always hate it.

01:04:19.065 --> 01:04:19.965
Well, that's not my job.

01:04:19.965 --> 01:04:20.925
It's not my department.

01:04:20.955 --> 01:04:21.705
That's for someone else.

01:04:21.710 --> 01:04:23.955
I do, I've worked here
for x amount of years now.

01:04:23.960 --> 01:04:24.045
Right.

01:04:24.045 --> 01:04:25.335
So I'm, I'm above that.

01:04:26.385 --> 01:04:27.765
I mean, the job's a job.

01:04:27.945 --> 01:04:28.575
We all do it.

01:04:28.575 --> 01:04:29.835
Some are dirty, some aren't.

01:04:29.925 --> 01:04:30.225
Yeah.

01:04:30.405 --> 01:04:37.725
But I, I think it speaks volumes to, uh,
a place that I would enjoy working at

01:04:37.725 --> 01:04:41.595
is one that that ego is left outside.

01:04:41.715 --> 01:04:42.105
Yes.

01:04:42.675 --> 01:04:43.095
Yes.

01:04:43.335 --> 01:04:45.885
And that's one of the things
cuz I've seen, you know, like

01:04:45.885 --> 01:04:47.805
David background and Yep.

01:04:47.865 --> 01:04:53.895
And, uh, British Army, British
military, and, uh, uh, accomplished

01:04:53.895 --> 01:04:55.995
individual as a PRS shooter.

01:04:57.105 --> 01:04:59.175
I didn't get one whiff of ego from him.

01:04:59.235 --> 01:04:59.415
Nope.

01:04:59.835 --> 01:05:01.065
Or anybody else here.

01:05:01.095 --> 01:05:01.275
Nope.

01:05:01.515 --> 01:05:05.235
And their backgrounds, I mean, Andy,
like, holy girl, look at what he is done.

01:05:05.445 --> 01:05:05.625
Yeah.

01:05:05.745 --> 01:05:05.905
Right.

01:05:05.905 --> 01:05:07.305
It's pretty amazing from nothing.

01:05:07.395 --> 01:05:07.665
Yeah.

01:05:07.755 --> 01:05:08.205
Pretty amazing.

01:05:08.385 --> 01:05:09.525
Just out of his

01:05:09.525 --> 01:05:09.945
basement.

01:05:10.905 --> 01:05:11.415
Yeah.

01:05:11.475 --> 01:05:15.045
Well I heard, uh, I didn't
actually know the whole story

01:05:15.045 --> 01:05:16.905
with, uh, accuracy International.

01:05:16.905 --> 01:05:18.385
I thought that was kind of interesting.

01:05:18.735 --> 01:05:24.345
I think we can talk to the EI story maybe,
but, uh, accuracy International, just.

01:05:24.924 --> 01:05:27.404
It just started out of their
basement, so to speak as well.

01:05:27.404 --> 01:05:30.595
And they just two people working in
the shed and they got this contract

01:05:30.600 --> 01:05:36.315
to, uh, uh, or possibility to have a
contract and they just rented a big

01:05:36.315 --> 01:05:40.665
old warehouse and had their friends
dress up and, uh, yeah, look busy.

01:05:40.665 --> 01:05:43.005
And they said, look it, this
is, this is our warehouse.

01:05:43.245 --> 01:05:44.775
It was a part of the procurement process.

01:05:44.775 --> 01:05:48.255
They had to do a factory tour,
but, uh, that sort of spirit

01:05:48.255 --> 01:05:52.725
of just getting it done and now
look at 'em, where they're at.

01:05:53.165 --> 01:05:58.154
AI is a, uh, I mean they supply all
the UK military with their precision

01:05:58.160 --> 01:06:00.465
rifles and other, other armies as well.

01:06:00.765 --> 01:06:01.065
Yeah.

01:06:01.395 --> 01:06:03.525
The difference between them and
us at that point in time is we

01:06:03.525 --> 01:06:04.695
actually owned the building, so

01:06:05.075 --> 01:06:05.235
Oh,

01:06:07.485 --> 01:06:08.235
. 
Oh, it's funny.

01:06:08.535 --> 01:06:08.895
Yeah.

01:06:09.465 --> 01:06:09.955
Yeah,

01:06:09.955 --> 01:06:10.245
for sure.

01:06:10.815 --> 01:06:12.285
Um, you had a hunting story?

01:06:12.615 --> 01:06:13.305
Want to hear this one?

01:06:13.965 --> 01:06:14.924
You haven't brought it up yet.

01:06:15.195 --> 01:06:15.884
No, I haven't.

01:06:15.884 --> 01:06:16.545
Yeah, I don't know.

01:06:16.595 --> 01:06:20.055
Haven't, so, uh, in the entire couple
days here, I, I heard something

01:06:20.055 --> 01:06:21.955
about, uh, having to be medivaced out.

01:06:22.935 --> 01:06:23.775
Uh, yeah.

01:06:23.805 --> 01:06:24.015
Yeah.

01:06:24.015 --> 01:06:27.765
So two years ago, I just passed
the two year anniversary.

01:06:28.125 --> 01:06:33.495
Um, I grew up hunting, um,
with my dad and my brother, and

01:06:33.555 --> 01:06:35.205
we hunt in the eastern shore.

01:06:35.445 --> 01:06:38.625
It's a very rugged, um, thick, dense area.

01:06:39.075 --> 01:06:43.665
Generally whitetail, you know,
if you are lucky, if you see

01:06:43.665 --> 01:06:46.315
them at 20, you know, 50 yards.

01:06:46.365 --> 01:06:47.745
And that's, that's max.

01:06:48.525 --> 01:06:53.295
And uh, we had found this new spot
and we kind of planned for it for six

01:06:53.295 --> 01:06:54.555
months, you know, looking at maps.

01:06:54.555 --> 01:07:00.795
We got in done Rey and just, we set
up blinds and cameras and all that.

01:07:00.795 --> 01:07:04.875
And, you know, my dad and my brother,
the plan was to go and sit in the blind.

01:07:04.935 --> 01:07:06.915
Um, it was two lakes.

01:07:07.245 --> 01:07:11.055
I was gonna go and kind of circle
around and there was a big buck that we.

01:07:11.835 --> 01:07:11.955
Yeah.

01:07:11.955 --> 01:07:12.885
Kind of tailing.

01:07:13.785 --> 01:07:18.855
I got fresh on the tail of
this monster, so I was a little

01:07:18.855 --> 01:07:21.495
bit, you know, jacked up.

01:07:21.555 --> 01:07:23.205
Yeah, a little excited, a little excited.

01:07:24.135 --> 01:07:30.195
And, uh, side to that and lessons
learned, and actually some of the things

01:07:30.195 --> 01:07:34.365
I've even picked up on the podcast from
watching some of your guests, I know

01:07:34.370 --> 01:07:37.785
a lot of the things that I did wrong
that day, um, a lot of things that I

01:07:37.785 --> 01:07:43.095
could have done better that, um, led to
me getting medevaced outta the woods.

01:07:43.095 --> 01:07:48.015
So I was in a real tough spot where,
um, I was kind on my hands and knees

01:07:48.020 --> 01:07:55.095
crawl through some thick bush and
there were some, um, quite steep hills

01:07:55.095 --> 01:07:57.645
with some quite steep little dropoffs.

01:07:58.335 --> 01:08:02.955
And, you know, my truck, I carry a
first aid kit and a tourniquet and sure,

01:08:02.955 --> 01:08:05.445
you know, um, all kinds of bandages.

01:08:05.445 --> 01:08:08.025
And I have a little spot, uh, messenger.

01:08:08.025 --> 01:08:09.135
So smart.

01:08:09.135 --> 01:08:09.975
If I get caught.

01:08:10.680 --> 01:08:11.459
It's in my truck.

01:08:11.520 --> 01:08:12.359
All in your truck

01:08:12.419 --> 01:08:12.870
in my

01:08:13.649 --> 01:08:17.219
right, which is my, I had a, I had
enough to probably survive a week in

01:08:17.219 --> 01:08:20.279
my pack, which I was only going out
for the day, but no way to message.

01:08:20.819 --> 01:08:22.229
So I had my cell phone, okay.

01:08:22.229 --> 01:08:27.960
And I had a Garin gps and I, uh,
probably halfway through the morning

01:08:28.229 --> 01:08:31.469
and messaged my brother, said, Hey,
listen, I don't know if you can see where

01:08:31.469 --> 01:08:32.700
I'm at, but I'm kind of getting close.

01:08:32.700 --> 01:08:33.630
I'm gonna, this is my plan.

01:08:33.630 --> 01:08:37.889
I'm gonna circle around this area, give
him my utm, and then kind of figured

01:08:37.889 --> 01:08:39.450
out on my phone that I could service.

01:08:39.450 --> 01:08:43.679
So we started sharing stuff, and
then I took a step and I kind of

01:08:43.679 --> 01:08:46.019
cut my finger and I looked at my,
I was like, ah, you know what?

01:08:46.109 --> 01:08:46.859
I'm really dumb.

01:08:46.859 --> 01:08:49.109
I don't have anything
to bandage myself up.

01:08:49.380 --> 01:08:53.189
So I put my gloves on and there
was a, a fairly steep ledge

01:08:53.250 --> 01:08:54.269
right in front of me, and I.

01:08:55.125 --> 01:08:56.085
Surveyed the area.

01:08:56.505 --> 01:09:02.684
I took one step with my pack on, I
had my gun on my hand, and I just lost

01:09:02.684 --> 01:09:05.354
my footing at the edge of this ledge.

01:09:05.835 --> 01:09:09.675
And I just went face first over the ledge.

01:09:09.974 --> 01:09:12.194
I was falling face worth face first.

01:09:12.795 --> 01:09:14.894
My gun with my tangent data.

01:09:15.104 --> 01:09:15.434
Yeah.

01:09:15.615 --> 01:09:17.295
In this hand pack on it.

01:09:17.295 --> 01:09:19.365
And I kind of cupped up as I was falling.

01:09:19.694 --> 01:09:25.335
And it was a sharp rock at the
bottom, my leg hit the rock, um, and

01:09:25.365 --> 01:09:28.005
snapped my tip and fib, uh, oh my.

01:09:28.595 --> 01:09:30.404
So, so that's a good break.

01:09:30.404 --> 01:09:32.115
And it was out to the skin.

01:09:32.295 --> 01:09:33.165
So compound.

01:09:33.255 --> 01:09:38.835
I, uh, I kind of fuzzed out for a
few minutes and I picked up my phone

01:09:38.835 --> 01:09:41.774
and I could still get to my brother
and I'm like, I'm really messed up.

01:09:42.075 --> 01:09:42.885
I broke my leg.

01:09:42.915 --> 01:09:43.785
You gotta get to me.

01:09:43.845 --> 01:09:44.385
And he's.

01:09:45.375 --> 01:09:46.395
You know, you're joking, right?

01:09:46.395 --> 01:09:48.795
Like he thought I was
calling cause I shot to tear.

01:09:49.125 --> 01:09:49.395
Yeah.

01:09:49.425 --> 01:09:50.024
Which I didn't.

01:09:50.085 --> 01:09:55.515
Um, you know, I reached down, I grabbed
my leg and I flipped over and it

01:09:55.605 --> 01:09:59.145
did the whole floppy, floppy and you
feel the bone sticking out through.

01:09:59.505 --> 01:10:02.265
So I got my leg elevated,
I still had my pack on.

01:10:02.505 --> 01:10:02.595
What

01:10:02.595 --> 01:10:05.385
were you feeling, like getting like
signs of shock when that happened?

01:10:05.385 --> 01:10:06.375
At that point I was good.

01:10:06.555 --> 01:10:06.795
Okay.

01:10:06.800 --> 01:10:11.715
Um, and I had taken, you know, I
take first cl first aid all the time.

01:10:11.745 --> 01:10:11.895
Sure.

01:10:12.195 --> 01:10:13.725
You're, I'm self aware.

01:10:13.785 --> 01:10:18.375
Um, my brother was the, uh, the head
of the search and rescue for his

01:10:18.375 --> 01:10:23.275
area wasn't the area that we were
in , but we were 500 meters apart.

01:10:23.325 --> 01:10:24.915
It took him 45 minutes to get to me.

01:10:25.035 --> 01:10:25.995
It was that thick.

01:10:26.445 --> 01:10:26.505
Wow.

01:10:26.535 --> 01:10:28.695
So I laid in the hole, broken leg.

01:10:29.025 --> 01:10:32.085
Um, he got to me and I'm like,
listen, you gotta call 9 1 1.

01:10:32.475 --> 01:10:34.935
You and my dad are not
getting me out of the spot.

01:10:35.445 --> 01:10:39.075
So, long story short, I laid
there for about three hours,

01:10:39.135 --> 01:10:41.395
um, before a, the first.

01:10:42.045 --> 01:10:46.215
People that get to me were, uh,
a fire department, um, that had

01:10:46.215 --> 01:10:47.505
kind of trudged their way in.

01:10:47.985 --> 01:10:48.645
God loved them.

01:10:48.675 --> 01:10:50.385
And, uh, they had a sled.

01:10:51.225 --> 01:10:53.445
And, uh, they got me in the sled.

01:10:53.505 --> 01:10:56.865
The paramedics kind of did
first level kind of support.

01:10:56.865 --> 01:10:59.865
They got my leg in a, in a flat swap flap.

01:10:59.865 --> 01:11:02.775
They got the flap, they got
the flappies down, but they.

01:11:03.870 --> 01:11:08.220
, they couldn't administer any mets, um,
cuz they didn't have the qualifications.

01:11:08.730 --> 01:11:12.720
So there was like 15, um, people
including police officers and the,

01:11:12.720 --> 01:11:17.400
and the, uh, ambulance guys that drug
me out of the woods for three hours.

01:11:17.880 --> 01:11:18.360
Unmetered.

01:11:18.510 --> 01:11:19.650
When did the pain kick in?

01:11:20.490 --> 01:11:22.440
Uh, soon as they bump

01:11:22.440 --> 01:11:23.400
me into the sled.

01:11:23.640 --> 01:11:23.940
Yeah.

01:11:23.970 --> 01:11:26.250
So while you're waiting for
them, it was like, okay.

01:11:26.250 --> 01:11:26.670
When I was

01:11:26.670 --> 01:11:31.920
waiting for them, I was right and then
it got dark and I started to get cold

01:11:31.920 --> 01:11:36.870
and I could feel like, all right, I know
that I'm, I've got signs of shock and

01:11:37.140 --> 01:11:41.490
you know, I'm talking to my brother and
he's taking pictures of me and he's doing

01:11:41.490 --> 01:11:43.050
what you would do as a brother would do.

01:11:43.050 --> 01:11:43.860
As a brother would do.

01:11:45.014 --> 01:11:48.344
Yeah, so it, it was, uh,
it was a bit surreal.

01:11:48.375 --> 01:11:51.795
Um, it's like I come into the terms
with the fact that I'm laying in the

01:11:51.795 --> 01:11:58.275
woods for what was a long time before my
brother even got there with a broken leg.

01:11:58.275 --> 01:12:04.094
Scary knowing that all of my kit was
in the truck and I didn't have it.

01:12:04.125 --> 01:12:07.184
And so, you know, I've
internalized that a lot since.

01:12:07.184 --> 01:12:09.375
And, you know, you kinda
live that over and over.

01:12:09.375 --> 01:12:09.495
And

01:12:09.795 --> 01:12:10.424
so

01:12:10.424 --> 01:12:10.905
lessons.

01:12:11.715 --> 01:12:14.025
Lessons learned, not so heavy pack.

01:12:14.295 --> 01:12:14.625
Right.

01:12:14.895 --> 01:12:15.945
Take what I need.

01:12:16.305 --> 01:12:17.475
Not more than I need.

01:12:17.985 --> 01:12:20.505
Um, take my time.

01:12:21.195 --> 01:12:22.635
Be a little bit more calculated.

01:12:22.695 --> 01:12:23.415
You're rushing a bit.

01:12:23.415 --> 01:12:27.195
Were you, um, I was, I was
trying to cover some ground.

01:12:27.345 --> 01:12:27.675
Okay.

01:12:27.765 --> 01:12:28.365
Because

01:12:28.875 --> 01:12:30.255
that's tactically advancing

01:12:30.315 --> 01:12:30.735
daylight.

01:12:30.740 --> 01:12:34.875
Swiftly, daylight was, uh,
was, was becoming scarce.

01:12:34.875 --> 01:12:37.335
It was in the afternoon,
so it was about two 30.

01:12:38.655 --> 01:12:41.325
You know, I wanted to get
my eyes on that big block.

01:12:41.445 --> 01:12:41.505
Yeah.

01:12:41.565 --> 01:12:46.515
Um, and, uh, I wouldn't have left
home without my spot and I wouldn't

01:12:46.515 --> 01:12:50.895
have, uh, left my tourniquet and
all my other first aid stuff, which

01:12:51.765 --> 01:12:53.235
for some reason was in my truck.

01:12:53.235 --> 01:12:56.025
And I decided to take
water and some other food.

01:12:56.030 --> 01:13:00.285
And I had, I had a, a blanket and
other things, which I did use, but.

01:13:01.650 --> 01:13:03.840
I had just some dumb mistakes
that could have really cost me.

01:13:04.080 --> 01:13:07.170
And if I wouldn't have had cell
coverage, that would've been tough.

01:13:07.170 --> 01:13:07.830
It'd have been worse.

01:13:07.830 --> 01:13:08.430
You'd be crawling.

01:13:08.940 --> 01:13:09.450
Yeah.

01:13:09.450 --> 01:13:10.200
That wasn't gonna happen.

01:13:11.220 --> 01:13:14.530
So about how far of a
fall was that, do you

01:13:14.530 --> 01:13:14.690
think?

01:13:14.880 --> 01:13:17.580
Uh, I'd say at about six, seven feet.

01:13:17.730 --> 01:13:23.010
Um, so it wasn't crazy, but you know,
I watched my leg hit that rock and

01:13:23.010 --> 01:13:27.750
this is like, I knew as soon as it
happened that, uh, something was up.

01:13:28.019 --> 01:13:28.560
So the question

01:13:28.560 --> 01:13:31.560
I'm sure everyone's asking,
how'd the scope Fair  know what

01:13:32.160 --> 01:13:32.760
it was?

01:13:33.690 --> 01:13:37.980
Strangely, the, it was the thing that
I can remember thinking about as I

01:13:37.980 --> 01:13:41.940
was falling, cuz you hear so many
stories of guys fallen with their

01:13:41.940 --> 01:13:44.640
rifles and, you know, discharging.

01:13:44.730 --> 01:13:44.820
Mm-hmm.

01:13:45.065 --> 01:13:48.210
. So as I'm falling, I threw it to the side.

01:13:48.300 --> 01:13:48.870
Okay.

01:13:49.650 --> 01:13:53.160
Landed in some moss and there was
some rocks, there was some scratches.

01:13:53.700 --> 01:13:55.770
It's since ran the battery test here.

01:13:56.370 --> 01:13:57.450
still shooting it.

01:13:57.450 --> 01:14:00.870
So it was, uh, it was our
three to 15 hunter model.

01:14:00.900 --> 01:14:02.010
Uh, it was fine.

01:14:02.280 --> 01:14:02.580
Wow.

01:14:02.580 --> 01:14:03.780
It did way better than me.

01:14:04.080 --> 01:14:04.970
, way better than you.

01:14:05.340 --> 01:14:07.140
I needed a three to 15 of my leg.

01:14:07.145 --> 01:14:07.410
So,

01:14:08.940 --> 01:14:14.400
um, I'm, I'm looking through a
couple more of my notes here.

01:14:14.400 --> 01:14:17.250
One of 'em I put down
was Cuts through Mirage.

01:14:17.610 --> 01:14:17.910
Yep.

01:14:19.200 --> 01:14:21.150
So there's a couple things
that we can talk about.

01:14:21.240 --> 01:14:21.750
Yeah.

01:14:21.930 --> 01:14:25.740
One of them is the resolution
and the clarity of the glass

01:14:25.890 --> 01:14:27.450
that is in our tangent.

01:14:27.450 --> 01:14:33.540
Thes, um, I think has an advantage
to, um, seeing through some

01:14:33.540 --> 01:14:35.310
of that distortion of mirage.

01:14:35.790 --> 01:14:39.750
Another product that we have
is, uh, polarizing lens for

01:14:39.750 --> 01:14:41.520
the ocular end of the scope.

01:14:41.850 --> 01:14:44.490
Okay, so like your sunglasses.

01:14:44.550 --> 01:14:44.700
Yeah.

01:14:44.700 --> 01:14:47.820
A polarizer on an optic
has the same impact.

01:14:48.180 --> 01:14:50.550
You have to tune it to get it to polarize.

01:14:50.610 --> 01:14:50.820
Yeah.

01:14:50.940 --> 01:14:54.120
But helps cut down some
of the effective mirage.

01:14:54.660 --> 01:14:59.040
Um, shooting on a bright, sunny day
over reflective surfaces like water,

01:14:59.340 --> 01:15:05.280
snow helps reduce the glare, um, from
that to help you see your target better.

01:15:05.910 --> 01:15:10.140
If you happen to be in a position
where you need to shoot or see through

01:15:10.140 --> 01:15:14.790
glass, um, same as your glasses, it
takes away all the glare so you can

01:15:14.790 --> 01:15:16.170
see to the target to the other side.

01:15:16.360 --> 01:15:20.925
So, One is the coatings,
one is the resolution.

01:15:21.615 --> 01:15:26.535
The other is, you know, pairing that with
a polarizer helps as a system to kind

01:15:26.535 --> 01:15:28.785
of bring that mirage down a little bit.

01:15:28.934 --> 01:15:32.355
It doesn't take it away, but it helps
you see your target a little bit better.

01:15:32.684 --> 01:15:33.345
Interesting.

01:15:34.125 --> 01:15:40.275
Uh, one thing, so tanex flip cap covers.

01:15:40.335 --> 01:15:40.485
Yep.

01:15:40.724 --> 01:15:43.425
Um, got a cool tour of the factory there.

01:15:43.425 --> 01:15:43.514
Yep.

01:15:43.545 --> 01:15:47.505
Looking at all the stuff you're doing and
they've got an interesting story as well.

01:15:48.224 --> 01:15:53.415
But, uh, one thing that, uh, you guys have
is the ad's, the anti-reflective devices.

01:15:53.474 --> 01:15:53.655
Yep.

01:15:54.375 --> 01:15:59.415
Uh, can you tell me a little bit
about how these ad's work and,

01:15:59.415 --> 01:16:00.825
uh, why somebody would want them?

01:16:02.055 --> 01:16:02.565
Absolutely.

01:16:02.595 --> 01:16:06.585
I think more people need
them than they know and.

01:16:07.890 --> 01:16:09.450
Don't understand why they would want them.

01:16:09.450 --> 01:16:12.690
So I, I'm happy to, to talk about
it cuz it's something that we

01:16:12.690 --> 01:16:19.140
developed for the US military and
goes back 25 years and we developed

01:16:19.140 --> 01:16:21.960
a proprietary coating called Exom.

01:16:22.320 --> 01:16:28.230
And that Exom is put on the honeycomb,
uh, and it helps absorb light.

01:16:29.190 --> 01:16:33.480
There's two things that we wanna
block, and that's the reflection

01:16:33.600 --> 01:16:39.150
coming back from the scope that if
sunlight hits the glass right and

01:16:39.155 --> 01:16:41.190
then comes straight back out is one.

01:16:41.195 --> 01:16:43.860
So if you're in the military and
you're buried in the side of a hill,

01:16:43.860 --> 01:16:46.860
you don't want to be discovered
because of cause you're flashing

01:16:46.860 --> 01:16:47.910
back out the glint or the glare.

01:16:47.940 --> 01:16:48.180
Right?

01:16:48.180 --> 01:16:48.240
Yeah.

01:16:48.750 --> 01:16:55.740
Um, and also the reflection that's kind
of come back off, it gets absorbed inside

01:16:55.740 --> 01:17:02.970
of that and it, uh, it actually acts as
a, um, as a lens cover or, um, sun shade.

01:17:02.970 --> 01:17:03.270
Sun shade.

01:17:03.300 --> 01:17:03.510
Yeah.

01:17:03.540 --> 01:17:03.750
Sorry.

01:17:03.755 --> 01:17:04.010
Okay.

01:17:05.085 --> 01:17:10.065
A two and a half inch honeycomb
works the same as a sun shade.

01:17:10.455 --> 01:17:14.625
What it doesn't do is doesn't
block the barrel ma uh, mirage.

01:17:14.684 --> 01:17:14.955
Right.

01:17:14.985 --> 01:17:15.885
Because of the lens.

01:17:15.889 --> 01:17:19.215
So if you're, if you're stacking that,
obviously we can't do the same thing,

01:17:19.220 --> 01:17:24.105
but it has the same effect as a sun shade
helps if the angle comes in from the sun.

01:17:24.105 --> 01:17:26.745
So kind of blocks off that glare
from your eye when you're, when

01:17:26.745 --> 01:17:27.764
you're looking at your scope.

01:17:28.425 --> 01:17:33.285
See I picked some of that up cuz I,
I just couldn't find a, um, an a r d

01:17:33.285 --> 01:17:35.085
for a scope that I was looking for.

01:17:35.144 --> 01:17:35.325
Yeah.

01:17:35.325 --> 01:17:38.055
And uh, to just kind of screw in.

01:17:38.059 --> 01:17:41.684
But, uh, Tenex had one that, uh, worked
with a scope and it works great and

01:17:41.684 --> 01:17:44.325
I use it for, on a hunting rifle.

01:17:45.305 --> 01:17:45.505
Excellent.

01:17:45.510 --> 01:17:50.865
At, um, uh, you only have to be
looking right towards the sun.

01:17:51.135 --> 01:17:51.315
Yeah.

01:17:51.315 --> 01:17:53.955
Are they coming in one time and not
be able to see anything through it to

01:17:53.955 --> 01:17:58.035
realize I could really use a solution
so I can actually see my target.

01:17:58.095 --> 01:17:58.815
Absolutely.

01:17:58.845 --> 01:18:01.705
And you know, one of
the other kind of just.

01:18:02.460 --> 01:18:03.390
Maybe forgotten about.

01:18:03.390 --> 01:18:06.660
Part is it actually protects the
glass in the front, so ah, yes.

01:18:06.660 --> 01:18:10.560
If you're trudging through the bush
and you know, you, something happens,

01:18:10.565 --> 01:18:15.690
the sticks hits your scope lens or,
or whatever it, uh, it's a small price

01:18:15.690 --> 01:18:17.370
to pay to protect the coating on the

01:18:17.370 --> 01:18:17.760
lens.

01:18:18.000 --> 01:18:20.820
One thing I've heard people talk
about is light transmission, and

01:18:20.820 --> 01:18:24.750
I know Elia's got thoughts on that
as well about, uh, the ideas of it.

01:18:24.750 --> 01:18:30.600
But, um, uh, an a r d would change
the amount of light just cuz it's got

01:18:30.600 --> 01:18:32.520
a, the honeycomb mash in front of it.

01:18:32.525 --> 01:18:34.860
It's gonna change the amount
of light that come through.

01:18:35.010 --> 01:18:35.100
Yep.

01:18:35.640 --> 01:18:37.890
Um, when and where
would that be a concern?

01:18:38.370 --> 01:18:40.200
Uh, or is it a psychological

01:18:40.200 --> 01:18:40.410
thing?

01:18:41.190 --> 01:18:42.480
It could be a little bit of both.

01:18:42.540 --> 01:18:42.780
Yeah.

01:18:42.780 --> 01:18:45.840
Um, it does, it does have an
impact on light transmission.

01:18:46.110 --> 01:18:46.350
Okay.

01:18:46.410 --> 01:18:46.770
For sure.

01:18:47.040 --> 01:18:47.340
Okay.

01:18:47.700 --> 01:18:53.160
It's very minimal, uh, in maybe the
very darkest edges of the evening.

01:18:53.490 --> 01:18:58.290
There may be a, a couple percentage,
um, drops in transmission.

01:18:58.730 --> 01:19:04.799
Uh, Very hard to see with the eye
and hard to measure in some cases.

01:19:05.219 --> 01:19:12.599
So, uh, we do, we do build different sizes
and different thicknesses of the honeycomb

01:19:13.080 --> 01:19:15.719
all have slight different impacts.

01:19:16.259 --> 01:19:20.040
And the cool thing about the
honeycomb in all of the magnified

01:19:20.040 --> 01:19:22.620
optics is you can't see it when you
put it on the front of the skull.

01:19:22.620 --> 01:19:23.160
No, you can't.

01:19:23.160 --> 01:19:26.820
So the focal point is out past where
the honeycomb is, and unless you're on

01:19:26.820 --> 01:19:32.519
a true one x, you can get the imprint,
but it really doesn't impede, you

01:19:32.519 --> 01:19:33.900
know, any of your shooting points.

01:19:33.900 --> 01:19:36.120
So, uh, it it's pretty cool.

01:19:36.809 --> 01:19:37.469
Very cool.

01:19:37.474 --> 01:19:42.240
Well, from my perspective, I mean,
just if I'm, if I wanna ring steel

01:19:42.419 --> 01:19:46.200
and it's a certain time of the day and
I'm in one of my lo locations, I like

01:19:46.200 --> 01:19:50.940
to go to, unless I have a sunshade
or an a r d, I'm just not seeing it.

01:19:51.120 --> 01:19:51.299
Yeah.

01:19:51.570 --> 01:19:52.259
Uh, hunting.

01:19:53.085 --> 01:19:54.375
Same thing out there.

01:19:54.525 --> 01:19:58.125
It came up and I couldn't take
the shot, wasn't an ethical shot,

01:19:58.155 --> 01:20:01.095
couldn't see the animal, so just
had to let it go by and I was like,

01:20:01.275 --> 01:20:02.985
I've gotta find a solution for this.

01:20:02.990 --> 01:20:03.795
And the a d worked

01:20:03.800 --> 01:20:04.035
well.

01:20:04.425 --> 01:20:07.305
So we all of our Tenex products.

01:20:07.935 --> 01:20:10.635
Before you go to the next question,
just while we're on the topic,

01:20:11.415 --> 01:20:13.725
all of them screw in all of them.

01:20:13.755 --> 01:20:16.215
That's one of the things
that we do very well.

01:20:16.245 --> 01:20:16.425
Right?

01:20:16.425 --> 01:20:18.885
If we're gonna brag about something,
we'll brag about the fact that

01:20:19.155 --> 01:20:24.585
we've got probably 5,000 fits
for almost every optical manufac

01:20:24.615 --> 01:20:26.535
optical manufacturer on the planet.

01:20:27.015 --> 01:20:31.605
Um, if we don't, we probably have
something that's pretty close.

01:20:31.725 --> 01:20:32.025
Yes.

01:20:32.055 --> 01:20:35.895
Uh, it's a pretty tough business to
have all the thread specs, the IDs,

01:20:35.895 --> 01:20:38.175
the ods, and have all those fits.

01:20:38.415 --> 01:20:42.915
We generally, we have a few models that
have the boots that go over that kind

01:20:42.915 --> 01:20:47.085
of fit over the top on some different
scope models that don't have the

01:20:47.115 --> 01:20:49.705
ability for a thread ring or right.

01:20:50.325 --> 01:20:57.375
That op, so we try to fix something to
that, but I would say 98% of all of our

01:20:57.375 --> 01:21:02.325
products for Tenex screw into the front
or have a cap that goes over the back.

01:21:02.385 --> 01:21:02.745
Right.

01:21:02.805 --> 01:21:05.684
They're really not a standard
in the optical industry for

01:21:05.684 --> 01:21:06.974
sizing and thread specs.

01:21:06.974 --> 01:21:08.985
And, which is crazy if you think about it.

01:21:09.195 --> 01:21:09.405
Yeah.

01:21:09.405 --> 01:21:09.644
Yeah.

01:21:09.644 --> 01:21:11.595
So, so that's what we do well.

01:21:11.805 --> 01:21:15.795
Um, you may not think that when you go to
our website and try to find your product

01:21:16.215 --> 01:21:17.684
, but we're trying to get better at that.

01:21:17.894 --> 01:21:21.644
So it, it's, uh, you know, it's
a, it's a work in progress.

01:21:21.915 --> 01:21:22.365
Well, that's,

01:21:22.365 --> 01:21:23.144
um, yeah.

01:21:23.144 --> 01:21:27.015
I don't think most people think
about the fact that within the same

01:21:27.055 --> 01:21:31.875
manufacturer in the same line, you can
have differing thread pitches or, uh,

01:21:32.385 --> 01:21:35.115
IDs, ods, , diameter, outside diameter

01:21:35.115 --> 01:21:35.295
even.

01:21:35.295 --> 01:21:37.755
It's just by the same line,
same model, different.

01:21:38.370 --> 01:21:38.820
Right.

01:21:38.940 --> 01:21:39.270
Yeah.

01:21:39.540 --> 01:21:42.270
And I don't think a lot of people would
really take that into consideration.

01:21:42.270 --> 01:21:47.250
And the fact that you guys have been
just scrapping, carving out a niche in

01:21:47.250 --> 01:21:52.140
an area, which probably really good in
making sure that, uh, uh, keep competition

01:21:52.140 --> 01:21:55.980
out cuz who else wants to go through
all of that effort and expenditure?

01:21:56.400 --> 01:22:02.370
Um, yeah, that's, uh, nothing
worthwhile ever comes easy does it?

01:22:02.460 --> 01:22:02.760
True.

01:22:03.570 --> 01:22:03.870
I mean,

01:22:04.440 --> 01:22:08.220
and then, and we built the, we built
the products to be tactically tough.

01:22:08.310 --> 01:22:11.580
Um, going back to the original days, and
I think I might have told you a story that

01:22:11.580 --> 01:22:17.700
the original design for the US soldier
was that flip cover that was positively

01:22:17.700 --> 01:22:21.360
attached to the scope was designed to
be grabbed in the open position so they

01:22:21.360 --> 01:22:26.900
could stand up, pick up their gun in their
optic by the flip cover and run and move.

01:22:27.000 --> 01:22:29.790
And, you know, we've never, we
tried not to lose sight of that.

01:22:30.060 --> 01:22:30.570
Right.

01:22:31.650 --> 01:22:36.105
Um, You know, sometimes being in
the right place at the right time or

01:22:36.105 --> 01:22:40.155
setting yourself up so you're ready
when the right opportunity comes up.

01:22:40.155 --> 01:22:43.725
That plays a big part in business,
saying yes to the right people and

01:22:43.725 --> 01:22:49.095
making sure you're surrounded by the,
uh, same similar minded people who are

01:22:49.095 --> 01:22:51.225
positive, who work in the right direction.

01:22:51.585 --> 01:22:56.955
I remember listening to you speak before
about saying no to the wrong people.

01:22:57.765 --> 01:22:58.695
Yeah, that's a tough one.

01:22:58.875 --> 01:22:59.025
Yeah.

01:22:59.085 --> 01:23:08.025
Um, it, uh, there's a lot of different
companies that have different business

01:23:08.025 --> 01:23:15.315
practices and we wanna partner with
companies, distributors, dealers who share

01:23:15.644 --> 01:23:21.675
our same beliefs, who, um, understand
what it takes to sell high end optic.

01:23:22.125 --> 01:23:25.095
We never compete or we
don't compete on price.

01:23:25.100 --> 01:23:27.915
Generally, I'd say we
never compete, but we.

01:23:28.950 --> 01:23:30.419
Stand behind the product.

01:23:30.750 --> 01:23:36.419
We understand that we are then
probably the most expensive.

01:23:36.509 --> 01:23:41.129
In some cases, all of our products are
usually a little bit more expensive.

01:23:41.129 --> 01:23:44.639
So having a partner that understands
the value and the quality is

01:23:44.700 --> 01:23:45.990
extremely important to us.

01:23:46.919 --> 01:23:48.599
We've learned a few hard lessons.

01:23:48.629 --> 01:23:52.469
We've had to break
relationships because of that.

01:23:52.599 --> 01:23:53.000
Mm-hmm.

01:23:53.000 --> 01:23:57.210
Because they're not a good
extension of our company here,

01:23:57.269 --> 01:24:01.860
or us as, as the way we want to
portray ourselves to our customers.

01:24:02.219 --> 01:24:06.089
And that's always a tough place to be in
because, you know, hey, we're Canadians,

01:24:06.120 --> 01:24:07.230
we wanna be friends with everyone.

01:24:07.440 --> 01:24:10.259
We don't, we don't want to be
the, we don't wanna be that guy.

01:24:10.259 --> 01:24:11.610
But sometimes you gotta be that guy and

01:24:11.610 --> 01:24:12.150
you've built.

01:24:12.765 --> 01:24:15.105
Business, our reputation on
saying, yes, can you do this?

01:24:15.105 --> 01:24:15.705
Yes we can.

01:24:15.785 --> 01:24:16.025
Yes.

01:24:16.025 --> 01:24:16.225
Right.

01:24:16.225 --> 01:24:17.625
Can you do cuz l can, yes, we can.

01:24:17.625 --> 01:24:17.985
Right?

01:24:18.135 --> 01:24:18.345
Yeah.

01:24:18.345 --> 01:24:21.795
And at a certain point you gotta
turn around and look at, am I

01:24:21.795 --> 01:24:22.995
saying yes to the right people?

01:24:23.145 --> 01:24:23.355
Yeah.

01:24:23.595 --> 01:24:25.245
Am I being a little bit more selective?

01:24:25.245 --> 01:24:26.865
So something like that comes up.

01:24:27.135 --> 01:24:31.485
Is that a big boardroom discussion and
everyone's waiting out the pros and cons?

01:24:31.485 --> 01:24:34.815
Or do you guys kind of have bumpers
in line and just say, you know what,

01:24:34.815 --> 01:24:39.405
this person's offside or this company's
offside outside of our bumpers

01:24:39.405 --> 01:24:40.785
or parameters that we've put in.

01:24:41.265 --> 01:24:43.815
Uh, we give them the opportunity
to correct it or they're gone.

01:24:44.085 --> 01:24:48.855
Is that sort of as easily pragmatic as we,
we kind of know where our variables are?

01:24:49.335 --> 01:24:51.555
I think in a lot of cases, yes.

01:24:51.885 --> 01:24:53.115
Comes with experience.

01:24:53.175 --> 01:24:57.075
It comes with hard lessons
learned, gut instinct.

01:24:57.435 --> 01:24:58.905
There's a few things that.

01:24:59.700 --> 01:25:00.720
Tip you off.

01:25:00.900 --> 01:25:06.000
People go down a certain particular
path at the beginning of a relationship.

01:25:06.270 --> 01:25:11.640
Not that you want to kind of paint
everybody with the same brush, but you

01:25:11.640 --> 01:25:16.830
know, you kind of, if you've done it
enough and things kind of tweak you

01:25:16.830 --> 01:25:20.910
in a different way, you kind of trust
your gut, you trust your instincts.

01:25:21.300 --> 01:25:21.840
Yes.

01:25:22.230 --> 01:25:25.500
I would say everyone would, if
they messed up, we'd give them

01:25:26.310 --> 01:25:27.600
multiple chances to Correct.

01:25:27.605 --> 01:25:28.170
Right, right.

01:25:28.320 --> 01:25:33.240
Um, we wanna avoid getting to the
place where we have to correct

01:25:33.245 --> 01:25:35.370
somebody if you can just
identify it right off the bat.

01:25:35.430 --> 01:25:35.670
Right.

01:25:36.300 --> 01:25:36.570
Yeah.

01:25:36.630 --> 01:25:39.300
That's interesting then the
gut instinct portion of it.

01:25:39.300 --> 01:25:43.500
Cuz people don't really talk about that in
business and you don't teach gut instinct.

01:25:43.710 --> 01:25:43.860
Yeah.

01:25:43.890 --> 01:25:46.980
I mean, the best predictor of future
performance is past performance.

01:25:47.010 --> 01:25:47.220
Right.

01:25:47.280 --> 01:25:50.610
So you and I, were gonna get
into a business relationship.

01:25:50.610 --> 01:25:52.950
First thing we're gonna do is look
at each other's past performance.

01:25:53.010 --> 01:25:53.160
Yep.

01:25:53.460 --> 01:25:58.740
And we're gonna take a look at,
um, Uh, social media presence.

01:25:58.740 --> 01:26:01.590
We're gonna take a look at like
personally, if I'm getting into business,

01:26:01.594 --> 01:26:05.040
some, somebody over on British Columbia,
I get onto court services online

01:26:05.160 --> 01:26:08.309
and if they have, I had one person
phone me up and he had this idea he

01:26:08.309 --> 01:26:12.120
wanted to build a mall for guns and to
getting all these gun things together

01:26:12.125 --> 01:26:13.590
and it'll have a range in there.

01:26:13.590 --> 01:26:18.500
And, and we'll be integral to this
and we'll warning bells, bing,

01:26:18.509 --> 01:26:20.759
bing, bing as this person's talked.

01:26:20.759 --> 01:26:26.519
And, uh, they had run some very
successful businesses and presented with

01:26:26.519 --> 01:26:28.889
a lot of flash and a lot of panache.

01:26:30.059 --> 01:26:34.320
But my gut, something was just ringing,
so I got off the phone first thing I did.

01:26:34.349 --> 01:26:34.799
Okay.

01:26:34.860 --> 01:26:39.420
Google a name, use ent, open
source intelligence tools, right?

01:26:39.420 --> 01:26:40.049
Absolutely.

01:26:40.110 --> 01:26:47.700
Um, court services online had three
pages of civil suits of people suing this

01:26:47.700 --> 01:26:49.500
person or the person suing them back.

01:26:49.500 --> 01:26:50.820
And I'm like, thank you.

01:26:50.820 --> 01:26:51.509
No, thank you.

01:26:51.570 --> 01:26:51.840
Right?

01:26:51.840 --> 01:26:52.080
But.

01:26:52.980 --> 01:26:56.610
I mean, the proposal that this persons
coming out with, it sounded great.

01:26:56.670 --> 01:27:01.050
And I think, um, I think that's
a difficult thing for people

01:27:01.050 --> 01:27:09.210
in business to, um, to quell
their ambition of for success.

01:27:09.240 --> 01:27:13.620
However, they deem success in their own
business to stop and regroup and say,

01:27:14.010 --> 01:27:15.720
what's the macro of this look like?

01:27:15.750 --> 01:27:17.700
What's the big picture
of this relationship?

01:27:18.210 --> 01:27:22.650
What, what would be some, like, without
naming names, uh, sort of warning

01:27:22.650 --> 01:27:26.970
signs that you would see, like if,
if you were to talk to old you, going

01:27:26.975 --> 01:27:28.170
back a little bit prior to learning

01:27:28.170 --> 01:27:29.070
something, I'd kick his butt.

01:27:30.750 --> 01:27:38.760
We, we have a, a pretty wide variety
of, of customers and have had over

01:27:38.760 --> 01:27:45.060
the multitudes of years, and we're
not looking for more, let's just

01:27:45.065 --> 01:27:46.560
talk about our distribution channels.

01:27:47.130 --> 01:27:49.380
We're not looking for more internet based.

01:27:49.905 --> 01:27:57.585
Customers that just have no, uh, angle
except to sell it at a cheaper price.

01:27:57.615 --> 01:27:57.975
Right?

01:27:57.975 --> 01:28:02.175
A lot of our products, we maintain
map and we protect them, which

01:28:02.175 --> 01:28:04.485
protects our distribution network.

01:28:04.995 --> 01:28:10.125
And we're looking for good partners who
pay their bill know how to sell, um,

01:28:10.155 --> 01:28:17.595
optics in the way that we would want
them sold and kind of extend our, um,

01:28:17.655 --> 01:28:22.815
culture in relation ethos exactly into our
customer base or what potentially will be,

01:28:22.875 --> 01:28:24.405
you know, their customer base and ours.

01:28:25.935 --> 01:28:31.605
Things they say when they call us on
the phone, um, tougher on the phone

01:28:32.715 --> 01:28:36.435
questions maybe that they're asking,
or things that they're looking for

01:28:36.645 --> 01:28:41.115
without a relationship, without
understanding what we're looking for and

01:28:41.120 --> 01:28:42.225
we don't know what they're looking for.

01:28:42.355 --> 01:28:46.515
So, Going back to some key
questions maybe will tip us off.

01:28:46.605 --> 01:28:47.955
And then we do the same thing.

01:28:48.375 --> 01:28:52.035
We'll get online, we'll start
doing our, our background checks.

01:28:52.755 --> 01:28:57.555
Maybe we'll give people a chance to
do stuff where, you know, it's kind of

01:28:58.305 --> 01:29:00.005
cash in the barrel head, so to speak.

01:29:00.025 --> 01:29:06.915
And we will, we will slide depending
on the personality of, of the person.

01:29:07.755 --> 01:29:08.865
It's almost tougher on the phone.

01:29:08.955 --> 01:29:14.715
And that's kind of what we've been lacking
over the last three years where we're

01:29:14.745 --> 01:29:18.615
starving a little bit for more face to
face stuff where you can pick up on keys.

01:29:18.620 --> 01:29:18.705
Right.

01:29:19.065 --> 01:29:22.335
And the non-verbals, the non-verbals,
you meet somebody at a trade show,

01:29:22.695 --> 01:29:26.205
probably more apt to get, uh,
involved with them if you have a

01:29:26.205 --> 01:29:27.540
face-to-face discussion like we are now.

01:29:27.915 --> 01:29:28.125
Mm-hmm.

01:29:28.935 --> 01:29:29.985
harder on the phone.

01:29:30.315 --> 01:29:32.595
We might be a little bit more
strict, but I don't know.

01:29:32.595 --> 01:29:33.375
It just depends.

01:29:33.375 --> 01:29:37.515
And how do you describe
the gut instinct but.

01:29:38.490 --> 01:29:41.250
A few things kind of
add up over the years.

01:29:41.940 --> 01:29:43.050
Put it all together.

01:29:43.080 --> 01:29:44.100
You make a decision.

01:29:44.880 --> 01:29:46.620
Sometimes you say yes,
sometimes you say no.

01:29:46.830 --> 01:29:48.300
Yeah, yeah.

01:29:48.420 --> 01:29:52.050
You know, when I'm talking to somebody and
everything they're saying sounds awesome.

01:29:52.830 --> 01:29:56.040
It sounds like exactly what I think
somebody would think I would want to hear.

01:29:56.100 --> 01:29:56.400
Yeah.

01:29:56.940 --> 01:29:57.180
Okay.

01:29:57.180 --> 01:29:58.410
Alarm bells are going off, right?

01:29:58.410 --> 01:29:58.680
What's up?

01:29:59.110 --> 01:30:02.700
I always just, for me, I just like
back up, back up, back up next.

01:30:02.700 --> 01:30:02.820
Sure.

01:30:02.820 --> 01:30:06.600
You got one fellow I work with
and he does that to me sometimes.

01:30:06.605 --> 01:30:07.470
He's like, I'm just doing it.

01:30:07.470 --> 01:30:11.280
Cause I know how much it, he's
like, I don't wanna hear this.

01:30:11.400 --> 01:30:18.660
Um, the, um, and how a person
will treat others who can't do

01:30:19.200 --> 01:30:22.440
anything for them is the one key
indicator that I've found as well.

01:30:22.445 --> 01:30:23.280
If they're, uh, yeah.

01:30:24.000 --> 01:30:27.300
You know, just seeing how they, if
you're going out for food and they

01:30:27.300 --> 01:30:28.890
treat somebody in a certain way that.

01:30:30.254 --> 01:30:31.394
that they're not treating you?

01:30:31.844 --> 01:30:33.355
Um, I, I,

01:30:33.434 --> 01:30:34.304
that's a warning sign.

01:30:34.394 --> 01:30:34.844
Big time.

01:30:34.844 --> 01:30:34.964
Yeah.

01:30:34.964 --> 01:30:35.745
That's a warning sign.

01:30:35.745 --> 01:30:35.894
Yeah.

01:30:35.894 --> 01:30:36.705
I'm with you on that one.

01:30:37.365 --> 01:30:39.254
Is there anything else we
should be chatting about?

01:30:40.245 --> 01:30:41.894
You know, I, I've gone through
a bunch of the questions.

01:30:41.900 --> 01:30:46.275
There are some basic, uh, q and A on
upkeep of the, uh, the scopes and,

01:30:46.275 --> 01:30:51.464
uh, and, and, uh, you know, common
questions that you'd probably get asked.

01:30:51.525 --> 01:30:54.495
Um, are there any things that maybe
I've missed or that we should be

01:30:54.495 --> 01:30:55.004
touching on?

01:30:55.184 --> 01:30:56.025
That's a good question.

01:30:56.144 --> 01:30:57.195
We have talked a lot.

01:30:57.285 --> 01:30:58.605
Um, we have.

01:30:59.925 --> 01:31:06.615
. You know, I think, uh, uh, a desire
and focus in our company to evolve

01:31:06.615 --> 01:31:12.225
and to grow our customers that are
listening now, you know, stick with us.

01:31:12.345 --> 01:31:14.805
You know, if you're waiting on
a scope, we'll get it to you,

01:31:15.240 --> 01:31:15.525
Yeah.

01:31:15.975 --> 01:31:19.515
Um, yeah, we want to,
we wanna be innovative.

01:31:19.515 --> 01:31:24.915
We want to be thought leaders within,
you know, without being too fatty.

01:31:25.315 --> 01:31:25.875
Right?

01:31:26.055 --> 01:31:27.375
Fatty, fatty

01:31:27.375 --> 01:31:29.205
faddish, fatty faddish, whatever.

01:31:29.265 --> 01:31:35.085
Uh, we're, we're professional company
and it's based on, you know, um,

01:31:35.255 --> 01:31:39.195
professional shooters and we're
very serious about our business.

01:31:40.035 --> 01:31:40.905
I like to have fun.

01:31:41.295 --> 01:31:44.745
We, I think we're a fun group of people,
but you know, we're pretty serious about

01:31:44.745 --> 01:31:49.525
this business and we're pretty serious
about, um, making sure that we maintain

01:31:50.085 --> 01:31:52.035
the standards that we set out to achieve.

01:31:52.514 --> 01:31:55.875
And we do have a lot of brands.

01:31:56.445 --> 01:31:59.355
We do have different
variations of products.

01:31:59.684 --> 01:32:05.535
We have a lot of great relationships
with our OEMs, which in one case, they're

01:32:05.845 --> 01:32:09.735
our customers and on other cases could
be considered, you know, competition.

01:32:10.035 --> 01:32:13.335
But it's such a small world
and we really value that.

01:32:13.335 --> 01:32:18.224
And we never wanna damage, we'll
never sacrifice the business over the

01:32:18.224 --> 01:32:22.394
relationships that we've built over the
last, you know, 10, 20 years in cases

01:32:22.394 --> 01:32:24.974
like brilliant, small, small company.

01:32:24.974 --> 01:32:30.705
And, and this industry as a whole
is a fantastic place to work for

01:32:30.705 --> 01:32:32.894
me, for a lot of the people here.

01:32:32.925 --> 01:32:34.455
I grew up in the outdoors.

01:32:34.724 --> 01:32:36.195
I love to fish, I love to hunt.

01:32:36.735 --> 01:32:44.045
Um, I like this culture, but I also
like everybody else in the industry

01:32:44.050 --> 01:32:47.054
who, I think I might have said this
before, they get up every day and

01:32:47.054 --> 01:32:48.965
they just grind it out and Right.

01:32:48.969 --> 01:32:51.344
They want to, they want to,
they want the same goals.

01:32:51.344 --> 01:32:52.995
They want to be in the same place.

01:32:53.625 --> 01:32:59.295
Helping people out, providing good
products, increasing, you know, the, the

01:32:59.295 --> 01:33:02.505
capabilities, either down range or in com.

01:33:02.625 --> 01:33:05.625
Competition, just refining stuff.

01:33:05.684 --> 01:33:10.965
Um, making our processes better,
uh, evolving our products, making

01:33:10.965 --> 01:33:13.125
those clicks a little bit, click
here, bit more clicking, you

01:33:13.125 --> 01:33:14.405
know, a little bit more clicky.

01:33:14.415 --> 01:33:14.835
The clicks.

01:33:14.965 --> 01:33:16.065
Clicks, quickies, clicks.

01:33:16.425 --> 01:33:16.934
Improving.

01:33:16.934 --> 01:33:21.405
Our trade market might already be,
I dunno, , you know, just stuff

01:33:21.405 --> 01:33:22.485
that makes us more efficient.

01:33:22.545 --> 01:33:22.635
Right.

01:33:22.635 --> 01:33:23.535
And it's for everything.

01:33:23.565 --> 01:33:27.495
It's like when a customer goes to
our website, I'm really concerned

01:33:27.495 --> 01:33:31.485
that it's complicated and sometimes I
question, man, I wouldn't buy from me.

01:33:31.844 --> 01:33:32.025
Right?

01:33:32.025 --> 01:33:33.495
Like, it seemed like it's, it's.

01:33:34.679 --> 01:33:37.139
It, there's a lot of information there,
and we're trying to make it easy.

01:33:37.139 --> 01:33:40.889
So that's a constant
battle we hope to approve

01:33:40.889 --> 01:33:41.070
on.

01:33:41.130 --> 01:33:43.590
That's a struggle that so many
companies have, will have.

01:33:43.590 --> 01:33:47.849
I mean, if you talk to a, uh, software
developer, an engineer designer, Hey,

01:33:47.849 --> 01:33:49.620
I'm a full stack developer, right?

01:33:49.679 --> 01:33:49.920
Yeah.

01:33:50.370 --> 01:33:52.650
They're gonna talk a very
different language and what the

01:33:52.655 --> 01:33:54.509
end user is gonna want to see.

01:33:54.540 --> 01:33:56.370
That's the way they have
their UX experts, right?

01:33:56.370 --> 01:33:56.429
Yeah.

01:33:56.429 --> 01:34:00.030
The people that, in, like from an
engineer's perspective, they can

01:34:00.150 --> 01:34:04.889
produce a best quality product and,
but is that being presented in the

01:34:04.894 --> 01:34:06.540
best way for the, for the end user?

01:34:06.545 --> 01:34:10.920
And some places do the other side
and they will present in the absolute

01:34:10.920 --> 01:34:14.940
best way, but maybe, maybe what they
got behind them isn't gonna be quite,

01:34:14.940 --> 01:34:16.950
uh, quite at the same level, right?

01:34:16.950 --> 01:34:17.160
Yeah.

01:34:17.219 --> 01:34:17.370
And

01:34:17.370 --> 01:34:21.719
I think the way that, you know, from
an operational perspective inside, we

01:34:21.719 --> 01:34:30.945
could make it, um, Different, that's
easy for us, but it would be like almost

01:34:30.945 --> 01:34:32.775
incomprehensible for our customers.

01:34:32.780 --> 01:34:36.105
And so now it's, it's a, it's a process.

01:34:36.110 --> 01:34:38.714
Like we build everything almost.

01:34:39.165 --> 01:34:42.344
It's not just in time cuz we
carry all the inventory, but

01:34:42.375 --> 01:34:43.424
it's gotta go into a build cycle.

01:34:43.424 --> 01:34:45.795
And I'm talking specifically
tenne bricks, right?

01:34:45.795 --> 01:34:49.605
So the tenne brick customer orders, a flip
cover ANR reflection device, whatever.

01:34:49.695 --> 01:34:49.875
Yeah.

01:34:50.384 --> 01:34:53.054
That gets through the
system into the build cycle.

01:34:53.264 --> 01:34:58.094
Well, there might be 7,000 parts
in front of that one customer's

01:34:58.125 --> 01:35:00.375
order and takes two to three weeks.

01:35:00.380 --> 01:35:02.085
So what we need to do
is get better at that.

01:35:02.415 --> 01:35:07.365
So there's a lot of things we
want people to have, our cust have

01:35:07.365 --> 01:35:09.585
our products in a timely fashion.

01:35:10.934 --> 01:35:16.695
Companies like Amazon, other just
in Time, which, you know, the FBA

01:35:16.785 --> 01:35:18.405
fulfillment where I, by Amazon Yeah.

01:35:18.634 --> 01:35:21.224
Have a product that order
like almost the next day.

01:35:21.495 --> 01:35:21.615
Yeah.

01:35:21.615 --> 01:35:24.735
There's an expectation of
online, um, procurement that

01:35:24.735 --> 01:35:25.424
that's what it's gonna be.

01:35:25.424 --> 01:35:27.884
And unfortunately, you know, for
us, we're not there, but we have

01:35:27.884 --> 01:35:29.625
a goal to be closer to that.

01:35:29.985 --> 01:35:33.285
Well, that's, as one developer
actually I was talking with, with

01:35:33.344 --> 01:35:39.195
said, everybody judges their user
experience or customer experience based

01:35:39.195 --> 01:35:41.025
on the best possible thing out there.

01:35:41.384 --> 01:35:41.504
Yeah.

01:35:41.625 --> 01:35:45.809
When people look at a, an online
store, they're comparing you to Amazon,

01:35:46.304 --> 01:35:52.235
which has millions and billions of
dollars to be able to, uh, perfect.

01:35:52.240 --> 01:35:56.264
And see what everyone's like,
demographic and psychographic and all

01:35:56.264 --> 01:35:58.065
of their user habits and all the rest.

01:35:58.065 --> 01:36:03.014
So it, it's tough for these
small and medium size businesses.

01:36:03.014 --> 01:36:04.754
It can be tough for the big ones too.

01:36:05.085 --> 01:36:05.325
Uh,

01:36:05.325 --> 01:36:06.014
yeah, for sure.

01:36:06.014 --> 01:36:10.155
And, uh, another challenge, not only
just for us, Getting the customers to

01:36:10.155 --> 01:36:13.575
find the part, like when you went to
find the part and the fit for your scope.

01:36:13.580 --> 01:36:14.985
Hopefully that was a good experience.

01:36:15.195 --> 01:36:15.495
Yeah.

01:36:16.305 --> 01:36:20.145
We also have a challenge with our dealers,
uh, who want to carry our products.

01:36:20.925 --> 01:36:27.525
So imagine a store that would have to have
a shelf that had 5,000 parts on it, right?

01:36:27.525 --> 01:36:28.885
It's not gonna happen, right.

01:36:28.890 --> 01:36:31.665
So we've struggled a lot with
that in the past, and it's very,

01:36:31.725 --> 01:36:34.695
it's very difficult for customers
to get the stuff that they need.

01:36:34.695 --> 01:36:37.905
Having on the shelf, some of our
competitors, um, it's a little

01:36:37.910 --> 01:36:40.005
bit easier to fit and model stuff.

01:36:40.485 --> 01:36:41.505
Ours, it's impossible.

01:36:41.685 --> 01:36:46.245
So our best path forward now has been
to get our dealers if they want to.

01:36:46.800 --> 01:36:49.050
Offer Tenex products to their customers.

01:36:49.290 --> 01:36:51.960
We can get them set up on our
website as kind of a dealer account.

01:36:52.110 --> 01:36:52.200
Mm.

01:36:52.500 --> 01:36:56.610
They have access to all of the fit guides,
all of the models they can buy at our

01:36:56.615 --> 01:36:58.590
dealer pricing directly on our website.

01:36:59.040 --> 01:37:00.030
It's easy for them.

01:37:00.090 --> 01:37:00.300
Yeah.

01:37:00.300 --> 01:37:01.230
Easier for them.

01:37:01.230 --> 01:37:04.320
Cuz then we don't have to manage
a whole bunch of infrastructure

01:37:04.325 --> 01:37:06.060
to get, keep them up to date.

01:37:06.450 --> 01:37:09.600
And then it's easy for us to, cuz we can
kind of get that into the cycle quicker.

01:37:09.990 --> 01:37:10.410
So.

01:37:10.890 --> 01:37:11.310
Yeah.

01:37:12.120 --> 01:37:12.690
Very cool.

01:37:12.690 --> 01:37:16.020
And I, and the other part that really
kind of struck out, stuck out to me

01:37:16.020 --> 01:37:18.600
was the, uh, uh, the relationships.

01:37:18.600 --> 01:37:21.420
How you're saying you don't want to,
why would we burn this relationship?

01:37:21.690 --> 01:37:22.830
Those are super important.

01:37:23.910 --> 01:37:26.950
Honestly, anybody listening to this,
I know we've covered ga I know we're

01:37:26.955 --> 01:37:30.120
talking about, uh, objects, but
we're also talking about a company.

01:37:30.120 --> 01:37:31.800
We're talking about being an entrepreneur.

01:37:31.800 --> 01:37:34.170
We're talking to Bill lessons
learned on a hunting trip.

01:37:34.170 --> 01:37:34.320
Right.

01:37:34.590 --> 01:37:37.200
I mean there, there's a kind of a
wide gamt what we're talking about

01:37:37.200 --> 01:37:38.610
here, but I can't say it enough.

01:37:39.690 --> 01:37:42.180
Business, it's not personal,
it's just business.

01:37:42.180 --> 01:37:43.070
People say that, right.

01:37:43.920 --> 01:37:48.690
I, I don't know, maybe, maybe somebody
out there who's much better at

01:37:49.110 --> 01:37:54.930
business than I am can, uh, can have
a compelling argument to the contrary.

01:37:54.930 --> 01:37:57.690
But in my opinion, all
business is personal.

01:37:57.860 --> 01:37:58.350
Yeah.

01:37:58.355 --> 01:38:00.180
It's all based on relationships.

01:38:00.210 --> 01:38:04.050
Those relationships take time to
establish, which are based on trust.

01:38:04.350 --> 01:38:08.010
You betray that trust, you
betray the relationship.

01:38:08.130 --> 01:38:11.790
It affects the business, and
that's from my experience.

01:38:12.810 --> 01:38:13.740
The core of

01:38:13.740 --> 01:38:14.340
business.

01:38:14.760 --> 01:38:20.520
In every situation that we've been
in a downturn or we've run into a

01:38:20.525 --> 01:38:25.350
rough patch in this company, it's the
relationships with our distribution

01:38:25.355 --> 01:38:28.710
and our customers and our OEMs
that have seen us through that.

01:38:28.840 --> 01:38:29.400
Right.

01:38:29.820 --> 01:38:30.720
Every single time.

01:38:30.780 --> 01:38:31.110
Yeah.

01:38:31.200 --> 01:38:33.540
And it's always, it's, it's not
personal, it's just business.

01:38:33.540 --> 01:38:35.610
When things are going
good on one side, right.

01:38:35.760 --> 01:38:39.210
You just wait till the other side
of the coin comes and it will come.

01:38:39.660 --> 01:38:40.170
And we hope

01:38:40.170 --> 01:38:40.290
that

01:38:40.290 --> 01:38:43.020
we never forget that when the
people that you know help you when

01:38:43.025 --> 01:38:45.540
you need it and you know when you
don't and they're always there.

01:38:45.540 --> 01:38:46.680
It's those, yeah.

01:38:46.685 --> 01:38:48.000
For me that's super important.

01:38:48.300 --> 01:38:48.420
Awesome.

01:38:49.630 --> 01:38:53.340
Trevor, thank you very much for
being on the Silvercore Podcast.

01:38:53.340 --> 01:38:57.240
I thoroughly enjoyed my time with you,
with the company and, and recording this.

01:38:57.270 --> 01:38:57.660
Thank you.

01:38:57.660 --> 01:38:58.320
It's been an honor.