WEBVTT NOTE This file was generated by Descript 00:00:09.090 --> 00:00:11.670 Dave Hoekstra: Welcome to Working Smarter, presented by Calabrio where 00:00:11.670 --> 00:00:15.330 we discuss contact center industry trends and best practices, as well 00:00:15.330 --> 00:00:18.210 as sharing success stories and pain points with some of the most innovative 00:00:18.215 --> 00:00:19.530 professionals in the industry. 00:00:20.250 --> 00:00:22.500 We're glad you're joining us to learn and grow together in order to 00:00:22.500 --> 00:00:26.009 provide world-class customer service to each and every one of our clients. 00:00:26.490 --> 00:00:30.240 My name is Dave Stra, product evangelist here at Collabreo, and my guest 00:00:30.240 --> 00:00:35.400 today, I am super excited because we have the legendary Jim Davies. 00:00:35.850 --> 00:00:40.140 Now, Jim Davies recently joined Collabreo as Chief Experience Officer, 00:00:40.140 --> 00:00:44.460 but as you'll probably learn today, has an extensive amount of background 00:00:44.460 --> 00:00:48.599 in the contact center industry with his time at Gartner, and I am. 00:00:49.415 --> 00:00:52.382 This is of like interviewing one of your heroes here, to be honest with you. 00:00:52.382 --> 00:00:54.032 So Jim, how are we doing today? 00:00:54.632 --> 00:00:55.862 Jim Davies: Oh yeah, very good day. 00:00:55.862 --> 00:00:56.262 Thank you. 00:00:56.262 --> 00:00:57.822 And I'm very kind you to say hero. 00:00:57.910 --> 00:00:58.970 I've not been called that before. 00:00:58.989 --> 00:00:58.994 Dave Hoekstra: Oh. 00:00:59.070 --> 00:01:00.244 It's it truly is. 00:01:00.244 --> 00:01:04.532 And I remember when when it was announced that we were hiring you, it was I can 00:01:04.532 --> 00:01:06.816 imagine someone's, that's like their. 00:01:08.111 --> 00:01:12.319 Baseball coach in little league is, the MVP of the American 00:01:12.319 --> 00:01:13.399 League or something like that. 00:01:13.399 --> 00:01:15.649 So it's really fantastic to have you here. 00:01:15.649 --> 00:01:21.377 And so I'd like to I'd like to, before we get into the topic of today, which 00:01:21.377 --> 00:01:23.987 we're gonna talk about some of the things that contact centers could do 00:01:23.992 --> 00:01:25.834 to look towards the future I'd like to. 00:01:26.194 --> 00:01:27.694 Hear a little bit about your background. 00:01:27.694 --> 00:01:29.014 Tell us how you got here now. 00:01:29.224 --> 00:01:33.075 I did a little research before we started, and I see that not only in your 00:01:33.075 --> 00:01:38.295 time at Gartner, but you are also the guitarist for Prodigy, the prog rock band. 00:01:38.745 --> 00:01:39.607 Is that yeah. 00:01:39.997 --> 00:01:41.517 Jim Davies: I saw Is that a different Jim Davies? 00:01:41.517 --> 00:01:42.927 It's possibly a different guy. 00:01:42.927 --> 00:01:43.467 Yeah. 00:01:43.477 --> 00:01:45.110 And I didn't, Create Garfield. 00:01:45.110 --> 00:01:46.640 Either that's somebody else's again. 00:01:46.640 --> 00:01:51.256 But no, my, my background is actually quite unusual for being 00:01:51.256 --> 00:01:56.576 in this position now because I was a Gartner analyst for 22 years. 00:01:56.576 --> 00:01:58.797 But before that I was actually a scientist. 00:01:59.047 --> 00:02:01.927 So I used to work for the Ministry defense as an organic chemist. 00:02:02.347 --> 00:02:05.857 So I was a classic person in a laboratory with a white coat mixing 00:02:05.857 --> 00:02:07.629 A and B and having fun there. 00:02:07.629 --> 00:02:11.649 But yeah, moved into Ghana primarily because I had the right sort of 00:02:11.658 --> 00:02:15.078 thought processes, the right of analytical minds, and I became one 00:02:15.078 --> 00:02:18.582 of Ghana's lead analysts for customer experience and contact center. 00:02:19.152 --> 00:02:23.232 So I've been tracking the, what used to be called workforce 00:02:23.232 --> 00:02:26.728 optimization market, and then I rebranded it to workforce engagement. 00:02:27.188 --> 00:02:29.438 Been tracking that for 15 plus years. 00:02:29.505 --> 00:02:32.466 But also as we were both talking about earlier, most 00:02:32.466 --> 00:02:33.706 jobs you can't just do one job. 00:02:33.706 --> 00:02:36.619 I was also the Gartner's lead analyst for Voice of the Customer. 00:02:36.679 --> 00:02:38.831 I'm one of our lead customer experience analysts. 00:02:38.831 --> 00:02:41.913 Dave Hoekstra: So let's, I I would, I've, this is actually a great question 00:02:41.913 --> 00:02:42.933 that I've been meaning to ask you. 00:02:43.958 --> 00:02:50.618 You are directly responsible for every time I talk to a customer or a client 00:02:50.618 --> 00:02:57.278 or a contact center, and I have to say the phrase uh, w e e M, but I always 00:02:57.278 --> 00:02:59.078 have to add the clarifier after it. 00:02:59.078 --> 00:03:03.634 What used to be called W F O what's the story behind the shift in branding there? 00:03:03.662 --> 00:03:06.765 . And why are you responsible for torturing all of us in the contact center? 00:03:06.818 --> 00:03:07.428 Jim Davies: I think that's what it is. 00:03:07.433 --> 00:03:09.918 An analyst, you can't let the vendors have it easy. 00:03:09.918 --> 00:03:11.140 You've always gotta make them work. 00:03:11.203 --> 00:03:15.043 So yeah we changed the acronym, but no, seriously, I, the W F O 00:03:15.043 --> 00:03:19.463 acronym was around for 7, 8, 9 years, and it was very much focused 00:03:19.463 --> 00:03:20.963 on driving operational performance. 00:03:22.043 --> 00:03:26.273 Whereas what I felt was missing was the emphasis on the employee and the 00:03:26.273 --> 00:03:27.653 engagement level of that employee. 00:03:27.713 --> 00:03:29.710 Now, they were treated like a cog in the machine, a. 00:03:30.190 --> 00:03:31.510 They weren't human beings. 00:03:31.960 --> 00:03:34.330 So I thought we, we have to change that perception. 00:03:34.379 --> 00:03:37.374 And the best way of doing that is to change the acronym. 00:03:37.406 --> 00:03:43.376 And so we change the acronym from W F O to WEM, but at the same time change 00:03:43.376 --> 00:03:46.886 the technology and the functionality that's associated with that acronym. 00:03:47.246 --> 00:03:53.186 So all of the old original W F O functions and traditional recording qm, workforce 00:03:53.186 --> 00:03:57.116 management, they were still there, but now they were looked at through 00:03:57.116 --> 00:04:01.781 a different, So workforce management wasn't just about how do we forecast 00:04:01.781 --> 00:04:03.611 and schedule as efficiently as possible. 00:04:03.941 --> 00:04:07.931 It's now also a tool that can help drive employee engagement because 00:04:07.936 --> 00:04:10.901 you're giving those employees greater flexibility on when they come to work. 00:04:11.351 --> 00:04:13.361 So it's looking through the same technologies through a 00:04:13.361 --> 00:04:14.651 different lens as part of it. 00:04:15.101 --> 00:04:17.921 But then the other part of it was overlaying it with new technologies 00:04:17.989 --> 00:04:21.821 things like real-time assistance, automation, gamification, things 00:04:21.826 --> 00:04:25.061 that can really help drive that engagement level of the employee even. 00:04:27.681 --> 00:04:27.951 Dave Hoekstra: Yeah. 00:04:27.951 --> 00:04:34.987 And I do sincerely appreciate that kind of rebranding and relenting of the discussion 00:04:34.987 --> 00:04:41.193 because I, like a lot of people in the industry used to wear the headset, right? 00:04:41.214 --> 00:04:46.224 I slogged through years of customer service on the end 00:04:46.284 --> 00:04:48.132 of being in a contact center. 00:04:48.150 --> 00:04:51.461 I reflect back to my early days and I never really thought of it, I never 00:04:51.461 --> 00:04:54.851 really thought of, Hey, here's a piece of paper that has your breaks 00:04:54.851 --> 00:04:58.514 and lunches on it, and this is, sit down, shut up, and take calls, which 00:04:58.514 --> 00:05:00.407 is, know, what I often refer to as. 00:05:00.411 --> 00:05:05.366 The old school contact center, and now the new school contact center is very much 00:05:05.382 --> 00:05:06.822 when would you like to take your breaks? 00:05:06.822 --> 00:05:08.485 What schedule would you prefer? 00:05:08.499 --> 00:05:12.379 W making sure we're involving the entire workforce and engaging it 00:05:12.379 --> 00:05:14.089 as opposed to just optimizing it. 00:05:14.094 --> 00:05:15.119 And so I, I. 00:05:15.654 --> 00:05:17.154 , I agree with your sentiment. 00:05:17.184 --> 00:05:21.326 Just know that it has caused me I, I've lost a lot of productivity in meetings, 00:05:21.326 --> 00:05:26.126 having to say what used to be called W F O as part of it, but mission accomplished. 00:05:26.131 --> 00:05:29.406 I think W E em has taken a nice solid foothold into what we do. 00:05:29.406 --> 00:05:31.512 And I'm I think we're gonna be better for it. 00:05:31.573 --> 00:05:32.356 Yeah, in 00:05:32.746 --> 00:05:35.148 Jim Davies: addition to, it being the right thing from the employee's 00:05:35.153 --> 00:05:38.885 point of view, there's gonna be a massive uptick in how that 00:05:39.095 --> 00:05:42.575 influences the customer experience because it is a bit of a cliche. 00:05:42.575 --> 00:05:45.163 But if you've got a happy employee, you've got a happy customer and so 00:05:45.163 --> 00:05:49.093 therefore you're more likely to have a higher retention growth, all the things 00:05:49.093 --> 00:05:52.033 we care about as organizations, you're gonna get those cuz you've got a happy, 00:05:52.033 --> 00:05:55.213 engaged employee who's going above and beyond delivering that experience. 00:05:55.303 --> 00:05:56.503 So it's gotta be a win-win. 00:05:58.558 --> 00:06:00.328 Dave Hoekstra: It's a cliche because it's true. 00:06:00.418 --> 00:06:00.478 Yeah. 00:06:00.539 --> 00:06:04.912 I've said this many times before, when you go into a business, it 00:06:04.912 --> 00:06:06.232 doesn't have to be a contact sentence. 00:06:06.232 --> 00:06:07.292 This could be any business. 00:06:07.292 --> 00:06:12.244 You can almost immediately tell whether the employees are engaged or not. 00:06:12.246 --> 00:06:13.516 Sometimes that means they're. 00:06:13.841 --> 00:06:15.791 They're being paid appropriately. 00:06:15.791 --> 00:06:18.341 But a lot of times it also means that their work-life 00:06:18.341 --> 00:06:19.571 balance is being addressed. 00:06:19.612 --> 00:06:22.342 That their personal needs are being addressed, that they're getting 00:06:22.342 --> 00:06:24.202 fulfillment out of their job. 00:06:24.442 --> 00:06:28.312 And you can also very easily tell when they're not engaged 00:06:28.402 --> 00:06:29.632 and it's pretty obvious. 00:06:29.632 --> 00:06:33.309 And, there's a, it's the alchemy of creating. 00:06:33.350 --> 00:06:37.245 And fostering a great work environment is a pretty complicated formula. 00:06:37.245 --> 00:06:40.444 There's no one magic bullet or, formula that does it. 00:06:40.444 --> 00:06:44.666 But engaging the employees is definitely a sizable chunk of that. 00:06:44.671 --> 00:06:49.592 So it's good to see, and I personally appreciate it, as do many other people. 00:06:49.597 --> 00:06:54.711 And hopefully we're creating a new wave of contact center management. 00:06:54.718 --> 00:06:59.008 We continue to grow the engagement of the overall workforce as opposed 00:06:59.008 --> 00:07:00.328 to just the optimization of. 00:07:01.108 --> 00:07:01.558 . Absolutely. 00:07:01.798 --> 00:07:02.698 That's fantastic. 00:07:02.698 --> 00:07:03.658 All right, so 00:07:04.738 --> 00:07:07.477 Jim Davies: say one, one final point on that as well is I believe that 00:07:07.477 --> 00:07:11.491 it's becoming even fundamentally more important because the more the well 00:07:11.491 --> 00:07:15.781 pushes towards AI and automation and sales service and all the digital 00:07:15.781 --> 00:07:19.711 channels that don't involve an agent, the more we're gonna find that when 00:07:19.711 --> 00:07:24.661 those channels can't help us and we have to escalate to a human, that 00:07:25.061 --> 00:07:26.421 customer's already a little bit frustra. 00:07:27.251 --> 00:07:30.581 And so this human being, this agent, they're the last 00:07:30.581 --> 00:07:32.201 chance to save the experience. 00:07:32.441 --> 00:07:35.201 And so if they're not engaged and they're not willing to help that 00:07:35.201 --> 00:07:38.711 customer and put the effort in, then that's gonna be very detrimental to 00:07:38.716 --> 00:07:40.181 the overall loyalty of that customer. 00:07:40.241 --> 00:07:42.120 So it's more important now than ever. 00:07:44.175 --> 00:07:44.925 Dave Hoekstra: more important. 00:07:44.925 --> 00:07:45.195 Yeah. 00:07:45.223 --> 00:07:48.793 As the tools get better the EM empathy becomes more important. 00:07:48.883 --> 00:07:51.925 It's a loose adage to what we're talking about. 00:07:51.925 --> 00:07:55.375 And it actually leads very well into kind of the point that we wanted to 00:07:55.375 --> 00:07:58.247 discuss with you today is the idea of. 00:07:59.197 --> 00:08:02.707 What contact centers might need to be looking for the future? 00:08:02.753 --> 00:08:06.089 Your time as a Gartner analyst, you've spent a lot of time analyzing 00:08:06.089 --> 00:08:09.080 the tools and the processes and things that are out there. 00:08:09.080 --> 00:08:12.175 And as we look to the future what should we be focusing or 00:08:12.175 --> 00:08:13.405 should we be thinking about? 00:08:14.395 --> 00:08:14.685 Jim Davies: I. 00:08:14.930 --> 00:08:18.167 There, there are so many cool things we can think about to improve 00:08:18.167 --> 00:08:19.307 the experience in the future. 00:08:19.367 --> 00:08:21.437 In the future, and improve our service operations. 00:08:21.437 --> 00:08:24.347 But actually I don't think that's what we should be doing at the moment 00:08:25.247 --> 00:08:29.990 because what I've seen from many years of being an analyst is that we are just 00:08:29.990 --> 00:08:31.730 doing a really bad job of the basics. 00:08:32.240 --> 00:08:35.498 Now we tend to get carried away with the new shiny toy. 00:08:35.546 --> 00:08:39.806 The new ai, the new this, the new that we, we latch onto that as the savior. 00:08:40.346 --> 00:08:45.296 But actually, if we want to do the best we can do right now, just doing those basic 00:08:45.296 --> 00:08:47.269 things better is what we need to focus on. 00:08:47.359 --> 00:08:51.053 And the analogy I always use is I buying a car? 00:08:51.125 --> 00:08:55.355 When you go and buy a car, The brakes of that car are not very glamorous. 00:08:55.595 --> 00:08:58.115 Now, you're not gonna choose a car because it's got good brakes or bad 00:08:58.115 --> 00:09:01.925 brakes, but if you buy that car and you get to the first junction and that 00:09:01.925 --> 00:09:05.975 car doesn't stop because the brakes don't work, then you're gonna be pretty 00:09:05.975 --> 00:09:09.845 unhappy with that car and that's gonna ruin your experience of owning that car. 00:09:11.165 --> 00:09:15.005 but if the brakes do work, you're never really going to tweet about 00:09:15.005 --> 00:09:16.355 the amazing brakes on your car. 00:09:17.015 --> 00:09:21.845 So having the brakes working really well is fundamentally 00:09:21.845 --> 00:09:23.435 important for your car ownership. 00:09:23.975 --> 00:09:25.685 But you are never gonna start raving about it. 00:09:25.685 --> 00:09:27.515 You're never gonna put it into Facebook, you're never gonna tweet 00:09:27.515 --> 00:09:28.895 about it just because the brakes work. 00:09:29.375 --> 00:09:31.550 But if they don't work, very bad. 00:09:31.760 --> 00:09:36.869 Now the opposite of that could be having Apple CarPlay or having a wifi within 00:09:36.869 --> 00:09:40.961 your car call, you're gonna tweet about that absolutely is a great thing to 00:09:40.961 --> 00:09:43.751 have, but there's no point having that. 00:09:43.751 --> 00:09:48.971 If the brakes don't work, you could have your Apple car play, but if the brakes 00:09:48.971 --> 00:09:52.331 don't work, there's no point and it doesn't have any impact on the experience. 00:09:52.331 --> 00:09:54.491 And I think linking that into customer service. 00:09:55.796 --> 00:09:56.816 We get carried away. 00:09:56.816 --> 00:10:00.877 So new shiny toys are the things that are the equivalent of the 00:10:00.907 --> 00:10:02.617 the wifi or the upper CarPlay. 00:10:03.007 --> 00:10:07.477 Whereas the basics of say, having a forecast that's accurate or having 00:10:07.477 --> 00:10:11.707 a QM program that actually fairly es your staff are the basics. 00:10:11.712 --> 00:10:15.067 We've just gotta get those in place first, which many companies don't. 00:10:15.067 --> 00:10:18.161 Before we start looking at these bigger, more glamorous technology, invest. 00:10:20.801 --> 00:10:22.061 Dave Hoekstra: Yeah, I think it's a great point. 00:10:22.139 --> 00:10:27.261 I often tell people that every contact center out there, whether you 00:10:27.266 --> 00:10:33.741 have two agents or 200,000 agents, every contact center does w e m. 00:10:34.311 --> 00:10:41.391 They just do it sometimes rather poorly or they do it with ineffective tools, right? 00:10:41.467 --> 00:10:46.327 You can have very effective forecasts through Excel spreadsheets, but you can 00:10:46.327 --> 00:10:50.434 also have very long manual processes that take up a lot of extra time. 00:10:50.434 --> 00:10:54.244 That could be done in significantly less time working through that. 00:10:54.464 --> 00:10:56.504 And let's maybe talk about some of. 00:10:57.184 --> 00:10:57.994 Examples? 00:10:58.041 --> 00:11:02.796 What, maybe give me a few things that back to basics that that, that could 00:11:02.796 --> 00:11:07.776 be, it could be focused on by an organization that maybe doesn't realize 00:11:07.866 --> 00:11:09.574 what their what the problem might be. 00:11:11.434 --> 00:11:13.829 Jim Davies: Yeah, and I think if you look at it look at it across all contacts 00:11:13.829 --> 00:11:18.899 into technologies, it's just, it could be things such as, when was the last 00:11:18.899 --> 00:11:20.369 time the knowledge base was updated? 00:11:21.149 --> 00:11:25.079 How accurate is information that those agents are providing to customers? 00:11:25.379 --> 00:11:28.709 Is there a different knowledge base on the website compared to the contact center? 00:11:28.859 --> 00:11:31.082 A small thing like that can be quite profound. 00:11:31.175 --> 00:11:32.933 If you look at it from the routing. 00:11:33.368 --> 00:11:35.378 Or routing engine based on where you come from. 00:11:35.378 --> 00:11:38.305 I I've worked for an American company for so long now, , but bringing English, 00:11:38.305 --> 00:11:39.805 I dunno whether it's rooting or routing. 00:11:39.814 --> 00:11:41.233 I, so whichever way is it bound to be wrong. 00:11:41.233 --> 00:11:44.516 But even the accuracy, does that routing engine send that customer 00:11:44.516 --> 00:11:45.656 to the right agent or not? 00:11:45.716 --> 00:11:46.826 Most of the time it doesn't. 00:11:47.066 --> 00:11:49.316 Simple things like that can make a huge difference. 00:11:49.796 --> 00:11:55.376 If you drill into the W F O WM space, can that workforce management system 00:11:55.886 --> 00:11:58.977 cope with a hybrid working environment where you've got some employees at 00:11:58.982 --> 00:12:00.776 home or some at work or doing a. 00:12:00.906 --> 00:12:05.465 Part part of each can the QM system actually fairly and 00:12:05.995 --> 00:12:09.785 accurately assess an employee's performance, identify training needs? 00:12:09.875 --> 00:12:13.442 Or is it more of a random lucky guest to pick a call where you 00:12:13.442 --> 00:12:15.362 identify some training opportunities? 00:12:15.842 --> 00:12:20.745 So there's things like that that I think we don't need to go massive investments 00:12:20.745 --> 00:12:24.375 of millions of dollars to try and focus on some of these basic things that can make. 00:12:25.120 --> 00:12:28.170 Transformational difference in terms of the performance, the center, 00:12:28.170 --> 00:12:29.400 and the experience we provide. 00:12:31.710 --> 00:12:34.171 Dave Hoekstra: It's a great point, and you actually reminded me when 00:12:34.171 --> 00:12:38.821 I first got into this industry, I went to some training over in London 00:12:39.241 --> 00:12:43.681 and I never caught more flack in my entire life by saying call routing. 00:12:44.361 --> 00:12:47.581 Instead of call rooting it that you actually brought back some 00:12:47.581 --> 00:12:51.123 past feelings there when you mentioned that, so I remember 00:12:51.648 --> 00:12:51.883 Yeah. 00:12:51.933 --> 00:12:57.045 It was, it was the focus of the entire week that how I pronounced specific words. 00:12:57.077 --> 00:13:00.252 But, there, there was a kind of a theme in what you said when 00:13:00.252 --> 00:13:01.362 we're going back to basics. 00:13:01.362 --> 00:13:06.222 A lot of those, a lot of those points that you made had to do. 00:13:07.032 --> 00:13:11.682 Focusing on the people and focusing on the right things. 00:13:11.732 --> 00:13:17.702 Some of the things that are easy to solve ba are basically how you look at the 00:13:17.702 --> 00:13:23.172 people that are performing the customer experience operations in the organization. 00:13:23.172 --> 00:13:29.670 You mentioned focusing on quality and instead of randomly finding, Being 00:13:29.670 --> 00:13:33.902 very pointed and detailed about the information that you're looking for. 00:13:33.902 --> 00:13:39.280 For example instead of just listening to a random call, how about we check out 00:13:39.280 --> 00:13:44.530 every single call from yesterday that had more than two or three holds in it 00:13:44.920 --> 00:13:48.790 to find out why we're putting people on hold so much, which leads you to. 00:13:49.100 --> 00:13:52.577 Updating the knowledge base because the knowledge base isn't very effective. 00:13:52.577 --> 00:13:54.867 It's that trickle down effect of making sure. 00:13:55.077 --> 00:13:59.907 And so I think that's a really great point in, in, in working through that. 00:13:59.912 --> 00:14:05.184 So you mentioned, hybrid scheduling the in-office versus at home, 00:14:05.184 --> 00:14:09.118 which is a big thing right now and probably is not going away anytime. 00:14:09.214 --> 00:14:13.467 Being able to check on whether you're reporting actually 00:14:13.557 --> 00:14:15.627 delineates between those two things. 00:14:15.687 --> 00:14:17.337 Those are actually really great points. 00:14:17.697 --> 00:14:24.671 And I wonder if there are suggestions, just in general, what would you suggest? 00:14:24.701 --> 00:14:26.885 A co where could a contact center start? 00:14:26.967 --> 00:14:31.489 From to, to really take a step back and look at what to do. 00:14:31.489 --> 00:14:35.596 How would, if someone came to Jim Davies and said, Jim efficiency is down. 00:14:35.596 --> 00:14:37.626 We know why, but we don't really For sure. 00:14:37.628 --> 00:14:40.144 Where would maybe somebody start to take a step back to the basics? 00:14:40.246 --> 00:14:44.986 Jim Davies: I think what I'd do is make a list of every single process 00:14:45.136 --> 00:14:49.473 system, technology that, that is used in that center and firstly identify, 00:14:50.223 --> 00:14:51.783 is this technology fundamental? 00:14:51.783 --> 00:14:55.304 Now, is this one of the must have technologies that with 00:14:55.304 --> 00:14:56.594 it, we can't do with each? 00:14:56.834 --> 00:14:57.474 Can't do. 00:14:57.541 --> 00:15:01.846 And then, so that would be the basics of the basic technologies or if it things 00:15:01.846 --> 00:15:06.976 that if we turn this off tonight, we're still gonna be able to function, but 00:15:07.186 --> 00:15:10.065 we are not gonna be able to do maybe ABC on top of what the basics are. 00:15:10.485 --> 00:15:14.565 And then once you've identified those two lists, then start to look at that. 00:15:15.600 --> 00:15:20.306 primarily looking at the basics list and say if we had to, this is really crude, 00:15:20.306 --> 00:15:25.046 really basic, but if you said for each of those technologies on that basic list, 00:15:25.046 --> 00:15:31.572 if you said, let's give ourselves a score from one to 10 on how optimized that is 00:15:31.572 --> 00:15:36.334 really crude and get three or four people who know that technology, get 'em to sit 00:15:36.334 --> 00:15:37.874 down and say, let's give you a score. 00:15:39.154 --> 00:15:40.564 It's just the best it can possibly. 00:15:41.494 --> 00:15:44.674 or we are just scratching the surface of this technology now, the workforce 00:15:44.674 --> 00:15:48.454 management, for example, and if you've got a score of between, you averaged 00:15:48.454 --> 00:15:53.374 out of less than five, outta 10, put your priority there because that would 00:15:53.374 --> 00:15:58.294 suggest that if you're scoring five or less outta 10, those breaks are not gonna 00:15:58.294 --> 00:15:59.794 work when you get to the next roundabout. 00:16:01.504 --> 00:16:03.244 And that's where the energy should be. 00:16:03.544 --> 00:16:06.514 So it doesn't have to be very scientific because you could. 00:16:07.594 --> 00:16:10.624 A huge amount of time doing this analytically, but literally just 00:16:10.624 --> 00:16:13.804 having the experts in the room sitting down and manually going through the 00:16:13.804 --> 00:16:14.974 little spreadsheet they've created. 00:16:15.334 --> 00:16:16.354 Here's all the technologies. 00:16:16.654 --> 00:16:19.024 These are the must haveve technologies to run our business. 00:16:19.564 --> 00:16:22.684 Let's give us scale a score of how optimized they are, one to 10. 00:16:22.744 --> 00:16:23.344 Simple as that. 00:16:23.794 --> 00:16:25.174 Ending less than five. 00:16:25.714 --> 00:16:28.684 Start focusing that and get those up to a seven or eight. 00:16:30.049 --> 00:16:32.821 , and that could be the routing, routing engine. 00:16:32.850 --> 00:16:36.310 It could be the knowledge base, it could be the QM system, it could be 00:16:36.310 --> 00:16:39.160 whatever, could be the CRM system, the case management handling. 00:16:39.640 --> 00:16:44.500 Get those up to a state where they're at least seven out of 10, and then start 00:16:44.500 --> 00:16:47.950 looking at some of the more glamorous technologies, whether that's real time 00:16:47.950 --> 00:16:51.460 interaction, assistance or whatever it happens to be, that can then overlay 00:16:51.460 --> 00:16:53.170 on top and provide that extra layer of. 00:16:53.173 --> 00:16:54.986 The other case thing, I would go. 00:16:57.371 --> 00:17:01.016 Dave Hoekstra: I was just gonna say that's I, it's so simple, but it's 00:17:01.526 --> 00:17:05.546 probably so effective identifying that low hanging fruit just right off the bat. 00:17:05.546 --> 00:17:10.316 It's it, like you said, you could probably do this in a two hour meeting with. 00:17:10.726 --> 00:17:14.656 Four to five people in your contact center or your organization, and then 00:17:14.656 --> 00:17:19.516 come out with, all right, we now know where we should be spending our time. 00:17:19.576 --> 00:17:22.784 And then that's the next challenge is spending your time. 00:17:22.784 --> 00:17:26.260 And we won't delve too deep into that, but think that's a great start. 00:17:26.265 --> 00:17:26.470 All right. 00:17:26.470 --> 00:17:29.500 So you were, continue on, you were saying the next step there. 00:17:30.550 --> 00:17:30.763 Jim Davies: Yeah. 00:17:30.767 --> 00:17:32.887 The ne the next step I'll try and look at. 00:17:34.337 --> 00:17:37.660 when you are looking to maybe start in investing in some of these 00:17:37.780 --> 00:17:42.816 layer on technologies and where to prioritize this these basics as well. 00:17:43.326 --> 00:17:48.996 The tendency is to try and focus on areas that are linked to one particular 00:17:49.416 --> 00:17:52.506 business goal, such as efficiency, which is the flavor of the market 00:17:52.506 --> 00:17:54.036 at the moment, driving efficiency. 00:17:55.881 --> 00:18:00.771 . The reality is a lot of these technologies can do more than that now, that they 00:18:00.771 --> 00:18:06.365 can also provide a, help you with your revenue growth or help you with your 00:18:06.365 --> 00:18:09.854 loyalty help you with your engagement as well as your operation efficiency. 00:18:10.754 --> 00:18:15.916 So whenever you are looking at saying, how well are we doing with this technology? 00:18:16.486 --> 00:18:20.146 Don't just look at it from the point of view of how well are we doing with this 00:18:20.206 --> 00:18:22.676 technology in terms of its driving our EF. 00:18:23.821 --> 00:18:28.351 look at it also in terms of how well are we doing with this technology in terms 00:18:28.351 --> 00:18:30.201 of how it improves employee engagement. 00:18:30.886 --> 00:18:34.186 In terms of how well it improves customer loyalty in terms 00:18:34.186 --> 00:18:36.376 of how well it's potentially helping us with customer growth. 00:18:36.766 --> 00:18:39.916 So you're now looking at it from a three or four dimensions rather 00:18:39.921 --> 00:18:43.299 than just the one dimension, which is what companies tend to do. 00:18:43.359 --> 00:18:46.359 They tend to look at it just from that internal operational efficiency 00:18:46.364 --> 00:18:48.549 perspective and not other perspectives. 00:18:48.939 --> 00:18:52.779 So going back to workforce management, the easy assessment is to say, okay, 00:18:52.779 --> 00:18:57.419 our workforce management is, let's give it a five, outta 10 for how we optimize 00:18:57.424 --> 00:18:59.049 is from the efficiency point of view. 00:18:59.909 --> 00:19:03.299 But maybe it's only three outta 10 in terms of how it's driving employee 00:19:03.299 --> 00:19:07.619 engagement, because you haven't got work-life balance capabilities within it. 00:19:08.489 --> 00:19:10.949 So that's the other dimension, second layer to this. 00:19:12.989 --> 00:19:13.229 Dave Hoekstra: Yeah. 00:19:13.234 --> 00:19:18.779 So instead of your Excel spreadsheet saying workforce management system 00:19:18.779 --> 00:19:22.169 and one number, the elements of the workforce management system 00:19:22.169 --> 00:19:25.193 underneath there, and maybe looking at the numbers of that as well and see 00:19:25.193 --> 00:19:26.701 what those, what that return comes. 00:19:27.431 --> 00:19:27.671 Yeah, 00:19:27.671 --> 00:19:28.181 Jim Davies: exactly. 00:19:28.195 --> 00:19:32.051 And don't just limit it to the web technologies because even your routing, 00:19:32.051 --> 00:19:35.801 routing engine will have an impact not just on efficiency, but it'll 00:19:35.801 --> 00:19:37.211 also have an impact on employee. 00:19:37.901 --> 00:19:39.161 Retention employee experience. 00:19:39.161 --> 00:19:43.262 Cuz if you've got employees dealing with customers asking questions, they 00:19:43.267 --> 00:19:46.331 dunno the answer to cause they've come through to the wrong agent, that's not 00:19:46.331 --> 00:19:48.021 gonna be a good day for that employee. 00:19:48.029 --> 00:19:51.054 And equally has an impact on the customer experience if they're put through to 00:19:51.054 --> 00:19:54.504 an agent who doesn't know the answer, their question cuz of the routing logic. 00:19:54.984 --> 00:19:59.094 So all of those different components of customer service can have 00:19:59.094 --> 00:20:00.834 that multi-dimensional scoring. 00:20:00.864 --> 00:20:05.004 Again, one to 10, keep it simple, and then from that work out the way forward. 00:20:07.074 --> 00:20:11.344 Dave Hoekstra: Jim, I would never solely focus on w e m. 00:20:11.344 --> 00:20:14.701 That, that is ridiculous to think that it would be something 00:20:14.701 --> 00:20:16.048 that only I would think of. 00:20:16.048 --> 00:20:19.532 I'm very multi-dimensional, multifaceted kind of person. 00:20:19.570 --> 00:20:20.967 No I've been accused of that. 00:20:21.010 --> 00:20:23.530 It's been basically my life for the last 15 years. 00:20:23.569 --> 00:20:25.565 I have to thank you for the reminder. 00:20:25.568 --> 00:20:26.528 Alright, so now let's. 00:20:26.873 --> 00:20:30.569 The next step, let's say the team sits down in the room, Excel spreadsheet. 00:20:30.666 --> 00:20:31.716 We're mapping everything out. 00:20:31.716 --> 00:20:33.986 Everything comes in a nice 7, 8, 9. 00:20:33.986 --> 00:20:37.832 We're feeling really solid or we've done some work to get back to making 00:20:37.837 --> 00:20:39.242 sure those basics are taken care of. 00:20:40.112 --> 00:20:44.222 What are some of the things that maybe to focus on for, to be prepared for 00:20:44.222 --> 00:20:48.692 the next wave of customer experience that a contact center could focus on? 00:20:49.712 --> 00:20:51.355 Jim Davies: I think there's another lab before we get to that. 00:20:51.615 --> 00:20:52.735 Sorry to, sorry. 00:20:52.735 --> 00:20:53.935 To keep delay in the future. 00:20:53.965 --> 00:20:54.612 Oh, let's know. 00:20:54.670 --> 00:20:55.020 . No. 00:20:55.940 --> 00:20:57.947 But there, there's another layer which I see. 00:20:59.862 --> 00:21:00.462 Overlooked too often. 00:21:00.882 --> 00:21:05.109 And actually to me, when I created W F O all those years ago, it was 00:21:05.109 --> 00:21:09.254 one of the founding reasons for it, which is the value you get from having 00:21:09.254 --> 00:21:14.324 all these different basic functions working together as one, it's the one 00:21:14.324 --> 00:21:16.704 plus one equals three type of analogy. 00:21:17.154 --> 00:21:21.369 And what are the incremental things you can do if you have these 00:21:21.369 --> 00:21:24.919 systems working together as one rather than the siloed systems? 00:21:25.664 --> 00:21:28.724 and that's something I don't think many companies spend enough time 00:21:28.724 --> 00:21:32.270 looking at as they try and go above and beyond just the basics. 00:21:32.930 --> 00:21:38.683 So as a very simple example of that could be using your quality data. 00:21:39.253 --> 00:21:43.813 To provide more granular granularity to how you generate your schedule. 00:21:43.933 --> 00:21:47.873 Now, using performance as a driver for the schedule allocation rather than just 00:21:47.887 --> 00:21:51.282 a skillset that's been predetermined, something like that, which you can do 00:21:51.282 --> 00:21:52.782 if these systems are working together. 00:21:53.052 --> 00:21:58.153 You can't, if they're not looking outside of WEM, it could be using that 00:21:58.153 --> 00:22:01.033 QM data to influence the routing logic. 00:22:02.248 --> 00:22:06.628 So the customer gets sent to an agent who's gonna be a better fit because of 00:22:06.628 --> 00:22:09.801 how they're performing in that particular area that day, that week, that month. 00:22:10.341 --> 00:22:14.271 So I would say that layer above getting the basics right is looking 00:22:14.271 --> 00:22:19.951 for opportunities to get these systems working together more, getting cross 00:22:20.121 --> 00:22:23.901 domain workflow across the domain value add, because I think that summit 00:22:23.901 --> 00:22:26.655 that's really been overlooked in the marketplace over the last decade. 00:22:28.710 --> 00:22:33.390 Dave Hoekstra: And the challenge often that I find in talking to organizations 00:22:33.570 --> 00:22:37.710 is not that they don't realize this, it's often that they're not taking a 00:22:37.710 --> 00:22:41.250 step back and looking at it from an organizational perspective as opposed 00:22:41.250 --> 00:22:42.840 to a context center perspective. 00:22:42.845 --> 00:22:43.925 And I'll give you a good example. 00:22:43.925 --> 00:22:45.844 You use the the routing engine. 00:22:46.294 --> 00:22:49.424 As a way to get callers to the higher quality agents. 00:22:49.424 --> 00:22:52.285 I think anybody in their right mind would think, yes, we want the 00:22:52.285 --> 00:22:53.755 best agents answering the calls. 00:22:54.145 --> 00:22:57.915 The problem that organizations have is often how to get to that question. 00:22:58.225 --> 00:23:01.667 It's not saying, what do we do with our C A S. 00:23:01.734 --> 00:23:06.667 Deployment to work Here it is more taking a step back and saying, boy, 00:23:06.667 --> 00:23:11.707 our customer survey scores are just not meeting what we need to do. 00:23:11.977 --> 00:23:15.517 How can we get our customer survey scores better? 00:23:15.727 --> 00:23:19.447 Okay, ha we need to get people to better quality people. 00:23:19.537 --> 00:23:20.227 Okay. 00:23:20.317 --> 00:23:25.327 That, and so that, that step is often overlooked as the, as an organization 00:23:25.327 --> 00:23:26.857 and taking a step back and looking at. 00:23:27.187 --> 00:23:30.187 Organizational issues, not contact center issues. 00:23:30.637 --> 00:23:34.027 Think asking questions like, are we spending our money 00:23:34.027 --> 00:23:35.915 correctly in the marketing phase? 00:23:35.966 --> 00:23:38.913 What, why our abandoned rate is really high. 00:23:39.003 --> 00:23:39.813 Take a step back. 00:23:39.813 --> 00:23:43.676 And the abandoned rate is because when we look back at it's, the 800 00:23:43.716 --> 00:23:45.476 number not published correctly, right? 00:23:45.508 --> 00:23:48.958 Those are organizational wide issues as opposed to contact center. 00:23:48.958 --> 00:23:50.368 So I think that's a really great point. 00:23:50.368 --> 00:23:56.277 It's taking that solution to the second level of, and how marrying solutions 00:23:56.277 --> 00:24:00.651 together can actually drive that, that the goal that we're looking for. 00:24:01.421 --> 00:24:01.601 Jim Davies: Yeah. 00:24:01.601 --> 00:24:04.449 And I think, and to be honest challenge isn't the technical one. 00:24:04.539 --> 00:24:05.659 The challenge is operational. 00:24:05.704 --> 00:24:09.484 Because quite often the owner of these different functions, 00:24:09.694 --> 00:24:10.664 they don't talk to each other. 00:24:10.688 --> 00:24:15.768 I remember 10 years ago when a, and I won't name names, but there was when a 00:24:15.773 --> 00:24:21.038 QM vendor bought a workforce management vendor, and the first thing they did was 00:24:21.038 --> 00:24:25.208 go through the two sets of customers and look for customers who were the same. 00:24:25.943 --> 00:24:29.743 And then visit those customers and physically introduce the employees 00:24:30.413 --> 00:24:31.903 of that organization to each other. 00:24:32.393 --> 00:24:35.603 but they'd never met each other before because one team worked on QM and 00:24:35.603 --> 00:24:38.003 one works on workforce management and they never knew each other. 00:24:38.873 --> 00:24:43.713 . So that if you're never talking to each other internally, how on earth 00:24:44.063 --> 00:24:46.703 are you gonna start thinking about the bigger picture of getting the 00:24:46.703 --> 00:24:50.003 two technologies to work together to provide the in incremental value? 00:24:50.064 --> 00:24:54.717 So a big part of this is having some form of entity, whether it's a customer 00:24:54.722 --> 00:24:59.237 service CX team or somebody that's looking now from above who can start to try. 00:24:59.422 --> 00:25:02.212 Break down those barriers internally and start to try and get the 00:25:02.212 --> 00:25:03.712 different aspects working together. 00:25:04.012 --> 00:25:05.552 Cause they can see that bigger picture. 00:25:06.952 --> 00:25:07.342 Wow. 00:25:07.402 --> 00:25:07.822 Just 00:25:07.822 --> 00:25:08.932 Dave Hoekstra: chuck full of insight. 00:25:08.932 --> 00:25:09.712 I love that. 00:25:09.769 --> 00:25:13.253 We're able to give this kind of information to the rest of the team 00:25:13.253 --> 00:25:14.769 here because there's so much good stuff. 00:25:14.769 --> 00:25:15.322 Okay. 00:25:15.412 --> 00:25:20.659 Now let me see if I could finally get to my original question that 00:25:20.678 --> 00:25:24.525 you we got so much good information here and I'm so appreciative of it. 00:25:24.915 --> 00:25:25.155 What. 00:25:26.030 --> 00:25:31.014 Couple of things that as we look to the future that we could that a contact 00:25:31.014 --> 00:25:32.934 center or an organization could focus on, 00:25:34.404 --> 00:25:39.054 Jim Davies: I think to break it into two parts, near future and long term future. 00:25:39.744 --> 00:25:46.344 So I think that near future, one of the technologies that we should all 00:25:46.344 --> 00:25:48.594 be investing in every context and should be investing in this now, 00:25:48.714 --> 00:25:51.714 is analytics, speech analytics in particular, or interaction analytics. 00:25:52.164 --> 00:25:52.374 It's. 00:25:53.509 --> 00:25:55.189 It's a technology that's not new. 00:25:55.209 --> 00:25:59.139 I remember years ago being asked whether this is witchcraft and how 00:25:59.139 --> 00:26:04.668 can it possibly understand the voice, but it's proven, it's accurate, and 00:26:05.478 --> 00:26:09.048 it's a technology that you can apply to so many different use cases. 00:26:09.713 --> 00:26:11.789 I think it's something that we should all be looking at now. 00:26:11.849 --> 00:26:15.239 Now whether that's trying to make our center more efficient, whether it's trying 00:26:15.239 --> 00:26:19.139 to drive employee retention, whether it's trying to drive revenue growth 00:26:19.139 --> 00:26:22.419 from up sale, cross sale, it doesn't matter that, that you can tailor the 00:26:22.424 --> 00:26:26.829 analytics to help drive that business scale or even just make your QM process 00:26:26.829 --> 00:26:30.759 more intelligent to your analyzing all of your calls, not just that random 00:26:30.759 --> 00:26:32.199 sampling that we talked about earlier. 00:26:32.649 --> 00:26:36.909 So I think near future, that's the one technology that stands out. 00:26:37.264 --> 00:26:39.994 any other that I think everybody should be looking at now because 00:26:39.994 --> 00:26:41.134 the value it can provide. 00:26:42.304 --> 00:26:47.644 The caveat I would say on that is you have to have the competency internally 00:26:47.644 --> 00:26:49.094 to get the most outta that technology. 00:26:49.094 --> 00:26:52.148 Because it's like buying a Ferrari and if you dunno how to drive it, you're 00:26:52.153 --> 00:26:53.348 not gonna get the most out of it. 00:26:53.378 --> 00:26:55.268 So you've gotta have that competency. 00:26:55.273 --> 00:26:58.508 So with the technology comes the appropriate training and onboarding, 00:26:58.958 --> 00:27:02.108 but as long as that's in place, that's the number one technology I'll be 00:27:02.113 --> 00:27:04.000 recommending anybody looks at the moment. 00:27:05.195 --> 00:27:11.045 Longer term, I would say that the bigger opportunity is really starting 00:27:11.045 --> 00:27:17.025 to get into how we assist the agent live in an interaction with a customer. 00:27:17.920 --> 00:27:24.670 So think of it in terms of real-time guidance, real-time assistance, being 00:27:24.670 --> 00:27:30.070 able to bring information to the agent to help them with the interaction, to help 00:27:30.310 --> 00:27:35.780 steer the agent through a complex process to navigate between different systems to. 00:27:36.820 --> 00:27:40.120 Detect that they're getting emotional and recommend they take a five minute 00:27:40.120 --> 00:27:41.710 timeout to go and grab a coffee. 00:27:42.070 --> 00:27:45.580 Really having that sort of real time ability to look at what's going 00:27:45.580 --> 00:27:49.070 on in that interaction and assist that employee however possible, 00:27:49.070 --> 00:27:50.494 I think that's the next leg. 00:27:50.494 --> 00:27:54.994 So I think that can have that type of technology stack can have the 00:27:54.994 --> 00:27:58.023 biggest impact on all those customer service metrics, whether it's 00:27:58.543 --> 00:28:00.823 employee, customer, or operational. 00:28:00.844 --> 00:28:03.514 Dave Hoekstra: Because you alluded to it earlier that. 00:28:04.069 --> 00:28:08.299 The self-service is taking care of the easy stuff, and the only thing 00:28:08.299 --> 00:28:12.859 that's making it to the agent is the hard stuff and the ability for 00:28:12.859 --> 00:28:18.446 them to navigate those waters with empathy and correct information, 00:28:18.746 --> 00:28:20.696 it becomes more and more difficult. 00:28:20.822 --> 00:28:21.692 Realtime guys. 00:28:21.842 --> 00:28:24.564 I, no, I've noticed you, you bring up a good point. 00:28:24.564 --> 00:28:28.494 I've noticed I, I attend the amount of a fair amount of conference trade 00:28:28.494 --> 00:28:31.883 shows and those types of things in the context center industry. 00:28:31.883 --> 00:28:38.089 And that seems to be the really big focus is realtime analytics, agent guidance, 00:28:38.089 --> 00:28:39.979 next best action, those kind of things. 00:28:39.979 --> 00:28:40.189 And. 00:28:41.269 --> 00:28:44.962 There seems to be a lot of energy in that space these days, and it's gonna 00:28:44.962 --> 00:28:50.166 be interesting to see the promise fulfilled with with organizations and 00:28:50.166 --> 00:28:55.224 really being able to, because at the end of the day, The reason all of us 00:28:55.404 --> 00:29:00.861 have jobs in this industry, whether it's you, me, the managers, the agents, is 00:29:00.861 --> 00:29:05.363 because somebody needs assistance with something that didn't go to plan, right? 00:29:05.368 --> 00:29:05.543 Yes. 00:29:05.628 --> 00:29:09.348 And when that plan goes awry, What information do we have 00:29:09.348 --> 00:29:10.720 available for us to fix it? 00:29:10.763 --> 00:29:15.323 I'm pretty good at searching for things online, but even I, tech 00:29:15.323 --> 00:29:19.313 guru Dave still need to contact support every now and again to 00:29:19.313 --> 00:29:21.401 report an issue or to find out and. 00:29:21.401 --> 00:29:27.482 When we do talk to that person who is knowledgeable, empathetic, and works it's 00:29:27.842 --> 00:29:31.832 what's, what I hate to say is that almost comes across as a surprise these days. 00:29:32.102 --> 00:29:34.545 It's almost wow, that was not what I expected. 00:29:34.550 --> 00:29:38.264 When we get someone that's nice and knowledgeable, , the, and that's a thing 00:29:38.264 --> 00:29:40.424 we need to change in our industry and. 00:29:40.512 --> 00:29:44.512 We hopefully, as we continue to see growth, and that's why we do episodes 00:29:44.512 --> 00:29:46.323 like this, is where should the next. 00:29:46.938 --> 00:29:48.288 Where should the next focus be? 00:29:48.288 --> 00:29:50.058 What should we really talk about? 00:29:50.058 --> 00:29:55.308 And so I think it's amazing that we have the ability to do some of these things. 00:29:55.313 --> 00:29:56.448 And yes, you're right. 00:29:56.808 --> 00:29:59.825 Analytics used to be like witchcraft, but you no longer need 00:29:59.825 --> 00:30:01.385 a room full of servers to do it. 00:30:01.385 --> 00:30:05.285 With cloud-based technologies, we can now do analytics on a hundred percent 00:30:05.315 --> 00:30:07.362 of every interaction that comes in. 00:30:07.362 --> 00:30:10.162 And we understand what's being sent, and I think that's amazing. 00:30:10.231 --> 00:30:13.758 I know we're getting close to being out of time and wrapping up here. 00:30:13.758 --> 00:30:17.985 I wanted to, one of the things I always like to do and when we have great guests 00:30:17.985 --> 00:30:21.516 on the podcast is give 'em the final word, give 'em the, prognosticate a 00:30:21.516 --> 00:30:25.352 little bit for me, Jim what what advice or what information would you love to 00:30:25.352 --> 00:30:26.901 make sure the audience hears about? 00:30:26.902 --> 00:30:29.342 Jim Davies: Going off a little bit of a tangent relief we've covered today. 00:30:29.417 --> 00:30:34.434 I think what we all need to focus on more is a better understanding of the 00:30:34.434 --> 00:30:38.603 experience we are providing our customers in customer service and not just a better 00:30:38.633 --> 00:30:42.323 understanding of it, but actually starting to do something with that understanding. 00:30:42.373 --> 00:30:49.154 Most contact centers do post call surveys or end of call surveys 00:30:49.154 --> 00:30:50.474 or follow up with an email. 00:30:50.924 --> 00:30:53.204 But 99% of the time nothing ever happens. 00:30:53.564 --> 00:30:58.484 So I think my, my, my plea to everybody in customer service is 00:30:58.489 --> 00:31:00.764 to really take a look at that. 00:31:01.334 --> 00:31:05.504 Post call, that CX program that they've got running at the end of 00:31:05.504 --> 00:31:09.317 their service incident and looking to are we taking it seriously? 00:31:09.364 --> 00:31:11.594 Are we really acting upon this information? 00:31:11.620 --> 00:31:14.855 And are we striving to improve the CX based on what the customers are 00:31:14.860 --> 00:31:16.355 telling us that they're experiencing? 00:31:16.360 --> 00:31:19.695 Because I think for the large part, most consumers. 00:31:20.870 --> 00:31:25.226 Don't have a good experience but equally don't feel like there's any point telling 00:31:25.226 --> 00:31:28.046 that brand about the experience because I don't feel like anything's gonna happen. 00:31:28.316 --> 00:31:29.885 So I think we need to change that expectation. 00:31:30.485 --> 00:31:34.055 Dave Hoekstra: And I will encourage, for those of you who are listening, remember 00:31:34.055 --> 00:31:35.915 this is a man who has seen it all. 00:31:36.470 --> 00:31:40.880 This is a man who has seen every single thing this industry can throw. 00:31:40.880 --> 00:31:43.280 The good, the bad, the ugly, and the indifferent. 00:31:43.580 --> 00:31:48.710 And if he's espousing this kind of information, we should listen because 00:31:49.070 --> 00:31:54.620 there is no one who's probably seen more about what we do than Jim Davies. 00:31:54.620 --> 00:31:58.370 And that's why it's super exciting that he's a part of the Calabrio family now. 00:31:58.370 --> 00:32:00.876 And Jim, I really enjoyed this one. 00:32:01.631 --> 00:32:06.071 A really fantastic discussion, and your insight and your knowledge is well 00:32:06.071 --> 00:32:09.776 appreciated, and I think it's going to be very useful for a lot of people. 00:32:09.802 --> 00:32:13.656 Thank you from me for joining for spending some time with us today. 00:32:13.986 --> 00:32:17.698 And as always, to our listeners, thank you guys so much for 00:32:17.698 --> 00:32:19.198 giving us some time in your day. 00:32:19.222 --> 00:32:21.788 We here at working smarter with Collabreo. 00:32:21.788 --> 00:32:24.925 Really try to put forth a great product here and make sure that you 00:32:24.925 --> 00:32:26.425 guys get the information you need. 00:32:26.430 --> 00:32:29.905 So Jim, again, thank you for spending time with us today. 00:32:30.625 --> 00:32:31.135 Jim Davies: Thank you, David. 00:32:31.435 --> 00:32:31.465 I 00:32:31.470 --> 00:32:31.885 Dave Hoekstra: appreciate it. 00:32:33.295 --> 00:32:34.345 Ah, absolutely. 00:32:34.435 --> 00:32:37.566 Oh, and he called me David only, oh, my mother calls me David. 00:32:37.566 --> 00:32:39.127 And so that's very British and very 00:32:39.127 --> 00:32:40.097 Jim Davies: formal, you say. 00:32:40.117 --> 00:32:40.357 Yeah. 00:32:41.647 --> 00:32:43.727 Dave Hoekstra: It's actually funny you bring that up because, 00:32:43.758 --> 00:32:46.518 my name is David James Stra. 00:32:46.698 --> 00:32:49.986 And a very common nickname for David is Davy. 00:32:50.376 --> 00:32:54.306 And so my parents when I was younger, called me Davey Jim. 00:32:54.666 --> 00:32:58.460 So we just take Jim Davies, flip it around to Davy Jim, and that's what we get. 00:32:58.460 --> 00:32:59.418 So that's great. 00:32:59.418 --> 00:32:59.738 There you go. 00:32:59.738 --> 00:33:01.348 So thank you again for joining us. 00:33:01.423 --> 00:33:04.652 Thank you to everyone out there and we will see you on 00:33:04.652 --> 00:33:06.332 the next episode of Working. 00:33:06.757 --> 00:33:07.567 From Collabreo. 00:33:07.567 --> 00:33:11.527 As always, if you have information you'd like to see, just go to 00:33:11.557 --> 00:33:17.137 collabreo.com, find any email address, send it in, and we will respond. 00:33:17.137 --> 00:33:21.037 If you need help or want to discuss anything with us, we really appreciate it. 00:33:21.097 --> 00:33:24.847 Otherwise, we will talk to you on the next episode of working Smarter from Collab. 00:33:25.117 --> 00:33:25.717 Thanks everybody.