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Jonily : Oftentimes, we think
we're getting kids a good

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cognitive demand. But we're
actually giving them cognitive

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loads of good

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Cheri Dotterer: morning. Welcome
to tier one interventions with

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Jonily Zupancic and Cheri
Dotterer, a

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Jonily : Jonily Zupancic. Here
Jay Z in the house today. And

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tier one interventions is really
about strengthening our core in

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schools, if you think about your
body, or our overall health

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really depends on our poor and
our poor strength. So in schools

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are poor, is our tier one
general classroom, general ed

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teacher, with intervention
specialist or other support

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personnel in the classroom, and
inclusive model serving all kids

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at the same time. So tier one
interventions is about the

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instructional strategies that
are going to enhance and

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maximize the learning for all
students, regardless of ability

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or disability. Tier one needs to
be strong enough to make certain

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that all ability levels of
students get their needs met.

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And I know this can seem really
overwhelming for the general

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classroom teacher. However, tier
one interventions is all about

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what are those techniques? Those
techniques have to do with the

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student body, brain, and
emotion? And how do we get all

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three of those things ready to
learn the content. When tier one

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general classroom course I'm
Your Math girl. But it doesn't

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matter what the content what the
subject is in tier one

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classroom. The same techniques
apply for all content areas, all

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subject areas, without a strong
tier one foundation. We tend to

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overload tier two small group
and tier three intensive one on

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one intervention to the point
where schools and districts

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don't have the personnel to
serve all of these students. So

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when we're getting these kids
ready for learning, and being

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able to do that in an inclusive,
least restrictive environment,

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tier one, there are certain
instructional strategies that we

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need to focus on. If you're a
general classroom teacher,

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administrator, support
specialists, occupational

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therapists, speech therapists,
intervention specialists,

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instructional coach, whatever
your role is, in your school or

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district want you to think and
evaluate in your mind, the

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strength of your tier one. Now,
how do we do this? There are

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certain components in tier one,
meaning, how visual is the

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content? How much do we adapt to
student visualization? How do we

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embed conceptual cognitive
stimulating multi sensory

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approaches to our content? How
is our content leveled and

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adaptive? What connections and
associations are we making and

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supporting students to make? And
we might be thinking, how do we

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do this in a classroom with 36
students and not overload the

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facilitators, the instructors,
the teachers in the room, and

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that is where we have this gap.
And this gap can be filled with

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our strategies on tier one
interventions. Before we get

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into the mathematics of this, I
want to talk about getting the

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brain ready for learning. And I
want to compare two phrases

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cognitive load and cognitive
demand. Cognitive Load is much

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more of a negative aspect,
cognitive demand is the sweet

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spot. All of us have different
tolerances for cognitive load,

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cognitive load, our stimulus
that are coming in things that

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are happening around us that we
can't handle, and our brains

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begin to disconnect,
malfunction. Set apart. And this

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is where many times frustration
and behaviors arise with

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students when they have too
great of a cognitive load. At

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times, our instruction for
students triggers cognitive load

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when we think we're trying to
reach cognitive demand.

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cognitive demand, on the other
hand, is all about getting

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students in the zone. So even
our students with ADHD or

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processing issues or focus
issues, if we can still simulate

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and instruct and facilitate
using all those components I

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mentioned, conceptual, visual,
multi sensory, if we can use all

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of these techniques in the right
way to simulate a good, just

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right cognitive demand for
students, their brains and

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bodies and emotions get in the
zone, just like if you're an

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athlete, and you're in the zone
and time passes, and you don't

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even realize how much time has
passed and you're able to

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perform at the optimal level of
your sport. Same thing in the

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classroom, if I can facilitate
so that kids are at, they're

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just right cognitive demand
level, that's when ultimate

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learning occurs. Now, I'm not
saying that this is easy, there

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are simple strategies. But
teaching is very complex. And

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tier one interventions is about
breaking down that complexity

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for us facilitators implement
implementing in an easy way,

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however, becoming more savvy and
artful with our teaching. If we

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get kids into that sweet spot,
that cognitive demand, not only

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are we going to maximize
learning, but we're going to

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help support students attend
focus. Get them motivated, we're

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going to help students
understand how to use their

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stamina to stay on task for
longer periods of time. And

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we're going to enhance their
independence and perseverance of

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tasks. Oftentimes, we think
we're getting kids a good

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cognitive demands, but we're
actually giving them cognitive

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load. So if you notice your
students are out of focus or not

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attending, or you noticed your
students behaviors are starting

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to turn negative. Yes, there are
a lot of factors that go into

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that one of the major factors is
the facilitation or lack of good

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technique by the instructor. So
what do we do to get kids into

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this good cognitive demand, I do
have to back up and say,

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research has continued to show
that the number one factor in

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student achievement is the
quality of the teacher. So think

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about yourself. And for the last
20 years, I've videotaped and

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audio taped and analyzed myself
and my own teaching, so that I

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can continue to be a better
instructional facilitator

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tomorrow than I was today, using
these components that I keep

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mentioning. So this difference
between cognitive load and

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cognitive demand is at times
very subtle. However, what we're

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going to teach on these
sessions, is how to get that

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sweet spot how to get that just
right cognitive demand. It's a

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lot of people call it the
Goldilocks principle. So

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Goldilocks and the Three Bears,
and you got the three bears in

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the soup that's too hot the soup
that's too cold, the soup.

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That's just right. So the
Goldilocks principle is how do

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we get our instructional
facilitation just right at a

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just right level for students,
so that their brains are

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absolutely ready to intake the
learning, there are no barriers

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to learning. And we can do that
with one lesson with 36 Plus

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kids in one classroom. Cognitive
Load, cognitive demand share,

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you are our neuroscience brain
based expert. Talk to us a

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little bit about how what we do
impacts the brain and learning

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if you could, please. Sure.

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Cheri Dotterer: I've been
thinking a lot about this as

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you've been talking, and you're
talking about the flow cycle. So

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the flow cycle was developed by
a psych kya tourist

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psychologist, several years
back, he's been gone a couple of

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years, and I'm probably gonna
butcher his name. It's me. Hi,

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son. chicony. Hi. Beautiful,
beautiful, hee hee. It's one

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I've been having to practice for
a long time to get that one out.

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Anyway, he realized that there
were four steps to, to creating

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productivity through these four
steps. Our body goes through

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them on a continuous basis. And
what Jonily is talking about is

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that spot called flow. That's
when cognitive demand is

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essentially at its peak. And so
when we're looking at struggle

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is when we're getting the
information in. And it might

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sound a little bit weird as far
as the title goes, when I I

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think about struggle, I think
about concentrating on getting

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the notes down on paper, getting
the concept in my brain release

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must happen next. And that's why
recess. And these triggers that

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in these activities that I share
all the time are so important,

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because there needs to be a
break between the taking in of

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the material and the putting out
of the material. And so what we

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do during release is we have to
have physical exercise, it can

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be as short as 30 seconds, it
can be as long as several hours.

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While that is happening, the
brain is taking that new

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information that you've been
thinking about. It's pairing it

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with this information that we've
already had in our brain, it's

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integrating them together, so
that when you get to the point

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of re engaging with the
material, again, you're in a

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state where you can really come
through and think about all

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kinds of different things that
are related to the same topic,

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but you didn't know. And that's
why asking questions, getting

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kids to ask questions is so
essential, because that helps

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that brain and that flow process
occur. And that will only last

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20 minutes, then our brains
usable the fuel that's up here,

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and we need to refuel it again.
And recovery is multi

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dimensional, multi sensory,
multi dimensional. It's not just

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going back out and having
physical exercise. It's also

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hydration, nutrition,
interaction with the community.

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So this is a part with release
and recovery. Having

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communication is really helpful
and beneficial to the whole

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process. I think, even if we've
talked about something totally

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not part of the topic. So think
about that, when you're thinking

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about what you're doing with the
kids. If you're even doing a 40

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minute lesson with them, their
brain went into cognitive load,

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about 20 minutes in.

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Jonily : As we are thinking
about this low cycle, I want to

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pinpoint struggle for a moment.
I had mentioned frustration

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earlier. So cognitive load,
really triggering frustration.

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There's a difference between
frustration and struggle, subtle

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differences between frustration
and struggle. And the

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differences are the same
differences in cognitive load,

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cognitive demand, cognitive load
is going to cause a negative

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frustration. However good
facilitation, inspiring

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cognitive demand, is going to
trigger good struggle in

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education. We have this phrase
that's been coined very recently

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called productive struggle.
That's exactly what we're

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talking about here. productive
struggle. If you're an

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education, you know that this is
what is going to trigger kids

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into a good, just right
cognitive demand. Depth of

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Knowledge is another educational
phrase where we know that we can

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have deep learning happen
through a good just right

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cognitive demand, all these
phrases in education that had

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been coined, they all relate
back to what the science says is

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the flow states and chicks Me
sent chick me how you did it

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better than than I did. Sherry
is called the godfather of flow,

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Steven Kotler, and just given a
shout out to Steven Kotler, he

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has a podcast his team, he's
written a number of books. One

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of his books is called The Art
of impossible. He is if Mihai is

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the The Godfather, the
grandfather of flow. Steven

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Kotler is the father of flow and
then a great friend and coach

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and mentor of mine of Sherry's
carry over Brunner has taken

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flow into another direction as
far as business personal

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relationships entrepreneur, and
has extended it to how in our

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daily lives, our professional
lives and our personal lives as

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adults can We become more
productive, and eliminate or at

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least barrier, some of the
distractions that come in, sort

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them out and get into this flow
state and go through this cycle.

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So tier one instruction,
maximizing tier one instruction

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is absolutely essential. I want
to give you three takeaways. And

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we just talked about this.
Teresa, we just talked about

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this right before we came on
live here in the recording.

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There are three specific
examples of instructional

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facilitation strategies that if
you leave with nothing else

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today, these are three things
that I do as a teacher, as a

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facilitator, that is going to
bring kids into a good

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productive struggle, cognitive
demands, and that sweet spot,

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they're the same. In one lesson
for all 2634 students that I

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have in the classroom. And they
are content that I am sharing

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with students, I'm going to ask
these questions, what do you

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see? What do you notice? And I'm
going to use my favorite three

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words, tell me about. So in tier
one, and instruction in the core

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classroom, we want to frequently
and repetitively be using those

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questions and prompts. What
those questions and prompts do

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is trigger perspective for the
student. And the students brain

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cognitively, will adjust in
education, we call it

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differentiate. Naturally, it'll
differentiate the levels for

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each individual student, without
me producing seven or eight

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different lessons, what do you
see? What do you notice and tell

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me about should be tools in our
toolbox that we're using

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multiple times a day multiple
times a lesson to gain student

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perspective. And then I can be
responsive in my teaching, take

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student perspective, and use
that to instruct my content

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that's going to engage students
and focus students, it's going

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to tell them you belong, I care
what you think. And I mentioned

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this before, I'm going to
mention Daniel Pink again, and

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Dr. What motivates humans, I
want to know that I belong, I

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want to know that my thoughts
matter, I want to know that my

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perspective matters. So we can
engage in all of those emotions,

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and increase the cognitive
demand and get students to that

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sweet spot with those three
prompts. I get this question all

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the time, we get this question
all the time. Are your

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strategies research based?
That's a big topic. How do I

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know that this is going to work?
What's it grounded in? And my

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answer to that is absolutely
yes. Everything we're teaching

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for this core general classroom
is research base. Now we have to

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define what research base means.
And then I've just given you all

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of the examples of it research
based is the work that we do. Is

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it grounded in the Mighty Hands
of giants that have come before

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us and what that means is the
research and the work that

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others have done? How has that
then impacted or affected the

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parallels in the strategies that
we teach? So research base is

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about looking at these
influencers, many names that

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I've just mentioned, I'm gonna
mention one other book, Make It

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Stick, make it stick, make it
stick is a number of researched

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strategies for cognitive
science. And all of the

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strategies that Sherry and I are
teaching are supported through

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the strategies that at the
university level, are taught in

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the book make it stick and in
other places about how to

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trigger and stimulate? Good,
just right cognitive demand. So

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absolutely, yes, positively. And
that is why I wanted to mention

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so many names this morning and
references to what this work

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looks like. And as we move into
specifically the math work, I'm

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going to be referring to each of
these strategies that are based

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on cognitive demand and
everything we talked about. No,

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I always say to teachers, when
they come to trainings, I always

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say there's so much user error,
so much user error, and even us

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as adults need interactions. Oh,
Over time, you need the same

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training with a different twist
over to hesitate on action.

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Action is hindered by
perfection. Don't wait till you

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have it all figured out to go
implement, go implement wrong,

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go in. I mean, I encourage you
take action go implement wrong.

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And then next time, just do it
better. But do not let

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perfection hinder your action
and implementing it to see

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Cheri Dotterer: the slide deck
before everybody else. And I'm

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sitting here going, Oh, but then
again, I'm not the math teacher,

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and I've got to give it that. I
thought I understood math until

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I met Ingo.

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Jonily : You guys, we don't none
of us do. None of us do. I have

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a bachelor's degree in
mathematics in pure mathematics,

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I was not going to be a teacher.
Then I started teaching, I'm

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certified secondary started
teaching eighth grade. And it

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was in that first year of
teaching that I connect with

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what Cheri just said, I was good
at math, I knew math. And man, I

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got stumped on my first year of
teaching. I taught these

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beautiful lessons, and my kids
weren't getting it. And I

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couldn't help them. What I found
out very rudely and cruelly is I

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did not know math. And I have a
bachelor's degree in

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mathematics. None of us, even us
adults, that did well at math in

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school. Listen to me, you were a
bright kid, you only achieved

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because you worked hard. And you
mimicked no one asked you to

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think deeply. And so you're
missing so many understandings

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of mathematics. We are all a
product of our system, our tier

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one core system. And that system
has proven to be broken time and

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time again. Because us as math
teachers, as secondary math

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teachers, we do not understand
the math well enough to help our

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students understand at a deep
level, we don't. And I can prove

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it to you time and time again,
with example, after example. And

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I don't mean to be a downer at
the end of this training. But

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what I'm saying is we need to
fix it through tier one

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interventions, through our
collaborations and connections

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to our therapists, and our
support staff. And you will only

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get these interventions that are
game changing, that truly work

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that are the next generation of
math achievement that we've

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never seen before. You will only
get them here with Tier One

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interventions.