1 00:00:00,110 --> 00:00:02,810 Carol Cox: My guest, Doctor Karen Corbin of Geeks That 2 00:00:02,810 --> 00:00:05,360 Speak, wants to reframe public speaking from 3 00:00:05,360 --> 00:00:08,000 an elite skill to an everyday power, which 4 00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:09,920 you'll hear about on this episode of the 5 00:00:09,920 --> 00:00:11,600 Speaking Your Brand podcast. 6 00:00:17,000 --> 00:00:19,700 More and more women are making an impact by 7 00:00:19,700 --> 00:00:22,430 starting businesses, running for office, and 8 00:00:22,430 --> 00:00:24,410 speaking up for what matters. 9 00:00:24,440 --> 00:00:26,690 With my background as a TV political 10 00:00:26,690 --> 00:00:29,570 analyst, entrepreneur, and speaker, I 11 00:00:29,570 --> 00:00:31,970 interview and coach purpose driven women to 12 00:00:32,000 --> 00:00:34,460 shape their brands, grow their companies, 13 00:00:34,460 --> 00:00:37,160 and become recognized as influencers in 14 00:00:37,190 --> 00:00:40,490 their field. This is speaking your brand, 15 00:00:40,520 --> 00:00:43,040 your place to learn how to persuasively 16 00:00:43,040 --> 00:00:46,400 communicate your message to your audience. 17 00:00:47,030 --> 00:00:48,800 Hi and welcome to the Speaking Your Brand 18 00:00:48,830 --> 00:00:50,990 podcast. I'm your host, Carol Cox. 19 00:00:51,020 --> 00:00:54,020 Today we're going to talk about why public 20 00:00:54,020 --> 00:00:57,320 speaking is not just an elite skill or not 21 00:00:57,320 --> 00:00:59,930 something that you have to be born with or 22 00:00:59,930 --> 00:01:01,220 naturally talented for. 23 00:01:01,220 --> 00:01:03,950 But really, public speaking and especially 24 00:01:03,950 --> 00:01:06,860 sharing your story is a skill and a power 25 00:01:06,860 --> 00:01:08,600 that everybody has. 26 00:01:08,630 --> 00:01:11,240 And my guest, Doctor Karen Corbin, is the 27 00:01:11,240 --> 00:01:12,680 epitome of this. She's going to share a 28 00:01:12,680 --> 00:01:15,290 little bit of her story of her, her 29 00:01:15,290 --> 00:01:17,510 transition from middle school to what she 30 00:01:17,510 --> 00:01:19,850 does now. And yes, I always love to ask 31 00:01:19,850 --> 00:01:21,470 people about their childhood. 32 00:01:21,470 --> 00:01:23,060 And so but we're really going to talk about 33 00:01:23,060 --> 00:01:25,280 the importance of storytelling, especially 34 00:01:25,280 --> 00:01:27,740 for scientists, people in the Stem fields, 35 00:01:27,740 --> 00:01:28,820 because that's where Karen is in. 36 00:01:28,820 --> 00:01:30,650 But really, for all of us, no matter what 37 00:01:30,650 --> 00:01:32,960 our industry, no matter what our topic, no 38 00:01:32,960 --> 00:01:34,940 matter where we work or what our business 39 00:01:34,970 --> 00:01:37,760 is, because we so many people believe again, 40 00:01:37,790 --> 00:01:39,710 that public speaking is only for a few, or 41 00:01:39,710 --> 00:01:41,270 that you have to be really gifted, or that 42 00:01:41,270 --> 00:01:44,090 you have to have tons of experience in order 43 00:01:44,090 --> 00:01:45,980 to share your message and your story. 44 00:01:45,980 --> 00:01:48,080 But that is not the case at all, which is 45 00:01:48,080 --> 00:01:50,390 where we're going to talk about Karen Corbin 46 00:01:50,390 --> 00:01:53,450 has not only a PhD, but also an Rd, and 47 00:01:53,450 --> 00:01:55,550 she's an associate investigator at the 48 00:01:55,550 --> 00:01:57,680 AdventHealth Translational Research 49 00:01:57,730 --> 00:02:00,310 Institute here in Orlando, Florida, where we 50 00:02:00,310 --> 00:02:03,100 both live. She's also the owner and chief 51 00:02:03,100 --> 00:02:06,520 geek of Geeks That speak, which I love, 52 00:02:06,550 --> 00:02:07,570 geeks that speak. 53 00:02:07,570 --> 00:02:10,270 And she really works to inspire and empower 54 00:02:10,270 --> 00:02:13,060 scientists to become powerful storytellers, 55 00:02:13,090 --> 00:02:15,490 not only adults, but also she works a lot 56 00:02:15,520 --> 00:02:17,350 with younger girls, which we're going to 57 00:02:17,350 --> 00:02:19,180 talk about towards the end of the 58 00:02:19,180 --> 00:02:21,250 conversation. Karen, welcome back to the 59 00:02:21,250 --> 00:02:22,120 podcast. 60 00:02:22,150 --> 00:02:24,490 Karen Corbin: Hi, Carol. Great to see you again five years 61 00:02:24,490 --> 00:02:25,240 later. 62 00:02:25,270 --> 00:02:27,100 Carol Cox: I know we were looking before we clicked 63 00:02:27,100 --> 00:02:30,070 record. You were on pretty much exactly five 64 00:02:30,070 --> 00:02:32,770 years ago, September of 2019. 65 00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:34,630 Episode 138. 66 00:02:34,660 --> 00:02:37,180 Amazingly, talking about scientists need to 67 00:02:37,180 --> 00:02:38,440 tell their stories to. 68 00:02:38,470 --> 00:02:41,110 And so as we chatted before we hit record, 69 00:02:41,110 --> 00:02:43,990 it's I love this because it shows how much 70 00:02:44,020 --> 00:02:46,000 our missions are who we are. 71 00:02:46,030 --> 00:02:48,220 This is clearly our thread throughout our 72 00:02:48,220 --> 00:02:50,320 careers. We're still doing it five years 73 00:02:50,320 --> 00:02:52,420 later. We'll be doing this five years and 74 00:02:52,420 --> 00:02:54,250 more from now. So I'm so glad to have you 75 00:02:54,250 --> 00:02:55,330 back on the podcast. 76 00:02:55,330 --> 00:02:56,380 Karen Corbin: Thank you. 77 00:02:56,530 --> 00:02:58,810 Carol Cox: Well, let's let's start off with what 78 00:02:58,810 --> 00:03:01,480 prompted this conversation you shared with 79 00:03:01,480 --> 00:03:04,180 me in an email not too long ago that you had 80 00:03:04,180 --> 00:03:06,790 a recent moment where you were listening to 81 00:03:06,820 --> 00:03:09,430 your colleagues share their stories and it 82 00:03:09,430 --> 00:03:11,710 made you stop in your tracks. 83 00:03:11,710 --> 00:03:13,720 You told me, and it made you realize 84 00:03:13,720 --> 00:03:15,850 something. Can you tell me what happened? 85 00:03:15,880 --> 00:03:17,260 Like set us. Set the scene. 86 00:03:17,290 --> 00:03:18,670 Tell us what was going on. 87 00:03:18,670 --> 00:03:20,620 And what was it about that experience that 88 00:03:20,620 --> 00:03:22,000 struck you so deeply? 89 00:03:22,270 --> 00:03:25,210 Karen Corbin: Yeah. So we had a group of educators from one 90 00:03:25,210 --> 00:03:28,240 of our local counties here to hear from a 91 00:03:28,240 --> 00:03:30,850 spectrum of our team members about how they 92 00:03:30,850 --> 00:03:33,160 chose their career, what they do every 93 00:03:33,160 --> 00:03:34,240 single day. 94 00:03:34,270 --> 00:03:37,780 So I did my spiel, interestingly, with my 95 00:03:37,780 --> 00:03:39,550 slides not working because that happens 96 00:03:39,550 --> 00:03:43,060 sometimes. So I had to just ad lib it, and I 97 00:03:43,090 --> 00:03:45,550 finished mine, and I and I left the stage 98 00:03:45,550 --> 00:03:47,320 and I just stayed and listened. 99 00:03:47,320 --> 00:03:50,470 And one by one, my friends, my colleagues 100 00:03:50,470 --> 00:03:52,600 told what I thought were really important 101 00:03:52,600 --> 00:03:55,620 stories about who they are, how they landed 102 00:03:55,650 --> 00:03:57,600 their job, what they do every day. 103 00:03:57,690 --> 00:04:01,710 And I'd say 95% of them essentially ran out 104 00:04:01,710 --> 00:04:04,530 of the room and put their hands in their 105 00:04:04,530 --> 00:04:06,840 face and said, I need to go somewhere dark 106 00:04:06,840 --> 00:04:09,300 and cold and just close the door. 107 00:04:09,330 --> 00:04:11,520 I never want to do that again. 108 00:04:11,520 --> 00:04:14,820 And I thought to myself, that's a tragedy. 109 00:04:14,850 --> 00:04:18,540 They had important insight that nobody else 110 00:04:18,540 --> 00:04:21,300 can have. Your story is your own, and the 111 00:04:21,300 --> 00:04:24,360 fact that people feel like they're not good 112 00:04:24,360 --> 00:04:26,520 at sharing their story and therefore they 113 00:04:26,520 --> 00:04:29,760 should stay silent, really concerned me. 114 00:04:30,360 --> 00:04:32,790 Carol Cox: And what do you feel like prompted that 115 00:04:32,790 --> 00:04:34,650 immediate reaction that basically they 116 00:04:34,650 --> 00:04:35,850 wanted to go hide? 117 00:04:35,880 --> 00:04:37,620 Did they feel like their stories were too 118 00:04:37,620 --> 00:04:40,200 vulnerable, that people heard too much about 119 00:04:40,200 --> 00:04:42,510 them? Was it the the fact of just standing 120 00:04:42,510 --> 00:04:43,950 in front of a group of people, what was 121 00:04:43,950 --> 00:04:45,210 going on for them? 122 00:04:45,330 --> 00:04:49,470 Karen Corbin: I think it's the the typical and normal fear 123 00:04:49,470 --> 00:04:50,520 of public speaking. 124 00:04:50,520 --> 00:04:51,960 You don't want to be judged. 125 00:04:51,990 --> 00:04:55,140 You you worry you didn't do it right, or you 126 00:04:55,140 --> 00:04:56,490 may say the wrong thing. 127 00:04:56,490 --> 00:04:58,740 And that's such a normal feeling. 128 00:04:58,740 --> 00:05:01,740 And I think it hinders people from wanting 129 00:05:01,770 --> 00:05:04,620 to to ever do that unless they absolutely 130 00:05:04,620 --> 00:05:05,400 have to. 131 00:05:06,030 --> 00:05:07,920 Carol Cox: And would you say that most of them would 132 00:05:07,920 --> 00:05:09,150 call themselves introverts? 133 00:05:09,150 --> 00:05:10,620 Do you think that had something to do with 134 00:05:10,620 --> 00:05:11,490 it as well? 135 00:05:11,910 --> 00:05:14,940 Karen Corbin: Yeah, I think the extroverts in the group 136 00:05:14,970 --> 00:05:16,500 were a little bit more comfortable. 137 00:05:16,500 --> 00:05:17,880 So I think that's true. 138 00:05:17,880 --> 00:05:20,160 But I think you can still be extroverted to 139 00:05:20,160 --> 00:05:23,310 have a really talented neuroscientist friend 140 00:05:23,340 --> 00:05:26,730 who is just she's actually great when she 141 00:05:26,730 --> 00:05:28,110 speaks in front of people. 142 00:05:28,110 --> 00:05:30,540 And I consider her very extroverted, but I 143 00:05:30,540 --> 00:05:31,680 don't think she loves it. 144 00:05:31,680 --> 00:05:33,690 I think she does it because she has to, but 145 00:05:33,690 --> 00:05:35,520 I don't think she loves it even though she's 146 00:05:35,520 --> 00:05:36,420 phenomenal. 147 00:05:37,530 --> 00:05:40,020 Carol Cox: And so Karen, so thinking about these 148 00:05:40,020 --> 00:05:41,970 scientists, like you said, they have really 149 00:05:41,970 --> 00:05:44,730 powerful, important, inspiring stories to 150 00:05:44,760 --> 00:05:47,670 share. And even though it's you. 151 00:05:47,790 --> 00:05:49,170 Well, let me let me ask it this way. 152 00:05:49,170 --> 00:05:51,240 I sometimes feel that people get nervous 153 00:05:51,240 --> 00:05:53,450 about public speaking because they feel like 154 00:05:53,450 --> 00:05:54,800 they don't know what to say. 155 00:05:54,800 --> 00:05:57,320 So they want to have a whole script written 156 00:05:57,350 --> 00:05:59,120 out word for word that they can basically 157 00:05:59,120 --> 00:06:01,220 read from, or they want to have slides that 158 00:06:01,220 --> 00:06:03,200 are chock full of a lot of text and bullet 159 00:06:03,200 --> 00:06:04,820 points. So they can basically read the 160 00:06:04,820 --> 00:06:06,560 slides to the audience, which we know is a 161 00:06:06,560 --> 00:06:08,390 big no no. Not a fun experience for your 162 00:06:08,390 --> 00:06:09,980 audience. So I feel like it's, you know, 163 00:06:10,010 --> 00:06:12,050 there's so much fear and hesitancy around 164 00:06:12,050 --> 00:06:13,670 public speaking because people want to make 165 00:06:13,700 --> 00:06:15,590 sure that they know what they're talking 166 00:06:15,590 --> 00:06:17,120 about, that they have all the expert 167 00:06:17,120 --> 00:06:18,650 information, the details. 168 00:06:18,650 --> 00:06:20,960 They don't say the wrong fact, but it sounds 169 00:06:20,960 --> 00:06:23,210 like that wasn't quite what was going on in 170 00:06:23,210 --> 00:06:24,470 this particular situation. 171 00:06:24,470 --> 00:06:26,750 They were sharing personal stories, which of 172 00:06:26,780 --> 00:06:28,610 course I always say, you know your story, 173 00:06:28,640 --> 00:06:30,470 you lived it. So what? 174 00:06:30,500 --> 00:06:32,120 Why do you think they felt that they were so 175 00:06:32,120 --> 00:06:33,680 bad about sharing it? 176 00:06:33,680 --> 00:06:36,500 Karen Corbin: I think we're just very self-critical and 177 00:06:36,500 --> 00:06:38,990 hate the idea of being in front of people so 178 00:06:38,990 --> 00:06:41,540 much that we just work ourselves up. 179 00:06:41,540 --> 00:06:44,570 And I agree, we we want to have these 180 00:06:44,570 --> 00:06:47,270 perfect scripts and not say the wrong word 181 00:06:47,270 --> 00:06:48,740 and not stutter a little bit. 182 00:06:48,740 --> 00:06:50,510 But in reality, when you have a 183 00:06:50,510 --> 00:06:52,280 conversation, you do that all the time. 184 00:06:52,280 --> 00:06:55,130 It's normal and actually makes you more 185 00:06:55,130 --> 00:06:57,650 endearing to the audience because they don't 186 00:06:57,650 --> 00:06:59,300 want to be up there. They're proud of you 187 00:06:59,300 --> 00:07:01,790 for being up there and having those little 188 00:07:01,820 --> 00:07:05,150 human moments. Actually, I think is a better 189 00:07:05,150 --> 00:07:07,010 way than having this, like perfectly 190 00:07:07,010 --> 00:07:09,830 choreographed speech that you give word for 191 00:07:09,830 --> 00:07:10,490 word. 192 00:07:10,970 --> 00:07:13,550 Carol Cox: Well, we're going to go into some things that 193 00:07:13,550 --> 00:07:16,490 we think will will help the colleagues like 194 00:07:16,490 --> 00:07:18,620 yours. But anyone listening to this podcast. 195 00:07:18,620 --> 00:07:21,140 But first I want to go back to middle 196 00:07:21,140 --> 00:07:24,350 school. Karen, when you were at a in person 197 00:07:24,350 --> 00:07:26,960 workshop that we facilitated a few weeks ago 198 00:07:26,960 --> 00:07:30,080 for the Athena Next Gen alumni, which I'm a 199 00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:31,160 class of 2016. 200 00:07:31,160 --> 00:07:33,050 I know, Karen, you went through that program 201 00:07:33,050 --> 00:07:35,270 as well, and you shared a story with that 202 00:07:35,270 --> 00:07:37,880 group of when you were growing up and 203 00:07:37,880 --> 00:07:41,600 decidedly not wanting to be a public speaker 204 00:07:41,600 --> 00:07:44,870 at all. So can you tell us about young Karen 205 00:07:44,870 --> 00:07:47,210 and then what caused this shift to who you 206 00:07:47,210 --> 00:07:49,400 are now, where you are at the forefront of 207 00:07:49,400 --> 00:07:51,050 science communication and even started a 208 00:07:51,050 --> 00:07:52,700 company called Geekspeak. 209 00:07:52,790 --> 00:07:55,700 Karen Corbin: Yeah. So I moved here from San Juan, Puerto 210 00:07:55,700 --> 00:07:58,070 Rico when I was nine years old, and I had an 211 00:07:58,070 --> 00:07:59,270 accent, believe it or not. 212 00:07:59,300 --> 00:08:00,770 I don't have one now. 213 00:08:00,770 --> 00:08:03,560 People don't peg me immediately as being 214 00:08:03,590 --> 00:08:06,920 from a Latin background, and I remember a 215 00:08:06,920 --> 00:08:08,990 specific day and listen. 216 00:08:08,990 --> 00:08:10,490 I forget a lot of stuff. 217 00:08:10,490 --> 00:08:11,660 I forget almost everything. 218 00:08:11,660 --> 00:08:15,050 But I remember this day in the library, 219 00:08:15,230 --> 00:08:18,230 reading something out loud to the class, and 220 00:08:18,230 --> 00:08:21,530 I remember exactly which word made me stay 221 00:08:21,530 --> 00:08:22,940 silent forever. 222 00:08:23,120 --> 00:08:25,850 And that was the word pyramid, because I 223 00:08:25,880 --> 00:08:27,590 said a pyramid. 224 00:08:27,680 --> 00:08:31,610 And the kids laughed at me and it was so 225 00:08:31,610 --> 00:08:33,920 awful. And I said, you know what? 226 00:08:34,160 --> 00:08:36,440 I think I'm better off backstage. 227 00:08:36,470 --> 00:08:38,060 I'll just stay silent. 228 00:08:38,060 --> 00:08:39,200 Silence is safe. 229 00:08:39,200 --> 00:08:44,480 And so I spent most of my years in school 230 00:08:44,480 --> 00:08:47,050 and even into my first professional job, 231 00:08:47,050 --> 00:08:50,020 avoiding public speaking as much as 232 00:08:50,020 --> 00:08:53,290 possible. Now that became something that I 233 00:08:53,290 --> 00:08:56,200 just couldn't do anymore because I chose a 234 00:08:56,200 --> 00:08:58,120 career in healthcare and science. 235 00:08:58,150 --> 00:09:01,000 And when I started in healthcare, I think on 236 00:09:01,000 --> 00:09:03,910 day two of being a registered dietitian, I 237 00:09:03,910 --> 00:09:06,460 was asked to audition my public speaking 238 00:09:06,460 --> 00:09:09,310 skills. And I was thinking, I didn't see 239 00:09:09,310 --> 00:09:11,800 that in the job description anywhere. 240 00:09:11,830 --> 00:09:14,170 Well, it turned out they ran this 241 00:09:14,170 --> 00:09:16,630 educational program out of this cardiology 242 00:09:16,630 --> 00:09:18,820 office that had just been hired to work in, 243 00:09:18,820 --> 00:09:21,430 where they trained other cardiology offices 244 00:09:21,430 --> 00:09:24,250 on how to establish prevention programs for 245 00:09:24,250 --> 00:09:26,230 heart disease. And it included a team of 246 00:09:26,230 --> 00:09:28,660 dietitians and nurses and physicians. 247 00:09:28,660 --> 00:09:32,770 And it was an expectation that I would join 248 00:09:32,770 --> 00:09:34,330 that traveling road show. 249 00:09:34,330 --> 00:09:37,360 And I thought, oh, boy, I'm either going to 250 00:09:37,390 --> 00:09:41,440 sink or swim. And so I wasn't going to sink 251 00:09:41,470 --> 00:09:42,550 and I auditioned. 252 00:09:42,580 --> 00:09:45,010 I was probably pretty bad, but they trained 253 00:09:45,010 --> 00:09:46,600 me. They worked with me. I learned through 254 00:09:46,600 --> 00:09:49,930 observation. And then when it was my turn to 255 00:09:49,960 --> 00:09:52,360 do it, clearly I was terrified. 256 00:09:52,390 --> 00:09:54,670 This was back in the day when the projectors 257 00:09:54,670 --> 00:09:57,370 were, like, the size of a suitcase, and you 258 00:09:57,400 --> 00:10:00,010 checked them in the airplane as luggage. 259 00:10:00,010 --> 00:10:02,560 And if you hit the button sequence the wrong 260 00:10:02,560 --> 00:10:04,540 way, the light bulb would blow and that 261 00:10:04,540 --> 00:10:06,790 would be the end of the show. 262 00:10:06,790 --> 00:10:08,890 So it was kind of interesting times 263 00:10:09,010 --> 00:10:11,380 historically in how we deliver talks. 264 00:10:11,380 --> 00:10:14,050 And so the more I did it, the more I said, 265 00:10:14,080 --> 00:10:17,260 oh, I kind of like this, and I think I'm 266 00:10:17,290 --> 00:10:18,670 getting better at it. 267 00:10:18,670 --> 00:10:21,520 And I made the connection that being on 268 00:10:21,520 --> 00:10:24,280 stage speaking gave me the same kind of 269 00:10:24,280 --> 00:10:26,950 feeling as when I was on stage dancing, 270 00:10:26,950 --> 00:10:29,770 because a little known fact is that I wanted 271 00:10:29,770 --> 00:10:31,750 to be either a scientist or a dancer. 272 00:10:31,780 --> 00:10:34,240 Those are my two career paths. 273 00:10:34,270 --> 00:10:35,920 Dancing is a passion of mine. 274 00:10:35,950 --> 00:10:37,570 I still love it. 275 00:10:37,570 --> 00:10:40,090 And if I could, I would be dancing every 276 00:10:40,090 --> 00:10:42,280 single day. So, um. 277 00:10:42,280 --> 00:10:45,390 So then I said, okay, this is actually 278 00:10:45,390 --> 00:10:46,500 something that I'm liking. 279 00:10:46,500 --> 00:10:47,730 I need to get better at it. 280 00:10:47,730 --> 00:10:49,050 I practiced. 281 00:10:49,320 --> 00:10:52,680 And when I got into science, to make a long 282 00:10:52,680 --> 00:10:55,200 story short, I noticed that there was a lot 283 00:10:55,230 --> 00:10:58,410 of gaps in scientific communication and that 284 00:10:58,410 --> 00:11:00,750 it was something that we have to do as 285 00:11:00,750 --> 00:11:01,980 science, as scientists. 286 00:11:01,980 --> 00:11:04,170 It's part of our job description to go to 287 00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:06,540 conferences to talk about our data. 288 00:11:06,570 --> 00:11:10,710 And I and I saw a need to say, hey, guys, 289 00:11:10,710 --> 00:11:12,120 this doesn't have to be boring. 290 00:11:12,120 --> 00:11:13,650 It doesn't have to be a data dump. 291 00:11:13,650 --> 00:11:15,420 There are ways to do this. 292 00:11:15,420 --> 00:11:18,180 So A you enjoy it more, but importantly your 293 00:11:18,180 --> 00:11:19,530 audience gets more out of it. 294 00:11:19,530 --> 00:11:22,500 So. So that's how I went from never doing it 295 00:11:22,500 --> 00:11:24,570 to looking for every chance to speak in 296 00:11:24,570 --> 00:11:25,680 front of people. 297 00:11:25,680 --> 00:11:27,450 And when I say this, people that don't 298 00:11:27,450 --> 00:11:29,430 believe me, they're like, but, but you're so 299 00:11:29,430 --> 00:11:30,870 good at it. You're a natural. 300 00:11:30,870 --> 00:11:31,890 You're so engaging. 301 00:11:31,920 --> 00:11:33,030 I said, practice it. 302 00:11:33,030 --> 00:11:36,030 Just it just taking the time to decide this 303 00:11:36,030 --> 00:11:38,340 is important to you and working at this 304 00:11:38,340 --> 00:11:39,180 craft. 305 00:11:39,570 --> 00:11:41,310 Carol Cox: Yes, I was going to say it sounded like the 306 00:11:41,340 --> 00:11:43,440 repetition of just doing it. 307 00:11:43,470 --> 00:11:44,880 You have to do it more than one time. 308 00:11:44,910 --> 00:11:46,710 If anything in life, if you only do 309 00:11:46,710 --> 00:11:49,410 something in life 1 or 2 times, and you do 310 00:11:49,410 --> 00:11:51,420 it only once every few years, yes, it's 311 00:11:51,420 --> 00:11:52,830 going to be very nerve wracking. 312 00:11:52,830 --> 00:11:54,510 You're probably not going to be as good at 313 00:11:54,510 --> 00:11:56,370 it as you want to be, and so you're not 314 00:11:56,370 --> 00:11:57,900 going to want to continue doing it. 315 00:11:57,930 --> 00:11:59,760 And so you have to just you have to put the 316 00:11:59,760 --> 00:12:01,620 reps in, just like with strength training or 317 00:12:01,620 --> 00:12:03,420 training for a half marathon. 318 00:12:03,450 --> 00:12:05,460 You can't just go out there and expect to be 319 00:12:05,490 --> 00:12:07,590 at your best the very first time you do it. 320 00:12:07,620 --> 00:12:09,960 Karen Corbin: Yeah, I mean, there may be a few people like 321 00:12:09,960 --> 00:12:12,750 you said that are born with it that since 322 00:12:12,750 --> 00:12:14,400 childhood could just do that. 323 00:12:14,400 --> 00:12:18,210 But for the 99% of the rest of us, it's 324 00:12:18,210 --> 00:12:20,580 something that takes time and practice and 325 00:12:20,580 --> 00:12:21,630 dedication. 326 00:12:21,930 --> 00:12:24,090 Carol Cox: And so and I think that what you mentioned 327 00:12:24,090 --> 00:12:26,580 about this early experience when you were 328 00:12:26,580 --> 00:12:29,310 young in school and getting laughed at by 329 00:12:29,310 --> 00:12:31,470 other kids, I feel like there's so many 330 00:12:31,500 --> 00:12:33,960 adults out there who have had those types of 331 00:12:33,960 --> 00:12:36,450 experiences in school, either teachers 332 00:12:36,450 --> 00:12:38,670 calling on them or teachers saying something 333 00:12:38,670 --> 00:12:40,190 that they probably shouldn't have said in a 334 00:12:40,190 --> 00:12:42,380 negative way or the kids laughing. 335 00:12:42,380 --> 00:12:44,510 And I feel like that holds back so many 336 00:12:44,540 --> 00:12:46,460 adults because they don't want to try it 337 00:12:46,460 --> 00:12:48,830 ever again. They they feel that, you know, 338 00:12:48,860 --> 00:12:51,230 in your in their bodies, they can feel that 339 00:12:51,230 --> 00:12:53,480 sense of embarrassment or humiliation or 340 00:12:53,480 --> 00:12:54,800 just those bad feelings. 341 00:12:54,800 --> 00:12:57,680 And so but to your point, Karen, for so many 342 00:12:57,680 --> 00:12:59,630 people in their careers, and especially if 343 00:12:59,660 --> 00:13:01,940 you own your own business, public speaking 344 00:13:01,940 --> 00:13:04,520 is an essential skill and storytelling is an 345 00:13:04,520 --> 00:13:05,600 essential skill to have. 346 00:13:05,630 --> 00:13:08,000 So for those of you listening, if public 347 00:13:08,000 --> 00:13:10,730 speaking is something that you feel 348 00:13:10,760 --> 00:13:14,030 trepidation about, feel so much nervousness 349 00:13:14,030 --> 00:13:15,800 that it really prevents you from doing it. 350 00:13:15,830 --> 00:13:19,130 Find those small kind of safe spaces to 351 00:13:19,130 --> 00:13:21,590 start with. Warm audiences, places where you 352 00:13:21,590 --> 00:13:23,810 feel comfortable. Maybe it is delivering a 353 00:13:23,810 --> 00:13:25,160 presentation at work. 354 00:13:25,190 --> 00:13:28,130 Do it more and more often and I will say, I 355 00:13:28,130 --> 00:13:30,710 promise you, I promise you it will get 356 00:13:30,710 --> 00:13:33,500 easier. Karen, what else have you seen works 357 00:13:33,500 --> 00:13:35,510 well for people that you work with. 358 00:13:35,750 --> 00:13:38,760 Karen Corbin: So I try to help them really step back and 359 00:13:38,760 --> 00:13:41,670 think about who's your audience, what do 360 00:13:41,670 --> 00:13:44,370 they know? What do they need to know, and 361 00:13:44,370 --> 00:13:46,680 how would they maximally benefit from 362 00:13:46,680 --> 00:13:47,790 everything? You know? 363 00:13:47,790 --> 00:13:50,010 Because as scientists, we know a lot of 364 00:13:50,010 --> 00:13:51,660 things about a lot of things. 365 00:13:51,660 --> 00:13:53,760 And when we get up there, we want to tell 366 00:13:53,760 --> 00:13:55,110 you everything. 367 00:13:55,110 --> 00:13:57,840 But in fact, you only have so much time and 368 00:13:57,840 --> 00:13:59,280 you can't tell people everything. 369 00:13:59,280 --> 00:14:03,240 So it's about tailoring the content to meet 370 00:14:03,240 --> 00:14:05,100 the needs of the audience. 371 00:14:05,160 --> 00:14:08,970 And once you do that, you will sense that 372 00:14:08,970 --> 00:14:10,950 engagement from your audience. 373 00:14:10,950 --> 00:14:12,810 When you get up there, you see that they're 374 00:14:12,810 --> 00:14:15,000 following you, they're smiling, they're 375 00:14:15,000 --> 00:14:18,120 laughing, they're listening, and that gives 376 00:14:18,120 --> 00:14:19,290 you confidence. 377 00:14:19,290 --> 00:14:23,940 So I really as as a technical person, as a 378 00:14:23,940 --> 00:14:26,790 scientist, we immediately think of the data 379 00:14:26,820 --> 00:14:29,820 first. And in fact, I tell people, start 380 00:14:29,820 --> 00:14:32,220 with the audience and then figure out what 381 00:14:32,220 --> 00:14:35,640 are the most critical pieces of data to 382 00:14:35,670 --> 00:14:39,380 maximally inform, engage and inspire your 383 00:14:39,380 --> 00:14:40,340 audience. 384 00:14:40,790 --> 00:14:42,260 Carol Cox: Mm. That's really helpful. 385 00:14:42,260 --> 00:14:44,090 And, you know, and to your point, thinking 386 00:14:44,090 --> 00:14:47,330 about you were one of the speakers for the 387 00:14:47,330 --> 00:14:49,250 brave Bold Beyond Live virtual Summit, the 388 00:14:49,250 --> 00:14:51,710 first one we hosted in October 2020. 389 00:14:51,740 --> 00:14:54,380 Of course, this was in the midst of the 390 00:14:54,380 --> 00:14:55,820 Covid 19 pandemic. 391 00:14:55,850 --> 00:14:57,290 This was the fall of 2020. 392 00:14:57,290 --> 00:15:00,410 So it was. We brought in ten women speakers, 393 00:15:00,410 --> 00:15:02,480 including you, to deliver a ten minute Ted 394 00:15:02,480 --> 00:15:05,030 style talks, and you did it on the 395 00:15:05,030 --> 00:15:08,180 importance of public health communication 396 00:15:08,180 --> 00:15:10,790 and the importance of science and reasoning 397 00:15:10,790 --> 00:15:12,620 and facts, because here we were in the midst 398 00:15:12,620 --> 00:15:14,390 of the pandemic, where that was definitely 399 00:15:14,390 --> 00:15:15,590 going awry. 400 00:15:15,620 --> 00:15:17,600 So, Karen, can you tell us about your 401 00:15:17,600 --> 00:15:20,780 realization of how important communication 402 00:15:20,780 --> 00:15:23,270 is for public communication is for science, 403 00:15:23,270 --> 00:15:26,300 but also how storytelling can fit in versus 404 00:15:26,300 --> 00:15:27,560 just giving people the facts? 405 00:15:27,560 --> 00:15:29,120 Because, as we've seen, just giving people 406 00:15:29,120 --> 00:15:31,160 the facts is not persuade them. 407 00:15:31,280 --> 00:15:33,860 Karen Corbin: Absolutely. And, you know, I started my 408 00:15:33,860 --> 00:15:36,970 career in nutrition in 1998, when most 409 00:15:36,970 --> 00:15:39,160 people didn't have a computer in their hand. 410 00:15:39,160 --> 00:15:42,490 So there was a a logical flow of information 411 00:15:42,490 --> 00:15:45,190 from the professional who had most of the 412 00:15:45,190 --> 00:15:48,010 access to the person on the other side who 413 00:15:48,010 --> 00:15:49,390 needed the information. 414 00:15:49,420 --> 00:15:52,150 Now we're in a totally different world where 415 00:15:52,150 --> 00:15:54,400 we're not under-informed in every way. 416 00:15:54,430 --> 00:15:56,800 We're over informed, but most of the time 417 00:15:56,800 --> 00:15:58,930 we're misinformed, and it's really 418 00:15:58,930 --> 00:16:02,170 challenging to tease apart what's the 419 00:16:02,170 --> 00:16:03,910 reliable information. 420 00:16:03,910 --> 00:16:07,390 And I feel very strongly that one thing we 421 00:16:07,390 --> 00:16:09,820 need to do as a scientific community is get 422 00:16:09,820 --> 00:16:13,060 more of us out there speaking about 423 00:16:13,060 --> 00:16:16,060 important health topics or other scientific 424 00:16:16,090 --> 00:16:18,700 topics, but in a way that's interesting and 425 00:16:18,700 --> 00:16:21,580 understandable. I think there's a statistic 426 00:16:21,580 --> 00:16:25,090 somewhere that people do trust scientists. 427 00:16:25,090 --> 00:16:27,910 The problem is they don't understand us, so 428 00:16:27,910 --> 00:16:29,860 they're going to go elsewhere to look for 429 00:16:29,860 --> 00:16:34,300 the information. So if we elevate an army of 430 00:16:34,300 --> 00:16:37,330 scientists out there that are flipping the 431 00:16:37,330 --> 00:16:41,380 narrative and and really taking charge of 432 00:16:41,380 --> 00:16:43,900 the narrative. I mean, there's nothing worse 433 00:16:43,900 --> 00:16:48,130 than being an expert in a discipline and and 434 00:16:48,130 --> 00:16:50,500 having people who've got no training or 435 00:16:50,500 --> 00:16:53,110 understanding put something out there that 436 00:16:53,110 --> 00:16:55,600 could literally cost someone their life. 437 00:16:55,630 --> 00:16:59,050 I mean, it makes me want to scream silently 438 00:16:59,050 --> 00:17:01,390 almost every day to see that. 439 00:17:01,390 --> 00:17:04,420 And so I think it's just critical to think 440 00:17:04,420 --> 00:17:06,880 about not just giving people the facts, 441 00:17:06,880 --> 00:17:10,270 because those can be blurred, but explaining 442 00:17:10,270 --> 00:17:12,340 things in a way that makes sense, and making 443 00:17:12,340 --> 00:17:15,520 sure we back that up with the sources of 444 00:17:15,520 --> 00:17:18,670 where this comes from so people can check 445 00:17:18,700 --> 00:17:19,810 us. Right. 446 00:17:19,810 --> 00:17:21,250 I tell people all the time, you don't 447 00:17:21,250 --> 00:17:22,360 believe me, read this. 448 00:17:22,360 --> 00:17:24,910 Here's where, here's where this science came 449 00:17:24,910 --> 00:17:29,440 from. So that's just so important for public 450 00:17:29,440 --> 00:17:31,950 health and for really for solving problems, 451 00:17:31,950 --> 00:17:33,330 because that's what science is. 452 00:17:33,330 --> 00:17:36,420 Science is seeking truth to solve problems. 453 00:17:36,420 --> 00:17:39,030 And if we could focus on that and help 454 00:17:39,030 --> 00:17:41,730 people understand the process of science, 455 00:17:41,730 --> 00:17:45,390 the discipline of science and and what it is 456 00:17:45,390 --> 00:17:47,280 that we're trying to accomplish together, 457 00:17:47,280 --> 00:17:49,290 then I think people would be much more 458 00:17:49,290 --> 00:17:51,300 likely to say, wait a minute, this person 459 00:17:51,300 --> 00:17:53,460 said this. Let me think about that and let 460 00:17:53,460 --> 00:17:56,250 me look for for some other sources to see if 461 00:17:56,250 --> 00:17:59,520 this makes sense, rather than just ingesting 462 00:17:59,520 --> 00:18:01,530 it, believing it, and moving on. 463 00:18:02,070 --> 00:18:04,260 Carol Cox: Yes. And and what a great point about the 464 00:18:04,260 --> 00:18:08,100 change in our media environment from 1998 to 465 00:18:08,130 --> 00:18:09,990 today. And you're right, like back then it 466 00:18:09,990 --> 00:18:12,240 was people watched the TV news for 30 467 00:18:12,240 --> 00:18:14,220 minutes, read the newspaper and got their 468 00:18:14,220 --> 00:18:16,680 information. And then and that was it. 469 00:18:16,680 --> 00:18:17,790 And, you know, obviously there's pros and 470 00:18:17,790 --> 00:18:20,400 cons to that compared to where we are today. 471 00:18:20,400 --> 00:18:22,470 But you think about the influencers on 472 00:18:22,470 --> 00:18:25,050 Instagram or TikTok, the ones who are really 473 00:18:25,050 --> 00:18:27,990 popular, you know, it's because, well, 474 00:18:27,990 --> 00:18:29,190 they're good at communicating. 475 00:18:29,220 --> 00:18:31,860 You know, they're good at headlines like 476 00:18:31,860 --> 00:18:34,410 clickbait type of stuff, absolutes, which we 477 00:18:34,410 --> 00:18:35,610 know with a lot of science. 478 00:18:35,610 --> 00:18:37,950 It's not about absolutes, but people like 479 00:18:37,980 --> 00:18:39,720 absolutes and certainties because it makes 480 00:18:39,720 --> 00:18:42,450 them feel better. So are there are there 481 00:18:42,450 --> 00:18:44,310 people you would recommend that we follow? 482 00:18:44,310 --> 00:18:45,990 And if you can't think of names off the top 483 00:18:45,990 --> 00:18:47,070 of your head, that's fine. We can put them 484 00:18:47,070 --> 00:18:48,690 in the show notes, some links, but maybe 485 00:18:48,690 --> 00:18:51,660 some good scientist or, you know, people in 486 00:18:51,660 --> 00:18:54,300 in similar fields who would be good types of 487 00:18:54,300 --> 00:18:56,910 people that we can follow instead of just 488 00:18:56,910 --> 00:18:58,530 finding the random influencer. 489 00:18:58,560 --> 00:19:00,180 Karen Corbin: So awesome question. 490 00:19:00,180 --> 00:19:02,010 I definitely need to think about that and 491 00:19:02,010 --> 00:19:03,180 I'll get back to you. 492 00:19:03,210 --> 00:19:05,760 Carol Cox: Okay, great. Because I know that they are out 493 00:19:05,760 --> 00:19:08,010 there. I don't think they are as plentiful 494 00:19:08,010 --> 00:19:11,130 as the regular influencers, but I do feel 495 00:19:11,130 --> 00:19:12,330 like there are some out there, probably some 496 00:19:12,330 --> 00:19:13,980 that I have come across. But I think there's 497 00:19:13,980 --> 00:19:15,990 also a little bit of a tension because think 498 00:19:15,990 --> 00:19:18,540 about you, Karen, like you have a full time 499 00:19:18,540 --> 00:19:20,820 job. You also have geeks that speak like 500 00:19:20,850 --> 00:19:22,050 you're busy. We're going to talk about some 501 00:19:22,050 --> 00:19:23,700 of the visibility that you've been doing. 502 00:19:23,700 --> 00:19:25,140 You're out there speaking. 503 00:19:25,140 --> 00:19:28,970 And do you have time to be an influencer on 504 00:19:28,970 --> 00:19:32,090 social media or the desire to do it? 505 00:19:32,090 --> 00:19:33,560 Probably not. And I feel like a lot of 506 00:19:33,560 --> 00:19:36,200 scientists are in similar shoes as you. 507 00:19:36,230 --> 00:19:39,410 Karen Corbin: Yeah. The time is is definitely hard to find. 508 00:19:39,440 --> 00:19:42,200 Science is pretty much 24 over seven, right? 509 00:19:42,230 --> 00:19:44,150 You're learning something new every day and 510 00:19:44,150 --> 00:19:47,120 failing every day and recharting your 511 00:19:47,120 --> 00:19:50,750 course. But I definitely have a desire to be 512 00:19:50,750 --> 00:19:54,620 a go to person and maybe connecting people 513 00:19:54,620 --> 00:19:56,540 like exactly what you just asked me. 514 00:19:56,570 --> 00:19:58,910 Who's the person you would want to talk to 515 00:19:58,940 --> 00:20:01,910 about this topic and and bringing those 516 00:20:01,910 --> 00:20:05,120 people forward in some sort of podcast or 517 00:20:05,120 --> 00:20:08,750 forum so that people had a place to go to 518 00:20:08,780 --> 00:20:10,820 get these answers. And also, I think it's 519 00:20:10,820 --> 00:20:12,860 important for people to understand some of 520 00:20:12,860 --> 00:20:14,120 our frustrations. 521 00:20:14,150 --> 00:20:15,830 You know, I can only imagine the 522 00:20:15,830 --> 00:20:20,270 immunologist during Covid and what they must 523 00:20:20,300 --> 00:20:21,650 have been going through. I mean, we saw a 524 00:20:21,680 --> 00:20:24,170 lot of it publicly, but there are dozens, 525 00:20:24,200 --> 00:20:26,090 thousands more that are just going, oh. 526 00:20:26,990 --> 00:20:28,220 This is crazy. 527 00:20:28,340 --> 00:20:31,340 Yeah. So if I could find a way to bring that 528 00:20:31,340 --> 00:20:34,580 all out into the public, it would allow me 529 00:20:34,580 --> 00:20:38,930 to to increase not just me as an influencer, 530 00:20:38,930 --> 00:20:42,920 but maybe science as an influencer via a 531 00:20:42,920 --> 00:20:45,020 whole bunch of people that could come and 532 00:20:45,020 --> 00:20:46,400 share their knowledge. 533 00:20:46,760 --> 00:20:49,070 Carol Cox: And I feel like the younger generation, the 534 00:20:49,070 --> 00:20:51,320 Gen Z generation, is probably going to be 535 00:20:51,320 --> 00:20:53,330 better at this naturally because they have 536 00:20:53,360 --> 00:20:55,790 grown up with this. So even they go into 537 00:20:55,790 --> 00:20:57,950 science or they go into medicine or a field 538 00:20:57,950 --> 00:20:59,960 like that, and I think they're going to be 539 00:20:59,990 --> 00:21:02,270 maybe more than will be more inclined to be 540 00:21:02,270 --> 00:21:05,330 more quote unquote, social online than they 541 00:21:05,360 --> 00:21:07,460 are. Generation X has been. 542 00:21:07,490 --> 00:21:07,760 Oh for. 543 00:21:07,760 --> 00:21:08,510 Karen Corbin: Sure, for. 544 00:21:08,510 --> 00:21:10,400 Carol Cox: Sure. Okay, so there's hope for the future. 545 00:21:10,430 --> 00:21:11,330 The children are our future. 546 00:21:11,360 --> 00:21:13,160 Karen Corbin: Yeah, that's why I love working. 547 00:21:13,160 --> 00:21:14,120 With young people. 548 00:21:14,150 --> 00:21:15,440 Carol Cox: Yes. All right. 549 00:21:15,440 --> 00:21:17,360 So let's talk about some of the visibility 550 00:21:17,360 --> 00:21:18,710 that you have been doing. 551 00:21:18,740 --> 00:21:21,980 You were featured in the Washington Post not 552 00:21:21,980 --> 00:21:23,690 too long ago for the work that you've been 553 00:21:23,690 --> 00:21:25,700 doing. So can you tell us about that. 554 00:21:25,700 --> 00:21:28,160 And then, you know, adjacent to this, the 555 00:21:28,160 --> 00:21:29,930 speaking and visibility media that you've 556 00:21:29,960 --> 00:21:31,880 been doing, how do you navigate your 557 00:21:31,880 --> 00:21:35,120 personal brand while having a full time job? 558 00:21:35,150 --> 00:21:36,770 You know, in the corporate world. 559 00:21:37,130 --> 00:21:40,790 Karen Corbin: So as far as the visibility is concerned, we 560 00:21:40,910 --> 00:21:43,070 first of all, science is a team sport. 561 00:21:43,070 --> 00:21:44,990 So we had a large team of people working on 562 00:21:44,990 --> 00:21:47,210 a project about the gut microbiome, which 563 00:21:47,240 --> 00:21:50,960 are the bacteria that live in in our GI 564 00:21:50,990 --> 00:21:53,090 system that have all kinds of impacts on 565 00:21:53,090 --> 00:21:56,170 health. And we worked on that project for 7 566 00:21:56,170 --> 00:21:58,940 or 8 years and finally published it. 567 00:21:58,940 --> 00:22:01,700 And the day that it came out online, I said, 568 00:22:01,700 --> 00:22:03,590 I'm going to do a tutorial. 569 00:22:03,590 --> 00:22:04,940 I don't know, what do we call them now? 570 00:22:04,940 --> 00:22:06,980 Editorial, I don't know, I still am going to 571 00:22:06,980 --> 00:22:08,060 say tutorial. 572 00:22:08,060 --> 00:22:10,100 And and I just broke it down. 573 00:22:10,100 --> 00:22:14,030 I put some of the main points with the 574 00:22:14,030 --> 00:22:16,190 figures and the data so people could see it, 575 00:22:16,190 --> 00:22:18,650 and I just explained it in a way that I 576 00:22:18,650 --> 00:22:21,650 thought would gain some interest. 577 00:22:21,650 --> 00:22:24,400 And I can tell you I've tweeted about papers 578 00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:27,580 lots of times and gotten zero attention, but 579 00:22:27,580 --> 00:22:31,180 this one hit a nerve because in a good way. 580 00:22:31,210 --> 00:22:33,910 Not a bad way. Because it's a timely topic. 581 00:22:33,910 --> 00:22:36,580 And I think that's such an important concept 582 00:22:36,580 --> 00:22:39,160 of getting attention from the media. 583 00:22:39,160 --> 00:22:41,290 It has to be something that's important 584 00:22:41,320 --> 00:22:44,800 today. Right now, even if the work you do is 585 00:22:44,800 --> 00:22:47,650 extremely valuable, if it's not something 586 00:22:47,650 --> 00:22:50,740 that is just at the forefront of public 587 00:22:50,740 --> 00:22:52,510 interest, it might not get the coverage. 588 00:22:52,510 --> 00:22:55,570 So I put this tweet together and literally 589 00:22:55,570 --> 00:22:58,000 two days later, a reporter from The 590 00:22:58,030 --> 00:23:01,300 Washington Post DM'd me on Twitter and 591 00:23:01,300 --> 00:23:03,250 wanted to to talk about the work. 592 00:23:03,250 --> 00:23:07,000 So that just started steamrolling a whole 593 00:23:07,000 --> 00:23:09,910 bunch of other opportunities to speak on the 594 00:23:09,910 --> 00:23:13,060 radio and on podcasts about this work and 595 00:23:13,060 --> 00:23:17,380 what I think was sort of a culmination of me 596 00:23:17,380 --> 00:23:19,510 as a healthcare professional, me as a 597 00:23:19,510 --> 00:23:22,600 scientist, and me wanting to do work that 598 00:23:22,600 --> 00:23:24,880 people could take directly to their life and 599 00:23:24,880 --> 00:23:27,130 to their homes. Is that the work that we did 600 00:23:27,160 --> 00:23:29,620 could literally go from the lab bench to 601 00:23:29,650 --> 00:23:31,270 somebody's dinner table. 602 00:23:31,300 --> 00:23:36,460 And so having that relevance in my message 603 00:23:36,460 --> 00:23:39,730 really helped it to gain a ton of attention. 604 00:23:39,760 --> 00:23:42,880 The work was labeled one of the top 25 605 00:23:42,880 --> 00:23:46,420 clinical pieces of work in the journal that 606 00:23:46,420 --> 00:23:49,000 we published in for that year, and we're 607 00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:52,900 also in the top 1% of attention from media 608 00:23:52,990 --> 00:23:55,720 and of all publications that have ever been 609 00:23:55,720 --> 00:23:58,900 tracked and in the top 2% of publications as 610 00:23:58,900 --> 00:24:00,880 far as media attention in this high ranking 611 00:24:00,880 --> 00:24:03,100 journal. I couldn't have predicted any of 612 00:24:03,100 --> 00:24:04,600 it. It just became a whirlwind. 613 00:24:04,600 --> 00:24:06,520 And I thought to myself, wow, everything 614 00:24:06,520 --> 00:24:08,710 I've done combining the science and the 615 00:24:08,710 --> 00:24:11,560 communication, every skill, every coach I 616 00:24:11,560 --> 00:24:13,960 worked with, including you and Diane, 617 00:24:13,990 --> 00:24:16,600 everything I've done has prepared me for 618 00:24:16,600 --> 00:24:19,780 this moment, and that just comes to show how 619 00:24:19,780 --> 00:24:22,530 important it is to hone the skill, to 620 00:24:22,560 --> 00:24:24,420 continue to work on it, because you don't 621 00:24:24,450 --> 00:24:26,220 know when that opportunity is going to be 622 00:24:26,220 --> 00:24:28,380 there and you want to be ready. 623 00:24:28,410 --> 00:24:32,370 And I was ready and also had the support of 624 00:24:32,370 --> 00:24:34,890 people higher up in my organization who 625 00:24:34,890 --> 00:24:37,410 allowed me to be the front person for a lot 626 00:24:37,410 --> 00:24:39,270 of this media attention, which I appreciate 627 00:24:39,270 --> 00:24:41,970 very much because I love every minute of it. 628 00:24:43,260 --> 00:24:44,790 Carol Cox: And I'm so glad to hear that. So they're very 629 00:24:44,790 --> 00:24:46,410 supportive of the visibility that you've 630 00:24:46,410 --> 00:24:48,180 been giving, getting so far. 631 00:24:48,180 --> 00:24:50,580 So it sounds like you have your personal 632 00:24:50,580 --> 00:24:53,130 brand, you have your LinkedIn profile, you 633 00:24:53,130 --> 00:24:54,990 have you, Karen, you have geeks that speak, 634 00:24:54,990 --> 00:24:56,190 but obviously you're very much a 635 00:24:56,190 --> 00:24:58,860 representative for the organization you work 636 00:24:58,860 --> 00:25:01,350 with. Adventhealth. So how how does that 637 00:25:01,350 --> 00:25:02,370 feel for you? 638 00:25:02,400 --> 00:25:03,690 Karen Corbin: It's fantastic. 639 00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:07,560 I mean, I'm so fortunate that the whole name 640 00:25:07,560 --> 00:25:09,780 geeks that speak was born here at 641 00:25:09,780 --> 00:25:12,120 AdventHealth through a conversation with a 642 00:25:12,120 --> 00:25:16,110 friend and colleague of mine, and that my 643 00:25:16,110 --> 00:25:19,860 company recognizes the value of strong 644 00:25:19,860 --> 00:25:22,170 scientific communication, particularly in 645 00:25:22,170 --> 00:25:23,700 the health field. And they've been so 646 00:25:23,700 --> 00:25:27,510 supportive and, you know, allowing me to to 647 00:25:27,540 --> 00:25:30,180 drive both cars and, and do both of it 648 00:25:30,180 --> 00:25:32,880 because it is it is such an important skill. 649 00:25:32,880 --> 00:25:35,370 And I also have the opportunity to train 650 00:25:35,370 --> 00:25:38,940 people here. So the company has seen benefit 651 00:25:38,940 --> 00:25:41,820 from our scientists upping their 652 00:25:41,820 --> 00:25:43,860 communication game because I'm here. 653 00:25:43,860 --> 00:25:45,270 So I might as well help them. 654 00:25:46,050 --> 00:25:48,360 Carol Cox: All right. Let's talk about Geekspeak. 655 00:25:48,360 --> 00:25:49,440 So some more. 656 00:25:49,440 --> 00:25:51,720 So tell us primarily, you know, when do 657 00:25:51,750 --> 00:25:52,980 people come to you. 658 00:25:53,010 --> 00:25:54,330 What exactly do you do with them? 659 00:25:54,330 --> 00:25:55,620 And then I also want to talk about the work 660 00:25:55,620 --> 00:25:57,030 that you're doing with young girls, because 661 00:25:57,030 --> 00:25:58,710 I love seeing the photos of them that you 662 00:25:58,710 --> 00:25:59,820 share on LinkedIn. 663 00:25:59,850 --> 00:26:01,080 Karen Corbin: Thank you. 664 00:26:01,080 --> 00:26:05,400 So people come to me by word of mouth. 665 00:26:05,460 --> 00:26:07,290 The people who work here with me at 666 00:26:07,290 --> 00:26:09,180 AdventHealth, they're going to they know me. 667 00:26:09,180 --> 00:26:11,580 So they just say, hey, I just got invited to 668 00:26:11,610 --> 00:26:14,250 give a talk at a big national meeting, and 669 00:26:14,250 --> 00:26:15,900 I'm terrified. Will you help me? 670 00:26:15,900 --> 00:26:18,860 So, people who come to me one on one, I'll 671 00:26:18,860 --> 00:26:20,690 do one on one coaching for them. 672 00:26:20,690 --> 00:26:23,480 We'll figure out what's their main story. 673 00:26:23,510 --> 00:26:26,330 How do they really elevate this from a data 674 00:26:26,360 --> 00:26:28,340 dump to something that's engaging? 675 00:26:28,370 --> 00:26:30,560 We'll work on, you know, how to create the 676 00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:31,880 best slides. 677 00:26:31,880 --> 00:26:34,190 But a lot of times people come to me, either 678 00:26:34,190 --> 00:26:37,250 from universities or different biotech 679 00:26:37,250 --> 00:26:39,590 companies that have a workforce that needs 680 00:26:39,590 --> 00:26:42,230 the help. And then I'll do a group workshop 681 00:26:42,230 --> 00:26:46,250 where I walk them through basically the ABCs 682 00:26:46,250 --> 00:26:51,560 of how do you go from boring and uninspiring 683 00:26:51,590 --> 00:26:54,290 to engaging, even a little entertaining, 684 00:26:54,290 --> 00:26:56,930 because why can't we laugh at scientific 685 00:26:56,930 --> 00:26:58,850 meetings? There's nothing wrong with that. 686 00:26:58,850 --> 00:27:00,650 But also, you know, I think it's so 687 00:27:00,650 --> 00:27:02,420 important and you've taught this to me, and 688 00:27:02,420 --> 00:27:04,460 I know you teach it to the people you work 689 00:27:04,460 --> 00:27:06,770 with. There needs to be an action on the 690 00:27:06,770 --> 00:27:09,260 other side. So what do you want people to do 691 00:27:09,290 --> 00:27:10,970 after they heard you speak? 692 00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:13,070 Do you want them to collaborate with you? 693 00:27:13,100 --> 00:27:15,230 Do you want them just to think about the 694 00:27:15,230 --> 00:27:17,750 topic a little bit differently because we've 695 00:27:17,750 --> 00:27:20,480 been driving the train this way, but the 696 00:27:20,480 --> 00:27:22,580 data are suggesting that there's a different 697 00:27:22,580 --> 00:27:24,290 way to think about it. So you want to give 698 00:27:24,290 --> 00:27:26,960 them those nuggets throughout so they know 699 00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:28,730 what they should be walking away with. 700 00:27:28,730 --> 00:27:31,910 And hopefully it'll lead to advancing of the 701 00:27:31,910 --> 00:27:32,660 field. 702 00:27:33,170 --> 00:27:35,240 Carol Cox: Mhm. Okay. So tell us about the young girls. 703 00:27:35,810 --> 00:27:39,410 Karen Corbin: So as I mentioned I'm from Puerto Rico and I 704 00:27:39,410 --> 00:27:41,870 didn't know any scientists when I was young. 705 00:27:41,900 --> 00:27:44,480 I dreamed about being a scientist since I 706 00:27:44,480 --> 00:27:47,330 was a kid. And and I don't know how or why. 707 00:27:47,360 --> 00:27:50,270 The only direct connection I can make is a 708 00:27:50,270 --> 00:27:51,620 visual of a scientist. 709 00:27:51,620 --> 00:27:54,200 Was some of the episodes of Wonder Woman 710 00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:57,050 from the original Lynda Carter series, where 711 00:27:57,080 --> 00:27:58,820 sometimes she was wearing a lab coat? 712 00:27:58,910 --> 00:28:01,190 Carol Cox: Yes, I loved that show. 713 00:28:01,220 --> 00:28:02,510 Karen Corbin: I know she did math. 714 00:28:02,510 --> 00:28:03,680 She did some science. 715 00:28:03,710 --> 00:28:05,930 I mean, she was amazing, right? 716 00:28:05,960 --> 00:28:07,040 She is amazing. 717 00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:11,090 So, um, I realized how important it is to 718 00:28:11,120 --> 00:28:13,430 have somebody rooting for you. 719 00:28:13,490 --> 00:28:15,560 Somebody that shows you the way. 720 00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:18,350 And a lot of times, especially for girls, 721 00:28:18,350 --> 00:28:20,990 there's still, sadly, this misconception 722 00:28:20,990 --> 00:28:23,150 that science isn't for girls. 723 00:28:23,150 --> 00:28:25,220 And that's just not true. 724 00:28:25,220 --> 00:28:27,980 So if you catch them early enough so that 725 00:28:27,980 --> 00:28:30,320 they don't let those narratives beat them 726 00:28:30,320 --> 00:28:34,970 down and change their trajectory to one that 727 00:28:34,970 --> 00:28:36,560 says, this isn't for me. 728 00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:38,090 I think it's so important. 729 00:28:38,090 --> 00:28:41,690 So whether it's I go to schools and talk to 730 00:28:41,720 --> 00:28:44,300 kids or they come here or I do some one on 731 00:28:44,330 --> 00:28:47,690 one mentoring, or I just grab some kids from 732 00:28:47,690 --> 00:28:50,270 a school that a friend owns, and I put them 733 00:28:50,270 --> 00:28:53,330 in lab coats, and we I meet them and I give 734 00:28:53,330 --> 00:28:54,800 them little microscopes. 735 00:28:54,830 --> 00:28:57,200 You just don't know what that little nudge 736 00:28:57,200 --> 00:28:59,900 can really do to spark that curiosity. 737 00:28:59,900 --> 00:29:02,150 But clearly I'm only one person, so I'm 738 00:29:02,150 --> 00:29:05,090 hoping to also get the message out there to 739 00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:06,710 other scientists. 740 00:29:06,710 --> 00:29:08,270 Hey, you have a community too. 741 00:29:08,300 --> 00:29:11,240 You don't have to travel the world to impact 742 00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:13,630 a child's life a couple times a year. 743 00:29:13,630 --> 00:29:15,970 You could engage with lots of different 744 00:29:15,970 --> 00:29:18,910 groups of kids in your community to help 745 00:29:18,910 --> 00:29:23,260 them, uh, advance that curiosity, not lose 746 00:29:23,260 --> 00:29:26,470 that dream that can often be lost with that 747 00:29:26,500 --> 00:29:29,530 kind of negative talk about who can and 748 00:29:29,530 --> 00:29:31,090 should be a scientist. 749 00:29:31,330 --> 00:29:33,970 Carol Cox: Yes. And also just for them, having not only 750 00:29:33,970 --> 00:29:35,650 women to look up to you, but also that 751 00:29:35,650 --> 00:29:38,860 support community because, you know, as with 752 00:29:38,860 --> 00:29:42,070 it being a male dominated degree and 753 00:29:42,070 --> 00:29:44,200 industry, you know, there's lots of great 754 00:29:44,200 --> 00:29:46,330 men out there who are allies to women. 755 00:29:46,330 --> 00:29:48,310 I know I've had that throughout my schooling 756 00:29:48,340 --> 00:29:50,470 and my career, but we also know that just 757 00:29:50,470 --> 00:29:53,110 numbers wise, it can feel very isolating and 758 00:29:53,110 --> 00:29:55,600 very lonely to be the only woman or the only 759 00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:58,900 1 or 2 who are studying in something or in a 760 00:29:58,900 --> 00:30:00,100 in a job. 761 00:30:00,130 --> 00:30:01,450 Karen Corbin: Yeah, absolutely. 762 00:30:01,450 --> 00:30:04,150 And and women lead differently. 763 00:30:04,150 --> 00:30:07,090 We've learned this from being graduates of 764 00:30:07,090 --> 00:30:08,710 the Athena NextGen program. 765 00:30:08,710 --> 00:30:10,840 And some of those ways of leading are 766 00:30:10,840 --> 00:30:14,020 sometimes not the expected way in a typical 767 00:30:14,020 --> 00:30:15,250 academic tower. 768 00:30:15,250 --> 00:30:18,370 So we have to break those barriers too, and 769 00:30:18,370 --> 00:30:21,430 show them that there are different ways to 770 00:30:21,460 --> 00:30:22,990 achieve a common goal. 771 00:30:22,990 --> 00:30:26,380 So yeah, I mean, it's just so critical to 772 00:30:26,410 --> 00:30:29,320 make sure that for the kids that aren't as 773 00:30:29,320 --> 00:30:31,480 fortunate as I was, that had parents that 774 00:30:31,480 --> 00:30:34,300 said, you can do anything that you dream of, 775 00:30:34,330 --> 00:30:38,410 they they never put barriers or I never 776 00:30:38,410 --> 00:30:41,650 really knew that girls weren't supposed to 777 00:30:41,650 --> 00:30:44,350 be scientists. I never really knew that 778 00:30:44,350 --> 00:30:46,840 there was anything I couldn't do because my 779 00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:48,160 parents did that for me. 780 00:30:48,160 --> 00:30:50,650 I had teachers that were very supportive as 781 00:30:50,650 --> 00:30:53,260 well, but not everybody has that 782 00:30:53,260 --> 00:30:56,560 opportunity. So if you can be that for just 783 00:30:56,560 --> 00:30:59,680 even one person, that could be the person 784 00:30:59,680 --> 00:31:02,380 that cures cancer, that could be the person 785 00:31:02,380 --> 00:31:04,510 that solves global warming and climate 786 00:31:04,510 --> 00:31:08,050 change. So know that a small amount of 787 00:31:08,050 --> 00:31:10,980 effort. Could. Really change the world and 788 00:31:10,980 --> 00:31:12,030 you may not see it. 789 00:31:12,030 --> 00:31:14,070 You may not know about it, but I promise 790 00:31:14,100 --> 00:31:17,460 it's worth your time and investing in young 791 00:31:17,460 --> 00:31:21,000 kids and encouraging them to to help us 792 00:31:21,000 --> 00:31:22,290 through science. 793 00:31:22,770 --> 00:31:24,420 Carol Cox: Well, Karen, I think that brings us full 794 00:31:24,420 --> 00:31:26,760 circle to the beginning of our conversation, 795 00:31:26,760 --> 00:31:29,610 which is this is why scientists, when all of 796 00:31:29,610 --> 00:31:31,260 us, no matter what our industry, is, but 797 00:31:31,260 --> 00:31:33,840 scientists, need to share their stories, 798 00:31:33,840 --> 00:31:36,450 their career journeys, and maybe they can 799 00:31:36,450 --> 00:31:37,860 start in schools. 800 00:31:37,860 --> 00:31:39,600 Maybe that would feel less pressure, like 801 00:31:39,600 --> 00:31:40,980 lower stakes for them. 802 00:31:41,010 --> 00:31:43,500 Karen Corbin: Yeah, that's true. Although I'm a little 803 00:31:43,500 --> 00:31:45,120 scared by teenagers. 804 00:31:45,420 --> 00:31:48,420 Carol Cox: Okay. Maybe like like elementary school, I 805 00:31:48,420 --> 00:31:50,820 think they still feel pretty, like, excited, 806 00:31:50,850 --> 00:31:51,090 right? 807 00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:52,140 Karen Corbin: Yeah. For sure. 808 00:31:52,470 --> 00:31:54,720 And, you know, that's what I was thinking to 809 00:31:54,750 --> 00:31:59,640 your stage. Doesn't have to be television or 810 00:31:59,670 --> 00:32:01,590 a big national meeting. 811 00:32:01,590 --> 00:32:03,930 It can be in a conference room. 812 00:32:03,930 --> 00:32:06,630 It can be a couple people sitting around a 813 00:32:06,630 --> 00:32:09,570 the table, but knowing that your story 814 00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:13,230 matters, the good things and the challenges 815 00:32:13,230 --> 00:32:16,620 you've had in your life could be exactly 816 00:32:16,620 --> 00:32:18,660 what somebody needs to hear. 817 00:32:18,660 --> 00:32:21,480 And if you don't speak, nobody's going to 818 00:32:21,510 --> 00:32:24,390 hear it. So it's just important for all of 819 00:32:24,390 --> 00:32:29,850 us to not just rely on some text message or 820 00:32:29,850 --> 00:32:33,090 some quick little response on social media. 821 00:32:33,090 --> 00:32:35,790 But those personal connections, I think, are 822 00:32:35,790 --> 00:32:39,540 so valuable, and I think all of us could 823 00:32:39,540 --> 00:32:42,300 make a difference in someone's life, even if 824 00:32:42,300 --> 00:32:43,620 we never realize it. 825 00:32:44,100 --> 00:32:46,530 Carol Cox: Yes. Because as I like to say, you are the 826 00:32:46,530 --> 00:32:48,990 messenger your audience is waiting for. 827 00:32:49,020 --> 00:32:50,700 Karen Corbin: That's right. Exactly. 828 00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:53,160 Carol Cox: Well, Karen, thank you so much for this 829 00:32:53,160 --> 00:32:54,630 inspiring conversation. 830 00:32:54,630 --> 00:32:56,040 For those of you listening, make sure to 831 00:32:56,070 --> 00:32:57,540 connect with Karen on LinkedIn. 832 00:32:57,540 --> 00:32:59,430 I've included the link to her profile in the 833 00:32:59,430 --> 00:33:02,670 show notes. Also, check out Geekspeak comm 834 00:33:02,670 --> 00:33:05,100 if you want to learn more about Karen and 835 00:33:05,300 --> 00:33:07,700 Geekspeak. And it's been such a pleasure. 836 00:33:07,730 --> 00:33:09,890 Karen, we have known each other for. 837 00:33:09,920 --> 00:33:12,380 I don't know if it was like 2017 or 2018 838 00:33:12,380 --> 00:33:14,450 when we did a VIP day together initially. 839 00:33:14,450 --> 00:33:16,430 And like I said on the podcast part of our 840 00:33:16,430 --> 00:33:18,650 summit at the workshop we did a couple of 841 00:33:18,650 --> 00:33:20,420 weeks ago and we see each other around town, 842 00:33:20,420 --> 00:33:21,320 which is always fun. 843 00:33:21,320 --> 00:33:23,270 Karen Corbin: It's awesome. I love that we both live in 844 00:33:23,270 --> 00:33:25,040 Orlando and can connect in a lot of 845 00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:26,120 different ways. 846 00:33:26,150 --> 00:33:27,440 Carol Cox: Great. Well, thank you again. 847 00:33:27,470 --> 00:33:29,330 Karen Corbin: You're welcome. Thanks for having me. 848 00:33:29,360 --> 00:33:31,520 Carol Cox: If you want to learn how to become a better 849 00:33:31,520 --> 00:33:33,770 storyteller, discover your speaker 850 00:33:33,770 --> 00:33:35,690 archetype, because then you'll get 851 00:33:35,690 --> 00:33:38,360 recommendations for how to lean into your 852 00:33:38,360 --> 00:33:41,360 natural communication style and what to do 853 00:33:41,360 --> 00:33:42,410 to amplify it. 854 00:33:42,440 --> 00:33:45,380 You can take our free ten question multiple 855 00:33:45,380 --> 00:33:49,250 choice quiz at Speaking Your brand.com/quiz. 856 00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:52,220 Again, that's speaking your brand.com/quiz. 857 00:33:52,220 --> 00:33:53,540 It just takes a few minutes. 858 00:33:53,540 --> 00:33:55,130 It's completely free and you'll get your 859 00:33:55,130 --> 00:33:56,600 results right away. 860 00:33:56,630 --> 00:33:57,860 Until next time. 861 00:33:57,860 --> 00:33:59,030 Thanks for listening.