Welcome to Orthodox Christian Parenting, where we bring the church's timeless wisdom into the everyday chaos of raising kids. I'm Michelle Mujaias, and today we're talking about something that every parent feels, but really few of us ever slow down enough to examine, and that's contentment. We live in a culture that constantly tells us and our children that what we have is not enough. Not enough money, not enough experiences, not enough success, but the gospel tells us a very different story. So how do we raise kids who are genuinely happy with what they have?

How do we help them resist comparison without having to totally disconnect from the world completely? And what does our faith actually teach about contentment for us and for our children? That's what we're talking about in today's conversation with the one, the only Rachel Cruze. Welcome, everyone. I am so excited about today's conversation.

But before we jump in, just a reminder to download the free digital discussion guide linked in the show notes. It's designed to help you go deeper with your spouse or a friend or some other parents in your local parish community. You can find the link in the show notes or at faithtree.org/parenting. I am so thrilled to jump into today's conversation because my guest lives at the intersection of faith, family, and finances. Rachel Cruze is a best selling author, a speaker, and a mom who has helped millions of people think differently about money, about success, and about the crazy pressure we all have to keep up.

But this conversation goes deeper than budgets and bank accounts. Rachel has a gift for connecting financial wisdom to the spiritual life. Because let's face it, contentment isn't ultimately a money issue. It's a heart issue. She is the one, the only Rachel Cruze.

Welcome, Rachel, and thank you for being with us today.

Oh, thank you for having me. It's a pleasure to be here.

Alright. So let's just jump in. I wanna get us all on the same page. So when we say contentment, can you tell me what that word means to you? Like, what is contentment?

Yeah, it's a great question because I do feel like there's so many definitions the way people talk about it, and I've written about it for so many years, and honestly, for me personally, there is a level at peace at which your heart just rests and where you're at presently. And to me, that's contentment, that it brings a level of peace in your life that you are able to be so present with where you are in the moment and in the situation you're in. Now, just because you're content doesn't mean that you still don't have goals or you're not still striving for something. Like, you can have those things and still be content. It is ultimately for me, and again, everyone has their own definition, it is this place where your soul just rests in peace, that you are at peace.

And in one Timothy, it says that godliness with contentment is great gain, and so that godliness peace with contentment together is like a superpower, I feel like, in today's world.

Absolutely true. So paint a picture for me. If our, audience full of Orthodox parents and grandparents were to watch this and do everything that you and I talk about today, what would it look like that might be different than it is right now so that they have that contentment or peace that you just spoke about? Like, what would it even look like?

Yeah. I think there's a level of satisfaction, and I think it's just this place of rest that there's like not there's a restlessness that can live in us so often to feel like we We have to keep

have

to keep doing what everyone's doing, whether it's a standard of living or a job, or even honestly, know, our kids in the way that they're quote unquote behaving or whatever life is throwing at you in this moment, there's something to be said of, hey, I'm gonna see the joy and find the gratitude in this moment. And so for me, it's just that presence of mind that you're actually intentionally thinking about those things. And that is hard because I know at least for me, I may have three kids. I'm working. I'm a wife.

Like, you have all these roles that you play. I'm, you know, getting texts from the PTO in the last meeting I was in just before I came here, you know, of like a You're brownie, mom. There's so much. Like, there's just so much going on. And so I think, you know, there's when contentment plays such a big part in your life, you're so aware, so self aware, and there's a slowing down that has to occur in your soul in order to get there.

And we don't live there often. I don't live there often. Know? Even my natural bent personality is a go, go, go, next thing, task, lists, all of it. And there's just something about when you, I don't know, meet people sometimes, you know, and I'm just talking to them.

Oh my gosh, they just have a slowness, a they're not urgent, and they're just so presently aware. But again, I think that takes a mindfulness and a deep intentionality that doesn't come, I'll say for me, naturally. So people that work at that and build that over time, and I think different seasons of life may give you the margin to be able to go there even more. But yeah, you meet people that live that live that verse out truly, godliness with contentment is great grain, over decades of their life, and you meet them, and you're just like, I wanna be you when I'm old.

You don't

need to see that in them.

That's right. So what I'm hearing you say is that's a learnable skill. It may not be something that we're naturally inclined to, but we can teach it to our children. We can kind of grow in that area ourselves.

Yeah. I think there's definitely that nurture component over nature. I mean, I do think there's something about all of us that we can we can be, yeah, dissatisfied, right, and and in that restlessness. But I think it is a learned, and it's a practiced approach. Even, you know, that's one thing I love about even the Orthodox church, I'm like the consistency of even the prayers.

Like whatever it looks like, there's something about that repetition that holds so true that's beautiful, and we're not great at that in the world today.

That's right.

And so there's something about that. It's the repeating pattern of that presence presentness of mind, if that's even a thing.

It is a thing. That's right. Okay. So let me ask you this. I think, for our audience who is really interested in how we practically apply the Orthodox Christian faith.

What does that look like? And and just tell us in case anyone in our audience doesn't know who you are, kinda what your background is, what did that look like in your home growing up? So give us a little bit of Rachel Cruze history.

Yes. So I grew up as Dave Ramsey's daughter, so Dave is my dad. And, you know, it's funny because I will talk to people, and they hear that, and they assume that we were obsessed with money, that, like, all we talked about was money and that, you know, budgets, and we had mutual funds, birthday parties, and like, you know, people think all this stuff about us. But the truth is mom and dad really lived out this beautiful principle that more is caught than taught. And so we did have discussions around money, but it honestly was in the ebb and flow of life.

It was never I do not remember ever sitting down in the living room in this, like, formal setting and getting a three hour crash course on taxes and investments. Like, that's not how I learned those things. It was through things happening in life, and that's like, hey, just check this out, look at this. Or we'd be at the grocery store, and mom's like, hey, just notice this cereal is cheaper than this because it doesn't have the bee. The Bumblebee is different on this box of Cheerios versus this, and it's just cheaper.

It's called store brand versus, you know, name brand. Like it was in those moments that you take, and watching my parents too say no to themselves, to big purchases, watching them have the patience to save up and pay for things, and the slowness at which they have won with money, their actions followed that. They never hurried themselves beyond what they could make. And so there's something about that principle of living something out. People see your actions, and it is so true.

Like so many of my money memories is just, again, in the mundane parts of life, but mom and dad were aware of them enough to speak into that, which is beautiful. And that was more the tactical side, you know, and we had chores. You know, I always laugh. I'm like, I've been on commission since I was like five years old because you work, you get paid. You don't work, you don't get paid.

That's where money comes from. And you give first, you save second, and you spend third. And we had three envelopes as kids, and we had to put our money every week in these envelopes. So the tactical side was very real. But then there's the emotional side of money.

Mean, you opened up with contentment, right? There's an emotional side that is picked up on in the household. That, I think, generosity, gratitude. Like, there's this philosophical way of looking at money and not making it an idol. You know, even in scripture, like, more scriptures about money than heaven and hell combined.

Like, there's so much said. So many of the parables that Jesus talked about were money focused. Like, there's so much about money. And so there's something beautiful in that because there's some warnings about it that are very fair, but then also some very practical applications. You read through Proverbs, and it's like, oh my gosh, you could get a master's degree in finance.

Don't

That's just read through right. Like, it's amazing. And so there is that more spiritual philosophical side of money that is as important as the tactical, but both have to meet in the middle.

I love that. You said the word gratitude, which, you know, the Orthodox Church fathers talk about all the time outside of even holy scripture. Gratitude implies you're grateful to someone. And I think that is one of the lessons that at least for our kids so we have four. And one of the things we constantly and not everybody who knows me knows I'm a big Dave Ramsey girl.

We we found Financial Peace University right when we first got married, and it was game changer for us. But one of the things I know as we really talked about money with our kids and we really spoke into, you know, the place money served in our lives and where it really didn't demand the focus of our lives, gratitude was something we always came back to. And I think we have an obligation as parents to really tie together the idea of who are you grateful to. Right? Who gave you all these resources?

Because if you understand whose resources they are and who you've been entrusted to steward them, then you could go forward and steward them with a a whole different level of freedom. I think I think that's really important. So then let me ask you on that. When you learned about that and when your parents were walking you through how to be grateful, how to spend, save, do you think that that impacted you differently than just financially? Like, personally, what did that do for you and who you are today?

Yeah. I would say so much because, you know, that level of gratitude, it's interesting. Someone said this once, and I thought, I've never thought about it like that. But it kinda keeps you in a place of humility because like you said, you were provided for, and it could have been a person giving you something. Someone pays for your dinner, right, and to say thank you and be grateful for that.

You didn't provide that. Someone stepped in and did that for you. And I think we get this applause in our Western culture, I would say American culture so often to be so independent and that it's up to us, and we have to pull ourselves up by the bootstraps, and we gotta make the thing work. And part of that is beautiful, right? I mean, I think there's something about the grit and the, like, you push through hard things.

Absolutely.

For sure.

But it also implies that you can't do things alone, and that's not how we were created. And so there takes this level of humility to say, I can't do everything. And when someone does for me, it puts me at a place, you know, where I didn't provide that. That wasn't me that did that. And it's kind of beautiful.

So it's either God providing, right, the situation, the opportunity, whatever the blessing is, or even someone in your community is doing something for you. And so there's something about that that I love that heart and that posture, because I really do think gratitude leads to humility. Rick Warren said, Humility is not thinking less of yourself, but it's thinking of yourself less. And so it does put you at this place of like, Hey, it's not all about me. Like, I'm able to like sit there and rest.

And there's something in that that is And that translates then, what you were saying, to every other aspect of life, right? I mean, if you're in a marriage, you know, I think a healthy spouse is one that, you know, man or woman, you're serving each other, and you love each other. Like, there's a level of that that puts you in a state of humility and gratitude for each other, you know, for your parents, you know, in your household or your children or at work, right? When you have a level of gratitude and appreciation for the team around you, and especially if you're a leader, people gravitate towards that type of attitude versus one of the opposite that's more entitled. And so, yeah, so I think it all plays together.

And what's kind of interesting about money is it is so practical and tactical right there that you can learn a lot of life lessons through That's right. Through this this tool. Right? And, yeah, there's something beautiful beautiful about that.

I wanna know then let's let's help our audience get really practical and tactical, to use your words. What would it look like I mean, we live in a culture with Instagram ready everything. Everything looks perfect. Everybody's always ready to upgrade. More is better.

Like, we are convinced in so many ways that we need more of everything. So what can parents do who are really trying to shift that focus off of more or better or upgraded, the newest, to help their kids find that peace and that contentment and that rest, that exhale? When you say that, that makes me just I just wanna take it in for a second. That rest, How can we help our kids find that in a culture that looks very different than that?

Yes. You know, I think for me and my kids are ten, eight, and and wait. Ten, eight, and six. I was gonna say four. I like, he's not 46.

Yeah. 10, eight, and four. So parents that are listening that have teenagers, you know, I have not walked your road, and so the whole social media battling that, I can speak for my own personal, you know, what I've had to do of, you know, putting up boundaries. And I think as adults too, we're able to somewhat, if we're aware, have at least the logical sense that we know what is putting out is the highlight reel of everybody's life. Like at this point in life, we know that.

And so I think there's a level of learning and telling yourself and reminding yourself like, hey, there's that. And then for me too, you know, if any level of comparison or jealousy or whatever floats into my mind on social media, I have started to practice of just celebrating that person because I was in a bad, you know, cycle of, like, I would, being what I do every day and teaching about no debt and all of it, I'd see someone in Europe, and I'm like, they probably put everything on a credit card. Like, I would just like, I would like put them down in my mind to make myself feel better. And so I've had to say to myself, you know what? Good for her.

Like genuinely, whether she put it on a credit card or not, it's none of my business.

That's right.

I don't know the girl. So like, you do you, I'm doing me over here, and there is like a shutoff that kinda has to happen emotionally with social media. I don't think teenagers probably even have the, you know, I don't even think their brain is fully formed right until you're No. 20 So I'm not even sure if they even have the ability to do all that yet. It's developed all the way.

But I'll say for my eight year old, you know, all kids, including my siblings, have such money, you know, different personalities when it comes to money. And my middle, which I was the middle in my family, is me. Like, as she plays things out in life, I just see it. I'm like, I get you so much because you are literally me. I get it.

She's the spender of our family, and as was I and as I still am. And she does, she wants new stuff. And I remember, this was just like two months ago, at the dent at our dentist office, they get like a little coin that they get a little contraption thing, and they get a little fidget toy or something. And I remember her saying, mom, I just cannot wait to go I cannot wait to go to the dentist because I just can't wait for that toy. I just can't wait to get that new little toy.

And I told her, I like, Caroline, I was like, okay. That's fine. Like, you can be excited about that. And I'm not gonna, like, shame you and be like, that's wrong. But also, what did you get six months ago from the dentist?

What what toy did you get? And she was like, oh, I don't I don't know. I think a bouncy ball. And I was like, okay, where is that? She's like, I have no idea.

And I was like, okay, Caroline, if the newness of stuff is what creates joy in your life, you're gonna be like a little hamster on a wheel that just runs and runs and runs, and you're gonna get nowhere. And I can say that too because that's me. I'm like, that's me. My Amazon earrings or whatever, you know, that I my my drug of choice in that way as an adult. And so it is that reminder of ourselves of that part of our brain that is God given, God created.

There is a dopamine hit. Something triggers in us that exciting and new is fun. But if you live in that part that is never gonna be satisfied, genuinely, the brain chemistry is never satisfied long enough. That's why we keep going to the next thing and the next thing and the next thing. And so shifting our what we're looking at, what we're desiring and wanting to something that is good for us.

So whether that's calling a friend, going on a walk, reading a book, right? It's almost like creating a new habit in its place. And so for her, I just see it so much in her because again, it's me. So when those moments come up of like, mom, can I just look on X, Y, and Z? I'm like, hey, no, let's just, let's go play a game.

Let's go do something else. So you kinda almost have to, if you're in a bad you do, you do. Yeah. And in our world, we don't have to redirect because we have our phones and we have everything right in front of us. We're able to get those quick hits, you know, the dopamine hit, and we live in that forever and ever until finally we have a wake up moment of like, I can't just keep living like this, or financially, I'm so deeply in debt of continuing to buy and upgrade that we don't have the money, and now I'm stressed out.

You know, people hit a wall eventually, whether it is financial, spiritual, or emotional. And so if you hit the wall, listen to that. But yeah, kind of having those conversations, at least I am with my kids because I see it in them, and I get it. Yeah.

Yeah, I know. I mean, for me as well, I know, and I'm definitely the spender in our family for sure. And one of the things that I'm so passionate about for my children, not good at, but passionate. Wish I was really good at it.

That's good. It's them

find that dopamine hit from the things that are outside of, you know, the advertising marketing loop. You know? That's just an endless cycle of what you need. And I I have these moments, and my kids are a little older than yours. I have two that are in college and one that's in high school and one going into high school.

And I there are these little moments where I see the the light bulb go on where it's like, no. I guess I don't have to do that. Everybody's doing that. And doesn't have to be necessarily about something that everyone spends. Like, for my daughter, it's like skincare.

That's a whole thing. Just wait. It's coming. It's a disaster. But for for my sons even for participating in certain programs or certain extracurricular activities, this idea of helping them think for just a minute, like, why do we wanna do that?

Is that best for the course that we're on? That pause is something that doesn't come readily. And I wonder, are there things when when you see Caroline and you're going to the dentist to help her kind of pivot and redirect her towards calling a friend, playing a game so the dopamine hit comes from somewhere else?

Yes. Oh, absolutely. For sure. What does that look like?

Tell me what that looks And, like in your

well, I was gonna say, you know, the hard thing is is there's a balance of and I feel like my parents said this well of that, you know, it's it's the whole premise that having nice stuff is okay, but we don't like, it's okay to have nice stuff, but we don't want our nice stuff to have us.

Oh, I

love And so there's a pool to that. It's not necessarily these things are evil or wrong, but when we place them in our lives at a level that is, that they were never supposed to be there. They were never supposed to be the thing that satisfies us. It was never supposed to be the end game that we work hard. I mean, at Ramsey, we, you know, we help people, obviously, financially, and one of our things is live like no one else, so later you can live and give like no one else.

And so building wealth, we don't villainize that. In fact, we're like, is amazing because you get to do so many great things with money. Like if you build wealth, you get to change your family's life and your community. Like you get to give and serve and do things that's absolutely amazing, but that's the placement. It's not the end goal just to go and hoard and keep it all, right?

So with her, yes, it is this, I mean, for her at eight years old, I can put up some hard boundaries because, I mean, she'll just wanna be like, Hey mom, can I go on Amazon and look for a new slinky? And I'm like, No. So like, that's an easy boundary. Like, you don't have access right now to that. But when they do have access, as they become teenagers and they go off to college, they live on their own and they have to start making these decisions, you know, being able to train them to not only just kind of stop gap it where it is as their young kids, but also, you know, I think a level of like a no spend season, and we've done this with our kids.

Though they earn money they can spend it, we did a no spend summer last summer because even if they you know, I love Caroline. I feel like I'm giving her the hard time on this podcast. No.

No. No. No. We'll keep Caroline.

Yeah. Even if she had, like, $4, she'd like, can we go to Target, mom, and see what I can give her for $4? And it became exhausting. I'm like, I know you worked for that money, and that's in your spend, but like, no. Winston and I were like, we're done.

We can't just keep these like little chatter. So we're like, no. So we said, you're not allowed to spend money. And so what it forced them to do then is what? Play with the stuff that they already have.

That's And

then it reunites joy, right? So it's these practices that you put in place. And again, we're not perfect parents at it by any means, but it's that redirection right now that we kinda have a level of more control over than versus like, you know, when they're teenagers or college or young adults, you know, like that's a whole other ballgame, but it's hard.

It is so hard. When did you start having conversations? Like, do believe very much so that let's start them really young and let's establish kind of the foundation so that when they go off to college, it's not a foreign idea, and they've already kind of been molded. When did that start in your house?

Yeah. I mean, growing up, it was as far back as I can remember with our kids right now. I mean, we started gosh, many I mean, when they were probably five, six years old, and it's funny, personality wise, some need some discussions over others. Our oldest, she's such a saver. I mean, such a saver, doesn't wanna spend anything.

So I have to almost encourage giving. Like, it's harder for her to even give because she doesn't wanna let go of anything.

I have one of those too.

Yes. Let's just yes. Let's be a little bit more generous and go and have fun, enjoy some of your money. You know, I almost have to push her in that way versus, you know, Caroline, I'm like having to pull back this way because she's a giver too. That's the funny thing.

Most spenders are more generous agree. They live life with an open hand, which is beautiful. So there's gifts in all of it. But yeah, that conversation, and then, you know, what you said was exactly right, and I think that is a goal of all parts of parenting, obviously, is ideal, but with money specifically, of letting them make mistakes. And that's one thing I do credit my parents for too.

They were not legalistic parents. I remember getting, we had a student checking account when we were teenagers, and I bounced three checks at the mall when I was 15. And we got a letter in the mail from the bank, and it had the photocopy, I'll never forget it, of the checks, and it was the, here's the fees and all, I mean, all the stuff. And dad made me go down to the bank and apologize to the branch manager for lying to him because I told him I had money in his bank to spend, and I didn't have the money. And so I had

to Oh my goodness. That's amazing.

So like there were lessons like that, but he was not mad. Like when I bounced the checks, you would think Dave Ramsey would be like, wow. You know? Like, whatever you had to think of him of the show. But he was cool as a cucumber, but he's like, all right.

But you're gonna have to go down and say you're sorry because you kinda lied. You said you had money, and you didn't have money. So let's go. And I was

what? So good.

So it was a a lot of mistakes were made, but that's the beautiful thing is they're inexpensive mistakes, you know, when you're 15 under your parents' roof versus the first time ever handling monies on your own when you're 18, 19 years old. And so that's a that's a whole other world.

Yeah. That's great. Oh, I love it. Painful, but great. It's a smaller smaller pain at 15.

So let me then ask you one of the things that, you wrote, I have your book here, Love Your Life, Not Theirs, which is such a great resource for helping those of us who are right in the middle of this Instagram, you know, Facebook. I say Facebook. My kids are rolling their eyes somewhere because I guess that's, again, for old people we know. Cool. Not cool.

But when you look at when you look at, the comparison culture that we are immersed in, this idea of really loving your life is something that you speak so beautifully into. And I just wonder if you could touch a little bit on how do you avoid I know I know we talked about, like, if you saw someone on social. For me, I'm kind of an extremist. I'm just off social. I can't do it because I'm so it's the worst version of myself.

I hate it. I'm like, oh, look at her. She doesn't look so good now, does she? You know, that's the kind of girl I am on social. But I wonder if you have other practical wisdom that, you know, parents in our audience can think about and really transfer to their children on what does that look like, especially with name brands or, you know, we're in the stage even like what college you go to is a big thing.

Right? You have to have the right school so that you can have the right gear. So how do you navigate that? Any suggestions?

You know, it is hard because it's such a hard issue, you know, with contentment and the comparison game that I feel like, yeah, we all can live in. You know, one thing for me is practicing, and I do this, and hopefully, you know, as my kids get older, they probably will understand this more. But where our society has gotten wrong so much with money is that money has become our worth. It's become our identity. It's become who we are.

And so our net worth is not our self worth, but it is in the world outside. I mean, is. You can So be applause with the high salary or whatever the life, if you look successful, you look a certain way and people assume something about you, right, because we've attached our identity to it. And that's on the positive end of like the success, but also the negative. Like people that have made deep financial mistakes carry the shame with them that is them, and it's like, it's not.

Money is out here. It's this item, but we have to know how to obviously handle it well. So I think stripping back this identity piece, for me, I'm like, and I tell myself this, I'm like, you know, if nobody sees this purchase, do I still want it? Like how much of our motivation is for other people, right?

That's so good.

So there's a And the why we wanna spend is a very fascinating question to ask yourself. And I think it starts to get at the root of things, right? Some people spend because they're bored, which means they're kind of bored with their life. They wanna check out, and this feels good over here, and I'm gonna just spend here. Some people, you know, out of our, you know, I've talked to so many people on the Ramsey show, and they've gone through sobriety.

But instead of doing this over here, I'm gonna just go spend. Redirect it in, you know, not a great way to spend, yes. Or that you're spending because of you wanna feel good about yourself. You want others to, whatever that is, like, understanding that motivation, and that's the stuff that I, that's the layer at which we can have the conversation and work from. Because, yeah, the name brand, the school, what you're saying, I mean, all of it, it is so wrapped up in ego.

Like, our egos play such a role in all of this. And people that chase that life over and over and over for years and decades, like, again, back to the very beginning of our conversation, they're not the ones at peace. The finish line continues to move for them.

That's And

so there's something about not letting it become us. And that's a really hard thing, I think, in a practical way to teach. I think, again, it's a spiritual shift that has And to for me too, you know, one thing I've told myself, and it's something that I think about is, you know, don't put your identity and your value and all these things in something that can be taken away, right? Your house can be taken away. Your car can be taken away.

Like, these things can be taken away. What are things in my life that I can't pay for and that, you know, someone can't come and take from me, right? It is my spiritual life. It is my family. It's my health.

It's my friendship. Like these things that I can't go and purchase and buy, that's where I wanna put my energy and my time, because those are the things over the scope of life actually do give you a level of satisfaction and create a life that you do love. You know? After a while, it does just become stuff. And I think sometimes we have to learn the hard way after a while, and I think that's some people's stories too.

Yeah. I love that. I think also for us as parents, modeling, obviously, such a wonderful way of teaching our children, but we fall into the trap probably way more often than we understand. Right? Where we're aware and comparison comparing ourselves to other people, and we're worried about all of those external things, that kinda make up our identity.

And so I think as starting place is really to take some inventory ourselves of, like, what am I doing and why? I love what you said about if no one ever saw this, would I buy it? Such a good question. Yeah. That's such a good question.

I heard this. Don't know if it's true, but I heard the ZIP code that we live in, my family is the most debt ridden ZIP code in The United States.

No way. That's true.

Where are

you? I don't even know if I

know California. California. We're outside of Los Angeles.

Oh, I bet I bet you. Yeah.

I mean, I I would believe that maybe it's possible it's one of the highest, if not. But it's so interesting because it does bring a cultural, like, norm. Right? So in having those conversations and trying to strive not for what tends to be everybody else is striving. I mean, it won't happen perfectly, but I think you start.

Absolutely. You start. Absolutely. I it. What do you do then, Rachel, if you suspect one of your kids might be going, a little bit towards discontentment?

Maybe they're not so grateful and they do want some of the things. One, how can you spot that? And two, then what do you do about it?

You know, for me, I'm like, I I don't my red flag doesn't come up as much if it's kind of a one off, but when a pattern starts to occur Okay. In what they're doing, that's when I'm like, okay, hey, let's just talk about this. This is what I'm saying. And I'll be honest, if my husband was sitting right here, he'd be looking at me and be like, Rachel, this is me mostly giving the red flag because I'm probably like the Amazon boxes and everything.

I mean

Genuinely. Yes. But we have, but we've talked about it of like, what are they seeing? You know, what are they seeing? And when they start to actually replicate it, you know, how do we kinda put a stop gap?

And again, at the age of our kids, I feel like we're able to do that a little bit more in a controlled setting than others when they're older. But yeah, for me, is that conversation of, hey, and let's do something together, like whether it's the no spend thing. To some parents are thinking, my gosh, what? But it's like, if it's not a necessity as a family for two weeks, we're not gonna spend. We're not gonna go out.

We're not gonna do the movies. We're not doing anything. So what are we left with? Then you actually have to start getting creative, right? Mean, I just read a whole study about how even our smartphones using maps, you know, Google Maps or whatever, all of it, like, we're actually, our brains are not firing as they were twenty years ago.

And I think the same is true, like, with our stuff that we can just order things and do what we need, and the avenue of debt, like what you're saying, banks are happy to give you loans. Credit card companies are there. You can sign up. You can get whatever you want when you want it, basically.

That's right. That's right.

And so there is, I don't know, there is that level of forcing yourself to actually think different and think creatively. And I think it's, yeah, I think it's good for all

of Yeah. The long game. That's good. So if a parent has reflected and going, I I think we might not have done all of this the way we wish we had. Any wisdom for those parents to think, you know, what would it look like to kind of make up for some choices you would not make again?

Sure, well, you know, we talk to a lot of families who start to do the debt free journey, where they start to get out of debt. And when you're on that journey, scaling back your lifestyle is a big part of it. Income is one end of the equation and your expenses is the other end. And so to cut expenses, to put that extra margin towards paying off debt as fast as possible is kind of part of the system. And so for those families, you know, and I would say the same, even if you're not getting out of debt, but you're like, oh, we probably need to pull back from maybe the spending, maybe what we've been presenting.

You know, I always say to be clear is to be kind. And if something's gonna shift, and especially the age of your kids, age appropriately, do sit them down and just be like, hey, time out. Like, mom and dad, we've messed up, and we've realized that we have done x, y, and z, given you whatever you've wanted, or whatever the thing is, right, in your life, or we're trying to get out of debt. We're gonna be getting out of debt. And so here's what life is gonna look like.

It's gonna look a little different, and different, and change is uncomfortable. And it's uncomfortable for all of us. Regardless of your age, when you're changing, you're doing something new that you don't know how to do very well, it's not gonna feel great at first. So we're gonna be in this together. You're taken care of.

You know, your basics are fine. The house is not on fire, but some of our decisions are gonna look different. And come to us and talk to us if that feels uncomfortable, that's frustrating, like, I get it. So like Right. Talk to us because we're all gonna be on a learning curve here.

And there's something really beautiful and humble

Yes.

About that of like, hey, I didn't do this well, and we're gonna try something different. And if you can be, if you have things in your mind for your family that are more of that practical tactical side that you're gonna implement, like talk about it and say it out loud.

All right. Let me ask one more Michelle question before we have some audience questions, if I can throw those to you.

Yes.

Alright. If a parent listening could do just one thing to get started or to further enhance their children's contentment with where they are and what they're looking at currently in the instead of the striving for everybody else's stuff, what would that be? What's the one thing that you would call out first?

As a parent to my kids, I would want to get inside of their hearts and their heads on why they're doing what they're doing.

Oh, that's so good.

If they ask questions or they're wanting something or doing something, ask back. Ask some and kinda see where they're at because each kid is gonna be so different, you know, their motivation and why they're wanting something or seeing something or they're insecure. Whatever the thing is, you actually learn so much about your kids. As adults, you know, money, we always say, is a magnifying glass. It makes you more of what you already are.

So what you're going to magnify and see says a lot about you, and you're human. You know, you're not gonna be perfect. Like, that that doesn't happen. But you actually become more in touch with your kids and know them, I think, at a deeper level when you have these avenues of life that you get to walk down with, and money can be one of those.

I love that. Ask them. Get in their heart and their head. So good. Alright.

Let me throw a few questions from our audience your way and see what you have. This comes from Sylvia in Houston. She is the mother of four, and she asks, how can my husband and I come to agreement on what enough looks like for our family? That's good.

That's a great question. Yeah. Money represents so much, especially in marriage. You know, when you talk to two couple you know, a couple, and you have two different people that come from two wildly, probably different backgrounds, were raised so differently with money, experience money differently, look at money differently, wanna spend it differently, like you are two different people, which is the beautiful part of marriage. I wouldn't look at the end goal of what is enough.

I would say, Hey, as a family, what do we want our home and our life to look like and feel like? Doctor. John Zalone talks about this a lot, which I love. Like, what do we want our home to feel like in the next six months, in the next five years, ten years? What does that look like?

What does that feel like? And there's something about that. It sounds a little theoretical, but when you actually pin it down, you're like, okay, what do we need to accomplish that goal? It's not a money goal because a number is really hard for me. Always kinda hate, honestly, like a, let's get to this number and we're gonna be okay, because there's something there that always shifts.

I don't like that. So it's more of a lifestyle, what we want the emotional home. What do we want it to be? What do we want our life to be? And then money then is the tool to create that and to help with that, to assist in that.

So that's more of the question. So I would say dream together. What do you want your life to be like? What does that look like for you? And there may be a little give and take.

You know, some may want more than others, and some may have a scarcity mindset, abundance mindset. You know, you can get into all of that. But I would say enough would not be a number for me. It would be more of a how do we want our life and our family to function, and what do we need to support that?

Alright. This one comes from Michael who is in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. He has four kids, and he asks, I feel pressure to provide more than my parents were able to give me. How do I know the difference between healthy provision and overcompensating because I'm insecure?

Oh my gosh.

Yeah. That's a great question. Super honest, Michael. Thank you.

I know. That is a great question. Yeah, that would be one I would probably say, what is the scorecard saying? What am I thinking that money's gonna say? And what am I trying What's the end game look like?

Because for some people in that situation, it's like, I just want my dad and Sam proud of me. Like that's the end game. I wanna prove that I am enough. And the danger with that is, is if you are not, again, fighting for the things that actually give your life value, and it's just providing to provide that stuff. I mean, it's what we talk about this whole podcast.

That's not the ultimate. That's not the ultimate goal. There's, you know, when I do media stuff around Christmas time, it's like releasing parents of the pressure of Christmas and just like buying a bunch of crap just to be under the tree, just to feel like I did something, you know? And I'm like, it's not. And like, and what our kids do, what they long for, what my kids long for, It is, I'm not kidding.

It sounds so cheesy, but it's just true. It's like bike rides around the neighborhood with mom and dad. Mom and dad, will you come with us? Like, they want us to participate in their life. They wanna play games.

They want us. They want us. And they think they want the stuff, and we think we wanna provide the stuff. But again, as we all know, it's stuff that you end up like throwing or giving away nine And months so Right. So there is a, there would be more of an emotional pull for me question of, if you didn't provide enough of what you thought was enough or what your parents how would you still be with yourself?

Would you still be okay? Because if you're not, that's more of an identity question for me.

Yeah. And it'll never be enough. Right? It'll never be enough if it's identity. You'll just have to keep going.

That's right.

Alright. This question comes from Boise, Idaho. Christine asks, I have two teenage boys and I'm newly divorced. We are on a tight budget right now, and I am very worried that my kids are going to feel deprived. I find myself buying them things I normally wouldn't because I feel bad that they've seen their parents go through this divorce.

How can I possibly cultivate contentment in a season where we truly should be saying no to everything, but I can't even stop myself?

Yeah. I think the biggest gift when you have teenage boys and you're in that situation is to give them honesty and where

you're at. Great.

And that is a life lesson that they carry for the rest of their lives. If they can have a single mom that actually has a boundary and says, I'm actually not gonna go beyond what we make because the stress of that, even though in the moment I think it's gonna feel good and everything's gonna be it's gonna be a Band Aid, it's not actually the deeper healing that I'm looking for. And I'm not gonna let money be in the way of this horrific thing that's occurred of this divorce, which is just so sad and so horrible, so horrible. And so I'm actually gonna leave margin so that I can have peace in this area of my life because this other area of my life is really heartbroken. Like, that's a gift to me.

That's right. And the peace is so much more important than this stuff.

Oh my gosh.

So much.

Oh, fight for peace. When we over leverage ourselves, we create deep stress, lack of sleep. I mean, staying in a job we hate to pay bills for stuff that we're trying to impress people we don't even like, That's right.

And then you have to manage all the stuff. How many of us have homes that are just filled with stuff and we wanna throw it all away and we get tied to it and we have sunk cost and we start to stress out about that. Alright. One more. This comes well, actually, are several, but they're all along the same line.

This comes from Maria in Charlotte, North Carolina. And she says, I am the mother of three girls, and I struggle personally with comparison, especially with all these other moms who seem to do it all and have it all together. How can I teach my daughter's contentment when I'm battling discontentment in my own heart? That's good question. Like that, Maria.

I would I would tell Maria, they're not doing

it all. Yeah. That's good. What

you're seeing, they're not. It's like this idea of life balance is not true. Like we're not gonna have a perfect spiritual life and parenting season and marriage season and friend season and skincare season. Like all these things now are not gonna be through the course of your life, you want these things to have balance. Right?

We don't wanna just be workaholics and the work thing is always high and everything else is low. No. And we also don't wanna, you know, like, need balance over the scope of your life. But in the moment, those moms, I guarantee you, feel like they are not keeping up and they're not doing the best.

So That's

I would say that is a lie. They're not doing it all. So, you know, you're either delegating out things that you're able to, which financially, you know, if you have the money to do that, that's great. You know, someone to help clean the house or whatever it looks like for you. You're, you know, delegating different parts of your life if that's where you're at, but not everyone's doing it all.

So I would remove that because that's, yeah, that's not true. Find a great community of moms that are like honest about it too. Because there's hard seasons, and people look for people for that

That's right.

That honesty.

That's right. Alright. I love this. I wanna show everybody. I have all the things here, and I want them to know about it because they've been helpful.

So I showed this book, Love Your Life, Not Theirs. And now I wanna show your oh, yeah. And the gratitude journal. This is so good.

The contentment journal.

Yes. This is the contentment journal. It's so good. It actually walks with Rachel through ninety days of a journaling plan that really help you have a life and live a life of contentment. But these also are nuggets.

For those of you who have younger kids, I wanted to show these. This is a series of children's books that Rachel has written largely around contentment, some version of that story. But, this is I'm glad when I can share. I'm glad for what I have, and I'm glad for where I am. So I really wanna encourage everybody to take a look at these.

They are so fun and so beautiful. Your illustrator is great. I know she's great job. Great job. Tell us where else people can find you, Rachel.

Yes. Well, thank you. So I host the Ramsey Show a couple of times a week, so you can check that out. It's a podcast on YouTube. Also, smart money happy hour with George Camel.

I host that. And then as we're bashing social media, I'm on Instagram. So you can check me out there and Facebook Yes. And all the

All the things. Well, I'm very grateful for your time. It's been a joy to be with you.

Well, thank you for having me. I so appreciate it.

And thanks to you for being here with us today. Remember, as Orthodox Christian parents, we are invited to journey with our children toward Christ likeness, not toward more stuff. The goal is to pursue peace, not pressure. And as for contentment, remember this, it's not passive. It's powerful.

And when we as parents live it, our children learn it. Now I know I keep saying this, but if you wanna go deeper on today's topic, please make sure to download the free digital discussion guide so that you can discuss all of these things with your spouse, with a friend or a godparent, or other parents in your church community. I'm sure thankful that you joined us today. Until next time.