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This file was generated by Descript 

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Speaker: Welcome to Real Estate is Taxing,
where we talk about all things real estate

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tax, and break down complex concepts into
understandable, entertaining tax topics.

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My name is Natalie Kalady, I'm
your host, and I am so excited

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that you've decided to join me.

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Microphone (Shure MV7)-5: Hello.

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Hello everyone.

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And welcome to today's show.

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So we are only a few days away from the
extended deadline for entity tax returns.

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So this is the filing deadline for
anything that is a pass through,

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typically our partnerships and our escorts

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Microphone (Shure MV7)-6: And this
deadline is normally September 15th.

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It's September 15th for our entities,
October 15th for our personal return.

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But because this month,
the 15th is on a weekend.

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Our deadline for entities
is going to technically be

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September 16th for this year.

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Microphone (Shure MV7)-5:
So for today's show.

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We are going to talk about this
tax deadline, who it applies to

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and some common misconceptions.

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And what your options are.

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If you think you might miss this deadline.

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As a starting point to kick
things off the September 15th

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or technically 16th deadline.

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Is the extended filing deadline
for S corpse and partnerships.

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These are normally due on March 15th.

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So if you file for an extension that gave
you an additional six months to file.

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It does not give you an
additional six months to pay.

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So the same thing happens
with your personal return.

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If you filed an extension for your 10 40.

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Then you have until October
15th to complete your 10

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40 or personal tax return.

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However your income taxes do.

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Should be paid by April 15th extension.

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Give us more time to file.

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They do not necessarily
give us more time to pay.

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Before we move on.

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Let's do a quick recap on what's an
S-corp and what is a partnership?

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Because there are a lot of people who do
not realize they might have one of these.

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An S corporation.

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Is either a C Corp that elects to
be taxed as an S Corp or an LLC that

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elects to be taxed as an S-corp.

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For either of these circumstances, you
file form 25 53 to be taxed as such.

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Even if you're starting as an LLC.

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You don't have to file
anything else first.

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Do you change your LLC?

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To a corporation and then to
have it taxed as an S status,

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it all happens in one step.

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and that is what it takes.

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The other common return that is going
to be due in a few days is partnerships.

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There are multiple ways.

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You can create a partnership, the most
common being general partnerships,

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a business that is just operating
with more than one person running it.

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Even if there's not an entity.

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And also any LLC that has more
than one person on the LLC,

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it has more than one owner.

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So a multi-member LLC is going to almost
always default to being a partnership.

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And this is the most common way.

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I see people surprised by having a
partnership or creating a partnership

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when they didn't intend to.

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That is because.

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A lot of people set up an LLC and they
add their spouse to it by a default.

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Or they're going to do, you know, one
small real estate deal with a friend.

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So they do this LLC with both their
names, thinking they'll just split

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it 50 50 at the end, not knowing.

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They now also have to
file an entire 10 65.

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They have to file a whole
partnership tax return as a result

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of the way they structured this.

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So these are really common situations.

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So if this applies to you, don't feel bad.

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It happens pretty often.

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Now.

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If you are a multi-member LLC.

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But the only members
are you and your spouse.

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You're married.

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Couple.

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And you are based in a
community property state.

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Then you might not have
to file a partnership.

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But only in that specific circumstance.

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If both of those things exist, you're
married and in community property, state.

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You might have the option to
treat that LLC as disregarded.

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And did not have a partnership tax return.

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If you are a married couple who
are operating a business together

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without any type of an entity, you are
married, you're running the business.

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You also have an option to file
as a qualified joint venture

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where you could each choose to
file your own separate schedule.

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C's each report as a separate
independent business.

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Instead of reporting together on your
10 40, or having to file a partnership.

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As well.

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Those are a few of the nuances for times
you might not have to have a partnership.

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But in most situations,
if you have an LLC.

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That has an S selection, or if
you have an LLC with more than one

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person, You have a tax return that
is normally due on March 15th.

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And if you file an extension,
it's due six months later.

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On September 15th.

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But like I said in this year,
because that fell onto a weekend.

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It's technically due on September 16th.

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Microphone (Shure MV7)-2: Now
if you have that extension filed

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or especially if you don't.

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You'll want to try to get this return
filed as soon as possible, even if

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you don't have money to pay right now.

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So in any case, Filing a return late.

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And paying late is always
worse than just paying late.

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So even if you don't have money to pay any
taxes you might owe in the next few weeks.

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Still make sure to get your business
returns filed by this deadline

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here in the next few days for
your partnerships or your escorts.

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And get your 10 40 filed
by the October 15th.

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Extended deadline.

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Even if you end up paying later,
you don't want to file late.

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If you can avoid it.

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But we'll know, sometimes
these things are unavoidable.

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Sometimes you may not have
realized you had a partnership.

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Or you forgot to file an extension
or your books aren't ready.

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They're all kinds of reasons that
entity returns end up filed late.

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And there might be a few solutions
depending on your circumstances.

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The first solution is if you
have a partnership, this does

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not work for S corporations.

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But if you have a partnership tax
return, And you meet the requirements.

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Under rev proc 84 35, which is
the small partnership exception.

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Then as long as you have all of the
information correctly reported on

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your personal tax return, your 10 40.

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Following some criteria.

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We're going to talk about.

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Then using this rev proc you can request
to have that late penalty forgiven.

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So again, if you have a partnership,
not an S-corp rev proc 84 35.

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What this allows is basically if
there was a reasonable cause for

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having this late partnership.

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If you meet these criteria,
there's a good chance.

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You can have the penalty removed.

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If you contact the IRS,
either send them a letter.

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Or call up and talk to them.

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They won't do it automatically.

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Microphone (Shure MV7)-4: Okay.

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So let's dive into the requirements to
see if you can get that penalty removed.

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Under these criteria.

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The first one is your partnership.

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Can't have more than 10 partners.

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Has to be a small partnership.

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The second one is that the partner
has to either be, they have

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to either be all individuals.

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Or the estate of a deceased partner.

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So if you have a partner who is
a trust or an LLC or something

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else, Will not qualify.

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The third one is that each partner's
share of income deductions and credits.

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Our aliquot allocated
in the same proportion.

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As all other items of income,
deduction and credits.

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So things have to be.

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Allocated to each person correctly.

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And each partner has to have reported.

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Their share of the partnership,
income or loss on their timely

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filed income tax return.

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This is what I was saying, and
this is why it's important to

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get this returned on quickly.

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Even if it's late at this
point, if you can get it done.

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Before you file your personal return,
that if it's extended, isn't due

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for another month, you have till
October 15th to file your 10 40.

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If you can complete this
partnership in time.

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So that the K one, which reports your
share of partnership, income or losses is

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included on your personal return and you
pay the tax on your share accordingly.

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Then you would qualify
for this penalty relief.

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So even if right now you're
having a little bit of an oh shit

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moment and realizing you have
a late partnership tax return.

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And you're sitting there and calculating
this $235 a month per person penalty.

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If you can get it together
in the next, like 25 days.

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And get it done and finished
up and get those K ones.

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And your share of income and your partner
shares of income onto their personal

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returns that are filed on time before
their extended October 15th due date.

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Then you can qualify for this rev
proc 84, 35, as long as you meet

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the other criteria we talked about.

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Again, this doesn't
apply to S corporations.

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And whether or not.

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The state will also allow a
forgiveness is going to vary by state.

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Some states might carry over.

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Some might not.

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It is also important to note that
there are some tax return elections.

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That require being on a
timely filed tax return.

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So even if you get that return
finished up and you're going to

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avoid that late filing penalty now.

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There might be certain tax return
elections that you might want to

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make, but might not be able to
now because the return is late.

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So just make sure you check that and
discuss it with your tax professional.

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The next option that might be worth
looking into, if you think you might

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have a late file tax return or we're
coming up on this deadline in a few

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days and you know, you are not ready.

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Is that this year there
were quite a few disasters.

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And if you are located or
your business is located.

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In one of these areas that were
deemed a formal area of a disaster,

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then you might have your deadline
bumped out to February 3rd.

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This applied to quite a few
circumstances this year.

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And again, I will note, so
this extends any deadlines.

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That occurred after the disaster.

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It doesn't apply to.

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Your taxes owed and a
lot of these situations.

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Because for example, Your personal
income taxes are due by April 15th.

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Because filing an extension gives you an
extension of time to file, not to pay.

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So if your personal return is due
in the next 30 days, but you're

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in one of these disaster areas.

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Then you're filing.

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You might have more time for that.

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Could be, do.

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February 3rd.

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However your payment.

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Is still late, either way.

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So if you have a partnership.

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Or an S-corp tax return that are
going to be doing a few days.

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But, you know, you are in an
area that might have had a

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qualified disaster this year.

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Then you might have that deadline
pushed out to February 3rd.

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Under this disaster relief.

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So there is a full list of
qualifying events, disasters,

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what states, counties, et cetera.

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Fell under it.

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And the specifics on the filing
due dates and what was impacted.

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On the IRS website and I have the
link to that in the show notes.

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So go to the show notes to get that
full link to the disaster relief list.

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And see if your circumstance
is listed there.

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Just a few days ago.

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There was a release for Connecticut that
had to do with some of the flooding,

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severe storms and landslides where various
deadlines were bumped out to February 3rd.

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A couple of days before that we had
another posting related to New York,

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same thing, severe storms and flooding
bumped some deadlines out to February 3rd.

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We had several counties in North Carolina
and I believe all of South Carolina.

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Was extended due to the hurricane impact
that we had there a couple months ago.

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And it goes all the way back to
some additional situations that

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were a little earlier in the year,
including some areas of Texas from a

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hurricane there, some Kentucky from
some mudslides, there was Georgia

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was impacted from hurricane Debbie.

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So lots of different areas
where you may be covered to

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have your due date bumped out.

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Now.

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I will add the caveat that a lot
of people will say that if you and

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your business are based there, or
if your tax preparer is based there.

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So the idea being, if you live in like
Seattle, But your tax professional

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is in South Carolina in one of those
disaster zones where businesses

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and people were bumped out to.

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February 3rd, that because that's, who
does your taxes that yours aren't due till

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that date and this isn't clearly stated.

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So the nuance to it is that it's
somewhat based on the ability and

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who and where your business records
are kept allowing the filing.

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So if that professional has all of
your records, like you mailed them

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all of your documents or they do all
of your bulk bookkeeping and they

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are who receive all of your bills and
do all of your invoicing, et cetera.

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Then you have a good argument.

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However, if you have just uploaded
PDFs to a portal and you could

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just as easily upload them to
another tax professionals portal.

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It might not qualify.

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So I wouldn't fall a hundred percent
on that being a saving grace.

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But if you or your business is based
in one of these impacted disaster

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zones, Then you might have a bumped out
filing deadline into early next year.

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So it's worth checking out.

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Again, check the show notes to
get that link to the IRS website

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for the full list of locations.

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The last small item, I'll mention
that's not specifically due

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to the filing or filing late.

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But just something that
some people don't realize.

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And I find this catches quite a few
of my clients off guard each year.

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So when it comes to an
S-corp or a partnership.

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The entity itself typically does
not pay tax in most situations.

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So the amount of income
or loss is calculated and

00:15:39.148 --> 00:15:40.768
figured out on those returns.

00:15:41.368 --> 00:15:45.718
And then each of the partners or
shareholders receive a K one that gives

00:15:45.718 --> 00:15:47.968
them their portion of income or loss.

00:15:48.598 --> 00:15:51.958
Which they report on their
personal tax return on your 10 40.

00:15:52.648 --> 00:15:54.358
And that's where the taxes are paid.

00:15:54.838 --> 00:15:56.398
It all nets out on the 10 40.

00:15:57.208 --> 00:16:02.608
So even though at the end of T level
for an S Corp or a partnership,

00:16:02.938 --> 00:16:05.218
there's typically not income tax paid.

00:16:06.238 --> 00:16:07.678
Depending on your state.

00:16:08.338 --> 00:16:12.568
You very well might have franchise
tax due each year when you file this.

00:16:13.078 --> 00:16:15.268
For example, in North
Carolina, where I am.

00:16:15.688 --> 00:16:20.788
There is a $200 minimum for
escorts for the first million

00:16:20.788 --> 00:16:22.648
dollars, pretty much of income.

00:16:22.648 --> 00:16:27.328
So the majority of S Corp owners
here still have to send in a $200

00:16:27.358 --> 00:16:28.768
check each year to the state.

00:16:29.368 --> 00:16:30.688
As a franchise tax.

00:16:31.018 --> 00:16:32.008
Even though.

00:16:32.488 --> 00:16:36.808
The S-corp itself, isn't paying any
kind of income tax based on the exact

00:16:36.808 --> 00:16:39.058
amount of earnings or anything like that.

00:16:39.838 --> 00:16:43.858
even if you have one of these pass
through entities, Just confirm and

00:16:43.858 --> 00:16:48.178
see if you do have a state fee that
is also due to make sure you're

00:16:48.178 --> 00:16:50.188
not missing that each year as well.

00:16:50.488 --> 00:16:53.488
If there is a franchise tax for
your state, or there might be

00:16:53.488 --> 00:16:55.108
an annual filing requirement.

00:16:55.408 --> 00:17:00.058
Or something else outside of your
standard income tax return filing.

00:17:00.928 --> 00:17:03.898
So that is what I have for you guys.

00:17:03.988 --> 00:17:06.448
I wanted to keep it short
and sweet for this show.

00:17:06.478 --> 00:17:09.118
I know a lot of tax professionals
listen, and that you guys are

00:17:09.118 --> 00:17:10.858
going to be super busy this week.

00:17:11.488 --> 00:17:15.238
If you have questions, feel free
to hop into the Facebook groups.

00:17:15.238 --> 00:17:17.008
I'll link them below in the show notes.

00:17:17.488 --> 00:17:21.988
And as always, I hope that you guys
have found value from today's episode.

00:17:22.318 --> 00:17:25.918
Don't forget to check out the
list for disaster areas to see

00:17:25.918 --> 00:17:27.568
if that buys you some extra time.

00:17:28.138 --> 00:17:32.488
And if you have a partnership that
is going to be late, don't forget

00:17:32.488 --> 00:17:37.738
to check out rev proc 84 35 and
see if you qualify to receive some

00:17:37.738 --> 00:17:39.778
relief from that late filing penalty.

00:17:40.828 --> 00:17:45.598
I hope you guys have a fantastic
September 16th filing deadline.

00:17:45.928 --> 00:17:48.898
And as always, I will
talk to you next week.

00:17:49.919 --> 00:17:52.258
Mhm.