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Unknown: Sklar told me a story a
long time ago. Leland said he

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had this bass rig that he set up
when we did Billy Thorpe's album

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from Australia, and it was 3500
watts. Wow. He said, I can

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literally play a concert and
make the first the first three

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rows in the audience poop their
pants involuntarily. The amount

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of

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vibration I can generate out of
this. You remember the Oakland

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earthquake in 1989

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Yeah, so he had a switch on his
base, toggle switch, like you

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see on a telly. And he goes, I
call this my producer's switch.

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And he says, it does absolutely
nothing. And he said, When he

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gets in working for a client
that he doesn't know and who he

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knows doesn't know anything, he
says, they'll say to him,

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Leland, we're not happy with the
sound of your bass. Can you get

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a little more punch out of it?
Oh, he goes, Sure. He flips the

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switch. He plays the exact same
thing, the exact same thing, and

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then they go, that's terrific.

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Welcome to a podcast about music
and entertainment before it all

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goes down the disposal. This is
circling the drain.

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Hey, welcome back into circling
the drain. And, man, we're gonna

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have fun today, I promise you.
Johnny Bozeman, right here.

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Johnny B you know Jay

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Harper, yes. And are you
intimating that we haven't had

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fun up to this point?

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We always have fun. It's been a
really, I think you're right.

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Secrets, I swear I'm not telling

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that's why we have you here. We
want to hear the

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yes, we do. And we also have Jim
McCarthy in there, and Jim is

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the one that makes this thing
run. Thank god yes. Thank you.

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The technical cameras
strategically placed. Yes, he

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does.

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Yes. Hands on the table. Yeah.

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He's like, the government, yeah,

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I wish, yeah, cameras and
recording.

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But folks, if you don't know the
name Bill Cuomo, you should slap

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yourself, because this guy has
done everything. If you remember

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the keyboard part to Oh Sherry,
just before you know Steve Perry

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goes into this man, he also
Betty Davis Eyes and the I'm

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just, I'm just scraping the
surface. This guy has done so

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much, and we really appreciate
you joining us. Thank you guys.

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We're gonna try to not circle
the drain. Yeah. Well, yeah,

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no circling the drain. No. I
tell people, you know, they go,

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oh, you should write a book. And
I said, I'm, first off, I'm not

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famous, so I'm one of those guys
in the background kind of like

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me and, yeah, like all of us. I
got lucky. Yeah, lucky. I mean,

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there's plenty of people
floating around with talent that

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don't get a break, right? That
happens

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a lot. We see a lot of them here
in this town.

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Boy, in this town? Yeah, I mean,
that's why you can't make a

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living playing live. No, you
really can't in this town. I

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mean, I joined a band here years
ago, played out live for about

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six, seven years. It was fun
till the 40 songs got old. But

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you know, you It got so bad when
we had to play downtown, we'd

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have to meet at Hunter oaks
mall, take all the equipment out

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of our cars, loaded in a van,
yeah, then the van would drive

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downtown. Then we take all our
equipment out of the van, schlep

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it, yeah, and the same thing
back in reverse, back down to

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the van, back to Hunter oaks
Mall. So you're loading your

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equipment like six times, and
you're going, I made 50 bucks

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tonight. Whoo, you know,

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I've heard that has changed down
there, like, that's a highly

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coveted gig Broadway now.

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Well, I mean, it still the pay
isn't great, you know, it's

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tips. Yeah, yeah. I got a friend
of mine who's real talented guy,

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and his wife says she can make
$2,000 in tips. Yeah, she's good

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looking gal. She knows how to
work the bucket. Yeah, you know

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what? I mean, she and it's cash.
Cash is king until they pull it.

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So I thought that was a great
thing for her. You know

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what brought you to Nashville?
That's a good story, because you

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came from LA, right? I was

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there for 34 years, yeah. And I
did sessions. And then after the

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mid 80s, things started to
change. Rap was getting big, and

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my clientele were the kind of
people that would are they had

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already done the damage to the
record, yeah. And then they

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would give me the record and
say, can you put some sense on

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and fix it? You know, I
couldn't. Yeah. I just couldn't

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Yeah. And what ended up
happening was I called a drummer

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friend of mine, the guy who
wrote osier with me, Craig. I

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said, Craig, can you come in the
studio and I'd like to. Some

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drum parts on this thing. He's,
ah, I'm moving to Nashville. Say

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what, you know, there was
silence, trying to figure

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Nashville, but we'd had a bunch
of people that migrated, yeah.

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So I said, Okay, so I planted
the seed. You know, I'd been out

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here in 1980 and I did an album
with Kim and Kenny Rogers, and

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she had written all the songs on
his Gideon album, yeah. So she

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had me come in and play piano,
and it was really interesting,

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because Larry Butler produced
it, right? And it was completely

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opposite the way we worked in LA
he had you there every day, 10

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o'clock, you wait in the lobby,
like in a doctor's office, yeah,

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okay, come on in, you know,
yeah, play this. Okay, go back

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out there and wait. And you were
there basically every day from

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10 to nine or 10 at night, yeah,
and you were on call, and as he

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needed you, he brought you in,
and he just paid you for the

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whole time. But the whole album
was done in three days, you

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know, in LA three days, we might
get a song. Yeah, it's a whole

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different thing. So I I decided
to to move here, and I had a

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fishing trip booked with
Vanessa, who was my girlfriend

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at the time, and we're going to
Owens Valley go trout fishing.

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So new Owens River, I called up.
I said, How would you feel about

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going to Nashville. There was
silence on the line, nothing.

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And then I wait, and then I
hear,

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Well, I didn't tell her I had
already bought the tickets. Oh,

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I bought two round trip tickets
on the worst airline, TWA lost

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our baggage, going and coming.
Oh, man, yeah. But we came here

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for 10 days. We stayed in
Brentwood, and we went all

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around town, went northeast,
Southwest, came back to the

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South side of town, to
Williamson County. And our real

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estate agent was from the West
Coast, so she knew it very well,

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yeah. And she says, I got this
house. It's been for sale for a

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year. A year, she goes, I know
you want to build a studio. I

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mean, in Arrington, three and a
quarter acre, two year old house

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built by the resident. He was a
electrician, beautiful home,

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5500 square feet, included an
1100 square foot walkout

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basement, which is where I ended
up building my first studio. And

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$229,000 Wow. So people from
California came out and I went,

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what this is a million and a
half dollar house. I said, Not

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here, yeah. I said it was on the
market for over a year. In fact,

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I didn't realize it. The
gentleman who owned it was

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transferred to Kansas City. So
he put the house on the market.

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He got transferred back. So the
house was coming off the market

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the Wednesday after the weekend
that we saw when I bought it. He

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was mad, you bought my house.
Well, why didn't you take it off

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the market? He goes, hell. This
is was on the market for almost

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a year and a half. I didn't
think was going to sell. Wow.

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And then you came, you know, so
he softened up afterwards. But,

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I mean, it was, it was
beautiful. Home, four garages,

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six bedrooms, five baths. I
mean, this thing was 19 rooms.

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Well, see, you started
something. It seems like more

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people are moving from

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well, we got in on the early
rush. And then, you know, in the

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late 90s, I started getting
calls going, Hey, I'm a guitar

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player. I'm thinking of going to
Nashville. I went, keep going,

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don't go. Everybody here is a
guitar player. Yeah, they are,

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you know, and there's a lot of
good ones here, boy, oh, you're

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not so it. And then it turned
out that the guy who played

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rhythm guitar in Kim's band,

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Josh Leo, you're talking Kim
Karnes, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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I've known her

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since we were 25 we started out
in the beginning. So, Oh, Josh

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Leo, what a character. Yeah, he
is. And so Josh was nice enough

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to hire me, not knowing what the
hell I was doing in country

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music, yeah. And I played on, I
don't know, four Alabama albums

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and trace Adkins. And so I did a
bunch of country music, and then

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I fired myself. I mean, I it
just wasn't what I did. Yeah?

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You know, I I'm more in that pop
genre and country is all about.

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Do you remember the Tennessean
issue, I don't know, years and

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years ago, where they had on the
front cover a bunch of belt

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buckles, yeah? A bunch of hats,
yeah? And then I said, Now, pick

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the entertainer that belongs to
these because everything was

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about the sameness. Oh, it is
come that way, yeah. And I, my

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whole thing was, my record is
not like your record is not like

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your record, you know, right?
And I really like the

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individuality and the ability to
experiment.

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Well, that's one reason. I think
that, speaking for myself.

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That's one reason I loved the
outlaw movement. Waylon

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Jennings, those guys, because
they broke that mold. Yeah, they

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came up with their own sound.
And you could tell who was who

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you can't anymore.

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No, it's tough. It's tough. And
it had been that way for a

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while, you know, and I thought
not to take away from anything,

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because. I mean, for example,
working with Randy Owen in

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Alabama, yeah, guy's a great
singer. Yes, he is. And people

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said, Ah, he's kind of a crabby
guy. Said, No, you know, you get

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to know him. He's just, he plays
it close to the vest. He's like

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Henley, Don Henley, right? He's
not real outgoing with people he

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doesn't know. And Josh pulled me
aside and he said, Listen, this

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is going to work a little
differently than you're used to.

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He said, You may think the band
got the take, you know, and you

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got the part, and that's the
master, he said, but it's not

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the master or the take until
Randy gets the vocal he wants. I

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thought about that for a minute,
and I looked at Josh and I said,

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you know, that's really not so
strange, yeah, because evidently

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what we played inspired him
enough to get the vocal he

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wanted. So we just go back and
fix what we didn't get right if

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we flubbed, you know? Yeah. And
actually, it was pretty cool.

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And I remember we did this song
called Forever is as far as I'll

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go, Yeah, remember it well,
yeah, and Randy made me rehearse

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that thing, and, oh, it had to
be five or six different keys.

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So we finally got the key. We
did the track came out. Great.

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I'm in Dallas at the airport,
and I was out with Katie oslin,

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and we were touring. And Randy
in Alabama, in the airport, I

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didn't see him. He spotted me,
and he comes up, gives me a big

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hug, and then he goes that, you
know. And that's, that's Randy,

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you know? And, yeah, he's just a
really sweet guy, and a lot of

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funny stories on that record,
because when Jeff was alive, I

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guess he was a cousin, and Randy
raises prize bulls. I don't know

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if he still does, but he does.
Yeah, he's a big cattle guy, so

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Jeff kept bugging him, and I
want to get one of them there,

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cows you got. Randy sold him. I
mean, it was like a $10,000 bowl

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and breeding, you know, wow. So
we're in the studio, and I hear

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the conversation, and Randy
says, How's that? How's my bull

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doing? He goes, Oh, he's good.
What do you mean he was good?

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Because I had him.

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That was a great steak.

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Yeah, mistake, it was funny
stuff like that. And then Teddy,

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you know, Teddy, they're all
cousins. He was a nice guy,

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Teddy. But they, they own the
town of Fort Payne, virtually.

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Oh, yeah, they do. They bought
the old Chevy dealership, and

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that was the warehouse for all
their parts in the shop. They

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kept all their stuff the road
gear, you know, because Randy

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sent me says, we go out and we
make X dollars on a concert. We

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make 2x in merch. Wow, that was
before record companies got

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their hands in it, yeah. And now
it's, you

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know, so did you ever
participate in June jam with

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them down in Fort?

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Payne, no, that was huge. Yeah,
that's a big deal, yeah,

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00:13:03,479 --> 00:13:07,019
what about dealing with Harold
shed as producer? Never had to,

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yeah? Oh, wow. Josh produced all
the

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00:13:09,479 --> 00:13:15,719
did you did? Okay, yeah, I don't
know how to deal with I mean,

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working with Larry Butler was
fine and dandy. I just it was

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weird to me. Just a different
rhythm of recording, just

212
00:13:23,239 --> 00:13:26,419
foreign. Yeah, I would think,
yeah, that's just not that. It

213
00:13:26,419 --> 00:13:29,899
was good or bad. It's just that
what I was raised on, it's like,

214
00:13:29,959 --> 00:13:34,759
I don't know if I can, can I
swear, I used to work for this

215
00:13:34,759 --> 00:13:40,359
producer in LA George Tobin, and
he had hit records. George was

216
00:13:41,319 --> 00:13:44,019
not so much a musician. He was a
salesman. He could sell

217
00:13:44,079 --> 00:13:50,499
anything. So he said to me one
day we were recording, he was

218
00:13:50,499 --> 00:13:54,339
producing Kim Karnes on the, I
think it was the romance dance

219
00:13:54,339 --> 00:13:59,799
album, and she got her first Top
10 hit. More Love. Yeah. So we

220
00:13:59,799 --> 00:14:03,059
were all done with a record. All
the tracks are full on the 24

221
00:14:03,239 --> 00:14:07,499
track, because it was tape at
that time. And he says, Bill,

222
00:14:07,619 --> 00:14:12,959
give me some of that classical
shit up front. That was, you

223
00:14:12,959 --> 00:14:15,599
know. I said, What do you mean
classical, you know. And he

224
00:14:15,599 --> 00:14:19,739
says, Well, you know, something
classical kind of thing, okay. I

225
00:14:19,739 --> 00:14:22,579
said, with George, all the
tracks are full, you know, yeah.

226
00:14:23,539 --> 00:14:26,599
Well, I said, Can we cut a
leader in the tape? For people

227
00:14:26,599 --> 00:14:31,099
who don't know leader tape is
just like plastic or paper tape

228
00:14:31,639 --> 00:14:35,119
that you don't record on. It's
just at the head of the tape. So

229
00:14:35,119 --> 00:14:37,699
you know where the tape starts.
You make the cut, right? And in

230
00:14:37,699 --> 00:14:41,019
this case, if I'd have gone over
in that intro, I would have

231
00:14:41,019 --> 00:14:45,819
erased somebody else's tracks.
So, so there's a drum pickup on

232
00:14:45,819 --> 00:14:51,099
the record. It was 123, and then
it comes in, yeah. So I had to

233
00:14:51,099 --> 00:14:54,759
be out by that drum pickup,
yeah. So the engineer I was

234
00:14:54,759 --> 00:14:57,399
working with at the time, Ryan
had just started out, Ryan

235
00:14:57,399 --> 00:15:00,659
Elliot, and he went on to do Tom
Petty and Scott. Great engineer,

236
00:15:00,659 --> 00:15:04,259
but he was sweating bullets. He
doesn't want to be the guy that

237
00:15:04,559 --> 00:15:10,739
erased Steely Dan, you know what
I mean. So George would not cut

238
00:15:10,739 --> 00:15:14,039
a leader in so we wouldn't
accidentally erase so we had to

239
00:15:14,039 --> 00:15:16,619
put grease pencil on the tape so
you could see the little

240
00:15:16,619 --> 00:15:19,859
squiggles going by as it's
rolling around at 30 IPs. And

241
00:15:19,859 --> 00:15:23,299
what we wound up doing was we
made the grease come faster and

242
00:15:23,299 --> 00:15:27,199
faster the squiggles so I'd know
that it was coming. And then

243
00:15:27,199 --> 00:15:30,679
we'd wind it to a start point
that we set up, and I rehearsed

244
00:15:30,679 --> 00:15:33,679
and I rehearsed and rehearsed.
And you can hear on the intro

245
00:15:33,679 --> 00:15:39,019
that I do at the end, I kind of
bump up, bump up, bump. And I

246
00:15:39,019 --> 00:15:41,679
hold that just long enough so
that the drums come in right

247
00:15:41,679 --> 00:15:43,479
under it, but you had to come

248
00:15:43,480 --> 00:15:44,020
off that.

249
00:15:44,500 --> 00:15:47,260
I had to come off that at that
time. Yeah, wow. And he

250
00:15:47,260 --> 00:15:47,620
otherwise,

251
00:15:47,860 --> 00:15:48,940
you cut off the snare.

252
00:15:49,300 --> 00:15:53,860
Yeah, that's so Ryan. I mean, we
got it, and that was the worst

253
00:15:53,920 --> 00:15:55,960
thing we could have done,
because we validated his bad

254
00:15:55,960 --> 00:16:00,780
method of doing it. And, and, of
course, you know, everybody said

255
00:16:00,780 --> 00:16:04,200
you can't put a 32nd intro on a
song. Disc jockeys loved it

256
00:16:04,380 --> 00:16:09,540
because they made a game out of
talking, yeah? Kim Karns,

257
00:16:09,540 --> 00:16:14,040
chicken blue, and I provided the
background classical music. But

258
00:16:14,040 --> 00:16:18,060
that's how I started off on this
whole intro thing. Wow, that's

259
00:16:18,060 --> 00:16:20,480
kind of how I got dubbed the
intro guy, yeah.

260
00:16:20,960 --> 00:16:24,020
Well, because that intro to Oh
Sherry, I mean, that's classic,

261
00:16:24,079 --> 00:16:28,279
they that. Now this is another
thing. I did it at home. I had

262
00:16:28,279 --> 00:16:32,119
an eight track, and so I put it
together, and I brought it down

263
00:16:32,119 --> 00:16:36,079
to the studio, and I said, How
about this? Everybody goes, Oh,

264
00:16:36,079 --> 00:16:41,079
this is good. Then I thought,
Oh, great. But now I have to do

265
00:16:41,079 --> 00:16:44,859
it all over again. Oh, man,
because we didn't have USB

266
00:16:44,859 --> 00:16:49,179
sticks, we didn't have, yeah,
none of that, yeah. So it was, I

267
00:16:49,179 --> 00:16:52,719
had to go in coal to do it again
and recreate it. But it came

268
00:16:52,719 --> 00:16:57,219
out. I mean, came out fine, but
it's always that, you know, as

269
00:16:57,219 --> 00:16:59,799
well as I do in demos, sometimes
you hear somebody sing a demo,

270
00:16:59,799 --> 00:17:02,459
and there's a magic about it,
yes. And then when you go in to

271
00:17:02,459 --> 00:17:06,719
cut the real one, you worry
about losing it Yes, and not

272
00:17:06,719 --> 00:17:10,019
recreating that. Feel, yeah,
yeah. So that's, I don't know

273
00:17:10,019 --> 00:17:13,079
how many tracks I did on that,
Oh, really? How many takes? No,

274
00:17:13,079 --> 00:17:15,359
no, just how many tracks I took,

275
00:17:16,680 --> 00:17:19,140
because you have the effects
built in. And that sounds like,

276
00:17:19,800 --> 00:17:21,380
oh, Val probably, I mean,

277
00:17:23,180 --> 00:17:27,620
yeah, they mixed it in, they
mixed it in. But I had one, two,

278
00:17:27,680 --> 00:17:30,440
think, three synths I used on
that. I got a friend of mine in

279
00:17:30,440 --> 00:17:34,760
town here who is a synth whiz,
Jim danakar, and he was Michael

280
00:17:34,760 --> 00:17:39,080
W Smith's conductor and
orchestra leader for 25 years.

281
00:17:39,080 --> 00:17:41,980
Yeah, this guy is, like, whiz
bang when it comes to

282
00:17:41,980 --> 00:17:44,920
synthesizers, yeah, but he's
doing this thing called arcade

283
00:17:44,920 --> 00:17:48,580
orchestra, which is all about
the 80s, and he's recreating all

284
00:17:48,580 --> 00:17:52,480
the sounds and the tracks with
different singers for a live

285
00:17:52,540 --> 00:17:56,440
show. Oh, wow, supposed to be
quite a spectacular Yeah.

286
00:17:56,980 --> 00:17:59,260
Listen, I love myself. Keep them
80s alive, baby.

287
00:18:02,560 --> 00:18:06,960
My brother is a lifelong piano
keyboard synthesizer player.

288
00:18:06,960 --> 00:18:11,220
He's in a journey tribute band
was and is kind of getting back

289
00:18:11,220 --> 00:18:16,020
into a Bob Seger tribute band.
But he and I on my podcast, we

290
00:18:16,200 --> 00:18:19,560
we talk about music all the
time. We have so much more in

291
00:18:19,560 --> 00:18:22,520
common now than we ever did. But
we go back and listen to all

292
00:18:22,520 --> 00:18:29,120
those gateway music, like 1984
Yeah. And he's like, the one

293
00:18:29,120 --> 00:18:32,600
thing I could never do is
recreate the brass on aisle

294
00:18:32,600 --> 00:18:37,640
weight from 1984 like, he's
like, I could just never get

295
00:18:37,640 --> 00:18:41,080
that sound that Eddie was able
to get from, I guess the obi

296
00:18:41,080 --> 00:18:42,400
eight or the, oh, yeah,

297
00:18:42,400 --> 00:18:45,460
that's a very brassy instrument,
yeah. And it's got a very

298
00:18:45,460 --> 00:18:46,480
characteristic sound

299
00:18:46,480 --> 00:18:48,640
to it. And I'm thinking, I'm
like, Well, I had to meet Don

300
00:18:48,640 --> 00:18:51,640
Landy having some sort of
something to do with the post

301
00:18:51,640 --> 00:18:55,600
production, and however they
mixed it. And I said maybe it

302
00:18:55,600 --> 00:18:58,600
was an EQ thing, because he's
like, I have tried to get

303
00:18:58,600 --> 00:19:00,900
replicated. It is so difficult.

304
00:19:00,900 --> 00:19:04,320
You mentioned tribute bands
because often the discussion

305
00:19:04,320 --> 00:19:08,880
comes up with players about, is
the band a tribute band? Now,

306
00:19:09,720 --> 00:19:11,100
you know, like, journey, yeah,

307
00:19:13,920 --> 00:19:16,260
yeah, Chicago,

308
00:19:16,260 --> 00:19:18,720
we talked about that. We said,
What does a band become a

309
00:19:18,720 --> 00:19:19,140
tribute

310
00:19:19,140 --> 00:19:21,860
of itself? Yeah? And tribute
bands are big business. Yeah,

311
00:19:21,860 --> 00:19:22,100
they are.

312
00:19:22,160 --> 00:19:26,300
Well, you know, I interviewed
Brady seals for a radio station

313
00:19:26,300 --> 00:19:29,780
I work for, and he's in a
tribute band. He's in a Tom

314
00:19:29,780 --> 00:19:35,180
Petty tribute band. Oh, wow,
yeah, lead singer, because he

315
00:19:35,180 --> 00:19:37,940
can sound like Tom Petty, you
know, used to be with little

316
00:19:37,940 --> 00:19:40,460
Texas. So, yeah, the tribute
band

317
00:19:40,460 --> 00:19:41,860
just has to smoke a few jobs.

318
00:19:44,140 --> 00:19:48,340
Now, Bill, you said you, you
know, working with Larry Butler

319
00:19:48,340 --> 00:19:51,340
was a different experience. You
know, I worked for Jimmy Bowen

320
00:19:51,340 --> 00:19:54,520
at MCA when I was there. Did you
ever work with Bowen? I heard

321
00:19:54,520 --> 00:19:57,760
that he was kind of a brought a
different experience to

322
00:19:57,760 --> 00:20:00,840
Nashville, that a lot of players
here didn't really. Appreciate

323
00:20:01,020 --> 00:20:02,640
so what was your experience?

324
00:20:02,940 --> 00:20:06,420
Jimmy pulled us aside one day,
and he says, Well, when I came

325
00:20:06,420 --> 00:20:10,920
to Nashville, I showed her how
to make a $50,000 record for

326
00:20:10,920 --> 00:20:11,040
250,000

327
00:20:12,120 --> 00:20:15,660
Yeah, exactly, yeah, yeah. You
know, we brought digital to

328
00:20:15,660 --> 00:20:20,100
town, and a lot of folks were
not hip to that. What was, what

329
00:20:20,100 --> 00:20:23,840
was your what is your thought
for analog versus digital? You

330
00:20:23,840 --> 00:20:26,120
know, you talk about what you
went through to create that

331
00:20:26,120 --> 00:20:29,840
intro. I mean, with digital now,
it wouldn't be that arduous.

332
00:20:29,840 --> 00:20:33,440
No, it would not. It would not.
I kept my console. I still have

333
00:20:33,440 --> 00:20:38,540
my Trident console. So the big
problem with digital, for me is

334
00:20:39,140 --> 00:20:42,340
when you have a digital audio
workstation, and you take all

335
00:20:42,340 --> 00:20:45,700
those tracks up on the screen
and you sum them into a two

336
00:20:45,700 --> 00:20:48,700
track bus coming out of the
computer. That's where the

337
00:20:48,700 --> 00:20:54,160
crunch comes. If like for I run
a very convoluted setup, so

338
00:20:54,160 --> 00:20:57,340
everything I have goes through
the console first, then it goes

339
00:20:57,340 --> 00:21:00,720
through my converters to the
computer, comes out of the

340
00:21:00,720 --> 00:21:03,300
computer, through the
converters, back through the

341
00:21:03,300 --> 00:21:09,780
console. So and I set my console
up to I take 16 tracks of it for

342
00:21:09,780 --> 00:21:15,000
drums, bass, acoustic guitars,
electric guitars, keys, vocals,

343
00:21:15,060 --> 00:21:19,560
background vocals, reverbs, all
in stereo, and then that all

344
00:21:19,560 --> 00:21:23,180
comes through the two bus
analog. So when I'm listening,

345
00:21:23,180 --> 00:21:26,480
I'm listening to the console,
and the difference in the sound

346
00:21:26,660 --> 00:21:31,100
is pronounced, very pronounced.
And then I have a set of high

347
00:21:31,100 --> 00:21:34,160
octane burl converters. They're
real expensive, but they sound

348
00:21:34,160 --> 00:21:37,820
really good, and they're stereo.
And I just run through those,

349
00:21:38,180 --> 00:21:43,420
and I just spit out whatever
format I need, if it's 2496 2488

350
00:21:43,900 --> 00:21:48,040
whatever I need film might be
1648, you know, but, yeah, I

351
00:21:48,040 --> 00:21:50,800
just got to switch on the burl,
and then that just goes to

352
00:21:50,800 --> 00:21:53,800
through the burl to a hard disk
recorder, and I print out the

353
00:21:53,800 --> 00:21:57,040
CDs as I need them for
mastering. You know, you

354
00:21:57,040 --> 00:21:59,980
record vocals and stereo as
well. No, okay,

355
00:21:59,980 --> 00:22:02,940
but I keep I just because
everything's in stereo, if I

356
00:22:02,940 --> 00:22:05,280
have effects on a vocal, right,
right, if I have a pan or

357
00:22:05,280 --> 00:22:08,280
anything like so I just leave
the vocal tracks up, you know,

358
00:22:08,580 --> 00:22:14,220
but they're mono, yeah, unless,
you know, and but it seems to

359
00:22:14,220 --> 00:22:16,680
work that way for me. I haven't
been able. I almost sold the

360
00:22:16,680 --> 00:22:20,040
console. I had a guy wanting to
buy it, and then I had second

361
00:22:20,040 --> 00:22:24,140
thoughts. I couldn't do it well,
it has a sentimental value to me

362
00:22:24,200 --> 00:22:28,580
too. I there was a store in LA
for years called everything

363
00:22:28,580 --> 00:22:32,900
audio, and it was a Hyatt, you
know, store, and I went in there

364
00:22:32,900 --> 00:22:35,420
to buy my gear. After my
royalties came in, it's either

365
00:22:35,420 --> 00:22:39,260
give them to the government or
buy stuff that depreciates.

366
00:22:39,320 --> 00:22:42,040
Yeah, buy stuff, yeah.

367
00:22:42,040 --> 00:22:45,400
So I bought a 24 track, a two
track, and I bought a board, and

368
00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:48,640
I bought a bunch of outboard
gear, and I was talking with the

369
00:22:48,640 --> 00:22:51,040
guys, and we were laughing, and
the gal came out of the office

370
00:22:51,040 --> 00:22:55,480
to give me my receipt for the
console, and I was like, Oh, who

371
00:22:55,480 --> 00:22:58,300
are you? And she goes, I just
wanted to see who owned that

372
00:22:58,300 --> 00:23:04,800
laugh. And that's and that's my
wife. Oh, wow. The console has a

373
00:23:04,800 --> 00:23:07,200
little bit of a sentimentality
to it for me.

374
00:23:07,200 --> 00:23:12,540
Well, speaking of Semin being
sentimental, one way we got to

375
00:23:12,540 --> 00:23:15,660
know each other was through Phil
Valentine, the guy I worked with

376
00:23:15,660 --> 00:23:18,840
on the Phil Valentine show. Yes,
a lot of people don't realize

377
00:23:18,840 --> 00:23:22,220
that you guys worked on music
together. Yeah. I mean, he told

378
00:23:22,220 --> 00:23:25,220
me that he came here to pursue
music. Well, both of us did,

379
00:23:25,220 --> 00:23:27,920
actually, and we ended up in
radio, yeah.

380
00:23:27,920 --> 00:23:33,200
I mean, he, I helped him out on
his film, on a song. Think it

381
00:23:33,560 --> 00:23:36,740
was the spirit, yeah, I love
that tune. So he had, I mean,

382
00:23:36,740 --> 00:23:40,060
Phil would bring me tracks. He
had everything all laid out. Oh,

383
00:23:40,060 --> 00:23:44,200
yeah, you mean he's very oral
McCarthy, you know, he's a very

384
00:23:44,200 --> 00:23:47,560
organized, talented guy. Yeah,
he was, and I was thrilled when

385
00:23:47,560 --> 00:23:50,320
he did that little EP of
Chadwick station. Yes, that I

386
00:23:50,320 --> 00:23:51,880
got to do that with him. And we
had it.

387
00:23:51,879 --> 00:23:56,559
We had a ball. Well, it's funny,
when he did Chadwick station, he

388
00:23:56,619 --> 00:24:00,659
basically came up with these
members that it's basically just

389
00:24:00,659 --> 00:24:01,439
you guys.

390
00:24:01,500 --> 00:24:05,040
Well, his kids, too. They all
got him on the cover.

391
00:24:05,100 --> 00:24:08,520
Yeah, they came up with these
fictitious characters. Well, the

392
00:24:08,520 --> 00:24:11,940
thing started taking off in
Europe, and Phil started getting

393
00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:17,460
interview requests from for
this. Elvis Ken Kensington, I

394
00:24:17,460 --> 00:24:20,720
think was the name of the and so
it goes, it came to me. He goes,

395
00:24:20,720 --> 00:24:24,860
What do I do? And I said, You
act like Prince. You say, Alvis

396
00:24:24,920 --> 00:24:28,580
is an artiste. He doesn't have
time for interviews. No, you

397
00:24:28,580 --> 00:24:32,660
know, just be that way. That's
so interesting that you guys got

398
00:24:33,560 --> 00:24:34,220
meat.

399
00:24:35,540 --> 00:24:39,020
My wife was his banker. When she
worked in banking. See, there

400
00:24:39,380 --> 00:24:41,560
she was at the drive through.
And he always came through in

401
00:24:41,560 --> 00:24:47,140
that Miata that he Yeah, yes. I
love that Miata. And so they got

402
00:24:47,140 --> 00:24:49,120
to chatting, and she always
helped him out the banking

403
00:24:49,120 --> 00:24:53,020
stuff, yeah. And then I guess
the topic came up of me

404
00:24:53,080 --> 00:24:56,740
somewhere, and he put it in the
back of his mind, I guess, yeah.

405
00:24:56,740 --> 00:25:00,960
And next thing I know, I mean,
he was so nice. To me. I mean,

406
00:25:01,560 --> 00:25:05,340
you guys both were gracious and
having me on, I mean, I remember

407
00:25:05,340 --> 00:25:08,460
the time I went on the show with
Beeb from the Little River Bay,

408
00:25:08,460 --> 00:25:12,000
yes, and I was just sitting
back, you know, just taking it

409
00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:14,880
all in. It was his thing, you're
right, and I didn't want to

410
00:25:14,880 --> 00:25:18,480
intrude. And Phil goes in, grab
a mic, pull, you know, up here.

411
00:25:19,500 --> 00:25:24,320
Okay, you'll be sorry, but I'd
be more than happy to do it.

412
00:25:25,640 --> 00:25:29,480
Yeah, you did work with Little
River Band. And, yeah, that was

413
00:25:29,540 --> 00:25:32,960
a really. Martin got you that
into that, didn't he? Let me

414
00:25:33,020 --> 00:25:37,460
think, how did I get that job?
It was through Sir George

415
00:25:37,460 --> 00:25:41,740
Martin, yes, he got me the job I
had done a film with George.

416
00:25:42,280 --> 00:25:45,040
Think it was either Every Which
Way But Loose, or one of those.

417
00:25:45,040 --> 00:25:51,340
Yeah, he scored the film. And I
get a call from George Martin.

418
00:25:51,460 --> 00:25:55,300
Bill, would you like to come
down to Montserrat for a week?

419
00:25:55,899 --> 00:26:01,619
I'm wide open. I'm that book I
crossed. There we go. I'm wide

420
00:26:01,979 --> 00:26:03,959
open. I'm going to buck snort.

421
00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:09,480
Can we go to Cleveland, please?
Finally, so he flew me down. And

422
00:26:09,480 --> 00:26:13,500
this is funny, back before
airlines got so crazy, I had one

423
00:26:13,500 --> 00:26:16,440
synthesizer my profit that I did
Betty Davis with, yeah, and I

424
00:26:16,500 --> 00:26:20,540
had it in a road case, and we
bought it a seat, and I brought

425
00:26:20,540 --> 00:26:23,720
it right on the airplane and
strapped it in, laid it down, so

426
00:26:24,080 --> 00:26:27,260
the case was under the seat, in
front of me, in front of next

427
00:26:27,260 --> 00:26:30,920
door there, and laying over the
seat. And I strapped it in. And

428
00:26:30,920 --> 00:26:34,280
all I had to do at the gate was
open up the case, which I had

429
00:26:34,280 --> 00:26:37,880
padlocked, plug it in, turn it
on to show them it worked, and

430
00:26:37,880 --> 00:26:40,120
they let me on the plane with
it. And we had three flights to

431
00:26:40,120 --> 00:26:44,440
get there. So I flew to Miami,
then I had another flight, and

432
00:26:44,440 --> 00:26:47,500
then we had to pick up a puddle
jumper, a Twin Otter. Oh, that's

433
00:26:47,500 --> 00:26:50,680
fun, because, yeah, because
landing on Montserrat, it's a

434
00:26:50,680 --> 00:26:53,920
small airstrip, yeah. And so
we're, we're doing the circle

435
00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:56,980
over the runway, and there's a
Twin Otter on the edge of the

436
00:26:56,980 --> 00:27:00,660
runway. You know, still smoking.
It crashed, yeah, I don't think,

437
00:27:00,660 --> 00:27:01,620
oh boy.

438
00:27:02,460 --> 00:27:05,040
Seems a Buddy Holly come. Oh
boy. You know,

439
00:27:05,040 --> 00:27:08,220
I toured with seals and cross
for a year, and they flew this

440
00:27:08,220 --> 00:27:12,960
plane they bought from an ex
president of Mexico, Convair 440

441
00:27:13,560 --> 00:27:15,540
Oh, and that's the same one that
Skinner,

442
00:27:17,400 --> 00:27:20,360
yeah, and we flew up to I
remember my first gig with them

443
00:27:20,360 --> 00:27:23,660
was playing the Calaveras County
frog jumping festival in

444
00:27:23,900 --> 00:27:35,420
Northern California for real,
and oh my god, so the plane. I

445
00:27:35,420 --> 00:27:37,760
mean, any of the band members
will tell you this, the plane

446
00:27:37,760 --> 00:27:40,360
was white when we took off with
the gold stripes on it. We

447
00:27:40,360 --> 00:27:44,200
landed. It was black. Blew out
40 quarts of oil all over the

448
00:27:45,220 --> 00:27:49,180
wings. So I remember we were on
tour and we were in Vegas before

449
00:27:49,180 --> 00:27:53,560
we came home, and dash cross and
I went down to the hangar to see

450
00:27:53,560 --> 00:27:55,960
how the plane was doing, because
a manifold fell off one of the

451
00:27:55,960 --> 00:27:58,720
engines and exhaust manifold
that makes you feel good. Oh,

452
00:27:58,720 --> 00:28:05,280
yeah. So dash says, How's it
going? And he goes, Ah, it'll

453
00:28:05,280 --> 00:28:06,000
get you there.

454
00:28:12,540 --> 00:28:16,080
I still chat with dash on
Facebook these days, a nice guy

455
00:28:16,080 --> 00:28:20,280
and boy, what a hell of a
mandolin player. Oh yeah, nicest

456
00:28:20,280 --> 00:28:26,420
guy. I really enjoyed him. And
Jimmy seals was funny. He he

457
00:28:26,420 --> 00:28:30,620
had, he played sax on tequila,
you know. And they, he said they

458
00:28:30,620 --> 00:28:33,500
used to tour in the band on the
road. There were six of them in

459
00:28:33,500 --> 00:28:36,800
a Cadillac. And he said, we're
playing in Texas. We have to

460
00:28:36,800 --> 00:28:40,480
stop every once a while, get out
of the car and fight. And they

461
00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:45,640
get back in the car and continue
on. But I remember the crazy

462
00:28:45,640 --> 00:28:48,220
stuff growing up, because when I
first started out, I was going

463
00:28:48,220 --> 00:28:53,680
to college, and I got a call to
play in some stupid lounge group

464
00:28:53,680 --> 00:28:57,700
that a guy was putting together
to open for Little Richard. So I

465
00:28:57,700 --> 00:29:00,420
used to watch Little Richard
play every night Caesar's

466
00:29:00,420 --> 00:29:04,500
palette. Oh, wow. And this guy,
he was, that was when in his

467
00:29:04,500 --> 00:29:07,620
strange days, you know, the long
cape and the makeup and the

468
00:29:07,620 --> 00:29:09,900
lipstick and the, you know, he
was pretty out there. I'm

469
00:29:09,900 --> 00:29:16,440
beautiful, yeah. But man, he,
I'd never seen a man hit a piano

470
00:29:16,800 --> 00:29:20,180
with the force that Little
Richard did. I mean, he bang

471
00:29:20,180 --> 00:29:23,960
that thing, he'd break six,
seven strings a night. Wow,

472
00:29:24,020 --> 00:29:28,460
that's, I mean, on a Steinway B.
That's hard to do because

473
00:29:28,880 --> 00:29:32,180
they're a stiff action. It's
like having guitar strings this

474
00:29:32,180 --> 00:29:35,600
far above the neck. Yeah, it's,
I don't know how he did it, but

475
00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:38,060
that guy, but boy, what a rock
and roller. Oh, he was,

476
00:29:38,060 --> 00:29:40,840
it was the truth to watch him,
and it freaked me out that he

477
00:29:40,840 --> 00:29:45,640
lived here. I really didn't know
for a long time. And then that

478
00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:48,820
doesn't seem like you think
Memphis, maybe, yes, you know,

479
00:29:48,820 --> 00:29:51,280
but not here. Well, he's like,
living in Lewisburg or

480
00:29:51,280 --> 00:29:53,320
something. That was where he was
living.

481
00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:57,940
But he was that that was my
early you know that? And Bobby V

482
00:29:58,000 --> 00:30:01,920
was another one when I was a
senior. Used. La, he asked me to

483
00:30:01,920 --> 00:30:04,440
go to Sweden to be his music
director. And I thought, oh,

484
00:30:04,980 --> 00:30:09,360
Sign me up. And then I we were
on the quarter system at that

485
00:30:09,360 --> 00:30:12,960
time, so classes only went for
10 weeks, yeah, so none of my

486
00:30:12,960 --> 00:30:17,280
teachers would let me out. Oh,
gosh. So I thought, okay, when I

487
00:30:17,280 --> 00:30:20,400
get out of college, I'm going to
give myself a little time. So as

488
00:30:20,400 --> 00:30:23,780
a math major, yeah, you know, in
psychology of all things, people

489
00:30:23,780 --> 00:30:26,240
said, well, how are you going to
use that music? And I said,

490
00:30:26,240 --> 00:30:31,100
Well, sick ass. People going to
try to take, take my money away.

491
00:30:33,620 --> 00:30:36,680
So, but that was funny, and I
never thought about a career

492
00:30:36,680 --> 00:30:40,720
music. I mean, I avoided it.
Wow. I just, I don't know

493
00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:45,640
musicians, to me, I didn't much
care for Well, I mean, they just

494
00:30:45,640 --> 00:30:47,740
thought about two things, yeah,

495
00:30:48,340 --> 00:30:51,280
that's it. That's, you know,
that's why they usually get in

496
00:30:51,280 --> 00:30:51,700
music.

497
00:30:51,940 --> 00:30:54,520
I tell you what, I tried. You
gotta hear my first gig. This is

498
00:30:54,520 --> 00:30:57,580
really funny. Do you remember
you guys any good with one hit

499
00:30:57,580 --> 00:31:03,600
wonders, some degree. Yeah,
electric prunes. I had too much

500
00:31:03,600 --> 00:31:05,880
to dream last night. Oh, is

501
00:31:06,060 --> 00:31:09,300
a big remember that? Yeah, the
song? Yeah. I wouldn't know the

502
00:31:09,300 --> 00:31:11,520
name of the song, yeah.

503
00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:16,380
So I'm, I mean, I, you know, I
guess I'm kind of a

504
00:31:16,380 --> 00:31:19,380
conservative, like I can see now
looking back here, I was clean

505
00:31:19,380 --> 00:31:22,220
cut in college. V neck sweaters,
yeah, no beard, nothing, you

506
00:31:22,220 --> 00:31:27,920
know, Mr. B and I was teaching
piano, and one of my students

507
00:31:28,520 --> 00:31:31,220
was an accordion player, and he
wanted to make the transition

508
00:31:31,220 --> 00:31:34,040
from accordion to piano. Well,
he happened to be the brother of

509
00:31:34,040 --> 00:31:37,520
Mark tool, and who was the bass
player in the prunes. So they

510
00:31:37,520 --> 00:31:40,460
had a fight with their guitar
player and kicked him out, and

511
00:31:40,460 --> 00:31:43,120
they had a weekend tour in
Seattle and Portland, just two

512
00:31:43,120 --> 00:31:47,860
gigs, yeah, so they said, you
want to play? Sure. So they gave

513
00:31:47,860 --> 00:31:51,520
me a Vox super continental
Oregon and the big super B lamp,

514
00:31:51,520 --> 00:31:54,640
you know, that goes up to 11
and, you know, yeah, they were

515
00:31:54,640 --> 00:32:00,480
awful live. Well, they played so
loud, you know, because we, I'll

516
00:32:00,660 --> 00:32:04,380
never forget, we were playing in
Portland in this big arena like

517
00:32:04,500 --> 00:32:07,620
and it had concert seating on
the floor, you know. And

518
00:32:07,860 --> 00:32:12,720
everybody who came to see this
the prunes in the 60s, they were

519
00:32:13,260 --> 00:32:15,840
stoned, yeah. So they're sitting
on the floor waiting for this

520
00:32:15,840 --> 00:32:18,240
concert. And when this thing
started, it was so loud, you

521
00:32:18,360 --> 00:32:21,980
could just see them doing the
creep. By the time the show was

522
00:32:21,980 --> 00:32:24,080
done, they were all stuffed in
the corner like ferrets, you

523
00:32:24,080 --> 00:32:24,200
know.

524
00:32:24,920 --> 00:32:27,860
Well, the sound systems were so
bad, but I remember the poor

525
00:32:27,860 --> 00:32:32,120
Beatles, man, yeah. I mean, they
never really toured what like,

526
00:32:32,120 --> 00:32:35,420
that's why I think it's not fair
for people to compare the

527
00:32:35,420 --> 00:32:38,840
Beatles and The stones, because
the stones at least got to

528
00:32:39,020 --> 00:32:42,040
experience new sound systems,
yeah,

529
00:32:42,100 --> 00:32:44,740
oh yeah. Trying to remember the
name of the sound company,

530
00:32:44,860 --> 00:32:47,740
Claire brothers, yeah, if you
had them, you were good. Yeah.

531
00:32:47,740 --> 00:32:50,020
Because your monitors, you could
always hear everything in the

532
00:32:50,020 --> 00:32:52,660
monitors, it was great. But if
you didn't have those guys, it's

533
00:32:52,660 --> 00:32:53,680
crap shoot. Yeah.

534
00:32:53,740 --> 00:32:57,340
So Bill, what? What is your
preference? Studio, work or live

535
00:32:57,340 --> 00:32:57,940
performing?

536
00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:02,940
Studio, studio, I, you know, I'm
on the road, and you you play,

537
00:33:02,940 --> 00:33:04,920
you know, if you're in an
opening act, you play 3540

538
00:33:05,460 --> 00:33:08,880
minutes, and then, as my friend
Goldie used to say, the rest of

539
00:33:08,880 --> 00:33:11,460
the time, you're waiting. Yes,
you know, you're either in a

540
00:33:11,460 --> 00:33:15,720
hotel, you know, or you're in a
bus, you're in a plane, but

541
00:33:15,720 --> 00:33:18,720
you're just waiting. And I don't
like being away from home. I'm a

542
00:33:18,720 --> 00:33:23,240
homeboy, yeah. So I understand,
you know, I remember I got in

543
00:33:23,240 --> 00:33:26,180
Dutch one time with Kim because
I was building a house in the

544
00:33:26,180 --> 00:33:30,140
National Forest in California,
about 6570 miles out of the San

545
00:33:30,380 --> 00:33:34,280
Fernando Valley where all the
studios were. And I just wanted

546
00:33:34,280 --> 00:33:37,940
to somebody said, Why are you
doing that? And I said, I want

547
00:33:37,940 --> 00:33:41,140
to wake up and not hear police
helicopters and sirens and all

548
00:33:41,140 --> 00:33:44,440
that crap. I wake up, I got
national forest all around me. I

549
00:33:44,440 --> 00:33:48,460
said, I'm protected by federal
bureaucracy nobody will ever

550
00:33:48,460 --> 00:33:52,720
build. And I ended up buying.
This is funny. I talked some of

551
00:33:52,720 --> 00:33:55,060
my friends into buying lots
around me. There were four lots

552
00:33:55,060 --> 00:33:58,720
available. They're all about
three, four acres a piece. So I

553
00:33:58,720 --> 00:34:01,020
bought my three and a half
acres, and they bought theirs. I

554
00:34:01,080 --> 00:34:03,720
said, it's a good investment. It
was because I had to buy them

555
00:34:03,720 --> 00:34:04,560
out. They all went back.

556
00:34:06,360 --> 00:34:08,100
But I had the land up there. And

557
00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:12,000
people loved coming up there.
Kim would come up there. We'd

558
00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:15,480
work. Steve Perry came up there.
We wrote, that's where we wrote,

559
00:34:15,480 --> 00:34:20,180
oh, Sherry up there, yeah. David
Coverdale from White Snake. He

560
00:34:20,180 --> 00:34:24,620
had to make an entrance. You
know, he he landed in the the

561
00:34:24,740 --> 00:34:30,200
main meadow on a big bell jet,
Ranger helicopter. Yeah, yeah,

562
00:34:30,260 --> 00:34:32,780
the kind that the news crews
use, like Channel Five. Oh,

563
00:34:32,780 --> 00:34:36,560
yeah. He lands there, comes in,
makes his entrance.

564
00:34:37,100 --> 00:34:38,900
Was, it was smoke and slow
motion

565
00:34:40,940 --> 00:34:42,580
with some girls traveled across

566
00:34:43,239 --> 00:34:47,799
I remember when I was working on
a starship record. We were doing

567
00:34:47,799 --> 00:34:50,199
a song called it's not over till
it's over. And I was doing

568
00:34:50,199 --> 00:34:53,739
programming and playing, and
Grace Slick was at the house,

569
00:34:53,739 --> 00:34:56,139
and she was up in the dome
portion of the house making tuna

570
00:34:56,139 --> 00:35:01,019
sandwiches for everybody.
Surreal. She was really neat.

571
00:35:01,319 --> 00:35:04,379
But, I mean, they love to come
up there because it was such a

572
00:35:04,379 --> 00:35:09,719
stark contrast to LA, which is
bumper to bumper, people and

573
00:35:09,719 --> 00:35:14,339
cars, yeah, up there, it's just
quiet, you know? That was nice.

574
00:35:14,819 --> 00:35:17,639
I love living up there. I just
hated the commute, yeah, you

575
00:35:17,639 --> 00:35:21,079
know, it was wicked. And then as
the Antelope Valley grew around

576
00:35:21,079 --> 00:35:24,139
Edwards Air Force Base, and
Palmdale and Lancaster grew.

577
00:35:24,679 --> 00:35:27,259
Then the traffic began problem,
and that was another thing

578
00:35:27,379 --> 00:35:30,259
Vanessa and I talked about
about, do we want to stay here?

579
00:35:31,399 --> 00:35:34,579
I had 40 acres next to the
devil's punch bowl, and I had

580
00:35:34,579 --> 00:35:38,719
hired an architect to design us
like a dome out of concrete,

581
00:35:38,899 --> 00:35:41,919
because we were right next to
the San Andreas Fault. So domes

582
00:35:41,919 --> 00:35:46,959
made a lot of sense, and I was a
bit of money into that. And

583
00:35:46,959 --> 00:35:49,839
that's when we flew to Nashville
to look around, and then I gave

584
00:35:49,839 --> 00:35:52,899
this guy a deposit on the house,
and went, Oh crap, I was gonna

585
00:35:52,899 --> 00:35:57,819
pay for it. So luckily, we sold
the 40 Acres. Yeah, you know,

586
00:35:57,819 --> 00:36:01,079
came here, but I remember it was
so different back then, when I

587
00:36:01,079 --> 00:36:05,639
came here, the more, I mean, we
both had no jobs. You know,

588
00:36:05,639 --> 00:36:09,119
people were looking at us like
you, you got, you ain't got a

589
00:36:09,119 --> 00:36:13,499
job? Said, No. I said, but
something, somebody's telling me

590
00:36:13,499 --> 00:36:17,279
that this is the thing to do.
I'm doing it. And Vanessa didn't

591
00:36:17,279 --> 00:36:20,159
have a job. I mean, she left her
everything, audio chat, wow. So

592
00:36:20,459 --> 00:36:23,779
her two babes in the woods, you
know, and the mortgage company,

593
00:36:24,259 --> 00:36:28,339
I remember, couchy and Miller
out of Kentucky, said, Well, can

594
00:36:28,339 --> 00:36:33,439
you write us a letter of intent?
I said, Well, sure. I said, I

595
00:36:33,439 --> 00:36:40,299
intend to buy this house, and I
intend to pay for it. And I

596
00:36:40,299 --> 00:36:43,719
said, I have some friends here
that'll that'll give me work,

597
00:36:43,779 --> 00:36:48,219
you know? And I said, look at I
said, I just gave you guys a

598
00:36:48,219 --> 00:36:51,759
$75,000 down payment. Yeah? I
said, That's chump change to you

599
00:36:51,759 --> 00:36:55,179
guys, but to me, that's a lot of
money, and I'm not going to walk

600
00:36:55,179 --> 00:36:59,139
away from it, right? So I said,
You'll get your check. Yeah,

601
00:36:59,199 --> 00:37:00,239
trust me, yeah.

602
00:37:00,240 --> 00:37:05,700
They're two famous words in the
show business, trust me, yeah,

603
00:37:05,700 --> 00:37:09,060
so, but I mean, that's the
start. Was really interesting.

604
00:37:09,060 --> 00:37:12,540
And I love the people here.
That's what really attracted me

605
00:37:12,540 --> 00:37:16,680
to Tennessee. And then I found
is the longer we stayed, the

606
00:37:16,680 --> 00:37:20,660
Tennesseans kept moving further
further out, and the people from

607
00:37:20,660 --> 00:37:26,300
New Jersey started moving Yes,
and it just they kind of

608
00:37:26,300 --> 00:37:27,860
tarnished it a little bit, yeah.

609
00:37:27,859 --> 00:37:30,919
So sorry. You know, I'm from
Connecticut, so

610
00:37:33,500 --> 00:37:35,480
Well, that's the whole thing
about because I was asking

611
00:37:35,480 --> 00:37:38,540
another podcast, you know, the
guy was talking about talk

612
00:37:38,540 --> 00:37:42,400
radio, and he said, You know,
there's no native Tennesseans.

613
00:37:42,400 --> 00:37:46,660
And I said, when Has there ever
been? I said, most of the people

614
00:37:46,660 --> 00:37:50,740
that were in talk radio had come
here from other areas. Yeah. I

615
00:37:50,740 --> 00:37:53,680
mean, I'm from Kansas. That's
where I originated from.

616
00:37:53,680 --> 00:37:56,500
So see, you got more Tennessee
in you than most of us. You

617
00:37:56,500 --> 00:37:59,020
know? Yeah, I, you know,
whenever I get mad and I lose my

618
00:37:59,020 --> 00:38:01,080
patience, my wife goes your New
York is showing

619
00:38:03,540 --> 00:38:05,940
upstate New York, upstate,
outside of Schenectady.

620
00:38:06,600 --> 00:38:10,560
So you and Tully Kennedy have a
lot in common. You know, Tully,

621
00:38:10,740 --> 00:38:13,980
no, from Al Dean's band, the
bass player, he's from upstate.

622
00:38:14,279 --> 00:38:17,939
Ah, yeah. I mean, it's, it's a
different, you know, California,

623
00:38:17,939 --> 00:38:20,779
and when I came here, it's very
much the same as Upstate New

624
00:38:20,779 --> 00:38:24,259
York. The accent is different,
but it's please, thank you.

625
00:38:24,259 --> 00:38:28,639
Yes, sir, yeah. That's yeah.
That is rural,

626
00:38:28,940 --> 00:38:32,360
and it was appealing to me
because, you know, I had a

627
00:38:32,360 --> 00:38:36,200
neighbor when we first moved to
Arrington, and we had two gravel

628
00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:39,800
driveways for the upstairs and
the downstairs, or the studio

629
00:38:39,800 --> 00:38:44,080
was and John came by with his
tractor. John Lane, I forget

630
00:38:44,080 --> 00:38:48,520
this guy. And he scraped the
driveway, scraped the driveway,

631
00:38:48,520 --> 00:38:52,540
knocked on my door. So Bill
says, I got your driveway fixed

632
00:38:52,540 --> 00:38:55,360
for you, and I just barely met
the guy. I said, Well, John,

633
00:38:55,360 --> 00:38:59,200
what I owe you. And he says,
Welcome to Tennessee. So a few

634
00:38:59,200 --> 00:39:02,460
years later, we bought the lot
next door, and I asked John to

635
00:39:02,460 --> 00:39:06,840
come in and carve a road for me
and gravel it. Yeah, so he did

636
00:39:06,840 --> 00:39:09,000
it. He came up to my door with a
bill, and he says, you know

637
00:39:09,000 --> 00:39:13,260
Bill? He says, You never asked
me how much I charge you. And I

638
00:39:13,260 --> 00:39:17,340
said, Well, John, I said, I'm
sure that it would be fair. So

639
00:39:17,640 --> 00:39:22,100
give me the bill and I'll pay
it, you know. And I love that

640
00:39:22,100 --> 00:39:26,300
about a handshake and a word,
which is so absent in my

641
00:39:26,300 --> 00:39:30,020
business. Yes, you know, I mean,
I've had to sue record companies

642
00:39:30,320 --> 00:39:34,220
three times, wow, for what was
written on paper that they would

643
00:39:34,220 --> 00:39:40,040
not execute. And, I mean, I had
a Sue Ford Motor Company. And J

644
00:39:40,040 --> 00:39:41,320
Walter Thompson, I mean,

645
00:39:41,440 --> 00:39:42,520
sounds like radio.

646
00:39:45,880 --> 00:39:48,640
In radio, we don't have the
horsepower to conduct a lawsuit.

647
00:39:48,700 --> 00:39:49,000
No, we

648
00:39:49,000 --> 00:39:50,140
don't, yeah,

649
00:39:50,200 --> 00:39:52,780
but I mean, it's, well, it's the
same thing. I mean, I think when

650
00:39:52,780 --> 00:39:57,520
they stole o Sherry for their
Taurus commercial, they figured,

651
00:39:57,520 --> 00:40:01,500
hey, four songwriters. No, no.
Ever get together and agree on

652
00:40:01,500 --> 00:40:04,680
suing us? And besides, we got
300 lawyers sitting around.

653
00:40:04,680 --> 00:40:07,560
It's a staring contest. Who
blinks first? It's all it is.

654
00:40:07,560 --> 00:40:10,920
Yeah, seven years they dragged
it out. Oh yeah, seven years,

655
00:40:10,920 --> 00:40:14,100
hoping that we just die or go
away run out of money. And then

656
00:40:14,100 --> 00:40:18,180
three Yeah, three weeks before
court date, they settled. Yeah,

657
00:40:18,180 --> 00:40:20,040
paying is what they should have
paid seven years

658
00:40:20,040 --> 00:40:21,440
ago because they don't want to
go in

659
00:40:23,360 --> 00:40:24,500
public. You know, I just

660
00:40:25,880 --> 00:40:29,120
hate, well, Bill being from New
York State originally. I mean,

661
00:40:29,120 --> 00:40:34,700
in the last name, Cuomo, do you
get asked or about the family

662
00:40:34,700 --> 00:40:35,120
relation?

663
00:40:35,120 --> 00:40:38,180
Yeah, you know, I'm always
prepared to run, just in case

664
00:40:38,180 --> 00:40:42,880
they're going to come after. I
always do not no relation, no

665
00:40:42,880 --> 00:40:46,480
relation. Yeah, that's a
political family. Not my, not my

666
00:40:46,480 --> 00:40:47,020
gumbo.

667
00:40:47,259 --> 00:40:52,839
Well, politics has really
gotten, oh, just kind of ugly in

668
00:40:52,839 --> 00:40:54,099
the in the music business.

669
00:40:54,100 --> 00:40:58,060
Yeah, it does. We were talking
about this earlier, the fact

670
00:40:58,060 --> 00:41:04,020
that, well, the arts in general,
lean way left, yes. And I lean

671
00:41:04,020 --> 00:41:09,480
center, center to center. Right.
You don't really lean. I walk

672
00:41:09,480 --> 00:41:09,960
upright,

673
00:41:11,040 --> 00:41:13,560
like I told Phil one time,
because he was talking about

674
00:41:13,560 --> 00:41:17,520
that. You know that people, if
you're in the middle, you're

675
00:41:17,520 --> 00:41:21,140
gonna get run over. And I said,
the way I look at it, because

676
00:41:21,140 --> 00:41:25,580
I'm in the middle. I said, I
think you guys on the far right

677
00:41:25,580 --> 00:41:29,000
and the far left are in the
ditch. We're still in the we're

678
00:41:29,000 --> 00:41:30,680
still in the road, baby, yeah?

679
00:41:30,680 --> 00:41:33,320
But you get, you get the ditches
on both sides yelling at you,

680
00:41:33,320 --> 00:41:34,940
yeah? You do. You know, that's
the thing.

681
00:41:34,940 --> 00:41:40,360
And I and that goes from ditch
to bitch, you know, ditch the

682
00:41:40,360 --> 00:41:41,080
bitch to ditch.

683
00:41:41,320 --> 00:41:44,080
Yeah, bitches in the ditches.

684
00:41:49,960 --> 00:41:53,740
It's crazy. It's gotten to where
you can't honk your horn

685
00:41:53,740 --> 00:41:54,220
anymore.

686
00:41:54,220 --> 00:41:59,320
Oh, you can't here in Nashville
on I'm 24 you can't you get shot

687
00:41:59,320 --> 00:41:59,620
at.

688
00:41:59,620 --> 00:42:04,980
Well, that's crazy in Tennessee,
that that would happen. And I

689
00:42:04,980 --> 00:42:09,060
heard about that. And people get
shot at, yeah, the one guy who

690
00:42:09,060 --> 00:42:12,480
honked at the guy in front of
him who had cut him off, yeah,

691
00:42:12,540 --> 00:42:15,360
guy gets out of the car and
start shooting an AR 15 at him.

692
00:42:15,720 --> 00:42:18,720
Oh, yeah. And I'm thinking, Come
on, you. People have lost your

693
00:42:18,720 --> 00:42:19,080
minds.

694
00:42:19,080 --> 00:42:22,520
People have. I mean, it just
seems like people have really

695
00:42:22,520 --> 00:42:25,340
become crazy over the years.

696
00:42:25,340 --> 00:42:28,640
Yeah, I mean, and the other
thing is, you know everybody,

697
00:42:29,420 --> 00:42:32,120
well, I have a concealed a lot
of people have concealed.

698
00:42:32,720 --> 00:42:35,840
Everybody doesn't realize the
fact that if you introduce a

699
00:42:35,840 --> 00:42:40,340
weapon into a situation, you
better be prepared to use it,

700
00:42:40,340 --> 00:42:44,380
yeah, because you've just raised
the ante huge. And that's what

701
00:42:44,380 --> 00:42:46,540
we were talking about earlier,
about the Renee good thing. And

702
00:42:46,540 --> 00:42:48,940
I thought, you know, these guys
are all on edge. They've been

703
00:42:48,940 --> 00:42:52,900
shot at, run over. They may not
be right, but they're going

704
00:42:52,900 --> 00:42:56,380
there for a mission to get the
illegals out, right, all for

705
00:42:56,380 --> 00:43:01,320
that which needs to be done.
Yes, I agree, but they're a

706
00:43:01,320 --> 00:43:04,080
little heavy handed sometimes,
but then people come and poke

707
00:43:04,080 --> 00:43:07,560
the bear, and it's like we're
talking when you get pulled

708
00:43:07,560 --> 00:43:11,400
over. I have my license and
registration, insurance card,

709
00:43:11,520 --> 00:43:15,420
their hands visible, because I
know these guys. I watch op

710
00:43:15,480 --> 00:43:18,900
live, and I see what these guys
go through. Oh yeah, holy crap.

711
00:43:18,900 --> 00:43:21,200
I mean, they never know they're
going to get shot at. It could

712
00:43:21,200 --> 00:43:22,460
be killed. I don't know

713
00:43:22,460 --> 00:43:24,500
every day whether they're saying
goodbye to their

714
00:43:24,500 --> 00:43:28,340
loved right? No such thing as a
routine traffic stop.

715
00:43:28,339 --> 00:43:32,479
No, I remember in LA because I
commuted such great distances

716
00:43:32,479 --> 00:43:36,379
from the dome to the valley, I
had three different cars because

717
00:43:36,379 --> 00:43:39,499
I didn't want to put all them. I
put 45,000 miles a year and

718
00:43:39,499 --> 00:43:43,719
driving. So I'd have a little
sports car, a pimp wagon, and

719
00:43:43,899 --> 00:43:46,899
then my scout with a snowplow,
because I needed that sometimes.

720
00:43:46,899 --> 00:43:53,199
Yeah, I got pulled over. One
time, I had a 924 Porsche Turbo.

721
00:43:53,199 --> 00:43:56,319
That was a fun car. I was going
to town. I had my drum machine

722
00:43:56,319 --> 00:43:58,239
in the back. You could see it
through that big window, you

723
00:43:58,239 --> 00:44:01,379
know? And I got pulled over as
soon as I got down the valley on

724
00:44:01,859 --> 00:44:05,819
Interstate 14, Highway Patrol
pulled me over. I was going

725
00:44:06,119 --> 00:44:09,359
fast, and at that time we had
the 55 mile an hour limit to

726
00:44:09,359 --> 00:44:13,319
conserve gas, and that turbo
would kick in right around 55

727
00:44:13,679 --> 00:44:17,939
and the car want to keep going.
Yeah. So he pulled me over. It

728
00:44:17,939 --> 00:44:22,759
was a Japanese gentleman,
really. I mean, cops are nice. I

729
00:44:22,759 --> 00:44:24,859
gave my thing. And he says, You
know, I pulled you over. I said,

730
00:44:24,859 --> 00:44:28,639
Oh yeah. I said, I know. I said,
I said, I knew immediately when

731
00:44:28,639 --> 00:44:32,179
all the cars started doing this
and falling back, that I stuck

732
00:44:32,179 --> 00:44:35,179
out like a sore thumb, you know?
And I said, I said, this thing,

733
00:44:35,179 --> 00:44:38,059
I I try to keep a handle on it.
And I said, you've seen my

734
00:44:38,059 --> 00:44:41,919
record. I'm a largely Good boy.
I don't get tickets, but you got

735
00:44:41,919 --> 00:44:45,759
me, the worst thing you can do
to a police officer is lie to

736
00:44:45,759 --> 00:44:49,059
him that it insults their
intelligence, because they've

737
00:44:49,059 --> 00:44:53,559
heard every freaking excuse in
the world. So I mean, I flat out

738
00:44:53,559 --> 00:44:57,519
said, No, I was going over 60,
you know. So anyway, we started

739
00:44:57,519 --> 00:44:59,919
asking me about the drum
computer, and we're talking and.

740
00:45:00,479 --> 00:45:03,959
A low rider goes by while we're
talking a Chevy. I mean, it was

741
00:45:03,959 --> 00:45:08,399
just barely off the ground with
six Latinos in it. You know, he

742
00:45:08,399 --> 00:45:14,819
goes, Well, gotta go. And then
the funniest part was he pulled

743
00:45:14,819 --> 00:45:17,999
him over about three miles down
the road. When I went by, wave

744
00:45:17,999 --> 00:45:25,279
got a new friend. But, I mean, I
was always courteous, and I got

745
00:45:25,279 --> 00:45:28,759
let go most every time, yeah.
And I think the only time I

746
00:45:28,759 --> 00:45:32,059
didn't get let go was in Santa
Monica, the motorcycle cops.

747
00:45:33,019 --> 00:45:38,179
They do not say, okay, you can
go. You can go with your paper,

748
00:45:38,179 --> 00:45:40,299
yes, and your ticket, you know,
but they will cut you know,

749
00:45:40,299 --> 00:45:44,199
Slack. And the only ticket I got
in Tennessee, and I've been here

750
00:45:44,199 --> 00:45:48,639
since 89 I was down at Fort
Payne with Alabama rehearsing,

751
00:45:48,639 --> 00:45:51,759
and I was coming home, and I
wanted to get home, and I had a

752
00:45:51,819 --> 00:45:54,939
Ford Taurus SHO, and that little
thing would get up and Boogie,

753
00:45:55,479 --> 00:45:59,799
and that Yamaha v6 sounded so
good, it's going about 85 Yeah,

754
00:45:59,799 --> 00:46:05,219
come on north on 65 and boom, he
got me my escort radar detector

755
00:46:05,219 --> 00:46:08,279
went off, and that meant that he
hit that instant on radar. Yes,

756
00:46:08,459 --> 00:46:14,459
it basically said, you're
getting a ticket. The cop pulls

757
00:46:14,459 --> 00:46:16,679
me over, you know, he's a
Tennessee State Trooper, and he

758
00:46:16,679 --> 00:46:19,199
I rolled on the window and I got
everything ready for him, and he

759
00:46:19,199 --> 00:46:21,739
looks on the dash and he sees
the Escort radar detector and

760
00:46:22,279 --> 00:46:25,819
goes lot of money to pay for
something that don't work. Oh,

761
00:46:26,779 --> 00:46:30,499
it works. I said, Yeah, what
often said, you're getting a

762
00:46:30,499 --> 00:46:35,359
ticket. So we chat. I mean, he
was nice, and we chatted a

763
00:46:35,359 --> 00:46:38,659
while. I mean, hey, he got me. I
was moving, and he was nice

764
00:46:38,659 --> 00:46:41,439
enough to write me under 80. He
said, I'll tell you what he

765
00:46:41,439 --> 00:46:44,919
says. You know, he said,
anything over 80 is considered

766
00:46:45,099 --> 00:46:49,299
reckless driving and counts like
a DUI. Yeah, you get a lot of

767
00:46:49,299 --> 00:46:51,339
points. So he says, I'll write
you under 80. I said, well,

768
00:46:51,339 --> 00:46:51,699
thank you.

769
00:46:51,700 --> 00:46:54,220
Yeah, that's very nice. Yeah,
that happened to me in a turbo

770
00:46:54,220 --> 00:46:58,660
Trans Am, oh, where the state
trooper got me caught me at 133

771
00:47:00,040 --> 00:47:03,840
Wow. You're real. I'm a hero.

772
00:47:03,840 --> 00:47:07,560
Yeah, I had just gotten that car
and one, it was south of New

773
00:47:07,560 --> 00:47:10,740
Orleans. It was like four in the
morning. I dropped a girl off

774
00:47:10,740 --> 00:47:14,760
for a date. I'm on River Road.
Nobody, nobody. And I'd never,

775
00:47:14,820 --> 00:47:18,060
man, let me see what this thing
can do, you know, yeah. And that

776
00:47:18,060 --> 00:47:20,480
turbo charger kicked in, you
know? It had the lights on the

777
00:47:20,480 --> 00:47:24,260
hood that you could see, oh,
yeah. And when that turbocharger

778
00:47:24,260 --> 00:47:28,160
kicked in, threw me back in the
seat, and I see sparks in my

779
00:47:28,160 --> 00:47:31,460
rear view because I'm hitting
the pavement, I slowed down.

780
00:47:31,700 --> 00:47:35,360
Then I see headlights go the
other way, and then I see him

781
00:47:35,360 --> 00:47:38,960
behind me getting bigger and
bigger. That speedometer only

782
00:47:38,960 --> 00:47:44,140
went to 80. Oh, he told me he
actually won. 39 is what he

783
00:47:44,140 --> 00:47:46,480
clocked me at after I had
already started slowing down.

784
00:47:46,480 --> 00:47:50,740
Yeah, but yeah, he only put 80
on the ticket. And that was

785
00:47:50,740 --> 00:47:53,980
nice. He did do a big Yeah. And
told me all of that too. I was

786
00:47:53,980 --> 00:47:57,700
like, 1920 years old. He told
me, Son, if you'd seen as many

787
00:47:57,700 --> 00:48:00,540
wrecks as I have where the
engine was in the front seat,

788
00:48:01,140 --> 00:48:05,460
you know you'd be, you'd be
pulling people over to slow them

789
00:48:05,460 --> 00:48:07,920
down. Yeah? So, yeah, I got
lucky,

790
00:48:07,980 --> 00:48:11,700
boy, you guys are, because when
I was coming back from Florida

791
00:48:12,480 --> 00:48:17,640
and with my wife, at the time,
we were in a Trans Am, I don't

792
00:48:17,640 --> 00:48:20,600
know how fast I was. I must have
been doing 80, maybe a little

793
00:48:20,600 --> 00:48:26,420
bit over 80. And sure enough,
Alabama State because we crossed

794
00:48:26,420 --> 00:48:31,880
over in Alabama, and Alabama
State Trooper, I met him, and

795
00:48:31,880 --> 00:48:38,480
sure enough, he, I mean, he got
me big black gentleman was not

796
00:48:38,480 --> 00:48:42,100
friendly at all. In fact, put me
in the car with him and said,

797
00:48:42,100 --> 00:48:46,240
We're going to Montgomery. Oh,
going to court. And I said,

798
00:48:46,240 --> 00:48:49,900
Whoa, okay. And you know, my
wife was having to drive the

799
00:48:49,900 --> 00:48:54,700
trans, am following us, and I'm
thinking, God, the whole reason

800
00:48:54,700 --> 00:49:00,180
we were speeding, I want to get
home. And so, so luckily, there

801
00:49:00,180 --> 00:49:05,280
was some woman that came by and
she waved at him, and he

802
00:49:05,280 --> 00:49:09,180
apparently knew her. And all of
a sudden, he pulls over into

803
00:49:09,180 --> 00:49:12,960
this church parking lot and he
goes, I'm gonna let you go ahead

804
00:49:12,960 --> 00:49:17,040
and pay this by mail. He said,
But you better pay it, or you'll

805
00:49:17,040 --> 00:49:20,960
never be allowed back in Alabama
again. I said, Yes, sir,

806
00:49:21,200 --> 00:49:23,660
Yeah, boy, you were lucky too.
Yeah, I was lucky.

807
00:49:23,660 --> 00:49:26,660
Must have had a rendezvous
planned her son. I think he did.

808
00:49:27,319 --> 00:49:28,699
He sure changed man.

809
00:49:32,600 --> 00:49:37,580
She waved. Okay, we're gonna
second thought.

810
00:49:37,700 --> 00:49:41,200
Yeah, you go ahead. We'll pay
this by mail.

811
00:49:42,880 --> 00:49:45,760
That's great. I remember one
time because I I tried to make

812
00:49:45,760 --> 00:49:48,640
the commute fast, and I was
going, there's a stretch of

813
00:49:48,640 --> 00:49:52,120
road, Mount mo road and desert
road, nothing, yeah, a lot of

814
00:49:52,120 --> 00:49:55,180
Whoop de doos. And I was coming
home, and I thought, I see what

815
00:49:55,180 --> 00:49:59,680
this Porsche will do. I'll go
135 I see a car in my rear view

816
00:49:59,680 --> 00:50:04,740
mirror. And it's gaining on me.
I'm thinking, cop cars go that

817
00:50:04,740 --> 00:50:09,180
fast. And then I thought, I'm
going to jail. I'm going to

818
00:50:09,180 --> 00:50:14,280
jail. So I slowed down about 120
no point really. Guy comes right

819
00:50:14,280 --> 00:50:17,520
up, and then he gets alongside
me, and it was my friend's dad,

820
00:50:17,520 --> 00:50:20,480
who's a test pilot out at
Edwards Air Force Base, Bill

821
00:50:20,480 --> 00:50:26,060
Bryden, and he had one of those
Magnum PI Ferraris. Oh, wow. He

822
00:50:26,060 --> 00:50:33,080
waves and gone. I looked down at
my speedometer. I'm 120 miles an

823
00:50:33,080 --> 00:50:38,180
hour, and this guy is flying,
wow. Wow. Used to be able to

824
00:50:38,180 --> 00:50:41,560
open it up there. Oh, yeah,
until the day I came into town,

825
00:50:41,740 --> 00:50:44,440
and I came over the Whoopty doo,
and there's a CHP and a big film

826
00:50:44,440 --> 00:50:44,860
truck,

827
00:50:47,200 --> 00:50:49,720
so I slowed down as best I could
without looking like I was.

828
00:50:52,960 --> 00:50:59,560
And the cop runs to his unit,
his CHP, yeah, California high

829
00:50:59,560 --> 00:51:01,800
patrol, and he pulls around
behind me, and he's following

830
00:51:01,800 --> 00:51:04,440
me, you know. And I know he's
running a license checking I

831
00:51:04,440 --> 00:51:07,200
just pull over and I have
everything ready at the window,

832
00:51:07,200 --> 00:51:09,300
because what you pull over for?
I said, Well, you're going to

833
00:51:09,300 --> 00:51:12,360
pull me over anyway. So I said,
you know? He says, how fast are

834
00:51:12,360 --> 00:51:18,180
you going? About 5055, and he
said, Well, don't you know

835
00:51:18,180 --> 00:51:21,380
you're supposed to slow down
when there's a film crew there.

836
00:51:22,280 --> 00:51:24,800
I said, Well, I'd have known
there was a film crew there if

837
00:51:24,800 --> 00:51:27,200
you were at the top of the hill
signaling traffic like you were

838
00:51:27,200 --> 00:51:30,740
supposed to do. You know, he
looked at me, and he goes, I

839
00:51:30,740 --> 00:51:34,460
scrape guys like you off the
pavement all the time. I said, I

840
00:51:34,460 --> 00:51:37,460
wasn't going that fast, but I
said I had no idea that anybody

841
00:51:37,460 --> 00:51:40,480
was there. Your car was parked
behind the film truck. Can't

842
00:51:40,480 --> 00:51:43,240
even see it. And you were
talking to the director, and

843
00:51:43,240 --> 00:51:46,060
just having a good old time. And
I said, I'm coming down the

844
00:51:46,060 --> 00:51:49,060
road, and I have no idea you're
there, you know, I said, and

845
00:51:49,060 --> 00:51:52,720
that's why they had you there
was to direct traffic. Yeah, it

846
00:51:52,720 --> 00:51:55,240
kind of looks, you can see the
little brain processing. And he

847
00:51:55,240 --> 00:52:00,220
goes, Well, just slow it down.
Let me go. Wow. Well, because I

848
00:52:00,220 --> 00:52:02,520
busted it. I mean, he was
supposed to be doing that so

849
00:52:02,520 --> 00:52:05,940
people would know that they were
filming a commercial. Well,

850
00:52:05,940 --> 00:52:10,140
yeah, you know, I mean, I was
like five miles from the Little

851
00:52:10,140 --> 00:52:16,500
Rock dam where the mafia dumped
bodies. I mean, way out privacy.

852
00:52:16,560 --> 00:52:20,240
I wanted to ask you too, because
one of your early bands was

853
00:52:20,240 --> 00:52:25,040
called Bonnaroo, oh yeah. And
boy, that was, yeah, you would

854
00:52:25,040 --> 00:52:25,820
have covered the but

855
00:52:28,100 --> 00:52:30,560
I was, my name is not como. I
wasn't in that.

856
00:52:32,060 --> 00:52:34,160
No, that's funny. You found that
yeah,

857
00:52:34,220 --> 00:52:37,100
because we have the Bonnaroo
festival, yeah.

858
00:52:37,100 --> 00:52:41,080
Difference was the spelling yes
one in, yes one end. And that

859
00:52:41,620 --> 00:52:44,680
was an interesting thing. I was
just starting to break into

860
00:52:45,340 --> 00:52:50,440
session work after I got out of
college, and I was doing a gig

861
00:52:50,440 --> 00:52:55,660
with Mac Davis, who was, he was
a nice guy. This the material,

862
00:52:55,660 --> 00:52:57,940
some of it was good, but
everything was in the same key,

863
00:52:57,940 --> 00:53:01,740
so it got confusing sometimes,
yeah, you know, because a lot of

864
00:53:01,740 --> 00:53:04,080
the songs became the same,
because they're the same chords,

865
00:53:04,080 --> 00:53:09,720
yeah. And, but Mac was a great
guy, and he had some great songs

866
00:53:09,720 --> 00:53:14,760
too, yeah. So I was doing this
TV show, yeah, which was super

867
00:53:14,820 --> 00:53:18,780
great gig, yeah. And then I got
a call from a bass player, I

868
00:53:18,780 --> 00:53:22,400
think it was Bobby that called
me about this band that they

869
00:53:22,400 --> 00:53:25,700
were putting together on Warner
Brothers, but it was a an

870
00:53:25,700 --> 00:53:29,060
assembly band. In other words,
it was the record company's

871
00:53:29,120 --> 00:53:33,020
idea, yeah, to put this
together, yeah. And Bruce cone

872
00:53:33,020 --> 00:53:35,840
was going to manage us. And
Bruce managed the dubies for 45

873
00:53:36,140 --> 00:53:39,920
years, and he went on to do a
winery, you know, Bruce cone

874
00:53:39,920 --> 00:53:44,260
winery, and he's very successful
guy, and we debate a lot because

875
00:53:44,260 --> 00:53:47,560
he's real conservative. I was
surprised. Yeah, he's he loves

876
00:53:47,560 --> 00:53:52,300
everything that Trump does. So
we Yeah, I said, No, Bruce. But

877
00:53:52,300 --> 00:53:56,080
anyway, so we got together, and
it was the drummer from the

878
00:53:56,080 --> 00:53:59,620
Dubs, Michael hossek, who played
on China Grove and all his great

879
00:53:59,620 --> 00:54:02,700
records. Listen to the music.
Yeah, I love that. Love that

880
00:54:02,700 --> 00:54:06,480
Allison Catherine and me. Love
that record. And the bass player

881
00:54:06,480 --> 00:54:09,120
was Bobby lighting from seals
and cross. Bobby was with them

882
00:54:09,120 --> 00:54:13,800
as a trio. And the guitar player
Jerry Weems, who played with

883
00:54:13,800 --> 00:54:17,700
Ronnie Montrose and Edgar Winter
screaming guitar player, a

884
00:54:17,700 --> 00:54:20,360
singer and rhythm guitar player
named Bobby Winkelman, who

885
00:54:20,360 --> 00:54:25,400
played with Steve Miller and
myself. And it was an

886
00:54:25,400 --> 00:54:28,340
interesting thing, because the
band was still forming. When we

887
00:54:28,340 --> 00:54:31,340
were going into the studio, we
had nailed down our guitar

888
00:54:31,340 --> 00:54:34,220
players, so I had a friend of
mine come in and play guitar on

889
00:54:34,220 --> 00:54:38,360
a song that I wrote and sang and
but we toured Europe. We did the

890
00:54:38,360 --> 00:54:40,720
Warner Brothers music show,
which, to me, was the most

891
00:54:40,720 --> 00:54:45,760
amazing thing I ever saw a
record company do, from the

892
00:54:45,760 --> 00:54:51,880
president of Warner Brothers on
down, the entire staff went six

893
00:54:51,880 --> 00:54:55,960
bands, 12 and a half tons of
gear, five countries. They

894
00:54:55,960 --> 00:54:59,920
booked entire hotels. They set
up a hospitality suite in every.

895
00:55:00,000 --> 00:55:03,780
Hotel that we went to, wow. And
it would have like, video

896
00:55:03,840 --> 00:55:06,960
cassettes of all American
movies, and they'd have orange

897
00:55:06,960 --> 00:55:09,780
juice and donuts and stuff where
the bands could hang out and

898
00:55:09,780 --> 00:55:14,460
talk. And they broke it down
into the Red Tour and the blue

899
00:55:14,460 --> 00:55:19,200
tour, three bands, three bands,
and it was Bonnaroo Graham

900
00:55:19,200 --> 00:55:25,160
Central Station, Montrose Doobie
Brothers, Tower of Power and

901
00:55:25,160 --> 00:55:29,660
little feet. Oh my goodness. So
I got to sit side stage and

902
00:55:29,660 --> 00:55:33,860
watch every Oh, man. So that was
a treat for me. It spoiled me

903
00:55:33,860 --> 00:55:36,500
because I hate crowds, and I
won't go to concerts because

904
00:55:36,500 --> 00:55:40,300
it's just nuts, and people are
too nuts. But watching little

905
00:55:40,300 --> 00:55:44,320
feet play the rainbow Theater in
London, and I was just my jaw

906
00:55:44,320 --> 00:55:46,720
was on the floor, because you
listened to him on record.

907
00:55:46,720 --> 00:55:51,040
That's one thing. You listen to
him live. Lowell, George and

908
00:55:51,580 --> 00:55:56,740
Paul on guitar. Paul Barack,
yeah, unbelievable. They got

909
00:55:56,740 --> 00:56:00,240
five encores at the rainbow.
Wow. And they'd have gotten five

910
00:56:00,240 --> 00:56:03,660
more, they had to stop, and the
Doobie Brothers had to follow

911
00:56:03,660 --> 00:56:07,440
them, you know? And that's when
Baxter was playing with them,

912
00:56:07,440 --> 00:56:11,460
yeah. And I felt so bad for
those guys, because it took them

913
00:56:11,460 --> 00:56:14,700
an hour of playing before they
got this that audience was so

914
00:56:14,700 --> 00:56:17,880
rung out. Oh, man from and they
were so, I mean, they closed

915
00:56:17,880 --> 00:56:19,860
with all Atlanta, and

916
00:56:21,000 --> 00:56:24,380
man, was that Sammy Hagar
Montrose era? Yeah.

917
00:56:24,380 --> 00:56:28,640
Was it? No, no, no. Well, wait,
let me think yes, it was. It was

918
00:56:29,900 --> 00:56:34,340
because Ronnie was playing,
Sammy was singing, and then I'd

919
00:56:34,340 --> 00:56:38,300
watch Graham Central Station.
Oh, yeah, you know Larry Graham

920
00:56:38,300 --> 00:56:41,740
and our bass player, Bobby, had
to ask him. He says, because he

921
00:56:41,740 --> 00:56:45,100
played nylon string bass and
black nylon strings. And he

922
00:56:45,100 --> 00:56:47,500
says, Well, how often do you
have to change him? Larry says,

923
00:56:47,500 --> 00:56:50,560
I never change him, so I take
him off and put him in water and

924
00:56:50,560 --> 00:56:55,780
boil them. Wow, boils him.
What's him back on the bass?

925
00:56:57,460 --> 00:56:58,840
Boy, that bass sound. I mean, he
could,

926
00:56:58,960 --> 00:57:00,460
oh, God, he was

927
00:57:00,460 --> 00:57:03,000
well seasoned strings, yeah? I
mean, I've

928
00:57:03,000 --> 00:57:05,520
never heard of that regular
round ones. I mean, they pick up

929
00:57:05,520 --> 00:57:08,280
all your grease and dirt and
everything. Yeah, you want to

930
00:57:08,280 --> 00:57:10,200
change them, but these

931
00:57:11,580 --> 00:57:14,160
just spoiled them. I'd never
heard anything like that in my

932
00:57:14,160 --> 00:57:14,340
life.

933
00:57:14,520 --> 00:57:19,200
So, Bill, have you ever been
part of film scores and or TV

934
00:57:19,200 --> 00:57:19,680
music?

935
00:57:19,980 --> 00:57:23,300
A little bit, a little bit. I
Well, you had Footloose, didn't

936
00:57:23,300 --> 00:57:27,260
you? Well, I had a song in
there, yeah, but I did a my

937
00:57:27,260 --> 00:57:32,840
first movie was an ABC movie the
week, where it was called

938
00:57:32,840 --> 00:57:37,040
Catherine with sissy SpaceX,
yes, Henry Winkler, and they had

939
00:57:37,040 --> 00:57:39,560
a limited budget, and the
director comes up to me and he

940
00:57:39,560 --> 00:57:46,960
says, Do you know, hiding the
Seventh Symphony, not offhand. I

941
00:57:46,960 --> 00:57:50,020
had this little arch string
ensemble, and I ended up scoring

942
00:57:50,020 --> 00:57:52,540
it out in pages. I wrote it all
out. It was, I don't know how

943
00:57:52,540 --> 00:57:55,360
many pages, yeah, you're doing
this all the time, right? Yeah.

944
00:57:55,480 --> 00:57:59,140
And that ran throughout the
movie, and then we did sound a

945
00:57:59,140 --> 00:58:01,900
likes for beach voice and stuff
like that, because, I guess they

946
00:58:01,900 --> 00:58:05,880
didn't have enough budget to get
the licensing. So we just they

947
00:58:05,880 --> 00:58:09,900
licensed the songs, and then we
just duplicated the records as

948
00:58:09,900 --> 00:58:12,900
close as we could. So that was
fun. That was my first dabble

949
00:58:12,900 --> 00:58:19,260
into it. And then I did a movie
with Keith Olson, and Keith was

950
00:58:19,260 --> 00:58:24,020
like, what a giant he was. He
produced everybody from Stevie

951
00:58:24,020 --> 00:58:27,020
Nicks to starship to, I mean,
you name it. He's done it,

952
00:58:27,020 --> 00:58:32,540
Springfield, Fleetwood Mac and
so he hired me fairly often, and

953
00:58:32,840 --> 00:58:37,340
we got this movie that was then,
this is now that se Hinton

954
00:58:37,340 --> 00:58:41,980
novel, yeah, and it was with
Emilio Estevez and Morgan

955
00:58:41,980 --> 00:58:45,640
Freeman, and there were a couple
other majors in it, and he and I

956
00:58:45,640 --> 00:58:48,280
did the music for that, which is
a lot of fun, you know,

957
00:58:48,280 --> 00:58:52,060
electronic stuff, you know,
synth stuff, kind of like at

958
00:58:52,120 --> 00:58:56,620
Beverly Hills, cop, very goodies
sound, yeah, Harold valdemeyer

959
00:58:56,620 --> 00:59:02,280
kind of stuff. And and then me,
see, I worked, I did a couple

960
00:59:02,280 --> 00:59:06,120
albums with Herb Alpert, and I
did three or four songs on each

961
00:59:06,120 --> 00:59:09,540
one where I arranged for him,
and Herb was like, you know,

962
00:59:09,540 --> 00:59:12,720
being on the A and M campus at
that time, you know, when herb

963
00:59:12,720 --> 00:59:18,300
would walk around, everybody go.
But working with him, you know,

964
00:59:18,300 --> 00:59:21,620
you realize he's a trumpet
player first, and a good one.

965
00:59:22,040 --> 00:59:25,760
And he's very, very keen on
getting things right and doing

966
00:59:25,760 --> 00:59:32,540
it right. So he asked me if I'd
like to arrange a song. And I

967
00:59:32,540 --> 00:59:36,620
said, Sure, and it was for Never
Say, never again, the Bond film,

968
00:59:36,680 --> 00:59:42,280
yeah. And Michael Massa wrote
the song. Michael's a fantastic

969
00:59:42,280 --> 00:59:45,940
writer, but as a piano player,
he's not real conscious of band

970
00:59:45,940 --> 00:59:50,680
timing. So I remember I went to
play piano, and Michael sits

971
00:59:50,680 --> 00:59:53,680
down at the piano. He hands me a
pencil. He goes, here, you

972
00:59:53,680 --> 01:00:01,680
arrange. So they go through
some. Aches. And finally, Carlos

973
01:00:01,800 --> 01:00:04,440
Vega, the drummer, comes to me,
because Billy Boy. He says, You

974
01:00:04,440 --> 01:00:08,280
got to get this guy off the
piano. I said, Yeah, I know. And

975
01:00:08,280 --> 01:00:12,060
I said, so I went up to Michael.
I said, Michael. I said, your

976
01:00:12,060 --> 01:00:15,060
time is all over the place, and
the guys can't follow you. He

977
01:00:15,060 --> 01:00:18,720
goes, Yeah, but I'm in a
separate room. I said, Michael,

978
01:00:18,840 --> 01:00:21,020
you're in their headphones
because Yeah, but I'm in a

979
01:00:21,020 --> 01:00:24,740
separate I said, well, they need
to hear the piano, you know. And

980
01:00:24,740 --> 01:00:28,820
he just couldn't. So finally
went, I handed him the pencil

981
01:00:28,820 --> 01:00:31,460
and sat down and played, yeah.
So that's the way that worked

982
01:00:31,460 --> 01:00:33,800
out. But that was fun and but
Lonnie Hall, when she did the

983
01:00:33,800 --> 01:00:39,980
vocal, she was so funny. We were
in studio, a which is huge, and

984
01:00:39,980 --> 01:00:42,280
she's just sitting in the middle
there. She's got a stool. She's

985
01:00:42,280 --> 01:00:46,060
right under the light, you know.
And I brought out a bowl of

986
01:00:46,060 --> 01:00:48,520
fruit, and I said, Is this okay?
Miss all. We're just playing the

987
01:00:48,520 --> 01:00:53,380
part. Yeah, she's playing the
Jap to a tee. So, great gal, and

988
01:00:53,500 --> 01:00:55,600
she and her were still together,
which I'm tickled to see. I

989
01:00:55,600 --> 01:00:58,660
think I'm gonna try to see him
in March, see if he remembers

990
01:00:58,660 --> 01:01:02,520
the antics that we had back
then, because he was an abstract

991
01:01:02,520 --> 01:01:05,220
guy. I mean, when he was in the
studio, we were working on

992
01:01:05,220 --> 01:01:07,260
something, and he said,

993
01:01:09,780 --> 01:01:12,000
I need more blue sky, less
trees,

994
01:01:13,860 --> 01:01:17,940
trying to decode that. Yeah, no.
But he he thought an abstract,

995
01:01:17,940 --> 01:01:22,820
you know? Yeah. So okay, can do
it, you know, yeah, because we

996
01:01:22,820 --> 01:01:25,820
sat one day in the studio, he
wanted to hear with the drum

997
01:01:25,820 --> 01:01:30,380
machine. He wanted to hear the
difference in the timing between

998
01:01:30,380 --> 01:01:33,260
the downbeat of the bass drum
and the downbeat of the snare.

999
01:01:33,980 --> 01:01:38,360
Let's try it 12 milliseconds
late or 13, you know. And we

1000
01:01:38,360 --> 01:01:41,980
went through, I spent 12 hours
doing that one day. Wow. He was

1001
01:01:41,980 --> 01:01:47,680
the A of A and M. He could do
it, yeah, yeah. But, I mean, but

1002
01:01:47,680 --> 01:01:50,080
he was a nice guy. He signed an
album for me. I never asked for

1003
01:01:50,080 --> 01:01:52,900
it, but I, you know, I did that.
And I'm trying to think of what

1004
01:01:52,900 --> 01:01:55,480
other I just worked on a movie,
but it, I don't know what's

1005
01:01:55,480 --> 01:01:58,540
going to happen with it, because
movies shopping have a less

1006
01:01:58,900 --> 01:02:02,580
success rate, lesser success
rate than records. Oh, yeah, you

1007
01:02:02,580 --> 01:02:06,180
know, so I don't know. And they
keep changing things around.

1008
01:02:06,900 --> 01:02:09,480
He's got family that wants to
insert music, so they'll take a

1009
01:02:09,480 --> 01:02:12,540
piece of mine out and put a bad
piece of music in. I told my guy

1010
01:02:12,540 --> 01:02:15,000
in LA, I said, I think I'm going
to take my name out of the

1011
01:02:15,000 --> 01:02:20,280
credits. I don't want to be
blamed for anything. But I did a

1012
01:02:20,280 --> 01:02:23,000
bunch of scoring for it was a
lot of fun. Yeah, and I've got a

1013
01:02:23,000 --> 01:02:27,320
library now of string stuff, and
it's, it's pretty amazing.

1014
01:02:27,439 --> 01:02:31,399
Well, you've also done a lot of
work in gospel music too. I did,

1015
01:02:31,459 --> 01:02:31,819
you know,

1016
01:02:31,819 --> 01:02:35,959
I that was an interesting foray,
because I was traumatized as a

1017
01:02:35,959 --> 01:02:36,859
child in Catholic

1018
01:02:36,859 --> 01:02:39,379
school. So, yeah, you too. You
were not alone.

1019
01:02:39,379 --> 01:02:43,659
Well, I mean, you know, I went
in the 50s, you know, and it was

1020
01:02:44,439 --> 01:02:49,299
upstate New York. I mean, the
rulers were king, and they were

1021
01:02:49,299 --> 01:02:54,819
weapons. And I saw things happen
that, you know, as a young kid.

1022
01:02:54,819 --> 01:02:58,659
I mean, I started school when I
was four and a half, and I

1023
01:02:58,659 --> 01:03:01,739
remember one day we had those,
remember the old desks that were

1024
01:03:01,739 --> 01:03:06,899
all in a row Yes, and they had
the ink wells and yes? And so

1025
01:03:06,959 --> 01:03:11,699
our kindergarten class was
basically class, walk through

1026
01:03:11,699 --> 01:03:16,499
the Holy garden class,
lunchtime, nap time, walk

1027
01:03:16,499 --> 01:03:19,979
through the Holy garden class.
Home. That was, that was the day

1028
01:03:20,399 --> 01:03:25,099
no recess to just go do what you
want. It was very coordinated.

1029
01:03:25,639 --> 01:03:30,679
And I remember one time we were
laying down for nap time, and my

1030
01:03:30,679 --> 01:03:33,079
friend Eddie was in the next row
over, and we're laying down with

1031
01:03:33,079 --> 01:03:36,679
our heads on the desks, and
we're giggling, uh oh, she

1032
01:03:36,679 --> 01:03:39,919
caught him. This is the pattern
of my life. I usually slip out

1033
01:03:39,919 --> 01:03:45,519
and don't get caught. He got
nailed. And she wraps that ruler

1034
01:03:45,519 --> 01:03:49,659
on the desk and goes, class.
Everybody wake up, and she goes,

1035
01:03:49,659 --> 01:03:53,739
Eddie come up here. Calls in
front of the class, and she

1036
01:03:53,739 --> 01:03:57,159
makes him get up on the chair
and stand on the desk. She goes,

1037
01:03:57,159 --> 01:04:00,039
Eddie doesn't want to rest.
Doesn't want to sleep. He wants

1038
01:04:00,039 --> 01:04:04,979
to giggle like a little girl, so
he should look like a little

1039
01:04:04,979 --> 01:04:08,399
girl. And she puts a Catholic,
one of those Catholic pleated

1040
01:04:08,399 --> 01:04:11,099
skirts on him, oh, man, and
proceeds to have the entire

1041
01:04:11,099 --> 01:04:16,619
class laugh at him. And that
that is burned in my brain,

1042
01:04:16,619 --> 01:04:21,559
because that day that's abusive.
It is, it is. It's like breaking

1043
01:04:21,559 --> 01:04:24,679
the spirit of anything, right?
Animal person, she broke his

1044
01:04:24,679 --> 01:04:28,639
spirit that day. I hated her for
it. I was just so mad, and I

1045
01:04:28,639 --> 01:04:31,219
told my mom stuff like this, and
she couldn't believe it, you

1046
01:04:31,219 --> 01:04:34,819
know, yeah, until I was sick
with 104 fever and I threw up,

1047
01:04:34,879 --> 01:04:38,179
and they made me clean it up.
And that was the day I left

1048
01:04:38,179 --> 01:04:38,839
Catholic school.

1049
01:04:39,799 --> 01:04:42,279
So when these nuns So, yeah, so

1050
01:04:42,400 --> 01:04:45,280
when I'm working with these
Christian artists, and I work

1051
01:04:45,280 --> 01:04:49,360
with some famous ones, and I
work with some not famous ones,

1052
01:04:50,020 --> 01:04:53,560
and they said, Well, what church
do you go to? I said, church.

1053
01:04:53,740 --> 01:04:57,340
Said, sometimes I go. I don't
normally. Yeah, I said, you

1054
01:04:57,340 --> 01:05:00,300
probably classify me as a
heathen. But I said. The very

1055
01:05:00,300 --> 01:05:03,720
fact that I'm here tells you
that I am a recovering Catholic.

1056
01:05:07,140 --> 01:05:11,160
It was, that's a great one,
yeah, and I, but I got to work

1057
01:05:11,160 --> 01:05:14,340
with, I'll tell you, the guy who
really impressed me, because the

1058
01:05:14,340 --> 01:05:18,120
Christian industry at that time
had big people, and then I had

1059
01:05:18,120 --> 01:05:22,324
big fish and small pond people.
And I got to work with Larnell

1060
01:05:22,324 --> 01:05:27,304
Harris. And larnell's career had
been around. He had been

1061
01:05:27,304 --> 01:05:32,584
established for 18 years, and
Benson records wanted to revive

1062
01:05:32,584 --> 01:05:35,764
his career with a little pop
injection, so they hired Robert

1063
01:05:35,764 --> 01:05:41,920
and I to do it. And I remember
he says, who'd you work with in

1064
01:05:41,920 --> 01:05:46,300
LA? And I told him, he goes,
Steve Perry, Sam Cook just like

1065
01:05:46,300 --> 01:05:50,440
that. There's a lot of Sam Cooke
and Steve Perry. I won't argue

1066
01:05:50,440 --> 01:05:53,980
there, yeah, and, but he was the
kind of guy. I mean, I swear I

1067
01:05:54,040 --> 01:05:58,060
probably the only guy I was
nervous around in that when I

1068
01:05:58,060 --> 01:06:03,180
hit record, because I had the 24
track then I better be set mic

1069
01:06:03,180 --> 01:06:07,800
levels, preamp levels, level to
tape, because when he sang that

1070
01:06:07,800 --> 01:06:11,700
first time, he was like,
Sinatra, that was it. Wow, you

1071
01:06:11,700 --> 01:06:14,940
know, yeah, you talked earlier
about Bowen. That's a funny

1072
01:06:14,940 --> 01:06:20,720
story, too. With Sinatra, Bowen
told us the story he was dating

1073
01:06:20,720 --> 01:06:22,340
his daughter, but he didn't tell
Frank.

1074
01:06:22,340 --> 01:06:24,920
Yes, he's told that story to us,
yeah.

1075
01:06:25,100 --> 01:06:27,980
So yeah, he was working on a
song called,

1076
01:06:29,600 --> 01:06:31,040
if it was my way.

1077
01:06:33,080 --> 01:06:37,760
Anyway, the the microphone was
crackling when Frank did his

1078
01:06:37,760 --> 01:06:41,860
vocal, and the engineer was
like, freaking out. And Jimmy

1079
01:06:41,860 --> 01:06:45,220
had to be the one to tell
Sinatra that that he'd have to

1080
01:06:45,220 --> 01:06:47,920
sing it again. And he's got his
two goons with him in the

1081
01:06:47,920 --> 01:06:55,120
studio. So finally, this is
great, typical bow, and he says

1082
01:06:55,540 --> 01:07:01,080
he's a smart guy, man, he says,
Frankie says, I'm afraid we'll

1083
01:07:01,080 --> 01:07:05,160
have to do another that's just
not the right take. And Sinatra

1084
01:07:05,160 --> 01:07:10,440
goes, the right take is the one
I just sang. He says, Well, I'd

1085
01:07:10,440 --> 01:07:14,340
like you to put a little more
force into it, a little more

1086
01:07:14,340 --> 01:07:18,540
aggressiveness into the wrong
word of the song, right? And he

1087
01:07:18,540 --> 01:07:23,300
was aggressive. Sinatra was a
little mad, but he did it. He

1088
01:07:23,300 --> 01:07:26,720
sang it. And then Jimmy said, he
went and burned the lacquer. You

1089
01:07:26,720 --> 01:07:28,640
know, those days they'd send the
lacquer over, and they

1090
01:07:28,640 --> 01:07:31,520
messengered the lacquer over to
Sinatra. And he said, The next

1091
01:07:31,520 --> 01:07:35,120
day he got a studio call, no
introduction as to who it was.

1092
01:07:35,120 --> 01:07:38,840
He picks up the phone, he goes,
You were right. Click. That was

1093
01:07:38,840 --> 01:07:42,700
it. Wow. Just like that. And I
went because he said, you know,

1094
01:07:42,700 --> 01:07:43,360
he was 25

1095
01:07:43,600 --> 01:07:46,180
years old, yeah, no, he was a
young guy when he did all that

1096
01:07:46,240 --> 01:07:48,520
with Dean Martin Sammy Davis,
Jr.

1097
01:07:48,700 --> 01:07:51,580
He, you know, he had quite a
history, and that's, I mean, to

1098
01:07:51,580 --> 01:07:54,040
survive that and to succeed at
that. Yeah.

1099
01:07:54,040 --> 01:07:57,100
Well, Bowen did produce
strangers in the night for for

1100
01:07:57,100 --> 01:08:01,500
Sinatra. And everybody loves
somebody, Dean Martin, yeah. So

1101
01:08:01,500 --> 01:08:05,700
yeah. And as you say, he was,
like, in his 20s, incredible.

1102
01:08:05,700 --> 01:08:09,120
He had a great story about
Sinatra, where he said he'd be

1103
01:08:09,120 --> 01:08:11,820
the kind of guy that in the
studio if he had an orchestra in

1104
01:08:11,820 --> 01:08:16,020
there, and he said, you'd have
several pieces, and he would

1105
01:08:16,020 --> 01:08:21,440
stop and go that second string.
He said, That guy's a little

1106
01:08:21,440 --> 01:08:24,140
sharp. He said he was right.

1107
01:08:24,620 --> 01:08:27,920
Well, you know the story about
that, don't you? He was working

1108
01:08:27,920 --> 01:08:32,900
with Sid in LA, yeah, and the
guys weren't giving him what he

1109
01:08:32,900 --> 01:08:36,560
needed. They figured Jimmy
Bowen's 25 he doesn't know what

1110
01:08:36,560 --> 01:08:39,860
he's doing. So Bowen sent him on
a 10 because you have to take a

1111
01:08:39,860 --> 01:08:43,180
union 10 every hour. Yeah, right
now I go out and talk about

1112
01:08:43,180 --> 01:08:50,200
their airplanes and stuff. So
the string player that was

1113
01:08:50,200 --> 01:08:52,840
giving him the most grief, he
thought, he went over and he

1114
01:08:52,840 --> 01:08:58,840
took one of the strings and de
tuned it, and then he hustles

1115
01:08:58,840 --> 01:09:01,440
them back in because they had
210s and they had to make up

1116
01:09:01,440 --> 01:09:03,420
time. Yeah, it's okay,
everybody, let's go. Gotta go.

1117
01:09:03,420 --> 01:09:07,620
Gotta make up time. Count it.
Off. They go. And in the middle

1118
01:09:07,620 --> 01:09:11,820
of the take, Bowen stops him,
yeah, and says, He points to the

1119
01:09:11,820 --> 01:09:15,180
violin player. Says, check your
tuning. He says, I think one of

1120
01:09:15,180 --> 01:09:18,420
your strings is out of tune.
Yeah, I just tuned this thing.

1121
01:09:18,420 --> 01:09:23,240
So he checks it, and it's out of
tune. Rest of the day, Bowen

1122
01:09:23,240 --> 01:09:28,400
said those guys were like, Yes,
sir. No, sir, Mr. Bowen, because

1123
01:09:28,940 --> 01:09:32,240
they figured, if he's got ears,
like, yeah, he's smart. Yeah, it

1124
01:09:32,240 --> 01:09:34,940
was very smart. I mean, he's a
sharp guy. And I remember we

1125
01:09:34,940 --> 01:09:37,940
were always trying to figure out
why it sounded important. He

1126
01:09:37,940 --> 01:09:40,900
didn't have a wall. So we
always, at the end of the song,

1127
01:09:40,900 --> 01:09:45,520
we'd rate for wait for Bowen to
go and off, you know? Because

1128
01:09:45,520 --> 01:09:49,360
that's how we do it. You want to
yell because to the wall, yeah,

1129
01:09:49,360 --> 01:09:53,440
you know. But he did, and he was
smart the way he did sessions.

1130
01:09:53,500 --> 01:09:58,540
Beside the joke about the 50 and
250 he knew that if he kept his

1131
01:09:58,540 --> 01:10:03,240
players together. And got the
band cohesive, he'd get a better

1132
01:10:03,240 --> 01:10:09,120
product, you know, he very much
aware of that, so he'd have

1133
01:10:09,120 --> 01:10:12,540
lunch catered in, have fabulous
lunches. Oh, wow. So we'd all

1134
01:10:12,540 --> 01:10:18,000
sit around and talk, and it was,
I mean, it was really a good

1135
01:10:18,000 --> 01:10:21,140
idea and a good hang, yeah? And
that's what he did. And I

1136
01:10:21,140 --> 01:10:23,540
thought, Man, this guy is smart.
He knows how to produce a

1137
01:10:23,540 --> 01:10:27,200
record. He knows how to get
results out of the players. So,

1138
01:10:27,200 --> 01:10:30,920
I mean, I did a bunch of work
for him. Yeah, cool. Yeah. It

1139
01:10:30,920 --> 01:10:34,040
was fun. I mean, I I was lucky.
I mean, I'm not a country guy,

1140
01:10:34,040 --> 01:10:35,600
but I played enough to get by.

1141
01:10:36,260 --> 01:10:39,620
What was like working with trace
Adkins?

1142
01:10:39,740 --> 01:10:44,500
He it was his first record.
Yeah? So he a nice guy, general

1143
01:10:44,500 --> 01:10:47,440
giant. Oh, he's cool, a voice
that comes out of his boots,

1144
01:10:47,500 --> 01:10:50,500
yeah. I mean, I never talked to
a guy that had such a baritone

1145
01:10:50,500 --> 01:10:55,060
well, and plus, he's the size of
you and I together, yeah, yeah.

1146
01:10:55,420 --> 01:10:59,920
And he, I saw him. I hadn't seen
him in years. And my mastering

1147
01:10:59,920 --> 01:11:04,260
guy, Brian, who worked with me
in LA he lost his wife, young to

1148
01:11:04,260 --> 01:11:08,700
cancer, and she ran Gary bormans
management in town, so she

1149
01:11:08,700 --> 01:11:13,200
managed trace and Lone Star, and
she was contract queen. This

1150
01:11:13,200 --> 01:11:17,760
woman scary, I wish she was. And
trace even said at the funeral.

1151
01:11:17,760 --> 01:11:20,480
He said she was like a rooster
in a barnyard. I was petrified

1152
01:11:20,480 --> 01:11:23,600
of her, and I can see little
Joanie, like, five foot one,

1153
01:11:23,600 --> 01:11:28,700
yeah, here's back it up, you
know, because it was great. But

1154
01:11:28,700 --> 01:11:31,460
he was really nice. He was a
very nice guy. And that's the

1155
01:11:31,460 --> 01:11:36,080
thing that impressed me about
Nashville, in that the artists

1156
01:11:36,440 --> 01:11:39,440
there wasn't this, well, you get
there and rehearse and I'll be

1157
01:11:39,440 --> 01:11:43,840
by later kind of thing, yeah, if
we, if we were down in Fort

1158
01:11:43,840 --> 01:11:48,040
Payne rehearsing with Randy in
the band, Randy sang for nine

1159
01:11:48,040 --> 01:11:50,800
hours, if we played for nine
hours, yeah, that's the way it

1160
01:11:50,800 --> 01:11:56,080
was. And, man, you know, I never
saw that was usually like, well,

1161
01:11:56,080 --> 01:11:58,600
you know, I'll be there later.
You guys work it out.

1162
01:11:58,660 --> 01:12:02,580
I'm sure you not asking you to
name names, but I'm sure you had

1163
01:12:02,580 --> 01:12:05,640
some pretty unpleasant
experiences working with certain

1164
01:12:05,640 --> 01:12:09,540
artists too, right? Yeah, yeah,
I can

1165
01:12:09,660 --> 01:12:16,320
imagine that unpleasant just a
little harder to manage. I

1166
01:12:16,320 --> 01:12:22,460
produced with Kim, a duet with
her and Barbra Streisand and

1167
01:12:23,000 --> 01:12:26,540
that was an interesting
experience. I went over to

1168
01:12:26,540 --> 01:12:29,540
Barbara's house, and the weird
thing was, you know, she's in

1169
01:12:29,540 --> 01:12:32,660
Beverly Hills, and she's got
gardeners all around, you know,

1170
01:12:32,660 --> 01:12:34,940
and they're looking in the
window, because Kim Karnes and

1171
01:12:34,940 --> 01:12:38,360
Barbara standing over the piano
singing, and I'm looking, and

1172
01:12:38,360 --> 01:12:42,760
there's this Mexican outside the
window. He's already clipped

1173
01:12:42,760 --> 01:12:46,300
ahead, but he just moving so he
can look in the window, yeah?

1174
01:12:46,960 --> 01:12:49,840
And I thought I could never live
like that. I mean, you know,

1175
01:12:49,840 --> 01:12:53,980
being like, in a fish tank. Oh,
you know, but they're leaning

1176
01:12:53,980 --> 01:12:56,920
over singing, and I'm playing,
I'm going, this is gonna be

1177
01:12:56,980 --> 01:13:01,980
great, yeah. And it wasn't, it
was interesting. I mean, Kim

1178
01:13:01,980 --> 01:13:04,380
could come in here and tell you
stories. There were seven

1179
01:13:04,380 --> 01:13:05,640
producers on that record,

1180
01:13:05,760 --> 01:13:09,240
like mercy, wow. Way too many
cooks in the kitchen.

1181
01:13:09,240 --> 01:13:15,240
Yeah. And the politics, only one
gentleman produced three signs,

1182
01:13:16,500 --> 01:13:19,320
wow. That was Maurice White from
Earth, Wind and Fire, Wind and

1183
01:13:19,320 --> 01:13:24,980
Fire. And I didn't know Maurice,
but I was walking down the halls

1184
01:13:24,980 --> 01:13:27,140
of A and m1 day, and he was
coming the other way, and he

1185
01:13:27,140 --> 01:13:31,460
goes, Hey, Bill. I says, Well,
hi Maurice. How are you? He

1186
01:13:31,460 --> 01:13:35,660
says, Well, I've learned one
thing working with Barbara

1187
01:13:35,660 --> 01:13:40,420
Streisand. I said, What's that?
He says, I never, ever want to

1188
01:13:40,420 --> 01:13:43,780
work with her again. And he was
not a man to say anything. Yeah,

1189
01:13:43,780 --> 01:13:48,520
swear. He was very spiritual
guy, and I love that band, so I

1190
01:13:48,520 --> 01:13:51,100
Oh, yeah, you know, I was just
in awe. I even knew I was, you

1191
01:13:51,100 --> 01:13:57,280
know, coming down the hall, but
he was trying. And I'm doing a

1192
01:13:57,280 --> 01:14:01,440
string session for her. I got 36
of the best string players,

1193
01:14:01,500 --> 01:14:04,440
yeah, and I got the charts all
written out, and I'm sharing the

1194
01:14:04,440 --> 01:14:07,320
three hour date with Lee
holridge, who's an amazing

1195
01:14:07,320 --> 01:14:13,200
arranger. So we split the time,
and I get out there, and I'm

1196
01:14:13,200 --> 01:14:17,040
trying to get everybody right,
and they know who I am, because

1197
01:14:17,040 --> 01:14:23,720
I play synth and I do string
parts, and they hate me. So I

1198
01:14:23,720 --> 01:14:27,080
must have, I must have called on
Jimmy Bowen's spirit, because I

1199
01:14:27,080 --> 01:14:29,660
didn't, hadn't met him yet, and
Laura heard those stories. Yeah,

1200
01:14:30,020 --> 01:14:35,840
but I, I did a run through, and
it was, oh, it was amazing. And

1201
01:14:35,840 --> 01:14:38,780
I finally said, after the run
through, I said, you know? I

1202
01:14:38,780 --> 01:14:41,500
said, I know you people, some of
you know, who I am, and I what I

1203
01:14:41,500 --> 01:14:44,980
do, and I play synthesizer,
because this was at the time

1204
01:14:44,980 --> 01:14:48,280
when electronic instruments were
starting to replace players.

1205
01:14:48,580 --> 01:14:52,180
Everybody was petrified they'd
lose their job, kind of the same

1206
01:14:52,180 --> 01:14:56,080
fear we have with AI now, you
know, yeah, and drum machines

1207
01:14:56,080 --> 01:14:58,420
were out, and drummers were
getting nervous, you know, and

1208
01:14:58,420 --> 01:15:02,160
paying attention to following
the clip. Better. And I said,

1209
01:15:02,160 --> 01:15:04,620
so. I said, You know what I do?
But I said, I have to tell you,

1210
01:15:04,740 --> 01:15:08,340
I said, and this was the truth.
I said, sitting in front of 36

1211
01:15:08,580 --> 01:15:11,760
of Hollywood's finest. I said,
You will never, ever be

1212
01:15:11,760 --> 01:15:15,960
replaced, ever. Yeah, I got a
standing O for that. And the

1213
01:15:15,960 --> 01:15:20,840
next take, wow, they knocked it
out of the park. Cool, but it

1214
01:15:20,840 --> 01:15:23,840
was cool. But then So Barbara,
right in the middle of all this,

1215
01:15:23,840 --> 01:15:32,600
yeah, Bill, I don't like the way
I sang the word they, Oh Lord,

1216
01:15:33,440 --> 01:15:38,060
I'm thinking they only know how
I feel that day. Okay, well,

1217
01:15:38,060 --> 01:15:41,500
Barbara, I said, we're in a
different studio, different

1218
01:15:41,500 --> 01:15:45,160
mics, different engineer,
different console. She was, I

1219
01:15:45,160 --> 01:15:51,880
don't care, that's his job. Tell
him to do it. Whoa. Okay, so it

1220
01:15:51,880 --> 01:15:54,460
was a little bit of that, yeah,
you know. And I'm not used to

1221
01:15:54,460 --> 01:16:00,240
that, yeah, hey, he's an
engineer. So she changed it. But

1222
01:16:00,240 --> 01:16:05,160
then when she approached Kim, we
had done the demo with her band,

1223
01:16:05,640 --> 01:16:08,280
and we all played, and Barbara
loved it. So we're thinking,

1224
01:16:08,280 --> 01:16:11,760
okay, so we hired the same band
we all played, she loved it. And

1225
01:16:11,760 --> 01:16:14,160
then I just took the string
parts that I did on keyboards

1226
01:16:14,160 --> 01:16:17,460
and I wrote them out for a
section, yeah, and everything

1227
01:16:17,460 --> 01:16:20,600
was fine. And then she says to
me, and that's a ballad. Mind

1228
01:16:20,600 --> 01:16:23,480
you, a very slow ballad, and
it's the same one that Kenny

1229
01:16:23,480 --> 01:16:26,600
Rogers Ronnie Millsap did make
no mistake She's mine. Yeah,

1230
01:16:26,600 --> 01:16:30,140
make no mistake He's mine. So
she says, Well, when it gets to

1231
01:16:30,140 --> 01:16:34,940
the bridge, I want to get that
part. I said, Barbara said it's

1232
01:16:34,940 --> 01:16:40,360
a ballad. There's not going to
be any yet that that that, well,

1233
01:16:40,840 --> 01:16:45,940
so we go down to Richard Perry's
studio, and the one he built on

1234
01:16:45,940 --> 01:16:51,040
Pointer Sisters fame, and I
hired Ray Kelly, who's top

1235
01:16:51,040 --> 01:16:54,820
cellist in town. I wrote out a
cello part for him, and Barbara

1236
01:16:54,820 --> 01:16:57,760
wasn't there, so he had these
big Yuri monitors. And so she

1237
01:16:57,820 --> 01:17:00,660
would call the studio, and I
take the phone, and I'd hold up

1238
01:17:00,660 --> 01:17:03,420
the phone, and she'd listen to
it, then she'd say, Okay, I want

1239
01:17:03,420 --> 01:17:06,660
this. I want that. And I did
that, and I'll call back. So I

1240
01:17:06,660 --> 01:17:11,820
wrote another part out. I gave
it to Ray. She calls back, I

1241
01:17:11,820 --> 01:17:16,920
want this and that five times.
What's going on? Finally, Ray

1242
01:17:16,920 --> 01:17:19,620
Kelly, I mean, you know, string
players are very quiet and

1243
01:17:19,620 --> 01:17:24,920
political in nature. And he
says, What does what on earth

1244
01:17:24,980 --> 01:17:30,740
does this woman want? He says,
You just wrote five great cello

1245
01:17:30,740 --> 01:17:33,080
parts, yeah. And I thought,
coming from Ray, that was a

1246
01:17:33,080 --> 01:17:35,900
compliment. I I said, well,
thanks. And I said, Welcome to

1247
01:17:35,900 --> 01:17:40,780
my world, because, you know, and
then then we were doing vocals

1248
01:17:40,780 --> 01:17:43,600
at the village, another fine
studio in Santa Monica, and she

1249
01:17:43,600 --> 01:17:47,020
couldn't hear herself. But she
had the engineer have her voice

1250
01:17:47,380 --> 01:17:51,160
so loud in the phones that she
couldn't hear, you know, it was

1251
01:17:51,160 --> 01:17:54,220
just her voice, yeah, powering
everything, you know, yeah. And,

1252
01:17:54,820 --> 01:17:59,140
I mean, live, that woman is
scary good, on how good she is.

1253
01:17:59,680 --> 01:18:03,000
So, I mean, it was, it was a
learning experience for me,

1254
01:18:03,000 --> 01:18:07,500
because I don't tolerate prima
donna as much. I don't have a

1255
01:18:07,500 --> 01:18:10,320
lot of patience for that. No,
you know, we're there to make

1256
01:18:10,320 --> 01:18:12,900
music and make it the best we
can make it. So don't be an ass.

1257
01:18:12,900 --> 01:18:16,080
Do you think some people just
are naturally wired to F with

1258
01:18:16,080 --> 01:18:16,800
other people?

1259
01:18:16,800 --> 01:18:20,540
Yeah, you know, I think so maybe
upbringing or something, you

1260
01:18:20,540 --> 01:18:20,780
know,

1261
01:18:21,200 --> 01:18:23,480
you know, I'm in a position
where I can get away with this

1262
01:18:23,480 --> 01:18:26,720
and have act bad, have bad
behavior. Yeah, I can be a diva,

1263
01:18:26,780 --> 01:18:29,240
yeah, you know. And it's like, I
just want to see how far I can

1264
01:18:29,240 --> 01:18:30,500
push you before you break.

1265
01:18:31,340 --> 01:18:35,120
I don't know. I mean, I just, I
had a that was my experience,

1266
01:18:35,120 --> 01:18:41,320
you know, the record, okay, from
a psychology standpoint, Kim, we

1267
01:18:41,320 --> 01:18:44,620
got the record, you know? She's
Barbara. Said to me, she goes,

1268
01:18:46,120 --> 01:18:50,200
Kim sings the first verse with
just the band. Barbara comes in

1269
01:18:50,200 --> 01:18:55,240
on the second verse, 36 strings,
an oboe, you know? Yeah,

1270
01:18:55,240 --> 01:18:57,940
addition. And Barbara said to
me, she goes, it's not big

1271
01:18:57,940 --> 01:19:01,080
enough. Said, Barbara, you got
the whole string section. She

1272
01:19:01,080 --> 01:19:05,400
says, That's not big enough. So
she goes, double it. So I

1273
01:19:05,400 --> 01:19:10,380
doubled it. Now it's, you know,
72 strings.

1274
01:19:12,300 --> 01:19:14,940
And then she says, and she says,
it's

1275
01:19:15,240 --> 01:19:19,560
still not big enough. Triple it.
What she doesn't realize is, you

1276
01:19:19,560 --> 01:19:24,020
get, you get to a point where
the doubling and tripling, it

1277
01:19:24,020 --> 01:19:27,320
starts to cancel out. It starts
to sound smaller than bigger.

1278
01:19:27,860 --> 01:19:31,640
You know, it just with the same
section. It didn't so now I got

1279
01:19:31,640 --> 01:19:35,720
108 strings, and it's not big.
So Kim invites me over, and we

1280
01:19:35,960 --> 01:19:38,000
were sitting down to listen to
the record. She's got the

1281
01:19:38,000 --> 01:19:40,940
record. She hands me the album.
And of course, the album is just

1282
01:19:40,940 --> 01:19:46,060
Barbara's head shot on the front
cover, of course. And Barbara

1283
01:19:46,060 --> 01:19:48,400
had told Kim, she goes, Oh, come
on over. We're going to take

1284
01:19:48,400 --> 01:19:52,360
some publicity photos. So Kim
says, I you know, I went over

1285
01:19:52,360 --> 01:19:56,800
kind of casually for blue jeans
and whatnot. Yeah. Kim says,

1286
01:19:56,800 --> 01:20:00,180
when I get there, then I find
out it's back cover shot. It,

1287
01:20:00,180 --> 01:20:04,380
and Barbara didn't tell me, so
then she hands me the record,

1288
01:20:04,380 --> 01:20:07,800
and I'm looking at the 33 in the
back. She goes, you see anything

1289
01:20:07,800 --> 01:20:14,100
funny I'm looking Barbara had
the graphic designer die Kim's

1290
01:20:14,100 --> 01:20:18,840
eyes brown. Oh, wow, because
there's only room for one blue

1291
01:20:18,840 --> 01:20:22,400
eyed singer on that. And I went,
wow, there's a real deep insight

1292
01:20:22,400 --> 01:20:23,660
more into the psyche.

1293
01:20:24,620 --> 01:20:27,380
Yeah, when you're doubling and
tripling, stuff like that, does

1294
01:20:27,380 --> 01:20:30,380
she know what you're doing while
she's watching you? Does she

1295
01:20:30,380 --> 01:20:32,060
know the techno tech like

1296
01:20:32,120 --> 01:20:34,640
I think so. I mean, she just
wanted it bigger, and I

1297
01:20:34,640 --> 01:20:38,120
understand that. But when we put
the song on, yeah, she went to

1298
01:20:38,120 --> 01:20:41,800
mastering. This is really crazy
when you listen to it, when the

1299
01:20:41,800 --> 01:20:45,160
second verse comes in, she had
the mastering guy crank up the

1300
01:20:45,220 --> 01:20:49,780
level. So not only do 108
strings come in, the track gets

1301
01:20:49,780 --> 01:20:51,700
visibly and audibly louder.

1302
01:20:52,600 --> 01:20:57,280
Doesn't mean that's like for me
sometimes just like, okay, maybe

1303
01:20:57,280 --> 01:21:00,240
I can push back a little bit
here and test you, and maybe

1304
01:21:00,240 --> 01:21:02,880
I'll just do a little bit of a
stereo pan to make it sound

1305
01:21:02,880 --> 01:21:06,360
bigger. Yeah. I mean, yeah,
cross your mind. Yeah.

1306
01:21:06,660 --> 01:21:10,500
Did. Sklar told me a story a
long time ago. Leland said he

1307
01:21:10,500 --> 01:21:13,560
had this bass rig that he set up
when we did Billy Thorpe's album

1308
01:21:13,560 --> 01:21:19,560
from Australia, and it was 3500
watts. Wow. He said, I can

1309
01:21:19,560 --> 01:21:22,880
literally play a concert and
make the first the first three

1310
01:21:22,880 --> 01:21:28,100
rows in the audience poop their
pants involuntarily. The amount

1311
01:21:28,100 --> 01:21:31,340
of vibration I can generate out
of this.

1312
01:21:31,340 --> 01:21:33,260
You remember the Oakland
earthquake in 1989

1313
01:21:34,700 --> 01:21:37,700
he had a switch on his base,

1314
01:21:39,620 --> 01:21:42,940
toggle switch, like you see on a
telly. And he goes, I call this

1315
01:21:42,940 --> 01:21:48,760
my producer's switch. And he
says, it does absolutely

1316
01:21:48,760 --> 01:21:53,320
nothing. And he said, When he
gets in working for a client

1317
01:21:53,440 --> 01:21:57,340
that he doesn't know and who he
knows doesn't know anything, he

1318
01:21:57,340 --> 01:22:00,660
says, then they'll say to him,
Leland, we're not happy with the

1319
01:22:00,660 --> 01:22:03,300
sound of your bass. Can you get
a little more punch out of it?

1320
01:22:03,300 --> 01:22:07,560
Oh, he goes, Sure. He flips the
switch. He plays the exact same

1321
01:22:07,680 --> 01:22:11,340
thing, exact same thing. And
then they go, that's terrific.

1322
01:22:13,140 --> 01:22:20,360
And then I know for sure they're
an asshole. It was a great

1323
01:22:20,360 --> 01:22:24,140
story, but that, you know, that
happens a lot? Oh yes, that

1324
01:22:24,140 --> 01:22:25,340
power of suggestion.

1325
01:22:25,340 --> 01:22:27,500
Well, it's even like with
audiences, you know, you'll have

1326
01:22:27,500 --> 01:22:30,980
somebody in a audience, in the
club, and they'll come up to you

1327
01:22:30,980 --> 01:22:34,220
and say, you know, you're you
guys playing too loud. Can you

1328
01:22:34,280 --> 01:22:37,760
turn it down? We'd always like,
act like we were, yeah, yeah.

1329
01:22:37,760 --> 01:22:40,100
Didn't do anything. And they go,
Yeah, perfect.

1330
01:22:40,099 --> 01:22:43,419
How many times have you guys
been mixing a radio spot and

1331
01:22:43,419 --> 01:22:46,059
same client comes back? Music's
just really too hot, yeah,

1332
01:22:46,059 --> 01:22:50,259
really too Oh, okay. And I'll
literally just re render it with

1333
01:22:50,259 --> 01:22:54,579
just a smidge pulled down. I
won't even move the mouse that

1334
01:22:54,579 --> 01:22:58,719
much. I'll just be like, Yeah,
and I re render it and like,

1335
01:22:58,719 --> 01:23:01,799
how's that? Oh, that's great.
Yeah, okay,

1336
01:23:03,360 --> 01:23:07,920
there's that, you know, there is
that. But, you know, it's been

1337
01:23:07,920 --> 01:23:11,340
an interesting ride. I mean,
because people said, if you

1338
01:23:11,340 --> 01:23:13,500
write a book, what would you
call it? And I said, my

1339
01:23:13,500 --> 01:23:17,280
accidental life, yeah, because I
never intended to do this. I

1340
01:23:17,280 --> 01:23:20,960
mean, it was not when I was five
months old, my father died in a

1341
01:23:20,960 --> 01:23:27,320
plane crash. So he flew in World
War Two on loan to England, when

1342
01:23:27,320 --> 01:23:30,500
America had a program to provide
the British with pilots because

1343
01:23:30,500 --> 01:23:33,800
they were short, yeah, from all
the fighting, and he made it

1344
01:23:33,800 --> 01:23:36,920
through the whole war, came
back, started a flight school

1345
01:23:37,040 --> 01:23:40,960
upstate New York, and his buddy
brought a plane back that he had

1346
01:23:40,960 --> 01:23:44,560
taken a student up in those days
they were the sticks, no, yeah,

1347
01:23:44,560 --> 01:23:47,620
and he said it's feeling a
little funny. So they both took

1348
01:23:47,620 --> 01:23:51,100
the plane up, and it went in
straight in 1000 feet. Wow. So

1349
01:23:51,100 --> 01:23:57,580
that was that. So my mom married
Lou, my stepdad, when I was

1350
01:23:57,580 --> 01:24:05,280
five, Lou played piano, and
there my torture began. But, I

1351
01:24:05,280 --> 01:24:08,700
mean, he was, he was my teacher,
yeah, so, you know, come out

1352
01:24:08,880 --> 01:24:11,640
Wednesday. I remember my lessons
were on Saturday, and he'd say,

1353
01:24:11,880 --> 01:24:16,320
Billy, how's your bot coming? I
said, it's coming along. Let me

1354
01:24:16,320 --> 01:24:18,960
hear it. Said, Well, I thought
my lesson was Saturday, because

1355
01:24:18,960 --> 01:24:24,140
let me hear it now. So, but, I
mean, that's funny how fate and

1356
01:24:24,140 --> 01:24:24,800
things work.

1357
01:24:24,860 --> 01:24:27,860
Well, you went to UCLA. How did
you get from one coast to the

1358
01:24:27,860 --> 01:24:28,340
other?

1359
01:24:29,240 --> 01:24:33,260
Yeah, well, that's a that's a
story in itself. My father

1360
01:24:33,260 --> 01:24:36,140
worked six nights a week in a
jazz club with his two brothers.

1361
01:24:36,140 --> 01:24:39,020
They played, and he had a day
job at the American local

1362
01:24:39,140 --> 01:24:42,340
locomotive club or factory,
whatever it was, it's like a

1363
01:24:42,340 --> 01:24:46,720
club. And they closed, they
closed their doors, and he said

1364
01:24:46,720 --> 01:24:51,100
he couldn't find a job, but
really he wanted to. He says,

1365
01:24:51,100 --> 01:24:56,020
Well, we're going to go to
Florida, okay, but we went to

1366
01:24:56,020 --> 01:24:59,680
California, where his family
was. I don't think we were ever

1367
01:24:59,680 --> 01:25:03,600
going. Of Florida. Next thing I
know, I'm a house full of crazy

1368
01:25:03,600 --> 01:25:08,340
Italians, you know, I'm half
Irish paper so, you know, it was

1369
01:25:08,580 --> 01:25:12,900
crazy. Grandmother, grandfather,
my uncle, my aunt, my father, my

1370
01:25:12,900 --> 01:25:16,080
mother, my sister, my brother,
all in one house. Wow, one of

1371
01:25:16,080 --> 01:25:19,320
those big old Hollywood houses,
you know, yeah, on DeLong pray.

1372
01:25:19,800 --> 01:25:23,780
And I was like, Is this my life?
I'd have to climb out the window

1373
01:25:23,780 --> 01:25:26,660
and climb up a tree to have
peace and quiet, yeah. So I

1374
01:25:26,660 --> 01:25:30,140
think then the seas were cast
for me moving to the dome house

1375
01:25:30,140 --> 01:25:36,260
in the forest, because I've got,
I don't like loud houses, you

1376
01:25:36,260 --> 01:25:38,540
know. It's just not me, you
know. And that place was like a

1377
01:25:38,540 --> 01:25:45,880
man, a man. Wow. So we never
left. Yeah, we never left. And I

1378
01:25:45,880 --> 01:25:50,020
remember when my mom and I drove
up to New York for her sister's

1379
01:25:50,020 --> 01:25:54,580
90th and so we made the we made
the drive. My mom was probably,

1380
01:25:54,580 --> 01:25:59,080
I don't know, 87 at the time,
but really young she was eight.

1381
01:25:59,320 --> 01:26:04,320
I mean, young until the day she
dropped so she told me, she

1382
01:26:04,320 --> 01:26:06,960
goes, you remember when we went
to New York? We flew to New

1383
01:26:06,960 --> 01:26:09,360
York. I said, Oh yeah. I said,
that was my first plane flight.

1384
01:26:09,360 --> 01:26:13,920
We went to visit. She goes. What
I didn't tell you was, if your

1385
01:26:13,920 --> 01:26:17,640
father didn't get us a place
away from there, I wasn't coming

1386
01:26:17,760 --> 01:26:20,360
back because she don't like it
either. It's just too nuts. I

1387
01:26:20,360 --> 01:26:23,000
mean, there were nice there were
nice folks and everything, but

1388
01:26:23,000 --> 01:26:25,760
it's just, it's hard to raise a
family in that kind of

1389
01:26:25,760 --> 01:26:29,360
environment, you know, you got
everybody shouting and yelling

1390
01:26:29,360 --> 01:26:33,200
and whatnot on top of one
another. So that was, that's

1391
01:26:33,200 --> 01:26:35,720
how, but that's how I wound up
in California. We stayed, you

1392
01:26:35,720 --> 01:26:38,660
know, and I thought, Well, okay,
then we moved to the San

1393
01:26:38,660 --> 01:26:41,500
Fernando Valley, and then we
moved out to the West Valley,

1394
01:26:41,500 --> 01:26:44,440
and at that time, there were no
freeways. It was all orange

1395
01:26:44,440 --> 01:26:48,640
groves and farmland. So I
watched it disappear over the

1396
01:26:48,640 --> 01:26:51,580
years. So when I came here and I
saw this happening,

1397
01:26:51,880 --> 01:26:55,600
yeah, yeah, a lot of the same
things happening, yeah?

1398
01:26:55,600 --> 01:26:58,660
Developers, yeah, they just,
they're universal, yeah,

1399
01:26:59,140 --> 01:27:01,740
farmland, all this stuff's
disappearing. Yeah.

1400
01:27:01,740 --> 01:27:05,280
I mean, you used to be able to
buy farmland for nothing, yeah.

1401
01:27:05,520 --> 01:27:08,700
And nowadays, you know, like you
said, is farmland right out

1402
01:27:09,000 --> 01:27:10,080
you're walking on gold.

1403
01:27:10,200 --> 01:27:13,860
Yeah, you are. Oh, man, I'm glad
you're here. I'm glad, thanks.

1404
01:27:13,980 --> 01:27:18,840
We love it. I mean, I I really
enjoyed the change, and I still

1405
01:27:18,840 --> 01:27:20,940
have Tennessee and friends, you
know what? I mean, they just a

1406
01:27:20,940 --> 01:27:23,180
little farther. Our next door
neighbor is great. Next door

1407
01:27:23,180 --> 01:27:26,420
neighbor's great gal, and we're
part of their family farm. Yeah,

1408
01:27:26,480 --> 01:27:30,740
there's, she's got 20 or 30
acres, and then her brother's

1409
01:27:30,740 --> 01:27:35,000
got 90 behind us. And they were
worried because it was her

1410
01:27:35,000 --> 01:27:38,060
daughter's place, yeah, and her
daughter divorced, and so they

1411
01:27:38,060 --> 01:27:40,220
had to sell the house, so she
goes. We were kind of worried

1412
01:27:40,400 --> 01:27:45,880
who was going to move in there,
you know. But my wife loves

1413
01:27:45,880 --> 01:27:48,460
Piper. She's just the nicest
gal, I mean. And they're just

1414
01:27:48,460 --> 01:27:51,220
really neat people, salt of the
earth people. And they tell you

1415
01:27:51,220 --> 01:27:54,100
what they think, yes, you know.
And I appreciate people like

1416
01:27:54,100 --> 01:27:59,020
that. I got I just love it. So I
love my wife. Yeah, she's very

1417
01:27:59,020 --> 01:28:00,960
honest. Well, you got to be
brutally,

1418
01:28:04,020 --> 01:28:06,420
well, I mean, if she's not going
to tell you who

1419
01:28:06,420 --> 01:28:09,540
is, yeah, exactly, it's like,
that's why I appreciate her,

1420
01:28:09,600 --> 01:28:12,300
you know, yeah, so, I mean, and
the music thing here has been

1421
01:28:12,300 --> 01:28:16,980
really fun. And then the last, I
mean, I started that label with

1422
01:28:16,980 --> 01:28:20,900
B, we did that for a long time.
Then I did that musical audio

1423
01:28:20,900 --> 01:28:24,080
book with Jonathan, and then I
did this film. But, you know, I

1424
01:28:24,080 --> 01:28:27,500
tell people I'm just semi
retired, I, you know, I got

1425
01:28:27,500 --> 01:28:30,680
plenty to do, yeah? And I got
stuff that I'd like to finish

1426
01:28:30,680 --> 01:28:34,220
writing. Well, yeah, just, I
mean, just for myself. I mean,

1427
01:28:34,220 --> 01:28:38,060
I'm not. I have no illusions
about selling records. You know

1428
01:28:38,060 --> 01:28:40,840
what? I mean, it's the music
business today. Oh, it's totally

1429
01:28:40,840 --> 01:28:44,740
different than what it Yeah, and
with this AI thing, I I really

1430
01:28:44,740 --> 01:28:47,140
feel bad for guys coming up
trying to make a living, because

1431
01:28:47,140 --> 01:28:50,440
my friend from North Carolina or
South Carolina, we were in a

1432
01:28:50,440 --> 01:28:53,260
first band together. We won the
Dick Dale Battle of the Bands

1433
01:28:53,260 --> 01:28:56,200
back in 1964 I still got my
little mini Oscar. Oh, Dick

1434
01:28:56,200 --> 01:29:00,100
Dale, yeah, they blind us up on
flatbed trucks. Yeah. You know,

1435
01:29:00,280 --> 01:29:06,000
no sound system, nothing, just
amps. And he says, I went to

1436
01:29:06,000 --> 01:29:11,520
this chat GBT, and I said, I
need some lyrics for something

1437
01:29:11,520 --> 01:29:14,580
about the cross. He wanted you
know a spiritual song, because

1438
01:29:14,580 --> 01:29:19,920
John does church music. And he
said, and then I went to this AI

1439
01:29:19,920 --> 01:29:24,260
site, and I said, Write me a
song using these lyrics and a

1440
01:29:24,260 --> 01:29:31,460
ballad. And he sent me the song,
and it was scary. It was a girl

1441
01:29:31,460 --> 01:29:34,880
vocal, kind of like Dolly, you
know, with a nice harmony part,

1442
01:29:35,480 --> 01:29:38,540
guitars and everything. And I
went, Holy crap,

1443
01:29:39,620 --> 01:29:42,160
we're doomed. Yeah, we are
doomed. We are doomed.

1444
01:29:42,160 --> 01:29:46,060
Yeah, don't Yeah. And I just
read that Matthew McConaughey

1445
01:29:46,060 --> 01:29:50,740
trademark his name, really, yes,
I saw that as well. Yeah,

1446
01:29:51,040 --> 01:29:54,220
because, and I think actors and
people better do that that are

1447
01:29:54,220 --> 01:29:56,620
in the public light, because
they'll have their likeness

1448
01:29:56,620 --> 01:29:57,700
used. Oh, yeah.

1449
01:29:57,700 --> 01:30:01,560
Ai, yeah. Well, McCarthy. Hey,
if I'm not mistaken, has teamed

1450
01:30:01,560 --> 01:30:08,160
up with the 11 labs, one of the
AI companies that Well, Michael

1451
01:30:08,160 --> 01:30:13,260
Caine is part of that, where he
has licensed his voice Yes, for

1452
01:30:13,740 --> 01:30:17,520
AI, and McConaughey has done the
same thing. Yeah, smart, yeah.

1453
01:30:17,580 --> 01:30:21,200
Things are changing, but I'm
just glad Don't, don't ever

1454
01:30:21,200 --> 01:30:23,000
leave here, because we want you
to stay.

1455
01:30:23,000 --> 01:30:26,540
Oh, good. I'm crazy. It gets Do
you remember he made me think

1456
01:30:26,540 --> 01:30:30,500
about Nashville, on Josh's
dates, on all those Alabama

1457
01:30:30,500 --> 01:30:35,060
albums and stuff. He hired
Bernie ledden. Yeah, and Bernie,

1458
01:30:35,480 --> 01:30:37,880
I'd love to see him again. I
haven't seen him since those

1459
01:30:37,880 --> 01:30:41,620
dates. Funniest man and a great
multiplayer. I mean, he plays

1460
01:30:41,620 --> 01:30:46,780
everything, yeah, Banjo, yeah,
Bernie could do anything. And he

1461
01:30:46,780 --> 01:30:50,080
said one day in the studio, he
said, you know, Nashville has a

1462
01:30:50,260 --> 01:30:54,820
funny way of taking the edge
off. I didn't quite get it. Now

1463
01:30:54,820 --> 01:30:59,680
I get it. Yeah, you know, it's
like when Deborah made her turn

1464
01:31:00,220 --> 01:31:03,900
to just spread her wings a
little bit. Yeah, I think there

1465
01:31:03,900 --> 01:31:07,200
was a little resistance. And I
worked on that album that she

1466
01:31:07,200 --> 01:31:10,440
got to do with James Stroud,
yes, but I always got the

1467
01:31:10,440 --> 01:31:14,580
feeling like they weren't going
to put any effort into it. You

1468
01:31:14,580 --> 01:31:17,940
know? I just had that feeling,
just because it was, like their

1469
01:31:17,940 --> 01:31:22,820
way of saying, don't get off the
lane. Yes, stay in your lane.

1470
01:31:22,880 --> 01:31:25,700
Yeah. That's the only bad thing
about the I noticed same thing

1471
01:31:25,700 --> 01:31:30,020
with Steve Earle when he when he
went to Memphis to do Copperhead

1472
01:31:30,020 --> 01:31:33,440
road. I can tell that MCA just
wasn't.

1473
01:31:34,160 --> 01:31:39,740
He had, he had, yeah, yeah, I
am. I worked with Skinner when

1474
01:31:39,740 --> 01:31:45,460
Ed King was still alive. Oh,
wow. And he it was a trip. I

1475
01:31:45,460 --> 01:31:49,360
mean, because when I first met
him, it was we went to Memphis

1476
01:31:49,360 --> 01:31:52,780
to record, and Johnny Vanzant
was singing leads. Yeah,

1477
01:31:52,780 --> 01:31:55,240
Johnny's great guy. I like
Johnny, and he's sitting on the

1478
01:31:55,240 --> 01:31:59,380
couch drinking Jack Daniels. I'm
thinking, really, then I met Ed,

1479
01:31:59,680 --> 01:32:03,780
and at this time, Ed had not
sobered up, yeah, so it was, you

1480
01:32:03,780 --> 01:32:07,140
know, champagne, and you name
it, in the morning, and he got

1481
01:32:07,140 --> 01:32:09,660
right in my face. I didn't met
the guy in it. I want eighth

1482
01:32:09,660 --> 01:32:13,680
notes like this. No, eight
notes, eight notes. Okay, you

1483
01:32:13,680 --> 01:32:16,500
got eighth notes? Yeah, Billy
was in rehab, so they brought me

1484
01:32:16,500 --> 01:32:19,680
in to sub for Billy. Yeah,
Billy's, he's great for that

1485
01:32:19,680 --> 01:32:22,760
band. I'm thinking, Oh, I'm not
Billy. You know, that's not my

1486
01:32:22,760 --> 01:32:25,760
thing, but Right? I'll do the
best. And I walked out of the

1487
01:32:25,760 --> 01:32:29,900
studio after doing all that, and
I never really knew whether or

1488
01:32:29,900 --> 01:32:36,800
not he was happy with it. So I
said, my wife said, Geez, I

1489
01:32:36,800 --> 01:32:39,740
don't know if they were happy or
not. You know, I got called back

1490
01:32:39,740 --> 01:32:43,900
for a Christmas album. But
anyway, Ed called me up because

1491
01:32:43,900 --> 01:32:46,420
we were friends on Facebook.
Yeah, and he called me up says,

1492
01:32:46,420 --> 01:32:51,160
Hey, Ted, say Ed. And he says,
want you and your wife to come

1493
01:32:51,160 --> 01:32:56,140
up and have dinner with me
before I die. Oh, wow, yikes. I

1494
01:32:56,140 --> 01:32:58,720
don't know if at the time he
thought he was gonna die, but I

1495
01:32:58,720 --> 01:33:01,860
think he was just saying
figuratively, you know, yeah. So

1496
01:33:01,860 --> 01:33:05,460
we went up to his house, and he
was on the lake, and him and

1497
01:33:05,460 --> 01:33:11,100
Sharon, I mean, amazing posters
everywhere, of all the movies,

1498
01:33:11,820 --> 01:33:17,040
Sweet Home, Alabama was in, wow.
I mean, this was his ticket to

1499
01:33:17,040 --> 01:33:20,720
paradise. Yeah, he even licensed
the song for the road signs in

1500
01:33:20,720 --> 01:33:26,180
Alabama. He guys said, I get $5
a sign. Welcome to Alabama. Wow.

1501
01:33:26,180 --> 01:33:30,500
Welcome to Sweet Home Alabama.
Wow. And, you know

1502
01:33:30,920 --> 01:33:33,680
what's become, the state song,
basically, yeah, yeah.

1503
01:33:33,680 --> 01:33:36,080
But it was, it was a great time.
I mean, Ed, you know, we're

1504
01:33:36,080 --> 01:33:39,260
talking about how crazy it got,
because we used to open for

1505
01:33:39,260 --> 01:33:44,560
Skinner with Bonnaroo, yeah, you
know. And Ronnie was so

1506
01:33:44,560 --> 01:33:47,500
different from Johnny and
Donnie. I mean, he was

1507
01:33:47,500 --> 01:33:50,500
a terror. Oh, man, I don't see
how any of those guys really

1508
01:33:50,500 --> 01:33:51,280
worked with him.

1509
01:33:51,340 --> 01:33:55,360
No. Ed said the thing that sent
him away was one night Ronnie

1510
01:33:55,360 --> 01:33:57,940
got mad at something that Ed
played, and he broke a beer

1511
01:33:57,940 --> 01:33:59,560
bottle and came at him with, Oh,
yeah.

1512
01:33:59,740 --> 01:34:04,800
And Ed said that was it that
same night, I think he cut up

1513
01:34:05,160 --> 01:34:09,480
Gary rosington's hand and said,
You'll never play again. That's

1514
01:34:09,480 --> 01:34:13,380
abusive man. I couldn't imagine
working with that. No.

1515
01:34:14,040 --> 01:34:17,820
And I mean, I heard stories from
when the plane was running out

1516
01:34:17,820 --> 01:34:22,220
of gas. He was up in the cockpit
beating on one of the pilots, I

1517
01:34:23,180 --> 01:34:25,580
can imagine, because he was
pissed that they didn't get put

1518
01:34:25,580 --> 01:34:29,420
enough gas in the plane. That's
why they're going down. Gosh,

1519
01:34:29,540 --> 01:34:33,740
so, you know, Insanity, yeah.
And Ed was, I mean, such a nice

1520
01:34:33,740 --> 01:34:37,580
guy and funny. And I really
liked where he sat in life. He

1521
01:34:37,580 --> 01:34:40,540
was not a hard liner right or
left. He was a common sense guy,

1522
01:34:40,540 --> 01:34:45,040
right? You know? And he said,
you know that incense and

1523
01:34:45,040 --> 01:34:48,460
peppermint, he never, I don't
think he got proper credit for

1524
01:34:48,460 --> 01:34:50,620
writing that CO writing that
that's not right.

1525
01:34:50,620 --> 01:34:53,800
Hey, that's easy business. Yes.
I mean, I remember or

1526
01:34:53,800 --> 01:34:54,940
entertainment, when I came

1527
01:34:54,940 --> 01:34:58,060
up with that idea for Betty
David's eyes, we were playing it

1528
01:34:58,060 --> 01:35:01,796
the old way, like on Jackie's
album. And it was a real news

1529
01:35:01,796 --> 01:35:05,636
lane for us, yeah, and we were,
we were playing this song, I

1530
01:35:05,636 --> 01:35:08,696
don't know how many hours in
rehearsal hall. And I finally

1531
01:35:08,696 --> 01:35:12,356
just, I laid on the keys, and I
just made this horrible rang,

1532
01:35:12,356 --> 01:35:15,956
you know, and everybody stopped
and looked at me, and I'm a

1533
01:35:15,956 --> 01:35:18,956
typical New Yorker. I said, this
sucks. This is terrible. And

1534
01:35:19,376 --> 01:35:22,280
then, of course, Val our
producer goes, well, what do you

1535
01:35:22,280 --> 01:35:30,200
got? What do I got? Big mouth,
so I just pulled up a patch on

1536
01:35:30,200 --> 01:35:32,540
the Prophet and I played the
opening line of that song that

1537
01:35:32,540 --> 01:35:37,040
you hear, yeah. I said, How
about this? He goes, Yeah, okay.

1538
01:35:37,520 --> 01:35:42,580
So we sent the band out for two,
three hours, go play pinball,

1539
01:35:42,580 --> 01:35:45,040
eat whatever you want to do
while Kim and I worked out the

1540
01:35:45,040 --> 01:35:48,640
song, because I had to rewrite
it according to these changes,

1541
01:35:48,700 --> 01:35:52,840
right? But the thing that
bothered me most was I made, I'm

1542
01:35:52,840 --> 01:35:58,120
sure Jackie and Donna millions,
and I'm fine with that. That's

1543
01:35:58,120 --> 01:36:01,500
my gig. Yeah, I'm a studio guy,
but a thank you would have been

1544
01:36:01,500 --> 01:36:04,620
nice, because I had to, I
crossed that line. There's a

1545
01:36:04,620 --> 01:36:07,980
line between arranging and
writing, right? And sometimes,

1546
01:36:08,280 --> 01:36:11,760
as an arranger, you cross over
and rewrite things. And so I

1547
01:36:11,760 --> 01:36:14,220
wasn't looking for royalty. I
thank you would have been been

1548
01:36:14,220 --> 01:36:16,320
nice. Yeah, I never even got
that. And I thought that was the

1549
01:36:16,320 --> 01:36:18,780
only thing that kind of bugged
me a little bit, yeah. I

1550
01:36:18,780 --> 01:36:23,540
thought, you know, it's like,
all right. But years ago, when I

1551
01:36:23,540 --> 01:36:28,280
was doing demos with that little
string ensemble, I played piano,

1552
01:36:28,280 --> 01:36:31,820
and I met this singer, and we
found out that whenever she and

1553
01:36:31,820 --> 01:36:35,660
I worked together, the writer's
song got placed, and we were

1554
01:36:35,660 --> 01:36:39,380
both about 25 that was Kim
Carnes, wow. So we started

1555
01:36:39,380 --> 01:36:42,700
working a lot together, doing
those demos, yeah, and we did

1556
01:36:42,700 --> 01:36:46,780
this one demo, and they sold it
to share with my string

1557
01:36:46,780 --> 01:36:48,940
arrangement and everything on
it, right, wow. Well, here's the

1558
01:36:48,940 --> 01:36:55,960
crazy part. They called me for
the master date, and they had me

1559
01:36:55,960 --> 01:36:59,560
bring my string ensemble to play
the parts that I played on the

1560
01:36:59,560 --> 01:37:03,840
demo with the string section. So
it's kind of like a security

1561
01:37:03,840 --> 01:37:07,320
blanket for the Yeah, for the
producer and arranger. Yeah, but

1562
01:37:07,320 --> 01:37:11,160
my first lesson I should have
learned wiser. It said arranged

1563
01:37:11,160 --> 01:37:16,260
by Al Capps. Wow, you know,
yeah, okay, but you know, I

1564
01:37:16,260 --> 01:37:20,160
mean, you guys, I'm not telling
you anything you don't know. No,

1565
01:37:20,160 --> 01:37:22,500
that's a dream, and it's just
the way it works. You could have

1566
01:37:22,500 --> 01:37:24,680
come up with could have come up
with a slogan or something, oh

1567
01:37:24,680 --> 01:37:26,840
yeah, and then somebody would
have said, you know, this is our

1568
01:37:26,840 --> 01:37:29,420
new app. Guy. He came up with
the slogan. Wait a minute.

1569
01:37:29,780 --> 01:37:31,460
Johnny B said that on the show
yesterday.

1570
01:37:31,700 --> 01:37:36,260
Well, Phil used to do that to
me. He actually stole one of my

1571
01:37:36,380 --> 01:37:40,480
and he told me he was going to,
oh yeah, he did. He told me, but

1572
01:37:40,600 --> 01:37:43,840
it was looters. He said, I got
to come up with some name for

1573
01:37:44,080 --> 01:37:48,520
these people that loot and that
mooch. And I said, looters. And

1574
01:37:48,520 --> 01:37:51,280
he goes, that's great,
everybody. Use it. And he's

1575
01:37:51,280 --> 01:37:55,540
using he's almost steal it from
you. And he did. That's fair,

1576
01:37:55,540 --> 01:37:59,380
though that's good, at least, he
told me. But I really want to

1577
01:37:59,380 --> 01:38:00,580
thank you for coming on, sir.

1578
01:38:00,580 --> 01:38:03,300
Well, thank you. Thank you guys.
It was fun. I really incriminate

1579
01:38:03,300 --> 01:38:04,560
myself too badly. I think

1580
01:38:04,559 --> 01:38:06,959
we, I think we do that every
time we do the show.

1581
01:38:06,960 --> 01:38:12,180
Well, yeah, I was listening to,
was it Shannon? Yeah, yeah, that

1582
01:38:12,180 --> 01:38:16,380
was she had some stories. Oh,
she's great. But it opened my

1583
01:38:16,380 --> 01:38:20,900
eyes about radio and oh yeah,
radio is a whole different game.

1584
01:38:20,900 --> 01:38:23,900
I didn't realize it was as
brutal it is. It's very brutal.

1585
01:38:23,900 --> 01:38:26,300
I see why you guys are doing
this. This is much more fun.

1586
01:38:26,419 --> 01:38:29,839
Yes, it is exactly, much more
free form, unlimiting.

1587
01:38:29,900 --> 01:38:33,560
Well, these two guys are just
great to work with. And silent

1588
01:38:33,560 --> 01:38:33,920
Jim, I

1589
01:38:33,919 --> 01:38:35,179
make it brutal. I bring the

1590
01:38:36,139 --> 01:38:39,499
brutality, but remind everybody
how they can find us.

1591
01:38:39,500 --> 01:38:42,460
Yeah, absolutely. Of course,
we're on all the social media

1592
01:38:42,460 --> 01:38:47,500
platforms, Facebook X YouTube
channel, and our website is up

1593
01:38:47,500 --> 01:38:51,280
and running, circling the
drain.net. You can find all the

1594
01:38:51,280 --> 01:38:54,520
episodes there. And of course,
you can also grab some

1595
01:38:54,520 --> 01:38:58,300
merchandise. We've got those
circling the drain, T shirts,

1596
01:38:58,300 --> 01:39:04,680
caps, yes, and caps are coming.
And so yeah, check us out on the

1597
01:39:04,680 --> 01:39:06,180
website, circling the drain.net.

1598
01:39:06,840 --> 01:39:09,660
Thank you so much. And thank
you, Bill Cuomo, once again,

1599
01:39:09,660 --> 01:39:12,660
thanks, guys. We'll be back once
again with circling the drain.

1600
01:39:12,660 --> 01:39:13,320
Be here you.