WEBVTT NOTE This file was generated by Descript 00:00:05.050 --> 00:00:09.479 Raph: Folks, and welcome to this latest episode of the Small Tech Podcast. 00:00:09.550 --> 00:00:12.489 Today, we have another amazing guest. 00:00:12.679 --> 00:00:18.709 He is building GridBid, the platform to simplify your heat pump retrofits. 00:00:18.850 --> 00:00:20.650 He is Matt Lanigan. 00:00:20.790 --> 00:00:20.939 Hey, 00:00:21.247 --> 00:00:22.307 Matt: Hey Raph, thanks for having me. 00:00:22.642 --> 00:00:23.312 Raph: How's it going? 00:00:23.799 --> 00:00:24.219 Matt: good. 00:00:24.429 --> 00:00:28.729 Summer in Vancouver is finally kicking and excited to get on my bike again. 00:00:28.729 --> 00:00:32.559 Raph: I am also very excited to start biking around some more. 00:00:32.846 --> 00:00:35.226 Matt: my, my tires are still completely empty. 00:00:35.446 --> 00:00:38.936 So I think that's my Friday night activity tonight is actually sitting 00:00:38.936 --> 00:00:42.336 down and giving it the TLC it needs before I go on a ride this weekend. 00:00:42.462 --> 00:00:43.132 Raph: Awesome. 00:00:43.202 --> 00:00:43.832 Nice. 00:00:44.002 --> 00:00:47.822 So you are building GridBid and I'm of curious, I want to ask you some 00:00:47.822 --> 00:00:50.172 questions on how you ended up here. 00:00:50.632 --> 00:00:56.412 What was the journey, not just right before GridBid, but just how, like career 00:00:56.412 --> 00:01:01.312 wise, what led you eventually to know, I'm going to start this company and 00:01:01.312 --> 00:01:05.182 I'm going to start it around heat pump retrofits and building a tech platform 00:01:05.255 --> 00:01:05.725 Matt: Sure. 00:01:05.765 --> 00:01:06.095 Yeah. 00:01:06.095 --> 00:01:10.195 So originally my academic background was in civil engineering. 00:01:10.665 --> 00:01:14.275 I did a technology diploma, an undergraduate degree. 00:01:14.645 --> 00:01:18.965 And as soon as I was out of university at 21, I started working in consulting. 00:01:19.175 --> 00:01:23.665 So did engineering consulting for municipal land development. 00:01:23.665 --> 00:01:27.095 So the roads we drive on, the bridges we drive on, the pipes 00:01:27.095 --> 00:01:28.405 that feed our buildings, water. 00:01:28.930 --> 00:01:32.680 And I continued to evolve in that space. 00:01:32.710 --> 00:01:36.460 I worked in construction, I managed construction projects, I worked in 00:01:36.470 --> 00:01:42.890 government with policy team and putting together strategic policies around 00:01:43.090 --> 00:01:46.060 net carbon zero buildings, as well as other infrastructure projects. 00:01:46.890 --> 00:01:52.290 During this time, I started to hear a lot more. 00:01:52.550 --> 00:01:56.500 Buzz around heat pumps and just being someone who loved and 00:01:56.500 --> 00:01:57.830 always followed decarbonization. 00:01:58.450 --> 00:02:03.370 I started following it a bit more and then I started to hear a whole whack 00:02:03.370 --> 00:02:07.510 of problems from contractors who I knew, homeowners who started to get 00:02:07.530 --> 00:02:11.120 heat pumps retrofitted and that's what enabled me to start to take the 00:02:11.200 --> 00:02:13.230 deep dive into what the problems were. 00:02:13.390 --> 00:02:16.200 Raph: It's funny, because I think since I met you, which was 00:02:16.200 --> 00:02:18.660 what, like a year and a half ago? 00:02:18.660 --> 00:02:19.680 Something like that? 00:02:20.030 --> 00:02:25.420 I feel like I've heard now the word heat pump just keeps popping in my life, and 00:02:25.440 --> 00:02:29.330 I'm, It's funny like, once you get exposed to something, you start recognizing 00:02:29.330 --> 00:02:30.800 it, you start seeing it around you. 00:02:30.890 --> 00:02:35.180 okay, so you decide to the heat pumps are this thing that is, that makes 00:02:35.180 --> 00:02:37.630 sense to you why build a tech platform? 00:02:38.003 --> 00:02:38.403 Matt: Sure. 00:02:38.413 --> 00:02:43.563 So one of the main challenges with home decarbonization, particularly 00:02:43.563 --> 00:02:48.313 detached homes, it's very clunky and currently we rely on homeowners and 00:02:48.763 --> 00:02:54.723 for a lot of enterprise SaaS tools and so on, it's super easy to scale. 00:02:54.903 --> 00:02:58.163 You build a stack, you work with businesses and it takes an organic 00:02:58.173 --> 00:03:03.273 growth for homeowners to, to understand the process and to be able to actually 00:03:03.673 --> 00:03:08.149 go through it simply, we can apply project management, best practices and 00:03:08.359 --> 00:03:10.863 first principles, which is something that I've had a ton of time with. 00:03:11.278 --> 00:03:14.318 into something that can guide homeowners through a retrofit. 00:03:14.938 --> 00:03:19.148 So rather than acting as a consultant and, calling them, sending lots of emails, 00:03:19.178 --> 00:03:23.308 you can automate a lot of practices that guide homeowners through the practice. 00:03:23.758 --> 00:03:28.478 And this is what makes something scalable and allows the tens of millions of 00:03:28.668 --> 00:03:33.533 homes that will ultimately make the switch to make it sooner and easier. 00:03:33.533 --> 00:03:37.343 Raph: Nice and is this, is your first time building a tech 00:03:37.655 --> 00:03:40.345 Matt: It's my first time building a tech product, and it's very different than 00:03:40.625 --> 00:03:46.425 building a bridge or a building, which is what I had done for nearly 10 years. 00:03:46.425 --> 00:03:47.295 Raph: Yeah, a little bit. 00:03:47.295 --> 00:03:49.665 I assume the iteration cycles are a little faster. 00:03:50.552 --> 00:03:53.842 Matt: One thing that's been, one thing that's been such a challenge is with 00:03:54.052 --> 00:03:58.462 infrastructure and projects, you spend so much time getting it right the first time. 00:03:58.472 --> 00:04:00.642 There's no ifs, ands, or buts about it, right? 00:04:01.202 --> 00:04:03.162 And, my, my co founder he's brilliant. 00:04:03.162 --> 00:04:04.612 He's been such a help because he's nope. 00:04:04.882 --> 00:04:05.782 Matt, we ship it. 00:04:06.102 --> 00:04:07.782 And then we figure it out. 00:04:07.792 --> 00:04:08.432 Then we iterate. 00:04:08.482 --> 00:04:11.582 And man, I remember the first couple of times we did that. 00:04:11.622 --> 00:04:13.842 I literally had a tough time sleeping. 00:04:14.052 --> 00:04:16.932 Raph: Oh, no you hear this, Agile, right? 00:04:16.932 --> 00:04:21.272 Like, Agile product development practices it makes a lot of sense if you come 00:04:21.372 --> 00:04:25.802 from the tech world, but then I see Something like a bridge or any kind 00:04:25.802 --> 00:04:28.772 of infrastructure, and I'm like, oh, I feel like the things, the ways that 00:04:28.772 --> 00:04:33.512 I've learned to build things just do not apply to so many things in the world. 00:04:33.565 --> 00:04:34.465 Matt: Yeah, and you know what? 00:04:34.745 --> 00:04:40.425 When I was in the last year of working in infrastructure and project management, 00:04:40.455 --> 00:04:44.885 I took an accreditation exam called Project Management Professional, PMP. 00:04:45.405 --> 00:04:49.235 And 50 percent of it is Waterfall, which is that type of project 00:04:49.235 --> 00:04:50.835 delivery, and the other half is Agile. 00:04:51.015 --> 00:04:54.815 And that's when I was starting to tinker and think of ideas for applying 00:04:54.815 --> 00:04:58.015 software to some of the problems that I saw in the built environment space. 00:04:58.585 --> 00:05:02.805 And I'm like, okay, on paper it makes sense, and then, you tie together the 00:05:02.855 --> 00:05:06.435 kind of underpinnings of Waterfall that I've had for so many years. 00:05:06.980 --> 00:05:10.840 And then bring it into software is has been quite the 00:05:10.840 --> 00:05:11.870 learning curve, let's call it. 00:05:12.065 --> 00:05:12.725 Raph: But it's been fun. 00:05:13.007 --> 00:05:14.157 Matt: It's been a lot of fun, man. 00:05:14.157 --> 00:05:19.217 I mean, it's great to build something that you hope will 00:05:19.227 --> 00:05:21.677 support people decarbonizing homes. 00:05:22.117 --> 00:05:26.534 We've had customers go through who have just been so thrilled and such 00:05:26.564 --> 00:05:28.464 big champions of what we're building. 00:05:28.562 --> 00:05:32.372 It's been incredibly fulfilling, obviously a huge challenge as you and many other 00:05:32.462 --> 00:05:36.692 listeners know, but the fulfillment and excitement and energy you get from it 00:05:36.762 --> 00:05:38.312 is like nothing I've ever experienced. 00:05:38.362 --> 00:05:42.449 Raph: And, you're doing all of this with, so you've got a, a business partner, 00:05:42.449 --> 00:05:47.589 you've got a CTO and you've got other people you're, or is that it's the two of 00:05:47.589 --> 00:05:50.359 you and you were in an accelerator, right? 00:05:50.499 --> 00:05:51.549 what's, your ecosystem? 00:05:51.549 --> 00:05:52.209 Who are you building 00:05:52.286 --> 00:05:52.976 Matt: are we building with? 00:05:52.976 --> 00:05:57.406 So it's myself and my co founder, Jacob, who has spent a lot of time building 00:05:57.416 --> 00:05:59.316 software The better part of a decade. 00:05:59.666 --> 00:06:04.156 And he's been a great guiding force in how to develop and deliver this thing. 00:06:04.416 --> 00:06:07.156 And it's been very complimentary with my background in built environment and 00:06:07.196 --> 00:06:09.406 project management and his in software. 00:06:09.406 --> 00:06:11.176 So we make a great team. 00:06:11.666 --> 00:06:13.696 Otherwise, it's really just him and I. 00:06:13.756 --> 00:06:17.646 We do work with a number of freelancers and the Accelerator 00:06:17.646 --> 00:06:21.716 that we were a part of, Foresight Canada, has been a tremendous help. 00:06:21.856 --> 00:06:28.621 So we started working with Foresight In the fall of last year through 00:06:28.711 --> 00:06:33.231 sort of different schools, Launch Deliver, which are CEO and CTO 00:06:33.231 --> 00:06:37.521 school, respectively, investor readiness programs, access to capital. 00:06:37.541 --> 00:06:38.681 And now we're a residency company. 00:06:39.071 --> 00:06:42.471 So we're working with tons of different mentors on different subjects. 00:06:42.601 --> 00:06:45.531 And they've been, it's, I only have great things to say about Foresight. 00:06:45.541 --> 00:06:46.391 It's been a great program. 00:06:46.461 --> 00:06:49.371 Raph: Anything in particular that you learned that was just, I don't know, 00:06:49.371 --> 00:06:52.761 something mind blowing or something that just like completely changed the way 00:06:52.761 --> 00:06:54.241 you think about what you were doing? 00:06:54.348 --> 00:06:58.258 Matt: I think a lot of things were particularly in the CEO school. 00:06:58.498 --> 00:07:01.048 I mean, I know and I understand the problem very well. 00:07:01.508 --> 00:07:06.448 But a lot of programs and lectures and processes as part of Foresight allowed 00:07:06.448 --> 00:07:10.388 me to zoom out and better understand that, okay, there's a pain point 00:07:10.398 --> 00:07:14.348 here, but if you look at the entire value chain, it's actually a byproduct 00:07:14.348 --> 00:07:15.568 of another pain point elsewhere. 00:07:16.078 --> 00:07:19.218 That was obviously a process that we understood when we did our customer 00:07:19.218 --> 00:07:23.558 discovery, because we did a lot of customer discovery, but Foresight and its 00:07:23.558 --> 00:07:28.258 programs did a very good job of allowing me to zoom out and look at the big picture 00:07:28.258 --> 00:07:33.659 and how we can best fit in what is a very nuanced ecosystem and evolving space. 00:07:33.801 --> 00:07:35.200 Raph: Out of curiosity what does that mean? 00:07:35.301 --> 00:07:38.771 What did you find out about this like broader ecosystem? 00:07:38.858 --> 00:07:42.198 Matt: main issues that made me look into this problem were 00:07:42.228 --> 00:07:43.778 issues that homeowners faced. 00:07:44.931 --> 00:07:45.401 Raph: Okay. 00:07:45.448 --> 00:07:48.398 Matt: Spending a lot of money, not getting the right system installed, perhaps 00:07:48.398 --> 00:07:49.938 it was the system that was too big. 00:07:50.288 --> 00:07:53.478 If you have a system that's too big, it cycles incorrectly, it costs more 00:07:53.478 --> 00:07:55.438 on energy, and they tend to die sooner. 00:07:55.968 --> 00:08:01.233 And a lot of this is actually A process of struggles that contractors 00:08:01.233 --> 00:08:05.383 are having with assessing homes, the calculations that can be given to them 00:08:05.383 --> 00:08:10.233 at certain times, and to be able to solve homeowners problems by also solving 00:08:10.233 --> 00:08:14.003 contractors problems at the same time was something that required a ton of 00:08:14.013 --> 00:08:16.023 massaging, and we're still actively doing. 00:08:16.543 --> 00:08:20.527 But that's one of the biggest takeaways was with some of these two sided things, 00:08:20.527 --> 00:08:24.817 or when you look at the longer value chain, there's Issues littered everywhere. 00:08:24.917 --> 00:08:29.587 And in some cases, if you help someone someplace in the beginning, it actually 00:08:29.587 --> 00:08:33.297 pays dividends in the end to potentially another user, another customer. 00:08:33.904 --> 00:08:34.794 Raph: That's super cool. 00:08:35.004 --> 00:08:37.424 With that in mind, like, so the mechanics of how you're 00:08:37.424 --> 00:08:38.784 solving these problems, right? 00:08:38.784 --> 00:08:40.044 So you've got this, interface. 00:08:40.304 --> 00:08:44.034 I got to hop on, on a call with you guys a little while ago and 00:08:44.034 --> 00:08:45.714 check it out, which was pretty fun. 00:08:45.984 --> 00:08:49.234 How did you come up with that UI, that flow? 00:08:49.524 --> 00:08:53.564 What's it been like talking to, users and getting them to walk through this? 00:08:53.564 --> 00:08:55.774 Like, how's that whole process worked out for you 00:08:55.814 --> 00:08:59.691 Matt: Yeah, you were one of the very first people to set eyes on the MVP, which is 00:08:59.691 --> 00:09:02.271 now live and being used by homeowners. 00:09:02.701 --> 00:09:07.171 What we ended up doing was the latter half of last year, we actually 00:09:07.501 --> 00:09:10.651 brought on some homeowners and we managed the project for them manually. 00:09:10.751 --> 00:09:14.511 From day one, what they were looking to do, what they wanted to get out of it 00:09:14.871 --> 00:09:17.301 what challenges they saw what things were. 00:09:18.176 --> 00:09:23.246 Absolutely no brainers in what things we could potentially do, and I honestly 00:09:23.246 --> 00:09:29.246 just did it as if it was a project I was handed to at a previous role, so I 00:09:29.246 --> 00:09:33.416 had some hypotheses on reports that we could generate and things that we could 00:09:33.436 --> 00:09:37.636 automate right away, and we started to do that with the first few customers, and 00:09:37.636 --> 00:09:41.286 then as we saw more and more, we got more feedback, We better understood what we 00:09:41.286 --> 00:09:45.976 could automate right away, what we should hold off on until, we get more volume 00:09:45.976 --> 00:09:47.456 or perhaps some more developer help. 00:09:47.986 --> 00:09:51.336 And that's what sort of built this first iteration, which is 00:09:51.336 --> 00:09:55.756 really a, as you saw, a dashboard for homeowners, where they can. 00:09:56.176 --> 00:10:00.136 Store documents, we can store documents, there's bidirectional communication, and 00:10:00.136 --> 00:10:03.566 depending on what step in the retrofit they're in, there's new reports and 00:10:03.566 --> 00:10:07.876 insights based on contractor quotes, or walkthrough and commissioning summaries, 00:10:07.976 --> 00:10:09.766 or rebates that they may be eligible for. 00:10:09.766 --> 00:10:14.146 And we're excited to build onto that, but this first iteration is something 00:10:14.146 --> 00:10:18.856 that we can confidently say was built through lived experience and 00:10:19.596 --> 00:10:21.406 feedback from actual customers. 00:10:21.456 --> 00:10:22.066 Raph: That's cool. 00:10:22.106 --> 00:10:25.496 And so I'm curious, like when you did this like very manual work, did you 00:10:25.496 --> 00:10:27.356 still have like a digital interface? 00:10:27.356 --> 00:10:31.796 Like they would submit something, but then you go do the work or 00:10:32.076 --> 00:10:35.996 it, was it completely face to face or like, how did you do that? 00:10:36.106 --> 00:10:39.246 of curious, specifically with the context like, what is an MVP, right? 00:10:39.256 --> 00:10:42.696 Like people like have so many thoughts about like what that 00:10:42.696 --> 00:10:46.186 means, but to me, this is like, this sounds like an MVP, right? 00:10:46.186 --> 00:10:50.446 Like testing the value of the thing that you're hoping to deliver, not by building 00:10:50.446 --> 00:10:52.176 it out, but by doing something else. 00:10:52.356 --> 00:10:56.676 But I'm curious, like how much of the sort of testing the built assumptions, 00:10:56.676 --> 00:11:00.286 if that makes sense, like the, or the assumptions around the end product 00:11:00.506 --> 00:11:03.724 where you're doing versus like just the value that you're hoping to deliver. 00:11:03.724 --> 00:11:08.124 Matt: First days, it was primarily just emails, phone calls, I'd 00:11:08.124 --> 00:11:10.684 send them articles we'd call. 00:11:10.914 --> 00:11:14.404 In some cases, we had a FaceTime and they'd walk me around their house 00:11:14.664 --> 00:11:19.304 and point out certain things that, that they felt were like cold spots 00:11:19.304 --> 00:11:22.444 in their home or spots where they'd like to hang out in their home. 00:11:22.874 --> 00:11:25.214 And really, it was just like a Google Drive. 00:11:25.274 --> 00:11:26.234 They drop in some things. 00:11:26.334 --> 00:11:27.664 I would share some things with them. 00:11:28.024 --> 00:11:30.294 They'd take a look and then we'd hop on another call. 00:11:30.754 --> 00:11:34.524 And through that, we got more confidence in saying, okay, this is a report we 00:11:34.524 --> 00:11:39.414 can actually standardize, or this is a process that happens in every case. 00:11:39.734 --> 00:11:45.074 And that's what's actually allowed us to build what you saw last month, I suppose. 00:11:45.074 --> 00:11:48.424 Raph: yeah, something like that a few weeks ago, a month ago, two months ago. 00:11:48.904 --> 00:11:49.414 I don't know. 00:11:50.154 --> 00:11:55.594 Okay, so you do all of that and then you put this thing out or to, to some 00:11:55.594 --> 00:12:00.444 people before you, you actually launch publicly and then you launch publicly. 00:12:01.754 --> 00:12:03.004 What's the feedback been like? 00:12:03.186 --> 00:12:04.096 Matt: What's the feedback been like? 00:12:04.096 --> 00:12:09.466 So obviously the, I think we had six to 10 people with varying backgrounds, 00:12:09.496 --> 00:12:13.396 people in product, people who are in management consulting, we had 00:12:13.396 --> 00:12:16.206 so many different people take a look at it before it went live. 00:12:16.716 --> 00:12:20.876 And what's great is there are a lot of things that were consistent 00:12:20.876 --> 00:12:22.006 from one person to the other. 00:12:22.366 --> 00:12:24.936 And then there were some things that were unique about each 00:12:24.996 --> 00:12:26.256 individual person, right? 00:12:26.286 --> 00:12:29.466 Someone who focused on product had a couple interesting things to say. 00:12:29.841 --> 00:12:31.761 Someone with an engineering and construction background had a 00:12:31.761 --> 00:12:33.181 couple of interesting things to say. 00:12:33.651 --> 00:12:37.441 Now we have this list, which is something we're excited to tackle, 00:12:37.441 --> 00:12:39.241 but also difficult to prioritize. 00:12:39.991 --> 00:12:44.991 Um, first, first few customers that are now on, on the platform it's 00:12:44.991 --> 00:12:48.311 always a unique conversation to have because it's a completely new 00:12:48.321 --> 00:12:49.661 way of going about a home retrofit. 00:12:50.251 --> 00:12:53.421 It's always been call a contractor who's been recommended to you 00:12:53.491 --> 00:12:56.061 through a neighbor or Google reviews. 00:12:56.531 --> 00:12:59.921 Or a friend and start to do the song and dance with them. 00:13:00.401 --> 00:13:04.231 Whereas now it's sign up on this platform to get physical work done at my home. 00:13:04.411 --> 00:13:04.831 Like what? 00:13:05.491 --> 00:13:11.406 So there's always a conversation there and it's been interesting to share the value 00:13:11.486 --> 00:13:18.076 and the process and why it's so valuable with Efficient Homes today, and what 00:13:18.086 --> 00:13:22.926 happens today and what happens next, and once when we do have that conversation, 00:13:22.946 --> 00:13:27.186 or they read the messaging on the platform when they log on, It makes a ton of sense. 00:13:27.666 --> 00:13:34.036 But the education of the value while trying to deliver value is a tightrope 00:13:34.046 --> 00:13:35.796 that, that we're always trying to work on. 00:13:35.796 --> 00:13:37.616 Yes. 00:13:37.824 --> 00:13:39.524 Raph: So I'm really curious about that too. 00:13:39.524 --> 00:13:43.314 So what's your strategy to, to bring people into the platform? 00:13:43.314 --> 00:13:48.354 Cause I mean, if know, this doesn't exist, then you, how do 00:13:48.354 --> 00:13:49.964 you, are you doing Google ads? 00:13:49.964 --> 00:13:53.024 And if you do Google ads, how do you convince someone who's 00:13:53.184 --> 00:13:56.264 presumably just looking for a contractor or whatever to come in? 00:13:56.669 --> 00:13:58.749 Like, how do you do that education? 00:13:58.759 --> 00:14:02.458 How do you do that sort of massaging that journey so that it makes sense 00:14:02.559 --> 00:14:04.699 for your product and for that customer? 00:14:04.801 --> 00:14:08.241 Matt: is very much a real time thing that we're working through. 00:14:08.321 --> 00:14:12.531 We do have a small SEM budget strategic marketing budget. 00:14:13.051 --> 00:14:16.891 We do see quite a bit of volume through SEO as well. 00:14:16.911 --> 00:14:21.261 We do have Geographic specific landing pages for Burnaby, for North 00:14:21.261 --> 00:14:23.871 Vancouver, for Richmond and so on. 00:14:24.191 --> 00:14:25.341 We do publish a lot of blogs. 00:14:25.351 --> 00:14:26.751 We are pretty active on the socials. 00:14:27.141 --> 00:14:29.381 I do spend a lot of time at home trade shows. 00:14:29.431 --> 00:14:31.121 We do have a booth and 00:14:31.661 --> 00:14:33.651 that's an opportunity to speak to hundreds of people. 00:14:33.821 --> 00:14:38.111 Whether or not someone I actually speak to wants to work together or 00:14:38.111 --> 00:14:42.361 they know their neighbor wants to, we have gotten customers through actually 00:14:42.431 --> 00:14:43.701 every single one of those channels. 00:14:43.711 --> 00:14:45.131 So SEM, SEO. 00:14:45.216 --> 00:14:48.176 Ory Kratos and word of mouth which is great. 00:14:48.296 --> 00:14:50.876 But the actual education component is tricky. 00:14:50.896 --> 00:14:54.716 Our, we have a cost calculator on our landing page and that's where a lot 00:14:54.716 --> 00:14:57.146 of people end up going to get an idea. 00:14:57.656 --> 00:15:00.476 And then from there we'll do a follow up or there's an educational email. 00:15:00.706 --> 00:15:04.726 And with our platform now, our landing page has a two minute 00:15:04.726 --> 00:15:06.856 explainer video of my floating head. 00:15:07.111 --> 00:15:11.581 Which one, I think instills a bit of trust that, there's an actual person 00:15:11.581 --> 00:15:16.601 and there's a service to do with it, but it also shows basically a fast 00:15:16.611 --> 00:15:20.611 forward of an entire project lifecycle, which takes around two months and it's 00:15:20.611 --> 00:15:21.931 actually compressed into two minutes. 00:15:22.161 --> 00:15:26.171 So it shows the plan report, it shows the quote compare, it shows the rebate 00:15:26.211 --> 00:15:27.821 summary, it shows the walkthrough summary. 00:15:28.126 --> 00:15:30.616 And it shows why these things exist and what problems exist 00:15:30.616 --> 00:15:33.726 today and how this process is alleviating them of those pains. 00:15:33.726 --> 00:15:34.226 Raph: Awesome. 00:15:35.157 --> 00:15:36.537 And what's next? 00:15:36.657 --> 00:15:39.667 So you've got it out in the wild you're you're getting some 00:15:39.667 --> 00:15:42.297 clients you, what are you building next or what are you doing next? 00:15:42.410 --> 00:15:46.440 Matt: right now it's just building that, that trust with products like this. 00:15:46.470 --> 00:15:50.400 They rely heavily ultimately on, on word of mouth and network effects. 00:15:50.840 --> 00:15:53.710 So we're spending a lot of time here in the lower mainland. 00:15:53.720 --> 00:15:56.160 It's only been launched here in the lower mainland of 00:15:56.160 --> 00:15:57.370 Vancouver in the Fraser Valley. 00:15:57.910 --> 00:16:02.540 So a lot of time spent with grassroots organizations at home trade shows. 00:16:02.955 --> 00:16:04.415 Working with homeowners in the region. 00:16:04.845 --> 00:16:08.755 We're focused on heat pump installs right now, primarily because these are 00:16:08.755 --> 00:16:12.505 the things that have at least a big benefit from a consumer perspective, 00:16:12.835 --> 00:16:17.025 significant rebates, home cooling reduced energy bills, assuming 00:16:17.025 --> 00:16:18.645 that the system was installed well. 00:16:19.305 --> 00:16:23.665 And from there, we want to start to include other home efficiency 00:16:24.025 --> 00:16:29.235 retrofits, so EV chargers and solar panels, and window insulation upgrades. 00:16:29.465 --> 00:16:32.925 We want to be that one stop shop that can guide a homeowner 00:16:32.925 --> 00:16:36.275 through any sort of energy saving or energy efficiency retrofit. 00:16:36.734 --> 00:16:37.174 Raph: I love it. 00:16:37.184 --> 00:16:37.824 That's awesome. 00:16:37.874 --> 00:16:41.074 That sounds like a pretty, pretty epic mission for like the longer 00:16:41.491 --> 00:16:44.791 Matt: It's a big goal because we do have homeowners and contractors on 00:16:44.791 --> 00:16:47.531 either side, and we want to make sure we make life easier for both of them. 00:16:48.351 --> 00:16:50.831 And heatpumps is the language we're speaking right now. 00:16:51.001 --> 00:16:56.341 And once when we expand, whether it's regions or scopes hard to 00:16:56.341 --> 00:16:57.321 say what's going to come first. 00:16:57.341 --> 00:16:58.691 That'll be dictated by feedback. 00:16:59.341 --> 00:17:02.501 But yeah, each and every one of those scopes have their own set of challenges. 00:17:02.951 --> 00:17:07.741 But it's very exciting to think that we can start to add more locations or scopes. 00:17:09.204 --> 00:17:09.694 Raph: Totally. 00:17:09.864 --> 00:17:13.023 I'm curious, like, what's, like for you, what, would you prefer to work on next? 00:17:13.124 --> 00:17:15.904 Is it adding scope or is it adding regions? 00:17:16.101 --> 00:17:17.501 Matt: Ah, that's a good question. 00:17:17.531 --> 00:17:23.051 I think adding scopes would be a lot of fun because We could see one customer 00:17:23.081 --> 00:17:26.411 completely transform their home with our platform, which would be a very 00:17:26.434 --> 00:17:26.934 Raph: That is 00:17:27.801 --> 00:17:28.061 Matt: right? 00:17:28.061 --> 00:17:34.651 Someone could go from a oil furnace and a fairly like leaky, inefficient 00:17:34.681 --> 00:17:40.351 home that purely relies on the grid for energy to a home that could potentially 00:17:40.351 --> 00:17:41.771 be self sustaining with solar panels. 00:17:42.266 --> 00:17:46.216 Have a backup battery and have a heat pump and they could effectively be 00:17:46.586 --> 00:17:49.116 their own little micro grid, right? 00:17:49.326 --> 00:17:52.936 So I think including other scopes in the short term would be incredible 00:17:52.946 --> 00:17:55.546 to just completely be able to transform an individual home. 00:17:55.546 --> 00:17:55.985 Raph: Yeah. 00:17:56.096 --> 00:17:57.796 That sounds super compelling. 00:17:58.065 --> 00:18:01.795 What would be your like top, top thing to, to tackle next? 00:18:01.795 --> 00:18:02.675 If it, yeah. 00:18:02.715 --> 00:18:03.575 Out of those scopes. 00:18:04.138 --> 00:18:07.298 Matt: It's a function of what happens with our energy provider here in BC. 00:18:07.508 --> 00:18:11.168 There's a lot of shifts in the world of how they charge homeowners 00:18:11.218 --> 00:18:12.558 per kilowatt hour of energy use. 00:18:13.258 --> 00:18:18.248 If when it changes there may be a very compelling business case for homeowners 00:18:18.268 --> 00:18:22.998 to start to switch to solar and get smart electrical panels electrical 00:18:22.998 --> 00:18:27.428 panel panels that are smart in the sense that they understand what the 00:18:27.428 --> 00:18:29.598 grid's demand is at any given time. 00:18:29.963 --> 00:18:32.563 And when a home should actually be taking energy from the grid 00:18:32.593 --> 00:18:34.913 versus when it should actually be feeding energy back to the grid. 00:18:35.673 --> 00:18:40.283 Um, that would be something that would be a lot of fun to, to tackle. 00:18:40.423 --> 00:18:45.443 Again, very challenging, but I think depending on how energy rates roll out 00:18:45.643 --> 00:18:49.493 in the foreseeable future, that may bring a pretty compelling business case 00:18:49.583 --> 00:18:51.353 to homeowners to start to look to that. 00:18:51.353 --> 00:18:51.713 Raph: Yeah. 00:18:51.713 --> 00:18:52.333 That's cool. 00:18:52.333 --> 00:18:55.943 I actually, that makes me think too like the funding that's available out there. 00:18:56.093 --> 00:18:58.343 how do you interact the funding and bringing. 00:18:58.753 --> 00:19:02.033 Like government funding to, to support these projects. 00:19:02.090 --> 00:19:05.770 Matt: the funding is probably the most mobile target of everything. 00:19:07.193 --> 00:19:07.663 Raph: Okay. 00:19:08.510 --> 00:19:13.580 Matt: been around, which has been a bit more than a calendar year, there's been 00:19:14.110 --> 00:19:19.090 a federal rebate program that has been pulled, the Greener Homes grant has been 00:19:19.090 --> 00:19:23.620 pulled as they ran out of funding, and there's been new funds that have been 00:19:24.520 --> 00:19:26.410 handed over to the provincial government. 00:19:27.085 --> 00:19:27.575 So 00:19:27.875 --> 00:19:33.035 currently these programs have independent portals that only homeowners can access, 00:19:33.575 --> 00:19:38.045 which we can help to some degree as we move homeowners through this process, 00:19:38.065 --> 00:19:42.425 we pull out the necessary and relevant information to make those applications and 00:19:42.445 --> 00:19:44.535 that portal easier for them to navigate. 00:19:45.155 --> 00:19:48.475 Now, ultimately where we'd love to be is to actually plug into these 00:19:48.475 --> 00:19:52.555 systems and just feed them the information when the homeowner has done 00:19:52.555 --> 00:19:54.105 their retrofit and the contractors. 00:19:54.970 --> 00:19:56.140 Have the work signed off. 00:19:56.320 --> 00:20:00.090 Of course, these programs are a tough egg to crack. 00:20:00.240 --> 00:20:01.280 Let's call it that, but 00:20:01.560 --> 00:20:03.120 We've chatted with a few folks. 00:20:03.120 --> 00:20:09.370 They're aware that we're around and hopefully we can demonstrate the trust 00:20:09.400 --> 00:20:13.230 and productivity to be able to show that we can actually help them with 00:20:13.900 --> 00:20:16.100 their back end of managing rebates. 00:20:16.100 --> 00:20:16.590 Raph: Awesome. 00:20:17.005 --> 00:20:17.345 Cool. 00:20:17.655 --> 00:20:21.545 If you had to talk to yourself, a year and a half, two years ago, what would be like 00:20:21.545 --> 00:20:22.895 the main thing you would tell yourself? 00:20:22.995 --> 00:20:26.235 Okay, look out for this when you hop into this project yeah, what would 00:20:26.235 --> 00:20:27.395 you, what advice would you give 00:20:27.658 --> 00:20:29.458 Matt: Man, that's a very good question. 00:20:29.688 --> 00:20:30.738 I haven't been asked that. 00:20:30.801 --> 00:20:33.694 I would say, you know, honestly, take care of yourself. 00:20:33.954 --> 00:20:36.084 It's it's a marathon, not a sprint. 00:20:36.164 --> 00:20:38.204 And sometimes you feel like you're sprinting a marathon. 00:20:38.814 --> 00:20:44.009 And to be able to Get outside, take a deep breath, go on your 00:20:44.009 --> 00:20:45.299 run, go on your bike ride. 00:20:45.569 --> 00:20:48.599 I, during the winter and fall months, I love yoga. 00:20:48.779 --> 00:20:50.139 So I've been doing a lot of yoga. 00:20:50.139 --> 00:20:54.149 I think it would just be, there was a period in time, about a four month 00:20:54.199 --> 00:20:56.129 stretch where I completely neglected that. 00:20:56.199 --> 00:21:00.109 There was just RFPs, there were customers, we were in a pretty, pretty 00:21:00.109 --> 00:21:01.699 heavy sprint just with the two of us. 00:21:02.439 --> 00:21:04.859 And that stuff can go by the wayside. 00:21:05.389 --> 00:21:08.409 And it can, Really wreak havoc. 00:21:08.509 --> 00:21:10.859 So just take care of yourself. 00:21:10.909 --> 00:21:11.709 Take a deep breath. 00:21:11.979 --> 00:21:13.669 Like it's a struggle. 00:21:13.719 --> 00:21:14.489 Absolutely. 00:21:14.659 --> 00:21:19.109 And yeah it's just being aware that you do need to take a bit of time. 00:21:19.109 --> 00:21:19.659 Raph: awesome. 00:21:20.154 --> 00:21:20.764 Sweet. 00:21:20.944 --> 00:21:23.464 That sounds like great advice to pass to you. 00:21:23.564 --> 00:21:27.074 and know, hopefully anyone who's listening can take that into account if they're 00:21:27.084 --> 00:21:28.804 hopping on a journey that's like yours. 00:21:29.154 --> 00:21:32.844 So with that, this is the small tech podcast do you have a small 00:21:32.844 --> 00:21:34.344 tech product that you want to shout 00:21:34.627 --> 00:21:38.467 Matt: Yeah, I think staying on the subject A app that I use, that I've 00:21:38.477 --> 00:21:43.467 used for several years, Insight Timer, it's similar to Calm it's effectively 00:21:43.467 --> 00:21:48.727 like a guided meditation app that you can plug into and listen to. 00:21:48.727 --> 00:21:49.817 And it chills you out a bit. 00:21:49.907 --> 00:21:53.007 It sends you some friendly reminders at a time that you would typically do it. 00:21:53.347 --> 00:21:55.977 That's been something I've used for years and will continue to. 00:21:56.197 --> 00:21:59.327 So that's a product I've always have and always will. 00:21:59.707 --> 00:22:00.477 Love and use. 00:22:00.577 --> 00:22:01.267 Raph: Fantastic. 00:22:01.297 --> 00:22:02.797 Matt, this was amazing. 00:22:02.897 --> 00:22:05.687 I, really appreciate you coming on the podcast and super fun 00:22:05.687 --> 00:22:07.047 chatting with you as always. 00:22:07.147 --> 00:22:09.827 And yeah, I feel like I learned a lot from this conversation. 00:22:09.847 --> 00:22:11.497 So yeah, I appreciate 00:22:11.610 --> 00:22:14.520 Matt: No, I'd love to be able to share the story and any 00:22:14.520 --> 00:22:16.500 insights, and thanks for having me. 00:22:16.500 --> 00:22:16.699 Raph: Cool. 00:22:16.972 --> 00:22:17.432 Matt: Take care. 00:22:17.432 --> 00:22:17.662 Raph: Bye. 00:22:17.962 --> 00:22:18.502 Folks. 00:22:18.532 --> 00:22:22.762 That was my interview with Matt Lannigan of grid bid. 00:22:23.032 --> 00:22:27.462 You can find him and GridBid at gridbid.co. 00:22:27.462 --> 00:22:30.282 And I want to thank him so much for coming on the podcast. 00:22:30.282 --> 00:22:31.032 I learned a lot. 00:22:31.032 --> 00:22:32.292 I hope you did as well. 00:22:32.562 --> 00:22:36.472 You can find the podcast at smalltechpodcast.com. 00:22:36.552 --> 00:22:40.002 Where you can listen to this episode past episodes, you can find all 00:22:40.032 --> 00:22:42.882 the links to all of the different apps where you can listen to the 00:22:42.882 --> 00:22:45.882 podcast that Spotify that's YouTube. 00:22:45.912 --> 00:22:49.122 That's a whole bunch of other places, apple podcasts, 00:22:49.152 --> 00:22:50.772 pocket casts, all the apps. 00:22:51.082 --> 00:22:52.792 And subscribe on YouTube. 00:22:52.822 --> 00:22:53.812 Give us a rating. 00:22:53.842 --> 00:22:54.952 Five star, please. 00:22:55.592 --> 00:22:56.342 Everywhere else. 00:22:56.372 --> 00:22:58.712 I, it really helps out we really appreciate it. 00:22:58.712 --> 00:23:01.412 We're a small team and we'll take all the help that we can get. 00:23:01.842 --> 00:23:02.622 You can find 00:23:03.192 --> 00:23:03.772 EC at ec.io 00:23:04.182 --> 00:23:04.642 Raph: io. 00:23:04.692 --> 00:23:08.802 so if you need any help building a platform, a tech product, a 00:23:08.802 --> 00:23:12.492 cloud enabled service, anything like that, shoot us a message. 00:23:12.522 --> 00:23:14.142 We would love to help. 00:23:14.142 --> 00:23:15.702 And thanks again for listening. 00:23:15.702 --> 00:23:19.342 I feel like I have not been telling you who I am anymore, so I am Raph. 00:23:19.395 --> 00:23:23.715 I'm one of the co-founders of EC and yeah, I really appreciate you listening. 00:23:23.739 --> 00:23:26.289 And with that, we all want to do some good in the world. 00:23:26.319 --> 00:23:27.969 So go out there and build something. 00:23:27.969 --> 00:23:28.539 Good folks. 00:23:28.539 --> 00:23:30.309 I'll see you in the next one. 00:23:30.369 --> 00:23:30.879 So yeah.