WEBVTT NOTE This file was generated by Descript 00:00:05.050 --> 00:00:09.040 Rupert Isaacson: Welcome to Live Free Ride Free, where we talk to people who 00:00:09.040 --> 00:00:14.680 have lived self-actualized lives on their own terms, and find out how they 00:00:14.680 --> 00:00:18.888 got there, what they do, how we can get there, what we can learn from them. 00:00:19.032 --> 00:00:23.839 How to live our best lives, find our own definition of success, 00:00:24.169 --> 00:00:26.689 and most importantly, find joy. 00:00:27.579 --> 00:00:29.259 I'm your host, Rupert Isaacson. 00:00:29.373 --> 00:00:32.463 New York Times bestselling author of the Horse Boy. 00:00:32.468 --> 00:00:36.456 Founder of New Trails Learning Systems and long ride home.com. 00:00:36.456 --> 00:00:42.074 You can find details of all our programs and shows on Rupert isaacson.com. 00:00:42.074 --> 00:00:44.204 Welcome back to Live Free, ride Free. 00:00:44.274 --> 00:00:49.074 where we talk to people who are living self-actualized lives, people who 00:00:49.079 --> 00:00:54.004 are effectively living the dream, , how have they managed to do it? 00:00:54.334 --> 00:00:56.464 What does it mean for them, their dream? 00:00:56.834 --> 00:00:58.094 , what can we learn from them? 00:00:58.464 --> 00:01:02.064 , how can mentorship from them help us? 00:01:02.619 --> 00:01:06.319 To achieve our dreams too, , and to live free and ride free in 00:01:06.319 --> 00:01:07.639 the way that's right for us. 00:01:08.179 --> 00:01:10.679 So, , today I've got, Lisa Dison. 00:01:11.339 --> 00:01:16.859 , Lisa Deon runs something rather unique called the Equus Film Festival. 00:01:17.729 --> 00:01:18.269 That's right. 00:01:18.329 --> 00:01:22.909 It's a film festival dedicated to telling stories, through the medium of the horse. 00:01:23.809 --> 00:01:26.049 And, , people might think, well, that's a bit niche. 00:01:26.049 --> 00:01:27.849 That's a bit, you know, but actually, no. 00:01:27.879 --> 00:01:33.639 It's one of those worlds that crosses over into so many other worlds because 00:01:33.639 --> 00:01:36.549 there's so many people that like horses, and yet there's so many people that 00:01:36.549 --> 00:01:39.009 like film and there's so many people that like story, and there's so many 00:01:39.014 --> 00:01:44.199 people that are either on the fringe of that or right in the middle of it. 00:01:44.229 --> 00:01:49.569 You, if you, if you look up any list of Hollywood as you'll see that at least 00:01:49.574 --> 00:01:51.939 half of them are into horses in some way. 00:01:52.659 --> 00:02:03.129 And if you like, the horse represents, I think, to humans, an idea of dream, 00:02:03.129 --> 00:02:08.869 an idea of allegory, an idea of a lot of people think about horses, , and 00:02:08.929 --> 00:02:10.819 use terminology around horses. 00:02:10.819 --> 00:02:11.989 Oh, she's a real stallion. 00:02:12.319 --> 00:02:14.689 Oh, you know, he, he's a bit of a wild stallion. 00:02:14.719 --> 00:02:17.329 Oh, you know, rain reign in that thought. 00:02:17.329 --> 00:02:18.589 Curb your enthusiasm. 00:02:18.669 --> 00:02:21.819 , you know, all of these things actually come from horses and. 00:02:22.629 --> 00:02:26.649 Something like Equus Film Festival sits square in the middle of, I think what 00:02:26.649 --> 00:02:30.219 horses mean is a metaphor for humans. 00:02:30.219 --> 00:02:34.449 But Lisa Tierson's made an absolute success out of this. 00:02:34.549 --> 00:02:36.409 , Lisa, thank you for coming on the show. 00:02:37.759 --> 00:02:38.269 Hi Rupert. 00:02:38.269 --> 00:02:39.379 Thank you for having me. 00:02:39.649 --> 00:02:41.569 Oh, it's, it's, it's, it's such a treat. 00:02:42.129 --> 00:02:47.309 Lisa, I've known you for quite a while, 15 years or something like that. 00:02:48.119 --> 00:02:54.504 Something like, I remember when, we were meeting at horse shows, both of us are 00:02:54.504 --> 00:02:56.634 enthusiasts of the Lucit horse breed. 00:02:57.154 --> 00:03:00.484 and then I remember you saying, oh yeah, I've got this idea. 00:03:00.514 --> 00:03:03.604 I, I think I wanna do this film festival, and yeah, it won't be, it 00:03:03.604 --> 00:03:05.044 won't be, you know, anything big. 00:03:05.044 --> 00:03:06.694 It's just, yeah, I just kind of wanna give it a go. 00:03:06.934 --> 00:03:09.034 And now it's huge and it's international. 00:03:09.484 --> 00:03:12.034 So tell us how you got there. 00:03:12.064 --> 00:03:14.344 Why, why, why, why did you come up with this idea? 00:03:16.024 --> 00:03:23.764 Lisa Diersen: You simply put, you and your documentary about your son were the 00:03:23.764 --> 00:03:29.374 reason that this film festival got started and, and yeah, going back and thinking 00:03:29.374 --> 00:03:37.084 back at, the Andalusian show in Texas and seeing your film the first time, and 00:03:37.414 --> 00:03:46.054 I remember being so moved because it, it lit me up literally because I felt that. 00:03:46.624 --> 00:03:47.194 Wow. 00:03:47.344 --> 00:03:52.054 Here's what's missing in, in the world. 00:03:52.054 --> 00:03:58.684 People don't feel enough empathy for what someone else is going 00:03:58.684 --> 00:04:02.284 through, whether it's the family unit, what you all went through. 00:04:02.674 --> 00:04:09.424 , now with us, with Josh, because I have a Down syndrome grandson who we've made 00:04:09.429 --> 00:04:16.564 a documentary about as well, the general public doesn't, doesn't have that empathy. 00:04:16.569 --> 00:04:20.794 When they see a family with this crying screaming child, they automatically think, 00:04:21.154 --> 00:04:22.594 oh, something's wrong with those parents. 00:04:22.594 --> 00:04:23.854 Or get that kid in line. 00:04:23.884 --> 00:04:30.634 And when I saw your documentary and I saw the struggle, which it truly was at 00:04:30.634 --> 00:04:35.224 that time, a, a struggle because it's a journey that's led you so many places. 00:04:35.974 --> 00:04:40.664 I went, oh my gosh, I want everybody I know to see this film. 00:04:41.164 --> 00:04:46.744 Because it, it, the story is so important and not because it was a horse story, 00:04:46.744 --> 00:04:51.394 because of course I love it cuz it's a horse story, but mainly because of 00:04:52.354 --> 00:04:56.824 the, the deeper felt message and kind of what you were talking about earlier. 00:04:57.004 --> 00:05:03.364 You know, I, how many films we've had in the festival that center around 00:05:03.934 --> 00:05:09.574 mental health issues, physical limitations, veterans who, who 00:05:09.694 --> 00:05:11.854 contemplate committing suicide. 00:05:13.304 --> 00:05:19.654 Youth in Crisis, all of these, this general public encompassing 00:05:20.704 --> 00:05:23.224 our world of people in crisis. 00:05:23.229 --> 00:05:26.374 And what's the thing that's out there to help all of them? 00:05:26.884 --> 00:05:31.564 It's the horse and it's telling those stories with the horses and, and we've 00:05:31.564 --> 00:05:35.944 had so many of those documentaries in the festival and they're so powerful. 00:05:36.574 --> 00:05:40.714 No matter where I show 'em or when I show 'em, people leave in tears 00:05:41.464 --> 00:05:43.054 because of the power of that. 00:05:43.954 --> 00:05:50.194 So that's, that was the catalyst that made the whole festival start Simply put you, 00:05:51.544 --> 00:05:52.714 Rupert Isaacson: well, you're very kind. 00:05:52.794 --> 00:06:00.504 and you know, it was amazing of you to, to have us there with the Horse 00:06:00.504 --> 00:06:07.064 Boy movie at the, at the first, at the first film festival, in New York. 00:06:07.514 --> 00:06:14.064 But there must have always been in your mind, oh, , since you were a little girl. 00:06:14.244 --> 00:06:16.524 Something around Story and Horse. 00:06:16.974 --> 00:06:18.594 Take us back to when you were small. 00:06:20.124 --> 00:06:24.714 What, did you have an idea like this was something cooking or was it 00:06:24.714 --> 00:06:26.544 an am Amal gum of, of other ideas? 00:06:26.544 --> 00:06:28.014 What, what, what, what started it all off? 00:06:29.634 --> 00:06:34.014 Lisa Diersen: Oh, I, well, I've always, always been around horses. 00:06:34.114 --> 00:06:36.424 My grandmother had horses, a pony. 00:06:36.424 --> 00:06:39.454 I always had a little pony spark plug was my first Pony's name. 00:06:39.784 --> 00:06:40.384 And where did you grow 00:06:40.384 --> 00:06:41.014 Rupert Isaacson: up, by the way, 00:06:41.019 --> 00:06:41.284 Lisa Diersen: Lisa? 00:06:41.794 --> 00:06:46.084 I grew up outside of Chicago in a, in a suburb called La Grange. 00:06:46.084 --> 00:06:49.084 But my parents' family lived down in Kentucky. 00:06:49.084 --> 00:06:52.354 So on my grandmother's farm, every summer we'd go down and spend time 00:06:52.894 --> 00:06:57.184 with the, with her at the farm and the horses and, and the pony 00:06:57.904 --> 00:06:59.844 and you know, always being around. 00:06:59.844 --> 00:07:06.604 And we would always take this pony out and create games and tell stories and, create 00:07:06.604 --> 00:07:09.664 little alternate, towns and things to do. 00:07:09.664 --> 00:07:12.604 And we were different people with those, with the pony. 00:07:12.604 --> 00:07:17.314 And to tell st tell storytelling, I think somewhere in the back of my mind 00:07:17.314 --> 00:07:25.674 always wanting to tell, tell stories or at least share stories, has something 00:07:25.734 --> 00:07:31.854 that's, I've always kind of always wanted to, always had back there, percolating 00:07:32.784 --> 00:07:38.244 then kind of life gets in the way and I ended up in the engineering field of 00:07:38.244 --> 00:07:40.494 all things, for, for quite a while. 00:07:40.794 --> 00:07:45.744 And then building houses and the horses were always the constant. 00:07:45.744 --> 00:07:50.724 I always either had a horse or was riding or involved with horses, involved with 00:07:50.729 --> 00:07:53.754 teaching young people with pony club. 00:07:53.754 --> 00:07:58.579 I went through many years of being, Un mounted pony club instructor for all 00:07:58.579 --> 00:08:03.769 the D level, for very, oh, there's the Jack Russell for a, for a long time. 00:08:03.799 --> 00:08:06.899 And then, , it's just always has been there bringing 00:08:06.904 --> 00:08:08.699 people together around horses. 00:08:10.289 --> 00:08:13.889 Rupert Isaacson: What do you think it is about the horse that serves as 00:08:13.889 --> 00:08:17.689 this, , catalytic factor, with humans? 00:08:17.689 --> 00:08:21.169 Because it does, it seems that people don't even need to ride 00:08:22.069 --> 00:08:24.119 to have a fascination, right, 00:08:24.349 --> 00:08:24.619 Lisa Diersen: right. 00:08:24.619 --> 00:08:24.949 With the horse. 00:08:24.949 --> 00:08:26.419 And I, what is it, do you think? 00:08:28.519 --> 00:08:33.619 Well, first of all, I believe that it's a 1200 pound electromagnetic field drawing 00:08:33.619 --> 00:08:40.939 us in, and it's also a 1200 pound metaphor for everything that's in our life. 00:08:41.329 --> 00:08:48.049 but I, even with my friends, I had, and I have quite a few friends that just have 00:08:48.319 --> 00:08:53.659 a horse to have that horses, they, they go and they'll brush the horse at night. 00:08:53.659 --> 00:08:55.279 They'll do stuff with the horse. 00:08:55.279 --> 00:08:58.309 They'll long line, they'll, they'll do everything but ride the 00:08:58.314 --> 00:09:00.859 horse and that's okay for them. 00:09:00.919 --> 00:09:05.929 There's entire Facebook groups dedicated to people who are just the 00:09:05.929 --> 00:09:10.129 non ridden horse and everybody thinks that it, you have to be in the horse 00:09:10.129 --> 00:09:14.569 to, you have to ride the horse to be into horses, and that's so wrong. 00:09:15.379 --> 00:09:19.669 One of the things with the film festival is people thought, well, you know, 00:09:20.809 --> 00:09:24.499 the, the non, there's only so many non or out there horse people riding 00:09:24.499 --> 00:09:25.849 and they don't have hours in the day. 00:09:26.419 --> 00:09:30.259 There's so many non-writing horse people that are moved by these stories and 00:09:30.649 --> 00:09:36.539 that magnetism of the horse that just draws them in, , from watching Misty 00:09:36.539 --> 00:09:43.049 of Shin Tea when we were kids and all of those stories, there's just, we 00:09:43.049 --> 00:09:46.469 talk, this is funny that you say that cuz we talk about this all the time. 00:09:46.474 --> 00:09:51.809 It's a, it's part of our con general conversation when we have, our Mustang 00:09:51.809 --> 00:09:56.819 summits or whatever, there's just something about these horses and when 00:09:57.089 --> 00:10:01.619 we use horses in the mental health field and you see the results that 00:10:01.619 --> 00:10:09.599 you can't get anywhere else with any other metaphor tool or just even simple 00:10:09.599 --> 00:10:14.009 talk therapy, you can't get there where you can get there with a horse. 00:10:14.639 --> 00:10:16.679 Rupert Isaacson: Talk to me about this business of being 00:10:16.679 --> 00:10:18.059 in the electromagnetic field. 00:10:18.059 --> 00:10:18.869 That's fascinating. 00:10:18.899 --> 00:10:23.129 Okay, so you say the horse is a 1200 pound electromagnetic field. 00:10:24.089 --> 00:10:26.879 How so and how does that benefit people? 00:10:27.269 --> 00:10:34.139 Lisa Diersen: So when we're around another human, basically you're, you're equal. 00:10:34.139 --> 00:10:38.459 We're bo we're, you know, you're, whether it's a big person or a little person, 00:10:38.519 --> 00:10:42.419 basically your weights are 120 hundred. 00:10:42.824 --> 00:10:44.264 30 pounds to each other. 00:10:44.654 --> 00:10:52.244 You bring a horse in, it's 10 times what energy and, and feeling that we are. 00:10:53.744 --> 00:10:58.964 So I think that they, I, I just think they help balance us that way. 00:10:59.414 --> 00:11:00.734 It's, you can't, what, what 00:11:00.734 --> 00:11:03.674 Rupert Isaacson: is, what is throwing out that electromagnetic field that you're 00:11:03.734 --> 00:11:04.244 Lisa Diersen: referring to? 00:11:05.534 --> 00:11:09.754 What do I, I, well, I just think it's an e I just think it's pure energy. 00:11:09.754 --> 00:11:14.674 I think I, I can watch a horse across an arena at a horse. 00:11:14.674 --> 00:11:16.264 You can do this at a horse show. 00:11:16.804 --> 00:11:17.794 Watch a horse. 00:11:18.574 --> 00:11:20.104 One horse goes crazy. 00:11:20.164 --> 00:11:22.104 Everybody around it feels it. 00:11:22.654 --> 00:11:27.814 And if you're a, a, a more sensitive person, temple Grandin comes to mind. 00:11:27.814 --> 00:11:30.394 People who are really sensitive can feel that. 00:11:30.444 --> 00:11:35.034 when you get, when you're working with horses a lot, you can feel when a horse is 00:11:35.124 --> 00:11:41.094 un uncomfortable, you can feel that kind of wave, that a mare standing in a field 00:11:41.094 --> 00:11:43.194 with a bunch of other mares and babies. 00:11:44.424 --> 00:11:48.834 When that coyote is out across, at, at the corner of the field, 00:11:48.864 --> 00:11:50.694 that one mare turns up looks. 00:11:50.784 --> 00:11:56.274 And everyone can feel that just by her, her simple head, bring your head up. 00:11:56.904 --> 00:11:59.334 It's just the, it's very forceful. 00:12:00.144 --> 00:12:01.674 Well, the energy of the horse. 00:12:01.734 --> 00:12:01.794 Yeah. 00:12:02.154 --> 00:12:02.394 What 00:12:02.394 --> 00:12:03.804 Rupert Isaacson: I'm, what I'm wondering about is, I, 00:12:03.864 --> 00:12:05.064 you're probably aware of this. 00:12:05.094 --> 00:12:07.134 I, I know that there's a, an organization. 00:12:07.664 --> 00:12:10.274 Research in institute called the Heart Math Institute. 00:12:10.274 --> 00:12:10.364 Mm-hmm. 00:12:10.634 --> 00:12:12.074 Which has been doing, yep. 00:12:12.684 --> 00:12:17.204 Research into the electromagnetic fields thrown out by hearts of one kind or 00:12:17.209 --> 00:12:20.924 another, and finding that the sort of, the larger the heart, the greater the 00:12:20.924 --> 00:12:22.604 electromagnetic field it throws out. 00:12:22.604 --> 00:12:22.694 Mm-hmm. 00:12:22.934 --> 00:12:27.404 So if our heart, if our relatively small hearts throughout a certain 00:12:27.404 --> 00:12:31.514 electromagnetic field, this huge heart throws out a much bigger one. 00:12:32.114 --> 00:12:32.414 Yes. 00:12:32.714 --> 00:12:36.704 How, how, how do you feel that that benefits a human to be in the 00:12:36.709 --> 00:12:40.784 presence of a greater electromagnetic field coming from a larger heart? 00:12:41.834 --> 00:12:46.314 Lisa Diersen: Well, I think it's, especially with animals because, and we, 00:12:46.514 --> 00:12:50.714 the bigger, the electromagnetic field is gonna be the bigger animal, definitely. 00:12:51.194 --> 00:12:57.704 But if they're sentient animals like a horse or an elephant or a, a peaceful, 00:12:58.214 --> 00:13:03.254 a peaceful animal, they're gonna bring that peaceful energy to you. 00:13:03.314 --> 00:13:09.644 And I see it from when I used to do work in the equine assisted therapy field. 00:13:10.064 --> 00:13:14.864 You what would happen when a horse would be around someone in crisis. 00:13:14.869 --> 00:13:16.364 It, it's undeniable. 00:13:16.364 --> 00:13:23.474 You can't, you can't work with someone and, and be in a equine assisted, 00:13:23.984 --> 00:13:30.254 whether it's psychotherapy or just general therapy situation, and deny what 00:13:30.344 --> 00:13:32.684 happens between a person and a horse. 00:13:32.744 --> 00:13:35.054 And I think it's just because the horses are just. 00:13:35.834 --> 00:13:41.354 You can't go into an arena working with a horse in a, equine-assisted 00:13:41.444 --> 00:13:47.144 therapy setting with a bad attitude because the horse is gonna just 00:13:47.474 --> 00:13:48.584 turn around and blow you off. 00:13:48.614 --> 00:13:49.814 It will just ignore you. 00:13:50.264 --> 00:13:53.774 I mean, I've seen so many amazing things happen in therapy sessions 00:13:53.774 --> 00:13:58.364 that, I mean, they've, you know, there are books and films about it. 00:13:58.424 --> 00:14:01.364 They're, it's just undeniable. 00:14:01.634 --> 00:14:03.074 I mean, what happened with your son? 00:14:03.074 --> 00:14:04.814 It's How do explain that? 00:14:04.934 --> 00:14:05.204 Well, 00:14:05.204 --> 00:14:05.714 Rupert Isaacson: sure. 00:14:05.719 --> 00:14:10.124 And you know, when, when my son, in the early days would just lie on 00:14:10.124 --> 00:14:13.484 Betsy, that was the mayor he became close to, he would lie on her back. 00:14:13.854 --> 00:14:15.804 this is before we even started riding together. 00:14:16.074 --> 00:14:20.424 And he would use her body like a big old couch and all of his agitated 00:14:20.424 --> 00:14:21.924 behaviors would just disappear. 00:14:22.134 --> 00:14:27.294 And I had no idea why until, some years later, even after we had been practicing, 00:14:27.294 --> 00:14:28.464 you know, horse boy method and so on. 00:14:28.704 --> 00:14:32.064 Then I, I think it was Linda Ton Jones who, who came along and said, 00:14:32.514 --> 00:14:33.864 oh yes, the HeartMath Institute. 00:14:33.964 --> 00:14:39.834 you, you put your heart into the close range, heart to heart 00:14:39.834 --> 00:14:41.574 with a much greater electro. 00:14:41.579 --> 00:14:44.004 And it's interesting that you said for peaceful animal, cuz of course, 00:14:44.009 --> 00:14:47.094 I guess you could say, you know, an angry polar bear might not be 00:14:47.094 --> 00:14:48.264 quite so, you know, good for us. 00:14:48.324 --> 00:14:48.384 Yeah. 00:14:48.734 --> 00:14:49.854 and, different type of hug. 00:14:50.334 --> 00:14:56.714 and, This seems to bring our hearts into what they call coherence. 00:14:57.284 --> 00:15:01.819 Meaning that the, the way in which, the rhythms of the ventricles 00:15:01.819 --> 00:15:06.989 as they're pumping, become much more, stable, slow, down, slow. 00:15:07.199 --> 00:15:11.069 And that seems to bring our brainwaves down at the same time, because of 00:15:11.069 --> 00:15:13.169 course, hearts are composed of neurons. 00:15:13.529 --> 00:15:15.839 The gut is composed of neurons and the brain is composed of neurons. 00:15:15.839 --> 00:15:20.169 So it seems to then bring one from that sort of busy brain, the 00:15:20.169 --> 00:15:23.894 basic, you know, to, to more of an alpha, meditative brain state. 00:15:24.074 --> 00:15:25.334 Cause I didn't know any of this at the time. 00:15:25.334 --> 00:15:26.564 I just, you know, observed it. 00:15:26.564 --> 00:15:28.514 But it was very interesting when it was explained to me. 00:15:28.664 --> 00:15:32.564 You, you said something else though, about horses metaphor, which I really like. 00:15:32.614 --> 00:15:36.784 and I presume that to understand the horse as a metaphor, you don't necessarily 00:15:36.784 --> 00:15:37.894 even have to be a horse person. 00:15:38.104 --> 00:15:40.414 What, what do you feel horse are as a metaphor 00:15:40.414 --> 00:15:41.044 Lisa Diersen: for humans? 00:15:42.844 --> 00:15:46.594 I think it depends on the human and what the human is going through. 00:15:46.714 --> 00:15:56.344 whether for me, the, the horse is, gosh, I think a metaphor of I 00:15:56.344 --> 00:15:58.724 can do it, you know, possibility. 00:15:58.724 --> 00:16:00.244 Like nothing's too big. 00:16:01.194 --> 00:16:01.484 Yeah. 00:16:01.489 --> 00:16:02.114 Possibility. 00:16:02.119 --> 00:16:02.864 Possibility. 00:16:02.894 --> 00:16:03.644 Perfect word. 00:16:04.064 --> 00:16:06.314 For a veteran who's. 00:16:08.024 --> 00:16:12.854 Just handed a, a letter to a therapist that said, in, before I 00:16:12.854 --> 00:16:16.934 got into the equine program, I was thinking about committing suicide. 00:16:17.324 --> 00:16:21.794 That horse could be a metaphor for, for living and for life 00:16:21.794 --> 00:16:24.194 and for, you know, surviving. 00:16:25.244 --> 00:16:31.454 we're doing, it's so funny, and I love, I've watched in the last 30 years how 00:16:31.544 --> 00:16:39.014 all of these, these people who were considered fringe before, but now that the 00:16:39.014 --> 00:16:44.924 science is balancing with the knowledge and, and it's all coming together. 00:16:45.174 --> 00:16:49.924 even when, e equ I, when e Equine assisted Growth and Learning Association 00:16:49.924 --> 00:16:54.844 started, it was not considered what it is now, which is a, a gold 00:16:54.844 --> 00:17:00.974 standard for, the equine therapy field and in the psychology field. 00:17:01.574 --> 00:17:08.284 So I've watched all of this kind of, these pieces come together and, and now the, 00:17:08.289 --> 00:17:12.764 the general public and even non horse people are getting an understanding. 00:17:13.094 --> 00:17:16.664 You know, when, when I ha have a conversation with someone who works 00:17:16.664 --> 00:17:22.499 for, the veterans and administration in their, recreational therapy 00:17:22.504 --> 00:17:26.099 department, because that's what equine assisted therapy is generally considered 00:17:26.104 --> 00:17:31.349 with the va, it's still considered recreational therapy until there's enough. 00:17:31.724 --> 00:17:39.644 Research and data and study that comes in through accredited resources that 00:17:39.644 --> 00:17:43.874 they'll be able to actually bring it in as a therapeutic use with veterans. 00:17:44.804 --> 00:17:49.244 But we all know everyone who's been out there, and especially now with the 00:17:49.244 --> 00:17:54.644 Mustangs, because we're doing so much more with Mustang horses, watching how, 00:17:54.644 --> 00:17:59.714 because of the PTs d that the Mustang horse goes through, balancing with the 00:17:59.714 --> 00:18:05.444 ps, PTs d that veterans go through, whether it's an accredited program or not. 00:18:05.984 --> 00:18:07.994 Those programs 00:18:07.994 --> 00:18:08.594 Rupert Isaacson: work. 00:18:08.954 --> 00:18:12.534 You're talking about the work, the, the, the, the trauma that, Mustang 00:18:12.539 --> 00:18:13.914 goes through in being captured Yes. 00:18:13.914 --> 00:18:14.244 Filed and brought 00:18:14.964 --> 00:18:15.414 Lisa Diersen: into pen. 00:18:15.414 --> 00:18:15.614 Yes. 00:18:15.624 --> 00:18:18.714 Or even being separated because they're family based. 00:18:18.744 --> 00:18:18.834 Mm-hmm. 00:18:18.834 --> 00:18:23.784 The herds are, I mean, there's a huge, movement going on right now 00:18:24.144 --> 00:18:27.564 to stop the helicopter around if there's actually a bill in Congress. 00:18:28.084 --> 00:18:34.534 Colorado is the first state that passed legislature to, they have an 00:18:34.534 --> 00:18:38.914 entire organiza or group now that's, and funding that's gonna be dedicated 00:18:38.919 --> 00:18:43.924 to, taking care of the, what the Mustang issue is going on in Colorado. 00:18:44.884 --> 00:18:49.024 So, and these horses form family bands, so they're going through traumas, they're 00:18:49.024 --> 00:18:52.924 getting torn apart and the mares and fos are getting separated and all of that. 00:18:52.924 --> 00:18:56.374 But that balance is what the veterans go through and that. 00:18:56.974 --> 00:18:57.964 That works. 00:18:58.714 --> 00:19:03.154 And it doesn't have to be a path or a, a gala certified 00:19:03.154 --> 00:19:05.854 program with, with veterans. 00:19:05.854 --> 00:19:10.294 It seems to be that as long as a group of veterans have gotten together with 00:19:10.294 --> 00:19:15.574 their horses and they work with each other, if you are stopping someone from 00:19:16.744 --> 00:19:19.474 committing suicide, something is working. 00:19:19.834 --> 00:19:20.224 Absolutely. 00:19:20.284 --> 00:19:22.504 And, and something is working with the horse. 00:19:23.014 --> 00:19:28.924 But, when you talk about the heart math, that's, and that's another 00:19:28.929 --> 00:19:32.974 thing that was considered kind of fringe until just recently. 00:19:33.514 --> 00:19:38.014 We're doing a lot of, in fact, next week we'll be filming in Indiana, or the first, 00:19:38.104 --> 00:19:42.359 first week of July, we'll be filming in Indiana for a, where we're using 00:19:42.449 --> 00:19:48.959 brain-based neuro pathway release work with Mustangs and for our, our documentary 00:19:48.964 --> 00:19:53.549 series, the Mustang story documentary series that we started to years ago. 00:19:54.809 --> 00:20:00.719 And it works when you watch these horses in this program, it, it's 00:20:00.719 --> 00:20:03.809 just amazing how well it works. 00:20:04.139 --> 00:20:08.339 Waiting for those dopamine and serotonin hits and teaching the 00:20:08.339 --> 00:20:12.959 horses how to give themselves those dopamine and serotonin hits. 00:20:14.099 --> 00:20:16.829 Which changes the, which changes the whole training. 00:20:17.549 --> 00:20:20.669 You know, there's people out there doing amazing work, which 00:20:20.669 --> 00:20:23.159 is one of the, I I feel that. 00:20:23.669 --> 00:20:28.829 With the film festival or with what I do just in general is I kind of 00:20:28.829 --> 00:20:35.909 act as a connector for all of these stories and things out there that 00:20:36.449 --> 00:20:41.729 either are, are brought to me or we find or we help get those stories out 00:20:42.359 --> 00:20:44.849 to everybody else who has no idea. 00:20:45.659 --> 00:20:52.139 There's still people who I refer your documentary to that sit after 00:20:52.139 --> 00:20:53.849 they watch it and go, I had no idea. 00:20:54.719 --> 00:20:55.499 I had no idea. 00:20:56.459 --> 00:20:59.339 And now they know, and once you see, you can't unsee. 00:20:59.609 --> 00:21:01.889 So now you know that horses can do this. 00:21:01.889 --> 00:21:07.259 So it's your move to continue to tell that, tell people about all 00:21:07.259 --> 00:21:08.579 the things that horses can do. 00:21:09.269 --> 00:21:10.949 Rupert Isaacson: So what you're really talking about with, with, 00:21:11.004 --> 00:21:14.724 the film festival of course is, is the healing power of story. 00:21:15.324 --> 00:21:17.964 In, in your case, the stories happen to be about horses. 00:21:18.474 --> 00:21:24.384 but I guess story, you know, people talk about us as, or, or, or, the 00:21:24.894 --> 00:21:28.909 name for our species is, homo sapien sapiens, the Thinking Ape. 00:21:29.029 --> 00:21:32.459 But I've always thought that was a rather asinine, title for us 00:21:32.459 --> 00:21:34.229 because everything thinks right. 00:21:34.229 --> 00:21:36.359 If you have a brain, you think there's nothing special 00:21:36.359 --> 00:21:37.619 about our species that way. 00:21:38.129 --> 00:21:41.579 But we do have a larynx. 00:21:42.019 --> 00:21:43.549 we speak with a speaking aid. 00:21:44.254 --> 00:21:47.494 Other animals vocalize and they can vocalize obviously in a very 00:21:47.494 --> 00:21:52.164 complex way, but they don't, write rap or, you know, Shakespeare or, 00:21:52.554 --> 00:21:54.174 you know, epic poetry or whatever. 00:21:54.414 --> 00:21:55.914 That's us with the storytelling app. 00:21:55.914 --> 00:22:00.924 And it seems, you know, the time I've spent in indigenous communities, 00:22:01.284 --> 00:22:04.824 with shamans and healers and that sort of thing, that story seems to 00:22:04.824 --> 00:22:06.324 also be very tied up with healing. 00:22:06.444 --> 00:22:11.454 in that it seems to be the original form of medicine in that even, even actually 00:22:11.454 --> 00:22:15.534 in modern medicine, what happens, you go to see the doctor with a story. 00:22:15.564 --> 00:22:18.164 You say, this is happening, this did happen, this has 00:22:18.284 --> 00:22:19.724 happened, this is happening now. 00:22:20.544 --> 00:22:21.444 what's the story? 00:22:21.624 --> 00:22:26.094 You know, and the doctor goes off, the shaman would go into the spirit 00:22:26.099 --> 00:22:29.964 world, you know, the doctor goes into their notes and their research, and 00:22:29.969 --> 00:22:34.854 then they come back with a set of instructions and sort of create a new 00:22:34.854 --> 00:22:36.684 story, which could be done through drugs. 00:22:36.684 --> 00:22:39.024 It could be done through, you know, a, a psychic medium. 00:22:39.024 --> 00:22:41.514 It could be not a medium in terms of connecting with the dead, 00:22:41.514 --> 00:22:44.379 but in terms of, a channel, it could be done through many ways. 00:22:44.379 --> 00:22:45.009 It could be both. 00:22:45.009 --> 00:22:47.769 It could be all, but nonetheless, that seems to be what happens. 00:22:47.769 --> 00:22:48.909 It's a storytelling process. 00:22:49.929 --> 00:22:53.359 Where did storytelling begin for you, as a girl? 00:22:53.719 --> 00:22:55.369 Were you always an a of story? 00:22:57.199 --> 00:22:57.739 Lisa Diersen: Oh yeah. 00:22:57.739 --> 00:22:59.029 I was an avid reader. 00:22:59.109 --> 00:23:04.599 my mother was, Al was very ill while I was growing up, and so reading I. 00:23:05.004 --> 00:23:07.104 Reading was a great escape for me. 00:23:07.854 --> 00:23:13.464 And of course it was reading every horse book that was, was ever written. 00:23:13.564 --> 00:23:16.834 and now seeing those, some of those horse books that have come in, been 00:23:16.894 --> 00:23:20.974 turned into movies and that you're, if you're a little girl and you read all 00:23:20.974 --> 00:23:24.424 the whole Black Stallion series and then you can watch the Black Stallion 00:23:24.874 --> 00:23:27.084 movie, that was, that was my escape. 00:23:27.084 --> 00:23:34.104 So reading horse horse books, I have shelves full of all the horse books 00:23:34.104 --> 00:23:38.154 that I've read as a, when I was a kid I was able to find those books. 00:23:38.154 --> 00:23:41.604 But, that's the other, one of the other things with Equus is we have 00:23:41.934 --> 00:23:44.094 all the literate, we have books. 00:23:44.094 --> 00:23:48.744 We have usually 60 or so books that get entered every year. 00:23:48.804 --> 00:23:48.924 Oh. 00:23:48.924 --> 00:23:49.284 So, you know, 00:23:49.584 --> 00:23:51.504 Rupert Isaacson: a literary festival as well as a film festival. 00:23:51.774 --> 00:23:51.954 We're 00:23:51.954 --> 00:23:54.384 Lisa Diersen: a literary, we're art, we're podcast. 00:23:54.504 --> 00:23:54.834 Okay. 00:23:55.284 --> 00:24:00.264 any form of storytelling in the equine world. 00:24:00.624 --> 00:24:00.744 Okay. 00:24:00.984 --> 00:24:02.544 We, we award that. 00:24:03.394 --> 00:24:06.494 Rupert Isaacson: so for listeners, if you've got a book, and you get 00:24:06.494 --> 00:24:08.754 writing, you might be able to submit it. 00:24:09.164 --> 00:24:10.274 what was your mother sick with? 00:24:10.374 --> 00:24:12.024 what was, what was the issue with her? 00:24:13.044 --> 00:24:17.514 Lisa Diersen: Oh, my mother had giant bone cell cancer, which back and when I was 00:24:17.514 --> 00:24:23.184 growing up, we didn't have even anywhere near the, the medicine that we have now. 00:24:23.184 --> 00:24:24.724 But, she had bone cell cancer. 00:24:24.724 --> 00:24:26.014 She had lost a leg. 00:24:26.749 --> 00:24:27.409 To that. 00:24:27.649 --> 00:24:28.339 and then at what 00:24:28.339 --> 00:24:30.199 Rupert Isaacson: age was she when that really kicked in? 00:24:30.199 --> 00:24:31.009 And what age were you? 00:24:31.589 --> 00:24:35.849 Lisa Diersen: I was, well, okay, so I remember on my 13th birthday was 00:24:35.854 --> 00:24:39.599 when they told, told us as a family that they were going to amputate her 00:24:39.604 --> 00:24:42.779 leg, but she was, okay, we go back. 00:24:43.229 --> 00:24:48.579 My brother died when I was, my mom was five months pregnant with me in 00:24:48.579 --> 00:24:51.219 a tragic accident in our basement. 00:24:51.399 --> 00:24:53.439 he fell off of a pogo stick. 00:24:53.444 --> 00:25:00.339 My older sister was bouncing him on, hit a tool and my dad's workshop, and 00:25:00.339 --> 00:25:03.879 it went into his ear and punctured his eardrum and went into his brain. 00:25:04.569 --> 00:25:06.549 And he lived maybe three days. 00:25:06.699 --> 00:25:11.499 So they didn't think that my, I, they thought my mom was gonna lose me. 00:25:11.499 --> 00:25:12.159 She didn't. 00:25:13.449 --> 00:25:18.609 But she really never recovered, I think, don't think from that point 00:25:18.759 --> 00:25:22.779 on, I think until she passed away. 00:25:22.779 --> 00:25:29.679 And she was, I, I believe 64, 65 when she passed away a actually, and it 00:25:29.684 --> 00:25:32.529 was diabetes related and her body. 00:25:32.559 --> 00:25:39.699 She just, with that moment with my brother, I just think she just, I 00:25:39.699 --> 00:25:44.079 don't rem I don't have any other memories of, as a child of her not 00:25:44.079 --> 00:25:47.109 being sad, I guess you not being 00:25:47.109 --> 00:25:48.459 Rupert Isaacson: so she, she was sick and sad all through 00:25:48.464 --> 00:25:48.969 Lisa Diersen: your childhood. 00:25:49.329 --> 00:25:53.709 Sick and sad all through my tub and my little sister should say that again. 00:25:54.519 --> 00:25:58.029 And my little sister, I had a sister that came a couple years after I 00:25:58.029 --> 00:26:04.059 was born, but she was never, my mom was never, never, well, so between 00:26:04.059 --> 00:26:08.079 being physically or mentally, she was never, never really Well. 00:26:08.469 --> 00:26:11.174 Rupert Isaacson: And your older sister who, had been bouncing your 00:26:11.174 --> 00:26:14.234 brother on the Perga six, she must have of course, suffered terribly, 00:26:14.874 --> 00:26:15.724 Lisa Diersen: guilt and so forth. 00:26:15.864 --> 00:26:16.084 Yes. 00:26:17.074 --> 00:26:17.364 Yeah. 00:26:17.424 --> 00:26:22.854 And it wasn't until probably 30 years later, and it was after my mother 00:26:22.974 --> 00:26:29.394 passed away that, I had an uncle who was a, a priest and he had a long talk 00:26:29.394 --> 00:26:32.964 with my sister where she, and then you talk about how people carry stuff. 00:26:33.294 --> 00:26:38.034 She really finally opened up and let loose and house, you know, 00:26:38.304 --> 00:26:40.434 it had affected her entire life. 00:26:40.894 --> 00:26:41.044 yeah. 00:26:41.074 --> 00:26:43.384 So, you know, you watched Yeah. 00:26:43.504 --> 00:26:47.614 And you, and so you, I grew up very acutely aware of how 00:26:47.614 --> 00:26:52.294 one action affects everything. 00:26:52.354 --> 00:26:59.584 And so you have to be, you have to consciously make decisions in your life to 00:26:59.584 --> 00:27:09.004 not, to not fall into, you know, conscious decisions in your life all the way along. 00:27:09.004 --> 00:27:13.114 Not to fall into any, you know, doing things that negatively. 00:27:13.114 --> 00:27:15.574 You need to work on positivity. 00:27:17.539 --> 00:27:18.709 Rupert Isaacson: What, tell me about your father. 00:27:18.909 --> 00:27:20.109 where was he in all this? 00:27:21.069 --> 00:27:22.209 Lisa Diersen: Oh, he was my dad. 00:27:22.299 --> 00:27:22.779 My dad. 00:27:22.779 --> 00:27:23.499 I love my dad. 00:27:23.499 --> 00:27:24.759 My dad was great. 00:27:24.764 --> 00:27:26.439 He was always there. 00:27:26.439 --> 00:27:28.749 He was, always took care of my mother. 00:27:29.199 --> 00:27:33.609 and she was not, she was not a happy person to take care of. 00:27:33.709 --> 00:27:35.689 he wa he worked all the time. 00:27:35.689 --> 00:27:36.589 So What did he do? 00:27:36.639 --> 00:27:40.179 he was a plant manager for a big aluminum rolling mill. 00:27:40.179 --> 00:27:42.369 He was a mechanical manager for that. 00:27:42.549 --> 00:27:47.259 my earl earlier, I kind, my brother who passed, I kind of 00:27:47.499 --> 00:27:49.089 took his place with my dad. 00:27:49.089 --> 00:27:55.119 So I was always kind of doing, I don't wanna call 'em boy things, but I was 00:27:55.124 --> 00:27:59.559 all my dad, there wasn't anything my dad ever told me I couldn't do. 00:28:00.549 --> 00:28:05.439 So if, if he was up fixing shingles on a roof, I was up 00:28:05.559 --> 00:28:07.389 fixing shingles on a roof with him. 00:28:07.489 --> 00:28:13.759 changing tires, I mean, learning how to change the oil in a car there if he did 00:28:13.759 --> 00:28:15.889 it, he wanted me to know how to do it. 00:28:16.849 --> 00:28:17.389 Did he teach 00:28:17.394 --> 00:28:18.199 Rupert Isaacson: all the kids? 00:28:18.249 --> 00:28:22.179 , and you just ha happened to have more of a, of an aptitude for that 00:28:22.179 --> 00:28:24.009 sort of practical stuff, or did you 00:28:24.009 --> 00:28:27.129 Lisa Diersen: all In fact, there was a, there was a big difference. 00:28:27.199 --> 00:28:32.269 my brother, my older sister was 13 years older, so I, I don't 00:28:32.269 --> 00:28:33.859 have much of a memory of her. 00:28:34.759 --> 00:28:36.249 It, she had, she got. 00:28:38.859 --> 00:28:42.969 So her youngest, her oldest daughter's the same age as my sister. 00:28:42.969 --> 00:28:46.989 So it, I don't have that memory of my older sister with 00:28:46.994 --> 00:28:49.179 my dad and my little sister. 00:28:49.179 --> 00:28:56.199 My mom was so ill at that point that, my dad spent more time taking 00:28:56.204 --> 00:28:58.509 care of that end of my mother then. 00:28:59.649 --> 00:29:03.429 So it was, no, I didn't, so I got, I was kind of always referred 00:29:03.429 --> 00:29:07.689 to as my dad's sidekick, so. 00:29:07.694 --> 00:29:07.959 Rupert Isaacson: Okay. 00:29:08.429 --> 00:29:10.809 Because you, you had a much older one, a much younger one. 00:29:10.809 --> 00:29:10.899 Mm-hmm. 00:29:11.379 --> 00:29:13.299 You were sort of in the middle and Yep. 00:29:13.809 --> 00:29:15.249 Able to middle child syndrome. 00:29:15.639 --> 00:29:16.029 Okay. 00:29:16.539 --> 00:29:17.019 Interesting. 00:29:17.019 --> 00:29:23.349 So, so you, you are, you are, you have a positive dad, but a mom who is basically 00:29:23.349 --> 00:29:29.629 sick with sadness, and grief, and you find story and you find horse stories 00:29:30.049 --> 00:29:33.439 as, as, as, as a way to escape happiness. 00:29:33.889 --> 00:29:37.429 what were the stories that really stood out for you at that age? 00:29:40.759 --> 00:29:41.689 Lisa Diersen: Black beauty? 00:29:41.789 --> 00:29:44.819 the Billy, I loved the Billy and Blaze stories. 00:29:44.819 --> 00:29:47.219 I loved the Black stallion stories. 00:29:47.849 --> 00:29:53.669 Mis misty of hin tea, you know, just always like horse hero stories. 00:29:53.669 --> 00:29:53.999 I love 00:29:53.999 --> 00:29:54.709 Rupert Isaacson: those kinds of stories. 00:29:54.709 --> 00:29:55.439 Horse hero stories. 00:29:55.444 --> 00:29:58.649 So horses that were somewhat against the odds. 00:29:59.369 --> 00:29:59.549 Yes. 00:29:59.819 --> 00:30:03.269 Like, like the black beauty story, you know, sold to bad people surviving. 00:30:05.309 --> 00:30:10.409 And that, I guess you were taking as back to the idea of the horses as a metaphor. 00:30:10.649 --> 00:30:14.549 Would you think it, it was clear to say that even if it was unconscious, you 00:30:14.549 --> 00:30:20.159 were putting yourself perhaps in the shoes, the horseshoe of, of, I was just 00:30:20.159 --> 00:30:23.969 gonna say underdog horse characters that were, that were suffering. 00:30:23.969 --> 00:30:25.921 Would, would that be correct to say, to say? 00:30:26.069 --> 00:30:28.619 Lisa Diersen: Probably, probably dead on, probably. 00:30:29.159 --> 00:30:31.319 Rupert Isaacson: Did you at some point want to tell story? 00:30:31.379 --> 00:30:34.529 Did you at some point say, well, I want to write, I want to create 00:30:34.529 --> 00:30:38.549 story or, was it different somehow? 00:30:40.349 --> 00:30:46.249 Lisa Diersen: You know, I, I like telling stories through, through, 00:30:46.249 --> 00:30:49.129 pictures and film versus writing. 00:30:50.029 --> 00:30:51.319 , and that's evolved. 00:30:51.319 --> 00:30:54.949 That's really evolved in the last 20 years with doing that. 00:30:55.129 --> 00:31:02.449 I love that having bred the lucit horses, the horses that I, I think 00:31:02.454 --> 00:31:06.199 every baby that we've had that's hit the ground is part of a story. 00:31:06.739 --> 00:31:11.839 And so following every one of our foals as they grow up and what they're 00:31:11.839 --> 00:31:17.869 doing, you know, it's, that's just more of the way to tell those stories. 00:31:18.739 --> 00:31:19.069 So sort 00:31:19.069 --> 00:31:20.539 Rupert Isaacson: of living stories really. 00:31:20.699 --> 00:31:21.119 Lisa Diersen: Mm-hmm. 00:31:21.499 --> 00:31:25.789 Living stories like the, like Josh's story, kind of like your son's story. 00:31:25.789 --> 00:31:31.069 I, I like those stories where they can still continue because people still 00:31:31.069 --> 00:31:33.949 want to know what's going on with Rowan. 00:31:33.979 --> 00:31:38.989 They still, Josh still loves the fact that now we can take pictures of him 00:31:39.649 --> 00:31:43.849 four or five years later and he's now writing his mom's Lucit mayor 00:31:43.849 --> 00:31:46.099 and taking writing classes with her. 00:31:46.099 --> 00:31:49.399 And, you know, it's, it's continuation. 00:31:49.399 --> 00:31:52.309 It's not something that has an ending. 00:31:53.539 --> 00:31:55.489 It has, it just continues. 00:31:55.609 --> 00:32:00.129 Rupert Isaacson: You, you get into story, partly to assuage this, you know, to, 00:32:00.129 --> 00:32:04.609 to, to survive really, or to thrive in this, in, in this house full of grief. 00:32:05.479 --> 00:32:07.789 as, as well as of course your relationship with your dad and so on. 00:32:08.239 --> 00:32:14.799 you say that living stories and it naturally film, were you, did you, 00:32:14.829 --> 00:32:17.709 had you always sort of wanted to be a filmmaker, did you, were there films 00:32:17.709 --> 00:32:22.329 that you watched that, was there always this little bit of you, I wanna do that, 00:32:22.329 --> 00:32:24.339 but I just dunno how I'm gonna do that? 00:32:26.169 --> 00:32:31.899 Lisa Diersen: You know, I, I don't know if it was something consciously that I had. 00:32:31.999 --> 00:32:37.189 I've always been a creator, so when I worked. 00:32:38.089 --> 00:32:41.869 When I was in engineering at General Motors, you're, you're creating, you're 00:32:41.869 --> 00:32:47.359 taking, blueprints and creating a, something that will grow into being 00:32:47.359 --> 00:32:54.009 a part in a, in a truck or a car that evolved into, building houses and, 00:32:54.309 --> 00:32:57.009 and building, developing subdivisions. 00:32:57.399 --> 00:33:00.369 Just, I love the creative process. 00:33:00.369 --> 00:33:06.129 I love taking something that is just an, an idea and turning it 00:33:06.129 --> 00:33:10.899 into something, whatever it is. 00:33:10.929 --> 00:33:14.049 Whether it's a story or a house or a barn. 00:33:14.109 --> 00:33:18.339 I'm working right now on a friend's barn, so it's like, you 00:33:18.339 --> 00:33:19.959 can't, can't get away from it. 00:33:20.499 --> 00:33:20.679 Rupert Isaacson: No. 00:33:20.679 --> 00:33:21.219 Sure. 00:33:21.219 --> 00:33:24.789 And, and I think, you know, creative people will always, it's very interesting 00:33:24.794 --> 00:33:29.379 to, to hear you say actually that the creative process of, of an auto 00:33:29.379 --> 00:33:35.899 part is as, because of course it is, it's as, creative as a movie 00:33:35.904 --> 00:33:37.909 or a book and or a piece of art. 00:33:37.939 --> 00:33:40.339 We often don't think of it that way until, of course we see them. 00:33:40.699 --> 00:33:45.349 They say it was a Roman artifact or an Egyptian artifact, which is just a tool on 00:33:45.354 --> 00:33:47.329 display in the Met or something like that. 00:33:47.389 --> 00:33:48.679 Oh, wow, it's beautiful, amazing. 00:33:48.679 --> 00:33:49.489 Look at that technology. 00:33:49.699 --> 00:33:50.179 It's incredible. 00:33:50.179 --> 00:33:51.079 What's the story behind that? 00:33:51.079 --> 00:33:53.479 But of course, if we see, you know, that because the, the, the 00:33:53.479 --> 00:33:57.139 junk, the, the junk of today is tomorrow's archeology, as they say. 00:33:57.139 --> 00:33:59.539 So everything has that creative process. 00:33:59.539 --> 00:34:00.589 It's good to be reminded. 00:34:02.014 --> 00:34:02.734 Yes, you're right. 00:34:02.734 --> 00:34:04.994 A button does, a button does the creative process. 00:34:04.994 --> 00:34:04.995 Yeah. 00:34:05.304 --> 00:34:07.464 You as that little girl with story. 00:34:08.364 --> 00:34:10.404 Did, was there a part of you that said, I want to tell 00:34:10.404 --> 00:34:11.904 stories, or was it not conscious? 00:34:13.434 --> 00:34:15.054 Lisa Diersen: I think it was always conscious. 00:34:15.234 --> 00:34:17.154 Tell stories or create something. 00:34:17.159 --> 00:34:18.774 Just, just do something. 00:34:19.014 --> 00:34:23.694 I mean, I was always doing something, you know, whether it was cooking, 00:34:23.699 --> 00:34:26.184 cooking, cooking, gar gardening. 00:34:27.714 --> 00:34:31.914 Maybe I did write a few, few little stories when I was a kid, or I 00:34:31.914 --> 00:34:36.024 was never, like drawing like I could, it's still a stick horse. 00:34:36.084 --> 00:34:36.504 Okay. 00:34:36.504 --> 00:34:42.504 Like, thank God for Adobe, because now I can really get kind of creative. 00:34:42.504 --> 00:34:43.944 But, with Photoshop. 00:34:44.424 --> 00:34:50.424 But, writing and, and, and film, you know, film photo has always 00:34:50.424 --> 00:34:55.494 been a great, you know, a good way for me to put a story together. 00:34:55.524 --> 00:34:56.514 Did you pick up a camera? 00:34:56.514 --> 00:34:56.814 Young? 00:34:59.064 --> 00:35:04.464 I, yeah, I think I had one of those that you clicked and the, the, the picture 00:35:04.469 --> 00:35:07.644 came out of, but yeah, I always had, I've always had a camera, I always 00:35:07.649 --> 00:35:13.734 had, when video cameras first came out, even, you know, with, even just with 00:35:13.734 --> 00:35:19.084 doing stuff, with trips or whatever, I was always the one taking the pictures. 00:35:19.084 --> 00:35:24.304 Capturing, capturing the moments to tell the story. 00:35:24.514 --> 00:35:28.114 Rupert Isaacson: Would you say primarily then you, you, you. 00:35:30.634 --> 00:35:39.594 You, instinctively, realized very young that the way to heal was through 00:35:39.594 --> 00:35:41.574 positive creative action, basically. 00:35:41.904 --> 00:35:42.234 Oh, yes. 00:35:42.239 --> 00:35:42.294 Yes. 00:35:42.384 --> 00:35:43.824 And did somebody tell you that? 00:35:43.824 --> 00:35:45.204 Like, did your dad tell you that? 00:35:45.564 --> 00:35:47.304 Or did a mentor tell you that? 00:35:47.304 --> 00:35:48.744 Or did you just come to that? 00:35:48.774 --> 00:35:49.554 Was it, was it not? 00:35:49.734 --> 00:35:53.424 Was it, was it one of those households where it wasn't openly discussed or 00:35:53.424 --> 00:35:56.844 did your dad say, actually listen, this is the way, or was it Yeah. 00:35:56.844 --> 00:35:57.684 Was it intuitive? 00:35:58.944 --> 00:36:02.214 Lisa Diersen: I don't think he ever said as much. 00:36:02.219 --> 00:36:08.774 So, listen, this is the way, I, I, I remember, with him never telling 00:36:08.774 --> 00:36:13.184 me I couldn't, I remember talk with, very distinctly with him one time, 00:36:14.234 --> 00:36:18.434 one of the facilities he worked at, they had a, a, a metal cooling, 00:36:18.464 --> 00:36:20.384 a problem on how to cool metals. 00:36:20.894 --> 00:36:26.294 And I, I drew him up a littles little schematic, and, and he 00:36:26.294 --> 00:36:29.264 didn't, he didn't downplay it. 00:36:29.264 --> 00:36:30.704 He was like, oh, that's great. 00:36:30.704 --> 00:36:34.844 You know, you know, it's good to think about that and problem solve and, and 00:36:34.964 --> 00:36:37.364 try to try to work out the problems. 00:36:37.964 --> 00:36:42.554 I was never told I couldn't, if I wanted to do something, I couldn't, 00:36:42.674 --> 00:36:43.904 you know, you can't do that. 00:36:44.124 --> 00:36:46.124 You, you can't do that cuz you're a girl. 00:36:46.499 --> 00:36:53.249 So I, I was never put down, put that way, but, and nowadays, well, they 00:36:53.249 --> 00:36:58.229 still have, and it's gonna, we're gonna have to go back so many light years now 00:36:58.234 --> 00:37:06.719 between o v, Wade and Barbie out for girls with getting back to where they had 00:37:07.039 --> 00:37:08.179 told they can do something. 00:37:08.179 --> 00:37:08.899 You're lucky yet. 00:37:08.959 --> 00:37:11.719 Well, no, now you've got girls though, or a girl. 00:37:11.719 --> 00:37:17.149 But no, being able to, to just create if I wanted to. 00:37:18.079 --> 00:37:18.259 So 00:37:18.329 --> 00:37:20.589 Rupert Isaacson: and so you, would you think it was just more that you just, 00:37:20.689 --> 00:37:26.419 you, you yourself, realized that staying creative was the way to find healing? 00:37:26.419 --> 00:37:26.509 Yes. 00:37:26.959 --> 00:37:31.969 Rather than somebody specifically saying, this is how to find healing. 00:37:32.839 --> 00:37:33.349 Lisa Diersen: Yes. 00:37:33.889 --> 00:37:34.939 Yes, I would say that. 00:37:35.299 --> 00:37:38.209 Rupert Isaacson: And now of course, here you are with a festival that's 00:37:38.209 --> 00:37:43.639 primarily about healing, under the masquerading as a, as a, as 00:37:43.639 --> 00:37:45.369 a as a festival about, horses. 00:37:45.789 --> 00:37:52.239 what made you think festival, have you always liked the idea of groups of 00:37:52.239 --> 00:37:56.119 people coming together, to celebrate creativity in that sort of way? 00:37:56.119 --> 00:37:56.749 Like Yeah. 00:37:56.759 --> 00:37:58.159 What, at what point did festival creep 00:37:58.309 --> 00:38:03.459 Lisa Diersen: in the festival creeped in when, , we were breeding. 00:38:03.864 --> 00:38:04.674 The horses. 00:38:04.754 --> 00:38:06.484 Horses and horses. 00:38:06.489 --> 00:38:12.804 You, , with your documentary, we were doing, the town I was in there, 00:38:12.864 --> 00:38:15.384 there was no horse event around. 00:38:15.804 --> 00:38:23.324 So I had the bright idea of let's try to do, with some friends, 00:38:23.329 --> 00:38:28.964 let's try to do a festival that addresses equine assisted therapy 00:38:28.964 --> 00:38:33.524 that addresses the African-American community with their horses. 00:38:33.524 --> 00:38:37.089 Because in Chicago there's a lot of, there's some bunch of guys who are 00:38:37.089 --> 00:38:43.539 Buffalo soldiers, plus there's also a big black cowboy community in Chicago. 00:38:44.079 --> 00:38:48.309 We have a wonderful Hispanic community in the area that 00:38:48.519 --> 00:38:51.789 does, EscaRosa a lot of the, 00:38:51.889 --> 00:38:54.439 Rupert Isaacson: beautiful dancer, by the way, for those who don't know 00:38:54.439 --> 00:38:58.429 what that is, that's the, female side saddle, mounted displays 00:38:58.429 --> 00:38:59.749 right in the Mexican tradition. 00:39:00.649 --> 00:39:01.189 Lisa Diersen: Beautiful. 00:39:01.219 --> 00:39:02.509 It's absolutely beautiful. 00:39:02.589 --> 00:39:07.689 and then we have classical writing and, and along with, art and literature. 00:39:07.689 --> 00:39:13.329 So we were going to create a festival that kind of addressed things that 00:39:13.334 --> 00:39:14.589 aren't at your average horse show. 00:39:14.589 --> 00:39:16.329 Oh, we had Native Americans too. 00:39:16.359 --> 00:39:20.619 We had a, a big Native American, Component to the festival. 00:39:20.619 --> 00:39:22.749 We, it was called Festival of the Horse and Drum. 00:39:23.169 --> 00:39:26.559 And it, that was when we did the very first film festival. 00:39:26.799 --> 00:39:31.929 And I have a friend who owns a theater in town, and I asked him if I could show 00:39:31.929 --> 00:39:36.369 your film because you had just broken your leg, so you were not gonna be 00:39:36.369 --> 00:39:42.129 able to come, but you were gonna Skype in, which I broke my leg last year, 00:39:42.129 --> 00:39:44.169 so I had to follow in your footsteps. 00:39:44.589 --> 00:39:50.209 , but we did, we had that and I, and so I asked Ron, I said, can we show 00:39:50.214 --> 00:39:52.219 some film or show this documentary? 00:39:52.219 --> 00:39:55.429 He goes, yeah, as you can show it, and it's a beautiful little theater. 00:39:56.299 --> 00:39:59.599 And so he's, after he said Yes, I said, well, what if I got a few more? 00:39:59.599 --> 00:40:01.159 Because you know how I am, Robert. 00:40:01.189 --> 00:40:04.069 I can't, I can't just stop. 00:40:04.669 --> 00:40:09.739 And so I had 30 films the first year and that kind of let me know that 00:40:11.089 --> 00:40:13.969 this is something that is out there. 00:40:13.969 --> 00:40:18.229 All of these films are out there because for every, oh, we had Jousts too. 00:40:18.619 --> 00:40:23.749 So for every aspect of what we had at that festival, there was a documentary 00:40:24.319 --> 00:40:29.209 that existed in the world that was a counterpart, a, a compliment to that. 00:40:29.209 --> 00:40:32.119 So the therapy part, we had yours, we had. 00:40:32.854 --> 00:40:34.894 and a Nakota horse stories. 00:40:34.894 --> 00:40:40.174 We had a documentary about Esam, beautiful Es Moosa documentary. 00:40:40.474 --> 00:40:42.094 We had a jousting documentary. 00:40:42.094 --> 00:40:46.434 We had the Black Rodeo, which was, Thero held in Harlem back in the 00:40:46.434 --> 00:40:48.414 seventies, a documentary on that. 00:40:48.414 --> 00:40:55.164 So there were so many stories out there before we even tried to, to put out a 00:40:55.164 --> 00:41:02.064 call for, for equine theme documentaries that it just kinda let me know that this 00:41:02.064 --> 00:41:04.014 might, there might be something to this. 00:41:04.954 --> 00:41:08.304 Rupert Isaacson: And then I guess your, background with engineering 00:41:09.234 --> 00:41:13.554 must have come in handy in terms of the logistics and the organization 00:41:13.554 --> 00:41:14.784 and the sort of nuts and bolts 00:41:15.324 --> 00:41:15.594 Lisa Diersen: side. 00:41:15.599 --> 00:41:16.704 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:41:17.034 --> 00:41:20.244 It just, it's, it's just piecing the puzzle together. 00:41:21.174 --> 00:41:21.864 So 00:41:21.894 --> 00:41:24.984 Rupert Isaacson: what are o over the, it's been quite a few years now that 00:41:24.984 --> 00:41:26.394 you've been running this, festival. 00:41:27.144 --> 00:41:31.534 What are the stories that really, really stand out for you, that 00:41:31.684 --> 00:41:32.914 we should all be aware of? 00:41:32.914 --> 00:41:35.974 Because, there'll be people who are driving their cars listening to this. 00:41:35.974 --> 00:41:39.064 So I want to, I want to tell you guys at this point, pull 00:41:39.064 --> 00:41:40.264 over and get the notebook out. 00:41:41.284 --> 00:41:43.084 Lisa Diersen: or we can put it in your show notes. 00:41:43.564 --> 00:41:44.134 Rupert Isaacson: Exactly. 00:41:44.134 --> 00:41:46.324 And of course you can also listen to this, you know, later on. 00:41:46.564 --> 00:41:50.884 But what are the must sees and the must reads. 00:41:51.874 --> 00:41:55.234 That you've come across over the years that you're like, whoa, this one 00:41:55.234 --> 00:41:58.114 changed my life, this one changed my life, that we might not know about. 00:41:58.114 --> 00:42:00.964 What, what are the stories that, that we should know? 00:42:00.964 --> 00:42:02.584 I'm gonna, I'm getting my notebook out too. 00:42:03.574 --> 00:42:06.904 Lisa Diersen: Well, you know, , this is the 11th season with this back, with 00:42:06.904 --> 00:42:13.924 this film festival, and we've had over 600 films submitted into this festival, 00:42:14.314 --> 00:42:18.364 which is kind of mind blowing, when I, when you sit back and think of it. 00:42:19.384 --> 00:42:23.854 But there's one that, that actually, there's two that really stick 00:42:23.854 --> 00:42:28.684 out in my mind, but one is called Healing Horses, and there these are 00:42:28.684 --> 00:42:31.834 short, these are under 20 minute 00:42:32.863 --> 00:42:34.633 Rupert Isaacson: so tell us about Healing Horses. 00:42:34.633 --> 00:42:35.533 The Healing Horses doc, 00:42:36.613 --> 00:42:39.793 Lisa Diersen: the, the Healing Horses documentary is about a young lady who 00:42:39.793 --> 00:42:42.103 has a car accident on the 4th of July. 00:42:43.213 --> 00:42:46.303 So immediately you must think it's a teenager out drinking and 00:42:46.303 --> 00:42:48.223 driving, which it totally wasn't. 00:42:49.273 --> 00:42:55.093 But she learns how to walk again with the therapeutic use of this big draft 00:42:55.093 --> 00:43:02.063 horse, which happens to also be an, a world equestrian level draft horse that 00:43:02.063 --> 00:43:04.193 teams that come into the United States. 00:43:04.193 --> 00:43:08.783 Karen is the lady who runs the program, is also a coach 00:43:08.788 --> 00:43:11.423 for, a lot of the, the teams. 00:43:11.423 --> 00:43:15.893 And so she'll use this, this draft horse who is on his side gig is 00:43:16.433 --> 00:43:18.323 being used as a therapy horse. 00:43:19.043 --> 00:43:23.723 And the other one was an early on documentary called Riding My Way 00:43:23.723 --> 00:43:31.043 Back, and it was about a veteran who got into a program, just met this 00:43:31.043 --> 00:43:38.213 horse, kind of standoffish for a great part of it, but then got into a real 00:43:38.393 --> 00:43:40.643 one-on-one relationship with the horse. 00:43:40.643 --> 00:43:46.238 And when he was about four weeks into the program, Maybe it was four months, 00:43:46.568 --> 00:43:54.038 turned around and gave his therapist a letter, and the letter had said how he was 00:43:54.188 --> 00:43:59.078 g going to commit suicide the night that he called to say goodbye to the horse. 00:44:00.158 --> 00:44:04.148 And because of this horse, he didn't do that. 00:44:04.148 --> 00:44:10.658 And now he is mentoring other veterans and he's part of the program and he's 00:44:10.658 --> 00:44:13.328 engaged to this beautiful young girl. 00:44:13.328 --> 00:44:19.298 And, you know, it's, it's just such a, it's such a feel good, amazing story, 00:44:19.298 --> 00:44:21.938 but it's what horses can do for us. 00:44:23.138 --> 00:44:24.248 Riding my way back. 00:44:25.418 --> 00:44:25.718 Yeah. 00:44:25.838 --> 00:44:28.958 Robin Rosenthal was a filmmaker on that Beautiful Doctor 00:44:28.958 --> 00:44:29.108 Robin 00:44:29.108 --> 00:44:29.678 Rupert Isaacson: Rosenthal. 00:44:30.398 --> 00:44:30.688 Okay. 00:44:31.238 --> 00:44:32.558 And healing horses. 00:44:32.928 --> 00:44:33.138 heal. 00:44:34.098 --> 00:44:35.388 Who was the, who was the, 00:44:35.438 --> 00:44:38.468 Lisa Diersen: I would have, that was way back in the beginning. 00:44:38.568 --> 00:44:41.928 I have to, I'd have to look up who that filmmaker was, but 00:44:41.988 --> 00:44:45.258 there's just so many amazing ones. 00:44:45.348 --> 00:44:49.728 We're working on a, on a project right now, that kind of goes 00:44:49.728 --> 00:44:53.758 back to the Mustang Pro, series we're working on called The Must. 00:44:54.118 --> 00:44:57.688 The whole project is called the Mustang Discovery Ride Project, 00:44:58.048 --> 00:45:00.118 but I had a young girl, Mustang girl, the Mustang Discovery ride. 00:45:01.198 --> 00:45:01.738 Yes. 00:45:02.278 --> 00:45:05.998 So two years ago, actually, it's funny, two years ago 00:45:06.003 --> 00:45:09.688 today, I met a young lady in. 00:45:10.708 --> 00:45:16.888 Montana, Bozeman, Montana at Art of the Cowgirl, who they were looking for someone 00:45:16.888 --> 00:45:22.138 to help them pull together their project and they were starting in Delaware. 00:45:23.128 --> 00:45:27.538 So logistically them coming outta Montana, Wyoming and getting 'em to 00:45:27.538 --> 00:45:30.088 Delaware was a, was a project and a half. 00:45:30.088 --> 00:45:35.968 But they rode from Delaware to California all the way across the 00:45:35.973 --> 00:45:42.928 United States, almost 5,000 miles with four Mustangs and a mule mule stang, 00:45:43.708 --> 00:45:46.528 and all the way across the country. 00:45:46.588 --> 00:45:52.898 We set up meetings and, seminars and clinics at different veterans 00:45:54.038 --> 00:45:58.688 or youth programs across the country for her to speak at as she wrote. 00:45:59.288 --> 00:46:04.538 And finding all of these places non-connected, through 00:46:04.538 --> 00:46:05.828 to different associations. 00:46:05.828 --> 00:46:10.808 These are just kind of standalone places where the horses are healing people. 00:46:11.228 --> 00:46:15.578 Mostly Mustangs, but it, that was, that's just amazing. 00:46:15.578 --> 00:46:20.738 So that documentary is Julianne Neal is working on getting that finished out. 00:46:20.738 --> 00:46:26.048 I know I, you met her years ago and she's been a important part 00:46:26.048 --> 00:46:31.118 of Equus, but she's the, was the chief filmmaker on that documentary, 00:46:31.688 --> 00:46:33.698 so that hopefully will be ready. 00:46:34.373 --> 00:46:38.303 Gosh, by sometime next year, cuz there's a ton of, there's a year's 00:46:38.303 --> 00:46:41.693 worth of a year and a half's worth of footage cuz we wrapped that last 00:46:41.693 --> 00:46:44.723 November on the beach in California. 00:46:45.593 --> 00:46:48.463 Rupert Isaacson: Tell me, I mean, as a filmmaker myself, I immediately 00:46:48.853 --> 00:46:50.353 think, oh, that sounds expensive. 00:46:50.743 --> 00:46:53.173 How, did she, financed that ride? 00:46:53.173 --> 00:46:54.433 That's not a cheap thing to do. 00:46:54.883 --> 00:46:57.433 And then to get a, a documentary around it. 00:46:57.533 --> 00:46:58.223 what, what were the 00:46:58.223 --> 00:46:59.033 Lisa Diersen: mechanisms there? 00:47:00.263 --> 00:47:05.483 So we had, because it was Mustangs, we had some support from the Mustang 00:47:05.483 --> 00:47:11.333 Heritage Foundation, which supported until about halfway through, and 00:47:11.333 --> 00:47:13.013 then they ran out of their support. 00:47:13.013 --> 00:47:18.413 And we had to, we had to really scramble, but because I have some 00:47:18.418 --> 00:47:25.823 amazing filmmakers all the way across the country and Julianne was willing 00:47:25.823 --> 00:47:31.913 to, to kind of oversee the main part of the putting everything together. 00:47:33.893 --> 00:47:38.183 I had different filmmakers who came in and rode with Anne and 00:47:38.273 --> 00:47:40.103 would film and do some writing. 00:47:40.103 --> 00:47:44.883 And Rhonda Gregorio, who's working on the Mustang book project, she came in 00:47:44.883 --> 00:47:48.473 and rode in, in Washington DC with us. 00:47:49.343 --> 00:47:52.923 We rode all the way down out of, oh gosh, I can't remember 00:47:52.923 --> 00:47:54.033 the name of the park, but. 00:47:54.423 --> 00:47:58.743 Through this park all the way along through, so into downtown 00:47:58.743 --> 00:48:04.743 DC up to the Washington Monument with these mustangs, which was one 00:48:04.748 --> 00:48:09.783 of the, well, nerve wracking, but exciting things that I've ever done. 00:48:10.593 --> 00:48:15.323 And but I had, I have had an amazing group of filmmakers, cross country 00:48:15.323 --> 00:48:20.993 who were willing to just come on and ride for a couple of weeks with her 00:48:20.993 --> 00:48:25.943 or, or drive along or do whatever or follow or ride in the chase car and 00:48:25.948 --> 00:48:28.163 film and get parts of this story. 00:48:28.823 --> 00:48:35.393 So from that point of view, I mean, it's gonna be a little rougher, but we just 00:48:35.483 --> 00:48:39.203 screened one of the best documentaries I've seen called The Long Rider, 00:48:39.893 --> 00:48:45.053 which was about Felipe Long Rider, the long, the long Rider that came out. 00:48:45.053 --> 00:48:47.003 That was part of the festival last year. 00:48:47.813 --> 00:48:49.763 That's a 90 minute documentary. 00:48:50.003 --> 00:48:53.393 Felipe Road from Canada to Brazil. 00:48:54.053 --> 00:48:54.443 Felipe who? 00:48:54.443 --> 00:48:57.533 He did all Alte Ale. 00:48:57.538 --> 00:48:58.343 How do I spell that? 00:48:59.003 --> 00:49:02.123 I think it's l e t i e. 00:49:02.303 --> 00:49:05.033 I will get you that because I think he needs to be on your show. 00:49:06.003 --> 00:49:06.783 Rupert Isaacson: Felipe Letti. 00:49:06.893 --> 00:49:07.183 Okay. 00:49:07.873 --> 00:49:08.483 Brazilian. 00:49:08.513 --> 00:49:08.933 He's back guy. 00:49:10.493 --> 00:49:10.913 Lisa Diersen: Pardon me? 00:49:11.153 --> 00:49:11.843 Brazilian guy. 00:49:12.683 --> 00:49:13.103 Yes. 00:49:13.253 --> 00:49:14.903 And he lives in Canada now. 00:49:15.533 --> 00:49:19.913 but his family, it's an amazing story and so. 00:49:21.293 --> 00:49:24.113 he did most of his own filming with a hand, you know, with 00:49:24.113 --> 00:49:26.993 his phone or with a, a GoPro. 00:49:26.993 --> 00:49:32.393 And, you know, when you're telling a story of riding across the country, it, you 00:49:32.393 --> 00:49:34.673 wanna see it from the seat of the rider. 00:49:35.453 --> 00:49:38.573 You want, you want that bird's eye view as you're going across. 00:49:38.573 --> 00:49:41.993 Kind of like what Ben Masters did with unbranded, that was one of 00:49:41.993 --> 00:49:47.663 our first documentaries we had in the, in the festival was unbranded. 00:49:47.663 --> 00:49:50.963 And that you still, that still stands up. 00:49:50.968 --> 00:49:53.273 It's beautiful and breathtaking. 00:49:53.273 --> 00:49:59.693 And, but Felipe wrote from Canada to Brazil, then from Brazil to the 00:49:59.698 --> 00:50:03.083 furthest, most southern tip you can ride, I think in Argentina. 00:50:03.863 --> 00:50:08.213 Then they went back up, he went up to Alaska and rode from Alaska 00:50:08.218 --> 00:50:09.713 back down to Calgary, Canada. 00:50:10.553 --> 00:50:12.773 So that's an amazing, amazing, 00:50:12.953 --> 00:50:14.303 Rupert Isaacson: and what was he, what was he trying to achieve with this? 00:50:14.303 --> 00:50:15.653 Why did he do this crazy ride? 00:50:16.703 --> 00:50:20.423 Lisa Diersen: He, to ride the three at with Schley's book 00:50:20.423 --> 00:50:22.643 about writing the Americas. 00:50:22.643 --> 00:50:25.793 He wanted to follow Schley's story. 00:50:26.693 --> 00:50:30.143 And so, and, and he's, he's a cha, you'll love him. 00:50:30.203 --> 00:50:31.133 He's a character. 00:50:31.163 --> 00:50:32.693 He's a great interview. 00:50:32.873 --> 00:50:36.113 He's just such an amazing young man. 00:50:36.673 --> 00:50:40.823 Rupert Isaacson: What, what, what was he trying to bring attention to any cause or 00:50:41.093 --> 00:50:43.343 what, what was the, what was the capital? 00:50:43.343 --> 00:50:43.793 No, not 00:50:43.793 --> 00:50:44.993 Lisa Diersen: really to any cause. 00:50:44.993 --> 00:50:48.443 This was, it was more that he could do this. 00:50:49.178 --> 00:50:50.768 You know, long riders are. 00:50:50.818 --> 00:50:56.248 with Lasan it was different because we were riding, we 00:50:56.248 --> 00:50:58.078 were doing the Mustang horses. 00:50:58.078 --> 00:51:01.348 Were the whole focus of this to bring awareness to all the horses 00:51:01.353 --> 00:51:06.298 that are standing in b l m Holding, which is right now close to 70,000 00:51:06.328 --> 00:51:07.738 horses that they've rounded up. 00:51:08.188 --> 00:51:09.328 They're standing and holding. 00:51:09.328 --> 00:51:12.328 We can use them in veterans programs, we can use them in 00:51:12.328 --> 00:51:14.188 mental health programs with youth. 00:51:14.188 --> 00:51:14.968 We can use them. 00:51:15.328 --> 00:51:17.338 They're, they're wonderful riding horses. 00:51:17.338 --> 00:51:19.768 They're great all around horses. 00:51:20.638 --> 00:51:23.488 So that was what our project was about, bringing awareness 00:51:23.488 --> 00:51:24.958 to these horses and holding. 00:51:26.338 --> 00:51:33.028 Rupert was a long rider and Felipe in the world, there's an organiz, pardon me? 00:51:33.358 --> 00:51:34.198 Rupert Isaacson: Felipe was a Felipe. 00:51:34.198 --> 00:51:35.248 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:51:35.758 --> 00:51:37.498 What, when you say a long rider, what does that mean? 00:51:37.498 --> 00:51:37.708 What's 00:51:37.708 --> 00:51:38.068 Lisa Diersen: a long rider? 00:51:40.198 --> 00:51:44.008 So there's an organization called the Long Riders Guild. 00:51:44.008 --> 00:51:47.848 I think there're, they're based out of either Ireland, Ireland, I think it's 00:51:47.848 --> 00:51:53.598 Ireland, the, the, the, the main, rider or the, the organization is out of. 00:51:53.598 --> 00:51:58.488 But it's an organization that if you ride more than a thousand miles in 00:51:58.488 --> 00:52:02.888 your ride from start to get, you know, for the ride to end, you be, 00:52:03.038 --> 00:52:07.268 you qualified to be a long rider and you can join the Long Riders Guild. 00:52:07.268 --> 00:52:11.438 Then, Bernice, who we had the documentary a couple of years 00:52:11.438 --> 00:52:14.648 ago about Lady Long Rider, she. 00:52:15.518 --> 00:52:19.598 She passed away a year and a half ago, but she rode 30,000 00:52:19.598 --> 00:52:21.308 miles across the United States. 00:52:22.478 --> 00:52:26.108 There's, there's all of these people out there that do this, that 00:52:26.588 --> 00:52:27.128 Rupert Isaacson: go out. 00:52:27.248 --> 00:52:29.838 They're not doing it for any, any specific, cause they're 00:52:29.838 --> 00:52:31.218 doing it as a personal odyssey. 00:52:31.608 --> 00:52:31.909 No, no. 00:52:33.138 --> 00:52:33.348 Lisa Diersen: Yep. 00:52:34.248 --> 00:52:34.518 Yep. 00:52:34.888 --> 00:52:38.868 Niece got divorced and when she got divorced, she got on her 00:52:38.868 --> 00:52:40.428 horses and just started riding. 00:52:40.428 --> 00:52:44.748 She was gonna ride to go visit her sister, and she just kept riding and she kept 00:52:44.748 --> 00:52:51.768 riding until she, she, her last long ride was two months before she died of cancer. 00:52:52.668 --> 00:52:54.288 She just kept riding. 00:52:54.648 --> 00:52:57.858 There's just people who, it's like a runner. 00:52:57.858 --> 00:53:01.338 It's like anybody else that wants to get out there in their sport and 00:53:01.728 --> 00:53:04.128 achieve it for their personal best. 00:53:04.188 --> 00:53:07.518 Rupert Isaacson: Well, what what your, what immediately springs to mind when 00:53:07.523 --> 00:53:11.288 you talk about these rides is, you said, and she just kept riding. 00:53:12.158 --> 00:53:13.118 Remember Forrest Gump? 00:53:13.598 --> 00:53:15.758 And he starts running and then he just keeps running. 00:53:15.758 --> 00:53:19.538 And of course he builds his following, but of course what he's 00:53:19.538 --> 00:53:20.888 really doing it for is healing. 00:53:21.368 --> 00:53:23.078 Do you think that Yes. 00:53:24.128 --> 00:53:29.318 Clearly this lady who, who, who, who died of cancer with her 30,000 00:53:29.318 --> 00:53:31.238 miles was after her divorce. 00:53:32.138 --> 00:53:34.208 That seems to be a healing journey she's trying to heal. 00:53:34.568 --> 00:53:38.638 Is, is, is Felipe with his, Canada to tear going back up. 00:53:39.058 --> 00:53:41.458 Is, is he looking for healing as well? 00:53:42.418 --> 00:53:48.148 Lisa Diersen: He talks completely and openly about his search for healing and 00:53:48.148 --> 00:53:51.748 how the horses for his mental health. 00:53:52.528 --> 00:53:57.258 One of the organizations that we're working with now is Horses for Mental 00:53:57.258 --> 00:54:02.878 Health, horses for Mental Health, two year, two year old organization. 00:54:02.878 --> 00:54:09.628 Lynn Thomas, who's the founder of I, is now the director 00:54:09.628 --> 00:54:11.278 for Horses for Mental Health. 00:54:11.748 --> 00:54:12.038 Okay. 00:54:12.043 --> 00:54:14.698 And Felipe was just on her. 00:54:14.778 --> 00:54:19.368 they had in May, they had their big mental health awareness month with the 00:54:19.368 --> 00:54:24.378 horse campaign and Felipe was one of the guests on there and talks about, 00:54:25.248 --> 00:54:30.708 you know, the depression and, and how horses and what horses have done for him. 00:54:31.128 --> 00:54:33.078 Rupert Isaacson: So really he was doing, he was riding. 00:54:33.078 --> 00:54:33.318 Yes. 00:54:33.528 --> 00:54:36.858 He was riding his away, away from and through depression. 00:54:36.858 --> 00:54:37.008 Feeling. 00:54:37.818 --> 00:54:38.088 Okay. 00:54:38.138 --> 00:54:39.398 So this is interesting. 00:54:39.478 --> 00:54:43.588 I mean, we talked, you talked earlier about the idea of horses as metaphor, 00:54:43.588 --> 00:54:47.188 and I was asking you, what do you feel horses are a metaphor for? 00:54:47.578 --> 00:54:51.778 And I do think that, I think everybody, would you not agree, 00:54:51.988 --> 00:54:54.568 who, whether, whether they're, whether they're horse people or not. 00:54:55.318 --> 00:54:57.928 When people think of horses, they think freedom, don't they? 00:54:58.828 --> 00:54:59.188 You think? 00:54:59.193 --> 00:54:59.358 Mm-hmm. 00:54:59.443 --> 00:54:59.728 Freedom. 00:54:59.733 --> 00:55:01.348 You think that's a free animal? 00:55:01.813 --> 00:55:04.693 If I sit on the back of this horse, it will take me to freedom. 00:55:04.693 --> 00:55:08.503 You think about the image of the cowboy, you think about riding the ranch, it's, 00:55:08.503 --> 00:55:12.528 it, it's about freedom, in a world that seems to be less and less free. 00:55:13.128 --> 00:55:20.778 do, do you feel that with the Equus Film Festival, you can give people 00:55:21.768 --> 00:55:27.618 a sense that they can find freedom through, through the, whether it's by 00:55:27.623 --> 00:55:29.718 actually sort of doing these things that these people are doing, these 00:55:29.718 --> 00:55:30.948 sort of pilgrimages people are doing? 00:55:30.948 --> 00:55:32.958 Or, or just through the stories themselves? 00:55:34.668 --> 00:55:38.538 Lisa Diersen: I think, I think that's a yes to both. 00:55:40.008 --> 00:55:45.208 One of, one of the films we had a couple of years ago was, about called the 00:55:45.208 --> 00:55:54.148 Gobi Gallup and my friend Julie Vlu, who runs the, the Vlu Foundation, she 00:55:54.838 --> 00:56:05.038 started this ride in Mongolia in her sixties to, and she didn't even start 00:56:05.038 --> 00:56:07.108 writing till her mid to late fifties. 00:56:07.798 --> 00:56:16.228 She started this ride now to help build, build schools and, libraries 00:56:16.228 --> 00:56:20.038 for the children in the village, in the Mongolian Village where she 00:56:20.038 --> 00:56:24.958 first went to do a, a horseback ride because she saw these children. 00:56:25.513 --> 00:56:30.373 Scrounging for food and clothing and everything else on a garbage dump. 00:56:31.333 --> 00:56:35.923 And she thought, my God, I got, I, I have to be able, able 00:56:36.283 --> 00:56:38.293 to do something about this. 00:56:38.923 --> 00:56:44.353 And so since then we've showed her documentary and we've had people who, 00:56:44.353 --> 00:56:48.253 after they've seen their document, her documentary have gone and ridden with her. 00:56:49.333 --> 00:56:53.533 every year she do, they do an annual ride now, and she ac they actually have five or 00:56:53.533 --> 00:56:55.693 six different rides they do in Mongolia. 00:56:55.698 --> 00:56:58.753 And it's, it's completely changed her life. 00:56:59.713 --> 00:57:02.413 Getting into to what she's doing now. 00:57:02.413 --> 00:57:06.973 It's like a, a, another whole phase of her life happening. 00:57:07.483 --> 00:57:12.763 I, I've seen this happen time and time again with so many people, with the 00:57:12.763 --> 00:57:18.763 horses, when the horse is just, when it's their time to be part of your life, you 00:57:18.763 --> 00:57:26.923 can't, there's nothing you can do to, to, to stop 'em from coming on and driving 00:57:27.263 --> 00:57:29.023 and, and taking you where you're going. 00:57:29.443 --> 00:57:30.043 The, the people 00:57:30.043 --> 00:57:32.743 Rupert Isaacson: who come to your festival, I should imagine they're 00:57:32.743 --> 00:57:36.343 primarily horse people, but are you getting the general public? 00:57:36.823 --> 00:57:40.543 Are there people who are showing up to the festival with no horse background? 00:57:40.663 --> 00:57:40.903 People? 00:57:42.193 --> 00:57:46.003 Lisa Diersen: A little bit, but they usually come as guest with 00:57:46.003 --> 00:57:49.603 someone with that has horses. 00:57:51.073 --> 00:57:57.693 A, a good partnership would, would be with something like say, being a little 00:57:57.693 --> 00:58:02.443 off, kind of like what I wanna call off Broadway, but when, when Sundance 00:58:02.443 --> 00:58:08.323 does their big festival, they'll have like rooms that Doy cat films or very 00:58:08.323 --> 00:58:15.043 specific genre of films that would probably get a, a broader audience. 00:58:15.043 --> 00:58:21.973 But I think, and the sad thing is, is that no matter how good a horse 00:58:21.973 --> 00:58:30.073 documentary is, it's still a horse documentary and the industry as far as, 00:58:30.173 --> 00:58:35.453 the other film festivals and that they tend to not show horse horse theme films. 00:58:35.453 --> 00:58:42.893 I have no idea why it, it, it doesn't make sense why they wouldn't show and amazes 00:58:42.893 --> 00:58:48.473 me because some of these are some of the best movies I've ever seen just from the 00:58:49.073 --> 00:58:49.823 Rupert Isaacson: pure emotion. 00:58:49.823 --> 00:58:50.033 Sure. 00:58:50.033 --> 00:58:50.873 And cinematic. 00:58:51.233 --> 00:58:54.808 But, in terms of, of the audiences that that show up to your festival, 00:58:55.438 --> 00:58:56.938 do you get non horsey people? 00:58:59.038 --> 00:59:04.378 Lisa Diersen: Only from 90% if they come with other people, like with a 00:59:04.378 --> 00:59:07.898 horse, horse lover, so it's like a, then they get kind of drop, they have to be 00:59:07.898 --> 00:59:09.338 initiated and then they don't properly. 00:59:10.388 --> 00:59:10.678 Rupert Isaacson: Okay. 00:59:10.978 --> 00:59:17.418 So, so, so for example, with the, the, the horses for mental health or. 00:59:18.183 --> 00:59:23.393 With the Mustang issue in, America, I, I happen to know that it's costing 00:59:23.393 --> 00:59:27.923 the taxpayer, I think it's 150 million a year to keep these horses in these 00:59:27.923 --> 00:59:32.033 holding pens, which are not, not very nice if they don't end up going down 00:59:32.123 --> 00:59:33.923 shit down to Mexico to solve the meat. 00:59:34.053 --> 00:59:39.123 and these are issues which of course don't get into the mainstream unless 00:59:39.123 --> 00:59:41.343 people find out about them somehow. 00:59:41.343 --> 00:59:44.043 Obviously, therapeutic riding, you know, and, and working 00:59:44.043 --> 00:59:45.183 with horses in mental health. 00:59:45.483 --> 00:59:47.793 This now is edging its way into the mainstream. 00:59:47.843 --> 00:59:51.563 obviously I work, people are starting to be referred to us, 00:59:51.863 --> 00:59:53.513 but it's a slow, slow process. 00:59:54.473 --> 00:59:58.173 What do you feel, you could do, I mean, you are, you're obviously already doing 00:59:58.173 --> 01:00:01.053 it, but what do you feel you could, the, the, the film fe the, the festival 01:00:01.053 --> 01:00:08.503 could do more, to bring the idea that horses are integral to human mental 01:00:08.503 --> 01:00:11.893 health, , into the wider mainstream so that they, they don't have to 01:00:12.043 --> 01:00:14.713 stumble upon your, your, your festival. 01:00:14.833 --> 01:00:15.073 Right. 01:00:15.123 --> 01:00:16.773 , with a, with a horsey person. 01:00:17.283 --> 01:00:20.493 How, how can we move it further into the mainstream, do you think? 01:00:20.553 --> 01:00:21.093 This message? 01:00:21.813 --> 01:00:26.763 Lisa Diersen: well, we're, we're in the horse world to reach 01:00:26.763 --> 01:00:28.593 further, to get to more people. 01:00:28.593 --> 01:00:34.883 We've started a, what we call the Mustang Summit because part of what, 01:00:35.813 --> 01:00:39.713 and, and it's kind of a different layered answer, but the Mustang Summit. 01:00:40.238 --> 01:00:46.928 Has been developed to be an educational platform where we talk only about off 01:00:46.928 --> 01:00:52.658 range issues after the horses have been rounded up in those 60, 70,000 horses. 01:00:52.658 --> 01:00:54.098 What can we do with them? 01:00:54.788 --> 01:01:00.698 There's two really distinct camps in the wild horse world and there's, 01:01:00.908 --> 01:01:05.648 there's kind of the WildHorse extremists that think they should just stay out 01:01:05.648 --> 01:01:10.628 on the planes and nothing should be done with them and let them be wild. 01:01:11.138 --> 01:01:20.258 And then there's the people that have, have Mustangs and love them and realize 01:01:20.258 --> 01:01:27.128 that the Bureau of Land Management, which the other camp thinks is the evil overlord 01:01:28.748 --> 01:01:34.448 ha, has been tasked in 1971 when the WildHorse and Bureau Act passed, they were 01:01:34.478 --> 01:01:37.088 tasked with managing these wild horses. 01:01:38.828 --> 01:01:44.978 They're just like, I don't want to be in a country where we have an open season 01:01:45.608 --> 01:01:52.778 on hunting where we give a hunter a license to go out and pull 20,000 horses. 01:01:53.318 --> 01:01:57.218 That happened, that was called How Kennel Ration got started. 01:01:58.748 --> 01:02:04.928 So in order to stay out of that, we have to have roundups and a 01:02:04.933 --> 01:02:07.748 certain amount of those horses have to be rounded up every year. 01:02:08.543 --> 01:02:14.303 Well, when you bring that certain amount of horses in the we, in, 01:02:14.363 --> 01:02:17.123 in the US we have the hin ponies. 01:02:17.123 --> 01:02:22.253 I think everybody knows what the hin ponies are, where they round 01:02:22.253 --> 01:02:22.673 Rupert Isaacson: them up. 01:02:22.673 --> 01:02:27.563 Let, just for those listeners outside of, of the USA Chin is an 01:02:27.563 --> 01:02:30.503 island, off of the coast of Virginia. 01:02:30.983 --> 01:02:32.813 and there's actually a few of these islands are called barrier 01:02:32.818 --> 01:02:37.493 islands, where horses washed up from shipwrecks, hundreds of years ago and 01:02:37.523 --> 01:02:40.493 have established feral populations, some of which are quite famous. 01:02:40.498 --> 01:02:42.323 Sti Okay, I'll shut up now. 01:02:42.593 --> 01:02:43.523 Back, back, back to that. 01:02:44.033 --> 01:02:49.763 Lisa Diersen: Well, well, the Chin Kati model works because the, the 01:02:49.763 --> 01:02:53.813 fire department for the last 70 years and in Chin Kati has kind 01:02:53.818 --> 01:02:56.483 of overseen the pony population. 01:02:56.483 --> 01:02:58.463 They round them up every year. 01:02:58.763 --> 01:03:01.253 They swim them across a channel. 01:03:02.063 --> 01:03:06.113 They take, give them their shots. 01:03:06.113 --> 01:03:09.053 They keep a record of who's who. 01:03:09.353 --> 01:03:13.343 They take the, the younger horses, the babies, and the yearlings, 01:03:13.583 --> 01:03:15.203 and they auction them off. 01:03:15.203 --> 01:03:18.353 And the older breeding stock gets taken back to the island 01:03:19.013 --> 01:03:22.493 to to, to start a new crop. 01:03:23.243 --> 01:03:28.613 And the, that model works, we have, we have all different kinds of what's called 01:03:29.303 --> 01:03:31.733 hmas out west horse management areas. 01:03:32.528 --> 01:03:35.948 Where people love, say sand washed basin. 01:03:35.948 --> 01:03:40.178 There's beautiful, very colorful mustangs that come out of that area. 01:03:40.448 --> 01:03:41.348 People love them. 01:03:42.308 --> 01:03:47.888 If we started to do, like with the Shin Kati model, where you are cultivating 01:03:48.038 --> 01:03:55.928 a group of people who want those very specific Mustang horses, then you've got 01:03:55.928 --> 01:03:59.828 your, you've got your buyers, and every year you have people who are waiting in 01:03:59.828 --> 01:04:06.038 line for that roundup to happen to bring those horses in and so they can auction 01:04:06.068 --> 01:04:07.808 or pick their horse out of an auction. 01:04:07.838 --> 01:04:10.658 And so that's years away creating that. 01:04:10.663 --> 01:04:16.898 So in the meantime, we still have 70,000 horses, 65, or whatever the number is. 01:04:16.898 --> 01:04:21.128 It changes that we have to find homes for. 01:04:22.058 --> 01:04:27.998 So with the Mustang Summit, our goal is to educate people about the prison programs, 01:04:27.998 --> 01:04:29.858 the veteran programs, the youth program. 01:04:29.978 --> 01:04:36.128 There's a youth program in Utah that turns out 50 to 60 horses a year through 01:04:36.128 --> 01:04:41.558 their tip training program with their kids who have gone through the adoption, 01:04:41.563 --> 01:04:46.173 the, welfare system with the kids and the kids who are going through all of 01:04:46.173 --> 01:04:48.053 the, the Foster, it's Youth at risk. 01:04:48.123 --> 01:04:50.063 It's a, it's a youth at risk program. 01:04:50.153 --> 01:04:50.243 Mm-hmm. 01:04:51.893 --> 01:04:55.553 They, those kids are the ones doing the gling of the Mustang. 01:04:56.978 --> 01:04:58.718 And it's called three-Point Center. 01:04:58.718 --> 01:05:00.398 They do an amazing job. 01:05:01.538 --> 01:05:03.968 So the, the Mustangs work with Youth at Risk. 01:05:03.973 --> 01:05:09.578 They work with SueAnn Wells, who has her program in Chattanooga, Tennessee, 01:05:09.578 --> 01:05:13.718 with her Inner City Girls program who are doing dressage with Mustangs. 01:05:14.558 --> 01:05:19.118 And then they, they work with all of the other programs that are out there. 01:05:19.118 --> 01:05:22.798 So that's what we try to do with the, , the Mustang Summit is 01:05:22.798 --> 01:05:24.838 to at least educate that part. 01:05:25.498 --> 01:05:35.458 But in my heart of hearts, I, I genuinely believe and feel that 130 years ago 01:05:35.458 --> 01:05:42.208 or so, maybe even 140 pe everybody at some point was around a horse. 01:05:42.448 --> 01:05:47.888 Whether it was a horse pulling, the milk wagon or delivery 01:05:47.893 --> 01:05:51.608 wagons or horse were by humans. 01:05:52.628 --> 01:05:56.318 Still in other parts of the world, horses are by humans all the time. 01:05:56.468 --> 01:05:59.128 And, you know, you wanna get deeper into the conversation. 01:05:59.128 --> 01:06:03.478 You don't see youth committing suicide in those countries at the rate that they're 01:06:03.483 --> 01:06:05.068 committing suicide in this country. 01:06:05.968 --> 01:06:10.338 W we had daily interaction with, this, with sentient 01:06:10.338 --> 01:06:12.258 beings, horse or cow or whatever. 01:06:12.918 --> 01:06:20.118 Now we are removed from that because nobody's around horses on a daily basis, 01:06:20.658 --> 01:06:23.028 except for those of us that have horses. 01:06:23.523 --> 01:06:24.873 And know what they do. 01:06:24.933 --> 01:06:33.813 And I think that horses are here for their next part of, of their, of their 01:06:33.813 --> 01:06:37.023 journey with the humans to heal us. 01:06:37.953 --> 01:06:43.833 That more importantly, not to be a riding instrument, which is it's, I would not 01:06:43.833 --> 01:06:46.413 give up my give up riding horses, period. 01:06:46.413 --> 01:06:49.233 I love getting on my horse and riding. 01:06:49.983 --> 01:06:55.653 But to, to whether they're people are riding, whether they're doing 01:06:55.653 --> 01:06:58.833 therapy with them or whatever, that horses are here to heal us. 01:06:59.763 --> 01:07:05.073 Horses are here to bring people back to what they're missing in life. 01:07:05.073 --> 01:07:11.733 And that's, that, that connection, that call it HeartMath, that, that finding 01:07:11.733 --> 01:07:14.343 your center again, finding your peace. 01:07:14.883 --> 01:07:22.893 And you, you can do that when you're with your horse or a horse, any horse. 01:07:23.043 --> 01:07:25.923 Rupert Isaacson: Well, I, I like what you said just now also about 01:07:26.673 --> 01:07:29.853 that it, it wasn't just horses. 01:07:29.858 --> 01:07:32.463 It was being around sentient beings. 01:07:32.673 --> 01:07:34.143 Obviously we, we have pets. 01:07:34.143 --> 01:07:34.233 Mm-hmm. 01:07:34.653 --> 01:07:37.513 But I think that, our relationship with our pets can be different 01:07:37.513 --> 01:07:39.733 because, What does a horse do? 01:07:39.733 --> 01:07:41.893 It carries you or it, you rely on it. 01:07:42.223 --> 01:07:43.693 You know, what did a cow do? 01:07:43.693 --> 01:07:44.953 You, you relied on it. 01:07:45.253 --> 01:07:49.363 If you have a hunting dog, I suppose, or a guide dog, a seeing eye dog or a 01:07:49.363 --> 01:07:50.863 sheep dog or something, you rely on it. 01:07:51.043 --> 01:07:54.433 But of course, the vast majority of people with pets, I have pets too. 01:07:54.773 --> 01:07:58.793 , we don't, we, we just have them as a, as a feel good factor 01:07:59.813 --> 01:08:02.273 for our mental health, really. 01:08:02.273 --> 01:08:03.233 That's why we have pets. 01:08:03.323 --> 01:08:03.383 Yeah. 01:08:03.773 --> 01:08:06.053 But it is true what you say, I think. 01:08:06.083 --> 01:08:11.183 And something I hadn't considered though is that yes, the, the, the malaise 01:08:11.183 --> 01:08:19.943 that you see through the youth of the western world, and I think probably 01:08:19.943 --> 01:08:21.503 the industrialized world everywhere. 01:08:22.133 --> 01:08:22.343 Yes. 01:08:22.703 --> 01:08:22.943 Yes. 01:08:23.213 --> 01:08:27.233 It seems that mental health is deteriorating that, that, depression's on 01:08:27.233 --> 01:08:32.003 the rise and rapidly despite the fact that life has materially never been better. 01:08:32.523 --> 01:08:37.593 and it's interesting that you say in the countries where people are, 01:08:37.598 --> 01:08:40.503 around sensient beings all the time, in a way that they're around them. 01:08:40.583 --> 01:08:41.943 You, you have better mental health. 01:08:41.943 --> 01:08:45.003 It's, it would seem that suicide, for example and that sort of thing, 01:08:45.393 --> 01:08:49.893 not so much of a factor that I think you've just answered my question for 01:08:51.213 --> 01:08:52.923 what's in it for the mainstream person. 01:08:52.923 --> 01:08:55.413 Because let's say you're listening to this podcast say, well, why should 01:08:55.413 --> 01:09:01.203 I listen to a podcast about a, a a a festival around art and film with horses? 01:09:01.203 --> 01:09:02.553 I mean, I, I live in. 01:09:03.093 --> 01:09:07.113 An apartment in London or Queens or Buenos Aires or Cape Town, 01:09:07.143 --> 01:09:09.813 it, it makes no difference to me or I don't care from horses. 01:09:10.323 --> 01:09:13.233 But I think your, the point that you're making about being around sentient 01:09:13.233 --> 01:09:19.353 beings back to where we went to with HeartMath earlier is, is, is important. 01:09:19.353 --> 01:09:23.283 And it seems that you are somewhat of a profit of this. 01:09:23.383 --> 01:09:26.863 where would you like this to go? 01:09:27.523 --> 01:09:31.333 You, you've, you've, you've established now a very successful festival. 01:09:31.893 --> 01:09:33.813 you, you could say yourself actualized with it. 01:09:33.813 --> 01:09:35.253 You're, you're kind of making a living from it. 01:09:35.253 --> 01:09:38.943 You've, you've taken this idea that everyone said was just this silly little 01:09:38.943 --> 01:09:41.193 niche idea for people that like ponies. 01:09:41.193 --> 01:09:42.663 And you've put the light to that. 01:09:44.763 --> 01:09:48.363 Obviously, you, you, you, you, you are educating people about the Mustang issue. 01:09:48.393 --> 01:09:51.543 Obviously you're educating people about horses and mental health and 01:09:51.783 --> 01:09:56.253 so on, but where would you like to go back to yourself as a little girl? 01:09:56.703 --> 01:09:59.823 Where would you like to really go with this festival? 01:09:59.823 --> 01:10:00.933 What would you like to see it do? 01:10:03.453 --> 01:10:08.463 Lisa Diersen: I'd like to see more people, non horse people 01:10:09.003 --> 01:10:10.683 coming and seeing this magic. 01:10:11.613 --> 01:10:12.453 Cause it's magic. 01:10:12.633 --> 01:10:19.783 I mean, it's, it's so powerful and, and I don't care whether I'm showing 01:10:21.303 --> 01:10:26.253 films and I still do this, three times a year at a library by us. 01:10:26.628 --> 01:10:30.948 I'll take a, a group of our documentaries and we do a little 01:10:30.948 --> 01:10:36.858 movie night at a library, and you see people walking out in tears just 01:10:36.858 --> 01:10:39.498 because they, they, they're so moved. 01:10:40.188 --> 01:10:46.938 They're just, they, they're just so moved because they simply had people 01:10:46.938 --> 01:10:49.338 go, just keep saying, I had no idea. 01:10:49.938 --> 01:10:50.748 I had no idea. 01:10:50.808 --> 01:10:56.298 That's, that seems to be the chant of people who've seen the seen horse 01:10:56.298 --> 01:11:04.728 movies that are about mental health or veterans or kids, therapeutic uses. 01:11:04.788 --> 01:11:08.028 They walk out and they just go, I just, I just had no idea. 01:11:09.258 --> 01:11:15.168 And I'd like that to be, , more, more people to be experiencing that because 01:11:15.168 --> 01:11:21.588 these people, these filmmakers work so hard to pull these stories together and 01:11:21.588 --> 01:11:27.768 to share them with, with people and to, to let someone experience, to have the 01:11:27.768 --> 01:11:35.478 experience that I had the first time I saw your film, to want to make, to want 01:11:35.478 --> 01:11:38.688 to make it everybody, to, to see that. 01:11:39.978 --> 01:11:45.528 I think everybody who, who takes the time to make a documentary about horses or. 01:11:46.878 --> 01:11:48.468 You know, what, what is going on? 01:11:48.468 --> 01:11:51.528 Whether it's a good one or a bad one, they've still put their heart and 01:11:51.528 --> 01:11:54.228 soul into, into that storytelling. 01:11:55.788 --> 01:11:57.318 Rupert Isaacson: You know, it, it's really interesting. 01:11:57.318 --> 01:12:01.158 As you were doing this, I I, I was inspired to just jump on Google because, 01:12:01.258 --> 01:12:09.778 it, it, reminded me of something I read a few months ago, which was that for 01:12:09.778 --> 01:12:13.378 people who are stuck in cities, and I think this came out of lockdown, , that 01:12:13.378 --> 01:12:16.408 watching nature documentaries, for example, wildlife documentaries and 01:12:16.648 --> 01:12:20.128 nature documentaries, turned out to be incredibly good for people's health. 01:12:20.488 --> 01:12:23.488 Not just their mental health, but actually their physical health too. 01:12:23.628 --> 01:12:24.048 Mm-hmm. 01:12:24.133 --> 01:12:28.258 And of course, what is a horse, but nature and where do mm-hmm. 01:12:28.498 --> 01:12:29.758 Horse documentaries take place. 01:12:29.758 --> 01:12:32.428 And I was just thinking, well, what's in it for me if I, I don't 01:12:32.428 --> 01:12:36.298 care from horses, but, and I've, I, I've just got something here. 01:12:36.303 --> 01:12:40.178 It says, in a new study published by Oxford University Press, , experts 01:12:40.178 --> 01:12:43.898 describe how television shows can ultimately not benefit, not 01:12:43.898 --> 01:12:47.368 just the planet, , by making people, more interested in, in 01:12:47.368 --> 01:12:48.568 nature and the causes of nature. 01:12:48.573 --> 01:12:52.678 But it backed up something which had come out from the University of, of 01:12:52.708 --> 01:12:58.928 California Berkeley, where, watching nature documentaries of any kind was 01:12:59.588 --> 01:13:04.928 shown to be one of the best ways to boost your mental health and decrease stress. 01:13:05.318 --> 01:13:08.048 And of course, we know that stress is a physical thing. 01:13:08.108 --> 01:13:09.038 It, it's not just a. 01:13:09.653 --> 01:13:13.283 Something that happens because the amygdala in the brain signals 01:13:13.283 --> 01:13:14.513 your body to produce cortisol. 01:13:14.513 --> 01:13:17.243 The stress hormone, that stress hormone we know is a neurotoxin. 01:13:17.753 --> 01:13:22.853 So people who are stressed all the time, which is most people in our culture, 01:13:23.763 --> 01:13:27.228 are suffering, you know, health, physical health, degradation from it. 01:13:28.098 --> 01:13:32.278 Would you posit that, by producing this documentary and sort of putting th th 01:13:32.338 --> 01:13:35.398 this festival and putting all of these documentaries out there for people to 01:13:35.398 --> 01:13:41.138 watch, and giving them a, a platform where they get to television and that sort 01:13:41.143 --> 01:13:45.998 of thing, you are actually benefiting people's physical as, as well as mental 01:13:45.998 --> 01:13:47.918 health way outside of the horse world. 01:13:49.748 --> 01:13:50.708 Well, I would love to think 01:13:50.713 --> 01:13:51.668 Lisa Diersen: that that would happen. 01:13:53.198 --> 01:13:55.358 Rupert Isaacson: It seems, well, it seems the academics think it, it, 01:13:55.438 --> 01:13:59.148 it's, it's, it's, it's very interesting to, to, to hop onto, to Google. 01:13:59.148 --> 01:14:00.438 It seems to be a hot topic right now. 01:14:00.738 --> 01:14:03.588 I just did one, one little search here. 01:14:04.148 --> 01:14:08.948 and it seems that it does come down to reducing stress, which 01:14:08.948 --> 01:14:11.708 makes perfect sense if you think about it, I guess because mm-hmm. 01:14:11.948 --> 01:14:18.848 If, if planet Earth is where our organism, because humans are organisms, is pro 01:14:18.878 --> 01:14:24.038 pre-programmed to, to be in, and of course we, we divorce ourselves from that. 01:14:24.368 --> 01:14:28.368 then to beam something into a living room, to beam something into a 01:14:28.373 --> 01:14:35.148 cell phone, Surely must connect one, reconnect one, even if it's 01:14:35.148 --> 01:14:36.858 in a metaphorical or virtual way. 01:14:38.238 --> 01:14:38.358 Mm-hmm. 01:14:38.898 --> 01:14:40.878 Something in our organism must respond to that. 01:14:41.148 --> 01:14:41.748 Would you not think? 01:14:43.158 --> 01:14:47.118 Lisa Diersen: Oh, I think for sure, because we're, we are, we're mammals. 01:14:47.118 --> 01:14:54.348 I mean, we are the same type of being that, that the horse says. 01:14:55.638 --> 01:14:58.248 We just have the ability to think of it more. 01:14:58.248 --> 01:15:00.888 But, and some there that could be questionable at 01:15:00.888 --> 01:15:02.148 some time with some people. 01:15:02.153 --> 01:15:05.538 But, I noticed you me, when you, that's where comes from. 01:15:07.938 --> 01:15:12.438 But, there was a, one of our, we also do commercials, have commercials in 01:15:12.438 --> 01:15:17.928 the festival and equine productions, who happens to be based in, the UK 01:15:18.678 --> 01:15:24.418 did a really nice piece, a little commercial on, for the mental health. 01:15:24.568 --> 01:15:28.228 there's a mental health group that takes care of the jockeys and 01:15:28.258 --> 01:15:30.808 people who work at the racetracks. 01:15:31.618 --> 01:15:35.568 And, when you were talking, you were talking a little bit about people in their 01:15:35.568 --> 01:15:38.838 apartment or this and that, but I'll bet you there's a bunch of people who are 01:15:38.838 --> 01:15:42.308 gamblers and or race horses and Oh, yes. 01:15:42.308 --> 01:15:42.428 Yeah. 01:15:42.433 --> 01:15:43.128 That kind of thing. 01:15:43.128 --> 01:15:46.158 I mean, the dark side of horse industry affects them that way too. 01:15:47.028 --> 01:15:47.328 Yes. 01:15:47.328 --> 01:15:51.588 The dark side of the racing world, but still a horse world, but. 01:15:52.248 --> 01:15:56.508 They did a beautiful little piece, and it was more, it just kind of scanned. 01:15:56.508 --> 01:16:01.068 I wanna think, I think it was at Ascot, Royal Ascot, and they would zoom in 01:16:01.068 --> 01:16:06.678 on a, on someone in the crowd and they would say, has body issues, you 01:16:06.683 --> 01:16:10.888 know, just, maybe it's the, maybe it's a jockey or one of the ladies 01:16:10.888 --> 01:16:14.458 serving, and then the other one would say, dealing with, dealing with grief. 01:16:14.458 --> 01:16:18.388 And it would just keep zooming in on, on different people. 01:16:19.138 --> 01:16:23.668 And it made you stop and think everybody's got a story. 01:16:23.668 --> 01:16:25.378 Everyone has something going on. 01:16:26.488 --> 01:16:33.748 You know, everyone needs what the horse has to give them at 01:16:33.748 --> 01:16:37.828 some level because everybody has something going on in their life. 01:16:38.338 --> 01:16:41.968 It goes to that little, I, I have a little sign in the kitchen that 01:16:41.968 --> 01:16:47.518 says, be nice because you don't know what the other person's going through. 01:16:48.928 --> 01:16:49.108 You know? 01:16:49.108 --> 01:16:52.438 Always be nice because you don't know what the other person's going through. 01:16:52.828 --> 01:16:54.238 You don't know what kind of day they're having. 01:16:54.238 --> 01:16:55.618 You don't know what their home life is. 01:16:55.618 --> 01:16:59.668 You don't know whether they're going through a, a, a parent dying or something. 01:16:59.673 --> 01:17:00.838 I mean, you just never know. 01:17:00.838 --> 01:17:03.418 So never take it personally. 01:17:05.034 --> 01:17:09.174 Rupert Isaacson: What would it's, to me, this goes beyond horses. 01:17:09.234 --> 01:17:12.259 and it goes back to the human car of story, right? 01:17:12.259 --> 01:17:15.319 So there you are as a little girl and. 01:17:15.769 --> 01:17:18.619 You are growing up in a household where you are, you are seeing 01:17:19.069 --> 01:17:23.419 your mother die slowly from grief, basically in front of your eyes. 01:17:23.419 --> 01:17:25.479 It manifests as cancer, but mm-hmm. 01:17:25.709 --> 01:17:30.649 Effectively that, and you see your older sister, functional, but walking 01:17:31.309 --> 01:17:34.889 dead to some degree because of this terrible guilt, of what happened to your 01:17:34.889 --> 01:17:38.309 brother, even though I'm sure it wasn't her fault, it was just a freak thing. 01:17:38.309 --> 01:17:38.399 Mm-hmm. 01:17:39.609 --> 01:17:46.119 and then you fortunately have this creative dynamic father who includes you 01:17:46.124 --> 01:17:50.649 in everything and, shows you, encourages you to, to be creative in every way, 01:17:50.769 --> 01:17:55.629 and shows you the creative power of what people often don't think of as creative. 01:17:55.629 --> 01:17:58.809 Things like the engineering side, the building side, that, that 01:17:58.809 --> 01:18:01.479 actually pointing out to machine tooling, that sort of thing. 01:18:01.629 --> 01:18:04.309 That, that is actually as creative as riding a novel or, 01:18:04.749 --> 01:18:05.799 or producing a piece of art. 01:18:06.099 --> 01:18:10.059 Then you get into, obviously horses and horse breeding, and suddenly you want to 01:18:10.059 --> 01:18:16.059 run a horse festival to promote stuff that you wouldn't normally see in your regular 01:18:16.059 --> 01:18:21.939 horse show, and that leads you into this, , very successful, Equus festival. 01:18:22.569 --> 01:18:26.749 but really it seems to me what you've done through the whole thing is you've, you've, 01:18:26.754 --> 01:18:32.919 you've identified the healing power of story and you've created a nexus whereby 01:18:32.924 --> 01:18:35.199 people can be healed through story. 01:18:35.204 --> 01:18:39.039 It happens to be about, primarily about horses, but it. 01:18:39.699 --> 01:18:46.269 Obviously could be pretty much any story if story is at the root of healing 01:18:46.269 --> 01:18:57.789 for humans and festivals are where we find out about and celebrate and give 01:18:57.789 --> 01:19:00.369 our attention to this type of healing. 01:19:00.374 --> 01:19:05.079 I, I think everyone who goes to a festival of one kind always comes 01:19:05.079 --> 01:19:07.029 away feeling uplifted, inspired. 01:19:08.079 --> 01:19:09.849 I know there's a lot of people out there probably listening 01:19:09.849 --> 01:19:12.009 who would like to do a festival. 01:19:12.309 --> 01:19:14.409 It's certainly always been in the back of mind. 01:19:14.649 --> 01:19:16.239 Oh God, I like to do a festival someday. 01:19:16.269 --> 01:19:21.879 But, I think a lot of people have this idea what, give us your nuts and bolts 01:19:21.879 --> 01:19:24.519 as a, as a the engineering side of you. 01:19:25.209 --> 01:19:28.899 How do you put a festival together and how do you make it work? 01:19:29.319 --> 01:19:30.489 Cuz most festivals don't work. 01:19:30.789 --> 01:19:32.589 How do you make a festival work? 01:19:33.219 --> 01:19:33.849 How do you do it? 01:19:34.172 --> 01:19:41.582 Lisa Diersen: Team, a great team having, having a great support team, 01:19:41.642 --> 01:19:43.892 people really good people helping. 01:19:44.582 --> 01:19:51.332 I've learned with, especially with the EQU component of this festival, with the film 01:19:51.542 --> 01:19:58.802 component that we partner now with next or the middle of July, I'll be at Briar 01:19:58.802 --> 01:20:01.652 Fest at the Kentucky Horse Park, which. 01:20:01.922 --> 01:20:04.892 For those out there that don't know what Briar Fest is. 01:20:05.462 --> 01:20:09.242 everyone I think globally knows what Briar horses are. 01:20:09.242 --> 01:20:14.072 They're the little model horses that come in a come in a yellow 01:20:14.072 --> 01:20:17.942 box, and every little girl usually has at least one of them. 01:20:18.182 --> 01:20:24.602 But Briar Fest gets about 40,000 people every year in at the horse park. 01:20:25.292 --> 01:20:29.312 We show, I go down there and we'll do a day of film screening. 01:20:29.312 --> 01:20:34.892 The films I've learned to partner with other festivals. 01:20:34.892 --> 01:20:37.472 We come in as a, as a component. 01:20:37.892 --> 01:20:42.422 two, two festivals now with the Mustang Summit where we have the 01:20:42.422 --> 01:20:47.192 film festival and the Mustang Summit kind of running simultaneously. 01:20:48.032 --> 01:20:51.812 one because there's some overlap between the documentaries and the, the 01:20:51.817 --> 01:20:58.382 storytellers of those documentaries, which happened to be horse people who then in 01:20:58.382 --> 01:21:02.972 the morning they can go watch a seminar with that horse person and then go in the 01:21:02.972 --> 01:21:07.562 evening and watch a documentary and sit through a q and a with the filmmaker who 01:21:07.562 --> 01:21:09.872 made a the film about that horse person. 01:21:10.232 --> 01:21:15.352 so I've learned that, oh, throughout the years, COVID was killer for two 01:21:15.352 --> 01:21:18.622 years, but we learned how to go virtual. 01:21:18.622 --> 01:21:21.052 We learned how to do a lot of stuff online. 01:21:21.052 --> 01:21:26.182 We have a film channel, EQU Films channel where people can go and 01:21:26.272 --> 01:21:31.642 watch, I think it's $7 a month, they can watch some of our horse 01:21:31.647 --> 01:21:34.012 documentaries and films on demand. 01:21:34.042 --> 01:21:35.102 The EQU film channel, 01:21:35.782 --> 01:21:36.412 Rupert Isaacson: it's taught us. 01:21:36.412 --> 01:21:40.102 How do, is that run by you or is that, is that, run by a larger, 01:21:40.802 --> 01:21:44.992 Lisa Diersen: we have, i, I, it's, it's under, film festival. 01:21:44.992 --> 01:21:46.672 Flix is who we are. 01:21:46.672 --> 01:21:48.592 Their, we are their horse channel. 01:21:49.162 --> 01:21:54.472 So it's a company out of, LA that I work with and, we are their, 01:21:54.622 --> 01:21:56.062 we are their horse content. 01:21:56.092 --> 01:22:00.272 So it's a whole dedicated channel, called the EQU Film Channel. 01:22:01.752 --> 01:22:05.822 there's an app that, that we have that's film Festival flicks. 01:22:05.822 --> 01:22:07.382 And then you we're on that app. 01:22:08.292 --> 01:22:13.122 you know what we, you learn, when before Covid, we were doing quite a 01:22:13.122 --> 01:22:15.072 few tour stops around the country. 01:22:15.072 --> 01:22:17.262 Every month we would be in a different location. 01:22:17.852 --> 01:22:22.652 Canada, you, I remember sitting down with you one time, we were 01:22:22.652 --> 01:22:31.087 at, the Abilities Expo in for the, the therapeutic expo where people 01:22:31.177 --> 01:22:32.407 could come and get their stuff. 01:22:32.407 --> 01:22:36.427 And you and I were talking, you were talking about at one day this, 01:22:36.577 --> 01:22:40.237 this film festival, you could, would be able to carry it in a suitcase. 01:22:40.702 --> 01:22:44.062 Well, we've gone from being in a suitcase to now it goes on a hard 01:22:44.062 --> 01:22:49.882 drive, so we can go anywhere with the film festival and screen these films. 01:22:49.882 --> 01:22:54.472 So if, if a little goal I have, I'd love to be doing something 01:22:54.477 --> 01:22:59.002 with, next week is the five schools. 01:22:59.032 --> 01:23:03.592 The five writing schools are doing a big presentation in Spain. 01:23:04.432 --> 01:23:08.632 And I did not know until a friend of mine is going to see this, that Abu 01:23:08.902 --> 01:23:12.412 Dhabi now has a classical writing school. 01:23:13.162 --> 01:23:13.402 Did you 01:23:13.407 --> 01:23:13.912 Rupert Isaacson: know that? 01:23:14.212 --> 01:23:15.052 I did not know that. 01:23:16.282 --> 01:23:20.352 We're talking about classical dressage in the, in the vein of, the Spanish 01:23:20.352 --> 01:23:21.582 Writing School of Vienna, that 01:23:22.122 --> 01:23:22.542 Lisa Diersen: France. 01:23:22.602 --> 01:23:22.822 Yes. 01:23:22.822 --> 01:23:27.372 So the, the Spanish Writing School is, is there, the Portuguese School is 01:23:27.372 --> 01:23:29.922 there, the Andalusian school is there. 01:23:30.522 --> 01:23:31.872 the school from France. 01:23:32.262 --> 01:23:33.252 France is there. 01:23:33.252 --> 01:23:37.112 And then the Saudi Arabian, I mean, the school for Abu Dhabi is there. 01:23:37.652 --> 01:23:41.822 So the five schools are coming together to do a big presentation in Spain. 01:23:42.182 --> 01:23:45.632 So I would love to take the festival to Abu Dhabi. 01:23:45.632 --> 01:23:51.242 I think that would be really cool to take the film festival there, to do a weekend 01:23:51.362 --> 01:23:54.482 screening or whatever, maybe Germany. 01:23:55.022 --> 01:23:58.712 And we, we did a little short one in France and we're talking 01:23:58.712 --> 01:23:59.732 to some people in the uk. 01:23:59.732 --> 01:24:04.442 So now that we're all past the Covid fear, I think, I think 01:24:04.442 --> 01:24:06.782 we'll be moving a little bit. 01:24:07.262 --> 01:24:10.682 Things have loosened up since January of this year. 01:24:11.102 --> 01:24:15.782 So since this January we've been in, i almost every month I've been 01:24:15.782 --> 01:24:17.522 somewhere else with the film festival. 01:24:17.522 --> 01:24:20.522 So it's finally shaking 01:24:21.842 --> 01:24:22.202 Rupert Isaacson: after. 01:24:22.622 --> 01:24:25.532 At what point would you say, let's talk about money? 01:24:25.982 --> 01:24:31.772 I think when people get an idea for a festival of any kind, there's an 01:24:31.772 --> 01:24:36.152 initial rush of enthusiasm and then they say, oh, but shit, we need sponsors. 01:24:36.372 --> 01:24:37.002 how do we do that? 01:24:37.002 --> 01:24:38.712 And everyone sort of scratches their head, no, we need to, 01:24:38.712 --> 01:24:39.672 looks, looks the other way. 01:24:40.332 --> 01:24:43.512 How do you get the money to run a festival? 01:24:43.722 --> 01:24:44.352 Talk to us. 01:24:44.892 --> 01:24:47.412 Let's say everyone's listening now wants to run a festival. 01:24:47.712 --> 01:24:51.102 What are the, what's the A, B, C, and D of how'd you get the money to 01:24:51.102 --> 01:24:51.732 Lisa Diersen: run a festival? 01:24:52.842 --> 01:24:58.452 We still need sponsors, but we, we take the money that we get from sponsors and 01:24:58.842 --> 01:25:04.902 you make the ends meet at that event and you do the best you can and you pray for 01:25:04.902 --> 01:25:09.372 a little bit of a turnout with people and you then plan for the next one. 01:25:09.372 --> 01:25:09.612 And 01:25:09.792 --> 01:25:11.712 Rupert Isaacson: what do you do to get it off the ground though? 01:25:11.712 --> 01:25:13.512 Do you have to just put in your own money? 01:25:13.692 --> 01:25:14.202 At first? 01:25:14.202 --> 01:25:14.622 You put in 01:25:14.622 --> 01:25:15.282 Lisa Diersen: your own money. 01:25:15.282 --> 01:25:18.312 You either put in your own money or you have people who are willing to 01:25:18.312 --> 01:25:20.442 put money in and that's your sponsors. 01:25:20.442 --> 01:25:25.632 And, I, equi has been very lucky because we have a couple 01:25:25.632 --> 01:25:30.912 of, people who really believe in what the mission is that have that. 01:25:31.542 --> 01:25:36.072 Regularly make a, a nice donation to keep the mission going. 01:25:36.642 --> 01:25:40.422 but you know, it's, it's, don't do it. 01:25:40.422 --> 01:25:44.712 If you think you're gonna make a fortune, but do it. 01:25:44.802 --> 01:25:46.932 I do it because I'm passionate. 01:25:46.992 --> 01:25:54.042 I, I believe that this is, that every time I say, dammit, I'm not doing this again. 01:25:55.032 --> 01:25:58.422 Somebody sends me a really great film and I'm like, dammit, I 01:25:58.422 --> 01:26:00.072 want everybody to see that film. 01:26:01.092 --> 01:26:09.612 And so, as long as the creators keep creating good horse stories, I think 01:26:09.612 --> 01:26:16.092 there needs to be someone out there reviewing and patting them on the back 01:26:16.097 --> 01:26:22.542 and, and maybe giving them an award for taking the time to, to make that content. 01:26:23.562 --> 01:26:31.032 And before we were in existence, before EQU was here, and to any big sponsors out 01:26:31.032 --> 01:26:35.502 there that might be listening, this is why I think it's a responsibility of a Purina 01:26:35.502 --> 01:26:43.302 or a, your bigger people who, who exist on horses, their, their business exists 01:26:43.332 --> 01:26:50.472 because of the horse they should be the ones really carrying the, carrying it on 01:26:50.472 --> 01:26:58.092 this because without those people telling, getting those stories to us, And us being 01:26:58.092 --> 01:27:00.642 there to say, wow, you did a great job. 01:27:00.647 --> 01:27:04.422 Or, here, let's have an audience that will actually see it. 01:27:04.812 --> 01:27:08.862 Then that little film will get made, and it might go on YouTube. 01:27:09.642 --> 01:27:13.422 Somebody might see it on YouTube, but only per chance. 01:27:14.682 --> 01:27:17.832 And then it just is out there in the internet world. 01:27:18.552 --> 01:27:25.272 So at least with us, someone sends us a film and it gets shown to the 01:27:25.422 --> 01:27:30.432 different audiences, and we help help get these stories out because 01:27:30.432 --> 01:27:31.932 otherwise how are they gonna get out? 01:27:32.412 --> 01:27:35.242 Rupert Isaacson: So Purina and the big, , feed companies and that's, 01:27:35.242 --> 01:27:36.622 they're not yet sponsoring you? 01:27:37.072 --> 01:27:37.552 Lisa Diersen: Not yet. 01:27:37.672 --> 01:27:38.182 Not yet. 01:27:38.187 --> 01:27:38.272 Okay. 01:27:38.422 --> 01:27:38.512 Okay. 01:27:38.542 --> 01:27:40.912 No, and that's after, that's after 11 01:27:40.912 --> 01:27:41.842 Rupert Isaacson: years, so, okay. 01:27:41.842 --> 01:27:44.632 Are you actively going after them saying, Hey, 01:27:44.932 --> 01:27:47.242 Lisa Diersen: we, yeah, we are knocking a little. 01:27:47.342 --> 01:27:51.272 we, we, it's, it's after the 10th year, things are changing a little. 01:27:51.272 --> 01:27:54.122 Like people, people go, oh, it's, you're not going away. 01:27:54.842 --> 01:27:54.992 Rupert Isaacson: Okay. 01:27:54.992 --> 01:27:56.702 So longevity is an important thing. 01:27:56.702 --> 01:27:57.692 You've got, you've gotta stick around. 01:27:57.692 --> 01:27:57.932 Oh, yes. 01:27:58.112 --> 01:27:58.332 Ok. 01:27:58.352 --> 01:27:58.572 Yes. 01:27:58.592 --> 01:27:58.772 Yes. 01:27:58.872 --> 01:28:00.522 talk to me about the, the, the structures. 01:28:00.522 --> 01:28:04.225 You said donations, are you what you'd call in America, a five 01:28:04.225 --> 01:28:05.742 oh one C three, or a nonprofit? 01:28:05.742 --> 01:28:07.512 What people in England will call charity? 01:28:08.022 --> 01:28:10.782 You're, you are a, a for-profit or a non-for-profit 01:28:10.782 --> 01:28:12.672 Lisa Diersen: organization or llc. 01:28:12.732 --> 01:28:18.597 what I've found, and again, this is in, in this country, I know a 01:28:18.597 --> 01:28:25.077 lot of people who've had some really great, nonprofits going and eg. 01:28:25.077 --> 01:28:27.867 Gala is the classic example. 01:28:28.527 --> 01:28:33.897 You, Lynn Thomas and Greg Kirsten started that organization and their 01:28:33.897 --> 01:28:37.557 boards voted them out, got rid of them. 01:28:37.917 --> 01:28:38.007 Mm-hmm. 01:28:38.007 --> 01:28:44.277 Which, you know, once they wanted to, I mean they just, once it was 01:28:44.277 --> 01:28:45.987 successful, the boards got rid of them. 01:28:46.497 --> 01:28:46.947 So, 01:28:47.277 --> 01:28:48.687 Rupert Isaacson: palace cos in a little bit the, the, 01:28:49.047 --> 01:28:49.287 Lisa Diersen: yeah. 01:28:49.617 --> 01:28:50.277 Yes. 01:28:50.517 --> 01:28:55.947 So the, I just think that this mission, we've really been able to stay true to 01:28:55.947 --> 01:29:01.257 the mission of what EQU is, and that's being the home to the storytellers of 01:29:01.257 --> 01:29:05.937 the horse world, whether it's through film or art or literature that we've 01:29:05.937 --> 01:29:10.257 been able to stay true to that because I don't have a board saying, well, we 01:29:10.257 --> 01:29:15.147 don't like this film, so I don't, I don't, you know, we're not, we're we 01:29:15.147 --> 01:29:20.607 don't have that the, the heavy hand of you're a nonprofit, you can't do this. 01:29:21.027 --> 01:29:22.647 So, but presumably though, no, we're 01:29:22.647 --> 01:29:23.487 Rupert Isaacson: for-profits. 01:29:23.577 --> 01:29:27.027 So in, in the American climate though, people obviously can give 01:29:27.207 --> 01:29:31.837 money to a not-for-profit, and get a tax deductible donation from that. 01:29:31.937 --> 01:29:35.187 and that allows people with nonprofits, to. 01:29:36.162 --> 01:29:37.662 To fundraise, quite effectively. 01:29:37.662 --> 01:29:41.562 You, you are saying you right to some degree denies yourself that mechanism. 01:29:41.562 --> 01:29:44.682 Do you, do you think that it would be easier if you were a nonprofit 01:29:45.012 --> 01:29:46.242 to get sponsors and funding? 01:29:47.652 --> 01:29:51.612 Lisa Diersen: it, it's a, it's a half and half because right now sponsor 01:29:51.612 --> 01:29:53.862 dollars are so tight everywhere. 01:29:53.892 --> 01:29:59.262 Even people who are nonprofits sponsor dollars are, are tough to come across. 01:30:00.012 --> 01:30:06.222 it just, we haven't, we haven't done gone after that yet, that part of it 01:30:06.222 --> 01:30:11.802 yet, because it is with c when Covid hit, I wasn't sure whether we were 01:30:11.802 --> 01:30:14.562 going to be able to keep it going. 01:30:15.612 --> 01:30:20.682 And then when we were able to, to keep plugging along through having, 01:30:20.712 --> 01:30:25.062 we, I mean we had two virtual festivals with Covid, had to do it 01:30:25.572 --> 01:30:28.463 completely online, wor it worked. 01:30:29.722 --> 01:30:33.042 It, it was, I don't know how we did it, but we did it. 01:30:33.312 --> 01:30:38.462 And, I mean, people had fun and people won awards and it, 01:30:38.467 --> 01:30:39.722 you know, we pulled through it. 01:30:40.442 --> 01:30:45.392 But, , you know, this has been a year to regroup this, this year. 01:30:45.932 --> 01:30:51.002 This is the first year since Covid that we've really, you know, gotten really 01:30:51.002 --> 01:30:53.102 back into things a hundred percent. 01:30:53.102 --> 01:30:56.822 Rupert Isaacson: So, But basically you're saying then that the, the EQU 01:30:56.822 --> 01:31:00.962 Film Festival runs as a business, like any other business, and it has 01:31:00.962 --> 01:31:03.582 to sink or swim, depending on Yes. 01:31:04.162 --> 01:31:08.092 so people that, so, so the people who donate, who, who become 01:31:08.092 --> 01:31:10.852 sponsors, what they're doing is they're investing in a business. 01:31:11.122 --> 01:31:15.202 Are they investing, investing in, are they investing in it looking for a return or 01:31:15.202 --> 01:31:17.302 are they investing in it, in it as angels? 01:31:18.382 --> 01:31:20.332 Lisa Diersen: They're investing as investor angels. 01:31:20.332 --> 01:31:20.572 Yeah. 01:31:21.922 --> 01:31:24.172 So what would you looking to keep the, keep it going. 01:31:24.352 --> 01:31:24.862 Rupert Isaacson: Okay. 01:31:24.867 --> 01:31:28.942 So if, if you are somebody out there, and I'm sure there will be people out there, 01:31:29.452 --> 01:31:37.362 and one of my goals with this podcast, is to help people who want to make a 01:31:37.367 --> 01:31:39.522 living doing the quote unquote impossible. 01:31:40.122 --> 01:31:42.582 as you have, as I have and so on. 01:31:43.002 --> 01:31:47.742 I want them to know what the mechanisms are because when, when I was younger, I 01:31:47.742 --> 01:31:51.732 couldn't really find people to mentor me and, and answer those questions for me. 01:31:52.062 --> 01:31:56.382 And I had to sort of piece it together Over years, let's say 01:31:56.502 --> 01:31:58.032 someone decides to go your route. 01:31:58.032 --> 01:31:59.352 They say, okay, I want to do a festival. 01:31:59.357 --> 01:32:01.212 I've been listening to this Lisa Dison lady. 01:32:01.692 --> 01:32:05.802 , she says, okay, that the, the danger of going the nonprofit 01:32:05.802 --> 01:32:08.022 route is that you could end up getting voted off your own board. 01:32:08.232 --> 01:32:09.162 Okay, copy that. 01:32:09.672 --> 01:32:12.822 so now I've got to find angel investors because my, it's not 01:32:12.822 --> 01:32:15.252 a purely commercial enterprise. 01:32:15.257 --> 01:32:17.532 I can't offer people a, you know, a. 01:32:18.072 --> 01:32:19.392 Shareholder thing or something. 01:32:19.392 --> 01:32:21.072 Not, at least not for the first hundred years. 01:32:21.522 --> 01:32:25.692 how do you go about finding angel investors? 01:32:25.932 --> 01:32:27.252 What's the ABC of that? 01:32:28.992 --> 01:32:29.232 Well, 01:32:29.682 --> 01:32:35.412 Lisa Diersen: one of our, one of our, our bigger and investors is someone 01:32:35.412 --> 01:32:43.152 who fully believes in what we're doing mission wise with connecting the veterans 01:32:43.152 --> 01:32:49.212 programs up with horses and, and horses up with the veterans programs and getting 01:32:49.332 --> 01:32:53.922 that message out across the country and that they feel that that work. 01:32:54.462 --> 01:33:01.032 Just, that just simply being able to get that message out there is as important as, 01:33:01.752 --> 01:33:07.212 you know, if it, if they were giving to a nonprofit that was, was running a program, 01:33:07.662 --> 01:33:11.772 just educating people that these programs are out there is really important. 01:33:11.772 --> 01:33:17.532 And that's, and we do that just simply by doing what we do, being who we are, 01:33:17.952 --> 01:33:20.202 tell being, telling these stories. 01:33:20.862 --> 01:33:24.972 another believes in get, making sure that the message on the 01:33:24.972 --> 01:33:27.042 Mustang Steep keeps getting told. 01:33:27.372 --> 01:33:32.262 And we do, we do that all the time because that's just part of 01:33:33.282 --> 01:33:34.242 Rupert Isaacson: a lot of our stories. 01:33:34.242 --> 01:33:37.682 So there people out there who, who are willing to invest, who share 01:33:37.722 --> 01:33:40.272 the same concerns and passions. 01:33:40.887 --> 01:33:42.057 Horses for mental health. 01:33:42.447 --> 01:33:44.487 As you, how do you find these people? 01:33:44.517 --> 01:33:44.877 Do? 01:33:44.877 --> 01:33:48.567 Would you say that someone who is, they've found us. 01:33:48.897 --> 01:33:49.197 Right? 01:33:49.197 --> 01:33:50.187 That's what I was gonna ask you. 01:33:50.187 --> 01:33:54.627 So if, if someone, again is listening to this and says, oh gosh, all 01:33:54.627 --> 01:33:56.277 right, I'd like to do this thing. 01:33:56.277 --> 01:33:59.307 I, I have this cause I would like to do a festival around this. 01:33:59.307 --> 01:34:03.897 Cause how do I find, do I go knock on doors or is it more, you just gotta start 01:34:03.897 --> 01:34:06.267 doing it and then people notice, just 01:34:06.267 --> 01:34:06.627 Lisa Diersen: do it. 01:34:06.747 --> 01:34:13.197 one of somebody asked me about this in an, in an interview and, because when we 01:34:13.202 --> 01:34:19.947 started this, I, I, all I wanted to do was to have people see your documentary. 01:34:20.337 --> 01:34:22.047 I didn't care how I was going to do it. 01:34:22.947 --> 01:34:24.687 I didn't care what it took. 01:34:24.927 --> 01:34:26.367 I wanted people to see. 01:34:26.667 --> 01:34:28.887 So I was lucky. 01:34:28.887 --> 01:34:34.347 I had a friend who owned a theater, but unless I ask him, your, your film 01:34:34.347 --> 01:34:38.787 isn't gonna magically appear there, I, I had to go talk to him and, and 01:34:38.787 --> 01:34:40.617 get him to let me use that theater. 01:34:41.697 --> 01:34:46.587 Thank God Ron was as gracious as he was because that's how the first festival 01:34:46.587 --> 01:34:50.967 got off the ground it and ran for a whole weekend in a, in a beautiful 01:34:50.967 --> 01:34:57.867 theater with an amazing technician running the films and me not knowing. 01:34:58.302 --> 01:35:02.772 Anything at all about how to run a film festival except for, okay, here's the 01:35:02.772 --> 01:35:04.542 movies, here's where they're gonna start. 01:35:04.962 --> 01:35:09.642 And the poor guy, I, I wasn't even putting breaks in between the, the films, but, 01:35:09.702 --> 01:35:13.992 you know, only by the grace of God have I learned how to run a film festival now. 01:35:13.992 --> 01:35:20.232 But, the first, the first year in New York, we did it in Harlem and 01:35:20.232 --> 01:35:25.272 did it in a theater where I had three screens and a hundred plus movies. 01:35:25.272 --> 01:35:26.832 And I thought, oh, this will be fun. 01:35:26.832 --> 01:35:32.472 And I, I literally ran myself ragged trying to help the projectionist 01:35:32.472 --> 01:35:35.292 make sure that everything was starting when it was supposed to. 01:35:35.292 --> 01:35:38.112 But, you just have to do it. 01:35:38.172 --> 01:35:41.532 You just don't sit back and go, oh, well I can't do it because of this. 01:35:41.532 --> 01:35:42.882 I can't do it because of that. 01:35:43.962 --> 01:35:49.992 If you believe in what you're doing and what, what your mission is, I hate to use 01:35:49.992 --> 01:35:57.222 that word, but it's, I fully believe, I mean, I was so passionate about, these 01:35:57.222 --> 01:36:04.272 are great stories, people need to see 'em, I'm gonna do it just so I just did it. 01:36:04.802 --> 01:36:08.682 Rupert Isaacson: And you had, but the reason you, you wanted people to see them 01:36:08.742 --> 01:36:14.462 was you had already a passion for how the horse can heal, which I presume, yeah. 01:36:14.462 --> 01:36:14.902 I him 01:36:14.902 --> 01:36:16.622 Lisa Diersen: for horses, period addiction. 01:36:16.622 --> 01:36:16.782 Right. 01:36:16.802 --> 01:36:21.342 Rupert Isaacson: But you, you yourself, have been healed by stories of horses 01:36:21.342 --> 01:36:24.042 as a girl, as well as by actual horses. 01:36:24.792 --> 01:36:28.842 Yes, but had you not had access to an actual horse and you'd been in that 01:36:29.472 --> 01:36:33.972 household watching your mother die of sadness, those stories about horses still 01:36:33.972 --> 01:36:36.132 would've carried you a long way through. 01:36:36.137 --> 01:36:36.402 No. 01:36:36.972 --> 01:36:44.712 so yes, from that early, early experience to now you fostered a, a knowledge that 01:36:45.312 --> 01:36:50.202 story can heal and story about these healing animals can heal it even more. 01:36:50.982 --> 01:36:56.802 what are the biggest mistakes you've made, putting all this together would you say? 01:36:57.762 --> 01:36:59.792 Lisa Diersen: Oh my gosh, biggest mistakes and what? 01:36:59.922 --> 01:37:04.902 It's just not having enough money ever to do it the way I wanted to do it. 01:37:04.912 --> 01:37:08.742 And, and I'm not even sure that's a mistake because that's caused, 01:37:09.252 --> 01:37:13.572 that's created another learning opportunity, that's taught me 01:37:13.577 --> 01:37:16.302 another way to get something done. 01:37:17.172 --> 01:37:24.922 So, you know, that maybe ha having, partnering with some people that I, you 01:37:24.922 --> 01:37:30.502 know, you partner with because you're at you, you need to have that extra 01:37:30.502 --> 01:37:35.812 money and to make, to make it go, you know, to, to make the film festival go. 01:37:35.812 --> 01:37:40.192 And it's not exactly who you, you'd wanna partner with. 01:37:40.192 --> 01:37:43.792 Maybe that, and I don't think those were mistakes because through 01:37:43.792 --> 01:37:46.762 those mistakes, through that, that. 01:37:48.577 --> 01:37:53.107 Having that happen, I learned how to deal with other, other parts of it. 01:37:53.677 --> 01:37:59.357 So, you know, I learned a lot about the WildHorse people through different things. 01:37:59.362 --> 01:38:05.057 You know, I, I went into it like Pollyanna thinking that if everybody loved Mustangs, 01:38:05.057 --> 01:38:09.017 they were all, you know, everybody was in this la la world loving mustangs. 01:38:09.017 --> 01:38:15.677 Not knowing that there were completely one radical group on one side and another 01:38:15.677 --> 01:38:17.927 rabid radical group on another side. 01:38:18.317 --> 01:38:19.817 You know, it's, it's right. 01:38:19.877 --> 01:38:21.077 And you find yourself in middle. 01:38:21.077 --> 01:38:21.557 Every issue is 01:38:21.557 --> 01:38:22.007 Rupert Isaacson: that way. 01:38:22.277 --> 01:38:25.067 I basically is the message there that there are no mistakes. 01:38:25.067 --> 01:38:26.267 It's just all learning curve. 01:38:27.527 --> 01:38:27.827 Yes. 01:38:29.447 --> 01:38:30.407 Lisa Diersen: But isn't that life? 01:38:31.937 --> 01:38:32.657 Rupert Isaacson: I would say so. 01:38:32.657 --> 01:38:33.017 Yes. 01:38:33.127 --> 01:38:35.287 you know, sometimes one can say, does it, does it have to 01:38:36.367 --> 01:38:38.227 happen, with a baseball bat? 01:38:38.287 --> 01:38:41.047 You know, could we not have it happen with a polite cup of tea 01:38:41.047 --> 01:38:43.447 and a and a blank check, please. 01:38:43.837 --> 01:38:45.667 Lisa Diersen: but would we learn that much, Rupert? 01:38:45.667 --> 01:38:46.807 Would we really learn? 01:38:46.807 --> 01:38:48.817 Would we be where we're at right 01:38:48.817 --> 01:38:48.877 Rupert Isaacson: now? 01:38:48.877 --> 01:38:51.907 I'm willing, I'm willing to, to find out. 01:38:53.557 --> 01:38:53.947 I'm ready. 01:38:55.867 --> 01:38:58.837 Well, I think what also happens too is that when it, when it does go smoothly, 01:38:58.837 --> 01:39:01.957 of course, and it does actually quite a lot of the time, more, more, 01:39:01.957 --> 01:39:03.607 more than we, we give it credit for. 01:39:03.612 --> 01:39:07.087 I, I think what happens is, of course, because of the negative bias in the 01:39:07.092 --> 01:39:10.327 human brain, you know, you remember your close encounter with the elephant. 01:39:11.347 --> 01:39:15.787 More than you remember, or your peaceful encounters with the elephant, because that 01:39:15.787 --> 01:39:18.307 was the one that made a big impression. 01:39:18.517 --> 01:39:21.307 But that also Yeah, where you learned probably the most about elephants. 01:39:21.427 --> 01:39:25.327 you know, I'm just saying if, if, if you're sort of a bushman in the wild, so 01:39:25.897 --> 01:39:32.227 I, I, but I very much agree with you that when it seems that one has made terrible 01:39:32.227 --> 01:39:37.597 mistakes in retrospect, generally one looks back at those and go, oh, that 01:39:37.597 --> 01:39:42.517 was actually where, I learned the most about how to make this thing really work. 01:39:42.977 --> 01:39:47.952 I just had to see that extreme of not working in order to understand 01:39:47.952 --> 01:39:49.422 where the middle point of working was. 01:39:49.842 --> 01:39:52.092 but at the time I couldn't quite see that because there 01:39:52.092 --> 01:39:52.932 was a lot of stress going on. 01:39:53.832 --> 01:39:59.082 but yeah, I, I, I think, I think for listeners, you know, I grew 01:39:59.082 --> 01:40:03.792 up always being told, oh, Rupert, those things you want to do, you 01:40:03.792 --> 01:40:04.932 can't make a living doing that. 01:40:04.932 --> 01:40:06.462 You know, you can't make a living through horses. 01:40:06.467 --> 01:40:09.372 And I remember thinking, but there's this thing called the equine industry. 01:40:09.372 --> 01:40:11.682 I mean, some, someone out there is making a living at it. 01:40:11.682 --> 01:40:13.392 You know, why, why, why not me? 01:40:13.392 --> 01:40:15.822 Oh, Rupert, you can't make a living, you writing books. 01:40:16.032 --> 01:40:17.802 Well, but there's this thing called the publishing industry. 01:40:17.802 --> 01:40:21.162 I mean, someone is out there fueling that. 01:40:21.162 --> 01:40:21.432 Right? 01:40:21.462 --> 01:40:22.092 it's not just. 01:40:23.832 --> 01:40:25.262 publishing aristocrats or something? 01:40:25.262 --> 01:40:26.742 No, there's, there's people out there making a living. 01:40:26.742 --> 01:40:28.342 I mean, films the same thing. 01:40:28.342 --> 01:40:31.792 Why you can't do that, you know, you got, but, and I, what I realized was that 01:40:31.912 --> 01:40:38.572 people meant they felt that they couldn't do it, and that if you did it, it would 01:40:38.662 --> 01:40:39.892 make 'em feel bad about themselves. 01:40:39.892 --> 01:40:41.272 So they would try to discourage you. 01:40:41.572 --> 01:40:44.302 And so what you had to do was not listen to that. 01:40:44.302 --> 01:40:47.302 And I, I was discouraged earlier in my life and there were a few things 01:40:47.302 --> 01:40:51.892 I didn't do because people talked me out of it, which I later realized 01:40:51.892 --> 01:40:53.152 actually, I, I could totally have done. 01:40:53.272 --> 01:40:55.282 And, and maybe will at some point. 01:40:55.822 --> 01:41:00.022 you seem to have been somebody who also has made your living. 01:41:00.532 --> 01:41:02.692 You've made your living through horses, you've made your living. 01:41:02.902 --> 01:41:05.902 I know, I know your breeding has been successful with the lucit as 01:41:05.902 --> 01:41:07.222 you've, you've shown successfully. 01:41:07.882 --> 01:41:12.232 You, you've made a great success of the Quis Festival and you say, okay, maybe 01:41:12.232 --> 01:41:14.362 it's not as much money as you would've wanted, but the fact that you even have 01:41:15.202 --> 01:41:18.802 made it into this 11th year and it's still running and it's carrying you, it, it's, 01:41:18.802 --> 01:41:20.422 it's, that's an extraordinary achievement. 01:41:20.512 --> 01:41:25.582 I mean, it's, we, we know that that's not anything to be sniffed at. 01:41:26.332 --> 01:41:29.902 but a lot of people out there do feel that they can't live 01:41:29.907 --> 01:41:32.092 free and ride free as you have. 01:41:32.092 --> 01:41:36.712 And of course, you are making a festival that shows people living 01:41:36.712 --> 01:41:38.452 free and riding free, literally. 01:41:39.592 --> 01:41:42.982 what do you think people can do to unlock. 01:41:43.417 --> 01:41:47.287 Themselves from that little nagging voice that says they can't, 01:41:49.657 --> 01:41:53.437 Lisa Diersen: well, don't you think saying I can't is just your fear? 01:41:54.247 --> 01:41:56.197 Rupert Isaacson: Well, sure, but I mean, fear is a real thing. 01:41:56.437 --> 01:41:58.057 So what is people's 01:41:58.057 --> 01:41:58.387 Lisa Diersen: Right? 01:41:58.387 --> 01:41:58.388 Rupert Isaacson: Right. 01:41:58.393 --> 01:41:59.137 It is a real thing. 01:41:59.257 --> 01:42:00.727 What what is what? 01:42:01.447 --> 01:42:06.817 How, how in, in, in, in your, do you feel people can create a practice 01:42:06.822 --> 01:42:08.767 where they can begin to just climb 01:42:08.767 --> 01:42:09.457 Lisa Diersen: out of that hole? 01:42:09.907 --> 01:42:15.427 You, you, you got, you've got to, I, I just went through this last year and I 01:42:15.427 --> 01:42:19.027 know you went through the same thing too when you went, and I, and I didn't get a 01:42:19.032 --> 01:42:26.977 chance to ask you before, but like when I, when I broke my leg last year, that 01:42:27.157 --> 01:42:34.417 first time, well, first of all, ha having to go almost a month before I could go 01:42:34.417 --> 01:42:38.527 back into even maybe a month and a half before I could even go back into a barn 01:42:38.527 --> 01:42:43.387 and see my horse was like the worst part of my life that I can remember. 01:42:44.077 --> 01:42:51.097 But, that the first time I sat back on my horse after I, I had got my boot off 01:42:51.097 --> 01:42:57.757 and I could put, I mean the, the cast boot and could put my, even, I, I had, 01:42:57.817 --> 01:42:59.587 I didn't even have a riding boot on yet. 01:42:59.587 --> 01:43:04.147 I was able to wear my barn clog to sit back on my horse. 01:43:04.557 --> 01:43:09.457 I, I don't wanna say it was terrifying, but it was, I was like, oh my God, 01:43:09.457 --> 01:43:11.137 am I really gonna do this again? 01:43:11.872 --> 01:43:17.152 Because the, going through the, the, the pain I had mine was a compound 01:43:17.152 --> 01:43:19.372 spiral fracture completely out my ankle. 01:43:19.822 --> 01:43:22.432 So it was a, it was pretty painful. 01:43:22.672 --> 01:43:26.302 So I, your mind is saying, don't I, you don't wanna go back through that again. 01:43:26.302 --> 01:43:30.262 But my, I, I was just saying I'm gonna do this. 01:43:30.262 --> 01:43:31.672 I'm just gonna do it. 01:43:31.702 --> 01:43:36.862 I need, I cannot go the rest of my life not riding my horse. 01:43:37.672 --> 01:43:38.602 I can't do that. 01:43:38.752 --> 01:43:40.312 It's too much of a part of me. 01:43:40.312 --> 01:43:42.052 And so I just did it. 01:43:42.592 --> 01:43:48.652 And even if the first time was just going and walking around the indoor arena and 01:43:48.652 --> 01:43:55.522 getting back off of that horse again, and this was my white stallion who I had just 01:43:55.522 --> 01:44:02.362 gelded maybe three, four months before, a couple months before I had my accident. 01:44:02.722 --> 01:44:06.712 So he was still feeling all testosterone. 01:44:06.712 --> 01:44:07.342 Still a lot of horse. 01:44:07.342 --> 01:44:07.582 Yeah. 01:44:08.632 --> 01:44:09.712 Still a lot of horse. 01:44:09.712 --> 01:44:13.282 And he, even though he's 22 now and he's still a lot of horse. 01:44:13.462 --> 01:44:13.522 Yeah. 01:44:13.882 --> 01:44:18.052 but I sat on him and I did it and I, and I accomplished that and we 01:44:18.052 --> 01:44:21.472 came out of Covid and I went, are we gonna do the festival again Live? 01:44:21.802 --> 01:44:24.112 But we went ahead and we just did it. 01:44:24.202 --> 01:44:30.472 And I had that last year when we, cuz we did it in Sacramento, California, 01:44:31.132 --> 01:44:33.142 because that's where we ended the ride. 01:44:33.242 --> 01:44:35.722 And, and I, and everybody was in California. 01:44:36.367 --> 01:44:41.627 I had a, an author come in from, oh my God, oh my gosh. 01:44:41.737 --> 01:44:45.487 fin not Finland, nor Norway, I think came in, no, Sweden. 01:44:45.517 --> 01:44:50.977 She came in from Sweden who came all the way there, lost her luggage 01:44:50.977 --> 01:44:52.477 at the thing, but she just did it. 01:44:52.477 --> 01:44:56.617 She just came to the festival cause she was so excited about 01:44:56.617 --> 01:44:57.817 coming and being part of it. 01:44:58.297 --> 01:45:03.277 If you ha if you just do it, just take that first step and just do it. 01:45:04.537 --> 01:45:06.877 It makes doing it easier every time. 01:45:06.907 --> 01:45:07.927 The next time you do 01:45:07.932 --> 01:45:10.087 Rupert Isaacson: something is, is what it comes down to. 01:45:10.092 --> 01:45:12.997 I mean, one could say feel the fear and do it anyway, but does it 01:45:12.997 --> 01:45:14.557 come down to basically small steps? 01:45:15.217 --> 01:45:20.167 The idea that steps and, and what can seem like a small step to one person 01:45:20.167 --> 01:45:22.717 feels like a giant step for somebody else. 01:45:22.717 --> 01:45:26.677 I I remember when I was younger having less patience. 01:45:27.497 --> 01:45:29.412 I was like, oh, you know, someone's just get over themselves. 01:45:29.417 --> 01:45:33.582 And, and then someone said, well, Ru for example, you're terrified of eggs. 01:45:34.122 --> 01:45:39.882 I know that it, you will rather leap out of a first floor window than first 01:45:39.882 --> 01:45:43.277 floor European sense, than a third floor window, than than eat an egg. 01:45:43.282 --> 01:45:45.137 That yes, someone pulls an egg on you. 01:45:45.137 --> 01:45:48.677 You know, you, you, you, you have, you have achilles heels 01:45:48.677 --> 01:45:49.757 that you don't think you have. 01:45:50.087 --> 01:45:54.587 well, if, if I said to just get over it and just eat that egg and 01:45:54.587 --> 01:45:56.807 you're sitting there overcome with nausea and suddenly you're like a. 01:45:57.257 --> 01:46:00.827 Little autistic child going, I, I actually really am afraid of this even though 01:46:00.827 --> 01:46:04.757 it's just an egg, you know, this is not sitting in a riot in South Africa. 01:46:04.757 --> 01:46:08.297 Or, you know, other things that have happened to me that I 01:46:08.297 --> 01:46:10.667 find I find the egg more scary. 01:46:10.727 --> 01:46:11.057 I do. 01:46:11.567 --> 01:46:14.412 And, someone pointed that out to me and said, what would it 01:46:14.417 --> 01:46:15.762 take for you to eat that egg? 01:46:16.392 --> 01:46:18.432 And I was like, you know, actually that's a really good question. 01:46:18.592 --> 01:46:19.972 because it's become like a phobia. 01:46:20.652 --> 01:46:23.712 and I suppose if I had to see what it'd probably take is, you know, extreme 01:46:23.717 --> 01:46:25.752 hunger, but let's say it wasn't that. 01:46:26.322 --> 01:46:29.862 It would be somehow making friends with the idea of egg, you know what I mean? 01:46:30.192 --> 01:46:33.852 And somehow, runny texture and the stink and all the things that 01:46:34.362 --> 01:46:37.712 nauseate me about them, what would I need to do to get over them? 01:46:37.712 --> 01:46:42.812 And I realized, ah, yes, to many people, that seems completely absurd. 01:46:43.752 --> 01:46:45.577 and they'd say, Rupert, just get over it. 01:46:45.582 --> 01:46:47.677 And to me that seems like this huge thing. 01:46:48.377 --> 01:46:53.267 even though one has faced things in one's life that are obviously much more real. 01:46:53.657 --> 01:46:55.147 And, so I thought, well, what would it take? 01:46:55.147 --> 01:46:59.857 And I thought, well, I suppose it would, it would take breaking what looks like 01:47:01.207 --> 01:47:09.517 one step for somebody else down into as many steps as it would take for each 01:47:09.517 --> 01:47:13.477 one of those steps to not feel like a big step, which could probably be 01:47:13.477 --> 01:47:17.887 a hundred or a thousand steps, which somebody else would roll their eyes at. 01:47:18.517 --> 01:47:22.597 But for me or someone with a phobia about spiders or somebody which can't 01:47:23.137 --> 01:47:25.717 get out of bed because of depression, you know, and I've been there, I 01:47:25.717 --> 01:47:26.707 know you've probably been there. 01:47:27.137 --> 01:47:31.847 it, it's that first half step, that quarter step, that eighth of a step, 01:47:31.847 --> 01:47:40.637 that 16th of a step, that what's the fraction that's doable now today 01:47:42.347 --> 01:47:45.947 And can that I, cause I, I, I, I, I think what happens is that we all 01:47:45.947 --> 01:47:50.177 judge ourselves by other people and we think, let's say we wanna write a 01:47:50.182 --> 01:47:51.407 book where you want to do a festival. 01:47:51.407 --> 01:47:53.267 We say, well, there's Lisa Dyson, she's done a festival, 01:47:53.567 --> 01:47:54.497 or this person never there. 01:47:54.497 --> 01:47:59.537 They've written a book and you've already projected yourself in your mind to the 01:47:59.537 --> 01:48:01.217 finished festival, the finished book. 01:48:01.577 --> 01:48:04.577 And then there's that moment of euphoria and then there's that. 01:48:04.577 --> 01:48:07.127 Ah, but I can't do that cuz I dunno how to do that. 01:48:07.127 --> 01:48:08.177 I don't understand the mechanisms. 01:48:08.417 --> 01:48:10.397 And then you would say, just do it. 01:48:10.457 --> 01:48:12.947 Or just take, but really then you said, just take the first step. 01:48:13.787 --> 01:48:14.027 You know? 01:48:14.027 --> 01:48:21.857 So is it about finding that first step or that first half step or 01:48:21.857 --> 01:48:23.357 that first fraction of a step? 01:48:23.807 --> 01:48:26.357 Is that really what it is, do you think? 01:48:27.917 --> 01:48:29.087 Lisa Diersen: yeah, I think yes. 01:48:29.477 --> 01:48:30.917 For me it would be eating bugs. 01:48:30.917 --> 01:48:31.217 But 01:48:32.447 --> 01:48:33.227 Rupert Isaacson: see, no problem with that. 01:48:33.227 --> 01:48:35.087 For me, it munch bugs all day. 01:48:35.087 --> 01:48:35.367 Yeah, totally. 01:48:35.707 --> 01:48:38.767 Oh, as long as they don't got, as they're not presented today, eat eggs all 01:48:41.207 --> 01:48:43.307 Lisa Diersen: Yeah, no, I, yeah, you just have to. 01:48:44.192 --> 01:48:48.692 It doesn't matter how big the step, it's just as long as the step is forward. 01:48:49.142 --> 01:48:51.002 Rupert Isaacson: Yeah, yeah, yeah. 01:48:51.002 --> 01:48:57.862 I, I, I forget which, is it lasu or is it Confucius or, it's one of those, it's ne 01:48:57.892 --> 01:49:02.872 never mock somebody who is engaged in an endeavor in which they're moving forward, 01:49:03.292 --> 01:49:08.842 no matter how incrementally or in, no matter how tiny a, a fashion, they are 01:49:08.842 --> 01:49:12.442 more courageous than you, your mockery. 01:49:12.992 --> 01:49:16.657 and they'll probably get there, and or they'll set into process, into motion 01:49:16.657 --> 01:49:20.857 a process where even after their death, that thing will probably be achieved. 01:49:21.577 --> 01:49:28.657 I guess would you say that, by showcasing these stories about people 01:49:28.662 --> 01:49:32.977 taking these journeys, cuz it's, it, it seems that the, the films that 01:49:32.977 --> 01:49:35.977 you've listed as the sort of masses, that they're all seem to be journeys, 01:49:35.977 --> 01:49:38.447 pilgrimages, really, to wellness. 01:49:39.347 --> 01:49:43.217 Would you say that really what you're doing is you're showing 01:49:43.637 --> 01:49:44.777 people taking those steps? 01:49:44.777 --> 01:49:45.977 There's a first step, isn't there? 01:49:46.697 --> 01:49:49.697 The first they mount the horse and they take a step, 01:49:51.347 --> 01:49:51.617 Lisa Diersen: right? 01:49:51.677 --> 01:49:52.007 Right. 01:49:52.007 --> 01:49:53.507 Yes, yes. 01:49:55.847 --> 01:49:58.667 Rupert Isaacson: The, the journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step. 01:49:59.507 --> 01:49:59.927 Mm-hmm. 01:50:02.087 --> 01:50:03.437 Single, single hoof print. 01:50:06.152 --> 01:50:09.692 I guess we can then follow the traces of the hoof prints of 01:50:10.052 --> 01:50:11.162 those who've gone before us. 01:50:12.662 --> 01:50:12.812 Right. 01:50:12.812 --> 01:50:13.502 And find our way. 01:50:13.772 --> 01:50:14.612 You, okay. 01:50:14.612 --> 01:50:19.202 So I just want to, to go back over some of these films that you've said 01:50:19.202 --> 01:50:25.392 that other masses, you, you, you mentioned, riding my way back mm-hmm. 01:50:26.322 --> 01:50:27.972 You mentioned healing horses. 01:50:28.962 --> 01:50:29.052 Mm-hmm. 01:50:29.682 --> 01:50:31.212 You mentioned the long rider. 01:50:32.232 --> 01:50:32.592 Yes. 01:50:33.012 --> 01:50:34.752 And you mentioned unbranded. 01:50:35.952 --> 01:50:38.982 Lisa Diersen: Unbranded is available pretty much so globally. 01:50:39.942 --> 01:50:45.792 I think I have Healing Horse up on the EQU Film Festival YouTube channel 01:50:45.792 --> 01:50:48.452 or on our, on the EQU Film channel. 01:50:50.252 --> 01:50:50.402 How 01:50:50.402 --> 01:50:52.332 Rupert Isaacson: do people access the EQU film channel? 01:50:52.472 --> 01:50:52.742 Lisa Diersen: Again? 01:50:53.702 --> 01:50:58.382 You can, there's a link right on the front of our, it's equ film 01:50:58.382 --> 01:51:01.052 festival.net, which is our website. 01:51:01.052 --> 01:51:03.992 There's a, a link right on the front page 01:51:04.322 --> 01:51:06.662 Rupert Isaacson: at Chris Film Festival net. 01:51:07.142 --> 01:51:07.412 Yeah. 01:51:07.502 --> 01:51:07.742 Yep. 01:51:08.402 --> 01:51:11.677 Lisa Diersen: And that takes you right to the, to the, film 01:51:11.677 --> 01:51:13.927 channel and people can subscribe. 01:51:14.527 --> 01:51:20.647 And then, the Felipe's film, the long writer is under, it's out for distribution 01:51:20.647 --> 01:51:25.517 right now, so I'm not sure if they've got their, distribution in place. 01:51:26.387 --> 01:51:31.217 So the only place that anybody can see that is when it we're doing one of our 01:51:31.217 --> 01:51:34.697 tour stops with e with the film festival. 01:51:34.702 --> 01:51:38.127 So we, I think we will be screening that in, dur or 01:51:38.127 --> 01:51:40.707 Westcliffe Colorado in September. 01:51:41.247 --> 01:51:45.387 But the other film that we were talking about too was Lady Long 01:51:45.387 --> 01:51:51.177 Rider, which is the story about Bernice Endy Lady Long Rider. 01:51:51.387 --> 01:51:51.777 Right? 01:51:51.777 --> 01:51:52.047 Yeah. 01:51:52.317 --> 01:51:57.657 And, and that film, that filmmaker has available. 01:51:58.317 --> 01:52:02.007 I think if you just type in Lady Long Rider Bernice Endy, it'll pop 01:52:02.007 --> 01:52:04.677 up where to, to go to see that. 01:52:05.157 --> 01:52:09.807 Cuz that's available pay-per-view on her, on the, the filmmaker's own channel. 01:52:10.377 --> 01:52:10.407 Okay. 01:52:10.412 --> 01:52:12.567 And that's a, it's a beautiful documentary. 01:52:12.567 --> 01:52:14.337 It's, it's very well done. 01:52:14.342 --> 01:52:20.797 It's, at that time when she filmed that Bernice was down riding two halfling 01:52:20.887 --> 01:52:26.797 horses across the, around the country, up and down the, the continent, so to speak. 01:52:28.237 --> 01:52:33.027 And so we had, we had a documentary, A Man, a Mule America, 01:52:33.667 --> 01:52:35.267 Rupert Isaacson: A Man Which, A mule? 01:52:35.467 --> 01:52:37.187 A Mule, A America. 01:52:38.587 --> 01:52:39.397 Lisa Diersen: And how do people see that? 01:52:40.717 --> 01:52:41.137 Pardon me? 01:52:41.197 --> 01:52:45.037 I'm just, I'm trying to remember the name of these are, this film was 01:52:45.037 --> 01:52:47.167 probably eight, seven or eight years ago. 01:52:47.827 --> 01:52:54.067 But he wrote, he followed, because at one point before the continent of the 01:52:54.067 --> 01:52:55.987 United States was actually a continent. 01:52:55.987 --> 01:52:58.837 It was a lost C, there was a lost C in the middle. 01:52:58.837 --> 01:53:01.987 And Bernie Hubbert is the, is the filmmaker's name. 01:53:02.857 --> 01:53:09.097 And Bernie had a mule in a, in a little wa with a little wagon. 01:53:09.097 --> 01:53:12.247 Like the wagon was only big enough that he could sleep in. 01:53:12.937 --> 01:53:19.687 And he followed that whole trail all the way down from Canada to Mexico 01:53:20.617 --> 01:53:26.227 to the Mexico border with his, he a man and a mule across America. 01:53:26.257 --> 01:53:27.407 Just the stories 01:53:27.427 --> 01:53:28.767 Rupert Isaacson: and exploring the Lost Ocean. 01:53:28.947 --> 01:53:30.207 The lost prehistoric ocean. 01:53:30.212 --> 01:53:30.277 Mm-hmm. 01:53:30.907 --> 01:53:31.237 Yes. 01:53:31.687 --> 01:53:34.747 People Did you just look it, people find that on what, what can, can people 01:53:34.747 --> 01:53:36.457 find that on, Chris film festival 01:53:36.667 --> 01:53:36.877 Lisa Diersen: net? 01:53:36.877 --> 01:53:41.197 I I, no, he hasn't, he hasn't got that back out yet. 01:53:41.227 --> 01:53:45.067 It's getting re-released this year into the film festival. 01:53:45.067 --> 01:53:47.287 It was on PBS a few times. 01:53:47.737 --> 01:53:47.797 Okay. 01:53:47.827 --> 01:53:52.717 But it, he's, he's updating it and it'll be in this year's film festival again. 01:53:53.047 --> 01:53:53.527 Fantastic. 01:53:53.527 --> 01:53:56.407 Rupert Isaacson: Now, you, you said that the film festival is happening 01:53:56.407 --> 01:53:58.027 live in Westcliffe, Colorado. 01:53:58.777 --> 01:53:58.987 Well, 01:53:58.987 --> 01:54:02.107 Lisa Diersen: we have one that'll be in Westcliffe, Colorado. 01:54:02.107 --> 01:54:05.922 That it will be a big Mustang summit, along That's the Mustang Summit. 01:54:06.302 --> 01:54:06.632 Okay. 01:54:06.932 --> 01:54:07.232 Yeah. 01:54:07.502 --> 01:54:09.932 And, and we will be screening films there. 01:54:10.292 --> 01:54:11.702 So that's When is that? 01:54:12.122 --> 01:54:12.332 Yeah. 01:54:12.782 --> 01:54:18.992 September 29th and 30th, and then October 1st, and then our main 01:54:18.992 --> 01:54:21.902 festival is in Sacramento, California. 01:54:21.962 --> 01:54:24.752 November 17th, 18th, and 19th. 01:54:25.112 --> 01:54:25.592 Rupert Isaacson: Okay. 01:54:26.162 --> 01:54:29.882 Um, where is Westcliffe Colorado? 01:54:30.072 --> 01:54:36.062 Lisa Diersen: Westcliffe is on the south east side of the Rocky Mountains. 01:54:36.602 --> 01:54:41.112 So it's, south, directly south, about two and a half 01:54:41.112 --> 01:54:43.632 hour drive from Denver, so maybe 01:54:43.632 --> 01:54:44.232 Rupert Isaacson: three hours. 01:54:44.472 --> 01:54:46.482 Denver, around Pueblo area, would you 01:54:46.482 --> 01:54:46.722 Lisa Diersen: say? 01:54:46.752 --> 01:54:48.762 Pueblo, Colorado Springs area. 01:54:48.882 --> 01:54:49.692 Rupert Isaacson: Okay. 01:54:49.692 --> 01:54:49.693 Okay. 01:54:50.182 --> 01:54:51.132 that's the Mustang Summit. 01:54:51.132 --> 01:54:51.972 Summit south of Colorado. 01:54:52.802 --> 01:54:54.982 So Mustang Summit the 27th. 01:54:55.042 --> 01:54:56.662 Be 27th. 01:54:56.662 --> 01:54:59.062 September to October 1st, basically. 01:54:59.152 --> 01:54:59.362 Yep. 01:54:59.842 --> 01:55:01.162 In Westcliffe, Colorado. 01:55:01.162 --> 01:55:05.472 And then the, film festival itself and the General Arts Festival 01:55:05.472 --> 01:55:07.782 will be in Sacramento, November. 01:55:07.782 --> 01:55:08.022 Again. 01:55:08.022 --> 01:55:08.862 Give us the dates. 01:55:09.642 --> 01:55:10.902 Lisa Diersen: 17th, 18th, 01:55:10.902 --> 01:55:11.562 Rupert Isaacson: and 19th. 01:55:11.712 --> 01:55:13.602 17th, 18th and 19th. 01:55:13.902 --> 01:55:17.592 And they can get all this information on equ film festival.net. 01:55:18.432 --> 01:55:18.792 Yes. 01:55:18.882 --> 01:55:19.692 On the website. 01:55:20.322 --> 01:55:20.802 Okay. 01:55:20.932 --> 01:55:28.732 if somebody has a, a equine arts project, how do they submit to your festival? 01:55:29.782 --> 01:55:31.462 Lisa Diersen: They can reach out to. 01:55:31.852 --> 01:55:38.142 To me, via email, or they can go to the website or reach out on our Facebook page. 01:55:38.502 --> 01:55:42.102 But our website has applications for the artist. 01:55:42.102 --> 01:55:43.932 It has applications for filmmakers. 01:55:43.932 --> 01:55:49.062 It has applications for the podcasters and for the authors. 01:55:49.632 --> 01:55:49.842 Perfect. 01:55:49.872 --> 01:55:53.382 So all of those applications are available right on the front page of the 01:55:53.382 --> 01:55:53.922 Rupert Isaacson: website. 01:55:54.192 --> 01:55:56.622 What is the email address that people want to get through to 01:55:56.622 --> 01:55:56.742 Lisa Diersen: you? 01:55:57.192 --> 01:56:01.872 It's Lisa Equ film Festival net. 01:56:02.532 --> 01:56:03.642 Rupert Isaacson: L i s a. 01:56:03.732 --> 01:56:04.152 Lisa? 01:56:05.202 --> 01:56:05.422 Yes. 01:56:07.892 --> 01:56:09.432 Lisa Diersen: EQ uu. 01:56:10.332 --> 01:56:11.952 S F I. 01:56:12.302 --> 01:56:13.952 LM festival. 01:56:14.512 --> 01:56:16.902 S festival T ia l net 01:56:17.652 --> 01:56:17.892 Rupert Isaacson: net. 01:56:18.882 --> 01:56:21.072 Lisa equ festival net. 01:56:21.077 --> 01:56:24.482 Well, hopefully, some of the listeners will be submitting some of their stuff. 01:56:24.482 --> 01:56:27.192 You guys should, , remember, take that step. 01:56:27.192 --> 01:56:31.072 If you've got a, if you've got a project, Lisa's one of the 01:56:31.072 --> 01:56:32.122 nicest people in the world. 01:56:32.422 --> 01:56:34.192 She's not gonna write your letter back saying You suck. 01:56:34.492 --> 01:56:38.482 so, and if it doesn't make it in into the festival, she'll have 01:56:38.487 --> 01:56:40.912 advice for you about what to do. 01:56:41.342 --> 01:56:42.082 So, and 01:56:42.262 --> 01:56:48.112 Lisa Diersen: if I look behind me, there's at least 300 books in the festival 01:56:48.862 --> 01:56:51.322 that I have on shelves just behind me. 01:56:52.342 --> 01:56:55.402 So that have been entered over the past couple of years. 01:56:56.992 --> 01:57:01.452 Rupert Isaacson: And, E even if something doesn't make it in, , what are 01:57:01.452 --> 01:57:03.072 your words of encouragement to people? 01:57:03.072 --> 01:57:06.162 Because, you know, th this happened to me, you know, when I was submitting 01:57:06.162 --> 01:57:10.452 stuff, submitting books, submitting films, it wasn't always successful. 01:57:10.452 --> 01:57:11.532 People didn't always take it. 01:57:11.952 --> 01:57:17.052 but it didn't me, I didn't take that as meaning that I should stop submitting. 01:57:17.992 --> 01:57:18.372 Right, right. 01:57:18.762 --> 01:57:22.182 What's, what's your word of advice for people who are going through 01:57:22.182 --> 01:57:25.602 that process where they're sort of laying their baby, their work on the 01:57:25.602 --> 01:57:28.032 line for acceptance or rejection? 01:57:28.992 --> 01:57:31.092 Lisa Diersen: Well, I do that every single time. 01:57:31.092 --> 01:57:33.732 I put a start, have another festival. 01:57:33.732 --> 01:57:37.632 I'm putting it out there for people to either like it or dislike it. 01:57:37.662 --> 01:57:43.032 But the, , what I can tell people is, first of all, if you've written 01:57:43.032 --> 01:57:48.642 something or made a piece of artwork or created a film about something 01:57:48.642 --> 01:57:54.342 that you're passionate about, somebody out there is going to acknowledge it. 01:57:54.612 --> 01:57:58.902 And it maybe you're just sending it to somebody who doesn't understand 01:57:58.902 --> 01:57:59.922 what you're trying to tell 'em. 01:57:59.927 --> 01:58:01.572 And that mean doesn't mean anything. 01:58:01.577 --> 01:58:05.892 That means that just simply the person you sent it to wasn't the right person 01:58:05.897 --> 01:58:08.022 to just keep trying, keep sending it. 01:58:08.982 --> 01:58:12.672 I mean, you know what it's like to keep sending in a manuscript 01:58:13.452 --> 01:58:15.132 and, and being told no. 01:58:15.132 --> 01:58:15.192 Yeah. 01:58:15.582 --> 01:58:18.102 So you just keep trying keep and keep at it 01:58:18.672 --> 01:58:22.362 Rupert Isaacson: most, by the way, most good books, most good films, so. 01:58:23.112 --> 01:58:23.952 Were turned down Yes. 01:58:24.402 --> 01:58:26.442 By quite a few people before they found their homes. 01:58:27.012 --> 01:58:31.002 and it's easy to forget that, you know, music too, you know, bands that seem to 01:58:31.002 --> 01:58:33.882 come out of nowhere, you know, and then they get interviewed and like, actually 01:58:33.882 --> 01:58:35.712 no, we were gigging for about 20 years. 01:58:35.712 --> 01:58:37.652 It's just that we started in middle school. 01:58:37.712 --> 01:58:38.442 Yes, exactly. 01:58:39.822 --> 01:58:41.142 Before we had any kind of break. 01:58:41.532 --> 01:58:42.402 I, I agree with you. 01:58:42.402 --> 01:58:44.982 It's, it's to keep putting one foot in front of the other thing. 01:58:45.222 --> 01:58:46.002 don't give up. 01:58:46.362 --> 01:58:49.032 whether your dream is to have the festival or whether your dream is to 01:58:49.037 --> 01:58:54.402 put together pieces of art that get shown in festivals or both, the art 01:58:54.402 --> 01:58:55.812 of story and the, and, and the world. 01:58:55.812 --> 01:58:56.532 It's interesting. 01:58:56.862 --> 01:58:59.442 I feel that the world never runs out of the need for story. 01:58:59.922 --> 01:59:00.462 Lisa Diersen: Oh my gosh. 01:59:00.462 --> 01:59:02.772 No, there's always another story. 01:59:03.192 --> 01:59:09.042 There's al someone, every single living human being has a story. 01:59:10.932 --> 01:59:12.672 Everybody has their story. 01:59:12.702 --> 01:59:14.022 Everyone has a story. 01:59:16.962 --> 01:59:17.082 Yeah. 01:59:17.082 --> 01:59:17.862 Everybody does. 01:59:19.452 --> 01:59:27.942 It's, it's, and, and I think you become an adult when you realize that everybody 01:59:27.942 --> 01:59:32.712 has a story and you need to give everybody kind of time to tell their story. 01:59:34.032 --> 01:59:36.822 You know, when it j when you figure out, oh wow. 01:59:36.822 --> 01:59:40.722 It's not just about I'm not special, I'm just one more story. 01:59:41.142 --> 01:59:41.432 Yeah. 01:59:42.132 --> 01:59:42.192 Rupert Isaacson: Yeah. 01:59:42.882 --> 01:59:44.772 And yet each story is completely unique. 01:59:44.772 --> 01:59:44.832 Yeah. 01:59:46.482 --> 01:59:49.442 It's, and your story is healing, if it's given the chance to be. 01:59:49.652 --> 01:59:50.132 I agree. 01:59:50.242 --> 01:59:56.152 . well, Lisa, thank you for coming on and turning us on to the Healing Power Story. 01:59:56.152 --> 02:00:02.022 Thank you for letting the listeners know, that Equus Film Festival exists. 02:00:02.562 --> 02:00:06.522 I would thank you, encourage you, if you're listening and you're not into 02:00:06.522 --> 02:00:12.912 horses, check it out anyway, because you don't need to be horsey to appreciate 02:00:12.912 --> 02:00:18.942 a good story, and you don't need to be horsey to appreciate a story about, 02:00:19.242 --> 02:00:21.072 what was it that you said sentient? 02:00:21.132 --> 02:00:24.762 That sentient beings, the human relationship with sentient beings 02:00:25.152 --> 02:00:26.472 is important for human health. 02:00:27.462 --> 02:00:28.842 maybe there'll be something to be learned. 02:00:29.482 --> 02:00:32.152 I hope to catch up with you at one of the festivals. 02:00:32.152 --> 02:00:35.112 It's been a long time since I was there, and it's sort of given me a 02:00:35.112 --> 02:00:40.452 bit of a kick in the pants to, to, to to, to get to it again, actually. 02:00:40.452 --> 02:00:41.892 So I, I, I would love to. 02:00:41.922 --> 02:00:44.112 So maybe we'll see some of the listeners there. 02:00:44.562 --> 02:00:49.082 any, any parting words before we, before we close Lisa? 02:00:49.682 --> 02:00:53.372 Lisa Diersen: Oh, anybody who wants to, to do it and has a dream to 02:00:53.372 --> 02:00:55.622 do it, get out there and do it. 02:00:57.242 --> 02:00:57.482 Okay. 02:00:57.692 --> 02:01:00.692 Everybody want, the world is waiting for your story. 02:01:01.502 --> 02:01:02.372 Rupert Isaacson: It's very true. 02:01:02.702 --> 02:01:03.602 And it doesn't matter. 02:01:03.602 --> 02:01:05.762 I, I, you know, people say, well, who'd be interested in my story? 02:01:06.092 --> 02:01:07.382 It doesn't matter if it's only one person. 02:01:07.382 --> 02:01:11.882 I remember right when I was first, trying to raise money for the human 02:01:11.882 --> 02:01:19.172 rights work that I used to do, and it started with an event I put together 02:01:19.982 --> 02:01:21.242 to which five people showed up. 02:01:22.682 --> 02:01:25.772 Lisa Diersen: Yeah, but you changed those five people saw it Uber. 02:01:26.132 --> 02:01:26.432 Well, 02:01:26.432 --> 02:01:28.262 Rupert Isaacson: what happened was one of those five people 02:01:28.262 --> 02:01:30.472 went and spoke to someone, right? 02:01:30.477 --> 02:01:33.992 And I, I got a phone call three months later from someone saying, you don't 02:01:33.992 --> 02:01:37.952 know who I am, but I've been researching this thing that you're talking about. 02:01:37.982 --> 02:01:42.392 And yes, I see this is a good cause and I'm gonna back it. 02:01:42.452 --> 02:01:46.022 And so never think that it's wasted time. 02:01:46.022 --> 02:01:48.062 Never think that any audience is too small. 02:01:48.482 --> 02:01:49.322 I agree with you. 02:01:49.372 --> 02:01:50.602 Lisa, get out there and do it. 02:01:50.812 --> 02:01:52.252 Get out there and tell the story. 02:01:52.282 --> 02:01:53.062 Tell the story. 02:01:53.962 --> 02:01:55.852 Lisa Diersen: Look at what happened because of your story. 02:01:58.012 --> 02:02:02.032 You know, that, I mean, this is why, this is why this festival exists. 02:02:02.662 --> 02:02:02.842 Why? 02:02:02.847 --> 02:02:05.422 You're, because I was motivated by your story. 02:02:05.962 --> 02:02:06.872 Rupert Isaacson: Well, you're very kind. 02:02:06.952 --> 02:02:10.462 it seems to me though, that really what happened was perhaps 02:02:10.462 --> 02:02:13.072 my story was a catalyst for yes. 02:02:13.522 --> 02:02:17.692 That that little girl who had had discovered the healing power of 02:02:17.692 --> 02:02:22.832 story decades before where she needed that healing, in that house 02:02:23.912 --> 02:02:25.622 with, that had had that tragedy. 02:02:26.432 --> 02:02:30.182 And so I'm honored if my story was a catalyst in that. 02:02:30.212 --> 02:02:36.932 But I do know from what you said that you'd have done it anyway. 02:02:37.947 --> 02:02:40.352 And that's, and that's a wonderful thing. 02:02:40.412 --> 02:02:44.882 So I'm honored to be the catalyst in what would've in an avalanche 02:02:46.052 --> 02:02:47.732 that would've happened regardless. 02:02:48.072 --> 02:02:51.342 cuz you're, you're, you're, you're, you're a pa a force of nature, Lisa. 02:02:52.122 --> 02:02:55.542 And by the way, if you're interested in the lucit tarno horse and you 02:02:55.542 --> 02:02:58.542 jolly well should be cuz they're the best riding horse on the planet. 02:02:58.542 --> 02:03:02.382 I'm sorry, but they're, you should check out Lisa Di as a, as a breeder. 02:03:02.472 --> 02:03:04.712 She, the horses she's producing are, are wonderful. 02:03:05.142 --> 02:03:09.582 but I'll, I'll let you find that through Google, Lisa Dis 02:03:10.542 --> 02:03:15.162 Lisa Diersen: and, and any of those people out there that wanna find that, that don't 02:03:15.162 --> 02:03:21.282 have pockets full of money and want an amazing horse, the American Mustang horse 02:03:21.282 --> 02:03:23.172 because of the Siberian, that's very true. 02:03:23.262 --> 02:03:28.422 Ties or the lusitano horse to the Mustang horse's, Iberian ties because 02:03:28.422 --> 02:03:34.122 now we found through all the d n a research that every horse on the planet, 02:03:35.242 --> 02:03:37.732 originated on the North American plateau. 02:03:37.737 --> 02:03:43.282 So actually our ano horse are descendants of the original Mustang horses. 02:03:43.732 --> 02:03:45.922 And when those horses went. 02:03:46.777 --> 02:03:49.837 Over the bearing straits and came back around and went to 02:03:49.837 --> 02:03:55.597 the Andalusian and, and Iberian Peninsula and became Spanish horses. 02:03:56.017 --> 02:04:00.517 They were reintroduced when the Spaniards came to Mexico and 02:04:00.517 --> 02:04:01.857 Con tried to conquer Mexico. 02:04:02.947 --> 02:04:08.587 That's how the American Mustang horse got or reintroduced with the Spanish blood. 02:04:09.367 --> 02:04:13.747 And that's why they thrive on the North American Plateau cause they're back home. 02:04:14.617 --> 02:04:17.587 I mean, there's an amazing documentary called Return of the 02:04:17.587 --> 02:04:19.957 Horse, and I'll send you the name. 02:04:19.962 --> 02:04:25.717 Sharon Ila Sha was that filmmaker and that is on the EQU Film Channel. 02:04:26.017 --> 02:04:27.497 It's probably one of the return of the horse. 02:04:28.567 --> 02:04:29.467 Return of the horse. 02:04:29.687 --> 02:04:30.107 Mm-hmm. 02:04:30.297 --> 02:04:33.157 Everybody that's a horse person should watch that. 02:04:33.162 --> 02:04:34.507 It's very, very, very good. 02:04:34.507 --> 02:04:39.037 It was financed by the Spanish Horse Foundation and, or the 02:04:39.037 --> 02:04:40.687 Spanish Mustang Foundation. 02:04:40.777 --> 02:04:47.587 And it's, it's a beautifully well-made documentary about the origin through 02:04:47.587 --> 02:04:51.447 d n a research of Quis Cabales. 02:04:52.627 --> 02:04:54.187 Rupert Isaacson: I'm just Googling it now. 02:04:54.217 --> 02:04:55.337 Return of the Horse 02:04:56.437 --> 02:05:03.517 Lisa Diersen: and Sharon, I think it's s h a r r o n or l Shar was the filmmaker. 02:05:03.817 --> 02:05:04.147 Rupert Isaacson: Oh, okay. 02:05:04.147 --> 02:05:06.427 So I'm on idb.com. 02:05:07.057 --> 02:05:09.787 return of the Horse is a highly researched, scientific and 02:05:09.792 --> 02:05:12.667 historical documentary about. 02:05:13.777 --> 02:05:16.927 The North American native horse spanning over 57 million years. 02:05:17.407 --> 02:05:20.077 This documentary explores the science and history of the modern horse, its 02:05:20.077 --> 02:05:25.567 evolution in prehistoric America, and then return in the historical period with the 02:05:25.657 --> 02:05:30.187 Spaniards in the 15th century, the impact on Native Americans, and finally, the Euro 02:05:30.192 --> 02:05:34.927 American relationship with the wild horse from establishment in America till today. 02:05:35.137 --> 02:05:36.457 That sounds like a must watch. 02:05:37.597 --> 02:05:39.907 Lisa Diersen: It is, and you can watch it on the EQU Film Channel. 02:05:40.897 --> 02:05:41.257 Rupert Isaacson: Okay. 02:05:41.467 --> 02:05:42.187 I will be there. 02:05:42.787 --> 02:05:44.467 also what you say about Mustangs is true. 02:05:44.497 --> 02:05:49.087 my son, Rowan, I still maintain a horse for him, and that horse is a Mustang. 02:05:49.627 --> 02:05:53.287 Lisa Diersen: oh, Rupert, we, you and I need to talk further about that Okay. 02:05:53.557 --> 02:05:54.127 Rupert Isaacson: After this. 02:05:54.132 --> 02:05:54.387 Okay. 02:05:54.397 --> 02:05:54.577 Okay. 02:05:54.577 --> 02:05:58.867 Yeah, no, I'm, I'm, I'm absolutely sold on the Mustang as a, as a therapeutic, as 02:05:58.867 --> 02:06:02.637 well as a riding horse, because there's a, there's a level of intelligence in 02:06:02.637 --> 02:06:06.157 there that is, it's not that all horses aren't, but Yes, you and I both know that 02:06:06.157 --> 02:06:07.447 there's, there's something extra there. 02:06:07.687 --> 02:06:07.867 yep. 02:06:07.957 --> 02:06:09.577 And them solving abilities and so on. 02:06:10.597 --> 02:06:10.837 Okay. 02:06:10.837 --> 02:06:13.177 Well, Lisa, it's been, it's been a treat. 02:06:13.417 --> 02:06:13.987 Thank you. 02:06:14.747 --> 02:06:15.197 , it's, it's okay. 02:06:15.197 --> 02:06:15.917 Thank you. 02:06:16.397 --> 02:06:17.627 It's been an inspiration. 02:06:17.627 --> 02:06:21.377 Those of you who don't know now that Equi who didn't know that EQU 02:06:21.377 --> 02:06:22.787 Film Festival exists, now you do. 02:06:23.807 --> 02:06:25.937 So get online or go to it. 02:06:26.897 --> 02:06:28.367 thank you for creating it, Lisa. 02:06:29.537 --> 02:06:32.267 Lisa Diersen: Thank you for being part of it and having me on your show, 02:06:32.267 --> 02:06:32.717 Rupert Isaacson: Rupert. 02:06:33.107 --> 02:06:34.517 Oh, well, I hope you'll come on again. 02:06:35.177 --> 02:06:36.267 And, I will, whenever 02:06:36.267 --> 02:06:36.807 Lisa Diersen: you need me. 02:06:37.137 --> 02:06:38.247 Rupert Isaacson: I'm, well, maybe what we could do, maybe what we 02:06:38.247 --> 02:06:41.127 should do is we should do a podcast from, that's what we should do. 02:06:41.127 --> 02:06:43.857 We should do a podcast That would be fun from from the film 02:06:43.857 --> 02:06:44.247 Lisa Diersen: festival. 02:06:44.252 --> 02:06:44.337 Yes. 02:06:44.337 --> 02:06:46.437 And then we can interview and then you could meet a whole bunch 02:06:46.437 --> 02:06:49.347 of interesting people who would be there in podcasts with them. 02:06:49.707 --> 02:06:49.977 That 02:06:50.007 --> 02:06:51.027 Rupert Isaacson: would be a very good thing. 02:06:51.027 --> 02:06:52.227 We could interview them right there. 02:06:52.377 --> 02:06:52.677 Okay. 02:06:52.737 --> 02:06:53.037 Yes. 02:06:53.037 --> 02:06:53.937 Let's talk about that right there. 02:06:54.117 --> 02:06:55.137 Something to look forward to. 02:06:56.157 --> 02:06:56.367 Yep. 02:06:56.877 --> 02:06:57.057 Alright. 02:06:57.057 --> 02:06:57.597 Lot fun. 02:06:57.837 --> 02:06:58.227 We'll talk. 02:06:58.287 --> 02:06:58.647 Lisa Diersen: Okay. 02:06:59.187 --> 02:07:00.507 Nice seeing you again. 02:07:03.966 --> 02:07:05.076 Rupert Isaacson: Thank you for joining us. 02:07:05.106 --> 02:07:06.936 We hope you enjoyed today's podcast. 02:07:07.175 --> 02:07:12.215 Join our website, new trails learning.com, to check out our online 02:07:12.215 --> 02:07:17.405 courses and live workshops in Horse Boy Method, movement Method, and Athena. 02:07:18.112 --> 02:07:22.760 These evidence-based programs have helped children, veterans, and people 02:07:22.760 --> 02:07:24.770 dealing with trauma around the world. 02:07:25.098 --> 02:07:28.848 We also offer a horse training program and self-care program 02:07:28.848 --> 02:07:32.088 for riders on long ride home.com. 02:07:32.386 --> 02:07:36.436 These include easy to do online courses and tutorials that 02:07:36.436 --> 02:07:38.356 bring you and your horse joy. 02:07:38.893 --> 02:07:43.453 For an overview of all shows and programs, go to rupert isaacson.com. 02:07:43.783 --> 02:07:44.713 See you on the next show. 02:07:45.125 --> 02:07:47.815 And please remember to press, subscribe and share.