WEBVTT

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You are listening to the USDN on the

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DFPN.

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Thanks for watching!

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What is up everybody and welcome to the

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United States Department of Nerds where we

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are for the people, by the people,

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and of the people.

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And... Ooh, I scrolled down way too far.

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Hang on.

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Where am I at?

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I'm found.

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So he was rejected over two hundred times

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by the mainstream comic industry.

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So he built his on no crowdfunding,

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no shortcuts, no A.I.

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Seventeen volumes currently in print and

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for sale.

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Nearly thirteen thousand physical copies

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sold a TV deal in motion.

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And now a toy line headed to Wal-Mart

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shelves.

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This isn't a comeback story.

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This is what happens when you never stop

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building.

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The Council of Nerds is now in session.

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Zim,

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welcome to the United States Department of

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Nerds, my friend.

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Thank you so much for having me.

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I'm really happy to be here.

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so this has been i think you hit

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me up why early february or late january

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i think so this has kind of been

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sitting on the docket for a while now

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and it's when i've been really really

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excited to dig into because my guy you

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have such a rich history of doing

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everything your own way so how did you

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get started in this business of comic

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books

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So I always enjoyed fantasy and fairy tale

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stories and things that took you on

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adventures beyond the scope of reality.

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And I had been drawing for as long

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as I could remember, even as a kid,

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just making doodles and coming up with

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stories for things.

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And then I...

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created one character that stuck with me.

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And then I figured, well,

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I'll keep building on that.

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And I kept building and weeks turned into

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months and months turned into years.

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And then the first copy

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I sold in front of a seven eleven

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in nineteen ninety six and it was all

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placed to sell something in front of a

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seven eleven.

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Yeah, I mean,

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it just kind of it was just kind

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of happened that way.

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And and and back then, I mean,

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you know, printing is so different today.

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There are so many options that are

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available to creators, to anyone, really.

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But back then it was

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It was difficult.

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It was expensive.

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Technology was not caught up to where we

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are now in the present.

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And so it was a lot of like

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kind of finagling to try to get it

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done.

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And I just had to take paper and

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print it in sets of four on large

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laid out pieces.

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uh, eleven by seventeen paper,

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and then I had to fold it,

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I had to staple it,

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I had to trim it myself,

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and they were trimmed so bad, it was,

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and I still have two of the original

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copies from back then, and, and so then,

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I, it was just like, okay, um,

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I just wanted to tell my story,

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I just wanted to put it out there,

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and, and hope, well,

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maybe somebody would enjoy it,

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someone would like it, and,

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and I didn't know what was gonna happen,

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and then, you know, here we are,

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thirty-two years later, and, um,

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You know,

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things have kind of taken the shape where

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they're at now.

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So it's very well known that you were

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rejected multiple times.

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I'm talking like two hundred rejections.

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What did those rejections actually teach

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you about the business of comics?

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Um, well, it taught me,

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it taught me a couple things, uh,

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definitely in endurance.

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Uh, and I mean, you know, if,

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if you really want something,

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the hits are going to come.

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Then no matter what it is,

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they are going to come and the failure

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will come with it.

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And so you have to be able to

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navigate that the right way so it doesn't

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break your spirit.

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And it was it was hard.

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Like in the very beginning,

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I remember the first like maybe ten

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rejections I got.

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it was soul crushing.

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And I was just like,

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I don't understand why can't I get this

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chance?

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And then I realized as time went on

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and I kept submitting and I kept getting

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rejected,

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the industry has a very specific window

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that they operate through this view of how

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they see things.

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And, um,

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Some could see it as narrow-minded.

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Others could see it as gatekeeping.

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Some might say it's a mixture of all

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of those types of things.

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And so I knew from that that the

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only way to succeed is...

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You can't wait for someone to give you

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a door.

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You have to just make your own door.

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And you can't just rely on a hope

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that someone... Now, yes,

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sometimes people do get a chance.

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They're in the right place where they know

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the right people.

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And it opens up things for them.

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But that wasn't my experience.

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And so...

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I took away from it that really to

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do this and to endure,

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you have to love what you do.

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You have to be passionate about it.

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It can't be about...

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I want people to think I'm famous or

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I want to do this or do that.

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You got to just love the craft as

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it is and you just stick with it.

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And when the bumps come,

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because they will,

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you just roll with them and then you

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just keep going.

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So that's what I took away from it.

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And then I just made my own path

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to just do my own thing.

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That's inspirational as hell right there.

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Jeez.

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And, dude, you've done it eloquently.

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You're not complaining about it.

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You're not doing anything like that.

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You just picked it up, said okay,

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and just pressed forward.

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That's something that everybody should be

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able to look at you and go,

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I'm going to do it that way.

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And it's tough.

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I mean, it's, you know,

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I speak with a lot of creators who

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are new to comics who've maybe been in

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it a couple years.

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And, you know, and I always,

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I always like to use the illustration of

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the Cell Saga comic.

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as a perspective to get balance on things,

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in the sense,

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when they went into the hyperbolic time

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chamber, Vegeta and Trunks,

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and Trunks talked about how he watched his

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father train,

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but Vegeta wouldn't let him train with

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him.

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And so...

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He realized what Vegeta had done,

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but Trunks thought, well,

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I'm going to do that,

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and I'm going to train,

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and I'm going to get my power up.

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So battle comes.

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We know what happens.

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You know,

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Vegeta's ego kind of gets the better of

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him.

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trunks did surpass his father in a power

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level but the problem was he didn't have

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the experience to know how to balance that

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out the right way and what happened his

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power went all the way up and then

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it burned out very quickly and and so

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i use that analogy to say that's how

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you you have to do things methodically

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like vegeta you have to say okay

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We can do this,

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but if we do it turn and burn,

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it will fail.

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But if you take your time and you

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do it the right way,

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then you'll start to develop that ability

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to balance what you need to keep the

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long run in mind and not,

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I instantly want success because anything

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instant, it does not endure.

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Anything that takes a long time to

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cultivate,

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it stays and it becomes something that is

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kind of unshakable in a certain way.

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So that's really how you have to approach

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it.

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Speaking of unshakable,

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thirteen thousand physical copies,

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zero crowdfunding,

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rare in today's ecosystem of indie comics.

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How did you build a direct audience like

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that?

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Um, so I think the

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The thing is that whenever you're

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presenting what you do to somebody,

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you have to really know your story.

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It has to be as lifelike to you

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as reality is.

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You need to be able to just say,

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hey, well, this is that,

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and these are these things,

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and I can tell you about this place

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and its history.

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So you for yourself have to know it,

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and you have to make it believable.

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When it comes to selling,

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So many, I know,

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I get the use of why digital is

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convenient.

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I understand it.

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It's free.

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You don't have to worry about shipping

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costs and printing costs and all things

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that go into that.

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However,

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if you give away all the secrets for

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free,

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unless someone is really an ardent

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supporter,

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why would they come back and then buy

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it to rediscover the secrets they've

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already seen?

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And so for me,

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I find what you have to do is

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you have to find a way to present

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your series to someone

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and get them emotionally invested,

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get them hooked.

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You give them just enough to pique their

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curiosity.

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And then once that happens,

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then you can show them the rest of

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the door to say, okay,

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this is where this is going to take

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you.

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And so for me, I found that

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selling is just another part of...

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It's like another art.

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You just have to find a way to

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do it.

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If you can't pitch what you do in

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thirty seconds or less,

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you need to go back to the drawing

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board because nobody's going to sit at a

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table and say, well,

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give me five minutes and I can tell

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you the story.

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No.

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you need to be able to say, hey,

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this is about boom, boom, boom.

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And if they're interested and it's got a

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hook that they like, then there you go.

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And that's what you do.

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And then you just keep learning how to

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pivot that for every audience,

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how you sell to one comic shop and

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how you sell to someone just walking

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around at a comic convention might be two

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different things.

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So that's what you have to do.

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And so over the years, it was like,

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I realized that and it's not about me

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at the end of the day.

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Yeah, this is my series.

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I created it.

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I write it.

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I draw it.

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I publish it.

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But it's because people believe in it that

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turns into something else.

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And then you share that experience with

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them.

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But you have to be able to get

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people invested in what you're doing.

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And then at a certain point,

00:12:37.486 --> 00:12:38.908
it kind of sells itself.

00:12:39.687 --> 00:12:41.688
It just kind of moves along.

00:12:41.788 --> 00:12:43.049
And there are times where

00:12:44.217 --> 00:12:46.940
The books are selling out faster than I

00:12:46.960 --> 00:12:50.743
can reprint them and get them shipped out.

00:12:50.783 --> 00:12:52.565
And so, you know,

00:12:52.684 --> 00:12:54.525
it's something I'm incredibly grateful

00:12:54.566 --> 00:12:54.865
for.

00:12:55.667 --> 00:12:59.129
But I every day I just keep trying

00:12:59.169 --> 00:12:59.490
to say,

00:12:59.629 --> 00:13:02.371
what can I do today that will give

00:13:02.412 --> 00:13:05.094
them more than what I did yesterday?

00:13:05.475 --> 00:13:07.275
It's always about quality,

00:13:07.296 --> 00:13:09.717
because if you don't hold yourself to a

00:13:09.857 --> 00:13:10.399
standard,

00:13:11.451 --> 00:13:12.591
Well,

00:13:12.611 --> 00:13:14.113
people will get things that aren't the

00:13:14.153 --> 00:13:16.173
best and you have to you have to

00:13:16.293 --> 00:13:17.914
always give the best that you got.

00:13:19.716 --> 00:13:22.658
So let me what's the what were the

00:13:22.697 --> 00:13:25.058
biggest challenges of sustaining momentum

00:13:25.078 --> 00:13:27.360
without Kickstarter or Indiegogo or

00:13:27.400 --> 00:13:32.083
another crowdfunding platform like that?

00:13:32.783 --> 00:13:34.764
I mean, part of it, I think,

00:13:34.804 --> 00:13:35.405
is just my.

00:13:38.322 --> 00:13:41.344
my refusal to to stop making it because

00:13:41.443 --> 00:13:45.284
i because i love it but um i

00:13:45.345 --> 00:13:47.426
think part of it too is you know

00:13:47.466 --> 00:13:49.767
it's tough there and you go through

00:13:49.787 --> 00:13:51.626
drought seasons where you sell really good

00:13:51.908 --> 00:13:54.067
and then you know you go through eras

00:13:54.087 --> 00:13:55.428
where you're like i sold

00:13:56.269 --> 00:13:58.650
two books this week and then sometimes

00:13:58.691 --> 00:14:00.552
it's like great i sold two hundred books

00:14:00.592 --> 00:14:03.254
this week and so really you have to

00:14:03.495 --> 00:14:05.537
it's like this is this is my full-time

00:14:05.576 --> 00:14:06.837
job this is just what i do every

00:14:06.878 --> 00:14:08.658
day i come in my office and i

00:14:08.698 --> 00:14:11.341
draw and i letter and i work on

00:14:11.400 --> 00:14:14.244
different aspects of of the current issues

00:14:14.264 --> 00:14:16.644
that i'm at i pack orders and you

00:14:16.706 --> 00:14:20.067
just have to every day say okay let

00:14:20.087 --> 00:14:20.187
me

00:14:21.208 --> 00:14:23.673
email new shops let me talk to new

00:14:23.712 --> 00:14:26.918
customers when sometimes the delivery drop

00:14:27.077 --> 00:14:28.759
comes i'm like hey

00:14:29.898 --> 00:14:30.577
You into this?

00:14:30.677 --> 00:14:31.477
You into anime?

00:14:31.518 --> 00:14:33.198
You got people who like that?

00:14:33.219 --> 00:14:33.918
And they're like, yeah,

00:14:34.099 --> 00:14:36.759
I'll give them a preview edition for free.

00:14:37.739 --> 00:14:38.539
So they take it.

00:14:39.299 --> 00:14:40.360
They have a business card.

00:14:40.799 --> 00:14:42.500
Then they come back and I get an

00:14:42.700 --> 00:14:44.620
order from the website.

00:14:44.980 --> 00:14:47.880
So you have to take advantage of every

00:14:48.041 --> 00:14:50.682
opportunity and you have to know when to

00:14:50.741 --> 00:14:51.841
push and when to pull.

00:14:51.881 --> 00:14:52.022
See,

00:14:52.062 --> 00:14:53.961
that goes back to the balancing thing.

00:14:54.522 --> 00:14:56.883
And so I just keep...

00:14:57.442 --> 00:14:59.583
I just keep telling the story and I'm

00:14:59.644 --> 00:15:03.066
so grateful for the people who believe in

00:15:03.125 --> 00:15:03.245
it.

00:15:04.426 --> 00:15:04.706
You know,

00:15:04.787 --> 00:15:07.707
that to me is the greatest reward of

00:15:08.008 --> 00:15:10.589
this is knowing how it affects people.

00:15:10.668 --> 00:15:13.049
And I've had people message me to let

00:15:13.090 --> 00:15:15.871
me know it's made them cry.

00:15:16.331 --> 00:15:18.633
It's made them reflect on how they

00:15:18.753 --> 00:15:21.313
interact with people in their lives that

00:15:21.333 --> 00:15:22.115
they care about.

00:15:22.595 --> 00:15:25.576
So it's a lot of things that...

00:15:27.076 --> 00:15:29.518
i never thought would happen but i just

00:15:30.038 --> 00:15:31.798
kept saying well i just want to share

00:15:31.817 --> 00:15:34.198
this story and keep putting it out there

00:15:34.219 --> 00:15:38.799
for for people to hopefully enjoy dude i

00:15:38.820 --> 00:15:41.399
i like it i i really do so

00:15:41.659 --> 00:15:42.720
this i don't know if this is going

00:15:42.740 --> 00:15:44.961
to be a controversial question or not but

00:15:45.041 --> 00:15:47.581
it's one of those where you you've done

00:15:47.660 --> 00:15:49.721
everything without crowdfunding so do you

00:15:49.761 --> 00:15:51.942
believe indie creators have become too

00:15:51.981 --> 00:15:54.602
dependent on crowdfunding platforms

00:15:55.881 --> 00:15:58.884
Or do you wish more would utilize them?

00:15:59.303 --> 00:15:59.583
I mean,

00:15:59.644 --> 00:16:01.705
now it's part of the business model that

00:16:01.745 --> 00:16:03.186
just exists for comics.

00:16:03.225 --> 00:16:04.106
It just is there.

00:16:05.932 --> 00:16:10.956
And I understand the nature of why people

00:16:11.196 --> 00:16:11.475
use it.

00:16:11.936 --> 00:16:12.355
I get it.

00:16:12.697 --> 00:16:15.298
That's a completely reasonable thing.

00:16:16.719 --> 00:16:21.522
But I also think if you only rely

00:16:21.861 --> 00:16:25.484
on using that and you're only selling in

00:16:25.524 --> 00:16:26.605
your own circles,

00:16:27.865 --> 00:16:29.405
I hear a lot of creators say,

00:16:29.546 --> 00:16:31.027
I have a hard time marketing.

00:16:31.126 --> 00:16:32.408
I have a hard time selling.

00:16:32.427 --> 00:16:33.369
I have a hard time.

00:16:33.948 --> 00:16:36.811
But if you're using the platform,

00:16:36.951 --> 00:16:38.392
you're used to just saying, OK,

00:16:38.432 --> 00:16:40.133
here's the link.

00:16:40.192 --> 00:16:41.855
Hey, guys, can you share it out?

00:16:41.914 --> 00:16:43.255
Or hey, you want to support it?

00:16:44.015 --> 00:16:46.677
that works for that part of the community

00:16:47.057 --> 00:16:49.418
but a person outside of that they're not

00:16:49.458 --> 00:16:51.120
going to want to know that i have

00:16:51.159 --> 00:16:53.260
to go to two and three different links

00:16:53.360 --> 00:16:54.881
or i have to go to this page

00:16:54.922 --> 00:16:57.264
and sign up to that page and it

00:16:57.323 --> 00:17:00.524
so it's important to learn how to be

00:17:00.625 --> 00:17:03.907
versatile and not because now just imagine

00:17:04.887 --> 00:17:07.689
imagine crowdfunding went away tomorrow

00:17:09.329 --> 00:17:11.852
how many series would survive

00:17:12.913 --> 00:17:16.594
if it disappeared tomorrow and see that is

00:17:16.713 --> 00:17:20.075
so many amazing series disappear i think

00:17:20.134 --> 00:17:23.756
i've interviewed maybe fifty different you

00:17:23.776 --> 00:17:28.117
know indie creators and um like to see

00:17:28.157 --> 00:17:29.738
some of those series that i've grown to

00:17:29.837 --> 00:17:31.939
love just disappear overnight because of

00:17:31.959 --> 00:17:33.598
that would honestly it would be

00:17:33.618 --> 00:17:34.839
heartbreaking for me but i couldn't

00:17:34.900 --> 00:17:38.441
imagine as a the creator of those how

00:17:38.480 --> 00:17:39.580
they would feel about that

00:17:40.557 --> 00:17:40.897
Right.

00:17:41.057 --> 00:17:42.959
So see, that's that's where, again,

00:17:43.179 --> 00:17:46.380
it's a it's a balance of of what

00:17:46.400 --> 00:17:47.019
you have to do.

00:17:47.079 --> 00:17:48.099
And so I get it.

00:17:48.200 --> 00:17:48.539
I do.

00:17:48.980 --> 00:17:50.020
I completely understand.

00:17:50.080 --> 00:17:51.740
And it's funny because ironically,

00:17:52.740 --> 00:17:53.342
in March,

00:17:54.261 --> 00:17:57.242
I'm going to do my first ever crowdfund

00:17:57.282 --> 00:17:58.002
with the company.

00:17:58.982 --> 00:18:01.525
uh for a very small just it's a

00:18:01.625 --> 00:18:04.386
small it's not the money thing it's i

00:18:04.446 --> 00:18:08.169
thought well it let me try to share

00:18:08.189 --> 00:18:11.932
it with more creators in that vein of

00:18:11.971 --> 00:18:14.333
things because it's so much that

00:18:14.473 --> 00:18:17.214
circulates through these groups that i

00:18:17.255 --> 00:18:19.356
thought well this is how you can keep

00:18:19.436 --> 00:18:22.098
introducing it to to new people so i

00:18:22.759 --> 00:18:25.141
i mean you know this is it feels

00:18:25.201 --> 00:18:26.942
weird it's kind of like a weird thing

00:18:26.961 --> 00:18:27.862
for me to even

00:18:28.843 --> 00:18:32.223
think that I'm going to have like a

00:18:32.324 --> 00:18:34.605
small one that I'm going to try because

00:18:34.644 --> 00:18:35.924
for so long, it's just like, well,

00:18:35.944 --> 00:18:36.325
I just,

00:18:37.065 --> 00:18:38.885
I just make it and I publish it

00:18:38.965 --> 00:18:41.287
and I open pre-orders on my website and

00:18:41.326 --> 00:18:43.067
then people order and I just sell it

00:18:43.086 --> 00:18:44.146
at stores and I,

00:18:44.607 --> 00:18:45.667
I get it into shops.

00:18:45.748 --> 00:18:48.729
And, and so that,

00:18:49.048 --> 00:18:51.630
that for me is different, but I, I,

00:18:51.750 --> 00:18:52.690
I think it's a good tool.

00:18:53.509 --> 00:18:56.510
but i think it's important to also learn

00:18:56.550 --> 00:19:00.752
to thrive without that as your your main

00:19:01.053 --> 00:19:04.453
source because if if you don't have that

00:19:05.355 --> 00:19:08.135
and you don't know how to market you're

00:19:08.175 --> 00:19:10.676
not going to grow by still saying hey

00:19:10.717 --> 00:19:13.238
just hey go support that no one's going

00:19:13.258 --> 00:19:15.417
to most people are going to say well

00:19:15.479 --> 00:19:17.798
no i'm not going to do that you

00:19:17.818 --> 00:19:19.059
have to give them a reason why

00:19:20.410 --> 00:19:20.849
No,

00:19:20.930 --> 00:19:22.491
and that's one of those reasons why I

00:19:22.551 --> 00:19:26.494
do this show right here where I'm

00:19:26.575 --> 00:19:27.316
staunchly...

00:19:27.855 --> 00:19:31.138
I support indie creators because I do want

00:19:31.159 --> 00:19:34.240
to give them another platform to market

00:19:34.280 --> 00:19:37.663
themselves to other people because the

00:19:37.743 --> 00:19:39.525
marketing part, in my opinion,

00:19:39.605 --> 00:19:42.288
and what I've noticed in the year plus

00:19:42.307 --> 00:19:45.329
that I've been doing indie creator content

00:19:45.589 --> 00:19:45.851
is...

00:19:46.691 --> 00:19:49.291
marketing is the hardest part.

00:19:49.352 --> 00:19:50.972
Yes, Facebook groups are great.

00:19:51.653 --> 00:19:53.833
Instagram is great,

00:19:53.933 --> 00:19:57.154
but it's getting people to those sites to

00:19:57.234 --> 00:19:58.674
see your stuff.

00:19:59.315 --> 00:20:01.675
And even I, as a podcaster,

00:20:01.976 --> 00:20:03.517
I have those same issues.

00:20:04.057 --> 00:20:05.396
And I was just telling you before we

00:20:05.416 --> 00:20:07.117
went live that I've literally spent

00:20:08.455 --> 00:20:10.858
probably ninety percent of my day doing

00:20:10.919 --> 00:20:15.724
exactly those things that I'm learning to

00:20:15.825 --> 00:20:17.646
market myself better and to make my

00:20:17.707 --> 00:20:21.010
content better for others and people seen

00:20:21.050 --> 00:20:23.815
an example of that today with that quick

00:20:24.234 --> 00:20:26.317
fifteen second video just reminding people

00:20:26.337 --> 00:20:26.738
like hey

00:20:27.398 --> 00:20:28.901
Zing is going to be here tonight.

00:20:29.221 --> 00:20:30.262
Make sure you tune in.

00:20:30.923 --> 00:20:32.105
Right, exactly.

00:20:32.204 --> 00:20:32.345
No,

00:20:32.425 --> 00:20:34.208
and you're approaching it the right way.

00:20:34.248 --> 00:20:35.769
I mean, so real quick,

00:20:35.809 --> 00:20:38.553
let's just look at the dynamics of the

00:20:38.593 --> 00:20:40.154
way the system is set up.

00:20:41.817 --> 00:20:44.540
Diamond left the comic industry in

00:20:44.701 --> 00:20:45.260
shambles.

00:20:45.821 --> 00:20:46.342
Why?

00:20:46.761 --> 00:20:50.963
Because they used a model that really was

00:20:51.243 --> 00:20:53.005
prehistoric and it really,

00:20:53.164 --> 00:20:54.825
it functioned in a way that it shouldn't

00:20:54.865 --> 00:20:56.945
have functioned for so long, but it did.

00:20:57.306 --> 00:20:57.905
Now, yes,

00:20:57.945 --> 00:20:59.547
there are detractors who will say that's

00:20:59.586 --> 00:21:00.047
not true,

00:21:00.086 --> 00:21:02.728
but the proof is evident because why?

00:21:02.847 --> 00:21:03.307
Where is it?

00:21:03.728 --> 00:21:05.888
Diamond has become like what Obi-Wan said

00:21:05.929 --> 00:21:08.150
about the Jedi in episode four.

00:21:08.190 --> 00:21:08.829
They're all but,

00:21:09.109 --> 00:21:10.911
comic shops now are all but extinct.

00:21:11.471 --> 00:21:14.833
because of that method that they hook

00:21:14.873 --> 00:21:19.757
themselves to and and so really yes there

00:21:19.876 --> 00:21:22.858
are always new books and and creators and

00:21:22.919 --> 00:21:25.701
new things coming out so the marketing

00:21:25.760 --> 00:21:28.082
part to say well how can i stand

00:21:28.241 --> 00:21:31.203
out how how can i get my my

00:21:31.324 --> 00:21:34.906
work seen and there's already so many very

00:21:35.027 --> 00:21:37.607
unique things out there and that goes back

00:21:37.648 --> 00:21:40.750
to the very simple basics of

00:21:41.471 --> 00:21:43.832
You have to really know your story,

00:21:44.413 --> 00:21:45.772
make something unique,

00:21:46.193 --> 00:21:47.634
make something engaging.

00:21:48.275 --> 00:21:51.215
When everybody else is following a popular

00:21:51.316 --> 00:21:53.758
artistic trend, do the opposite.

00:21:54.420 --> 00:21:56.201
Don't do the thing everybody else is

00:21:56.240 --> 00:21:56.560
doing.

00:21:56.621 --> 00:21:58.061
And I know there are people who will

00:21:58.082 --> 00:21:59.241
say, oh, but if you do that,

00:21:59.722 --> 00:22:01.303
you won't be seen and you won't get...

00:22:01.624 --> 00:22:02.084
Sure,

00:22:02.183 --> 00:22:03.924
it's easy to get seen in the mass

00:22:03.964 --> 00:22:04.964
of crowds of things.

00:22:05.325 --> 00:22:06.346
But then even in that,

00:22:06.405 --> 00:22:09.267
you begin to dwindle out when people with

00:22:09.527 --> 00:22:12.128
much more popular names jump on that same

00:22:12.169 --> 00:22:12.868
bandwagon.

00:22:13.288 --> 00:22:15.789
And now they have all the prime spots.

00:22:16.191 --> 00:22:16.351
So...

00:22:17.191 --> 00:22:20.012
to stand out, you have to really say,

00:22:20.133 --> 00:22:20.432
okay,

00:22:20.593 --> 00:22:23.314
what can I do that no one else

00:22:23.354 --> 00:22:24.654
is doing that way?

00:22:25.095 --> 00:22:27.455
And that's a part of the longevity that

00:22:27.476 --> 00:22:30.337
has helped Symphonic Verses is it's not

00:22:30.397 --> 00:22:32.019
like other series.

00:22:32.199 --> 00:22:34.420
It's not like, I mean, like,

00:22:34.460 --> 00:22:35.279
here's an example.

00:22:37.204 --> 00:22:37.904
This is the,

00:22:38.465 --> 00:22:40.247
this is the seventeenth issue.

00:22:40.886 --> 00:22:43.548
Now, this is the Pythagorean Chromatica,

00:22:43.647 --> 00:22:45.808
which it's called Seventeen Over Three,

00:22:46.229 --> 00:22:47.450
and that is a reference,

00:22:47.529 --> 00:22:49.050
it's a musical reference.

00:22:49.510 --> 00:22:51.852
However, you don't see the characters,

00:22:52.511 --> 00:22:54.272
you don't see action pages,

00:22:54.353 --> 00:22:57.234
you don't see great splashes of color.

00:22:58.035 --> 00:23:00.297
why because for me this is how i

00:23:00.397 --> 00:23:02.338
this is how i tell my story this

00:23:02.378 --> 00:23:04.260
is how i present it to people with

00:23:04.481 --> 00:23:07.183
symbolism of things that are indicative to

00:23:07.203 --> 00:23:10.106
the story itself because symphonic verses

00:23:10.186 --> 00:23:12.429
really is uh it's like even though it's

00:23:12.449 --> 00:23:14.451
a dark fantasy it's really like a melodic

00:23:14.592 --> 00:23:17.694
opera uh that that is traffic and and

00:23:17.775 --> 00:23:21.818
beautiful and um so that's one example

00:23:22.219 --> 00:23:25.622
Now, this is the Horovacui edition.

00:23:25.823 --> 00:23:27.984
Now, this is over two hundred pages.

00:23:28.045 --> 00:23:28.945
It's hardcover.

00:23:29.385 --> 00:23:30.787
It's the first eight volumes.

00:23:31.647 --> 00:23:33.789
And again, you don't see the characters,

00:23:34.290 --> 00:23:37.374
but you see themes that are written are

00:23:37.493 --> 00:23:38.414
so important.

00:23:38.714 --> 00:23:40.836
that have meaning to to me to the

00:23:40.875 --> 00:23:43.596
story to the characters uh and now on

00:23:43.616 --> 00:23:46.597
the back i've put some of the uh

00:23:46.678 --> 00:23:49.278
endorsements i've got from msn and screen

00:23:49.339 --> 00:23:52.780
rant and jim valentino santa monica studio

00:23:53.361 --> 00:23:57.222
who produces god of war konami so you

00:23:57.303 --> 00:23:59.523
put that real quick we put that into

00:23:59.564 --> 00:24:04.445
perspective i'm a one-man show all the

00:24:04.486 --> 00:24:07.207
rejections all the things yet

00:24:08.871 --> 00:24:11.971
The actress from The Handmaid's Tale reads

00:24:12.071 --> 00:24:12.711
my series.

00:24:12.872 --> 00:24:14.472
She has bought every volume.

00:24:15.752 --> 00:24:17.353
Santa Monica Studio,

00:24:18.114 --> 00:24:19.354
God of War is one of the most

00:24:19.413 --> 00:24:21.255
popular IPs in the world.

00:24:21.755 --> 00:24:24.315
Sold hundreds of millions of copies to

00:24:24.335 --> 00:24:24.654
gamers.

00:24:24.674 --> 00:24:26.816
And Konami is Castlevania.

00:24:27.155 --> 00:24:28.155
Castlevania, right.

00:24:28.497 --> 00:24:33.357
So imagine people who do those things and

00:24:33.397 --> 00:24:36.598
they're saying what you're doing is right.

00:24:37.179 --> 00:24:40.641
what you're doing is correct and and so

00:24:40.881 --> 00:24:43.722
again this comes back to it's not that

00:24:43.742 --> 00:24:46.845
it's about me but it's about the work

00:24:47.105 --> 00:24:50.027
itself that's see that's the dichotomy of

00:24:50.086 --> 00:24:52.689
this situation and and so that's where

00:24:52.709 --> 00:24:56.432
it's important for creators to say okay i

00:24:56.471 --> 00:24:59.313
need to really make something unique i

00:24:59.333 --> 00:25:01.034
need to really make it original i mean

00:25:01.694 --> 00:25:04.497
i got put on screen rant screen rant

00:25:05.057 --> 00:25:07.137
said this is the best indie comic you

00:25:07.157 --> 00:25:10.179
haven't read and and i have i'm not

00:25:10.419 --> 00:25:12.519
a legacy publisher attached to something

00:25:12.619 --> 00:25:14.760
it's not like i have corporate warner

00:25:14.780 --> 00:25:18.682
brothers money funding it no it's just me

00:25:18.862 --> 00:25:21.262
but i have found that what i do

00:25:21.663 --> 00:25:23.864
and how i present it and how i

00:25:23.903 --> 00:25:27.826
tell my story that affects people greatly

00:25:28.346 --> 00:25:30.807
and that's what continues to bring them

00:25:30.846 --> 00:25:31.166
back

00:25:31.626 --> 00:25:34.148
for more and more and and i'm just

00:25:34.288 --> 00:25:36.471
thankful for that so i'm just saying all

00:25:36.510 --> 00:25:39.413
of that those those really all those parts

00:25:40.094 --> 00:25:42.536
they they connect and they work together

00:25:42.715 --> 00:25:44.477
and and that's what creators should try to

00:25:44.537 --> 00:25:48.180
focus on as best they could well said

00:25:48.881 --> 00:25:50.742
so jen thank you for stopping by the

00:25:50.762 --> 00:25:52.624
podcast it really means a lot to stop

00:25:52.644 --> 00:25:54.665
by to support the usd and as well

00:25:54.786 --> 00:25:56.727
as zing it means the world to us

00:25:56.787 --> 00:25:59.269
so appreciate that don't forget to drop us

00:25:59.348 --> 00:26:00.589
a a follow please

00:26:01.424 --> 00:26:02.785
Because we do this every week,

00:26:02.924 --> 00:26:04.006
multiple times a week.

00:26:04.266 --> 00:26:05.945
And we do appreciate when people stop by

00:26:05.965 --> 00:26:07.046
and show their love.

00:26:09.567 --> 00:26:11.228
So let's talk about the Sephanic verses

00:26:11.268 --> 00:26:11.508
now.

00:26:12.087 --> 00:26:14.347
So that's the center of your universe is

00:26:14.468 --> 00:26:15.628
Prince Adonis,

00:26:15.769 --> 00:26:18.308
an omnia centuries-old figure forced to

00:26:18.348 --> 00:26:21.470
choose between power and love.

00:26:23.611 --> 00:26:25.631
And you said this has been the idea

00:26:25.651 --> 00:26:27.892
that has been with you since you were...

00:26:28.932 --> 00:26:31.594
a young younger man correct oh yeah i

00:26:31.614 --> 00:26:33.454
mean as you can see i'm a much

00:26:33.555 --> 00:26:36.556
older man now but um yeah i mean

00:26:36.675 --> 00:26:38.797
and it's funny the story the story that

00:26:39.057 --> 00:26:41.558
i started working on thirty two years ago

00:26:41.659 --> 00:26:43.079
in the story of today they are the

00:26:43.119 --> 00:26:46.521
same they it is the same awesome and

00:26:46.821 --> 00:26:50.703
and so in the story uh prince adonis

00:26:50.903 --> 00:26:53.444
now the world symphonic verses takes place

00:26:53.505 --> 00:26:56.126
in is called levy samanos v and

00:26:57.248 --> 00:27:02.174
That has a very particular meaning to the

00:27:02.215 --> 00:27:05.840
series and how it affects what's going on.

00:27:06.121 --> 00:27:07.542
And so, of course, it's not Earth.

00:27:07.824 --> 00:27:09.926
It's its own universe.

00:27:10.587 --> 00:27:11.750
And in the story,

00:27:13.351 --> 00:27:13.631
Yes,

00:27:13.671 --> 00:27:15.892
he's trying to find this iniquitous power,

00:27:17.032 --> 00:27:20.314
but it really is about him making a

00:27:20.394 --> 00:27:23.036
choice not between good and bad,

00:27:23.096 --> 00:27:25.257
but between evil and a greater evil.

00:27:25.676 --> 00:27:26.436
So really,

00:27:26.596 --> 00:27:28.417
how can you do what's right when you

00:27:28.458 --> 00:27:29.637
can only do what's wrong?

00:27:29.679 --> 00:27:31.459
You can only make wrong choices.

00:27:31.898 --> 00:27:33.579
And as the series goes on,

00:27:34.200 --> 00:27:37.021
you will see that he actually lived a

00:27:37.041 --> 00:27:39.502
very lonely, very solitary life.

00:27:40.284 --> 00:27:42.145
His parents have died.

00:27:42.787 --> 00:27:44.390
His wife has died.

00:27:45.680 --> 00:27:48.321
he has his mentor who has trained him

00:27:48.461 --> 00:27:51.644
for centuries countess concerto and even

00:27:51.663 --> 00:27:54.285
though he is the crown prince of his

00:27:54.404 --> 00:27:56.646
empire which is called the noctum imperium

00:27:57.386 --> 00:28:00.048
uh he's not he's not ruling it as

00:28:00.108 --> 00:28:02.349
its emperor there's a reason he he's not

00:28:02.410 --> 00:28:04.912
sitting on the throne uh there's a reason

00:28:04.951 --> 00:28:07.534
in the story for that uh so he

00:28:07.634 --> 00:28:10.796
sets out he goes to this treaty signing

00:28:11.788 --> 00:28:14.391
because their world has been at war for

00:28:14.770 --> 00:28:15.912
eight hundred years,

00:28:16.553 --> 00:28:20.036
and there's a powerful empire called the

00:28:20.076 --> 00:28:23.137
Countethalian Dynasty, and Countethalia,

00:28:23.618 --> 00:28:24.799
in their dialect,

00:28:24.839 --> 00:28:26.641
it means the land of nobility,

00:28:27.142 --> 00:28:30.023
and so he goes to this treaty signing

00:28:30.044 --> 00:28:32.105
that takes place in a neutral kingdom,

00:28:32.486 --> 00:28:34.067
which is known as the Glass Kingdom,

00:28:34.488 --> 00:28:35.367
and he goes there,

00:28:35.628 --> 00:28:37.369
and that's where he meets Princess

00:28:37.430 --> 00:28:38.111
Sappharos,

00:28:38.951 --> 00:28:39.191
and

00:28:40.290 --> 00:28:43.094
They discover that they both share this

00:28:43.233 --> 00:28:46.016
rare ability to behold celestial light.

00:28:46.477 --> 00:28:48.798
And they're the only two beings on their

00:28:48.858 --> 00:28:51.020
entire world who possess this power.

00:28:51.540 --> 00:28:53.603
And that ties into the story.

00:28:53.623 --> 00:28:55.464
It ties into all these things that are

00:28:55.484 --> 00:28:56.045
going on.

00:28:56.826 --> 00:28:59.769
And he discovers that there is a way

00:29:00.489 --> 00:29:01.970
he could bring his wife back.

00:29:02.830 --> 00:29:05.471
and both of us if we could not

00:29:05.593 --> 00:29:08.173
fix the wrongs and save the people we

00:29:08.233 --> 00:29:13.276
love right what what would you do to

00:29:13.316 --> 00:29:15.718
fix it what would you do to save

00:29:15.758 --> 00:29:18.598
the people you love and so that's really

00:29:18.699 --> 00:29:21.599
where the story starts to take this very

00:29:21.861 --> 00:29:25.001
interesting shape in the dialogue of about

00:29:25.082 --> 00:29:26.182
choices about

00:29:26.863 --> 00:29:29.565
things that that we do and is it

00:29:29.644 --> 00:29:33.868
really justified or do do the ends justify

00:29:33.909 --> 00:29:37.432
the means is it really this way and

00:29:37.991 --> 00:29:40.834
that image that we were speaking about uh

00:29:40.854 --> 00:29:45.798
before we came on oh absolutely the the

00:29:45.877 --> 00:29:48.039
other various uh characters that people

00:29:48.079 --> 00:29:50.662
meet throughout the series he's the again

00:29:50.682 --> 00:29:52.523
see he's the only one looking backwards

00:29:52.943 --> 00:29:54.786
see and that's indicative to what is

00:29:54.846 --> 00:29:56.989
happening in in the story and his

00:29:57.068 --> 00:29:59.991
inability to to let go of things and

00:30:00.231 --> 00:30:02.334
and it has a lot of action the

00:30:02.374 --> 00:30:03.816
characters have all these really

00:30:03.895 --> 00:30:06.077
fantastical powers and things that they

00:30:06.117 --> 00:30:08.800
can do and as it goes on

00:30:10.076 --> 00:30:13.038
you see him falling further into darkness

00:30:13.460 --> 00:30:15.961
you see him making worse choices than he

00:30:16.001 --> 00:30:20.845
did before and the series is again it's

00:30:20.865 --> 00:30:23.887
like a melodic opera so so much of

00:30:23.907 --> 00:30:26.049
the series is built around musical

00:30:26.089 --> 00:30:28.912
references um a lot of the book is

00:30:29.031 --> 00:30:32.354
written in latin um and welsh and greek

00:30:33.035 --> 00:30:35.936
uh i actually created languages for the

00:30:35.977 --> 00:30:37.878
various races so they have their own

00:30:37.919 --> 00:30:38.578
dialects

00:30:40.121 --> 00:30:41.362
There's world maps,

00:30:41.501 --> 00:30:43.923
there's the soundtrack.

00:30:44.084 --> 00:30:45.284
And I mean, the soundtrack,

00:30:45.703 --> 00:30:49.467
I had the soundtrack composed like decades

00:30:49.507 --> 00:30:51.728
ago for the music.

00:30:51.788 --> 00:30:53.648
So I wanted people to be able to

00:30:53.749 --> 00:30:57.830
explore the aspects of that world and then

00:30:57.871 --> 00:30:59.873
explore music that came with it.

00:31:00.373 --> 00:31:03.575
And so now the soundtrack, I mean,

00:31:03.714 --> 00:31:05.996
it's got twenty four songs and actually

00:31:06.016 --> 00:31:06.715
the composer

00:31:07.836 --> 00:31:09.038
A year and a half ago,

00:31:09.238 --> 00:31:11.778
he wrote two more new songs for it.

00:31:13.539 --> 00:31:15.862
So when you order it from the website,

00:31:15.882 --> 00:31:19.223
you get the soundtrack as a digital

00:31:19.263 --> 00:31:19.723
download.

00:31:19.784 --> 00:31:20.724
All that comes with it.

00:31:21.744 --> 00:31:23.566
So that's what the story is about.

00:31:23.625 --> 00:31:27.828
It's about him and that choice between

00:31:27.868 --> 00:31:28.909
these two evils.

00:31:29.609 --> 00:31:29.769
And

00:31:31.078 --> 00:31:33.020
where do we justify it and where does

00:31:33.060 --> 00:31:35.042
the line draw where we say, hey,

00:31:36.384 --> 00:31:38.425
that was too much or no,

00:31:38.486 --> 00:31:41.789
I've got to take this even further now

00:31:41.829 --> 00:31:42.790
to make this right.

00:31:43.900 --> 00:31:46.143
But not everything is the way it appears

00:31:46.182 --> 00:31:46.502
to be.

00:31:47.104 --> 00:31:49.665
And so that's the very human element.

00:31:50.007 --> 00:31:52.809
But it's set in that stunning fantasy

00:31:52.849 --> 00:31:56.313
world that is very high Baroque.

00:31:56.713 --> 00:32:00.057
But it's my own influence on that and

00:32:00.337 --> 00:32:02.881
Asian culture and European design.

00:32:03.101 --> 00:32:05.222
And it really is just kind of its

00:32:05.323 --> 00:32:05.723
own thing.

00:32:07.130 --> 00:32:10.112
So it's been like there's been comparisons

00:32:10.152 --> 00:32:13.615
between Final Fantasy Castlevania to your

00:32:13.694 --> 00:32:14.055
book.

00:32:14.115 --> 00:32:17.057
Were those influences to you or did it

00:32:17.116 --> 00:32:17.758
kind of like.

00:32:19.318 --> 00:32:21.180
Provide anything for you or that's just

00:32:21.260 --> 00:32:22.662
really awesome comparisons.

00:32:24.442 --> 00:32:27.605
I so I love I love Castlevania.

00:32:27.704 --> 00:32:28.786
I love Final Fantasy.

00:32:30.887 --> 00:32:31.607
They're just there.

00:32:31.748 --> 00:32:32.048
You know,

00:32:32.148 --> 00:32:35.411
they're it's it's what I take away from

00:32:35.451 --> 00:32:36.112
that is this.

00:32:36.936 --> 00:32:38.558
There's a difference between someone

00:32:38.598 --> 00:32:42.363
saying, well, it inspired me,

00:32:42.403 --> 00:32:44.585
but then they just are copying what they

00:32:44.664 --> 00:32:46.967
see or someone saying, oh,

00:32:47.567 --> 00:32:50.451
that taught me something about how I need

00:32:50.490 --> 00:32:53.594
to think outside the box and what can

00:32:53.693 --> 00:32:54.755
I take away from that?

00:32:55.135 --> 00:32:58.638
And so really the inspiration is

00:32:59.640 --> 00:33:00.060
Yes,

00:33:00.141 --> 00:33:02.342
you get inspired by things that you see,

00:33:02.402 --> 00:33:04.364
but it's more of what can I what

00:33:04.403 --> 00:33:07.145
can I learn from this that I can

00:33:07.165 --> 00:33:08.165
then say, OK,

00:33:08.906 --> 00:33:10.567
these are things I need to work on

00:33:10.607 --> 00:33:12.490
to improve how I tell my story,

00:33:12.529 --> 00:33:15.832
to improve how I I show these designs.

00:33:16.372 --> 00:33:18.534
What can I do to keep making it

00:33:18.693 --> 00:33:19.153
unique?

00:33:19.575 --> 00:33:22.156
And so that's that's the takeaway from it

00:33:22.176 --> 00:33:22.656
that way.

00:33:24.409 --> 00:33:25.169
As far as,

00:33:25.769 --> 00:33:27.210
and I don't like to compare things,

00:33:27.630 --> 00:33:30.411
but sometimes people ask, like,

00:33:30.651 --> 00:33:32.290
what does it feel like?

00:33:32.371 --> 00:33:33.070
And I tell them, well,

00:33:33.111 --> 00:33:35.511
if you took Hamlet and Final Fantasy and

00:33:35.551 --> 00:33:39.292
Castlevania and you like the vein of those

00:33:39.333 --> 00:33:41.814
things, the pronounced irony,

00:33:42.273 --> 00:33:43.653
the dark fantasy,

00:33:43.794 --> 00:33:48.035
the magnificent designs and stunning

00:33:48.095 --> 00:33:50.516
creatures and cities and backdrops.

00:33:51.596 --> 00:33:52.477
It is that,

00:33:52.517 --> 00:33:53.877
but it's just its own thing.

00:33:53.897 --> 00:33:55.278
Yeah.

00:33:55.378 --> 00:33:56.759
If that makes sense that way.

00:33:56.920 --> 00:33:57.819
Oh, a hundred percent.

00:33:57.880 --> 00:33:58.560
And I'm telling you,

00:33:58.601 --> 00:34:00.842
Adonis gives me strong Belmont vibes.

00:34:04.684 --> 00:34:06.566
One bad decision after the other.

00:34:08.148 --> 00:34:09.628
That's a Belmont for you.

00:34:10.550 --> 00:34:11.731
That is a great compliment.

00:34:12.030 --> 00:34:13.692
I would definitely take that.

00:34:13.891 --> 00:34:15.293
Hey, please.

00:34:16.094 --> 00:34:18.715
It's funny because in the series,

00:34:20.737 --> 00:34:21.336
in a way,

00:34:21.398 --> 00:34:22.798
he kind of puts on a...

00:34:23.518 --> 00:34:27.221
a cool veneer about his his self it's

00:34:27.300 --> 00:34:31.422
really to hide his his pain and and

00:34:32.043 --> 00:34:35.704
agony i mean he's suffering with ptsd um

00:34:35.865 --> 00:34:38.447
he's suffering with with depression and

00:34:38.766 --> 00:34:40.628
one of the other elements about the series

00:34:40.827 --> 00:34:44.050
it is written and it's endorsed by a

00:34:44.210 --> 00:34:46.971
licensed professional psychologist who

00:34:47.371 --> 00:34:49.072
specializes in those mental health

00:34:49.112 --> 00:34:51.153
disorders because of

00:34:52.014 --> 00:34:53.856
the things that he is struggling with.

00:34:54.096 --> 00:34:57.498
And within each release,

00:34:57.818 --> 00:34:59.480
there is a letter from the doctor,

00:34:59.960 --> 00:35:02.001
and then there is information for the

00:35:02.041 --> 00:35:03.342
National Crisis Line.

00:35:03.722 --> 00:35:08.086
So it's meant to also help people who

00:35:08.206 --> 00:35:10.708
are in these similar situations.

00:35:10.789 --> 00:35:12.570
It's by no means at all a...

00:35:13.291 --> 00:35:15.431
it is not a replacement for anything yeah

00:35:15.472 --> 00:35:18.333
but it is something to help aid people

00:35:18.393 --> 00:35:21.394
in realizing that they're not alone when

00:35:21.414 --> 00:35:22.996
they're struggling through these types of

00:35:23.036 --> 00:35:24.817
things because that is very much where he

00:35:24.876 --> 00:35:26.737
is at he is in this bad place

00:35:27.137 --> 00:35:28.639
and he's been in this bad place for

00:35:28.699 --> 00:35:32.260
a long time and when you're trying to

00:35:32.460 --> 00:35:34.342
to make sense of things and you're trying

00:35:34.382 --> 00:35:35.722
to make it uh

00:35:37.864 --> 00:35:39.065
in the modern time,

00:35:39.666 --> 00:35:41.027
you need people to help you.

00:35:41.527 --> 00:35:42.827
He doesn't have people helping him.

00:35:43.268 --> 00:35:45.550
He has people encouraging his behavior

00:35:45.971 --> 00:35:48.231
that is not helping anything in the long

00:35:48.291 --> 00:35:48.452
run.

00:35:48.492 --> 00:35:51.994
And so that is also part of the

00:35:52.054 --> 00:35:54.217
problem for him.

00:35:54.958 --> 00:35:59.300
So what makes Sephanic verses emotionally

00:35:59.400 --> 00:36:02.202
different from traditional dark fantasies

00:36:02.222 --> 00:36:04.844
that people may find themselves reading or

00:36:04.905 --> 00:36:05.405
picking up?

00:36:06.987 --> 00:36:14.050
So dark fantasy sometimes is categorized

00:36:14.090 --> 00:36:16.130
by just that one tone.

00:36:16.170 --> 00:36:17.190
It's like one note.

00:36:17.210 --> 00:36:18.030
Yeah.

00:36:18.811 --> 00:36:23.132
But symphonic verses is like a ghost note.

00:36:24.152 --> 00:36:25.893
So in the musical sense,

00:36:26.153 --> 00:36:29.894
that means indistinguishable beat that

00:36:30.155 --> 00:36:30.896
comes along.

00:36:31.016 --> 00:36:35.657
You can't really put it in a certain

00:36:35.697 --> 00:36:36.398
perspective.

00:36:36.617 --> 00:36:39.840
And so it's not just that it's this

00:36:39.960 --> 00:36:42.481
element where there are these ferocious

00:36:42.561 --> 00:36:44.722
types of beasts and these dark elements.

00:36:45.891 --> 00:36:49.711
but sometimes darkness comes from the

00:36:49.771 --> 00:36:52.413
things that seem most human even though

00:36:52.432 --> 00:36:56.233
they're not relationships inner struggles

00:36:57.233 --> 00:37:00.074
the the situations we find ourselves in

00:37:01.195 --> 00:37:04.574
enemies that we didn't know we had enemies

00:37:04.614 --> 00:37:09.016
that are that were once allies and so

00:37:09.315 --> 00:37:11.536
the writing is done in a way where

00:37:12.940 --> 00:37:17.666
It helps the reader to appreciate it's not

00:37:17.726 --> 00:37:19.387
written like Batman or Superman.

00:37:19.467 --> 00:37:20.929
It's not written the way you would write

00:37:20.969 --> 00:37:22.251
Thor or Spider-Man.

00:37:23.532 --> 00:37:25.494
It has a very different take,

00:37:25.594 --> 00:37:27.436
and the lyrics are written in a way

00:37:27.818 --> 00:37:29.539
as if they're almost being sung.

00:37:30.880 --> 00:37:33.304
It's like the recitative that's used for

00:37:33.523 --> 00:37:33.824
opera.

00:37:34.887 --> 00:37:38.128
that same kind of act to it and

00:37:38.369 --> 00:37:42.652
and so really what happens is that as

00:37:43.492 --> 00:37:46.134
you read the words and you're looking at

00:37:46.253 --> 00:37:50.175
each character i try to pour so much

00:37:50.516 --> 00:37:50.617
of

00:37:51.396 --> 00:37:54.737
the essence of all of the pain and

00:37:54.778 --> 00:37:57.059
the the joy and the love and the

00:37:57.300 --> 00:37:59.541
anger and the all the things that are

00:37:59.561 --> 00:38:02.362
there so that it becomes beautiful it

00:38:02.382 --> 00:38:05.983
becomes mellifluous but it becomes tragic

00:38:06.503 --> 00:38:09.605
in that way um and and i think

00:38:09.664 --> 00:38:11.646
that's what helps it to stand out is

00:38:13.985 --> 00:38:15.467
I couldn't say I could write a Batman

00:38:15.487 --> 00:38:15.867
story,

00:38:16.188 --> 00:38:17.909
but I know how to write this story

00:38:18.248 --> 00:38:20.371
because the way it sounds and the way

00:38:20.411 --> 00:38:21.751
it looks match each other.

00:38:22.592 --> 00:38:23.353
If that makes sense.

00:38:23.913 --> 00:38:25.114
Oh, a hundred percent.

00:38:25.434 --> 00:38:27.735
That a hundred percent makes sense to me.

00:38:28.317 --> 00:38:30.777
So you've made it abundantly clear

00:38:31.949 --> 00:38:36.090
and that you do not use any AI

00:38:36.170 --> 00:38:37.132
generated art.

00:38:37.612 --> 00:38:39.293
I know when people first put their eyes

00:38:39.353 --> 00:38:39.672
on this,

00:38:39.693 --> 00:38:41.333
that could be where the first place their

00:38:41.373 --> 00:38:42.894
mind is going to go is that it

00:38:42.994 --> 00:38:44.155
is AI generated.

00:38:44.635 --> 00:38:45.255
However,

00:38:45.295 --> 00:38:48.117
you have been making this book longer than

00:38:48.456 --> 00:38:50.759
AI has been around.

00:38:51.259 --> 00:38:52.539
Yeah.

00:38:52.599 --> 00:38:54.860
How important is it for people to

00:38:55.561 --> 00:38:57.222
understand that this is you?

00:38:58.684 --> 00:39:00.443
One hundred percent.

00:39:00.463 --> 00:39:01.525
I mean, that's very important.

00:39:01.664 --> 00:39:05.865
And it it's offensive when someone assumes

00:39:06.545 --> 00:39:08.846
that that that's what it is.

00:39:09.606 --> 00:39:12.766
I mean, I I get offended by that,

00:39:12.887 --> 00:39:14.608
not in the sense of.

00:39:16.347 --> 00:39:18.588
Like, oh, you know.

00:39:20.052 --> 00:39:20.632
I did this,

00:39:20.672 --> 00:39:23.277
you shouldn't be watering it down.

00:39:23.336 --> 00:39:23.617
No,

00:39:24.057 --> 00:39:30.047
because it takes so much of my very

00:39:30.567 --> 00:39:33.190
being to make this artwork.

00:39:34.170 --> 00:39:38.574
Every design, every pattern, every color,

00:39:39.074 --> 00:39:42.297
every ornate detail, I have to make.

00:39:42.697 --> 00:39:43.797
I have to design.

00:39:44.177 --> 00:39:45.159
And it's funny,

00:39:45.699 --> 00:39:47.240
I could never get distribution.

00:39:47.840 --> 00:39:49.963
And this ties to your question.

00:39:50.043 --> 00:39:51.804
Diamond didn't want to distribute it.

00:39:52.105 --> 00:39:53.786
I couldn't get other distribution.

00:39:53.885 --> 00:39:54.586
So, of course,

00:39:54.867 --> 00:39:57.889
Philbo Distribution came along.

00:39:58.769 --> 00:39:58.949
uh,

00:39:58.990 --> 00:40:00.913
Phil is such a great guy and he

00:40:00.992 --> 00:40:03.695
really wants to help creators and help the

00:40:03.755 --> 00:40:04.275
industry.

00:40:05.016 --> 00:40:07.519
He, uh, him and Mar they're both,

00:40:07.539 --> 00:40:08.320
she's wonderful.

00:40:08.420 --> 00:40:09.762
They, they run it together.

00:40:10.302 --> 00:40:10.523
Uh,

00:40:11.751 --> 00:40:13.972
They didn't hesitate.

00:40:14.012 --> 00:40:15.152
They didn't gatekeep me.

00:40:15.572 --> 00:40:17.934
But he told me, he said, well,

00:40:18.494 --> 00:40:20.215
we just want you to know we had

00:40:20.255 --> 00:40:23.836
to run it through these AI things to

00:40:23.876 --> 00:40:24.336
make sure.

00:40:24.416 --> 00:40:25.536
I said, no, I understand.

00:40:25.597 --> 00:40:26.257
You know, I get it.

00:40:26.277 --> 00:40:28.018
You're not familiar with what I do,

00:40:28.097 --> 00:40:28.918
so I understand.

00:40:29.798 --> 00:40:31.639
And they ran it through, and he's like,

00:40:31.719 --> 00:40:33.219
no, it's not AI.

00:40:33.260 --> 00:40:35.240
He said, we checked, and it's not.

00:40:35.360 --> 00:40:36.161
And I said, right,

00:40:36.262 --> 00:40:38.943
it wouldn't be because I made it, but...

00:40:40.083 --> 00:40:43.204
so you know he because he won't distribute

00:40:43.264 --> 00:40:46.327
books that are made with ai and so

00:40:46.567 --> 00:40:49.688
my distributor uh can vouch for it there

00:40:49.728 --> 00:40:52.371
are um i've got so many things that

00:40:52.411 --> 00:40:55.353
show where the and the book started

00:40:55.393 --> 00:40:58.494
looking like this about thousand ten like

00:40:58.594 --> 00:41:01.996
full color with the details but it just

00:41:02.016 --> 00:41:04.878
it the style just kept evolving and and

00:41:05.018 --> 00:41:07.639
you keep growing as an artist that's what

00:41:07.659 --> 00:41:08.721
you do and that's why

00:41:09.722 --> 00:41:10.862
You don't want to be stuck.

00:41:11.463 --> 00:41:13.764
You want to evolve when the art evolves

00:41:13.784 --> 00:41:14.545
and the way comics evolve.

00:41:14.565 --> 00:41:17.228
Yeah, exactly.

00:41:17.429 --> 00:41:19.449
And so for me, you know,

00:41:19.630 --> 00:41:22.592
and I learned art from Korean, Indonesian,

00:41:22.672 --> 00:41:23.994
and Chinese art experts.

00:41:24.474 --> 00:41:27.097
And so anyone who is familiar with art

00:41:27.117 --> 00:41:28.878
from those parts of the world,

00:41:29.440 --> 00:41:31.280
it is not like Western art.

00:41:31.762 --> 00:41:32.001
It is...

00:41:33.123 --> 00:41:36.766
That and European art has always been

00:41:36.905 --> 00:41:40.349
ahead of the curve from where America and

00:41:40.389 --> 00:41:42.889
their standards with art are placed at.

00:41:43.630 --> 00:41:46.632
And so that's what greatly influenced how

00:41:47.034 --> 00:41:47.733
I do my, you know,

00:41:47.753 --> 00:41:50.536
my comic is much closer to a Hong

00:41:50.556 --> 00:41:54.199
Kong comic really than anything.

00:41:54.318 --> 00:41:57.041
I thought you were going to be an

00:41:57.221 --> 00:41:57.782
Asian man.

00:41:57.842 --> 00:41:59.003
I'm going to be honest.

00:41:59.083 --> 00:41:59.182
Yeah.

00:41:59.603 --> 00:42:02.144
So I started doing my research on who

00:42:02.204 --> 00:42:02.784
you were.

00:42:03.786 --> 00:42:04.987
And then I was like,

00:42:05.007 --> 00:42:05.927
that name don't match.

00:42:06.387 --> 00:42:06.588
No.

00:42:07.969 --> 00:42:10.630
So my grandmother is from Taiwan.

00:42:11.251 --> 00:42:14.492
And so, you know, it's like,

00:42:15.054 --> 00:42:16.795
I have cousins that if you see us,

00:42:17.135 --> 00:42:19.476
we don't look like we should be related,

00:42:19.536 --> 00:42:21.378
but we are, we just have different dads.

00:42:22.518 --> 00:42:23.820
And, and so growing up,

00:42:24.679 --> 00:42:26.541
long before, you know,

00:42:26.561 --> 00:42:30.181
the anime boom and the Toonami and all

00:42:30.202 --> 00:42:31.081
the, you know,

00:42:31.121 --> 00:42:33.842
there was a time where you couldn't just

00:42:33.862 --> 00:42:35.503
go into a comic shop and pick up

00:42:35.543 --> 00:42:38.324
an anime and, you know, check it out.

00:42:38.585 --> 00:42:40.025
There were some comic shops that didn't

00:42:40.045 --> 00:42:40.405
carry it.

00:42:40.425 --> 00:42:42.005
There were some video stores that didn't

00:42:42.085 --> 00:42:42.686
used to have it.

00:42:43.427 --> 00:42:47.007
And so I grew up in an environment

00:42:47.027 --> 00:42:48.668
where I was used to seeing those things.

00:42:49.528 --> 00:42:50.648
That was not new to me.

00:42:50.909 --> 00:42:52.050
So when people would say, oh,

00:42:52.150 --> 00:42:52.710
I saw this

00:42:53.469 --> 00:42:56.110
this cartoon and I don't understand what

00:42:56.130 --> 00:42:57.630
it is but it was so great and

00:42:57.650 --> 00:42:59.452
I always think I like chuckle because I'm

00:42:59.492 --> 00:43:01.552
just like oh yeah wait till you see

00:43:01.572 --> 00:43:03.572
the stuff better than that like because

00:43:03.612 --> 00:43:06.172
it's so many things that are there and

00:43:06.253 --> 00:43:11.574
so for me that's been the important part

00:43:11.594 --> 00:43:14.474
and that's also why a lot of the

00:43:14.534 --> 00:43:17.175
writing on the covers that's why I use

00:43:17.476 --> 00:43:19.396
the Chinese calligraphy because it's

00:43:19.436 --> 00:43:20.376
important to

00:43:21.456 --> 00:43:23.018
It's like you have to be able to

00:43:23.097 --> 00:43:25.940
feel the intentions of the author.

00:43:25.960 --> 00:43:26.820
That's the whole,

00:43:27.041 --> 00:43:31.585
that really is a whole set of skills

00:43:31.704 --> 00:43:33.306
and ideals within itself.

00:43:33.626 --> 00:43:36.088
And so that's the motivation behind that.

00:43:36.329 --> 00:43:37.148
That's part of it.

00:43:37.509 --> 00:43:39.110
And that's, you know,

00:43:39.670 --> 00:43:40.751
if people were wondering,

00:43:40.771 --> 00:43:41.913
that is why I do it that way.

00:43:43.376 --> 00:43:43.735
No,

00:43:43.755 --> 00:43:46.039
that is really cool that it's not just

00:43:46.079 --> 00:43:47.039
because it looks cool.

00:43:47.139 --> 00:43:49.742
It's actually a familial bond for you.

00:43:50.342 --> 00:43:51.963
And that's really awesome that you're able

00:43:51.983 --> 00:43:53.266
to bring a part of yourself,

00:43:53.306 --> 00:43:56.088
your family into what it is that you

00:43:56.148 --> 00:43:56.829
are doing.

00:43:57.570 --> 00:43:59.231
And that's awesome, dude.

00:43:59.731 --> 00:44:01.373
And it makes so much more sense.

00:44:01.833 --> 00:44:04.416
And because like, you know,

00:44:05.833 --> 00:44:07.835
I don't know how other podcasters or

00:44:07.876 --> 00:44:09.817
journalists or anybody else does things,

00:44:09.876 --> 00:44:11.918
but when I get like,

00:44:12.079 --> 00:44:12.998
I'm going to look you up.

00:44:13.059 --> 00:44:14.179
I'm not just going to be like, Oh,

00:44:14.219 --> 00:44:15.721
let me figure out who this person is.

00:44:16.222 --> 00:44:17.362
I'm going to just be like, Oh yeah,

00:44:17.382 --> 00:44:17.543
sure.

00:44:17.583 --> 00:44:18.623
I'll put it down for this day.

00:44:20.385 --> 00:44:20.525
Yeah.

00:44:20.565 --> 00:44:21.985
Before I ever email you back,

00:44:22.025 --> 00:44:23.146
I've already looked you up.

00:44:23.726 --> 00:44:24.588
I've Googled you.

00:44:25.188 --> 00:44:25.949
I've done all that.

00:44:26.509 --> 00:44:26.849
Right.

00:44:29.050 --> 00:44:29.630
Oh, I'm sorry.

00:44:29.650 --> 00:44:30.411
I didn't mean to cut you off.

00:44:30.452 --> 00:44:30.811
No.

00:44:31.012 --> 00:44:33.393
And it was just, I was like, like,

00:44:33.414 --> 00:44:34.474
cause I'm expecting like,

00:44:35.775 --> 00:44:38.396
because my reach has gotten out there

00:44:38.456 --> 00:44:40.077
further because I do have some Filipino

00:44:40.117 --> 00:44:43.297
guests coming on here soon for a new

00:44:43.338 --> 00:44:45.878
manga company starting up in the

00:44:45.898 --> 00:44:46.438
Philippines,

00:44:46.518 --> 00:44:48.000
which would be really cool to have them

00:44:48.139 --> 00:44:48.320
on.

00:44:48.880 --> 00:44:50.960
So my reach is getting further and further

00:44:51.320 --> 00:44:52.121
and I love that.

00:44:52.940 --> 00:44:55.081
But I'm going to be straight up honest.

00:44:55.141 --> 00:44:57.302
I was expecting to have a Chinese man

00:44:57.322 --> 00:44:59.143
sitting in front of me or a Vietnamese

00:44:59.182 --> 00:44:59.443
man.

00:44:59.463 --> 00:45:03.003
I get that.

00:45:03.023 --> 00:45:04.264
So my shock when I look you up

00:45:04.304 --> 00:45:04.864
and I'm like,

00:45:05.632 --> 00:45:07.472
Did I misspell something and I'm like

00:45:07.492 --> 00:45:07.773
retyping it?

00:45:07.833 --> 00:45:12.617
I'm like, oh, no, it's him.

00:45:12.637 --> 00:45:12.976
It's him.

00:45:13.016 --> 00:45:14.918
He's a Jersey boy, so it's him.

00:45:15.759 --> 00:45:16.398
It is.

00:45:16.559 --> 00:45:17.420
It's me.

00:45:17.679 --> 00:45:20.661
And, you know, and I mean, I've I've.

00:45:22.851 --> 00:45:26.474
It's a lifelong thing of just,

00:45:27.153 --> 00:45:29.755
you just have to be who you are.

00:45:29.815 --> 00:45:31.538
And I mean, growing up,

00:45:32.358 --> 00:45:35.360
kids were outside playing sports and all

00:45:35.380 --> 00:45:35.840
that stuff.

00:45:36.561 --> 00:45:38.202
I was drawing my own books.

00:45:38.342 --> 00:45:39.923
I was, you know,

00:45:39.943 --> 00:45:42.606
looking at things with Greek mythology and

00:45:43.146 --> 00:45:43.726
history.

00:45:43.807 --> 00:45:46.409
And that's stuff I've done all my life.

00:45:46.510 --> 00:45:47.349
Like, I just...

00:45:48.231 --> 00:45:48.590
People are, hey,

00:45:48.610 --> 00:45:49.731
we're going to go play basketball.

00:45:49.751 --> 00:45:51.851
And I'm like, no, it's cool.

00:45:51.911 --> 00:45:54.253
But I mean, it's fine.

00:45:54.293 --> 00:45:55.672
Hey, you like what you like.

00:45:55.713 --> 00:45:56.873
That's perfect.

00:45:57.014 --> 00:45:57.253
Fine.

00:45:57.293 --> 00:45:59.793
But I just I always tell people that's

00:45:59.813 --> 00:46:00.795
just not what I'm into.

00:46:01.114 --> 00:46:02.755
And I just like to do this stuff.

00:46:02.815 --> 00:46:04.235
And this is what I've done my whole

00:46:04.275 --> 00:46:04.576
life.

00:46:06.315 --> 00:46:08.697
Absolutely nothing wrong with it.

00:46:08.737 --> 00:46:11.478
So in this era of rapid automation,

00:46:12.018 --> 00:46:14.978
what does the word craft mean to you?

00:46:16.570 --> 00:46:18.650
I think it's a skill.

00:46:19.231 --> 00:46:23.492
It's something that you develop and it's

00:46:23.512 --> 00:46:27.353
something you spend a long time trying to

00:46:27.413 --> 00:46:29.454
hone and you never get it perfect,

00:46:29.514 --> 00:46:32.335
but you keep reaching for excellence.

00:46:33.380 --> 00:46:35.862
It's like a lifetime of perfection for a

00:46:35.922 --> 00:46:37.483
lifetime of failure.

00:46:39.105 --> 00:46:40.126
There is no perfect,

00:46:40.266 --> 00:46:41.786
but you don't stop trying.

00:46:42.027 --> 00:46:47.110
You just keep going and you hone that.

00:46:47.130 --> 00:46:48.351
If you make that skill,

00:46:49.431 --> 00:46:53.094
razor sharp day after day after day and

00:46:53.114 --> 00:46:55.016
that again goes back to the longevity

00:46:55.056 --> 00:46:57.137
because if you do again you do the

00:46:57.197 --> 00:46:59.820
turn and burn sure it might float you

00:46:59.860 --> 00:47:02.260
for a little bit but eventually you'll run

00:47:02.360 --> 00:47:04.443
out of steam because you don't have the

00:47:04.503 --> 00:47:08.425
endurance to to survive but slopes down

00:47:08.666 --> 00:47:11.407
after you you come off the the top

00:47:11.447 --> 00:47:15.371
part of success and um so it really

00:47:15.391 --> 00:47:16.731
it's a skill it's just a

00:47:17.851 --> 00:47:19.333
it's something you have to just keep

00:47:19.393 --> 00:47:23.998
honing for life so are you ready though

00:47:24.579 --> 00:47:27.943
because we're about to go into the next

00:47:27.983 --> 00:47:31.786
segment indie to industry you're streaming

00:47:31.827 --> 00:47:33.809
bound you're collaborating with disney

00:47:33.849 --> 00:47:35.530
plus hulu

00:47:36.567 --> 00:47:38.628
You're also entering retail through a toy

00:47:38.648 --> 00:47:39.710
line in Walmart.

00:47:40.349 --> 00:47:41.592
But are you ready to show them the

00:47:41.612 --> 00:47:42.893
clip?

00:47:42.972 --> 00:47:44.534
We only got the sample.

00:47:44.833 --> 00:47:46.376
We got the sampler platter.

00:47:47.016 --> 00:47:48.157
We can't give them the whole thing,

00:47:48.197 --> 00:47:49.679
but I'm pretty sure they will all

00:47:50.159 --> 00:47:52.081
appreciate this sample platter that you

00:47:52.121 --> 00:47:52.942
gave us tonight.

00:47:54.364 --> 00:47:56.887
I'd very much like for them to see

00:47:56.947 --> 00:48:02.431
it and just know what you're seeing is

00:48:03.032 --> 00:48:05.994
just a little taste of what the TV

00:48:06.014 --> 00:48:08.717
show will offer.

00:48:08.838 --> 00:48:09.559
All right.

00:48:09.878 --> 00:48:10.840
Let's hit this button.

00:48:13.842 --> 00:48:18.927
Let me do it with the volume.

00:48:18.947 --> 00:48:20.027
I don't want to cheat people.

00:48:20.047 --> 00:48:20.887
I don't want to cheat people.

00:48:31.740 --> 00:48:33.322
And that's just the sampler platter.

00:48:34.563 --> 00:48:35.403
I don't know about the rest of the

00:48:35.443 --> 00:48:36.144
people out there,

00:48:36.164 --> 00:48:38.786
but when I see that hype,

00:48:39.706 --> 00:48:42.009
like I'm ready to go.

00:48:42.148 --> 00:48:42.909
I appreciate it.

00:48:42.929 --> 00:48:44.070
I, you know, and I,

00:48:44.090 --> 00:48:45.992
I was so fortunate to, um,

00:48:47.634 --> 00:48:48.233
when I got,

00:48:49.135 --> 00:48:50.416
when I got the TV deal, um,

00:48:51.362 --> 00:48:53.045
got a i got a message from a

00:48:53.085 --> 00:48:55.586
guy and he said um what is this

00:48:56.007 --> 00:48:57.509
and it was a picture of honest that

00:48:57.588 --> 00:48:59.731
i had drawn at the time and i

00:48:59.751 --> 00:49:01.333
said oh it's this character from my my

00:49:01.373 --> 00:49:02.673
series and he said i want you to

00:49:02.733 --> 00:49:05.175
call this number at exactly three p.m on

00:49:05.235 --> 00:49:07.137
monday and i didn't know what he was

00:49:07.197 --> 00:49:08.318
i thought maybe he was like an art

00:49:08.338 --> 00:49:09.699
dealer or something i didn't know he was

00:49:09.719 --> 00:49:12.242
a publisher so i was like okay and

00:49:12.262 --> 00:49:14.664
he emphasized again he said three p.m do

00:49:14.704 --> 00:49:16.626
not be late and i thought okay and

00:49:16.806 --> 00:49:19.628
So I'm checking because I'm like that area

00:49:19.668 --> 00:49:21.050
code is not where I'm living.

00:49:21.369 --> 00:49:22.771
So let me check it.

00:49:22.831 --> 00:49:23.891
Monday rolls around.

00:49:25.072 --> 00:49:27.815
I'm like timing it to make sure ringing

00:49:27.835 --> 00:49:29.755
there at exactly because he was very,

00:49:30.856 --> 00:49:31.097
you know,

00:49:31.938 --> 00:49:34.358
very sturdiest on that point that you

00:49:34.398 --> 00:49:35.320
cannot be late.

00:49:36.672 --> 00:49:40.574
So I call, and he answers the phone.

00:49:40.614 --> 00:49:42.514
And he said, good, you called on time.

00:49:42.835 --> 00:49:44.155
He said, OK, I'm here.

00:49:44.675 --> 00:49:46.135
The board of directors are here,

00:49:46.155 --> 00:49:47.795
and the president of the film company is

00:49:47.856 --> 00:49:48.036
here.

00:49:48.076 --> 00:49:49.115
You have thirty seconds.

00:49:49.215 --> 00:49:49.896
Pitch it to us.

00:49:50.336 --> 00:49:50.936
And at first,

00:49:51.376 --> 00:49:52.757
I'm thinking I'm being pranked.

00:49:53.036 --> 00:49:53.958
I'm thinking it's a joke.

00:49:53.998 --> 00:49:58.699
Like, OK, all right, who is with me?

00:49:59.039 --> 00:50:01.139
But I do my little pitch.

00:50:01.300 --> 00:50:02.420
I do the thirty second pitch.

00:50:03.380 --> 00:50:04.800
And they're like, OK, hang on.

00:50:04.900 --> 00:50:05.740
And it's inaudible.

00:50:05.940 --> 00:50:06.621
I can hear them,

00:50:06.641 --> 00:50:08.862
but I hear what they're what they're

00:50:08.882 --> 00:50:09.262
saying.

00:50:09.882 --> 00:50:12.242
And then the president of the film company

00:50:12.282 --> 00:50:13.842
gets on the phone and he says,

00:50:13.882 --> 00:50:14.224
you know what?

00:50:14.284 --> 00:50:14.764
I like it.

00:50:14.824 --> 00:50:16.063
So we're going to turn it into a

00:50:16.103 --> 00:50:16.724
TV show.

00:50:17.184 --> 00:50:18.804
We'll get you the contracts this week.

00:50:19.918 --> 00:50:20.599
And I thought,

00:50:21.298 --> 00:50:23.360
I remember I was holding the phone and

00:50:23.440 --> 00:50:24.902
I thought, wait,

00:50:25.103 --> 00:50:28.085
I can't get a publisher to publish it.

00:50:28.465 --> 00:50:30.748
I can't even get them to give me

00:50:30.788 --> 00:50:31.327
a chance.

00:50:31.708 --> 00:50:34.951
And you're telling me that a movie studio

00:50:35.211 --> 00:50:37.753
wants to turn it into a TV show

00:50:38.134 --> 00:50:38.514
to which...

00:50:39.315 --> 00:50:41.177
I get to be an executive producer.

00:50:41.277 --> 00:50:42.398
I get to be one of the lead

00:50:42.438 --> 00:50:42.878
writers.

00:50:43.820 --> 00:50:45.842
I'm involved with the art direction of the

00:50:45.862 --> 00:50:46.161
show.

00:50:46.222 --> 00:50:46.782
And I thought,

00:50:48.485 --> 00:50:51.307
this can't be happening this way.

00:50:51.788 --> 00:50:53.489
But sure enough, there it was.

00:50:54.231 --> 00:50:55.231
And so then that...

00:50:56.559 --> 00:50:59.001
that that changed everything that opened

00:50:59.061 --> 00:51:01.643
up so many doors to so many things

00:51:02.804 --> 00:51:05.485
that now I found myself saying, whoa,

00:51:06.425 --> 00:51:08.106
I didn't in a hundred years,

00:51:08.708 --> 00:51:09.768
if someone said, hey,

00:51:09.829 --> 00:51:10.688
this is going to happen,

00:51:10.708 --> 00:51:12.630
I would have never believed it.

00:51:13.411 --> 00:51:14.512
That is so amazing.

00:51:14.552 --> 00:51:16.474
Thirty seconds to change your life.

00:51:17.114 --> 00:51:18.335
Literally thirty seconds.

00:51:18.394 --> 00:51:20.856
And I just they were just like, OK,

00:51:21.016 --> 00:51:21.277
you know,

00:51:21.717 --> 00:51:23.739
and so then that that that really

00:51:25.286 --> 00:51:26.686
That, for me,

00:51:26.786 --> 00:51:30.648
it helped me to appreciate that I have

00:51:30.668 --> 00:51:34.309
to just keep learning and keep refining

00:51:34.349 --> 00:51:35.150
what I'm doing.

00:51:35.449 --> 00:51:38.331
And, you know, just that's what you do.

00:51:38.351 --> 00:51:39.771
You keep your head down and you just

00:51:39.791 --> 00:51:40.690
keep doing the work.

00:51:42.172 --> 00:51:44.172
And not getting caught up in all,

00:51:44.231 --> 00:51:46.672
you know, this and that.

00:51:47.172 --> 00:51:49.434
No, just focus on your story,

00:51:49.733 --> 00:51:50.893
focus on your craft,

00:51:51.454 --> 00:51:52.614
and just stay at it.

00:51:54.840 --> 00:51:58.664
things i i can firsthand i'm living proof

00:51:59.025 --> 00:52:01.188
things can happen that you didn't think

00:52:01.248 --> 00:52:02.489
would happen now it's different for

00:52:02.570 --> 00:52:06.833
everybody however um you know that is

00:52:06.974 --> 00:52:10.798
proof that anything is possible dude that

00:52:10.858 --> 00:52:13.922
is absolutely outstanding and that's just

00:52:13.942 --> 00:52:16.244
like the the ultimate like

00:52:17.976 --> 00:52:19.056
put it right back at them.

00:52:19.356 --> 00:52:20.177
You know what I'm saying?

00:52:20.197 --> 00:52:23.518
See, you wouldn't shake my hand then,

00:52:23.557 --> 00:52:24.318
but look at me now.

00:52:24.378 --> 00:52:30.500
Not only are you literally just eat a

00:52:30.559 --> 00:52:31.460
TV deal,

00:52:32.181 --> 00:52:36.561
you're also designing and your action

00:52:36.601 --> 00:52:40.163
figures will soon be in Walmart retail

00:52:40.202 --> 00:52:40.702
stores.

00:52:41.762 --> 00:52:45.143
I have seen the videos of the one

00:52:45.164 --> 00:52:45.744
finished one

00:52:47.068 --> 00:52:48.969
And these aren't just normal action

00:52:49.090 --> 00:52:49.610
figures.

00:52:49.710 --> 00:52:52.474
These are hefty boys,

00:52:52.514 --> 00:52:54.677
like bigger than McFarlane's size.

00:52:55.577 --> 00:52:57.039
And I think McFarlane's are seven,

00:52:57.460 --> 00:53:00.623
seven point five or something like that.

00:53:00.663 --> 00:53:01.184
Yeah, I do.

00:53:01.344 --> 00:53:03.706
Lots McFarlane size figures.

00:53:04.429 --> 00:53:05.329
Yeah, yeah.

00:53:06.250 --> 00:53:07.972
I do want... And people ask,

00:53:08.012 --> 00:53:09.411
why did I choose that scale?

00:53:09.532 --> 00:53:12.193
I always wanted action figures that were

00:53:12.454 --> 00:53:15.637
super detailed and unique and looked that

00:53:15.677 --> 00:53:15.956
way.

00:53:15.996 --> 00:53:20.019
But nowadays,

00:53:20.099 --> 00:53:21.860
those things exist and it's easier to get

00:53:21.960 --> 00:53:22.581
access to them.

00:53:22.601 --> 00:53:24.041
But years ago, it wasn't like that.

00:53:24.322 --> 00:53:25.262
It was different.

00:53:25.302 --> 00:53:27.784
But yeah, so I actually have...

00:53:29.525 --> 00:53:31.528
um of course the first figure is the

00:53:31.568 --> 00:53:34.532
prince adonis now when uh i don't do

00:53:34.572 --> 00:53:37.434
the three d sculpting um i i hire

00:53:37.454 --> 00:53:39.757
a team of people who do that but

00:53:40.018 --> 00:53:41.639
all the designs and the art are things

00:53:41.679 --> 00:53:43.382
that i've made for the series and then

00:53:43.402 --> 00:53:44.884
they take it and they build the three

00:53:44.903 --> 00:53:45.445
d sculpt

00:53:45.985 --> 00:53:48.967
And so before the first figure was done,

00:53:49.507 --> 00:53:49.927
I said, well,

00:53:49.947 --> 00:53:51.769
I just want to see how it will

00:53:51.829 --> 00:53:54.492
look to see Adonis in person.

00:53:55.172 --> 00:53:58.335
And this so is just part of his

00:53:58.375 --> 00:53:58.775
body.

00:53:58.855 --> 00:54:00.956
We didn't get to get all of it

00:54:00.996 --> 00:54:02.498
done because at the time it wasn't

00:54:02.518 --> 00:54:02.878
finished.

00:54:03.257 --> 00:54:06.019
But this is this is the Prince Adonis

00:54:06.460 --> 00:54:09.143
action figure, which is massive.

00:54:09.443 --> 00:54:13.264
twelve by five by eight when it's when

00:54:13.284 --> 00:54:15.585
it's all put together because it's one six

00:54:16.226 --> 00:54:18.248
um it will have like twenty eight points

00:54:18.288 --> 00:54:20.909
of articulation and there's like all this

00:54:20.949 --> 00:54:24.210
stuff that you cannot see that it just

00:54:24.251 --> 00:54:26.552
makes it look really fun but so that's

00:54:26.592 --> 00:54:29.172
him um and we had to go back

00:54:29.293 --> 00:54:33.114
and re making toys that's a whole

00:54:33.155 --> 00:54:35.476
different art so i had to you know

00:54:35.496 --> 00:54:35.956
they're like

00:54:37.036 --> 00:54:38.518
you know i get it but because the

00:54:38.538 --> 00:54:41.659
way the design it's so dramatic we have

00:54:41.699 --> 00:54:44.601
to account for the mobility and how we

00:54:44.682 --> 00:54:45.983
move it so we had to go back

00:54:46.063 --> 00:54:49.666
and redesign articulation for him um so i

00:54:49.726 --> 00:54:52.128
said okay while that's happening let's do

00:54:52.327 --> 00:54:54.690
one of the villains which is the shadow

00:54:54.710 --> 00:54:57.030
knight and we were able to fully finish

00:54:57.050 --> 00:54:57.411
that one

00:54:58.483 --> 00:55:01.286
so this this is the shadow knight wraith

00:55:01.306 --> 00:55:05.130
viper um which is such a cool figure

00:55:05.612 --> 00:55:08.735
oh thank you uh it's thirteen inches tall

00:55:08.775 --> 00:55:10.737
because of the thunder auroras that are

00:55:10.836 --> 00:55:12.358
that are at the top of his armor

00:55:13.179 --> 00:55:15.422
and i mean you can see the the

00:55:15.521 --> 00:55:20.007
detail is it's i mean

00:55:22.673 --> 00:55:24.695
That's absolutely amazing.

00:55:24.715 --> 00:55:25.394
All the pieces.

00:55:26.315 --> 00:55:27.135
So in the story,

00:55:27.175 --> 00:55:30.036
the Shadow Knights are this race of

00:55:30.097 --> 00:55:33.237
warriors that they thought were extinct,

00:55:34.297 --> 00:55:38.119
but they had been in secret building new

00:55:38.239 --> 00:55:40.940
alliances with new powers and doing other

00:55:40.981 --> 00:55:41.760
stuff like that.

00:55:42.300 --> 00:55:44.402
So that's the Shadow Knight.

00:55:44.842 --> 00:55:45.641
He has a cape.

00:55:45.742 --> 00:55:48.523
He has different sets of hands that he

00:55:48.563 --> 00:55:49.844
comes with and weapons.

00:55:51.364 --> 00:55:52.144
So the box...

00:55:53.961 --> 00:55:56.782
this is the box that the figure will

00:55:56.842 --> 00:56:00.224
come in by itself wow that's that's

00:56:00.784 --> 00:56:03.483
freaking awesome it doesn't come with just

00:56:03.563 --> 00:56:05.405
the box by itself like this is just

00:56:05.445 --> 00:56:07.744
the box for the figure but the figures

00:56:07.784 --> 00:56:10.025
come with accessories and all that stuff

00:56:10.385 --> 00:56:14.447
so this is the box that everything comes

00:56:14.547 --> 00:56:17.748
in is this massive box

00:56:18.596 --> 00:56:21.177
And so when people get their figures,

00:56:21.797 --> 00:56:23.239
this is what you'll see.

00:56:24.079 --> 00:56:25.300
That's the synopsis.

00:56:25.780 --> 00:56:26.880
And on the back,

00:56:28.202 --> 00:56:30.324
that shows you the Prince Adonis with

00:56:30.384 --> 00:56:33.166
three of his celestial swords out of the

00:56:33.226 --> 00:56:35.266
five that he comes with for the Ultimate

00:56:35.306 --> 00:56:35.726
Edition.

00:56:36.547 --> 00:56:38.608
So that lets you see how the rest

00:56:38.648 --> 00:56:40.329
of his body looks.

00:56:40.409 --> 00:56:43.891
And then, oh, this one has...

00:56:44.873 --> 00:56:47.074
the QR codes to the screen grant in

00:56:47.094 --> 00:56:49.335
the USA News and Yahoo.

00:56:49.514 --> 00:56:51.856
And so people can look at the articles,

00:56:51.876 --> 00:56:53.237
they can see the media coverage,

00:56:53.277 --> 00:56:54.016
stuff like that.

00:56:54.876 --> 00:56:56.677
And so it's a it's a lot.

00:56:57.197 --> 00:57:00.340
There is a lot that is going into

00:57:00.460 --> 00:57:01.440
to everything.

00:57:01.739 --> 00:57:01.960
And

00:57:03.583 --> 00:57:07.666
you know the the toys are we're still

00:57:08.188 --> 00:57:10.969
in production and getting things moving

00:57:11.070 --> 00:57:14.472
and i'm hoping by end of this year

00:57:14.693 --> 00:57:20.038
into like early then they'll be available

00:57:20.137 --> 00:57:22.480
at at uh and to to get from

00:57:22.539 --> 00:57:25.601
walmart so it just you know it's made

00:57:25.681 --> 00:57:28.824
so many moving parts so many logistical

00:57:28.844 --> 00:57:30.865
pieces to everything uh

00:57:31.686 --> 00:57:34.188
and and it's like you're having to relearn

00:57:34.208 --> 00:57:37.271
how to walk yeah for everything for

00:57:37.431 --> 00:57:39.572
everything it's just a totally different

00:57:39.592 --> 00:57:42.195
thing but it will come with a t-shirt

00:57:42.534 --> 00:57:46.197
and the weapons and power effects and it

00:57:46.297 --> 00:57:48.239
also comes with this they get the horror

00:57:48.278 --> 00:57:52.442
vacui edition so anyone who gets the toys

00:57:52.461 --> 00:57:54.184
you get the first eight volumes as well

00:57:54.224 --> 00:57:55.364
this is included with it

00:57:56.456 --> 00:57:57.978
So as you can see, I mean,

00:57:57.998 --> 00:57:58.557
that box,

00:57:58.938 --> 00:58:01.199
that box is huge and it has to

00:58:01.239 --> 00:58:03.940
be to hold everything that will be inside

00:58:03.981 --> 00:58:05.121
there.

00:58:05.181 --> 00:58:06.702
Are you using a microphone right now?

00:58:07.583 --> 00:58:07.842
Yeah.

00:58:07.983 --> 00:58:08.222
Yeah.

00:58:09.364 --> 00:58:10.605
Because when you just hit it,

00:58:10.824 --> 00:58:12.585
it gave us a lot of pop in.

00:58:13.735 --> 00:58:14.255
Really?

00:58:14.614 --> 00:58:16.275
Yeah, I don't know what it was there,

00:58:16.335 --> 00:58:18.335
but... Oh, I'm sorry about that.

00:58:18.356 --> 00:58:19.757
No, no, you're good.

00:58:20.056 --> 00:58:21.336
I just wanted to let you know that

00:58:22.137 --> 00:58:23.057
I don't know if you knew that or

00:58:23.097 --> 00:58:24.438
not, that whenever you hit your mic,

00:58:24.577 --> 00:58:27.119
it just does that popping noise.

00:58:27.518 --> 00:58:28.958
Oh, anyone who has...

00:58:28.978 --> 00:58:30.960
I don't know if it's a cord issue

00:58:31.139 --> 00:58:31.880
or what it is,

00:58:31.940 --> 00:58:33.219
but I just wanted you to know that.

00:58:33.320 --> 00:58:34.141
I'm sorry about that.

00:58:34.340 --> 00:58:35.641
No, no,

00:58:35.661 --> 00:58:37.121
that is literally nothing to apologize

00:58:37.141 --> 00:58:37.362
about.

00:58:37.442 --> 00:58:39.081
I've had worse stuff happen before.

00:58:40.061 --> 00:58:41.023
Yeah, sorry, my bad.

00:58:41.182 --> 00:58:41.523
I will...

00:58:42.947 --> 00:58:43.666
When I come again,

00:58:43.708 --> 00:58:45.289
I'll make sure I have a different setup

00:58:45.329 --> 00:58:45.849
for sure.

00:58:47.530 --> 00:58:48.570
Oh, no, you were good, man.

00:58:48.891 --> 00:58:53.054
I just wanted you to know that, hey,

00:58:53.114 --> 00:58:53.753
later on.

00:58:54.355 --> 00:58:54.835
Yeah, no,

00:58:55.014 --> 00:58:56.396
I appreciate you letting me know.

00:58:56.755 --> 00:58:57.297
Thank you.

00:58:58.097 --> 00:58:59.157
Oh, yeah, absolutely.

00:58:59.818 --> 00:59:01.940
So we've talked about...

00:59:03.695 --> 00:59:05.778
You've grown past comics now.

00:59:05.838 --> 00:59:07.201
You're moving into anime.

00:59:07.681 --> 00:59:09.545
You're moving into action figures.

00:59:10.507 --> 00:59:12.630
What was that moment where you realized

00:59:12.730 --> 00:59:16.655
Siphonic Versus was going to scale beyond

00:59:16.896 --> 00:59:17.717
comic books?

00:59:20.005 --> 00:59:22.666
um it i i think it was once

00:59:22.887 --> 00:59:26.090
i got the the tv deal that kind

00:59:26.130 --> 00:59:29.532
of just i mean that that just kind

00:59:29.592 --> 00:59:31.034
of put everything in a different

00:59:31.153 --> 00:59:33.614
perspective completely it took it from

00:59:33.715 --> 00:59:37.557
being um something completely

00:59:38.579 --> 00:59:43.360
unassuming to then saying okay maybe all

00:59:43.400 --> 00:59:47.143
those two hundred people who said no maybe

00:59:47.202 --> 00:59:48.864
just didn't really know what they were

00:59:48.903 --> 00:59:51.824
talking about and and maybe i am doing

00:59:51.885 --> 00:59:55.126
something that that is worthwhile um

00:59:55.186 --> 00:59:57.206
because you know i i mean i still

00:59:57.246 --> 00:59:58.987
question myself with a lot of things uh

00:59:59.809 --> 01:00:01.648
for those let me pinch myself to make

01:00:01.668 --> 01:00:02.809
sure it's really happening

01:00:03.110 --> 01:00:04.791
right like you want to make sure hey

01:00:04.811 --> 01:00:06.871
is this really where it's at so i

01:00:07.112 --> 01:00:09.932
that for me was the beginning of what

01:00:11.054 --> 01:00:14.635
what made me realize okay there there is

01:00:15.434 --> 01:00:18.456
something to this that could work uh

01:00:18.496 --> 01:00:22.117
despite all the setbacks and um and that's

01:00:22.137 --> 01:00:23.958
kind of where everything started to change

01:00:23.998 --> 01:00:26.679
that that way so let me ask you

01:00:26.699 --> 01:00:28.780
this there's been very few independent

01:00:28.820 --> 01:00:29.981
creators out there

01:00:31.952 --> 01:00:34.373
enter big box retail like you are about

01:00:34.413 --> 01:00:37.273
to do and not just retail but also

01:00:38.514 --> 01:00:40.494
you just need to deal with you know

01:00:40.534 --> 01:00:43.094
for your anime there's been one other

01:00:43.356 --> 01:00:45.715
that's i think todd mcfarland has been the

01:00:45.795 --> 01:00:47.617
only other person who's really gone from

01:00:47.757 --> 01:00:50.677
independent to mainstream to movies

01:00:50.998 --> 01:00:54.139
animation and action figures but he bought

01:00:54.179 --> 01:00:55.858
a whole toy company to make that happen

01:00:56.500 --> 01:00:57.460
you did not do that

01:00:58.532 --> 01:01:04.195
So how does that kind of like –

01:01:00.414 --> 01:01:01.815
how does that make you feel knowing that

01:01:02.476 --> 01:01:05.739
you're probably like one of two guys or

01:01:05.778 --> 01:01:07.780
three guys who have done that?

01:01:08.141 --> 01:01:09.481
Well, the toxic Avenger,

01:01:10.001 --> 01:01:13.065
but that's beside the point.

01:01:13.724 --> 01:01:17.967
I mean, it's – I feel like –

01:01:22.371 --> 01:01:23.713
I feel like it's one of those things

01:01:23.733 --> 01:01:25.313
that it just felt like a natural

01:01:25.373 --> 01:01:28.657
progression for what I was hoping to do.

01:01:28.976 --> 01:01:29.277
You know,

01:01:29.317 --> 01:01:31.338
it's like I always dreamed of having my

01:01:31.438 --> 01:01:33.340
own toys, my own toy line,

01:01:33.400 --> 01:01:34.621
but I never... Again,

01:01:34.661 --> 01:01:36.663
I never thought I would actually have it.

01:01:37.884 --> 01:01:39.764
And I think it's very good company to

01:01:39.824 --> 01:01:40.184
be in.

01:01:41.766 --> 01:01:42.847
You know, I didn't buy...

01:01:44.989 --> 01:01:46.110
couldn't buy a toy company,

01:01:46.170 --> 01:01:48.552
but I need a division of my own

01:01:48.592 --> 01:01:51.295
company that now makes the toys.

01:01:51.335 --> 01:01:54.297
And it's not like, you know, yes,

01:01:54.978 --> 01:01:56.858
ability to mass produce them.

01:01:57.420 --> 01:01:59.300
But that's not the goal right now.

01:01:59.360 --> 01:02:01.362
The goal is to say we're going to

01:02:01.443 --> 01:02:04.565
make them and make them in quantities that

01:02:06.086 --> 01:02:08.068
the company can handle right now.

01:02:08.188 --> 01:02:09.409
And that is in itself.

01:02:09.489 --> 01:02:10.150
Let me tell you,

01:02:10.251 --> 01:02:12.132
the cost is extremely still

01:02:12.952 --> 01:02:13.313
high.

01:02:14.054 --> 01:02:14.994
It is steep.

01:02:16.074 --> 01:02:18.117
Even with that, it's like, okay, well,

01:02:19.097 --> 01:02:20.757
that's how I'm going to do it.

01:02:21.418 --> 01:02:24.400
It's done more from a collectible

01:02:24.460 --> 01:02:25.101
perspective.

01:02:27.483 --> 01:02:29.985
It feels nice to know that I am

01:02:30.065 --> 01:02:33.407
doing something that someone like Todd

01:02:33.447 --> 01:02:37.188
McFarlane is also doing despite everything

01:02:37.208 --> 01:02:37.889
that's happened.

01:02:38.891 --> 01:02:40.411
I can't tell you how many times

01:02:41.688 --> 01:02:44.711
I have, I mean,

01:02:46.293 --> 01:02:48.135
I cannot tell you the amount of trouble

01:02:48.175 --> 01:02:50.938
that I've had from people.

01:02:51.739 --> 01:02:56.043
One magazine canceled my interview because

01:02:56.083 --> 01:02:57.005
they said, well,

01:02:57.746 --> 01:03:00.208
we couldn't verify your sales.

01:03:01.648 --> 01:03:03.168
we checked your ISBN.

01:03:03.309 --> 01:03:04.248
I said, yeah, but see,

01:03:04.268 --> 01:03:06.630
you sell them in batches to comic shops

01:03:06.710 --> 01:03:07.650
and it discounted.

01:03:07.891 --> 01:03:10.032
See, that's what you're not understanding.

01:03:10.351 --> 01:03:11.992
That's how you have to sell them in

01:03:12.092 --> 01:03:12.432
batches.

01:03:12.452 --> 01:03:13.313
It's a single ISBN.

01:03:13.512 --> 01:03:14.873
Right,

01:03:15.114 --> 01:03:17.054
you can't take that one and say you

01:03:17.074 --> 01:03:17.715
couldn't find them.

01:03:18.014 --> 01:03:19.436
And they were like, well, no,

01:03:19.456 --> 01:03:21.117
there's too many holes in your story.

01:03:21.436 --> 01:03:23.737
And I'm like, yet I'm on MSN.

01:03:24.197 --> 01:03:25.318
I'm on Screen Rant.

01:03:25.478 --> 01:03:27.840
I'm on USA News.

01:03:27.920 --> 01:03:28.780
I'm on Yahoo.

01:03:28.840 --> 01:03:29.260
Guess what?

01:03:29.300 --> 01:03:30.501
They verify

01:03:31.141 --> 01:03:34.923
everything you think yahoo or msn is just

01:03:34.943 --> 01:03:36.065
going to be like oh sure throw it

01:03:36.126 --> 01:03:37.666
up we're not going to check this i'll

01:03:37.686 --> 01:03:39.387
put it here no one's going to investigate

01:03:40.769 --> 01:03:43.891
they fact-check everything i have to

01:03:43.952 --> 01:03:47.695
provide the the evidence hey yeah here is

01:03:47.835 --> 01:03:49.757
a b and c about this and from

01:03:49.938 --> 01:03:51.918
emails from this person and these people

01:03:51.980 --> 01:03:52.039
are

01:03:52.599 --> 01:03:53.880
And it's all out there.

01:03:54.041 --> 01:03:54.342
Why?

01:03:54.442 --> 01:03:55.782
Because it's all true.

01:03:56.222 --> 01:03:58.025
So there, you know,

01:03:58.244 --> 01:04:00.547
I've encountered people who I think really

01:04:00.567 --> 01:04:01.387
at the end of the day,

01:04:02.068 --> 01:04:04.250
they didn't want to see that I was

01:04:04.329 --> 01:04:05.931
doing something that they weren't.

01:04:06.291 --> 01:04:08.472
And they actually tried to sabotage me

01:04:08.853 --> 01:04:09.273
with stuff.

01:04:09.353 --> 01:04:10.554
But, you know,

01:04:10.574 --> 01:04:11.815
those are things that it's like.

01:04:12.717 --> 01:04:15.259
that's that's you i'm just going to keep

01:04:15.278 --> 01:04:16.739
doing what i have to do and you

01:04:16.760 --> 01:04:20.463
understand forward and and um and it's

01:04:20.483 --> 01:04:23.005
worked out for you right i mean everything

01:04:23.045 --> 01:04:25.726
years it's worked out so it's like well

01:04:26.166 --> 01:04:28.309
you know i'm i'm still doing what i

01:04:28.329 --> 01:04:30.929
have to do and and i'm i'm just

01:04:30.949 --> 01:04:33.532
grateful and and but yeah i'm i'm very

01:04:33.552 --> 01:04:35.293
grateful to be sitting in that company

01:04:35.353 --> 01:04:37.815
with with um with people like that

01:04:38.775 --> 01:04:39.996
Oh, a hundred percent.

01:04:40.458 --> 01:04:42.519
So you now have distribution.

01:04:42.579 --> 01:04:43.860
We were talking a little bit about it

01:04:43.900 --> 01:04:46.182
before we went live with Filbo.

01:04:46.202 --> 01:04:49.306
We might have also mentioned it earlier

01:04:49.346 --> 01:04:51.228
when we were talking earlier in the

01:04:51.288 --> 01:04:51.748
interview.

01:04:52.329 --> 01:04:54.610
So how important was entering a direct

01:04:54.690 --> 01:04:57.873
market for long-term sustainability with

01:04:57.934 --> 01:04:59.956
Filbo as the distributor?

01:05:02.259 --> 01:05:02.438
I mean,

01:05:02.498 --> 01:05:04.380
it's very important because that opens up

01:05:04.420 --> 01:05:07.784
so many other avenues that you wouldn't

01:05:07.824 --> 01:05:10.965
have access to that way because despite

01:05:11.025 --> 01:05:13.849
having the TV deals,

01:05:13.889 --> 01:05:16.751
despite the endorsements from these huge

01:05:16.831 --> 01:05:18.032
names in entertainment,

01:05:18.990 --> 01:05:23.094
The mainstream top of the industry still

01:05:23.173 --> 01:05:25.476
makes you fight for your spot at the

01:05:25.516 --> 01:05:26.016
table.

01:05:26.717 --> 01:05:29.280
They're not so quick to say,

01:05:30.139 --> 01:05:32.402
we'll let you have a place now because

01:05:32.481 --> 01:05:34.664
you've proven yourself.

01:05:34.824 --> 01:05:38.347
I still have to fight and tend for

01:05:38.487 --> 01:05:41.148
every opportunity that way within the

01:05:41.228 --> 01:05:41.730
industry.

01:05:41.789 --> 01:05:44.692
And so having a distributor who...

01:05:47.327 --> 01:05:52.012
is grounded and wants to see creators grow

01:05:52.172 --> 01:05:55.273
and see them benefit from their work.

01:05:55.934 --> 01:05:58.036
That has been really great because now

01:05:58.717 --> 01:06:01.759
it's introduced me to so many different

01:06:01.878 --> 01:06:05.501
new comic shops that I hadn't spoke to

01:06:05.541 --> 01:06:05.942
before.

01:06:06.021 --> 01:06:06.422
And I mean,

01:06:06.603 --> 01:06:08.583
I've sold books to people all over the

01:06:08.623 --> 01:06:08.945
world.

01:06:09.525 --> 01:06:12.106
But having a distributor makes it easier

01:06:12.545 --> 01:06:16.228
for shops to be able to have your

01:06:16.487 --> 01:06:19.730
library catalog and say, oh, hey, well,

01:06:19.909 --> 01:06:21.431
I can go back and I can order

01:06:21.471 --> 01:06:23.211
the first three books because they're out

01:06:23.672 --> 01:06:25.052
and then I've got the new one.

01:06:25.253 --> 01:06:27.833
And it's been very helpful.

01:06:29.813 --> 01:06:30.795
That's really awesome.

01:06:30.994 --> 01:06:33.476
Phil Boat has a Facebook group for those

01:06:33.536 --> 01:06:34.197
interested.

01:06:34.717 --> 01:06:36.297
Their own Instagram, of course.

01:06:37.659 --> 01:06:38.278
Really cool.

01:06:38.298 --> 01:06:40.900
I have a few friends that are a

01:06:40.940 --> 01:06:42.101
part of that group and a part of

01:06:42.121 --> 01:06:43.101
that family as well.

01:06:43.541 --> 01:06:44.181
Nice.

01:06:44.202 --> 01:06:45.322
Phil is such a nice guy.

01:06:45.362 --> 01:06:46.063
He really is.

01:06:47.364 --> 01:06:50.547
he really wants what is best for creators

01:06:50.827 --> 01:06:52.889
he really does and that's that's what i

01:06:52.949 --> 01:06:55.052
really respect and appreciate about him

01:06:55.112 --> 01:06:57.375
he's not a grifter he's not a you

01:06:57.394 --> 01:06:59.737
know there are plenty of those who are

01:06:59.797 --> 01:07:01.719
in the industry there are plenty of people

01:07:01.760 --> 01:07:04.362
who will take any angle they can play

01:07:04.784 --> 01:07:06.284
and play it for their own means

01:07:06.945 --> 01:07:09.507
Phil is the guy who literally is trying

01:07:09.527 --> 01:07:12.467
to help make a difference for the mess

01:07:13.088 --> 01:07:16.329
that Diamond helped leave for so many,

01:07:17.088 --> 01:07:17.568
so many.

01:07:17.688 --> 01:07:18.869
And I mean, the creators,

01:07:19.068 --> 01:07:20.889
even big companies that may have been

01:07:20.929 --> 01:07:21.449
affected,

01:07:21.929 --> 01:07:24.570
they had so much corporate backing in the

01:07:24.630 --> 01:07:25.210
coffers.

01:07:25.471 --> 01:07:27.311
They weren't going to go under because of

01:07:27.331 --> 01:07:27.572
that.

01:07:27.911 --> 01:07:30.411
But think about smaller labels who are

01:07:30.672 --> 01:07:31.932
owed checks,

01:07:32.253 --> 01:07:34.172
owed money that they never are going to

01:07:34.233 --> 01:07:34.492
get.

01:07:34.914 --> 01:07:36.034
And it's like, well,

01:07:36.990 --> 01:07:37.391
What do you do?

01:07:37.411 --> 01:07:38.393
It wasn't that long ago.

01:07:38.512 --> 01:07:42.077
Coffin Comets went purely self-publishing,

01:07:42.177 --> 01:07:43.099
self-everything.

01:07:43.579 --> 01:07:43.900
Right.

01:07:44.402 --> 01:07:45.463
And then Zenscope,

01:07:45.722 --> 01:07:47.445
they're kick-starting now to get their

01:07:47.465 --> 01:07:47.967
books out.

01:07:48.648 --> 01:07:49.027
Right.

01:07:49.869 --> 01:07:50.150
See?

01:07:50.250 --> 01:07:51.231
So the domino effect.

01:07:53.144 --> 01:07:54.204
of that situation.

01:07:54.846 --> 01:07:56.585
It's crazy to think about because you used

01:07:56.606 --> 01:07:58.525
to be able to buy Zen scope and

01:07:58.545 --> 01:08:00.047
coffin right off the shelf.

01:08:00.387 --> 01:08:01.467
Yeah, yeah.

01:08:01.786 --> 01:08:04.588
But the actions of, you know,

01:08:05.128 --> 01:08:06.188
and it's funny, Diamond,

01:08:06.228 --> 01:08:08.588
when I when I went when I submitted

01:08:08.628 --> 01:08:08.989
to them,

01:08:09.748 --> 01:08:12.010
they told me and people sometimes think

01:08:12.050 --> 01:08:13.690
I'm joking and I send them the screen

01:08:13.730 --> 01:08:15.510
capture of the email so they can see

01:08:15.530 --> 01:08:16.110
for themselves.

01:08:16.570 --> 01:08:17.270
Diamond said,

01:08:17.810 --> 01:08:19.350
we're not going to pick up your book

01:08:19.390 --> 01:08:21.591
because we can't compare it to anything on

01:08:21.612 --> 01:08:22.131
the market.

01:08:23.097 --> 01:08:26.359
so because you can't make me want to

01:08:26.399 --> 01:08:28.740
carry it right you would think that's the

01:08:28.761 --> 01:08:31.641
that's the point of creativity is we want

01:08:31.721 --> 01:08:34.403
new we want exciting things but they

01:08:34.422 --> 01:08:36.083
wouldn't take it because they said we

01:08:36.123 --> 01:08:38.444
can't compare it to anything so we're not

01:08:38.465 --> 01:08:39.725
going to pick it up and so they

01:08:39.746 --> 01:08:42.766
didn't but in the long run yeah i

01:08:42.787 --> 01:08:45.969
was disappointed by that but look how that

01:08:46.389 --> 01:08:47.529
but now it's like

01:08:48.863 --> 01:08:50.164
It's like Guy,

01:08:50.585 --> 01:08:53.228
when he talked about Rock Lee and how

01:08:53.287 --> 01:08:55.690
he has no Taijutsu and he has no

01:08:55.791 --> 01:08:57.932
Ninjutsu, he has no Ginjutsu.

01:08:58.354 --> 01:09:00.817
He said all he has is his Taijutsu.

01:09:00.837 --> 01:09:01.337
That's it.

01:09:01.898 --> 01:09:03.118
And he said, so...

01:09:04.904 --> 01:09:07.706
what do you do you take that disadvantage

01:09:07.826 --> 01:09:10.509
and you turn it into a blessing you

01:09:10.548 --> 01:09:13.131
turn it into that superpower so it's kind

01:09:13.171 --> 01:09:16.372
of like yeah uh a lot of things

01:09:16.472 --> 01:09:17.895
didn't work the kind of way i would

01:09:17.914 --> 01:09:20.076
have hoped or needed to but you just

01:09:20.176 --> 01:09:23.179
pivot and then you discover another way to

01:09:23.238 --> 01:09:28.743
get it done and that's no that's how

01:09:28.762 --> 01:09:29.163
you do it

01:09:30.542 --> 01:09:31.182
That's awesome.

01:09:31.563 --> 01:09:33.784
So, three decades.

01:09:34.685 --> 01:09:35.826
Three decades.

01:09:35.865 --> 01:09:39.189
That is a long amount of time.

01:09:39.229 --> 01:09:43.072
What has kept you going when things looked

01:09:43.091 --> 01:09:44.832
like they were going to slow down or

01:09:44.872 --> 01:09:49.176
just completely die out for you?

01:09:52.458 --> 01:09:54.301
You need a support system.

01:09:55.402 --> 01:09:56.823
There are some fans that...

01:09:58.802 --> 01:10:01.704
we're oh thank you thank you dan i

01:10:01.765 --> 01:10:04.247
appreciate that appreciate you stopping by

01:10:04.287 --> 01:10:07.930
dan um there are some fans who have

01:10:07.970 --> 01:10:10.051
been with me for so long that they're

01:10:10.091 --> 01:10:11.573
not just a fan but they're like a

01:10:11.632 --> 01:10:13.875
friend you know and i i communicate with

01:10:13.895 --> 01:10:16.537
them you know as regularly as i can

01:10:17.457 --> 01:10:20.701
and um to know that

01:10:22.466 --> 01:10:26.627
They're always like whatever has happened

01:10:26.648 --> 01:10:29.430
or gone on with these things not working

01:10:29.470 --> 01:10:31.430
or deals falling apart, they're just like,

01:10:31.490 --> 01:10:31.791
hey.

01:10:33.511 --> 01:10:34.052
You know,

01:10:34.712 --> 01:10:38.395
we believe in you and and we want

01:10:38.435 --> 01:10:40.296
to see you succeed and we want to

01:10:40.336 --> 01:10:43.957
see it keep going and to know that

01:10:43.978 --> 01:10:47.279
there are people who are that invested

01:10:48.060 --> 01:10:49.981
that they're like, hey,

01:10:52.472 --> 01:10:53.894
Really, for all of us starting out,

01:10:54.033 --> 01:10:54.515
thank you.

01:10:54.795 --> 01:10:55.314
Oh, no,

01:10:56.095 --> 01:10:58.578
I'm happy to share my experience and my

01:10:58.637 --> 01:11:01.060
story and just encourage creators.

01:11:01.400 --> 01:11:03.042
It doesn't matter whether you've been

01:11:03.082 --> 01:11:05.583
doing it ten years, twenty years.

01:11:06.185 --> 01:11:08.726
You just keep focusing on your craft.

01:11:08.867 --> 01:11:09.887
You keep honing it.

01:11:10.387 --> 01:11:12.649
And yeah, the hits are going to come,

01:11:12.670 --> 01:11:14.190
but you just keep going forward.

01:11:14.270 --> 01:11:15.391
And that's what you do.

01:11:15.551 --> 01:11:18.375
So I appreciate your kind words very much.

01:11:19.814 --> 01:11:20.274
Absolutely.

01:11:20.314 --> 01:11:21.735
They're all well-deserved,

01:11:21.836 --> 01:11:23.997
and you've earned every single bit of it.

01:11:24.398 --> 01:11:25.337
Shout out to Donald.

01:11:25.637 --> 01:11:27.479
He just got his book funded not that

01:11:27.519 --> 01:11:28.880
long ago on Kickstarter.

01:11:29.119 --> 01:11:30.541
It's called Powerscape.

01:11:31.202 --> 01:11:31.542
Nice.

01:11:31.582 --> 01:11:32.181
Congrats.

01:11:32.242 --> 01:11:32.922
It's a book.

01:11:33.103 --> 01:11:33.943
Great dude.

01:11:35.283 --> 01:11:37.305
I won't hold anything over him because

01:11:37.965 --> 01:11:39.706
he's a Jersey and living in Canada.

01:11:41.728 --> 01:11:43.908
He's a great friend of the podcast and

01:11:43.929 --> 01:11:44.689
a great dude.

01:11:46.770 --> 01:11:47.610
That's really nice, man.

01:11:47.631 --> 01:11:48.070
Congrats.

01:11:48.110 --> 01:11:48.912
That's excellent.

01:11:50.009 --> 01:11:52.430
But so this is going to be one

01:11:52.451 --> 01:11:54.311
of those questions that I think every

01:11:54.572 --> 01:11:56.653
creator that comes on here gets asked.

01:11:57.514 --> 01:11:59.555
And what would you tell creators who are

01:11:59.595 --> 01:12:02.837
currently sitting or who are currently

01:12:02.936 --> 01:12:05.838
sitting at rejection number fifty or one

01:12:05.878 --> 01:12:08.341
hundred?

01:12:08.381 --> 01:12:08.921
Don't stop.

01:12:12.488 --> 01:12:15.789
There is no... You don't stop.

01:12:16.510 --> 01:12:18.451
If you love this,

01:12:18.551 --> 01:12:19.730
if this is what you love,

01:12:19.770 --> 01:12:20.911
this is your passion,

01:12:21.751 --> 01:12:24.152
you're not going to let those numbers stop

01:12:24.192 --> 01:12:24.412
you.

01:12:24.712 --> 01:12:25.912
You will just say, okay,

01:12:26.752 --> 01:12:27.573
I'll just keep going.

01:12:28.113 --> 01:12:30.353
And you will find a way to do

01:12:30.432 --> 01:12:30.552
it.

01:12:30.592 --> 01:12:33.673
You will find a way to overcome that.

01:12:34.033 --> 01:12:38.755
And you just have to keep going.

01:12:38.854 --> 01:12:40.315
Because guess what?

01:12:40.355 --> 01:12:40.935
People think...

01:12:42.006 --> 01:12:44.667
when you reach certain levels like i've

01:12:44.728 --> 01:12:46.748
had people say well it's easy for you

01:12:46.929 --> 01:12:49.451
you've got tv deals and you're doing this

01:12:49.511 --> 01:12:53.172
and you guess what now years later right

01:12:54.014 --> 01:12:57.315
literally three decades of of life but now

01:12:57.976 --> 01:13:01.479
you work even harder so don't have a

01:13:01.559 --> 01:13:04.680
disillusionment about the man behind the

01:13:04.720 --> 01:13:07.021
curtain that you can't think that way

01:13:07.063 --> 01:13:09.304
you'll put yourself in a box and you'll

01:13:09.323 --> 01:13:10.265
set yourself up

01:13:10.984 --> 01:13:13.828
You have to just keep going forward,

01:13:13.908 --> 01:13:17.073
no matter who doubts, who doesn't believe,

01:13:17.172 --> 01:13:18.494
who... Don't worry about that.

01:13:19.154 --> 01:13:21.137
I know that sounds easier said than done,

01:13:21.497 --> 01:13:24.061
but every day, if you're a writer, write.

01:13:24.421 --> 01:13:26.203
And people say, I have writer's block.

01:13:26.344 --> 01:13:28.087
Okay, well then study literature.

01:13:28.587 --> 01:13:30.728
actual literature not just reading comics

01:13:30.807 --> 01:13:33.389
pick up literary works and study them

01:13:33.469 --> 01:13:35.710
learn from them if you're an artist i'm

01:13:35.729 --> 01:13:38.011
having artist block okay well you need to

01:13:38.051 --> 01:13:40.292
train yourself to be able to draw

01:13:40.372 --> 01:13:42.412
regardless of how you feel see it's a

01:13:42.533 --> 01:13:44.974
skill yes it's a feeling but it's a

01:13:45.073 --> 01:13:47.755
skill that we ask about the craft see

01:13:47.795 --> 01:13:50.155
that's where that comes into play that's

01:13:50.176 --> 01:13:51.475
what you have to be able to do

01:13:51.576 --> 01:13:53.436
what i did there right see you got

01:13:53.457 --> 01:13:54.657
it all to roll back on each other

01:13:54.898 --> 01:13:55.618
man let me tell you

01:13:56.238 --> 01:13:59.201
a perfect setup for this play and and

01:13:59.480 --> 01:14:01.382
and now you know that's that's the in

01:14:01.443 --> 01:14:03.744
tandem of of what just happened see and

01:14:03.765 --> 01:14:07.729
that perfectly explains what creators have

01:14:07.769 --> 01:14:09.850
to do so you have to make it

01:14:09.890 --> 01:14:13.113
so that it is a natural reaction to

01:14:13.173 --> 01:14:15.676
what is happening so you don't give up

01:14:16.938 --> 01:14:18.399
I mean, you keep going.

01:14:19.380 --> 01:14:23.422
You dig in and you refuse to quit

01:14:23.502 --> 01:14:26.104
because that is what is going to give

01:14:26.164 --> 01:14:28.707
you the ability to overcome the other

01:14:28.747 --> 01:14:30.689
challenges that will present themselves

01:14:30.708 --> 01:14:33.411
because they don't stop coming.

01:14:33.911 --> 01:14:36.613
The hardships, the difficulties,

01:14:36.654 --> 01:14:39.036
the things that you have to face, no.

01:14:40.456 --> 01:14:42.777
The challenges just get stronger.

01:14:43.177 --> 01:14:45.759
But as you keep going,

01:14:46.179 --> 01:14:49.319
you're going to build that up and you're

01:14:49.340 --> 01:14:50.640
just going to be able to endure the

01:14:50.661 --> 01:14:52.501
things that come as they do.

01:14:53.101 --> 01:14:55.743
And that's just what you have to do.

01:14:55.783 --> 01:14:56.582
Dude, I love it.

01:14:56.922 --> 01:14:58.163
And we're going to give Donald Kraut,

01:14:58.203 --> 01:14:59.444
because he moved to Canada,

01:14:59.965 --> 01:15:02.826
complaining he traded pizza for poutine.

01:15:07.862 --> 01:15:09.023
He really is a great guy.

01:15:09.403 --> 01:15:10.382
He could take a joke.

01:15:12.984 --> 01:15:14.145
He's a friend of the podcast.

01:15:14.324 --> 01:15:15.904
He will be on the podcast next month

01:15:15.925 --> 01:15:16.345
again.

01:15:17.805 --> 01:15:19.766
I'll give him a crap again next month

01:15:19.806 --> 01:15:23.188
too.

01:15:23.228 --> 01:15:23.807
We love you, bro.

01:15:25.787 --> 01:15:27.529
I did mention I had to ask this

01:15:27.550 --> 01:15:29.632
question and I told you before the show,

01:15:29.672 --> 01:15:31.414
you can say you can laugh it off,

01:15:31.454 --> 01:15:32.176
do what you want.

01:15:32.896 --> 01:15:36.480
March eighteenth, twenty twenty six.

01:15:37.301 --> 01:15:37.622
Yeah,

01:15:37.682 --> 01:15:41.787
just just just keep waiting just a little

01:15:41.828 --> 01:15:42.207
longer.

01:15:43.149 --> 01:15:44.010
just a little longer.

01:15:44.050 --> 01:15:46.153
It's like I think about that.

01:15:46.172 --> 01:15:47.635
Thirty more days of teasing that you're

01:15:47.654 --> 01:15:48.877
dropping us.

01:15:48.917 --> 01:15:49.438
More days.

01:15:49.497 --> 01:15:50.658
It's like in Labyrinth,

01:15:51.881 --> 01:15:55.666
David Bowie's song where he says where

01:15:55.685 --> 01:15:58.029
they're at that ball and

01:15:59.813 --> 01:16:01.314
I'm just picturing that scene right now.

01:16:01.475 --> 01:16:03.456
The name of that song has just left

01:16:03.496 --> 01:16:04.077
my mind.

01:16:04.396 --> 01:16:05.899
It's what happens when you're getting old.

01:16:06.319 --> 01:16:08.600
But it's one of the lyrics in there.

01:16:08.921 --> 01:16:11.023
He said, it's only forever.

01:16:11.583 --> 01:16:12.704
It's not long at all.

01:16:13.064 --> 01:16:15.146
So it just, yeah.

01:16:15.488 --> 01:16:17.810
So you just keep waiting.

01:16:18.210 --> 01:16:20.252
And then, you know,

01:16:20.572 --> 01:16:22.094
then all this other stuff is going to

01:16:22.134 --> 01:16:22.434
happen.

01:16:22.453 --> 01:16:23.555
And it's exciting.

01:16:23.774 --> 01:16:24.055
Yeah.

01:16:24.615 --> 01:16:25.237
That's awesome.

01:16:26.837 --> 01:16:28.359
and i i did for everybody out there

01:16:28.420 --> 01:16:30.181
i did pre-gave him i did tell him

01:16:30.202 --> 01:16:31.844
i had to ask the question and i

01:16:31.863 --> 01:16:33.404
was hoping about an hour into this he

01:16:33.425 --> 01:16:34.546
would have a change of heart and give

01:16:34.586 --> 01:16:37.750
us some something i tried y'all i did

01:16:37.770 --> 01:16:39.992
try you you can't fault me i tried

01:16:40.472 --> 01:16:42.614
well trust me when when it when it

01:16:42.654 --> 01:16:45.618
does become apparent i assure you

01:16:46.738 --> 01:16:51.023
it like it's one of those moments where

01:16:51.844 --> 01:16:54.907
um it's like in phantom menace and as

01:16:54.926 --> 01:16:58.130
you realize you i like to describe

01:16:58.210 --> 01:17:00.070
everything in life with movie quotes from

01:17:00.091 --> 01:17:02.713
or quotes from books and movies and that's

01:17:02.734 --> 01:17:04.215
how i just do everything but

01:17:06.556 --> 01:17:11.059
When Sidious and Darth Maul are talking at

01:17:11.158 --> 01:17:13.099
night and he's telling him, you know,

01:17:13.179 --> 01:17:16.400
you have to go find them and follow

01:17:16.440 --> 01:17:16.841
the ship.

01:17:17.301 --> 01:17:20.862
And Darth Maul is like, oh, well,

01:17:21.322 --> 01:17:23.403
at last we're going to reveal ourselves to

01:17:23.422 --> 01:17:23.962
the Jedi.

01:17:24.042 --> 01:17:26.344
At last we're going to have revenge.

01:17:27.163 --> 01:17:29.505
It's that kind of thing where it's like

01:17:30.204 --> 01:17:32.426
that's just where you're waiting.

01:17:32.466 --> 01:17:34.046
You're waiting to be able to...

01:17:35.518 --> 01:17:39.640
share it with people that way and so

01:17:39.721 --> 01:17:41.962
yeah it's just kind of like that it's

01:17:42.042 --> 01:17:44.045
it's it's exciting and i can't wait i

01:17:44.064 --> 01:17:47.587
can't wait to to share what what is

01:17:48.208 --> 01:17:50.690
developed and what is about to happen and

01:17:50.850 --> 01:17:52.051
i'm super excited

01:17:53.927 --> 01:17:54.809
No, I appreciate it.

01:17:54.828 --> 01:17:56.229
And it's just been fun watching you kind

01:17:56.270 --> 01:17:58.511
of like tease it for the last like,

01:17:58.690 --> 01:17:59.572
you know, week or two.

01:17:59.631 --> 01:18:01.672
It's just, yeah, I got a key.

01:18:01.693 --> 01:18:01.974
You know,

01:18:02.014 --> 01:18:04.534
it's going to be amazing and everybody's

01:18:04.555 --> 01:18:05.555
going to be super excited,

01:18:05.655 --> 01:18:06.356
not just for you,

01:18:06.396 --> 01:18:07.898
but for it in general.

01:18:08.457 --> 01:18:10.158
So it's just really awesome that,

01:18:10.338 --> 01:18:10.979
you know,

01:18:11.000 --> 01:18:12.421
we're all on the edge of our seats

01:18:12.501 --> 01:18:15.061
and you know, nobody else knows.

01:18:15.382 --> 01:18:17.583
And it's just everybody else just like,

01:18:18.364 --> 01:18:19.786
what do they say about the monster truck

01:18:19.805 --> 01:18:20.105
rally?

01:18:20.126 --> 01:18:21.106
You can buy the whole seat,

01:18:21.127 --> 01:18:22.648
but you'll only need the edge.

01:18:22.768 --> 01:18:23.047
Right.

01:18:26.364 --> 01:18:28.046
I like that.

01:18:28.087 --> 01:18:28.849
That's very good.

01:18:28.929 --> 01:18:29.529
I like that.

01:18:29.649 --> 01:18:31.511
And I really appreciate it.

01:18:31.572 --> 01:18:32.132
I really do.

01:18:32.212 --> 01:18:33.815
You know, I appreciate that.

01:18:33.836 --> 01:18:34.957
And I can't wait for...

01:18:35.918 --> 01:18:37.880
can't wait for people to to know what's

01:18:37.899 --> 01:18:40.881
going on and and um yeah i'm i'm

01:18:40.980 --> 01:18:43.643
so excited and i'm so thankful and and

01:18:44.403 --> 01:18:46.944
um that i mean anything it is it's

01:18:46.963 --> 01:18:49.706
going to change everything everything is

01:18:49.746 --> 01:18:52.806
going to change literally that's it's so

01:18:52.846 --> 01:18:55.927
awesome to see good shit happen to good

01:18:55.948 --> 01:18:58.069
people man it puts a smile on my

01:18:58.088 --> 01:18:59.970
face i think i've smiled this entire show

01:19:00.551 --> 01:19:03.091
it has been absolutely a blast

01:19:03.752 --> 01:19:04.957
I've had a great time.

01:19:05.257 --> 01:19:05.518
Yeah.

01:19:08.168 --> 01:19:09.609
know i i tried something new with this

01:19:10.270 --> 01:19:12.631
tonight's episode you you've seen my my

01:19:12.692 --> 01:19:14.872
little pre-drop i did about a couple hours

01:19:14.912 --> 01:19:17.234
before the show yeah experiment with

01:19:17.253 --> 01:19:18.614
different things i tried a few different

01:19:18.654 --> 01:19:20.935
things with this one and it's just me

01:19:21.015 --> 01:19:23.056
digging into like how to do what i

01:19:23.097 --> 01:19:25.578
do better and i think that's what you've

01:19:25.618 --> 01:19:27.800
done and what i will continue to do

01:19:27.840 --> 01:19:31.702
and that is evolve as a creator so

01:19:31.862 --> 01:19:35.783
with that sting tell everybody where they

01:19:35.804 --> 01:19:36.744
can find you at

01:19:37.738 --> 01:19:40.520
okay um so you can go to

01:19:40.581 --> 01:19:44.344
symphonicverses.com which is x i m p h

01:19:44.524 --> 01:19:46.706
o n i c v e r s

01:19:46.845 --> 01:19:48.646
u s dot com or you can put

01:19:48.686 --> 01:19:52.289
symphonic verses into google it pops up

01:19:52.390 --> 01:19:55.472
i'm on instagram i'm on facebook um you

01:19:55.493 --> 01:19:58.015
can message any of the social media uh

01:19:58.954 --> 01:20:00.195
You can send a message through the

01:20:00.235 --> 01:20:00.815
website.

01:20:01.895 --> 01:20:04.056
The store is there for anyone who wants

01:20:04.077 --> 01:20:04.997
to order books.

01:20:06.018 --> 01:20:08.559
So anywhere that there is a form of

01:20:08.618 --> 01:20:09.238
social media,

01:20:09.279 --> 01:20:11.579
you can contact me and I always will

01:20:11.600 --> 01:20:12.800
make sure I get back to you.

01:20:13.180 --> 01:20:14.720
It may be later that day or if

01:20:14.780 --> 01:20:15.400
I'm really busy,

01:20:15.421 --> 01:20:16.381
it might be the next day,

01:20:16.661 --> 01:20:18.061
but I always get back to people.

01:20:20.525 --> 01:20:21.987
Yeah, even if you misspell it, y'all,

01:20:22.346 --> 01:20:23.106
it'll still take you there.

01:20:23.146 --> 01:20:23.487
Trust me.

01:20:23.867 --> 01:20:25.207
I misspelled it once or twice,

01:20:25.228 --> 01:20:26.087
and it still took me to where I

01:20:26.108 --> 01:20:26.608
needed to go.

01:20:27.929 --> 01:20:28.868
It will just pop up.

01:20:28.889 --> 01:20:30.850
Yeah, it really will.

01:20:33.390 --> 01:20:34.990
But we're going to close it out.

01:20:35.690 --> 01:20:36.891
Two hundred rejections.

01:20:38.167 --> 01:20:40.630
Thirty two years, seventeen volumes,

01:20:40.930 --> 01:20:41.590
more coming.

01:20:42.029 --> 01:20:43.551
And I know he's working on like nineteen

01:20:43.652 --> 01:20:46.372
and twenty as we speak right now.

01:20:46.993 --> 01:20:49.836
Nearly thirteen thousand copies sold

01:20:50.055 --> 01:20:53.238
without crowdfunded and now streaming

01:20:53.278 --> 01:20:54.679
adaptions in development.

01:20:55.139 --> 01:20:58.180
A toy line soon to be entering Walmart

01:20:58.240 --> 01:20:59.341
twenty twenty seven.

01:20:59.442 --> 01:21:00.662
Be on the lookout for that.

01:21:01.302 --> 01:21:03.304
And this beautiful gothic world built

01:21:03.363 --> 01:21:06.166
entirely outside the traditional world.

01:21:06.546 --> 01:21:07.466
System.

01:21:07.546 --> 01:21:11.007
Zing did not ask for permission.

01:21:11.467 --> 01:21:14.050
He built persistence into legacy.

01:21:14.529 --> 01:21:17.411
And tonight we saw what happens when a

01:21:17.470 --> 01:21:20.332
creator refuses to disappear.

01:21:21.153 --> 01:21:23.453
The Council of Nerds is now adjourned.

01:21:23.913 --> 01:21:24.373
Zing,

01:21:25.014 --> 01:21:26.755
thank you again for joining the Council

01:21:26.774 --> 01:21:30.016
tonight, sharing your journey with us.

01:21:31.149 --> 01:21:32.170
Oh, thank you so much.

01:21:32.350 --> 01:21:34.631
I appreciate the time and everyone's

01:21:34.891 --> 01:21:35.591
encouragement.

01:21:35.752 --> 01:21:38.395
And I look forward to coming back on

01:21:39.135 --> 01:21:41.657
the show and sharing more things at some

01:21:41.697 --> 01:21:42.037
point.

01:21:42.238 --> 01:21:44.319
And for everyone out there who's a

01:21:44.378 --> 01:21:44.899
creator,

01:21:45.020 --> 01:21:46.541
no matter what it is that you do,

01:21:47.860 --> 01:21:51.184
believe in yourself and do not give up.

01:21:51.543 --> 01:21:53.605
Don't, don't ever stop trying.

01:21:54.126 --> 01:21:56.868
You fight for those dreams every single

01:21:56.908 --> 01:21:57.930
day and,

01:21:58.069 --> 01:21:59.970
and you just keep going forward because

01:21:59.990 --> 01:22:01.192
that's how winning is done.

01:22:01.332 --> 01:22:03.113
That's how you do it is you,

01:22:03.213 --> 01:22:03.875
you don't give up.

01:22:03.954 --> 01:22:04.996
So that's,

01:22:05.336 --> 01:22:07.398
that's the parting advice I would share

01:22:07.438 --> 01:22:08.057
with anybody.

01:22:08.519 --> 01:22:09.739
Just keep going forward.

01:22:11.800 --> 01:22:12.962
perfectly said.

01:22:13.061 --> 01:22:14.524
And with that, ladies and gentlemen,

01:22:15.265 --> 01:22:16.828
this has been the United States Department

01:22:16.849 --> 01:22:20.315
of Nerd podcast where indie comics come to

01:22:20.355 --> 01:22:20.615
life.

01:22:20.837 --> 01:22:21.819
Y'all be safe out there.

01:23:02.005 --> 01:23:02.028
Z.