1 00:00:04,760 --> 00:00:08,457 Well, welcome to the Hot Dish comfort food for middle America. Although I'm 2 00:00:08,481 --> 00:00:12,225 not feeling very comforted. I'm Heidi Heitkamp. And I'm Joel 3 00:00:12,265 --> 00:00:15,953 Heitkamp. We're gonna talk about the election, but we don't wanna 4 00:00:16,009 --> 00:00:19,857 dwell just on that. We have more for you in this episode. 5 00:00:19,961 --> 00:00:23,777 Joel, you were pretty busy again, and thanks for picking up the slack. You had 6 00:00:23,801 --> 00:00:27,597 two really interesting interviews. We should share that you spoke 7 00:00:27,621 --> 00:00:31,301 with Pete Yocum, the executive producer of the documentary 8 00:00:31,413 --> 00:00:35,117 Odd Hours, no Pay, Cool Hat. That's 9 00:00:35,141 --> 00:00:38,957 right. The documentary is about the lives and families of volunteer 10 00:00:39,021 --> 00:00:42,797 first responders across the country. So Pete and I talked 11 00:00:42,821 --> 00:00:46,285 about how he made the movie and its ultimate 12 00:00:46,365 --> 00:00:50,093 message. Well, I mean, you and I spent a lot of 13 00:00:50,109 --> 00:00:53,851 time with the first responder in our life, and that was our father, who was 14 00:00:53,883 --> 00:00:57,627 chief of the volunteer fire department for years. And so I hope that 15 00:00:57,651 --> 00:01:00,987 you told people where they can watch this documentary, because I think a lot of 16 00:01:01,011 --> 00:01:04,795 people had our experience growing up. Yeah. And I think 17 00:01:04,835 --> 00:01:08,675 Pete alone is definitely worth their time. Good. You also 18 00:01:08,755 --> 00:01:11,691 had a really important conversation with Donovan 19 00:01:11,723 --> 00:01:15,531 Archambault. He also wrote a book, 20 00:01:15,683 --> 00:01:19,427 Failed Attempt to Kill the Indian. It's based on 21 00:01:19,451 --> 00:01:22,615 his own experience, and it's a tribute to his tribal community 22 00:01:22,965 --> 00:01:26,725 and really an important examination of 23 00:01:26,805 --> 00:01:30,381 not where we've been, but also where we're going. So good on you, 24 00:01:30,413 --> 00:01:34,197 Joel. You know, it really was, Heidi, a true honor, especially 25 00:01:34,261 --> 00:01:37,821 for November, which is American Indian Heritage 26 00:01:37,893 --> 00:01:41,021 Month. But before we get to that, Heidi, tell me what you think of the 27 00:01:41,053 --> 00:01:44,789 election of Donald Trump and the Republican gains in 28 00:01:44,837 --> 00:01:47,717 Congress. Well, you know, 29 00:01:47,901 --> 00:01:51,101 disappointment, I think, would be a good response. 30 00:01:51,173 --> 00:01:54,743 Disappointment that Kamala Harris and her team and 31 00:01:54,839 --> 00:01:58,639 a number of Democrats didn't do better. But, you know, Joel, 32 00:01:58,807 --> 00:02:02,471 I think hope is a terrible thing sometimes to have because 33 00:02:02,623 --> 00:02:06,335 it will overwhelm your rational thinking. And my 34 00:02:06,375 --> 00:02:09,823 rational thinking was, you can't have right track, wrong track numbers 35 00:02:09,999 --> 00:02:13,607 the way that the administration had right track, round track numbers 36 00:02:13,711 --> 00:02:17,391 and expect to win. And probably the only person she had a 37 00:02:17,423 --> 00:02:21,125 chance of defeating was Donald Trump. And so, you know, in 38 00:02:21,165 --> 00:02:24,861 some sad way, it's tragic that the Republicans 39 00:02:24,933 --> 00:02:28,661 didn't have, let's say, a more conventional 40 00:02:28,773 --> 00:02:32,541 candidate, because now we have four years of leadership that we've 41 00:02:32,573 --> 00:02:36,265 seen before. And I've been watching, and you've been watching 42 00:02:36,565 --> 00:02:40,101 some of the appointments to cabinet positions, 43 00:02:40,293 --> 00:02:44,101 people who I think will lead with not knowledge in facts, 44 00:02:44,133 --> 00:02:47,917 but ideology. And so elections have consequences. But 45 00:02:47,941 --> 00:02:51,549 the worst thing for the Democratic Party is to assume 46 00:02:51,677 --> 00:02:55,245 that this was some kind of Good Housekeeping 47 00:02:55,285 --> 00:02:58,965 seal of approval on Donald Trump. I think Democratic Party 48 00:02:59,005 --> 00:03:02,541 has to look in the mirror and examine why that party, which 49 00:03:02,573 --> 00:03:06,253 we say is the party of working people, can't seem to 50 00:03:06,269 --> 00:03:10,069 get working people to vote for him. Well, I think that's a perfect example, 51 00:03:10,117 --> 00:03:13,765 Heidi, of why, you know, the hot dish in one country is so 52 00:03:13,805 --> 00:03:17,623 important, because I think that we always mention middle America. But 53 00:03:17,639 --> 00:03:21,479 it goes deeper than that. They. They have forgotten. And I wrote a blog about 54 00:03:21,527 --> 00:03:24,943 this. I. I hope people go read it. Where can they read your blog? They 55 00:03:24,959 --> 00:03:28,607 can read it@kfgo.com but I think lost in all of 56 00:03:28,631 --> 00:03:32,183 this is that the Democratic Party no longer 57 00:03:32,239 --> 00:03:35,743 talks to me. And I'm gonna give you a couple examples, 58 00:03:35,799 --> 00:03:39,615 Heidi. They no longer talk to an individual that 59 00:03:39,695 --> 00:03:43,383 is worried when deer hunting opens up. They no 60 00:03:43,399 --> 00:03:47,143 longer talk to a guy that owns shotguns and rifles and, you 61 00:03:47,159 --> 00:03:50,647 know, grew up in an era where, you know, pickups still matter 62 00:03:50,791 --> 00:03:54,527 and actually still lives in that era. They no longer talk to a 63 00:03:54,551 --> 00:03:58,135 guy who's more worried about what time the football game 64 00:03:58,215 --> 00:04:00,967 starts than what time commentary is on 65 00:04:00,991 --> 00:04:04,479 msnbc. I really believe that they 66 00:04:04,527 --> 00:04:08,089 don't care about people that 67 00:04:08,177 --> 00:04:11,961 haven't graduated college and might be 68 00:04:11,993 --> 00:04:15,673 willing to wake up with a hangover. I mean, these people, Heidi, don't matter 69 00:04:15,729 --> 00:04:19,073 to the Democratic Party anymore. I mean, that's part of what I talked about in 70 00:04:19,089 --> 00:04:22,857 my blog, that it's not sexy to talk about, you know, 71 00:04:22,961 --> 00:04:26,785 the sewer pipe. It's not. But the truth of the matter is, on 72 00:04:26,825 --> 00:04:30,513 Christmas morning, it better work when the house is full of people 73 00:04:30,689 --> 00:04:34,385 and, you know, the sewer pipe and the sewer system is brand new 74 00:04:34,425 --> 00:04:38,037 or going to be brand new because of what Joe Biden did. But nobody talked 75 00:04:38,061 --> 00:04:41,749 about that. Nobody did. You know, what I heard over and 76 00:04:41,797 --> 00:04:45,557 over and over again were issues that didn't connect 77 00:04:45,701 --> 00:04:49,381 with those men and women that really come from the 78 00:04:49,413 --> 00:04:53,045 same background that you and I grew up with, Heidi. It was just 79 00:04:53,205 --> 00:04:56,305 such an intellectual. 80 00:04:56,965 --> 00:05:00,101 I don't know how to put it. Let me put it this way. 81 00:05:00,213 --> 00:05:03,887 Snobbery. Elite. How's that? Is that a word? Elitist? Yeah. 82 00:05:03,981 --> 00:05:07,579 Yep, it sure is. Well, and it's elite. The message 83 00:05:07,667 --> 00:05:11,211 tends to be elite. And I also think, though, 84 00:05:11,323 --> 00:05:14,747 that, you know, let's give her some credibility. 85 00:05:14,891 --> 00:05:18,539 She stepped in really late. I think, you know, we at least 86 00:05:18,587 --> 00:05:22,435 believed she had a chance. But at the end of the day, there 87 00:05:22,475 --> 00:05:26,251 also is it. For some reason in this country, there 88 00:05:26,283 --> 00:05:29,851 may be a bigger hurdle than what we care to admit for a woman, 89 00:05:29,923 --> 00:05:33,445 especially a woman of color, to get elected the chief executive. 90 00:05:33,945 --> 00:05:37,761 No, there's no question. I have five granddaughters and I wrote a note 91 00:05:37,793 --> 00:05:41,441 to them right off the elect after the election of what they're up against 92 00:05:41,513 --> 00:05:45,233 in this world, being girls now and future women 93 00:05:45,289 --> 00:05:48,905 that I have no doubt they're going to, going to be leaders at some 94 00:05:48,945 --> 00:05:52,737 point. The fact is it's harder for them. It's going to be harder for 95 00:05:52,761 --> 00:05:56,425 them. I agree with you. We have to give her credit. It was not 96 00:05:56,465 --> 00:06:00,285 her fault. She got thrown into the third end of the pool without 97 00:06:00,635 --> 00:06:04,315 much time to really convey what the strategy was going to be. 98 00:06:04,355 --> 00:06:08,203 But that doesn't change the fact that the party has been here 99 00:06:08,259 --> 00:06:12,011 for a long time. If you look at who won, if you look at who 100 00:06:12,043 --> 00:06:15,787 won, Joe Biden won. He beat Donald Trump, 101 00:06:15,851 --> 00:06:19,571 albeit narrowly, but he beat him. And why? Because he 102 00:06:19,603 --> 00:06:23,283 knows how to talk to the very people that I just mentioned. 103 00:06:23,419 --> 00:06:26,739 He does. He can walk in the VFW hall, he can walk in the Legion 104 00:06:26,787 --> 00:06:30,207 hall and feel comfortable. He can walk in that union 105 00:06:30,271 --> 00:06:33,927 hall and know exactly how they live and what got 106 00:06:33,991 --> 00:06:37,559 them to wear all of those stickers on their helmet. 107 00:06:37,687 --> 00:06:41,495 Right. I mean, I don't think that Kamala Harris can do that. I don't think 108 00:06:41,535 --> 00:06:45,303 many of the people that lead the Democratic Party can do that. 109 00:06:45,399 --> 00:06:49,247 So let's give people some bright news. You know, we have said at one 110 00:06:49,311 --> 00:06:52,835 country we've done numbers basically saying that 111 00:06:53,425 --> 00:06:57,113 there isn't a lot of split ticket voting and there wasn't a lot of 112 00:06:57,129 --> 00:07:00,793 split ticket voting here, but there was some. And that's how Tammy 113 00:07:00,849 --> 00:07:04,497 Baldwin, that's how Slotkin, that's how 114 00:07:04,601 --> 00:07:08,169 Gallegos, that's how Jackie Rosen, I mean, 115 00:07:08,257 --> 00:07:12,073 you go down the line, split ticket voting delivered at 116 00:07:12,089 --> 00:07:15,705 least four additional senators. And then there were senators 117 00:07:15,785 --> 00:07:19,471 who couldn't overcome that headwind. And that's Jon 118 00:07:19,503 --> 00:07:23,071 Tester who actually I think of all the senators running 119 00:07:23,183 --> 00:07:26,935 probably did the best in terms of overcoming the headwind. 120 00:07:27,055 --> 00:07:30,615 It just was so that the gale was too strong in 121 00:07:30,655 --> 00:07:33,935 Montana. Sherrod Brown obviously 122 00:07:34,095 --> 00:07:37,399 wasn't able to overcome the headwind. And 123 00:07:37,567 --> 00:07:41,407 tragically, and they're all tragic, Bob Casey wasn't able to get 124 00:07:41,431 --> 00:07:45,167 it across the finish line. And so we lost three great incumbent 125 00:07:45,231 --> 00:07:48,997 senators, didn't have any pickups and then lost Joe 126 00:07:49,021 --> 00:07:52,837 Manchin, which means that there now is a three vote majority for 127 00:07:52,861 --> 00:07:56,477 the Republican Party in the United States Senate. 128 00:07:56,621 --> 00:08:00,413 How do people who are listening to us, how do they get their 129 00:08:00,469 --> 00:08:04,269 sense across of frustration that they have with the 130 00:08:04,317 --> 00:08:07,597 direction of the party? Well, I think many of 131 00:08:07,621 --> 00:08:11,149 them are going to look at different ways they can get 132 00:08:11,197 --> 00:08:14,875 politically active. And that isn't going to be necessarily 133 00:08:14,955 --> 00:08:18,331 through the party. And I'm sorry to say that, but it's not going to be. 134 00:08:18,363 --> 00:08:22,171 The other thing is, and what I'm hearing from people here in the middle 135 00:08:22,203 --> 00:08:25,571 of this country is, I quit. You know, I'm sorry, 136 00:08:25,643 --> 00:08:29,187 but that's what they're saying is I quit. I'm hearing it on my 137 00:08:29,251 --> 00:08:32,971 show, I'm hearing it from a lot of people. So they're talking 138 00:08:33,003 --> 00:08:36,771 about doing exactly what we need to not do, 139 00:08:36,923 --> 00:08:40,668 but they are talking about it because in one country 140 00:08:40,756 --> 00:08:44,508 territory, there were out. Heidi. Yeah, but admit it, Joel, 141 00:08:44,556 --> 00:08:48,260 didn't you want to say, I'm done, I quit. I went media 142 00:08:48,332 --> 00:08:52,140 blackout is what I did. Hey, by the way, I saw the 143 00:08:52,172 --> 00:08:55,944 cookies. I saw the dinner rolls. You could have sent me a few. Cookies 144 00:08:57,484 --> 00:09:01,028 for those listeners out there. I'm convalescing by taking up 145 00:09:01,076 --> 00:09:04,892 baking. I'm done raising pumpkins now. And so I bake 146 00:09:04,948 --> 00:09:08,523 cookies and dinner rolls in the last couple of days. But I 147 00:09:08,539 --> 00:09:12,171 mean, here's the truth. If you want 148 00:09:12,203 --> 00:09:15,619 to sit there as a person and say, look, 149 00:09:15,747 --> 00:09:19,355 these people, the Trump people get to define me, then 150 00:09:19,395 --> 00:09:23,211 fine, quit, then quit. But if, and I'll 151 00:09:23,243 --> 00:09:26,851 use this scenario of dad again, right? Go ahead, quit. 152 00:09:26,923 --> 00:09:30,435 Go home. You don't got to play anymore, but you're going to miss playing ball. 153 00:09:30,595 --> 00:09:34,291 I mean, we're about to find out how vicious this all 154 00:09:34,323 --> 00:09:38,115 can be. And we're going to. We are absolutely going to. 155 00:09:38,235 --> 00:09:41,307 And so if you just want to sit back and watch, sit back and watch. 156 00:09:41,371 --> 00:09:45,003 But I think in the middle of this country, what, what the leader, 157 00:09:45,059 --> 00:09:48,335 whoever that future leader is, needs to call 158 00:09:48,675 --> 00:09:52,363 people from the middle of this country and say, come talk to 159 00:09:52,379 --> 00:09:55,291 me, I need to talk to you. I was in a cab on the way 160 00:09:55,323 --> 00:09:59,131 back from New York doing television for almost 36 hours 161 00:09:59,203 --> 00:10:02,997 straight. And, you know, I, I, I, I put on the happy face, 162 00:10:03,061 --> 00:10:06,533 Joel, and you know, I was ready to not be happy face. 163 00:10:06,589 --> 00:10:10,357 And, and the cab driver felt so bad for me, he got 164 00:10:10,381 --> 00:10:14,225 out and gave me, he's Nigerian. 165 00:10:16,005 --> 00:10:19,325 And I hadn't cried until then. And he just, he was 166 00:10:19,365 --> 00:10:23,189 Nigerian and immigrant, told me how hard he works, told me that he too 167 00:10:23,237 --> 00:10:27,025 had cried. And, and then he said, but never forget this. 168 00:10:27,755 --> 00:10:31,603 This is the most wonderful, beautiful country in the history of 169 00:10:31,619 --> 00:10:35,427 the world. And it really took kind of that calibration. And 170 00:10:35,451 --> 00:10:39,015 I thought, okay, you could quit. You can sit on the sidelines, 171 00:10:39,315 --> 00:10:43,019 but you're going to get the same result. And this 172 00:10:43,067 --> 00:10:46,707 administration now has to govern. I want to take a picture 173 00:10:46,771 --> 00:10:49,763 of the price of eggs. I want to take the picture of a price of 174 00:10:49,779 --> 00:10:53,447 a loaf of bread. And then every week, say, hasn't come 175 00:10:53,471 --> 00:10:56,823 down yet. Here's the picture. A lot was 176 00:10:56,879 --> 00:11:00,455 promised. I don't know how he can possibly 177 00:11:00,615 --> 00:11:04,239 deliver the kind of bread and butter, meat and potatoes, or 178 00:11:04,287 --> 00:11:08,095 macaroni and cheese promises that were made. I don't think it's 179 00:11:08,135 --> 00:11:11,775 going to happen. And, you know, the accountability that 180 00:11:11,855 --> 00:11:15,647 we can, in fact, be responsible for, because that is the 181 00:11:15,671 --> 00:11:19,433 job of the opposition party. The accountability is a huge 182 00:11:19,489 --> 00:11:23,201 part of, hopefully, the strategy. Well, but I would add 183 00:11:23,233 --> 00:11:26,833 this. I agree with your Nigerian friend or your new Nigerian 184 00:11:26,889 --> 00:11:30,721 friend. I agree with him. This is a great 185 00:11:30,793 --> 00:11:34,457 country. I don't dispute that. But what we also found out about this 186 00:11:34,521 --> 00:11:38,361 country is we're not that different than other 187 00:11:38,433 --> 00:11:41,865 countries. I mean, we're not. You know, I know that sounds 188 00:11:41,905 --> 00:11:45,751 negative. I don't care. It's something we need to take a 189 00:11:45,783 --> 00:11:48,951 step back and ask ourselves how we fix. 190 00:11:49,023 --> 00:11:52,195 Because what we found out was we could 191 00:11:52,575 --> 00:11:55,983 elect an individual where it doesn't 192 00:11:56,079 --> 00:11:59,711 matter if eggs go up under his watch. It 193 00:11:59,743 --> 00:12:03,399 only mattered if eggs went up under the previous 194 00:12:03,487 --> 00:12:06,975 watch. And until the American people can get done 195 00:12:07,055 --> 00:12:10,823 idolizing someone like him, we're not going to move forward. 196 00:12:10,879 --> 00:12:14,235 And I've got one more point to make, Heidi. On my show, 197 00:12:14,545 --> 00:12:18,353 when I say. Because the majority of my audience is Republican, 198 00:12:18,409 --> 00:12:21,577 very, very conservative Republican, when I say to them, 199 00:12:21,721 --> 00:12:25,377 look, this is the man that you want your kids 200 00:12:25,441 --> 00:12:29,025 to emulate. This is the man that. That you are 201 00:12:29,105 --> 00:12:32,685 proud to have as president and that you love. 202 00:12:33,065 --> 00:12:36,913 My phone lines light up. They just light up. They say that's not what we. 203 00:12:36,969 --> 00:12:40,773 That. I bet you they're all really defensive. Nope, nope, nope, nope, 204 00:12:40,869 --> 00:12:44,429 nope, nope. I just like his policies. I just, like. I just. 205 00:12:44,477 --> 00:12:48,205 I don't care much for him. I just. Yeah, you do care 206 00:12:48,245 --> 00:12:51,701 for him, because he's going to be that Grover 207 00:12:51,813 --> 00:12:55,397 Cleveland face above the blackboard. Yeah. 208 00:12:55,461 --> 00:12:58,869 Now there is no blackboard anymore, I realized. But those little 209 00:12:58,917 --> 00:13:02,245 circle pictures that were above that blackboard in Mrs. 210 00:13:02,285 --> 00:13:05,665 Stack's room matter to me. And you know what? 211 00:13:06,775 --> 00:13:10,355 They just elected a convicted rapist felon. 212 00:13:10,655 --> 00:13:14,167 And it doesn't matter what eggs are to these 213 00:13:14,231 --> 00:13:17,815 guys. It matters whether or not they get to be close to 214 00:13:17,855 --> 00:13:21,575 him and whether or not they get to be as cool as 215 00:13:21,615 --> 00:13:25,455 him. And so, Heidi, we proved 216 00:13:25,535 --> 00:13:28,991 that we can be a country no different than many other 217 00:13:29,063 --> 00:13:32,401 countries. And that doesn't mean I don't love this country. Yeah. 218 00:13:32,473 --> 00:13:36,313 Okay. Well, listen, Joel, it's always fun. We're going 219 00:13:36,329 --> 00:13:39,833 to continue to be here and we're going to continue to talk and we're going 220 00:13:39,849 --> 00:13:43,521 to continue to be a voice for real America. So this isn't the last 221 00:13:43,593 --> 00:13:47,401 conversation, but we're going to move forward from here and listen to Joel 222 00:13:47,433 --> 00:13:48,485 and Donovan. 223 00:13:52,985 --> 00:13:56,417 You know, this is a real honor for me, ladies and gentlemen. I get a 224 00:13:56,441 --> 00:13:59,729 chance to visit with Donovan Archambault. He is a tribal 225 00:13:59,777 --> 00:14:03,615 member, born in Fort Belknap, Montana. Now, 226 00:14:03,735 --> 00:14:07,415 you can't just easily go through his resume or his 227 00:14:07,455 --> 00:14:10,895 life, quite frankly. He went to Harvard, holds a master's of 228 00:14:10,935 --> 00:14:14,487 education degree, served as director of the tribal health 229 00:14:14,551 --> 00:14:18,271 Department, later his tribal planning department. But here's, here's one 230 00:14:18,303 --> 00:14:21,951 for you folks. 16 years on the tribal council, including 231 00:14:22,063 --> 00:14:25,759 two as chair. We're going to talk to him about his 232 00:14:25,807 --> 00:14:29,615 book, Tatanga Hoksheen. A Failed Attempt 233 00:14:29,695 --> 00:14:33,471 to Kill the Indian is the name of the book. It's a work 234 00:14:33,503 --> 00:14:37,287 of fiction, but unfortunately there's just a lot of 235 00:14:37,351 --> 00:14:41,151 truth in of it. Donovan Arshambo, thank you for joining 236 00:14:41,183 --> 00:14:44,991 us, sir. It's a real honor. Thank you for having me, sir. I hope 237 00:14:45,023 --> 00:14:48,767 I can add some things to what happened to us 238 00:14:48,911 --> 00:14:52,401 in boarding schools and things that the 239 00:14:52,543 --> 00:14:56,061 need to they talk about. You 240 00:14:56,093 --> 00:14:59,837 bet they do. And clearly by reading some 241 00:14:59,861 --> 00:15:03,573 of the excerpts of the bill or the book, I should say 242 00:15:03,749 --> 00:15:07,349 they do need to talk about it. Now this, the plot of this book is 243 00:15:07,477 --> 00:15:11,045 about a 10 year old that was, that was forced 244 00:15:11,125 --> 00:15:14,077 into the pier Indian school in South Dakota, government 245 00:15:14,141 --> 00:15:17,869 institution with one goal and that was to kill 246 00:15:17,957 --> 00:15:21,675 the Indian, save the man. What does that mean, 247 00:15:21,715 --> 00:15:25,531 Mr. Arshambeau? Well, it means that we had to make 248 00:15:25,563 --> 00:15:29,403 a drastic change in our whole culture, 249 00:15:29,539 --> 00:15:33,095 religion, our whole lifestyle. And 250 00:15:33,675 --> 00:15:37,147 what it's done to us is evident today 251 00:15:37,251 --> 00:15:40,819 in all these social ills and the high statistics 252 00:15:40,867 --> 00:15:44,335 of Indian alcoholism, drug abuse, 253 00:15:44,635 --> 00:15:48,287 suicide and things like that. And I didn't even know the 254 00:15:48,311 --> 00:15:52,007 word suicide. Never even heard of it before I went 255 00:15:52,031 --> 00:15:55,671 to boarding school. And not that boarding school is 256 00:15:55,703 --> 00:15:58,935 a direct result of it, but it shows 257 00:15:58,975 --> 00:16:02,471 that it possibly could BE so. 258 00:16:02,623 --> 00:16:05,671 The US Department of the Interior has identified 259 00:16:05,783 --> 00:16:09,567 408 government backed Indian schools in 260 00:16:09,631 --> 00:16:13,011 37 states over 150 years. I grew 261 00:16:13,043 --> 00:16:16,171 up right next to one of those in the 262 00:16:16,203 --> 00:16:20,035 Sistinhwapatin Lakota tribe. The schools 263 00:16:20,075 --> 00:16:23,819 forced children to have English names and work manual 264 00:16:23,907 --> 00:16:27,475 labor. Did that actually happen to you as well, 265 00:16:27,515 --> 00:16:31,203 Donovan? Well, that happened to us before I 266 00:16:31,219 --> 00:16:34,987 went down and I had my English name, but living with 267 00:16:35,011 --> 00:16:38,697 my grandfolks, my name was Totonga Hoshide. That's what 268 00:16:38,721 --> 00:16:42,225 I answered to. So I had a home name and a school name 269 00:16:42,345 --> 00:16:45,609 when I started school, but my name was 270 00:16:45,657 --> 00:16:49,105 already Donovan Archamble when I went to 271 00:16:49,145 --> 00:16:52,617 Pierre. So really, the name you 272 00:16:52,681 --> 00:16:56,241 use in the book is your name. I realize this is a work of 273 00:16:56,273 --> 00:16:59,657 fiction, but it certainly is patterned after 274 00:16:59,841 --> 00:17:03,625 your life. I want people to understand that are 275 00:17:03,665 --> 00:17:06,909 taking in this conversation what that was 276 00:17:06,957 --> 00:17:10,613 like, what the book not just portrays, 277 00:17:10,709 --> 00:17:14,405 but actually did happen. If you would, sir. Well, 278 00:17:14,445 --> 00:17:18,093 I would say that probably 90% of the 279 00:17:18,189 --> 00:17:21,385 things that I write about actually happened. 280 00:17:22,205 --> 00:17:25,885 They happened to myself. And in some instances 281 00:17:26,005 --> 00:17:29,781 I didn't remember the person's name. And 282 00:17:29,893 --> 00:17:33,165 so I can insert other names or my own 283 00:17:33,205 --> 00:17:36,701 name and things that happened, but the actual 284 00:17:36,773 --> 00:17:39,865 events, the things that I write about 285 00:17:40,365 --> 00:17:42,905 actually happened. There was some 286 00:17:43,845 --> 00:17:47,469 things I had to kind of fill in because I didn't 287 00:17:47,517 --> 00:17:51,357 remember the exact details of how it 288 00:17:51,421 --> 00:17:55,205 actually happened or I was there, but I wasn't 289 00:17:55,245 --> 00:17:58,821 in the immediate location where it actually happened. And 290 00:17:58,933 --> 00:18:02,761 I heard some of the events that happened from my 291 00:18:02,873 --> 00:18:06,697 friends and from other matrons, teachers and things like 292 00:18:06,721 --> 00:18:10,425 that. With your background as an educator, as 293 00:18:10,465 --> 00:18:14,009 someone so highly educated, as somebody who 294 00:18:14,057 --> 00:18:17,521 worked within the tribe to try to make lives better, 295 00:18:17,673 --> 00:18:21,345 I guess I gotta ask you this. How many people do you 296 00:18:21,385 --> 00:18:24,977 think know what you're writing about here? 297 00:18:25,161 --> 00:18:28,285 Well, I believe other than tribal 298 00:18:28,615 --> 00:18:32,183 members and the students that I went to school with, 299 00:18:32,319 --> 00:18:35,759 I think very little of the greater 300 00:18:35,807 --> 00:18:39,647 population know these things actually happened. I know 301 00:18:39,671 --> 00:18:43,407 we tried to tell other people, but we were 302 00:18:43,551 --> 00:18:46,983 labeled liars or fabricators or something 303 00:18:47,159 --> 00:18:50,655 that, no, this really didn't happen. And I went 304 00:18:50,695 --> 00:18:54,535 to Carlisle in 1990 and 305 00:18:54,575 --> 00:18:58,093 sat on the panel discussing things that 306 00:18:58,149 --> 00:19:01,261 happened there. And on that panel there was a 307 00:19:01,333 --> 00:19:05,065 priest, myself, some historian, 308 00:19:06,285 --> 00:19:10,045 reporter and a teacher. Some. There was 309 00:19:10,085 --> 00:19:13,845 five of us on the panel and I mentioned the fact 310 00:19:13,885 --> 00:19:17,461 that, yeah, there was abuse, sexual abuse, and 311 00:19:17,493 --> 00:19:21,341 the priest was on the other end of the table from me, stood up 312 00:19:21,373 --> 00:19:25,189 and looked directly at me and said, now that can be true because 313 00:19:25,237 --> 00:19:28,977 our people aren't like that. And I told him, father, are you calling 314 00:19:29,001 --> 00:19:32,505 me a liar? I don't let anybody call me a liar. And if you don't 315 00:19:32,545 --> 00:19:36,041 apologize, I'm coming down there. And of course 316 00:19:36,153 --> 00:19:39,753 he apologized. The colonel sat me back down 317 00:19:39,929 --> 00:19:43,529 and I came home after that. And three weeks 318 00:19:43,577 --> 00:19:47,097 later, or a month later, three inch headlines in the Boston 319 00:19:47,161 --> 00:19:50,529 Globe. Priests molest altar Boy and all hell broke 320 00:19:50,577 --> 00:19:54,245 loose. I reported that in 1951. 321 00:19:54,425 --> 00:19:58,221 But it had no consequences except me getting beat up 322 00:19:58,253 --> 00:20:02,013 because I said something about the priest and it 323 00:20:02,029 --> 00:20:05,605 didn't sit well with the administration and I was 324 00:20:05,645 --> 00:20:09,109 punished for that. I want to talk to you about 325 00:20:09,237 --> 00:20:12,773 the way you chose to tell this story through 326 00:20:12,829 --> 00:20:16,189 fiction. Why did you choose fiction to tell this? 327 00:20:16,317 --> 00:20:20,093 Basically, it's a true story. Well, basically I didn't 328 00:20:20,149 --> 00:20:23,749 remember a lot of the names. I didn't remember the 329 00:20:23,797 --> 00:20:27,389 exact times, the dates. I didn't remember exactly 330 00:20:27,437 --> 00:20:31,261 from one year to the next because they all kind of ran together. 331 00:20:31,453 --> 00:20:35,237 You know, there was no break, there was no going home, no listening to 332 00:20:35,261 --> 00:20:38,661 your grandparents, no listening to your parents. My 333 00:20:38,693 --> 00:20:42,485 parent down there was a whistle. The whistle blew at 6:00. 334 00:20:42,525 --> 00:20:46,285 You jump up, make your bed. Whistle blew again. You lined up, you've done your 335 00:20:46,325 --> 00:20:49,805 exercise. Whistle blew again. You went to dining hall at 336 00:20:49,845 --> 00:20:53,169 8. Whistleblow again. He lined up, went to 337 00:20:53,217 --> 00:20:56,881 school, whistleblow again. So that was my, that was 338 00:20:56,913 --> 00:21:00,569 my parenting experience at Pier. And 339 00:21:00,617 --> 00:21:04,337 so, you know, we really didn't have any kind of direction 340 00:21:04,401 --> 00:21:07,945 except do what we tell you. We marched every 341 00:21:07,985 --> 00:21:11,681 place two by two, to school, to the dining hall, 342 00:21:11,833 --> 00:21:15,329 to church, to wherever we went. And it was a big 343 00:21:15,377 --> 00:21:19,065 tongue, military practice on how we were 344 00:21:19,225 --> 00:21:22,657 taken care of. How did you get into the 345 00:21:22,721 --> 00:21:26,537 school? What, what was the reason that I don't know if I 346 00:21:26,561 --> 00:21:30,377 should use the word enrolled or placed or. How did you get 347 00:21:30,401 --> 00:21:33,601 into the school, Mr. Archambault? My mother and father 348 00:21:33,673 --> 00:21:37,441 separated and we were more or less orphaned. 349 00:21:37,553 --> 00:21:41,265 My mother still cared for us, did the best she 350 00:21:41,305 --> 00:21:45,155 could. But although there was about six or seven of us still at 351 00:21:45,195 --> 00:21:48,683 home. So we had a choice. We either had to go to 352 00:21:48,699 --> 00:21:52,515 boarding school or we had to go to a foster home. And one of my 353 00:21:52,555 --> 00:21:56,355 uncles wanted to keep us, keep me anyway. And the 354 00:21:56,395 --> 00:21:59,899 social services here at the bureau wouldn't allow it because he 355 00:21:59,947 --> 00:22:03,603 already had five or six kids of his own. So I had, 356 00:22:03,659 --> 00:22:07,371 like I said, I had a choice of foster home or peer. So I 357 00:22:07,403 --> 00:22:10,693 chose peer because I heard all the wild stories about 358 00:22:10,819 --> 00:22:14,385 foster homes and how kids were training and so I chose 359 00:22:14,465 --> 00:22:17,801 boating school. Ladies and gentlemen, you're listening to Donovan 360 00:22:17,833 --> 00:22:21,609 Archambault, a member of the Assiniboine tribe. 361 00:22:21,657 --> 00:22:24,737 His new BIC is just absolutely 362 00:22:24,801 --> 00:22:28,609 amazing. Basically something that is 363 00:22:28,657 --> 00:22:32,329 focused on a failed attempt to kill the Indian. You 364 00:22:32,377 --> 00:22:35,961 talked about suicides, but one of the 365 00:22:36,033 --> 00:22:39,625 points, you know, as you look at it, the US Department of the Interior 366 00:22:39,705 --> 00:22:43,253 identifying those 408 government backed 367 00:22:43,429 --> 00:22:46,989 Indian schools in 37 states over 150 368 00:22:47,037 --> 00:22:50,381 years. They talk about hundreds of children 369 00:22:50,533 --> 00:22:54,109 dying in these schools, hundreds dying. 370 00:22:54,277 --> 00:22:58,101 I actually had a couple of my family members that went to 371 00:22:58,133 --> 00:23:01,925 Pier actually commit suicide. One shot herself 372 00:23:02,045 --> 00:23:05,669 and the other one just Drake himself. Death, broken 373 00:23:05,717 --> 00:23:09,553 artery somewhere and bled to death leaning over a toilet bowl. That's 374 00:23:09,569 --> 00:23:13,017 how he died. But he stayed drunk almost his whole life. 375 00:23:13,161 --> 00:23:16,841 And to me, alcoholism is suicide. You know, once 376 00:23:16,873 --> 00:23:20,617 you start that and you don't get away from it, it's going to kill you. 377 00:23:20,681 --> 00:23:24,137 And that's suicide to me. I stayed drunk for 25 378 00:23:24,201 --> 00:23:27,801 years trying to wash away the shame and the anger 379 00:23:27,953 --> 00:23:31,449 that we acquired going to school. I want to talk 380 00:23:31,497 --> 00:23:35,191 about people recognizing and basically 381 00:23:35,383 --> 00:23:38,919 respecting your life and others that you write about in this 382 00:23:38,967 --> 00:23:42,315 book. I want to talk, if we can, a little bit about 383 00:23:42,775 --> 00:23:46,367 testifying and publicly sharing, because clearly 384 00:23:46,431 --> 00:23:49,999 that's what you're doing here. Is there responsibility there, 385 00:23:50,047 --> 00:23:53,615 sir? Definitely. I think the responsibility is with the 386 00:23:53,655 --> 00:23:57,295 federal government, is if you can teach us all 387 00:23:57,335 --> 00:24:00,857 these things that have brought us to where we're at now, 388 00:24:00,991 --> 00:24:04,685 then we can. We can unlearn those kind of things and get 389 00:24:04,725 --> 00:24:08,389 back on the right track. In my class, I teach 390 00:24:08,437 --> 00:24:12,221 my students. You know, we're sitting on a fence now, a fence here. 391 00:24:12,333 --> 00:24:16,157 The old way and the new way. The old way, we 392 00:24:16,181 --> 00:24:19,869 had respect, discipline. We respected our parents. We 393 00:24:19,917 --> 00:24:23,549 never answered back. The new way, we're alcoholic, 394 00:24:23,637 --> 00:24:27,407 drug addicts, and we know that didn't work for us. So 395 00:24:27,431 --> 00:24:31,271 we have an opportunity, and I think it falls 396 00:24:31,303 --> 00:24:34,839 on everybody from the parents to Congress to 397 00:24:34,887 --> 00:24:38,719 wherever we have, to begin to teach the values 398 00:24:38,767 --> 00:24:42,607 that made us who we are in the beginning. That's what I'm 399 00:24:42,631 --> 00:24:46,239 trying to teach. I'm trying to say we need to go back to 400 00:24:46,367 --> 00:24:49,911 when your parents tell you to go wash 401 00:24:49,943 --> 00:24:53,681 dishes and go wash dishes. What is a society 402 00:24:53,793 --> 00:24:57,145 do we need to do? I think the 403 00:24:57,185 --> 00:25:01,009 society had an opportunity to look at what was 404 00:25:01,057 --> 00:25:04,713 going on from the very beginning. But there's only one 405 00:25:04,769 --> 00:25:08,321 man that I read about. He's my favorite 406 00:25:08,393 --> 00:25:11,809 artist, and that's C.M. russell. In one of his 407 00:25:11,857 --> 00:25:15,561 books, he drew a picture of an Indian sitting in the shade of his 408 00:25:15,593 --> 00:25:19,371 horse. And the caption under that picture was, the 409 00:25:19,403 --> 00:25:22,803 red man is the true American. He is almost gone 410 00:25:22,859 --> 00:25:26,675 now. The earth was his mother, son was his God, 411 00:25:26,795 --> 00:25:30,395 and all Outdoors was his Bible, and he knew 412 00:25:30,435 --> 00:25:34,099 every page. But he's the only one that 413 00:25:34,147 --> 00:25:37,891 seen us like that, and Nobody heard him. Mr. Archambault, 414 00:25:37,923 --> 00:25:41,203 this has been a real honor. DONOVAN Archambault, 415 00:25:41,259 --> 00:25:44,915 Senior I would say it's safe to say you Found your 416 00:25:44,955 --> 00:25:48,661 purpose, sir. Thank you for joining us on One Country. Thank you for having 417 00:25:48,693 --> 00:25:49,265 me. 418 00:25:54,405 --> 00:25:57,821 I'm excited to talk to Pete Yokum about his documentary 419 00:25:57,893 --> 00:26:01,613 film Odd Hours, no Pay, Cool Hat. Five 420 00:26:01,669 --> 00:26:05,229 years ago, he began a project focusing on volunteer 421 00:26:05,277 --> 00:26:08,933 firefighters and the risks they take for their communities, 422 00:26:09,029 --> 00:26:12,569 especially rural America. And that's daily 423 00:26:12,717 --> 00:26:16,113 in his movie. He dives deep into the lives 424 00:26:16,209 --> 00:26:19,593 and families of volunteer first responders spread 425 00:26:19,689 --> 00:26:23,465 across the country. And Pete began this film as a personal quest to 426 00:26:23,505 --> 00:26:27,153 find the answers to the question, why would anybody do 427 00:26:27,169 --> 00:26:30,993 it? Why would somebody put themselves in harm's way 428 00:26:31,169 --> 00:26:34,825 while leaving their job and family to respond to a neighbor's 429 00:26:34,865 --> 00:26:38,635 emergency with little or no pay? Pete, 430 00:26:38,675 --> 00:26:42,187 thanks for joining me on the Hot Dish. Appreciate it, Joel. You know, I'm just 431 00:26:42,211 --> 00:26:45,739 going to be upfront with you, Pete. All I saw was the trailer, but after 432 00:26:45,787 --> 00:26:49,587 seeing the trailer, I'm going to see it. I'm going to see the work. 433 00:26:49,651 --> 00:26:53,227 Because what you just showed is really the world I live 434 00:26:53,251 --> 00:26:56,987 in. Well, it's worth it. You'll be able to see it on some of the 435 00:26:57,011 --> 00:27:00,555 PBS stations coming up here soon. But you can also 436 00:27:00,635 --> 00:27:03,987 download it in the full original version from 437 00:27:04,091 --> 00:27:07,893 Apple, from Amazon Prime. You can even get it 438 00:27:07,909 --> 00:27:11,557 on airplanes for longer flights. Something started this up. 439 00:27:11,621 --> 00:27:15,413 Something got in your head. Why the project? Now, let me make 440 00:27:15,429 --> 00:27:18,945 sure you know the name of it, folks. Odd Hours, no Pay, 441 00:27:19,245 --> 00:27:23,045 Cool Hat. Which, by the way, in and of itself is a cool 442 00:27:23,125 --> 00:27:26,941 name, Pete. But something made you do this. What was it? 443 00:27:27,133 --> 00:27:30,957 I wanted to find a project that 444 00:27:31,021 --> 00:27:34,589 would allow me to prove to myself that 445 00:27:34,677 --> 00:27:38,463 Americans are a lot more similar than politicians and 446 00:27:38,519 --> 00:27:42,231 social media channels would have us believe. So I 447 00:27:42,263 --> 00:27:45,855 began looking for Americans that were contributing something 448 00:27:45,935 --> 00:27:49,135 very significant to our society, but who weren't very 449 00:27:49,175 --> 00:27:52,235 well known or recognized for that contribution. 450 00:27:52,735 --> 00:27:56,335 Okay, well, how did you pick them? Because 451 00:27:56,455 --> 00:27:59,503 you and I both know there are so many 452 00:27:59,639 --> 00:28:03,375 individuals out there that fit the criteria of the 453 00:28:03,415 --> 00:28:06,915 story you're trying to tell. I mean, something made you 454 00:28:07,415 --> 00:28:11,235 decide which ones were going to be the focus. What made you pick them? 455 00:28:11,935 --> 00:28:15,743 I had a hunch that I'd end up focusing on volunteer 456 00:28:15,799 --> 00:28:19,407 first responders. And I did a lot of due diligence and research and 457 00:28:19,511 --> 00:28:23,119 realized, unlike the career fire departments, where, you know, 458 00:28:23,207 --> 00:28:26,893 Hollywood makes movies that are drama movies, there 459 00:28:26,939 --> 00:28:30,617 is very little that was told about the volunteer 460 00:28:30,681 --> 00:28:34,473 first responder sector. So first I set off sort 461 00:28:34,489 --> 00:28:37,825 of driving around the country with one of my retrievers and 462 00:28:37,865 --> 00:28:41,697 started looking for that project. My 463 00:28:41,721 --> 00:28:44,969 wife, understandably, did not know what the hell I was doing, nor 464 00:28:45,017 --> 00:28:48,769 why? And eventually I found my way to 465 00:28:48,817 --> 00:28:52,377 Hoxie, Kansas, where I met Steve Hirsch, who's one of the 466 00:28:52,401 --> 00:28:55,915 most extraordinary people that I've met in my 467 00:28:55,955 --> 00:28:59,691 life. He's been a volunteer firefighter for 44 years. He serves 468 00:28:59,723 --> 00:29:03,211 as the chairman of the National Volunteer Fire Council. He's a 469 00:29:03,243 --> 00:29:06,923 prosecutor for several of the rural counties in northwest Kansas. He 470 00:29:06,979 --> 00:29:10,571 prepares 1500 tax returns for his neighbors each year. 471 00:29:10,723 --> 00:29:14,507 He's a very, very productive guy. And we hit 472 00:29:14,531 --> 00:29:18,227 it off almost instantly. After I 473 00:29:18,251 --> 00:29:22,017 told him about my project, he just essentially opened 474 00:29:22,041 --> 00:29:25,665 up the book for me in terms of contacts, of 475 00:29:25,745 --> 00:29:29,445 ideas, associations with the National Volunteer Fire Council. 476 00:29:30,065 --> 00:29:33,721 And initially, you're right, this started out as 477 00:29:33,753 --> 00:29:37,153 a personal quest to answer that question. 478 00:29:37,249 --> 00:29:40,529 But after I started visiting 479 00:29:40,577 --> 00:29:44,401 with hundreds of volunteer first responders, 480 00:29:44,513 --> 00:29:48,105 I realized that this was a far bigger project than what I had 481 00:29:48,145 --> 00:29:51,909 originally imagined. The public is just generally unaware of that. 482 00:29:51,957 --> 00:29:55,749 And they constitute more than two thirds of all U.S. firefighters. 483 00:29:55,917 --> 00:29:59,213 The economic contribution to our 484 00:29:59,269 --> 00:30:02,965 population is enormous, and it's especially critical, as you say, 485 00:30:03,005 --> 00:30:06,813 to those areas that they can't afford a full time fire service. Pete, I don't 486 00:30:06,829 --> 00:30:10,373 want to say recovering because, you know, I loved it, 487 00:30:10,429 --> 00:30:14,173 but I'm a former rural firefighter. I lived in a town and 488 00:30:14,189 --> 00:30:17,811 I worked out of a town with 100 people in it when that whistle 489 00:30:17,883 --> 00:30:21,299 went off, and that's how we knew the whistle blew in that small 490 00:30:21,347 --> 00:30:25,187 town, everybody came running. But that's small 491 00:30:25,251 --> 00:30:28,891 in comparison to my dad. My dad was real fire chief for 492 00:30:28,923 --> 00:30:32,499 30 years. And one of the things that both Heidi and I cherish the 493 00:30:32,507 --> 00:30:35,891 most is that that badge, that fire 494 00:30:35,963 --> 00:30:39,723 chief badge, there's a lot of pride to that. And 495 00:30:39,859 --> 00:30:43,331 I think in large part because of the volunteerism, 496 00:30:43,523 --> 00:30:46,987 it isn't just fighting fire or fighting that 497 00:30:47,051 --> 00:30:50,587 accident or getting the ambulance there, those type of things. 498 00:30:50,691 --> 00:30:54,387 And so, you know, all of that is challenges for you 499 00:30:54,411 --> 00:30:57,979 to tell that story had to be challenging. 500 00:30:58,107 --> 00:31:01,683 I mean, what were you faced with while you went about being in a 501 00:31:01,699 --> 00:31:05,499 rural area and telling a story that very few people know 502 00:31:05,547 --> 00:31:09,307 in urban areas? You know, I won't call it challenging because 503 00:31:09,331 --> 00:31:12,851 I found it one of the most rewarding things I've ever done in my 504 00:31:12,883 --> 00:31:16,427 life. A lot of those interviews were done during COVID 505 00:31:16,531 --> 00:31:19,899 so that was kind of a challenge. I purchased a sprinter 506 00:31:19,947 --> 00:31:23,507 van, fully self contained, and drove around and visited 507 00:31:23,571 --> 00:31:27,259 these places that were, you know, trails in 508 00:31:27,307 --> 00:31:31,059 sort of places in many cases. But I was just so 509 00:31:31,227 --> 00:31:35,075 welcomed and well received the challenges really well 510 00:31:35,235 --> 00:31:38,883 in filming this, first, raising the money. But second, 511 00:31:38,979 --> 00:31:42,675 I took my library of interviews and took 10 512 00:31:42,715 --> 00:31:46,315 minutes of them out, turned it into what I call 513 00:31:46,395 --> 00:31:49,835 like the pitch video, and went out 514 00:31:49,875 --> 00:31:53,227 to a list of about a hundred different US 515 00:31:53,291 --> 00:31:57,091 Corporations where I thought this would be received well. But I ended 516 00:31:57,123 --> 00:32:00,535 up getting through to John Deere 517 00:32:01,395 --> 00:32:04,883 and realized that I had found the needle in the haystack there 518 00:32:04,939 --> 00:32:08,609 because John Deere himself had been a volunteer firefighter 519 00:32:08,657 --> 00:32:12,145 when he started John Deere. So that 520 00:32:12,225 --> 00:32:15,905 part sort of took care of itself. But then when we 521 00:32:15,945 --> 00:32:19,633 went out and we did a casting call with the assistance of the National Volunteer 522 00:32:19,689 --> 00:32:23,449 Fire council, we got 900 responses when we were 523 00:32:23,497 --> 00:32:27,161 expecting 50. So originally we were going to 524 00:32:27,193 --> 00:32:30,273 do three venues around the country, but when we got these 525 00:32:30,329 --> 00:32:33,085 responses which were just 526 00:32:33,435 --> 00:32:37,139 heartwarming, well, we went to John Deere and they said, well, let's just 527 00:32:37,227 --> 00:32:40,419 increase the scope of the project. So we went to eight different 528 00:32:40,467 --> 00:32:44,211 venues, eventually dropping one, but it did expand the 529 00:32:44,243 --> 00:32:47,443 project significantly and the budget. So John Deere was 530 00:32:47,499 --> 00:32:51,295 extremely generous as they helped us through this process. 531 00:32:51,755 --> 00:32:55,483 When you do a piece like this, there's going to be some people that you 532 00:32:55,539 --> 00:32:59,309 instantly think of, that you think this story 533 00:32:59,357 --> 00:33:03,029 of this person has to be told. They're all, to your 534 00:33:03,077 --> 00:33:06,485 point, they're big hearted and generous and so 535 00:33:06,525 --> 00:33:09,989 forth. I guess I would say my favorite 536 00:33:10,117 --> 00:33:12,705 is Barbara Williams. Barbara was 537 00:33:13,245 --> 00:33:16,957 62 or 3, her husband retired and she went 538 00:33:16,981 --> 00:33:20,509 into the local fire department there in Little 539 00:33:20,557 --> 00:33:23,925 Fork, Virginia and wanted to be, you know, a 540 00:33:23,965 --> 00:33:27,771 secretary, bookkeeper, accountant. And they said, no, no, no, no, 541 00:33:27,803 --> 00:33:31,243 no. And now she's the head EMT for the fire 542 00:33:31,299 --> 00:33:35,067 department and she's been there for 11 years. And she 543 00:33:35,091 --> 00:33:38,675 was generous enough to allow me to pull into her home and 544 00:33:38,835 --> 00:33:42,459 hook a power cord up so I could stay there. But we sat, 545 00:33:42,587 --> 00:33:46,131 you know, for hours and hours and hours before the film crew 546 00:33:46,283 --> 00:33:50,019 arrived, talking about her situation there and 547 00:33:50,107 --> 00:33:53,853 what experience she had. Pete, in my 548 00:33:53,909 --> 00:33:57,621 time as a real firefighter, it was all men. It was all men. 549 00:33:57,773 --> 00:34:01,357 That was just the custom. And then you know what? 550 00:34:01,461 --> 00:34:04,829 It happened. Not just because of fairness, actually, it 551 00:34:04,877 --> 00:34:08,581 happened because some of the rural fire departments were running out 552 00:34:08,613 --> 00:34:12,165 of people to be members and to do that. And then they 553 00:34:12,325 --> 00:34:15,741 went to a place they should have gone a long time ago, which was to 554 00:34:15,773 --> 00:34:19,417 recruit women to join that force. And to me, I 555 00:34:19,441 --> 00:34:23,129 always thought they found out, and I'm fairly confident I'm right about this, that 556 00:34:23,177 --> 00:34:26,569 why the hell did we have them on the force earlier? My 557 00:34:26,617 --> 00:34:30,129 prediction is that half of the recruits that we 558 00:34:30,177 --> 00:34:33,769 generate will be women. Yep. And 559 00:34:33,857 --> 00:34:37,073 it makes for nothing but a better firefighting 560 00:34:37,129 --> 00:34:40,977 department. Pete, I know I keep going back in time here, but 561 00:34:41,001 --> 00:34:44,633 the one reason I do that is to emphasize, you know, what 562 00:34:44,689 --> 00:34:48,205 you found and how that's changed, how professional it 563 00:34:48,245 --> 00:34:52,021 is now. And I still have this image of my dad 564 00:34:52,093 --> 00:34:55,845 running and my mom worried about what he's going to 565 00:34:55,885 --> 00:34:59,701 come back like, I mean, that's. They were going to 566 00:34:59,733 --> 00:35:02,949 a place that's incredibly dangerous. 567 00:35:03,077 --> 00:35:06,533 Absolutely. I think that people don't realize 568 00:35:06,589 --> 00:35:10,269 that they appreciate the fact that firefighters are out there on the front 569 00:35:10,317 --> 00:35:13,695 line. But many of these individuals that are 570 00:35:13,735 --> 00:35:17,519 volunteering are going through the same anxiety, for 571 00:35:17,567 --> 00:35:20,599 lack of a better way of putting it. If somebody's in that house, they're going 572 00:35:20,607 --> 00:35:24,143 to go in that house and get them. And so I'm 573 00:35:24,199 --> 00:35:27,791 curious what that person that was involved with the 574 00:35:27,823 --> 00:35:31,551 firefighter, whether it was the husband or the wife, did you get a 575 00:35:31,583 --> 00:35:35,191 chance to visit with them? Oh, absolutely. 576 00:35:35,263 --> 00:35:38,645 I interviewed a lot of spouses of firefighters 577 00:35:38,985 --> 00:35:42,145 and ask them the same question. I can't 578 00:35:42,265 --> 00:35:45,633 overemphasize the notion that these 579 00:35:45,689 --> 00:35:49,289 volunteer fire departments, they become a family 580 00:35:49,377 --> 00:35:53,009 for the individuals who join them. And their 581 00:35:53,057 --> 00:35:56,585 support system is very strong. And so that 582 00:35:56,625 --> 00:36:00,337 extends just way beyond just the firefighter. It extends to their 583 00:36:00,401 --> 00:36:04,169 family and everything else. Well, Pete, I only have 584 00:36:04,217 --> 00:36:07,849 182. I was sitting here counting 182 585 00:36:07,897 --> 00:36:11,065 other subjects I want you to do documentaries on now 586 00:36:11,605 --> 00:36:15,389 that I think in some of the rural areas, the stories 587 00:36:15,557 --> 00:36:19,261 need to be told. But is there anything else? Is there anything else that 588 00:36:19,293 --> 00:36:22,757 you want to tell the listeners of one country? Just keep the 589 00:36:22,781 --> 00:36:26,261 faith. Oh, Pete, thank you for doing this. I really 590 00:36:26,413 --> 00:36:30,173 look forward to it. And I can tell you this, if it does nothing 591 00:36:30,229 --> 00:36:33,989 else, giving those individuals the honor that they deserve 592 00:36:34,037 --> 00:36:36,785 and the gratitude they deserve is awesome. 593 00:36:39,325 --> 00:36:42,677 We've been hearing from a number of you, and we'll be getting your 594 00:36:42,741 --> 00:36:46,589 questions in the next episode of the Hot Dish. Remember, you can 595 00:36:46,637 --> 00:36:46,917 email 596 00:36:46,981 --> 00:36:50,997 us@podcastonecountryproject.org 597 00:36:51,061 --> 00:36:54,665 that's podcastonecountryproject.org. 598 00:36:55,365 --> 00:36:58,785 Well, Joel, thank you for not making me feel better today, 599 00:36:59,965 --> 00:37:03,675 but thank all of our listeners for joining us. The Hot 600 00:37:03,715 --> 00:37:07,187 Dish is brought to you by One Country Project, making sure the 601 00:37:07,211 --> 00:37:10,675 voices of the rest of us are heard in Washington. Learn 602 00:37:10,715 --> 00:37:14,427 more@onecountryproject.org we're going to be back in 603 00:37:14,451 --> 00:37:17,835 two weeks with more Hot Dish comfort food for middle America.