WEBVTT NOTE This file was generated by Descript 00:00:00.190 --> 00:00:03.140 Which, like, maybe I'm not the person to be saying that, probably not, 00:00:03.150 --> 00:00:06.270 but Well, that's the other tagline of this episode, is maybe we're 00:00:06.270 --> 00:00:07.450 not the person to be saying that. 00:00:07.890 --> 00:00:08.340 You know what I mean? 00:00:08.569 --> 00:00:09.602 So don't fact check us. 00:00:09.602 --> 00:00:10.493 Don't fact check us. 00:00:10.493 --> 00:00:11.290 Don't fact check us. 00:00:11.389 --> 00:00:13.500 And we're not probably the right person to be saying it. 00:00:13.500 --> 00:00:14.660 So let's get some microphones. 00:00:14.660 --> 00:00:15.359 But we're going to say it anyway. 00:00:15.359 --> 00:00:17.520 We're definitely going to say it and we're going to make you listen to it. 00:00:24.690 --> 00:00:30.379 So this, you said, was your second most played album of 2023? 00:00:30.380 --> 00:00:30.720 Sure was. 00:00:30.749 --> 00:00:34.199 And was, I think there were a couple songs on my top five songs. 00:00:34.239 --> 00:00:35.509 Yeah, tell me the tracks. 00:00:36.639 --> 00:00:38.529 Pretty Girls, number one. 00:00:38.849 --> 00:00:39.259 Okay. 00:00:39.779 --> 00:00:43.020 Production wise, I think that's the most impressive song on the whole album. 00:00:43.970 --> 00:00:45.230 And then I don't know that one. 00:00:45.230 --> 00:00:47.130 I think I hate Boston might have been the second one. 00:00:47.130 --> 00:00:50.350 I absolutely love that one I'm so basic. 00:00:50.390 --> 00:00:54.470 I just like the the first one talk too much and that's a really good one. 00:00:54.550 --> 00:00:59.800 It's great Would you like to introduce yourself by any name that you would 00:00:59.800 --> 00:01:01.970 like folks to know you as my friend? 00:01:02.449 --> 00:01:03.279 Sure. 00:01:03.310 --> 00:01:09.540 Hey Hey ladies gents gays and they's my name's drew drew car. 00:01:09.800 --> 00:01:12.914 You can find me on instagram at A Drew Carr named Desire, 00:01:12.914 --> 00:01:14.365 if you feel so inclined. 00:01:14.425 --> 00:01:15.924 Wait, that's your Instagram handle. 00:01:15.925 --> 00:01:18.675 I know, I'm literary, I'm a literary girl. 00:01:19.024 --> 00:01:23.054 I love to pay homage to the greats, the greats of American theater. 00:01:23.384 --> 00:01:26.395 And my name's Drew Carr, so it kind of just happened. 00:01:26.574 --> 00:01:30.565 The first, and I, what I hope to be a heavily repeat guest, 00:01:30.625 --> 00:01:32.495 feature on this channel. 00:01:32.535 --> 00:01:33.765 Everybody say hello to Drew. 00:01:34.370 --> 00:01:38.610 Drew and I had a little chat, a little moment in LA where we both somehow moved 00:01:38.610 --> 00:01:43.679 here at the same time had never met before Worked at this company together and we're 00:01:43.679 --> 00:01:44.990 like, wait, are you down the street? 00:01:45.770 --> 00:01:46.340 Literally. 00:01:46.450 --> 00:01:48.650 You were like, wait, did you move to Venice this week? 00:01:48.650 --> 00:01:52.159 And I said, yes, and you said I moved to Santa Monica this week. 00:01:52.839 --> 00:01:54.192 Wait, did I just dox us? 00:01:54.192 --> 00:01:55.170 Want to get a margarita on the beach? 00:01:55.170 --> 00:01:56.340 I'll take that out, I just doxed us. 00:01:56.570 --> 00:01:57.640 Let me post your address. 00:01:58.350 --> 00:01:58.710 Absolutely. 00:01:58.740 --> 00:02:01.060 Well, I'm not there anymore, so it's fine actually. 00:02:01.500 --> 00:02:02.570 You couldn't find me there. 00:02:02.880 --> 00:02:04.179 I want to be a part of the zeitgeist. 00:02:04.179 --> 00:02:05.920 I like to, uh, have opinions on things. 00:02:05.979 --> 00:02:06.699 It's kind of what I do. 00:02:06.830 --> 00:02:10.949 Speaking of the zeitgeist, my friend, we're today we're talking about 00:02:10.960 --> 00:02:14.180 someone first off, you pitched this topic and I couldn't have said yes 00:02:14.269 --> 00:02:19.015 harder or faster because this girl I'm very excited about, but I also 00:02:19.295 --> 00:02:22.055 feel like everyone's excited about her, so now I don't feel very special. 00:02:22.055 --> 00:02:24.855 But, you know, always me trying to say I was there first, that's like, 00:02:24.855 --> 00:02:27.015 you know, part of my brand, you know. 00:02:27.355 --> 00:02:30.594 I do feel I was sort of on this girl first, just because of my 00:02:30.594 --> 00:02:33.164 proximity to how she got started, so. 00:02:33.345 --> 00:02:37.334 We were talking about Renee Rap, Miss Renee Rap, who just last night, 00:02:37.384 --> 00:02:40.435 performed SNL, was featured in a skit. 00:02:40.515 --> 00:02:41.965 I'm happy for what it means. 00:02:42.505 --> 00:02:45.905 culturally to be a musical guest on SNL like for her. 00:02:45.905 --> 00:02:46.645 I think that's hell. 00:02:46.645 --> 00:02:47.974 Yeah, huge. 00:02:48.084 --> 00:02:48.284 Hell. 00:02:48.284 --> 00:02:49.005 Yeah, it always is. 00:02:49.005 --> 00:02:50.914 So SNL has launched careers. 00:02:50.954 --> 00:02:57.594 Adele hit and ended them because well, I mean, and then the Lana Del Rey's of it 00:02:57.594 --> 00:02:59.765 all like semi ended and then crawled back. 00:03:00.125 --> 00:03:03.954 And wasn't it didn't Ashley Simpson isn't that where she did the whole. 00:03:05.339 --> 00:03:09.390 Let's do an entire episode on just flop live performances and 00:03:09.390 --> 00:03:10.145 that'll be like the capstone. 00:03:10.145 --> 00:03:11.369 Oh, we could be here for days. 00:03:11.519 --> 00:03:11.950 We would. 00:03:11.950 --> 00:03:12.789 We will be here for days. 00:03:12.839 --> 00:03:13.279 Yeah, that's right. 00:03:13.299 --> 00:03:13.709 That's right. 00:03:13.959 --> 00:03:17.039 Um, okay, Renee Rapp is of the moment right now. 00:03:17.039 --> 00:03:22.289 She's currently Regina George in the movie adaptation of the musical 00:03:22.289 --> 00:03:25.799 adaptation of the movie Mean Girls, which was also based on the book, right? 00:03:26.039 --> 00:03:27.209 Good luck figuring that out. 00:03:27.239 --> 00:03:27.769 That's right. 00:03:27.939 --> 00:03:33.229 Um, I just saw the film, uh, not 48 hours ago and I thought she was amazing. 00:03:33.640 --> 00:03:38.689 But what I think she came into my consciousness, not through Mean Girls. 00:03:38.719 --> 00:03:43.239 I believe I heard her pop music and it was probably served to me on Spotify. 00:03:43.630 --> 00:03:45.980 Um, but what was, what was your gate? 00:03:46.019 --> 00:03:47.630 How did the gate open to Renee for you? 00:03:47.799 --> 00:03:51.439 You, I will tell everyone you are in the theater community much more than I am. 00:03:51.439 --> 00:03:53.820 So I can imagine that being a part of it. 00:03:54.620 --> 00:03:58.519 I am in the theater, the New York musical theater specifically community. 00:03:58.640 --> 00:04:03.140 Um, was pretty heavily pre COVID less. 00:04:03.785 --> 00:04:06.335 Less heavily now, and that's kind of by design. 00:04:06.715 --> 00:04:11.175 But for those who don't know, and maybe many of the people who are fans of Renee 00:04:11.225 --> 00:04:15.775 will know this, is that she was a Jimmy Award winner, which is the National 00:04:15.775 --> 00:04:18.865 High School Musical Theater Award show. 00:04:18.994 --> 00:04:20.205 I don't think I knew this. 00:04:20.784 --> 00:04:26.105 Oh, well, allow me to educate you on the Jimmy Awards, which are, for all of the 00:04:26.105 --> 00:04:30.244 ways that it is sort of, I guess, as the kids would say, choogy, maybe that word is 00:04:30.245 --> 00:04:34.435 even out now, and don't at me, because I'm going to say what I want, and choogy is a 00:04:34.435 --> 00:04:39.444 fun word, but for, for as, for as much of the National High School Musical Theater 00:04:39.444 --> 00:04:44.490 Awards are a little bit embarrassing, they are also like, Remarkable and awesome 00:04:44.490 --> 00:04:48.750 and I've been to the show a few times and it's an incredibly supportive environment. 00:04:48.780 --> 00:04:53.240 It's so fun to watch These nerdy kids ultimately do the 00:04:53.240 --> 00:04:54.429 thing they love the most. 00:04:54.640 --> 00:04:56.309 It's like a spelling bee for singing. 00:04:56.320 --> 00:05:00.450 It is it's a spelling bee for musical theater nerds and I love it. 00:05:00.520 --> 00:05:01.590 Perfect way to describe it. 00:05:02.080 --> 00:05:05.990 And she, I can't remember the year, but she won, so it's always a female 00:05:05.990 --> 00:05:10.770 and a male winner, and she won for the entire, she won the whole thing. 00:05:10.860 --> 00:05:15.409 And nowadays what happens to a winner of the Jimmy Awards is they kind 00:05:15.409 --> 00:05:17.779 of immediately get signed by CAA. 00:05:18.210 --> 00:05:18.730 Um. 00:05:18.980 --> 00:05:21.680 And which is like, uh, an agency, right? 00:05:21.750 --> 00:05:27.620 It is the biggest, largest, like conglomerate agency in the world. 00:05:28.100 --> 00:05:33.199 Every major star you can think of is represented either by them or UTA 00:05:33.210 --> 00:05:37.094 or sometimes like right paradigm or something like three major agencies. 00:05:37.575 --> 00:05:39.555 And at play for really big stars. 00:05:40.185 --> 00:05:44.555 So huge, huge opportunity for these kids, these literal 18 year olds who 00:05:44.555 --> 00:05:48.315 are like going to go to school for musical theater to win this competition. 00:05:48.825 --> 00:05:54.835 So from there, she was immediately a replacement for the mean girls musical, 00:05:55.055 --> 00:05:58.075 which at the time was running on Broadway. 00:05:58.425 --> 00:06:03.795 She was the first Regina, first full time Regina replacement, right? 00:06:04.054 --> 00:06:05.595 So she did that at 18 drew. 00:06:05.625 --> 00:06:07.135 I don't think I knew that she was that young. 00:06:08.055 --> 00:06:10.395 Yeah, 18, 19 probably. 00:06:10.435 --> 00:06:11.705 So didn't go to college. 00:06:11.845 --> 00:06:13.025 Did not go to college. 00:06:13.065 --> 00:06:17.224 And Certainly made the right choice as we are now, um, sort of 00:06:17.465 --> 00:06:18.945 witness to college is still there. 00:06:18.974 --> 00:06:19.395 She can go. 00:06:19.865 --> 00:06:20.995 She can do whatever she wants. 00:06:21.414 --> 00:06:26.075 Um, but so she replaced an actress named Taylor Louderman, who was 00:06:26.075 --> 00:06:27.734 the original Regina George, right? 00:06:27.934 --> 00:06:30.214 And went in to. 00:06:31.184 --> 00:06:35.655 Critical acclaim is, you know, built this incredible fan base and usually a Jimmy 00:06:35.655 --> 00:06:41.624 Award winner is already acquiring this like really large, younger fan base and 00:06:41.624 --> 00:06:44.895 Mean Girls, the zeitgeist around that at the time was really, really strong. 00:06:45.324 --> 00:06:49.914 Um, it sort of did first with the new movie attempted at the 00:06:49.914 --> 00:06:54.395 very least to achieve, which was presenting this story for a new 00:06:54.395 --> 00:06:56.245 generation and for a new audience. 00:06:56.544 --> 00:06:56.715 Right. 00:06:57.385 --> 00:07:02.635 While the musical wasn't nearly as inclusive or progressive in the sense 00:07:02.635 --> 00:07:08.355 of, like, gender representation, um, queer representation, et cetera, as 00:07:08.355 --> 00:07:12.704 the film is, um, I think it definitely resonated differently with the audience 00:07:12.704 --> 00:07:16.975 that was going to see it, which were contemporaries of Rene's age at the time. 00:07:17.205 --> 00:07:21.305 Yeah, it was like the, it was like the early, or like the elder Gen Zs who, 00:07:21.305 --> 00:07:24.585 like, couldn't, like, weren't driving yet, and their parents were taking 00:07:24.585 --> 00:07:25.844 them to the show kind of thing, right? 00:07:26.205 --> 00:07:26.665 Totally. 00:07:26.855 --> 00:07:29.055 I wasn't in the area at the time to know if Millennials 00:07:29.065 --> 00:07:30.095 were interested in the show. 00:07:30.135 --> 00:07:33.290 Like, we're You're you're a younger millennial, right? 00:07:33.500 --> 00:07:35.390 I am a younger millennial. 00:07:35.390 --> 00:07:39.600 Yeah, sort of on the cusp if you will But I think it was it was it's difficult 00:07:39.600 --> 00:07:44.470 for me because I had a lot of very good friends that were in the show Ah, so 00:07:44.480 --> 00:07:48.909 that was my way in was really I didn't have strong buy in to the fact that 00:07:48.909 --> 00:07:52.740 it was the mean girls musical aside from loving the movie and Remembering 00:07:52.740 --> 00:07:56.380 when the movie came out and yeah being interested in the very least of sort 00:07:56.380 --> 00:08:03.080 of how Tina Fey would adapt this Um, cultural phenomenon of a film into a 00:08:03.080 --> 00:08:08.710 musical, I'm not always a huge proponent of that being done and I don't think 00:08:08.710 --> 00:08:10.730 it's typically done very successfully. 00:08:10.830 --> 00:08:12.950 Perhaps I need to unpack what that means for my like, 00:08:12.950 --> 00:08:13.809 relationship to musical theater. 00:08:13.809 --> 00:08:17.031 Well, and every time that happens, no, I don't, I mean, maybe, but I think 00:08:17.031 --> 00:08:20.990 every time that happens it's also like one fewer original screen, uh, script 00:08:21.010 --> 00:08:24.160 that is getting shelved because they're, they're adapting something, right? 00:08:24.160 --> 00:08:26.950 So like there's this whole other world of creatives that are like, oh great, 00:08:26.950 --> 00:08:28.750 we're doing another movie musical, right? 00:08:28.750 --> 00:08:29.020 Yeah. 00:08:29.155 --> 00:08:32.585 It always begs the question, why, right? 00:08:32.695 --> 00:08:33.115 Why? 00:08:33.405 --> 00:08:38.034 Um, there's some wonderful music for folks that are into theater 00:08:38.034 --> 00:08:40.135 soundtracks or like show tunes. 00:08:40.135 --> 00:08:41.275 There's some phenomenal. 00:08:41.295 --> 00:08:43.344 There's a song at the very beginning of the show called It 00:08:43.345 --> 00:08:45.294 Roars that I will always listen to. 00:08:45.305 --> 00:08:50.545 It is Vocally, um, Erika Hennigsen, who plays, um, the Katie role, 00:08:50.905 --> 00:08:53.035 phenomenal singer, incredible. 00:08:53.065 --> 00:08:54.015 The production's great. 00:08:54.025 --> 00:08:57.744 I mean, it's just, it's very wonderful music, I think. 00:08:58.085 --> 00:09:03.395 But, to bring Renee back into it, from what she has very explicitly divulged 00:09:03.405 --> 00:09:07.645 from her time at that show, which kind of was the beginning, the catapult of 00:09:07.645 --> 00:09:12.824 her career as an actor, and especially as a pop star, as a pop singer. 00:09:13.365 --> 00:09:17.115 Was that it was not at all a safe environment for her to be in. 00:09:17.115 --> 00:09:20.715 I think that she has been on record saying she was like in the L. 00:09:20.715 --> 00:09:20.755 A. 00:09:20.755 --> 00:09:21.845 Times or the New York Times. 00:09:21.845 --> 00:09:24.234 There was a lot of shaming of her body. 00:09:24.234 --> 00:09:28.914 And she is an incredibly gorgeous young woman, which really is just 00:09:28.914 --> 00:09:33.095 like a call to action, more so for the way we talk about women's bodies and 00:09:33.095 --> 00:09:36.295 the way that we shouldn't talk about women's bodies, especially young women. 00:09:37.245 --> 00:09:41.484 She had a terrible time in that show, and I think vowed at that 00:09:41.484 --> 00:09:43.214 moment kind of never to do. 00:09:43.800 --> 00:09:47.990 theater again, not that that was even really her passion or her main focus. 00:09:48.800 --> 00:09:51.769 So, but before that, she had, I believe another interview of 00:09:51.769 --> 00:09:52.970 hers, I forget where it was from. 00:09:52.970 --> 00:09:57.169 She had been asked first before pre Broadway to join the tour 00:09:57.180 --> 00:09:58.090 that was already happening. 00:09:58.330 --> 00:10:02.059 And she, I think fully said no and she did was unconcerned, was 00:10:02.090 --> 00:10:05.250 unbothered because she was like, well, this is not really what I'm trying 00:10:05.250 --> 00:10:06.770 to like plant my flag in anyway. 00:10:06.960 --> 00:10:07.880 And then I think they. 00:10:08.110 --> 00:10:09.210 Her talent speaks for itself. 00:10:09.210 --> 00:10:12.220 They liked her enough that they were like, okay, a few months later, 00:10:12.230 --> 00:10:15.490 however long it was, they needed a replacement for Taylor on Broadway. 00:10:15.630 --> 00:10:16.810 And they said, will you do it on Broadway? 00:10:16.810 --> 00:10:19.285 And I think she was like, Yes. 00:10:19.465 --> 00:10:20.765 Begrudgingly, yes. 00:10:20.805 --> 00:10:21.295 Right. 00:10:21.444 --> 00:10:21.735 Right. 00:10:21.755 --> 00:10:26.715 And like, and that really speaks to both like the power you achieve immediately 00:10:26.715 --> 00:10:30.624 if you're like a Jimmy award winner, like you are able to leverage these decisions. 00:10:30.975 --> 00:10:31.255 I see. 00:10:31.265 --> 00:10:34.804 These very, like, and you know, these, these long running shows, Mean Girls 00:10:34.804 --> 00:10:38.505 is closed and is, isn't considered, I think, like a long running show. 00:10:38.515 --> 00:10:39.694 It ran decently. 00:10:39.745 --> 00:10:40.025 Couple years. 00:10:41.004 --> 00:10:44.484 But, you know, these casting teams, these creative teams, will try you 00:10:44.504 --> 00:10:48.644 out, essentially, on the road, before they're willing to bring you into, 00:10:48.644 --> 00:10:50.694 like, the established Broadway. 00:10:51.095 --> 00:10:51.814 Cast. 00:10:52.085 --> 00:10:52.314 I see. 00:10:52.324 --> 00:10:53.965 Um, they do it all the time with Wicked. 00:10:53.965 --> 00:10:58.385 It's like you, you're never gonna be an Elphaba or a Glinda in Wicked unless 00:10:58.385 --> 00:10:59.935 you've done it on the tour first. 00:11:00.005 --> 00:11:03.814 Essentially, there's like real, this very prescribed pipeline 00:11:03.835 --> 00:11:05.155 for how you're going to become. 00:11:05.155 --> 00:11:06.024 I don't think I knew that. 00:11:06.625 --> 00:11:08.024 Yeah, it's interesting for sure. 00:11:08.054 --> 00:11:10.754 Um, it's a little bit irritating, especially when people have 00:11:11.270 --> 00:11:12.480 Pretty established careers. 00:11:12.480 --> 00:11:16.370 And so I think people probably were frustrated with someone like Renee Rapp, 00:11:16.380 --> 00:11:21.110 who had no professional theater credits at the time, regardless of that, like 00:11:21.110 --> 00:11:26.690 she ate the fucking house down and like the clips of her singing in that show are 00:11:27.150 --> 00:11:28.980 some of the best that exist currently. 00:11:28.989 --> 00:11:29.650 A hundred percent. 00:11:29.730 --> 00:11:30.390 Just amazing. 00:11:30.390 --> 00:11:33.749 But wait, here's a little bit of, this is a three year ago clip. 00:11:33.809 --> 00:11:35.809 I saw this sometime in the early. 00:11:36.715 --> 00:11:40.445 The early part of my awareness of her and I was like, oh, I didn't realize 00:11:40.475 --> 00:11:45.045 this pop album was this girl This is now three or four years old And this isn't so 00:11:45.205 --> 00:11:49.764 they give Regina some like serious songs like I my reaction to the movie musical 00:11:49.764 --> 00:11:51.994 and I don't know if this would be the musical too because I haven't seen it is 00:11:51.995 --> 00:11:55.745 like Katie's not the lead character like Regina's the lead character and maybe 00:11:55.745 --> 00:11:59.964 specifically Renee as Regina she sucks the air out of the room not in a negative 00:11:59.964 --> 00:12:03.810 way, but like Everyone's just waiting for her to compete with her and Janice 00:12:03.810 --> 00:12:07.629 like the the Janice songs are really big as well But especially in the movie, 00:12:07.629 --> 00:12:11.419 I think because she is the most cachet They trimmed the track list down and 00:12:11.419 --> 00:12:15.429 they like left Regina's belters in they majorly trimmed it down for they did not 00:12:15.439 --> 00:12:16.910 leave the one That you mentioned earlier. 00:12:16.910 --> 00:12:22.069 I don't think Andy makes sense It doesn't need to be right and some 00:12:22.069 --> 00:12:25.109 of the ones that did make it are shorter like they took intros out or 00:12:25.109 --> 00:12:28.784 segments out but anyway, this was This is, uh, Someone Gets Hurt, which is 00:12:28.784 --> 00:12:31.685 like Regina's, like, scream belter. 00:12:31.984 --> 00:12:34.356 Yes, they do that. 00:12:34.356 --> 00:12:36.624 This is performance. 00:12:36.624 --> 00:12:40.404 This is all self defense. 00:12:40.404 --> 00:12:44.939 I thought you had the sense. 00:12:44.940 --> 00:12:52.339 She's good. 00:12:52.520 --> 00:12:53.290 She's really good. 00:12:53.290 --> 00:12:56.369 She's 19 years old. 00:12:56.369 --> 00:12:57.840 Couldn't be more, really. 00:12:58.290 --> 00:12:58.480 I don't think. 00:12:58.480 --> 00:13:10.289 Come 00:13:30.869 --> 00:13:31.420 on, piano. 00:13:31.510 --> 00:13:31.910 Piano. 00:13:31.910 --> 00:13:34.439 Jinx. 00:13:37.160 --> 00:13:39.359 She like screams the ending, uh, she does. 00:13:39.410 --> 00:13:41.250 She's that, that is a scrouty run. 00:13:41.250 --> 00:13:43.930 I mean, I feel like when you're young and you're in that position, you just 00:13:44.020 --> 00:13:46.030 scrouting is like the first instinct. 00:13:46.079 --> 00:13:49.579 Uh, she seems very trained, but it's coming from, it seems like 00:13:49.579 --> 00:13:50.869 a lot of it's coming from here. 00:13:50.869 --> 00:13:54.059 And these days it sounds like she's mixing a lot more and it seems a little 00:13:54.059 --> 00:13:56.889 bit healthier, but it's so powerful. 00:13:56.950 --> 00:13:59.430 Like that's so much power coming out of a child. 00:13:59.824 --> 00:14:04.505 It's a skill that she's always clearly had, is like to sing exceptionally well, 00:14:04.505 --> 00:14:06.185 like better than anyone else in the room. 00:14:06.594 --> 00:14:09.685 But of course if you're a lead on Broadway, especially the lead in like 00:14:09.685 --> 00:14:15.614 a Tina Fey led musical, you have no, you have no resource spared for you. 00:14:15.625 --> 00:14:19.294 Like you're seeing the best voice teachers, you're getting like lymphatic 00:14:19.294 --> 00:14:25.375 drainage massages every single week, like you are able to perform at a higher level. 00:14:25.375 --> 00:14:32.785 And it's also it's exceptionally difficult work to do an eight show a week schedule. 00:14:32.985 --> 00:14:37.275 Um, so I think that's to have like four songs that are like in that 00:14:37.385 --> 00:14:41.775 sound just that are at that, like that are in that sit there consistently. 00:14:42.274 --> 00:14:48.435 And so I think it's often why people as good as Renee are, and as acclaimed as 00:14:48.435 --> 00:14:51.265 her and who have the kind of fame that she does don't really want to go back to 00:14:51.265 --> 00:14:54.595 Broadway because it is so difficult to do. 00:14:54.650 --> 00:14:57.470 Drew, do you want to send your, your cash app or your Venmo to the listeners? 00:14:57.500 --> 00:14:58.080 Absolutely. 00:14:58.080 --> 00:14:59.060 Drew dash car. 00:15:00.030 --> 00:15:00.580 Who ares? 00:15:00.900 --> 00:15:01.830 He said yes. 00:15:02.500 --> 00:15:03.889 I got to make, I got to make some money back. 00:15:04.010 --> 00:15:04.689 That was expensive. 00:15:09.669 --> 00:15:11.129 This meeting has been upgraded. 00:15:11.300 --> 00:15:11.990 Did you see that? 00:15:12.010 --> 00:15:12.480 I literally. 00:15:12.819 --> 00:15:14.270 I am so proud. 00:15:14.290 --> 00:15:15.990 I, uh, Capitalism. 00:15:16.420 --> 00:15:16.980 Girl! 00:15:17.420 --> 00:15:19.920 I just extended this content live. 00:15:20.380 --> 00:15:22.829 That's a funny way I didn't expect a tech career to serve me. 00:15:22.840 --> 00:15:24.630 I can do anything during a meeting. 00:15:24.809 --> 00:15:28.080 For those folks that know of Rene just through the movie musical, which I think 00:15:28.080 --> 00:15:31.499 is going to be a lot of people and makes complete sense if you aren't like deeply 00:15:31.499 --> 00:15:34.900 in the theater world or for some reason on to the pop album on the early side. 00:15:35.230 --> 00:15:38.370 What's cool, I kind of realized this when I was comparing the soundtracks of the 00:15:38.370 --> 00:15:40.500 movie musical to the theatrical musical. 00:15:40.750 --> 00:15:41.390 I forgot. 00:15:41.400 --> 00:15:45.870 She didn't get to record any of the mean girls music at all. 00:15:45.920 --> 00:15:48.880 Like the couple of the thing we just played was from like a broadway dot com 00:15:48.880 --> 00:15:51.150 video of like, Oh, look at our new star. 00:15:51.510 --> 00:15:55.939 But now she actually gets some recordings through the movie, which is cool. 00:15:56.030 --> 00:15:57.050 Have you seen the film yet? 00:15:57.060 --> 00:15:58.239 Drew, do you intend to? 00:15:58.250 --> 00:15:58.979 I have not. 00:15:59.000 --> 00:16:01.030 And I Frankly don't think I will. 00:16:01.060 --> 00:16:02.050 Um, yeah, that's fair. 00:16:02.110 --> 00:16:02.170 Yeah. 00:16:02.170 --> 00:16:04.810 May, if it comes to streaming, I'll, I'll watch it on like Netflix or whatever. 00:16:04.810 --> 00:16:07.000 Well, these days they come to streaming like two weeks later. 00:16:07.030 --> 00:16:07.120 Yeah. 00:16:07.120 --> 00:16:07.930 They're still in the theater. 00:16:07.930 --> 00:16:09.010 It's like it should there today probably. 00:16:09.010 --> 00:16:09.340 I'll check. 00:16:09.340 --> 00:16:09.400 Yeah. 00:16:10.530 --> 00:16:13.710 , I will say I was laughing and giggling so much. 00:16:14.040 --> 00:16:17.420 And I looked around and I was like, this is the millennial nursing 00:16:17.420 --> 00:16:19.170 home is like this movie theater. 00:16:19.280 --> 00:16:20.980 Like we're all out to pasture. 00:16:21.040 --> 00:16:24.680 And I was like, Oh no, maybe we can segue to like vocal technique 00:16:24.689 --> 00:16:29.959 a little bit, because I know that, you know, so much about it. 00:16:31.009 --> 00:16:33.360 Wait, that's my degree in vocal performance. 00:16:33.360 --> 00:16:33.920 Everyone. 00:16:34.130 --> 00:16:36.160 Hi, she's educated. 00:16:36.765 --> 00:16:37.515 Does everyone see that? 00:16:37.515 --> 00:16:38.055 Right there. 00:16:38.655 --> 00:16:42.155 So we listened to the recording of Someone Gets Hurt, which is old. 00:16:42.235 --> 00:16:47.155 Maybe we can like, put a little bit in of the new one from the movie musical. 00:16:47.155 --> 00:16:47.595 Oh yeah. 00:16:47.765 --> 00:16:50.115 Let me pull that up, just a quick sec. 00:16:55.244 --> 00:16:56.644 She has a very natural vibrato. 00:16:56.645 --> 00:16:58.004 Mhmm. 00:16:58.085 --> 00:16:59.105 Like a husky vibrato. 00:16:59.295 --> 00:17:00.225 It's meaty. 00:17:13.650 --> 00:17:15.930 I Remember in the movie, that's a pop song. 00:17:16.000 --> 00:17:19.939 It's a pop song exactly She took out in the three year ago video that we played 00:17:19.940 --> 00:17:24.089 she was doing more trails more She was doing the most so to speak and in them 00:17:24.270 --> 00:17:28.510 and in this she took Out a lot of things and just left like one or two little 00:17:28.810 --> 00:17:33.210 little things in and it was like, oh, like razor sharp The payoff is strong. 00:17:33.210 --> 00:17:36.609 I had the same reaction What do you hear when you hear her sing 00:17:36.669 --> 00:17:38.049 like these theatrical songs? 00:17:38.050 --> 00:17:40.979 Like what what kind of vocalist does she like present as to you? 00:17:41.010 --> 00:17:45.534 Like this is a score of exclusively pop music. 00:17:45.835 --> 00:17:50.855 Like it lends itself to theatricality more than like a normal pop album would. 00:17:51.085 --> 00:17:55.964 But like, you have to be able to sing pop music very well to sing 00:17:55.965 --> 00:17:57.655 the score of Mean Girls well. 00:17:57.674 --> 00:17:59.834 You know, I saw Renee do this live. 00:17:59.855 --> 00:18:04.264 Renee can sing anything and like the way she navigates like the 00:18:04.275 --> 00:18:08.255 different parts of her voice, like her sort of chesty belt versus her 00:18:08.255 --> 00:18:10.685 registers, falsetto and her head voice. 00:18:11.180 --> 00:18:15.960 indicates to even like an uneducated listener, she can sing anything. 00:18:16.310 --> 00:18:18.500 Um, and, and she also has that thing. 00:18:18.500 --> 00:18:22.889 And she had this live too, where you never worry about whether 00:18:22.889 --> 00:18:24.429 or not she will make it through. 00:18:24.430 --> 00:18:25.600 Oh my God. 00:18:25.630 --> 00:18:26.730 I'm so glad you said that. 00:18:26.760 --> 00:18:29.760 I've never really put words to that, but she is that singer. 00:18:30.050 --> 00:18:30.380 Yeah. 00:18:30.600 --> 00:18:34.480 You have no anxiety about her, her ability to perform something that might 00:18:34.500 --> 00:18:36.570 sound difficult to sing or execute. 00:18:36.830 --> 00:18:41.370 Can I look at the visual cues of how they sing and understand that there's like a 00:18:41.370 --> 00:18:46.590 technique there because it is a visual thing to a certain extent you have someone 00:18:46.619 --> 00:18:49.720 literally like watching the way that they're yeah watching the way that they're 00:18:49.720 --> 00:18:54.720 like where their tension lies you know not to say that it Needs to be perfect 00:18:54.720 --> 00:18:59.430 and not to say that like someone needs to have Uh an irritating degree from like 00:18:59.470 --> 00:19:01.680 nyu to be able to like sing on broadway. 00:19:01.690 --> 00:19:06.080 That's certainly not true In fact often not true right often not true 00:19:06.080 --> 00:19:09.440 in fact I think there's a lot of harm that this big expensive piece of paper 00:19:09.440 --> 00:19:13.665 did to me as a singer but I think, yeah, like, it's, it's the thing my 00:19:13.665 --> 00:19:14.805 friends and I talk about the most. 00:19:14.805 --> 00:19:18.155 Like, I have a friend on tour right now, and we talk all the time about, you know, 00:19:18.155 --> 00:19:22.735 she covers some different roles in this particular show, and they're both, like, 00:19:22.745 --> 00:19:25.005 her ensemble track is very dance heavy. 00:19:25.005 --> 00:19:28.154 She's like a remarkable dancer, but she's also an incredible singer. 00:19:28.345 --> 00:19:35.145 So she has to, you know, sort of hop into these different ideas and these 00:19:35.145 --> 00:19:40.014 different like mentalities around how she's going to perform that particular 00:19:40.014 --> 00:19:44.165 role that she's like swinging into or understudies, which are like way more 00:19:44.455 --> 00:19:46.835 singer heavy than they are dance heavy. 00:19:47.355 --> 00:19:49.965 And yeah, it's like you have to know how to be able to do that 00:19:49.984 --> 00:19:55.054 if you want to do your job well and do it eight times a week. 00:19:55.255 --> 00:19:55.655 Totally. 00:19:55.655 --> 00:20:02.415 I think the like knowing how to do your job well is, is the, to me, fundamentally. 00:20:02.695 --> 00:20:05.645 generally net positive training of being in the theater world. 00:20:05.764 --> 00:20:10.034 Like you have to become athletic about whatever it is you're doing. 00:20:10.045 --> 00:20:13.305 And like you're saying, it's just, it's often just a mindset switch. 00:20:13.514 --> 00:20:15.284 Being able to like pull those levers. 00:20:15.514 --> 00:20:19.564 That's the stuff that I think creatives in just the music industry don't always know. 00:20:19.575 --> 00:20:21.464 They don't understand their capabilities. 00:20:21.465 --> 00:20:22.965 They, it just billows out of them. 00:20:22.975 --> 00:20:25.395 And like, oftentimes like steamrolls them. 00:20:25.395 --> 00:20:26.525 They don't know what to do with it. 00:20:26.525 --> 00:20:30.904 And yeah, they oftentimes like have really difficult lifestyles and are really hard 00:20:30.904 --> 00:20:32.124 to get along with because they like. 00:20:32.575 --> 00:20:36.195 Don't have that sort of like internal self knowledge of like, now I'm 00:20:36.195 --> 00:20:37.155 doing this, now I'm doing this. 00:20:37.155 --> 00:20:39.505 And this is what I need to do if I need to get in gear for this. 00:20:39.725 --> 00:20:43.365 So I see that as like, just being able to start the car or like change the 00:20:43.365 --> 00:20:47.615 gears in all of the ways you're talking about as such an asset, even if Renee 00:20:47.615 --> 00:20:50.985 did it for like, I don't know, however many accumulated years she's done. 00:20:52.465 --> 00:20:53.465 Maybe she'll never do it again. 00:20:53.595 --> 00:20:57.405 I think that's going to serve her in touring as a musician, which is anyone 00:20:57.405 --> 00:21:00.665 that's just a musician in a way, or just goes to recording artistry. 00:21:01.014 --> 00:21:02.755 They're at the mercy of their creativity. 00:21:02.764 --> 00:21:08.005 They don't necessarily know how to, how to like, turn on, off or shift, you know? 00:21:08.224 --> 00:21:12.794 So I think like the, the sense that I like the way you said, you, 00:21:12.794 --> 00:21:15.575 you trust Renee, like, you know, she's going to hit it or whatever. 00:21:15.870 --> 00:21:19.790 That is like a byproduct of anyone that is trained enough to know how to like 00:21:20.100 --> 00:21:21.690 kick it into high gear, so to speak. 00:21:21.690 --> 00:21:28.284 Like, if I may kind of put a look, offer a critique on another sort of contemporary 00:21:28.284 --> 00:21:36.529 of us Renee's in this way is Miss Ariana Grande, whom obviously began her before 00:21:36.529 --> 00:21:38.299 her professional performing career. 00:21:39.045 --> 00:21:40.045 in musical theater. 00:21:40.065 --> 00:21:43.605 And it's really interesting, you know, having a lot of mutual friends with her. 00:21:43.605 --> 00:21:45.105 Like I, I do not know her. 00:21:45.185 --> 00:21:48.314 What I find interesting about Ariana's recorded music. 00:21:48.314 --> 00:21:53.784 And I'm so, so interested to see how, and if this changes with 00:21:53.784 --> 00:21:59.545 the release of wicked, the film is that is my, that's my biggest 00:22:00.065 --> 00:22:02.325 gripe with Ariana's recorded music. 00:22:02.345 --> 00:22:06.275 And it's why I think that I, uh, I find this real respite 00:22:06.315 --> 00:22:08.465 as a singer myself in Renee's. 00:22:08.770 --> 00:22:15.900 album is that Renee is never hiding the fact that she is a singer with 00:22:15.900 --> 00:22:19.989 this unbelievable instrument that can do all of these impressive things. 00:22:20.260 --> 00:22:24.120 And she was able to work with producers, work with co songwriters 00:22:24.130 --> 00:22:30.305 for this particular album that that ability in a way that doesn't feel 00:22:30.795 --> 00:22:37.385 derivative of pop music or harkens towards theatrical music too much. 00:22:37.405 --> 00:22:38.295 I couldn't agree more. 00:22:38.325 --> 00:22:38.965 It is. 00:22:38.995 --> 00:22:44.705 It is the rarest of rare, like fine lines that does often not get executed well. 00:22:44.905 --> 00:22:46.225 It is that. 00:22:46.415 --> 00:22:51.145 So now we're on Renée's 2023 album, Snow Angel, which I think she, one of the songs 00:22:51.145 --> 00:22:52.905 from SNL last night promoted this, right? 00:22:53.034 --> 00:22:53.304 Yeah. 00:22:53.315 --> 00:22:54.525 This is Talk Too Much. 00:23:01.095 --> 00:23:02.994 Like she has the presence of a singer already. 00:23:03.345 --> 00:23:06.594 She's possessing, but then she's like, but I have the range though. 00:23:18.244 --> 00:23:19.784 Come on, layer those vocals, girl. 00:23:19.794 --> 00:23:21.644 Sing high and loud. 00:23:24.705 --> 00:23:27.264 I hear so much and talk too much, especially when those 00:23:27.295 --> 00:23:28.695 like upper harmonies come in. 00:23:28.985 --> 00:23:32.414 She's so masky and facey in a very trained way, but she's 00:23:32.554 --> 00:23:34.295 loud, like loud in the best way. 00:23:34.295 --> 00:23:35.895 I love a loud singer. 00:23:36.745 --> 00:23:41.845 This is I Hate Boston, which is, I believe, not about Boston. 00:23:42.375 --> 00:23:44.525 It's just an avatar for a place that an ex lived. 00:23:54.784 --> 00:23:58.645 Just the melodies as well as the songs are so beautiful. 00:23:58.815 --> 00:24:00.253 They really are captivating. 00:24:00.253 --> 00:24:06.543 And that is going to be a signature for her, that That like registration change. 00:24:06.543 --> 00:24:08.640 She does it a lot. 00:24:08.640 --> 00:24:09.478 It's yummy. 00:24:09.478 --> 00:24:10.736 It's really yummy. 00:24:10.736 --> 00:24:11.994 It is yummy. 00:24:20.235 --> 00:24:21.645 Mixed belt, ladies and gentlemen. 00:24:21.755 --> 00:24:23.245 That's how you do it. 00:24:23.610 --> 00:24:24.800 That's a mixed belt. 00:24:24.880 --> 00:24:28.750 It's coming from throat, it's coming from face, and she can do that all day. 00:24:28.750 --> 00:24:29.770 She can do that in her sleep. 00:24:30.250 --> 00:24:30.510 Yeah. 00:24:30.840 --> 00:24:31.570 Damn. 00:24:31.719 --> 00:24:32.460 That's so good. 00:24:32.480 --> 00:24:35.259 It also sounds like the other song that had Boston in it that 00:24:35.259 --> 00:24:36.959 was a very, very millennial song. 00:24:37.060 --> 00:24:38.630 Um, this may predate you, Drew. 00:24:38.669 --> 00:24:39.639 Uh, Let's see. 00:24:41.249 --> 00:24:43.880 You probably, you hear this, if you need to just find this in the 00:24:43.880 --> 00:24:47.004 wild, just go fill a prescription at a Duane Reade or a CVS. 00:24:47.365 --> 00:24:48.054 Amazing. 00:24:48.065 --> 00:24:48.435 You know what I mean? 00:24:48.534 --> 00:24:52.784 It's on the prescription sound fray from the very first notes it's Very fray. 00:24:52.915 --> 00:24:53.815 It's very fray. 00:24:54.525 --> 00:24:56.485 All these bands wrote in the same key for some reason. 00:24:56.485 --> 00:24:56.965 This is the fray. 00:24:56.965 --> 00:24:57.444 It is pre fray. 00:24:57.444 --> 00:24:58.824 This has to be the fray. 00:24:58.875 --> 00:24:59.675 This is pre fray. 00:25:00.105 --> 00:25:01.525 Okay, so fray pirated this. 00:25:02.115 --> 00:25:05.505 Augustana walked so that the fray could do whatever they did. 00:25:05.505 --> 00:25:06.825 I don't, you could call it run. 00:25:07.625 --> 00:25:08.725 Maybe a jog. 00:25:09.615 --> 00:25:10.925 It's a little light jog for me. 00:25:11.774 --> 00:25:14.575 Maybe I did actually always think that was the fray, so. 00:25:15.315 --> 00:25:17.205 Sorry you guys, now I know. 00:25:18.115 --> 00:25:22.705 And then maybe the last piece of, like, recorded vocal technique 00:25:22.705 --> 00:25:24.075 of Rene that I pulled up. 00:25:24.205 --> 00:25:24.925 Have you seen this? 00:25:24.925 --> 00:25:27.575 Her singing with Jennifer Hudson on the Jennifer Hudson talk show? 00:25:27.584 --> 00:25:28.095 Of course I have. 00:25:28.115 --> 00:25:28.875 Okay, I know. 00:25:29.075 --> 00:25:30.035 But of course. 00:25:30.385 --> 00:25:32.864 I didn't mean for that to be an offensive homosexual question, you know what I mean? 00:25:32.865 --> 00:25:34.595 Oh my god, I get to sing with her! 00:25:35.944 --> 00:25:39.504 Like, these two powerhouse singers together is so fun. 00:25:40.235 --> 00:25:40.925 Singing D. 00:25:40.925 --> 00:25:41.045 I. 00:25:41.045 --> 00:25:41.295 L. 00:25:46.844 --> 00:25:48.855 In a way, Jennifer's voice is like too big for this. 00:25:48.855 --> 00:25:49.855 This is not the It is. 00:25:49.864 --> 00:25:51.425 She sounds amazing, but this isn't right for her. 00:25:51.425 --> 00:25:56.884 But then Renee just like, She kind of eats her up in a way. 00:25:56.894 --> 00:25:57.155 She does. 00:26:00.840 --> 00:26:04.190 People are cheering. 00:26:04.190 --> 00:26:14.080 I love that girl. 00:26:14.080 --> 00:26:17.964 Girl! 00:26:20.074 --> 00:26:22.105 They're both seated, also, it's so funny. 00:26:22.415 --> 00:26:23.175 They're just so casual. 00:26:26.435 --> 00:26:28.054 Piano player did not learn the right chord there. 00:26:28.055 --> 00:26:34.065 Ah, yeah, ah! 00:26:34.484 --> 00:26:35.025 God, I love her. 00:26:42.755 --> 00:26:46.365 She's got meat in her voice. 00:26:58.514 --> 00:27:02.064 I will say, in that clip, in the chorus specifically, I mean, she's obviously 00:27:02.064 --> 00:27:04.525 just like going off on a talk show, and who knows if she even warmed up. 00:27:04.525 --> 00:27:05.395 She sounds amazing. 00:27:05.405 --> 00:27:10.210 I would never say she doesn't sound amazing, but it is a little over the 00:27:10.330 --> 00:27:15.100 line of it seems like she's overpowering the song, but that's kind of it. 00:27:15.100 --> 00:27:15.850 Definitely. 00:27:16.760 --> 00:27:19.929 The listen to it is like, there's a little bit of push there. 00:27:19.929 --> 00:27:24.830 I would imagine that she's, you know, see, she seated, she's probably nervous 00:27:24.840 --> 00:27:26.109 to be singing with Jennifer Hudson. 00:27:26.110 --> 00:27:27.529 Like there's a lot of elements there. 00:27:27.530 --> 00:27:31.940 And probably that was so early in the day or like after multiple different 00:27:31.949 --> 00:27:33.560 talk show appearances she'd been on. 00:27:34.010 --> 00:27:39.100 Which like obviously to us as like trained listeners to the way people sing like you 00:27:39.100 --> 00:27:44.710 can hear that and you also can hear like a real like formant difference between 00:27:44.720 --> 00:27:49.049 her and Jennifer's voice like Jennifer sits like a little bit further back in 00:27:49.060 --> 00:27:53.579 her throat and she like her vowels are a little bit flatter and a little bit 00:27:53.629 --> 00:27:58.000 wider and I think that probably comes from like where she started singing and 00:27:58.000 --> 00:28:01.109 like the nature by which she started singing which like definitely was like 00:28:01.109 --> 00:28:05.969 gospel music and like in the church and That's also what her voice does so well. 00:28:06.370 --> 00:28:09.719 Um, and like Renee's is like pitched a little bit more forward. 00:28:09.719 --> 00:28:13.549 Like her vowels are a little bit more closed, which also is like indicative. 00:28:13.620 --> 00:28:17.170 Both cases are indicative of like well trained singers. 00:28:17.170 --> 00:28:21.090 It's like knowing how to sort of manipulate words, manipulate. 00:28:21.509 --> 00:28:24.920 Words on notes and vowels on particular notes that are higher 00:28:24.929 --> 00:28:28.219 that you're able to, like, actually get out and make sound good. 00:28:28.920 --> 00:28:31.940 And for Renee to hold her own with her is like, it's cool. 00:28:31.980 --> 00:28:32.659 That's amazing. 00:28:32.720 --> 00:28:33.850 As a pop singer. 00:28:34.219 --> 00:28:35.170 Do you? 00:28:35.500 --> 00:28:39.579 So I hear Renee's lane thinking less about her voice and just more about like 00:28:39.580 --> 00:28:44.230 the genre and like what, what it's what it sounded like as packaged towards. 00:28:44.520 --> 00:28:47.150 To me, it sounded like, okay, we have Olivia out there. 00:28:47.150 --> 00:28:49.619 Olivia Rodrigo killing it in this like pop. 00:28:49.925 --> 00:28:53.525 Pop punk punk pop, like I don't know what I'll pop rock resurgence in a 00:28:53.525 --> 00:28:57.025 way like doing the like Kelly Clarkson Atlanta's Morrisette thing that every 00:28:57.025 --> 00:29:00.134 20 years like we get excited about a girl with a guitar, which I'm raising 00:29:00.135 --> 00:29:03.135 my hand I love that genre It's my literally probably one of my favorite 00:29:03.135 --> 00:29:07.125 pop genres And it seems like every time someone hits it super big like that. 00:29:07.145 --> 00:29:07.934 They need another one. 00:29:07.934 --> 00:29:12.220 They need a Not an enemy, just like someone else, like an alternate. 00:29:12.520 --> 00:29:14.080 Like the NSYNC and the Backstreet Boys. 00:29:14.320 --> 00:29:16.809 When I heard Renee, I was like, Oh, word! 00:29:16.819 --> 00:29:20.710 Like, now we have like, someone who's like a muscular singer 00:29:20.800 --> 00:29:22.320 gonna take this genre on. 00:29:23.090 --> 00:29:25.859 Olivia can sing her ass off, she's a great singer, but like, Renee 00:29:25.860 --> 00:29:26.960 is a different kind of singer. 00:29:26.990 --> 00:29:28.749 That's how it stands to me. 00:29:29.089 --> 00:29:34.255 But hearing, like her, her Conversation with Jennifer Hudson. 00:29:34.255 --> 00:29:38.905 She talked a lot about wanting to make an R& B album and that R& B She cites 00:29:38.905 --> 00:29:42.704 all of her references of her inspirations are like Jasmine Sullivan and she talks 00:29:42.704 --> 00:29:46.554 about J Hud as being an inspiration Like do you think that that's where she's 00:29:46.574 --> 00:29:48.244 going and would you want her to go there? 00:29:48.630 --> 00:29:54.130 I think that would likely be a sophomore album pitch for her would be to go still 00:29:54.130 --> 00:29:59.650 pop but like much more R& B influenced because I think what would there 00:29:59.650 --> 00:30:04.779 would be based solely off of Renee's capabilities and also the way she talks 00:30:04.779 --> 00:30:08.869 about music I think that there would be like the respect and homage paid to 00:30:09.380 --> 00:30:14.275 that genre of music in the same way that I think You know, Christina Aguilera 00:30:14.275 --> 00:30:15.715 was able to do pretty well, I think. 00:30:15.725 --> 00:30:16.725 Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's true. 00:30:16.785 --> 00:30:20.025 She's also had the stamp of approval of like Aretha and Patti LaBelle, 00:30:20.025 --> 00:30:24.105 like, they, like these women who are, you know, powerhouses of the 00:30:24.105 --> 00:30:28.004 genre, think that she belongs there. 00:30:28.025 --> 00:30:32.655 My only hesitation with a Renée, like Renée at this point just being an avatar 00:30:32.685 --> 00:30:36.035 of like a young white woman who's like an absolutely extraordinarily talented 00:30:36.035 --> 00:30:42.155 singer Making an R& B album like choosing to make an R& B album Um, I just have this 00:30:42.164 --> 00:30:47.074 instinct that every for every Renée that gets to actually commercially release What 00:30:47.074 --> 00:30:52.125 will probably succeed no matter what it is uh an R& B album there's like Dozens and 00:30:52.125 --> 00:30:57.435 dozens of equally as if not differently or more talented Females of color that 00:30:57.435 --> 00:31:01.664 are like here we go again Like another christina aguilera for the 2020s kind of 00:31:01.664 --> 00:31:06.375 thing read a book that actually touches on this And uses it's like a book of 00:31:06.395 --> 00:31:12.290 essays and it uses christina aguilera's back to basics essentially that That 00:31:12.290 --> 00:31:17.000 particular album and that particular moment of her career is like a really 00:31:17.000 --> 00:31:22.749 cut and dry example of what so many white artists do, which is sort of usurp and 00:31:22.760 --> 00:31:27.900 take the art of black singers, the art of black artists, the historical art, 00:31:27.940 --> 00:31:33.440 all that comes with that, particularly R& B and soul music in particular, and use 00:31:33.440 --> 00:31:38.825 it for their benefit and then ultimately shed that And have a return to basics, 00:31:38.835 --> 00:31:44.225 as is like very explicitly demonstrated in the, albeit very good, incredible 00:31:44.225 --> 00:31:46.045 album, Back to Basics by Christina. 00:31:46.455 --> 00:31:51.234 Where she, you know, takes on this sort of like, pin up 1950s, 00:31:51.315 --> 00:31:55.695 um, desirable white woman. 00:31:56.075 --> 00:32:00.485 So I think, yeah, and I think another like, a modern example that I'm constantly 00:32:00.485 --> 00:32:05.265 in discussion with my friends about now is like, the Victoria Monet of it all. 00:32:05.265 --> 00:32:05.955 Oh my god. 00:32:06.085 --> 00:32:06.545 Um. 00:32:06.760 --> 00:32:10.450 And just because of the, the sheer nature of the industry, the racism of the 00:32:10.450 --> 00:32:15.800 industry, the, the, the, just the phobias that the industry has baked into it. 00:32:15.820 --> 00:32:20.799 Like you can't break in until someone like decides to make on 00:32:20.799 --> 00:32:22.960 my mama go viral on tick tock. 00:32:22.989 --> 00:32:27.060 I learned because, uh, when Ariana was promoting briefly the 10th 00:32:27.060 --> 00:32:28.490 anniversary of her first album. 00:32:28.830 --> 00:32:32.460 During her filming of Wicked, she did like live sessions of 00:32:32.460 --> 00:32:34.190 a few songs from yours truly. 00:32:34.250 --> 00:32:38.150 And then, I don't know how, because at the time I had no social media, I found that 00:32:38.840 --> 00:32:43.849 many of those songs were demoed, written by, demoed for, and like constructed 00:32:43.850 --> 00:32:46.170 for Jordan Sparks third or fourth album. 00:32:46.189 --> 00:32:48.520 And then it's, you read the comments and then you realize 00:32:48.530 --> 00:32:50.270 like it's yet another example. 00:32:50.490 --> 00:32:52.170 No, no shade to anyone involved. 00:32:52.170 --> 00:32:57.495 It's just like, it's yet another example of Extraordinarily talented black woman. 00:32:57.795 --> 00:32:59.295 This woman won American Idol. 00:32:59.385 --> 00:33:05.024 She like and is an Exceptional fucking song like her career looks nothing 00:33:05.025 --> 00:33:08.065 like Arianna's and this would have been her fourth album I think and instead 00:33:08.444 --> 00:33:11.795 whoever the powers that be and maybe she didn't want it I don't know but 00:33:11.795 --> 00:33:16.595 like the it just moved over to this like little cupcake dress wearing white 00:33:16.595 --> 00:33:20.815 girls a little infantilized woman this little white girl who can sing really 00:33:20.815 --> 00:33:25.175 well, but Renee getting into R& B and talking about R& B references, I want 00:33:25.185 --> 00:33:29.915 her to do what she is so inspired by and talented at, but at the same time, it 00:33:29.915 --> 00:33:31.905 just feels like we've been here before. 00:33:31.925 --> 00:33:36.724 There's so many women trying to do that same thing right now, and like, she'll, 00:33:36.755 --> 00:33:39.580 she's gonna be the one that's like, Not just the one, but a one that's just 00:33:39.630 --> 00:33:42.040 able to do it because of who she is. 00:33:42.290 --> 00:33:45.770 Do you think Renee is positioned to, like, do you, is what you hear from 00:33:45.770 --> 00:33:49.299 Renee, a woman, like a young woman that is singing with her voice and 00:33:49.300 --> 00:33:51.940 like is unaffected comparatively? 00:33:51.940 --> 00:33:52.480 Yes. 00:33:52.769 --> 00:33:55.790 Yes, I think, and I think that's why I loved it so much. 00:33:55.830 --> 00:34:01.110 And what I was also the most worried about from her moving into a pop 00:34:01.150 --> 00:34:07.995 space, like, I mean, we got her EP, her, Rene's EP before, which is also 00:34:07.995 --> 00:34:10.085 like, I think it's five songs, right? 00:34:10.324 --> 00:34:13.465 Which are also wonderful, wonderful songs. 00:34:13.514 --> 00:34:16.915 The first one being, um, I can't be. 00:34:17.355 --> 00:34:17.815 Uh, what? 00:34:17.855 --> 00:34:19.965 Oh, God, everything to everyone. 00:34:19.975 --> 00:34:21.295 Yeah, everything to everyone. 00:34:21.505 --> 00:34:24.344 And there's an she also released an extended version of that because 00:34:24.355 --> 00:34:29.935 that one is like acapella on the EP, which it's like, that I think is a 00:34:29.935 --> 00:34:36.465 really good example of Renee singing pop music, quote unquote, affected 00:34:37.194 --> 00:34:39.514 with still her beautiful voice. 00:34:45.740 --> 00:34:47.800 Kind of has that like 80s synth sound. 00:34:47.909 --> 00:34:51.570 This is very pretty and at the same time I'm glad this is not the predominant 00:34:51.650 --> 00:34:55.329 style of her album because I think this, to an untrained listener, 00:34:55.330 --> 00:34:57.079 gets lost in the genre shuffle. 00:34:57.330 --> 00:35:00.199 I think this sounds more like radio music in a way. 00:35:00.410 --> 00:35:04.785 This is so beautiful but The like, sad girl of it all. 00:35:04.955 --> 00:35:08.665 Like, not that it's not legit, but It has that Billie Eilish 00:35:08.665 --> 00:35:12.694 effect of like, you know, she ages herself explicitly in her album. 00:35:12.694 --> 00:35:17.805 She has a song called 23, um, and it's about her Jordan year, her being 23, 00:35:17.805 --> 00:35:21.394 and it's like, me listening to that at my big age, I'm like, oh my god, this 00:35:21.395 --> 00:35:25.125 girl is like I've got four years on you. 00:35:25.665 --> 00:35:26.615 Girl, I know, but that's okay. 00:35:26.625 --> 00:35:27.105 It's okay. 00:35:27.575 --> 00:35:29.105 We're still so young, too. 00:35:29.115 --> 00:35:29.905 I know, we're young. 00:35:30.295 --> 00:35:31.695 We're so young. 00:35:33.045 --> 00:35:37.584 I know, it does kind of, like, beg the reality that, like, there's kind 00:35:37.585 --> 00:35:42.294 of only so much hyper criticism and, like, editorializing that can be 00:35:42.294 --> 00:35:44.374 done about someone that's this age. 00:35:44.674 --> 00:35:44.694 Yeah. 00:35:44.695 --> 00:35:50.540 Because she is, uh, she's so young that she is as much just a product of All 00:35:50.540 --> 00:35:54.020 the things that raised her and taught her and the environments that she's been 00:35:54.020 --> 00:35:58.170 in like Who has their, I mean, I'm not saying no one, but who has their own 00:35:58.180 --> 00:36:02.490 voice, their own everything at, at 22, 23, like we shouldn't expect anything. 00:36:02.670 --> 00:36:02.970 Yeah. 00:36:02.970 --> 00:36:06.539 And I hope that she doesn't because like, then what, what do we have 00:36:06.539 --> 00:36:07.520 to look forward to from her? 00:36:07.530 --> 00:36:08.959 Like grow into it for sure. 00:36:09.150 --> 00:36:09.520 For sure. 00:36:09.739 --> 00:36:13.660 I see her as already having successfully crossed over from 00:36:13.670 --> 00:36:15.650 theatrical music into pop music. 00:36:15.650 --> 00:36:16.670 I think the mean girls. 00:36:16.935 --> 00:36:18.895 movie is helping her do it. 00:36:18.895 --> 00:36:23.485 Like you said, it was already like a pop music musical, so it's not a huge stretch. 00:36:23.855 --> 00:36:28.465 In the canon though, of theater singers trying to have pop careers, there's 00:36:28.904 --> 00:36:33.754 fewer successes than there are like middling or, or just like failures. 00:36:33.785 --> 00:36:34.455 And yeah. 00:36:35.045 --> 00:36:39.455 How do you think she stands up against some of the ones we've seen more recently? 00:36:39.455 --> 00:36:43.655 Like, I mean, I'm not in this world like you are, but like Ben Platt obviously 00:36:43.655 --> 00:36:45.764 made a huge turn into pop music. 00:36:45.764 --> 00:36:46.455 He's toward it. 00:36:46.604 --> 00:36:49.425 Idina is trying to be a house house girl. 00:36:49.425 --> 00:36:51.314 He's trying some, she's really trying. 00:36:51.315 --> 00:36:52.615 I saw her at WeHo Pride. 00:36:52.824 --> 00:36:53.244 Yeah. 00:36:53.395 --> 00:36:55.025 The gays were really there to support her. 00:36:55.385 --> 00:36:58.205 And like Cynthia, Cynthia Erivo very much. 00:36:58.215 --> 00:37:00.535 I think China has already made an album that. 00:37:00.710 --> 00:37:04.070 As a diehard fan of her voice as I am, I haven't listened to this album. 00:37:04.070 --> 00:37:07.560 So like, what, what is it about this that generally doesn't work? 00:37:07.560 --> 00:37:10.150 And do you think it's going to work differently or better for Renee? 00:37:10.790 --> 00:37:14.710 I mean, I think it's probably just using those three examples you gave. 00:37:14.710 --> 00:37:18.040 I think it will and already has worked better for her. 00:37:18.250 --> 00:37:21.120 I also think with the exception of Cynthia, like what I think about 00:37:21.120 --> 00:37:25.109 Cynthia is that she's actually making more of a career and has made more 00:37:25.109 --> 00:37:26.770 of a conscious pivot into being. 00:37:27.140 --> 00:37:32.430 Like a, as a movie star, she's in Hollywood, like she is like a two 00:37:32.430 --> 00:37:36.809 time Oscar nominated like once for a performance and also that same 00:37:36.809 --> 00:37:40.539 exact year for best song, but like, speaking more, it's like, I guess the 00:37:40.540 --> 00:37:44.589 Ben Platt's the Idina Menzel's, um, and I'll exclude Ariana from this, 00:37:44.590 --> 00:37:49.980 I think just because like, she is so much, she's at a much higher place in 00:37:49.980 --> 00:37:52.210 her pop career than either of them. 00:37:52.310 --> 00:37:52.650 Yeah. 00:37:53.225 --> 00:37:57.335 I think Renee just simply has the package that works a little bit 00:37:57.345 --> 00:37:59.145 better from a marketing perspective. 00:37:59.154 --> 00:38:05.225 And that is maybe unfortunate, but I think is also a very 00:38:05.465 --> 00:38:07.074 clear reality of the industry. 00:38:07.074 --> 00:38:11.325 It's like she's young, she's hot, she's blonde. 00:38:11.345 --> 00:38:17.395 She actually can saying and she's also funny and she's queer like she has a lot 00:38:17.395 --> 00:38:22.815 of interesting fan bases yeah and as sort of like queer celebrities are having queer 00:38:22.815 --> 00:38:27.115 celebrities are having a moment um we'll see how long it lasts every every like 00:38:27.145 --> 00:38:33.844 10 years they're sort of like oh yeah gay people what's what's going on with gay 00:38:33.844 --> 00:38:38.915 people let's see and then they're like too much we look bring the straights back 00:38:38.915 --> 00:38:46.105 in oh I think that, like, she checks all the boxes in the perfect amount of ways. 00:38:46.105 --> 00:38:49.865 I think, I mean, Ben Platt, I, I'm not a huge fan of his, of 00:38:49.865 --> 00:38:50.825 the music that he's released. 00:38:50.845 --> 00:38:53.184 There are a couple songs that I think are really great. 00:38:53.195 --> 00:38:58.204 And I think that he is so talented and also king of nepo babies. 00:38:58.214 --> 00:39:01.235 So rock on Lord of the nepo dominion. 00:39:01.235 --> 00:39:03.685 I mean, he's just own it and move on. 00:39:03.715 --> 00:39:10.840 I mean, yeah, I think Yeah, I, I think Renee will have a successful 00:39:10.850 --> 00:39:12.720 transitive career into pop music. 00:39:12.720 --> 00:39:14.640 The only other one obviously being Ariana. 00:39:15.180 --> 00:39:17.520 And I think people need to be a little bit more afraid. 00:39:17.560 --> 00:39:21.749 Like I say this as a joke mostly, but I also find it to be funny. 00:39:21.750 --> 00:39:25.499 I'm like, whenever she's released her EP, I was talking to my good 00:39:25.499 --> 00:39:28.980 friend Jenna, who I hope will listen to this and watch and get a kick. 00:39:29.150 --> 00:39:29.690 Hi Jenna. 00:39:29.700 --> 00:39:34.240 She, um, I was like, people need to be more scared of Renee. 00:39:34.280 --> 00:39:36.160 This is a hot queer. 00:39:37.805 --> 00:39:40.635 Uber talented girl, new girl on the scene. 00:39:41.015 --> 00:39:43.725 And she can sing circles around everybody else. 00:39:43.725 --> 00:39:48.765 Like, I, if I were a girl, if I, it's like Kelly Clarkson covering someone's song. 00:39:48.795 --> 00:39:52.545 Yeah, you're like, If I released a song, I'd say have, have fun with it. 00:39:52.645 --> 00:39:55.135 If you're Kelly Clarkson, don't fucking touch this. 00:39:55.565 --> 00:39:58.744 Because it's going to be better than anything I've Yeah, it's lights for us. 00:39:58.754 --> 00:40:00.315 Like, it's just what she does. 00:40:00.334 --> 00:40:06.475 Renee is un Bothered like completely the interview affect whether we believe it to 00:40:06.475 --> 00:40:08.965 be real like she's just going off script saying things that she shouldn't like 00:40:09.185 --> 00:40:15.055 She's kind of making I hate saying like making a brand out of her But her like 00:40:15.225 --> 00:40:19.514 what she's kind of building her brand on is that she'll just say whatever Yeah, 00:40:19.545 --> 00:40:24.555 like she's playful like she's like I said no to mean girls and they at they 00:40:24.555 --> 00:40:29.460 called me again And then I was like, yes like I kind of, I kind of love it. 00:40:30.170 --> 00:40:30.500 I do too. 00:40:30.760 --> 00:40:32.930 That's the part of Gen Z that I'm like, there is something there. 00:40:33.120 --> 00:40:35.720 She's like seemingly successfully unbothered. 00:40:35.840 --> 00:40:36.770 They've like figured it out. 00:40:36.830 --> 00:40:37.290 She doesn't care. 00:40:37.319 --> 00:40:38.510 We can learn something from that. 00:40:38.520 --> 00:40:40.910 I loved the way, I like the way she talks about her music. 00:40:40.960 --> 00:40:42.390 And I think that it's, Same. 00:40:42.399 --> 00:40:47.690 Having watched her from an 18 year old dancing on the Minskoff stage 00:40:47.700 --> 00:40:49.920 for the Jimmy Awards up until now. 00:40:50.255 --> 00:40:53.865 Like, the evolution is, like, for all intents, in the grand scheme of 00:40:53.865 --> 00:40:55.725 things, very, very short amount of time. 00:40:55.735 --> 00:40:58.884 Like, this has happened in five years. 00:40:58.885 --> 00:41:01.045 Comparing her to Ariana is interesting. 00:41:01.065 --> 00:41:05.364 I am so out of that world in a way that I've never thought 00:41:05.364 --> 00:41:06.774 of Ariana as a theater person. 00:41:06.794 --> 00:41:09.884 Or maybe just because she was there so briefly or so young. 00:41:10.624 --> 00:41:14.745 But, like, it does seem in your formula, like, that the two of them 00:41:14.745 --> 00:41:19.734 might be, like, the ones that got out into their pop career successfully. 00:41:20.265 --> 00:41:23.045 Do you think it's like the less time you spend in theater, the better? 00:41:23.075 --> 00:41:26.635 Like every additional show you do, like pulls you more into the show 00:41:26.635 --> 00:41:28.895 world and away from the, the pop world? 00:41:29.355 --> 00:41:30.165 Absolutely. 00:41:30.175 --> 00:41:35.475 And I think that that's exactly what I think that she used the formula 00:41:35.475 --> 00:41:37.755 that Ariana unknowingly created. 00:41:37.955 --> 00:41:39.255 I did one Broadway show. 00:41:40.235 --> 00:41:41.659 People really liked me in it. 00:41:41.659 --> 00:41:45.345 People heard I did really well and it gave me the opportunity. 00:41:45.345 --> 00:41:49.154 I was able then to leverage the opportunities that came my way because 00:41:49.154 --> 00:41:50.734 I had that one singular credit. 00:41:51.165 --> 00:41:53.865 And luckily there were people like Tina Fey attached. 00:41:54.675 --> 00:41:59.315 And so I think that five years later, five years down the line from now, we 00:41:59.315 --> 00:42:03.885 will culturally have forgotten that she was ever in a musical at all. 00:42:04.225 --> 00:42:04.685 Totally. 00:42:04.694 --> 00:42:05.995 She, I don't know. 00:42:06.065 --> 00:42:08.754 It was, it must've been in one of the interviews for Mean 00:42:08.754 --> 00:42:10.065 Girls that I saw recently. 00:42:10.095 --> 00:42:15.154 And she, I don't think Renee is playing Coachella, but a lot of her 00:42:15.154 --> 00:42:16.595 contemporaries in the pop world are. 00:42:16.595 --> 00:42:17.825 I could be wrong about this. 00:42:17.874 --> 00:42:19.615 I think she is playing Coachella. 00:42:19.615 --> 00:42:20.385 Maybe she's playing it. 00:42:20.645 --> 00:42:24.035 But they were asking her, they, she must be because they were asking her, 00:42:24.315 --> 00:42:26.165 um, Are you excited for Coachella? 00:42:26.165 --> 00:42:28.744 And she was like, I'm so excited to see, like, my girls are there. 00:42:28.744 --> 00:42:31.605 And she named Sabrina Carpenter and Chapel Roan. 00:42:31.635 --> 00:42:34.145 And I, I'm not trying to stir anything. 00:42:34.275 --> 00:42:35.084 Also, I'm small fish. 00:42:35.085 --> 00:42:35.545 Who the fuck cares? 00:42:35.555 --> 00:42:43.180 But Sabrina being like the nemesis of Or the anti hero of Olivia. 00:42:43.480 --> 00:42:47.380 And Olivia being my original, like, counterpart to Rene. 00:42:47.380 --> 00:42:48.740 I'm like, oh, are there sides? 00:42:48.900 --> 00:42:51.640 But then Chaperone, do you know who Chaperone is? 00:42:51.880 --> 00:42:53.050 Of fucking course. 00:42:53.050 --> 00:42:58.460 Okay, well Chaperone is like the original muse of Olivia's producer Dan 00:42:58.540 --> 00:43:04.420 Nigro's, like, self Uh, he made a label literally just for Olivia, I think. 00:43:04.450 --> 00:43:09.295 But his, like, Aesthetic muse to like become then the producer that was ready 00:43:09.295 --> 00:43:14.215 for Olivia was Chapel Roan, and I'm wondering like does Olivia acknowledge 00:43:14.235 --> 00:43:20.385 or hate or like Chapel and like is Chapel on Olivia's side or Sabrina's are there 00:43:20.385 --> 00:43:25.225 sides and now I'm like, oh no because I'm still Toxically or otherwise like 00:43:25.585 --> 00:43:30.790 in Olivia's camp for whatever reason and now I'm like, oh, I hope I hope I don't 00:43:30.790 --> 00:43:36.190 have to like forget this in order to continue to enjoy These women's music. 00:43:36.340 --> 00:43:37.800 I'm not a sabrina carpenter fan. 00:43:37.800 --> 00:43:41.279 So that's like not I have paid absolutely zero attention to 00:43:41.279 --> 00:43:44.080 anything she's ever done, and I hardly know what she looks like. 00:43:44.550 --> 00:43:48.270 And I think I'll keep it that way, but what I will say that's interesting 00:43:48.380 --> 00:43:53.120 about what you mentioned is that Olivia Rodrigo did say that her favorite 00:43:53.130 --> 00:43:54.850 album of last year was Snow Angel. 00:43:55.100 --> 00:43:55.829 No shit! 00:43:55.869 --> 00:43:56.659 Oh my god! 00:43:56.660 --> 00:43:57.690 I didn't know that! 00:43:58.010 --> 00:44:00.310 She said the album she was listening to and couldn't stop 00:44:00.340 --> 00:44:01.970 listening to was Snow Angel. 00:44:02.160 --> 00:44:03.530 Drew, you just made my day. 00:44:03.985 --> 00:44:09.925 I have a feeling that the majority of this beef is fully orchestrated by the psycho 00:44:09.925 --> 00:44:15.435 PR people, and it ultimately has zero to very little to zero basis in reality. 00:44:15.925 --> 00:44:19.825 I'm not even joking that I can sleep easier knowing that Olivia has handed 00:44:19.825 --> 00:44:23.575 some flowers to Renee because I don't care about the Sabrina Carpenter 00:44:23.575 --> 00:44:27.425 beef at all, but I did care about the prospect of this being a beef. 00:44:27.425 --> 00:44:29.685 And I'm glad that at least she's not a dog. 00:44:29.705 --> 00:44:32.595 I just want all these young women who are making exceptional music to 00:44:32.595 --> 00:44:36.254 get along and hopefully collab with each other to make even better music 00:44:36.265 --> 00:44:38.145 because that's all I want to see. 00:44:38.175 --> 00:44:41.285 I just want to keep listening to really fucking good music. 00:44:41.625 --> 00:44:42.805 I just want everyone to get along. 00:44:42.805 --> 00:44:42.955 Literally. 00:44:43.615 --> 00:44:46.375 And like bake a cake with rainbows. 00:44:46.905 --> 00:44:47.575 Say bye Drew! 00:44:47.585 --> 00:44:48.175 See you next time! 00:44:48.185 --> 00:44:48.764 Bye everyone!