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John, welcome to the show.

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It's an absolute pleasure to talk to you
today.

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I want to start from your coach history.

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You got into it absolutely by accident,
but then, and please don't be humble.

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I know that's a problem you have, a good
problem you have, but don't be humble.

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us all the things.

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Give us the coaching history and where you
got to and the great athletes that you had

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the opportunity to

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No, it was, I mean, one, was a real
privilege to be able to coach.

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You know, you get to work with student
athletes and really help them develop.

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It started off at when I was in undergrad
at Old Dominion University.

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You know, I was on the rowing club.

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Kind of felt like I became president of
the club by default.

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But the kids, the high school kids

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one of those summers needed some help.

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They already had a coach, a Navy captain
who was doing a lot of work, but also he

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was having some external challenges and so
they needed help.

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you know, me, it's probably more function
of me standing there, know, warm body you,

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you're it.

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But, you know, we got to start there.

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And then, you know, coaching a little bit
at Oldham University, graduated.

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our coach from the year previous when I
was there, moved on.

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and so I was coaching the guys.

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and, now another coach came in a year
later, Bill Zach.

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and he, think he was pretty instrumental
in me figuring out, what it was to be a

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professional coach.

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you know, he was very supportive of the
idea of, being a student of coaching.

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in fact, I remember one time I was reading
a book in the van.

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And one of the athletes, it was at the end
of the season, one of the athletes asked

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me, you know, and then paraphrasing, but
they were just like, why are you doing

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this?

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You know, the season's over and, and, and
Bill turns around and goes, well, John's

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trying to be a better person.

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What are you doing?

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and I was like, I'm just going to read my
book.

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but, then it went to South Carolina.

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Got my master's degree.

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there is rowing in South Carolina, by the
way, for those folks, but, I didn't do

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anything there while I was getting my
master's, but I went to San Diego state.

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to get my PhD in geography.

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And probably one week into being on
campus, was of course, know, t -shirts and

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rowing are a requisite.

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yeah, just kind of wandering around
campus.

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I think it was just exploring, but you
know, everybody wears a rowing t -shirt.

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In fact, in rowing, there's an old
tradition that if you win the event, you

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get the other team's shirts, jerseys,
their unis, their kit.

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and, in fact, if you watch the Harvard
Yale race, the men still do that.

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They, at the end of the race, they
exchange, you know, whomever the winner is

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gets the other teams, tank top or Jersey
or, and so, no, it's a trophy.

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now once you get away, I mean, once you
get away from the race, you know,

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sometimes you'll go to practice.

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And in fact, at one point when I was
coaching with the athletic director, kind

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of mentioned that he saw some of our
athletes weren't wearing.

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other other other teams t -shirts and I'm
like well you know they they won those and

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almost like the handshake at the end of
tennis, right?

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I mean, sure, it's a trophy and there's an
ego aspect to it, but it's also like, you

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know, we're civil and, you know, I'm also
showcasing them, but yeah, we also won

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this.

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totally.

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So that's what got me back into coaching
in San Diego and in Mission Bay.

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It's fantastic.

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There's tons of rowing, tons of great
organizations, and really had, I think a

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fantastic five year run, you know,
practically coaching in some way, or form,

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you know, multiple, multiple organizations
or riding around and launches.

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Uh, with other coaches, I mean, it really
was a unique environment to be able to

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like experiment, learn, um, and, be able
to grow there.

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And that's where it kind of took off for
me, uh, especially coaching the master

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women, uh, in San Diego.

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Uh, they, had a really great core nucleus
of women that were, uh, really ranging

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from like, I think about 20 to.

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North of 60 in terms of age ranges.

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wow.

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In the same team.

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In the same team?

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wow.

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yeah, Masters is pretty much, know, it's,
most of them are post college, but there

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were a couple of women that were in
community college and they didn't have an

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opportunity or they were at another, you
an opportunity, they hadn't gotten to uni

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yet.

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And so they were just starting to row.

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And, but most of them

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Probably in the age range, I'm going to
put it in 28 to 38.

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And yeah, it was fascinating.

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I learned a ton.

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I had the privilege of coaching them.

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were ultimately, think the year that I got
the head coaching job at Nova Southeastern

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a couple months after I left, they went
with the entire rowing club, the Masters

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Nationals and the rowing

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through a totality of points came home
with the national championship.

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And the women were a significant
contributor to that.

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And I was really, really proud of them.

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I wasn't coaching them at the point, but
it's just a couple of months on.

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And so I don't know how to take credit for
it.

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And I have a hard time taking credit, but
at the same time, my pride was really top

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shelf.

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And then I ended up at Nova Southeastern
University.

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Not ended up, I got the job there and
started the program.

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They didn't have a rowing show.

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They didn't have an athlete.

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didn't have, you know, we knew where we
were going to row and that was it.

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And we built the program up and across the
course of the eight years that we were

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there.

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I was really fortunate to work with a
tremendous number of amazing women.

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And they went to the national championship
seven out of eight years while we were

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there the women's four won the national
championship in 09 and the We won several

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conference championships That it is it was
a really special time with a bunch of

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really special people and

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You know, the, the, the, probably the one
of the defining moments of their, of that

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first year that we started the program,
was, we went to Rollins college up in

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winter park, Florida.

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and you know, and, okay.

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Yeah.

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No great college.

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And by the way, winter parks, beautiful.

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and yeah, we're, Lake Maitland, if I
remember correctly.

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and, we were.

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out, we were racing, but it was our first
year.

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so in rowing, first year rowers are
considered novices.

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and, and if everybody in the boat is a
first year rower, they don't have to be a

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freshmen, just a first year rower.

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they're a novice.

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Well, and a couple of weeks before we
went, the university of Miami coach at the

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time, had spoken to me.

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She pulled me aside.

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She was a friend of mine, is a friend of
mine.

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and a, she said to me, you know, you
really should

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race up, you know, you should race against
the other varsity crews in the, in the

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state, because your boat's faster than I
think you think it is.

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And I was like, you know, I mean, I had
mad respect for this coach.

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So, you know, I was going to take that
advice and run with it.

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And I was like, okay, went back to the
women and I was like, Hey, we're going to

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try something in our next regatta.

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When we go to Rollins, we're going to race
because we can qualify for the novices.

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Cause we're all novice rowers, first year
program, first year.

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university everything we're gonna race the
knobbies but we're also gonna try our hand

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at the varsity entry as well and so we
doubled up so in the novice race they I

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mean it's solid it was great great win the
varsity race you know and it's and by the

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way for the listeners and the viewers like
rowing is the race course is 2 ,000 meters

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Typically, you'll see this gathering of
coaches at the finish line.

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And we have no idea what's happening in
the first two thirds of the race.

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Because we can't even be like, just like,
well, it looks like boats have started.

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There's some splashing.

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Who knows?

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But here they.

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listeners, 2000 meters is like a 10 minute
run, right?

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If you're not fit.

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I would call it about almost a mile and a
half, give or take.

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Yeah, but but little shy than a mile and a
half.

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But yeah, I have to.

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It's funny.

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I always have to switch between worlds of
metric and English measurements.

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But yeah, it's it's a hike.

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It takes usually an average women's crew.

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A really top level women's crew will do it
in six minutes and 15, six minutes and 20.

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Uh, at the NCAAs I've seen six minutes and
11 seconds.

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Uh, you know, but that's.

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That, that, that's your best collegiate
university crew.

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Um, but we're, we're all standing at the
finish line watching this race come down

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and, know, here, here it comes.

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And, um, I'm watching it.

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I'm like, Oh, you know, it looks like
we're in it.

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You know, I think we're doing okay.

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You know, and, and, uh, and that that's
the first half of the race.

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I'm just like, ah, you know, who knows?

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Uh, it, you know, it's like watching a
marathon and just see

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But the, the, suddenly, it starts to come
into view that I'm like, my gosh, we're

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like in it, like in it, in it.

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And it was four boats across.

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And if I remember right, it was
Jacksonville university, Barry university,

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Rollins college and us, and just four
across just, mean, just everybody's going

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for the finish line and you're just
watching this crew and I'm watching them

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and I'm just like, my gosh, like we're,

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Yeah, I was just pleasantly well, no, I
was ecstatic that we were competitive.

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Like I was excited that we were in it and
we were, you know, we're rowing and I'm

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like, my gosh.

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I mean, it was just bow ball to bow ball.

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You saw all four boats just coming towards
the finish line and literally they hit the

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finish line.

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There's a horn at the finish line.

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All you hear is beep beep beep beep.

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And I'm like, you know, I was like, I
don't know what happened.

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I don't know.

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You know, at that particular moment in
time, I was

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All I know is we did a outstanding job.

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So, they, you know, they, they order, you
know, they were rank order the metals at

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the end of the regatta.

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The women go up and get their novice
metals, which is great.

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and then, they get down and the varsity of
course is the last race they announced in

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terms of the winners and everybody's down
there at the front of the boathouse.

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And then they go through the winners.

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Okay.

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Third place, you know, second place.

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first place, Nova Southeastern University.

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So the women go with their novice medals
on and go get their varsity medals.

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it was Disney.

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It was a Disney movie

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the goosebumps.

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That is...

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And I looked around and everybody was
like, wait, what?

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Like literally, you just saw this kind of
like the novice won the art, you know, and

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I was like, we just set a standard that
we're going to have to really live up to.

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You can't invent this.

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This is just crazy.

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So, okay, let me, my God, you could only
hope to experience moments like that.

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You learned a lot becoming a coach.

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What were your breaking points where
you're like, that's super interesting.

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Like, this is something I need to do.

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This is something I didn't know.

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This is something I've now learned and was
fundamentally new for you and made you

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change the

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that you behaved with yourself, with
others.

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What did you learn through that coaching
career?

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Two things immediately come to mind.

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One, and I want to say this one before I
forget it, it actually originated from one

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of the women that was in that first boat.

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So, Falouka, she became all everything in
the 40s.

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She was a swimmer in high school.

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Came to Nova Southeastern University from
New York.

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Was not recruited.

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She walked onto the team.

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I remember distinctly when she walked up
to me at orientation said coach, I'm going

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to come row.

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It's it.

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And it wasn't, if I recall correctly, it
wasn't, I want to come row.

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It was going to come row.

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And I was like, okay.

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just love it when people have a sense of
confidence, but not arrogant.

228
00:13:26,496 --> 00:13:28,118
And that's, it's that, right?

229
00:13:28,118 --> 00:13:29,499
I'm coming to Ro.

230
00:13:29,998 --> 00:13:34,150
Now, a ton of the women that we have, they
really understood that it was a team sport

231
00:13:34,150 --> 00:13:38,892
and it was all nine women in the boat or
all five women in the four.

232
00:13:38,892 --> 00:13:42,984
Ironically, you call it a four, but
there's the coxswain coxswain's need more

233
00:13:42,984 --> 00:13:43,394
respect.

234
00:13:43,394 --> 00:13:44,475
They're the drivers of the boat.

235
00:13:44,475 --> 00:13:48,197
They're the person who's and by the way,
they don't shout row, row, row.

236
00:13:48,197 --> 00:13:50,878
OK, for anybody who's tired

237
00:13:51,442 --> 00:13:56,066
but, Cheyenne Posky, who's was our cox in
that first or the first four years of the

238
00:13:56,066 --> 00:14:02,510
program, she will happily, correct you,
and in no uncertain terms, by the way.

239
00:14:02,610 --> 00:14:09,995
but, so Nikki, one day after she
graduated, we were sitting there talking

240
00:14:09,995 --> 00:14:14,118
and she had become somebody involved in
rowing, had done coaching, definitely

241
00:14:14,118 --> 00:14:16,159
still absolutely part of her life.

242
00:14:16,320 --> 00:14:17,981
she's an immense alumni.

243
00:14:18,011 --> 00:14:19,682
but, she,

244
00:14:19,914 --> 00:14:22,883
We're talking about novices and for some
reason I had expressed some level of

245
00:14:22,883 --> 00:14:26,993
frustration and she turned to me and goes,
coach, they don't know what they don't

246
00:14:29,586 --> 00:14:33,857
And I literally was like stunned silence.

247
00:14:33,857 --> 00:14:40,409
And I'm just like, like, well, you know,
and I had to go back and realize it and

248
00:14:40,409 --> 00:14:42,010
kind of rewind the tape.

249
00:14:42,010 --> 00:14:46,241
Because when I was in San Diego, I worked
with a lot of I taught a lot of rowing

250
00:14:46,241 --> 00:14:51,142
classes, which actually was a huge amount
of help for me when I started coaching at

251
00:14:51,142 --> 00:14:56,784
the university level, you know, coaching
uni students, because, you know, I think I

252
00:14:56,784 --> 00:14:57,814
developed.

253
00:14:57,814 --> 00:15:00,914
a methodology and I won't even call it
methodology.

254
00:15:00,914 --> 00:15:10,634
I developed an approach to coaching that
involved understanding how to teach a real

255
00:15:10,634 --> 00:15:14,554
wide diverse audience because you know
when you're teaching rowing classes you

256
00:15:14,554 --> 00:15:19,094
had and much to like the master women that
would catch the San Diego you have anybody

257
00:15:19,094 --> 00:15:23,354
from 18 to and rowing is a great sport for
all life.

258
00:15:23,354 --> 00:15:24,118
So I had

259
00:15:24,118 --> 00:15:25,878
I had athletes that were 60.

260
00:15:25,878 --> 00:15:28,538
I even had a couple of athletes that were
70 years old.

261
00:15:29,358 --> 00:15:34,398
And, and, you know, also all of these
crazy backgrounds, you know, I had women

262
00:15:34,398 --> 00:15:39,878
that were former basketball players, women
that had never rode before women who were,

263
00:15:39,878 --> 00:15:44,438
or men and women that were, uh, you know,
in the band, but had never done a, you

264
00:15:44,438 --> 00:15:46,438
know, in their mind, a sport.

265
00:15:46,458 --> 00:15:51,678
Um, and, um, it was great trying to figure
out how to communicate with them, you

266
00:15:51,678 --> 00:15:53,018
know, what's going to

267
00:15:53,094 --> 00:15:57,877
You know also just everybody's got a
different communication style and so, you

268
00:15:57,877 --> 00:16:04,400
know when Nikki said that I had to kind of
check myself and go Okay I need to reset

269
00:16:04,400 --> 00:16:09,803
when I'm talking to novices and when I'm
talking to people who don't know and also

270
00:16:09,803 --> 00:16:16,287
people who don't know what they don't know
and And to go okay, you have to find that

271
00:16:16,287 --> 00:16:20,719
lowest common denominator for a team You
have to find that lowest common

272
00:16:20,719 --> 00:16:22,450
denominator for the individual

273
00:16:22,632 --> 00:16:25,624
You have to be able to relate to them.

274
00:16:25,624 --> 00:16:30,186
You have to start to peel away the layers
of the onion to in terms of that

275
00:16:30,186 --> 00:16:31,847
educational process.

276
00:16:32,127 --> 00:16:33,648
know, and this applies to the classroom.

277
00:16:33,648 --> 00:16:34,679
This applies to coaching.

278
00:16:34,679 --> 00:16:41,253
This applies to life, you know, and, know,
like here at Northern Arizona University,

279
00:16:41,253 --> 00:16:44,774
like we have a huge population of first
gen students.

280
00:16:45,835 --> 00:16:51,018
You know, these first gen students may not
know something that we take for

281
00:16:51,112 --> 00:16:51,629
Right.

282
00:16:51,629 --> 00:16:52,623
That's right.

283
00:16:52,796 --> 00:16:56,727
everyone knows and we can't make that
assumption with anybody.

284
00:16:57,188 --> 00:17:01,169
And so when Nikki said that, just was
like, that was a huge check on my part.

285
00:17:01,169 --> 00:17:05,260
And then another element, you know, it's
like, okay, they don't know what they

286
00:17:05,260 --> 00:17:05,580
don't know.

287
00:17:05,580 --> 00:17:09,331
But another element of my own personal
self -despair.

288
00:17:10,272 --> 00:17:11,132
Yeah, absolutely.

289
00:17:11,132 --> 00:17:12,782
Yeah, yeah.

290
00:17:12,782 --> 00:17:15,293
We forget what it means to be a rookie.

291
00:17:15,893 --> 00:17:18,694
We forget what it is like on that first

292
00:17:19,030 --> 00:17:22,470
In anything, the first day on the job,
first day in the classroom, first day at,

293
00:17:22,470 --> 00:17:25,030
you know, camp, first day, whatever.

294
00:17:25,550 --> 00:17:32,510
We, the experts have to be way more
empathetic and we have to like, we can't

295
00:17:32,510 --> 00:17:34,330
even assume they're going to meet us
halfway.

296
00:17:34,470 --> 00:17:38,470
We have to go 100 % over to the other side
and go, OK.

297
00:17:39,350 --> 00:17:42,670
Tell me if you don't, if you already know
this, but I'm going to take it all the way

298
00:17:42,670 --> 00:17:47,010
down to zero and start here and assume
they don't know anything.

299
00:17:47,510 --> 00:17:48,052
And.

300
00:17:48,052 --> 00:17:54,547
Now the other piece of that process was me
in the self discovery of learning how to

301
00:17:54,547 --> 00:17:59,121
teach and you know, and I would just say
learning how to teach not learning how to

302
00:17:59,121 --> 00:18:06,457
coach but learning how to communicate
information so that the individual one

303
00:18:06,457 --> 00:18:15,134
understands to is able to start applying
and three you give them a process that

304
00:18:15,134 --> 00:18:16,685
allows them to

305
00:18:17,962 --> 00:18:23,925
get the small wins, move forward
successfully, has the space to fail and

306
00:18:23,925 --> 00:18:26,565
understands that failure is just a data
point.

307
00:18:26,947 --> 00:18:32,070
You know, it's not, you know, you don't
want to set expectations too high, but you

308
00:18:32,070 --> 00:18:33,410
do want to challenge them.

309
00:18:33,471 --> 00:18:38,353
You do, you know, but all of this was
occurring to me, you know, throughout my

310
00:18:38,353 --> 00:18:40,054
coaching career and even

311
00:18:40,300 --> 00:18:41,681
This is true for coaching.

312
00:18:41,681 --> 00:18:43,383
This is true for parenting.

313
00:18:43,383 --> 00:18:47,496
This is true in the corporate environment
of, quote unquote, managing leading.

314
00:18:47,496 --> 00:18:55,112
I mean, this is a fundamental truth of how
to help people get from point A to point

315
00:18:55,112 --> 00:18:55,472
B.

316
00:18:55,472 --> 00:18:58,995
just want to, you know, you're saying
these things, but they're so incredibly

317
00:18:58,995 --> 00:19:00,226
important and interesting.

318
00:19:00,226 --> 00:19:04,710
I just want to let the audience absorb
this for a second and understand how

319
00:19:04,710 --> 00:19:07,422
applicable everything you're saying

320
00:19:07,518 --> 00:19:08,508
And let me just repeat it, right?

321
00:19:08,508 --> 00:19:09,840
You said small wins, right?

322
00:19:09,840 --> 00:19:11,881
That reinforces confidence.

323
00:19:11,881 --> 00:19:15,504
It reinforces this idea that you can make
small steps.

324
00:19:15,504 --> 00:19:17,745
But then you said it's okay to fail.

325
00:19:17,786 --> 00:19:21,558
And that failure, you're teaching them
that it's just a lesson on their way to

326
00:19:21,558 --> 00:19:25,671
their next success or their next failure,
which is yet another lesson, which is

327
00:19:25,671 --> 00:19:26,392
okay.

328
00:19:26,392 --> 00:19:28,914
And then you're saying something also
incredibly important, which I feel like

329
00:19:28,914 --> 00:19:32,476
sometimes in America we forget, you need
to also be challenged, right?

330
00:19:32,476 --> 00:19:34,824
Like these participation trophies.

331
00:19:34,824 --> 00:19:37,685
No, it's okay to say that you failed and
this is the lesson to learn.

332
00:19:37,685 --> 00:19:42,367
And then, you know, this is the, this was
a challenging thing that you, you achieved

333
00:19:42,367 --> 00:19:43,238
something.

334
00:19:43,238 --> 00:19:47,039
And even if you didn't get the perfect
score, you, you achieved the law.

335
00:19:47,400 --> 00:19:50,601
It's, it's such, such an, such an
important message.

336
00:19:50,601 --> 00:19:52,882
So I, I'll tell you a short story.

337
00:19:53,282 --> 00:19:59,495
one of my, one of my, partners, he, he
bombed a sales meeting and, and he, you

338
00:19:59,495 --> 00:20:02,568
know, he was obviously upset and.

339
00:20:02,568 --> 00:20:07,822
And I called him up maybe a couple hours
later and I said, that was amazing.

340
00:20:07,822 --> 00:20:09,122
That was a great job.

341
00:20:09,163 --> 00:20:11,374
And he was in shock.

342
00:20:11,374 --> 00:20:14,756
like, no, we completely bombed it and the
guy's not interested and blah, blah, blah.

343
00:20:14,756 --> 00:20:19,669
And I said, yes, but look at what you
learned.

344
00:20:20,110 --> 00:20:24,883
And you've taken this first step and look
at all the insights you have and look at

345
00:20:24,883 --> 00:20:26,694
what path this has set you

346
00:20:27,362 --> 00:20:30,724
and you know, I kind of changed the way he
looked at it and he came out from that

347
00:20:30,724 --> 00:20:33,946
discussion with this hugely positive
perspective.

348
00:20:33,946 --> 00:20:35,497
And now he's on this new journey.

349
00:20:35,497 --> 00:20:37,448
And I said, look, you're not a sales guy.

350
00:20:37,448 --> 00:20:39,009
This was your first sales meeting.

351
00:20:39,009 --> 00:20:42,471
You bombed it, but now you have all this
learnings and insights and it's such a

352
00:20:42,471 --> 00:20:43,771
wonderful thing.

353
00:20:43,771 --> 00:20:48,154
And so I just wanted to share my
appreciation of you kind of sharing these,

354
00:20:48,154 --> 00:20:50,235
these incredible points.

355
00:20:50,235 --> 00:20:55,097
So you talked about communication style

356
00:20:56,436 --> 00:21:01,973
common denominator, but it also matters
the kind of background of the person,

357
00:21:01,973 --> 00:21:03,516
where they come from.

358
00:21:03,516 --> 00:21:07,571
What are the different communication
styles that you have used as a coach, as a

359
00:21:07,571 --> 00:21:11,816
mentor, as a professor in order to really
connect and empathize?

360
00:21:12,670 --> 00:21:17,672
I think I approach it with almost a mix of
media and see what...

361
00:21:17,672 --> 00:21:20,313
I hate to say it like, let's throw it at
the wall and see what sticks.

362
00:21:20,313 --> 00:21:30,298
But on day one, it's me, it's audio, it's
text, it's imagery, it's creating

363
00:21:30,298 --> 00:21:31,618
analogies.

364
00:21:32,059 --> 00:21:38,621
And so I can be the sage on the stage, but
I can tell you right now, that actually is

365
00:21:38,621 --> 00:21:40,322
probably the least effective

366
00:21:40,426 --> 00:21:42,647
you know, in terms of getting them to
engage.

367
00:21:43,008 --> 00:21:47,392
One of the things is getting them to talk
to each other and for them to, you know, I

368
00:21:47,392 --> 00:21:52,876
love it when a student can teach a student
and because that student who's teaching it

369
00:21:52,876 --> 00:21:57,420
now is reinforcing it for themselves and
they're having to process and how to do

370
00:21:57,420 --> 00:21:58,080
that.

371
00:21:58,080 --> 00:22:02,764
So I can, you know, do an initial
conversation, have them have a second

372
00:22:02,764 --> 00:22:03,985
conversation.

373
00:22:04,266 --> 00:22:08,669
I can also with the, you know, in the
department of small wins, you know, it's

374
00:22:08,669 --> 00:22:10,170
like, okay, we're going to do

375
00:22:10,186 --> 00:22:13,777
At the end of this particular class or
this particular week, we're going to do a

376
00:22:13,777 --> 00:22:17,928
five really low stakes, five question
quiz.

377
00:22:18,408 --> 00:22:19,989
Or I will ask the athletes.

378
00:22:19,989 --> 00:22:21,129
So what did you learn today?

379
00:22:21,129 --> 00:22:22,979
How do you feel about what you got today?

380
00:22:22,979 --> 00:22:24,840
You know, and feel like that feel
question.

381
00:22:24,840 --> 00:22:28,571
Like it really gets them to dig in and go,
okay, how do I feel?

382
00:22:29,931 --> 00:22:34,453
and you know, and again, this has been,
you know, kind of a journey and a process.

383
00:22:34,453 --> 00:22:37,513
So like when I first started coaching, I
was horrible.

384
00:22:37,694 --> 00:22:39,005
I was bad.

385
00:22:39,005 --> 00:22:40,947
The why, why, how do you feel?

386
00:22:40,947 --> 00:22:44,379
I mean, you're glossing over something
incredibly important.

387
00:22:44,379 --> 00:22:48,702
Why is that important exercise for the
athletes?

388
00:22:49,332 --> 00:22:57,669
I think it really gets them to analyze and
to think about, what is my body and my

389
00:22:57,669 --> 00:22:59,570
mind saying to me?

390
00:22:59,751 --> 00:23:02,193
You know, because we can go do a workout.

391
00:23:02,193 --> 00:23:07,457
And I think that's why a lot of people
like don't make progress is they don't do

392
00:23:07,457 --> 00:23:12,331
the analysis, you know, or they're just
assuming that if I run, you know, a mile

393
00:23:12,331 --> 00:23:17,606
on the treadmill, whatever, you know,
where versus it's like, okay, how'd you do

394
00:23:17,606 --> 00:23:18,546
yesterday?

395
00:23:18,944 --> 00:23:20,285
How do you did you do today?

396
00:23:20,285 --> 00:23:21,346
How did yesterday feel?

397
00:23:21,346 --> 00:23:22,677
How did today feel?

398
00:23:22,677 --> 00:23:26,000
Did you make any sort of mechanical
improvement between that?

399
00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:29,603
Did you make any sort of mental strength
improvement between that?

400
00:23:30,164 --> 00:23:34,297
And for them, you when you talk about
feelings, you know, they're like, yeah,

401
00:23:34,297 --> 00:23:38,831
you know, when I was like really sitting
on that and really feeling like I was

402
00:23:38,831 --> 00:23:42,234
pushing against the ore, I felt this.

403
00:23:42,915 --> 00:23:47,258
And now they know what it's supposed to
feel like tomorrow.

404
00:23:48,562 --> 00:23:52,485
And this, you know, and the same thing as
in the classroom or, you know, just

405
00:23:52,485 --> 00:23:57,768
working with students or with kids or with
families or with corporations is what was

406
00:23:57,768 --> 00:23:58,788
yesterday?

407
00:23:59,209 --> 00:23:59,979
How did you do?

408
00:23:59,979 --> 00:24:00,760
How'd you feel?

409
00:24:00,760 --> 00:24:03,771
You know, what what did we accomplish?

410
00:24:03,872 --> 00:24:05,473
What what went wrong?

411
00:24:05,473 --> 00:24:06,853
Let's talk about it.

412
00:24:06,954 --> 00:24:07,814
How do we do today?

413
00:24:07,814 --> 00:24:08,275
crazy.

414
00:24:08,275 --> 00:24:12,353
You're almost advocating that even in the
employment environment you can...

415
00:24:12,475 --> 00:24:13,334
Okay, so this

416
00:24:13,334 --> 00:24:18,329
think, well, we're human, you know, and
emotions.

417
00:24:18,329 --> 00:24:20,335
let's not talk about emotions, right?

418
00:24:20,335 --> 00:24:21,737
Let's like, this is

419
00:24:22,570 --> 00:24:29,182
I think people are losing percentages of
potential and percentages gains, when we

420
00:24:29,182 --> 00:24:34,134
don't take a moment to recognize that how
do we feel about that?

421
00:24:34,894 --> 00:24:38,005
You know, because the thing is, it also
allows us like if we felt good about let's

422
00:24:38,005 --> 00:24:38,975
celebrate.

423
00:24:39,435 --> 00:24:42,896
If we felt uncomfortable about it, what
was uncomfortable?

424
00:24:42,916 --> 00:24:45,767
If we had created an uncomfortable
environment?

425
00:24:45,767 --> 00:24:50,068
Well, you know, hey, coach, leader, know,
captain of the ship, whatever.

426
00:24:50,452 --> 00:24:51,845
That's a you problem.

427
00:24:51,845 --> 00:24:53,988
That's not the sailors problem.

428
00:24:53,988 --> 00:24:55,992
That's not the employees problem.

429
00:24:55,992 --> 00:25:00,679
That if we're creating a negative
environment that makes them feel like they

430
00:25:00,679 --> 00:25:04,956
can't, then that's a leader.

431
00:25:06,058 --> 00:25:08,630
So in the business environment, it's
difficult.

432
00:25:08,630 --> 00:25:14,154
I think a lot of people fail on this
because employees, team, they don't want

433
00:25:14,154 --> 00:25:18,128
to show that they have an issue or that
they're weak or that they're unhappy

434
00:25:18,128 --> 00:25:23,993
because you're almost taught to exude the
strength and you don't want to, then the

435
00:25:23,993 --> 00:25:25,795
boss is going to come and say, what's your
problem?

436
00:25:25,795 --> 00:25:26,636
Why aren't you performing?

437
00:25:26,636 --> 00:25:29,228
Like you're almost pulling attention to
yourself.

438
00:25:29,228 --> 00:25:31,499
So everybody's happy, happy, happy all the
time.

439
00:25:31,660 --> 00:25:32,621
Is there a trick to it?

440
00:25:32,621 --> 00:25:34,492
Is there a way to build?

441
00:25:34,506 --> 00:25:38,907
And I'm guessing here that there's a
cultural thing you can do to make this

442
00:25:38,907 --> 00:25:39,359
work.

443
00:25:39,359 --> 00:25:40,131
What's the approach?

444
00:25:40,131 --> 00:25:42,606
How do you make this difficult thing
feasible?

445
00:25:43,382 --> 00:25:47,482
I think the first thing is getting to know
them.

446
00:25:48,182 --> 00:25:50,002
We love talking about ourselves.

447
00:25:50,002 --> 00:25:55,262
here, I tell you right now, me and you,
could be at 10 o 'clock, I'm in the West

448
00:25:55,262 --> 00:25:59,702
Coast time, so we could be at 11 o 'clock
today and I'd still be happy to talk about

449
00:25:59,702 --> 00:26:00,682
myself.

450
00:26:03,122 --> 00:26:10,134
But I think it's key that we actively
listen to our teammates.

451
00:26:10,134 --> 00:26:12,065
to our employees, to our families.

452
00:26:12,065 --> 00:26:17,258
And active listening is putting the pen
down, turning away from the keyboard,

453
00:26:17,258 --> 00:26:21,980
facing the individual and having, and it
doesn't, I'm not talking about hours on

454
00:26:21,980 --> 00:26:22,701
conversations.

455
00:26:22,701 --> 00:26:27,884
I'm talking about the two minutes of
either you're coaching the individual,

456
00:26:27,884 --> 00:26:32,046
you're helping to support the individual,
you're learning about the individual.

457
00:26:32,046 --> 00:26:39,049
And so when, to start that trust, they
have to believe we as leaders care.

458
00:26:40,490 --> 00:26:45,833
And not the the not the fake care, you
know, like, hey, great to see you today.

459
00:26:46,934 --> 00:26:48,576
OK, that's fake care in my mind.

460
00:26:48,576 --> 00:26:50,957
If you're honestly great to see them,
great.

461
00:26:50,957 --> 00:26:54,340
Tell them it's great to see them, but keep
going.

462
00:26:54,340 --> 00:26:55,700
You know, how are you doing today?

463
00:26:55,700 --> 00:26:58,162
Today, right now, how are you doing right
now?

464
00:26:58,823 --> 00:27:00,143
How's your cat?

465
00:27:01,044 --> 00:27:05,367
Hey, how was that Hawaiian pizza you had
last night?

466
00:27:05,707 --> 00:27:09,340
How you know, you told me on Friday you
were going on a hike.

467
00:27:09,340 --> 00:27:09,942
How to go?

468
00:27:09,942 --> 00:27:11,222
Like, where'd you go?

469
00:27:11,222 --> 00:27:12,462
Oh, it got rained out.

470
00:27:12,462 --> 00:27:13,462
Oh, that stinks.

471
00:27:13,462 --> 00:27:15,162
But what else did you do?

472
00:27:15,222 --> 00:27:17,102
You know, but what's that?

473
00:27:17,102 --> 00:27:19,342
30 seconds, one minute.

474
00:27:19,342 --> 00:27:23,082
Like, you know, like, like one of my
teammates that, you know, that's on my

475
00:27:23,082 --> 00:27:27,642
team here at the university at Northern
Arizona.

476
00:27:28,062 --> 00:27:34,322
Like I uncovered the fact that literally
we love the same wine brand, the same

477
00:27:34,322 --> 00:27:35,342
winery.

478
00:27:35,662 --> 00:27:38,484
Because we had a conversation like.

479
00:27:38,484 --> 00:27:40,856
And I can tell you this, this is not a
popular winery.

480
00:27:40,856 --> 00:27:45,330
The Masako wines out in Sonoma,
California, like the fact that they even

481
00:27:45,330 --> 00:27:47,822
knew the name blew my mind.

482
00:27:48,143 --> 00:27:49,594
And they're like, I love that winery.

483
00:27:49,594 --> 00:27:52,797
I'm like, my wife, literally we just
opened a bottle.

484
00:27:52,797 --> 00:27:53,287
my gosh.

485
00:27:53,287 --> 00:27:59,032
You know, like, but that's that human
connection, you know, and, and now we can

486
00:27:59,032 --> 00:28:04,877
build on that and, and they can, and, and
also like, it doesn't hurt for me to share

487
00:28:04,877 --> 00:28:06,178
where I mess

488
00:28:07,380 --> 00:28:10,232
You know, because we're human, I'm going
to fail.

489
00:28:10,332 --> 00:28:13,724
And if they know that I have a
relationship with them, if they know that

490
00:28:13,724 --> 00:28:18,237
it's okay to try something, you know, and
being a calculated risk.

491
00:28:18,518 --> 00:28:18,978
Okay.

492
00:28:18,978 --> 00:28:21,880
But we, we, we let that happen.

493
00:28:21,880 --> 00:28:26,713
We want them to try to push the envelope a
little bit and we want them to explore, to

494
00:28:26,713 --> 00:28:28,932
innovate, to try something different
because.

495
00:28:28,932 --> 00:28:30,523
on, I have to stop you on that.

496
00:28:30,544 --> 00:28:34,997
It's such an important point because I
think a lot of people in lot of

497
00:28:34,997 --> 00:28:38,369
environments, they try to showcase
themselves as perfect.

498
00:28:39,311 --> 00:28:44,215
And that does the opposite of what you
want it to do because people are like,

499
00:28:44,215 --> 00:28:45,336
you're not perfect.

500
00:28:45,336 --> 00:28:48,758
So actually that's creating a negative
perception.

501
00:28:48,899 --> 00:28:55,914
But if you just share honestly and humbly
like I fucked up, you know, I learned from

502
00:28:55,914 --> 00:28:56,565
this.

503
00:28:56,565 --> 00:28:58,195
Here's what I learned.

504
00:28:58,195 --> 00:28:58,658
Mm -hmm.

505
00:28:58,658 --> 00:29:01,479
know, you're a real person now.

506
00:29:03,350 --> 00:29:09,052
since we were talking about rowing, here's
a now in hindsight, funny, but really

507
00:29:09,052 --> 00:29:09,672
happened.

508
00:29:09,672 --> 00:29:11,893
I got the regatta dates wrong.

509
00:29:12,173 --> 00:29:18,285
We went we literally scheduled a race with
the university on the wrong weekend when

510
00:29:18,285 --> 00:29:22,406
they were expecting us on it on a like one
of the other book in weekends.

511
00:29:22,406 --> 00:29:25,677
I don't remember which we get about two
weeks out.

512
00:29:25,677 --> 00:29:27,167
I've made hotel reservations.

513
00:29:27,167 --> 00:29:28,678
I've reserved the bus.

514
00:29:28,678 --> 00:29:30,918
It's you know, everything is done.

515
00:29:30,930 --> 00:29:34,172
And something just tickled in the back of
my head and I called them up and I said,

516
00:29:34,172 --> 00:29:36,713
hey, we're coming on X and they're like.

517
00:29:37,533 --> 00:29:39,354
We're racing on why.

518
00:29:39,634 --> 00:29:40,915
And I was like.

519
00:29:41,936 --> 00:29:44,417
And so I had to go back to my team and go,
hey.

520
00:29:45,477 --> 00:29:47,138
I really messed

521
00:29:48,992 --> 00:29:53,084
But I told them, you know, I literally
owned it like I was the one that, know,

522
00:29:53,084 --> 00:29:53,885
I'm the head coach.

523
00:29:53,885 --> 00:29:57,928
That's a me problem, even though maybe my
assistant coach at the time might have had

524
00:29:57,928 --> 00:30:02,031
a whole bunch of involvement in helping me
make that arrangement.

525
00:30:02,131 --> 00:30:02,552
Neat.

526
00:30:02,552 --> 00:30:06,234
None of us realized how.

527
00:30:08,086 --> 00:30:09,907
Apparently we need to look at calendars
better.

528
00:30:09,907 --> 00:30:13,138
But the thing is, like, you know, I told
him, I was like, guys, I messed up.

529
00:30:13,138 --> 00:30:16,178
Now, did we, did we get it to work?

530
00:30:16,178 --> 00:30:17,210
Did we fix a couple of things?

531
00:30:17,210 --> 00:30:18,050
Sure.

532
00:30:18,170 --> 00:30:20,141
But it wasn't what it was supposed to be.

533
00:30:20,141 --> 00:30:23,952
And we weren't necessarily racing the way
it was supposed to be, you know, who and

534
00:30:23,952 --> 00:30:31,376
what and when, but you know, I, know, what
am I going to do other than tell them,

535
00:30:31,376 --> 00:30:33,036
Hey, I messed up at the same time.

536
00:30:33,036 --> 00:30:37,610
It opens the door for the athletes to go,
it's okay.

537
00:30:37,610 --> 00:30:39,811
to come to me and say I messed up.

538
00:30:40,451 --> 00:30:45,573
You know, now, you know, there are still
standards.

539
00:30:45,914 --> 00:30:46,794
Okay.

540
00:30:46,794 --> 00:30:52,006
And then so, you know, we have to hold
everybody to a standard, but you know, if

541
00:30:52,006 --> 00:30:55,668
someone messes up and I've learned this
and then there was another case where I

542
00:30:55,668 --> 00:30:59,579
think I messed up big time in the in
learning this process is we have to give

543
00:30:59,579 --> 00:31:04,581
them a little bit of grace and we have to
go, you know what they tried something

544
00:31:04,581 --> 00:31:06,282
where they did something.

545
00:31:06,770 --> 00:31:11,074
and they messed up, but I need to
understand that, okay, there's a

546
00:31:11,074 --> 00:31:16,458
consequence, but it, but can we learn from
that?

547
00:31:17,199 --> 00:31:21,483
And, know, and I could probably review a
couple of times where I, as a leader,

548
00:31:21,483 --> 00:31:23,384
messed up doing that.

549
00:31:24,605 --> 00:31:27,678
and, know, and I think now if I was to
approach the same situation, I would

550
00:31:27,678 --> 00:31:28,628
handle it.

551
00:31:29,169 --> 00:31:34,173
Well, I would say very, very differently,
you know, knowing that it's like, Hey, we

552
00:31:34,173 --> 00:31:35,534
have to know

553
00:31:36,328 --> 00:31:37,979
And again, it's also going back to that.

554
00:31:37,979 --> 00:31:41,222
Hey, you know, you were a coordinator at
some point.

555
00:31:41,222 --> 00:31:43,544
You were an assistant director at some
point.

556
00:31:43,544 --> 00:31:46,076
You were a brand new employee at some
point.

557
00:31:46,076 --> 00:31:48,588
You were a brand new team member at some
point.

558
00:31:49,049 --> 00:31:52,862
Anytime we encounter this, where you might
be like literally holding your head in

559
00:31:52,862 --> 00:31:55,100
your hand, like, I can't believe they did

560
00:31:55,100 --> 00:31:56,510
Yeah, that's right.

561
00:31:57,351 --> 00:31:58,692
So how do we...

562
00:31:59,833 --> 00:32:06,336
So, I mean, if I'm the leader, right, I
can put that culture forth.

563
00:32:06,636 --> 00:32:14,460
But as an employee, if I have the culture
of admitting my fault that others don't,

564
00:32:14,781 --> 00:32:15,591
is that dangerous?

565
00:32:15,591 --> 00:32:18,713
Does that put me in a disadvantage because
now I'm the guy that looks like I'm

566
00:32:18,713 --> 00:32:19,944
fucking up all the time?

567
00:32:19,944 --> 00:32:23,436
And then, excuse my language, and then
this other person is always blaming other

568
00:32:23,436 --> 00:32:24,306
people.

569
00:32:24,756 --> 00:32:30,316
Is that, am I making a bad choice by
living out that culture that I believe in

570
00:32:30,316 --> 00:32:31,578
of ownership?

571
00:32:32,330 --> 00:32:38,995
Well, I think if we're having multiple
negative outcomes, that might be

572
00:32:38,995 --> 00:32:44,019
necessitating a self review of, OK, why
are we having multiple bad outcomes?

573
00:32:45,060 --> 00:32:51,104
However, think that when you know,
hopefully you're not messing up every day,

574
00:32:51,625 --> 00:32:58,442
but when we do mess up, I think it allows
and we say, hey, I did this, I messed

575
00:32:58,442 --> 00:33:01,804
this is why, you know, or even maybe
adding us some contacts and saying, Hey,

576
00:33:01,804 --> 00:33:05,226
this is why I, you know, I tried this and
this is why it failed.

577
00:33:06,507 --> 00:33:13,240
that allows for our teams are, you know,
and, I'm a big team guy.

578
00:33:13,240 --> 00:33:15,972
So if you work on my team, you work on my
team.

579
00:33:15,972 --> 00:33:19,494
If you row on my team, you're on my team
teams all over.

580
00:33:19,764 --> 00:33:26,558
but, the, I think that if we are going

581
00:33:27,656 --> 00:33:32,930
allowed them some grace and gives and
hopefully they develop.

582
00:33:33,410 --> 00:33:39,855
We need to take those opportunities to go,
know what, failure is a data point and I

583
00:33:39,855 --> 00:33:41,256
messed this up.

584
00:33:42,037 --> 00:33:46,490
But the responsibility is also on us and
our other teammates is when we make those

585
00:33:46,490 --> 00:33:50,713
mistakes or when things don't go wrong or
when we don't win the race or whatever,

586
00:33:50,713 --> 00:33:55,036
you know, and winning special, you know,
anytime you succeed, it's special.

587
00:33:55,210 --> 00:33:58,541
You know, and, we should celebrate that
because we're all not going to get a

588
00:33:58,541 --> 00:33:58,761
hundred.

589
00:33:58,761 --> 00:34:01,122
know, nobody makes a hundred percent of
shots and things like that.

590
00:34:01,122 --> 00:34:07,105
So we have to assume that there's going to
be failure, but if we act like

591
00:34:07,105 --> 00:34:12,137
everything's perfect, everybody else is
assuming that we're holding them to this

592
00:34:12,137 --> 00:34:15,528
particular standard and they're either
going to try to get it and they're going

593
00:34:15,528 --> 00:34:21,721
to fail and they're going to not tell
anybody or they're not even going to try.

594
00:34:22,421 --> 00:34:25,110
Which both of them are, I think are.

595
00:34:25,110 --> 00:34:29,330
bigger negative outcomes than for them to
go, you know what, I tried it and it

596
00:34:29,330 --> 00:34:32,210
didn't work, not failure, but it didn't
work.

597
00:34:32,210 --> 00:34:37,010
But these are the things I learned and
next time I'm going to get that extra 10%.

598
00:34:37,010 --> 00:34:40,850
And, and so, but we have to do that too as
leaders.

599
00:34:40,850 --> 00:34:41,270
Okay.

600
00:34:41,270 --> 00:34:43,630
It means all of us need to develop.

601
00:34:43,650 --> 00:34:44,970
All of us need to try.

602
00:34:44,970 --> 00:34:48,990
All of us need to kind of reach and
stretch and we need to share when we don't

603
00:34:48,990 --> 00:34:50,450
get that, you know?

604
00:34:50,450 --> 00:34:54,166
And so I don't think we're putting
ourselves at a competitive disadvantage.

605
00:34:54,166 --> 00:34:58,306
nor is it in a weaker perception to the
team.

606
00:34:58,306 --> 00:35:03,546
When we say, you know what, I tried this
to get the team 10 % better or for me to

607
00:35:03,546 --> 00:35:07,106
get 10 % better or for me to make a bigger
sale or for me to get the team a little

608
00:35:07,106 --> 00:35:07,906
bit faster.

609
00:35:07,906 --> 00:35:08,926
Didn't work.

610
00:35:08,926 --> 00:35:11,346
But these are the, and this is, think is
really key.

611
00:35:11,346 --> 00:35:12,866
This is what we learned.

612
00:35:13,686 --> 00:35:16,226
And now we've taken this calculated risk.

613
00:35:16,226 --> 00:35:18,126
Didn't work out.

614
00:35:18,126 --> 00:35:18,766
Great.

615
00:35:18,766 --> 00:35:20,326
These are the things we learned.

616
00:35:20,466 --> 00:35:23,846
Let's apply it and find maybe that 5 % of
the

617
00:35:24,534 --> 00:35:30,594
You know, and, and on the water rowing 1 %
is roughly four seconds at the finish

618
00:35:30,594 --> 00:35:31,474
line.

619
00:35:31,894 --> 00:35:36,534
And I told the group of students I was
speaking to last night, um, I'll take 1 %

620
00:35:36,534 --> 00:35:41,354
every single day of the week, twice on
Sunday, like 1 % four seconds.

621
00:35:41,354 --> 00:35:47,054
That's almost a length of a rowing, of a
60 foot rowing show at the finish line.

622
00:35:47,914 --> 00:35:52,194
And there, there are numerous races.

623
00:35:52,942 --> 00:35:54,974
Yeah, in fact one flashes back in my mind.

624
00:35:54,974 --> 00:35:58,327
It's like literally it's a it's it's it I
won't call it post -traumatic stress, but

625
00:35:58,327 --> 00:36:03,991
it's definitely a flashback but I would
have loved for percent for one percent

626
00:36:03,991 --> 00:36:09,516
four seconds at that finish line because
we were racing Florida Tech at Dad Vail's

627
00:36:09,516 --> 00:36:15,581
which is a huge regatta in Philadelphia
Literally we hit the finish line It was BB

628
00:36:15,581 --> 00:36:18,884
and me and the Florida Tech coach were
standing right there Casey Baker and I

629
00:36:18,884 --> 00:36:21,966
were standing right there and both of us
looked at each other were

630
00:36:22,262 --> 00:36:23,842
We had no idea who won.

631
00:36:23,922 --> 00:36:25,582
We literally could not.

632
00:36:25,802 --> 00:36:32,782
And my squad was about that much on the
wrong side of the result.

633
00:36:33,342 --> 00:36:35,562
And, you know, but it was a great race.

634
00:36:35,562 --> 00:36:41,238
Like I will never forget that race, but 1
% completely different.

635
00:36:41,238 --> 00:36:41,858
right?

636
00:36:41,858 --> 00:36:46,878
Take 1 .01 and, you know, to the power of
100, you're almost three times better,

637
00:36:46,878 --> 00:36:47,618
right?

638
00:36:47,618 --> 00:36:51,259
Like small, my dad used to say, baby
steps, baby steps,

639
00:36:51,259 --> 00:36:53,651
wins, huge outcomes.

640
00:36:53,651 --> 00:36:54,757
Keep investing.

641
00:36:54,757 --> 00:36:55,639
That's right.

642
00:36:55,639 --> 00:36:56,440
So,

643
00:37:01,716 --> 00:37:03,960
You see now I have the pause.

644
00:37:07,476 --> 00:37:17,927
Tell me about the places where one of the
team members just broke down and they hit

645
00:37:17,927 --> 00:37:19,428
their rock bottom.

646
00:37:20,956 --> 00:37:26,905
And how do you help a person kind of get
out of that hole and keep

647
00:37:28,630 --> 00:37:34,666
I'm not going to name them, but they will
know exactly who they are when they see

648
00:37:34,666 --> 00:37:35,456
this.

649
00:37:35,877 --> 00:37:45,587
We were at a regatta and she had come over
from another team in our athletic

650
00:37:45,587 --> 00:37:47,489
department to start rowing with us.

651
00:37:50,336 --> 00:37:54,008
So in rowing, there's what we call
catching a crab.

652
00:37:54,008 --> 00:37:58,901
And basically what happens at that point
is the ore hydrodynamically gets stuck in

653
00:37:58,901 --> 00:37:59,851
the water.

654
00:38:00,572 --> 00:38:01,692
You're pulling through.

655
00:38:01,692 --> 00:38:02,873
mean, the boat's moving.

656
00:38:02,873 --> 00:38:04,864
All eight women are moving together.

657
00:38:04,864 --> 00:38:09,516
I mean, there is a it is a ballet of
motion when it's done well.

658
00:38:09,516 --> 00:38:10,997
It is beautiful.

659
00:38:11,518 --> 00:38:16,180
But one, you know, any number of things
can throw you off.

660
00:38:16,180 --> 00:38:17,541
She caught a crab.

661
00:38:18,361 --> 00:38:20,052
We were leading the race.

662
00:38:21,598 --> 00:38:23,899
We ended up out of the medals.

663
00:38:24,200 --> 00:38:29,763
And literally here she comes to the dock.

664
00:38:30,905 --> 00:38:35,568
I mean, she is an emotional bomb has
absolutely leveled her.

665
00:38:35,568 --> 00:38:38,730
Like she is absolutely distraught, gone to
pieces.

666
00:38:38,730 --> 00:38:43,173
you know, and if I recall correctly, it
was our first year rowing.

667
00:38:44,094 --> 00:38:49,367
but, you know, she felt she let the school
down, the team down, me down, herself

668
00:38:49,367 --> 00:38:49,678
down.

669
00:38:49,678 --> 00:38:50,594
Like, I mean,

670
00:38:50,594 --> 00:38:51,905
literally like they're there.

671
00:38:51,905 --> 00:39:02,969
I mean, negativity all the way around, you
know, and, and we, at that point, there is

672
00:39:02,969 --> 00:39:10,273
the worst thing we can do is to either
blame fine fall, you know, and at that

673
00:39:10,273 --> 00:39:17,246
point, it's literally for me, it's like,
Hey, you know, and I'm sure I didn't say

674
00:39:17,246 --> 00:39:18,106
it this

675
00:39:18,262 --> 00:39:25,082
But this is what I wanted to communicate
to them is I still respect you, still love

676
00:39:25,082 --> 00:39:28,042
you, still want you on our team.

677
00:39:28,342 --> 00:39:30,182
You are important.

678
00:39:30,222 --> 00:39:35,762
And you took 199 great strokes out of

679
00:39:38,742 --> 00:39:44,462
And so, you know, it, and, but the thing
also is to pull them aside and have, you

680
00:39:44,462 --> 00:39:49,082
know, that conversation, allow them to be
who they are.

681
00:39:49,082 --> 00:39:55,162
You know, if there's crying and rowing
great, you know, uh, you know, why?

682
00:39:55,162 --> 00:39:57,742
Because we're passionate, you know, we
cared.

683
00:39:57,742 --> 00:40:01,962
So, and, I've seen it in business world,
you know, where something didn't go wrong.

684
00:40:01,962 --> 00:40:07,894
Everything else lined up 199 great
strokes, one bad stroke and literally, you

685
00:40:07,894 --> 00:40:09,554
takes the boat, turns it sideways.

686
00:40:10,514 --> 00:40:12,694
We have to be compassionate.

687
00:40:13,934 --> 00:40:20,534
We have to be, we again, have to go back
and go, OK, put ourselves in their shoes.

688
00:40:20,534 --> 00:40:22,334
Be empathetic.

689
00:40:22,674 --> 00:40:29,014
And know that when we have these failures,
probably it may be a smidge off color, but

690
00:40:29,014 --> 00:40:31,394
nobody wants to suck.

691
00:40:32,794 --> 00:40:36,674
If someone's doing something and they're
showing up 40 hours a week, they don't

692
00:40:36,674 --> 00:40:37,774
want to stink at

693
00:40:38,652 --> 00:40:41,463
If somebody's showing up and they're
rolling in above, they don't want to stink

694
00:40:41,463 --> 00:40:42,343
at that.

695
00:40:42,364 --> 00:40:47,626
You know, they may not be the best at it,
but if we're good coaches, we're good

696
00:40:47,626 --> 00:40:48,306
leaders.

697
00:40:48,306 --> 00:40:54,528
They're going to try their best to be
their best.

698
00:40:55,209 --> 00:40:56,509
And they're going to work hard.

699
00:40:56,509 --> 00:41:02,952
And I heard this last week, they're going
to try to work to be, they're going to try

700
00:41:02,952 --> 00:41:04,713
their best to be better.

701
00:41:05,553 --> 00:41:07,514
You know, and, and, and

702
00:41:08,138 --> 00:41:12,980
what we want to be able to do is to
really, but we as leaders, we need to give

703
00:41:12,980 --> 00:41:14,714
them space to do that.

704
00:41:14,714 --> 00:41:18,472
And a piece of that is when that person
hits their lowest.

705
00:41:19,978 --> 00:41:21,207
That's the teachable moment.

706
00:41:21,207 --> 00:41:25,299
down and say, and now I won't even say
that, we have to climb in the hole with

707
00:41:25,406 --> 00:41:26,328
Hmm,

708
00:41:26,954 --> 00:41:29,716
We have to get down there and go, you know
what?

709
00:41:29,716 --> 00:41:31,818
Me and you, we're in this trench together.

710
00:41:32,439 --> 00:41:34,760
And we're both going to get out of it.

711
00:41:35,581 --> 00:41:42,867
know, and I because it's something you see
these graphics where somebody is reaching

712
00:41:42,867 --> 00:41:46,230
down to help pull somebody up, you know,
and that's a piece of it.

713
00:41:46,230 --> 00:41:46,490
Yes.

714
00:41:46,490 --> 00:41:50,973
But why not climb down there and help them
climb up with them?

715
00:41:51,755 --> 00:41:56,348
You know that to me, that's a teammate,
somebody who's not going to get, you know,

716
00:41:56,372 --> 00:42:00,164
And it's a big philosophy of mine is never
leave a person behind.

717
00:42:00,484 --> 00:42:06,937
And no matter what we're and yeah, it
could be out hiking, could be what we're

718
00:42:06,937 --> 00:42:12,120
doing in the boat house, what we're doing
at work, no one gets left behind.

719
00:42:12,120 --> 00:42:13,430
We need to care.

720
00:42:13,871 --> 00:42:20,304
And when they're at their lowest, we need
to care even more and get down in the

721
00:42:20,304 --> 00:42:20,724
trench with