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If your inability to maintain your intimate relationship with your partner is one of the bumps on your road to divorce, then you need to keep listening... because today we’re taking on one of the big ones: your sex life with author and specialist Dr. Janet Williams.
Show Notes
If your ability to maintain your intimate relationship with your partner is one of the bumps on your road to divorce, then you need to keep listening because today we’re taking on one of the big ones: your sex life.
Dr. Janet Williams is a specialist in obstetrics and gynecology and member of the International Society for the Study of Women’s Sexual Health. And, as the author behind Why Don't I Like Sex Anymore: The Grown Woman’s Guide to Getting Your Groove Back and Claiming Your Truth, she’s just the right voice to help guide us through reclaiming balance in our sexual relationship.
Sex is a bio-psycho-sociological connection. It’s completely normal for interest in sex to ebb and flow through a couple’s life together. The real question, as Dr. Williams explains, is why. What is your orgasm gap, the difference in your relative levels of joy from sexual interaction? There is no normal but instead a range of behaviors and physiological reasons why some people may be drawn to certain things. Your goal, to rebuild your level of intimacy, is to discover why you have a desire-libido mismatch.
Links & Notes
- Get the book!
- Check out Janet’s Intimate Wellness Shop
- Schedule a consult with Seth
- Got a question you want to ask on the show? Click here!
- (00:00) - Welcome to How to Split a Toaster
- (00:28) - Introducing Dr. Janet Williams
- (02:34) - When you fall out of love with sex
- (06:12) - Are you bringing sex up to your attorney?
- (07:59) - Sex and Communication: Bio-Psycho-Social
- (17:10) - What's getting in the way of arousal
- (20:10) - Sponsor: Soberlink
- (23:07) - Learning to talk about sex
- (25:11) - About the Book
- (29:46) - Self-care
- (32:58) - Learn More
Creators & Guests
Host
Host
What is How to Split a Toaster: A Divorce Podcast About Saving Your Relationships?
Seth Nelson is a Tampa based family lawyer known for devising creative solutions to difficult problems. In How to Split a Toaster, Nelson and co-host Pete Wright take on the challenge of divorce with a central objective — saving your most important relationships with your family, your former spouse, and yourself.
Pete Wright:
Welcome to How To Split a Toaster, a divorce podcast about saving your relationships, from TruStory FM. Today, what happens when your toaster just doesn't want to brown anymore?
Seth Nelson:
Welcome to the show, everyone. I'm Seth Nelson. As always, I'm here with my good friend Pete Wright. If your ability to maintain your intimate relationship with your partner is one of the bumps on the road to divorce, then you need to keep listening because today we're talking about one of the big ones, your sex life. Dr. Janet Williams is a specialist in gynecology and a member of the International Society for Study of Women's Sexual Health and is the author behind Why Don't I Like Sex Anymore? The Grown Woman's Guide to Getting Your Groove Back and Claiming Your Truth. She's just the right voice to help guide us through reclaiming balance in our sexual relationship. Dr. Janet, welcome to the Toaster.
Janet Williams:
Well, thank you. Thanks for having me. [inaudible 00:01:11].
Pete Wright:
Anytime we get to talk about sex on this show, I'm on board.
Janet Williams:
Yeah, that's the way it should be.
Pete Wright:
That's the way it should be.
Seth Nelson:
Pete, Pete, Pete-
Janet Williams:
[inaudible 00:01:20].
Pete Wright:
Yeah.
Seth Nelson:
... put down the cigarette. Okay?
Pete Wright:
You're the one carrying a drink around, man.
Seth Nelson:
It's the holiday season. It's eggnog, but there's no alcohol in it. It's the middle of the day at work. I've got some potential clients I have to talk to later, some clients, so-
Pete Wright:
Okay. You're all above board, Mr. Hefner.
Seth Nelson:
Yeah.
Pete Wright:
Okay.
Seth Nelson:
You're lighting up over there, though.
Pete Wright:
Here's the question that we wanted to kick off here is, if intimacy is something that is in the way of your relationship, we're hoping that this conversation can help shed some light on what you can do to bring back the spark in your relationship. And if there's something else that's going on, we can't think of a better voice to help us navigate that conversation. I mean, the book, Why Don't I Like Sex Anymore? is... I searched for your book, and let me tell you, your book's title is not the only Google search that comes up when you search for that. That is a widely, widely circulated challenge that I think people are facing. And so can we start off with, what's going on when people forget how to love sex?
Janet Williams:
Right. Well, I don't know we've forgotten how to love sex. It's that there's so many other things that are getting in the way of sex, in particular for women. The way that we approach things is a little bit different from men. And so a lot of times in perimenopause and menopause, around the age where a lot of women are coming into this realization that, "I'm not feeling it anymore," there's a lot going on in our lives. So it's multifactorial, is the short answer. I talk about in my [inaudible 00:03:11]-
Seth Nelson:
We're looking for the long answer today.
Janet Williams:
Yeah, yeah. So, I talk about this in the book. Usually, around that time in your life, there's many things going on. I mention divorce, for example. There may be divorce or separation. You might have kids that you're schlepping back and forth to soccer practice and ballet. They might be headed off to college. You might be having some empty nester stuff going on. Aging parents. Your body is changing. It's all of these things. If you're in menopause or perimenopause, you're waking up with freaking hot flashes at three o'clock in the morning. You're not getting sleep. Who freaking wants to have sex when you're exhausted? So it's all of these [inaudible 00:03:58]-
Seth Nelson:
Every guy. Every guy I've ever talked to.
Pete Wright:
Do you know, in [inaudible 00:04:03]-
Janet Williams:
But [inaudible 00:04:03]-
Pete Wright:
That sort of leads me to another question, though, that there are the stereotypes of sexual... And I don't want to call it sexual peaking. Like, "Oh, males peak when they're 18," or whatever that means, and women peak at a different time. I don't know. How do we age with sex? When you get to 40s, 50s, 60s, are your interests naturally ever aligned again, or you're just having to fight the counter curve all the way to bed?
Janet Williams:
Well, some of it has to do with hormones and the changes that occur with hormones. And some of the studies don't actually show that it's actually the hormones, but it's what the hormones do and when they're not there. For women in their 40s, a lot of times what we'll see is a lot of fluctuations in the estrogen levels. So one day they're, might be horny as hell, and like, "Let's go." And the next day they're like, "Back it up, buddy. We're not feeling it." So there's that thing that happens. You might have heard that, where people like, "The best sex I ever had was in my 40s." And then, just a few years later, then you're not wanting to do anything. So there is that physiologic part of it that does that take place. And so we can see some fluctuations there.
Seth Nelson:
So, what I'm hearing you say is-
Janet Williams:
Mm-hmm.
Seth Nelson:
... there is biological things going on in the human body for women, and for men as well. And then we're going to also talk about the whole emotional connection with your partner or spouse or whoever you might be [inaudible 00:05:49].
Janet Williams:
Yes. So yeah, in the field of-
Seth Nelson:
So those two things have to align, right?
Janet Williams:
Yeah.
Pete Wright:
Yeah. That was going to be my question for you, Seth, which was, when you talk to people who come to you, by the time they get to you, Mr. Attorney, how often does sex come up in the process of a dissolving relationship? I mean, does it come up regular, or people don't really talk about it with you?
Seth Nelson:
I don't ask. But people will offer. And it's not like they'll say-
Pete Wright:
I'm sure that's the case. Yes.
Seth Nelson:
And let me be very clear on what I just said. It's not that I don't ask my clients for sex, but they offer me sex. That's-
Pete Wright:
I think you're a handsome man.
Seth Nelson:
Okay. No, no, no, no, no, no. What I'm saying is, is I never bring up the topic of sex with my clients, but they will ask me or tell me about it. And a lot of my clients will say, "Well, is there a therapist I can go to?" Or, "What about this?" Or, "What about that?" And sometimes, as you know, divorce is stressful.
And I will say to my client, depending on the type of client and what we've talked about before, when we're trying to get close to finishing the deal, and I'm like, "There's a big thing in this deal that's a huge benefit to you, and it's not written." And they're like, "Oh, my God, should we put it in there?" I'm like, "No, you don't need to put it in there." They're like, "What's the benefit?" And I'll say, "You never have to have sex with that guy again." And they're like, "Oh, my God. I didn't think about that. You're right. Let's finish this divorce." Right?
Janet Williams:
Right.
Pete Wright:
Yeah.
Janet Williams:
Oh, go ahead.
Seth Nelson:
What they'll mention... And Jan, this is what I was going to ask you. Sometimes it will come up in my conversations because there's been infidelity. Sometimes it'll come up with my conversation because they'll start dating somebody during the divorce process. And like Janet says, then they'll say, "Oh, my God. This is the best sex I've ever had. Seth, why didn't you tell me there are all these guys out there?" Or, "Seth, this is amazing. Why don't you tell me there's these women out there?" And I'm like, "Because-"
Pete Wright:
"Because I'm an attorney."
Seth Nelson:
"That's not my job." Right? Like, "Hello." But to Janet's point, what I'm really interested in is, we have the physical going on. We have the emotional going on. That's a lot to align, which makes it, in my mind, easy for things not to align and then to cause harm to a relationship.
Pete Wright:
Right. Right. And just to jump between your two points... Jan, I don't mean to hijack you. I have some dear friends, and they've been divorced for 10 years. And we were at a holiday party the other night, and we were having a conversation, kind of laughing and laughing, and she said, "You know what I've learned? I learned why I divorced." Because we were talking about splitting sides. Somebody gets the friends. And she said, "I got divorced because we stopped having sex eight years prior. We stopped having sex because we couldn't figure out what was going on, on how to find our physical alignment. And the lack of-"
Janet Williams:
Wow.
Pete Wright:
"... intimacy drove a wedge in our communication, our ability to communicate." That's what I want to just anchor here, that this is not just about finding a way to make your partner feel good, but more than that. Right?
Janet Williams:
Definitely. I think what we need to realize is that sex is... In the sexual medicine community, it's bio-psychosocial. It's not emotions only. It's not just hormones. It's not just like your partner's an asshole, and you don't want to have sex with him. It's a combination. So it's bio-psychosocial, all of those things, and the cultural impact and influences. And what do your friends think? That actually has an impact on your sex life, believe it or not.
Seth Nelson:
Is that what the social part is?
Janet Williams:
Your friends' religion, what society thinks about what you should be doing or what you should not be doing, all of those things factor in. And so, it helps if we have that realization, if we have that knowledge, so that we don't think that there's something wrong with you, because people are going to have some sort of sexual issue in their lifetime. Most people do. It's actually not abnormal. But there's ebbs and flows. And so we have to have the realization that all of these factors are involved. And so we can kind of take a look at what is going on for each individual person.
Seth Nelson:
So, I actually litigated a case that-
Janet Williams:
Ooh.
Seth Nelson:
... dealt with a lot about sex, and-
Janet Williams:
Interesting.
Seth Nelson:
... the reason it was an issue in the case is, in Florida... Check your local jurisdiction... any behavior of the parent that you're complaining about or one side's complaining about, there has to be a nexus to the children. So on this case, the sexual behavior was so far outside of the norm, even though the behavior was not happening when the children were home... They knew nothing about it. They didn't see anything, hear anything. There was no photos of anything. There was no way for them to ever know... they were trying to make the connection, in this case I was involved in, that this is so far out of the norm that there should be a psych eval because something's got to be going on that's going to be negatively impacting the children.
And what I learned from that is there is no normal. There is a range of behaviors, in all sorts of behaviors that we have, that is, quote unquote, that most people do. Let's just call that a normal range. But then people do stuff outside of the normal range, but it doesn't mean that they're abnormal. Do I have that right?
Janet Williams:
That's about right. I mean, I think there's things that we would consider fringe, but the research is actually showing that it's not necessarily fringe, when we talk about like BDSM. This is the nerd in me that's coming out. But there's some actually very interesting things about pain receptors like the nerve and how BDSM helps with people who have chronic pelvic pain, for example. So a lot of those connections, again, it's bio-psychosocial. It's not just like, "Oh, this guy has a fetish," then it's off to the side. But there's some physiologic reasons why people might be drawn to certain things. And so yes, I would agree that there is a range of what is normal.
Pete Wright:
What a relief. Whew.
Janet Williams:
Whew.
Pete Wright:
I think the challenge that I'm having, kind of wrapping my head around, is I'm trying to put myself in the middle of a relationship that is struggling with communication and sexuality, and figuring out how to recover intimacy in a relationship that's struggling. At what point are there efforts you can take to reignite for yourself a kind of starving intimate relationship? Is that such a thing?
Janet Williams:
Yeah, I think, and the work that I do is around individuals. So I work with women mostly. Well, I will say only women, right, at this point. But a lot of what we do is helping that person to figure out what they want, because a lot of people don't really know. There is something called the orgasm gap, which is basically a disparity in the amount of pleasure that heterosexual couples are, the female versus male, are having in the relationship. And so a lot of times that gap where you're not really, actually getting pleasure from sex, then leads you to not desire sex and or not be responsive to sex.
So a part of it is just kind of figuring out what is your why as to the reason why you are not wanting to have sex or you're not having sex. And once you can figure that out for yourself, I call it intimacy congestion. There's things that are blocking, that are in the way of you being [inaudible 00:14:00] to express yourself fully. Then we can begin to communicate that with our partners, because a lot of people don't know. They just stop for whatever reason, and they-
Seth Nelson:
And-
Janet Williams:
... in themselves, don't know.
Seth Nelson:
Right. And-
Janet Williams:
And so how are you going to relay that to your partner? You don't know your own situation.
Seth Nelson:
And do you kind of wake up one day and be like, "Oh, man, something's wrong. We haven't had sex for three years." Or is it-
Janet Williams:
Yeah. It's more. It can be more sometimes. Yeah.
Seth Nelson:
Right. But when they first realize there's the problem.
Janet Williams:
Mm-hmm.
Seth Nelson:
Sometimes I feel like you get so busy in your life, and they're like, "Oh, my god, it's a problem. We haven't had sex for six months." And I hear that stuff a lot from my clients. "Well, we haven't had sex for so long," or whatever the case may be. I always wonder, "At what point did you think, 'Hmm. We're not connecting,' or, 'This is a problem. Do I want to stay in this marriage?' Or, 'Is there something wrong with us physically, psychologically, socially?'" Does that just-
Pete Wright:
Yeah, which one is a leading indicator, right? Right.
Seth Nelson:
Yeah.
Janet Williams:
The chicken or egg situation. I don't know. I think it's a tough question because sometimes people are so wrapped up in the other stuff that's going on, but they really, truly don't realize it until something external. And so it may be that desire mismatch, which is very common. You have one partner who has a higher desire for sex, or what we would call libido, and the other partner doesn't. And so, obviously, the one who has a higher desire and is mismatched is going to realize it first. Right? And if they're able to communicate it... And this is what I think is a problem. A lot of times, they're not able to communicate that. And instead they'll go cheat. Right? Instead of like, "I'm not getting what I need, so I'm going to go find it somewhere else." So that's a problem right-
Seth Nelson:
Right. "I'm only have sex with my spouse once a month. So the other three weekends I'm out having sex with other people."
Janet Williams:
Yeah. That's a point where instead of going out, that's where the communication needs to take place. But I think that's where we tend to see it as, if that communication does take place, and the person with a higher level of desire or libido communicates that, that's when we make that realization. If both partners are low desire, you're not ever-
Pete Wright:
Then there's two negatives make a positive. Right? Eventually it's okay, right? Maybe they're just roommates.
Janet Williams:
Sometimes, yeah. Sometimes if they're... and nobody wants sex, and they're just operating as friends, and it works for them.
Seth Nelson:
But you could be intimate in different ways without sex.
Pete Wright:
Yes, sure.
Seth Nelson:
So that could just not be one of the things that if you have a different sexual drive and your partner does, and it's once a month. Well, it's once a month. We're not saying that's a problem. We're saying people have different sex drives and different libidos. So that makes sense to me.
Pete Wright:
Right. I think that really it's when your expectation meets a harsh reality that is not at the level of your own, that's when we have frustration. And if you're meeting at the same level, you're probably going to be fine.
Seth Nelson:
So-
Pete Wright:
Yeah. I'm sorry.
Seth Nelson:
Sorry, Pete. Dr. Janet, you said like, "Someone has to identify the problem first." So for our listeners, I know you can't list them all, but what might be some of those problems that if they're listening now and saying, "Yeah, well, we haven't been having sex." Is it bio? Is it psycho? Is it social? What might be something you hear that people might say or you help them realize about themselves that's getting in the way of this type of intimacy?
Janet Williams:
What I see most commonly is, it's a combination of desire and arousal. Desire, arousal, and pain. Those are probably probably the most common thing. So when we talk about desire, again, that's your innate or receptivity to sexual stimuli. So if your partner's like, "Babe, let's get it on. Let's go upstairs," and you're like, "Yeah, let's go upstairs," then your desire is good. Sometimes the next kind of part to that is the arousal. And that's how our bodies actually respond to the desire. And so if you're having changes in your body, like dryness where you need lubrication, and that's not happening, it's sort of like a feedback loop. You may have the desire, but if your body's not responding, then it's like you're not getting the pleasure from it. So that might be one of the points.
What we see a lot of, if you do have some changes in your body, you might have pain. And so if there's pain that's going on, when you associate pain with sex, you're not going to want to have sex. So it's going to kind of come back around. So a lot of times, in the clients that I work with, they'll know that they don't want to have sex anymore, but they're not sure where in that process it is. And so it's kind of identifying where that is. I had one client, actually a patient of mine, a few weeks ago, who came in with like, "I don't want to do it anymore." And as I talked to her a little bit further, she actually had desire for her husband. She thought he was gorgeous. They had a good relationship. But her body wasn't responding. And so I gave her some treatments, and she came back few weeks later and was like, "This is fantastic." So it was one of those things where we had to figure out where that was.
Another thing that happens is if you've got medical problems. For example, diabetes can cause nerve damage. And then, if you have nerve damage, you may not actually orgasm. And so you might be doing all the steps up to orgasm, and then you're not having a orgasm. It's sort of frustrating. That's another thing that might make you not want to do it anymore. So all of those things, those are some of the kind of physical things that could be taking place.
Seth Nelson:
Pete, you might not know this. I think you do. But according to the National Institute of Alcohol Abuse and Alcoholism, about 10% of children live with a parent with an alcohol use disorder.
Pete Wright:
So sad.
Seth Nelson:
As a family law professional, this is an alarming statistic. And we want to make sure that your children are safe and are always with a parent who's sober. That way, we can make sure that parent can maintain a quality relationship with that child. Balancing this is one of the hardest things we navigate, as you know, in custody litigation.
Pete Wright:
That's why we have partnered with Soberlink. Soberlink is an incredible tool for those dealing with an alcohol situation in their divorce process. It is a device. It's like a breathalyzer, but it's a lot more than that. It's a device that you blow into. And monitored co-parent, monitored partner blows into the device. Has facial recognition. It is tamper-proof. And it sends immediate signal to those who need to know, when you are about to drive with a child, when you're about to experience a child on carpools, on pickups, on drop-offs and trade-offs, all of those times. It lets you know if the child is going to be safe immediately. There are two models. There's a wifi model that connects with your phone. And there's a cellular model. You don't even need a phone. It's instant right over the cellular network in North America. Soberlink is an incredibly powerful tool to help in your alcohol-related issues in your divorce process.
Seth Nelson:
And here's the thing, what people are thinking, Pete. "I don't have an alcohol-related issue. She just says I do." Well, that's the weaponization of "he said, she said." And Soberlink eliminates that because you have an independent third-party verification, in real time, that will just cut those arguments out from under people because you're going to be able to say, "There's no alcohol in my system. I'm focused on the kids." And when you do that for two months, three months, four months, five months, six months, whatever the case may be, when you have the children, then that court knows that what the other side is saying just isn't true. And I get it. You might not want to do this. You might not think you have to do this. But it's going to save you time and a lot of money and a lot of grief. So I suggest to people, put your ego aside. Do Soberlink. Prove your sobriety, even if you shouldn't have to, because it's going to save you a lot of time and money.
Pete Wright:
And you can sign up for Soberlink and get $50 off your device. All you have to do is visit soberlink.com/toaster. That's soberlink.com/toaster. And we thank Soberlink for sponsoring this show.
How do you counsel folks around talking about these issues with their partner? Because I can imagine a situation in which it is much easier for someone to come to you and talk about the physiological, the psychological aspects of their current sex life, and the troubles that they're having, in a way that they cannot talk with their partner. And that, I think... Stop me when I start lying, but probably creates kind of an assumption feedback loop where suddenly the partner is assuming some things that might not be true, and you're just not talking about it. How do you broach that conversation in a way that's healthy and progressive?
Janet Williams:
You know what I usually recommend is that if a woman has an issue, we've kind of worked through it, and we have some education around it, she can then go to her partner and say, "I've been working with Dr. Janet, and I've been concerned about the fact that I have not wanted to have sex. And it was a concern to me, and I want us to do better." Most, 99.9% of people, when you start with that conversation, like, "Why it is we're having this discussion and what the goal is," like, "The goal is, essentially, to have pleasure-"
Seth Nelson:
I was thinking in my head, Dr. Jan, there isn't one guy in the world-
Janet Williams:
Yeah.
Seth Nelson:
... that isn't going to be okay with that conversation.
Janet Williams:
Exactly. Yeah. And by and large, regardless what it is, and a lot of times, people find out that they are interested in using toys or interested in all different things that they haven't done before. And when they bring it to their partner, the partner is down. They're like, "Yes. Let's do that." So it's just, I think, having the conversation and just getting the nerve up to have it. And when you present it in that way, most people are very receptive, and it can change your life, really.
Pete Wright:
Yeah. Yeah, it can. It's short-term, long-term too, I imagine. How'd you decide to get into this line of work yourself? Why'd you write the book?
Janet Williams:
In medical school, in my residency training... I'm an OB-GYN, obstetrics and gynecology. I deal with women and their vaginas all the time. Right? But when I started in practice, I kept seeing women, all ages, 30s, 40s, 50s, asking me about their libido, like, "What do I do?" And over and over. And I would ask my colleagues like, "Hey, I'm not really sure. We [inaudible 00:25:50] really get trained on this." And there weren't really any good answers. I had somebody tell me like, "Tell them to get in some lingerie." And I'm like, "It's not about lingerie. It's not about date night." We need [inaudible 00:26:04].
Seth Nelson:
That's the other thing I was going to say, is not one thing have you said, has it been like, "We got to have date night," all these kind of social things that people talk about. That's not what you're talking about. You're talking about there could be physical stuff. There could be social stuff. There could be the psycho stuff. But it's a lot more complicated than, "Oh, we don't have date night." You're not saying that, "Hey, our lives don't get [inaudible 00:26:28] or busy. Elderly parents we're taking care of, kids leaving off for college or still running them around, or worried about applying to college. And we're busy in our jobs." We have all those things. We all have those things all the time. But you're talking about a much more nuanced, in-depth conversation than date night.
Janet Williams:
Right. Yeah, I think it's all of it. I mean, date night is important because you do have to set time aside for sex. People have this thing where it's supposed to be spontaneous. You run in the house, and you get slammed against the wall, and you just go. It doesn't always go down like that.
Seth Nelson:
The last time that happened to me, I thought I was getting robbed.
Janet Williams:
Right.
Seth Nelson:
I was fricking scared.
Janet Williams:
Yeah. So I mean, sometimes we have to schedule. You put it on the calendar, and you just do it, and that [inaudible 00:27:14] get you there. But [inaudible 00:27:16]-
Seth Nelson:
Okay. So, you're asking your colleagues. They say, "Lingerie." You're like, "That's not a good answer."
Janet Williams:
That's not the answer. Yeah.
Seth Nelson:
Then what do you do?
Janet Williams:
So I started to look into it and found that there wasn't a whole lot of research around this area. Now there's a lot more. Most of the research that took place for women, only started after Viagra came out. So Viagra came out. Now all these partners that are like, "What do we do?" And that's where the research-
Seth Nelson:
Fricking drug companies.
Janet Williams:
That's where the research for women's sexual medicine actually started. So yeah. I joined some organizations, and I started looking into it and wanting to help patients a little bit more specifically. So that's how that came about.
Seth Nelson:
That's awesome.
Pete Wright:
Yeah, I think so. It shouldn't be a surprise to me, but it is. I hear these kinds of conversations. There's a whole area of sexual health that even-
Seth Nelson:
Oh, yeah.
Pete Wright:
You're not even hearing about in medical school. It is continually shocking to me that there are these broad areas that we're afraid to talk about socially, we're afraid to talk about with our own partners. And you're-
Janet Williams:
In medicine, right.
Pete Wright:
... not even talking about it-
Janet Williams:
It's crazy. Yeah.
Pete Wright:
... in the health care community. Yeah.
Seth Nelson:
Dr. Janet, when-
Janet Williams:
I know. I-
Pete Wright:
It's crazy.
Seth Nelson:
... you were having these conversations, either before you got focused in this area of practice or currently, do they talk to you too about, "Hey, this is really impacting our marriage. I'm thinking about divorce"? Or are they really coming to you saying, "I'm trying to save my marriage"? Or does that "divorce, not divorce" topic not even come up in the conversation?
Janet Williams:
It's a combination. Yeah. I do see it. People are worried about the relationships. And then there's some people who just tap out. They're like, "I'm out. I don't want to do it." But the reason, I think, is because they think that that's the end. A lot of people don't realize that there's options. They don't realize what they're going through is very common and normal, that there's solutions. It makes me happy when I'm able to turn that light bulb on then and say that it's not necessarily over. Most of the time, there are some things that can be done.
Pete Wright:
You mentioned that you were able to help people and give them some guidance on things they can do to help their own libido. Can you share a couple of tips for folks who are listening?
Janet Williams:
Well, I always, always recommend a self-care practice. So, it's like when you're moving so quickly, you can disassociate from yourself, essentially. When I talk about self-care, I talk about getting back into your body and connecting your mind and your body. When people jump on... They're taking care of themselves, but they'll jump on the Peloton, or they'll go for a run, and they're just in the run, and they're not necessarily connecting with their body. And so I recommend a self-care practice that you do on a regular basis, where you're able to connect your mind to your body and the emotions that you're feeling. It shows up in our bodies as well. Just like if you're at a desk all day and get back pain, same thing happens in the pelvic floor if you've got stress. And yeah, let's shake it out.
Pete Wright:
Yeah, exactly. You said that, and I'm like, "Ooh, I better improve my posture."
Janet Williams:
Yeah. Oftentimes we're so into the computer or whatever it is that we're doing that we're not making that connection with our bodies. And so I think the first thing that everyone, man or woman, should do, or non-binary person should do, is to get into their body and make that connection between their mind and the body. Because if you've got all that stuff going around, you may not connect. There's actually studies. I read a study just recently about incontinence. If you meditate, it actually can improve incontinence. from meditation.
Pete Wright:
Wow. Open every door. Around every problem, there's something that meditation's going to help with. That's amazing. Incontinence.
Janet Williams:
Yeah. It is. And so if you have that mind-body connection, it will help to kind of spark everything off. It's sort of like the starting point to getting that back.
Pete Wright:
I don't know what the background is of this, but if you're sad, and you just force your face to smile, you'll suddenly be happy. Right? That's what I've heard. That's the sort of trope, the stereotype, that you smile and it'll make all the... So what you're saying is don't just go home and masturbate all the time. There are other things to do it-
Janet Williams:
Well-
Pete Wright:
... to do.
Janet Williams:
Well, masturbation is one way to do mind-body. Yeah. If you're-
Pete Wright:
Oh, it's not a bad way. Don't get me wrong.
Janet Williams:
Yeah. If you're mindful about it, like mindful masturbation is actually-
Pete Wright:
Mindful... Is that the sequel to your book?
Janet Williams:
... going to be helpful.
Pete Wright:
That should be your next book.
Janet Williams:
I know. I know. I just never said that before.
Pete Wright:
It's just-
Janet Williams:
Yeah. A mindful masturbation.
Seth Nelson:
That happens a lot on this show. Don't worry about it.
Pete Wright:
I'm never going to forget. Do you want to register the domain right now? Mindful masturbation?
Janet Williams:
Yeah, yeah, [inaudible 00:32:48].
Pete Wright:
That's amazing. Well, listen. Let's talk about the book. Tell us about the book. Tell us where you want people to learn more about you. What can we do to help you out?
Janet Williams:
Okay, so yeah, the book is called Why Don't I Like Sex Anymore? If that sounds like a question that you've asked yourself, I actually have a website where you can download the book for free. It's www.whydontilikesexanymore.com. And you can get the PDF there. I also have a sexual health and wellness shop online, and it's intimatewellnessshop.com. And that's where you can find all the products and devices to support your sexual health and wellness. So you can check us out in either of those places.
Pete Wright:
That's good. Well, we sure appreciate your time here. Thank you so much for hanging out with us and helping us two dudes figure out what's going on. I hope if-
Seth Nelson:
And this is why she works with women.
Pete Wright:
Yeah. Case example number one. Well, I-
Janet Williams:
[inaudible 00:33:59].
Seth Nelson:
It's like, "I'm not dealing with guys."
Pete Wright:
I'm sure we have a broad audience of listenership, in terms of gender identification. And I hope this helps half or maybe even more than half of you to figure out, not just what's going on with yourself, but how you can help your partner to understand what's going on with themselves and be a part of that progressive conversation. Dr. Janet Williams, you're amazing. Thank you so much for hanging out with us.
Janet Williams:
Thanks for having me.
Pete Wright:
And thank you everybody for downloading this show. We appreciate your time and attention. Don't forget, you can ask us a question any time. Just head over to howtosplitatoaster.com and click the button that says, "I have a question," and Seth's going to answer it, any of your legal questions. Maybe don't ask any sexual questions this time, but maybe. Who knows?
Seth Nelson:
I will definitely give the wrong answer. I will definitely give the wrong answer on that.
Pete Wright:
On behalf of Dr. Janet Williams and Seth Nelson, America's favorite divorce attorney, I'm Pete Wright. And we'll catch you right here next week on How to Split a Toaster, a divorce podcast about saving your relationships.
Speaker 4:
Seth Nelson is an attorney with NLG Divorce & Family Law, with offices in Tampa, Florida. While we may be discussing family law topics, How to Split a Toaster is not intended to nor is it providing legal advice. Every situation is different. If you have specific questions regarding your situation, please seek your own legal counsel with an attorney licensed to practice law in your jurisdiction. Pete Wright is not an attorney or employee of NLG Divorce & Family Law. Seth Nelson is licensed to practice law in Florida.