WEBVTT NOTE This file was generated by Descript 00:00:00.099 --> 00:00:02.169 Rupert Isaacson: Welcome to Equine Assisted World. 00:00:02.199 --> 00:00:03.879 I'm your host, Rupert Isaacson. 00:00:03.993 --> 00:00:07.083 New York Times bestselling author of the Horse Boy. 00:00:07.088 --> 00:00:11.077 Founder of New Trails Learning Systems and long ride home.com. 00:00:11.077 --> 00:00:16.694 You can find details of all our programs and shows on Rupert isaacson.com. 00:00:16.744 --> 00:00:18.664 Here on Equine Assisted World. 00:00:18.664 --> 00:00:23.794 We look at the cutting edge and the best practices currently being developed and, 00:00:23.844 --> 00:00:27.654 established in the equine assisted field. 00:00:27.684 --> 00:00:32.934 This can be psychological, this can be neuropsych, this can be 00:00:33.084 --> 00:00:38.334 physical, this can be all of the conditions that human beings have. 00:00:38.844 --> 00:00:43.254 These lovely equines, these beautiful horses that we work with, help us with. 00:00:43.351 --> 00:00:47.251 Thank you for being part of the adventure and we hope you enjoy today's show 00:00:47.737 --> 00:00:50.347 Welcome back to Equine Assisted World. 00:00:50.397 --> 00:00:52.587 Today, my guest needs no introduction. 00:00:52.597 --> 00:00:54.697 It's Linda Tellington Jones, the legend. 00:00:55.337 --> 00:00:59.067 If she does need an introduction to you, you need to go and 00:00:59.067 --> 00:01:00.457 look up Linda Tellington Jones. 00:01:00.777 --> 00:01:06.157 Whether you're into horse welfare from a sport point of view, from just a, 00:01:06.927 --> 00:01:11.527 horse ownership point of view whether you're into actually effective riding, 00:01:11.767 --> 00:01:15.447 whether you're into how to be better with your dog, whether you're better 00:01:15.447 --> 00:01:16.797 with how to be better with your human. 00:01:17.297 --> 00:01:18.097 Linda has. 00:01:18.502 --> 00:01:26.332 Covered all of these in the course of her illustrious career and She's one of 00:01:26.332 --> 00:01:30.102 our main mentors And but not just us. 00:01:30.102 --> 00:01:34.062 She's a mentor to many thousands of people around the world with good 00:01:34.062 --> 00:01:39.872 reason t touch Turning to touch is a thing if you don't know what it is. 00:01:39.992 --> 00:01:41.082 Go look it up. 00:01:41.112 --> 00:01:45.922 We will be talking about it, though Hopefully Linda will be explaining some 00:01:45.922 --> 00:01:51.907 of it in the course of today's But we're going to be looking really at the the 00:01:51.907 --> 00:01:56.497 idea of where the priorities are first with equine welfare This is this is 00:01:56.717 --> 00:02:03.097 something which we all know is not always there in the equine assisted field. 00:02:03.717 --> 00:02:08.717 But it's a conversation now that is being had and things are getting better. 00:02:08.727 --> 00:02:09.647 Things are improving. 00:02:10.197 --> 00:02:14.097 And once we asked that question, we're going to look at welfare for the 00:02:14.097 --> 00:02:16.127 humans as well within these programs. 00:02:16.217 --> 00:02:18.387 So Linda, thanks for coming on. 00:02:18.697 --> 00:02:19.407 Welcome. 00:02:20.317 --> 00:02:30.347 And if a listener now is wondering what is the primary 00:02:32.837 --> 00:02:38.877 aspect of equine well being that anybody who is running an equine 00:02:38.877 --> 00:02:41.837 assisted program should prioritize? 00:02:42.547 --> 00:02:43.827 What is that thing? 00:02:43.837 --> 00:02:45.997 Where should we be starting from as ground zero? 00:02:46.687 --> 00:02:49.627 Linda Tellington Jones: I believe, and Rupert, thank you for having me on 00:02:49.627 --> 00:02:54.087 again, I just love spending time with you just in these discussions because 00:02:54.177 --> 00:02:59.137 it's not, we're not thinking enough, what does the horse get out of this? 00:02:59.577 --> 00:03:05.852 And I've, you know, as you know, I think you know, I brought the idea 00:03:05.852 --> 00:03:12.082 of Liberty Ring riding to Germany at Equitana in 1975, and now it's everywhere 00:03:12.092 --> 00:03:14.632 in all disciplines, all breeds. 00:03:15.172 --> 00:03:20.352 And on my 50th anniversary, 50 years with, through, from the first equiton, 00:03:20.362 --> 00:03:25.532 I was asked, so that you've achieved this goal of people appreciating this 00:03:25.542 --> 00:03:29.412 freedom that a horse gets when you ride with just a neck ring around it. 00:03:29.922 --> 00:03:32.972 And what's your, what about for the next 20 years? 00:03:33.327 --> 00:03:33.987 What's your goal? 00:03:33.997 --> 00:03:35.807 Because I'm almost 90, Rupert. 00:03:35.807 --> 00:03:36.617 I'm so excited. 00:03:36.627 --> 00:03:37.157 You can't imagine. 00:03:37.157 --> 00:03:37.367 But you 00:03:37.367 --> 00:03:39.577 Rupert Isaacson: don't look a day over 25, so you're doing good. 00:03:40.767 --> 00:03:44.147 Linda Tellington Jones: And it's really important, I believe. 00:03:44.247 --> 00:03:51.147 My passion, my mission is to really tell people, enhance the 00:03:51.247 --> 00:03:56.217 understanding that seeing the personality of the horse, acknowledging 00:03:56.217 --> 00:03:57.867 the individuality of the horse. 00:03:58.292 --> 00:03:59.282 With gratitude. 00:03:59.332 --> 00:04:00.862 Thank them before you start. 00:04:01.252 --> 00:04:06.412 And I mean, I've been doing this part in assisted therapy, well, 00:04:06.452 --> 00:04:10.882 in the very, since, what, the 80s? 00:04:10.902 --> 00:04:14.252 When I first was working in Germany in the 70s, actually. 00:04:14.882 --> 00:04:18.192 To horses who were said to be really sour. 00:04:18.582 --> 00:04:20.422 Horses that were used in therapy. 00:04:21.047 --> 00:04:26.837 And all we had to do at the time, I didn't think about just thanking the horse 00:04:26.837 --> 00:04:34.967 because I wasn't aware, Rupert, of the force of energy, the function of energy 00:04:35.337 --> 00:04:37.727 from the quantum physics point of view. 00:04:38.087 --> 00:04:43.347 That every thought we have, every word we speak, every, every belief 00:04:43.397 --> 00:04:46.517 that we have and every emotion and every feeling is energy. 00:04:46.797 --> 00:04:52.387 And when we just smile at our horses and thank them, just, even if you don't 00:04:52.407 --> 00:04:54.767 know T Touch, you can start with that. 00:04:54.767 --> 00:04:58.487 Just put your hand on the horse's neck or, you know, where I started 00:04:58.487 --> 00:05:02.867 this before T Touch, just on the forehead of the horse and thank them. 00:05:03.782 --> 00:05:08.482 And something happens, and I want to tell you this story about three 00:05:08.482 --> 00:05:10.042 or four years ago in Germany. 00:05:11.172 --> 00:05:15.502 In this annual training that I do in the south of Germany, a woman 00:05:15.502 --> 00:05:19.872 came to me and she said she has six ponies that she uses for young 00:05:19.872 --> 00:05:21.522 children, like five and six year olds. 00:05:22.072 --> 00:05:26.452 And I mean, Certainly, that's therapy. 00:05:26.592 --> 00:05:30.052 I mean, it's so amazing for the children at that point, and she 00:05:30.052 --> 00:05:32.702 said, but her ponies aren't happy. 00:05:32.742 --> 00:05:34.192 Their ears are back. 00:05:34.192 --> 00:05:35.032 They're sour. 00:05:35.312 --> 00:05:36.462 They're not interested. 00:05:36.462 --> 00:05:37.432 They look depressed. 00:05:37.442 --> 00:05:38.202 What can I do? 00:05:38.222 --> 00:05:40.672 And I said, all you have to do. 00:05:40.922 --> 00:05:45.912 When that child comes in, it's just, teach the horse, just to allow them to just 00:05:45.922 --> 00:05:48.642 touch them on the forehead and thank them. 00:05:48.842 --> 00:05:51.532 Where, and if they, if they can't reach the forehead, go on the 00:05:51.532 --> 00:05:54.132 shoulder and just thank the horse. 00:05:54.782 --> 00:05:58.782 She came back to me the next year at the same training and said that 00:05:58.782 --> 00:06:00.722 her, her ponies are now smiling. 00:06:01.607 --> 00:06:07.217 It's all we have to do and it's just so important that when we're in a 00:06:07.217 --> 00:06:09.057 place of fear, that's the other thing. 00:06:09.367 --> 00:06:13.267 And when people, depending what type of therapy you're doing, they may, I mean, 00:06:13.267 --> 00:06:14.827 who isn't in a place of fear, right? 00:06:15.227 --> 00:06:16.247 This is a new horse. 00:06:16.657 --> 00:06:21.667 If they put one hand on the other, over the other, on their chest, on 00:06:21.667 --> 00:06:27.177 their heart chakra, and just imagine that you have a face of a clock 00:06:27.197 --> 00:06:28.577 looking at it from the outside. 00:06:29.362 --> 00:06:34.742 And put one hand over there and very as gently like with the least contact 00:06:34.742 --> 00:06:39.362 you can have to move the skin in just a tiny one and a quarter circle. 00:06:39.812 --> 00:06:44.862 What that does is bring us from that state of fear with under the control 00:06:44.882 --> 00:06:49.912 of the sympathetic nervous system and activate the parasympathetic. 00:06:49.922 --> 00:06:52.852 So, instead of being controlled by our fight, flight, fear, faint, 00:06:52.852 --> 00:06:56.422 fool around, you know, amygdala, we activate the forebrain. 00:06:57.047 --> 00:06:58.377 And the horses feel that. 00:06:58.457 --> 00:07:03.627 And when we add the smile to it, Rupert, when we add the smile, what 00:07:03.637 --> 00:07:05.677 happens, we activate our serotonin. 00:07:05.707 --> 00:07:11.217 And by moving the skin really lightly, what happens is we activate the 00:07:11.217 --> 00:07:15.867 most oxytocin, what Bruce Lipson is calling the trust hormone. 00:07:16.197 --> 00:07:19.397 And that's, that's from a 2000 person study done by the American 00:07:19.397 --> 00:07:22.867 Massage Association, thinking that they were going to get the most 00:07:22.927 --> 00:07:24.707 oxytocin from deep tissue work. 00:07:25.122 --> 00:07:29.052 They got some, but way, way more cortisol. 00:07:29.262 --> 00:07:32.622 And from the lightest contact with the body, which is what we do with the 00:07:33.092 --> 00:07:39.042 movement of the horse, it's not massage, it's a message to the intelligence 00:07:39.042 --> 00:07:45.022 of the cells, that amazing cellular consciousness that knows how to, every 00:07:45.022 --> 00:07:49.102 cell in the body knows how to function in the body and knows how to take care 00:07:49.102 --> 00:07:51.432 of us and our horses, and their bodies. 00:07:52.182 --> 00:07:53.312 So it's just so simple. 00:07:53.312 --> 00:07:56.282 Just have them do the simple heart hug and smile. 00:07:57.647 --> 00:07:57.887 So, 00:07:58.607 --> 00:08:00.907 Rupert Isaacson: for those people who can't see Linda on the other 00:08:00.907 --> 00:08:03.707 end of their Zoom like I can, I'm just going to describe what she did. 00:08:04.027 --> 00:08:07.467 She took one hand over the other and she put it over her heart. 00:08:08.567 --> 00:08:11.307 And so if you, if you're listening, if you're driving, don't do 00:08:11.307 --> 00:08:12.567 this or pull over, obviously. 00:08:12.867 --> 00:08:16.367 But if you're listening, why not give it a try? 00:08:16.527 --> 00:08:19.867 Place one hand over the other, put it over your heart. 00:08:19.917 --> 00:08:24.267 And then as Linda said, with a very light pressure to maybe that moves the 00:08:24.267 --> 00:08:26.797 skin, even if it's through your sweater. 00:08:28.017 --> 00:08:28.397 Linda Tellington Jones: Oh yeah. 00:08:28.447 --> 00:08:29.367 Rupert Isaacson: A circle. 00:08:30.317 --> 00:08:31.247 And a quarter, 00:08:33.487 --> 00:08:37.577 and see how that makes you feel, and I'm doing it right now, and 00:08:37.577 --> 00:08:39.747 I'm feeling a pleasurable softness. 00:08:40.467 --> 00:08:44.327 So I'm now going to add what Linda told me to do. 00:08:44.587 --> 00:08:51.577 So I'm going to thank Linda, because Linda has mentored me and made my equine 00:08:51.577 --> 00:08:53.327 therapeutic practices much better. 00:08:53.527 --> 00:08:55.547 So I have a lot of gratitude. 00:08:56.287 --> 00:08:58.477 So here I go, so my hand. 00:08:59.177 --> 00:09:02.357 It's over the other hand, now they're both over my heart. 00:09:03.307 --> 00:09:06.147 I'm one circle 00:09:08.347 --> 00:09:09.217 and a quarter. 00:09:09.247 --> 00:09:10.627 I'm thinking of Linda. 00:09:11.307 --> 00:09:14.037 Thinking about how much I love Linda. 00:09:14.037 --> 00:09:18.547 I'm thinking about how grateful I am to Linda for all the knowledge and support. 00:09:20.067 --> 00:09:20.877 Thank you, Linda. 00:09:23.167 --> 00:09:24.897 Linda Tellington Jones: And you know what's so interesting? 00:09:24.897 --> 00:09:29.144 It just made me think of a situation in Germany many years 00:09:29.144 --> 00:09:32.360 ago when I had a young woman. 00:09:32.360 --> 00:09:34.658 She was certainly under 30. 00:09:35.328 --> 00:09:41.578 in a wheelchair who came to see her Icelandic horse and she had cancer and 00:09:41.588 --> 00:09:45.188 she was in the later stages of cancer, but she wanted to come to see her horse. 00:09:45.868 --> 00:09:51.668 And so I just had her put her arms up on the horse and she could reach the chair. 00:09:51.698 --> 00:09:54.658 She could stand up just with a wheelchair there and with a little 00:09:54.658 --> 00:10:00.628 help and take her chest and put it on the horse's ribcage and make the 00:10:00.628 --> 00:10:02.168 circle and the quarter with that. 00:10:03.143 --> 00:10:09.063 And, you know, just, it was like hugging a horse, and it was, when I, it actually 00:10:09.113 --> 00:10:15.343 brings tears to my eyes when I think of the joy that she got from that. 00:10:16.783 --> 00:10:21.323 And the reason that we do the one and a quarter, I mean, we, that, that came to me 00:10:21.343 --> 00:10:27.773 intuitively many years ago, and it was, I don't know, we've been doing it at least 00:10:27.773 --> 00:10:33.458 10 years, when a young, man in autism spectrum came into a weekend for humans 00:10:33.468 --> 00:10:38.538 for t touch for self help and he said you know what you all are talking about 00:10:38.538 --> 00:10:45.558 here in this one and a quarter circle is that is that famous golden or sacred 00:10:45.558 --> 00:10:52.018 spiral that is the form that is in all of nature you see it really clearly the 00:10:52.248 --> 00:10:53.478 Rupert Isaacson: Fibonacci sequence yeah 00:10:53.848 --> 00:10:54.508 Linda Tellington Jones: exactly 00:10:54.558 --> 00:10:54.798 Rupert Isaacson: yeah 00:10:55.088 --> 00:10:59.638 Linda Tellington Jones: and and it's the same It's a spiral movement that's in 00:10:59.638 --> 00:11:05.668 our DNA, and so it's not a wonder that we can release pain and fear in ourselves. 00:11:06.058 --> 00:11:07.548 And that's the thing with the fear. 00:11:07.688 --> 00:11:12.968 So one of the things as you're approaching, and maybe you've never 00:11:13.428 --> 00:11:17.178 been with a horse before and you're using, you know, some form of assisted 00:11:17.178 --> 00:11:20.058 therapy from a distance to begin with. 00:11:20.518 --> 00:11:25.588 If you are feeling anxious, you can do the heart hug and you can 00:11:25.588 --> 00:11:27.288 also, another one that we do. 00:11:27.653 --> 00:11:31.573 is doing these one and a quarter circles on our lips around the mouth 00:11:31.963 --> 00:11:36.103 because the mouth is the closest connection to the limbic system. 00:11:36.433 --> 00:11:41.153 You know, that controls our, our taste, our smell, all of this. 00:11:41.183 --> 00:11:46.353 And you just, yeah, take your, your lips just between your thumb and 00:11:46.353 --> 00:11:50.543 forefinger and just make a little circle and a quarter and go around the lips. 00:11:51.003 --> 00:11:57.343 And we've had such wonderful experiences with this, with children and adults. 00:11:58.953 --> 00:12:00.213 And it just makes sense. 00:12:00.213 --> 00:12:02.593 I mean, look what happens emotionally. 00:12:02.613 --> 00:12:07.693 If something happens and we, you know, you startle and put your hand over your 00:12:07.693 --> 00:12:09.303 mouth, that's a common thing to do. 00:12:09.933 --> 00:12:14.733 Or guys who are lucky who have beards or mustaches, you'll see them a lot 00:12:14.753 --> 00:12:17.483 just, you know, pulling the mustache. 00:12:17.863 --> 00:12:20.133 It's a, it's a way of self, 00:12:21.868 --> 00:12:22.868 Rupert Isaacson: Yeah, self soothing. 00:12:23.058 --> 00:12:23.288 Yeah. 00:12:24.078 --> 00:12:24.358 Linda Tellington Jones: Yeah. 00:12:25.208 --> 00:12:26.018 Rupert Isaacson: Sure, I'm doing it now. 00:12:28.328 --> 00:12:29.108 Rubbing my beard. 00:12:29.108 --> 00:12:29.453 Think 00:12:29.453 --> 00:12:30.518 Linda Tellington Jones: of the thinker. 00:12:30.798 --> 00:12:32.008 Rupert Isaacson: Yes, absolutely. 00:12:32.318 --> 00:12:34.138 It is interesting how the chin and the beard. 00:12:34.138 --> 00:12:35.318 Linda Tellington Jones: Yeah. 00:12:35.398 --> 00:12:37.648 Rupert Isaacson: I guess what it does is it loosens the jaw, right? 00:12:37.668 --> 00:12:42.358 And the jaw is where you, if you clench the jaw, that's also, or 00:12:42.358 --> 00:12:45.318 if you press your tongue to the top of your mouth and your teeth. 00:12:45.318 --> 00:12:49.058 All of those are amygdala things like they're all stress reactions. 00:12:49.098 --> 00:12:49.328 Yeah. 00:12:49.328 --> 00:12:49.363 Yeah. 00:12:49.363 --> 00:12:49.398 Yeah. 00:12:50.478 --> 00:12:52.488 Linda Tellington Jones: And you can just calm yourself with that. 00:12:54.158 --> 00:12:58.248 Rupert Isaacson: But what's interesting is that you started this with gratitude. 00:12:58.248 --> 00:13:05.478 So, the technique, the physical technique of that rotation around 00:13:05.478 --> 00:13:11.808 the heart or these rotations around the mouth are accompanied, of 00:13:11.808 --> 00:13:14.538 course, by a feeling of gratitude. 00:13:14.608 --> 00:13:14.968 Yeah. 00:13:15.368 --> 00:13:17.118 Linda Tellington Jones: And the smile to activate that 00:13:17.158 --> 00:13:18.778 field hormone, the serotonin. 00:13:19.088 --> 00:13:19.398 Rupert Isaacson: Yeah. 00:13:20.143 --> 00:13:20.553 Okay. 00:13:20.923 --> 00:13:22.183 Linda Tellington Jones: Let's feel it when we do it. 00:13:22.423 --> 00:13:26.963 But let me, I, for you, I want to tell, I want to, I'm sure I've told you this 00:13:26.963 --> 00:13:31.683 at one point, but it's just such a passion, this concept of the one and 00:13:31.683 --> 00:13:35.763 a quarter circle on the chest, which is our heart chakra in the center. 00:13:36.283 --> 00:13:41.723 So if you imagine putting a clock on the wall, like kids used to have 00:13:41.733 --> 00:13:47.283 in school, you imagine taking that clock and putting it on your chest. 00:13:48.358 --> 00:13:53.738 The reason we're imagining is because imagining activates the right brain. 00:13:54.758 --> 00:13:56.728 And why is that so important? 00:13:57.278 --> 00:13:59.448 For our compassion, first of all. 00:13:59.958 --> 00:14:05.008 For our creativity, for our intuition, and for our feeling, 00:14:05.038 --> 00:14:06.788 Rupert, because think about it now. 00:14:07.058 --> 00:14:12.698 And we have so lost our, this, just the concept of hugging somebody 00:14:12.758 --> 00:14:15.908 or, you know, reaching out and shaking hands thanks to COVID. 00:14:15.948 --> 00:14:18.908 I mean, people are still, I still have doctors. 00:14:19.243 --> 00:14:23.243 Either touch, you know, fist to fist or elbow to elbow 00:14:25.253 --> 00:14:25.883 in the fear. 00:14:27.353 --> 00:14:32.713 And so, if whatever we, so we imagine the face of the clock and on this 00:14:32.783 --> 00:14:37.223 reason we do a clock, you put the numbers 6 toward the ground, you know, 00:14:37.483 --> 00:14:41.073 9 toward the right shoulder, 12 toward the chin, 3 toward the left shoulder. 00:14:41.073 --> 00:14:41.903 Why do I say it? 00:14:41.943 --> 00:14:42.763 Because it's obvious. 00:14:43.123 --> 00:14:44.423 Because it's a method. 00:14:44.893 --> 00:14:48.503 And methods and numbers activate the very important. 00:14:48.973 --> 00:14:50.683 logical left brain. 00:14:51.553 --> 00:14:55.693 And we couldn't be here on this podcast if we didn't have an active left brain. 00:14:56.483 --> 00:15:01.123 So this is why when you, when you make this one and a quarter circle 00:15:01.143 --> 00:15:04.783 on your, anywhere on your body or on your horse, of course, that's the 00:15:04.783 --> 00:15:09.493 next thing in order to make a cell to cell connection with your horse. 00:15:10.053 --> 00:15:11.283 It's something that you could do. 00:15:12.083 --> 00:15:15.973 And it's so exciting because what people, what, what happens is people 00:15:15.983 --> 00:15:17.743 become more flexible when they do this. 00:15:20.613 --> 00:15:24.013 Rupert Isaacson: It's interesting that, yeah, you're talking about activating the 00:15:24.013 --> 00:15:26.993 right brain first and then the left brain. 00:15:27.693 --> 00:15:34.913 So by right brain with the active self compassion, the, and then the face 00:15:34.913 --> 00:15:37.773 of the clock brings in the left brain and then you've got both hemispheres 00:15:38.933 --> 00:15:40.473 available and that's coherence. 00:15:40.573 --> 00:15:41.343 Yeah, no, absolutely. 00:15:41.343 --> 00:15:42.463 That makes a lot of sense. 00:15:43.013 --> 00:15:46.033 Linda Tellington Jones: And so every time you do these circles in the circle is like 00:15:46.033 --> 00:15:49.553 a homeopathic knowing of the, this clock. 00:15:49.983 --> 00:15:51.683 And the one and a quarter spiral. 00:15:51.683 --> 00:15:54.163 And of course, just the one and a quarter activates the left brain. 00:15:54.583 --> 00:15:55.303 It's a number. 00:15:55.653 --> 00:15:56.883 And again, it's a method. 00:15:57.373 --> 00:16:01.063 But, then, this concept of movement. 00:16:01.063 --> 00:16:03.293 So what activates the right brain? 00:16:03.763 --> 00:16:06.053 Daydreaming, imagination, movement. 00:16:06.053 --> 00:16:08.483 Of course, what you have in your, all of your therapy. 00:16:08.513 --> 00:16:12.083 Movement of the child on the, or person on the horse with you. 00:16:13.023 --> 00:16:16.523 And color, and music, art. 00:16:16.523 --> 00:16:16.958 Rupert Isaacson: Yeah. 00:16:16.958 --> 00:16:17.393 So, 00:16:17.393 --> 00:16:17.563 Linda Tellington Jones: Well, 00:16:17.563 --> 00:16:19.153 Rupert Isaacson: you just talked about color, music and art. 00:16:19.333 --> 00:16:26.283 Now this you also do not see a lot of in equine assisted or equine things, period. 00:16:26.303 --> 00:16:31.083 And what's so interesting to me about that is your average arena, as we 00:16:31.083 --> 00:16:34.913 know, particularly your average indoor arena looks like an industrial building 00:16:35.283 --> 00:16:36.943 and often is an industrial building. 00:16:37.503 --> 00:16:40.163 Maybe it's got some nice wooden kickboards, but. 00:16:41.758 --> 00:16:43.618 That's about it. 00:16:44.378 --> 00:16:45.638 They're often very sterile. 00:16:46.258 --> 00:16:49.178 Outdoor arenas can be nicer because you've obviously got the 00:16:49.178 --> 00:16:51.138 landscape, you know, visible. 00:16:51.688 --> 00:16:58.333 But When you look at old pictures of people in arenas, there's some on 00:16:58.333 --> 00:17:00.613 the wall behind me where I'm sitting. 00:17:00.983 --> 00:17:06.923 If I look at them, what you see is they're either, or actually those ones have a 00:17:06.923 --> 00:17:11.763 little bit of a landscape behind them, but you often see like Grecian pillars or 00:17:12.203 --> 00:17:14.183 art and drapery and that sort of thing. 00:17:14.193 --> 00:17:19.363 Like the sort of stuff that artists routinely put into their 00:17:19.363 --> 00:17:23.633 pictures, but they, those old riding halls had that stuff. 00:17:24.263 --> 00:17:26.623 They were aesthetically very, very beautiful. 00:17:27.023 --> 00:17:30.443 Places to be and so I say well, I you know, I can't afford to have fancy stuff 00:17:30.783 --> 00:17:37.733 But any of course any indoor arena is de facto expensive, but they're usually 00:17:37.843 --> 00:17:42.233 pretty ugly Now we're so busy looking at the horse, which is an object of beauty 00:17:42.433 --> 00:17:48.383 a being of beauty that of course We're enamored of that moving Aesthetics so 00:17:49.423 --> 00:17:52.763 we could say well, that's the art, but I don't believe that's enough And so it's 00:17:52.783 --> 00:17:54.303 interesting that you've brought that up. 00:17:54.323 --> 00:18:02.733 And so I'm a great believer in bringing art You Plants, trees, nature, all 00:18:02.733 --> 00:18:04.493 sorts of things into riding arenas. 00:18:04.563 --> 00:18:08.383 You know, when you go to see an equestrian show, that's kind 00:18:08.383 --> 00:18:09.393 of what you see, don't you? 00:18:09.483 --> 00:18:11.543 Or, or it's darkened and there's a spotlight. 00:18:12.563 --> 00:18:15.983 So talk to us about why art. 00:18:16.363 --> 00:18:19.843 And music and color came into your mind when you were talking about the 00:18:19.843 --> 00:18:23.263 therapeutic context with, with horses, because I think it's not something that 00:18:23.533 --> 00:18:25.743 necessarily people go intuitively to. 00:18:26.813 --> 00:18:30.733 Linda Tellington Jones: Well, the reason I go to it immediately is I know that 00:18:30.733 --> 00:18:35.963 this affects this hard hook, this, we call it a T touch hard hook, this one and 00:18:35.963 --> 00:18:38.173 a quarter circle on the, on the chest. 00:18:38.928 --> 00:18:45.058 And the fact is that when we do this and imagining the clock and then imagining 00:18:45.058 --> 00:18:50.118 the numbers, and we activate all this creativity, I mean, this feeling, this 00:18:50.158 --> 00:18:56.648 intuition, and this compassion, it's just, that's, you know, that's where I always go 00:18:56.648 --> 00:19:03.628 to first, because most children, and let's say, have gone through your program, are, 00:19:03.888 --> 00:19:05.828 everything is on the, on the left brain. 00:19:06.148 --> 00:19:08.528 It's all logic, and the problem with logic is. 00:19:09.023 --> 00:19:15.433 this black and white, you know, not having flow, not having choice, not being able 00:19:15.433 --> 00:19:18.203 to think compassionately or creatively. 00:19:18.553 --> 00:19:19.753 It's all for us. 00:19:20.233 --> 00:19:25.063 And I know, and we've seen it in our people who do tea touch on their animals, 00:19:25.063 --> 00:19:28.363 their horses, their dogs themselves over a period of time, they become 00:19:28.373 --> 00:19:32.053 more flexible, more willing to listen. 00:19:32.833 --> 00:19:35.813 And I, and I believe it enhances learning. 00:19:35.813 --> 00:19:39.633 And what I loved about what I saw with you, Rupert, in Texas. 00:19:40.053 --> 00:19:46.123 Having the different numbers written on around the paddock that the kids numbers. 00:19:46.143 --> 00:19:50.353 And if I remember correctly words that would that would enhance them. 00:19:50.353 --> 00:19:52.583 And I was just thinking from this point of view. 00:19:52.583 --> 00:19:53.473 Well, great. 00:19:53.473 --> 00:19:57.473 It would be when you went to any animal assisted therapy have 00:19:57.843 --> 00:20:05.043 horses that had different colored horse had different color alters 00:20:05.043 --> 00:20:06.753 on and different colored ropes. 00:20:07.163 --> 00:20:07.843 And. 00:20:08.368 --> 00:20:12.398 Maybe do something fun, like have the people before put together 00:20:12.578 --> 00:20:15.628 some sort of lei, not from flowers because it's too hard, but 00:20:15.898 --> 00:20:17.868 something, or something with color. 00:20:18.428 --> 00:20:23.778 Let them put, imagine putting something that would go around the horse's neck 00:20:23.818 --> 00:20:27.848 that would be like, you know, like a necklace, like something creative, 00:20:27.888 --> 00:20:32.268 and then have them pick the horse by the color of the, that's on the horse. 00:20:33.493 --> 00:20:38.233 And it would be so much fun, I mean, with, with your children riding with 00:20:38.233 --> 00:20:42.563 them if they would have some sort of, I don't know, a cape, actually, of 00:20:42.563 --> 00:20:46.083 different colors, and have them choose that cape, what cape would like, who 00:20:46.083 --> 00:20:47.473 would like, who would they like to be? 00:20:48.563 --> 00:20:48.573 Rupert Isaacson: I 00:20:48.713 --> 00:20:51.163 Linda Tellington Jones: mean, it's just, that's the kind of thing that 00:20:51.483 --> 00:20:57.623 we did with, I, I did this in the 80s, and not the 80s, the 60s, at our 00:20:57.623 --> 00:20:59.323 Pacific Coast Equestrian Research Forum. 00:20:59.323 --> 00:21:05.383 We did a 12 week program with a group of young people in their late teens 00:21:05.433 --> 00:21:09.613 being in a, an institute to teach. 00:21:10.008 --> 00:21:12.858 them to be able to get along with, with simple jobs that they 00:21:12.858 --> 00:21:14.168 could actually function with. 00:21:14.738 --> 00:21:16.598 And they came to ride once a week. 00:21:16.618 --> 00:21:23.828 And the one of the things that we did, I let them greet the horses and pick 00:21:23.828 --> 00:21:25.598 a horse that they liked the looks of. 00:21:26.218 --> 00:21:29.648 So they would actually look at the horse, because that is one of the 00:21:29.648 --> 00:21:33.718 toughest people, toughest things, I think, in the sport horse world, is 00:21:33.718 --> 00:21:36.928 that people don't see the horses. 00:21:37.788 --> 00:21:41.848 And it's so interesting, Rupert, when I was teaching as a citizen diplomat in 00:21:41.848 --> 00:21:45.623 Russia, One of the things, they asked me if I would work with the young, 00:21:45.863 --> 00:21:49.683 young people and teenage sport riders. 00:21:49.813 --> 00:21:54.883 And one of the things they wanted was to give them a sense that 00:21:54.883 --> 00:21:56.283 the horse was not a bicycle. 00:21:56.843 --> 00:21:59.973 And it's the same thing in the German Federation. 00:22:00.373 --> 00:22:01.493 It's all the same thing. 00:22:01.833 --> 00:22:09.303 How can we get our young riders to see the horse other than motorcycle or a bicycle? 00:22:10.203 --> 00:22:15.923 And I think the gift to the horses that you bring, that I've seen you give. 00:22:16.998 --> 00:22:20.878 Not just the horse walking around, but the excitement of sitting 00:22:20.878 --> 00:22:26.528 in that saddle with you, and all of the people working with you. 00:22:26.888 --> 00:22:28.848 And I actually had a chance to do it, too. 00:22:29.378 --> 00:22:33.868 It was such a, you know, you can pretend you're a knight or 00:22:34.478 --> 00:22:36.178 somebody else than what you are. 00:22:37.038 --> 00:22:38.128 And it takes you away. 00:22:38.138 --> 00:22:39.148 It takes you somewhere else. 00:22:39.148 --> 00:22:40.638 I mean, it was so incredible. 00:22:41.218 --> 00:22:41.388 Rupert Isaacson: Yeah. 00:22:41.388 --> 00:22:43.268 The whole idea is, is the imagination, right? 00:22:43.268 --> 00:22:48.408 We, so the more things that can spark our imagination and that's, that's of 00:22:48.408 --> 00:22:51.858 course, why any of us got into horses in the first place, because it, something 00:22:51.858 --> 00:22:53.628 sparked in our imagination around them. 00:22:54.178 --> 00:22:56.488 That of course breeds perspective and resilience. 00:22:57.353 --> 00:23:01.733 Problem solving the, the ability to think around problems, the ability 00:23:01.733 --> 00:23:04.253 to see solutions, not just problems. 00:23:04.603 --> 00:23:09.193 So I'm a great believer like you, that the more things that spark the imagination, 00:23:09.563 --> 00:23:16.443 the more chance there is for these, if you like cognitive processes to happen. 00:23:16.953 --> 00:23:20.823 Let's take this now to the physical and the structural. 00:23:20.983 --> 00:23:27.893 So again, one of the things we often see those of us who are practitioners 00:23:28.533 --> 00:23:32.978 is When a horse comes to us, well, it usually comes to us for a reason. 00:23:33.318 --> 00:23:37.458 People give away horses because usually they've broken them. 00:23:37.898 --> 00:23:39.188 It's just a fact. 00:23:39.468 --> 00:23:42.508 So they'll contact you or they'll contact me and say, Oh, this 00:23:42.508 --> 00:23:43.628 would make a great therapy horse. 00:23:43.628 --> 00:23:49.588 What they mean is he's now crocked and he can't do my hard competition job anymore. 00:23:49.728 --> 00:23:52.408 So I would like to get rid of him and I'd like you, Mr. 00:23:52.408 --> 00:23:57.818 Therapy or Miss Therapy provider to take on the costs of this horse for me. 00:23:58.243 --> 00:24:01.643 For the rest of its life, because I don't want to have to pay for 00:24:01.643 --> 00:24:03.203 this horse after I've broken it. 00:24:03.633 --> 00:24:08.963 And not only do I want you to take on all the costs, but I want you to feel 00:24:08.963 --> 00:24:12.563 grateful for the fact that I'm giving you this amazing horse that I'm just actually 00:24:12.943 --> 00:24:14.443 chucking effectively in the trash bin. 00:24:16.663 --> 00:24:20.913 What I often say to that is, yes, and how are you going to contribute 00:24:20.913 --> 00:24:22.173 to this horse's maintenance? 00:24:22.733 --> 00:24:27.603 And that's often, you know, greeted either with surprise or sometimes outrage. 00:24:28.123 --> 00:24:31.083 And it's like, well, dude, if I didn't take this horse, you'd be in trouble. 00:24:31.173 --> 00:24:33.363 Have to pay for its stuff, right? 00:24:33.553 --> 00:24:37.163 So if you care about this horse and say you love this horse, you love this horse 00:24:37.313 --> 00:24:41.753 so much that you're going to give it away then Surely if you were going to 00:24:41.753 --> 00:24:46.058 pay for it at home, you wouldn't mind paying a little bit less You know, to, 00:24:46.098 --> 00:24:47.238 to maintain it where it's going to be. 00:24:47.428 --> 00:24:49.208 That, of course, is a whole other can of worms. 00:24:49.208 --> 00:24:53.948 But, okay, so the horse arrives, and it's got stuff wrong with it. 00:24:54.128 --> 00:24:57.718 And, as we know, that's got usually a leg problem, a back 00:24:57.718 --> 00:25:00.548 problem, or like a stifle problem. 00:25:00.548 --> 00:25:02.468 Those are usually the three main ones. 00:25:02.628 --> 00:25:02.998 We'll see. 00:25:02.998 --> 00:25:05.258 Let's leave the brain out of it for a moment. 00:25:05.258 --> 00:25:13.703 When you see horses coming in with these issues, Talk to us how you would 00:25:13.943 --> 00:25:20.943 set about the rehab of the horse while it was still included in the program 00:25:20.943 --> 00:25:24.443 because a lot of people they can't take the time out say okay I'm going to take 00:25:24.463 --> 00:25:27.603 you know a year to rehab this horse and then I'm going to put him in the program 00:25:27.603 --> 00:25:31.023 because they're they're strapped for time they're strapped for cash so the horse 00:25:31.023 --> 00:25:37.113 is going to need to be worked with the Clients in a way that is also good for 00:25:37.163 --> 00:25:39.213 the horse and rehabs it simultaneously. 00:25:39.493 --> 00:25:42.363 Can you give us your thoughts on that? 00:25:42.503 --> 00:25:46.283 And some tech technologies and techniques that people can think about 00:25:46.523 --> 00:25:47.983 because everyone's facing this I think 00:25:48.643 --> 00:25:52.443 Linda Tellington Jones: yeah And I mean the thing is going back to that thing 00:25:52.443 --> 00:25:56.413 of people not wanting to pay I mean many of those sport horses come with 00:25:56.413 --> 00:26:00.473 insurance and they get a tax deduction if they're going to a non profit 00:26:00.673 --> 00:26:00.983 Rupert Isaacson: Absolutely, 00:26:01.683 --> 00:26:04.628 Linda Tellington Jones: and I mean it's something that It's just a 00:26:04.628 --> 00:26:08.348 fact of life and people are going to have to get used to it because we 00:26:08.348 --> 00:26:09.968 can't afford to take those horses. 00:26:09.968 --> 00:26:12.498 Now, in terms, so you have the horse, however it got there. 00:26:13.328 --> 00:26:21.158 My first question is, is the, is the issue that the horse, physical issue 00:26:21.158 --> 00:26:27.218 the horse is dealing with putting the horse in, Other than discomfort, in 00:26:27.218 --> 00:26:32.288 real pain, so that the respiration and pulse are affected, and you can 00:26:32.288 --> 00:26:34.288 feel a digital pulse in the hoof. 00:26:35.078 --> 00:26:41.028 Now, the reason I say that, Rupert, if you had asked me that question in 1975, 00:26:44.978 --> 00:26:47.508 I would have told you I wouldn't use a horse like that. 00:26:47.988 --> 00:26:51.598 But I have to tell you a story of why I would consider it. 00:26:52.518 --> 00:26:58.118 I was invited in Germany after all the present, you know, the 00:26:58.208 --> 00:27:02.588 show that we put on at Equitana, jumping four horses with no bridles. 00:27:02.898 --> 00:27:05.928 And so I was invited to different places around the country. 00:27:06.208 --> 00:27:10.098 And I was invited to go on a three day ride, cross country ride, 00:27:10.098 --> 00:27:12.158 with a woman named Angela Payson. 00:27:12.168 --> 00:27:15.868 She'd written a book about distance, about wander riding. 00:27:15.878 --> 00:27:17.128 It was called Wander. 00:27:17.143 --> 00:27:19.363 I forget in German now what the word is. 00:27:19.363 --> 00:27:25.763 Anyway and so we went to meet her and the idea was that we'd ride about 30 00:27:25.763 --> 00:27:29.943 miles a day and then stay in these nice places where horses could be kept 00:27:29.943 --> 00:27:31.663 in a stable and we'd be in a hotel. 00:27:32.233 --> 00:27:33.293 So it was a great idea. 00:27:33.483 --> 00:27:38.913 So we go there and we get, I had a really nice horse and she was riding 00:27:38.973 --> 00:27:40.758 a 19 year old mare who was dead. 00:27:42.038 --> 00:27:43.508 bloody dead lame. 00:27:44.448 --> 00:27:49.798 I mean, seriously lame in the right front. 00:27:50.648 --> 00:27:56.058 And I was like riding along in shock when, when we walked out of there. 00:27:56.218 --> 00:28:00.768 And after about 30 minutes, the lameness got less. 00:28:01.368 --> 00:28:04.963 And with by an hour, she was pretty. 00:28:07.033 --> 00:28:09.673 You'd, you'd, you'd notice it if you had a good eye, but she 00:28:09.673 --> 00:28:11.863 wasn't what I'd call lame anymore. 00:28:13.023 --> 00:28:17.433 And so we go all day, and about 5 o'clock, the mare starts to go lame again. 00:28:17.863 --> 00:28:18.403 Short. 00:28:18.883 --> 00:28:19.953 Not like in the morning. 00:28:20.713 --> 00:28:24.433 So we put the horses away, and I said to her over dinner that night, 00:28:24.783 --> 00:28:27.793 You know, I just can't believe it when I have a horse like that. 00:28:27.933 --> 00:28:31.383 That's, that's the time the quality of life is not okay, 00:28:31.383 --> 00:28:32.423 and we put the horse down. 00:28:33.273 --> 00:28:39.693 And she said, Look, I have some arthritis in my body also. 00:28:41.053 --> 00:28:42.323 Do I want to be put down? 00:28:42.333 --> 00:28:43.883 No, I don't. 00:28:44.483 --> 00:28:47.973 And she said, I tried turning this mirror out when she went, started 00:28:47.973 --> 00:28:50.783 to go like this, and she got worse. 00:28:50.943 --> 00:28:54.003 And she obviously didn't want to be alone. 00:28:54.003 --> 00:28:56.013 So I started riding her lightly. 00:28:56.503 --> 00:28:58.033 And you saw what happened today. 00:28:58.183 --> 00:28:59.183 She walked out of it. 00:28:59.833 --> 00:29:02.850 So I'm not recommending this report for anybody. 00:29:02.850 --> 00:29:05.248 But today what I say is. 00:29:05.908 --> 00:29:09.888 You know, check and make sure the horse is not suffering. 00:29:10.568 --> 00:29:15.848 And by that I mean the respiration and pulse are in normal range. 00:29:16.528 --> 00:29:19.688 And, and there's stuff that you can do to alleviate that. 00:29:19.688 --> 00:29:21.458 I mean, we have so much help nowadays. 00:29:21.843 --> 00:29:25.663 Of things just I mean the cheapest help that you can get and I 00:29:25.663 --> 00:29:28.663 don't know if you've ever heard this But they're life wave pain 00:29:28.663 --> 00:29:31.373 patches and I have seen miracles. 00:29:31.533 --> 00:29:32.533 I mean, I tell 00:29:32.533 --> 00:29:33.963 Rupert Isaacson: us that that product again 00:29:34.253 --> 00:29:36.723 Linda Tellington Jones: It's called life way if you life way 00:29:36.803 --> 00:29:38.425 Rupert Isaacson: life way pain patch Wave 00:29:38.425 --> 00:29:40.293 Linda Tellington Jones: w life wave. 00:29:40.293 --> 00:29:40.543 Rupert Isaacson: Okay, 00:29:42.423 --> 00:29:44.533 Linda Tellington Jones: and pain and they have all different kind of 00:29:44.533 --> 00:29:50.753 patches pain patches energy patches and I I have You I have put them on 00:29:50.773 --> 00:29:55.143 people, but the big thing is, the most amazing thing, two horses I put it on. 00:29:55.143 --> 00:29:58.503 I want to tell this for your people because it can't hurt. 00:29:58.953 --> 00:30:03.223 I mean they claim it's not homeopathy, but I'll tell you, it can't be 00:30:03.223 --> 00:30:07.033 measured because people were using it in the Olympics in London. 00:30:07.463 --> 00:30:11.973 People I know ride horses, and humans, both actually. 00:30:12.788 --> 00:30:18.248 And so, so I had, the first time I, I used it on a horse because I've 00:30:18.248 --> 00:30:22.828 been putting it on people with real longstanding pain and you just set the 00:30:22.828 --> 00:30:27.668 patch on there and like the pain is gone and we're, I'm talking in eight pain. 00:30:28.788 --> 00:30:34.558 This is like not just discomfort and it's longstanding in some cases. 00:30:34.878 --> 00:30:41.808 So I was up in Wyoming and an Arabian mare found it really badly. 00:30:43.873 --> 00:30:49.143 They didn't, they did some acupuncture, they did have a vet actually visiting that 00:30:49.143 --> 00:30:55.703 week because it's way out in the country, a long ways in Montana, in Wyoming, sorry. 00:30:56.263 --> 00:31:02.473 And so they just put the mare down by the river and left her with food and like I'm 00:31:02.473 --> 00:31:06.873 thinking they're not going to give this horse any help because in those, mostly 00:31:06.873 --> 00:31:11.573 today Rupert, it's still believed that, that if she would go in the river and 00:31:11.573 --> 00:31:13.903 get her ice cold feet, it would help her. 00:31:14.698 --> 00:31:17.808 Which, I don't know if you've read the studies, but it's 00:31:17.808 --> 00:31:18.828 the worst thing you can do. 00:31:19.288 --> 00:31:22.908 If you put a horse in ice, they're, they won't, they'll last a couple 00:31:22.908 --> 00:31:26.348 of months, and every horse I've known in the past that was treated 00:31:26.588 --> 00:31:29.488 traditionally with ice didn't make it. 00:31:29.708 --> 00:31:37.158 But a study was done at, at Texas no, at in Iowa, I think it was Iowa 00:31:37.198 --> 00:31:41.388 State, about 30 years ago, and I just happened to read it in Western 00:31:41.398 --> 00:31:43.628 Horseman, showing that it is. 00:31:44.223 --> 00:31:48.993 When a horse first, you know, gets the lemini engorged, instead of putting 00:31:48.993 --> 00:31:53.663 them in ice, you put them in hot water, not, I mean, hot water you can put 00:31:53.663 --> 00:31:59.563 your hand in, it's comfortable, hot and then cool, and hot and cool, and I did 00:31:59.563 --> 00:32:03.153 it on the Great American Horse Race, I was the international coordinator 00:32:03.153 --> 00:32:05.943 for the German, for the European team. 00:32:07.033 --> 00:32:12.163 One of our horses came up really off, and with, you know, a 00:32:12.163 --> 00:32:14.233 light case, a case of founder. 00:32:14.793 --> 00:32:19.873 In the very, on the second day out, and three other horses had the same 00:32:19.873 --> 00:32:24.283 condition, so they were pulled, and they were, the other three horses 00:32:24.283 --> 00:32:29.413 were iced, and just carried along across the country in trailers, and 00:32:29.443 --> 00:32:31.133 they were put down after two months. 00:32:31.423 --> 00:32:35.063 When our vet wanted to do that, I told him about this study, and I 00:32:35.063 --> 00:32:41.523 said, let's see what happens, and we put them in hot, and, Like, hmm. 00:32:42.943 --> 00:32:45.043 Hotter than warm, but not hot hot. 00:32:45.113 --> 00:32:46.053 Rupert Isaacson: Like bath water. 00:32:47.293 --> 00:32:48.293 Linda Tellington Jones: Yeah, like bath water. 00:32:48.293 --> 00:32:48.823 Exactly. 00:32:49.463 --> 00:32:53.073 And, and, and, and then cool, not ice, but cold. 00:32:54.003 --> 00:32:55.253 Just alternating. 00:32:55.463 --> 00:32:59.873 And we, I've got to call Dave Nicholson and ask him what 00:32:59.903 --> 00:33:01.413 the heck he can't remember. 00:33:01.673 --> 00:33:05.663 He sent me, I drove like 40 miles to pick up some other medication. 00:33:06.283 --> 00:33:07.723 that he gave the horse a shot. 00:33:07.803 --> 00:33:11.083 I don't know what, what it was, but our horse was back on the 00:33:11.083 --> 00:33:13.793 road in four days and crossed the country, finished the race. 00:33:14.363 --> 00:33:16.763 The other horses, all three horses were put down. 00:33:17.533 --> 00:33:22.553 Now, so I'm telling you this, so I'm, I'm really, you know, I've had a lot of 00:33:22.553 --> 00:33:29.013 horses in my life and seen a lot of cases of laminitis that ended up badly with ice. 00:33:29.023 --> 00:33:33.373 So the reason I'm telling you this is this to help anybody who's doing 00:33:33.373 --> 00:33:36.073 animal horse equine assisted therapy. 00:33:36.698 --> 00:33:38.628 this concept of the pain patches. 00:33:39.098 --> 00:33:45.178 So, this horse, they put her down by the river, which, I'm sorry, was really 00:33:45.178 --> 00:33:48.748 crazy because it was rocky and she had to go over rocks to get in the river. 00:33:49.028 --> 00:33:53.908 So, I go up to see her in the evening after my class ended, and the mare 00:33:53.908 --> 00:33:58.068 is standing there, not eating, respiration was up, her pulse was 00:33:58.068 --> 00:34:02.328 up, and her food was just standing there, and she was not happy, and 00:34:02.328 --> 00:34:05.003 she It was not standing in the water. 00:34:05.773 --> 00:34:13.963 And so I put the pain patches on her, bam, and I'm trying to remember 00:34:13.963 --> 00:34:19.083 why, I don't remember now, but it was a place that I knew from one 00:34:19.083 --> 00:34:20.743 of my, one of our veterinarians. 00:34:21.703 --> 00:34:29.553 And Rupert, this mare, I put it on within 30, maybe a minute. 00:34:31.073 --> 00:34:37.353 She picked her head up, walked like 10 feet to the hay and started eating and 00:34:37.353 --> 00:34:39.103 walked down to the river and drank. 00:34:39.778 --> 00:34:40.888 and came back and ate. 00:34:41.828 --> 00:34:43.238 That's the first time I did it. 00:34:43.288 --> 00:34:46.658 I thought, listen, I can't believe it. 00:34:46.708 --> 00:34:48.638 I mean, I just, I was just stunned. 00:34:49.358 --> 00:34:55.668 And then the other, the next time, and this is even like, it gives you hope. 00:34:55.668 --> 00:34:57.008 And these things are not expensive. 00:34:57.028 --> 00:34:58.268 That's the good news. 00:34:59.758 --> 00:35:06.438 So the next time was at another horse rescue place in Colorado. 00:35:07.513 --> 00:35:14.693 And I was watching this 35 year old warmblood, I mean three legged, 00:35:15.023 --> 00:35:21.153 his left hind leg, he was so, so in such pain that he was on his toe. 00:35:22.133 --> 00:35:28.033 And so I thought, eh, I was with one of our, one of my friends who's a vet and 00:35:28.033 --> 00:35:31.463 also does T Touch, and I said, Why don't we, why don't we just stick these pain 00:35:31.463 --> 00:35:33.013 patches on this horse, see what happens? 00:35:33.353 --> 00:35:34.563 Because she hadn't seen them before. 00:35:35.133 --> 00:35:36.543 And I put them on. 00:35:37.243 --> 00:35:44.963 The inside and the outside of the hawk, and this horse trotted 00:35:45.023 --> 00:35:48.513 off, Rupert, trotted off. 00:35:50.213 --> 00:35:51.693 I mean, isn't that incredible? 00:35:51.993 --> 00:35:52.893 Rupert Isaacson: With the patches on? 00:35:52.893 --> 00:35:54.023 Linda Tellington Jones: With the patches on. 00:35:54.063 --> 00:35:55.163 I put the patches on. 00:35:55.653 --> 00:36:01.153 It's, it's, the patch is about an inch across, and put one on the inside and one 00:36:01.153 --> 00:36:03.383 on the outside, and choop, trotted off. 00:36:03.383 --> 00:36:03.733 And 00:36:03.813 --> 00:36:05.623 Rupert Isaacson: how long do they last for, the patches? 00:36:06.363 --> 00:36:10.133 Linda Tellington Jones: Well, they tell you on humans, They say don't leave them 00:36:10.133 --> 00:36:15.583 on more than 24 hours because it, stuff on it, the stuff that sticks it to your 00:36:15.583 --> 00:36:17.603 skin you know, it's not good for you. 00:36:18.243 --> 00:36:23.823 Truth is, I've had people who couldn't afford even the price of the patches, and 00:36:23.823 --> 00:36:28.073 so they put one in their shoe and could go to work without pain in their feet. 00:36:29.583 --> 00:36:33.583 So, and I've known people who just put it in their cap and put the cap on. 00:36:36.393 --> 00:36:39.153 Rupert Isaacson: How do you get the patch to stick on the horse hair? 00:36:40.308 --> 00:36:42.398 Linda Tellington Jones: Oh, it just sticks on the dog or horse area. 00:36:42.398 --> 00:36:42.948 You don't have to. 00:36:43.538 --> 00:36:45.318 Rupert Isaacson: So I'm looking these up as you're talking about them 00:36:45.328 --> 00:36:46.448 because I haven't heard of them before. 00:36:46.668 --> 00:36:51.438 And I've got a horse who has some, who, who, who, basically the horse 00:36:51.438 --> 00:36:54.638 that you described from the German lady that walked itself somewhat 00:36:54.638 --> 00:36:56.038 sound and then would come up. 00:36:56.298 --> 00:37:00.168 So I have a horse like this and this horse was given to us. 00:37:00.268 --> 00:37:03.598 He's superbly talented and he does exactly this. 00:37:03.598 --> 00:37:04.598 He walks himself. 00:37:05.163 --> 00:37:11.433 More or less sound when you don't do much with him He gets lamer if you do long 00:37:11.433 --> 00:37:16.093 slow work with him He gets so sound that you he then actually wants a sharp for 00:37:16.243 --> 00:37:19.563 canter work and things like that You do that for a few days and then you go back 00:37:19.573 --> 00:37:23.133 to we manage it, you know We've managed it for about 10 years, but I think these 00:37:23.133 --> 00:37:24.533 pain patches might be a good thing. 00:37:24.533 --> 00:37:26.313 So I'm looking them up To see what's in them. 00:37:26.923 --> 00:37:29.313 And of course there's a variety of different ones. 00:37:29.763 --> 00:37:33.413 And active ingredients menthol, capiscum, and camphor. 00:37:33.843 --> 00:37:36.593 But some of them also have turmeric, willow bark and of 00:37:36.593 --> 00:37:38.793 course willow is aspirin, right? 00:37:38.953 --> 00:37:39.933 Willow is painkiller. 00:37:40.063 --> 00:37:45.243 So, I'm definitely going to check these out. 00:37:46.113 --> 00:37:46.283 It's just, 00:37:47.443 --> 00:37:48.273 Linda Tellington Jones: you see, before. 00:37:48.613 --> 00:37:48.833 Capperskin, by 00:37:48.833 --> 00:37:51.153 Rupert Isaacson: the way, is, is, is basically hot pepper, right? 00:37:51.153 --> 00:37:51.763 Chili pepper. 00:37:52.183 --> 00:37:52.483 Yeah. 00:37:52.603 --> 00:37:53.943 Sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt you there. 00:37:54.253 --> 00:37:56.173 Linda Tellington Jones: No, sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt you, 00:37:56.173 --> 00:38:00.843 but the thing is, until I, I, now I forget, I was a distributor for. 00:38:01.213 --> 00:38:05.943 a long time, but then I just you know, I didn't need to sell something. 00:38:06.483 --> 00:38:10.093 And so I just started keeping enough to give them to people. 00:38:10.103 --> 00:38:14.043 So if they found that one helped, they could order them. 00:38:14.673 --> 00:38:15.383 You know, you have a 00:38:15.383 --> 00:38:17.803 Rupert Isaacson: particular, I see there's a number of different brands. 00:38:17.803 --> 00:38:19.633 Do you have a particular brand that you like to? 00:38:21.733 --> 00:38:22.853 Linda Tellington Jones: What do you mean brand? 00:38:22.963 --> 00:38:25.813 Rupert Isaacson: Well, there's different pain patches here for, I'm looking. 00:38:25.863 --> 00:38:27.573 Linda Tellington Jones: Pain patches, yeah, for different purposes. 00:38:27.573 --> 00:38:27.753 For the 00:38:27.753 --> 00:38:30.753 Rupert Isaacson: LifeWave, okay, so LifeWave is the brand, okay. 00:38:31.883 --> 00:38:32.673 LifeWave, yeah. 00:38:33.233 --> 00:38:34.303 Oh, I see, okay, yes. 00:38:34.333 --> 00:38:41.693 Glutath Glucosamine, White Willow Bark, Turmeric, and MSM, other things. 00:38:41.723 --> 00:38:46.313 Okay, I'm gonna go give this a try. 00:38:47.723 --> 00:38:53.103 Now, I know that you're also a strong believer in the Beamer Blanket. 00:38:53.333 --> 00:38:53.993 And Yep. 00:38:56.073 --> 00:39:02.463 When you tried it on me when I was riddled with jet lag, I remember thinking, gosh, 00:39:02.463 --> 00:39:07.393 this, I can't really feel anything from the blanket, but I seem to be brighter. 00:39:07.943 --> 00:39:14.253 And then we tried the equine one and some of our hotter horses became less hot. 00:39:14.413 --> 00:39:18.203 And which reminds me, I need to start beaming one of my horses again through 00:39:18.203 --> 00:39:19.383 a bit of a hot patch right now. 00:39:19.723 --> 00:39:22.003 And also just some of our older horses were just. 00:39:22.073 --> 00:39:22.653 15 minutes. 00:39:22.683 --> 00:39:26.733 Can you talk to us a little bit about the beamer and why is it called a beamer? 00:39:26.793 --> 00:39:29.083 People think, Oh, I'm beaming something, beaming up, Scotty. 00:39:29.233 --> 00:39:29.673 What is it? 00:39:29.673 --> 00:39:30.303 How does it work? 00:39:30.303 --> 00:39:32.643 And why do you, why do you recommend this? 00:39:33.043 --> 00:39:34.023 Linda Tellington Jones: It's a PEMF. 00:39:34.023 --> 00:39:38.083 The reason I recommend it is that I'm almost 90 years old and I've had, 00:39:38.213 --> 00:39:43.703 I got my first beamer and 2003 in Germany, and it's gone through three, 00:39:43.753 --> 00:39:45.203 you know, upgrades over the years. 00:39:45.353 --> 00:39:49.603 I've had the, I've had the latest one, well I had the one that you 00:39:49.613 --> 00:39:56.373 have since 11 years ago I got it, and then two years ago I got the new Evo. 00:39:57.123 --> 00:40:03.403 And, you know, you see me, I'm riding, I can get down on the floor with a dog. 00:40:03.753 --> 00:40:07.163 The other day, Rupert, I couldn't believe it, I mean, I can do 00:40:07.163 --> 00:40:08.423 a leg circle with a horse. 00:40:08.473 --> 00:40:11.193 And I could get down and work all the way down the legs. 00:40:11.233 --> 00:40:14.553 I mean, that's like, just not possible. 00:40:15.093 --> 00:40:18.003 And I have no pain in my body. 00:40:18.733 --> 00:40:23.608 And that's Beamer, because I, I, Wouldn't I take it everywhere I go? 00:40:23.648 --> 00:40:24.388 I'm on it twice a week. 00:40:24.418 --> 00:40:24.718 B 00:40:24.748 --> 00:40:25.788 Rupert Isaacson: E M E R. 00:40:25.818 --> 00:40:27.408 That's the name of the Swiss company, right? 00:40:27.408 --> 00:40:28.638 That makes them. 00:40:28.668 --> 00:40:30.728 We're not getting, by the way, listeners, we're not getting 00:40:30.818 --> 00:40:32.708 sponsorship from any of these products. 00:40:32.708 --> 00:40:34.488 I wish we were, but we're not. 00:40:34.798 --> 00:40:36.258 How does it, how does the beamer work? 00:40:37.078 --> 00:40:40.138 Linda Tellington Jones: Well, it's a pulse electromagnetic frequency. 00:40:40.208 --> 00:40:45.388 It's a frequency and what it does, you know, people, we all think if you don't, 00:40:45.428 --> 00:40:49.748 if you haven't studied this, that our heart is responsible for circulation. 00:40:50.123 --> 00:40:54.553 But actually, we have like over 70, 000 miles of these micro 00:40:54.553 --> 00:40:57.133 blood vessels in our body. 00:40:57.463 --> 00:41:04.798 And as we age, or when we have any kind of dysfunction, what happens is the pumping 00:41:04.828 --> 00:41:10.918 action stops and, not stops, sorry, it slows down and it slows like after 00:41:11.038 --> 00:41:15.198 about, what's the age, I think they say around 40, it starts to really slow down. 00:41:15.518 --> 00:41:22.018 And we don't get the circulation to our extremities and way slower. 00:41:22.018 --> 00:41:28.338 So the energy starts to drop and, and the blood flow, the circulation, 00:41:28.338 --> 00:41:30.508 the pumping action of these 00:41:30.868 --> 00:41:35.498 And what the beamer does, just lying on it twice a day, you reactivate this 00:41:35.498 --> 00:41:41.068 and get the same kind of pumping action and movement, circulation in the body. 00:41:41.328 --> 00:41:43.788 And life is blood flow. 00:41:43.858 --> 00:41:47.948 I mean, without this, boy, we just don't have the health that we have. 00:41:48.558 --> 00:41:51.448 So it's, it's really incredible. 00:41:51.638 --> 00:41:54.178 The reason I didn't say it first is it's expensive. 00:41:54.673 --> 00:41:55.063 Rupert Isaacson: Yeah, 00:41:55.183 --> 00:41:57.353 Linda Tellington Jones: and whereas the pain patches aren't. 00:41:57.373 --> 00:42:00.213 I mean, I and I was just thinking today. 00:42:00.253 --> 00:42:04.583 I've got to order the pain patches again because I'm not using them and I'm going 00:42:04.583 --> 00:42:08.963 to get the stem cell because they now have stem cells and what I want to say as a 00:42:08.963 --> 00:42:14.293 long time unit user for many years before, but I haven't used them for at least 10 00:42:14.303 --> 00:42:19.023 years just because I have the Beamer and I sleep on it, you know, I lie on it. 00:42:19.403 --> 00:42:25.023 So, with the, with the pain, with the lightweight patches. 00:42:25.743 --> 00:42:28.863 What everybody thought before, and certainly what I thought 00:42:28.863 --> 00:42:30.093 was that they had a homeo. 00:42:30.183 --> 00:42:33.373 They were homeopathic, but that's not legal. 00:42:33.893 --> 00:42:35.423 I mean, it's nothing, right? 00:42:35.423 --> 00:42:40.073 So they have to put something in them and I'm sure all that sounds really good. 00:42:40.283 --> 00:42:43.703 And they have to put something that's harmless and that is not a drug. 00:42:45.133 --> 00:42:46.993 Otherwise, these athletes couldn't use them. 00:42:46.993 --> 00:42:47.053 So 00:42:48.333 --> 00:42:49.023 Rupert Isaacson: what are they putting in? 00:42:50.263 --> 00:42:50.923 Linda Tellington Jones: What you read? 00:42:51.393 --> 00:42:51.663 Rupert Isaacson: Yeah. 00:42:52.533 --> 00:42:52.953 Linda Tellington Jones: Herbs. 00:42:53.493 --> 00:42:53.883 Rupert Isaacson: Okay. 00:42:54.383 --> 00:42:55.073 Linda Tellington Jones: Helpful. 00:42:55.073 --> 00:42:57.083 Harmless herbs. 00:42:57.623 --> 00:42:57.863 Rupert Isaacson: Okay. 00:42:58.438 --> 00:43:00.848 Linda Tellington Jones: And I am about to order paint the stem cell 00:43:00.848 --> 00:43:02.318 patches for me, because that's 00:43:02.518 --> 00:43:03.898 Rupert Isaacson: Tell us about the stem cell patches. 00:43:05.728 --> 00:43:07.468 Linda Tellington Jones: Well, I don't know, because I haven't used them. 00:43:07.478 --> 00:43:11.648 And I just had a new something that's really pretty new. 00:43:11.708 --> 00:43:14.938 And it's not, I don't know if I'm in a trial or what. 00:43:14.968 --> 00:43:20.838 Because I just read that they're not fully yet you know, available. 00:43:21.458 --> 00:43:25.418 So it's, I had stem cells put into my brain. 00:43:26.043 --> 00:43:29.283 through the nasal passage on the side here. 00:43:29.293 --> 00:43:30.573 It's really interesting. 00:43:31.823 --> 00:43:32.903 Rupert Isaacson: Where, why and how? 00:43:33.543 --> 00:43:36.493 Linda Tellington Jones: And I got ketamine so that the pain was less. 00:43:38.013 --> 00:43:40.663 Rupert Isaacson: Why did you have, and who, why did you have stem cells 00:43:40.663 --> 00:43:42.263 put in your nose and who put them in? 00:43:42.723 --> 00:43:44.403 Linda Tellington Jones: Me, I put in my brain, my doctor. 00:43:44.693 --> 00:43:45.093 Rupert Isaacson: Right. 00:43:45.283 --> 00:43:45.853 Okay. 00:43:46.943 --> 00:43:47.273 Okay. 00:43:47.713 --> 00:43:48.593 That's a big thing to say. 00:43:48.703 --> 00:43:49.093 Why? 00:43:49.113 --> 00:43:49.843 What's the story? 00:43:50.873 --> 00:43:53.443 Linda Tellington Jones: The story is that I've been dealing with Epstein Barr 00:43:53.443 --> 00:43:56.988 virus and Hashimoto's, you know, With the 00:43:57.038 --> 00:43:57.708 Rupert Isaacson: thyroid, yeah. 00:43:58.228 --> 00:43:59.868 Linda Tellington Jones: Yeah, for more than 10 years. 00:43:59.908 --> 00:44:00.388 Okay. 00:44:00.968 --> 00:44:06.738 I, Rupert, I'm telling you, I am, there have been, the last couple of years, 00:44:06.768 --> 00:44:10.448 I haven't been able to ride, except when I go to teach, because then I'm 00:44:10.448 --> 00:44:14.988 stimulated, and I, you know, I rode, I think you heard, I rode five horses in 00:44:14.988 --> 00:44:16.428 my last training in Germany last month. 00:44:16.508 --> 00:44:17.858 Rupert Isaacson: Yeah, I, I saw the pictures. 00:44:18.988 --> 00:44:20.198 Nuts, but amazing. 00:44:21.028 --> 00:44:22.788 Linda Tellington Jones: And no brain fog. 00:44:23.323 --> 00:44:23.353 Okay. 00:44:23.363 --> 00:44:27.723 Because this Epstein Barr, the brain fog is just, you're just fighting through, 00:44:27.823 --> 00:44:29.623 it's like you're going through water. 00:44:29.863 --> 00:44:33.663 You know, I couldn't, unless I was lying down or sitting down. 00:44:33.673 --> 00:44:34.993 That's what's so interesting. 00:44:35.603 --> 00:44:41.633 So I decided, I said to my doctor, because I've been having these dreams 00:44:42.243 --> 00:44:45.353 that I had to get mitochondria help. 00:44:45.813 --> 00:44:51.793 For years it was the oxygen and, and then I kept getting these things. 00:44:51.793 --> 00:44:55.643 No, I actually, my mitochondria are having serious problems. 00:44:55.643 --> 00:44:56.803 I've got to get some help. 00:44:57.793 --> 00:44:59.613 So I had methylene blue. 00:45:00.763 --> 00:45:02.433 Which is supposed to be a help. 00:45:03.253 --> 00:45:04.913 Rupert Isaacson: Sorry, tell us the name of that again. 00:45:05.413 --> 00:45:06.603 Linda Tellington Jones: Methylene blue. 00:45:06.633 --> 00:45:07.133 Methylene 00:45:07.133 --> 00:45:07.493 Rupert Isaacson: blue. 00:45:07.553 --> 00:45:07.993 Okay. 00:45:08.363 --> 00:45:09.133 Linda Tellington Jones: You can look it up. 00:45:09.163 --> 00:45:13.853 Yeah, I had a IV shot, but it's supposed to make your brain fog go away. 00:45:13.853 --> 00:45:14.283 It didn't. 00:45:15.233 --> 00:45:16.413 Rupert Isaacson: Did not, did not work. 00:45:16.783 --> 00:45:17.663 Linda Tellington Jones: No, didn't work. 00:45:17.853 --> 00:45:20.303 So then, and they're really expensive. 00:45:21.063 --> 00:45:24.903 And so, well, really expensive. 00:45:24.903 --> 00:45:26.643 I mean, quite expensive. 00:45:27.563 --> 00:45:31.143 So then I, he gave me drops for it. 00:45:31.738 --> 00:45:32.538 So that's what I'm taking. 00:45:32.558 --> 00:45:34.618 Then I said, it's not enough, it's not working. 00:45:34.888 --> 00:45:39.178 I've got to get help from a mitochondria, I, I don't want to go on like this. 00:45:39.398 --> 00:45:44.938 And so, like when I sit down and do an interview, like a, or do anything 00:45:44.938 --> 00:45:48.908 on, on the computer like this, I'm fine as long as I'm sitting, 00:45:49.388 --> 00:45:51.018 as soon as I get up, brain fog. 00:45:51.028 --> 00:45:54.988 And I'm saying this for a lot of people out there who've been dealing with this. 00:45:55.868 --> 00:46:00.338 So my doctor said, well, you know, there is this new thing 00:46:01.088 --> 00:46:03.648 of stem cells taken from. 00:46:04.268 --> 00:46:11.968 People between the ages of I think it's 18 and 40 from belly fat, because fat 00:46:12.248 --> 00:46:14.168 is a really good source of stem cells. 00:46:15.038 --> 00:46:19.738 And until now, and I have been wanting to tell you about this anyway, until 00:46:19.738 --> 00:46:27.428 now, they're available very expensive from what is, from, from umbilical cord. 00:46:27.458 --> 00:46:29.138 That's the best source that you can get. 00:46:29.778 --> 00:46:32.848 And they're now, they're doing a long study on autism. 00:46:33.448 --> 00:46:38.368 With some really good results at the Stem Cell Institute in Panama. 00:46:39.768 --> 00:46:45.120 And there's lots on YouTube and from Neil Reardon who developed this. 00:46:45.120 --> 00:46:50.528 So it might be something for you to look into. 00:46:50.538 --> 00:46:50.768 Yeah, 00:46:50.768 --> 00:46:51.548 Rupert Isaacson: we'll definitely look at it. 00:46:51.768 --> 00:46:56.968 And I guess what, so you, you, you, your doctor put stem cells into your brain. 00:46:57.673 --> 00:46:58.743 Through your nose. 00:46:59.243 --> 00:47:02.583 So that's the sort of what the the reverse of the egyptian mummy 00:47:02.583 --> 00:47:04.763 process where they pulled your brain out Through your nose, right? 00:47:05.313 --> 00:47:10.463 And I I presume the the point of that is stem cells help to regenerate 00:47:11.353 --> 00:47:11.673 Linda Tellington Jones: Tissue, 00:47:11.673 --> 00:47:13.063 Rupert Isaacson: right and and other cells. 00:47:13.173 --> 00:47:15.433 So was the idea that this would help with the brain fog 00:47:16.253 --> 00:47:16.853 Linda Tellington Jones: exactly 00:47:17.383 --> 00:47:18.033 Rupert Isaacson: and has it 00:47:21.183 --> 00:47:23.913 Linda Tellington Jones: Since the next morning not only have I had no brain 00:47:23.913 --> 00:47:27.333 fog, but I had the energy I mean, I couldn't stop myself from getting 00:47:27.333 --> 00:47:31.533 dressed and going to run And I've been wanting to do this ever since I got home. 00:47:34.343 --> 00:47:38.073 Rupert Isaacson: What's interesting with you is I, whenever I meet you, you know, 00:47:38.093 --> 00:47:39.663 these days we tend to meet in Germany. 00:47:40.113 --> 00:47:42.483 And you say to me this, Oh, Rupert, I've got, you know, brain 00:47:42.483 --> 00:47:44.133 fog, I'm not as young as I was. 00:47:44.133 --> 00:47:46.073 And I, then I see you jetting off somewhere else. 00:47:46.073 --> 00:47:50.433 And I think you a bit like me are often jet lagged and traveling all the time. 00:47:51.103 --> 00:47:53.073 And yet here you are almost 90. 00:47:53.423 --> 00:47:56.343 Thriving and now riding these young warm bloods again. 00:47:56.893 --> 00:47:58.743 So there must be something in it. 00:47:59.013 --> 00:48:05.563 What, so let's, let's take this then to people like yourself. 00:48:05.793 --> 00:48:09.073 One of the things that's not really talked about much within equine assisted 00:48:09.073 --> 00:48:10.453 work, people talk about kids a lot. 00:48:10.493 --> 00:48:12.333 We work a lot with kids and young adults. 00:48:12.773 --> 00:48:16.343 People talk about people with trauma, you know, so that might be a more 00:48:16.343 --> 00:48:19.853 adult population, but people don't really talk about the elderly. 00:48:20.353 --> 00:48:21.433 Linda Tellington Jones: The 00:48:21.613 --> 00:48:25.093 Rupert Isaacson: elderly, you know, sometimes you'll see someone who's had a 00:48:25.093 --> 00:48:28.483 stroke or a TBI who's older up on a horse. 00:48:29.033 --> 00:48:32.943 Generally, the older people you see on horses are people who are just older 00:48:32.943 --> 00:48:34.943 but ride, you know, and it obviously. 00:48:35.628 --> 00:48:40.928 It's therapeutic to that degree, but you don't really see programs aimed at 00:48:40.928 --> 00:48:44.508 this and I suppose perhaps that's a risk factor, people falling off or whatever, 00:48:44.508 --> 00:48:49.288 but we all know that the outside of a horse is good for the inside of a man, 00:48:49.288 --> 00:48:54.678 we all know the brain, BDNF, brain derived neurotrophic factor, effect of 00:48:54.678 --> 00:48:58.663 moving and problem solving, balancing, this must be good are you aware of that? 00:48:59.083 --> 00:49:04.663 of any programs that are specifically targeted for the elderly? 00:49:04.713 --> 00:49:08.293 And if not, why not? 00:49:10.263 --> 00:49:11.643 Linda Tellington Jones: Well, it's a really good question. 00:49:11.693 --> 00:49:18.963 And I think probably the, the insurance and risk factors, but Rupert, one 00:49:18.973 --> 00:49:22.483 of the things that I'm seeing, and I have a friend who has no issues. 00:49:22.493 --> 00:49:23.863 She's a great therapist. 00:49:24.423 --> 00:49:30.353 And she decided to do one of these equine assisted therapies where you just. 00:49:30.753 --> 00:49:36.943 be in the presence of a horse, just sitting in a pa in a, like 00:49:36.943 --> 00:49:40.363 a pasture actually, and see if the horse has come up to you. 00:49:40.793 --> 00:49:41.243 Rupert Isaacson: Okay. 00:49:41.553 --> 00:49:43.613 Linda Tellington Jones: And it was life changing for her. 00:49:44.088 --> 00:49:49.898 And then her husband who has some fear issues did it and and for the two of them 00:49:49.898 --> 00:49:56.728 together It was amazing just being in the presence of horses But riding was not I'm, 00:49:56.728 --> 00:49:58.258 sure they wouldn't even be interested. 00:49:58.978 --> 00:50:01.758 Rupert Isaacson: Well, one of the reasons I ask is I actually just recently got 00:50:01.758 --> 00:50:08.188 contacted by a developer, german developer actually, but he's based out of hong 00:50:08.188 --> 00:50:14.273 kong and they are creating a retirement community in Hong Kong Chiang Mai in 00:50:14.273 --> 00:50:18.883 Thailand and you may know that we have a good horse boy movement method place in 00:50:18.883 --> 00:50:23.853 Thailand called Farm Delek and we must get Gay Pantrat who runs that place on 00:50:23.853 --> 00:50:27.213 this show actually because she's, she's done, it does incredible work and it's 00:50:27.213 --> 00:50:31.483 also an organic farm and they do amazing classical horsemanship and everything. 00:50:31.483 --> 00:50:35.223 They're, they're, they're state of the art amazing but this guy contacted 00:50:35.223 --> 00:50:39.233 me, Sebastian, and said, yeah, look Ru, we want to do a retirement 00:50:39.233 --> 00:50:42.003 community based around an equestrian. 00:50:43.373 --> 00:50:49.323 Not necessarily with the idea that Everyone who buys a house in this 00:50:49.323 --> 00:50:53.303 retirement community would ride but more Because the presence of 00:50:53.303 --> 00:50:55.233 horses seems to be so therapeutic. 00:50:55.413 --> 00:50:59.893 Maybe their grandkids want to come and ride Maybe also people from the local 00:51:00.043 --> 00:51:03.603 town want to come and ride and this creates a social life and a social hub 00:51:03.603 --> 00:51:08.768 and younger people And so on but You know, and so we're now working together to look 00:51:08.808 --> 00:51:13.518 at adapting horseboy movement method, perhaps for an age of an older population. 00:51:14.068 --> 00:51:18.748 But it does seem to me also that just in our culture, we are so youth oriented. 00:51:20.538 --> 00:51:24.518 The, my father, for example, who's 90 he's, 00:51:26.778 --> 00:51:27.998 he's very active. 00:51:28.348 --> 00:51:32.438 So when people see someone who's older, who's very active, there's 00:51:32.438 --> 00:51:33.768 this kind of, Oh, wow, that's amazing. 00:51:33.768 --> 00:51:33.968 I don't know. 00:51:34.368 --> 00:51:41.488 But in general, people past the age of about 75, maybe it's 80 these days 00:51:41.528 --> 00:51:42.828 because people are living longer. 00:51:43.088 --> 00:51:45.188 There is a bit of a, just a kind of writing off. 00:51:45.758 --> 00:51:46.208 And. 00:51:46.658 --> 00:51:52.188 This seems to me a gap really in our field, you know that the and here you are 00:51:52.188 --> 00:51:56.698 representing the older rider You know, is this something we should be looking at? 00:51:59.003 --> 00:52:00.893 Linda Tellington Jones: Well, I think Thailand would be a good place. 00:52:00.893 --> 00:52:04.483 The problem in our country, so many people are overweight. 00:52:04.503 --> 00:52:07.423 You'd have to have, which isn't a problem. 00:52:07.423 --> 00:52:12.663 I mean, these warm bloods that, you know, or actually, actually, I don't mean warm 00:52:12.663 --> 00:52:16.563 bloods, cold bloods make fabulous horses. 00:52:16.563 --> 00:52:17.393 They're fun. 00:52:17.753 --> 00:52:22.643 They're so interesting to sit on and they're really impressive. 00:52:22.923 --> 00:52:26.008 And all you need is a really great ramp to get 00:52:26.008 --> 00:52:26.473 Rupert Isaacson: people. 00:52:27.223 --> 00:52:30.533 Linda Tellington Jones: I mean, you need a tall, tall ones for them, but it's, 00:52:31.083 --> 00:52:37.543 I mean, see, have, I think it would be wonderful and have different sizes of 00:52:37.543 --> 00:52:43.743 horses, like ponies for the kids, but small horses actually rather than ponies, 00:52:43.773 --> 00:52:49.123 because it's so hard to keep a pony happy, you know, people boss them around so much 00:52:49.123 --> 00:52:51.053 that, and don't treat them with respect, 00:52:51.383 --> 00:52:51.573 Rupert Isaacson: so they're 00:52:52.693 --> 00:52:53.363 Linda Tellington Jones: resentful. 00:52:53.823 --> 00:53:00.093 Yeah, but I think it's a great idea and what would be really fun is to 00:53:00.093 --> 00:53:06.103 have you could have competitions of having people leading horses through, 00:53:06.373 --> 00:53:10.333 you know, the kind of stuff that we do like through what we call it. 00:53:10.953 --> 00:53:16.043 And, and it, it so empowers people to be able to just be in the 00:53:16.043 --> 00:53:18.183 presence of that horse and to. 00:53:19.023 --> 00:53:23.123 Be able to do something together with them and 00:53:23.723 --> 00:53:25.173 Rupert Isaacson: yeah, I think this is something I think this is something 00:53:25.183 --> 00:53:29.593 maybe we should start exploring Maybe you and I should have a chat with this guy. 00:53:29.623 --> 00:53:33.363 Maybe I should bring you in on the project Let's do that. 00:53:33.363 --> 00:53:34.783 I'm talking to him tomorrow actually. 00:53:35.513 --> 00:53:40.143 Okay, let's go back to the structural side of things with the horse another 00:53:42.833 --> 00:53:48.213 The two other areas that you generally see a lot of problems with the horses that get 00:53:48.223 --> 00:53:53.733 donated for therapy backs You Of course, the back is a big thing, because there's 00:53:53.733 --> 00:53:56.353 many parts of the back, and stifle. 00:53:56.453 --> 00:53:59.573 You definitely see lots of problems through there. 00:54:00.553 --> 00:54:06.113 Somebody gets a horse, lovely character, has problems there. 00:54:07.123 --> 00:54:09.703 Talk to us about your first approaches. 00:54:09.933 --> 00:54:10.893 What would you be looking at? 00:54:15.323 --> 00:54:18.623 Linda Tellington Jones: Well, the question is, I mean, what 00:54:18.623 --> 00:54:21.031 are you using for saddles? 00:54:21.031 --> 00:54:21.513 Rupert Isaacson: Hmm. 00:54:23.853 --> 00:54:26.963 Linda Tellington Jones: Because this is a thing that I find with so many horses and 00:54:28.263 --> 00:54:30.063 you saw the pictures of me on that one. 00:54:30.343 --> 00:54:32.043 It's called the German warm blood. 00:54:32.313 --> 00:54:37.383 But this, the mare has a head like an Arab, really sensitive horse. 00:54:37.383 --> 00:54:41.193 And she was brought to this clinic because she's an event horse. 00:54:41.603 --> 00:54:44.143 And the rider said she's slow. 00:54:44.423 --> 00:54:50.233 She's has, you know, no impulsion and she doesn't like me. 00:54:51.273 --> 00:54:54.493 It's just, so I asked her how she wrote her and she wrote her. 00:54:54.888 --> 00:54:59.488 You know, in the hand, like, really collected all the time, 00:55:00.178 --> 00:55:01.928 pushing her forward with the spurs. 00:55:02.508 --> 00:55:08.838 And it was really interesting, because what I did was, you know, just, 00:55:09.018 --> 00:55:13.358 first I took the bit out of her mouth and put the lindell on, so that she 00:55:13.358 --> 00:55:14.698 could ride her right away with that. 00:55:14.708 --> 00:55:20.598 And, and just let her move, and take the spurs off, and let the horse move. 00:55:20.658 --> 00:55:25.073 And it was It's such a difference we saw in the videos and, and then 00:55:25.073 --> 00:55:27.593 the next day what we did was it. 00:55:27.943 --> 00:55:28.713 Anyway, it doesn't matter. 00:55:28.713 --> 00:55:34.653 This doesn't answer your question because with back problems, this is 00:55:34.683 --> 00:55:36.423 where the Beamer is really great. 00:55:36.803 --> 00:55:39.683 And you know, I've never used the pain patches on the back. 00:55:39.903 --> 00:55:44.533 I mean, what we do is work on the body, but come on, you know, you have 00:55:44.533 --> 00:55:46.753 to have somebody who wants to do that. 00:55:48.783 --> 00:55:52.443 The thing that's so often done that I've seen, I've worked on horses. 00:55:52.523 --> 00:55:58.383 I mean, Olympic level horses that have had all kinds of back injections and 00:55:58.383 --> 00:56:05.213 stuff never did a bit of good until you, you know, did the, the, today 00:56:05.213 --> 00:56:08.273 I'd use a Beamer or use T Touch. 00:56:09.273 --> 00:56:09.493 Rupert Isaacson: Yeah. 00:56:09.493 --> 00:56:10.733 I would, I would say both are good. 00:56:10.753 --> 00:56:15.533 And, and those listeners who have not explored T Touch, I really would recommend 00:56:15.543 --> 00:56:20.563 you do because since knowing you Linda, we used it, we use it all the time. 00:56:23.123 --> 00:56:23.793 And it really helps. 00:56:23.993 --> 00:56:27.363 One of the things we do to help with backs and stifles and that sort of 00:56:27.363 --> 00:56:28.543 thing is we do a lot of long reining. 00:56:29.483 --> 00:56:32.873 And of course we do that as part of the, often the session. 00:56:33.603 --> 00:56:35.533 Maybe the client is long reining the horse. 00:56:36.203 --> 00:56:37.203 That's an interesting thing too. 00:56:37.213 --> 00:56:42.243 Maybe someone's being long reined on the horse and we find we can build a lot of 00:56:42.813 --> 00:56:48.443 strength and flexibility and also the in hand work And we can incorporate this 00:56:48.453 --> 00:56:52.563 into client sessions so that it's not like we're having a time conflict, you 00:56:52.563 --> 00:56:56.283 know, where oh gosh You know We've got to find this time to long rein the horse 00:56:56.283 --> 00:56:59.713 and work the horse in hand in between clients because that time doesn't exist 00:57:00.333 --> 00:57:05.428 We have to do it there in the body We have to work the horse therapeutically 00:57:05.788 --> 00:57:10.688 in as we're serving the client you when you're okay So when you you say 00:57:10.688 --> 00:57:16.198 t touch when you're using t touch on the back, let's say it's for something 00:57:16.198 --> 00:57:20.778 like thoracic kissing spine Standard thing that say a donated show jumper 00:57:20.778 --> 00:57:27.248 might have can you talk to us about the specific t touches that you would use in? 00:57:27.248 --> 00:57:28.538 that thoracic area 00:57:30.778 --> 00:57:33.168 And then we'll go down the back looking at other ones 00:57:33.168 --> 00:57:38.548 Linda Tellington Jones: Actually because I worked on a horse 00:57:38.548 --> 00:57:43.438 named Damiraz, a Canadian horse on the, on the jumping team. 00:57:43.948 --> 00:57:50.008 And he was in, they were in Ireland, and his rider came out to the stall 00:57:50.018 --> 00:57:54.548 in the morning, and this was before they kept guards on their horses, and 00:57:54.548 --> 00:57:56.278 the horse was completely crippled. 00:57:56.778 --> 00:57:58.328 I mean, it was unbelievable. 00:57:58.338 --> 00:58:02.428 They have no idea what they did to this horse, but he was, he was 00:58:02.428 --> 00:58:07.203 so sore in the back and he wound up diagnosed with kissing spine. 00:58:08.073 --> 00:58:12.063 And this is like overnight, I mean literally, not the kissing spine. 00:58:12.063 --> 00:58:16.373 So I still, when I think about that, I wonder what is going on. 00:58:16.373 --> 00:58:21.503 Anyway, I, this was a friend of my family's, and so I went and 00:58:21.503 --> 00:58:23.013 worked with the horse for a week. 00:58:23.743 --> 00:58:28.223 And after one week of work, and I'll tell you the stuff that I did with him, his vet 00:58:28.223 --> 00:58:31.643 came in and I I was riding at the time. 00:58:31.773 --> 00:58:34.603 And the horse, the vet did not recognize the horse. 00:58:35.513 --> 00:58:39.543 And because his movement was so different and he didn't, he was, 00:58:39.893 --> 00:58:41.473 his pain in the back was fine. 00:58:41.943 --> 00:58:45.963 And it, it's just, I was doing the belly lifts and the circles on the 00:58:45.973 --> 00:58:50.773 back and in the riding, allowing the horse to move, you know, to 00:58:50.773 --> 00:58:52.653 move in a, in a different way. 00:58:53.213 --> 00:58:58.233 And this thing of riding the horses, without, with, with the liberty rings 00:58:58.273 --> 00:58:59.973 as Ileana is doing so much with. 00:59:00.473 --> 00:59:03.813 It allows the horses to go down and stretch their backs when they 00:59:03.813 --> 00:59:06.413 want to, and that's the thing it can make so much difference. 00:59:07.063 --> 00:59:13.633 That's what, and this lick of the cow's tongue, and I believe now with 00:59:13.633 --> 00:59:17.683 this new, are you following all this new studies of fascia in horses? 00:59:18.633 --> 00:59:21.333 Rupert Isaacson: Yes, but there's a question I got from something you 00:59:21.343 --> 00:59:24.093 said earlier, so just, just go on and then I'm going to dial back in a 00:59:25.318 --> 00:59:27.598 Linda Tellington Jones: I mean, what I'm realizing what we're really 00:59:27.598 --> 00:59:32.608 affecting is the fascia and also the nuchal ligament, because the which 00:59:32.608 --> 00:59:33.068 Rupert Isaacson: ligament, 00:59:33.578 --> 00:59:34.948 Linda Tellington Jones: the nuchal ligament, 00:59:35.358 --> 00:59:37.758 Rupert Isaacson: the one over the, over the, where the, where the 00:59:37.758 --> 00:59:39.838 skull meets the spine, exactly, 00:59:40.308 --> 00:59:43.518 Linda Tellington Jones: Rupert, last month, I found, I think it 00:59:43.518 --> 00:59:48.058 was on Instagram, a veterinarian showing, I'm sure it was, I'm pretty 00:59:48.058 --> 00:59:49.658 sure she was, but I can't find it. 00:59:50.048 --> 00:59:54.308 It showed the skeleton of the horse and the ligament attached. 00:59:54.638 --> 00:59:58.578 And showed what's happening to the stretching of that ligament when the 00:59:58.578 --> 01:00:03.468 horses are overbent and over, you know, really over periods of time. 01:00:03.868 --> 01:00:08.148 Plus, what she wasn't talking about is what's happening when they're ridden 01:00:08.158 --> 01:00:10.988 in this extreme collection over time. 01:00:10.998 --> 01:00:15.108 What happens to the fascia and that it actually stiffens. 01:00:15.158 --> 01:00:17.148 And that's the other thing that's out there now. 01:00:17.458 --> 01:00:22.248 I mean, this is all like really new information, new ways of seeing things. 01:00:22.818 --> 01:00:27.008 And that's why, like, allowing the horse to stretch and move at times, 01:00:27.008 --> 01:00:31.498 not always, you know, not behind the vertical makes a huge, huge difference. 01:00:32.008 --> 01:00:32.618 Rupert Isaacson: Mm, mm, mm. 01:00:32.938 --> 01:00:34.478 And, and, well, yeah. 01:00:34.558 --> 01:00:37.628 So, for example, this is so true in competition riding. 01:00:37.748 --> 01:00:39.708 But it's also true, I think, in therapeutic ridings, people aren't 01:00:39.718 --> 01:00:41.258 trail riding their horses in between. 01:00:41.678 --> 01:00:43.568 So, of course, if you trail ride your horse on a loose 01:00:43.568 --> 01:00:45.158 rein, what's he going to do? 01:00:45.168 --> 01:00:47.198 He's going to stretch, he's going to look around, he's going to, 01:00:47.198 --> 01:00:49.903 you know, prick his ears up and look at something in the distance. 01:00:49.903 --> 01:00:51.783 He's going to sniff something on the ground. 01:00:52.233 --> 01:00:55.453 You're going to allow all that because you're just trail riding. 01:00:56.083 --> 01:00:59.763 Of course, if you never trail ride the horse or hand walk the horse out 01:00:59.883 --> 01:01:03.023 in a halter, say, when, when is the horse going to get a chance to do that? 01:01:03.033 --> 01:01:06.323 You say, well, maybe in the field, but as we know, a lot of horses are 01:01:06.323 --> 01:01:09.153 still living in boxes, you know? 01:01:09.203 --> 01:01:10.173 So, okay. 01:01:10.573 --> 01:01:12.683 You said something about the lick of the cow's tongue. 01:01:13.203 --> 01:01:13.583 Linda Tellington Jones: Right. 01:01:13.693 --> 01:01:15.713 Rupert Isaacson: Helping with this Thoracic area. 01:01:15.953 --> 01:01:16.803 Tell us what is that? 01:01:17.313 --> 01:01:22.073 Linda Tellington Jones: So you, you start just behind the elbow on the midline 01:01:22.083 --> 01:01:27.853 of the horse and take your flat hand and slide the hand up and then turn 01:01:27.863 --> 01:01:32.923 the hand so the fingers are pointed now upward over the top of the spine. 01:01:34.053 --> 01:01:36.063 So you start underneath, you know, the palm. 01:01:36.083 --> 01:01:36.423 Starting 01:01:36.453 --> 01:01:37.153 Rupert Isaacson: under the belly. 01:01:37.613 --> 01:01:40.013 Linda Tellington Jones: Under the belly, right on the midline under the belly. 01:01:40.023 --> 01:01:40.043 So 01:01:40.413 --> 01:01:42.338 Rupert Isaacson: you're stroking from front to back or back to front. 01:01:43.098 --> 01:01:45.268 Linda Tellington Jones: Yes, you're stroking from underneath. 01:01:45.278 --> 01:01:51.478 You come up, you know, just up to the ribs and then turn your hand and stroke up. 01:01:52.088 --> 01:01:52.398 So this 01:01:52.398 --> 01:01:53.778 Rupert Isaacson: would be like the long, along the line of 01:01:53.778 --> 01:01:55.408 the girth to the saddle area. 01:01:55.778 --> 01:01:56.278 Linda Tellington Jones: That's right. 01:01:56.328 --> 01:02:00.998 And then you go back like four inches and do it and you work all the way back. 01:02:01.008 --> 01:02:01.218 Like, 01:02:01.238 --> 01:02:01.838 Rupert Isaacson: okay. 01:02:02.068 --> 01:02:05.218 All the way down the belly, almost like you're painting the horse 01:02:05.218 --> 01:02:07.368 from the, with your palm from the, 01:02:07.808 --> 01:02:08.548 Linda Tellington Jones: from the under 01:02:08.578 --> 01:02:09.198 Rupert Isaacson: to the top. 01:02:09.468 --> 01:02:10.478 Linda Tellington Jones: Other side of the back. 01:02:10.478 --> 01:02:10.543 That's right. 01:02:11.193 --> 01:02:13.223 Rupert Isaacson: Okay, so you then go over the spine to the other 01:02:13.223 --> 01:02:14.253 side of the back with your hand. 01:02:14.803 --> 01:02:15.203 Linda Tellington Jones: Yeah. 01:02:15.443 --> 01:02:15.853 Okay. 01:02:16.243 --> 01:02:18.283 It's just connecting to the spine. 01:02:18.683 --> 01:02:19.253 Okay. 01:02:20.123 --> 01:02:24.283 And then you, just every hand width back to the flank. 01:02:24.603 --> 01:02:25.083 Rupert Isaacson: Okay. 01:02:25.903 --> 01:02:27.163 Tell me, tell us what this does. 01:02:27.713 --> 01:02:31.333 Linda Tellington Jones: What it does, it, it, if you've got a horse who's spooky 01:02:31.333 --> 01:02:36.653 or sensitive, you do it really lightly so that they, so they, you show them 01:02:36.663 --> 01:02:37.993 that you know that they're sensitive. 01:02:38.623 --> 01:02:44.693 And so instead of desensitizing them so that you put them through something and 01:02:44.733 --> 01:02:48.533 they just stand there and hold their breath, you get them to the point that 01:02:48.533 --> 01:02:50.323 they're comfortable with it and accept it. 01:02:50.383 --> 01:02:55.543 And then I've, I've seen it on horses who are stiff, for instance, or horses 01:02:55.543 --> 01:03:00.753 that are, Maybe worked hard or just now what I understand is happening 01:03:00.753 --> 01:03:02.293 is that the fascia is hardened. 01:03:02.653 --> 01:03:04.073 Because that can happen in these. 01:03:04.563 --> 01:03:09.673 When you, you're gonna be so excited when you, I'll, I'll find the poem 01:03:09.673 --> 01:03:13.673 via YouTube because I've looked at lots of them and there's one that 01:03:13.673 --> 01:03:18.253 is really shows the history of it and then what's happening in these 01:03:18.253 --> 01:03:20.223 cases where there's lack of movement. 01:03:20.893 --> 01:03:25.808 Because the fascia, they're like elastic spiderwebs through all the muscles and 01:03:26.778 --> 01:03:32.238 the body and so when the horse just stands so much and and they're not worked. 01:03:33.708 --> 01:03:34.628 It's really interesting. 01:03:34.898 --> 01:03:35.588 They harden. 01:03:36.948 --> 01:03:37.298 Rupert Isaacson: Yes. 01:03:37.368 --> 01:03:39.048 I think I think this is the same in people too. 01:03:39.048 --> 01:03:39.338 Yeah 01:03:39.388 --> 01:03:40.278 Linda Tellington Jones: Totally sedentary 01:03:40.278 --> 01:03:40.858 Rupert Isaacson: lifestyle. 01:03:40.888 --> 01:03:42.561 Yeah hardens up the 01:03:42.561 --> 01:03:44.748 Linda Tellington Jones: fascia Yeah, and that that's what's happening 01:03:44.748 --> 01:03:49.184 when when people sit at the computers all the time or down with 01:03:49.184 --> 01:03:49.957 Rupert Isaacson: their phone 01:03:49.957 --> 01:03:52.903 Linda Tellington Jones: They're stretching that fascia And 01:03:52.953 --> 01:03:55.523 also, of course, that ligament. 01:03:55.603 --> 01:03:57.033 So it's really interesting. 01:03:58.333 --> 01:03:59.133 Rupert Isaacson: Okay. 01:03:59.473 --> 01:04:01.853 Linda Tellington Jones: Thank God for beamer is all I can say for me. 01:04:02.628 --> 01:04:03.548 Rupert Isaacson: Yeah, no kidding. 01:04:04.238 --> 01:04:04.668 Okay. 01:04:04.668 --> 01:04:08.158 So Beamer's the, the, the lick of the cow's tongue, the, the, 01:04:08.188 --> 01:04:12.328 the, the circle and a quarter movements down the horse's spine. 01:04:12.598 --> 01:04:13.708 Let's go to the stifle. 01:04:13.968 --> 01:04:17.068 Because I think this is an area that a lot of people don't really look at. 01:04:17.178 --> 01:04:17.898 And you know how it is. 01:04:17.918 --> 01:04:21.638 Once you start looking at horses stifles, you can never like 01:04:21.678 --> 01:04:22.928 ever see a sound horse again. 01:04:23.308 --> 01:04:27.498 And you know, so to my mind, whenever I'm looking at horses, they're never sound. 01:04:27.508 --> 01:04:28.598 They've always got something. 01:04:29.173 --> 01:04:32.513 And my question is always, can I work with that something? 01:04:32.513 --> 01:04:34.523 Or how will I work with that something? 01:04:34.623 --> 01:04:35.683 Just like me. 01:04:35.683 --> 01:04:39.603 I mean, if you look at me walking, I'm not sound but I can go on a long 01:04:39.603 --> 01:04:42.223 distance walking trip, but you're going to have to work with me a little bit. 01:04:42.833 --> 01:04:46.193 So talk about, talk to us about stifles. 01:04:46.193 --> 01:04:48.503 Talk to us about the approach there. 01:04:50.043 --> 01:04:53.163 Linda Tellington Jones: So this is where I see the body differently 01:04:53.383 --> 01:04:55.433 and that's unique about T Touch. 01:04:55.833 --> 01:05:03.338 The cons, my, how I started to see this is that I'm totally aware as I'm 01:05:03.338 --> 01:05:09.108 touching that body that when a, when there's ideal function in the body, 01:05:09.178 --> 01:05:11.218 there's communication between the cells 01:05:11.728 --> 01:05:11.888 Rupert Isaacson: with 01:05:12.228 --> 01:05:17.728 Linda Tellington Jones: pain or discomfort or fear, stiffness, dysfunction, then the 01:05:17.728 --> 01:05:24.448 communication between the health cells is inhibited and the body's absolute ability 01:05:24.538 --> 01:05:31.598 to take care of itself doesn't happen because of the inhibition of pain or fear. 01:05:32.063 --> 01:05:36.133 or lack of, or, or fear of pain, even in the horse. 01:05:36.453 --> 01:05:40.893 So this is where our two touches really come in with the concept. 01:05:41.413 --> 01:05:46.743 And this is Rupert different since I last saw you, I finally got a 01:05:46.743 --> 01:05:51.073 different understanding of why we can release fear and pain in ourselves 01:05:51.113 --> 01:05:56.353 or in other people or in our animals with this one and a quarter circle. 01:05:57.033 --> 01:05:59.453 And should I tell you the story? 01:05:59.473 --> 01:06:01.213 This is, is this getting too far off? 01:06:01.423 --> 01:06:02.053 Rupert Isaacson: No, please. 01:06:02.643 --> 01:06:03.003 Linda Tellington Jones: Okay. 01:06:03.453 --> 01:06:10.233 So, I mean, all these years, we've been able to help people, just kids, just, 01:06:10.333 --> 01:06:15.433 they've got a bang, you know, they fall down on a, and hit a rock with their 01:06:15.433 --> 01:06:19.763 knee, and years ago, when I hear this story from one of our subscribers, 01:06:20.008 --> 01:06:25.178 long time teachers of the work when her son was like six or seven he fell 01:06:25.178 --> 01:06:29.218 down and she was going to kiss his knee right he said no mama t touch 01:06:29.218 --> 01:06:36.708 it raised on t touch and this is what many of our people who've been teachers 01:06:36.708 --> 01:06:38.338 and teaching kids in the classroom 01:06:38.578 --> 01:06:38.858 Rupert Isaacson: yeah 01:06:39.458 --> 01:06:43.348 Linda Tellington Jones: pain just put the fingers on and may and move the 01:06:43.348 --> 01:06:48.418 fingers in one and a quarter circles and you will reduce that pain or the fear in 01:06:48.418 --> 01:06:50.773 your body And we've seen this for years. 01:06:50.773 --> 01:06:52.333 I mean, this is just amazing. 01:06:52.353 --> 01:06:57.173 So, what, how have I changed my realization now? 01:06:58.013 --> 01:06:58.953 Oh my gosh! 01:06:59.893 --> 01:07:03.693 You know, all these years I kept asking, What is the reason we 01:07:03.693 --> 01:07:04.943 can reduce this fear and pain? 01:07:05.533 --> 01:07:08.433 And I'm going to show you one book that is just amazing. 01:07:09.043 --> 01:07:13.973 First of all, how I got started on this whole concept of cellular wisdom, 01:07:14.103 --> 01:07:19.113 of cellular intelligence was one book that I've got here sitting, it's at 01:07:19.243 --> 01:07:20.923 the far end of my table actually. 01:07:21.333 --> 01:07:24.613 It's called Man on His Nature, and it's Sir Charles Sherrington, 01:07:24.613 --> 01:07:25.793 and Sherrington won a Nobel. 01:07:25.793 --> 01:07:26.183 Man 01:07:26.193 --> 01:07:29.253 Rupert Isaacson: on His Nature, Sir Charles Sherrington. 01:07:29.573 --> 01:07:33.193 Linda Tellington Jones: Yeah, and it's the only non scientific book that he wrote. 01:07:34.733 --> 01:07:36.253 He's written many, many books. 01:07:36.253 --> 01:07:43.188 He won a Nobel Prize, and In this book the, and I can't find it, I got the 01:07:43.198 --> 01:07:47.858 definite impression, I know I was sitting in Morvenpach restaurant in Stuttgart, 01:07:47.858 --> 01:07:54.538 Germany in February of 1976 when I read whatever it was that inspired me to 01:07:54.538 --> 01:07:59.428 realize that he said, he said, look, if you cut yourself, think about it, 01:07:59.668 --> 01:08:05.148 the body, the cells know how to send healing, whatever it takes to heal that. 01:08:05.868 --> 01:08:09.748 And so I sat up and I thought, holy mackerel. 01:08:10.168 --> 01:08:15.628 Wait a minute, when I don't yet know how to do miracles of change in the 01:08:15.628 --> 01:08:19.748 physical structure of a human, like I had seen Moshe Feldenkrais do in our 01:08:20.128 --> 01:08:24.308 training at the Humanistic Psychology Institute the summer before, I 01:08:24.308 --> 01:08:26.268 thought, all I have to do is say cells. 01:08:26.693 --> 01:08:29.493 Just touch this body and remind these cells of their 01:08:29.503 --> 01:08:31.163 potential for ideal function. 01:08:32.083 --> 01:08:35.043 And that's how I started looking at the body. 01:08:35.083 --> 01:08:39.493 Instead of looking at it from the Feldenkrais concept of the nervous system, 01:08:40.363 --> 01:08:44.683 I started looking at it from the cellular intelligence through the whole body. 01:08:45.403 --> 01:08:49.703 And so, that's what's behind all the stuff that I do. 01:08:51.173 --> 01:08:56.553 But then, two, three years ago, Get this book. 01:08:56.643 --> 01:08:59.090 The Code of Authentic Living Cellular 01:08:59.090 --> 01:08:59.498 Rupert Isaacson: Wisdom. 01:08:59.498 --> 01:09:01.537 And the first chapter, the 01:09:01.537 --> 01:09:03.984 Linda Tellington Jones: first sentence in the first chapter 01:09:03.984 --> 01:09:07.392 begins with, Every cell is a genius. 01:09:07.842 --> 01:09:11.042 This is the same thing, you know, that Sherrington said all those 01:09:11.042 --> 01:09:18.192 years before, that had actually set up my whole life and the work I do 01:09:18.402 --> 01:09:20.122 with people and animals and myself. 01:09:20.897 --> 01:09:26.587 And so what enhances and what changed me, what made me realize this, wait a 01:09:26.587 --> 01:09:29.287 minute, I just, where did I put this? 01:09:29.287 --> 01:09:30.407 I had this yesterday. 01:09:31.217 --> 01:09:33.787 Anyway, it's on the back of this book. 01:09:33.947 --> 01:09:37.057 I'm going to, I'm going to tell you this because it changed my 01:09:37.057 --> 01:09:39.987 life, this, back of this book. 01:09:41.617 --> 01:09:46.487 So, and, and the reason it's important, this author for 20 01:09:46.487 --> 01:09:50.347 years sought, taught cell biology at Tufts University of Medicine. 01:09:50.347 --> 01:09:50.442 for listening. 01:09:51.282 --> 01:09:55.662 And she wrote that, Here is one legend of how wisdom came 01:09:55.662 --> 01:09:57.702 to be hidden from all humans. 01:09:58.052 --> 01:10:02.522 Upon up Upon rubbing up against the legend, Joan C. 01:10:02.522 --> 01:10:07.532 King asked herself, What if, in all my academic studies of cells, 01:10:07.932 --> 01:10:12.372 I've missed the depth, the deeper truth of what I'm really seeking? 01:10:12.372 --> 01:10:16.352 It was that question that led Joan beyond the academic 01:10:16.352 --> 01:10:18.072 search for the wisdom embedded. 01:10:18.502 --> 01:10:23.272 In our very selves to the discovery of cellular wisdom and the journey within. 01:10:24.052 --> 01:10:27.962 According to an old Hindu legend, there was once upon a time when 01:10:27.992 --> 01:10:29.542 all human beings were gods. 01:10:30.012 --> 01:10:35.572 But they so abused their divinity that Brahma, the chief god, decided 01:10:35.892 --> 01:10:39.772 to take it away from them and hide it where it could never be found. 01:10:41.117 --> 01:10:43.707 Where to hide their divinity was the question. 01:10:43.727 --> 01:10:47.127 So Brahma called a council of the gods to help him decide. 01:10:47.707 --> 01:10:51.087 Let's bury it deep in the earth, said the gods, that Brahma. 01:10:51.277 --> 01:10:56.547 And Brahma answered, No, they will, that will not do, because humans 01:10:56.547 --> 01:10:58.567 will dig into the earth and find it. 01:10:58.727 --> 01:11:01.017 I'm having a little trouble because the light isn't on, 01:11:01.017 --> 01:11:03.022 and the light Not so good here. 01:11:03.392 --> 01:11:07.712 So anyway, then another one said, okay, we'll take, I know what we'll do, we'll 01:11:07.772 --> 01:11:09.472 drop it in the deepest part of the ocean. 01:11:09.762 --> 01:11:10.822 No, they'll find it. 01:11:11.162 --> 01:11:14.762 Another said, we'll go to the deepest cave on the planet and 01:11:15.552 --> 01:11:16.762 dig deeper and leave it there. 01:11:16.882 --> 01:11:18.622 No, no, humans are very intelligent. 01:11:18.652 --> 01:11:19.352 They will find it. 01:11:19.942 --> 01:11:24.982 So he thought long and hard and said, finally said, you know, I know where 01:11:24.982 --> 01:11:26.702 we'll hide it and they'll never find it. 01:11:27.532 --> 01:11:28.772 We'll hide it within. 01:11:29.712 --> 01:11:34.502 And so the legend goes, People have been running up and down the mountains, digging 01:11:34.502 --> 01:11:39.282 in the dirt, going in the deep part of the ocean, always looking for what's inside. 01:11:40.582 --> 01:11:45.642 And that just so connected with me, Rupert, because of what I learned, 01:11:45.932 --> 01:11:50.372 you know, all those years ago in 1976 from Sir Charles Sherrington, 01:11:50.592 --> 01:11:52.422 this Nobel Prize recipient. 01:11:53.262 --> 01:12:01.492 And so what I see now, When this, when we put our fingers on the body and realize 01:12:01.542 --> 01:12:07.572 that every cell in this hand, every cell in my body knows its function in the body 01:12:07.992 --> 01:12:10.602 and communicates according to Bruce, Dr. 01:12:10.602 --> 01:12:11.252 Bruce Lipton. 01:12:11.552 --> 01:12:15.812 So what, what he writes in there is one chapter on the development of cells, 01:12:15.902 --> 01:12:19.722 the cells, and how cells communicate, and you can prove it in a Petri dish, 01:12:19.742 --> 01:12:24.962 like they can live alone for about two weeks, a single cell, but after 01:12:24.962 --> 01:12:29.192 that they die, because they need this communication, and the premise of 01:12:29.212 --> 01:12:34.722 the book is that if we humans would recognize our necessity for connection 01:12:34.722 --> 01:12:37.312 and communication, we could be in peace. 01:12:37.862 --> 01:12:44.387 It's so interesting, and so what And I, when I read this, this, and this book, The 01:12:44.417 --> 01:12:53.047 Code of Authentic Living Cellular Wisdom, I started thinking, come on, my Christian 01:12:53.047 --> 01:12:57.107 friends will not care what a Hindu says. 01:12:57.607 --> 01:12:59.437 It must be somewhere in the Bible. 01:12:59.477 --> 01:13:03.647 And I have a friend whose husband is a Bible studier. 01:13:04.247 --> 01:13:09.237 And so I called him and he said, it is, it's in the, the King 01:13:09.237 --> 01:13:10.787 James version of the Bible. 01:13:10.787 --> 01:13:12.157 And it's something to the effect that. 01:13:13.042 --> 01:13:16.682 The, the God is within and all around us. 01:13:17.342 --> 01:13:21.442 And it's the same, actually, I've, I've, I have other friends, Jewish 01:13:21.442 --> 01:13:26.192 friends who say the same kind of self wisdom is in our religion also. 01:13:27.162 --> 01:13:28.272 It's in the teachings. 01:13:28.342 --> 01:13:29.222 So it's everywhere. 01:13:29.222 --> 01:13:35.442 And so what, Rupert, when I put my fingers on my own skin now, and I gently move the 01:13:35.442 --> 01:13:37.522 skin because you, it's not going over it. 01:13:37.742 --> 01:13:40.232 You move the skin in this basic. 01:13:41.972 --> 01:13:47.842 spiral circle in a certain tempo, then it's like taking a key and 01:13:47.842 --> 01:13:53.862 turning a lock that opens to enter a door into this phenomenal divine 01:13:53.892 --> 01:13:55.812 wisdom in every cell in our body. 01:13:56.692 --> 01:14:02.042 And you know, it's so interesting because in, in the book called Uncommon 01:14:02.042 --> 01:14:09.852 Prayer by Ruth Miller, there's a one page that that says that in between 01:14:09.852 --> 01:14:11.832 the stuff that makes up the universe. 01:14:12.452 --> 01:14:14.952 This is a whole book on quantum science, actually. 01:14:15.332 --> 01:14:19.212 In between the stuff that makes up the universe is not just empty space. 01:14:19.562 --> 01:14:24.532 Holding it all together is a wonderful, rich, quantum field. 01:14:25.782 --> 01:14:31.872 Many scientists call this consciousness, or intelligence, and the rest of the 01:14:31.872 --> 01:14:38.062 world calls this God, or, from my point of view, source, divine spirit, all it 01:14:38.062 --> 01:14:40.687 is, whatever universal knowing, all it is. 01:14:42.027 --> 01:14:47.067 And I just realized this is why when I recognize this in my horse, I'm working 01:14:47.067 --> 01:14:53.237 on this, this horse that has a back issue and I'm not seeing the issue. 01:14:53.287 --> 01:14:59.687 This is the important part about understanding if I focus on the, on, on 01:14:59.697 --> 01:15:03.007 the problem, I'm not going to get this. 01:15:03.772 --> 01:15:07.082 Recognition of this intelligence that I'm putting my hands on, 01:15:07.082 --> 01:15:09.012 this amazing wonder that we are. 01:15:09.402 --> 01:15:11.672 And that's all I have to do is recognize that. 01:15:12.012 --> 01:15:16.412 And working with people who have disabilities, I know that you do this. 01:15:16.502 --> 01:15:21.402 I mean, kids, or people on the autism spectrum, when I look at them, I see that 01:15:21.422 --> 01:15:24.082 divine wisdom in every cell in the body. 01:15:24.102 --> 01:15:27.652 And when I am with them, just like when you all, thinking in this 01:15:27.652 --> 01:15:31.492 way, are with these people, they feel themselves in a different way. 01:15:31.792 --> 01:15:35.362 It's a gift, or when we look at that horse that has a problem, that's 01:15:35.362 --> 01:15:39.922 there to help us, and we see their beauty, no matter what they look 01:15:39.922 --> 01:15:42.292 like, something different happens. 01:15:42.862 --> 01:15:46.582 That's what excites me about what you're doing, because you know 01:15:46.582 --> 01:15:48.252 what happens beyond what we see. 01:15:50.952 --> 01:15:51.492 Rupert Isaacson: I do. 01:15:51.802 --> 01:15:59.522 What's interesting, I think, it's not, here's, this is, just as you say, okay, 01:15:59.522 --> 01:16:01.202 intelligence that's within each cell. 01:16:04.402 --> 01:16:04.672 That's. 01:16:05.387 --> 01:16:09.407 Got to be because they function so well, right? 01:16:09.717 --> 01:16:15.547 And When you look at the therapeutic world 01:16:18.517 --> 01:16:21.277 With the best of intentions 01:16:23.517 --> 01:16:27.787 what we talk about we use the words like disorder disease 01:16:30.767 --> 01:16:32.737 Even though they may not be disorders at all 01:16:35.077 --> 01:16:39.847 That's the vocabulary that we get given and then we start using it and 01:16:39.847 --> 01:16:42.187 then there's always a point I think what all of us as practitioners go. 01:16:42.187 --> 01:16:46.897 Hold on isn't really a disorder This is just a personality type. 01:16:46.897 --> 01:16:49.977 This is a way of being this is a you know, okay It comes with some 01:16:49.977 --> 01:16:55.307 challenges, but show me something that doesn't let's let's let's work towards 01:16:57.447 --> 01:17:03.702 What you would call what you just called, you know optimal what to me is 01:17:03.732 --> 01:17:07.312 always the issue is not the condition. 01:17:07.502 --> 01:17:10.632 So let's say the person has autism. 01:17:10.942 --> 01:17:18.312 Well, when I was first wondering what to do with my son, I looked for 01:17:18.312 --> 01:17:21.132 an autistic mentor and found one. 01:17:21.662 --> 01:17:21.982 Dr. 01:17:21.982 --> 01:17:26.682 Temple Grandin, who was very autistic and much more economically successful 01:17:26.802 --> 01:17:30.942 than many other people I knew and I thought, Oh, this is great because 01:17:30.942 --> 01:17:33.562 you can be like that and do fine. 01:17:34.202 --> 01:17:41.112 So therefore the problem cannot be autism and then I began to work with, 01:17:41.122 --> 01:17:46.412 you know, other conditions and again, frequently I would meet people who 01:17:46.412 --> 01:17:50.452 had these conditions who were actually leading great lives so, so that it would 01:17:50.472 --> 01:17:54.852 not despite the condition often, perhaps because of it in some certain ways. 01:17:55.142 --> 01:17:58.462 So more and more, and then I started looking at physical disabilities. 01:17:59.122 --> 01:17:59.962 There's that word again. 01:18:00.662 --> 01:18:04.412 And I realized that no, no, no, no. 01:18:04.442 --> 01:18:05.512 The, the problem. 01:18:07.027 --> 01:18:16.447 is the suffering is associated with some of the challenges these things can have. 01:18:16.647 --> 01:18:19.757 But the problem is literally that suffering. 01:18:20.227 --> 01:18:22.887 So what is the opposite of suffering? 01:18:23.617 --> 01:18:24.067 Joy. 01:18:25.957 --> 01:18:29.697 Where do you see joy on the equine training scale? 01:18:29.727 --> 01:18:30.557 You don't see it. 01:18:31.117 --> 01:18:36.567 Where do you see joy on the, in the therapeutic literature 01:18:37.207 --> 01:18:39.017 for therapeutic riding? 01:18:39.187 --> 01:18:39.947 You don't see it. 01:18:40.437 --> 01:18:44.802 Where do you see joy in You know, how to tackle autism, or how to 01:18:44.812 --> 01:18:46.742 tackle PTSD, you don't see it. 01:18:47.002 --> 01:18:51.792 But the opposite of suffering has to be joy. 01:18:52.562 --> 01:18:57.552 So it seems to me that what you're talking about here is, obviously, we 01:18:57.552 --> 01:19:01.622 associate joy as an emotional state, but how can you have that emotional state if 01:19:01.622 --> 01:19:03.652 you don't have it as a physical state? 01:19:04.572 --> 01:19:04.952 Linda Tellington Jones: Simple. 01:19:06.032 --> 01:19:06.682 Rupert Isaacson: So go ahead. 01:19:07.332 --> 01:19:07.882 Linda Tellington Jones: Gratitude. 01:19:08.632 --> 01:19:09.792 Rupert Isaacson: Okay, gratitude. 01:19:10.292 --> 01:19:15.382 Talk to us about the connection, please, between gratitude, joy, and physical, 01:19:15.422 --> 01:19:17.827 optimal, cellular, and mental health. 01:19:18.947 --> 01:19:19.337 Health, 01:19:20.137 --> 01:19:24.187 Linda Tellington Jones: you know in horses what I look for now is how 01:19:24.187 --> 01:19:26.187 can I get the sparkle in their eyes? 01:19:26.387 --> 01:19:29.487 Yeah, get them so that they're interested. 01:19:29.487 --> 01:19:30.327 They're curious. 01:19:30.327 --> 01:19:32.667 They're Appreciative of what we're doing. 01:19:32.667 --> 01:19:35.047 They're enjoying whatever i'm doing together 01:19:35.277 --> 01:19:37.627 Rupert Isaacson: even a bit of devilry, but devilry that's working with you 01:19:37.787 --> 01:19:39.417 not against you Yeah, yeah, sure 01:19:40.077 --> 01:19:41.247 Linda Tellington Jones: I have to tell you this. 01:19:41.287 --> 01:19:45.327 I saw the most amazing and they promised me they'd send me this photo because 01:19:45.327 --> 01:19:47.987 somebody caught it on You on film. 01:19:47.997 --> 01:19:49.327 We wouldn't have known it otherwise. 01:19:49.667 --> 01:19:53.637 This horse in Italy last week, I sent you a picture of that 01:19:53.637 --> 01:19:54.587 big gray it was sitting on. 01:19:54.587 --> 01:19:55.027 Yes. 01:19:55.267 --> 01:19:58.157 Unfortunately, I don't have any pictures of me riding him. 01:19:58.457 --> 01:20:03.937 But he came, this is a beautiful rehab center with, with vets 01:20:03.937 --> 01:20:05.347 who are both our teachers. 01:20:05.347 --> 01:20:08.367 I mean, T Touch, Tellington Method teachers. 01:20:08.877 --> 01:20:13.567 And so, They took this horse in rehab because he was having 01:20:13.567 --> 01:20:15.577 a constant tendon problem. 01:20:16.037 --> 01:20:20.267 And his owner really loves this horse and knew that he would never recover to 01:20:20.277 --> 01:20:23.217 be a Grand Prix, and that's all she's interested in, is Grand Prix jumpers. 01:20:23.647 --> 01:20:30.747 So she, the horse was given to Massimo Duret and Sylvia Materasson, his 01:20:30.747 --> 01:20:33.037 wife, and their daughter, who's 16. 01:20:33.467 --> 01:20:39.082 So when I got there, and the problem with the horse, He just, he's a big horse, 01:20:39.112 --> 01:20:44.402 he grew fast, he's heavy muscled, and he would he didn't want to go forward, 01:20:45.062 --> 01:20:49.572 and he had a tendency to what people call bucking, but kicking up, you know, 01:20:49.592 --> 01:20:54.762 going into the canter when you stick a spur in him, you know how horses do that. 01:20:55.922 --> 01:21:00.592 So it really scared his rider, because she's used to ponies, she's just graduated 01:21:00.592 --> 01:21:02.812 to horses maybe a year and a half ago. 01:21:03.687 --> 01:21:08.177 So, so I worked with him and like he had no feeling in his body when you would 01:21:08.197 --> 01:21:12.807 check to see, like his sensitivity, it's like he didn't feel himself. 01:21:13.137 --> 01:21:14.277 It was really interesting. 01:21:14.977 --> 01:21:20.497 So, we then rode him in the Lindell, got the bit out of his mouth, 01:21:20.917 --> 01:21:22.307 and did some work on his body. 01:21:22.307 --> 01:21:27.567 This is where we did tarantulas, which is this movement, it can't, it, it's, you 01:21:27.567 --> 01:21:33.192 just take your, Like, I'm holding my arm up and I'm doing a movement, forefinger, 01:21:33.192 --> 01:21:36.422 middle finger, forefinger, middle finger. 01:21:36.422 --> 01:21:36.702 Like a 01:21:36.702 --> 01:21:37.892 Rupert Isaacson: spider walking up your body. 01:21:38.342 --> 01:21:39.852 Linda Tellington Jones: Yes, a two legged spider. 01:21:40.172 --> 01:21:41.412 Rupert Isaacson: A two legged spider, okay. 01:21:42.262 --> 01:21:44.482 Linda Tellington Jones: We actually call this tarantulas pulling the 01:21:44.482 --> 01:21:45.872 pile, because I love tarantulas. 01:21:46.862 --> 01:21:48.232 Two legged tarantulas. 01:21:48.632 --> 01:21:52.372 And the little feet go along about, oh, an inch and a half apart. 01:21:52.887 --> 01:21:58.907 and make an indentation so that you can feel little feet and that activates the 01:21:58.907 --> 01:22:06.037 neural impulses and then we calm them with a plow, the thumb dragging like along. 01:22:06.087 --> 01:22:09.257 Rupert Isaacson: So the two fingers are walking, that's, I'm just describing what, 01:22:09.697 --> 01:22:11.267 what I'm seeing here to the, the viewers. 01:22:11.727 --> 01:22:15.997 She's, Linda's walking her middle finger, her index finger along her arm, but 01:22:15.997 --> 01:22:23.817 she's dragging the heel of her I heard she's dragging her thumb along behind, 01:22:24.877 --> 01:22:25.587 Linda Tellington Jones: like tarantulas 01:22:25.587 --> 01:22:26.157 Rupert Isaacson: pulling a plow. 01:22:26.197 --> 01:22:26.887 Yeah, okay, got it. 01:22:26.947 --> 01:22:27.187 Yeah. 01:22:27.197 --> 01:22:28.347 It does feel nice. 01:22:28.347 --> 01:22:28.607 Yeah. 01:22:28.787 --> 01:22:29.057 Yeah. 01:22:29.527 --> 01:22:31.167 Linda Tellington Jones: And the thing is, it comes from the 01:22:31.167 --> 01:22:34.387 concept of tuaka, or skin rolling. 01:22:34.887 --> 01:22:35.507 Rupert Isaacson: Okay. 01:22:36.097 --> 01:22:37.497 Linda Tellington Jones: And that was something that the 01:22:37.497 --> 01:22:39.947 Mongols did over the knees. 01:22:39.967 --> 01:22:43.977 They rolled the skin of their warriors over, it said, this is a legend, I 01:22:43.977 --> 01:22:48.487 don't know if it's true, but that's what one of the centers I went to says. 01:22:49.342 --> 01:22:55.922 In order to release the fear of death so it's an organization That does where 01:22:55.922 --> 01:22:56.872 Rupert Isaacson: did you hear that story? 01:22:56.872 --> 01:22:58.532 Sorry the mongol 01:22:58.962 --> 01:23:00.692 Linda Tellington Jones: in in london to release 01:23:00.692 --> 01:23:02.652 Rupert Isaacson: the fear of death That's so interesting 01:23:03.562 --> 01:23:04.422 Linda Tellington Jones: called chuaka 01:23:04.952 --> 01:23:05.542 Rupert Isaacson: Chuaka. 01:23:05.542 --> 01:23:05.862 Okay. 01:23:05.862 --> 01:23:06.752 I'm gonna i'm looking up. 01:23:06.772 --> 01:23:07.522 Please keep going 01:23:07.972 --> 01:23:13.062 Linda Tellington Jones: If if I remember correctly, this is like 40 years ago but 01:23:13.222 --> 01:23:19.557 so what happened when I when I I maybe I read that somewhere first, so I got 01:23:19.557 --> 01:23:24.787 the name of this organization, I was in Germany at the time when I read it, and 01:23:25.157 --> 01:23:27.367 I flew to London and I had a session. 01:23:27.977 --> 01:23:32.547 Rupert, I am ticked off till this day that I paid them for 01:23:32.547 --> 01:23:33.687 the pain they put me through. 01:23:34.837 --> 01:23:40.727 I broke it off in the middle because they wanted to lift the skin away 01:23:40.727 --> 01:23:44.717 from the fascia on your chest because they said that will release your, 01:23:44.987 --> 01:23:47.207 any unwanted emotions you have. 01:23:47.207 --> 01:23:47.627 Yeah. 01:23:48.927 --> 01:23:52.397 It, it, it released my kill emotion. 01:23:54.257 --> 01:23:55.667 I did want to have that. 01:23:56.107 --> 01:23:57.107 It was terrible. 01:23:57.147 --> 01:23:57.997 It was so painful. 01:23:58.027 --> 01:23:58.487 Anyway. 01:23:58.687 --> 01:24:03.797 So, but I, you know, I was really influenced by this concept of the Mongols. 01:24:03.797 --> 01:24:03.812 Yeah. 01:24:04.162 --> 01:24:05.942 They obviously knew what they were doing. 01:24:06.312 --> 01:24:10.712 So I started experimenting with it on myself, and instead of trying to 01:24:10.862 --> 01:24:17.772 tear the skin away from the fascia, I just rolled wherever it was easy 01:24:17.772 --> 01:24:21.672 to pick up the skin, or just made a little, like a little furrow. 01:24:22.102 --> 01:24:26.662 And I realize today, looking at these things I'm now studying 01:24:26.692 --> 01:24:32.412 about fascia, how interesting that is, because that, that may, that 01:24:32.432 --> 01:24:34.432 must have an effect on the fascia. 01:24:35.732 --> 01:24:41.462 And if you do it in a way that is kind and not painful, I believe 01:24:41.802 --> 01:24:43.332 there's something different happens. 01:24:43.732 --> 01:24:47.062 Because I think when we create pain, it doesn't make sense 01:24:47.062 --> 01:24:49.982 to me to traumatize ourselves. 01:24:51.582 --> 01:24:52.572 Rupert Isaacson: No, I agree. 01:24:52.882 --> 01:24:53.512 I agree. 01:24:53.662 --> 01:24:54.092 You know, 01:24:57.442 --> 01:25:05.702 I think we need you as a standard textbook consultant within the field, 01:25:05.742 --> 01:25:07.902 you know, as the, as the field of. 01:25:09.507 --> 01:25:10.467 Equine assisted stuff. 01:25:10.837 --> 01:25:15.997 It's starting to come so much into the mainstream now that people are looking to 01:25:15.997 --> 01:25:18.847 regulate it and in some ways, that's good. 01:25:18.947 --> 01:25:20.737 And in some ways, that's not good as always. 01:25:20.737 --> 01:25:20.977 Right? 01:25:21.777 --> 01:25:23.097 And but it's happening. 01:25:23.287 --> 01:25:25.287 So there it is. 01:25:25.597 --> 01:25:29.397 And you could argue that, you know, that was what Germany did very 01:25:29.817 --> 01:25:34.747 early on with the Curatorium for Therapeutic Riding that operates there. 01:25:34.987 --> 01:25:37.147 Sort of as a wing of the government, but 01:25:37.837 --> 01:25:40.017 Linda Tellington Jones: and Rupert, I just want to interrupt you a moment. 01:25:40.057 --> 01:25:40.507 Yeah. 01:25:41.377 --> 01:25:45.687 You know, I started working with the therapeutic writing in Switzerland. 01:25:45.687 --> 01:25:47.867 It was the biggest one in Europe at the time. 01:25:48.677 --> 01:25:53.277 It had to be 1976 or 7. 01:25:53.277 --> 01:25:54.387 Mm 01:25:55.967 --> 01:25:56.307 Rupert Isaacson: hmm. 01:25:57.047 --> 01:26:00.567 Linda Tellington Jones: And the thing that got me, they weren't 01:26:00.687 --> 01:26:06.667 paying attention to the emotional health of the horse or physical. 01:26:08.207 --> 01:26:10.747 The horses were really, well, you know what you're doing? 01:26:10.807 --> 01:26:15.007 Look at that is, do this, add to what you're doing, Rupert, make a 01:26:15.057 --> 01:26:21.197 circle and then hold the skin so it doesn't push up and stretch it. 01:26:21.657 --> 01:26:22.037 Rupert Isaacson: Okay. 01:26:22.387 --> 01:26:26.667 Linda just saw that on the zoom that I was stretching the skin of my forehead. 01:26:27.437 --> 01:26:27.737 Linda Tellington Jones: Yeah. 01:26:27.777 --> 01:26:27.887 The 01:26:28.257 --> 01:26:29.117 Rupert Isaacson: self soothing thing. 01:26:29.117 --> 01:26:29.457 Okay. 01:26:29.977 --> 01:26:32.347 Linda Tellington Jones: And you'll stretch it a little more if one hand 01:26:32.347 --> 01:26:33.517 hold, like, circle with your right. 01:26:33.527 --> 01:26:33.957 Holds the 01:26:33.957 --> 01:26:34.467 Rupert Isaacson: eyebrow. 01:26:34.967 --> 01:26:37.507 Linda Tellington Jones: Yeah, and then hold and then slide up. 01:26:37.997 --> 01:26:42.327 And it's really, I mean, if you do it on one side of the face and then look 01:26:42.327 --> 01:26:43.507 in the mirror, you won't believe it. 01:26:44.327 --> 01:26:44.577 Rupert Isaacson: Okay. 01:26:45.407 --> 01:26:47.567 Linda Tellington Jones: And I think we're affecting the fascia 01:26:47.697 --> 01:26:51.387 in a way that is really wonderful. 01:26:51.497 --> 01:26:52.017 Yes. 01:26:52.257 --> 01:26:54.087 Rupert Isaacson: Okay, so I'm doing this now and it does feel good. 01:26:54.087 --> 01:27:00.417 I'm holding my finger sort of along the eyebrow and then I'm running the 01:27:00.497 --> 01:27:01.787 other fingers of the other hand up. 01:27:02.517 --> 01:27:05.267 giving my skin a stretch, but let's go back to this place in 01:27:05.597 --> 01:27:07.127 Switzerland while I do this. 01:27:07.847 --> 01:27:10.147 Linda Tellington Jones: So I was teaching them T touch for their 01:27:10.147 --> 01:27:14.457 horses to, you know, for back, for just keep their back supple 01:27:14.457 --> 01:27:15.737 Rupert Isaacson: and 01:27:15.737 --> 01:27:16.467 Linda Tellington Jones: less pain. 01:27:17.027 --> 01:27:19.347 Not that everybody, not every horse has pain, but. 01:27:19.967 --> 01:27:23.367 You know, that is, you know, how many people, how many people 01:27:23.367 --> 01:27:24.417 are without pain in the back? 01:27:24.417 --> 01:27:24.737 Indeed. 01:27:24.967 --> 01:27:25.377 Rupert Isaacson: Indeed. 01:27:25.877 --> 01:27:27.217 Linda Tellington Jones: I mean, that's the truth of it. 01:27:27.847 --> 01:27:29.327 So we can do something about it. 01:27:29.337 --> 01:27:31.077 So anyway, I worked with them a lot. 01:27:31.757 --> 01:27:39.807 And that's when I remember really being so aware, regulated or not, man, 01:27:40.147 --> 01:27:46.797 Rupert, there were a lot of horses in a state of what I will call discomfort. 01:27:47.147 --> 01:27:47.467 Rupert Isaacson: Yeah. 01:27:48.502 --> 01:27:50.312 Linda Tellington Jones: And not recognized. 01:27:50.362 --> 01:27:54.092 And when I, I can remember, I wish I remember her name. 01:27:54.202 --> 01:27:57.402 I remember with an Arab mare that was just lovely. 01:27:57.702 --> 01:27:59.152 She was so unhappy. 01:27:59.722 --> 01:28:01.532 She was just used. 01:28:01.872 --> 01:28:06.592 And all she had to do was start thanking her for what they're doing. 01:28:06.872 --> 01:28:08.032 And the mare changed. 01:28:08.992 --> 01:28:13.172 We, this is where we have to give gratitude and count our blessings. 01:28:13.802 --> 01:28:15.082 And just thank the horse. 01:28:15.162 --> 01:28:16.562 All you have to do is thank the horse. 01:28:17.747 --> 01:28:19.377 Rupert Isaacson: You know what's interesting with this 01:28:19.387 --> 01:28:21.567 is we talked about suffering. 01:28:21.567 --> 01:28:23.577 So we want to alleviate suffering. 01:28:24.257 --> 01:28:29.357 Okay, that's our job Suffering the opposite of suffering is what we must 01:28:29.357 --> 01:28:33.877 be there for going towards that must be there for joy Which is not in any of the 01:28:34.167 --> 01:28:41.302 literature that way I've been given to use and then What is what is the secret 01:28:41.302 --> 01:28:48.552 of joy, of course, but gratitude law of attraction, you know If you are grateful 01:28:48.552 --> 01:28:51.852 for things and you turn your attention to those things So more of those things 01:28:52.322 --> 01:28:54.242 tend to come into your life, obviously 01:28:56.372 --> 01:29:00.292 and I think that People do feel that they thank their horses. 01:29:00.322 --> 01:29:04.742 I mean, people, good boy, you know, pat the horse and the, you 01:29:04.742 --> 01:29:06.402 know, you hear people say, Oh, you shouldn't pat your horse. 01:29:06.402 --> 01:29:09.652 But I don't know about that because I think anything that's that's, Oh, 01:29:09.912 --> 01:29:12.652 you hear people, you hear people say opinions about everything. 01:29:12.652 --> 01:29:12.892 Right. 01:29:13.182 --> 01:29:17.352 And you know, who God knows why, but there'll probably 01:29:17.362 --> 01:29:18.322 be someone listening to this. 01:29:18.322 --> 01:29:18.762 Oh yes. 01:29:18.762 --> 01:29:20.092 I'll tell you why it's so bad. 01:29:20.592 --> 01:29:25.042 But if it's a, if it's an emotional expression of gratitude, if somebody 01:29:25.062 --> 01:29:30.122 pats me on the back, I might perhaps prefer to have a massage or a tea 01:29:30.122 --> 01:29:35.312 touch But I absolutely accept the pat on the back as a as it makes me feel 01:29:35.312 --> 01:29:38.572 joyful because they're communicating their joy and their gratitude So 01:29:38.632 --> 01:29:40.422 we're communicating an emotion. 01:29:40.922 --> 01:29:45.082 That's positive Okay So I think people do feel that they do this and they scratch 01:29:45.082 --> 01:29:49.092 on their horses and love on their horses and give their horses Treats and you know 01:29:49.512 --> 01:29:51.962 pull on their ears if the horse likes that pull on the tail of the horse I 01:29:52.192 --> 01:29:54.312 think a lot of people really do do this. 01:29:54.702 --> 01:30:00.317 However, I think You In institutional settings, there 01:30:00.317 --> 01:30:02.357 often isn't the time for this. 01:30:03.047 --> 01:30:09.277 And when people are coming, clients are coming, and there's this perception, well, 01:30:09.287 --> 01:30:14.107 you're coming for this hour or whatever of sport or therapy or instruction. 01:30:14.427 --> 01:30:18.767 So this hour has got to be filled with the service. 01:30:20.257 --> 01:30:23.517 And it's not perceived. 01:30:24.437 --> 01:30:27.777 As a service, as part of the service to teach this gratitude. 01:30:27.807 --> 01:30:31.297 But it's so interesting that you say this because what I frequently do, if I 01:30:31.297 --> 01:30:37.327 can tell someone's in a bit of a not so great mood when they come in just for a 01:30:37.327 --> 01:30:42.077 regular riding lesson with me is I have them do a ride of a ride of appreciation. 01:30:42.537 --> 01:30:46.502 So for the first time, you know, I say, Hey, look, I can tell. 01:30:47.512 --> 01:30:52.952 You're a bit stressed, you know, let's for four minutes, just ride around the 01:30:52.952 --> 01:30:57.732 track of the arena, noticing anything that you're grateful for and it doesn't even 01:30:57.732 --> 01:30:59.432 have to be to do with your horse, right? 01:30:59.442 --> 01:31:03.962 It could just be the way the lights coming in through the window or the landscape 01:31:04.012 --> 01:31:07.612 that you can see beyond the window or, or it could be the horse or it could be 01:31:07.612 --> 01:31:11.282 something about the way the light hits the main or it could be the horse itself. 01:31:11.282 --> 01:31:15.252 But let's think, and I'll usually say, let's think of five things. 01:31:16.252 --> 01:31:20.782 That we're grateful for in this moment that may be to do with what the horse 01:31:20.782 --> 01:31:23.642 or what's happening here Or could be something else and I usually will 01:31:23.642 --> 01:31:26.282 leave I say i'll start, you know I'm grateful and usually what I'll say is 01:31:26.282 --> 01:31:31.322 i'm grateful for the fact that you are here Riding with me because thank you. 01:31:31.342 --> 01:31:34.642 Thank you for trusting me and i'm grateful for the fact that I live 01:31:34.642 --> 01:31:35.822 with horses This is wonderful. 01:31:35.822 --> 01:31:38.962 It's an amazing thing It was always my dream as a kid to have this equestrian 01:31:38.962 --> 01:31:43.902 life and now here I live it and And of course I remind myself to do this. 01:31:44.962 --> 01:31:46.212 But do I do it every time? 01:31:48.802 --> 01:31:54.272 And do I, I think I do more and more now, at least in my, in my head. 01:31:54.542 --> 01:31:56.962 And do I communicate this to my horses all the time? 01:31:57.752 --> 01:32:04.152 I think I try to now, but I think you drawing our attention to this, 01:32:04.802 --> 01:32:09.662 where it's really helpful is in an institutional setting where you are 01:32:09.752 --> 01:32:14.242 actually really trying to serve this person or this horse really well. 01:32:15.302 --> 01:32:18.322 I think it's a forgotten thing or an overlooked thing. 01:32:19.567 --> 01:32:25.527 To say well part of that service is to engender emotional well being and 01:32:25.527 --> 01:32:30.677 here is a tool So why don't we set aside a certain amount of time of this 01:32:30.677 --> 01:32:33.487 session to engender this well being? 01:32:33.697 --> 01:32:34.317 Here's a tool. 01:32:34.317 --> 01:32:34.987 It's called gratitude. 01:32:35.347 --> 01:32:39.347 You know, I think that's a very powerful statement that you made 01:32:39.987 --> 01:32:43.537 Linda Tellington Jones: Well, I think you see the thing is when it 01:32:43.537 --> 01:32:46.632 becomes institutionalized You want, 01:32:49.372 --> 01:32:55.042 I think this is where it's really important to add in this concept of 01:32:55.042 --> 01:32:57.302 releasing fear at the cellular level. 01:32:58.152 --> 01:33:02.922 And the, this, this is what we found that we can do with 01:33:02.922 --> 01:33:04.272 the one and a quarter circles. 01:33:04.802 --> 01:33:09.852 And how you can prove it is with the HeartMath M Wave. 01:33:10.352 --> 01:33:14.992 Because it puts us in the parasympathetic state of heart coherence. 01:33:15.402 --> 01:33:17.882 And it is the highest state for learning. 01:33:17.882 --> 01:33:17.932 HeartMath. 01:33:17.932 --> 01:33:24.582 com So from, in terms of Horse Boy World and the education program, there's, and 01:33:24.582 --> 01:33:30.352 it's a, Candace Burt, and she was just quoted in a podcast I saw yesterday 01:33:30.422 --> 01:33:37.772 on, I think I was listening to a stem cell podcast, and, and her work. 01:33:38.242 --> 01:33:43.367 Because that's where I got the idea when I realized That why T Touch works 01:33:43.367 --> 01:33:45.387 to release fear at the cellular level. 01:33:45.687 --> 01:33:48.447 And then Rupert, do you know of her book? 01:33:48.617 --> 01:33:52.687 She proved her book, The Molecules of Emotion by Dr. 01:33:52.687 --> 01:33:53.387 Candice Pert. 01:33:54.167 --> 01:33:54.697 P E R T. 01:33:54.707 --> 01:33:55.107 How do you, how 01:33:55.107 --> 01:33:55.967 Rupert Isaacson: do you spell PERT? 01:33:55.967 --> 01:33:56.233 P 01:33:56.233 --> 01:33:57.029 Linda Tellington Jones: E R T. 01:33:57.029 --> 01:33:57.560 PERT, P 01:33:57.560 --> 01:33:58.877 Rupert Isaacson: E R T, Dr. 01:33:58.877 --> 01:34:01.917 Candace PERT, the molecules of, the molecule of emotion. 01:34:02.007 --> 01:34:03.257 Linda Tellington Jones: Molecules of emotion. 01:34:03.267 --> 01:34:04.187 Rupert Isaacson: Molecules of emotion. 01:34:04.187 --> 01:34:05.007 I don't know this book. 01:34:05.007 --> 01:34:06.977 I will, I will, I will go and look at it. 01:34:07.267 --> 01:34:10.117 Linda Tellington Jones: The thing that's significant about it, her work, 01:34:11.127 --> 01:34:17.327 of course, her professor received was one of the Nobel Prize nominations. 01:34:17.687 --> 01:34:24.532 didn't receive it, but it was, it was one of the Possibilities because she, 01:34:24.562 --> 01:34:31.442 what she proved is that our cells hold our emo, our, our emotions. 01:34:31.802 --> 01:34:34.472 And that through these chemical connections to the brain, 01:34:34.472 --> 01:34:35.582 we think it's in our head. 01:34:35.962 --> 01:34:37.912 And that's why you can talk all you want. 01:34:37.912 --> 01:34:42.712 But that's why I know that with these light tea touches that do not activate 01:34:42.712 --> 01:34:45.432 fear because of discomfort or pain. 01:34:45.847 --> 01:34:47.207 That we can release fear. 01:34:49.317 --> 01:34:49.437 Yeah. 01:34:49.497 --> 01:34:53.917 And how, what's important for you and your program. 01:34:54.517 --> 01:34:57.217 I, I was going to grab my pod. 01:34:57.297 --> 01:35:03.317 I just did a webinar on it last week, but you know, heart, you, HeartMath 01:35:03.317 --> 01:35:09.429 Institute sells these little things, it's called an M Wave, E M W A V E, 01:35:09.429 --> 01:35:15.159 and it's a handheld computer, you clip to your ear, and when you go into 01:35:15.159 --> 01:35:21.687 heart coherence in the, state of the parasympathetic nervous system state. 01:35:22.367 --> 01:35:27.507 It has a little song, a tune, a different tune and different color. 01:35:27.917 --> 01:35:31.637 And when you're riding a horse, when you go in that state, which 01:35:31.637 --> 01:35:36.937 they, which you can get in yourself from gratitude and singing, 01:35:37.567 --> 01:35:39.537 singing, humming, singing, humming, 01:35:39.537 --> 01:35:40.197 Rupert Isaacson: yeah, humming, 01:35:40.507 --> 01:35:42.137 Linda Tellington Jones: singing and movement. 01:35:42.157 --> 01:35:45.217 So like if you had a kid, you know, who has. 01:35:45.747 --> 01:35:52.137 the ability to move, putting a soft stick in their hand and have them direct the 01:35:52.137 --> 01:35:57.367 horse from above, you know, play and make these big movements with this, or 01:35:57.367 --> 01:36:02.017 calling in the angels or the horse angels around and having them move up there. 01:36:02.457 --> 01:36:03.897 It's amazing what happens. 01:36:04.087 --> 01:36:08.997 And if you can get them to do this, Rupert, making the movement with 01:36:08.997 --> 01:36:14.017 the stick and the infinity sign, wow, that's a whole other way to put 01:36:14.017 --> 01:36:15.767 us in this parasympathetic state. 01:36:15.832 --> 01:36:17.852 You know, do you know the infinity? 01:36:18.002 --> 01:36:21.022 Rupert Isaacson: I do know the infinity sign and I do it as a, 01:36:21.682 --> 01:36:25.632 with my fingers on myself in any areas I have stiffness or pain. 01:36:26.362 --> 01:36:27.042 Linda Tellington Jones: Oh cool. 01:36:27.082 --> 01:36:29.082 Rupert Isaacson: And it, yes it works, but I haven't actually been 01:36:29.192 --> 01:36:30.572 doing it on the horses very much. 01:36:30.572 --> 01:36:34.892 I do all sorts of spider fingery, caressy things as I ride them 01:36:34.892 --> 01:36:37.142 and so on as I work them. 01:36:37.532 --> 01:36:39.972 But I haven't actually been doing the infinity singular. 01:36:39.972 --> 01:36:41.222 I should. 01:36:41.292 --> 01:36:41.522 Yeah. 01:36:42.652 --> 01:36:44.472 Linda Tellington Jones: Well, I learned it because in 01:36:46.652 --> 01:36:52.232 1972, I was one of 40 people who were measured for the activation 01:36:52.262 --> 01:36:56.432 of left and right hemispheres by Russell Tark, the director of 01:36:56.432 --> 01:36:58.002 the Stanford Research Institute. 01:36:58.502 --> 01:37:03.552 We were in a weekend workshop with Robert Munro, and, 01:37:03.662 --> 01:37:04.442 Rupert Isaacson: Who's Robert Munro? 01:37:05.247 --> 01:37:08.047 Linda Tellington Jones: He's the Robert Monroe Institute. 01:37:08.157 --> 01:37:09.187 Just write it down. 01:37:09.247 --> 01:37:09.517 Oh, the 01:37:09.517 --> 01:37:10.807 Rupert Isaacson: Monroe Institute, yes. 01:37:11.667 --> 01:37:13.387 Linda Tellington Jones: That was before there was an institute. 01:37:13.447 --> 01:37:16.907 And he was at Esalen Institute where he was doing a workshop. 01:37:16.907 --> 01:37:18.257 And I was one of the workshops. 01:37:18.592 --> 01:37:20.972 People in the workshop and Russell Tarr. 01:37:20.982 --> 01:37:21.352 By the way, 01:37:21.352 --> 01:37:22.772 Rupert Isaacson: just just for people listening. 01:37:22.782 --> 01:37:26.062 The Monroe Institute is Center education center. 01:37:26.072 --> 01:37:29.682 It's this it's probably the world's leading center for 01:37:29.692 --> 01:37:31.092 study of human consciousness. 01:37:31.162 --> 01:37:33.722 Okay, Monroe Institute Okay, so just just go on. 01:37:34.122 --> 01:37:37.532 Linda Tellington Jones: Yeah, that's important to say and so we were 01:37:37.672 --> 01:37:42.772 everybody in that class was being It was an invitational thing was being 01:37:42.772 --> 01:37:48.462 measured by by Russell Tark, and he said that I had the closest to a 50 50 use 01:37:48.462 --> 01:37:51.832 of left and right hemispheres, which I couldn't believe because I didn't 01:37:51.832 --> 01:37:53.452 think I was a very logical person. 01:37:53.892 --> 01:37:59.542 So I, after I left that weekend, I got the book Drawing from the Right Side of 01:37:59.542 --> 01:38:05.452 the Brain by Betty Edwards, and she had all of these exercises Of writing in the 01:38:05.452 --> 01:38:09.682 air, writing your name in the air with your right hand, writing it backwards 01:38:09.682 --> 01:38:15.262 with right and left hand, and doing just infinity and just, you know, going out to 01:38:15.262 --> 01:38:21.382 the outer edges of the universe and coming around the outside, imagining all of this, 01:38:21.412 --> 01:38:25.892 imagining coming, of course, up through this end of the earth and up through 01:38:25.892 --> 01:38:27.472 the body and then going the other way. 01:38:28.002 --> 01:38:29.682 And it was really, I did it for months. 01:38:30.387 --> 01:38:34.367 And it really made a difference, but the thing is that we can measure. 01:38:34.857 --> 01:38:35.817 with the M Wave. 01:38:36.147 --> 01:38:37.607 You know HeartMath Institute? 01:38:37.697 --> 01:38:38.037 I do 01:38:38.037 --> 01:38:40.197 Rupert Isaacson: and I was going to actually ask you to elucidate 01:38:40.197 --> 01:38:43.217 a bit more about HeartMath because not everybody listening 01:38:43.217 --> 01:38:44.527 to this does know about HeartMath. 01:38:44.567 --> 01:38:47.087 So just get through what you're saying there and I'm going to ask you to talk to 01:38:47.087 --> 01:38:48.737 us in more detail about HeartMath please. 01:38:48.877 --> 01:38:52.537 Linda Tellington Jones: Right, so anyway so I've, I've been so interested in 01:38:52.537 --> 01:38:57.717 this right and left hemispheres and I think it's so important to be on 01:38:57.757 --> 01:39:02.877 earth at this time, having the logic of the left brain without having this 01:39:03.252 --> 01:39:07.992 judgment of right and wrong, black and white, and that's what the right brain 01:39:07.992 --> 01:39:14.902 does to us with movement, color, art, you know, all imagining, imagining. 01:39:15.312 --> 01:39:21.732 So the more you can do wearing these great capes and choosing your cape 01:39:22.842 --> 01:39:24.792 and then making these movements. 01:39:24.792 --> 01:39:28.192 What I did with some kids that I worked with at the Eugen farm in 01:39:28.192 --> 01:39:32.852 Stuttgart many, many years ago was having them take like a stick. 01:39:33.352 --> 01:39:34.092 A riding whip. 01:39:34.862 --> 01:39:37.572 Actually, I don't think I gave them, I think I gave them a stick, 01:39:37.572 --> 01:39:38.682 I didn't want them to have a whip. 01:39:39.042 --> 01:39:43.232 And have, have these hyperactive kids being the circus directors. 01:39:43.422 --> 01:39:46.652 And standing in the middle of the ring with me, you know, telling the kids 01:39:46.652 --> 01:39:48.262 who are leading the horses what to do. 01:39:49.272 --> 01:39:54.542 And, of course, you know, I don't have to tell you, but, it's, I think it's as 01:39:54.542 --> 01:39:56.137 much pleasure for us as it is for me. 01:39:57.787 --> 01:39:58.737 Rupert Isaacson: Absolutely. 01:39:59.007 --> 01:39:59.847 Absolutely. 01:40:00.277 --> 01:40:03.947 I live vicariously my childhood over again every day. 01:40:04.477 --> 01:40:07.247 When I'm working with the kids, it's like, this is the childhood I wish I'd had. 01:40:07.257 --> 01:40:08.657 And, you know, here we go. 01:40:08.957 --> 01:40:10.117 I can have it with you. 01:40:11.127 --> 01:40:11.387 Linda Tellington Jones: Yeah. 01:40:11.387 --> 01:40:14.197 And, and doing like the NLP stuff with the kids. 01:40:14.527 --> 01:40:17.857 I remember another little girl at the Ugan farmer was coming for 01:40:17.857 --> 01:40:19.217 therapy in the afternoon with. 01:40:20.747 --> 01:40:22.937 And she was, she could never stay still. 01:40:22.937 --> 01:40:25.217 And so she was skipping a lot. 01:40:25.237 --> 01:40:28.657 So I just skipped with her into the ring and then said, you 01:40:28.827 --> 01:40:31.067 know, we have to be really quiet. 01:40:31.067 --> 01:40:33.427 So we don't, so the horses will listen to us. 01:40:33.547 --> 01:40:37.007 And of course, as soon as you do that, they start following you. 01:40:37.007 --> 01:40:38.586 Rupert Isaacson: Play what 01:40:38.586 --> 01:40:41.743 Linda Tellington Jones: you're talking about there. 01:40:41.743 --> 01:40:43.322 Rupert Isaacson: You know, 01:40:45.622 --> 01:40:49.532 Brain derived neurotrophic factor, that is neuroplasticity, that is 01:40:49.532 --> 01:40:52.872 neurogenesis, that's what we're all looking for, comes through play. 01:40:53.762 --> 01:40:58.602 Obviously, riding a horse or being with a horse, if we are approaching it in a 01:40:58.672 --> 01:41:02.172 joyful manner, is automatically play. 01:41:02.512 --> 01:41:04.242 It's automatically going to be good for our brains. 01:41:05.112 --> 01:41:08.102 Tell us, though, you, you've mentioned heart math. 01:41:09.082 --> 01:41:13.402 And obviously, I think anyone in our field ought to be aware of it, but 01:41:13.402 --> 01:41:17.312 it's, again, it's not necessarily as common knowledge as it should be, 01:41:17.562 --> 01:41:23.192 despite the fact that, you know, they now help to advise the G7 summit. 01:41:24.192 --> 01:41:26.292 Talk to us about heart math. 01:41:26.322 --> 01:41:27.682 How, how did you come across them? 01:41:27.682 --> 01:41:30.012 And what do you, where do you think they're helpful? 01:41:30.982 --> 01:41:36.962 Linda Tellington Jones: Well, I, I came across them first in it was 19 I think 01:41:36.962 --> 01:41:44.382 98 or 99, and I signed up for a weekend, which they were doing, just because a 01:41:44.382 --> 01:41:49.012 friend of mine had gone to it, and it made such a difference to him in this 01:41:49.512 --> 01:41:56.792 concept of activating both hemispheres, and I was, of course, already interested 01:41:56.792 --> 01:41:58.932 in that since, you know, the 72. 01:41:59.422 --> 01:42:02.862 And so, as it turned out, I wasn't able to go to that 01:42:02.862 --> 01:42:04.232 workshop, but over the years with. 01:42:04.502 --> 01:42:07.022 I had a lot of connections with them. 01:42:07.072 --> 01:42:15.902 And they're, they sent a doctor to us who was a new on the staff and sent it to us 01:42:15.902 --> 01:42:23.802 in Hawaii to, because they knew what TCH can do to release fear and in case in, 01:42:23.912 --> 01:42:26.922 in cases of like, what do you call it? 01:42:27.012 --> 01:42:28.162 Earthquakes and 01:42:28.942 --> 01:42:29.932 Rupert Isaacson: natural disasters, 01:42:29.982 --> 01:42:31.182 Linda Tellington Jones: natural disasters. 01:42:31.487 --> 01:42:34.347 And that's what heart, they do with their heart mass, they do 01:42:34.347 --> 01:42:36.267 it with a form of breathing. 01:42:36.857 --> 01:42:42.137 And they measure that, and it puts you out of the state of fear into the 01:42:42.497 --> 01:42:44.867 parasympathetic state with this M Wave. 01:42:45.207 --> 01:42:49.137 And I recommend, just go online, all of you, listen to this, and they have 01:42:49.147 --> 01:42:53.537 free, wonderful, many, many weekends. 01:42:53.557 --> 01:42:57.537 I think almost every weekend there's some incredible person from around the 01:42:57.537 --> 01:43:00.882 world visionary, giving a big talk. 01:43:01.822 --> 01:43:02.572 Rupert Isaacson: Absolutely. 01:43:02.572 --> 01:43:07.282 We have there's a person I work with quite closely now called Kansas Carradine who 01:43:07.762 --> 01:43:13.092 works a lot with heart math and she brings this into every aspect of, of horsemanship 01:43:13.112 --> 01:43:16.742 with trying to look through the lens, looking through the lens of the heart, 01:43:17.022 --> 01:43:19.852 showing people how to do that and why is that physically good for you as well as 01:43:20.052 --> 01:43:21.572 mentally and emotionally good for you. 01:43:22.122 --> 01:43:26.002 There was a really interesting study, which She turned me on to, 01:43:26.192 --> 01:43:30.262 from the University of Kassel, here in Germany, which, it's, that's 01:43:30.262 --> 01:43:31.852 quite a big deal, University Kassel. 01:43:32.352 --> 01:43:37.152 Way back in the 90s that was measuring the emission of photons, light 01:43:37.152 --> 01:43:39.872 particles, from the human heart. 01:43:41.182 --> 01:43:49.242 when people were consciously thinking loving thoughts and how, how far 01:43:49.322 --> 01:43:51.582 out those photons were going. 01:43:52.072 --> 01:44:01.322 So therefore we can absolutely project love and what is joy, but love, you 01:44:01.322 --> 01:44:05.752 know, that the, these things were actually being measured by quite hard 01:44:06.362 --> 01:44:10.042 nose, German universities 30 years ago. 01:44:10.602 --> 01:44:15.102 It's so interesting how these things are not more common knowledge and So she 01:44:15.102 --> 01:44:18.442 turned me on to this study just about ten days ago, and I'd never heard of it. 01:44:18.582 --> 01:44:20.382 So I thought, gosh, is that legit? 01:44:20.392 --> 01:44:24.162 You know, so I went and looked it up and found the study, and yep, there we go. 01:44:24.202 --> 01:44:25.552 Knocked me down with a feather, there it is. 01:44:26.882 --> 01:44:29.662 And HeartMath, I remember you were the first person to talk to me about 01:44:29.662 --> 01:44:34.712 HeartMath, and we had been wondering in Horseboy Method why What we call 01:44:34.712 --> 01:44:39.332 the sensory work, where you're lying body to body on a horse that's static. 01:44:39.362 --> 01:44:40.982 Why does this work so well? 01:44:40.992 --> 01:44:44.092 Why does this regulate the nervous system so well? 01:44:44.092 --> 01:44:48.312 Why does this bring people into a state of joy and bliss, the horse too? 01:44:48.562 --> 01:44:56.497 Why does This work and you I think the first person to point out, Aru, you 01:44:56.497 --> 01:44:59.517 should look at the heart math thing what's going on here is you're effectively 01:44:59.517 --> 01:45:06.147 plugging your small human heart into the mains of this huge horse heart and 01:45:06.157 --> 01:45:09.317 the electromagnetic field that's coming through that is coming into your heart 01:45:09.357 --> 01:45:14.597 and that's bringing heart coherence and this is impacting you positively 01:45:14.597 --> 01:45:19.017 on every single level But you were the first person to point that out to us. 01:45:19.017 --> 01:45:19.107 Yeah 01:45:20.122 --> 01:45:22.762 Linda Tellington Jones: I'm so glad you've, it's such, I mean, I think 01:45:22.762 --> 01:45:25.672 it's one of the most important institutions on the planet from 01:45:25.672 --> 01:45:26.662 the work that they have done. 01:45:26.992 --> 01:45:27.232 Rupert Isaacson: Yeah. 01:45:27.232 --> 01:45:27.472 It's 01:45:27.622 --> 01:45:28.012 Linda Tellington Jones: amazing. 01:45:28.012 --> 01:45:32.602 And, you know, one thing I wanted to add to what would be your 01:45:32.602 --> 01:45:36.422 listeners could do for those who are doing assisted therapy from the 01:45:36.422 --> 01:45:37.922 ground, and a lot of people do it. 01:45:38.192 --> 01:45:38.282 Mm-Hmm. 01:45:38.372 --> 01:45:43.172 We found that, just put your hand, one hand on the chest of a 01:45:43.172 --> 01:45:46.772 horse and the other hand on the withers on the ones you can reach. 01:45:47.212 --> 01:45:48.472 Rupert Isaacson: And just one hand on the chest of a horse. 01:45:48.472 --> 01:45:49.342 One hand on the withers. 01:45:49.347 --> 01:45:49.437 Okay. 01:45:50.177 --> 01:45:53.307 Linda Tellington Jones: And I, Rupert, I have had letters from 01:45:53.307 --> 01:45:57.937 people who said it transported them into a total other dimension. 01:45:58.257 --> 01:45:58.537 Rupert Isaacson: Hmm. 01:45:58.967 --> 01:46:00.917 Linda Tellington Jones: Just something happened. 01:46:00.927 --> 01:46:01.097 Is 01:46:01.097 --> 01:46:02.527 Rupert Isaacson: this a horse standing still? 01:46:02.527 --> 01:46:03.727 Is this a horse moving? 01:46:03.977 --> 01:46:05.767 Linda Tellington Jones: No, standing still, just standing there. 01:46:05.857 --> 01:46:06.277 Rupert Isaacson: Mm hmm. 01:46:06.777 --> 01:46:10.237 Linda Tellington Jones: You know, and what happens, you see, the T touch 01:46:10.247 --> 01:46:12.477 is not a massage, it's a message. 01:46:12.847 --> 01:46:13.837 It's a message. 01:46:14.382 --> 01:46:20.122 to make this connection to this phenomenal scientist now in this book. 01:46:20.292 --> 01:46:21.472 I don't know if you've heard of this. 01:46:21.472 --> 01:46:28.312 It's it's one of the latest, it's called The Song of the Cell, of the Cell. 01:46:29.082 --> 01:46:29.292 The Song 01:46:29.442 --> 01:46:30.202 Rupert Isaacson: of the Cell. 01:46:30.782 --> 01:46:33.972 Linda Tellington Jones: Yeah, An Exploration of Medicine and the New Human. 01:46:34.602 --> 01:46:34.752 An 01:46:34.912 --> 01:46:38.242 Rupert Isaacson: Exploration of Medicine and the New Human or in the New Human? 01:46:38.742 --> 01:46:39.462 Linda Tellington Jones: And the New Human. 01:46:39.462 --> 01:46:40.787 Rupert Isaacson: And 01:46:40.787 --> 01:46:44.172 Linda Tellington Jones: the Pulitzer Prize winner, the Emperor. 01:46:44.637 --> 01:46:47.267 Of all maladies. 01:46:47.747 --> 01:46:47.947 Can you 01:46:47.987 --> 01:46:49.247 Rupert Isaacson: give us the name of the author again? 01:46:49.707 --> 01:46:56.907 Linda Tellington Jones: Yeah, it's Eflixam I D D David H A R Richard 01:46:56.917 --> 01:47:04.852 T Tom H Henry A Siddhartha And the last name is another very long name, 01:47:04.852 --> 01:47:11.132 it's M like Mary, U K H E R J E E. 01:47:13.232 --> 01:47:13.962 Mukherjee. 01:47:14.592 --> 01:47:17.892 Rupert Isaacson: Mukherjee, Siddhartha Mukherjee. 01:47:19.852 --> 01:47:21.702 Okay, Indian or Nepali, I presume. 01:47:24.802 --> 01:47:27.222 Linda Tellington Jones: And you know, one of the things that's interesting, I never 01:47:27.222 --> 01:47:37.067 told you this, but up here, I have a, it's a, It's a PhD thesis written by an Iranian 01:47:38.247 --> 01:47:42.387 on the effects of TTouch on Ang angina. 01:47:43.317 --> 01:47:43.587 Rupert Isaacson: Okay. 01:47:44.827 --> 01:47:45.187 Linda Tellington Jones: Yeah. 01:47:45.517 --> 01:47:50.327 And because they found it really works just and you can do it yourself. 01:47:50.327 --> 01:47:52.037 That's the thing that's so interesting with it. 01:47:52.517 --> 01:48:00.377 And we have one of our practitioners he's a Portuguese, born from tech from Austin. 01:48:00.852 --> 01:48:07.072 And he swears that T Touch saved his life because he had such, such what 01:48:07.072 --> 01:48:08.812 do you call it his heart racing. 01:48:08.812 --> 01:48:09.882 I forget what that's called. 01:48:11.002 --> 01:48:11.652 I'm really, 01:48:12.752 --> 01:48:14.302 Rupert Isaacson: well, panic attacks, basically. 01:48:14.302 --> 01:48:14.632 Yeah, 01:48:15.092 --> 01:48:15.472 Linda Tellington Jones: they were. 01:48:15.892 --> 01:48:19.442 No, it's when the horse just races and he was able to with T Touch. 01:48:19.462 --> 01:48:21.092 He's been able to overcome it. 01:48:21.472 --> 01:48:22.022 Rupert Isaacson: Okay. 01:48:22.602 --> 01:48:24.612 Linda Tellington Jones: Because he came into the dog trainings 01:48:25.262 --> 01:48:29.392 and of course, in all, every dog training, we always teach people to 01:48:29.392 --> 01:48:31.592 do teach on, to touch on themselves. 01:48:32.472 --> 01:48:36.242 Yeah, and this is the thing about heart math, the fact that they have 01:48:36.242 --> 01:48:41.052 that M wave and you can measure when you come into this activation of the 01:48:41.052 --> 01:48:46.762 forebrain for learning and overriding the primitive part of the brain for panic. 01:48:48.262 --> 01:48:49.192 And then the other. 01:48:49.647 --> 01:48:53.787 A huge influence in my life, Rupert, has been Jerry Jampolsky. 01:48:54.387 --> 01:48:58.647 You know, he he is the author of many, many books, and the one that 01:48:58.647 --> 01:49:01.837 we use all the time in our trainings is Love is Letting Go of Fear. 01:49:03.127 --> 01:49:04.487 Rupert Isaacson: Love is letting go of fear. 01:49:04.827 --> 01:49:05.637 Linda Tellington Jones: Fear, yeah. 01:49:06.017 --> 01:49:06.237 Yeah. 01:49:06.237 --> 01:49:14.007 I, I had an experience 1984 at the Chris Griscombe's Light Institute in Galisteu. 01:49:14.617 --> 01:49:20.397 I was having a session with what they call needles to the sky points, 01:49:20.397 --> 01:49:22.117 acupuncture needles in the head. 01:49:22.957 --> 01:49:29.967 And I suddenly could feel that every cell in my body. 01:49:31.072 --> 01:49:34.272 It held the fear of all humans on the planet. 01:49:35.502 --> 01:49:36.252 We all do. 01:49:36.662 --> 01:49:36.852 Rupert Isaacson: Yeah, 01:49:37.742 --> 01:49:39.892 Linda Tellington Jones: we're, we're an accumulation. 01:49:39.892 --> 01:49:43.962 It's not just the ancestors, just seven generations. 01:49:43.962 --> 01:49:44.712 It's everybody. 01:49:45.292 --> 01:49:45.592 Rupert Isaacson: And 01:49:45.592 --> 01:49:47.962 Linda Tellington Jones: so I was doing a session to release 01:49:47.982 --> 01:49:49.622 that just from knowing it. 01:49:50.282 --> 01:49:57.682 And I, I went for a walk with Chris after, and I said, okay, so Chris, when we, when 01:49:57.682 --> 01:50:01.232 we release these, this fear in the cells. 01:50:01.682 --> 01:50:02.472 What's left? 01:50:03.072 --> 01:50:04.032 Of course, it's love. 01:50:04.522 --> 01:50:08.002 And that's where Jerry Jampolsky and his Center for Attitudinal 01:50:08.402 --> 01:50:12.132 Healing comes in, because I've worked with him for many, many years. 01:50:12.132 --> 01:50:13.722 The Center 01:50:14.002 --> 01:50:15.392 Rupert Isaacson: for Attitudinal Healing. 01:50:15.982 --> 01:50:16.552 Linda Tellington Jones: Center. 01:50:16.932 --> 01:50:18.362 Rupert Isaacson: The sense of attitudinal healing. 01:50:18.702 --> 01:50:19.012 Linda Tellington Jones: Yeah, 01:50:23.132 --> 01:50:25.582 and this is something they put out, and it's like, 01:50:28.282 --> 01:50:30.462 Joy comes with forgiveness. 01:50:30.702 --> 01:50:34.912 This is, may every step you take be one of forgiveness. 01:50:34.962 --> 01:50:35.932 It's the attitudinalhealing. 01:50:37.472 --> 01:50:37.882 org. 01:50:39.352 --> 01:50:41.092 He just died a couple of years ago. 01:50:41.962 --> 01:50:46.182 I can't remember if he was close to 100, but I knew him very well. 01:50:46.372 --> 01:50:48.852 And his wife, Diane Terenzioni. 01:50:49.462 --> 01:50:53.472 And we did a workshop together in Australia for, for ourselves, for 01:50:53.612 --> 01:50:56.232 for soul retrieval, our own souls. 01:50:58.232 --> 01:51:04.302 And just this concept of forgiveness, it's, that is forgiving ourselves 01:51:04.302 --> 01:51:07.852 when we make a mistake, forgiving others, you know, this whole concept. 01:51:08.272 --> 01:51:10.542 You must know of Hooponopono, right? 01:51:10.872 --> 01:51:11.292 Rupert Isaacson: I do. 01:51:11.692 --> 01:51:14.072 But could you please explain that for our listeners? 01:51:14.612 --> 01:51:15.232 Linda Tellington Jones: Yes. 01:51:15.952 --> 01:51:19.802 And it's a, it's a Hawaiian prayer of forgiveness. 01:51:20.242 --> 01:51:24.812 And actually, one of my very favorite books is a German book by, written 01:51:24.812 --> 01:51:29.002 by Rupert Dupre, and anybody that's interested, go on YouTube, because he 01:51:29.012 --> 01:51:31.432 has wonderful free talks all the time. 01:51:32.002 --> 01:51:39.202 And the Hawaiian, it's four phrases, the basic, and it's really simple, and 01:51:39.202 --> 01:51:41.992 it saved me in some amazing situations. 01:51:42.432 --> 01:51:45.232 It's I'm sorry, or whatever it is. 01:51:45.982 --> 01:51:46.962 Please forgive me. 01:51:47.642 --> 01:51:48.242 Thank you. 01:51:48.597 --> 01:51:50.057 Because the forgiveness is done. 01:51:50.477 --> 01:51:51.197 And I love you. 01:51:52.747 --> 01:51:56.467 And it's the I love you that stops most people because they think it's 01:51:56.477 --> 01:52:02.607 only to love someone else but actually it's also just as hard for most people 01:52:02.607 --> 01:52:07.177 to say I love ourselves because as western people we're taught that 01:52:07.177 --> 01:52:08.657 it's you shouldn't love yourself. 01:52:09.847 --> 01:52:11.117 It's kind of an interesting thing. 01:52:11.597 --> 01:52:15.777 But, I tell you where I learned how to say that and mean it 01:52:15.797 --> 01:52:17.607 in every person I look at. 01:52:18.902 --> 01:52:20.392 whether there's a problem or not. 01:52:20.552 --> 01:52:26.792 And it's, it's actually through a book called the Book of Ho'oponopono. 01:52:27.592 --> 01:52:28.802 Let me spell it for you. 01:52:29.082 --> 01:52:29.522 Okay. 01:52:30.602 --> 01:52:31.232 Or do you have it? 01:52:31.242 --> 01:52:31.702 You know it? 01:52:31.952 --> 01:52:35.952 Rupert Isaacson: No, I'm, I'm, I'm writing down the four stages of the prayer first. 01:52:35.952 --> 01:52:38.132 So I'm sorry for dot, dot, dot. 01:52:38.132 --> 01:52:38.632 I'm sorry 01:52:38.692 --> 01:52:39.402 Linda Tellington Jones: for whatever. 01:52:39.542 --> 01:52:39.952 It doesn't matter. 01:52:39.962 --> 01:52:40.992 Rupert Isaacson: Please forgive me. 01:52:41.802 --> 01:52:42.462 Linda Tellington Jones: Thank you. 01:52:42.932 --> 01:52:43.512 Rupert Isaacson: I love you. 01:52:44.602 --> 01:52:46.962 And you can say this to yourself as well as to somebody else. 01:52:47.422 --> 01:52:48.122 Linda Tellington Jones: Exactly. 01:52:48.262 --> 01:52:49.342 For anything you do. 01:52:49.827 --> 01:52:52.497 Or to a horse, or a dog, or something they do. 01:52:53.127 --> 01:52:54.257 Now, the thing is 01:52:55.237 --> 01:52:59.497 Rupert Isaacson: Okay, so, give us the strange Hawaiian name for this. 01:52:59.887 --> 01:53:06.057 Linda Tellington Jones: Yes, it's capital H O, apostrophe, O P O 01:53:06.147 --> 01:53:09.047 N O, and then repeat it again. 01:53:09.087 --> 01:53:10.177 O P O N O. 01:53:10.177 --> 01:53:12.177 Ho'oponopono. 01:53:13.857 --> 01:53:15.017 Rupert Isaacson: Ho'oponopono. 01:53:16.847 --> 01:53:19.667 Please, I'm sorry for blah. 01:53:20.217 --> 01:53:21.237 Please forgive me. 01:53:22.407 --> 01:53:23.057 Thank you. 01:53:23.987 --> 01:53:24.507 Linda Tellington Jones: I love you. 01:53:25.087 --> 01:53:27.997 And it's the I love you that stops most people because they 01:53:27.997 --> 01:53:31.427 certainly can't love something they think we did something wrong. 01:53:31.677 --> 01:53:32.367 Rupert Isaacson: Yes, 01:53:32.497 --> 01:53:39.057 Linda Tellington Jones: and it's essential for our, our joy, actually. 01:53:40.897 --> 01:53:41.227 And 01:53:41.427 --> 01:53:45.977 Rupert Isaacson: do we need to make self forgiveness a practice if we're going to 01:53:46.827 --> 01:53:49.787 even think about helping anybody else? 01:53:52.107 --> 01:53:54.187 Linda Tellington Jones: Well, that would be a judgment on my part, 01:53:54.187 --> 01:53:58.727 but I think that If you have any feeling of guilt, absolutely. 01:53:59.477 --> 01:53:59.607 Rupert Isaacson: If you 01:53:59.807 --> 01:54:01.707 Linda Tellington Jones: know that you've been doing the very best you 01:54:01.707 --> 01:54:05.757 can, forgive whatever you've done. 01:54:05.757 --> 01:54:10.277 I mean, Rupert, those of us who've worked with horses for many, many 01:54:10.287 --> 01:54:13.177 years have done things to horses that we would never do today. 01:54:13.417 --> 01:54:13.767 Rupert Isaacson: Sure. 01:54:14.277 --> 01:54:16.937 Linda Tellington Jones: And the beautiful thing is horses forgive us. 01:54:17.147 --> 01:54:17.777 Rupert Isaacson: Yes, they do. 01:54:18.307 --> 01:54:19.067 Linda Tellington Jones: That's the thing. 01:54:19.677 --> 01:54:21.927 And there's no reason to feel guilty because we were 01:54:21.937 --> 01:54:23.217 only doing the best we could. 01:54:24.467 --> 01:54:28.387 And but what I find most people can't do is say I love you to 01:54:28.387 --> 01:54:30.087 themselves if they've made a mistake. 01:54:30.207 --> 01:54:30.627 Rupert Isaacson: Sure. 01:54:30.647 --> 01:54:34.067 Well, we're because we're brought up to completely not do that. 01:54:35.167 --> 01:54:39.417 That's drummed out of us so early that that's one of the most radical acts 01:54:39.417 --> 01:54:42.827 of rebellion anyone can make is to say they love I love you to yourself. 01:54:43.837 --> 01:54:47.877 That's a total disruption of our entire societal norm. 01:54:48.427 --> 01:54:50.097 The church can't operate with that. 01:54:50.167 --> 01:54:51.917 You know, I don't mean Christianity. 01:54:51.917 --> 01:54:55.807 I don't mean, I don't mean spirituality. 01:54:55.807 --> 01:54:57.437 I don't mean, I don't mean Christ. 01:54:57.447 --> 01:54:58.627 I mean the church. 01:54:59.137 --> 01:55:00.037 Yeah, yeah. 01:55:01.062 --> 01:55:03.702 Yeah, you can't operate with if people are going around saying they 01:55:03.702 --> 01:55:06.912 love themselves all the time because then you don't need an intermediary 01:55:06.952 --> 01:55:10.372 Between them and Christ or between them and God that they're all right. 01:55:10.372 --> 01:55:13.402 So they don't need to pay you a tithe and you know, yeah 01:55:15.302 --> 01:55:17.892 Linda Tellington Jones: How you can overcome this dear listener, 01:55:18.382 --> 01:55:18.902 Rupert Isaacson: okay 01:55:19.262 --> 01:55:22.432 Linda Tellington Jones: And I I would I wouldn't have known because you 01:55:22.432 --> 01:55:28.212 know, like how do you forgive somebody who's done something horrendous to you? 01:55:28.532 --> 01:55:28.952 Rupert Isaacson: Mm hmm 01:55:29.657 --> 01:55:31.737 Linda Tellington Jones: That's, quote, unforgivable, right? 01:55:32.717 --> 01:55:37.447 And it's in, it's in the book of Ho'oponopono. 01:55:37.857 --> 01:55:40.847 Rupert Isaacson: The book of Ho'oponopono. 01:55:40.847 --> 01:55:48.267 Linda Tellington Jones: Yeah, and it's by Luke, L U C B O D A N, he's a M. 01:55:48.267 --> 01:55:48.577 D. 01:55:49.787 --> 01:55:50.357 And two others. 01:55:50.467 --> 01:55:50.667 By Luke 01:55:50.707 --> 01:55:51.147 Rupert Isaacson: Bodon. 01:55:51.747 --> 01:55:52.067 Linda Tellington Jones: Yeah. 01:55:52.417 --> 01:55:56.817 And it's Luke Bodon and another Bodon, I forget her name, I don't 01:55:56.817 --> 01:55:58.217 know if it's wife or daughter. 01:55:58.517 --> 01:55:58.937 Rupert Isaacson: Mm hmm. 01:56:00.377 --> 01:56:03.477 Linda Tellington Jones: And a third one, so it's, the reason it's important 01:56:03.477 --> 01:56:06.627 to know it's by three authors, because he's written many books, 01:56:06.847 --> 01:56:07.027 Rupert Isaacson: and 01:56:07.027 --> 01:56:12.887 Linda Tellington Jones: it's the one by three, and in it is the explanation that 01:56:12.887 --> 01:56:17.047 I got from one of my Swiss friends who reads French, I was fluent in French. 01:56:17.977 --> 01:56:22.477 She said that I love you is addressed to the divine consciousness 01:56:22.477 --> 01:56:23.797 in every cell in the body. 01:56:24.807 --> 01:56:26.327 It's to the divine within. 01:56:26.657 --> 01:56:29.157 I can say that to anybody, no matter what they've done. 01:56:29.967 --> 01:56:34.537 When you recognize that forgiveness is, it's necessary to 01:56:34.537 --> 01:56:36.617 change our world and the world. 01:56:42.607 --> 01:56:47.647 Rupert Isaacson: Wise words, Linda, and definitely words that we want to be 01:56:48.247 --> 01:56:54.607 holding in our hearts and our heads and our guts while we're wandering around 01:56:54.607 --> 01:56:58.667 Boris with ponies and people on them. 01:57:00.567 --> 01:57:04.597 This, we have, we have passed the two hour mark. 01:57:04.647 --> 01:57:12.707 All this leaves me is wanting more so there I would like to come back 01:57:13.287 --> 01:57:17.097 to you with this And can we go back into equine assisted world with you? 01:57:18.317 --> 01:57:29.247 in a few weeks and let's look at this whole concept of self disregard, let's say 01:57:30.387 --> 01:57:41.212 and how we can begin to dance with this in a way that we can create healing and 01:57:41.212 --> 01:57:49.142 joy, and then again how this might work in the equestrian context and in the You know 01:57:49.142 --> 01:57:53.042 that we could just go so much deeper here and I haven't even asked you about tendons 01:57:53.192 --> 01:57:57.262 and fitness and All these other things that we need to talk about too Which are 01:57:57.702 --> 01:58:00.742 what I love about the conversations with you is that they go from the absolutely 01:58:00.742 --> 01:58:05.412 practical like, you know If you touch like this or if you pay attention to this 01:58:05.412 --> 01:58:10.872 ligament or you know if you pay attention to the fascia to of course the absolute 01:58:10.882 --> 01:58:15.952 spiritual because how can you Separate one from the other because the cells 01:58:15.952 --> 01:58:20.052 are the spirit the spirits are the cells and then back again And then you bring 01:58:20.052 --> 01:58:21.682 it down to really useful techniques. 01:58:21.702 --> 01:58:26.612 Okay, this circle and a half way of touching Sorry, 01:58:27.392 --> 01:58:28.382 Linda Tellington Jones: a circle and a quarter. 01:58:28.632 --> 01:58:29.222 Rupert Isaacson: A circle and a quarter. 01:58:29.222 --> 01:58:35.392 Sorry a circle and a quarter moving the skin lightly and the Tarantula 01:58:35.392 --> 01:58:40.762 pulling the plow and I know of many many other forms of tea touch which have 01:58:40.782 --> 01:58:46.892 amazing effects on Horses and humans, so please let's Come back to this. 01:58:47.342 --> 01:58:49.892 Linda Tellington Jones: Can we give your, your listeners like 01:58:50.132 --> 01:58:54.732 the first book on forgiveness? 01:58:54.732 --> 01:58:59.352 The Hawaiian Book of Forgiveness that I recommend is a German author. 01:58:59.962 --> 01:59:03.082 Ulrich Dupre, D-U-P-R-E-E. 01:59:04.707 --> 01:59:04.927 Rupert Isaacson: Do 01:59:06.192 --> 01:59:06.672 Linda Tellington Jones: Dupre 01:59:06.972 --> 01:59:07.362 Rupert Isaacson: Dupre. 01:59:07.362 --> 01:59:10.512 DU like the French, D-U-P-R-E, Ulrich. 01:59:10.842 --> 01:59:11.562 Dupre, yeah. 01:59:11.562 --> 01:59:12.282 Linda Tellington Jones: Two E's. 01:59:12.282 --> 01:59:13.092 Two E's on the end. 01:59:13.092 --> 01:59:13.212 Oh, 01:59:13.212 --> 01:59:14.082 Rupert Isaacson: two E's Dupre. 01:59:14.262 --> 01:59:14.652 Okay. 01:59:14.652 --> 01:59:15.672 Ulrich Dupre. 01:59:16.497 --> 01:59:20.397 Linda Tellington Jones: And then, and that's like a wonderful overview of the 01:59:20.397 --> 01:59:23.512 work that will give you what you can make a huge difference in your, what's 01:59:23.512 --> 01:59:24.272 Rupert Isaacson: the title of the book? 01:59:24.952 --> 01:59:26.012 Linda Tellington Jones: Ho Ano. 01:59:26.152 --> 01:59:27.612 Rupert Isaacson: Ho Ano, okay. 01:59:27.612 --> 01:59:27.852 Yeah. 01:59:27.912 --> 01:59:30.377 Linda Tellington Jones: And the subtitle, look here. 01:59:33.507 --> 01:59:33.987 Rupert Isaacson: Okay. 01:59:35.667 --> 01:59:36.147 Linda Tellington Jones: Subtitle. 01:59:36.687 --> 01:59:37.827 It's a little tiny book. 01:59:37.827 --> 01:59:38.847 A little little book. 01:59:39.597 --> 01:59:40.047 Rupert Isaacson: Okay. 01:59:40.047 --> 01:59:40.647 I see it. 01:59:40.647 --> 01:59:40.977 Okay. 01:59:40.977 --> 01:59:42.117 A small, A slim Volume. 01:59:42.727 --> 01:59:43.027 Linda Tellington Jones: Yeah. 01:59:43.027 --> 01:59:49.057 And it's the Hawaiian Forgiveness Ritual as the key to your life. 01:59:49.527 --> 01:59:50.607 Life's Fulfillment. 01:59:51.262 --> 01:59:55.062 Rupert Isaacson: Hawaiian forgiveness, ritual 01:59:57.472 --> 01:59:58.492 as the key 02:00:00.802 --> 02:00:03.062 to your life's. 02:00:03.582 --> 02:00:03.972 Linda Tellington Jones: Yeah. 02:00:03.972 --> 02:00:04.572 Fulfillment. 02:00:04.722 --> 02:00:05.502 Rupert Isaacson: Fulfillment. 02:00:05.502 --> 02:00:06.042 Brilliant. 02:00:06.622 --> 02:00:08.662 Linda Tellington Jones: And the book of Ho Bono. 02:00:08.662 --> 02:00:11.952 It's a Hawaiian practice of forgiveness and healing and 02:00:12.002 --> 02:00:14.192 the, and it's, I always get it. 02:00:14.342 --> 02:00:16.382 It's Luke, B-O-D-I-N, 02:00:16.847 --> 02:00:17.197 Rupert Isaacson: Bodin. 02:00:17.547 --> 02:00:17.837 Okay. 02:00:18.577 --> 02:00:21.197 Linda Tellington Jones: And Natalie Bodin, lab boy 02:00:21.337 --> 02:00:24.482 Rupert Isaacson: and Natalie Bodin, the book of hot opponent porn 02:00:25.292 --> 02:00:26.372 Linda Tellington Jones: and John Garcia. 02:00:28.112 --> 02:00:29.592 But you'll find it. 02:00:29.882 --> 02:00:30.272 Three. 02:00:30.882 --> 02:00:31.292 Yes. 02:00:31.962 --> 02:00:32.432 Rupert Isaacson: Okay. 02:00:32.512 --> 02:00:38.552 I've got my reading list and we'll pick it up When we reconvene on this because 02:00:39.042 --> 02:00:42.862 now for listeners who want to know more about t touch, what do they do? 02:00:42.862 --> 02:00:43.452 Where do they go? 02:00:45.332 --> 02:00:48.522 Linda Tellington Jones: We're just in the process of modernizing our website. 02:00:49.102 --> 02:00:51.642 So what we have now is just go to t touch. 02:00:51.952 --> 02:00:52.492 com 02:00:52.682 --> 02:00:53.402 Rupert Isaacson: t touch. 02:00:53.702 --> 02:00:54.022 com. 02:00:54.102 --> 02:00:54.922 Yeah easy 02:00:55.337 --> 02:00:58.717 Linda Tellington Jones: Or, yeah, if you want to actually get a free 02:00:58.717 --> 02:01:01.977 introduction to it, go to learn. 02:01:02.387 --> 02:01:02.757 ttouch. 02:01:04.147 --> 02:01:05.357 ca for Canada. 02:01:06.727 --> 02:01:08.257 That's my sister Robin Hood. 02:01:09.017 --> 02:01:10.197 Rupert Isaacson: I love that she's called Robin Hood. 02:01:10.717 --> 02:01:12.407 Linda Tellington Jones: I know, my maiden name is Hood. 02:01:12.427 --> 02:01:16.507 She's 15 years younger than I and works around the world like I do. 02:01:16.847 --> 02:01:19.407 And I was able to, I named her. 02:01:20.917 --> 02:01:22.907 She kept that when she married Feel Pretty. 02:01:23.837 --> 02:01:24.307 Rupert Isaacson: Wow. 02:01:24.797 --> 02:01:25.077 Okay. 02:01:27.557 --> 02:01:27.847 Okay. 02:01:31.772 --> 02:01:33.222 All I can say listeners is 02:01:35.642 --> 02:01:39.542 we can all use mentors. 02:01:40.042 --> 02:01:40.742 Every. 02:01:41.837 --> 02:01:46.087 good thing that I do or have done has come from a mentor. 02:01:46.637 --> 02:01:50.557 Linda is one of our primary mentors. 02:01:52.037 --> 02:01:57.117 Don't do yourself out of the opportunity to be mentored by Linda Turlington Jones. 02:01:57.477 --> 02:01:58.307 There are many books. 02:01:59.422 --> 02:02:04.362 You can learn her stuff online, you'll see Just go on ttouch.com. 02:02:06.112 --> 02:02:07.312 Linda Tellington Jones: It's also on YouTube. 02:02:07.462 --> 02:02:09.142 We have stuff on under my right. 02:02:09.382 --> 02:02:14.652 Rupert Isaacson: Just go down the rabbit hole and we'll be having Linda back on. 02:02:14.712 --> 02:02:18.672 Also, if you want to know Linda's life story and how she arrived at all of 02:02:18.672 --> 02:02:23.922 this, go across to our other podcast, live Free, ride Free, where we talk 02:02:23.922 --> 02:02:27.072 about self-actualization, people living self-actualized lives, and. 02:02:27.487 --> 02:02:32.527 She tells us her autobiography there and how all this happened because 02:02:32.597 --> 02:02:34.007 it's good to have that background 02:02:36.277 --> 02:02:40.157 Okay, so you'll be hearing more from Linda this show. 02:02:40.587 --> 02:02:41.897 All right, Linda. 02:02:41.897 --> 02:02:42.487 Thank you 02:02:43.457 --> 02:02:44.607 Linda Tellington Jones: Until the next time. 02:02:45.607 --> 02:02:46.287 Rupert Isaacson: All right. 02:02:46.547 --> 02:02:49.057 Linda Tellington Jones: Hey Rupert made the force be with you. 02:02:49.877 --> 02:02:50.067 Rupert Isaacson: Haha. 02:02:50.107 --> 02:02:51.107 May it be with you, too 02:02:51.295 --> 02:02:52.405 thank you for joining us. 02:02:52.435 --> 02:02:54.265 We hope you enjoyed today's podcast. 02:02:54.503 --> 02:02:59.543 Join our website, new trails learning.com, to check out our online 02:02:59.543 --> 02:03:04.733 courses and live workshops in Horse Boy Method, movement Method, and Athena. 02:03:05.441 --> 02:03:10.089 These evidence-based programs have helped children, veterans, and people 02:03:10.089 --> 02:03:12.099 dealing with trauma around the world. 02:03:12.426 --> 02:03:16.176 We also offer a horse training program and self-care program 02:03:16.176 --> 02:03:19.416 for riders on long ride home.com. 02:03:19.715 --> 02:03:23.765 These include easy to do online courses and tutorials that 02:03:23.765 --> 02:03:25.685 bring you and your horse joy. 02:03:26.221 --> 02:03:30.781 For an overview of all shows and programs, go to rupert isaacson.com. 02:03:31.111 --> 02:03:32.041 See you on the next show. 02:03:32.454 --> 02:03:35.144 And please remember to press, subscribe and share.