Colin Casey (00:00:06):
Hi, welcome to Sober Banter.

Colin Casey (00:00:08):
I'm Colin.

Rachel Casey (00:00:09):
And I am Rachel.

Colin Casey (00:00:10):
Today we have a guest, Nick.

Rachel Casey (00:00:13):
Nick Pearson, who is the CEO, founder of Sober Outdoors.

Rachel Casey (00:00:21):
Hi, Nick.

Rachel Casey (00:00:21):
How are you?

Nick Pearson (00:00:22):
Good.

Nick Pearson (00:00:23):
I snowed in Denver.

Nick Pearson (00:00:24):
I'm going skiing tomorrow, so I can't complain.

Nick Pearson (00:00:26):
Oh, wow.

Rachel Casey (00:00:27):
Awesome.

Rachel Casey (00:00:28):
I took a call on skiing for the first time.

Rachel Casey (00:00:31):
Oh, wait.

Rachel Casey (00:00:32):
Six years ago.

Colin Casey (00:00:33):
Six years ago.

Colin Casey (00:00:33):
Oh, wow.

Colin Casey (00:00:34):
All right.

Colin Casey (00:00:34):
You got to get back out of here.

Rachel Casey (00:00:35):
You started on the bunny hill.

Colin Casey (00:00:37):
I crushed the bunny hill.

Colin Casey (00:00:39):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Colin Casey (00:00:40):
Crushed it.

Colin Casey (00:00:40):
Well, when this comes out, we'll take you out.

Colin Casey (00:00:42):
Yeah.

Colin Casey (00:00:43):
Then it got a little bit more difficult to pizza and French fry.

Rachel Casey (00:00:49):
And we weren't sober because we would go to the top,

Rachel Casey (00:00:53):
get off the ski lift and we would get shots and beers because they have like a

Rachel Casey (00:00:56):
whole little bar,

Rachel Casey (00:00:57):
like right when you get off the ski lift.

Rachel Casey (00:00:59):
I mean, typically at least.

Rachel Casey (00:01:01):
And we would also take edibles.

Rachel Casey (00:01:03):
The risk of how dangerous that is.

Rachel Casey (00:01:06):
I broke my wrist snowboarding when I was 14.

Nick Pearson (00:01:10):
And I can't even imagine.

Nick Pearson (00:01:13):
Yeah.

Rachel Casey (00:01:15):
I got super anxious because as soon as we'd start going fast, I would freak out.

Rachel Casey (00:01:20):
And I bet the drugs and alcohol probably played into that.

Nick Pearson (00:01:22):
Yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:01:23):
Yeah, definitely.

Rachel Casey (00:01:24):
How do you feel the difference of did you ever drink?

Nick Pearson (00:01:28):
You know,

Nick Pearson (00:01:28):
what's weird is if we get into my story a little bit,

Nick Pearson (00:01:30):
the one thing I didn't do was ski drunk or high.

Nick Pearson (00:01:33):
I mean, I did a few times, but it wasn't a consistent thing for me.

Nick Pearson (00:01:37):
And I saw how it took the edge off because I'm a speed demon.

Nick Pearson (00:01:40):
I love just going down double black diamonds and jumping off the cliff and going

Nick Pearson (00:01:43):
straight down no turns.

Nick Pearson (00:01:45):
My parents used to terrorize my parents when I was skiing with them as a younger kid.

Nick Pearson (00:01:49):
But my mom was actually hit by a drunk skier when she was 18.

Nick Pearson (00:01:53):
And she had to get like 37 or 34 knee surgeries over her lifetime to reset her knee

Nick Pearson (00:02:00):
every few years from this one accident.

Nick Pearson (00:02:02):
So I took it really seriously now.

Nick Pearson (00:02:04):
Funny enough,

Nick Pearson (00:02:04):
I didn't take that to driving drunk as like,

Nick Pearson (00:02:06):
it's fine to drive drunk,

Nick Pearson (00:02:07):
but you just don't ski drunk,

Nick Pearson (00:02:08):
Nick.

Colin Casey (00:02:10):
It's strange how that impacted you like that.

Colin Casey (00:02:12):
It's like,

Colin Casey (00:02:14):
oh,

Colin Casey (00:02:14):
wow,

Colin Casey (00:02:14):
I'm never going to ski or do anything on the mountain,

Colin Casey (00:02:18):
you know,

Colin Casey (00:02:18):
drunk or high.

Colin Casey (00:02:19):
But like you said, goes into the outdoor world.

Colin Casey (00:02:22):
You're like, oh, this is fine.

Rachel Casey (00:02:23):
Well, I think that's because you see it in real life happen.

Rachel Casey (00:02:25):
A lot of people with drinking and driving,

Rachel Casey (00:02:27):
they don't know anyone who's been hurt or been on the opposite end of the drinking

Rachel Casey (00:02:32):
and driving accident.

Nick Pearson (00:02:33):
Yeah.

Rachel Casey (00:02:34):
And

Rachel Casey (00:02:35):
It doesn't become real until it happens.

Rachel Casey (00:02:37):
So if you see your mom get injured by someone who was neighboring skiing,

Rachel Casey (00:02:41):
wow,

Rachel Casey (00:02:41):
this thing really happens.

Rachel Casey (00:02:43):
This isn't just something, some hypothetical.

Colin Casey (00:02:45):
Did that stop her skiing career?

Nick Pearson (00:02:47):
Yeah, ended her skiing career right when she was 18.

Nick Pearson (00:02:50):
She was a bomb skier when she was 18 from what I'm told from my father.

Nick Pearson (00:02:53):
It's hard to go skiing these days with folks and my friends because they don't see

Nick Pearson (00:02:59):
anything wrong with skiing and drinking,

Nick Pearson (00:03:00):
right?

Nick Pearson (00:03:00):
Yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:03:01):
Yeah,

Nick Pearson (00:03:01):
I've probably put the fear of God in them and told them that story about 100 times

Nick Pearson (00:03:04):
about my mom,

Nick Pearson (00:03:05):
but they'll still do it.

Nick Pearson (00:03:07):
And they're like, well, Nick, it's scary because, you know, I'm not.

Nick Pearson (00:03:10):
And then maybe you shouldn't be skiing if you're scared going up there and you need

Nick Pearson (00:03:13):
that boost of confidence.

Nick Pearson (00:03:15):
But,

Nick Pearson (00:03:15):
you know,

Nick Pearson (00:03:15):
that's why at Sober Outdoors,

Nick Pearson (00:03:17):
we'll do things like ski days because people tend to go with their friends who

Nick Pearson (00:03:21):
drink a lot and they just get turned off by the whole ski experience.

Nick Pearson (00:03:24):
Pretty much anything in the outdoors gets gets turned off because everyone

Nick Pearson (00:03:28):
celebrates in some way or another.

Nick Pearson (00:03:29):
hiking or biking or cycling with with a beer in their hand right at the end or

Nick Pearson (00:03:33):
during and so um it's nice to go ski with a bunch of several folks like i am

Nick Pearson (00:03:37):
tomorrow so then you don't really have to worry about anyone crashing or like

Nick Pearson (00:03:41):
anyone driving home drunk that was another thing that i rode in some cars with some

Nick Pearson (00:03:45):
friends and

Nick Pearson (00:03:46):
This does not seem like a good idea.

Nick Pearson (00:03:48):
We're driving back from the mountain.

Nick Pearson (00:03:49):
It's snowing.

Nick Pearson (00:03:49):
There's a foot on the highway.

Nick Pearson (00:03:51):
And we're 18 years old drinking beers thinking we're like badass bros.

Nick Pearson (00:03:55):
And then we realized it was stupid, right?

Nick Pearson (00:03:58):
When I look back.

Rachel Casey (00:03:59):
But, you know, that's... But at the time, everyone else is doing it.

Nick Pearson (00:04:03):
Yeah, everyone's doing it.

Nick Pearson (00:04:05):
Yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:04:05):
It was the cool thing to do,

Nick Pearson (00:04:06):
especially when I was in high school and in college was growing up in Colorado and

Nick Pearson (00:04:10):
having the mountains right in our backyard.

Nick Pearson (00:04:12):
Skiing was built into the lifestyle here.

Nick Pearson (00:04:14):
It still is.

Nick Pearson (00:04:15):
If you were a good skier and you also know to party on the mountain, you were like the bro.

Nick Pearson (00:04:19):
I thought it was more challenging to ski sober because you had to be aware of

Nick Pearson (00:04:23):
everything around you.

Nick Pearson (00:04:24):
Well, you're really supposed to because I mean, people die.

Nick Pearson (00:04:27):
Right, right.

Nick Pearson (00:04:30):
Pulse going down the mountain.

Rachel Casey (00:04:32):
And you're going double black diamonds in between trees?

Nick Pearson (00:04:34):
That is not... That's where the skill comes from.

Nick Pearson (00:04:37):
Yeah.

Rachel Casey (00:04:38):
Oh, my God.

Rachel Casey (00:04:39):
It's... Yeah.

Rachel Casey (00:04:41):
That terrifies me.

Rachel Casey (00:04:42):
I think Evan would love it.

Rachel Casey (00:04:43):
And I know I want to do it sober.

Rachel Casey (00:04:45):
I think I'll... I grew up going every other year.

Rachel Casey (00:04:48):
Yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:04:48):
Yeah, yeah.

Rachel Casey (00:04:50):
Anyways.

Nick Pearson (00:04:51):
Anyway.

Rachel Casey (00:04:53):
So, you've been sober since April.

Rachel Casey (00:04:56):
January 2019.

Rachel Casey (00:04:56):
Yep.

Nick Pearson (00:04:57):
I have been for... So, pre-COVID.

Rachel Casey (00:04:59):
Yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:05:00):
Pre-COVID.

Nick Pearson (00:05:02):
Yeah.

Colin Casey (00:05:03):
Just before COVID.

Nick Pearson (00:05:05):
Just before COVID.

Nick Pearson (00:05:06):
And I actually got stuck in Sweden when COVID started in the United States.

Nick Pearson (00:05:12):
And so being out there sober within like a year of sobriety was absolutely horrible.

Nick Pearson (00:05:17):
um but yeah it's been a six-year journey now and i just celebrated the six-year

Nick Pearson (00:05:20):
mark and congratulations going into our third year at sober outdoors so that's like

Nick Pearson (00:05:25):
i thought i started it yesterday if you asked me it feels like i started it

Nick Pearson (00:05:28):
yesterday but um looking at back on just kind of the wild ride it's been wow

Nick Pearson (00:05:33):
there's a lot has happened from my being in sobriety to just starting the company

Nick Pearson (00:05:39):
to selling my old company i had prior to sober outdoors

Nick Pearson (00:05:43):
to the career that I've been in.

Nick Pearson (00:05:45):
It's just been a wild ride.

Nick Pearson (00:05:46):
It's been the best gift I've ever given myself.

Nick Pearson (00:05:48):
It's not my golden retriever who might hop on my lap at some point.

Nick Pearson (00:05:51):
But six years, I'm like, man, that's like, I'm getting old.

Nick Pearson (00:05:55):
Because if I'm sober six years,

Nick Pearson (00:05:56):
that means I'm doing something right and I'm growing up and I'm getting old.

Rachel Casey (00:06:00):
So you started Sober Outdoors at three year sober and we've started Sober Banter at three year.

Rachel Casey (00:06:05):
I wonder if there's some correlation at the three year mark.

Rachel Casey (00:06:08):
But how did you originally do sobriety?

Rachel Casey (00:06:11):
Did you go through a 12 step?

Nick Pearson (00:06:12):
I did all levels of care.

Nick Pearson (00:06:15):
And I did.

Nick Pearson (00:06:16):
So I did inpatient.

Nick Pearson (00:06:17):
I did detox, inpatient, PHB.

Nick Pearson (00:06:20):
iop op and then with my therapist and then 12 steps twice once in dharma and once

Nick Pearson (00:06:27):
in aa um dharma is awesome and then there's another program here in denver called

Nick Pearson (00:06:32):
mindfulness and recovery that's even better it just i don't know it gives me all

Nick Pearson (00:06:36):
the excitements but um yeah so i i did two inpatients actually because i the first

Nick Pearson (00:06:41):
time i got an inpatient i was like i've got this i was terrified but i got this no

Nick Pearson (00:06:45):
big deal you go to rehab you get fixed i went to a bougie rehab here in denver and

Nick Pearson (00:06:50):
uh

Nick Pearson (00:06:51):
And yeah, I thought I was fixed when I came out.

Nick Pearson (00:06:53):
And it was a weird time for Colorado because we were going through.

Nick Pearson (00:06:55):
I just remember distinctly coming out of rehab and everywhere there being alcohol

Nick Pearson (00:06:59):
more than what normally there is.

Nick Pearson (00:07:01):
And the reason why is because Colorado changed laws while I was in rehab to where

Nick Pearson (00:07:06):
everywhere could sell normal beer.

Nick Pearson (00:07:07):
So I don't know if you guys know what 3-2 beer is, but...

Nick Pearson (00:07:10):
Oh, yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:07:11):
Yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:07:11):
That used to be everywhere.

Nick Pearson (00:07:13):
You can only buy real beer and liquor stores.

Nick Pearson (00:07:14):
Right.

Nick Pearson (00:07:15):
So I get out of rehab and every single store has on it these huge signs that say

Nick Pearson (00:07:21):
full strength beer and beer was my jam.

Nick Pearson (00:07:23):
That was my my go to drug.

Nick Pearson (00:07:26):
And so it was hard for me to stay sober.

Nick Pearson (00:07:27):
I ended up relapsing pretty darn quickly, went to an all men's facility.

Nick Pearson (00:07:31):
The rest has been history, really.

Nick Pearson (00:07:34):
I got a DUI.

Nick Pearson (00:07:35):
I got two DUIs during that relapse that was about six months long.

Nick Pearson (00:07:38):
And I don't want to do this anymore.

Nick Pearson (00:07:40):
You know,

Nick Pearson (00:07:40):
so when I got out of treatment or out of fully out of treatment,

Nick Pearson (00:07:43):
I went to sober living and did IOP and PHP and OP.

Nick Pearson (00:07:47):
And then,

Nick Pearson (00:07:48):
you know,

Nick Pearson (00:07:48):
I transitioned to moving in with one of my sober buddies who I met in sober living

Nick Pearson (00:07:52):
and to living with him for a couple of years.

Nick Pearson (00:07:54):
I just was like, I don't want to do this again.

Nick Pearson (00:07:56):
This sucks.

Nick Pearson (00:07:56):
Rehab is not great.

Nick Pearson (00:07:58):
You're kind of in prison.

Nick Pearson (00:07:59):
And I was in some nice, really nice rehabs.

Nick Pearson (00:08:01):
My second one I went to was even more bougie.

Nick Pearson (00:08:03):
My parents thought, well, let's throw more money at the problem because that's going to fix it.

Nick Pearson (00:08:07):
And the reality, you're not going to go to AA, Nick.

Nick Pearson (00:08:09):
Our sons don't go to AA.

Nick Pearson (00:08:11):
You don't live under a bridge.

Nick Pearson (00:08:13):
And AA has saved my life in many, many ways.

Rachel Casey (00:08:17):
People think AA is so like, and I mean, I was one of them before I got sober.

Rachel Casey (00:08:22):
It's just totally not what I expected.

Colin Casey (00:08:25):
You know,

Colin Casey (00:08:25):
I always thought of it as that scene in Fight Club when he's going to all those

Colin Casey (00:08:28):
different support groups.

Colin Casey (00:08:30):
That's just kind of how I always pictured a dark room with like really bad cookies

Colin Casey (00:08:35):
and donuts and cigarette smoke everywhere.

Colin Casey (00:08:37):
Yeah.

Colin Casey (00:08:38):
Yeah.

Colin Casey (00:08:39):
Kind of the complete opposite.

Colin Casey (00:08:40):
I mean, I'm sure there are rooms like that.

Nick Pearson (00:08:46):
When I went to AA,

Nick Pearson (00:08:47):
my first AA meeting I went to here in Denver,

Nick Pearson (00:08:49):
when I left it,

Nick Pearson (00:08:50):
I was like,

Nick Pearson (00:08:50):
holy cow,

Nick Pearson (00:08:51):
that was really cool.

Nick Pearson (00:08:52):
I want to come back.

Nick Pearson (00:08:53):
Because I was like, oh my God, people drink at eight in the morning like I do?

Nick Pearson (00:08:56):
Weird.

Nick Pearson (00:08:56):
I didn't know that.

Nick Pearson (00:08:57):
I thought I was the only one on the planet.

Nick Pearson (00:08:59):
And then you find out all the wonderful things they teach you about yourself and your ego.

Nick Pearson (00:09:04):
But I was traveling for work.

Nick Pearson (00:09:06):
during that time and i was traveling pretty much all around the country so i had to

Nick Pearson (00:09:09):
see a lot of different aas and i'll tell you there's some hardcore aas where you're

Nick Pearson (00:09:14):
smoking a cigarette they're like handing cigarettes on the door basically and all

Nick Pearson (00:09:17):
right we're gonna get into it you're gonna cry and you're gonna you know and it's

Nick Pearson (00:09:20):
and that's kind of how some of these places operate but i came from uh york street

Nick Pearson (00:09:24):
here in denver which is this this phenomenal clubhouse um that's actually the

Nick Pearson (00:09:29):
largest clubhouse in the united states it's this

Nick Pearson (00:09:31):
mansion from the 1800s.

Nick Pearson (00:09:33):
It's beautiful.

Nick Pearson (00:09:33):
It's three stories high.

Nick Pearson (00:09:36):
And it's just a place of recovery.

Nick Pearson (00:09:37):
It's just an amazing,

Nick Pearson (00:09:38):
amazing experience when you go there and get to see all walks of life there.

Nick Pearson (00:09:41):
But that's what I love.

Nick Pearson (00:09:42):
You get hearing those gnarly stories about about living under the bridge and that I

Nick Pearson (00:09:46):
may never been exposed to in my lifetime,

Nick Pearson (00:09:48):
you know,

Nick Pearson (00:09:49):
where it all ends up going if you don't pull yourself together and lean on

Nick Pearson (00:09:53):
something higher than yourself.

Rachel Casey (00:09:55):
Absolutely.

Rachel Casey (00:09:57):
And so for the outdoors part,

Rachel Casey (00:10:00):
there's something really powerful about the healing,

Rachel Casey (00:10:03):
especially I think in Colorado,

Rachel Casey (00:10:04):
like Texas,

Rachel Casey (00:10:05):
we haven't been as many really serene,

Rachel Casey (00:10:08):
beautiful areas.

Rachel Casey (00:10:10):
Colin, he went to school in Arizona and he's like the mountains.

Rachel Casey (00:10:13):
Every time we travel to Vegas or Arizona, California, he's like, it's so beautiful.

Rachel Casey (00:10:19):
And we went to Sedona and sobriety and that was amazing.

Rachel Casey (00:10:23):
magical we went and did signed up for a meditation in the vortex which we were told

Rachel Casey (00:10:31):
this vortex i originally thought it's a special spot in the mountains in a cave but

Rachel Casey (00:10:37):
it turns out the vortex is kind of just everywhere but i really do wish we had

Rachel Casey (00:10:42):
something more where we could do a little more physical you got to drive pretty

Colin Casey (00:10:47):
Yeah, we're in Dallas, so there are places in Texas, but Texas is very big and spread out.

Rachel Casey (00:10:52):
And then you've got to risk getting ticks and mosquito bites.

Rachel Casey (00:10:55):
I feel like in Colorado,

Rachel Casey (00:10:57):
how do you feel safety-wise,

Rachel Casey (00:10:59):
too,

Rachel Casey (00:10:59):
about wildlife,

Rachel Casey (00:11:01):
animals,

Rachel Casey (00:11:01):
or emergencies?

Rachel Casey (00:11:03):
When you're doing events of hiking or whatnot.

Nick Pearson (00:11:06):
Yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:11:06):
For me, it's not, it doesn't scare me because I've just been growing up here my entire life.

Nick Pearson (00:11:12):
You know, we camped every single summer and tail ends of the season.

Nick Pearson (00:11:16):
And so, I mean, just last season we had a bear the size of my car.

Nick Pearson (00:11:19):
I drive a Grand Cherokee for reference and,

Nick Pearson (00:11:21):
Walked through our campsite on a summer outdoors trip and I was just like,

Nick Pearson (00:11:24):
everyone just don't move.

Nick Pearson (00:11:26):
I don't know what to do.

Nick Pearson (00:11:27):
You don't know what to do.

Nick Pearson (00:11:28):
Do not run.

Nick Pearson (00:11:29):
That's all I know is do not run.

Nick Pearson (00:11:30):
And it just casually walked through our site and it was just this amazing experience.

Nick Pearson (00:11:33):
But,

Nick Pearson (00:11:34):
you know,

Nick Pearson (00:11:34):
honestly,

Nick Pearson (00:11:35):
the more things I worry about is people injuring themselves potentially or

Nick Pearson (00:11:41):
potentially using on a trip.

Nick Pearson (00:11:42):
And that's happened before, too.

Nick Pearson (00:11:43):
So.

Nick Pearson (00:11:44):
It's not really the nature or wildlife or anything like that.

Nick Pearson (00:11:48):
It's about someone falling on their butt and suing me or something.

Nick Pearson (00:11:52):
Because a lot of people,

Nick Pearson (00:11:53):
when they get fresh out of treatment and they're a few months or weeks into

Nick Pearson (00:11:58):
sobriety or even a few days,

Nick Pearson (00:12:00):
68% of our client base is in their first six months of sobriety.

Nick Pearson (00:12:05):
And so they're biting at the bit to do everything.

Nick Pearson (00:12:07):
And they usually go on harder trips than they probably should be going on.

Nick Pearson (00:12:11):
You do not need to be going on a seven mile hike when you're withdrawing from opioids, buddy.

Nick Pearson (00:12:16):
This one guy.

Rachel Casey (00:12:17):
So how do you explain that to them?

Rachel Casey (00:12:18):
Do you have a nice way to be like, hey, how about we like push back, reevaluate?

Nick Pearson (00:12:22):
Yeah, we are.

Nick Pearson (00:12:23):
We're actually introducing that for the coming months.

Nick Pearson (00:12:26):
We haven't in the past two years because we tried to make everything as accessible as possible.

Nick Pearson (00:12:29):
But I quickly learned what I thought was going to be this hardcore backpacking company.

Nick Pearson (00:12:34):
You're going to get sober out on the trail.

Nick Pearson (00:12:37):
It very quickly turned into like three mile hikes on the weekends because we wanted

Nick Pearson (00:12:42):
to service everyone in all walks of their recovery,

Nick Pearson (00:12:45):
whether they're just sober today,

Nick Pearson (00:12:48):
this morning,

Nick Pearson (00:12:48):
whenever it was,

Nick Pearson (00:12:49):
or they've been sober for 30 years.

Nick Pearson (00:12:51):
And so we do want to make things a little bit more complicated for those more seasoned folks.

Nick Pearson (00:12:56):
that come to us and want to be able to go on backpacking trips with,

Nick Pearson (00:12:59):
you know,

Nick Pearson (00:13:00):
some of their,

Nick Pearson (00:13:00):
maybe they did 15 milers with their buddies,

Nick Pearson (00:13:03):
backpacking trips that took 15 days,

Nick Pearson (00:13:05):
but their buddies still drink and they don't have anyone to do it with.

Nick Pearson (00:13:08):
I'd love for us to be an outlet for them or someone who's never backpacked in their

Nick Pearson (00:13:11):
life and wants to go on a two day trip with us.

Nick Pearson (00:13:15):
So it's just, you know, it's really, it's people's mistakes that I worry the most about.

Rachel Casey (00:13:19):
Do you have more men, women, equal?

Nick Pearson (00:13:21):
I'd say more women.

Nick Pearson (00:13:22):
I'd say almost two-thirds of our clientele are women.

Nick Pearson (00:13:26):
Yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:13:28):
And the only thing I can chalk that up to is,

Nick Pearson (00:13:32):
you know,

Nick Pearson (00:13:33):
I think women are just more,

Nick Pearson (00:13:35):
no offense,

Nick Pearson (00:13:35):
gentlemen,

Nick Pearson (00:13:36):
they're more go-getters when they're ready to get sober.

Nick Pearson (00:13:38):
And they're just like, F this, I'm staying sober.

Nick Pearson (00:13:40):
And I made a decision.

Nick Pearson (00:13:42):
And once I made it, it's done.

Nick Pearson (00:13:43):
Yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:13:45):
When they're getting sober or they've been sober,

Nick Pearson (00:13:47):
they are more willing to try a lot more things.

Nick Pearson (00:13:50):
And one of the biggest challenges we run into is just getting people out of their

Nick Pearson (00:13:53):
comfort zones coming to us,

Nick Pearson (00:13:56):
right?

Nick Pearson (00:13:56):
Who wants to sign up with a hype with 25 strangers on a Saturday morning and you're

Nick Pearson (00:14:00):
sober and it's 9 a.m.

Nick Pearson (00:14:02):
You don't know a single person there and you have to go out and meet 25 people and

Nick Pearson (00:14:07):
put yourself out there.

Nick Pearson (00:14:08):
and be uncomfortable in your own skin and all those things.

Nick Pearson (00:14:10):
And so we find that the women are just like,

Nick Pearson (00:14:13):
hell yeah,

Nick Pearson (00:14:13):
I'm here to show up and kick your ass off.

Nick Pearson (00:14:15):
Excuse my language.

Nick Pearson (00:14:17):
That's awesome.

Rachel Casey (00:14:18):
Yeah, I would have to.

Rachel Casey (00:14:20):
I'd be scared I wouldn't be able to do it.

Rachel Casey (00:14:21):
What if I can't finish?

Rachel Casey (00:14:23):
What happens then?

Rachel Casey (00:14:24):
Do you just leave me and come back?

Nick Pearson (00:14:26):
No, no, no.

Nick Pearson (00:14:28):
It's a group effort.

Rachel Casey (00:14:29):
Fair?

Nick Pearson (00:14:30):
Yeah, bear spray for that.

Nick Pearson (00:14:32):
Honestly, the woods are so safe.

Nick Pearson (00:14:34):
They're so safe.

Nick Pearson (00:14:35):
When's the last time you heard about someone getting mauled by a bear?

Colin Casey (00:14:39):
I'd like to know how you came to wanting to start what you're doing now because you

Colin Casey (00:14:43):
did have a background in...

Colin Casey (00:14:45):
kind of outdoor activities and managing those things together.

Colin Casey (00:14:49):
And as we said,

Colin Casey (00:14:50):
around that three year mark,

Colin Casey (00:14:51):
you kind of was like,

Colin Casey (00:14:53):
you know what,

Colin Casey (00:14:53):
I want to do something and give back.

Colin Casey (00:14:55):
So you sold the company that you did have to start this.

Colin Casey (00:14:58):
So what led to that?

Nick Pearson (00:15:00):
So originally, Sober Outdoors was a professionals group in the outdoor industry.

Nick Pearson (00:15:06):
I work in the outdoor industry or have my whole career going on like 18 years now,

Nick Pearson (00:15:10):
which is insane on the brand side of things.

Nick Pearson (00:15:12):
So think like North Face,

Nick Pearson (00:15:14):
Patagonia,

Nick Pearson (00:15:15):
Spider,

Nick Pearson (00:15:16):
that side of the business,

Nick Pearson (00:15:17):
working for them at corporate level.

Nick Pearson (00:15:20):
um and there's these big trade shows they have and on the sales side of things you

Nick Pearson (00:15:23):
take rei out to dinner and everything is just boozy right and so when i got sober

Nick Pearson (00:15:28):
and i was in sales and i was responsible for managing some of these bigger accounts

Nick Pearson (00:15:32):
even the smaller accounts taking them out to dinner and having even just a few

Nick Pearson (00:15:36):
glasses of wine was terrifying how was i going to be successful in this job and how

Nick Pearson (00:15:41):
was i going to go to a trade show and and

Nick Pearson (00:15:43):
and put my brand out there for the man who I was working for, whoever it was at the time.

Nick Pearson (00:15:48):
Happy Hour started at 2 o'clock in the afternoon.

Nick Pearson (00:15:50):
You were having meetings with people with shots of vodka and beer,

Nick Pearson (00:15:53):
depending on whatever booth you're at.

Nick Pearson (00:15:55):
And I was scared to do it,

Nick Pearson (00:15:57):
so I started a professionals group,

Nick Pearson (00:15:58):
and I kind of quickly realized there aren't a lot of sober people on the

Nick Pearson (00:16:01):
professional side of the outdoor industry,

Nick Pearson (00:16:03):
or at least people that want to tie their name to an organization.

Nick Pearson (00:16:06):
I think it was more tying their name to an organization than anything,

Nick Pearson (00:16:09):
because I found a lot of sober people.

Nick Pearson (00:16:11):
And so the second iteration was the LGBTQ side of it, which I'm a gay man myself.

Nick Pearson (00:16:18):
I'm in the LGBTQ community.

Nick Pearson (00:16:19):
And I thought, that's a pretty underserved community, right?

Nick Pearson (00:16:22):
Like, let's get them outside.

Nick Pearson (00:16:23):
Let's help them in their recovery.

Nick Pearson (00:16:25):
And then I thought even then, you know, we did that for a short few months.

Nick Pearson (00:16:28):
And even that's too small.

Nick Pearson (00:16:30):
So let's just open it up to everyone.

Nick Pearson (00:16:32):
And at first it was, you know, sober people.

Nick Pearson (00:16:34):
It's like, nope, we're still going too small.

Nick Pearson (00:16:35):
So sober curious folks, allies, everyone else in between.

Nick Pearson (00:16:39):
And so...

Nick Pearson (00:16:40):
I'm lucky enough that I kind of took my knowledge of growing up in Colorado,

Nick Pearson (00:16:44):
the outdoor industry,

Nick Pearson (00:16:45):
working in it,

Nick Pearson (00:16:46):
owning a ski company prior to this,

Nick Pearson (00:16:47):
and then now doing this whole time,

Nick Pearson (00:16:50):
being able to kind of

Nick Pearson (00:16:52):
do what I want, but also have the knowledge to put it together in a pretty easy way.

Nick Pearson (00:16:56):
Oh, I know all these great camping trails.

Nick Pearson (00:16:58):
Let's go hike on them and go camping on them.

Nick Pearson (00:17:00):
And that's all I have to do is just get people to sign up.

Nick Pearson (00:17:02):
And I get to go camp and be sober for fun and for work.

Nick Pearson (00:17:06):
Let's do it.

Rachel Casey (00:17:07):
I have to ask then, because there's got to be a wild one.

Rachel Casey (00:17:11):
What's your wildest kind of story?

Rachel Casey (00:17:14):
Obviously not naming names,

Rachel Casey (00:17:16):
but do you have one where you were like,

Rachel Casey (00:17:17):
whoa,

Rachel Casey (00:17:18):
wasn't expecting that on a camping trip or

Rachel Casey (00:17:21):
Or what was the wildest ride you had?

Nick Pearson (00:17:24):
Probably, there's been some crazy ones with just...

Nick Pearson (00:17:27):
People in really early sobriety going off on other people.

Nick Pearson (00:17:31):
Sex is almost like the newcomers versus the old timers.

Nick Pearson (00:17:35):
So that was kind of fun to sit back and watch.

Rachel Casey (00:17:37):
Is that an age thing too?

Nick Pearson (00:17:38):
It's a huge thing as well.

Nick Pearson (00:17:40):
But honestly, you know, in every one of our campouts, it's kind of funny.

Nick Pearson (00:17:44):
Mostly our campouts,

Nick Pearson (00:17:45):
our hikes,

Nick Pearson (00:17:46):
there's not enough time spent with each other for the old timers to start building

Nick Pearson (00:17:49):
resentments towards the youngins and vice versa.

Rachel Casey (00:17:52):
Let's do a 10th step campfire, guys.

Rachel Casey (00:17:55):
How was your day?

Rachel Casey (00:17:56):
Who are you mad at?

Nick Pearson (00:17:57):
You know,

Nick Pearson (00:17:58):
I think probably one of the biggest things that have been a surprise to me is just

Nick Pearson (00:18:03):
mitigating some of the conversations that someone who may be,

Nick Pearson (00:18:07):
this might be their first sober thing they've ever done ever.

Nick Pearson (00:18:10):
They've never been to an AA meeting.

Nick Pearson (00:18:11):
They've never been to anything in there.

Nick Pearson (00:18:13):
Like I said earlier, typically people bite off more than they can chew.

Nick Pearson (00:18:16):
And then they come and hike with us crazy sober folks.

Nick Pearson (00:18:19):
And we're talking about,

Nick Pearson (00:18:20):
oh,

Nick Pearson (00:18:20):
my God,

Nick Pearson (00:18:20):
this time I stole my mom's wedding ring to sell it for some crack.

Nick Pearson (00:18:23):
And like then I bought it back from the store so I could sell it again.

Nick Pearson (00:18:27):
You know,

Nick Pearson (00:18:27):
like we have these crazy stories and it kind of scares people off to come back into it.

Nick Pearson (00:18:31):
And so I have to kind of almost hold hands with some of these newcomers that it's like.

Nick Pearson (00:18:36):
Yeah, because a lot of people, they tell their war stories.

Nick Pearson (00:18:37):
That's how we connect, right?

Nick Pearson (00:18:39):
Like this crazy time in my life and here's how I connected.

Nick Pearson (00:18:42):
Oh my God, you did that too?

Nick Pearson (00:18:44):
Cool.

Nick Pearson (00:18:44):
And now let's go finish this hike together.

Nick Pearson (00:18:47):
And some of the newcomers, they're just like, what did I just get myself into?

Nick Pearson (00:18:50):
Oh, trust me.

Nick Pearson (00:18:51):
I know you went to that liquor store at 8 a.m., sweetie.

Nick Pearson (00:18:53):
Like time will tell us.

Nick Pearson (00:18:56):
So,

Nick Pearson (00:18:57):
um,

Nick Pearson (00:18:57):
and you know,

Nick Pearson (00:18:57):
the bear,

Nick Pearson (00:18:58):
the other,

Nick Pearson (00:18:58):
uh,

Nick Pearson (00:18:58):
that was a good one that,

Nick Pearson (00:19:00):
um,

Nick Pearson (00:19:00):
that we've come across.

Nick Pearson (00:19:01):
That was a pretty scary one.

Nick Pearson (00:19:02):
Cause that was the first time I had encountered an animal when I was like,

Nick Pearson (00:19:06):
when people like weirdly look up to me on the trips and I'm like,

Nick Pearson (00:19:09):
you guys,

Nick Pearson (00:19:09):
I'm just a normal dude.

Nick Pearson (00:19:10):
I don't even, I wasn't even a boy scout by any means.

Nick Pearson (00:19:12):
Like, I just know how to camp from like my own thing.

Nick Pearson (00:19:14):
So camping with 20, 25 people and having bear come through.

Nick Pearson (00:19:19):
All I know is don't move because if all my other friends were there,

Nick Pearson (00:19:21):
they'd all be running and screaming too.

Colin Casey (00:19:24):
The activity so far just been in the Colorado state or have you tried to?

Nick Pearson (00:19:29):
We've got a Portland chapter and then a Boston chapter and then an Austin chapter too.

Nick Pearson (00:19:35):
But Austin is more indoorsy stuff.

Nick Pearson (00:19:37):
So they haven't really quite taken over our name yet.

Nick Pearson (00:19:40):
okay like rock indoor rock climbing type rock climbing and things like that yeah

Colin Casey (00:19:44):
okay i know that's big here because we don't have a lot of mountains but we have a

Colin Casey (00:19:48):
lot of rock climbing gyms yeah yeah parts of and austin's got a lot of bike trails

Nick Pearson (00:19:53):
and lakes where you can go canoeing and stuff yeah so and we would like this to be

Nick Pearson (00:19:58):
a national program of some kind now we know in ohio can't exactly like in a

Nick Pearson (00:20:02):
cornfield go

Nick Pearson (00:20:04):
But we're going to try and make it the best for everyone.

Nick Pearson (00:20:06):
You can go ice fishing.

Nick Pearson (00:20:08):
You can go ice fishing.

Nick Pearson (00:20:08):
It's true.

Nick Pearson (00:20:09):
You can.

Nick Pearson (00:20:10):
And I've always wanted to go, even though I hate fishing.

Nick Pearson (00:20:12):
But I think there's something cool and peaceful about sitting on some ice,

Nick Pearson (00:20:15):
freezing your tail off.

Nick Pearson (00:20:17):
I never would have thought that was cool years ago.

Nick Pearson (00:20:19):
But yeah, so we've got really four chapters.

Nick Pearson (00:20:22):
The majority of it all happens here in Denver because we've got really the big

Nick Pearson (00:20:26):
backyard here with everything you possibly want to do in the outdoors.

Nick Pearson (00:20:30):
So I'd love to see Seattle open up.

Nick Pearson (00:20:34):
You know, even like Albuquerque and other parts of the country open up with other chapters too.

Nick Pearson (00:20:38):
It's just hard to manage some of that all from Denver because I'm doing my thing here in Denver.

Nick Pearson (00:20:44):
We've got ambassadors learning their thing out in Seattle or Austin,

Nick Pearson (00:20:48):
you know,

Nick Pearson (00:20:48):
wherever they might be trying to like build a chapter.

Nick Pearson (00:20:51):
I've got some marketing money for you,

Nick Pearson (00:20:52):
but you've got to hit the ground and go out and pass out cards and try to get

Nick Pearson (00:20:55):
people to these events.

Nick Pearson (00:20:56):
Yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:20:57):
You know, it's an interesting ride.

Nick Pearson (00:20:59):
And we've worked with another organization called LGBT Outdoors that is actually

Nick Pearson (00:21:04):
very similar to our setup of our organization with ambassadors and things like that.

Nick Pearson (00:21:08):
You know,

Nick Pearson (00:21:10):
right now we're focusing on partnerships to be able to grow some of our offerings

Nick Pearson (00:21:13):
here in Denver and then replicate that.

Nick Pearson (00:21:15):
So think of like nature-based therapy hikes.

Nick Pearson (00:21:18):
But, you know, that's not every hike.

Nick Pearson (00:21:20):
It can be ones that you want to go on.

Nick Pearson (00:21:21):
Maybe you want a therapist-led one.

Nick Pearson (00:21:24):
Um,

Nick Pearson (00:21:24):
we do already on the back end of sober outdoors,

Nick Pearson (00:21:27):
help people find treatment as kind of an out of our pastime.

Nick Pearson (00:21:30):
It's just,

Nick Pearson (00:21:30):
it's part of our business that I didn't know was gonna be a part of our business,

Nick Pearson (00:21:33):
but,

Nick Pearson (00:21:34):
um,

Nick Pearson (00:21:34):
it,

Nick Pearson (00:21:35):
we probably helped three to five people find treatment a week.

Nick Pearson (00:21:38):
Um, awesome.

Nick Pearson (00:21:40):
Yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:21:40):
So really what that looks like is our community outreach folks,

Nick Pearson (00:21:43):
like picking up the phone and being like,

Nick Pearson (00:21:44):
do you have a bed available?

(00:21:45):
Um,

Nick Pearson (00:21:46):
And if we want to get more funding as an organization,

Nick Pearson (00:21:49):
we need to have credentialed people picking up the phone and being like,

Nick Pearson (00:21:51):
hey,

Nick Pearson (00:21:51):
do you have a bet available for my client around the HIPAA things and so on.

Rachel Casey (00:21:56):
Did this start off as an organization or how did you really start this off?

Rachel Casey (00:22:00):
Because even we as a podcast, do we want to go nonprofit?

Rachel Casey (00:22:05):
Do we want to do organization kind of thing?

Rachel Casey (00:22:06):
Yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:22:07):
was to like get people together in the professional standpoint.

Nick Pearson (00:22:10):
But like, I just wanted to go grab coffee with strangers, right.

Nick Pearson (00:22:13):
That knew what it was like to get,

Nick Pearson (00:22:15):
to be sober at like one of these outdoor events where people are,

Nick Pearson (00:22:18):
you know,

Nick Pearson (00:22:19):
Patagonia has a booth bigger than my house and it's all closed off to the public

Nick Pearson (00:22:23):
and so on.

Nick Pearson (00:22:24):
But it was a hobby.

Nick Pearson (00:22:25):
And then,

Nick Pearson (00:22:26):
you know,

Nick Pearson (00:22:27):
I was working for a sunglass company up until September of this past year and

Nick Pearson (00:22:32):
And each time I've come across a moment of growth with Sober Outdoors,

Nick Pearson (00:22:36):
it's been like,

Nick Pearson (00:22:37):
when I first started it,

Nick Pearson (00:22:38):
my therapist was like,

Nick Pearson (00:22:39):
Nick,

Nick Pearson (00:22:39):
if you don't do it,

Nick Pearson (00:22:39):
it's never going to happen.

Nick Pearson (00:22:40):
So you might as well just do it.

Rachel Casey (00:22:41):
My therapist told me to do this podcast.

Rachel Casey (00:22:42):
So yeah, I mean, it's funny how... Yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:22:46):
And then,

Nick Pearson (00:22:47):
you know,

Nick Pearson (00:22:47):
the next iteration was my friends kind of telling me like,

Nick Pearson (00:22:50):
no,

Nick Pearson (00:22:50):
no,

Nick Pearson (00:22:50):
no,

Nick Pearson (00:22:51):
like you need to do this.

Nick Pearson (00:22:52):
Like...

Nick Pearson (00:22:52):
make it bigger open up portland open up here like and just kind of grow it is

Colin Casey (00:22:57):
naturally i was gonna ask how's the support from friends and family when you said

Nick Pearson (00:23:01):
you wanted to do this in transition i mean my dad is he's still a little uh he's

Nick Pearson (00:23:07):
still a little like you need to go work a real job but he's so supportive of it

Nick Pearson (00:23:11):
that like he sees the success that we've had and you know i have people come like

Nick Pearson (00:23:17):
you know initially like

Nick Pearson (00:23:18):
He would come to some of my events and he would just see how excited people were to be there.

Nick Pearson (00:23:24):
How something like a small that I put together has like 25, 30 people showing up to it.

Nick Pearson (00:23:29):
I put together my first event, my first actual Sober Sober Outdoors event.

Nick Pearson (00:23:33):
And it was a hike.

Nick Pearson (00:23:34):
And I remember like 17 people showed up and I was literally cuffing myself.

Nick Pearson (00:23:38):
How did these people find me?

Nick Pearson (00:23:39):
On our website, we had like 300 people see us in like two months.

Nick Pearson (00:23:43):
How did they find me on social media?

Nick Pearson (00:23:45):
I have like barely 100 followers.

Nick Pearson (00:23:47):
And we put up some ad in a few places, a paid ad, and just word of mouth.

Nick Pearson (00:23:52):
And once that started, the sky was the limit in terms of getting people involved.

Nick Pearson (00:23:57):
And so it's still really small compared to where I want it to be.

Nick Pearson (00:24:00):
And I was working a cushy job.

Nick Pearson (00:24:02):
I'll tell you,

Nick Pearson (00:24:02):
working at Nonprofit Life is...

Rachel Casey (00:24:04):
But it sounds like that also,

Rachel Casey (00:24:06):
that was some of the things that led you to the path to be able to run this efficiently.

Rachel Casey (00:24:10):
You kind of have the training, if you will.

Nick Pearson (00:24:12):
Yeah, definitely.

Nick Pearson (00:24:14):
And honestly...

Nick Pearson (00:24:15):
I think you just have to like decide,

Nick Pearson (00:24:17):
like,

Nick Pearson (00:24:17):
you know,

Nick Pearson (00:24:17):
I was really kind of unhappy in my career.

Nick Pearson (00:24:19):
I'm working at this particular company back in the fall.

Nick Pearson (00:24:24):
I had a conversation with my friend and sponsor who was an old sponsor of mine.

Nick Pearson (00:24:28):
And he's just like,

Nick Pearson (00:24:29):
again,

Nick Pearson (00:24:29):
Nick,

Nick Pearson (00:24:29):
if you want to do this and make it like into really what you want to do,

Nick Pearson (00:24:32):
you got to put all your eggs in one basket by that.

Nick Pearson (00:24:35):
Don't worry about your company, leave your company and go do sober outdoors full time.

Nick Pearson (00:24:39):
And I was like, but

Nick Pearson (00:24:40):
the winters are slow for us.

Nick Pearson (00:24:41):
He's like, you're making excuses for every reason not to do this.

Nick Pearson (00:24:45):
So we're going into our first season with me on deck and I literally work seven days a week.

Nick Pearson (00:24:51):
Nonprofit life is so much more, so much more busy than corporate America.

Nick Pearson (00:24:55):
Sometimes I look back and I used to think I worked a lot.

Nick Pearson (00:24:57):
Now I'm on my phone like 24 hours a day.

Nick Pearson (00:24:59):
Yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:25:02):
I think I've got staff around me.

Nick Pearson (00:25:04):
Lori, who handles a lot of my PR stuff, for example, she just is so great.

Nick Pearson (00:25:10):
She's able to, all right, Nick, here's what you need to know.

Nick Pearson (00:25:12):
She's like, I have 30 minutes with Nick.

Nick Pearson (00:25:14):
This is all I get with him for the next two days.

Nick Pearson (00:25:16):
And then he'll be out the door with partnerships.

Nick Pearson (00:25:18):
I speak at a lot of treatment centers here in Denver.

Nick Pearson (00:25:21):
It's just, it's amazing.

Nick Pearson (00:25:23):
I love it.

Nick Pearson (00:25:23):
I absolutely love it.

Nick Pearson (00:25:25):
Like just being able to go to detox centers where I've detoxed.

Nick Pearson (00:25:29):
And speak to people and be like,

Nick Pearson (00:25:31):
look,

Nick Pearson (00:25:31):
guys,

Nick Pearson (00:25:31):
I was a punk when I was in here and I never thought I'd run a nonprofit.

Nick Pearson (00:25:36):
I never, especially one that helps people get outside.

Nick Pearson (00:25:38):
That just seems like way too much work.

Nick Pearson (00:25:40):
I'd want something super lazy where people just give me money.

Nick Pearson (00:25:43):
But, you know, here it is.

Nick Pearson (00:25:44):
I'm like doing this and seeing these people that really are struggling in that moment.

Nick Pearson (00:25:48):
And they kind of see you in their eyes and they're like, oh, my gosh, like.

Nick Pearson (00:25:52):
I can get sober.

Nick Pearson (00:25:54):
It is possible.

Nick Pearson (00:25:54):
I'm seeing real life putting up.

Nick Pearson (00:25:56):
I remember I did some service work at a detox center literally a year to the day

Nick Pearson (00:26:02):
that I went to treatment.

Nick Pearson (00:26:03):
It was my first day sober in my entire adult life.

Nick Pearson (00:26:06):
A year later, I went to this detox center and I was like, you guys, it's real.

Nick Pearson (00:26:10):
Seeing that on those people's faces,

Nick Pearson (00:26:11):
it was like,

Nick Pearson (00:26:12):
one day I need to give back more than just coming and doing a service.

Nick Pearson (00:26:16):
Here we are,

Nick Pearson (00:26:16):
like,

Nick Pearson (00:26:16):
just trying to change some people's lives one outdoor adventure at a time,

Nick Pearson (00:26:20):
you know?

Rachel Casey (00:26:21):
Oh, that's awesome.

Colin Casey (00:26:22):
Now that you're six years sober,

Colin Casey (00:26:24):
what has changed throughout your sobriety of what you do now to kind of stay sober?

Colin Casey (00:26:30):
Because I know, I mean, we're only three years.

Nick Pearson (00:26:33):
That's a long time, guys.

Colin Casey (00:26:34):
Yeah.

Colin Casey (00:26:35):
But we've gone through dips and changes of how I found a good routine of going to

Colin Casey (00:26:40):
the gym and going to meetings and seeing my sponsor about twice a month.

Colin Casey (00:26:44):
I've gotten into such a good routine mentally and physically.

Colin Casey (00:26:48):
And I was just curious to you, what do you do to stay kind of in that...

Nick Pearson (00:26:53):
Yeah,

Nick Pearson (00:26:54):
a lot of work I do just in my day to day helps me stay sober and like my program

Nick Pearson (00:26:59):
has become pretty laxed.

Nick Pearson (00:27:00):
I'll just be honest, that's full transparency.

Nick Pearson (00:27:02):
And I would say just like something that I've learned over the years,

Nick Pearson (00:27:07):
it used to be the small things that would trip me up in my sobriety.

Nick Pearson (00:27:10):
And then it became the big things that would trip me up, right?

Nick Pearson (00:27:12):
And so the three-year mark, the two-year mark, whatever mark I was kind of crossing.

Nick Pearson (00:27:16):
And trust me, I've come real close to the bottle multiple times, like really, really close.

Nick Pearson (00:27:21):
But I've had friends and family to be there.

Nick Pearson (00:27:23):
I'm like, no, don't do it, Nick.

Nick Pearson (00:27:25):
And here's how we're going to keep you away from that.

Nick Pearson (00:27:28):
is just like not learning how that life's going to happen and it's going to happen

Nick Pearson (00:27:32):
when you least expect it.

Nick Pearson (00:27:33):
Two years ago, I was celebrating a milestone and lost my job.

Nick Pearson (00:27:38):
Two days later,

Nick Pearson (00:27:38):
after I broke up my boyfriend,

Nick Pearson (00:27:40):
two days later,

Nick Pearson (00:27:41):
self-induced overdose,

Nick Pearson (00:27:42):
like in like six days,

Nick Pearson (00:27:44):
three horrible things happen.

Nick Pearson (00:27:45):
That's one of the closest I've ever been to like losing my mind.

Nick Pearson (00:27:48):
But I think it's just realizing that you're not safe from the big things either.

Nick Pearson (00:27:52):
So you always need to just be like, you can't let your guard down.

Nick Pearson (00:27:55):
That's one thing, like even doing all this

Nick Pearson (00:27:57):
lackadaisical work about my own recovery.

Nick Pearson (00:27:59):
If I wasn't doing this,

Nick Pearson (00:28:00):
I'd be sure as hell going to a meeting probably a couple of times a week,

Nick Pearson (00:28:03):
if not more.

Nick Pearson (00:28:04):
I'm just trying to, and same with you guys, you guys are doing this podcast.

Nick Pearson (00:28:08):
So you guys have purpose and you're talking to people every day.

Nick Pearson (00:28:10):
Like I,

Nick Pearson (00:28:11):
if I didn't have purpose,

Nick Pearson (00:28:12):
like I do now that would,

Nick Pearson (00:28:14):
I probably wouldn't be here,

Nick Pearson (00:28:15):
you know,

Nick Pearson (00:28:15):
where I am in my recovery or just like all the trials and tribulations I've experienced.

Nick Pearson (00:28:20):
So yeah,

Nick Pearson (00:28:21):
But mindfulness and recovery is one way that I still stay engaged in my own program,

Nick Pearson (00:28:25):
which is just a take on Dharma.

Nick Pearson (00:28:27):
It's just a little bit different.

Nick Pearson (00:28:28):
It's a program here in Colorado.

Nick Pearson (00:28:30):
This guy, John Bruna, amazing, amazing guy.

Nick Pearson (00:28:33):
If you guys ever get him on your podcast.

Nick Pearson (00:28:35):
Oh, my gosh.

Rachel Casey (00:28:35):
I feel like I've heard that name.

Nick Pearson (00:28:37):
Yeah, he's just amazing.

Nick Pearson (00:28:38):
I'll shoot you a book recommendation by him.

Nick Pearson (00:28:41):
And, you know, just working with other people, even outside of Sober Outdoors.

Nick Pearson (00:28:46):
Like I have friends who call me and they're like, my mom is finally getting sobered.

Nick Pearson (00:28:50):
Can you talk to her?

Nick Pearson (00:28:51):
And, you know, it's like, dude, I don't have time.

Nick Pearson (00:28:54):
And I don't have time.

Nick Pearson (00:28:55):
I don't have time.

Nick Pearson (00:28:56):
Oh, yes, you do.

Nick Pearson (00:28:56):
Nick, you have time to pick up the phone and call us.

Nick Pearson (00:28:59):
this woman or this friend or like a friend of a friend of a friend stay in it.

Nick Pearson (00:29:03):
And I think that's what keeps most people sober past a certain mark is just giving back.

Nick Pearson (00:29:08):
That's why the treatment centers are full of all these people that,

Nick Pearson (00:29:11):
you know,

Nick Pearson (00:29:11):
eventually got sober and here they are giving back.

Nick Pearson (00:29:13):
And then same with folks like you and me and people that are really hell bent on AA

Nick Pearson (00:29:18):
and staying in the program,

Nick Pearson (00:29:19):
like they're just always giving back.

Nick Pearson (00:29:21):
And I think that,

Nick Pearson (00:29:22):
I don't know of another way to stay sober.

Rachel Casey (00:29:27):
Are you, are you with someone who's sober?

Nick Pearson (00:29:29):
Are you with, if you are currently single, I've done both.

Nick Pearson (00:29:33):
I've done someone in the program and someone out of the program.

Nick Pearson (00:29:37):
I wouldn't recommend dating someone dating.

Nick Pearson (00:29:39):
That's not sober.

Nick Pearson (00:29:40):
Personally.

Nick Pearson (00:29:41):
I did that.

Nick Pearson (00:29:42):
And just the disconnect between like, I cannot have a drink.

Nick Pearson (00:29:46):
You know, one is too many a thousand is not enough for me.

Nick Pearson (00:29:49):
Like,

Nick Pearson (00:29:50):
he just didn't understand that.

Nick Pearson (00:29:51):
Yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:29:51):
That's one of us.

Nick Pearson (00:29:52):
And they're like, Oh yeah, I did.

Nick Pearson (00:29:53):
I get that.

Nick Pearson (00:29:54):
You don't have to explain yourself.

Nick Pearson (00:29:55):
And so I found that I was just like,

Nick Pearson (00:29:57):
not wanting to have to explain those silly little things about sobriety that really

Nick Pearson (00:30:04):
it's like,

Nick Pearson (00:30:04):
all I needed to do is just say I'm sober.

Nick Pearson (00:30:06):
And that was enough to the person that I was seeing that was in recovery.

Nick Pearson (00:30:10):
And, uh,

Nick Pearson (00:30:11):
And then,

Nick Pearson (00:30:11):
you know,

Nick Pearson (00:30:11):
when I got out of that relationship,

Nick Pearson (00:30:13):
I got into a relationship a year later with someone who was drinking.

Nick Pearson (00:30:16):
I thought I was maybe ready to go date someone that was like a normie.

Nick Pearson (00:30:20):
Like a normie.

Nick Pearson (00:30:21):
Yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:30:22):
Well, I can go be normal too.

Nick Pearson (00:30:23):
And I was like, this is just disastrous.

Nick Pearson (00:30:25):
I'm going to drink over this person if I don't like get out of this.

Nick Pearson (00:30:28):
And I'm glad I did.

Nick Pearson (00:30:30):
And then I got laid off and then my best friend died.

Nick Pearson (00:30:34):
I'm glad I got out of it.

Rachel Casey (00:30:35):
It's over because drinking wouldn't have helped any of those scenarios.

Rachel Casey (00:30:38):
You know, taking a drink wouldn't have...

Rachel Casey (00:30:41):
In my head, that was what I tell myself.

Rachel Casey (00:30:45):
For any situation, would taking a drink make it better?

Rachel Casey (00:30:49):
It would only just ruin it more.

Rachel Casey (00:30:50):
Now I can show up.

Rachel Casey (00:30:52):
I can do things.

Rachel Casey (00:30:54):
Have you considered if there's partners for people that are...

Rachel Casey (00:30:59):
a sober Al-Anon if you will like sober outdoors Al-Anon do you let like partners or

Rachel Casey (00:31:04):
stuff go along for the ride if they're like hey my partner's an alcoholic but we

Rachel Casey (00:31:08):
want to go hiking together you know obviously not using while you know they

Rachel Casey (00:31:12):
shouldn't be drinking around all the alcohol but yeah

Nick Pearson (00:31:15):
Yeah,

Nick Pearson (00:31:15):
there's a zero tolerance policy,

Nick Pearson (00:31:16):
but like,

Nick Pearson (00:31:17):
you know,

Nick Pearson (00:31:17):
we actually encourage it because we want,

Nick Pearson (00:31:19):
you know,

Nick Pearson (00:31:21):
allies essentially to be like to see that we are normal people.

Nick Pearson (00:31:25):
We're trying to break down the stigmas like my family.

Nick Pearson (00:31:28):
I come from a generational generation of generational alcoholics.

Nick Pearson (00:31:32):
Right.

Nick Pearson (00:31:32):
And everyone in my family is an alcoholic.

Nick Pearson (00:31:35):
And they just thought when I was turning my life over sobriety,

Nick Pearson (00:31:38):
I was going to become this boring,

Nick Pearson (00:31:39):
like useless,

Nick Pearson (00:31:40):
sitting at home doing nothing,

Nick Pearson (00:31:41):
totally my thumbs.

Nick Pearson (00:31:42):
And the first six months I was because I was like, I'm going to go crazy.

Nick Pearson (00:31:44):
I'm going to go drink if I leave my apartment.

Nick Pearson (00:31:47):
But then I kind of learned how to do it on my own.

Nick Pearson (00:31:49):
And so we want people to see that this is like a fun group of people that,

Nick Pearson (00:31:54):
you know,

Nick Pearson (00:31:54):
you are a human being.

Nick Pearson (00:31:55):
You're not a stigma.

Nick Pearson (00:31:56):
You're not morally inept or you're any of these things that live out there about

Nick Pearson (00:32:00):
people that have substance use problems.

Nick Pearson (00:32:03):
You know, and for the time being, I don't know if this is going to change or not.

Nick Pearson (00:32:06):
You know, it's a federally recognized disease.

Nick Pearson (00:32:08):
Right.

Nick Pearson (00:32:08):
So it's like this is something that I think a lot of people don't know about addiction.

Nick Pearson (00:32:13):
And even if you tell them that to their friends and families,

Nick Pearson (00:32:15):
they're like,

Nick Pearson (00:32:16):
oh,

Nick Pearson (00:32:16):
I didn't know that.

Nick Pearson (00:32:16):
It's like, yeah, it's actually such a disease that it's actually federally protected.

Nick Pearson (00:32:21):
And we don't take one hard approach or another at Summer Outdoors like this is a disease.

Nick Pearson (00:32:27):
a disease of the mind or it's this or that or another.

Nick Pearson (00:32:30):
We welcome everyone's belief into what addiction is because it is so misunderstood.

Nick Pearson (00:32:34):
But my own personal belief and what does come through in some of our literature is

Nick Pearson (00:32:38):
for this time being,

Nick Pearson (00:32:39):
this is a federally recognized disease.

Nick Pearson (00:32:41):
That's why we're going to look at it and that's why we're going to treat it.

Nick Pearson (00:32:43):
So...

Rachel Casey (00:32:44):
Yeah, that's a great outlook.

Rachel Casey (00:32:45):
I love that.

Nick Pearson (00:32:46):
Yeah.

Rachel Casey (00:32:47):
So I think that's cool that you let partners go along because I think we're kind of an anomaly.

Rachel Casey (00:32:52):
Most people either one gets sober or one doesn't or yeah,

Rachel Casey (00:32:57):
how we were drinking buddies that got sober together.

Rachel Casey (00:33:00):
I didn't.

Nick Pearson (00:33:01):
And again, one in a million guys.

Rachel Casey (00:33:04):
It's very, um, I like the name sober ally.

Rachel Casey (00:33:08):
I wrote that stuck in my,

Rachel Casey (00:33:09):
I'm like,

Rachel Casey (00:33:10):
man,

Rachel Casey (00:33:10):
that's such a good,

Rachel Casey (00:33:11):
it's a,

Rachel Casey (00:33:11):
so that's what you want to be.

Rachel Casey (00:33:13):
I'm an ally.

Rachel Casey (00:33:13):
If you need it, you know, I'm here.

Rachel Casey (00:33:17):
And it's funny because you probably get to the outdoors and,

Rachel Casey (00:33:20):
and you're not really thinking about it.

Rachel Casey (00:33:23):
being sober not being sober like sure it's just you're in the you're able to be in

Rachel Casey (00:33:26):
the moment yeah yeah yeah do you do meditations and stuff on the yeah we do we do

Nick Pearson (00:33:32):
we typically start with some sort of guided meditation or we challenge people to

Nick Pearson (00:33:37):
think about a certain principle or something to think about throughout the trip we

Nick Pearson (00:33:42):
have fun like we tie it to something fun at the end like

Nick Pearson (00:33:45):
we'll get we'll do a gear giveaway and it's like do you remember what i said at the

Nick Pearson (00:33:48):
beginning of this most people don't but we try to encourage them to do a five

Nick Pearson (00:33:51):
senses hike or anything that they can make their own personal experience with it

Nick Pearson (00:33:56):
better and then and to get some of those bigger grant money that we are looking at

Nick Pearson (00:34:01):
uh to grow our programming is like we'll need to have therapists doing some of

Nick Pearson (00:34:04):
those like

Nick Pearson (00:34:05):
nature-based hikes where they do challenge people a lot more to just do more than

Nick Pearson (00:34:10):
just the hiking.

Nick Pearson (00:34:11):
And I think that it will actually really resonate with people because everyone I've

Nick Pearson (00:34:15):
ever talked to that's done therapy and they've done it outdoors,

Nick Pearson (00:34:17):
which my therapist used to take me on walks all the time.

Nick Pearson (00:34:20):
I was like,

Nick Pearson (00:34:20):
dude,

Nick Pearson (00:34:20):
I wanted to go on a walk every time I went to therapy and she wouldn't let me

Nick Pearson (00:34:24):
because it would be snowing outside.

Nick Pearson (00:34:25):
But I thought that was amazing.

Nick Pearson (00:34:27):
And like, why can't we offer that back?

Nick Pearson (00:34:29):
Obviously it's not going to go on five hikes a week or five hikes a day, but like,

Nick Pearson (00:34:32):
How can we make a group therapy or something like that into a more accessible thing for people?

Nick Pearson (00:34:38):
Because one, cost is a barrier for therapy.

Nick Pearson (00:34:41):
We can't just hand a scholarship to everyone that needs to go to therapy.

Nick Pearson (00:34:44):
And then two, how do we make therapy more accessible to people?

Nick Pearson (00:34:47):
Maybe a group setting at the top of a mountain is the way to do it.

Rachel Casey (00:34:51):
I think that sounds like a great idea.

Rachel Casey (00:34:53):
And if anyone listening knows any connections on how to help get Sober Outdoors

Rachel Casey (00:34:59):
some grants to be able to do things like that,

Rachel Casey (00:35:02):
please go.

Rachel Casey (00:35:03):
And I know your website, Sober Outdoors, and it's .org.

Rachel Casey (00:35:07):
And all the content, your website is laid out so beautifully.

Rachel Casey (00:35:11):
Like it's very easy to navigate.

Rachel Casey (00:35:13):
The pictures speak for themselves.

Rachel Casey (00:35:15):
Yeah.

Rachel Casey (00:35:16):
I did not have a hard time.

Rachel Casey (00:35:18):
Everything's very well labeled of, Hey, you want to do this.

Rachel Casey (00:35:21):
You want to look at this contact information events.

Rachel Casey (00:35:24):
You even have the past events.

Rachel Casey (00:35:25):
So if you want to see some of the things you've done already,

Rachel Casey (00:35:28):
I really liked an upcoming events on your webpage.

Rachel Casey (00:35:33):
So as well as there's Instagram,

Rachel Casey (00:35:35):
which I feel like that's the new,

Rachel Casey (00:35:38):
I feel like Facebook's kind of falling off.

Nick Pearson (00:35:40):
I do too.

Rachel Casey (00:35:41):
Yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:35:42):
But it's weird to get a lot of, a lot of people my age, I'm 36.

Nick Pearson (00:35:48):
I thought 36 year olds didn't use Instagram and stuff, let alone Facebook, but they do.

Nick Pearson (00:35:52):
Yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:35:53):
And like they do a lot.

Nick Pearson (00:35:55):
I don't use social media that much anymore.

Nick Pearson (00:35:57):
I have to do it for work for sober outdoors.

Nick Pearson (00:36:00):
But the amount of people my age that still use Facebook blows me away.

Nick Pearson (00:36:03):
I'm like,

Nick Pearson (00:36:03):
what are these?

Nick Pearson (00:36:04):
Cause they'll reach out to me for all sorts of questions.

Nick Pearson (00:36:06):
And like,

Nick Pearson (00:36:07):
you know,

Nick Pearson (00:36:07):
and I'm like,

Nick Pearson (00:36:08):
who,

Nick Pearson (00:36:08):
like what 38 year old that loves like everything I love is still using Facebook and

Nick Pearson (00:36:13):
people do,

Nick Pearson (00:36:13):
man.

Nick Pearson (00:36:14):
I mean, it's, it's, I think there's still a market there.

Nick Pearson (00:36:17):
You know, now we just have to figure out how to use some of those other, uh,

Nick Pearson (00:36:20):
social media tools that are a little,

Nick Pearson (00:36:22):
like,

Nick Pearson (00:36:22):
controversial,

Nick Pearson (00:36:23):
but,

Nick Pearson (00:36:24):
like,

Nick Pearson (00:36:24):
people decide to go down that path.

Nick Pearson (00:36:26):
Like, we've had multiple people ask me, are we on Blue Sky?

Nick Pearson (00:36:30):
And I'm like, I don't know what that was until, like, a week ago.

Rachel Casey (00:36:32):
Yeah, I just made a Blue Sky, and I'm like, I don't know what this is.

Rachel Casey (00:36:37):
And I get, I'm just already...

Nick Pearson (00:36:39):
You're like, it's another one.

Rachel Casey (00:36:41):
There's so many.

Rachel Casey (00:36:42):
And then now Pinterest is coming back.

Rachel Casey (00:36:44):
And I don't know how that,

Rachel Casey (00:36:45):
and especially if you're outdoors,

Rachel Casey (00:36:47):
I would say Pinterest is apparently cute.

Colin Casey (00:36:49):
You just want to go back to Zynga days where there was just one.

Rachel Casey (00:36:52):
Man, I love doing code on Zynga.

Rachel Casey (00:36:53):
I love Zynga.

Nick Pearson (00:36:54):
No, I'm talking MySpace, the top eight, just to start drama, guys.

Nick Pearson (00:36:57):
Yeah.

Rachel Casey (00:36:58):
Yeah.

Rachel Casey (00:36:59):
Oh, my.

Rachel Casey (00:36:59):
You'd have a hard time probably picking a top eight today.

Rachel Casey (00:37:01):
Yeah, probably.

Rachel Casey (00:37:02):
Hard because on you're like,

Rachel Casey (00:37:04):
you know,

Rachel Casey (00:37:04):
I don't even want to do this because I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings.

Rachel Casey (00:37:07):
And I don't want anyone having resentments.

Rachel Casey (00:37:08):
And can you imagine going to your sponsor and being like, I'm not in their top eight.

Nick Pearson (00:37:12):
I'm mad about it, bro.

Rachel Casey (00:37:16):
I had that feeling 1000%.

Nick Pearson (00:37:18):
Yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:37:19):
Like I saved that man's life and I'm not even in his top eight.

Nick Pearson (00:37:21):
Like get out of here.

Rachel Casey (00:37:22):
I'm number three.

Rachel Casey (00:37:23):
Why am I not number one?

Rachel Casey (00:37:25):
Like my ego is number one, you know, and I can only imagine.

Nick Pearson (00:37:29):
It's high school all over again.

Nick Pearson (00:37:31):
Yeah.

Rachel Casey (00:37:31):
You want to go in my, you want to be my top eight?

Rachel Casey (00:37:34):
Yeah, right.

Rachel Casey (00:37:35):
Your sponsor's not in your top eight.

Nick Pearson (00:37:37):
You're not taking it serious enough, apparently.

Rachel Casey (00:37:39):
You're not taking it serious.

Rachel Casey (00:37:39):
If you don't put your sponsor in your top eight, what are you doing?

Rachel Casey (00:37:43):
And then you think of that.

Rachel Casey (00:37:44):
Was the T-Mobile did the thing, the emergency contact bubble when they had the sidekick?

Colin Casey (00:37:51):
Well, there was the My5 or something like that.

Colin Casey (00:37:54):
Yeah, something.

Nick Pearson (00:37:55):
My5, I think, yeah.

Rachel Casey (00:37:55):
I'm glad that life isn't about hierarchy anymore.

Rachel Casey (00:38:00):
It's very...

Nick Pearson (00:38:02):
I don't know about that, but yes.

Rachel Casey (00:38:06):
At least I don't feel, even when we get messages or Instagram of

Rachel Casey (00:38:11):
anyone who like reaches out to come on the pot,

Rachel Casey (00:38:14):
it's like,

Rachel Casey (00:38:15):
yeah,

Rachel Casey (00:38:15):
we want to boost you ever because they're helping.

Rachel Casey (00:38:19):
Like,

Rachel Casey (00:38:19):
so helping it's all,

Rachel Casey (00:38:22):
I don't look at it as like,

Rachel Casey (00:38:23):
oh,

Rachel Casey (00:38:23):
I don't want,

Rachel Casey (00:38:23):
I'm competing against like this recovery podcast or,

Rachel Casey (00:38:28):
or event.

Rachel Casey (00:38:29):
Like, I'm like, no, go do it.

Rachel Casey (00:38:31):
Go you like I'm, I'm for it.

Rachel Casey (00:38:33):
I'm for it.

Rachel Casey (00:38:34):
So it's a really nice turn.

Nick Pearson (00:38:36):
On an ideal day,

Nick Pearson (00:38:38):
me doing less events outside and people naturally finding their groups within our

Nick Pearson (00:38:42):
group and them going on their own campouts is the most beautiful thing to me,

Nick Pearson (00:38:45):
right?

Nick Pearson (00:38:45):
Like they meet their community through an event of ours that likes going outdoors.

Nick Pearson (00:38:49):
And then suddenly we don't have to like,

Nick Pearson (00:38:51):
do any sort of the pulling people together on a Saturday.

Nick Pearson (00:38:55):
So we've got a member side of our website that folks actually – it is kind of like

Nick Pearson (00:39:00):
social media now that since we're talking about it.

Nick Pearson (00:39:02):
It's just a platform we use called Mining Networks, but it interacts similar to social media.

Nick Pearson (00:39:08):
If you go on a hike and you want to meet up with that person later, go meet them.

Nick Pearson (00:39:11):
Because if it means less work for me, that's better because it means I get to focus on –

Nick Pearson (00:39:15):
Other things I want to do.

Rachel Casey (00:39:17):
It's the same like when I get a sponsee and I'm like,

Rachel Casey (00:39:20):
hey,

Rachel Casey (00:39:20):
if you ever want to get a different,

Rachel Casey (00:39:21):
it's not going to hurt my feelings.

Rachel Casey (00:39:22):
The most important thing for me is that you are staying sober.

Rachel Casey (00:39:26):
So if that means that it's not with me, our schedules don't align.

Rachel Casey (00:39:30):
That's fine.

Rachel Casey (00:39:30):
And people get so weird about it.

Rachel Casey (00:39:32):
They're like, yeah, I don't want to.

Rachel Casey (00:39:34):
It's listen.

Rachel Casey (00:39:36):
If you're finding a time that you can go hike with someone and it's beneficial for

Rachel Casey (00:39:40):
the both of y'all to stay sober.

Colin Casey (00:39:42):
Do it.

Rachel Casey (00:39:42):
Do it.

Rachel Casey (00:39:43):
You know,

Rachel Casey (00:39:43):
I love the positive support versus I've been in other works of life where it's all

Rachel Casey (00:39:52):
like better than versus let's just all group and help.

Rachel Casey (00:39:57):
And that's what I love about the sober community.

Nick Pearson (00:39:59):
So I was going to say, I didn't know, like, I'm sure you guys find the same thing.

Nick Pearson (00:40:02):
Like I'm on a lot of partnerships calls every day and we're just trying to find or

Nick Pearson (00:40:07):
partner or be a better partner to our existing partners.

Nick Pearson (00:40:10):
And, uh,

Nick Pearson (00:40:12):
And it's just so easy and fun to talk to people in the industry because we're all

Nick Pearson (00:40:15):
in this game,

Nick Pearson (00:40:16):
whatever we want to call it,

Nick Pearson (00:40:17):
to help people at the end of the day.

Nick Pearson (00:40:19):
Yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:40:20):
That's the goal.

Nick Pearson (00:40:21):
Sometimes I feel like I'm pulling my hair out and I'm like,

Nick Pearson (00:40:23):
I have to remember I'm doing this for the one end goal of helping that person stay

Nick Pearson (00:40:26):
sober and everything.

Nick Pearson (00:40:27):
And I'm like, when I get the days over, I'm like, so effing worth it.

Nick Pearson (00:40:33):
I think everyone feels the same way in the industry.

Nick Pearson (00:40:37):
I wouldn't call this a treatment industry or the support industry.

Nick Pearson (00:40:40):
We're going to be this weird quasi,

Nick Pearson (00:40:42):
like go to therapy at the top of a mountain,

Nick Pearson (00:40:44):
but also we're not going to do that because you can do this.

Nick Pearson (00:40:46):
Right.

Nick Pearson (00:40:47):
Like, still don't know what our game plan is.

Nick Pearson (00:40:49):
But,

Nick Pearson (00:40:49):
you know,

Nick Pearson (00:40:51):
I love talking to other organizations,

Nick Pearson (00:40:52):
even if they're similar to ours in some way or another.

Nick Pearson (00:40:55):
There's a few others that are kind of similar to ours,

Nick Pearson (00:40:57):
but they're very location-based,

Nick Pearson (00:41:00):
just in their one part of their...

Nick Pearson (00:41:02):
country and so but like there's no competition here right like we're all in this to

Nick Pearson (00:41:06):
help and like why would I want to compete with you trying to compete for what donor

Nick Pearson (00:41:10):
dollars like that seems pretty like political in my opinion you know so like let's

Nick Pearson (00:41:15):
try and help this person whether they like

Nick Pearson (00:41:18):
Painting at a, you know, at an abandoned strip club versus going hiking.

Nick Pearson (00:41:22):
I don't know.

Nick Pearson (00:41:22):
Like we had one of those with that.

Nick Pearson (00:41:24):
I went to a sober event.

Nick Pearson (00:41:25):
That was an abandoned strip club painting at an abandoned strip club.

Nick Pearson (00:41:28):
It was really cool.

Rachel Casey (00:41:30):
Very specific example.

Rachel Casey (00:41:31):
Yeah.

Rachel Casey (00:41:32):
I know.

Rachel Casey (00:41:32):
I know.

Nick Pearson (00:41:34):
I had just,

Nick Pearson (00:41:35):
I like,

Nick Pearson (00:41:35):
I've kind of forget about it till it's times like these that I'm getting

Nick Pearson (00:41:37):
interviewed or something comes up and I'm like,

Nick Pearson (00:41:39):
yeah,

Nick Pearson (00:41:40):
I've done that.

Nick Pearson (00:41:40):
Like literally sat there in an, it's probably hard to repurpose that building for anything else.

Colin Casey (00:41:46):
Exactly.

Rachel Casey (00:41:47):
So it's like, I mean, it's sober too.

Rachel Casey (00:41:49):
Am I right?

Colin Casey (00:41:50):
It'd be hard to move a chase bank, you know, in that building with poles.

Colin Casey (00:41:54):
Yeah.

Nick Pearson (00:41:54):
Let's make it a community center.

Nick Pearson (00:41:56):
Cause why not?

Rachel Casey (00:41:57):
I mean, just, you know, all we're doing is not drinking.

Rachel Casey (00:42:00):
We can do anything in the world we want.

Rachel Casey (00:42:02):
We just don't put alcohol in our bodies anymore.

Rachel Casey (00:42:04):
you know and it's cool how that that works well thank you so much for coming on

Rachel Casey (00:42:08):
nick uh please every all links are in the bio uh if you want to contact him again

Rachel Casey (00:42:14):
sober outdoors.org is out the best way to reach you and i mean it has a lot of

Rachel Casey (00:42:20):
contact information on there it's very awesome and if you even want to just go look

Rachel Casey (00:42:24):
at the events coming up there are awesome pictures

Rachel Casey (00:42:27):
It's going to tell you maybe you can go fly out to Colorado and do one.

Rachel Casey (00:42:30):
We have family in Colorado, so we might have to come stop by.

Colin Casey (00:42:33):
Yeah, we have family in Denver area.

Rachel Casey (00:42:35):
If I can finally get healthy, that would be cool.

Nick Pearson (00:42:38):
Yeah, get healthy and then come out to Denver.

Nick Pearson (00:42:40):
I'll take you guys on a sweet trip.

Rachel Casey (00:42:41):
I was like... Yeah, that'd be so cool.

Rachel Casey (00:42:43):
Our five-year-old would...

Rachel Casey (00:42:45):
be he's the outdoorsy yeah he he rock climbs the big big big ones he loves the

Colin Casey (00:42:51):
indoor rock climb i will have a heart attack that's hard work dude that's hard work

Colin Casey (00:42:56):
it's a good honor good on no he has no and he's also he really likes the two um uh

Colin Casey (00:43:03):
What is it?

Colin Casey (00:43:04):
What do you do when you rappel down?

Colin Casey (00:43:06):
Yeah.

Colin Casey (00:43:07):
And he really likes it.

Colin Casey (00:43:08):
And I took him to one place.

Colin Casey (00:43:09):
And when he got to the top and it was time to belay, they lowered him down really slowly.

Colin Casey (00:43:14):
And he got down.

Colin Casey (00:43:15):
He's like, that was really slow, Dad.

Colin Casey (00:43:19):
Mad at the person who let him down because he wanted it faster.

Colin Casey (00:43:22):
Yeah.

Colin Casey (00:43:22):
I was like, I don't want to tell you.

Rachel Casey (00:43:25):
yeah uh evan he he's definitely an alcoholic like i'll go ahead and and he is uh he

Rachel Casey (00:43:33):
never one is not enough for this child like of anything well he's got some good

Rachel Casey (00:43:37):
parents there so all or nothing yeah well we've we tell him you know mommy and

Rachel Casey (00:43:41):
daddy don't drink anymore and we don't have alcohol because colin's parents do

Rachel Casey (00:43:46):
drink and yeah we explain you know

Rachel Casey (00:43:50):
I never thought I'd have to explain to my son.

Rachel Casey (00:43:51):
I thought he'd always know what a bottle of Jameson would look like because that was our life.

Rachel Casey (00:43:56):
It's almost his name.

Rachel Casey (00:43:57):
We were going to name him Jameson after Jameson.

Rachel Casey (00:44:00):
And, you know, thank God we went with Evan.

Nick Pearson (00:44:03):
So that was our secret bootleg drink we like to have from Evan.

Rachel Casey (00:44:08):
Well, we thought Jameson Casey sounded like a good name.

Rachel Casey (00:44:12):
Yeah.

Rachel Casey (00:44:12):
Evan Casey is so much better.

Rachel Casey (00:44:14):
And yeah.

Rachel Casey (00:44:16):
And again, we're very thankful to be so we're thankful to connect with you.

Rachel Casey (00:44:20):
And if you have any other questions,

Rachel Casey (00:44:23):
I was like,

Rachel Casey (00:44:23):
I'll put everything in the link below so they can contact you if you have any questions.

Rachel Casey (00:44:28):
for any colorado listeners too if you have any grant friends because sober friends

Rachel Casey (00:44:33):
have friends let's let's get sober outdoors to expand and get the connects they

Rachel Casey (00:44:37):
need so that's awesome all right