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Technology's daily show (formerly the Technology Brothers Podcast). Streaming live on X and YouTube from 11 - 2 PM PST Monday - Friday. Available on X, Apple, Spotify, and YouTube.
Why is no one talking about Armin Popperger? He's the CEO of Rheinmetall. Okay. And they've been on an absolute tear. We're, of course, gonna get to Code Red.
Speaker 1:We're gonna talk about OpenAI. But we talk about OpenAI every day, basically. And I thought it'd be interesting to, meet the CEO behind the world's fastest growing defense company. It's on the cover of the business section of The Wall Street Journal. Okay.
Speaker 1:When I think high growth defense companies, I usually think Andoril or, you know, Cyronic or there's so many other companies that are growing very fast in defense tech. Rheinmetall has been on an absolute tear. They're now basically the same size as Lockheed Martin and General Dynamics. You can see the the gun that they make in that picture. They make They make big guns.
Speaker 1:Massive cannons. They make artillery shells. They've been very important to the Ukraine war. So in the last three years, they've been on an absolute tear. They've gone from roughly 5,000,000,000 market cap three years ago to $80,000,000,000 in market cap.
Speaker 1:We gotta ring the gong. We gotta warm up the gong. Ring the gong. 80,000,000,000 market cap. They've been on a tear, but there's been basically three key drivers to the growth, to the story.
Speaker 1:First, they had a head start. This company, they actually started over a century ago. 1889. Can you believe that? They spend their first twenty five years basically just stacking up ammo for the German Empire.
Speaker 1:This obviously comes to a head in 1914 when World War one breaks out. At the time, the company was one of the largest arms manufacturers. Like, they were they were pretty pretty big after twenty five years of just stockpiling ammo, growing, growing, growing as a defense company. World War World War one breaks out. But then after the war, they gotta pivot.
Speaker 1:They gotta pivot because the Treaty of Versailles forces them to switch to non military products. Say, hey. You gotta
Speaker 2:build cars.
Speaker 1:Make some trains. They get fixated on trains. Trains. And also typewriters.
Speaker 2:Not the first group to get
Speaker 1:fixated
Speaker 2:on fixated on trains.
Speaker 1:And trains.
Speaker 2:It happens to the best
Speaker 1:of them. But they but they have a good run. They stay in business. They keep making trains, locomotives, particularly. You know, they're making big stuff.
Speaker 1:And then twenty years later, it's, the mid thirties. '20 it's, 1935 around there. They are, they're starting to get back into weapons and ammo production. They can't stay away. Uh-oh.
Speaker 1:Who are they rearming? The Wehrmacht. And World War two, obviously, it's massive for production. They're printing. They're making lots of weapons.
Speaker 1:But by the end of the war, their facilities have basically been destroyed by areas they need to rebuild the company from scratch. So after the second war, they get banned from making weapons again until 1950.
Speaker 2:Keeps happening.
Speaker 1:And so they have to go back to making typewriters. They keep getting relegated to typewriters. Like, you guys, no more guns.
Speaker 2:That's enough.
Speaker 1:You have to make some typewriters. And so they get back into defense tech in the fifties, sixties. The German armed forces gets reestablished in 1956. And by 1979, Rheinmetall is making a 120 millimeter guns that go on Leopard tanks that you've probably seen in that image roughly. And so there's lots of m and a, lots of diversification over the next few decades.
Speaker 1:They expand into automotive and electronics, and that kind of brings us to the second act of the story, which is the Ukraine war. Russia invaded Ukraine on 02/24/2022. Rheinmetall was around 5,500,000,000.0, market cap then. And three days later, Olaf, Scholz, the chancellor of journey Germany gives what's known as the Zeitenwald white Zeitenwende speech, which is, literally translates to turning point. So he says, this is a turning point.
Speaker 1:Europe has been invaded. We now have a foreign army on European soil. Even though Ukraine's not part of NATO, it feels like, you know, Russia is expanding. If they keep if they just keep going in the same direction, they're eventually gonna be in our hometown. So we gotta do something about it.
Speaker 1:And what does he propose? He doesn't just say, hey. This is a big deal. He says, no. We're actually going to invest a $100,000,000,000, like, off balance sheet from some fund into defense tech.
Speaker 1:We're going to spend more money. And then, of course, there's a whole bunch of other initiatives that happen. There's the Trump negotiations around how much Europe should pay as a portion of GDP on on defense. But, basically, it's this major turning point where Europe goes from spending, you know, sustainment levels. Okay.
Speaker 1:We're gonna spend this much every year to Yeah. We are going to double or triple or, you know, exponentially grow our spending, and it's all gonna be net new. So you can go and fight for it. Yeah. And that's what Ryan Mittal does.
Speaker 1:So, revenue's grown 50%, since 2022. They're guiding for sales of $58,000,000,000 and an operating margin of more than 20% by 2030. So they have, like, almost AI growth level numbers of everything. It feels very similar where there's a there's a structural change in the way their business is gonna work. Same thing as Eli Lilly.
Speaker 1:Same story. There's a couple of these stocks where there is now sort of a megatrend, and they are in position to capture a ton of value as long as they can execute. The the big question is, you know, what winds up happening? But the third leg of the stool, the third important piece in this story is the current CEO, the man no one is talking about until today, Armin Paperger. He's been called a white haired Goliath.
Speaker 1:I love that. CNN randomly threw
Speaker 2:a picture?
Speaker 1:Just randomly threw that in. Popular.
Speaker 2:There he is.
Speaker 1:There there's some other photos. And last year, he was targeted in an assassination plot by the Russians. What? So the CNN reported that Russia had made a series of plans to assassinate several defense industry executives all across Europe who were supporting Ukraine's war efforts. Earlier this year, Armin Paperger, opened a new factory that will allow his company to produce more of an essential caliber of artillery shell than The entire US defense industry combined.
Speaker 1:Rheinmetall is now the world's fastest growing large defense company and a key player in Europe's quest to rearm. Rheinmetall's stock is up 15 x since Russia's full scale invasion of Ukraine in 2022, giving a market cap of 80,000,000,000, roughly on par with US rivals. So let's head over to red alert territory.
Speaker 2:Gavin Baker, responding to the reporting says, October, 1,400,000,000,000.0 in spending commitments. November, rough vibes. And December, code red. Life comes at you fast. Code red.
Speaker 2:It it certainly has felt it certainly has felt fast Yes. Ever since that faithful podcast.
Speaker 1:Yes. That was a crazy turning point.
Speaker 2:Although there was there was plenty of conversation, you know, prior to that around Yeah. Around of of what the trajectory of OpenAI would actually look like.
Speaker 1:The the code red, like, leak from this the the the information reported, it was clearly, like, some sort of all hands that Sam Altman was, you know, whole whole holding a town hall with the rest of the OpenAI team. And he's kind of just saying, like, lock in. That's what he should have said. Never say code red. You gotta say, lock in, brothers.
Speaker 1:Lock in. Say, we're we're taking that hill. We're storming their fortress. We will grind Google Gemini team into paste with and we will crush our enemies. We will see them drift before us.
Speaker 2:Learned this lesson. Yes. They used to say code red. Yes. That meant there was a fire Yes.
Speaker 2:In the hospital, and that you would probably wanna figure out a way to get out.
Speaker 1:Yes. I think if you're if you're if you're a CEO who's under incredible scrutiny, like you're Sam Altman, and you have beat reporters at this point who are texting your employees every single day, hey. What's going on? What's on the ground? Give me a quote.
Speaker 1:What happened?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So to give people to give people context, a beat reporter might reach out to they will actually adopt the strategy of just trying to wear someone down Mhmm. Where they will send hundreds of messages Mhmm. To individual people on on the team just over and over and over relentless Yep. Like email, cell phone Yep.
Speaker 2:Instagram DM, LinkedIn, just like constantly, constantly, constantly flooding, hoping that at some point this person just says like, fine. Like, I'll I'll I'll Well,
Speaker 1:name beat reporter comes from them trying to beat you down. That's the whole point.
Speaker 2:Is that true?
Speaker 1:That's where it comes from.
Speaker 2:No way. You're you're you're messing with me?
Speaker 1:Yeah. I'm messing with you.
Speaker 2:Okay. Okay. Okay.
Speaker 1:I have no idea. But I like the idea of it. It's like they just try and beat down new employees.
Speaker 2:It's like that
Speaker 1:They're trying to beat you down. There is some praise for OpenAI on the timeline, which we should get to from none other than Blake Robbins. Blake says, OpenAI is operating on a different level. Play a that sound cue, Jordy. The amount they have shipped in the past few weeks and months is incredible.
Speaker 1:Feels like we are witnessing a generational run. This was on October 6.
Speaker 2:K. This was on October 6. Sora was, I think, number one in the charts at that point. Yes. It's now '21.
Speaker 1:Yes. The scattershot nature raises questions about the company's discipline and ability to support these disparate initiatives. Is OpenAI a frontier research lab, social network operator, a commerce engine, a hardware company? Because it's hard to do all of that well.
Speaker 2:If you go back to, the BG two interview or just the BG interview Mhmm. Sam Sam's answer to the question of how are you gonna support the 1,400,000,000,000.0 of commitments was we're automating science Sorry. And we're making Yes. And we're make and we're making, like, consumer electronics. Yes.
Speaker 2:And the reason that that to me, that that was kind of like a concerning answer because Yeah. Google has been doing those things for years.
Speaker 1:Yeah. But they've earned the right because they have twenty five years
Speaker 2:funding it with massive cash flow.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Hundreds of billions of dollars revenue and and so much cash. I have a plan. If Sam Altman really wants to set the record straight, everyone's saying Code Red. Oh, Code Red.
Speaker 1:It's so bad. He needs to come out with a statement. We're gonna Baja Blast Gemini out of the App Store. If he says our plan is to Baja Blast Gemini and Anthropic into the minor leagues of AI research, I think he just wins completely. Let's play let's actually play this clip Okay.
Speaker 1:From Ashley Vance here.
Speaker 3:Yeah. Yeah. So to speak to Gemini Theory specifically, you know, it's a pretty good model. And I think one thing we do is try to build consensus. Know?
Speaker 3:The benchmarks only tell you so much. And just looking purely at the benchmarks, you know, we actually felt quite confident. You know, we have models internally that perform at the level of Gemini three, and we're pretty confident that we will release them soon, and we can release successor models that are even better. But, yeah, again, kind of the benchmarks only tell you so much. And I, you know, I I think everyone probes the the models in their own way.
Speaker 3:There there is this math problem I like to give the models. This
Speaker 1:is funny. I
Speaker 3:I think so far none of them has quite cracked it, even the thinking models. So, yeah, I'll wait for that.
Speaker 1:Is this is this like a secret
Speaker 3:math problem? Oh, No. No. Well, if I nod to here, maybe it gets trained on.
Speaker 1:It's gonna get so saturated.
Speaker 3:To speak to Gemini theory specifically, you know, it's a pretty good model. And I think
Speaker 1:Let's read what Prince is saying here. So new new interview with Mark Chen from OpenAI. Ashley Vance, the interviewer, has apparently been spending a lot of time at OpenAI, including sitting in on meetings. He seems to be writing a book, and he seems to think that OpenAI has made some huge advance in pretraining. Pretraining seems like this area where it seems like you've figured something out.
Speaker 1:You're excited about it. You think this is gonna be a major advance. Mark doesn't spill the beans, though. He says, we think there's a lot of room in pretraining. A lot of people say scaling dead is dead.
Speaker 1:We don't think so at all. Big question about what that means. Is that scaling RL? Is that scaling dollars in? Is it is it oh, yeah.
Speaker 1:If you if you if you invest a $100,000,000,000,000, you can give it one more IQ point. It's like, yeah. That would be an example of, like, scaling holding, but, like, no one's gonna make that trade off.
Speaker 2:Okay. So what what Sam said in the internal Slack memo is he was directing more employees to focus on improving features of ChatGPT such as personalizing the chatbot Mhmm. For more than 800,000,000 people. And and again, we we've seen them like launch more functionality around this. I I think the theory is that this could be a very like make the product really really sticky.
Speaker 2:Mhmm. Whether or not that's true generally is still unclear. It's certainly people have have been very loyal to four o. Other key priorities covered by the Code Red include ImageGen, the image generating AI that allows users to create a variety of photos. Fundamentally, what
Speaker 1:LLMs are doing, all what these chatbots are doing is they're they're basically instantiating full web pages. They should be able to instantiate anything that you could possibly land on, whether it's a video, an image, a blog post with images embedded. Like, it should be able to to, like, not just understand everything and give you the answer, but it should be able to contextualize that answer in any format. Should they say, hey. We're just gonna use nana banana, which is, a crazy thing.
Speaker 1:But, you know, there is a world where they say, like, hey. Yeah. Like, we're not gonna focus on that. OpenAI has has a stronghold on the consumer market to the point where if they swapped out the underlying model, they would still accrue tons of the value because people don't really know what model is which. Like, I think the average user doesn't do it.
Speaker 1:But first, Tyler has a something Yeah.
Speaker 3:I mean, I I think that especially makes sense in the context of images and video because they're just so expensive. Yeah. Like, I think a Nano Banana Pro image is like I think it's, like, 10¢.
Speaker 1:No
Speaker 3:way. Or okay. That might be per, like, a thousand or something. But it's still it's still they're really expensive. Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah. Videos are even more expensive. Videos are, like, really, really expensive.
Speaker 1:Oh, architects are cooked. AI is coming for you. Prepare accordingly. And you see this, and it's like this AI generated image, and it looks like remarkable. Like
Speaker 2:Looks like a floor plan.
Speaker 1:It looks like a floor plan. It looks amazing. Like, it looks like okay. Yeah. That's like all the lines are straight, but you zoom in, and it's, like, one of the funniest layouts ever because you realize that it's just it's just one massive room with with with, like, three or four.
Speaker 1:Okay. So first off okay. So you come in through the two car garage, then there's a powder room.
Speaker 2:So The mudroom.
Speaker 1:So so first off, there's this mudroom lawn mudroom and laundry with two bathtubs in it. Scroll up to the right. Okay. Just go yeah. Right there.
Speaker 1:So why do you have two bathtubs next to your coat closet?
Speaker 3:Right? In the mudroom.
Speaker 1:In the mudroom. And then and also, like, you can't go normally, you come out of garage, you go straight to the mudroom. But here, you have to go into the main area, which is the gallery hall, and then you go from there into the and so scroll to the left a little bit so you can see the What is the coat? Why is it is it? There's a powder room, and then there's some
Speaker 2:The coat bath with two toilets. And why
Speaker 1:is there two toilets next to each other? Remember we were touring that facility and we had two, you know, two two bathrooms right next to each other with no line next to it or
Speaker 3:Yeah. Yeah. We were in the in the in
Speaker 2:the the crazy office that that had the machine. One of the bathrooms just it had was like it was like meant to be a private bathroom And it just had two toilets there. We were like, what? Why the two toilets?
Speaker 1:Yeah. So it's like so so you come in through your main foyer, then there's a master bathroom, then there's a coat bathroom with two more toilets. And then there's a huge walk in closet with which isn't even directly attached to anything else. So you have to, like, go through this corridor to get to the rest. And so this master suite has three toilets, but then it gets better, dude.
Speaker 1:It gets better. So go over to the top right hand side because this is so look at Bedroom Number 2. It's just like Woah. Off the center. Then Bedroom Number 3 is there.
Speaker 1:Then there's a Jack and Jill bath, then scroll down.
Speaker 2:But there's nothing Three three sinks?
Speaker 1:Three sinks. Three sinks. No toilets. And then there's another bed bathroom. And then there's a third bathroom with a toilet.
Speaker 1:This is With a z five sinks.
Speaker 3:This is you might not like it, John, but
Speaker 2:this is this is this is architecture at its best.
Speaker 1:Is is AI going to help with, you know, architectural design? Of course. Is Nano Banana gonna randomly one shot, like, the perfect floor plan? No. Also, no.
Speaker 2:This is why OpenAI is in code red. In the two weeks since the Gemini launch, ChatGPT unique daily active users, a seven day average, are down 6%. He is sharing, to be clear, web traffic data.
Speaker 1:These these traffic sources are so rough. I just feel like people use apps. Anyway, the part of the code red, of course, is that OpenAI Sora app has fallen out of the top 20 most downloaded apps in The United States on both the App Store and Google Play. Things are things are falling. I actually opened up Sora today.
Speaker 1:I looked at it, and there was some cool stuff happening. This is a little bit of a hot take. Like, it was not it there was still a lot of slop, which I would define as, like, the you know, it's a POV video of a bus driver with a bunch of cats on the bus, and it's, like, cute and funny or like, you know, it's a chipmunk water skiing, like that type of stuff.
Speaker 2:Is why you were late for the gym today? No. So you think they have to explain the funding gap at this point? Or can we all just agree that maybe everyone got a little too excited?
Speaker 1:Yeah. I don't know. I don't know. I I feel like everyone's sort of repriced everything already with the Oracle round tripping and just this idea that, you know, some of the equity investments, like, are circular, but it's basically just like a discount on their purchases. And, know, these things probably aren't as binding as as we think.
Speaker 1:And so I feel like the the OpenAI is gonna blow up the economy narrative. I feel like that was really oversold. It should be fading in my opinion, but I don't know.
Speaker 2:Apparently, ChatGPT is also down
Speaker 1:right now.
Speaker 2:I just tested it. It's not down for me, but the chat says it's down.
Speaker 1:Time to Baja blast those servers back online, brother. It's time to rock. And we're gonna have to Baja blast some, some funding into this company because, apparently, there's a $270,000,000,000 funding hole. Squaring the total, it leaves OpenAI in a $270,000,000,000 $207,000,000,000 funding hole. The math doesn't work.
Speaker 1:Maybe OpenAI should release to the world, here's how the math can work because I haven't seen anyone state how this can actually work. Even if you get there, OpenAI does fall $2.00 $7,000,000,000 short of the money. Needs to continue funding its commitments right. So it has in 2030, OpenAI free cash flow will be about $287,000,000,000 That's, like, insane. If you're in a situation where you have $287,000,000,000 of free cash flow, like, you can't raise more debt on that.
Speaker 1:Like, I I I feel like math tends to work out when you go from a nonprofit to a $300,000,000,000 cash flow a year in ten years. Like, it just the everything just forms in front of you. Like, the you know, like, yes. You are building the bridge as you're driving, but, like, that tends to happen when you're on that much of a tear. We should read through Ben Thompson's latest piece because he's provided a lot more context on Google, NVIDIA, and OpenAI with a post called Google, NVIDIA, and OpenAI.
Speaker 1:Would you look at that? You have Luke bored on Tatooine, called to adventure by a mysterious message borne by r two d two that he initially refuses, refusing refusal of the call. This is the classic hero's journey. A mentor in Obi Wan Kenobi leads him to the threshold of leaving Tatooine and faces tests and carries the battle station plans to the rebels while preparing for the road back to the Death Star. He trusts the force in his final test and and returns transformed.
Speaker 1:And when you zoom out to the original trilogy, it's simply an expanded version of this of the story. This time, however, the ordeal is in the entire second movie, The Empire Strikes Back. The heroes of the AI story over the last three years have been two companies, OpenAI and NVIDIA. The first startup is called, with the release of ChachiPT, to be the next great consumer tech company. The other was best known as a gaming chip company characterized by boom and bust cycles driven by their visionary and endlessly optimistic founder transformed into the most essential infrastructure provider for the AI revolution.
Speaker 1:Over the last few weeks, however, both have entered the cave. They they're in the cave. They there's the cave of disillusionment and are facing their greatest ordeal. The Google empire is very much striking back. So Google strikes back.
Speaker 1:The first Google blow was Gemini three, which scored better than OpenAI's state of the art model on a host of benchmarks even if actual real world usage was a bit more uneven. Gemini three's biggest advantage is its sheer size and the vast amount of compute that went into creating it. This is notable because OpenAI has had difficulty creating the next generation of models beyond the g p t four level of size and complexity. What has carried the company is a genuine breakthrough in reasoning that produces better results in many cases, but at the cost of time and money. Ben Thompson creates aggregation theory, this idea of, like, it's so important to aggregate demand in the modern Internet world.
Speaker 1:It's potentially the only thing you can do. You can't really monopolize supply. It's very hard to monopolize supply, but monopolizing demand is something that happens. And the the strength of habits is significant. Like, we're watching this stuff every single day, so we can take the time to, okay, yeah, we should test out this other, you know, model.
Speaker 1:We should daily drive this app. But for a lot of people, if they've if they have a map that's installed and they've been using it for a year, they're never changing.
Speaker 2:The thing that I've heard come up multiple times is people that, when Gemini three launched, they switched to Gemini three on desktop Yep. But they stayed using ChatGPT on mobile.
Speaker 1:And, I mean, to to be completely transparent, like like, the, the the Gemini mobile app has is really, really struggling to stay connected. There's something in the when you fire off a prompt, it doesn't, like, save it locally and then cache that and then send it off, inference it, and then come back. It like, unless you keep the app open, like, it will, it it it will just give you, like, a server disconnected error. Like, I've gotten, like, dozens of these. And and that's gonna be a real like, I I think it should be something they should be they should be able to fix in, a weekend.
Speaker 1:This is, I think, a broader point. The the naive approach to moats focuses on the cost of switching. In fact, however, the more important correlation to the strength of a moat is the number of unique purchasers to users. Okay. So that you can see where this is going with, like, NVIDIA has five buyers
Speaker 2:Yep.
Speaker 1:And ChatGPT has a billion buyers. I argued that you could map large tech companies across two spectrums, the degree of supplier differentiation from Facebook where the supplier's completely commoditized, just your friend on Facebook, to, to Microsoft and Apple where the suppliers are somewhat more controlled. Yeah. There's the What a chart. The the more the more unique buyers of your product you have, the the stronger your moat because it's hard to con because you have to convince each one of them.
Speaker 1:He started this article recounting the hero's journey in part to make the easy leap to The Empire Strikes Back. However, there is a personal angle as well. The hero of this site has been aggregation theory and the belief that controlling demand trumps everything else. There's there Google was my ultimate protagonist. Moreover, I do believe in the innovation and velocity that comes from a founder led company like NVIDIA.
Speaker 1:And I do still worry about Google's bureaucracy and disruption potential making the company less nimble and aggressive than OpenAI. More than anything, though, I believe in the market power and defensibility of 800,000,000 users, which is why I think ChatGPT still has a meaningful moat. At the same time, I understand why the market is freaking out about Google. Their structural advantage their their structural advantages in everything from monetization to data to infrastructure to r and d is so substantial that you understand why OpenAI's founding was motivated by the fear of Google winning AI. It's very easy to imagine an outcome where Google's inputs simply matter more than anything else.
Speaker 1:One of my most important theories is being put to the ultimate test, which perhaps is why I'm so frustrated at OpenAI's avoidance of advertising. Google is now my antagonist. Google has already done this once. Search was the ultimate example of a company winning an open market with nothing more than a better product. Aggregators win new markets by being better.
Speaker 1:The open question now is whether one that has already reached scale can be dethroned by the overwhelming application of resources, especially when its inherent advantages are diminished by refusing to adopt an aggregator's optimal business model. I really wonder who's gonna who's gonna take the lead first. Who is going to, who's going to jump and, and put ads in in in the in the app first. It it feels like Google should do it.
Speaker 2:Yeah. And nobody's gonna be like,
Speaker 1:oh What?
Speaker 2:Google is putting ads in a product? Yeah. It won't be that surprising.
Speaker 1:The Apple AI chief, John Giandrea, is leaving the company. Amar Subramanya from Microsoft has joined to lead AI under Craig Federighi. Aman brings a wealth of experience to Apple, he's quoting here, having most recently served as, CVP of AI at Microsoft and previously spent sixteen years at Google where he was head of engineering for Google Gemini. This is bearing the lead. He joined Microsoft AI four months ago.
Speaker 1:Wow. What a crazy turn
Speaker 2:LinkedIn says six months ago, but but who's who's counting?
Speaker 1:That's pretty fast.
Speaker 2:Sense considering Apple is partnering with Gemini and not a lot of people are gonna be in a better position to help integrate that into Siri
Speaker 1:Sure. Sure.
Speaker 2:Than Amar.
Speaker 1:Strange hire for a number of reasons, but it's hard to argue that the Apple job is a bad one. Anything is an important improvement at this point, so the bar is as low as it comes. I'm I'm personally just excited to actually test drive what Gemini how it works in Siri, how how seamless that is. Because if it really is just raise press the button, get Gemini, and it's linked up properly, and it doesn't have timeouts, and it gets back to you pretty quickly, like, that's gonna be a pretty powerful experience. That's that's definitely gonna cut down on ChatGPT app usage for iPhone users, I would imagine.
Speaker 2:Underrated threat.
Speaker 1:I would think so. I don't even know that Apple will benefit massively from this. It's not like they're gonna sell twice as many iPhones. They're already so big
Speaker 2:for I don't think it's necessarily, like It's underrated threat. Bullish for Apple. Yeah. It's it's an underrated threat for OpenAI.
Speaker 1:I would think there's a lot
Speaker 2:of queries that all hit ChatGBT on mobile that are not even super economic, but just a lot of my usage around, hey, just trying to learn about something or or research a product
Speaker 1:Exactly. Etcetera.
Speaker 2:Yeah. And if that's just, like, again Yeah. One tap and you're in there.
Speaker 1:Yeah. I I think I'm gonna be using that a lot unless they really botch it. And I don't know how they're gonna botch it, but, yeah, we Yeah.
Speaker 3:I mean, I I think the
Speaker 1:If anything's possible. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Apple's like, hold my beer.
Speaker 1:They're gonna be like, every for privacy reasons, every time you press the button, you have to esign. And it's like, why are we doing that?
Speaker 2:Right now Lin comes in, on the board of DoorDash, buys a 100,000,000 of DoorDash.
Speaker 1:Calling it Linsanity. He's not done stewarding DoorDash. He's he's continuing to steward the company with a $100,000,000 buy.
Speaker 2:Let's pull up this clip from, Huberman Lab. Doctor Jeffrey tells Huberman that LED lighting in buildings is a public health crisis that could be on par with the use of asbestos, many building contractors slash designers are coming to him worried they're going to be sued and asking how to start fixing the issues.
Speaker 4:We're lighting. Because I am very concerned about the amount of short wavelength light that people are exposed to nowadays, especially kids. The group of us that are shuffling around, some of them are saying, this is an issue on the same level as asbestos. This is a public health issue, and it's big. LEDs came in, and people won the Nobel Prize for this, very rightly at the time, because they save a lot of energy.
Speaker 4:The LED has got a big blue spike in it, although we tend not to see that. And that is even true of warm LEDs, And there is no red. The light found in LEDs, when we use them certainly we use them on the retina looking at mice we can watch the mitochondria gently go downhill. They're far less responsive. Their membrane potentials are coming down.
Speaker 4:The mitochondria are not breathing very well. Watch that in real time. Under LED lighting. Under LED lighting at the same energy levels that we would find in a domestic or in or or commercial environment.
Speaker 2:This is why I wanna rig the studio with Candles. Incandescent light.
Speaker 1:Incandescent. We're going back to candles.
Speaker 2:CandleMax.
Speaker 1:Let's do candlelight.
Speaker 3:How about
Speaker 2:a hearth?
Speaker 1:This is the way
Speaker 2:If we put a hearth so we have lights above our heads Those are sure or LEDs killing us slowly Candle. Softly. If we put like somewhat a bonfire Mhmm. Right above us
Speaker 1:That'd be the way.
Speaker 2:And then we just when when the wood kind of burns out Yep. The show's over. We just go until the
Speaker 1:That would be good. I like that. Leave us five stars on Apple Podcast. Thank you for out. Goodbye.
Speaker 2:Have a great evening.