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A narrative podcast from two bird lovers (and friends) exploring all things bird.
We're both like testing and then you come in like somehow completely offbeat every time.
I don't think I do have a beat of the heart.
To the beat of my...
Your heart song?
Not that. Can't be that.
That's not a song.
What's my heartbeat song?
Like, in, like, the answer to that question?
You're just asking me?
I'm Hannah.
And I'm Cleo.
And you're listening to Birds on Bird.
Hey, everybody, and welcome back to Birds on Birds.
We're so happy you're with us today.
Hi, Hannah.
Hi.
I am coming off the high of recording Bill Lishman and talking about Bill Lishman with you.
Bill, Bill.
Different bill.
Billishman, the goose guy.
Daddy goose.
Father Goose.
Daddy.
That's like one of your running accidental jokes now in this podcast is just creepily saying daddy dead in an appropriate time.
Or maybe it's always appropriate, but I love it either way.
Okay, yeah.
Yeah.
I love that.
Hannah, before we get into today, which we did a little teaser that we would be talking about a heated a heated rivalry, not the heated rivalry, but you were just in Seattle for work.
Tell me more about that and what you've been up to.
Yeah, I was just there.
Um, and what was I up to?
Mostly work.
But Monday, I flew in and I was able to take time to go to the UW Wetlands, um, University of Washington, wetlands, and it's just like on the other side of downtown.
So, it's really fun.
And I got to see a lot of really cool birds.
So, yeah, tell me what you got to see.
I want to hear all about it.
Also, I didn't realize once again that you're always surprised by the wetlands.
I am surprised by the wetlands.
You are.
I need a shirt that's...
I'm surprised by the wetlands.
That's merch, yeah.
I think so.
I think that's our 1st real merch idea.
Okay.
I'm locking that.
I'll figure out a fun way to make that into something.
But before we do that, please, let me know what you saw in the marshlands of Seattle of all places.
Yes.
Um, so I saw quite a few things.
It's this conservation area.
It's literally a wildlife refuge that they've that they use for studying with all the different students there, obviously.
But there were marsh runs and Redwing blockbirds, which we will be talking about this week, that inspired me.
Spoiler spoil, that was fun.
And then there were also a bunch of really cool ducks.
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
What kind of ducks?
Anything that stood out?
Yeah, so I saw wood duck, which was like my 1st time ever seeing a wood duck.
Incredible.
Up close.
How close?
Well, I was actually walking around this corner of the trail and there was no one there and they kind of like popped out of the cattails.
I think I scared them.
But it was really cool because I got to see like a male and a female like swimming with each other.
Oh, that's so sweet.
You could have had your, you had a Bill Lishman moment.
You scared the ducks.
I did.
You had a moment with them because of that.
They didn't fly or swim with them, which...
Wow, wouldn't that have been something if you just dove right in and it was like, I want swimming.
You do the opposite of Bill Lishman, where you want to swim with birds.
I mean, I do love to swim.
That feels more attainable.
It does. Than flying for me at this moment.
Yeah, I agree.
Continue, sorry.
Sorry.
I had that moment with the wood ducks.
And then I saw a ring neck duck, which you should look up.
They look really wacky.
Um, but the male kind of looks like he has this like monochrome gray black suit situation.
And he's got this like very nice beak with these white accents.
Yeah.
It's like 2 stripes.
It's one that is like right at the edge of the beak where it touches the face.
And then one towards the end where I only have one reference for this and it's going to be a very Florida reference where you when you catch a gator, you take their mouth shut, hopefully just in transportation, if you ever catch a gator and you leave its mouth taped, you're an evil, evil person because they cannot get that off.
But it looks like the tape that you would put over.
Like it's just a straight line.
Like if ducks had teeth, you would maybe put the tape there to make sure they didn't bite you.
Yeah.
Cool.
And they also have like a buffon.
A little puffed up.
No, it looks like spiky 90s gelled hair.
Yeah.
The female was like similar to a mallard where you could kind of, you could tell that they were the same bird, but more of the traditional brown.
Yeah, it's almost like they have the same markings, but they're just much more muted and brown toned rather than contrast toned.
And then the other couple that I saw.
These were all in couples.
They were just paired up breeding season, I guess.
Breeding season.
It was the Northern Shoveler, which I love the Northern Shoveler.
Shoveler as in a shovel.
Yep.
Not in the garden.
Yep, shovelier.
I spell it like Frenchly, like with a CH and a little accent over the years. Or something.
No.
A shoveler.
Like, he's digging.
He's digging.
Okay, yeah, I'm looking up a picture right now and their beaches do look like they're kind of like an upside down shovel.
Yeah. And like a garden shovel.
Like if you took a garden shovel and you, and it was facing the, if the, the, the concave part, the curve was facing upward.
That's what it looks like.
Yeah.
Really cool, really weird.
And like a nice, bright, green, very green. Head.
Um, but like definitely distinguished from a mallard.
And then the body is so cool.
It's like black and white mostly, but there's these beautiful tan and pale blue accent feathers that you see even more when they fly.
But they're so beautiful.
They're almost like, I don't know.
There's something about them.
Yes.
It's just like, it's like a mallard that really stepped up its game.
Yeah.
No offense to Mallard.
I think mallards can be gorgeous, but it is kind of like a fancy mallard.
It's like the race car version of a matter.
If a mallard is like, it's yeah, it's a little sportier.
It looks like it has like stripes.
Like, I'm looking at a picture right now with its wings open that's flying and it's got this, like, really incredible, like bright green stripe towards the back of the feathers.
Really cool. On the wing and they, yeah, they just look really sleek and really iridescent and gorgeous and weird.
Very weird.
The eye is super yellow.
So it kind of gives them this little bit of a like, golden eye.
Yeah, kind of an evil, like, I'm watching you kind of vibe.
But I like it. Like it. With them for a while.
I saw some coots, but I saw those the other day.
I went birding a lot the last couple weeks actually.
Yeah, I went the other day to the Rocky Mountain Arsenal, my favorite place.
I just found out that, sorry, not to hijack this, but I just found out turtles live in the Rocky Mountain Arsenal.
Yeah.
Well, turtles are an invasive, but very cute species in Colorado.
In Colorado.
Oh I had no idea.
They survive really well here in certain areas, but they're not like naturally native.
Naturally native.
Yeah.
Yeah, you know. Totally.
But, I mean, I do love them.
And there's a lot of cool shit at the arsenal.
We're gonna do...
I'm gonna make you come with me and we'll do a whole tour.
Yeah, I mean, you're going to have to yank my chain or pull me by my hair or something.
No, I'm excited.
Oh, okay.
No, I'm really excited to go.
I was actually just talking to Stuart about wanting to go to the Rocky Mountain Arsenal and he had no idea even where it was.
And, um, I think it's, I've been seeing a bunch of videos pop up on my TikTok from it lately, and that's been making me really excited.
Hot spot for birding. Love ducks.
Yeah, you do love ducks.
You are a big duck girl.
I am.
Big duck guy.
I really am.
Waterfowl in general are just like my jam.
Yeah.
I need to be better.
I've still been kind of locked down, locked in, but I have also traveled a little bit.
I went to Florida, um, to go see my family very, very briefly, very briefly, but I was able to go back to my cousin's house, which is the most gorgeous place.
It is on the coast, the east coast.
It's a place called Melbourne Beach.
It is like a tiny little peninsula off the side of Florida.
And they live.
Basically their house sits on the inlet to the ocean.
And so when you go outside, It is like immediately you're, you're basically on the, it's not quite the ocean because it's the inlet, so it's like the in between, but it's still, for all intents and purposes.
All the animals that go through.
And I just have so many memories tied to that place because they've lived there as long as I've been alive.
And so when you go outside, it's right on the water, like it's part of the property, basically, to be on the water.
And you can walk over to the dock and immediately we saw dolphins, we saw manatees, pelicans.
What else did we see?
We saw something else.
I saw a couple fish flopping out of the water, which was a lot of fun, and a couple other birds, but they flew by so fast, and I didn't bring my binoculars, which I was like.
So bummed about it.
I know.
And, like, my cousin apparently is friends with the dolphins.
Like, she goes to the...
I sent Hannah a video of this.
My cousin goes to the edge of the water and she'll be like, hey, friend, hey, friend.
And they do kind of swim like right up to the dock.
It's pretty crazy.
And they follow her.
She runs to the edge of the dock and they like play and then they swim off.
Like there's no interference.
She's not feeding them.
She's not doing anything other than like kind of speaking to them and then running along her dock.
But yeah, that was a lot of fun.
I got to see a ton of brown pelicans at basically sunset just swooping into the water, like dive bombing and catching fish, which was really fun to watch.
I mean, there was probably 10 to 15 near me at that and I was watching them all just go, boom, boom, boom.
Wow.
Um, and and it, like I said, it was sunset, so it was just like gorgeous backdrop sitting on a dock.
It was really beautiful weather.
And then the next morning I made time to go to the beach, which is right across the street because they literally live on a tiny strip of land.
Like it's genuinely a 2 lane, like, highway kind of area that goes across.
You just cross that street. You walk and you're on the beach.
That's how small it is.
Like properties are on either side, but the beach is right there.
So it's really, really cool.
Um, they have a key actually to a private beach.
And so when you go out there, um, it's just really well maintained.
It's really taken care of.
It's really beautiful.
There's not a ton of people out there.
I feel like Melbourne Beach, like, I don't want to blow up its spot, but it is kind of a hidden gem in Florida.
If you ever get a chance to go, you should go, but leave no trace and be nice to nature because it's awesome and I don't want people to ruin it.
But I was able to hang out on the beach and I saw some Sanderlings.
Which were so cute.
They do that like teeny, tiny little bird run where they have the long legs and they just kind of like...
And they were in like a group, which was really, really fun.
I was out there with my bird ID and I was getting my cousin into it where she was like, wait, what is that?
Oh, well, it has this kind of beak and this kind of thing and I was like, okay, you're getting into it.
Like, you're getting into it now.
So that was really fun.
There were a couple goals that flew overhead, but there wasn't a ton of them and I couldn't get close enough to figure out what kind of goal it was.
And as we know, gulls are the kind of, uh, they're the kind of animal that can breed and crossbreed very easily.
They make hybrids.
Yeah, it's a lot.
And then I also saw a black bellied plover, or at least I think it was a black belly plover.
Every time I got close to it, it kind of quickly shuffled away or flew away.
So I can't quite get close enough to confirm, confirm, but I'm 99% sure based on what I could see.
That feels pretty sure.
And it was, it was pretty cool.
It was really gorgeous.
I didn't go in the water because it was a bit too rocky for that or not rocky.
What's the word I'm looking for?
Like rough.
Yeah.
But we got to just stand on the water and hang out and enjoy that.
And I just feel like I've said this before.
I'll say it again, but I really, I did appreciate nature growing up, but there are times where living in Colorado.
I do wish it was just outside my door, the way it is in Florida, just like lizard, bird, frog.
I think there's parts of Florida that feel similar to Colorado, but yeah, where I grew up, I guess, is more.
But I do know, like you said, Rocky Mountain Arsenal is not that far.
There's definitely nature really close by.
It's just like the familiarity of all things Florida has really been becoming something more comforting than I expected it to.
I don't want to live there.
No.
But if I could bring it with me, I would.
Yeah.
That's how I feel.
So that's really all I've been up to.
That in school and work in school and work in school. Work in school.
Yeah.
I saw 2 different concerts in the last 5 days, which was too close together, if you ask me, but also unmissable.
The 1st one was Bill Murray, which was so fun.
I mean, it's just like old school punk vibes, like mixed with country mixed with saxophone.
Their sax player is a girl.
She's awesome.
She's such a showboat, and I mean that in a nice way.
Like she was really just crushing it on the sacks and she does backup vocals.
They just were having so much fun and it was like scream along to the lyrics type of beat, like just a really, really, really fun concert.
That's awesome Oh my god, I had so much fun.
And then I also went to Ethel Kane at Red Rocks, which...
Felt like such a cool experience.
Stuart and I decided that we weren't going to listen to her new album until we saw it at Red Rocks.
So we experienced all the new songs completely brand new live and it was so cool.
It was so I'm so glad I did because she crushed it.
Her vocals are insane.
The set design was super cool.
Yeah, it was like, it was like swampy.
It looked like she had like a stage built that almost looked like a dock that you would see in the south and then she stood on it and it had all these like pieces that made it look like swamp grass, but also in the country where there's like tires and like different pieces in it.
It was just really gorgeous.
Her mic stand was a scythe, like the bottom of a scythe, which was like pretty badass.
Um, and it's red rock.
So it was like ethereal, completely ethereal.
Um, yeah, I just, like I said, I left that concert and I was like, was that 20 minutes or was it 3 hours?
I have no idea.
I couldn't possibly tell you because I felt like I fell into a time warp and I just got serenaded by George's beautiful, perfect Ethel Canon.
And it was lovely.
I will say Red Rock's incredible venue. Getting in and out of there.
Hell.
Trek.
Hell.
Getting into the stadium itself.
I mean, you have to do an entire hike just to get in.
Yeah.
And it's a hike once you're in because of the steps.
Oh my god, there's so many steps.
I was like, there's got to be something that they do for people who have a hard time walking and like handicapped.
Yeah, it's not very accessible.
It's apparently there's a whole different route for people who, yeah, so I was like, thank God because they had to.
I mean, it's like you would literally have to.
Even for people who are just, I work out pretty frequently and I had to stop a couple times.
Stuart has really long legs, so he was just like going up the stairs so fast and I was like, I'm going to need you to slow down a little bit because I'm not the elevation, and they see elevation, so the air is thinner here.
There's not as much oxygen.
You just like by the time you get to the top, you're like, I'm exhausted.
We actually didn't end up buying any merch or anything too because the line was all the way down the steps.
Oh my gosh.
Which again, if you've never been to Red Rocks, it's a lot of steps, like a lot, a lot of steps, and it's the merch is like somewhere towards the top.
And so the fact that the line was all the way down the steps is pretty is a pretty phenomenal line.
Yeah.
So we just didn't bother.
Well, and Bill Murray, you like waited in line on your phone.
Well, yeah, they had this new system where you had to scan a QR code and then it told you when to come up and get your merch, which is cool, but also it's usually like mid-set and for a place.
So actually, I think that would have worked better at Red Rocks because at Red Rocks, you have a seat. At the show we were at, which is at the film or, I believe.
Yeah.
There's not seats.
It's just GA.
So you have to kind of like leave your spot or one of you has to go leave to go buy something while the other one stays and ours was like 20 minutes or 10 minutes into the Bill Murray set.
So Stuart went for us, but like, I don't know, it kind of would have been like a bummer if we lost our spot and then had to go, you know what I mean?
So I think it works better for a place where there's actually seats, but it wasn't the worst thing because you do get to kind of just like, instead of waiting in like a long, endless line where people are being kind of assholes, you can just wait until you get your number called and then you go up.
So yeah, I have mixed feelings about that.
But yeah, okay, they did not have that system set up.
And it was an insane line.
But it was really fun.
I think that the fun thing about concerts too.
I'm not a huge Halloween person.
But I think that concerts are kind of like a mini Halloween. Like everybody dresses to a theme.
You have kind of a vibe when you go, and so it was kind of fun to see the crossover between the Bill Murray fans and the Ethel Kane fans, and the crossover is real tree camo.
Okay.
That is the crossover between the two.
And that's probably it, but just because I went to them so close.
It was funny to see just like the differences in how and like how people interpret music styles and dressing, if that's not how they normally dress.
You know, I think that's like a really fun thing.
And I love it, to be clear, I'm not judging. Like cosplay.
But it feels like costume.
Like you're having a little costume moment.
And I think that's really cool.
So yeah, those are all the things I've been up to, but which is more than what I'm normally up to.
Yeah.
And now I'm really tired.
All the time.
No, it's time for bed.
No, I'm going to sleep.
So we're going to have to tell me the story another day.
Good night.
No, no, we're here and I'm excited about this, but it has definitely been a busier time than I'm used to. That's fine.
Yeah.
Without further ado then.
Yeah.
Let's get into our heated rivalry.
Not you and me, but our version of heated rivalry.
I don't know if you got the vibe, but we hate each other.
We hate each other.
It's always been that way. Always been that way.
Um, yeah.
No we're getting into it.
We hinted at it with the marshmun and the red wing blackbird. That I said I was excited to see, but yeah.
Well, you were excited to see, and I think to give a little bit of backstory, you had already actually worked notes for the Red Wing Blackbird, but then you saw them in the marsh fighting, and you had done some research that already mentioned that they were rivals.
And then you were like, okay, well, now that I've seen this, phenomenon. Talk about it.
Yeah, I've got to talk about it.
And so thus birthed this rivalry episode, this 2 for episode, 2 birds, one up, right.
Free 99.
Free 99.
Well, and I think a big thing for me that made it so inspiring was, yeah, I'd already heard about the Marsh Ren, but it's not native or it doesn't travel through Colorado.
Oh.
So red wing blackbirds are here, but marsh friends are not.
I see.
I see red wing backbirds all the time by my house and in the arsenal, everywhere.
But with the marsh run, I'd never seen it, and I wasn't sure I ever would, but they were there.
And they were having their rival moment, which you had already foretold. Their little dance, sing fight situation.
I love that.
I want to quickly just butt in and say when we went to the Sandhill Cranes Festival, That was my 1st time seeing a red wing blackbird, at least a male one that had the markings of that were noticeable.
And I, that was like probably the highlight for me.
Oh my god, I was so excited.
I was so excited because you had told me about them and when I had seen pictures and you were like, they're everywhere.
And I was like, where?
I've not seen it.
Show me one.
Show me one bird.
Name 10.
No, but like I hadn't seen them.
I was like, what the heck is going on?
And so when we were driving randomly to go see the cranes or talk about cranes at some point, I saw one on a fence post and I was like, ah, a red wing blackbird.
And it looked so it really looked so cool and I was really, really excited about it.
And I, in all fairness, I had seen Sandhill Cranes my whole life growing up.
I had never seen 10,000 at once.
But I was just really excited because I had seen a new bird and that got me real pumped.
So I'm excited to hear more about them.
I've been waiting for this since before I even saw one, but now that I've seen them.
And I haven't seen a Martian, except for enough. A photo.
Yeah, they're they're pretty cunty.
And they're cute.
Yeah.
Cunty and cute.
Double C.
Double C.
Double threat.
Yep.
And yeah, they are threat.
Yep.
Don't underestimate them.
Estimate them But, um, obviously, the other piece of this is the rivalry, we've made jokes about the heated rivalry.
That's the show.
If you've ever heard of it.
I don't know.
Have you heard of it?
Really niche.
Nobody's ever seen it.
It's very small.
Very small. Very independent.
I mean, I think it might be semi-independent, but it did catch the world by storm.
Everyone was watching it.
Straits and gays.
It was the great equalizer.
Is, is, continues to be. Is and will always be.
Yeah, I'm yet to watch any more of it, but we'll get to that when I do.
So moving on.
Tell me everything.
Yeah.
Okay.
So this is a different rivalry than the heated rivalry.
They're actually in love.
I mean, maybe like there's kissing adjacent activities when they're like fighting.
I don't know.
That did sound like a little bit sensual, like a will they, won't they?
Yeah.
Yeah. Don't know.
But they're not in love.
Okay, they will not end up together.
Spoiler.
Spoiler slash trigger warning, whatever you need.
This is not happily ever after.
Not happily ever after heard.
Okay.
I'm on board.
Okay.
So we've got 2 competitors, right, that make up this rivalry.
Round one, competitor in the corner is the red wing blackbird.
Okay, so the red wing blackbird are about 7 to 9 inches long.
Okay, tip to tail.
Okay, tip to tip.
The weight is one.
One, two, 2.7 ounces.
Okay.
So, one to three-ish.
Roughly. Roughly.
And then wingspan, 12 to 16 inches.
Okay, over a foot, usually. Or at least a foot.
I was going to say, I felt like they're bigger than that, but it might be the wingspan that makes them seem bigger.
Yeah.
Because they kind of look like a small crow if you, like, don't look super closely.
Yeah, totally.
I agree.
Um, they have, they're very famous for their plumage.
So the males are black mostly, but they have these very flashy, red and yellow epaulets they're called.
So they're little shoulder patches that literally rest on their little birdie shoulders.
No, it's, it's, I mean, I think I'm still riding the high. Like seeing one for the 1st time sometimes, but it really is striking. When you see one the 1st time because it genuinely looks like shoulder pads like little napoleons.
Yeah.
No, really?
Going into war.
Like they just have these 2 little...
They have Napoleon energy spots next to there and it's right on what would be the shoulder if they were people.
Yeah.
It's really, really cool.
It's really stunning and really contrasty.
And it's like mostly red.
It's a bright red.
Yes, very red.
And then it's that little yellow, like, swish, too, that kind of even continues to distinct.
It's just really cool.
Really, really cool birds.
Yeah.
Well, in, like, old school shoulders, like, dress uniforms.
They used to have like the little gold tassels that hang down.
It kind of looks like that.
It looks so much like that that it is almost weird.
Yeah, it really is.
Like, it makes me really happy, but I'm also like, did we get the ideas from the birds?
Or did they get it from us?
Which came first?
They're like, damn, these soldiers look fly.
We gotta grow some red feathers in here.
We got to get flashier.
The women love this.
Um, but their scientific name is very indicative of what they look like.
Galius Phoenicius, which means scarlet flock member. Love.
Also, being in Phoenix, Venetius, they seem, yeah, related.
It feels very much like a spell.
Yeah, it does.
Harry Potter spell for sure.
It sounds like Felix.
What is it?
Felix Felix Felicious. Are felicious.
Delicious, delicious, delicious.
I'm lucky tonight.
That's a weird Harry Potter joke.
Fuck JK.
Rowling, to be clear.
Just kidding.
And fuck, just kidding, too.
Stop joking with me.
Just kidding.
Oh.
Anyway, the female plumage is very different.
So they kind, they're about the same size as the male, but they have a little bit of a red marking on their shoulder.
But it almost blends in because it's like a maroon brown red instead of the bright, bright red that the males have.
And the rest of them is like a weird sparrow.
Like it literally is just streaky brown and like a pale, huh, white eyebrow.
That's really interesting for some reason.
And maybe this is why I thought I had never seen a red green blackbird because I thought that the males and the females look the same for whatever reason.
And so it is interesting that they, it's kind of like what we were just talking about with the ducks.
I can't remember which one they were with the mohawk, where it's like the same patterning.
Ring neck duck, yeah.
Where it feels like you could tell they're the same bird, but it's more muted and better for like adapting to survival situations and such.
Yeah, exactly.
And then their diet consists of about 75% seeds, grain, other vegetation, and then about 25% insect.
Wow.
One thing that makes red wing blackbirds so much more common than Marsh Friends is that they use their mostly seeds and grained diet to feed off of like agricultural land.
So they can be more widespread than just like in the marsh.
Oh, I see.
So you're saying that becau- so like in the situation where they live in the marshlands, in like Seattle, they're directly competing for resources, but red ring blackbirds, don't need to necessarily have marsh, and that's why they're able to...
Yeah, Marcia Jason.
Got it, got it, got it.
Okay Heard.
Yeah.
And then their nests are in the cattails, they actually weave the cattails themselves about one to 2 feet above the water, but there's like different areas where you might see like a bunch of cattails pushed down and it's probably to hide like different nests.
Oh that's interesting.
The blackbird and the marsh fren and other marshy birds.
When you say weave.
You mean like genuinely.
Like they pull it down and they kind of like twist them together and create, is it a cup shape, do you know?
Yeah.
It's like a large cup shape.
Okay, cool.
Like more like a bowl, but in that cup, a bowl.
Yeah.
Like when you're trying to eat less ice cream, so you eat it out of a cup instead of a bowl, but it's still a bowl.
It's still.
Yeah, yeah.
It's healthy.
It's how I portion control. Mom.
Um, the breeding range is Alaska and Canada south through all of the US and Central America.
So they're all over North America into Central America.
That's crazy, and once again, insane that I just saw my 1st one.
I still am just like, how is that possible?
And I've yet to seen one since, by the way.
Yeah.
I look all the time. Just need to come to my house more.
Yeah.
If your dog didn't hate me, I would.
Maybe she just needs time, you know?
We'll talk about this on another episode, but Hannah's dog is whatever the opposite of a man hater is.
She hates fem people and like women and high femmes.
Yeah.
Anyone who, like, doesn't look dikey or manage.
Yeah, exactly.
She's something.
And I love her, but she was really, really mad at me and does bark directly in my face while staring at me.
It's like close and stares you down and then throws her head back and yowls until I move and I don't.
And then she's like, what the fuck?
Away from me.
You have to, like, try and jug her up.
Yeah, yeah.
We'll try that next time.
We'll try drugs.
Drugs always works Exactly.
But their status is least concerned.
So they are thriving, not declining.
Yeah.
But the oldest recorded is 15 years and 9 months almost 16 years.
That's a pretty long lifespan.
But the average is about 2 years.
So, well, that one was really telling tales to the other birds.
He was like, my day.
These epaulettes didn't even believe how many...
I can't believe how many friends I've lost.
Oh, sorry.
Maybe.
Probably.
Tell me more.
I don't know yet.
And Connor number two.
We have a smaller contender.
Yes, it is the marsh friend.
They are about 4 to 5 inches long.
So length wise, they're closer in size, but that's again, tip to tip. Tip to tip.
They have kind of long tails.
What is that, like a 3 inch difference between the two?
Yeah, 4 to 5 and 7 to nine.
Yeah, that's about 3.
It's about 3 inches different.
Okay, so that's not much smaller, but I do think marsh runs are pretty, they're pretty small.
Yeah.
Again, a lot of it is like their tail feathers that make them longer.
Yeah, that's true.
That a good point.
They're a bit more like rotund. Than a red wing blackbird too.
Exactly.
They are.
They're very...
Stocky, round, round and.. In charge.
They weigh, even though they are round, they are .3 to .5 ounces.
So they're very, very, very light.
Yeah.
Tiny, tiny.
And then their wingspan is 5.5 to 6.5 inches.
So that's about half.
Yeah.
At least half the wingspan of red wing.
Okay.
The underdog is just based on stats alone.
Yeah, is the marsh end.
And size-wise on Merlin.
Redwing Blackbird is...
Redwing Blackbird is robin size.
Yes, okay.
And marsh runs are sparrow sized.
Okay.
Okay.
So yeah. Kind of like mid-range to small range.
Exactly.
Okay, got it.
Yep.
Yep.
Like a low mid-rage to...
So it's an unfair fight, is what you're telling me.
That's so strange.
Yeah.
Exactly.
You would think. You would think.
But the plumage of the marshren is much more of like a sparrow type plumage, so that brown, white, black mix, um, with different striped bees and stuff.
They're very cute.
Um, But they have a black and white triangular backpatch.
So that's one of their distinguishing features.
When they're flying, you'll see it like more clearly because of where their feathers are.
Oh, okay, so it's like between their waves on their desk, so you can only really see it when they open it up.
Yep, exactly.
Got it.
Yeah.
It's cool.
But as I mentioned, their tail is kind of one of their most iconic features.
It's cocked almost vertically.
Oh.
So, and then it kind of like bounces when they're doing their little like dance singing situation. Vertical. Vertical and a little bit more.
Oh yeah, I'm looking at a picture right now.
You know, they tip up quite a bit and they're they're pretty long, actually.
They're almost as long as like the rest of their body, I would say.
Like if you were to take just the tail feather.
Yeah, it's probably only a little shorter than the rest of their body.
Yeah, no, I completely agree.
I mean, they're freaking adorable.
Okay.
They, I mean...
Okay.
Okay.
Stop talking about my bird like that.
That's enough.
That's enough.
Hey, that's enough.
That's enough of that.
Hey, I know I just tell the you that they throw it back. And they're all fancy and they'll bounce on it, I believe is what you said, but hey, don't call them adorable.
That's my bud.
Don't call my bike adorable.
Okay.
Okay.
Okay, that's my bird.
Okay.
Tell me more about my bird.
Okay.
They are very cute.
Their diet is almost entirely insects and spiders and snails.
They don't eat any seeds.
Oh.
I mean, they might eat some vegetation, but more so because of like nesting and like hunting for things that might have...
Oh, it's like an accident.
Yeah, they're not intentionally seeking out vegetation.
They're mostly, um, I guess, kind of insectivorous?
Yeah, insect.
Well, if they're eating snail.
Snail is not insect.
Yeah, I thought that was interesting.
If they eat just insect, it's insectivore.
I do not know what happens when you introduce snail into the mix.
I don't.
So I'll have to come back.
You have to come back to me with more information.
Well, and spiders too.
Oh, those are arachnids.
That's a good point.
I will look into that.
Please, for another time.
Please.
Their nest is a dome.
So it's more like the magpie nest, um, where there's a little bit of a top.
It has a side entrance. Very fancy.
Oh, so modern.
And that's about one to 3 feet above the water, again, similar to the nest of the red wing blackbird, where it's in the cattails, but.. Yep.
The male builds up to 22 nests in a season.
Why?
They're just like out there building shit.
Just in case they have 22 suitors.
Yep.
Bob the Builder.
Yeah.
They're just building.
A lot of them aren't even used.
They just decoy.
Oh, again, this for who?
Well, find out.
Oh, okay.
That's so interesting.
That seems like a lot of work. Isn't that interesting?
This is what happens when you don't doom scroll.
You can build 22 now.
And you can build decoy nests for me and your family.
Just saying, just saying, think about what you could be doing. Instead of doom scrolling.
You could build decoyness.
Yep.
Their breeding range is southern Canada across the US, but the highest density is in northern prairies.
Okay. Which what's a northern prairie?
I guess like Alberta, Canada, probably.
Sure.
Um, and the winter, they like travel down to Mexico and stuff, but they all migrate.
They do migrate.
Okay.
But, yeah, there's not really a year round, um, population, which is the opposite of the red wing blackbird, it's mostly around populations.
Fascinating.
But they are also least concerned.
Oh, they do have a 9.40000000 population.
Um, So they're least concerned because of their current population standards, but they're not growing the same way that red wing blackbirds are. Because they are losing wetlands and they need wetlands.
I see.
Okay, so they're kind of as red wings like need less.
Okay.
I see.
So they're kind of like not, they're not currently in a bad position, but because they rely so heavily on the wetlands and those are disappearing.
They're more of like the other side of the spectrum.
Yeah, they're like a future concern, like question mark.
Yep, kind of thing.
Okay, I see.
Yeah, those are our 2 contenders.
In the ring.
Right.
But I do love that we have a featherweight and we have a, I don't know, a mid, middleweight?
A middleweight?
Is that what they're called?
I'm not big in wrestling or TikTok.
I really only know featherweight.
I only have a featherweight.
But one is not a heavyweight.
That would be like if they went against a shoebill stork.
Right. Would be not a good matchup. Don't think so.
A marsh Ren and a shoe bell store.
It would be...
It would need at least just a swallow.
Yeah.
Yeah, I think so.
But who knows?
How many of my friends, it'd be a shoe bill store.
It's a great question.
No, what do I think?
Okay, 1st of all. The 2 contenders.
I love red wing blackbirds because I feel like...
I have an attachment to them, and you know what I think it is.
I think that they might be my birding spark.
Even though that came later, I've always been obsessed with birds, but I loved learning about them on like TV and seeing them, but I hadn't been in a ton of places where I'd seen a lot of cool birds.
And they made me like remember the moment, you know, but I feel like the red wing black word was the 1st time that I saw a bird and I've just been like riding that high of like seeing it and in nature and just like being like, yeah, I did it like that feeling of like the moment you see a bird.
Um, because when I was seeing them previously, I didn't have that same, I don't know, vigor for like getting something on my lifeless.
I don't know.
I don't know.
I just feel like it was my moment where I was like, 0 my God.
This is really cool So I have an attachment to them.
Okay.
However, I love the Martian and I love the wetlands.
I yearn for the wetlands.
I am one with the wetlands.
You are.
I feel like the wetlands is something that I deeply connect to, and I keep finding out that there's more of them in the world that I had no idea that it existed.
They only need them to survive.
I need them.
I am one with the marsh.
And so, I'm of the marsh, if you will.
And I, which is, yes.
Yeah.
And I will be making merch of some kind someday that says one with the marsh or of the marsh or something like that.
Something like that.
Yeah.
I'm going to put it on my tombstone and I'm also going to make shirts that say that.
So if anybody else is interested in being one with the marsh or of the marsh, then we'll find something cool to do with that.
But so I'm interested to hear because I now know that they compete for basically the same resources, but only when they're in the same habitat area.
And I just can't see how the marsh Ren is really fighting off the red wing blackbird.
So I needed no more about what's going on there. Secret weapons at play.
Which I hinted at.
Decoy domes?
Yeah.
Okay, tell me more.
Well, 1st I'm going to give you a little more backstory on the red wing blackbird.
I wish you would.
Obviously, they're what they look like. They do have a whole very emotional backstory.
So let's get into it.
So they are very territorial.
Oh, which both of these birds, very heavy on the territory.
I mean, that makes sense.
That's why they're beefing.
Yep.
But they, the red wing blackbirds are not shy.
They don't like hang out at a certain time of day.
They are territorial from sun up to sundown.
Wow.
They're just doing it.
They are telling people where they are. They're telling them to back off.
Okay, good to know.
They do have a very specific.
That was pretty good, actually.
I haven't heard it but I believe you.
Okay, I'm still...
I like the ham.
It was a little bit like flamenco dancing.
For those at home.
I dense.
Now you're doing like Power Ranger hands.
I like it.
Yeah, we'll play that right here.
They do also dive bomb.
Ooh, they're.. Like the magpie?
Yeah.
They're not picky either.
They will dive bomb a hawk.
They will die bum humans.
They will die bum.
Horses, because they're obviously sharing a lot of the agricultural land with different farm animals.
So they get mad.
I feel like you shouldn't beef with horses.
I wouldn't beef with a horse.
No. They're going to win.
I agree.
I love horses, but then objective is scary. Blackbird?
Yeah, they could just lay down on top of you and be dead.
Yeah, you're also still continuously making me think that the red wing blackbird will prevail here.
So continue continue with your story, but I'm the more I learn, the more I'm standing with my guys.
Yeah.
Well, okay.
But they, um, do have their epaulettes that's kind of their big feature as far as recognition their territory.
But the more bright red, their display of feathers is, the more dominant of a male they are supposed to be in their little crew, the little squad roost.
Is there a group of black, red wing blackbird name?
I can look that up.
You keep talking.
So, but speaking of their fashion, their plumage, it is their most iconic peace, they just really...
They're using fashion as a statement.
Yeah, and didn't you say something about the like fluffing?
Can't they like stand them up?
Yeah, they can like puff them up.
I mean, as much as you can puff your own shoulders up, but then they kind of open their wings partially and they get into this kind of fight pose and then they do this little like puff up and then do their little calls.
They really are little napoleons.
I kind of love them.
I do love them But they have some drama at home.
So they are polygonous, which means there's one male and up to 15 nesting females.
At least that's what it means for red wing blackbirds.
He defends the territory and does the whole performance all day long, sunrise, sunset. A lot.
A lot of the women are nope.
The women, we always do this.
This is our biggest anthropomortize.
It really is.
Problem is that we keep saying the girls.
The girls and the boys.
It's so stupid.
The females.
All the females.
You know what it is, is when you say females in a normal world, if you're talking about girls, it's giving immediately red pillar.
Yes.
And so it's like hard to put that into this perspective because normally, I would never say that.
Talking about just like the girls and women in my life.
He's doing this whole puffy performance, but yeah, many of these nesting females are not actually his.
Females are quietly mating with the neighboring males.
So this is something that they'd studied at a couple of ornithological societies, like different colleges and stuff.
They were studying marshlands and different politics of the area.
Very cool, very fun.
But it turns out when they were testing the eggs, um, a lot of the eggs that were meant to be for the, for the male that had created the nest and had mated with the female.
They were not the only jeans.
I mean, yeah, well, if you stand outside all day long and you're just trying to defend your territory rather than spending time with your female, then, yeah, she's probably gonna go find comfort somewhere else because what are you doing?
What are you doing?
Defending her from what when you could be spending time with her?
Oh my gosh.
No that's messy.
And I would be so excited if I was a scientist and I was like, 0 my God, wait.
Wait, wait a second.
Is she slipping in it?
Is she slipping into his den?
No.
You know what I mean?
Meanwhile, this guy's just like puffed up. 20 feet away, screaming. You know, I'm crazy.
That's so messy. Love it.
It's so interesting.
I love it.
And when you go to actual, like, very dense cattail areas, like, you'll often see at least 3 or 4 red wing blackbirds.
And so I just wonder, like, how many of them are competing for the same females and how many of the females are just mating with all of them?
Riding around and getting it.
Yeah.
And that's, you know, like, I support women's wrongs.
Yeah, exactly.
And birds, females, rights, and females, rights.
Yeah, exactly.
Ta-da.
That's the backstory of the red wing blackbird.
Incredible.
Also, I did find there's not really a name for a group of them that is like specific.
It's a flock.
However, sometimes they're called a cloud when they're in, like, murmurations.
They'll call them a cloud or a merle.
So, um...
Yeah, and sometimes they'll call them like a river of, which is the similar thing to a murmuration because they kind of do look watery.
They do.
So I think that applies to any bird that murmurs or flies in big groups, but still interesting to mention.
Yeah, yeah.
Definitely interesting.
No, murmurations is why I originally was going to be talking about the red wing blackbirds because I thought only starlings did the murmurations, but it turns out, it's a lot of these birds and they're all related.
There are a lot of starlings as well, out and about in the world, and they're probably a little more prolific in the urban areas.
Yeah.
Whereas, I would say, redwing blackbirds are stuck to like more of the suburbs and the marshy agriculture areas. Totally.
Okay, so let's get into the backstory of the marsh wren, which you are like rooting for already.
And, well, I just like, you don't even know their story.
No, I'm rooting for the red wing blackbird.
I think, well, I think that the marshm is the underdog.
I think that I prefer the red wing blackbird because they are like one of my they're like my spark moment, I think, for like birding, not for birds, but for birding.
Right.
And so I have I have a weird attachment to red wing blackbirds and I just can't see how marsh runs are pulling through.
However, I love an underdog.
So I'm willing to change my mind.
They are very lightweight.
They are indeed the featherweight class.
Absolutely. As a fighter.
They are a handful of nickels weighs more than this bird in comparison.
I know that people are often.
I can pulling their nickels.
Just in town with a fistful of nickels wishing it was a marshm.
Can't even tell you how many times.
That happened to me.
Who carries change?
Who even has cash?
What's going on?
Good to know.
They don't weigh a lot.
They're very lightweight, featherweight, in fact.
Oh my god.
They do indeed have the 22 dummy nest per territory often.
Um, and most will not be used because, again, dummy. Decoy nest.
Yeah, they prefer decoy actually.
I prefer it as well.
I didn't like saying dummy repeatedly.
A lot of the theories around why they are making the decoyness is really to court the females, show off their work.
Um, and then the females, if they like it, they'll pick it and they'll finish the nest.
So the marsh like starts the the male starts it.
Uh-huh.
And he builds a bunch.
He builds a bunch and then he takes the female. Certain females will pick the ones they like and they'll build their own accents.
So he's like, let me show you to my house.
And then if she's like, no, I don't like this apartment.
Yeah, this one's too small.
Yeah. She flies away.
Look at this other one.
He's like, but I built this other house as well.
And he does that.
Until she picks one or if she doesn't, then he just brings a different female to his multiple houses.
Well, and now I'm like, is that is that why he makes so many?
Because he just wants to make sure.
But it sounds like it serves 2 purposes based on the like.
I think it also confuses predators is the idea.
Yeah, which is interesting, but also does give you a lot of options. Imagine if you had a partner who was just like, where do you want to move?
And they showed you 22 properties and you could just pick whichever one you wanted.
That's kind of hot. In like an emergency situation.
You have another backup. At your 22nd house, you can go to number 20.
Yeah, that's a good point.
That's a really good point.
Yeah.
I kind of like it.
Okay.
On board with this multi-house idea now.
He's a bit he's a bit flashy with his resources, but we like it.
Um, so they do know a ton of songs.
They will sing like all sorts of different songs.
It's very similar to like a song sparrow, but they are very much a song bird and they will sing even in the night.
So that's not always common, but they sing all the time.
Yeah, and let's go ahead and put a couple of songs in here.
Okay.
So, another reason why they probably are making the nests that they are, is for the courtship, because the male and the female really look almost identical.
Yeah, it would be hard to tell. Using, like, flashy colors, like the red wing blackbird.
They're like.. At how I make a house.
Look it.
I can make not just one. Lots of houses.
Yeah, as many houses as you could possibly dream of, girl.
Girl, girl.
Girl, look at all these hours.
I'm a contractor.
That's steady work.
AI could never.
Oh my gosh.
The other way that they typically are schmoozing their females is through song.
They know a ton of songs.
Yeah, songs.
They know all the songs.
There's so many of them that in fact, we would never be able to play them all.
Yeah, the unmated males are especially the most singing.
Oh.
Why does that feel sad?
They're like lonely?
They're just looking for, yeah, looking for love.
Justin Bieber.
Now we get to the villain era of the March.
Oh, oh, okay, just the marshren.
So the marsh run, their big thing. That they love to do is puncture eggs.
They fatally pick eggs or nestlings of their neighbors, which is the red wing, blackbird, and other marshmallows?
Yes.
No, they do it to their own species, even their own offspring.
Ah, they will do it to red wing blackbirds most commonly outside of, obviously, themselves.
Yellowheaded blackbirds, which I don't know that I haven't seen one of those.
Elise Bittern, which I've only seen videos of because they're very, very hard to spot.
Um, but yeah, they destroy Ness and they...
Okay.
Fatally peck these eggs.
So that does make sense because I was like, how are they taking on these red wing blackbirds, but they're not. Taking one of the babies.
Which is pretty...
Evil.
Yeah, from embryo.
Is that?
Not sure.
I know.
It's badass though. In like the worst way.
Yeah.
No, they they will do it.
They will do it to anyone, including again, their own offspring.
And it is just because they want to survive.
Yeah, well, I imagine that there is something to do with, like, carrying capacity there, which is basically carrying capacity, the concept, and excuse me, if I get this wrong, is just that, like, each space, ecosystem, each kind of area of an ecosystem can only house a certain amount of animals of each species before it becomes unsustainable and something will happen that will kind of cause a decline.
And so a lot of the times that's why you have these different like, I believe they're called trophic layers of like predator prey, so on and so forth that keep those balances in check in order to make sure that they can stay at carrying capacity, but still pretty wild. That they're pecking their own young.
Yeah.
Well, and it's just interesting because when you say it, the way you just explained it, it does seem like they're almost just like an extremely hyper vigilant planner and like strategizer.
They're like, we don't have enough food for that. Don't have enough food for you.
They're just, they're constantly thinking so far ahead with everything they're doing.
They're this contractor that just can't stop working and can't turn their brain off into like, this is my own child.
Like an industrial planner.
Yeah, like a city planner.
Yeah, that's really interesting.
No, a marsh planner.
Yeah.
March planner, yeah.
That's what they are love that.
They've taken on this role and they take it very seriously.
They're like an HOA, but for the amount of kids you're allowed to have in the neighborhood.
They're like, you already had one kid last year.
You cannot have another this year.
Yeah, they're like, we had a baby last year, George.
Yep.
Yep.
No more.
We can't do it again.
Meanwhile, they're just out here like desperately singing songs in the middle of the night.
Yeah.
I'm like, well, maybe you should have chilled out on that.
I don't know.
Like, maybe there's other ways to plan besides killing Nests.
It's giving hot and cold for sure.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Speaking of hot and cold.
Tell me more We we've reached the end of kind of like the backstories of each of these rivals.
I love it.
I know you haven't finished the show but you've started.
Do you feel like you get a vibe of Ilya or Shane for these 2 rivals?
Okay, so to caveat this and remind everybody, I'm only 2 episodes in.
And I think originally I would have said that I thought that Ilya was the red wing blackbird because I think on the surface, they're a bit more showboaty.
Yeah.
I do think he's kind of savage, though.
So I think he might be a marsh wren.
I think he is like the, he's not an underdog, but he is like someone who knows how to like get you right in the spot where it's going to hurt right after he was singing his beautiful song where he like entices Shane in.
And so I think that Ilya is actually the marshren and Shane is the red wing blackbird.
I think so too.
I think there is this like knee jerk reaction to put Ilyas, the red wing blackbird because he is loud and he is like, who wouldn't think a Russian hockey player is similar to like a soldier?
Like, they just like, the vibe feels similar.
But I think the way the March Friend just like is so loud and like sings in the middle of the night and just like to fuck around with people and like you said, go for what hurts.
Totally. Dig in.
Yeah.
I also think the red wing blackbird seems to be like really gung ho on his like one female and is like protecting it at all costs by doing all this crazy stuff.
Meanwhile.
He's getting cheated on.
Yeah, and like fucked around behind his back and I do feel like Shane is kind of so like pure of heart and in the closet that he does do that a little bit and he's kind of naive because of it and it feels a little bit naive, these red wing blackbird characters.
No, I think they're a little naive.
I think they like, I think Shane can be loud because like he's one of the most famous hockey players, but he's like loud in this like quiet, stoic way.
Totally.
And I think that's kind of how the red wing blackbirds are.
So I do think it's like not a perfect one-to-one comparison and again, doesn't end the same.
Um, no spoilers to Cleo, but yeah, even you can tell it's obviously not the same thing.
But they do indeed have some similarities.
I can see it.
I can see it.
Yeah, I love it.
I love this and the frame that it's in.
I think it's a lot of fun and it's a fun way to like look at, I don't know, some people will get really mad about how people anthropomorphize in order to connect.
But I feel like it's a fun way to have like empathy and connect our lives and you don't need to do that to care about them, but it's fun to attach these stories.
I mean, I do this to my dog all the time.
He has a whole, he has 10 lives and 10 backstories I've given him that, you know, just make it more fun.
So agreed.
I think this is the part of science that I love is that you can make it fun.
Yeah.
No, and I love pop culture and stuff, so it's just like natural to compare these things. Absolutely.
They're how we frame our world.
Exactly.
I mean, why were they ever even referenced as epaulettes because of the frame of preference when they were creating the world?
Yeah, so.
Absolutely. Creating the world.
When they were creating the world, they created pop culture at the same time.
So it says, so it says.
No, I completely agree.
I think, okay, and maybe you were about to ask me this, but now that I'm thinking about it too, I feel like cage match, if you had to cage match these birds, you couldn't really, because the Martian, as far as I know, behind the scenes.
It's all behind the scenes.
I mean, I will say they have trickery under their shave.
And so trickery can get you a long way, right?
Like if we're putting them one to one and they have all these different places that they can hide out and the red wing blackbird is like using all of its energy to, you know, poke holes in all their fake houses that they built and they're not actually in that one.
I'm thinking the scene in like a horror film where someone's hiding in the stall and someone's walking in and they're just hitting the door open.
And then because of that, you get like the surprise on them, you know?
I think that could work.
However, I think if it was just one to one with no, no, um, no hideouts, no, you know, like literally just one to one, probably the red wing blackbird ends up winning out.
Yeah, I think so.
But still, I actually think, though, the Martians surprised me.
I mean, they really said, you're going to go low and I'm going to go lower.
Literally.
As low as I can go.
Fighting dirty.
And I do kind of respect it.
I don't promote it.
I respect it.
I do.
But yeah, the rivalry has run so long that there's actually studies that have been done by multiple different universities that show that it has changed both species. And how it's like caused evolution.
Wow.
Martian eggs actually can withstand 3 times more pressure than expected for their size.
Holy shit.
Because they are out here destroying so many eggs.
They're like, we got to make this shit rock solid.
Yeah, I mean, that's pretty cool.
Evolution.
Evolution, yeah. Awesome.
Evolution's kind of like taking aside.
They're like, maybe don't break this egg. Too many.
Or like you hit it once and you're like, wait, dude.
Did I want to kill him?
Oh, it makes you think. Makes you think.
Wow.
Between 1st hit and 2nd hit. Animating.
That's what I think at least.
But also, Red Wings have responded by being proactively aggressive towards the Wrens.
Like, yeah, they're just out here, like, like, I mean, yelling at each other.
If something was gonna swoop in and beak my egg, I would totally do the same thing.
Yeah.
If I knew this bird beats my egg.
I'm gonna immediately start yelling as soon as I see one.
I'm not gonna wait until it's in my house, you know?
So that makes sense to me.
Yeah.
It does make sense.
And another thing that makes sense for this reason of the rivalry, but also the reason that we talked about earlier is the females started clumping their nest together.
In which species?
In the red wing blackbirds.
Oh, okay.
So they have more of a group defense.
They already roosted together.
So they were nearby, but now they're like much closer.
Okay.
If there's marsh friends in the area, so they have more like...
Yeah, they have more vigilance on that.
Vigilance right there.
But it also feels like convenient because they're also like running around with anyone.
Again, like, it feels weird to be like, it's cheating because they're birds and it's not like that, but it is funny.
Like when you think about it.
No, it's funny because opportunistic.
A bird mates with another bird and then the male bird is spending all of his time defending up on the female. Of the cat and his nest.
Meanwhile, she's like, I could probably sneak in a quickie.
Just sneak over a couple inches and they'll be with their other.
Yeah, and then sneak right back over afterwards because it's not like they have to take their clothes off.
No.
Correct.
It's all one whole.
Yeah.
I honestly, I don't know because I do know there's a couple birds that it's it's not just a cloaca.
It's like, I know there's like a couple birds who actually have like a penis.
Yeah.
No, I think they still do have, I think male birds still do have a penis, but they...
Oh, they just rub whole?
Yeah.
Hmm.
I don't, well.. Have to do a bird sex episode someday. Which I actually think is really fascinating, but my understanding was that they sometimes have like a protrusion that basically acts as a penis that, I don't know if it's called that, but, um, and then that is like, but it's still one hole because it comes out of that, I think.
Yeah.
And I'm not sure.
But we'll definitely do a bird sex episode.
We will some other time because I also want to talk about gay birds.
Same.
Because that happens a lot.
It does.
It happens a lot more than people know.
Yeah, so we'll get into it.
Sex and sexuality. With do people who have no idea what they're talking about, but are willing to learn.
Exactly.
Um, yeah, so this is this is the marsh heated rivalry.
It's all the same marsh.
It's all the same reeds, but I think the one thing that you did not bring up that I need you to talk about is how the marsh wren postures itself.
It looks like a power bottom.
It is fully doing the splits between 2 reads.
I looked it up in a photo.
It's just straight up, like this little cotton ball looking, adorable little, vertical tail, vertical tail bird, and then there's 2 cat tails, and this little thing just has both of its legs straight out to the side, spreading on to the sides of these little cat tails, and it's just standing there, and it's looking at you, like, come and try me.
Like, come and try me.
And it is really cunty.
And I love it.
Yeah.
And it's like, it's not a rare photo of a martial.
No, if you look at my friend right now, it's all the photos.
Yeah.
When I was watching them, like, go off at me and the red wing blackbirds, like, depending on the scenario, they were doing it. Personally.
Oh, that would make me so happy to see.
I like wanted to take a picture, but I was scared that as soon as I pulled my phone out, they would fly away.
That's totally fair.
You don't want to have any sudden movements.
Yeah.
But it was so cool.
Yeah.
They really stand like, try me.
Yeah.
Watch me.
I'm about to beat your egg.
They really feel like, I don't know.
It's almost so power bottom.
It's actually dead top, but I don't really know.
Yeah, I would have to.
I would have to really like read a, read a book about that before I would know for sure, but I'll trust your judgment.
Okay, thank you Yeah.
Thank you.
To me, it's giving just like drop into the splits.
Like somebody you know, they can do the splits and just does them whenever.
And I, by the way, love that.
You can do the splits.
If you can drop into the splits, you're doing something cooler than I know how to do.
Yeah.
I can do the splits, but I got to warm up and I got to go there slow.
I'm not falling on the ground after a kick with my head backwards.
I would have a concussion.
Yeah.
I would concuss.
Possibly die.
Yeah.
So shout out to my friends and shout out to ballroom culture and all of it.
Oh my gosh, that's so funny.
Have any, like, non-heated rivalry celebrities that you feel like.
I mean, I feel like for the red wing blackbird, once you see one, you can't not see like Napoleon or like a painting of any, you know, Yeah, with just like the red epaulets and the big, puffy shoulder and like a painting and they're honestly quite regal.
So I just think that's the only thing I could ever associate them with outside of this new thing, which is Shannon and Ilya, which I love.
I think it's amazing and I'm really into it.
For the marsh wren.
I was thinking, I don't remember this girl's name, but what about that girl that was like, catch me outside?
How about dad?
Is that bad baby?
Think so.
I think it's Bad Baby.
And I do think they kind of give bad baby, like, kind of like a random underdog, like, I don't want to say little girl because I don't know how old she is, but just like a girl that, like, suddenly is like, catch me outside.
How about that?
You know, like, I feel like they have the energy of, like, bad baby.
Yeah, okay.
So that's what I'm thinking for Marsh Ren.
And that was just the 1st thing that came to me, but did you have anything that you thought would be good for that?
I mean, honestly, it's hard for me to not think about Alien and Shane because of like how I decided and got inspired to rewrite.
So I kind of see the vibes there. It's causing blindness.
That's totally fair.
What was the?
Oh, the other thing I wanted to ask you about.
You had shown me some pictures of red wing blackbirds like on other birds.
Oh my gosh.
Yeah, the Denver Audubon and then E-Bird.
Okay, if you, if you haven't heard our one of our other episodes, we mentioned eBird and how it's a kind of complicated app, yeah.
If you're brand new to birding, you may not have heard about eBird yet.
Recommend it.
But I will say if you are on social media, a bird memes are so funny because people go and find these like wild pictures of birds that people have posted to like list them.
And one of them is like a fucking owl.
And the red wing blackbird is just riding on the back of the owl.
No, we thought it was AI.
We had to go deep.
We had to go deep and then we saw that it was posted on official bird accounts.
Right.
Does anybody know why that's happening?
They're just dive bombing and happened to catch them?
There was one on an eagle, too.
Yeah.
Yeah, I was like, what is happening?
I think they're just, well, I mean, they do dive bomb. These giant birds.
So I wonder if they just kind of like ride them for 2nd sometimes.
Is it not giving the red coats are coming or whatever?
The British are coming.
The British are coming on my back?
It's like they're on a horse.
You know what I'm saying?
Like, they literally are like a soldier riding a horse because the owl and the eagle are so much bigger.
We have to post those photos.
We can credit them for sure because they were the ones supposed to them.
I have a little thing that I made with those photos.
I am so excited about it. Really fun.
I yeah, I, those pictures stunned me.
Yeah.
No, they're wild.
I remember you sending them to me and we both were like, no, there's no way.
They're AI but they're not.
They're not the one time that they're not.
Yeah.
As far as we know.
I know for sure the owl one isn't.
I'm pretty sure the eagle one isn't either.
I mean, it seems like it's potentially a behavior that.
Right, because of their dive bumps.
Like it might just be a way for them to avoid colliding with the bird. Or like potentially getting caught by the bird because, I mean, they a red wing blackbird easily.
That's good point.
So if they're like dive bombing and then they get in a weird spot or there's like a weird wind gust, then they might have to like ride for a second.
Yeah, we'll have to look into that at some point.
Like, it seems like some very weird symbiotic moment between predator bird species.
Because it's very different than like, I don't know, a buffalo with like a bird chilling on the back.
It's, yeah, very different.
I mean, yeah, owls 100% eat other birds.
Yeah, I would imagine eagles do too.
Oh, yeah, they definitely do.
Raptors often.
Well, and that's part of the murmuration behavior is to protect themselves from predators.
Yeah, it's like when fish do the baseball.
Yeah, exactly.
Raptors have a lot more trouble diving and accurately grabbing one of the birds when they're doing these weird dancing movements.
Yeah, it's so interesting.
Yeah, I loved that.
That was such a fun episode.
What a great 2 for.
It was really fun.
Yeah, I loved it.
But I'm excited.
Next time, I think we're gonna talk about something really smelly.
Yeah, we're gonna, that's our, that's our small hint, and I'm really excited for our stink bomb of an episode next week that I will be recording.
That's the hint if anybody wants to guess who we're going to talk about and by who.
I mean, what bird.
It will be a bird, not a person, even though we did a person recently.
How funny would it be if we did a person and we were like, stinky.
Stinky.
They're so sneaky.
Our 1st guests were like, stinky.
No, it's a bird.
So if you have a guest, feel free to let us know on socials or on our email, I guess, if you want.
Our socials are birds on birds with a 0 instead of NO, and you can find us at birdsonbirdspodcast at gmail.com with a, oh, not a 0 spelled like you would say.
Yeah.
Yeah.
No zero.
No zero.
But anyway, until next time.
Stay cool, bird boy.