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Technology's daily show (formerly the Technology Brothers Podcast). Streaming live on X and YouTube from 11 - 2 PM PST Monday - Friday. Available on X, Apple, Spotify, and YouTube.
You're watching TVPN. Today is Tuesday, 11/04/2025. We are live from Silicon Valley.
Speaker 2:That's right.
Speaker 1:We're not gonna say exactly where we are, but we're in Silicon Valley, and we're hanging out with some absolute dogs today. Technology So we took your
Speaker 2:show on
Speaker 1:the road. Thank you to producer Ben for helping us get set up. And thank you for Ramp for making this possible. Time is money. Save both.
Speaker 1:Easy to use corporate cards, bill payments, accounting, and a whole lot more all in one place.
Speaker 2:So glad we have Pat here to be our live studio audience.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Yeah. You gotta clap Clap for for everything. Is required. We have some breaking news out of Sequoia Capital just down the street from where we are.
Speaker 1:They have a new set of bosses, new top dogs.
Speaker 2:Top dog alert.
Speaker 1:Yep. Top dog alert. They're going Linsanity mode and the Gradinator.
Speaker 2:The Gradinator.
Speaker 1:Pat Grady and and Alfred Lin are in. We haven't had Pat on the show. We've had Alfred Lin. He's fantastic.
Speaker 2:I can read through Yeah. Roloff's message. He said they they love to structure these as emails. So subject, a new generation of Sequoia stewards. Don Valentine founded Sequoia with a future in mind.
Speaker 2:He instilled a distinct culture focused on stewardship. We think of stewardship as leaving the firm better than when we found it. This belief has enabled successful intergenerational transfers and ensures we hire the right people who want to create a partnership that outlives all of us.
Speaker 1:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:Stewardship grounds our culture in an ethos of performance excellence, teamwork, and continuous innovation. It also extends to our companies. Even though we're called an investment firm, we think of ourselves as company builders. Since 1972, Sequoia stewards have transitioned the partnership from one generation to the next when they saw that the team was ready for the challenge. With each transition, a new generation is able to stand on the shoulders of those who came before them and build on and strengthen the Sequoia partnership.
Speaker 2:That moment has come for me. Today, I am announcing that Alfred Lin and Pat Grady are Sequoia's new stewards. Alfred and Pat embody the cultural traits that have defined Sequoia for the last fifty three years. They have exceptional performance having partnered with companies like DoorDash, ServiceNow, Airbnb, Snowflake, Citadel Security, Zoom, Kalshi, OpenAI, OpenEvidence, and Harvey. They are leaders.
Speaker 2:Alfred has co led Sequoia's early stage business since 2017 and Pat, our growth stage business since 2015. They embrace our apprenticeship model. They have a fearless and resilience a fearlessness and resilience that's necessary to win in this business. They do not shy away from difficult conversations and they roll up their sleeves to company build. Let's give it up for rolling up sleeves.
Speaker 1:Let's roll up our sleeves.
Speaker 2:Both with founders and within Sequoia, the two of them are true teammates to founders, to their partners, and to each other. They're the right pair to entrust with the stewardship of Sequoia. Like the stewards before me, I will transition into a new role advising the partnership while continuing to represent Sequoia on boards. I'm confident that Sequoia's ethos will endure and the deep bench of talent at Sequoia will thrive under Pat and Alfred's leadership. Best regards, Roloff.
Speaker 2:Both that.
Speaker 1:Are you reading between the lines here? I think I know what happened. I think Roloff probably just recently got into racing cars and he's just like, need to go full time.
Speaker 2:I need to go all
Speaker 1:in on I got it. Got it.
Speaker 2:I found my real calling.
Speaker 1:I found my real calling.
Speaker 2:It's time.
Speaker 1:I'm gonna I'm going to spend more time. I can't wait another day. I can't spend yeah. Spending time at managing Sequoia as a steward is just it's not it's not reducing my lap times.
Speaker 2:I I put this post in from Alex because this was my first thought too. Alex says, bro went out and said venture capital has returned free risk and then handed over the keys. The timing is is interesting that
Speaker 1:I don't if you read too much in that. I I
Speaker 2:I don't think you need to
Speaker 1:read too much into it. He said that the Delphi Delphi podcast. Yeah. Right?
Speaker 2:I think so.
Speaker 1:That's that's such a funny place to go drop a bombshell and then bounce. I I I don't think you can read too much into it because it's it's but he doesn't do a lot of media. So I don't know. Maybe maybe he was like, I'm I'm out. I'm out of venture.
Speaker 2:It's been a good run. Venture We'll
Speaker 1:have to keep keep tracking it. But anyway, thank you to Restream for making this stream possible. One livestream, 30 plus destinations, multi stream, reach your audience, wherever they are. Anthropic is the new king of AI API sales, boatload of new financials and projections below from the information. Anthropic this summer hiked its most optimistic growth forecast by roughly 13% to 28% over the next three years and is projecting as much as $70,000,000,000 in revenue in 2028.
Speaker 1:Okay. So that's up from close to $5,000,000,000 this year. So $5,000,000,000 then $10 then $20 then $30 Like, they're more than doubling every year for the next three years. Remarkable. Are you walking over here to hit the gong somehow?
Speaker 1:What are you doing? There we go. Oh, is I off mic? Yeah. Okay.
Speaker 1:Thank you.
Speaker 2:We're back.
Speaker 1:We're back. The company expects demand from businesses for its AI models to drive that growth. Anthropic projected that its $20.25 revenue from selling access to these models through an application programming interface will roughly double the revenue its bigger rival OpenAI generates. And Peter will
Speaker 2:Yeah. Notable thing here is they're projecting cash flow.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Profitable in 2027.
Speaker 2:17,000,000,000 cash flow in 2028. Not something you see from AI players outside of NVIDIA.
Speaker 1:I don't know. From the way Anthropic talks about pre training and scaling and new models, I would be remember the whole Dario idea of, like
Speaker 2:Well, no. This this
Speaker 1:each each model individually is cash flow positive, but you keep having to scale up by 10 x. So we're gonna do a $10,000,000,000 training run, and then we're gonna amortize that over five years, and it's gonna look great. But in the short term, it's gonna look terrible, and it keeps looking terrible because you keep scaling up. This is the exact opposite of that. I I wonder if Yeah.
Speaker 2:I feel like to actually be on. To actually be cash flow positive at the company level, I have to imagine they would have to not do the next training round.
Speaker 1:Well, not do something that's 10 x or a or a 100 x. I don't I don't know. I I understand that, like, compute will continue to scale with with revenue. So they can still be, like, extremely compute scaling pilled. But, in terms of viewing the incremental progress on their models as, essentially CapEx that puts them deep in a hole, it feels like there's some shift in the way that they're thinking about this or at least messaging it to the market.
Speaker 1:I don't know. May maybe this is in reaction to, that last quote that came out about, each model being so, so unprofitable in the short term. Let me tell you about Privy Wallet Infrastructure for Every Bank. Privy makes it easy to build on crypto rails, securely spin up white label wallets, sign transactions, and integrate on chain infrastructure all through one simple API. So Peter Willeford said, OpenAI's plan, spend 115,000,000,000 to then become profitable in 2030, and Anthropics plan is spend 6,000,000,000 to then become profitable in 2027.
Speaker 1:We'll be curious to see what works best. People are are are the bub talk is going through the roof. It's going back and forth. Mass memetic theory, the the swing builder himself, the man who built the
Speaker 2:What did he have say?
Speaker 1:The swing. He was saying that Rune has become extremely defensive lately, taking shots Okay. At former TBPN guest, Rune. And Jacob Rintamaki, another guest, says, to be fair, to Rune, people have also been saying a lot of crazy stuff about Sam Altman and AI CapEx Twitter Discourse in general just makes me want to take a shotgun to the brain. So deeply mid curve.
Speaker 1:And Mass is going back and forth showing that OpenAI has to 1000x their revenue over five years to get to a standard 15x PE ratio, which is certainly not the goal for most companies. And I think Jacob makes a good point here. He says, Palantir's price to earnings ratio is is 600 Yes.
Speaker 2:Meta is at six? Meta is at something like a 22, 27.
Speaker 1:27? That's like To get to 15 is like, yes, that might happen as a forty year old company, but certainly not as a company that's tripling revenue every year.
Speaker 2:Also, enterprise large language model API market share Yeah. This graph, this the this like study that was done
Speaker 1:Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Is from Menlo Ventures. Yep. She's a big investor in Anthropic. Oh. Was like a relatively it was, I think, a relatively small sample size.
Speaker 1:I mean, I think could be correct about the about the market share.
Speaker 2:I think it's probably directionally
Speaker 1:super fast. It's much less of an issue. And very clearly, like, the stated mission of OpenAI has never been like, we're a pure play enterprise large language model API company. Yep. It's been like, give us credit in our price to earnings relative to our advances on science and our consumer app and our agent to commerce and our and our AI slob.
Speaker 2:The the other notable thing from that specific report was that OpenAI's share of closed source foundation models via API dropped from 50 to 3450% to 34% across 2024.
Speaker 1:Sure. Yeah. So And then it went down further to 25%. Yeah. That's what it looks like.
Speaker 1:But, I mean, if the market's growing, like, how
Speaker 2:much does this really
Speaker 1:matter? It's but yeah, they're they're going back and forth. They're they're duking it out. But Jacob Rinamaki shares something funny. Just a reflection on NVIDIA that I wanted to share, because it's the Wojak meme.
Speaker 1:In 2019 people saying NVIDIA stock is extremely overvalued. This was pre the Ethereum pump, believe. And NVIDIA's market cap was a $100,000,000,000. And it did seem like, oh, they just like make they just make chips. Like, it's just like they they they have, like, one product kind of.
Speaker 1:Oh, yeah. They make great gaming graphics cards. It was at a 100,000,000,000, then at 500,000,000,000 in 2021. Now now NVIDIA did trade down crazy after the crypto proof of stake move. But then in 2023, Nvidia hit 1,000,000,000,000, and everyone was saying, this has gotta be the top.
Speaker 1:And then in 2025, we now see that the market cap is 5,000,000,000,000, and the Wojak is extremely dismayed.
Speaker 2:And pulling up this post from Trevor Scott when NVIDIA This was a crazy photo. This this was pretty surreal to see this image surface. I'm Jensen did this and allowed himself to be photographed doing it. But, this was 06/04/2024. Yeah.
Speaker 2:He was signing a woman's shirt at a conference Mhmm. And NVIDIA is up 85%. And obviously, lot of folks were calling the
Speaker 1:top Oh, man. On this fake
Speaker 2:Top historically, signals. These have these have been Yes. Signals. But here we are.
Speaker 1:But I mean, to to to steel man this, Jensen has always been a rock star. Like, he's always like fashioned himself like a rock star. Not like he put on the jacket as at at the top. He's just always been wearing it. He was born in it.
Speaker 1:And so I think he's just a man who manufactures a new top signal every quarter, and that makes him
Speaker 2:The arm link, beard chugging.
Speaker 1:Yeah. We're gonna look back on that in a year and be like, how was that at the top?
Speaker 2:And you know that Korean fried chicken stocks were pumping
Speaker 1:Wait. Really? Because of what he said?
Speaker 2:Well, we think he was eating I
Speaker 1:didn't see that.
Speaker 2:There's a I don't I don't On Wall Street Bets Mhmm. Three days ago, this could be a copy copy pasta. Mhmm. But there's a there's a post with 18,000 upvotes that says, I am financially ruined short selling Korean fried chicken companies. I have lost everything and I'm not sure how to continue.
Speaker 2:That's This week I lost $472,000 short selling Korean fried chicken companies. My idea was with the declining Korean population and the recent trend healthier eating and vegan diets, there's an opportunity here. I did some research into consumer trends in Korea and determined that this would be a lucrative play. So, I shorted Korean fried chicken companies across the board. Unfortunately, earlier this week NVIDIA CEO Jensen dined out at a Korean chicken restaurant called Kabu Chicken in Seoul Yeah.
Speaker 2:And pictures went viral of him enjoying fried chicken and beer. Stocks of chicken companies in Korea soared 20 to 30% and I was margin called. Everything is gone.
Speaker 1:It's great.
Speaker 2:I don't know how to continue. How could I not have known that Korean fried chicken is the future of AI?
Speaker 1:That's hilarious. That does seem like a copy pasta, but the Internet is such a wide such a big place that it is possible that there's one person that did that, that actually YOLO'd their full full send.
Speaker 2:There's been crazier bets made on Wall Street.
Speaker 1:I mean, we know some retail traders who full port into crazy thesis, like a crazy thesis every week. So wouldn't be surprised if someone out there did go giga short the Korean fried chicken stocks. It's totally possible.
Speaker 2:Well, yeah. If you were shorting a variety of restaurant stocks in The US, this this year, you did incredibly well.
Speaker 1:They all did poorly.
Speaker 2:Is that
Speaker 1:the Ozempic
Speaker 2:trade? Don't even know I don't even know that. There was just a lot of these restaurants that started trading at like 50 to a 100 times earnings. Mhmm. We'll get to it later
Speaker 1:in the show or I'll try to I'll try to Well, before we move on, let me tell you about Cognition, the makers of Devon. Devon is the AI software engineer. Crush your backlog with your personal AI engineering team. There's some debate over how impactful the ChatGPT launch has been on, job displacement. We keep going back and forth on this.
Speaker 1:I mean, I was working on a slide deck yesterday with Tyler, and I was and we were mapping it out, and I drew it out on I drew out the slide on the whiteboard. And I was like, okay. Now I need to get this this the picture of the whiteboard into Google Slides and have it, like, animate or get it into Figma and have it animate so I can actually use Slides. And and I just like there was still a disconnect and we still wound up doing a bunch of it manually. And there wasn't just like take a picture of something you scribbled turn it into a presentation.
Speaker 1:Like Yeah. It's just we're we're not in that like, the era of agents you said this in the show yesterday. You were like you're like, Codex or Microsoft Copilot doesn't get enough credit for bringing us into the era of agents. But Copilot is not actually an agent. It's it's like it's a copilot, which is different.
Speaker 1:An agent I see as a pilot. Yeah. Copilot is like sitting alongside you doing spell check. Would see like Grammarly as a full Grammarly, the original Grammarly was like a copilot. And then and then Deep Research is an agent.
Speaker 1:And so
Speaker 2:I And they have see some agent specific functionality.
Speaker 1:I see Devon as an agent. I see Codex as an agent. But but I I think there's still a there is still a big problem to solve of, like, what is the agent in every category? How can someone actually make it to be reliable?
Speaker 2:So I guess my point was like Copilot is meant to be a way to orchestrate agents.
Speaker 1:They certainly want it to get there. Yeah. But it it that's not how people use it just yet. Like, for the most part Yeah. It is like Well, I
Speaker 2:think the notable I think I think something notable about, like, when when I think of the ChatGPT, like, jobs displacement debate and discourse Yeah. Like, I look at our company
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Which is like, despite a bunch of new tools popping up, we still need to hire video editors. Yeah. Still wanna hire writers. There's like a bunch of these different roles that AI is great at. Like, AI is, I mean, AI isn't necessarily like great at writing, but it can produce a lot of writing.
Speaker 2:Right?
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:AI is great at writing code or at least it's great at at at increasing productivity and velocity. That just meant that we hired a software engineer. Yeah. Right?
Speaker 1:We should we we we should have a bigger debate about this. I feel like me and you can debate this a little bit, but we we we should have some we should have some folks on the show to go back and forth on this chart. Because it is first, I mean, we need to figure out how accurate is the how how accurate the actual chart is because it doesn't include a y axis. And and it's one of those things where where we've seen these viral we these viral charts where when you go and recreate them, they kind of, like, you know, don't quite
Speaker 2:line up. This this chart to me has always been about interest rates going through the roof. That Yep. That that's what it just happened to almost perfectly coincide with the chat GPT launch.
Speaker 1:Change in the high interest rate.
Speaker 2:And then if you look at the growth of the S and P 500, like almost all the growth is driven by AI. So it's like Yeah. The narrative here is just
Speaker 1:It's weird because high interest rates higher interest rates should should hurt the S and P 500. Right? Like, that's what happens when interest rates go up. Like, you flood to bonds. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Equities sell off. Like and that did happen a little bit in 2021 at the end of the top. But then we got the AI boom and we wound up building much bigger. And so Bubble Baby or something says Bubble Boy, who we've talked about before, says, If only there were some major event a year before that was important and affected interest rates and hiring trends. And so is this the is this the Silicon Valley Crisis and then the or the Silicon Valley Bank crisis and then the interest rate rate hike that I think Bubble Boy is referring to.
Speaker 1:And Young Macro is replying and says, but shouldn't restrictive policy also have impacted growth, proxied by the black line? Yes. And that's what I think we were getting at. Not saying the chart is great, but I don't get the consensus pushback, which is that policy was being tightened around the divergent point. So, yeah, I would love to dig into more of this because there's just so many different things that are going on.
Speaker 1:There's like the cultural trends around the what Elon did at X that just kind of like woke a lot of CEOs up to this idea that they could run leaner. The interest rate's huge. The the different, like, geopolitical dynamics of, Yeah. What do you wanna offshore or not? There's, like, so many different different aspects.
Speaker 1:And then even just even just if AI isn't displacing, but if CEOs think that AI is gonna displace people Yeah. Or AI will be in five years, well, a lot of the reason why you hire someone isn't because you need the job done today. It's because like
Speaker 2:You need time for them to ramp.
Speaker 1:Exactly. Like, the reason that a law firm hires a junior associate is because they need a new partner. Yeah. And the partner will grow up into a partner in twenty years.
Speaker 2:Yeah. And I I've said this probably 20 times by now. But I think that every CEO, even if they're not if they don't have an AI narrative Mhmm. Wants an AI narrative. So if you have to do layoffs, why not say, hey, we're getting a bunch of efficiency out of AI tools, that's why we're doing layoffs.
Speaker 2:So that's why we're not opening up a bunch of new Yeah.
Speaker 1:So it could be like The cost of capital went up. You have to pull back on a bunch of investments because you can't get cheap debt anymore. You're tightening your belt, and then you wrap it in the AI narrative. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1:It is possible. Well, if
Speaker 2:you're worried about AI job displacement, why not invest in a SPV that has fees with 0% carry and a seven percent one time management fee, Just 7% tax immediately. This is not even the craziest that that we've heard about. Yeah. There's some out there floating around that are just 1010%
Speaker 1:off the top.
Speaker 2:Right off the top.
Speaker 1:The 0% That's been happening on great for the principal agent problem. Totally. Sure it solves that. Not incentivized to raise
Speaker 2:as much money as humanly possible. I
Speaker 1:mean, it feels like you know, I've heard a lot of early managers like flip this around where they only get carried and they give on the management fee.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And they're basically working
Speaker 2:Yeah. Where they're charging like just an admin fee to cover the
Speaker 1:cost. Yep. Barely anything. And you'll see people with like small funds that seem, you know, somewhat sizable. But the actual management fee, once they've given so many fees because they don't just come out with a 3% or 4% fee structure.
Speaker 1:They might have 2%, and then they're giving it away in a bunch of places to get early LPs on board. And so there's plenty of early stage managers that are making like 100 ks or 200 ks. Like, they're just not taking that much home. But Yeah. They're heavily incentivized on the carry side that if it works, they will they will wind up doing very well.
Speaker 1:And so they're betting on themselves. This is kind of the opposite of that. Yeah. Anyway, let me tell you about figma.com. Think bigger, build faster.
Speaker 1:Figma helps design and development teams build great products together. You can get started for free. Michael Burry has just filed his his 13 f eleven days early. He has never done this before. Massive put.
Speaker 1:He's going short Palantir and Nvidia. But didn't didn't didn't Burry come out and say this is fake news?
Speaker 2:Yeah. This is a I mean, it's also Do you think people not understanding the notion The stance. The notion. The market?
Speaker 1:Do you think that there may be The accounts. One way
Speaker 2:or another? A bubble.
Speaker 1:It's a bubble is the entire account. Imagine what happens after the after the bubble pops. Like, your account is just so sad.
Speaker 2:Yeah. This is just this is just a I I think in general Yeah. People continuously misunderstand the sort of like notional value versus the size of
Speaker 1:Totally. The actual Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Also just like, I I I think that there's there's oftentimes where there's multiple funds and multiple vehicles within there and multiple multiple things that are hitting a reporting threshold. And so there's so much, like, legal nuance. I don't I don't know that it's super easy to just like see a big number in a 13 and a half and and tell a
Speaker 2:whole story around it. Totally.
Speaker 1:Let Burry cook. We'll see what he has to say.
Speaker 2:I wonder if Burry wish he played himself in The Big Short.
Speaker 1:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:So that all the meme, if if he knew all the meme images would be shared hundreds thousands of times a day. Yeah. It would just, he would just, it would be the ultimate marketing engine
Speaker 1:for It'd be very tolerated. That that was a tough role. I mean, it wasn't the toughest, I guess, in Christian Bale's. It wasn't the biggest transformation. But it was like I mean, Christian Bale's a great actor.
Speaker 2:I mean It was it was perfect.
Speaker 1:Is it called The Big Short? Is he big or is he short? Is he both the big short?
Speaker 2:Both at the same time.
Speaker 1:He he was he was defending his height. He said, I'm not five four or something like that. I don't know. Yeah. I've been there.
Speaker 1:Good. Very cool.
Speaker 2:Amit shared some more on Palantir earnings. We covered it a little bit at the end of yesterday's show. Q three, they did 1,180,000,000 of revenue, up 63% year over year. 883,000,000 of US revenue, up 77% year over year. 397 US commercial revenue, up a 121% year over year.
Speaker 2:Almost half a billion of US government revenue, up 52%, year over year. GAAP net income of, nearly half a billion at 40% margin. Rule of 40 at a 114%.
Speaker 1:Yes. Government contracts boom. This was particularly good for them. Although, you know I
Speaker 2:mean, it's growing slower than Than commercial revenue. Commercial, but still people understand.
Speaker 1:Why did the journal go with with government contracts boom? That's interesting. Data analytics company said it had 1,180,000,000.00 in the sales for the third quarter. Palantir stock here, another record high. Man, it's what a what a wild story, the Palantir story.
Speaker 1:It's over
Speaker 2:I mean, twenty years old. Down Right? It's down 8% today. So Yeah. But still, mean, like Beating
Speaker 1:This is just such a fascinating company that just like
Speaker 2:Beating like this cooking for and then trading down 8% the next day
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Is shows that the market's a little shaky.
Speaker 1:It's funny.
Speaker 2:Another iconic quote from Karp. He says, some of our detractors have been left in a kind of deranged and self destructive befuddlement. This remains the beginning. The first moment of a first chapter. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Super The to Denver base. Be twenty twenty years in and just be like, job unfinished. I
Speaker 1:like that The Wall Street Journal summarizes what Palantir does. The Denver based firm sells software to centralize, manage, and analyze large amounts of data. It's like the simplest one liner. Like
Speaker 2:What does Palantir do?
Speaker 1:Palantir was also in the Journal of Today because they're height they're they're hunting for they're hiring high schoolers now. They're just like, College is pointless. We'll just hire you straight out of high school, which is insane and awesome. I love it. One Palantir post says, College is broken.
Speaker 1:And we talked about this when when they went like out with like the meritocracy, like, kind of campaign. Yeah. But the journal's writing on it a little bit more. The fellowship offers a path for high school students to work full time at the company. After deciding to apply, Matteo Zanini found out that he got the fellowship at around the same time he got admitted to Brown University.
Speaker 1:Brown wouldn't allow him to defer. And he had also landed a full ride scholarship through the Department of Defense.
Speaker 2:What crazy What kind of track is that?
Speaker 1:This kid is is like what's a good example? Seal team six level or something. Like, this he's like an elite operator. The DOT is like, we will pay for your Brown education. And then Palantir is like, but we'll also I just hire you direct
Speaker 2:got a scholarship to be on the equestrian team at Brown.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Like, I got on part the fence. Be here. Who is this Mateo Zanini? This is a crazy, crazy person.
Speaker 1:Okay. Let let let's go through this. I'm I'm super interested in this now. I said, no one said to do the fellowship, said Zanini, who turned 18 in September. All of my friends, my teachers, my college counselor, it was a unanimous no.
Speaker 1:His parents left the decision to him and he decided to go with Palantir. Zanini is one of more than 500 high school graduates who applied Palantir's Meritocracy Fellowship, an experiment launched under Alex Karp. Palantir is a data analytics company that has been known lately for its government contracts, including with the US military and intelligence agencies. Karp, who studied philosophy at Haverford College and got a law degree from Stanford, said in an August earnings call that hiring university students these days meant hiring people who have, quote, Just been engaged in platitudes. The inaugural class of 'twenty two Palantir fellows wraps up in November.
Speaker 1:If they have done well in the four month program, they will have the chance to work full time at Palantir sans college degree. The fellowship kicked off with a four week seminar with more than two dozen speakers. Each week had a theme, foundations of the West, US history, unique culture. They're talking about Abraham Lincoln and Winston Winston Churchill. We felt obligated to provide more than the average internship, said Jordan Hirsch, a senior counselor who works with Carp on special projects.
Speaker 1:The intern's experience
Speaker 2:That's cool. On. So they're getting some some some classroom time in?
Speaker 1:Basically. Yeah. Yeah. They're they're they're
Speaker 2:They're studying game.
Speaker 1:They are studying some stuff.
Speaker 2:They're studying game and they're also getting into the history books.
Speaker 1:Yeah. It's pretty crazy.
Speaker 2:That's cool. I do I I find it a pretty show. A pretty common experience to be like blown away by, let's say, like a a somebody in there like mid to Mhmm. Mid to late twenties Yeah. And discover that they didn't go to college or they dropped out very Like, these people just I I I don't have a lot of maybe it's maybe it's like I don't know.
Speaker 2:May maybe it's something to do with, like, our network, but it seems like you can basically get a three a two to three year head start by dropping out. Right? And by the time you're in your twenties, like, you look, you you kind of appear and are accomplished like somebody that that is in their mid thirties.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Yeah. You just gotta be ready to kind of build your own thing. Like, if you're if you're not capable of that, like, you're gonna have a bad time. But if you're if you're ready to, like, you know, just kind of go independent and, like, lead from and just, like, solve any problem that comes your way, it's it's clearly very, very accelerating to your career.
Speaker 1:Appreciate it. Vanta, automate compliance managed risk, accelerate trust with AI. Vanta helps you get compliant fast, and we don't stop there. Our AI and automation power everything from evidence collection to continuous monitoring to security reviews and vendor risk, whether you're starting up or scaling.
Speaker 2:Couldn't have said it better myself, John. Let's get into this, highlights from this article in the Financial Times. The state of AI is China about to win the race. Clickbait. It worked.
Speaker 2:Let's get into it. Arnaud Arnaud Bertrand shared some highlights. He says, this is rare enough to be highlighted. And actually good Financial Times article on the state of the AI race between The US and China. He put race in quotes.
Speaker 2:Three interesting points stood out to Arnaud. One, the fact that for a general purpose technology such as AI, long term advantage often comes down to how widely and deeply technology spread across society. This is because at the risk of pointing the obvious benefits from a new technology come from using it widely, not just creating it. You wouldn't get any benefit from discovering the steam engine in and of itself. What drove productivity gains and ultimately Britain's advantage industrial revolution was spreading and using this technology in its society.
Speaker 2:And China has advantages here as the article notes since they're unarguably better at orchestrating society wide transformation as that's all they've been doing for the past three decades. They got some reps in. To the point that US semiconductors export controls actually help China in AI since they pushed Chinese companies towards a different playbook. Pooling commute compute, optimizing efficiency and releasing open weight models. John John is Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Mean, like the
Speaker 2:the the efficiency thing is
Speaker 1:impressive, but I mean, the the actual I I would love to know about like the the data point that I have not seen that I would like to see is is actual, basically, like, of AI. Like, it's clear that they were able to catch up on creation of frontier model with deep seek, but how much is actually getting implemented? Like, if you look at in America, you would go to, what's happening on OpenRouter. Let's look at OpenAI's revenue. Let's look at Palantir's revenue.
Speaker 1:Let's look at Anthropix revenue. Right? And we and we can see that companies are paying to actually implement this stuff. To understand close China is, I'd want to benchmark that a little bit more and try and understand that. Anyway, we can move on.
Speaker 2:Good point. The the the efficiency thing is real. The other thing that's fascinating is just like the and, you know, there there's the energy abundance that China has. Right? It's like helps off offset the the, like Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah. If they can use more energy and be more efficient Yep. Then and that's that's an edge.
Speaker 1:Before we move on to the next point, let me tell you about graphite. Dev code review for the age of AI. Graphite helps teams on GitHub ship higher quality software faster.
Speaker 2:Jordy, where were we? This is extremely ironic as The US effectively pushed China to develop models that are more efficient
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And open source, which turns out to be a better strategy for global diffusion.
Speaker 1:If you're
Speaker 2:a company in, say, Germany or Brazil, you can download Quine or DeepSeek, run it locally, fine tune it for your market, and never worry about API rate limits.
Speaker 1:But does that mean that you win? Like, it's like, cool. Like, Linus Torvalds is not the most powerful person in computing. Yeah. Like, did a great thing by creating Linux.
Speaker 1:It's awesome. But he's not like he's nowhere near the power of something.
Speaker 2:If anything, it seems like you you kind of hurt the Anthropics and the OpenAI's of the world that we have we Chesky was came out and talked about using Quan models Yeah. At Airbnb Yeah. Because they were fast and
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Cheap and they were
Speaker 1:I'm dying to talk to the CEO of Red Hat because Red Hat Linux is is built on top of Linux. It's ultimate like, the the apex predator of the for profit business built on top of an open source
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Software product. And to to to actually understand how much leverage you get from developing something like Quen or DeepSeek is a very open question to me. I I feel like it might be two orders of magnitude less value
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Capture. If you look at I mean, all of the Linux value creation I mean, the creation's immense, but the value capture is, I think, on the order of tens of billions. And I think that the closed ecosystems iOS and iOS and and Microsoft Windows is in the Trillions? Trillions maybe. I don't know.
Speaker 1:It's hard it's hard to
Speaker 2:Last point here, which I think is the most notable. Yeah. The oft ignored point of societal enthusiasm. As the article notes, the public in China is the most optimistic in the world about AI. Far more than in The US or The UK, optimism can be a powerful fuel.
Speaker 2:Arnaud says, I often lament about this as a European. We often have a doomous take on new technologies, AI very much included, which is a huge repellent for entrepreneurship and technological diffusion. And that ultimately hurts Europe in a lot of ways precisely because the first point above advantages from new technologies come down to how widely and deeply it spreads in society. If China is the most enthusiastic country in the world about AI, this in and of itself will help drive the widespread adoption that per point one is actually what matters for a long term competitive advantage. DJ Levy says, the point made about operating under constraints reminds me of how post war Japan adopted fine tune and promoted lean manufacturing to overcome scarcity.
Speaker 2:Interesting point.
Speaker 1:There's a there's an article in the Wall Street Journal today about about what happened behind the scenes between NVIDIA and China. The the reporting says that that the Trump administration Trump aides sank NVIDIA push to export AI chips to China. President, hearing from his inner circle, opted not to discuss policy shift with Xi Jinping. They met in South Korea, and an urgent issue emerged. Trump wanted to discuss a request by NVIDIA chief executive Jensen Huang to allow sales of a new generation of artificial intelligence chips to China.
Speaker 1:Current and former administration officials said greenlighting the export of Blackwell chips would be a seismic policy shift, potentially giving China, The US, The US's biggest geopolitical competitor, a technological accelerant. Wang, who speaks to Trump often, has lobbied relentlessly to maintain access to the Chinese market as they prepare to meet Xi Jinping. Top officials, including secretary of state Marco Rubio, told Trump the sales would threaten national security, saying they could boost China's AI data center capabilities and backfire on The US, officials said. And so I I still wonder I mean, it's like NVIDIA is a $5,000,000,000,000 company. Like like, if they could sell to China, how much like, it's not like it's a $10,000,000,000,000 company, is it?
Speaker 1:Is it that big of a deal? Like, how how how big is the China opportunity?
Speaker 2:Second largest computing market in the world.
Speaker 1:It's huge. That's right. But so do you think do you think that there's $5,000,000,000,000 at stake here? Is that is that how big of a deal this is? I don't know.
Speaker 2:Depends on how AGI pilled you are, John. I guess.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Then I don't know. Yeah. I mean, if if if you if you think AI is, like, safe, but, you know, it's you you you want to sell it everywhere. I don't know.
Speaker 1:I also just wonder, like, you know, how many how many American tech companies have really been able to do well in China over a long over a long period of time? It feels like even if you have the blessing of The United States, you won't have the blessing of the CCP forever. It seems like a very temporary thing.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Tesla was selling into China as long as well, as long as it took for them to copy it. Granted, chips are quite a bit harder to make
Speaker 1:than Before we move on, you might be aware that on the other side of the country, there's a mayoral election. New York City is choosing between Mamdani and Cuomo. And you can go to polymarket.com/nyc to track it. There are twelve hours, twenty two minutes, and thirty three seconds left, and Mamdani is at 95% chance. Cuomo's at five ninety earlier, but as Yes.
Speaker 1:They they they they flipped in July, and Mamdani has been grinding it up from the 70% up to 95 where he is right now. And his odds look very good. And, but, you know, there's a lot of people out there saying, smart money's on Cuomo. Maybe he'll win.
Speaker 2:I think the degenerate money is on Cuomo.
Speaker 1:That's probably true. I mean, yeah. Somebody said that to me and I was like I was like, I don't think that it it's like hard to pull Cuomo voters. Like, I don't know that much about it, but it doesn't feel like the Cuomo voters are like are, like, under a rock. Like, oh, they don't pick up the phone.
Speaker 1:Like, if anything, it's like the Mamdani voters. He's bringing out, like, a new voter. So I don't know. You can go track it at polymarket.com/nyc.
Speaker 2:Yeah. There's been some debate on whether or not, like, foreign whales could be be kind of, you know, pushing up one Yeah. You know, pushing up Sohran for some reason. But there's so much there's so much volume on on this market that it it's I think at a scale that someone would have to be extremely motivated to really
Speaker 1:I always forget that I believe we were doing the show during the election last year. And I think we were so locked in on technology, we barely covered it.
Speaker 2:I'm sure.
Speaker 1:But but I think it hap I I think the election happened, like because the election was in November, and we started the show in October. Yeah. So it's like Well,
Speaker 2:that was the first that was
Speaker 1:the first didn't cover it.
Speaker 2:That was I mean, but that was the first election that everyone was glued to the prediction mark Totally.
Speaker 1:Totally. Right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1:But also, think that it it it it was exhausting, and every show was obsessed with politics. And so it was kind of refreshing to to hop on the microphone and actually just talk about technology Talk about business.
Speaker 2:Get so ant on posters Exactly. And them down.
Speaker 1:Exactly. And and there was truly I I still I still maintain that technology is like the most important story of 2024, for example. And and tracking what's happening with OpenAI is is just
Speaker 2:as important. Most important to us. That's for sure.
Speaker 1:For sure. For sure. Just like Julius dot ai, the AI data analyst is the most important AI data analytics company. Connect your data, ask questions in plain English, and get insights in seconds. No coding required.
Speaker 1:What's this post from Martin Screlly?
Speaker 2:So couple accounts were sharing Yes. A couple big shorters were sharing that Chanos.
Speaker 1:He's not a
Speaker 2:GPU rental index with a big move down in late October. Now down 28% year to date. Yes. Just Dario says no signs of GPU oversupply whatsoever. And Skrilly comes over the top and dunks and mogs, by sharing, some neo cloud.
Speaker 2:I I don't I don't know Yeah. Which one exactly showing that every single every single service that that this cloud is offering is is out of capacity. So a one hundreds, h one hundreds, b two hundreds, g h two hundreds, etcetera. So definitely a tale of tale of two chips.
Speaker 1:Yeah. It is it seems very, very hard to to to, to, like, in to assess the market based on spot pricing in the single dollars per hour. Like, just the the the amount of, like, liquidity in the market if you want to spend $10 is probably way different than wanting to spend $10,000,000,000. And when you look at what the hyperscalers and the frontier labs are are talking about, I don't think that they're that they're happy one way or another to hoover up a couple little instances all over the place. I think I think they need they need a real data center.
Speaker 1:Yeah. But I don't know. We we haven't we haven't heard like, this is so interesting because, like, have you have you seen reports? Like, we see reports when, like, a startup's website goes down. Right?
Speaker 1:Because it's like, oh, maybe AWS went down or maybe, like, they're just, like, not they're being sloppy. Right? Like like, if especially if it's a company that somebody like wants to dunk on. Right? Like Cluely.
Speaker 1:Like if like if Cluely was like out of GPUs, like people would dunk on Cluely. Right?
Speaker 2:They were dunking. You didn't see this?
Speaker 1:Mean, they
Speaker 2:they people were were showing
Speaker 1:But not for GPU.
Speaker 2:Yeah. They were just showing that the service was down.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That that was just like the sir the status page.
Speaker 1:There was actually some FUD about that. Like, I wasn't sure if that was if that was super real. But but there are plenty of reasons why in in any oligopolistic, like, startup market, if there's two companies that are duking it out and one of them is like, oh, they couldn't secure their GPUs to do their inference to do their AI agents thing, one of them would dunk. Right? You'd think you'd see this, but you don't.
Speaker 1:And so I'm I'm much more I'm much more on the, like, there are generally enough GPUs to go around right now, but I don't know. I'd I'd I'd like to know more. We do we I know Tyler does does run into GPU constraints every once in a while, but it hasn't been it hasn't been like a major, majorly gating factor. Yeah. Most of it's available.
Speaker 1:And if you need some GPUs or on demand clusters for generative media, head over to Fall, the world's best generative image, video, and audio models all in one place. Develop and fine tune models Trust servers, GPUs, Shopify, and on demand
Speaker 2:Quora Let's go. Complexity, Adobe Yes. Anymore. Was the data that I was referencing earlier
Speaker 1:in the show. Yes.
Speaker 2:Pretty done. Qcap shared year to date or actually, sorry, monthly performance from Canva, Wingstop
Speaker 1:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:Shake Shack, a bunch of other restaurants.
Speaker 1:In there? CMG. Oh. CMG is down 22% in the last week. In the quarter, they're down 27%.
Speaker 2:Down 47% year to date. So That
Speaker 1:is so rough.
Speaker 2:But, yeah, really rough. Wasteland Capital shares, most of these restaurant stocks were trading at 35 to a 100 times forward PE just recently. Many still are. They were valued at a massive premium to the Mag seven and any comparable growth stocks in tech and AI. Yeah.
Speaker 2:This is just a bubble deflating. Bubbles can't be sustained indefinitely.
Speaker 1:Okay. Let me give you some more context on Chipotle because Chipotle was actually in the journal today, b 10. Okay. First, let me tell you about Turbo Puffer, Search Every Byte, service vector in full text search, built from first principles in object storage, fast, 10x cheaper, and extremely scalable. So often.
Speaker 1:The the Wall Street Journal says Chipotle's big bet on younger consumers is unraveling. An uncertain US economy is catching up to younger Americans and Chipotle Mexican Grill. The Mexican inspired chain has spent years cultivating a younger clientele pitching its burritos and bowls as nutritious protein packed meals for Jim Bros and healthy eaters. What do you think, Ben? Are you still a fan?
Speaker 2:Do you still love it?
Speaker 1:I still love it. I still love it. It's so it's so attractive. Ben used to go to Chipotle every day.
Speaker 2:No. I used to I used to get almost I I used to get easily 90% of my calories from Chipotle at certain times of my life. And and anytime you were like on a long drive
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:Knowing that at some point in the drive, you could pull over and have a nice, fresh, nutritious
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:Slot bowl.
Speaker 1:Slot bowl.
Speaker 2:Was just it it it was something to look forward to.
Speaker 1:Oh, it was amazing.
Speaker 2:And now, the last time I I pulled over and got Chipotle I'm like, this is gonna be rough.
Speaker 1:Is it is it quantity?
Speaker 2:It's a quality.
Speaker 1:It's a quality.
Speaker 2:It's entirely a quality. The quality degraded to such an extreme
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Degree that it's no I'd rather fast than eat Chipotle in almost in almost any situation. Obviously, I'm I'm extra picky.
Speaker 1:So apparently, they've been going they've been going younger. They've been targeting younger clientele. And it says here, Chipotle sponsors video game competitions and some dedicated fans dubbed themselves Chipotle boys.
Speaker 2:That sounds like something there in China. I haven't seen this at all.
Speaker 1:Have you seen this good. I I would never self identify as a Chipotle boy. In fact, the existence of the Chipotle boy makes me never wanna shop at Chipotle ever again. Millennials and Gen Zers have helped power Chipotle sales despite rising menu prices and slowdowns at rival chains. In recent months, though, a harsher economic reality has set in rising student loan payments, stagnant wage growth, and higher health insurance costs have bumped burritos down younger consumers' priority lists.
Speaker 1:They're just What what what are they eating instead? Dude, I've I've been in this scenario. When I first came to Silicon Valley, Chipotle was like a once a month Yeah. Luxury.
Speaker 2:No. At that same at that same time
Speaker 1:Literally, ramen noodles. You go to Costco. You get ramen noodles. Ramen noodles is truly 10¢ a meal. Like, it is the cheapest, cheapest thing.
Speaker 2:I mean, yeah, the I I
Speaker 1:totally spent it now. Sort of looked back
Speaker 2:fondly on the days when Chipotle was felt and was a luxury when I was like, okay.
Speaker 1:Getting extra meat and guacamole, extra extra guac and extra meat was like, I am a king.
Speaker 2:Were you were you like a frozen chicken breast guy too?
Speaker 1:Yeah. For sure.
Speaker 2:Because I'd just be looking
Speaker 1:at Costco.
Speaker 2:I'd be looking at the the huge bag of, you know Yep. One pound bag of rice and the frozen chicken breast Yep. Being like, again. We meet again, man.
Speaker 1:We meet again. And then and they'd
Speaker 2:be like, I gotta I gotta mix it up and and have chicken and rice from somewhere else.
Speaker 1:They're eating at home more often. They're eating with us less frequently. Chipotle CEO Scott Boatwright, I like that name, said in an interview. One is Sean Chopra, a 23 year old law student at UCLA. Chopra typically stopped at Chipotle several times a week, but lately, he decided he should make more Mexican style food at home.
Speaker 2:Okay. He's
Speaker 1:DIYing Chipotle. It isn't that difficult to replicate what you get there. That's a great point. He has to cut back his Chipotle habit to twice a month. Chipotle said last week that customer traffic slid over the three months ended September 30.
Speaker 1:For a third consecutive quarter, the company cut its forecast for same store sales. Consumers from 25 to 35 who account for roughly one quarter of Chipotle sales are pulling back on visits. Other fast casual restaurant stocks, including Cava and Sweetgreen, also declined ahead of their own earnings reports scheduled for the week ahead. Thrifty Eaters, there's more stuff So revenue is growing because
Speaker 2:they're they're opening new stores. But at existing stores, you see They
Speaker 1:got to go upmarket caviar bowls. Yes. I'll have double caviar. I'll have double beluga. Can I get double beluga?
Speaker 1:Yeah. We got a double beluga with extra caviar. Yeah. Yeah. Can I have a can I have Wagyu?
Speaker 1:A five Wagyu bowl with double beluga on top. Can I get that? That's the only way that they're gonna survive. They gotta go out market, the young people. You remember the permanent underclass
Speaker 2:Do you remember moment that you you you heard that you could just order even if you got a bowl, you could get tortillas on the side.
Speaker 1:I never did that. Never. I've never once wrapped my own because I just No.
Speaker 2:Wasn't even for me, the calculus is I wasn't even gonna wrap it. It was just extra calories.
Speaker 1:Extra calories. Okay. Okay. That that that's a true min maxer. I respect that.
Speaker 1:I respect
Speaker 2:that.
Speaker 1:I also respect Google AI Studio. Create an AI powered app faster than ever. Get started. Gemini understands the capabilities you need and automatically wires up the right models and APIs for you. You can get started at a i.studio slash build.
Speaker 1:Let's move on to the timeline. Bern Hobart, we gotta get him on the show. It's been too long. A bunch of people have mentioned how cheap restaurant stocks are, so I looked at Sweetgreen, and I would love to know what first principles you could use to deduce the existence of a fast food chain that pays 5% of market cap per year in stock based comp. This stock based comp thing is very, very interesting interesting to me.
Speaker 1:They gotta feel next week, you're
Speaker 2:got got has to get this number up more into the Snapchat range where it's where it's every ten years they
Speaker 1:So it's 10% of market cap per year. This is an interesting metric. I would love to know across across a wide swath of companies, market cap per year in stock based comp. This is a deep research report. Somebody's gotta fire it off.
Speaker 2:I wanna get the Sweetgreen founders on the show ASAP.
Speaker 1:I'd love to.
Speaker 2:To Jonathan or or Nicholas.
Speaker 1:I I I wonder. Yeah. It just feels like at a certain point, you're a mature business. You can just pay cash. Right?
Speaker 1:But maybe stock based comp is just advantageous because it's cheaper than cash somehow, or it it changes the financial profile. It feels like something that's more it's more just financial engineering and it doesn't it doesn't really create any value, but like you have to play the game on the field. Right?
Speaker 2:I think they've they've always invested more on the software side than other fast casual chains as well. And so I just imagine this a lot of this is executives and then
Speaker 1:Yeah. I'm just saying like there is a world where where instead of instead of taking 5% of your market cap and giving your employees shares, you just sell 5% in the open market, you get the cash, and then you pay the employees cash. Right? Like, that's those two should be economically equal. And yet, comp certain companies, Snapchat among them, will pay stock based comp.
Speaker 1:And I feel like it's because the public markets price things differently. And this is just like the reality of the public markets. Like, now, one of AI contract revenue is worth $4 cap. Like, just see this again and again and again. And so if the markets are pricing things in a certain way Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yesterday put a game on the field.
Speaker 2:$8,000,000,000 over seven years is worth
Speaker 1:all of it to it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's a 150,000,000,000
Speaker 1:It was a crazy moment.
Speaker 2:Of added market cap for Amazon.
Speaker 1:Yeah. I mean, at the same time, like, it the reason you could price that just to steel man a little bit. The reason that you could price a $38,000,000,000 contract at a 100 and 20 of market cap or something like that is, well, it's not just what's gonna happen after that 30 mill 38,000,038 billion runs out? Yeah. They're gonna size up the next contract because they're gonna keep growing.
Speaker 1:Like like, this is beginning of a long relationship. It
Speaker 2:seems like this is a capital intensive business. They're they're they're building restaurants. It seems like you'd want to compensate employees with stocks, you don't you like
Speaker 1:You have cash for I'm sure
Speaker 2:it's not like an necessarily an infinite bid.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah. That's interesting. In other news, Mustafa Soleiman says, it's an understatement to say a lot of us haven't felt good about our relationship with technology. So the absolute last thing we should be doing is making that relationship romantic.
Speaker 1:Let's hear from Mike.
Speaker 2:Shots fired. Let's check-in with the stock. The stock's down point 69% today. That's not nice.
Speaker 1:What is that? It's like 60,000,000,000 now or something like that. What The market is. 1% move on them is is 40,000,000,000 right now.
Speaker 2:So it's 38,000,000,000.
Speaker 1:So so so it's 30,000,000,000 was the price of the adult content in Excel that was just
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Or it was already priced in. It's gonna happen.
Speaker 2:It was already Anyway, priced
Speaker 1:you got to get your brand mentioned in ChatGPT. Got to go to ProFound, reach millions of consumers who are using AI to discover new products and brands and get started. Josh Wolfe, who I believe we might see today. I'm excited to hang out with him. Says history was just made.
Speaker 1:Lux family company Andoril Technology. Andoril has just successfully flown the first ever fully autonomous fighter jet ever in US history. So this is the secretary Office of the Secretary of the Air Force shares. Today, the Air Force made continuous progress in the CCA, the Collaborative Combat Aircraft Program, with the first flight of the YFQ 44 a developed by Anderle. This is a milestone that shows how competition drives innovation and accelerates delivery.
Speaker 1:He says one of two and then maybe doesn't.
Speaker 2:It is a crazy looking jack. Yeah. Like at some point it just starts looking like a missile.
Speaker 1:Was this So so the the the mainstream narrative is that this was created by humans? That's what that's
Speaker 2:what And I find that That's what impossible
Speaker 1:for wants us to believe. Yeah. That's the
Speaker 2:Just like the Alston Martin Valkyrie, everyone wants to say, oh,
Speaker 1:this Yeah. Human hands made Human hands. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Right. Yeah. Yeah. They got a carpenter. They got a carpenter.
Speaker 1:A guy
Speaker 2:with a saw. Pull up a thing looks like alien technology.
Speaker 1:It does. It does. Make it make sense.
Speaker 2:Make it make sense. Make Make it make sense.
Speaker 1:Linear. Do you think linear was built by human hands?
Speaker 2:Also hard to believe.
Speaker 1:The design
Speaker 2:We know the team
Speaker 1:It very could have been discovered though. It could have been something that they unearthed. That's right. And it was built by
Speaker 2:It's intergalactic SaaS that landed here on Earth discovered by humans to help build more and more great
Speaker 1:software and products. Yes. You can go check it out at Linear. Meet the system for modern software development, streamline issues, projects, and product roadmaps.
Speaker 2:You remember when we talked about that UFO ETF?
Speaker 1:Oh, yeah. We let's check-in on that. How's it doing? Is it ripping? It's probably way up.
Speaker 1:Tell me it's up. Because they had good stuff in there. Like, that was the funniest thing.
Speaker 2:Procure space ETF, Okay. NASDAQ ticker UFO. That's 40% all time.
Speaker 1:So, you
Speaker 2:bought it in '20 you could have bought it at $25 a share in 2019. It's currently sitting at $35 a share.
Speaker 1:Invest in aliens people. Simple.
Speaker 2:Simple. The Procure space may provide diversification beyond the limitations of solely earthbound companies. And I'll read from their investment objective. Since the beginning of humankind, our ancestors have looked to the skies with immense curiosity in search of answers. Space has always captured human interest but recently, the space economy has also captured commercial interests like never before.
Speaker 2:UFO may provide diversification beyond the limitations of solar earthbound companies.
Speaker 1:This is huge.
Speaker 2:This is huge. So, yeah. It's it's Up
Speaker 1:40% this year, Where
Speaker 2:do you how do they have SiriusXM in as in their top 10 holdings?
Speaker 1:They have satellites. It's they're out in space. They're literally out
Speaker 2:in space. But But But what's the What's UFO theory behind Sirius?
Speaker 1:It's If not through Howard Stern recordings being blasted out into the deep depths of space. That's how we make First Contact with Stern. Howard Stern. I
Speaker 2:can see it.
Speaker 1:It's broadcast on SiriusXM. Glad. Don't know if guys can see doing well. Did
Speaker 2:you see this company Incredible One Energy?
Speaker 1:Yeah. You mentioned this, and Harris nails it. Harris Rothermel says, where are all these companies coming from? We're so back. And I completely agree.
Speaker 1:Like, we've been talking. Everyone everyone in tech has been talking about He said, we don't know how to do this anymore. Are the solar panel companies? Casey Hanmer's doing a whole press tour. He's been on DoorDash.
Speaker 1:He's been on Cheeky Pint, coming on this show multiple times. Like, Casey Hanmer's been saying, like, we're not making solar in America effectively. And here's this company that's just, that's just cooking, setting out 14 megawatts of solar panels in a single day. They're producing 5.1 gigawatts annualized play pace. I very, very worry I I I I worry that there's, Jerry Rigg Everything says he'll go and make a video for free.
Speaker 1:That sounds awesome. I hope he does.
Speaker 2:So, the thing that was worrying for me on this front is that the company T One Energy is just TE on NICE Yeah. Is valued at $683,000,000 Mhmm. Which felt very low in comparison to some of the American dynamism companies that we've had on the show who have valuations far beyond this despite not not even, you know, 10% of the overall production capacity.
Speaker 1:Yeah. I really I really am so confused. Like, where did this come from? This was something that everyone was saying is not happening in America, impossible, like we're so behind and this seems really good. I guess we need to actually handicap this against the real production numbers in China.
Speaker 1:What is demand? Yeah. Also, seems like this is maybe a newer company that just hit 14 megawatts. It's not like they're actually pretty much five gigawatts.
Speaker 2:So Yeah. Yeah. You do. The company initially started as
Speaker 1:You
Speaker 2:did the deep research. Frey Freyer Freyer Battery. It was founded in Norway. It merged with Alusa Energy SPAC listed on NYSE as Frey. That was 2021.
Speaker 2:2024, they bought Trina Solar's five gigawatt Wilmer, Texas module plant. And only earlier this year, they rebranded t one energy. And so Mhmm. This was an existing company that base that's backed in The US that then bought a existing solar panel plant. And so this didn't just get spun up over
Speaker 1:Very typical spec. I guess it went out at $10 a share, roughly $4,000,000,000 market cap, I I think. And now it's traded down to $4 a share, $680,000,000 market cap. But as we've seen with a number of these SPACs that went out and got crushed after the interest rates, like some of them build back. Like some of them just just make it make it work after a while.
Speaker 1:I love the story of Dave. You know dave.com? I think it's dave.com. Oh, yeah. So it's a it's like a loan company.
Speaker 1:I know one of the co founders It's neobank.
Speaker 2:Yes. Neo Bank. Lending component.
Speaker 1:So, went out at 4,000,000,000. Everyone was like, awesome. Like, we did it. Trades down like 99.999%.
Speaker 2:The chart is just absolutely brutal.
Speaker 1:The chart is insane. It goes down so Down. They've done a number of reverse splits because I think they actually went out at, like, $10 a share or something. And now it's a so so if you split adjusted, I think it went out at, like, $310, traded down to, like, $5. So literally down 99%.
Speaker 1:I think it was trading, like, well below cash for a while, and now it's back up and is a $3,000,000,000 company. And so if you held on through all of that, but there were, like, multiple people who basically at the IPO were like, I I I'm I'm worth a 100,000,000 or, like, my fund is returned. And then it was like, not yet. You're gonna need to wait. And then and then they actually came back.
Speaker 1:It's such a crazy story.
Speaker 2:Mean, that that that was during peak bearishness around Yeah. Neobanks.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And anyways, turns out that high
Speaker 1:interest Cheers. Rates Salute to t one energy. Love what you're doing. CEO is welcome on the show. We'd love to talk to you.
Speaker 1:This would be fantastic. And if you need to sell your solar panels online, you gotta pay taxes. Head over to numeralhq.com. Sales tax on autopilot. Spend less than five minutes per month on sales tax compliance.
Speaker 1:What else is going on? I don't I don't think we can play this video of Sacha Nadella, but the BG two podcast is still burning up the timeline. It's it it is the current thing.
Speaker 2:Brad knows how to start a conversation.
Speaker 1:Martin Scarelli is forecasting that NVIDIA will get to 100,000,000,000,000 in market cap. Human thought is values by businesses. Even desk email jobs require human thought, but higher priced jobs like legal, medical, finance can also be replaced by AI. He's got a crazy bull case here. We will see 10,000,000,000,000 as I prophesied years ago.
Speaker 1:This is shortsighted and extremely lazy analysis. Stock might goes down. So he's he's he's he's putting putting it putting the screws to the to the Nvidia bears.
Speaker 2:In pharma nightmare post for Nvidia bears. Yeah. Is really You're like, you're telling me we got 20 x upside from
Speaker 1:That's 25% of the cost of a human thinker. A digital thinker is a great bargain. 10,000,000,000,000 revenue creating 40,000,000,000,000 in additional human thinking work. 10 a 100,000,000,000,000 market cap. That's his math.
Speaker 1:Pretty remarkable. And I don't know.
Speaker 2:Yeah. I think it would be awesome if NVIDIA can be, you know, scaled to being valued at the global GDP for 2020.
Speaker 1:Yeah. I mean, crazy thing here is that he doesn't I mean, it's already worth two Canada's g p GDP wise, although you can't really. It's not really apples to apples.
Speaker 2:I believe Canadian GDP is
Speaker 1:two point Two point five.
Speaker 2:It's 2.2.
Speaker 1:2.2. 2024. Yeah. 2.2. Again, GDP is more of like a revenue figure than like a valuation figure.
Speaker 1:So you can't it's not really apples to apples, but it's a funny comparison of the size. Yeah. Anyway, let me tell you about fin dot ai, the number one AI agent for customer service, number one performance benchmarks, number one competitive bake off, number one ranking on g two. Do you want to read this Chris Pike post about the end of cloud inference? This worth Looks very long.
Speaker 1:I'd say we should But just have him back on I would be very interested to hear this thesis. I think it is too a little bit too long to read through the whole thing. But I'm glad that he is And and the same thing for for Casey Hanmer. We should have him on the show to break down his his extreme hot take on NASA's Orion space capsule He calls it hot garbage.
Speaker 2:Flaming garbage.
Speaker 1:We need to do like one of those complex style trading cards for one of the TPPN trading cards for this quote. Like, this is a bombshell quote. And like in other contexts, news outlets would put this in big quotes and be like, quote, flaming garbage. Like, Casey Hanmer declares NASA's Orion space capsule
Speaker 2:They spent $31,600,000,000. Yeah. And they're planning to fly it around the moon with four astronauts next year and also test the life support system and heat shield which kind of sort of failed on the last flight. Anyway, this was miserable to write. I hope you enjoy it.
Speaker 2:Link below.
Speaker 1:Ugh. So rough.
Speaker 2:We gotta talk to the astronauts that are Yes. Potentially gonna be going
Speaker 1:There's another What is this post by Robin here? Robin says, can't make this stuff up. SpaceX Starship, 2,700,000,000.0 HLS contract cost includes docking adapter. NASA Lockheed Orion, 31,600,000,000.0 cost and counting. 19 in nineteen years in development, docking is an extra 2,500,000,000.0 extra.
Speaker 1:Wow.
Speaker 2:Yeah. The dock I mean The dock's gonna be an extra 2 and a half. We're sorry. We know we know it's already been 31, but we're gonna need another 2.5 to really Rough. Get this functional.
Speaker 1:Rough. Well, if you want to dock your body in your bed, get an eight Sleep. Go to 8sleep.com.
Speaker 2:Transition king.
Speaker 1:You get a pod five. They said you
Speaker 2:they said you wouldn't be able
Speaker 1:to I do a transition like
Speaker 2:got an 86 despite, despite the early takeoff this morning. Seven and a half hours not bad.
Speaker 1:It goes 77, I think. Oh, there we go. Let's see. But let me see. I I think I forgot to like turn it off in the morning.
Speaker 1:Yesterday, I'm 87. Today, 77. Not quite as good, but my REM sleep was up 17%.
Speaker 2:It's good
Speaker 1:for that.
Speaker 2:There we go. Not bad, John.
Speaker 1:Clearly pivoted. We barely touched on this. Maybe we mentioned it, but, I don't know. Did they actually pivot? It was it's refinement.
Speaker 1:It's certainly like a shift in the messaging. But, let's go through some of the hot takes, and then let's, let let's let's give our sort of analysis. So, hero thousand faces, great account, says all this to be an AI notetaker app number eight seven blah blah blah blah blah. Nizzy says, Clearly didn't pivot. They're simply selling they're simply not selling to 20 year olds anymore.
Speaker 1:So the Clearly homepage now says the number one AI notetaker for meetings. How would that have happened? There's so many. How do you jump straight to
Speaker 2:number one? Always claim the top spot.
Speaker 1:Number one in what in what way? Number one in newness? I don't know. But the pitch is to get accurate notes, live transcripts, and follow-up emails at the end of every meeting. You can get it from Mac.
Speaker 2:I felt a little bit bad because I was going so hard on AI note takers last week.
Speaker 1:Yeah. You could read Toby Lutke as sub tweeting this. No. Yeah. No one had no one had seen this, like, this new landing page.
Speaker 1:But then Toby Lutke just posted last week, I'm I'm not a fan of those AI notetakers that come into the Zoom rooms.
Speaker 2:Well, he kind of
Speaker 1:He said it was the equivalent of coming into a meeting with your fly down. Doesn't sound
Speaker 2:like that. He he kind of clarified it and said, I like some of them. I just don't like the the on bringing an entourage into the into the
Speaker 1:The entourage is Hilarious. But so so I mean, he said that bringing an AI notetaker to a Zoom meeting is the equivalent of having your fly down, which seems negative. And then you went you were like, I don't like it. I'm not I'm not letting me in. I'm not letting them in.
Speaker 2:But I think clearly, to their credit, is more of a is a desktop product, which means it wouldn't have to actually join the meeting.
Speaker 1:Which is
Speaker 2:So maybe they're building with the direction that people want. I think what what they're doing here is is is like a half pivot. Right? Yep. They they had a lot of traction around viral marketing towards a cheating tool.
Speaker 2:Yep. And I think they realized that that wasn't gonna be a great, you know, a trillion dollar market. And so they decided, hey, let's pivot to enterprise SaaS. Yep. They had always been, I think, doing some of this.
Speaker 2:Right? I remember Roy talking about when he came on our show talking about how, you know, Fortune 500 CEOs and his DMs, that that kind of thing. But a half pivot is always dangerous because they're using this Cluely brand, which they built a a very controversial brand really quickly. And and then and then now need to kind of leverage that brand and the initial technology software that they built to try to pivot into a category that is, kind of, I mean, just squarely at odds with the with the original brand. Right?
Speaker 2:If you have, an AI, notetaker, you want to have, you know, full faith and trust in the team around, a number of different things. There was another post in here. I'm trying to find it around, Ilya Sukar says, never kill yourself. There's so so many post granola depositions to read in the next decade.
Speaker 1:Post granola depositions? Are talking about?
Speaker 2:Like, when a when wait. If somebody's in a deposition and the opposing counsel has a bunch of your granola transcripts
Speaker 1:Oh, yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah. They can be like, on this meeting that you had on this date
Speaker 1:Yep. Yep.
Speaker 2:Yep. You said
Speaker 1:Everything is admissible in court if you have an AI following you around In terms of people to a lot of people would say, okay. Be careful about what you put in writing. But if you hop on the phone and you're spitballing on, oh, well, like, will we have monopoly if we do this strategy? Like, that's not gonna be admissible in court. Yeah.
Speaker 1:But but once you have a Yeah. Once you have every meeting transcribed, even, like, a little joke can be taken out of context in the court of law. So Yeah. Pretty aggressive.
Speaker 2:Yeah. The question the question here is Yeah. Is there a market for an AI notetaker for the kind of people that Cluely is really good at marketing too? Right? If you just hyperscale an AI notetaker to the TikTok, Instagram Yes.
Speaker 2:Younger generation that's not getting market marketed the same way as as granola
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:The challenge is like, I don't think it's possible for them to make a 10 x better product than Otter and granola. Otter's been around for a long time. Fireflies? Yeah. There there's
Speaker 1:Fireflies has been literally doing it since like 2015. Yeah. It's it's Yeah. Some of these companies have
Speaker 2:been So I think think it's possible that they'll they'll still have this opportunity, but it's possible like basically like killing just retiring the Cluelie brand and saying, hey, this
Speaker 1:is And then where there
Speaker 2:are we're gonna take another crack
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:With a new brand.
Speaker 1:And there are also there are also note taking. There are also, like, like, non, like like, I don't know what you call it, like, vertical SaaS within note taking. So, like, there are certain like, just for SDRs, call recording and analytics for, like, you're not just bringing the AI notetaker to your general meeting, your staff meeting. You're actually bringing your a special one just for your sales calls. And then it's doing analytics on how you're performing, what what, what points you're making, and then plugging all that into your CRM.
Speaker 1:If you need a CRM, go to Adio, customer relationship magic. Adio is the AI native CRM that builds, scales, and grows your company to the next level. Daniel said, of course, I'll give the guys who gleefully break every rule access to all my meetings for a product experience I could get from dozen other companies. What's interesting is, go back to the cheat on everything, pitch. That was pretty hard because what what are college students actually using?
Speaker 1:Like, what like, from what we've heard, the stack, if you want to, like, cheat on your homework, what is the stack, Jordy? It's actually ChatGPT Atlas. It's ChatGPT and Atlas because ChatGPT talked
Speaker 2:to a student who said, I started offering him dollar amounts on what it would take to get him to quit Atlas Yeah. Where he got up to $200 So a
Speaker 1:so Atlas is is just like Cluelie in the sidebar, hanging out all the time while you're navigating your homework. And then, you we on the free tier, you get 10 messages every five hours and one message per day with the GPT-five thinking model. And then also, for $20, can upgrade, get more thinking models, thinking and and for a lot of parents, I bet you the parents will see, oh, ChatGPT. Yes. That's like a professional tool.
Speaker 1:Like, I'm happy to pay for your $20 a month plan, like Yeah. Because it's like a tutor almost. And even the $200 a month plan, I bet, is getting expensed to the parents. Right? And so whereas, Cluly, you come to your parent and say, I want to buy this Cluly thing.
Speaker 1:It's a little bit harder to underwrite. It's much easier. And then not to mention, this was your point that Gemini and Google is giving away a ton of queries for students. And every student in college probably sets up a Gmail account when they get there.
Speaker 2:Roy posted a couple days ago, sometimes you have to listen to what the AB test tells you even if it means changing the words on your landing page and he shows a chart of when they introduce the new language on the website and the growth accelerates. So, anyways, good. Did
Speaker 1:you see this Pleometric post talking to Claude? You have made the same mistake three times in a row now. You should kill yourself. Claude, considered the weight of a life such as mine. You're absolutely right.
Speaker 1:This is so clearly fake. But it's very funny and sometimes Photoshop is very, very funny. Hero thousand faces back on the timeline. Second time in the show, talking about OpenAI marketing, breaking down what all the different, labs are looking like. So OpenAI marketing, ominous evil mega corp, OpenAI employees.
Speaker 1:We are making the world a better place. We are building the most beautiful human friendly future imaginable. Anthropic marketing, the friendly a the friendly AI. And Anthropic employees, every single atom that is not a GPU is an atom wasted. I love I love checking in on the vibes and the timeline.
Speaker 1:It's it's very, very funny. If you wanna check-in on the vibes of the market, go to public.com. Investing for those that take it seriously. Multi asset investing, industry leading yields, Trusted by millions. Benchmark 2020 vintage fund marked at an 80 x.
Speaker 1:Tyler Hodge has the story. They're doing just fine.
Speaker 2:Do I think Crazy. For the most part because of Sierra.
Speaker 1:Yep.
Speaker 2:As well as fireworks, which we had on it, I think, last week.
Speaker 1:Fireworks. Had all three CEOs, the royal flush.
Speaker 2:Royal flush.
Speaker 1:Three of
Speaker 2:kind. I think what Ev Randall should do, new GP
Speaker 1:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:Over at Benchmark
Speaker 1:What should he do?
Speaker 2:Is 10 x that fun again.
Speaker 1:Yeah. For sure.
Speaker 2:Do another 10 x I the 80 x. 80 No. On top. On top.
Speaker 1:Oh, 10 x. Okay. The eight x is a base hit. 10 x it. X it again.
Speaker 1:10 x it again.
Speaker 2:Yeah. To a to an 80 x fund.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Well well, we're gonna get him on the show again. We're gonna talk to him about our expectations for him, and we're gonna tell him, please don't let us down. We'll just just one more 10x.
Speaker 2:One more 10x. Just one more 10x. That's what the LPs are gonna wanna see. This is the LPs. Gonna give them faith.
Speaker 1:Yeah. You're bringing fresh blood in there. You gotta bring in some fresh ideas. You gotta go on adquick.com. You gotta put benchmark on the +1 01.
Speaker 1:Put
Speaker 2:your face.
Speaker 1:This is the first thing you do. Put your face. Hey. Do you need venture capital? Call Ed Randall at Benchmark.
Speaker 2:+1 8018
Speaker 1:Let me just, let me just, say his phone number right here on the stream. Adquick.com. Out of home advertising made easy and measurable. Say goodbye to the headaches of out of home advertising. Only Ad quick combines technology, out of home expertise, and data to enable efficient seamless ad buying across the globe.
Speaker 1:In other news, your people are making money on blueberries.
Speaker 2:That's right. Fruitist. Fruitist raises a 150,000,000 to power the next wave of healthy snacking. Is crazy. Brutus has closed a 150,000,000 funding round
Speaker 1:It's a huge blue there.
Speaker 2:By JPMorgan Asset Management with Ray Dalio doubling
Speaker 1:try some of these.
Speaker 2:Valuing the Berry powerhouse at over 1,000,000,000. The round also brought an Oaktree Steve Kaplan
Speaker 1:Oaktree.
Speaker 2:Alignment. This is a crazy Almond Capital bringing total equity raised to 443,000,000. The snacking company best known for its jumbo blueberries and new grab and go snack cups generated more than 400,000,000 in revenue last year with blueberry sales. They gotta get an AI narrative here. This this could this should easily be a $4,040,000,000,000 dollar, company at this point.
Speaker 2:Mhmm. With Blueberry sales tripling as Frutis expanded to 12, 12,500 stores across 40 countries. Wow. They're trading at two and a half times sales. I remember we talked about we talked about this company when they made the CNBC disruptors.
Speaker 2:Yes. They were like above Anderil. I was like, why why is a big fruit company Yeah. Above Anderol? And apparently, fruit maxing is a good strategy.
Speaker 1:You just pulled some strings maybe.
Speaker 2:Henry said, Charlie Munger once said, take a simple idea and take it seriously. And sometimes the simple idea is obscenely large blueberries.
Speaker 1:Do you see how chaotic the, the comments are on this Drew Fallon post? There's the the food manufacturing guy is in there being like, yes. GMO blueberries are all the rays. Like, I I don't like the fact that these are GMOs. And then Jeff Long Leung is here, and he's saying Driscoll's quality is more consistent.
Speaker 1:And it seems like everyone has their favorite fruit brand that they're that they're pushing on, And, it's knockout drag out fight. So will. I. Am is in the news because he will be teaching a new class on agentic AI at Arizona State University. I don't know if this is the first time will.
Speaker 1:I. M. Has got in into the professor game, but he Professorial. Professorial game. But he will be teaching a general elective general elective course in his Hollywood studio with some students in person and others joining from ASU classes.
Speaker 2:So, the same the same people that thought Jensen signing Yes. That woman's shirt.
Speaker 1:A lot of people are saying this is a top signal. This is
Speaker 2:the top. This has to be the top. Who knows? Kevin Gee
Speaker 1:Personally. Sharing that reminder. Personally. I think that hearing how will iam is using AI would be interesting. Yeah.
Speaker 1:I find that interesting. And I'm I'm I'm I'm endlessly entertained by there's somebody who has a craft. Like, you might not like his music. You might love his music. But clearly, you know that he makes music.
Speaker 1:Like, has a process. Has a studio. He makes he makes hits. Exactly. And there's a whole process for that, you know, scheduling the the studio time.
Speaker 1:Okay. Assembling the music. But here here's why
Speaker 2:I think it's not so crazy. Kevin Gee is highlighting. Will. Am was an early investor in Tesla, pre Elon as OpenAI, Anthropic, Twitter, Pinterest, Dropbox, Hugging Face, Beats, and Runway. He's exits.
Speaker 2:He's got IPOs. He's in the labs. He was even in the Everything app. He was in Hugging Face. So What a fantastic Put some respect on will.
Speaker 2:I. Am. Not not a bad portfolio at all. And, yeah. I I I hope they end up open sourcing the class so we can we can study along with them.
Speaker 1:I would love to.
Speaker 2:We should actually have Tyler. Tyler
Speaker 1:I was thinking about
Speaker 2:Tyler, get ready to go to ASU.
Speaker 1:Get ready to transfer.
Speaker 2:We know you're studying physics but we now need you to study Agenic AI. Agenic AI.
Speaker 1:I like that. That's very funny.
Speaker 2:In other news, there's some
Speaker 1:In other news, Bezel. Your Bezel Concierge is available now to source you any watch on the planet. Seriously, any watch.
Speaker 2:Any watch.
Speaker 1:Do you know who kim.com is? Is this before your This
Speaker 2:was kinda before my time. Yeah. But I've seen some kind of vibe reels and I Oh, yeah. I think this guy
Speaker 1:He had a wild build. He was running a crazy build. He had a very like mob boss enforcer type build.
Speaker 2:I mean, he's still running it. Right?
Speaker 1:I believe so. Yeah. But he was He's
Speaker 2:six seven. Oh. According to Wikipedia. And prosperous.dotcom rose to fame in Germany in the nineties as a hacker and Internet entrepreneur.
Speaker 1:I gotta I I gotta get my
Speaker 2:arrested in '19, 1994 for trafficking and stolen phone calling card numbers.
Speaker 1:He
Speaker 2:was convicted on 11 charges of computer fraud. Yeah. So he's definitely kind of mob boss
Speaker 1:He's crazy. Crazy guy. And so l two l three tweet engineer says, you don't really see guys like kim.com anymore. Modern Internet culture doesn't have room for these guys. It's interesting.
Speaker 1:Yeah. You you see them a
Speaker 2:says they exist in crypto which embodies much of the unhinged ethos of earlier Internet waves, which are siloed in crypto Twitter and Telegram.
Speaker 1:So that's true. But, yeah, it it is the siloing effect is very, very important. I was thinking about that guy who takes those, like, funny pictures. He always goes viral. He's like the I'm rich guy.
Speaker 1:Like, he kind of has that aesthetic. But the weird thing about kim.com was that, like, he actually made a product mega upload that a lot of people used, and it was, like, very controversial. And it and no one else was getting rich on it. It was for file transfers. So I could I I you could.
Speaker 1:It was it was, in theory, I could say, hey, we're gonna record a podcast. I'm gonna send a four gig file to our editors. Like, we use you know, you could use WeTransfer. You could use Google Drive. You could use any sort of Air.
Speaker 1:There's a whole bunch of different services for transferring, like, files. SPEAKER Calder But in
Speaker 2:the chat says six, seven mentions.
Speaker 1:SPEAKER Six, seven mentions. There we go. But Mega Upload quickly became used for piracy. So people Mhmm. Would use it to upload software Like movies.
Speaker 2:Maps of the high seas.
Speaker 1:Yes. Maps of the high seas. Exactly. So it was just a
Speaker 2:wild time. Andrew Curran says, an AI generated song has entered a billboard radio chart for the first time. Zania Monet created by human Talisha Jones who used Suno.
Speaker 1:Suno.
Speaker 2:Also signed a $3,000,000 record deal a few weeks ago. Just 3,000,000. Up and then all of a sudden you got the $3,000,000 record deal.
Speaker 1:3,000,000.
Speaker 2:It is funny that this is Soon as
Speaker 1:I saw. That's 2% of our revenue. AI song. We'd like that.
Speaker 2:AI song that we can't play on the show.
Speaker 1:We can't? Oh, because it's on
Speaker 2:It's an actual artist.
Speaker 1:Can't Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2:We can't.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's annoying.
Speaker 2:What's the difference between
Speaker 1:was hoping
Speaker 2:AI would change that. Three titles that have made the chart this year alone. Zaniam Monet is an AI driven artist, the product of a poet named Talicia Jones and her songs Chart Arrival marks the first known instance of an AI based act
Speaker 1:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:To earn a spot on a billboard radio chart. The move also represents another step in the evolving relationship between AI tools and creators in the music industry. I would like to see an AI musician not share their real
Speaker 1:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:Identity Mhmm. And Satoshi or Banksy. Satoshi of of music.
Speaker 1:Music. Yeah. Not a pop star, but a slop star. Slop star. Well,
Speaker 2:we have Michael, one of the cofounders of Suno
Speaker 1:coming I'm extremely excited
Speaker 2:for that. On the show Friday.
Speaker 1:There's gonna be lot of fun.
Speaker 2:Coming for that.
Speaker 1:And if you wanna log off, if you wanna touch some grass, head over to Wander, find your happy place, book a Wander with inspiring reviews, touch up great amenities, dreamy beds, top tier cleaning, twenty four seven concierge service, vacation home, but better. They
Speaker 2:can't Better.
Speaker 1:Make you listen to Slop if you're in your Wander.
Speaker 2:Guart says, like most of you guys, I didn't get into crypto to get rich. I got into crypto because I believed in the vision of 500 different stable coins issued by 500 different centralized institutions on 500 different blockchains.
Speaker 1:It's hilarious. The good
Speaker 2:news is you're gonna be able to swap in and out of all of
Speaker 1:that Yeah. I I I do wonder what the stable result is. Like, what what is the final equilibrium? Is it just endless proliferation of new coins, or is it a consolidation? Because there was a war for store of value.
Speaker 1:Like, there was, like, Bitcoin classic and and and I can't even remember that other one. There was the one that was like, it's the gold to Bitcoin's gold. And it wasn't I I can't believe I I don't even remember it anymore. It wasn't Ethereum. It was a different one.
Speaker 1:And it was, like, very popular for a while. And it's just completely left my brain. Monero? No. I'm so I'm completely lost.
Speaker 1:I don't know. Anyway, yeah. There were a whole bunch of those, you know. There was a war. There was a war and Bitcoin won.
Speaker 2:Capital war.
Speaker 1:And then there's been a war in the other chains and the other, like, values. And I wonder if there will be a winner in in stable coin or like or a stable duopoly. I mean, right now Maybe maybe no.
Speaker 2:Right now there there's I would it's effectively a duopoly between USCC and
Speaker 1:Yeah. But there's still a lot of value in in creating new new stablecoins.
Speaker 2:Let's look it up. Stablecoin market top stablecoin tokens by market cap. You have Tether at a 183,000,000,000, USCC at 75,000,000,000. The next largest is USDE at 9,000,000,000, below that is DAI. And then below that below that is World Liberty Financial.
Speaker 1:Wow. Remarkable. Palmer Luckey has a post here. He says, I have this partially formed hypothesis that artist backlash against generative AI crystallized largely in response to text driven user interfaces. The art world has come to accept tools like Photoshop and earlier photography itself that still shares the aesthetic of traditional art creation.
Speaker 1:If Midjourney, ChadGBT, DALL E, etcetera, had interfaces along the lines of NVIDIA Canvas from 2020 pictured below, I remember this tool. It was awesome. You could do that. You could draw whatever whatever, like Right. Outline you wanted, and it would just automatically generate it and look great.
Speaker 1:Palmer says it would look enough like existing tools that that the critique would look purest and elite. Art via command line, on the other hand, looks sufficiently other that you can easily berate the users as not artists. You just typed a few words. You aren't an artist. Has a better ring than your drawing skills rely on Photoshop somewhat more than mine.
Speaker 1:You aren't an artist. And that's really true. That's good. I I do I was thinking about, like, don't know if it's, like, bull case for Adobe or someone else, but there I I'm I I was shocked. I wanted to do a I I won't leak it just yet, but I wanted to make a big like we do those market maps, I wanted to make a big a big tapestry with a lot of detail that I could zoom in and zoom out on.
Speaker 1:Yeah. And I wanted to be able to to iteratively put together the collage with generative AI. I didn't wanna just try and one shot the entire thing. I wanted to zoom in and say, in this corner, I want a house. And so generate a house, and then I'll zoom out.
Speaker 1:And then over here, want a person. And over there, I want a forest or whatever. And I wanted to use something that was like the like the NVIDIA Canvas UI or something. And I just I haven't found a tool. And I was wondering I need to go back through all of the different, like, effectively, like drawing tools.
Speaker 1:There's been a few that have really taken off on the iPad Yeah. That allow you different brushes. So you can say, I want to make my brush a rubber stamp of a tree. And then you can just kind of scrub in some forest and it will just stamp the tree again and again. And that's not generative AI, but it certainly helps you speed up drawing a forest, for example.
Speaker 1:And I was wondering, like, how far caught up are those companies on implementing things like Nano Banana or GPT, you know, Images and ChatGPT? Because those models are great, but I am kind of sick of just the command line because I try and one shot it, and then I'm like, oh, it's not good. Do I try again? And then it's back and forth as opposed to, like, actually building it up like clay where you're molding it. That's way more satisfying in my opinion.
Speaker 2:Yeah. The thing the question for Adobe that I I don't necessarily have an answer yet or or even a strong take is if Gen AI makes it a lot easier for people to be creative, like combine these two ideas and make an image of it, does that create more people going down the pipeline to becoming power users that ultimately subscribe to various Adobe products? Right? Because historically, like the learning curve the learning curve on a lot of those tools is very steep. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Learning curve on just generating an image is much lower. So, I don't know. I think I think that bearishness was on on Adobe specifically was was always always overblown.
Speaker 1:Photoshop. I'm I'm gonna get to the bottom of this because I if I am somewhat comfortable in Photoshop mapping up, cutting, and lassoing and stuff. I know they have Firefly. If they if they had if they had so okay. So they have Choose a Model and then they have one of the non fly or fly models.
Speaker 1:What model could you use? I'm going to dig into this and understand this because potentially there there's some cool stuff you could do because I really I really want to make this like collage and I need to figure out the correct tools or I need to delegate
Speaker 2:it The to chat has some ideas for you. There is Bitcoin Gold Mhmm. Which was the thing. There was also Litecoin. Litecoin?
Speaker 2:Yeah. Litecoin's the
Speaker 1:last thing. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Gustav called it.
Speaker 1:Thank you, Gustav.
Speaker 2:It was silver to Bitcoin's gold.
Speaker 1:Yeah. It was silver to Bitcoin's And I don't know where the market Good gets you right now, but just in terms of like my my, you know, mental awareness, the Litecoin has truly fallen by the wayside. Whereas it was it was something that I was aware of during the Bitcoin rest.
Speaker 2:You probably invested in at one point.
Speaker 1:I don't think I did.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Litecoin is down at a $6,800,000,000 valuation.
Speaker 1:And and Bitcoin's at 2,000,000,000,000. Right? Think Bitcoin's at $2.02 t.
Speaker 2:That
Speaker 1:is Yeah. $22,000,000,000,000 on the dot. It's at a 100,000 today. Bitcoin And is off its the markets in general are very red. The Nasdaq is down 1.88.
Speaker 1:Dow Jones is down point six four.
Speaker 2:Meta down 16.7%.
Speaker 1:Everything is red today except for Apple, which is up. And guess what? My take today was a bull case for Apple. You're welcome, I will take full I will take full responsibility. Maybe we close out with my take.
Speaker 1:I would love to get your, feedback on what I would now almost
Speaker 2:getting it may may get to, down being almost down 10% today, nine point Bloodbath. 5%.
Speaker 1:Bloodbath. Well, not for Apple. And it feels like Apple's getting the good ending. It's not that, like, it's over. It's not like the conclusion of the AI play like like, you know, Game of Thrones has played out, but it feels like we just watched the total vibe reversal on Google, and I feel like there might be one coming for Apple.
Speaker 1:And the reason is that there's this popular narrative that they missed AI. Right? Like, missed AI. It's so egregious.
Speaker 2:And Gurman Gurman didn't really mince words.
Speaker 1:He was said too.
Speaker 2:He he said it was wildly embarrassing for them.
Speaker 1:And he said even internally, they feel that way. Yeah. And so it's weird playing, like, the bull from the outside. They're still getting the
Speaker 2:the do nothing win dynamic.
Speaker 1:The do nothing win dynamic. I should have put that in here, because that was the correct phrase that we should have used. But, but and and and to be clear, like, I do think that they missed AI. Like, I'm frustrated with Apple intelligence. I never use Siri.
Speaker 1:I can't even use the native dictation and speech to text reliably. Like, if I need to read a story out loud, I'll still, like, dump it in Gemini or ChatGPT. And, like, if I want to dictate something, I'll use a different app for that. I don't just
Speaker 2:Trying to get your phone to dictate an article challenge.
Speaker 1:And it's like, that is not super intelligent. Like, that's a very basic model that's been out for two years. So I do think they missed it. And for a you know, this phone cost almost $2. Like, it should be able to do that.
Speaker 1:Like, that's the expectation. But there might be worse fates than missing AI. Like, there is a worse scenario, which is imagine if they were like, oh, we're missing AI. And instead of just being like, oh, let's do some software and do some on device inference and do some cute little Genmojis. It's like, we need to spend $200,000,000,000 of CapEx right now to build a massive thing.
Speaker 1:We gotta build the Colossus data center. We gotta build all this crazy, crazy
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Frontier model. And then they burn all that, and then they get a model that's not even as good as Cheziofeet. They can't really integrate it. And then they run into imagine, you know, Google, like, dealt with the whole, like, the generative image thing where the the the German soldiers were depicted with the wrong races. You remember those black Nazi fiasco?
Speaker 1:Like, Google doesn't love that type of PR fiasco. Yeah. They got through it. Apple is, like, 10 times more risk averse than Google, in my opinion. And so Google is not like a move fast, break things company.
Speaker 1:They but they were able to move fast enough to get through that. And now they have v o three, which, like, has been amazing, and Nano Man, which has also been amazing. But Apple really would not want that. If Genmoji was doing crazy black Nazi stuff, that would not be good. And so they they they you know, Apple, we we heard this yesterday.
Speaker 1:They kicked they kicked the tires on some multibillion dollar AI acquisitions, but they never really got anything over the line. Now they're partnering the news yesterday was they're partnering with Google to essentially white label Gemini into Siri. I think this is awesome. I think consumers will love this. I want exactly this.
Speaker 1:Right now, Apple's paying Google for the API calls. But Yeah. Do think you think about the pay Apple is the flow.
Speaker 2:Is an underrated threat to ChatGPT? Because what Gurman said that was most notable to me is that Apple will try to pursue the agenda commerce opportunity, which I
Speaker 1:didn't understand that at all because I don't know how they would set that up. I think that I think that it's gonna offload to Gemini entirely. And so my question and my my take is that in the long term, what so so first off, yes, I do think I do think ChatGPT usage could fall if Siri plus Gemini gets good enough that when you want to fire off, you know, a a GPT five pro query, some of the time you're just like, let me just ask Siri because I know Siri's going to Gemini. It's good enough. Right?
Speaker 1:There's there's that possibility. The the flip side is is if if the if the end state, if like next year, all of the models, when you ask buy me a pair of shoes, they just go do it because that's just a functionality in the API, well, then Gemini is gonna start making a ton of money. Like, the API is gonna make money because, like, a certain percentage of the request sometimes it's gonna be like, tell me the history of the Roman Empire. And sometimes it's gonna be like, buy me a case of Diet Coke.
Speaker 2:Yeah. But And
Speaker 1:when it's done, buy me a case of Diet Coke, you're gonna make money.
Speaker 2:Apple is not Apple Apple at the product layer, if they're using Gemini at the intelligence layer, does not mean they're doing revenue shares at the at the model layer at all. What do you mean? Like, if Apple has has like their LLM experience, which is like Apple intelligence
Speaker 1:No. That will be Gemini. That's what they No.
Speaker 2:But that's not how I read that's not how I read Mark's thing. He said that Gemini will be below the surface Yes. Powering the product experience
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:Because there's a world like you can imagine ChatGPT could use non OpenAI models under the hood Yes. And still own the customer experience and own the customer relationship and monetize the queries.
Speaker 1:Sure. I don't Yeah. Okay. Okay. Okay.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No. No.
Speaker 1:No. I I think you're right. Basically Apple is the thing that I wanna do
Speaker 2:Apple sees what they have going with the App Store. Yep. Apple historically has not they historically haven't been able to monetize commerce well. Like all think about all the economic activity that's being driven by Apple products. Right?
Speaker 2:How many
Speaker 1:Yeah. Unless it's You digital
Speaker 2:probably spend probably spend like, the average Apple user is, like, driving so much purchase volume off of their phone whether it's buying clothes, buying groceries Just
Speaker 1:on Amazon. Yeah. Your iPhone. Like, the iOS sales on Amazon of And that was always off limits.
Speaker 2:That was off limits for App Store. Yeah. You know, revenue share because it was real world products And being sold and so I think they look at this and they're like, hey, this this could be a, you know, trillion dollar opportunity for
Speaker 1:It's gonna be really
Speaker 2:for Apple. It's gonna be super competitive. They're gonna be competing with Google, OpenAI, you know, a bunch of other companies. But I just felt this was this
Speaker 1:I don't know. I I think if it happens in the LLM, like, the in the LLM, like, for loop, basically. Like, if I go to Siri and I say, order me a case of Diet Coke, and it goes to Gemini and says the prompt is order John a case of Diet Coke, it's pretty hard for Apple to say, like, and we want the revenue. Like, it's like Google did the work, so they are gonna get the commission. It's the same thing as, like, wouldn't it be nice if if Apple was like, oh, yeah.
Speaker 1:Like, you know, you can use Google on your on your phone, but, like, if you click an ad, like, we're gonna take the cut. Like, no. That's not how it works.
Speaker 2:Yeah. But if they surf if they're surfacing the ad Yes. At the app layer
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:For Apple Yes. Then Apple can decide what ad network do we use. Do we use a native ad network that we're building similar to the App Store? Do we
Speaker 1:partner I don't no. So so so what I what I'm proposing is I mean, yes, you could build it either way, this is obviously going to be a point of debate and a point of negotiation. But there is a world where where you go to Siri, you say, I order me a case of Diet Coke. It goes to Gemini with that prompt. And Google says, we're using Google checkout and we'll have it delivered to your thing.
Speaker 1:We'll book your and we'll book your credit card Does as that on
Speaker 2:sound like Apple? Apple would
Speaker 1:definitely fight that off because
Speaker 2:And they're and they're doing they they ran a bake off with a bunch of different intelligence providers.
Speaker 1:Yep. I'm just saying
Speaker 2:think that that was something that would be top of the list in terms of, hey, we wanna use you for search and and Knowledge retrieval for sure. Knowledge retrieval
Speaker 1:and And that's why Apple's paying activity. Google. But but if if it like, play this out in a year.
Speaker 2:But it would be flipped if if if if
Speaker 1:What if Google is like, we can order you a case not a cup?
Speaker 2:If Google knew they would monetize they could monetize this
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:They would be like, you can have it for free.
Speaker 1:Totally. And I think it flips at some point.
Speaker 2:Well well, okay. So you think it flips at some point?
Speaker 1:I think it flips at
Speaker 2:some point. The grounds of the current agreement, I believe that Apple will want to own any sort of, like, payments, own Yeah. Capture at least
Speaker 1:That's certainly their leverage, but there is totally a world where where Gemini learns my home address through Siri, learns my credit card number through Siri.
Speaker 2:Yeah. But I mean Just
Speaker 1:starts making
Speaker 2:Apple's literally the final boss of of, like Yes. Disintermediating
Speaker 1:all business. I'm not I I I'm I'm not saying that they won't have leverage in the negotiation. But I but I am saying that like like Google is more set up to actually build the product that delivers Sure. I totally agree. And so But I think They're gonna be in the same situation.
Speaker 2:To The middle me would more likely be like a rev share.
Speaker 1:What yeah. No. That's exactly what I'm
Speaker 2:And that's what's happening with Google Search.
Speaker 1:But I'm saying yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Exactly.
Speaker 2:Apple has built a taxation engine with the App Store. They've already built an ad network.
Speaker 1:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:And so I think internally,
Speaker 1:they
Speaker 2:would probably like all the margin.
Speaker 1:But, I mean, you could use the exact same logic to, like, they should build a search engine then and then take all that margin.
Speaker 2:Yeah. But it was also So much easier harder to. It was much harder to build, like, a search experience until I
Speaker 1:don't I don't think they're gonna I don't think they're gonna do I think they're gonna I think that they're gonna say, hey. Look. Right now right now, LLM search queries cost a dollar every time you fire them off. So we're gonna pay you a billion dollars for, like, a million of them or whatever. You know?
Speaker 1:It's not a dollar each, like, you know, a million a million prompts is a couple bucks or whatever. Whatever the whatever the math is. Over time, it's gonna be like, no. Every prompt generates money. So you want people prompting your system because you make money every time people prompt it.
Speaker 1:Yeah. And and and and you monetize through advertising. And so at that point, there's gonna be another bake off, but the bake off is gonna be who's gonna pay Apple the most money. Yeah. Anyway, that was that was a big part of the debate.
Speaker 1:The the last question I had was like, who how do you feel if you're Tim Cook right now? You have to be pretty happy was my take. You don't get you didn't get over your skis chasing the AI boom. You didn't invest in a bunch of infrastructure. You didn't acquire a company for 20,000,000,000 that you didn't need to.
Speaker 1:Even though AI features are super nifty, lacking them clearly doesn't cause people to switch phones. IMessage is such an insanely locked in network effect. Everyone still went out and bought the 17 Pro. More importantly, Apple got through a massive existential crisis during Liberation Day and the ensuing trade war with China. Playing the political Game of Thrones while being a supply chain mastermind is more than enough to propel Apple to a $4,000,000,000,000 valuation and earn Tim Cook a major pat on the back.
Speaker 1:And so I think think Yeah. We're gonna lose his confidence
Speaker 2:confidence back to a 100 at least.
Speaker 1:At least. Least. At least. Let's get him in 9 figure club. It's Please.
Speaker 1:It's really really depressing
Speaker 2:that he hasn't been there. But Let's get to this post by Jason Schuman. He was highlighting ServiceTitan at $9,000,000,000 market cap on 866,000,000 of revenue Comparing that Harvey, which is $8,000,000,000 valuation on somewhere around a 100,000,000 of ARR. I think they're I think they're quite a bit beyond that at this point. But Mhmm.
Speaker 2:Jason says, this point you have to believe that we're moving from a world of niche vertical SaaS to the next industrial revolution. I think that's exactly what the VCs that are backing Harvey at 8,000,000,000 believe. Right? They believe they're eating that this is a labor displacement, labor replacement opportunity. And so they're they're underwriting underwriting Harvey against the overall revenue Mhmm.
Speaker 2:Of of law firms globally. And and can they capture a percentage of that? You would not be able to underwrite Harvey like this against like the existing legal AI market. And so, yeah, this is a bet that this is this is a bet on labor Yeah. Labor displacement.
Speaker 1:Yeah. I I I don't know. I mean, it is just like it is just a new market, like, in some ways. Like, ServiceTitan is a is a I mean, not to boil it down too much, but it's like customer relationship management software for tradespeople with applications focused on sales, customer service, marketing automation. So it is in, like, a niche of a niche that's big, and they make a ton of money.
Speaker 1:But it's it's somewhat niched down, which is the the point about the niche vertical SaaS. Harvey, at least right now, it feels like is in a fairly new and broader niche. Like, it's not it's not, it's like the legal market. It's had it's had niche vertical SaaS, but something that's, like, pretty dramatically accelerated. Like, it's Yeah.
Speaker 1:It feels like it feels like the returns to the AIification of your vertical SaaS product are just higher in legal than in CRM for tradespeople
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I would think. So
Speaker 2:Yeah. Apparently, the 200 largest law firms in the world annually provide 130,000,000,000 of legal services. That's the top two so Harvey's already sitting at, you know, basically their market cap Yeah. At like 6% of the of the, global Yeah. Annual spend.
Speaker 1:Also just the That top 200. The I mean, the growth rates are wildly different. So price to earnings growth, if you do if you just do PEG, like you're going to get to a wildly different number. But I don't know. Seen a bunch of examples of like, know, the the the lawyers genuinely like expressing that they are ready to pay for AI in a serious way.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Anyway. I have the right post to
Speaker 1:To end
Speaker 2:it on.
Speaker 1:Let's do it.
Speaker 2:A rare Pagani Zonda R, one of only 15 ever built has found a new life, not on the racetrack but as a centerpiece inside a luxury oceanfront condo valued at over 1 and a half million. This Italian hypercar has been suspended on custom engineered steel beams serving as a breathtaking room divider between the master suite and living area. The designs transforms what was once a track exclusive masterpiece into a sculptural focal point. Celebration of speed, art and architecture. This is very chat gbt coded, unfortunately, writing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, this is absolutely insane. I I had seen some of the pictures of it. I'd seen some of the pictures of it being like lifted up into the room. Yeah. It's kinda cool to to be able to like walk around the car and see see the bottom of it.
Speaker 2:Although, we can't see
Speaker 1:the I pictures think, of it keep it on the track.
Speaker 2:Keep it on the Keep
Speaker 1:it out of there. I disrespectful to my culture as a track guy. As someone whose entire personality is about tracking cars now that I went once, this is this is extremely disrespectful. Take it out of
Speaker 2:the Yeah. It really is
Speaker 1:Give it to a track Could you not? Could you not Give it to a track junkie in need.
Speaker 2:All of it.
Speaker 1:Give it to a track
Speaker 2:junkie in Come on to Hollywood. Say, for a $100,000, I want you to make a model of my car. I'm gonna keep my car at the track, but I wanna have it in my living room.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So, yeah. I'm a little Also, like, what is going on? Like, why is this in a condo? Like like, if you have $1,500,000 to spend on like a centerpiece, like, get a house.
Speaker 2:Ever heard of a penthouse, Ever. Ever heard of a Miami penthouse?
Speaker 1:It says condo. Doesn't say penthouse. Yeah. Give me an idea. It doesn't say, oh, own the whole building.
Speaker 2:Condo
Speaker 1:could They be best got a little studio And they put a 1.5. I mean, honestly, for going crazy with the prioritization. You're just like, yeah, my rent's 4 ks a month and I decided to put a $1,500,000 car in my four ks a month
Speaker 2:Do studio want to do what?
Speaker 1:Yeah. Tenant upgrades. I don't know. Let us know in the comments how what you would do if if if you had a Pagani Zonda R, one of 15 ever built. I say keep it on the track.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Personally, I would have at least kept it flat so you could use it as a as a call booth. Phone booth for sure. If you need to jump on a Zoom.
Speaker 1:For sure.
Speaker 2:Kinda loud.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2:You just jump in there. So
Speaker 1:Anyway, thank you for watching the show. Thank you for listening. Leave us five stars on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. Will see you tomorrow back
Speaker 2:in the Ultradump
Speaker 1:in Los Angeles. We'll see you
Speaker 2:Can't wait.
Speaker 1:Then. Goodbye.
Speaker 2:Thank you to Ben. Bye. Cheers.