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Welcome to the FourMan Podcast, where four shop teachers step out of the classroom and into the booth to talk all things building, trades, and the people behind the tools. Each week, we welcome a surprise guest from the world of construction — from seasoned pros to rising stars — to share real stories, career insights, and the kind of shop talk you won’t hear anywhere else.
Whether you're a student just picking up your first hammer or a veteran foreman with sawdust in your veins, this podcast brings you humor, heart, and a heavy dose of hands-on wisdom. Just straight-up conversations built on blue-collar pride.
Join us as we build futures, one episode at a time.
Ken Shek (00:00)
yours.
Scott Hughes (00:01)
Okay. Okay.
Noah (00:01)
Man all right, it's been a while We are back and hopefully better than ever after a little bit of I would say rest and relaxation But mostly craziness Has caused us not to be able to get together But finally here we are so the four-man podcast my name is Noah. We're joined by Adam Ken and Scott We are four
shop teachers scattered all throughout the country
And we are going to talk about the importance of things like the International Builder Show, Build Show Live, JLC Live, all of that Basically, the thought is if you're a teacher and you don't see the industry, the students never will,
I will be there, Ken will be there. Hopefully Adam and Scott will make an appearance at the International Builder Show, which is in Orlando, unfortunately not Las Vegas, which is a lot better and a lot easier. All right, so we all met at
the International Builder Show. Scott, it was two years ago, I think, and Ken, when, was it two years ago? Yeah.
Ken Shek (01:22)
100%.
We met two years ago, yeah,
briefly.
Scott Hughes (01:33)
Yeah.
Noah (01:36)
Yeah, so was really,
Adam Kennard (01:36)
Well...
Noah (01:37)
don't,
think, yeah, it was last year that we met,
Adam Kennard (01:41)
Yeah, I met Scott two summers ago at ⁓ Sashko's Summer
Scott Hughes (01:50)
Zero failures.
Adam Kennard (01:51)
Zero Failures Teacher event. And I met you there, Ken, too. And Noah, you might have been there. I don't know.
Ken Shek (01:52)
Alright.
Yeah, you did.
Scott Hughes (01:57)
I guess the cool people were there.
Noah (01:59)
I was there, obviously not a huge
impact, that's alright. I forget you too sometimes, Adam.
Ken Shek (02:06)
I think your
friend Kyle was there too, Noah.
Noah (02:09)
That's right. Speaking of which, I get pictures with everybody and look like, and I don't want to post them. All my students want me to get pictures with these people because we watch them. There's a huge impact and I get pictures with these people and it looks like I could not care any less. I look like I don't care. Matt Rice Singer I have a picture with. I was very excited about that. My students were very excited. Kyle Stump and Horse got a picture with him. Ken took it.
Scott Hughes (02:29)
Yeah.
Noah (02:38)
and I look like I'm bothered that I'm getting them. It looks like he has to take a picture with me.
So bad. ⁓ but that is the cool thing. You get to meet these people, we get to meet each other. There's nothing like this. If it wasn't for like, Sashko going out of their way to connect teachers, all that, I know I wouldn't be as good of a teacher. So for y'all, what's the big impacts that the builder, you know, building events, anything like that.
Adam Kennard (02:44)
⁓
Scott Hughes (02:47)
Okay.
Adam Kennard (02:56)
Yeah.
Noah (03:05)
has had on your career, has had on your profession.
Ken Shek (03:12)
I would have to agree with just the networking opportunity like
Sashko and Katie at Sashko. Like she's phenomenal. And then just like building friendships like with you guys and then constantly connecting. It grows your network and it gives you a lot more opportunity to give your kids more opportunity.
Adam Kennard (03:24)
Yeah.
Ken Shek (03:34)
just with suppliers like ZipSystem and it also increases your knowledge of the new products coming out that are getting released. So you're up to date and not teaching kids 40 year old practices. That still work, but there's just a lot better technology out there. Would probably be my biggest thing.
Scott Hughes (03:42)
Okay. ⁓
Adam Kennard (03:57)
Yeah, I I agree. The network has been huge. ⁓ That has been one of the best things that this has happened ⁓ since I got to go to my first International Builder
show, I guess, two years ago, I think. ⁓ And then just connecting to see what other people do and how they run their programs. like, I mean.
We've had our text, our group text has had multiple times where it's like, well, we've discussed PPE, we've discussed like behavior, we've discussed cell phones in class and just having a like a reference point because, you know, it's fine to discuss with your coworkers, but sometimes just the shop environment is a little different. So it's like, how do you do it within that environment? And having that like mindedness ⁓ for me has been a huge, just to ⁓ have that camaraderie to
Scott Hughes (04:25)
Okay.
Adam Kennard (04:54)
brainstorm with and talk about. So that's huge.
Scott Hughes (04:59)
I would absolutely agree. And when we walk around the showroom floor and you see different things and you ask, kind of bounce ideas off of each other. And like you said, like that group text, ⁓ even people that aren't here, ⁓ Mike DeGuide is from Colorado. Like I've texted him before, like, man, how do you do this? And ⁓ it's just pretty cool having a network of us guys that
Definitely no secrets, like just, oh, you need this, I'll share that with you. And so, I don't know, just pretty good.
Adam Kennard (05:30)
Yeah, the network that's Sashko has kind of put together. If you're a shop teacher and you, you randomly stumble on this and you don't know who Sashko is, you should figure out that they're a sealant company out of Colorado, ⁓ plug for them, but they're promoting this like teacher network. ⁓ and just the, the more veteran teachers, some from larger programs and such, like Scott just said, there's no secrets. The generosity people have.
Scott Hughes (05:31)
a good feeling.
Adam Kennard (06:00)
put out to help with lesson plans or ideas or ideas.
I mean, like we just got a donation from, ⁓ my gosh, BS and beer because, ⁓ Travis, ⁓ out of Kansas city was talking to the Colorado guy that Scott just mentioned. And my, my name randomly got brought up that it was like, Hey, reach out to Adam. He could probably use a, ⁓ a donation and like, we were working on the first shed project, so we could use a donation and it was a huge blessing to us. So, ⁓
but that was just, you know, just being part of that network. Which came through going to these conferences. I mean, to connect it back to like Noah's original thing is like the advantage of is paying the price ⁓ to go to these conferences.
Scott Hughes (06:45)
Yep. Yep.
Noah (06:54)
Yeah, the first year that I went, I think this one I met Scott three years ago. The first year I went, I walked up and ⁓ to basically didn't know anybody. I was a new shop teacher, everything like that. And Matt Bloomquist was there. I looked aggravated. I always look mad, but I'm very happy to be everywhere I am. Yeah, Matt Bloomquist was there as I was checking in with ⁓ Greg. ⁓
Scott Hughes (07:06)
And he looked aggravated.
Noah (07:19)
And if you know either one of them, like basically, I walked around with them on the show floor. They didn't owe me anything. They were unbelievably kind to me. And I was just basically, I had messaged back and forth when I first became a shop teacher. I had called ⁓ Matt Blomquist and been like, hey, what you're doing is really cool. I'd love to learn more. I'm new to this. And he, you know, on the phone with me, like took more time than... ⁓
Scott Hughes (07:32)
you
.
Noah (07:47)
was even necessary, was like incredibly kind. And then he walked me around and then Scott, who you have a ton of experience, somebody that's new.
You know, basically I owe a lot to a lot of people and probably I don't think that I would have stayed a shop teacher because I think that what people don't realize is I'm the only one of me at my school. There's no math department like set up. got there's other kind of CTE related stuff, but they're very different than what I got going on. So if you're feel like you're on an island.
Scott Hughes (08:02)
you
Adam Kennard (08:07)
Yeah.
Scott Hughes (08:15)
Yeah. Okay.
Noah (08:19)
like which you can sometimes, which is kind of good sometimes because you're kind of just doing your own thing. But sometimes it's lonely out there and you need some basically somebody to help you figure out, know, whatever it is pitfalls or different things. I remember somebody gave me advice basically even on grading.
Ken Shek (08:28)
All right.
Noah (08:39)
And I was like, man, I am glad that they gave me this, because I
was all stressed about something. And he was just like, nah, man, you got to do it like this. And it was just like, that little comment saved me from a lot of headache. these events just bring everybody together. And we all have to sit through professional development. That really means nothing to our programs or anything like that. But this is actually professional development, which is incredibly valuable. So.
Scott Hughes (08:44)
Okay.
Noah (09:08)
It's unbelievable
what it is, what it can do. I think, you know, hopefully there's ways to reach out to other new teachers and basically say, hey, there's this opportunity that you might not know about. ⁓ That's an opportunity, I think, for builders to maybe, ⁓ if you have a CTE program doing construction in your area, is to reach out and say, hey, look.
Scott Hughes (09:19)
Okay. So.
Noah (09:32)
There's an opportunity we can help get you there, all that. I think that's basically what builders should be doing in areas. Because the Builders Association helps me get to the, my local Builders Association helps me get to the trade show funds, gives me a chunk of change to make it happen. So ⁓ it says something that think hopefully builders could ask. ⁓
Scott Hughes (09:34)
you you
Noah (09:57)
teachers, think that's, as a shop teacher, you end up asking and asking and asking for material and everything, because we're always, always short on stuff,
Scott Hughes (10:08)
Yeah, well, there's a lot of great advice in there, ⁓ partnering up with a builder to
you know, financially back you to get to the show, that's good. ⁓ Getting your program in front of builders for the everyday, you know, guest speaker, I need a box of nails or whatever, like those partnerships are awesome. So.
Noah (10:31)
for sure.
Scott Hughes (10:31)
Yeah, PD is not always fun. We have PD coming up this Friday.
Adam Kennard (10:32)
Yeah.
Noah (10:35)
Nice.
Ken Shek (10:35)
I've connected with my, the Habitat for Humanity local chapter here and we've, like I'm trying to tie my class into also helping like them with their projects. Cause it's like a two-fold double-edged sword there in the sense of not only are they learning and applying what they're learning, but they're also helping out the community. So it's like a.
Double positive on
Scott Hughes (11:06)
more
Ken Shek (11:08)
They're learning how to build siding decks, stuff like that. And that's a need for Habitat for Humanity on providing homes for
Adam Kennard (11:08)
Yeah.
Ken Shek (11:17)
less fortunate people that can't really afford it. they, 90 % of them building these things are on volunteer basis. So it, and it also helps with like class content. Like if we're siding, helping Habitat for Humanity side and
Scott Hughes (11:26)
So.
Ken Shek (11:37)
weeks I can spend two to three
weeks because I only have class one day a week on the proper techniques on sighting so when we get on site we're productive and we're not really learning we're applying what we learned the last three weeks in a real-life application but we're not making a lot of mistakes and causing extra money to be spent because stuff is breaking because we're not doing it right kind of thing
Scott Hughes (11:43)
So
Adam Kennard (11:56)
Yeah. ⁓
Noah (12:09)
It is a good setup because Habitat's used to working with volunteers.
So it's not like you're throwing them on a job site. They already know what to kind of expect. Because we build our house through with Habitat kind of in conjunction with them and it's worked out very well. With ours it's tough because Habitat in our area will be really busy, then it'll be really slow, then really busy, really slow. I think sometimes with...
Scott Hughes (12:15)
Okay.
Noah (12:37)
with class like school, the way it operates, it's great, but it's such a,
⁓ like basically there's such a big wheel in motion and there's all these restrictions, basically to try to like jump into a project real fast to change gears, like builders I think are used to that kind of like fast decision making and all that. School is not and. ⁓
Scott Hughes (12:45)
Restriction.
Noah (13:02)
So that's, that's, it's been a little bit tricky, a little bit of a learning curve, but it's been awesome as far as our connection with Habitat. So.
Ken Shek (13:08)
That's kind of my biggest thing too, is even if like as programs go out and talk to local builders and ask them like what are helpful skills that you want these kids to learn that like if they come out of our program, they basically hit the ground running instead of us like arbitrarily coming up with things to teach them that really employers don't really care if they have that skill. I feel like it's
kind of important to get kind of on the same page with local builders in the area of like, what do you think would be useful and helpful? And then kind of develop your program around the actual need of what these, cause that's the whole reason I got into being a trade teacher is because I owned a business. It's super hard to find quality people to do what I did. So I figured
Scott Hughes (13:42)
you
Ken Shek (14:08)
I could find a couple sharp kids if I'm teaching a construction class at a community college that would help like build a business around essentially because everyone's aging out of our trade.
Scott Hughes (14:18)
Do you guys have to yeah,
amen.
Adam Kennard (14:22)
That's awesome, Ken. mean, that's it. mean, I mean, side note from the conference thing, but just like to step into a thing like teaching, ⁓ even at a I mean, like give yourself props even once a week to to do something. Yes, to benefit you, you know, is one motive, but actually, you know, hopefully send a handful of kids into the workforce willing, ready to go. I mean, and just even like the time, the effort to do that.
Scott Hughes (14:52)
⁓
Adam Kennard (14:52)
besides just keep running your business. that's... I didn't fully know that. So I gotta give you some props.
Ken Shek (15:02)
One is kind of like giving back to the community because this community is giving so much to me like I don't just want to be a taker.
Adam Kennard (15:06)
I hear that. Yeah.
Noah (15:11)
In 15 years, he's gonna have
Scott Hughes (15:11)
Do you guys have to have?
Noah (15:13)
the ultimate crew. This is gonna pay off tenfold.
Adam Kennard (15:15)
Seriously. ⁓
Scott, you were trying to butt in here, but we were butt heads.
Scott Hughes (15:21)
Yeah.
No, it's okay. It's good stuff. ⁓ Do you guys have to have advisory committee meetings?
Noah (15:23)
You
Ken Shek (15:27)
I don't.
Adam Kennard (15:28)
Because of how since I'm not in a school and a lot of our teachings I'm I'm very self like I don't but I do choose to run a lot of our plans by our Vaughn by my volunteers because they're the ones that actually really help teach and help move things forward So I include them in a lot of our decision-making But I know it's not in the same way that you've told me about like this advisory thing, but it's not in the same exact way you do
Scott Hughes (15:31)
Yeah.
Yep. Yep.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Right. ⁓ Noah, do you?
Yeah. Do you utilize them quite a bit or?
Adam Kennard (16:00)
Okay.
Noah (16:05)
So it's tricky because it's like I had, there's an overall, over a few of the CTE stuff, which is Career and Technical Education. So a few of the classes have a larger advisory committee. And then I kind of have a smaller group of people from the Builders Association. And then there's a handful of builders that are.
Scott Hughes (16:19)
you
Noah (16:27)
Local like my local county because like our area it can be very there's builders even that live in caroline where I work They they don't really do a lot of the building in the area So I have a few builders that live and work in the area that have hired students that I basically use them
Scott Hughes (16:29)
Okay.
Adam Kennard (16:42)
Hmm.
Noah (16:44)
But the Builders Association and then a handful of builders and then it's like there's like an electrician in there that's been incredible because I'm not an electrician. I don't know. But students, we don't have electrical program.
So having the advisory committee and having this guy Chris on it is really helpful because I can just be like, hey, I have students that are interested in this. Can you tell me what I should be doing to help? And I understand what an electrician does, right? But I don't know. Like, I don't I can't keep up with everything with that.
Ken Shek (17:13)
steps to get there.
Scott Hughes (17:14)
Yeah.
Noah (17:15)
Yeah, so I want
Adam Kennard (17:15)
how to backfeed a switch.
Noah (17:16)
to seek wise counsel type thing.
Adam Kennard (17:16)
Yeah.
Noah (17:18)
Do you utilize yours, Scott?
Scott Hughes (17:19)
⁓
Yeah, I just, I do. And I've fought many times for like the rest of our CTE people, we kind of, ⁓ teachers can also be pretty negative people. ⁓ Like, we got to these advisory meetings. And I'm like, yeah, but it's like, it's what you make of it. And then I've kind of recently kind of noticed myself getting in that like, like,
Some people haven't been showing up and I'm like, man, I need to like go out and find some businesses. Cause that's kind of what made me think about how you guys say you partner with businesses and I need to get some more. Maybe I should join the local, you know, builders association or something like that to get plugged in. so.
Noah (18:07)
Here's the reason why
I like the Builders Association is they're good at everything I'm not. Like, I'm not the kind of person that's just gonna, I don't know, like things that I should be good at, I just, know I'm not, and I can just ask the Builders Association to help me out and just be like, hey, I'm focused on this, is there any way you can help me with X, Y, and Z, whatever it is. And I need to find an electrician, like I just can't, like I'm.
Scott Hughes (18:12)
⁓ yes.
Noah (18:35)
like striking out, I'm not good about following up, all this stuff. And it's just like, boom, we got it. And the way I got the electrician that we have is through the Builders Association. And he's been beyond incredible. And so it's like, tell, you ask one person from the Builders Association, the lady that runs it.
Scott Hughes (18:43)
Yeah
Noah (18:51)
And she's like, I got this, don't worry. And she'll just, she'll be like the, she'll call somebody up and be like, Hey, look, if you care at all about your community, you're going to go and you're going to visit Noah's shop. And like, I can't do that necessarily. I want to be that person, but I'm not. And so I'm extremely fortunate in that. And, that also has to do, it's Maria who's, who runs the builders association. She's really talented at a lot of things that I really suck at. So.
Scott Hughes (19:04)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Adam Kennard (19:20)
Yeah, but it, mean...
bring that back to the conferences. mean, like it's awesome when you have someone advocating for you. Like it's one thing to get good at like learning how to pitch your program and ask for materials. I mean, that is a skill set that like we all can we all can hone. But it's another thing to have someone call on your behalf and say like, you know, like you need to stop by know that he needs help in this area or, you know, call Lumberyard and say, hey,
Scott Hughes (19:25)
Networking, yeah.
Adam Kennard (19:52)
The kids miss cut the two by four studs. He needs 80 more of them like tomorrow or else this habitat house is like going to have a permanent lien. You know, like, you know, that's one thing I mean, and what's really amazing about the conferences is that like, we mentioned her earlier, but Katie from Sachiko, Matt Reisinger, Travis, what's Travis's last name? Brungard. There we go. ⁓ and a lot of the
Scott Hughes (20:16)
Run garden.
Adam Kennard (20:20)
Yes, I mean like I'm sure there's other people that are doing this but I know they're those guys are mostly connected with build and all of that, but I know there's other like youtubers that are really pushing like, you know Help the trade teachers out like help by help will lean on lumber yards for us and ⁓ But I think that's one of the things that this
what SASHCO is doing, what the conferences do, is create those networks. So it's not just like us, but it's also getting to know ⁓ professionals and like...
Scott Hughes (20:55)
Yeah.
Adam Kennard (20:58)
from my experiences, like they want to actually get to know us. mean like Travis has no stake in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. Like he's a nice guy. I give him super credit, like I'm eight, I'm nine hours away in Western PA, but like he is, would advocate for me ⁓ or us in general in a heartbeat. And I know he does that all the time from Scott because of what Scott has said.
Scott Hughes (21:01)
Yeah. Yeah.
Travis and Joe, Joe Cooks' partner, and they're both fantastic. I've been on a job site before and I remember the day distinctively. We were digging a hole and I was like, ⁓ I think, I'm not sure what to do. And I kinda had some options in the back of my head and I called them and I was like, do you guys have a second to FaceTime? And literally, like the excavator was waiting on my decision and.
Adam Kennard (21:30)
Yeah.
Scott Hughes (21:54)
I was like, I'm thinking about moving this bedroom here and then we can put this grinder pump here and and they're like, yeah, that's what I would do. And I was like, awesome. Like, otherwise I freak out about it and second guess myself because I'm like a kind of part time builder, you know, like we build one house every two years. So those guys do it all the time. So. Anyways, I'm grateful for people like that, and I think the the trade shows, the.
anything you can get plugged into, whether it's a SashCo thing. know Charlotte Mustard is also doing stuff to try to promote trade teachers and partnerships with industry. I think that'd be my advice to anybody, if there's anybody listening to our rambling, is to get plugged in and don't.
Ken Shek (22:42)
There's all kinds of people listening.
Noah (22:45)
In case my mom becomes a shop teacher. All right, hey Scott, so I got a question. So you've been doing this longer than we have. It does seem like there's a big push towards getting support to trades teachers. Have you seen a change from pre-Sashco or this relationship thing, pre-people like the Builder Show Network getting involved with it, to like, has there been a shift?
Scott Hughes (22:48)
Yes, yes.
⁓ definitely. think, because I'm thinking like, I keep telling my wife, like this, this famous guy, Matt Reisinger, like, he knows me, like, not like we're best friends, but like, never in a million years would I have thought like, that dude would be because of knowing Travis and Joe. ⁓ Matt Reisinger came in town for a an event and then they're like, Hey, why don't you go to dinner with us? And I was, I've learned to just say, okay.
And so I went to dinner, I sat across the table from Matt, we talked, we talked about our kids, we talked about, you know, construction, we talked about life and it was awesome, you know, and I'm seeing more and more like this, the SASHCO Teacher Appreciation Dinner, it's what year, is it six or five? I almost think it's year six.
Adam Kennard (24:00)
Maybe you're six.
Scott Hughes (24:02)
And like, and I mean, for Matt to stand up at the last one and say, let's do our best to get, you know, sponsor these teachers and get, you know, get them back here next year. ⁓ I don't know. like.
Like, you know, Ken, you were true work and we all laugh at that. But like, there was never like a trade apparel like Carhartt. But, you know, now now Carhartt, know, it's kind of cool and true work is cool and all these other brands. But I think we've elevated the idea of, know, with almost starting with, of course, I'm gonna forget his name, Mike Rowe, you know, like
in the efforts of like, you know, kind of bringing attention and awareness to the everyday, you know, American worker and their value. And not everybody has to go to college. then with, you know, YouTube stuff getting popular and Instagram, I think Instagram was a huge shot in the arm for getting this, this type of thing in front of people. yes, I've definitely seen like I'm my
Ken Shek (24:55)
Right.
Scott Hughes (25:14)
My program is in a whole different place than it was five years ago. Like, I have donated material taking up space in my shop right now. And it's like, I'm like, we need to get building so I can get this stuff out of my shop. So that was never the case before.
Adam Kennard (25:34)
And just perspective, how long you've been teaching for how long.
Scott Hughes (25:38)
This is my 20th year.
Noah (25:39)
Damn. I'm just kidding.
Scott Hughes (25:41)
I know!
Adam Kennard (25:43)
He's old.
Scott Hughes (25:45)
Yeah.
Noah (25:46)
Started when he was four, y'all. What did y'all do?
Adam Kennard (25:48)
You
Scott Hughes (25:48)
No,
no. So...
Noah (25:52)
And
what's it called? saw what's it called? Matt Reissinger visited your shop.
Adam Kennard (25:58)
Yeah.
So like I, we got connected. mean, Matt Rysinger is from Pittsburgh. I'm in Pittsburgh. I grew up in Texas, close to where he was, ⁓ where he builds. So we got connected a couple of years ago and, ⁓ I mean, he's the reason that, ⁓ him and Sashko are the reason I made it to my first ⁓ international builder show. And then I made it to, ⁓ the summer zero failures event. And then I made it to, ⁓ IBS.
again and you know but it's but because of his willingness to just be generous and sash goes well and generous both of their generosity has totally changed ⁓ the scope of our program like ⁓ and what we're doing and kind of direction we're going ⁓ so it's been really cool and just also give me a lot of encouragement of like
of what to do, kind of like what you've been voicing Noah, just solidifying ideas, bouncing stuff off, things like that. it's yeah, it's a
Scott Hughes (27:01)
Yeah. ⁓
Adam Kennard (27:15)
It feels like you're really a part of something, getting the chance to go to these conventions and being a part of this teacher stuff. And ⁓ just with so much of the, need trades people.
Like I'm fighting for my kids to do trades. I tell them, like, you're not gonna make me sad if you never touch a hammer again. I mean, I love construction. That's what my hobby is, is like construction videos. But... ⁓
Scott Hughes (27:28)
So, thank
Adam Kennard (27:41)
I mean, our goal in our shops to make positive community members at the end of the day, that's like our number one thing. But ⁓ I try to also instill that like, this is a very honorable way of life that you can ⁓ make. this
is this what you want to do, if you swing a hammer, know, glues PVC together. don't, know, in the world, I mean, there's tons of stuff, drive trucks, ⁓ move material, heavy equipment. mean, golly,
Scott Hughes (27:58)
So Okay.
Adam Kennard (28:11)
The list is huge, truly. ⁓ And ⁓ just being a part of that, ⁓ it is very cool.
Ken Shek (28:25)
When I feel like all of the
builders have a vested interest in training the next generation, because if the next generation isn't trained, we're still going to need building. Like that's never going to get away. And AI isn't going to build houses. So we still need that physical labor aspect that is also that have the skills to be able to do that effectively and efficiently.
Scott Hughes (28:31)
you
Adam Kennard (28:40)
Right.
Scott Hughes (28:43)
Okay.
Ken Shek (28:54)
understand how technology is constantly evolving. it's super helpful. Back to that's why I got into teaching just so I could try to help encourage that because
it is like when you're a builder, it doesn't matter what you're doing. If you're building sheds or you're redoing a bathroom for someone like it's very fulfilling work and it's a rush and you're doing good to make your customers happy. It's
Scott Hughes (29:09)
Okay. Okay.
Ken Shek (29:23)
It's a lot different than just sending emails to people all day long. It's a lot more fulfilling. That's why I've got into it. I started when I was, I mean, my dad was doing it and in order to hang out with him, I had to go work on job sites.
And then I got away from it for 15 years, but it always drew me back because of how fulfilling it is.
Noah (29:46)
Yeah, one thing I've been looking at is like the history of shop classes, because I want to do episodes somehow kind of just talk about like the history of shop classes, how they've evolved from like, why do we even have them in schools to why there was kind of like in the 80s to 2000s, why there was a downfall and then why now there's an uptick. And really, if you look at the downfall, everyone's like it was just because everybody pushed college for all. But really, one of the other factors was that ⁓
It wasn't that it wasn't valuable because now it's valuable, then it was valuable, it's always been valuable, it's expensive. So when you look at these things, when a school is the sole funder of a program like this and it's a big expense, then they're going to cut it when basically times get tough. And that's really kind of what happened in the 80s to 2000s. They cut all these programs. And so it doesn't change it. It's still one of the most expensive programs to have in a school.
Adam Kennard (30:32)
Yeah.
Noah (30:43)
or have another program like Adam, I'm sure your program, it's expensive to run that. And so that's why we need these connections. It's always been valuable. It's gonna continue to be more and more valuable, but the expense is one of those things that we need to figure out. And that's why it's cool. All these pieces coming together, maybe this will keep another downfall from happening.
Adam Kennard (30:48)
Yeah. ⁓
Scott Hughes (30:52)
you
Noah (31:09)
like it kind of did in the past. And then who knows what the
holds for all of this, but it's definitely cool to feel like, hey, things are changing.
All right, appreciate y'all tuning in to the Four Man Podcast. ⁓ We will be trying to get the episode out once a month. We're not trying, we are. So look forward to the next one. All right, thanks.
Ken Shek (31:48)
See you guys.