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Welcome to Cheryl's Travel Blueprint! Iâm a former Spanish teacher turned travel advisor, passionate about curating unforgettable experiences. My expertise lies in European adventures (with a special love for Spain), cruising, and all-inclusive Caribbean getaways. I specialize in creating tailored trips for families, multi-generational groups, and teachersâwhether theyâre traveling solo, with colleagues, or leading student groups.
In this podcast, we celebrate the joy of travel, uncover hidden gems, share practical tips and tricks, and embrace the spirit of adventure. Each episode features inspiring conversations with fascinating guests from all walks of life as they share their unique travel stories, lessons, and favorite destinations. Whether you're planning your next getaway or simply love to dream about the possibilities, this is your place to explore the world from wherever you are.
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What if a single week abroad could change the way you see the world, or even how you understand your place in it? Today, we're exploring the intersection of travel, service, and global impact, and asking the big question, how do we experience a destination in a way that not only transforms us, but also empowers the communities we meet along the way? To help us dive into that, we're joined by someone who has spent more than 25 years proving that meaningful travel is not only possible, it's powerful. So I want to welcome you, Eric, to this show. And can you tell us a little bit about your journey into hospitality entrepreneurship? Be happy to, thanks for having me, Cheryl. Wow, that's a long journey, so I'm not sure how much time we have, but I'll keep it high -level to the degree that I can. So, you know, I think hospitality's just always been one of those things that I've been passionate about. Not necessarily knowing that it's hospitality per se, but just think life is relationships, it's friendships, it's people that you work with, it's people that you meet. And I've always liked leaning into that in life. And so, early on, my wife and I, we've been married 35 years now. When we first met and got married, we liked to go into bed and breakfasts. And this is back in the day when the Internet wasn't a thing yet, right? So it was guidebooks. And there were a couple ladies, Sandy Soul, Bernice Chesler did guidebooks, and you literally had to read. all of these guidebooks, we'd go get them at the library, because to buy all of them was too expensive. And then you read through all of them to try to find a place to stay, and then you call it, and there's no website. You call, and they're out of business, right? The number's been disconnected, or they're full that weekend. So came up with the concept of creating a database of bed and breakfasts, and licensing it out to, at the time, CompuServe, Prodigy, Delphi eWorld, MSN Network, et cetera. Before I could get around to doing that, the internet was created, and so I just went straight to the internet and created bedandbreakfast . com. It was a lot of fun. I mean, we created the leading website in the world for information on true bed and breakfasts. We had the first central reservation system, or CRS, in the space. So we allowed innkeepers to update us with rates and inventory and then we would distribute that onward to Expedia, Travelocity and the big OTAs. We had the leading property management software system in the space. And I sold all that in 2010 to a company also here in Austin called HomeAway. Not that I was trying to sell it, really. I wasn't, frankly. But HomeAway wanted to buy it. I had kids at the time that were 12, 10, and 7. And it's like, OK, I'm never going to get this time back with my kids. So I sold it. And after a couple of years of, you know, full -time husband and dad, which was absolutely amazing. Just, you keep thinking of other things that you wanna do, other businesses. So I bought, with a buddy of mine and business partner, we bought Sage Hill. We've owned that now for, I don't know, over 12 years, 13, 14 years. That's a lot of fun. It's 88 acres, just south of Austin. It's a 4 .8 rated place and sort of gives us that sort of hospitality. fix, if you will. About that same time, I guess it was a year later, we were trying to figure out, okay, well, what do we want to do? And we thought being in the bed and breakfast space and selling that, what's the next market that we could sort of bring technology to and a brand? What's the next fragmented hospitality market? And we thought of the property management market, vacation rentals. And so we created a company called Turnkey Vacation Rentals. We built that to be the second largest in North America, and then we sold it to Vacasa in 2021. That was fun as well. The whole thought there was let's create a property management company. You know, most property management companies back then, this is 2008, 13, 2012. They were really mom and pop. There were no big chains franchises, if you will. And it was somebody that happened to live in Vail, Colorado, and their neighbor had a a place and they're like, hey, can you rent my place out? Next thing you know, they've got two and then five and then 25 and they're a property manager, but they've got no, you know, real experience and they're using, you know, notebooks and writing things down, not software. So, we created Turnkey. That was a lot of fun. We built it up and sold it in 2021. And that also just sort of solved a problem for us. personal need for me, which is to, I like creating businesses, but I like bringing people together. Anything that can bring friends and family together to create memories, I think that's something that I can get passionate about. Ironically, not. directly hospitality, if you will. But again, in 2013, I created another company and still own it, and it's doing well. It's called Fun Air, funair . com. We, of all things, here in Austin, Texas, we're the leading global manufacturer of inflatable toys for megayachts. So think of a 200, 300, 400 -foot yacht with a slide coming off of the third or fourth or fifth deck, a big beach club off the back of the boat with a netted pool so people can swim, get down to the water, you know, because you can have a big amazing, very expensive yacht, and it's still not gonna have a big pool, right? So we've created this floating, you know, sort of beach club that goes off the back of the boat, and you can park the e -foils there, and the sea bobs, and the jet skis, and everybody can hang out down there. But again, the reason I got into that business was because it was, something that would get people off their screens and bring people together to create memories, right? So it's been really cool. And then Savvy's just the most latest one. And we just launched Savvy . com back in February. And the whole point there is we just felt that travelers were sort of getting taken advantage of in the fees that they were paying to the big platforms like Airbnb and Vrbo, Booking . com. You know, same thing happens at Ticketmaster and StubHub and those guys, but coming from the hospitality background, the hospitality portion of it was something that I felt like, okay, we know how to fix this. Travelers aren't happy paying an extra 15 or 20 % to book a vacation rental. Property managers, hosts, homeowners aren't happy that they've got this big distribution cost and that there's this intermediary out there that owns the guest relationship. You know, and that didn't, create good hospitality, right? When you've got, back to your sort of opening comments, when you've got a platform or an app standing between the host and the guest, I mean, that's just not great hospitality, right? Hospitality by definition is relational. So we set out to create Savvy . com and Savvy, a marketplace where people can sort of search and find and compare properties like they would on Airbnb Vrbo. But once they did that and they go to book, we facilitated direct reservation with the property manager. So it's not our customer, it's the property manager's customer. It saves the traveler money and it allows them to use that money that they would have paid to Airbnb or Vrbo or booking and fees to go to book. upgrade their stay, right? Instead of being in a beach town, you could be beach front. Instead of being in a ski town, maybe you use that money to be ski front. Maybe you stay an extra night or bring in a chef or whatever. And so, yeah, so that's what we're doing now and keeping us busy, but we're loving it. I said, and that's the short version, by the way. Sorry. Yeah, and you clearly have an entrepreneurial spirit, just listening to all, and it seems like you're really able to find these needs that people have, and you just go back and build whatever it is that's necessary. That's the, I don't think there's any great secret to that, no. It's nothing, it's not like I'm this brilliant guy. I just sort of see, okay, well, Gosh, that sort of stinks. We could do that better. Let's go do that. So how did owning and operating a boutique inn shape your understanding? I think you kind of spoke to that, but what, I guess, what was the passion behind it? Like just because you saw a need or was there some underlying? No, that's a great question because that's the one that we didn't necessarily see a direct need in owning an individual property, right? The thought there was we were going to do a roll -up. Think of Ian Schrager, Joie de Ville, you know, luxury hotels and resorts. the world. We wanted to go out and buy 25 to 100 B &Bs, unique inns, boutique hotels, keep them all independent, but have an umbrella brand over them. So you as a traveler, you knew what you were going to get. you had a customer relationship management database, you had points, you had, you know, just, it's, in a crass way, it's Starbucks, but not Starbucks. They were still gonna be individually branded coffee shops, if you will, but you knew what you were gonna get. I mean, personally, not a fan of Starbucks coffee, and I'm on record as the guy that didn't think that would work, so I was wrong. I thought people wanted the unique, you know, coffee, the mom and pop coffee shop. People wanna know what they're gonna get, and that's why they've been successful. And so we were trying to go in and buy this property that was an existing bed and breakfast with 10 rooms. We've now taken it to 20 keys and 24, 25 rooms, added a spa, added pickleball, et cetera. But what we found out is when we got that first property and it's on 88 acres, surrounded by 2 ,500 acres of open space. So it's beautiful, but it's a lot of work. 88 acres, seven, now it's 10 structures. It's a lot to manage. And we just, we decided, you know what? It's fun owning it. And, it's fun creating a place where you try to think of everything before the guest does. So when they're like, oh my gosh, I'm going on a hike, I need a bottle of water. Oh, guess what? Well, there's a cooler with water at the trailhead at the hike. Oh, I need a walking stick. Oh, there's a walking stick. Oh man, I'm in my unit, gosh, I need a Kleenex. Oh, whatever. is, right? You just try to be a step ahead and give people a place of respite, if you will. Give people a place where they can go and they come back and they're fully refreshed and ready to hit the week or the month or whatever the world's gonna throw at them. Because there's a lot going on in the world right now. We like our place to be a place that's just sort of that safe retreat where you can just, you know, there's not a ton to do. Like I said, we've got four pickleball courts, we've got a four -room spa, we've got several miles of hiking trails, but other than that, you don't get there and feel like, oh my gosh, I gotta go to this cooking class, I gotta do this, I gotta do all these things. No, go sit in a hammock, go sit by the pool, go get a massage, just chill and let us take care of you and leave, you know. refreshed. That's the goal, and that's the hospitality piece. So we decided not to do the roll -up because we launched Turnkey, and I launched FunAir, and it was a lot of work. But we still love having that place and being able to take care of folks. Well, I love what you said about having some continuity when people know what to expect when they get to a place. That's super important. And it gives people more, sets people at ease, I think, knowing that they don't have to - Totally think you're right. And I mean, that ties into sort of, I mean, hats off to Airbnb, right? What they did was they took a very, very, very fragmented industry and they created a platform that allowed people to get a better idea of what they were going to get. Now they ran into issues, obviously, with fake listings and bad actors, and everyone does. And I think that's where we sort of took a unique twist, right? With us, we don't list for rent by owner properties on savvy .com. com. We don't think that's too savvy, frankly. No pun intended there. But we only have properties that are managed by professionals. So if someone that uses Savvy shows up to Austin, Texas, and they flew in from Vegas, and they're here for a three -day weekend, and they've got a group in tow, and they go to check in at 11 o 'clock at night, and the Bluetooth doesn't work, We want to know that they can call the local property manager and someone's going to get their butt over there and let them in the house, not that they've got some gig economy bro that's surfing in Costa Rica and is out partying and they're stuck outside of their house, right? So Savvy is professionally managed and saves you a lot of money. That's really the difference. It's the same properties that you're going to find on Airbnb and Vrbo. We just don't add the fees. and a lot more peace of mind knowing that. That's right, that's right. Yeah, for sure. So thinking about the evolution of travel stays, I should probably start to ask, well, I think you kind of, I think you, I already know what you're gonna say, how traveler expectations have, how traveler expectations have kind of shaped the, have changed over the years and just the rise in vacation rentals. I'm guessing that, like you said, you, you're a step ahead of the customer and hopefully, you know, you're knowing what it is that they want. Let me do this. Let me ask this. Why do travelers want direct relationships with hosts? Yeah, great question. I mean, there's just, I think a professional host that lives in a market is going to understand their market better than you. an app can, right? We all heard the buzz about AI, and AI's coming, and it's strong, and it can look at everything and give recommendations, and I think it'll continue to improve. But AI's not gonna know that I'm traveling with my family, and we love foiling on the lake, And this property manager's got this amazing house right on the lake that's not live on the site yet, but it's going to be before my trip, right? So if I'm talking with the host, the host can get a better understanding of what my needs are, and they can recommend the best solution that I'm most likely to have the best time. And then, you know, you also get all the other things that technology can try to step in, right? Chef, well, what type of chef? Well, what type of cooking do they do? What type of meals do we want? You know, this one's stuffier, this one's more laid back. I mean, just all the nuance. And I think we're getting to a point where apps and websites can probably handle more and more of the transaction, but I think you lose the nuance and you lose the hospitality. Yeah, because you definitely, that's the thing about, it's in the name itself, hospitality. People want a relationship. They don't want just transactional interactions with people. Yeah, if you're staying in a hotel, transactional's great. I'm booking a hotel room. My reason for traveling is probably different. My need is different. If I'm staying in a vacation rental, I'm traveling with a group. It's either a group of friends, buddies, it's a family, it's an extended family. it's a golf trip or a ski trip or a family reunion or a bachelor party or whatever. But I've got an order of magnitude more unique needs in that situation than I do with a commodified product like an airline seat or you think airline seats, right? basic economy economy plus business first class you think hotel rooms basic economy deluxe and premiere etc etc i mean they all have their their classes and i think you find that vacation rentals don't fit in those boxes so so apps and sites are helpful because you know what customers want number one they want really good photos. Secondly, they want ratings and reviews, right? So I can't, you know, I can't really put it in a box of the category, but I can see what other people thought of it. But then you also, with everything going on with reviews, right? And, and Airbnb and Vrbo basically, well, if you don't have a 4 .8, we're not going to show you an algorithm. Then it creates this sort of bogus review loop where the host or the homeowner's like, hey, please give us a 50, anything less than a 50 means we just killed your unborn pet, you know, whatever it is, right? So give us a 50, and if there's something wrong, please contact us directly, don't, you know. And it's just not as genuine, unfortunately, but it's the best there is for now. And then, you know, they wanna know that the host is legit. I mean, there's been, It's been a year or two now, but Airbnb just like took 80 ,000 listings off their site that were fake, right? Fake listings. So people want to know that the host has been vetted and they're real. And so all those things create a need for a site like Airbnb or Vrbo. And until someone comes along like we're doing at Savvy and gives travelers somewhere else to go. because travelers aren't gonna go to Austin, Texas and look at 20 different websites for each different property management company and redo their search. July 1st through the 5th, 12 people on the lake, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. They're not gonna do that 20 times. They're gonna go to one site. So it's on us as an industry to give travelers something other than Airbnb and Vrbo that has vetted hosts, that has ratings and reviews, and allows you to book direct and save hundreds. I mean, since we launched Savvy, 1st of February, so I guess a year, it's been a year. We're saving travelers 16 % on average per reservation, $400. That's a lot of money. I mean, you see companies running national ads, car insurance, save $350, save $700. And that's an annual purchase. Vacation rentals, people, maybe they go once a year, maybe they go two, three times, four times, five times. So yeah, we think it's not gonna be for everyone, but nor does it need to be. And I don't mean this, you know, not everyone's savvy. And I don't mean to say that like, you know, there's these people out there that are idiots. I mean, it's not it at all. People may be looking for something else, right? But there's enough people out there that truly are savvy that are like, wait, I'm gonna be smart about this. And we're just gonna go provide those folks with a better tool. Right. And it's great to have, like you said, it's just great to have options. you know? Absolutely. There's so many different types of travelers, so we all, we need different options and there's plenty. It's great to have something that you can trust and find the kind of, you know, the kind of stay that you wanna have. Well, for sure, and we wanna make it, you know, easy too. We don't want people to have to go look at, when you come to Savvy, We're going to show you our price. You give us dates, and you choose a property. We're going to show you our price. We're going to show you Airbnb's price, maybe Vrbo's price. you don't have to go look at three different sites. Just come to Savvy, find something. If we're not the least expensive, we should be, because we're not adding platform fees. But sometimes property managers give us the wrong rate table in their software system. Or sometimes maybe Airbnb or Vrbo is running a special new property onboarding deal or something. But we're going to show you, so you can go book at Airbnb or Vrbo. Right. And today's, today's travelers are just there. They are to use your word. They're more savvy about a lot of things. They've got so many tech tools that they can use. So they definitely, you know, people are going to get turned off if they have to, they have to hunt around for too long. Absolutely. Absolutely. And that's a lot of, a lot of what happens now. So pre -savvy. what would happen is people would, showroom is what we called it, right? So we've all sort of gone to Best Buy to look at TVs, but then we've gone on to Amazon to buy the TV, right? Or whatever it is. That happens on Airbnb and Vrbo. People will go look, find something, like, oh man, dang, $4 ,000, jeez. Let me just go spend an hour or two online and see if I can find whoever has that property directly and book it directly and not pay the platform fee. So there's savvy travelers out there. that get it. There's just been no one give them a better solution yet. You're right. If you're loving these behind the scenes conversations about how travel really works, make sure you're subscribed to Sheryl's Travel Blueprint. And if you're planning a trip that needs more than a standard hotel, especially for families or groups, this episode is for you. I encourage you to think differently about your next stay. and connect with Cheryl's Travel Blueprint for curated travel planning. So why don't we talk a little bit about designing stays that work for families and multi -generational travel. Dealing with what families actually need versus what's often marketed to them. That seems to be sometimes maybe an issue for families. Maybe you could speak to that. It's a great one. I mean, I feel that We talked about a little bit earlier about how when you get into vacation rentals, it's really trying to accommodate a wide audience versus, you know, typically a business traveler or a couple that's staying in a hotel. I've certainly seen, you know, it really gets down to what amenities and features that the individual properties have in a well -built site will allow you to filter and search based on those criterias, right? You know, an elevator, and some homes have elevators instead of stairs, right? Handrails, ADA compliant. We have a vacation rental, too. And, you know, making sure that you have a pack and play. And, you know, the high chair and the sippy cups and all the stuff. I mean, that's stuff that certainly traveler could bring, but to the degree that you provide those things, it just takes the weight off of your guest, which is ideal, right? But I mean, I know it's more stuff you have to clean, right? When someone uses the pack and play, it's gotta be thoroughly cleaned afterwards. And you've heard as much as I have about how people are sick of the cleaning fees, right? Well, guess what? I mean, that's just sort of a, The way it's got to be when you don't have a hundred rooms under one roof and every room is the same and they don't have kitchens and they don't have three bathrooms and they don't have, you know, living rooms and all that stuff. I mean, cleaning fees are different for every property based on the nuance of the property and how much stuff they have that needs to be cleaned. A little bit of a soapbox there, but getting back to your question. You know, I think making sure on the soapbox that it's priced fairly. I think where people get upset is when they see a cleaning fee and it's just absolutely ridiculous for the size of the house, right? Back to your question, I think it's really, has the host considerably thought through the different things that could be needed? And have they also done a good job of conveying that on the website and or on their listing on the website? Savvy . com or Airbnb or Vrbo, whichever one they're using. For sure. And that kind of goes back to what you were saying before about knowing, just being, again, a step ahead of what the client wants and just being dialed in. For sure. And I'd say the same thing applies to pets, right? If you allow pets, do you have that bed? Do you have bowls? Do you have a place for them to go to the bathroom? Do you have a place for them to go outside and not get away, et cetera, et cetera. Yes, indeed. And so maybe we could talk a little bit about, do you have any memorable guest moments that reinforced to you why this is important to you? And your experience is vast. Yeah, no, it's a great question. I mean, we don't typically really get we're not in the process, right? As a book direct marketplace, the guest is working directly with the host, not with us, which is how they can save all that money and have better hospitality. So we unfortunately don't get insight to as many of the stories as you would think. But one does come to mind, and that one was just, we had a lady that shared on social that she, was planning a trip down to Port Aransas, which is on the coast here in Texas, for Memorial Day weekend. And she said that she saved $1 ,200 using our site. I mean, that's something to get pumped about. The team was excited about that. I mean, that's real money that could go towards, you know, a nicer stay in Port Aransas, or heck, Renting a car to go down there, whatever. You're playing tickets down, whatever it is. So I think we get excited when we see how much money we can save people, because we know that that's, you know, prices aren't going down most places. No, sadly. Everything's going up. So to the degree that we can make it something that someone can do, because now they can afford it, and without us maybe they couldn't have, it was out of their price. That's awesome. You just gave a family the opportunity to go create memories together. And $1 ,200 is nothing to sneeze at. That's a good chunk. Absolutely. No, absolutely not. What's your favorite type of stay when you travel with family? You know, it changes. And I think that's what it is for a lot of people. I mean, there's times where I want to stay in a resort. And I can do room service and I can go out to, you know, the restaurant right there on property and not have to cook or clean or anything. There's times when a hotel works if I'm speaking at a conference. you know, Verma conference or travel conference. I don't need a vacation rental. But there's been times for sure where as a family, we've stayed in vacation rentals because we've got a big group and we want to all be able to hang out in our sweats and, you know, watch whatever it is, the football game on TV and grill in the backyard or do whatever and not be in hotel rooms. So, I think it depends upon, you know, what the travel's for. I mean, and then there's times if it's fall and it's foliage season in the Northeast, I want to be in a bed and breakfast. So sometimes I'm ready for a spa. I mean, I love to travel and I think there's a lot of great options out there. You just got to find the one that fits the vibe. Is there any particular hospitality trend that you're excited about right now? Well, I mean, it's the one that's driving our business, right? I mean, I think you're seeing, and the data supports it, more and more travelers are booking direct. And we're going to help facilitate that and make it easier for more and more and more travelers to book direct. But no, we're excited to be a part of that. We understand why it is and it makes total sense. And I think that's the trend that caused us to say we need to create this business. So I think that's the one that's top of mind for us. Excellent, excellent. Do you have an unforgettable experience of a personal experience in a vacation rental. I think my unforgettable experience in a vacation rental was, unfortunately it wasn't unforgettable because it was like, oh wow, this is this amazing place. And we've had some of those too. We've rented a place in Carmel, California on the bluff on scenic drive right above the beach for a month. And just, I worked remote. I worked from out there for a month and it was amazing. That would probably actually, That was amazing. We did a week in Hanalei Bay in Hawaii one time with my son and his wife, my wife and I, the four of us, and just the island of Kauai at the northern end, and absolutely beautiful. But then the one that really comes to mind for me was the one that made me realize that this opportunity to do Savvy was here. We were trying to book a place in watercolor, Seaside, sort of the panhandle of Florida. And 30A is the region and beautiful area. And a lot of people, it's not like some undiscovered gem. It's well -known, it's a great spot. We booked something on Airbnb and it was like $395 a night. So we booked it for four nights. and taking my wife and daughter and a few of her friends. And I'm like, okay, 400 a night, four nights, it's gonna be 1 ,600 tax and tip. It's gonna be like two grand, $2 ,700. And I was like, wait a minute. How did it go from 400 a night for four nights to $2 ,700? 27 divided by four, I was told there'd be no math, but that's like $700 a night. That one stands out because that one was the one that made me realize this is absolutely ridiculous. People are getting taken advantage of. Yes, Airbnb and Vrbo provided some value added a point and maybe still do to some people, but we need a better marketplace for people to not have to pay that. Yeah, that's insane. Yeah. That's kind of the, some of the things that we see here in Vegas, not with vacation rentals necessarily, but just the same concept of, you know, you go to a, you go to a resort and then in some cases, the resort fee is more than the, um, the nightly stay, which, you know, and, and again, it's like, you see this bill and you're trying to understand why it, why it jumped up that high. And in Vegas, you look at the resort fee and look what it's for. Parking, no one drives to Vegas, no one from Texas. Most people don't drive to Vegas, right? Right. Wi -Fi, give me a break, you're still charging for Wi -Fi? And what are you gonna, USA Today, you're gonna throw a subscription to a newspaper? And then all of that, and they still close their pools at seven o 'clock at night when it's light until 8 .45. We were at Mandalay Bay with our kids, doing the wave pool, and they're like, yeah, the pool's closing. We're like, what are you talking about? It's like the sun is still up. Nope, nope. They want you to go spend money and gamble. So they close everything. Yeah. So not very responsive to - The resort fees are annoying. I mean, the truth is, is that if it's a part, if it's a mandatory fee, it should be a part of the nightly rate. It's a cost of doing business. Right, exactly. That just makes it easier. Yeah. Yeah. It makes it easier and it prevents them from advertising a fake lower rate, which is all they're doing. Right. Absolutely. $3 .95 a night with a mandatory $75 resort fee nightly means that your nightly rate is $4 .70. not 395. Exactly, exactly. And people want to know what they're getting and being transparent is, and I think even if, you know, it's okay to have high prices if you can, if it's worth it to the client and that's the choice that they can make. Be, you know, transparent about it and, and yeah, if you've got a good product, they're going to come. That's right. That's right. Absolutely. Um, so a couple of other questions for you before we wrap things up. Um, I guess I'm sure that you would say that the value of choosing accommodations intentionally is that's up there at the top with choosing an experience because that's that to me is the best trend that I've seen is that people are choosing experiences and making memories and traveling with their families. I'm loving that. Yeah. Yeah. I'm sure you're seeing a lot of that. We're seeing a lot of that. We sure are. I mean, my son right now, he works remote, and he and his wife moved to Hawaii for three months, and they're living in a tiny, tiny little one -room thing so they can afford it. But they're like, we don't have kids yet. Let's go live in Hawaii and work remotely. for a little bit. How fun is that? It's like, yes. Absolutely. Do that while you can. Yes. And then you'll have lots of people wanting to come visit you. That's right. Maybe that's why they got a tiny place. That might not be enough to keep people away. Yeah, you could be right. They literally have to fold, the bed folds down over the couch. So they like, no room. Very smart, very smart. And I think another thing that that you touched on as well is connection, connection over technology, you know, connecting with the people that are going to be impacted by by these decisions for where they're going to stay. That's right. Tech has a role. Tech should help facilitate, but it shouldn't replace. Yeah, definitely. Because it's all about the experiences. So if travelers remember one thing from this episode, what do you think it should be? You know, I would say it sounds self -serving, but I mean, maybe it's not with Savvy, but it is just, if you book direct, whether you go find something on Airbnb and Verbo, and then you go spend some time on Google or whatever, or you go to Savvy . com, however you do it, typically when you book direct, you're gonna save money. And you're going to have a higher level of hospitality because you've got that connection with your host. It's direct and there's not an intermediary between you and them. It's probably where I'd end. I mean, I would say many of us and probably many of your listeners have booked a hotel room through Expedia. You show up at the hotel, you're like, hey, can I upgrade? Or can I do this? Or can I do that? Oh, sorry, you're not our customer. Expedia is. You got to go back to Expedia. You're like, I'm literally standing here at the check -in counter. Nope, nope. So that's a great example of booking through an intermediary versus booking direct. Yes, yes. I think a lot of us have been trained to go do a flight search on Google maybe and then go straight to American Airlines or Southwest or Delta or United and book it direct. Same with hotels. And I think we're seeing that happen in vacation rentals. Absolutely. So people can, there's a lot to be learned from that. Absolutely. Okay. Well, I want to thank you for taking out some time to talk to us and letting us learn a little bit more about you and what it is that you do. And I love your, as I said earlier, I love your entrepreneurial spirit. Well, I appreciate it. I love that. It's just a, I don't know where it came from, but it's something fun about it. Well, and it, you know, it keeps you busy and, you know. keeps you on your toes. And then are you still like looking for things that like ways to make things better with people like in other areas? Just with Savvy right now. There's a lot of work we're working on right now. So that's sort of keeping me full time, full time busy. Well, keep up the good work. I appreciate it. Thanks for having me. Thank you so much. If this episode inspired you to rethink your next trip, Share it with someone you travel with. And if you're planning a family or multi -generational getaway and want help finding the right experience, not just a booking, reach out to me at Nostalgic Travel, and I will put the link below. show notes all of Eric's information as well. Thank you so much.