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Pete and PJ discuss cultivating healthy relationships. Plus, Pete’s got friends in low places.
A podcast between two tired dads on manhood, mentoring and maturity. Join PJ Wehry and his dad Pete aka "Coach" as they discuss life lessons they've learned being dads.
I built a and I think this is very important as we talk, I built some really strong relationships with people that do not come from the same spiritual battle. Right. They're not believers. I don't mean that harshly towards, I mean that, and then there were some that were, but I built strong relationships because one of the things is not only myself, but even you would come with me sometimes, whatever we were doing and we found a way to, to serve others.
Your dad's I'm your host, PJ weary and cohost dad. This is here. I'm here. We're in. And ready to go. I know you might be looking at about, I'm looking at an email that's going to be shared. So I was looking down awesome today. I'm excited about that. There's nothing like a very current and real, um, it's interesting to see because we've Madeline cold just to test.
It's not COVID. Thank the Lord. Um, so. I've been watching a lot of tick talks cause I've just been completely drained and it's amazing how people interpret the world based on experiences they've had. And so when you give a story or an argument based on a specific experience, we be like, well, that's not my experience.
And so it's really helpful to have something like this email I'm looking forward to it. That's something where it's an email. You can be like, no, no, no, this person said this, this stuff does happen. You need to understand. Um, so what we're going to talk about today is how to create healthy relationships.
And, uh, this is kind of the flip side of last weeks. How do we deal with toxic people? Um, speaking of colds, So, um, you have an email to share with us. I'm sure the verse has kind of come up. And when we talked about this a little earlier, um, a man who wants friends must show himself friendly, the PJ paraphrase of the proper, but it's it's so, uh, The first thing, as we talked about how to create healthy relationships, how to find people who are not toxic and develop those close communal relationships.
Um, and for us, that's building the kingdom of God, but you know, for everyone, I think this is a basic human need. Uh, Aristotle talks about man is basically a social animal. And at the time I was like, well, what about rationality and intelligence and stuff? And I think it's our relationships that are more fundamental.
And I really do believe that I think that's rooted in scripture. So I'm really excited to hear what you have to say. And I think, you know, first and foremost, just like we mentioned earlier, if you're going to create a healthy relationship. You have to be healthy yourself because if you're a toxic person, if you are, uh, an unhealthy person, you're not going to have a healthy relationship, all your, all your relationships are going to be a problem because you are the problem.
Well, it's not a verse, but birds of a feather, you know, it's not a verse. I think I've heard people try to quote it as a birth, but you know, there is this, uh, traction of those you are like. And so if you're a, you know, a complete. You often end up with the complainer's if you are encouraged her. Yeah. I mean, th th that seems to happen.
So this email is really not a story. Anything it's more, um, by James clear, who I think is, um, oh, top notch on the cusp of. His book, atomic habits, some have said it to be the seven habits of highly effective people by Stephen Covey was the book of the nineties. This is the book of this, um, decade. Uh, you know, I think he wrote it in 2019, so he gets the last 10 years, but we'll give them even three or 400.
He sends out an email. And it's interesting because some of the strongest leaders that I know of, uh, are always tweeting what he, he writes. And the funny thing is that's clearly James clear, James clear. He wants some good content, good place to start. Yeah. Atomic habits, his book, but he has this email called 3, 2, 1.
Um, and it's 3, 2, 1 Thursday. Um, and it's a newsletter comes out and what he has is three ideas. That's James clear, two quotes from others. And one question for you, this was his first idea last Thursday, and I read it and I went man, doubled down on your best relationship. It's the investment with the highest return.
Yeah. What's your best relationship? And spend more time with it. Um, now interestingly enough, what would you say, PJ? And this might not even be where you wanted to go, but I think it's important. What you say is, um, what's your strongest relationship? Who's your strongest relations? I mean, the obvious answer is going to be my wife.
I think that that's where, I mean, and I understand some people are stuck, right. They make a decision when they're in their twenties with someone they don't know where you are in your twenties. I don't know if that means you have to be stuck as you. No, no. What I'm saying is some people make a poor decision, right?
Like I got, I got lucky. Yeah. And that's something that I paid attention. Some things you hear this noise kind of, I don't think it's luck. I think it was wisdom and discernment. You D you saw character traits about your wife that were
appealing for a relationship that would be deeper than just, um, though she is beautiful. It's beyond physical. You know, um, I used to say this and people would freak out. I dated some girls that people might consider prettier than your mom, but I'd never met a woman that was more beautiful. Yeah. And, and, um, your mom is beautiful, uh, physically, but man, there was some steps.
So I would agree for me, it's my relationship with my mom. So. I would with your mom, which is my wife. Okay. For everybody out there, if you're not confused by get it, you were hoping you do get confused by me.
I, I do think husbands and wives, if that's a strong relationship, it needs to be doubled down on. Yes, you need to say, well, I thought this was on manhood, mentoring and maturity. If you want to be the leader of your home, you better. Invest in your relationship with your wife, especially, um, and then you have some others that you might even consider it to be.
Strong relationships. You make a lot of phone calls, right? Yeah. I mean, I immediately think of Andy. Um, that's something that, uh, he just gives me a lot of, uh, wisdom and a lot of perspective when I call him encouragement. Yeah. Uh, Yes, Andy, Andy is more a source of wisdom and honest critique, but I need that.
Well, that's what is encouraging, cause he's not, he's a true friend. Yeah. I mean, you know, I think of, uh, you know, Joe's editing this podcast, I think, uh, Joe. Okay. Um, I think of, um, I don't know. It's interesting because. Um, there are relationships that even now are very close. I don't keep it as, as close to contact with them.
You know, some of that was college. Some of that was just the moving on. I'm good friends with Greg Klein, but he's in Turkey and all his email communications are moms. So he's probably not getting into deep. Yeah. And I think I have to even be careful about what I, like you said, get into that. Yeah. And so I just like, and great friend, awesome.
Uh, Adam, uh, Pruden, great friend, uh, very close to him. Not good at long distance communication. So that's what we're talking about is w you know, it's is we talked about toxic relationship. We're talking about having strong relationships. Yeah. The thing I loved about clear, as he's saying double down, invest more in those, because they're going to impact you in a more positive and, um, for you and I, it's a biblical way, like look at things in a proper perspective.
All right. That God is sovereign. And if God is sovereign, he reigns in us, but there are people out there probably saying, well, how do I find good friends? And you don't find good friends in bad places. Good communities. Yeah. I almost just broke down into I've got friends in low, but I don't sing that.
Right. And the first time I heard that was a Kansas city Royals game for all our Kansas city friends. Uh, we have some kids that are like, I have some kids that I coached in Kansas when you went to school with, but I think you got to go to places where there's a like-minded. And for you and I, that would be important that our church ministries, I talked to a couple last night that your mom and I are literally, um, mentoring and they are in their late thirties.
He is looking at the next steps in his life. Um, having him write down where he sees himself 20 years from now than 10 years, and then five, in other words, how to get to that 25 years where he sees himself. And one of the things I said to him, because there, there are searching for good, strong friendship.
And I shared this about doubling down. If you want to be with people who are kind and gracious and serve, the best thing for you to do is find a place where you can be kind gracious and serve, and that stuff gets rewarded. So that's kind of an interesting thing because the first step is to be kind and gracious.
And to be a servant, but you said it Proverbs 1824. He did have friends, must show himself friendly, but so you go, you be kind, you, your tenderhearted you're loving and, and you serve, and this is the, this is the pain of growing up is I was taught those things and I'm very grateful. You taught me those things.
And I think there's an experience. There's some things that only experience can teach. When you grow up and you're taught those things and those, for the most part around you reward those things and act on those things. And you'll run to people who don't, uh, to go, you're going to run to communities where they say they do those things.
And then when you do those things, uh, you get penalized. And by that, I mean, you get taken advantage of, and that's something, you know, uh, that's where. Harmless as wise as serpents harmless of like, I mean, and, and to understand like, yes, we need to be sacrificed. And I wholeheartedly agree with that, but when you go into a community where your sacrifice, uh, not only doesn't help the community, it actually enables them.
That's where you have to be careful. And I think you see that even with Christ, like Christ literally died for the whole world, but he made sure what he was doing was, uh, efficacious. If I can put it that way, you know, it's not like, um, he didn't die on someone else's terms. Um, I, it makes me think of a CS Lewis in the great divorce talking about how one of the reasons that hell exists is there are literally people who are so stubborn that they would rather reside in hell than change something about themselves or change their goals to fit into heaven.
Hmm. Well, I think it's funny you used the word enabled, cause I thought a couple of other words in. And, uh, expectations, uh, unhealthy expectations. Uh, some people say, well, I don't have friends and they are struggling with complaining or gossiping and, and no one wants a, that type of friendship. And they have these expectations that everybody's going to careful serve them, uh, give them what they need, what they think they need.
And there's a difference between needs and wants. Yeah. Oh, absolutely. And there's also just like, uh, I think one of the really important things is to realize that everyone has just a rich, just as rich of an inner life, as you do may, it might be slightly. But basically most people have just as much going on as you do.
And there'll be slight differences in that. But for that, that's a pretty small variance in re in comparison to how we often think of other people. It's like, well, why didn't they come over? It's like, well, they just had like, you know, when you look at your life and you're like, I just need a break tonight.
Other people have that. And so when you're like, why didn't they have, why didn't to come and do this? It's like, well, you didn't think through that, like, you didn't think through, like, you weren't there for someone else was like, well, I couldn't be, there was so much going on. It's like, and that's the way other people are too life isn't easy.
And so when, and that also makes us more grateful and more appreciative of when someone really sticks their neck out. Okay. That's good. What, um, w w where do you find these folks? I think you've got to go to play. Where, um, as we said, you can go serve. And for us, you know, I look back at, and here's the interesting thing.
Um, I was talking to your mom about this today in 19 96, 97, 98. We lived in Ocala. Um, literally I was making $7 an hour. Um, and we did have, uh, a lighter. But it was still a rent and it's $7 an hour is not a lot of money, you know, it's your mom and I, and you, and as I'm saying all this, um, I was coaching at a public school and I coached and I'm careful.
I say I coached hard. And what I mean by that as I was there all the time, and then I did individual workouts or different people, I coach a couple extra sports, but during that time we were financially tight, but I don't remember a better time in life as your mom got to serve her family, taking care of her mom with, um, Alzheimer's.
And I look back at that and I built. Uh, and I think this is very important as we talk, I built some really strong relationships with people that do not come from the same spiritual background that I have. Right. They're not believers. I don't mean that harshly towards them. I mean that, and then there were some that were, but I built strong relationships because one of the things is not only myself, but even you would come with me sometimes, whatever we were doing and we found a way to, to serve others and.
Some of the greatest memories. I have coaching where those years in, uh, at Ocala Vanguard high school, uh, you know, it was only three, but it was three very special years. I have some great relationships in Connecticut and Indiana. We both do. And then while we were up at Northland in Wisconsin, and I think a lot of that has to do because we try to help others.
And when you do that, you build strong relationship. So, where do you find good friends? You go and help them serve. Yes. And you have to get out there to, I mean, you're not going to, you have to be friendly to find friends, right. So, I mean, for, for the person who is staying at home and is worried, I mean, I saw someone talking about a school to help socially anxious men who wanted to get dates, but couldn't, and they just gave him the assignment.
Go get 50 girls, go ask 50 girls for their numbers. Didn't have to get the numbers, just had asked 50 girls. And the whole point was just get used to rejection, not the end of the world. It's not the end of the world. It's okay. If you offer to like, don't be afraid to ask, to go out, to eat with them. If they say no, it's like, that's fine.
If they look at you, like, you're weird, that's fine. Like, I mean, be careful how you ask it. I'll be like, Hey, you want to go? You know, I could do the Peter Lorre thing. I never thought about asking anybody, anything that way. But yeah, exactly. It's interesting. You say that because. If you go and you do that, put yourself out there, there is a chance you might feel a little weird and there's also chance you might get a low heart, but there's more chances that you're going to have.
Not just the word is not Cigna success or even significance. And it's going to be, um, strengthened relationships. That's how I would put it. You're going to get some strong relationships. Reaching out love and other people putting yourself out there and, uh, sitting at home and feeling sorry for yourself is not going to build relationships.
Yeah. And I love it. You know, you're talking about this, like, oh, I'm not a people person. That's fine. There are a lot of trees that do well by digging down deep roots. You don't have to have a lot of friends, but you should have. You should have some good friends. Everyone needs that. Everyone needs someone to kick them in the butts on once in a while.
Yeah. It's funny you say that. Cause I don't know if I have great friends. This sounds terrible to say people say why. Um, uh, one of my best friends in college lives in, um, Colorado, we stayed in. But by the very nature of the distance, we're not great friends. We're good friends. We would get together. We're talking about doing that with another guy that three of us did everything together in college because of our nature of being in Connecticut, Florida, Indiana.
I have good friends in those places. But it's been transient. It's interesting because since we've been in Florida, I had a guy that I thought was, yeah, he's a good friend. Now I'm working with him and he lives in Florida. We're traveling together. Yeah. It's becoming a better friendship. I don't know if we're really great friends, but there's, and you know, it is built a lot on the gospel that's but I'm going to go back to this.
My best friend is your mom. Yeah. You know, and even living here, we're only going to become better. Uh, father, son, Frank. Though you, you, you put yourself in these positions and you work at it and you don't agree with everything. You're never going to, you just work through it. If you agree on everything that something's probably wrong.
Well, you're probably almost said lactose, but that's probably not true that people could be lactose isn't what's the right word. Is there a intolerance? No, I would say you probably have. What's the term where you're, um, milk toast, milk toast. I got to jump in. We had a kid on our basketball team that was lactose and.
And I'll never forget. His friend was making, they were like best friends too. And he was making fun of him for it. And he turned and said to him, I hope your kids are lactose-intolerant,
which we found out. You might have a little lactose. I have that. Yeah, whatever that is. Well, it goes around, but you still eat ice cream because that's, and I, then I pay for it later. It's a story of my life. Um, when you talk about like one thing you mentioned there that I think is important is time and effort.
Okay. Right? Yeah. Like definitely. It's going to take you and that's the doubling down investment. You have to invest in relationships. That's like being friendly, takes time. Um, Yeah, man. I mean, there's some, there's some good little nuggets. I always think of them like something I learned from you. And I think this is definitely worth it is being willing to pay for meals.
Cause there's no like, even when you don't have to, and especially when you don't have to, like with that communicates to people. Um, you know, I think, uh, even when we were struggling financially, just communicating to people that, that we care and, um, Uh, you know, and I understand some people have different cultures on that.
Um, for me, uh, when I take out a calculator. And I'm like trying to figure out whose is whose. And we'd like, we spent five minutes with, like, it makes the relationship feel very translate, uh, transactional, which I don't think is super healthy. Yeah. I mean, and that, that also, I think is a different personality thing, but I think you need to be cautious of who you're dealing with because, uh, with a calculator person, if you pay for the meal, you're going to be.
With a knock calculator person. If you get the calculator out, you're going to hurt them. So you, that's something you have to read. Yeah. So of those is safer than the others. Obviously you're going to lose some money, but is it worth it to find good friends? Yeah. And I think even for me being part of ministry, I almost hated the fact that we almost had this look like, well, I'm in ministry.
This is exciting. We're having meat tonight. We've never had me on now. It's just not going to be that way. And I did. And, you know, uh, going back to, um, expectations and being entitled. Well, listen, I don't, there was a guy and he's a, he was a good friend. We did not get to spend as much time. And I would love for him to hear this, but he did something for you and I.
That you probably don't even remember, but, um, and it's really sad. I can't, I'm looking right at them, Bob from Mishawaka, Bob, um, I'm looking right at him and Bob gave us his golf passes. He had seasoned golf paths and he let us go golf. The golf course was ever heard. Yup. Wasn't new. So I just had dinner with Bob about two years ago, folks.
Um, I hope Bob listens to us. He can call me up. Uh, Bob had this thing and we had an intern for three summers in a row live with us. And every Monday he said, just take those golf passes. It's part of my deal with Everhart called Bob Watson. And that wasn't, that was, that was not expected. I never asked him, but what I didn't want to do is be that guy well, I'm in ministry.
We don't have any money, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Let's. And it's, it's interesting how that, uh, if you give back, God gives back to you, but I mean, there's more about friendships, but I think one of the ways is not, I think what you're saying is don't be cheap. Well, you know, this is, this is great. I love that you brought this up because one of the things that men struggle with in our society is asking for help.
Right. And that's very clear, but the other side of that is you don't want to be the person who cried. No question. And so when you're, don't be afraid to ask for help when you really need it. And there's a lot of people who will ask her help and all they're doing is creating dependence between them and the other person, which eventually will create resentment on both sides.
I say the best person to ask help from is bring it before God. And he'll use others. Sounds really spiritual, but it's really true. Like. Uh, we're in this scenario and we, we saw that come bring someone along. Yeah. He brings to the right person and right spot in that builds a community and friendship and a confidence in Christ.
And what we've seen that we've seen that numerous times, your mom and I did, I mean, I've been grateful to be a part of seeing that sometimes it's been not all of them, you know, some of the materials like two or three years old. Right. Um, I think the, you know, one of the big things we kind of touched on earlier, Find a community find a community that shares your values.
And it's interesting because people are like, Hey, you know, you even mentioned this. And there's even reasons that I find myself saying I'm a devout Christian set of conservative Christian, because there are certain parts of Christianity that, uh, or people who call themselves Christians. I don't really follow the Bible, honestly.
And, uh, because Christianity is as much a culture thing here as it is a religion. And, um, just because you share values doesn't mean they all have to be the same types of values. So it doesn't have to be just based on. Right. Um, that's, that's why Paul talks about being unequally, yoked, it being Christian and being Christian really helps.
Right. But that's different for friendships than a wife, which is going to be about an intimate relationship that you have in your entire life. And so finding, I mean, that's a big part. Even what I wanted to create for candid guilt productions was creating common ground for con for the common good. And that whole idea of, um, I was talking to someone the other day and we disagreed on some really big topics, but we could agree.
Even how we addressed some similar, like some issues that we deeply disagreed on. And we had a great conversation because he was really, it was very clear that he was really worried about taking care of people. Like he actually cared about people. And I do think like, uh, one of the things that, you know, when we were like, well, that person we don't share any values with, they're really kind, um, that might be a red flag for you.
If you don't think that kindness is about. Right. Like, and if you both share kindness, you'll be surprised how much you can get done together. Right. Good. And so just like that, that will help guide those friendships. You can grow. If you have no values in common, you are not going to be friends with that person.
Uh, there's a number of people I think of that may take the time to listen to this. And there are people that have, uh, been friends with me or invest me in, I think of how they have been able to invest in communities outside of the church, how just by going in and being gracious and kind and serving and how they impact.
Communities and they're still impacting communities. Yes. They're being asked to lead groups and lead teams or, and, uh, I have a friend that is very much, uh, it's not about coaching. It's about mentoring and the study. He didn't have the time to do it in the D set. I want my son to be. Well, and that's, that's a huge statement, man.
Yeah. And I think that some thing goes along with that too, is we shouldn't be so arrogant and I would never want to communicate that we don't think that gracious and kind people don't exist outside the church. Right. And, and ungracious and unkind people sometimes do reside exists in the church and that needs to be addressed from the word.
Yeah. And the word works. If people allow God. Absolutely think it's really good page. I think, as we talk about this, that you to put yourself in the right communities, obviously one of the greatest places that church, I think the biggest step is this was not about dating, but I think every guy out there it is imperative.
As you're looking at a marriage that you think this is going to be the person that's going to be. My best friend. Um, and we're gonna spend tons of time together. Yeah, it's funny. We even talked about Andy today. Uh, he was the best man at my wedding and he gave me something I thought for, for what I would want to share at the end.
Uh, for my conclusion, I, he pointed me to a thinker called Simone V. And, uh, she talks a lot about how, uh, one of the problems in the west is that we all have our politics is based around rights when it should be based around the obligations. And I don't know if that's actually possible in a political sense, but I do know this, that if you go into a relationship worried about your rights, rather than your obligations, Think about what you can offer, what you can bring and you should still safeguard yourself.
I understand the importance of those rights, but that's where you look at the other person, like they're not fulfilling their obligations. Right? You can measure that person according to that, because I think a lot of people go and it's like, this is what life owes me. Or this is what this person owes me.
Instead of being like, what, what am I doing to help make the situation better? And, um, I think that would, if we just approach it simple as like, you know, love others as much as, uh, as you would wish to be loved, you know? I mean, it, it doesn't get more basic than that. About relationships and friendships. We were given two key commandments, love, God love others.
And if you love us, It will be at times reciprocated. It will be, it might not always. Yeah, but it will. So that's really good. Awesome. Really appreciate it. Thank you. Thank you. .