Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
A podcast to disrupt common narratives and constructs to empower diverse communities. We provide inspirational content from entrepreneurs and leaders who are disrupting the status quo.
create a better connection
between the brand and the customer.
So I think we're looking at different ways
to incorporate it where we can see value
and it can, and not just for the for
the brand, but for the customer as well.
So I think we're not just looking at
AI like a blanket like replacement.
It's like, where can it really,
you know, solve a problem.
If you believe
we can change the narrative.
If you believe,
we can change our communities.
If you believe we can change the outcomes,
then we can change the world.
I'm Rob Richardson.
Welcome One.
Welcome to disruption.
Now I'm your host and moderator,
Rob Richardson.
As always, it's
great to be joined here at 1819.
if you're if you're watching this, please
like please comment.
That's how we get our message out.
More about all the disruption
and all the creators
and all the brilliant minds
we have on here
that are disrupting
common narratives and constructs.
With me is Adam Khan.
He is the chief creative officer
for Great Midwest.
We're going to have a discussion.
Do you see AI for creativity as a threat?
Is an opportunity? Is it both?
I don't know.
These are like the discussions
people are having.
Like what do we do with this
massive technology?
How do we view it especially as a creator?
Adam, good to have you on another.
Very, very, very happy to be here.
So thank you for having me.
Yeah.
So I know you,
Adam, are creative at heart.
Like, we've,
you've used creative and,
and and combine technology.
You did that with Web3. With, NFTs.
Right?
And you.
And you've helped, like,
use your creative, mind to,
to really merge technology.
and I think NFTs are still a thing,
but they're
but in comparison to scale,
AI is just a whole nother level.
in terms of, like,
what's happening with the creator economy.
I just love to get your thoughts about
what do you see
as the future of creatives
and what role does I play with that?
at everything,
I think, you know, I've been
I've been in this advertising industry
for 18 years.
And, you know,
when I got in, it really was about
a few key principles
to making great work. Yes.
And and you had some tools,
that you, you had access to.
It was, it was limiting.
But now,
today with AI
and all the innovation that's
been happening over the past, you know,
you know, 510 years, it has just changed
everything about how we think
about creation in general.
Right.
So, you know, in, in the ad worlds,
you know,
you come up with an idea for a brand
and then you'd have to hire
all these other people
to help execute your vision.
Right.
But today, I really don't need them right
to the same capacity as I do,
because I have AI.
Right?
And I think it's going to, be impossible
to move forward without incorporating it
into your skill set.
because it, it,
it gives you the ability to move
at a speed
in which you never would have imagined.
And, I don't want to ever cut out
those that helped in the past
or help build things, but,
it really is going to become a massive
skill set that everyone has to learn to,
to continue pursuing creativity.
But I imagine, businesses
are going to have expectations as they
there's always been there's already been,
you know, this pressure to,
on, on your clients to bring down costs.
I don't know what your
how are your clients talking about AI?
Do they do they assume like,
okay, used to be able to do this for less
because I hear now
do they make that assumption?
If so,
how do you navigate something like that?
okay. So it's a very recent topic.
I'd say over the past,
16 months, I've been meeting with,
with most of the clients
talking about AI because I think
AI is
like can be
seen in so many different facets, right?
Right.
You know, I think we typically think of
AI as like ChatGPT
or you got the Midjourney for visuals,
but then there's like AI
from a productivity standpoint
and an efficiency standpoint that
most people aren't even thinking about.
So I think when we've approached them,
we try and communicate
as best as possible.
One the creative opportunities that it
can unleash and unlock and make for you.
But then also some of the side effects,
I'd say for using.
Yeah.
I you know, that to some extent
we still don't know where some assets
come from.
Yes, we want to partner
with those that license, etc..
so you kind of balance
the risk and reward.
I haven't seen too many clients
I want to totally move over to.
I think they're exploring the
possibility of what it can do
and how we would use
it to, either attract talent,
new customers or more revenue.
you know, some examples could be,
we are
very used to going to like a delta.com
and instead of waiting
six minutes for a callback, we can text.
But what if you, that chat bot,
relationship was actually a 3D avatar
that was built on
AI who could actually talk to you
about your needs of,
you know, upcoming travel, visually.
Right.
So, you know,
there's AI platforms that are turning,
you know, the old antiquated chat bots
into people.
Exactly. To make a more human.
I think, you know, for
maybe that brand that actually
might create a better connection
between the brand and the customer.
So I think we're looking at different ways
to incorporate it where we can see value
and it can, and not just for the for
the brand, but for the customer as well.
So I think we're not just looking at
AI like a blanket like replacement.
It's like, where can it really,
you know, solve a problem.
So you are creative naturally.
And we talked
we had this conversation offline about
like how both of us because,
I consider myself a creative in some ways.
And I have ADHD.
I have a million things on my mind.
And, you know, I have found it useful to,
to actually use,
ChatGPT and multiple tools
of artificial intelligence
to really help me bring out
all these thoughts and organizing.
I'm curious, you know, as a creative,
what how how have you used it
and what are some tools that you know,
from a creative point of view,
that a creator should embrace
based upon your experience?
Sure. So, I'll give you a few examples.
You know, I'm an artist
by trade and designer.
but I also know my limitations.
So, you know, one thing I use Midjourney
for almost every single day
is basically a digital sketchbook.
So any ideas I have,
whether it's a character or a story,
I just jot it down, prompt it, and output
kind of like a digital digital memory.
So I think from a visualization
standpoint, I'm using it
obsessively, right.
for so many reasons.
One, I can't draw as fast as I think to.
I know my limits,
and sometimes I just can't, produce
what I'm visualizing,
with with the tools I have.
Right.
and it helps me do a lot of,
like, I'd say, daydreaming.
Right.
you know, we have great ideas sometimes.
And sometimes I can't find
all these people to think through it
or put it down,
and it just helps me in 30s outputs
something that that will help me
remember where I want to go next,
you know, from, like a ChatGPT standpoint,
I am not a writer, all right?
I might be a good storyteller,
I might have great ideas.
But when it comes to like structurally
writing things, I need it for help.
Whether it's emails, feedback, reviews,
you know, emailing, customer service
about a problem.
I think that it helps
me, eliminate a
lot of the friction it gets me to go from,
you know, A to B, right.
and it lets me, puts my thoughts down
and then, you know, format in a way that
someone would want to receive it.
and then I think from,
you know, an AI standpoint
and just like creative exploration.
Yeah, it's opening me up to how utilizing
more than just one tool can really unlock,
so many more ways to be,
expressive as creative.
Right?
You know, so, you know. Sure.
I'll use Midjourney
to create an image, but,
putting it in Firefly and adapting it,
you know, stretching it,
beyond the initial cropping
and letting me change
things is actually really getting me
to think differently about, how,
the creative output could be at the,
at the end, you know, instead of, like,
hiring someone to do a photo shoot
with a person
wearing a blue shirt,
now I can have that person.
I can adapt the clothing,
you know, on the computer using
AI until I see it as a viable product.
Yeah, yeah.
So with that, like,
I think about, like, I think there's just
there's really this debate I had and
I had another, a designer, on my, on
my podcast is just the last podcast.
It just came out,
his view was he definitely uses AI,
but his view was that AI doesn't doesn't
it won't make you creative.
It's not a word I say this way.
It doesn't replace creativity.
it in the.
For those who rely on that solely,
they will be outpaced
by those who are creative and use it.
What is your thought on that?
Yeah, I don't
I think I think AI is creative.
I mean, it has to be to some extent.
I think,
I think that it's going
to you're going to have to understand
how to use AI to truly be creative versus
it being like a set it and forget it.
I think there is an element of creativity,
of prompting and creating the output.
But at the end of the day, too,
I think it all comes down to taste, style
and sensibility. Yeah.
So anyone can put anything into the prompt
and see a result.
But unless you have taste and style right,
you're only going to reach a certain
threshold like,
you know,
there was a way that the early, let's say
end of 21 where like,
I think everyone just got tired of AI
because they're like,
everything looks the same, right?
and then there were some modifications
and updates, and you see people
starting to incorporate real design into,
what the initial output is.
And that's where it starts
to really unlock the possibilities.
So I think taste helps you blend.
That's a good way of putting it.
Like I, I went to a,
I went to this performance a couple,
I think it was last week.
and, and a performer
that's coming to Midwest.
Com. Lisa. Fancy five,
actually is her name.
She had a, a performance
about authentic intelligence
and said the age of AI is not going to.
What's going to still matter
is, it's kind of, like, similar.
What you're saying taste and style.
What makes you an authentic person
affects offensive creator.
And thinking about how you put that
and then get ideas
and other expressions for that.
And so like, how do you balance that out?
Like how
how do you advise people to think about
how do you tap into your authentic self?
What does that look like for you?
I mean, I think, I think
I use the same lens that I apply at work.
Like if you have an idea, art, your
your first go at it is like go to Getty
or stock photography
site to find something
that reflects an element of the vision,
and then you hope
that you can go shoot it.
And that's where your craft style
and taste come out in the final execution.
I think
that comes with years of experience.
I agree, and there is a big difference
between good and great,
you know, and I think those sites like,
you know,
that have stock photography
serve a real purpose.
But when you want to elevate the craft
and creativity, you you do have to have,
and I think an element of expertise
and experience to uplevel the work.
Otherwise
you're just going to get the status quo.
Yeah, I agree, and I think about like what
I think about the creativity
that a lot of that that was generated
out of the 80s and the 90s
that just thinking about music right now
that say we don't have any creativity now
we have some, but it's nothing compared
to like the 80s and 90s early 2000s.
And I'm not saying that just because
we're we're a little more seasoned
old a little bit,
but what I'm saying is that, like you
look at like
think about Michael Jackson, right?
How much effort he put into his craft.
Right? Right.
In terms
of being able to dance, perform right.
Produce right.
Like so
I do think people are had this sense that,
hey, you don't need to do some of these
things, I believe, to get
that authentic self, to get that authentic
kind of like what makes you great.
You still have to go through
some of that work and process it.
I can enhance that.
I think it's people that are just looking
to think that they can be mediocre
and that those people
will have some trouble because, you know,
I think people can still tell
when thing, when,
when there's no authenticity put into it.
I think. Yeah. And I mean, I, I know I,
we probably sound old
saying that. Like you probably do.
You know, I, I still think that people
need to start off on the ground
floor, like learn how things are made
before they can skip steps.
you know, again, me
using AI and everything
now isn't shortcutting anything for me.
I still draw every day and and use
my brain, but there is an element that is,
you know, a bit speedier to market
than what I'm used to,
but I'm still applying
the same sort of taste, sensibility,
style and years of experience
in the in the output.
It's just manifesting differently.
Yeah.
I also think authenticity
and or leaning have into this,
but I think it's important is like,
a lot of folks aren't used to doing this
either.
Like in terms of like,
you know, newer generations, it's
because everything can't be replaced
with technology, right?
Everything can't be replaced
with a text message.
people will tell you, like,
even the most, expert people
in implementing technology is three things
in order to do it right, people,
process which is learning stuff
and then technology.
Right.
So like and but people think you can start
with technology and work backwards
and that's the problem. Right.
And that's why I think we produce
a lot of things that seem similar.
because to me
music sounds really similar now.
Like for the most case
there are exceptions or
there are some very creative people
and that's one example.
But there others and people
I think will die
for that taste and style
and that authenticity to come.
I, I will.
I noticed this the other day though.
It's getting harder and harder
to really see
what's real and what isn't real though.
And I think like as an artist,
as much as I love this stuff,
it is
a bit of a battle because if you open acts
or, you know, or Instagram
and you see all this beautiful photography
and art does beg the question,
is it real anymore or is it not?
Because the how do we got that?
Like what's what's your thought on that?
Like what should we do about that.
Because I don't
well I think, I think there's, I think
that there's a few way
I think the government and other companies
have talked about, like calling out
and truly identifying what is.
I. Yeah.
but I think in general, like
I'm questioning if people even appreciate
real art anymore.
Yeah.
because I can make, to some extent
what I do
in, Midjourney in a few seconds through,
so I don't want to lose that appreciation
for real handcrafted.
So you're not sure if people do?
I don't know.
I don't know, my hope
maybe I'm an optimist
is that people will still want to connect
with people.
Oh, yeah, I definitely think that's true.
I think, you know,
I've seen sales slip for a lot of artists.
Right.
or people just being like,
yeah, it's cool.
Like, yeah, I can make it. Yeah.
so I'm really
concerned about, like,
you know, people's well-being and career.
I kind of goes to what we talked
about, too, with, Tyler Perry.
Tyler Perry.
I was building,
I think, a $800 million studio in Atlanta.
He saw saw AI and halted production.
And and I think his words were like,
we have to figure out what this policy
looks like.
because it's, you know, this, this
this made him stop, like,
obviously something
that's to have a lot of support
for a lot of creatives in a big industry.
So I think your, your,
your concerns are well-founded.
I mean, I when I saw that article,
I was a little frustrated.
Why were you frustrated?
Because, when you look at what saw,
and other people have done with, runway,
you should look in to runway.
they have done an amazing
job with conceptualizing
ideas like nuggets of ideas.
There was a gentleman on X.
I can't keep saying assets.
You know, it's. Twitter,
but I just can't say, this.
Yeah, okay.
I think he.
Was the first person who did the.
Platform formerly known as Twitter. There
you go.
He, he created the first movie trailer.
Totally built, with eyes.
He used ChatGPT and Midjourney, runway
and other tools, and it looked phenomenal.
It was like Dune meets Star Wars.
I think he used cap cut to edit it,
but you got to go shoot that.
You got to get into production.
So I think I worry that, like,
just assuming that
these tools can replace
all the handcrafted, right?
Storytelling,
is, is a little too far fetched right now.
I understand that
maybe he wants to cancel it
because he wants to think about, like,
who's really needed in this $800
million studio, moving forward.
But, to kind of pause and halt thinking
that it's going to replace a lot,
I think is,
it's a
little troublesome to for jobs in L.A.
and people's careers.
You know, we're focused a lot here
at the Universe Society well, as well as
as well as Midwest Con.
Like, what does policy
look like around data like?
Because when we talk about AI, it's,
it's really we're talking about data.
and so like,
I'm really thinking about, like,
if we don't get this right to your point,
like what I, what I fear could happen
is that people don't know what's real
and what's not.
Right.
And there
so the initial part people might like it
because the algorithms know us better
than we know ourselves in some ways.
But we've also seen
the negative side of algorithms
that don't have any type of restraint.
That is what I call
social media right now. Right.
Like we we've seen that.
At least that's my perspective.
I can probably say
that a lot of social media companies start
off with the best of intentions.
I think Facebook was about connecting
the world, right.
That happened
until it disconnected the world,
because then the algorithms
took over. Right?
And the goal was engagement at all
costs. Yeah.
It wasn't about,
making sure the world was connected.
It became, how do I keep you glued?
And how people stay glued is that they're
always mad and arguing with each other.
Right. So that's what they give people.
And it's hacking their brains in some way.
I do have that fear
that it could hack our brains.
that and then it could also do something
where people, enough
people get upset that they want to
shut down innovation, which is also bad.
Right.
So I believe the most important thing
we need to do
is figure out a way to do this and still,
keep trust.
I think,
it needs to be augmented intelligence.
Not not not
not not completely artificial.
Yeah.
and I think
we got to find that balance in.
And I still think people will want to.
Maybe I'm naive and I still think people
will want to connect with people.
And I think we should we should know
if we're talking to a person, right.
Or a false person and some people
and entertainment is fine, right?
If I'm watching Disney, I know,
I know what's happening.
Right? But
if someone's pretending to be Adam Con,
I need to know
if it's you or is fake. It.
If it is a fake version of you
that you approved it, right?
Because that's you, right?
And no, like, we don't know.
We have laws against that that are going
to protect your image and likeness.
But it's we're we're entering into an area
that, like you said, we just don't
know like
what shouldn't we do with AI?
If you had to say what we talked about,
what we can't do, but what what
should be off the table
from your perspective?
make, make it
the only thing we interact with.
You know.
I mean, I think that's where you get
to, like, AGI and some some craziness.
Right?
I do think it's
I've listened to a lot of podcasts.
It's going to be really hard to, like,
crack down on what's what's real and fake,
I think to a point where I've, like,
almost given up, like
reading the news somewhere or,
you know, going through X or Twitter.
I mean, yeah, you don't I don't know where
that's where you get that.
I don't know what's real or fake.
And I do think that that's going to
just totally screw up this next generation
in understanding,
like what's really happening in the,
in the world, versus what
people are telling you what's happening.
Well, that's good.
So how do you go about getting
getting your news then?
I don't turn it off.
No. I know my wife has gotten
so mad at me lately because I'm like, I'm
just refuse to watch you
because everything is so skewed.
You're like me. To a perspective.
You know? So I have I have a lot.
I've said often, news is to the mind
as sugar is to the body.
It's a hit.
Yeah, but then it takes you down.
It makes you actually feel
some type of reaction.
But then you go downward.
Know it's meant to is meant to do that to.
We don't need actually as much information
as we get.
That's also part of the problem.
Right, right.
but but I do think what I
so something I do is I don't
I try not to look at the news on Twitter
or anything else.
I do read long form content
and I'll maybe listen to a podcast
about something, because that's less
likely to trigger, right,
than seeing a reaction,
because on social media,
the goal is to capture your attention.
Yeah, it's not to inform you. Right.
And so I try to pull myself back,
but most people it's it's it's
by the way,
it's impossible to do it all the time.
Yeah.
Most people don't know
I listen to a lot of podcasts
because I think that's kind of where
I get my source for like tech and yeah,
and all that stuff happen in the world.
But even local news in the paper, it's
just so depressing.
It is, though.
The goal is to depress
you and get you to angry.
And I'm like, I'm not. I'm not doing. It.
I remember as a couple of years ago
I called my buddy.
I used to live in Manhattan, I called him,
I was like, dude,
what is going on there? And he's like,
what are you talking about?
Yeah, he's like, it's a nice day out.
I'm in Union Square and I'm like, well,
the news just said
there was a shooting here
and then a murder there,
and then someone got dragged
and he was like, yeah, no.
We're good,
we're good, we're good, we're good.
Okay, well, this is
a little scary.
Yeah.
All right.
So what do you want it like,
what would you tell future
creatives, people that are in this world
that are just starting like,
I mean, let's face it, this way.
Your creator, you are.
You always been. It's in your heart.
what advice would you give yourself
as a younger creator?
Right.
You're talking to young at this time.
And then what advice would you ignore?
what advice would I give the younger Adam?
I typically say nothing because I.
I like that I made all these mistakes.
Right.
but, and and and failed a million times,
I think.
I think the advice I'd give my younger
self is like, don't, don't cut corners.
You know, obviously we had less tools back
then.
and focus more on the craft
you want to be excellent at.
I think I tried a lot of things.
you know, whether it was going into
the movie industry or being an artist.
And I think, I wish I had spent more time
crafting certain things that I thought
could be really great strengths.
Right.
And don't be afraid to fail
and fail and fail and fail.
Because I think that's where you get
the most, learning experiences.
No. Agreed.
all right,
another lightning round question.
This is this always trips up, people.
What's an important truth you have that
very few people agree with you on?
truth that I have.
Oh, man.
As it relates to my own art,
anything, man,
that I don't I don't want your feedback.
I think that,
hopefully I don't get dinged
for saying this, but,
when I was in art school,
my professor went up to a piece
that I had made and asked me
kind of kind of a tough question
to answer as an 18 year old.
And he said, he's like,
let's look at this.
Let's talk about this piece.
are you
are you masturbating or doing art?
And I was like, what's wow.
And only are teachers, but yeah.
And that has stuck with me,
for forever and really,
I think the crux of it is,
are you doing art for yourself
or are you doing, for other. Right.
And I think when I do art,
it really is for me.
And for the most part,
like I think that it's the one thing
that I own, that
that I want to create what I want versus
it being like, nipped
and tucked by budgets and constraints.
And then so
I think that would be my one truth.
So sometimes art's just for me.
Yeah.
And I think I would argue
the greatest artists probably have that.
Like I think about
like they probably didn't go out in,
think about what everyone's opinion
is going to be and like,
how can I make something great?
It's greatness comes from within.
And then you share it with the world.
It is your unique experience.
But I kind of going back to the authentic
intelligence, right?
I actually think we all are artists
in our own way.
We are all expressing ourselves
in this world, whatever,
whatever God gave us,
we had to figure out how to use that.
And if we listen to too many voices,
you can drown out who you are.
That doesn't mean don't listen to people
I don't want
I don't want people to take that.
But I do believe one of the problems
we're facing in this generation
is that social media has it that you
you do things
to compare yourself to others
and not figure out how to get in tune with
what makes you great.
Yeah, yeah.
I mean, I just think that's, that's a
I think that's a really good truth
that you have.
And that's why you're able to be creative.
Because if you're trying to be like
everybody else, you come up with art
that's like everything else, right.
Right. Right. Yeah.
All right.
You got a committee of three.
They can be living.
They can be dead.
You can combine living and dead. Yeah.
They can advise you on business,
life, creativity.
Tell me who these
three people are and why.
Steve
Jobs I think for, for obvious reasons,
Jake Burton,
the founder of Burton Snowboards,
I guess quickly because,
you know, at a time when,
there were, you know, two flankers,
skiers, ruled the mountain.
there was one individual
who really pursued, a different sport,
and it got rejected over years and years
and kind of built
one of the largest snowboarding companies.
so I think,
you know, he's not living anymore.
but I would love to know
how he got through all the tough times
and pursued a vision
that was honestly widely rejected.
So that would be my question for him.
And then, finally, mixer was one of
the first artists I ever saw as a child.
and it was the kind of art
that I just stared
at for hours being like,
how did you do this?
And I think, I think those three people
have always been really interesting to me
from, you know, someone who,
went against the grain for design
innovation and had really strong beliefs
and what great greatness is.
And then someone that, when,
when against the current
when it came to trends and popularity,
and then just art for the sake of doing
art and blowing your mind
I think is always just fascinating.
All right.
The had a motto and life slogan.
What is it?
It kind of kind of ties into,
my art, but it's simple.
It's I am what I am, and what I am is me.
I love it, Adam. Let's
have you on, brother.
Thank you very much for having me, Rob,
I appreciate it. It's it's. Great.