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The Moonshots Podcast goes behind the scenes of the world's greatest superstars, thinkers and entrepreneurs to discover the secrets to their success. We deconstruct their success from mindset to daily habits so that we can apply it to our lives. Join us as we 'learn out loud' from Elon Musk, Brene Brown to emerging talents like David Goggins.
00:00:02:00 - 00:00:33:14
Unknown
Hello and welcome to The Moonshots podcast. I'm your co-host, Mike Parsons, and as always, I'm joined by the man himself for the episode 258. Yes, the man himself, Mr. Mark Pearson. Freeman. Good morning. Mark. Hey, good morning Mike. Good morning, listeners, subscribers and viewers. Man, I got to admit, Mike, it's really fun to be digging into today's episode number 258 with our second episode within the Austin Kleon series.
00:00:33:16 - 00:01:01:19
Unknown
What a big series. He kind of opened this up in that first one to giving us the permission and demystifying the idea of creative effort and creative works. And now today, Mark, we are going to go beyond doing some work. We're going to show your work right. Woo! You're right. Mike, if last week we were digging in to the idea of steel like an artist, inspiration.
00:01:01:21 - 00:01:22:09
Unknown
the concept of creativity and getting vibes as well as permission from individuals. you know, we touched upon Elizabeth Gilbert, for example, finding that permission is now, the foundation that we can build on when it comes to the second book that we're going to dig into show you work, which I think is we're going to reveal and explore and be inspired by.
00:01:22:10 - 00:01:42:11
Unknown
Today is a little bit more around the idea of sharing, the idea of finding more inspiration, but also being able to put your work out there, which I think is probably the second hardest thing, or maybe the hardest to individuals who want to go out and create. Not only is it starting just on day one, but actually it's getting that work out there, isn't it?
00:01:42:11 - 00:02:05:17
Unknown
Sometimes that's like it for a lot of people, for us. So spot on there. I think if we're if we're a bit frank and honest with ourselves, we're often we're often thinking about what others are going to say before we've even shown it, which is crazy, right? and, you know, we need to step in the arena and take our inspiration from Brené Brown.
00:02:05:17 - 00:02:34:21
Unknown
And I think as far as the ideas in show your work, I think what Austin is going to help us do is get going, get the work moving, start sharing, start collaborating, and realizing that the path and the journey of creativity is insanely collaborative. And it's very intuitive. Like I was just saying to you before, we started recording, when I think about the first episodes of this show of my oh my gosh, is that awful?
00:02:34:23 - 00:02:56:00
Unknown
But hey, I had to start somewhere, and we were both laughing at ourselves in our 250 plus episodes like, okay, hey, we can at least we can record it properly. Who knows about the rest? But the point is, if you're ready to show your work and to get through the fear and the uncertainty, this is the show for you, our members, listeners and viewers.
00:02:56:00 - 00:03:18:04
Unknown
Mark, where do we begin? What a great intro. Mike, thank you for that. Let's dive straight in with Austin Kleon himself. Now we're going to hear from Austin chatting to the legend Brian Johnson to really set the scene around this book. Because you're right, there are a number of different themes within it. Let's hear from Austin specifically calling out what he, really calls out is the misunderstanding of the book.
00:03:18:06 - 00:03:39:00
Unknown
But also why we all need to just start early. You know, when I was on tour for See Like an Artist, that was the big question I got asked. Just like every other author, you know, it's like, how do you do this? How do you get published? How do you grow an audience, like how you do your blog, you know, and that's all kind of, you know, questions about self-promotion.
00:03:39:00 - 00:04:21:03
Unknown
And I, I just thought, you know, I'm just going to roll with this and I'm going to write a book about self-promotion for people who hate the very idea of self-promotion. what show your work is about is there is a particular way of working that I noticed in the people that I admire, and what they do is that they're they're connected, they're online, and they're sharing little bits and pieces of their work over time as they're working, they still have this kind of they have figured out a way to get their work done, but to not totally disappear for eons before they come back and kind of share.
00:04:21:03 - 00:04:43:21
Unknown
They're kind of just doing these little daily bits and pieces, and most of it is their process. It's like, you know, like for a writer, it might be like what they're reading or what they're thinking about or, you know, that kind of thing might not even be their actual work, but they're sharing these little bits and pieces of their creative life and their process over time.
00:04:43:21 - 00:05:11:05
Unknown
And what that turns into is an audience that's then kind of primed for their work when they actually want to release something. And so what I wanted to do is write a kind of operating manual for this way of working. And, that's why I call it Show Your Work. And that the big idea of show your work is to not wait until you have this perfect, finished, polished product that you want everyone to know about.
00:05:11:05 - 00:05:31:17
Unknown
But to start kind of sharing little bits and pieces of your creative life before something is ready. And the big misunderstanding of the book is that you, like, show a bunch of rough drafts and like, you know, oh, I got to show my work before it's ready. And like, that kind of thing. That's not necessarily what the book is about.
00:05:31:17 - 00:05:54:09
Unknown
That's fine if you want to do that. But really, the book is about rethinking your whole process in terms of what's useful or interesting about it that you could share with people. And so one of the things I really poke writers about is like, look, if you're a great writer, you're working on writing and you don't, you know, you can't necessarily show your rough drafts because they're not ready yet.
00:05:54:09 - 00:06:13:14
Unknown
They need to be shown to like, you know, like a writer's group or your editor or something. But you are a great reader because every writer is a great reader. So I'm like, you should be sharing the thing that you're reading, the things you're inspired by. You know, that kind of thing. You know, rethinking the process is.
00:06:13:16 - 00:06:48:07
Unknown
Fundamentally, starting with this point that, Austin made Mark. And that is like, you do not have to wait for the final polished, finished, amazing completed works of mark based and freely. You can say, hey, I saw this movie, I read this article, I really I took this interesting photo. I want to share it. and you know, the secret about this is it's classically breaking things down into small bits.
00:06:48:09 - 00:07:16:05
Unknown
Yeah. And sharing something small versus the finished life works of Mark. That's like two totally different things. So if you really enjoyed an article that is connected to the theme that you're writing a book on, as the person who is writing a book which is not published yet, you have every right in the world to go out and say, hey guys, I read this and I thought this was really powerful.
00:07:16:05 - 00:07:49:10
Unknown
What do you think? And maybe those comments and conversations bring you even further inspiration to producing your book. This to me, taking, you know, this moment to say, I am not going to sit in an ivory tower for years because the risk is we all know we probably won't publish it that way, right? Yes. Yeah. Right. Yeah. And rather think about an iterative continue sharing smaller bits, whether directly or indirectly related to your work, to your final works.
00:07:49:12 - 00:08:14:25
Unknown
I think this is huge because you don't experience as much fear and self-doubt sharing a little thing than when you do a big thing. And if you can race that, I think then you sort of get in the habit of writing, creating, designing, sharing. And then this is how you can inspire your main process by just sharing these little snacks along the way.
00:08:15:01 - 00:08:43:17
Unknown
Yeah. Delicious little, amuse amuse. Boosh. Oh but the I think you're totally right Mike. And the thing that stands out to me obviously we know that Austin is quite a fan of of sharing work. You know he he's a bit of a creative powerhouse. We had a lot from him in the previous episode with regards to newspaper blackouts, you know, just coming up with cool quirky little ideas that maybe then become bigger, a little bit like a snowball rolling down a hill over time.
00:08:43:23 - 00:09:05:05
Unknown
So the benefit I think that Austin's probably seen with a lot of his content is he'll put it out there. Maybe he'll get some feedback, maybe some positive reinforcement that then enables him to gather speed. And I think what I really take out from the work of Austin, and obviously specifically today with show you work, is to not fear the idea of sharing your work.
00:09:05:07 - 00:09:40:03
Unknown
You know, we know that a lot of people will be put off, from not doing that. They'll probably be sitting on maybe a draft or maybe even a finished product of whatever it might be for a long time, because they're afraid of that criticism. And I think what we are hearing from people like Brené and Elizabeth Gilbert, but also obviously, Austin here, is to not let those big battles that we have in our head when it comes to the fear of feedback, whether people are going to accept your product or your book or whatever it might be, or whether they're going to give you negative input to fear or all of that is a
00:09:40:03 - 00:10:07:03
Unknown
great excuse. It's a great reason to flee from the idea of putting something out in the world that maybe you're really passionate about. Yes, and I think that battle is always often in our heads. And instead, what we need to do through the encouragement of Austin, for example, by starting early, maybe it gives you that little bit of confidence to continue not only getting that inspiration, but actually by the time the finished product comes out, you're kind of comfortable.
00:10:07:07 - 00:10:36:24
Unknown
Yeah, it's a little bit written, like putting the mindset into practice, isn't it? Yeah, yeah. You know, it's funny, I for some strange reason, as you were talking that I thought about Napoleon, and when Ryan Holliday writes about Napoleon and good versus bad news, Napoleon would priority his bad news and delay the good news because he found it more beneficial to hear feedback, negative feedback, negative news than to hear or just the light, fluffy stuff.
00:10:37:00 - 00:11:12:03
Unknown
And the reason I went there is something we've seen in the show is if you look at these extreme examples of high performance, they invariably do not fear problems. Negative feedback and the best ones search out the cynics. They search out the negative feedback because they see an ultimate truth. If you can face your greatest fear, the greatest criticisms, actually, that is the path to the greatest achievements.
00:11:12:05 - 00:11:40:13
Unknown
So whilst I know this is a little abstract, I think the point here is by starting small, we can start a journey of putting our work out there and taking whatever comes good or bad from that, and seeing it all as part of a chance to learn, understand and grow. And I think if there was one bad habit we all tend to have as human beings is, you know, we're working on a thing and it's pretty good.
00:11:40:19 - 00:12:07:15
Unknown
It's not quite great. And you're like, oh, I don't want to share it yet. I don't want to tell people about it yet. I think the real problem is that yet becomes forever. Yes, yes, I agree, and I think you're totally right with the idea of sharing despite the fear of negative feedback. You know, we we saw a lot of that with the early doors of, of space X.
00:12:07:16 - 00:12:30:15
Unknown
Yeah. You know with Elon, you know he got a lot of criticism from. Yeah. Astronauts from the private space also in the public space with regards to space exploration and so on. And what's interesting now, I think maybe through the process that he had of gathering feedback, inputs, guidance and so on, is that actually now the world is pretty captivated by it.
00:12:30:17 - 00:12:57:10
Unknown
You know, you can watch SpaceX, takeoffs and launches quite easily nowadays because everybody's sort of curious. Yeah. And I wonder whether that is a product of taking everybody on the journey. So enabling and showing your process is showing your work. You take a lot of the the haters, let's call it along that journey with you. And by the end of it, you can't do anything but respect the individual or the business.
00:12:57:10 - 00:13:23:11
Unknown
That's kind of gone through that process. Can you so check this out. I want to remind you of this little anecdote we had in one of our Elon shows where the interviewer says to him, jeez, it must have been hard having your childhood heroes and criticizing you publicly. And there was this really long pause in this very fragile answer of yes.
00:13:23:13 - 00:13:49:00
Unknown
So it's not like it didn't hurt. But the difference about Elon is he kept going regardless. How many of us could be publicly criticized by our childhood heroes in front of everyone? Yeah, and keep going, because that's the bar. That's the bar that we have to. And so if you just say, yep, I'm going to put myself out there, I'm gonna put my work out there, going to see what comes.
00:13:49:04 - 00:14:15:08
Unknown
We get crazy comments for the show. Yeah, but that's just part of how it is. We also get great ones, and those great ones often come from them in this manner. That's right. So without further ado, obviously we know and love and appreciate all of our members who with us day in, day out, providing feedback, providing recommendations, as well as, inspirational moments for you and I, Mike, as well as the whole moonshots family.
00:14:15:10 - 00:14:42:24
Unknown
We appreciate every single one of them. So please welcome in all of our moonshot members. Bob, can Dietmar, Marge and Connor, Lisa. Sita, Mr.. Bonjour, Paul, the. Kalman, Joe, Christian, Samuel and Barbara and Deborah. Lazar, Steve. Craig and Ravi. Eva. Raul. Nicole. Ada and Ingram. Dirk. Van Casa. Marco. Jet. Roger. Steph. Rory. Netherland. Diana. Christoph. Danny. Smitty. Corey.
00:14:43:00 - 00:15:05:08
Unknown
Daniela. Mike. Antonio. Zachary. Austin. Fred. Jez. Ola. Andy. Diana, Margie, Chris, Ron and Jasper who have joined us very, very recently. Thank you so much. John. Jasper and Ron for joining us. I know I didn't call out our annual members within that group, so I'm going to have to let all of our members remember and notice when they joined.
00:15:05:08 - 00:15:36:10
Unknown
But I'll reveal to the guys next week. There you go. That is the cliffhanger, yes. Now, Mark, we're we're obviously very grateful, to all of our members. And that really helps us produce our moonshots. Master series, which is exclusively available for members. We just did the most recent one last week on a growth mindset. So if you are interested in, listening to that, head over the moonshots video and click on that big members button.
00:15:36:10 - 00:15:56:08
Unknown
And, the Moonshots Master series will be awaiting you. What's awaiting you and especially me, Mark, is that when it comes to creativity, you don't need to be a genius. This is a bit of a relief for me, because I think I can categorically say I am not a genius like Austin has some thoughts on this. So why don't you let it rip?
00:15:56:10 - 00:16:25:17
Unknown
Yeah, absolutely. Mike and and I think where we're going to go with this next clip from Mike Naughtie is exactly that. We're going to find a little bit of permission as well as reassurance when it comes to sharing and being open with what inspires us. And our creativity kind of lays things out in a way where, you know, throughout history, people kind of have this idea of geniuses where they're they're kind of working on all their genius stuff in private for years and years and years, and then poof, they release it to the world.
00:16:25:17 - 00:16:46:19
Unknown
Everyone's amazed, and they get all this recognition. But the reality is that this is kind of rarely the case. And these geniuses that are so good at the things they're good at usually get good at it by interacting in social circles with other people, like minded people, or people who share similar interests. And that's really a fine thing to do.
00:16:46:19 - 00:17:12:07
Unknown
There's no harm in being in amateur, as you work on your skills in anything and build your way up, just like there's no harm in being an amateur or novice freelancer doing things like sharing your experiences with other freelancers, chatting, helping each other, and trying to grow together. Trying to build our skill sets together as freelancers. This is huge, right?
00:17:12:07 - 00:17:44:13
Unknown
Because I think everybody would mostly agree if we put 100 people in a room and said, Is Einstein a genius? But of course equals MC squared. Okay, but you know, the truth that we revealed on our study of Einstein is a couple of things. First of all, very slow as a kid to develop. two he categorically said, I do not think I am smarter than the average person.
00:17:44:15 - 00:18:06:03
Unknown
and then he revealed to us, Mark, what he did. Do you remember, he just tried again and again. He never gave up, did it? And he, to build in that, he said he just focused on the one problem for an extremely long time. And what we know is a lot of people, as to your point, don't have the daily habits.
00:18:06:05 - 00:18:27:14
Unknown
And if they do, they don't last for long enough. Right. Think about the whole diet industry is predicated on people that can adhere to a balanced diet. So they have to go swings and roundabouts. Right. And my, my interesting thing here is he was also, very active in academia, talking to a lot of other scientists sharing ideas.
00:18:27:14 - 00:18:48:23
Unknown
Sometimes he would work on something for seven years and sharing and discussing with others. Fast forward to today. We mentioned Elon in Space X. They're effectively sharing their journey along the way as well. You'll remember there was the whole build up to being able to get a rocket to land and be reused a second time, and now they're on to more and more.
00:18:48:23 - 00:19:16:14
Unknown
They're pushing for more distance, etc., etc. my point is this sharing and you can make your work a sharing moment to. And I cannot stress that if you share your work, you are bound to make it better. And again, I just think, Mark, how many times have you been in a situation where you and I have chatted? I've shared an idea with you.
00:19:16:14 - 00:19:40:07
Unknown
You give me a build or vice versa, or in other areas of your life. You're like, I'm thinking about this. Yeah. And with the right message to the right person, you can get amazing feedback and that will take you push you further, because we all know that we can be going in the tunnel and we're just focused on the thing, and there are just moments where you run out of all your gas despite your effort.
00:19:40:09 - 00:20:20:00
Unknown
It is like, what it's really saying to you is go out, share that work, get new inspiration, and that will rejuvenate you. And you can go again. Right? Yeah. Big time I mean you're right. There's a, there's a couple of things that stand out to me, both within the McNally clip as well as where you were just taking us there, the first of which, similar to your reference with Einstein, we know from I suppose you could say pop culture, but also from the broader sense of the science world that the majority of key, revelations within an academic space is through collaboration, but also, feedback from your peers.
00:20:20:02 - 00:20:35:14
Unknown
That's why you have medical journals. That's why you have peer reviews. Yes. At the end of the day, just because you and I say, hey, everybody, this is the best book in the world, somebody else probably will want to go out and get a second opinion. Yeah, that's the case with medicine. That's the case with, probably inventors and so on.
00:20:35:14 - 00:21:06:11
Unknown
What's safe, what a consumer's going to going to get research, consumer groups and so on and so forth are all, in my mind, part and parcel of this concept, which is showing your work, getting it better and ready for that end consumer. What also stood out to me as I think about where Austin's journey is taking us, obviously this is episode two out of three in our Austin series is how you effectively work well and proactively in a work from home situation.
00:21:06:13 - 00:21:44:22
Unknown
So where I see the real value of collaboration, in the careers that I've had is when I've been able to work with each other. Yeah, you and I collaborating on big whiteboards and so on that. Then, you know, obviously became, you know, digital through work from home situation where I think Austin is inviting our, curiosity as well as, forgiveness or openness is to put your work out there, you know, work from home situation where maybe you don't have somebody to bounce around ideas, you know, you're in your your, cans contained area, let's say, of your brain.
00:21:45:01 - 00:22:08:19
Unknown
Yeah. You got an idea? You don't know how to share it. Maybe you don't know how to communicate it to your partner, your friends, maybe your colleagues, instead just putting out little pieces that inspiring you is essentially, a putting a marker in the road of what is taking you to your final destination. So along that journey, people say, hey, that book is great.
00:22:08:22 - 00:22:28:02
Unknown
You should also look into X, Y, or Z that might take you even further down the rabbit hole of, let's say, design thinking or agile mindset or whatever it is. Maybe a piece of music that will only enable you to go further down that road and make it much, much better. So I think it's really about this idea of collaboration, isn't it?
00:22:28:06 - 00:22:57:12
Unknown
It's early days and we see this in the form of sports team, groups and founders and startups. there are all these collaborations happening all over the world, and even with people like academics like Einstein, you actually, when you look into it, is a very collaborative approach. And I think that many of us think that maybe the work won't be appreciated.
00:22:57:12 - 00:23:33:19
Unknown
Maybe you'll get negative feedback. Many of us think maybe people will steal my ideas. But here's the thing. What we've also learned is, let's say you've got an idea for a book, right? That may well and truly be the case that you share it. And someone says, oh, I want to write that book. but if they haven't been obsessed with it in the way you have, and if they haven't done the work that you have and also remember this, it will be your point of view will be unique.
00:23:33:21 - 00:23:59:22
Unknown
because as Elizabeth Gilbert teaches us, everyone is different to everyone's ideas, even when writing on the same topics are different. This is what you have to figure out. Don't fear people stealing your ideas because you still have to go do them. You know the perspiration, right? Two the chances are if you have any tech writer, you'll know the right people to share with.
00:23:59:24 - 00:24:22:24
Unknown
And genuinely, I think you'll find if you share your idea, they will reciprocate with feedback, and maybe they share an idea with you and you can help them. And once you build that trust, then you can be an open smorgasbord of ideas. And what an amazing idea that is. Yeah, the ability to jump in and out. It's similar to, the moonshots model.
00:24:22:25 - 00:24:46:18
Unknown
Like, you know, there's so much content and ideas within all of the shows or 258 shows done in 333 master series, which obviously is available for for members only. There's so many moments of inspiration within each of those that I think the idea of putting it all out there, making it available, is the way that we find inspiration, not only as kind of consumers of that content.
00:24:46:22 - 00:25:04:24
Unknown
You know, you can drop in and out much like you can on, you know, platforms like YouTube, but also as creators, it's it's so valuable to be able to put everything out there and see what sticks. Yeah. What people are inspired by. Yeah. Because that can really help us and other creators, you know, continue to get better. You're spot on there.
00:25:04:24 - 00:25:32:00
Unknown
So hopefully what we've started to do now is we've kind of got the work sharing early in the process. And these little micro, snippets, stories, snackable content, Snackable ideas. And I think also reminding you that you don't have to be a genius because your work will always be unique, because it's your work. And so get over the hump.
00:25:32:02 - 00:25:55:07
Unknown
Don't be scared of getting critiqued or people stealing your ideas, because one of the things we've learned from Austin is every ideas have already been done before, so he in fact encourages us to steal from others and build something that is new, remixing old things. And so now this gives us the chance to jump into the creative patterns, the creative habits.
00:25:55:09 - 00:26:19:23
Unknown
And we've got a bit of a classic, moonshot at coming up. So why don't you kind of set us up now to move into getting this creative work out there? Yeah. You right now, let's figure out how we might be able to put a little bit of this into practice. But I think part and parcel of of actually putting your work out there is understanding the right way of doing it and the right way of being creative and accessing the right processes.
00:26:19:23 - 00:26:38:15
Unknown
As we said earlier, it's all about maybe starting to share early. We're now going to take that a little bit further. Mike. We're going to hear again from Brian Johnson. Moonshots legend. We love him on the show here. He's going to now talk to us a little bit more about how to find rhythms not only of work, but also of rest when you're looking to create.
00:26:38:17 - 00:27:04:06
Unknown
So let's hear from Brian. Now talk to us about micro sabbaticals. Micro sabbaticals. So sabbatical is related to Sabbath once every seven days you rest well. And academics for example, one year out of seven they'll take off for a sabbatical. Right now I was laughing as I was typing this because it was about seven years ago that I took a one year sabbatical, took a couple of years off with a one year sabbatical to go to Bali.
00:27:04:08 - 00:27:26:13
Unknown
Right? My life is so different now with a child being married with a kid and with all these other things we got going on. that it was actually funny for me to imagine that version of my life. But what we can do if we can't carve out the year for the sabbatical in the near term, is we can create micro sabbaticals every single day and week and month.
00:27:26:13 - 00:27:46:03
Unknown
We can create ways to get away from our work and this is in the context of if you want to really engage in your work, you have to know how to disengage. You can't always be on. Right. So I'm going to keep on drawing this in all the episodes where it makes sense. We need to make waves, we need to train recovery.
00:27:46:05 - 00:28:06:14
Unknown
People talk about, well, how do you get so much done? Well, it's because I'm focusing and I'm as focused on being off as Jim Moore taught us. The best athletes, the tennis players that he studied were the ones who recovered the best between points. They relaxed deeply and profoundly. We just talked about this in a mind for numbers, she says.
00:28:06:14 - 00:28:23:20
Unknown
We have a focused mode of thinking, and then we have a diffuse mode of thinking. You need to have distributive learning where you do some of one in some of the other, kind of like the base camp was the metaphor that she used, right? If you're ascending Everest and you want to put your old flag up there, you have a base camp here.
00:28:23:20 - 00:28:43:23
Unknown
You work hard and you climb. You have another base camp, you work hard, you climb, and you continue doing that. So we need to create those rhythms in our lives. If we want to create in powerful ways, consistently and sustainably over the long run. Someone commented recently on the ten Acts rule by Grant Cardone. They said, look, the only way you can do that is with caffeine.
00:28:43:25 - 00:29:07:02
Unknown
Well, that's one way to do it. But that's trying to do this and to try to keep on going up, and you do that and you're going to go like that and you're not going to be able to get back up at will. You need to oscillate. The best way to do that again is sleep. If you're not getting an adequate amount of sleep, you're not going to give yourself the best chance you can to optimize micro sabbaticals.
00:29:07:04 - 00:29:30:18
Unknown
What's your number one self-care habit? You remember that we talked about that with Michelle Seager. You want to actualize your potential. You need to have a strong base. She asks, what's your number one non-negotiable self-care habit? The thing that if you don't do it, you're not going to have as great of a day as you could identify your number one and then do that every single day as a gift to yourself in our little micro sabbatical.
00:29:30:18 - 00:30:01:08
Unknown
That's our fourth big idea. So understanding your creative rhythms, this is huge, right? Because I think I really didn't understand, my creative rhythms too well up until probably the last 2 or 3 years. Mark. so I think what we could do is something fun. Now, I think what we could do is let's share our creative rhythms and let's, let's try and like, throw out as many suggestions that work for us.
00:30:01:08 - 00:30:33:18
Unknown
That might work for our listeners. So my number one non-negotiable is sleep. So I will literally sacrifice anything else but sleep. So if it comes to it, I will skip a run. I will move meetings if I've been up working late and I'm not going to get a sleep till midnight, I need to give myself till eight. It's just what I need.
00:30:33:20 - 00:31:07:11
Unknown
And sometimes if I am going to bed at 12 and waking up at eight, I actually know that the sleep then won't be as good a quality. So I'll probably go for 8.5 hours of sleep. this is my number one non-negotiable. What I know is that whenever I mean, like, in a busy schedule and very, very, occupied with all my work, I know as a promise to myself that sleep is priority number one.
00:31:07:17 - 00:31:25:08
Unknown
What about you must. Yeah, I sleep is enormous, I think, and I love this kind of topic of exploring how we can be, you know, creative and efficient and so on. So I think there's a lot of tips that you and I probably have more like for me. And I know we've said it before, exercise is absolutely essential.
00:31:25:08 - 00:31:49:15
Unknown
Every day you've got to get the, cobwebs out of your brain first of all. So if you've had a nice solid amount of sleep, typically I try and go to bed pretty early. I try and wake up early because I think the most, effective use of my brain is often when I'm in the morning. That's my sort of circadian rhythm, a bit of exercise to pair that get the cobwebs out or the blood moving.
00:31:49:18 - 00:32:17:06
Unknown
ideally in a way that not only kind of, challenges your body. Maybe you feel a bit exhausted afterwards. but more importantly, it's something that gets you moving and you feel connected and present, I think is one of the key moments for me and what I try and foster, whether it's going for a run or a swim or just that 30 to 60 minute walk out in nature, something that grounds you and connects you, I think is is essential for my journey.
00:32:17:08 - 00:32:43:02
Unknown
Yep. some other ones for me, because I like all of those. Journal in the morning, stretch in the morning, breathwork meditation in the morning. These are all great. I definitely need I like, if I think about rhythms, there's the three, two, one rule. Okay. Yes. You stop eating three hours before bed. you stop drinking two hours before bed.
00:32:43:05 - 00:33:10:08
Unknown
You stop screens one hour before bed. I find this one really, really, really powerful. and here's a nice novel. One is to allocate 30 minutes a week of reading spontaneously. So I literally go to my book library along the wall and, boom, pick something that is not part of my works, like so books. Playing all of my daily work.
00:33:10:12 - 00:33:35:02
Unknown
I'm talking about grab a design book, grab the data is beautiful book. the photo agency Magnum I've got is this massive coffee table book of Magnum test shots. Like pick up something spontaneous 30 minutes a week, 4:00 every Friday afternoon. That's when it's scheduled. Have you got, like, a fun, creative thing that you know you're in, like, artist pages or creative pages?
00:33:35:02 - 00:34:03:05
Unknown
Yeah. You know what I find, I do more of nowadays. and you're right. It's partly by establishing a routine, something that you come back to quite regularly. And I like the book. Similar to that is photos. Yeah. I like to look back at some of the photos that I've taken, maybe over the past week or so, but I also go further back than that, specifically around photos that I've taken out and about that have has inspired me.
00:34:03:11 - 00:34:34:24
Unknown
You know, some of our eagle eyed, Patreon member subscribers would have noticed an email that went out a couple of weeks ago referencing the beautiful Tuscan hills. Well, that wasn't just a coincidence or drive from you. And I like to get out and, get into Europe. It's actually where I was located. So what I found I was doing in Italy was taking photos of of pieces of maybe art, graffiti, a bit of history out in the culture, out in the community and so on that I now find myself looking back at because it inspires me.
00:34:34:24 - 00:35:00:11
Unknown
Yeah, that has now entered into my routine as something that I want to go back to as a, as a sort of ritual, because it does not only ground me, it puts me in not only the present, but also helps me appreciate. Okay, well, where else have I been? What have I done? Yes. And prior to them working on something, you know, rather than jumping straight in, that's that's kind of helping me, get inspired I think.
00:35:00:13 - 00:35:34:15
Unknown
Yeah. And I so I think the, the thing here is there's a, there's something going on that I think you and I both share, which is if you haven't scheduled it as a recurring event in the calendar, the chances are it's not going to become a habit. Big time, big time. And if you want to build this creative rhythm, like, at the beginning of the year, I discovered in my vacation by picking up books, sort of randomly wandering my own library, if you will.
00:35:34:17 - 00:36:01:03
Unknown
And then I was like, oh, wow. It's so there's something creatively feels really great about just picking up, one of these books randomly. you know, I've got a lot of history of design. just like a ton, right? The point I've even got, like, the artwork sketches that Ridley Scott did for Blade Runner. And sometimes I flip through that because it's just so cool to think that he drew it.
00:36:01:04 - 00:36:35:12
Unknown
He shot it. He directed it. It was amazing. but allocating time to get into that, I find that process has to be scheduled and it might sound a little over the top right. But for Fridays it's the time to do it, because what I find is, despite enjoying it so much, if I don't use the calendar to prompt me like before, I know it, I've forgotten about it, and then I've put something else in there and there's a call or a meeting or something, and then I've lost touch with that creative rhythm that, that Austin talks about in the book.
00:36:35:14 - 00:37:02:24
Unknown
Yeah, yeah, I know exactly what you mean. I'm also a huge fan of time blocking, of putting it into my diary. I utilized to do this, every single day, in order to help me prioritize. You know, I think the, the main blocker, when it comes to not only working creatively, you know, churning out original ideas as well as pieces of content, like books and so on, but also doing any type of work that I need to do.
00:37:03:01 - 00:37:31:24
Unknown
It's the distractions that get in the way. and the build on that is obviously decluttering, you know, your desk, but also turning off social media, so on and so forth, but actually having the time set aside. Yeah. And actually prioritizing prior to sitting down and working is, I think, the secret that helps me go from, you know, let's say zero miles an hour to maybe 100 miles an hour is because I've prepared prior to the event.
00:37:31:24 - 00:37:57:06
Unknown
Yeah, totally. And it's almost like where we're going here is that if you want to build a creative rhythm, you have to do the kind of highly organized schedule, the time to let your mind go free. Yeah, yeah. Because if you just know it's 4:00 Fridays, that's when it's happening. Then you sort of start to orientate yourself, but you also approach that moment like, oh, ooh, creative reading time coming up.
00:37:57:07 - 00:38:22:12
Unknown
Yay. And exactly here's the interesting thing. Then when you have that time allocated, I think you've made yourself more open to the possibilities of learning from others. finding inspiration from around the world. And what's so good is you have expertly found just the clip from Austin talking about this very subject. Looks sadly, like we're coming to the end of our show today and show you work.
00:38:22:12 - 00:38:50:22
Unknown
I've been super inspired. I've got so many notes from the clips that we've delved into from Austin. But you're right, we do have one final secret clip, which is going to help us really appreciate the value of working with others, but also absorbing the work of others. So let's hear from Austin telling us to start absorbing today. So with my first book, Newspaper Blackout came out, you know, a lot of artists think that sharing is just a matter of putting their work in front of people where they can see it, you know?
00:38:50:22 - 00:39:10:06
Unknown
But sharing really means opening up and kind of having a relationship with your audience. it means letting your audience kind of talk back to you and alongside you and learning something from them and actually think of them as like co learners or like coconspirators. So when newspaper blackout came out, I didn't want to keep the technique to myself.
00:39:10:06 - 00:39:38:15
Unknown
Like I wanted to let other people try out the technique. So instead of doing book readings, what we do is we do poetry workshops and I'd actually encourage people to make their own poems. And then this crazy thing would happen. At these workshops, a full grown adults would get up and read their poems. And I've never seen any kind of adult event where where people adult event that sounds, you know, kind of scandalous.
00:39:38:18 - 00:39:59:24
Unknown
they've never seen any adults in a room with strangers, you know, get up and read their poems. This is this is really awesome thing. And now I would start getting emails from teachers who actually use the poems in their classrooms. And I just get these awesome photos of, like, all these teenagers with, like, blackout poetry up on the wall and kind of like looking at what they've made and sharing it with each other.
00:40:00:00 - 00:40:19:02
Unknown
So I thought, man, there should really be a place where people can share. You know, I'm not just sharing my own poems, like there should be a place where people can share the stuff that they've made. So that's when I started newspaper blackout.com. And, you know, newspaper Black Outcome has taken off in a way that I just never expected.
00:40:19:02 - 00:40:45:21
Unknown
Like we've published, where I think we have like 80,000 readers or something. And, you know, it's bigger than most literary journals. And, we've published power. I say we it's me right away. That weird thing. Well, yeah, we like where some organization, it's me in my underwear at home hosting us. But, you know, we posted people from all over the world and we've got just, you know, hundreds and thousands of poems right now.
00:40:45:21 - 00:41:04:19
Unknown
And what's really interesting about this is I thought it was some, like, philanthropic measure on my part. Oh, let me give a voice to the masses, give them a place where they can share their own stuff. But what's amazing is, like I learn just as much from these poems that people send me as I think they do from from the ones I post.
00:41:04:19 - 00:41:20:05
Unknown
I mean, I find all kinds of awesome stuff to steal, you know, from these people who sent me these really cool poems.
00:41:20:07 - 00:41:44:06
Unknown
So I'm like, you're on me, mate. by the way, our viewers will love this. Mark. how cool was some of this artwork that was really neat, right? Yeah. Beautiful, right? It was stunning. pieces of work as well. Just when you just imagined all these black and white wiping out, you know, blacking out the words. But there was these beautiful illustrations, different colors.
00:41:44:08 - 00:42:05:04
Unknown
once again, this is what happens when you open yourself up, create the rhythms, share the work, collaborate and iterate. And good things really happen today. Yeah. Look. And I find his work with the newspaper blackouts is a great visual demonstration, particularly of the format that he did it, putting it out there just as a bit of a tester.
00:42:05:06 - 00:42:25:09
Unknown
I think the newspaper blackout project from Austin is a is the culmination of show you work. You know, he put it out there. It was just a test and gradually became a book. But I think the key thing for for you and I, our members, our listeners and viewers, is that process just started with that little bit of courage?
00:42:25:11 - 00:42:44:22
Unknown
Yeah. Trying something new. Let's put it out there, put it online. And now he's referencing the success of it, but also more importantly, the I think the knock on effect that it's probably had for him. Yes. Which is understanding the value of collaborating with others as well as inviting feedback from the general public, which I think is wonderful.
00:42:44:22 - 00:43:15:21
Unknown
It's also great to see, you know, an author or an expert eating their own dog food. Right. I you know what I mean? Like, they actually do the thing and they share with you the results of the thing they're telling you to do. Yeah. That's it. The proof. That's how the sausage is made. And also seeing what it looks like in the end, I think is a great, demonstration and call out for, for us as we come to the end of show you work, which is if you do put it out there, the stuff you might get back is going to be so valuable for, for next time.
00:43:15:21 - 00:43:41:10
Unknown
Yeah. As well as this current project. Well there you go, Mark. I mean, we've covered a lot about sharing your work with the world we've dug deep into, into this body of work from Austin Kleon. And by the way, we still have one more book to go, which is fantastic. But for this bookmark of those four ideas, which one is your personal homework assignment?
00:43:41:12 - 00:44:11:23
Unknown
Well, I think it would be, pretty, pretty expected to call out and say starting today. Yeah. Is the way to do it. Just get going. But I actually like the idea that Brian calls out from Austin's book around the micro sabbaticals built into your routine, not only the courage to put your work out there, but also the processes within your creative journey to create something that you want to put out there, something that you want to experience and and get feedback on.
00:44:12:00 - 00:44:49:04
Unknown
Yeah. What about you, Mike? What's standing out for you? You know, so because we're sharing so much work ourselves on this show and I do in addition to this show like start sharing early, I feel I got that one, under control. I could do more to absorb from others. Like I, I would say probably fall in the basket of being so busy with the enormous Mike Parsons publishing empire that I probably don't take enough time, to absorb from others.
00:44:49:04 - 00:45:09:09
Unknown
So that's going to be my little. That's a good call out. I think you're totally right there. Yeah. And there's so many great ways to do that today. Oh, geez. Too much, too much good stuff. Too much goes well, Mark, I want to say thank you to you, joining me here on show 258. And you know who else is joining us?
00:45:09:09 - 00:45:34:20
Unknown
A big thank you to them, our members, viewers and listeners too, because we were figuring it out how to show you work. the book by Austin Kleon, the second part of our series. And we had four big ideas. Start sharing early. You don't have to be a genius. You just have to be you. And as you do that, build a rhythm, work hard, and find the ups and the sabbaticals so you can recharge the batteries so that great things can come to you.
00:45:34:20 - 00:45:45:21
Unknown
You can start absorbing today so you can be better tomorrow. And boy, is that something we're all about here on the Moonshots podcast. That's a wrap.