The Resistbot Podcast

States’ inconsistent arguments against a women’s reproductive rights and protecting lives are dissected.

Show Notes

✊🤖 Welcome to Episode 16 where we deep dive into the age-old, ongoing conversation of reproductive justice and abortion. Listen along as we deconstruct one of the most popular theology-based talking points with this week’s guest Kia Smith, an unapologetic speaker, content creator, award-winning digital director, and V.P. of Communications for a national advocacy organization.

Related Petitions
This Week's Panel
Watch Live Sundays at 1 pm
Episode edited by Angel Barrera. If you need a show edited, you can find her on Twitter here!
★ Support this podcast ★

Creators & Guests

Melanie Dione
Angel Barrera

What is The Resistbot Podcast?

Season 2 of The Resistbot Podcast, hosted by Melanie Dione, features a different interview every week with an organizer working to create change in their community. We aim to elevate voices without a large platform, focusing on their stories. Our pod is brought to you by the same volunteers behind the Resistbot ( chatbot that's driven over 30 million pieces of correspondence to elected officials since 2017. If you haven't given it a try, pull out your phone and text the word "resist" to the number 50409 to get started. You can text officials from your Mayor to the President, check your voter registration, start your own campaigns, and much more!

Intro: Coming together from
across the United States.

The real issues you don't
hear about elsewhere.

Focusing on what matters
to you and your neighbors

Welcome to Resist bot Live

Melanie: Hey y'all it is
Sunday, February 6th, 2022.

I'm your moderator, Melanie
Dione and this is resist bot live.

Thank you for joining us.

We had a little break last week after
our amazing conversation uh, with

Rashida and Kristina about redistricting.

We hope that you were able
to catch the rebroadcast.

Today we have another special
guest and our panelists Athena

and Christine will be with us.

We're here this Sunday as we are
every Sunday at 1:00 PM Eastern

and you can catch us on Facebook,
Twitter, Twitch, and YouTube.

If you're listening from a podcast,
please be sure to let us know

you can hashtag live botters
and join conversation with us.

Today, we are going to be talking about
reproductive justice and abortion.

A lot of times when we had this
conversation, we have had this

conversation before where we talked
about planned parenthood and it

was very important that we actually
talk about abortion itself without

couching it in anything else,
because abortion is healthcare.

We're right now looking at Still
50 years later fights over what

Roe versus Wade, which was about
three years before I was born.

And I am old enough though,
I am not quite a grandmother.

I can be a grandmother
and this is something.

So we're looking at 50 years of a
basic argument for the rights of women.

So what I'm going to do
is bring up the crew.

We have Athena and Christine
joining us this morning.

And we also have our guests Kia Smith.

Hello kia!

Kia: Hi, thank you for having
me excited to be with you all.

Melanie: Excited to have you one of our
biggest things, we love to have people who

are actually doing the work we can talk
and suppose and see how it impacts us, but

we like to know how the sausage is made.

So I'm going to catch
up with Athena first.

Hello, Athena

Athena: How's it going
Mel good to see you.

Melanie: Going great.

Good to see you too, always.

Thank you again, as always
for being on the comments.

Athena: Yeah.

Happy to be here.

Everybody chime in, in the chat with
any thoughts, questions, concerns.

I'll relay it to the larger panel,
but yeah, just stay engaged and

we hope it's going to be I know.

I know it's going to be a pretty fruitful
conversation, just hearing what Kia

has to say and the rest of our team.

About how important this issue
is and what we can do about it.

Melanie: Because the thing is we keep
having this conversation and it seems

like we're still having the ABCs of
it because we're just caught in this

holding pattern over and over again.

So I'm excited about the conversation too.



Christine: Hi, everyone.

Gosh, this topic I'm really looking
forward to your insights Kia.

it Brings me back to my
college years, right?

A young student in Boston.

3000 Miles away from Los Angeles and
planned parenthood really played an

ongoing role in just my four years
there in terms of reproductive health,

in terms of birth control pills, right.

I'd go down the street every uh,
you know, month when I needed that.

And I do remember memories of.

Young women for whatever reason
they were there just like me.

also feeling that was an, especially
in a college town like Boston,

where many of us are far from home.

There was that safe
space, even 25 years ago.

And so for me as a mom now over the years
you don't have to tell me twice where

to show up to support something that has
been Part of why I am here today, the

ability to be able to choose the ability
to have this support network, knowing

that there are women out there and men who
are um, you know, being a stand for us.

even when we're young and we don't
know what we're doing half the time.


And so that just, it just takes
me back to those years and I'm

just really glad to be here.

Thank you.

Melanie: And isn't that like
part of what we're doing?

Making sure that the people behind
us are able to have those same

rights, because I mean, I'm, I'm 45.

I have way more childbearing years
behind me than I do ahead of me.

So these laws are not necessarily going to
have a big impact on me and how I navigate

life, but they will, for my daughter, they
will for, any grandchildren I may have.

And that's the part of it that's
important for me, which is why

I appreciate people like Kia.

Hi Kia.

So let's get into it.

Can you talk to us first about what
you do and what your role is in

this fight for reproductive justice?

Kia: Sure.

My name is Kia Smith.

By day I'm a digital director and acting
VP of comms and digital for a national

advocacy organization, where we do a lot
of organizing around progressive issues.

And by night I'm a procrastinating
writer in content creation who

sits at the intersection of
theology culture and justice.

So I like to find conversations like
the reproductive justice, and talk

about the theology behind it and
why it's important for us to respect

the dignity of people who are having
abortions and their own ability to

decide their healthcare for them.

And then to connect that with
culture and how it shows up in our

day-to-day life and talk about it
also from a justice standpoint.

so I do a lot of writing, speaking and
creating events that help shape the

narrative and shift the culture uh, to
make sure that all marginalized people

have access to the care and support
they need not just to survive, but to

thrive in our communities and society.

Melanie: That's one of the things, one
of the things that struck me about you,

it was when there are people who do
reproductive justice work, who are in the

theology community, that is often where
we as women face the biggest pushback.

So what moved you to to join the to,
to see this need and join the two

and make that part of, your work?

Kia: Because religion and theology has
been used to restrict what women do

with their body and to dominate women
from a sexist and patriarchal lens.

But in reality, that's not who I
know God to be, and that's not how

God has ever showed up in my life.

I know God to be a God of love and
liberation, and that does not come

with controlling that does not come
with controlling women's bodies.

It does not come with making
paternalistic decisions over other people.

It does not come with building
a culture and society that

truly does not support life.

through its structures and systems
like our ability to survive and

thrive, but wants to force us to
give birth into this world without

addressing the other structures
that we need to live and live well.

Melanie: I appreciate that because when
we look at the pushback against abortion,

a lot of that, we're not usually dealing
with the people who are gonna feel the

brunt of it aren't necessarily people with
money or people with access we're often

dealing with Economically disadvantaged
or otherwise marginalized people.

you're in Georgia, which,
Hey, just flipped blue.


you were you, weren't one of
the people who did a lot of

work to make that possible.

So thank you.

because we're able to have
conversations like this because

there are four for the purpose of
advocating for the people who need it.

I think with many of us, especially
when we're either women or black or

other POC, we can look at things from
a part of some level, but we still

have to look at how this is affecting.


So it's not necessary.

goes beyond just Hey, Hey, it's blue,
but this is who is giving us the service,

who is reaching the people who are
giving people the services that we need.

So what stumbling blocks did you
come against or do you come against

in your work, in a state like that?

That is still kind of, You know, We
can say blue, it's still probably

mostly purple, maybe a lightish.


So what is, what does that work look
like in an environment like that for you?

Kia: I think there are two big
stumbling blocks that I would need.

And one.

The way that our Republican
legislators have codified power.

So that even when legislation is popular
with people, voting rights, legislation

is popular with majority of the public
reproductive justice abortion care

is popular with the majority of the
people, but we have so gerrymandered

in codafide partisan power that.

Republican legislators in states
like Georgia have the ability to

pass unpopular laws without it
having any consequences to them.

And it is such, it's such a complex.

System to be absolutely honest that a
lot of the public doesn't understand

it, but you have the money that's at
play, the big dollars that they're

able to fund into drive their agendas.

You have the gerrymandering of districts
so that you are protecting legislators

you create districts that protect
the power of those who are in power.

So despite Georgia becoming more
diverse and bringing in younger and

more educated voters, Those numbers
. We may be able to elect like federal

level statewide democratic senators.

We may be able to elect Stacey Abrams
in 2020, but those legislative seats

will still be so gerrymandered that it
guarantees Republican control, who are

the ones who are passing our state laws.

That gets even more complicated when we
start talking about how they are Changing

electorial board laws so that they also
get to decide like how votes are certified

in the state that may take power away
from the people who are actually voting.

Melanie: When we look at that
that's one of the big things.

I think last week we talked about it.

When we were talking about redistricting
the people who support Roe in this

country, I think it's something like
60%, if I'm not mistaken polled.

And the comment was made that
abortion is not a political issue.

It's not a conservative liberal issue.

It's a gerrymandered issue.

Kia: It made me think about real
world Los Angeles homecoming.

So in season two of real world, Tammy
Rowan, who we know from like basketball

wives and now one of the original, like
reality TV stars, she had an abortion

on television and as it was broadcast
in 1993, it seemed like very isolating.

You saw this young black girl who
was going through an abortion.

She went through all the
emotions that always come up.

But as she comes back almost 20 years
later to talk about it, what you

realize is every woman in that house
had also had an abortion before Tammy.

So it's something that we all encounter.

We all have these abortion stories
or were connected to people who have

abortion stories across the political
spectrum across like lived experience.

It's something that affects us all.

So to treat it as.

Something that a majority of people
don't understand or connect to, or

haven't had personal experiences with.

it's a way to increase that isolation
and shame instead of opening up

the conversation and having a real
conversation about health here, because

that's what the decision is about.

Melanie: When we look at the big boy
I'll call it SBA, the so-called heart

part, beat bill in Texas, when it
addresses the heartbeat of, the fetus.

There's nothing that addresses how
black infants are twice as likely to

not see their first birthday in Texas.

It doesn't address how the
mortality rate for black women.

I think it's 17.9 for white women
per 100,000 births in Texas.

It's 44.

So it's more than twice for black women.

So when you start looking at these
restrictions and the lack of care that

comes around, it it comes back to it
being an attack against disadvantaged

people and how that can be segmented.

I mean, I'm a 45 year old
woman with health insurance.

Even with these restrictions.

If I needed an abortion, I more or
less have the resources to figure out

how to get where I need to get one,
someone else, a 25 year old who's,

just out of college may not have that,
so we're looking at an attack against

just another way to penalize people
for being poor and disadvantaged.

Kia: Absolutely.

And even when you look at what it takes
to care for a kid, so let's say for some

reason, people have these kids, we don't
provide paid leave we have no federal

paid leave policies for parents who
give birth, we don't provide childcare.

Our childcare costs are unaffordable.

So what you're doing is you are creating a
system and structure where you're forcing

people to give birth to kids and you're
not providing them with the structures

or supports to care for those kids well.

Not From infancy throughout college,
If we are truly going to be about

life and ensuring that we are able
to thrive, we have to build systems

to support that and not try to
control women's reproductive choices.

That is a backwards way
of thinking about it.

And it tells me that you really
don't care about life or babies.

You care about the control
of women and their bodies

Melanie: I think all of us were mostly
in, in the same age group, more or less.

I think we're all a very close in age.

So I like to ask everyone from your
personal experience in just having been

a woman all your life, do you feel
that the conversation has deteriorated?

Because for me, I like, I remember when
Tammy that episode and, how it felt

like things were progressing forward.

It does not seem that way to me.


It seems like it's still, we're kind
of just in this holding pattern, , I

feel like we've been having the
same conversation for 50 years.

Christine: I feel like we have to.

So, you know, what's frustrating.

I think for me, I feel like every
time uh, we collectively who are

aligned take steps forward, there is.

Energy that comes to add us.

That pushes us two steps back.

This is what it's felt like
for the last five, six years.

I think many of us are exhausted,
but still it also activates this

fighting spirit in us where it's
like, no, you're not going to do

that because I know what is possible.

And I'm just going to keep moving forward.

And I think at a time where many
of us are exhausted and many of us

feel that pressure of, you know,
being pushed two steps back what I'm

here to show up and be like, what
is everyone else doing about this?

You see what I'm seeing?

So, that's where I'm at with
this in a year of elections.


Melanie: And it doesn't seem coincidental
when we look at more women than ever

being involved in politics, more women
completing college, more women not

having lives necessarily derailed by
unplanned pregnancies because we've all

experienced that, especially, you know,
I remember being in my early, my mid

teens knowing girls who were, were , on
a certain path and it got derailed.

When we look at what access to
abortion can make possible for us

in terms of achievement for women
or anyone who can get pregnant.

It does not seem like a
coincidence that government,

mainly men are like, okay, Nope.

We're going to shut that down.

Like today, it's just not a, it doesn't
strike me as a coincidence at all.

Athena: I find in to what
Christina was saying.

We have been completely outplayed
on this issue and topic.

I felt we, the Progressive's liberals
lefts have in many ways, sat back

on our laurels that this is a right.

This is something that we have and we
have been completely outplayed . By the

continued polarization of the topic.

I love Kia what you had to
say, this idea of culture,

theology, justice intersection.

If the Democrats would take half
as much energy as a Republican

has, when it comes to calling out.

The fact that this is a healthcare
issue, it's a larger issue to what you

were talking about now, this idea of so
when the baby is born, what safeguards

are in place to ensure that they have
an education, that they have health

care, that the mother is supported, that
there are social constructs that would

facilitate their success in society.

that conversation is a very important
conversation that needs to be had.

And yet the spin on this has been
about heartbeats has been about.

Genocide of the unborn and it's like
there's nothing on the other side as

much as I, sorry, not to discredit the
amazing work that has been done, by

fantastic activists and people doing
that, but it is completely drowned out

and has been polarized to affect that.

This, I feel in many cases, a an
Achilles heel in the democratic party.

Once we achieved something, once
we obtained something, the foot

is let off the gas pedal and the
overwhelming swing of that pendulum,

the other way, completely derailed.

I feel some of the progress that's
been made in the last 50 years, because

yes, 50 years after Roe V Wade, you
would think this country would have

universal health care or some sort of.

Some sort of metric in place that the
rate of women dying after childbirth

is the worst in the developing world.

The developed world, I should say.

So how we have gotten here, is easily
another episode in and of itself, but so

what you were saying Kia, this idea that
where we are now, we're looking at we're

in the pandemic world, we're looking at
how society is versus how we envision it.

And how as Americans, we aspire it to be.

And again, this issue of
reproductive rights and women's

health care and body sovereignty.

And all of these issues
are coming to a forefront.

The the point that you made about lives
being changed and how the 35, 40, 60

hour work week was not designed for two
people to be working that was designed.

The structure is designed to support
one person staying at home and

taking care of the home, taking
care of the family, et cetera.

And so even that is, we
are living in a time that's

challenging some of these norms.

And again, in the point where you
would think we could make some headway

on this particular one issue for
50 years ago, it's getting lost in

that shuffle and it's frustrating.

Melanie: And I think that's the point.

If we're constantly relitigating a and b.

We can't address C so we can't address
as there, there have been a million

conversations about inadequacies
that black and brown women face in

healthcare, just across the board.

I'm talking about just
going to the regular doctor.

I am loathed to believe that is not
taking place in abortion clinics, but

we can't address that because we're
just trying to keep the building open.

It keeps you off your guard when you're
constantly having to deal with the basics.

And it's very clearly by design.

I mean, We saw all those movies in
the eighties where, you know, there's

the little guy who takes on the big
guy and their attorneys just throw

paperwork at them and throw paperwork
at them and they're overwhelmed and

that's literally what's happening to us.

. No one calls out the disconnect.

I believe it was.

I can't remember if it
was Cassidy or Kennedy.

I just remember the vowel, the
consonant sound, and it was a jerk.

I can't stand, but he said that he
believes that people should be responsible

for taking care of their own children,
but he's also adamantly against abortion.

Those two continents don't
meet that doesn't work at all.

We have to figure it out.

What we want, we see these restrictions,
but we don't see corresponding bills that

are providing programs for these kids.

If they're born in low income families,
we see these restrictions, but we

don't see anything that provides
postpartum mental care for parents who

were not ready or who had reservations
about carrying the pregnancy to term.

So there's a disconnect . What you
said earlier, Athena, it's not taking

anything away from the organizers.

It isn't, but it is a drain on the
organizers who have done all this work.

And then the people we elected
don't do squat with it.

It doesn't mean anything.

If we're, if we're doing all this work.

They're shaking hands with the folks
that are standing in the way of our

rights what ends up happening, it's not
that abortions won't happen anymore.

They just won't be safe.

So you're going to deal
with a larger health crisis.

And this is something that we say over
and over, and we have to keep saying it,

but more times than not . It's almost
like shouting into the void because

this is none of this is new information.

None of it.

And it's a 50 year conversation.

Athena: And some of that hypocrisy is
absolutely playing out right now with

this pandemic, kids shouldn't wear
masks in schools, not schools right.


You know, How many of these senators
and representatives children's are

in school with masks and they're
not challenging their own lives.

The representative, whoever that
might've been Cassidy or Kennedy that

had said that statement, chances are
that they've had childcare in their life.

Somebody has come to their house and
taking care of their child at some point.

And yet here they are denying that right.

or access really to others is
where the rubber hits the road on

a lot of issues like this to deny.

And back to Kia's point, if you're
looking at this from the lens of

Christianity, You want to do unto
others as you would have them do unto

you, why would you deny others the
right to things that you readily have?

And that is at the heart of what
we're trying to fight for here.

Kia: it's really them leaning into their
power and their privilege and their

economic wellbeing to make choices that
they are denying other people, because

you can get rid of abortion in Texas.

You can pass this awful law
that bans it at six weeks.

the most restrictive abortion ban
in the United States, but you still

have access and the ability to
fly out people to have abortions.

In other places You still have the
access to bring in childcare, to put

your children in private schools, to
make sure that they are receiving care.

And you're doing this while denying
black, brown, marginalized, poor

folks, the ability to make choices
about their bodies and also to have

communities and structures to raise
their kids and raise their kids well.

Melanie: The access, when we started
talking about that, it's the cruelty

is the point to keep people in their
place for, for lack of a better term.

And this will always, uh, whether it's
money or healthcare, there will always be.

That pushback from people who
don't want change, benefit from

things being the way they are, and
they're going to do what they do.

We're going to do what we do.

So that means we have petitions.

There are three there's one that is
specific to the state of Minnesota

protect access to safe abortion.

The call sign for that is P as in Paul,
F as in Frank, V as in Victor, L as in

lion, T as in Thomas, V as in Victor,
we have another take federal action

to prevent statewide abortion bans.

That call sign is P as in Paul, a
as in apple, G as in girl, V as in

Victor, Q as in Quincy, Y as in yoyo
one of my, I hate to say favorites

considering the topic, but we have
one of our users who does a letter

a day who does an open letter a day.

And this is day 64 of the letter
a day to end forced birth.

And that call sign is P as in Paul, D
as in David X as an Xavier or a as in

apple, V as in Victor, a L as in lion you
can text 5 0 4 0 9 and have any of these

letters said, one of them, as I said, the
first one is specific to Minnesota, but

we've got Jonathan doing a letter a day.

So that is something we continue to
get signer's sign us for those, which

is just every time I see a new one.

I perk up a little bit, because
this is the kind of, this is

the kind of work that we need.

This is the type of work.

It takes that tireless.


I'm going to talk until you hear
me which I greatly appreciate.

And one of the reasons why we're
all here So we're talking about what

happens Kia what can we do when it's
someone like me, someone like Athena,

someone like Christine, what is it
that we can do from where we are now?

Kia: That is a great question.

what I would suggest that all people
do is still look at the organizers

who are on the ground, who are working
with these communities who are going

to be most harmed by these abortion
bans there are abortion funds that

are prioritizing poor black brown
folks who need access to abortion and

are making sure they're getting them.

There are also organizations who
are working on the legislative side

of these things who are challenging
these in courts to make sure that we

continue to have access to abortion in
wherever we are in the United States.

I think the other thing is we need to
codify Roe through federal legislation.

We do that when we are able
to get rid of the filibuster.

So we really need to push the Senate, the
Democratic majority in the Senate to do

what is necessary to end the filibuster
the filibuster has most recently stood

in the way of voting rights legislation.

And it is the big hindrance
that is stopping us from getting

the material change that we
need in our lives to live well.

Melanie: One of the things that we
like to, talk about in, in terms of

filibuster, before it was the um, I
think it was build back better when,

you know, everybody was crossing their
fingers, hoping that Sinema and Manchin

did the right thing and whatever,
but it's, not just that one thing.

It's, It's a matter of abolishing
the filibuster and getting the

legislation that we need passed.

Granted to us, that means it can be taken.

And so it's beyond time for
this back and forth arguments.

And it does, 100% needs to be codified,
in the face of what we're looking

at with the potential challenges
to Roe, how has your work shifted

in what your focus looks like?


Things, take a turn for the worst.

where does, what does that work looking
like preparing for what comes next?

Kia: What does it look like?

I guess you're saying like, if Roe is
overturned, what does that look like?

If it looks like getting the
money to the people who need it

the most to be absolutely honest.

for me personally, I have the financial
resources to like support people who are.

most in community with
these organizations.

One of those organizations that I
support is here in Atlanta, SisterSong

who work with black and brown people
who need abortion care and in the

reproductive justice movement overall.

So to make sure that I am what I'm doing
is like I'm sitting in those webinars and

I'm learning from them So I can take this
information back into my communities.

I'm also providing them with the
financial resources that they need

so that they can make sure that the
individuals they're working with

can get the care that they need.

also faith group, there
is a group in Ohio.

I need to find the name, but
they're working with faith leaders.

I think it's important to remember.

Jewish, progressive Judaism comes
to mind, but not all religion.

It is not controversial in all
religions to have abortions.

Oh, lots of progressive Jewish people see
that as healthcare and they acknowledge

a woman's right and ability to do that.

That shows up in lots of
our religious traditions.

The problem is the religious right
has been so loud and dominating

this conversation that these
other voices aren't coming up.

and that's the culture
change part of that, right?

we're in a culture war that we don't know
as a culture war, I feel like oftentimes,

so to tell the stories of these peoples,
to tell the stories of these different

traditions to let people know that
there's not one way that this should be

done, but women, people who need access
to abortions should be given the dignity

and the ability to choose what they, what
is going to happen with their bodies.

Melanie: I greatly appreciate that.

there are organizations all over.

There's a great organization here in
new Orleans uh, Women With a Vision.

that supports particularly disadvantaged
women, black women in new Orleans, like

we're a predominantly black city, I think
was something like 60 something percent.

And so that is one of the amazing
organizations that, that kind of

focuses, but they're everywhere.

They are literally everywhere
and we have to be willing to.

Reach out and look and assist them.

Athena, Christine, are there any
organizations that you're familiar with

what have been your steps with your eyes
on Roe what have you taken away from

this and how you're going to proceed?

Should things take a turn for the worse

Christine: So for me, it's
the levers of politics, right?

We kind of play in the spaces that we're
familiar with while supporting and Kia.

I love that you've come on because that
whole intersection of theology and,

this issue has really opened another,
area that I want to learn more about.

But my world, I'm just looking at who
are the candidates And I also realize

there aren't a lot of people like us
to actually go and do that research.


What they stand for, because you have
politicians in these purple zones or

states that, will say one thing, but they,
hush hush are gonna vote another way.

we're seeing that now.

And so.

I would love to see in this year more
data, more information on where these

candidates stand and actually ask them
these questions that are framed in a

way where you can't be like, Sitting
on the fence on something like this.

So that that's kind of
what comes up for me.


And who are the politicians?

What do they stand for?

Who's going to hold them accountable
throughout the course of their

campaign on being consistent.

and putting it out
there, like, okay, great.

Is that you support a
woman's right to choose.

Hey everyone.


This candidate right here is
saying that pay attention to what

they say in other fundraising
situations, private circles maybe?

We seen that.

All right.

That's that's what comes to mind.

Athena: I agree.

Especially that last comment.

That's a great segue
into what I have to say.

This this idea that it has
to be private conversations.

in many ways, We all know that
people who want to have a better

understanding of this, everybody
believes themselves to be good people.

So it's a matter of appealing to that
compassionate side and understanding,

some of the hypocrisy behind we're
asking when we're demanding, some of

these laws be put in place The choice
extends, not just from the womb, but

to, issues of education of healthcare.

What I talked about earlier, gun
violence, the death penalty, how has

the death penalty still in the books
in this country from there jumps

onto prison, industrial complex.

So this this consistent ethic of
life, is how I tend to approach my

work and advocacy in all of this.

And, I.

am, Successful in some cases, but if not,
then at least I am moving the needle.

I feel in some of the other issues to
get people, to see that larger picture of

what they're trying to talk to, because
at the heart of what they're talking

about, if you're looking for justice,
if you're looking for equity, if you're

looking for liberation, then that's not
the you're not pro-life you're pro birth,

or like you're, you're pro in utero life.

You're not pro life.

If you're not supporting.

providing the necessary means for a robust
fruitful, successful life after that.

So, Conversations like that
are going to need to happen.

I think obviously the filibuster needs to
go, but I think if you're talking about

all eyes on particular topics, I think
voting rights filibuster needs to go.

But again, in the case of topics
that tend to be as heated as this,

for some folks, I find personal
conversations need to advance.

So if folks can continue to find the
family members or the friends that

either don't want to talk about this,
or don't seem to have an opinion,

we're sort of beyond that this is it.

Melanie: I totally agree in
something that you said not about

being pro-life it's pro birth.

And I don't even know if they're pro
birth because I don't think they give

a damn if these women actually go to
term, they just want to make sure that.

Don't have an abortion, nothing about
prenatal care not adequate prenatal

care nothing about postpartum care.

And unless these babies are born
and taking care of themselves, the

health of the mother still matters.

it's very clearly A, Disconnect.

And then when you look at how
these people, like you mentioned

gun laws and things like that
there's no actual concern for life.

It's just a matter of control.

One of the things you said earlier with
regards to faith Kia, that I appreciated

and wanted to go back to slamming a book.

God don't like, that is a
really easy way to slam a book.

It's like a cop out.

Kia: It's lazy.

Melanie: It's so lazy because
God don't like abortion.

That's not enough.

you get to ignore postpartum issues.

You get to ignore maternal death.

You get to ignore infant death.

You get to ignore kids living in poverty.

There are just these gaping
holes and you just use this.

Blanket argument, fold your
hands and turn your head.

And it's just, it's not enough.

It is absolutely not enough.

There has to be an
interrogation, of faith.

When it comes down to, that's
not just somebody with someone

tells you I'm absolutely.

I grew up in a very religious household
and I still consider myself someone

with an, a good relationship with God.

If I had to interrogate what that meant
to me, what abortion is, healthcare

meant to me as someone who is.

A Christian who actually, you know,
does that think Christ said, and kind

of like thinks about other people.

So there's, there's got to be more
than just parroting a scripture.

Someone told you, they read that one time.

It's gotta be more than that.

This is not enough.

Kia: and what's happening is we're
stripping people of their dignity.

We're attempting to strip people of
their dignity and using God doesn't like

that as an excuse, but what God does,
like it's for us to be able to live and

thrive and to live lives with dignity
that requires us to be valued, respected,

and treated ethically that requires us
to have autonomy over our bodies and

our decisions and how our life will be.

And we can't keep having discussions about
life without ensuring life has dignity.

We have to prioritize dignity in
these conversations so that people

can be taken care of and not just here
to exist for the sake of existing.

Melanie: Absolutely.

I appreciate all of you.

Thank you so much Kia.

Thank you.

Before we go, can you tell the
folks where they can find you.

Kia: Yes.

So you can find me on all social
media outlets at Kia speaks.

I also have a website Kia speaks and you can go there and

you can find some of my writings
and connect with me and find out

more about the work that I'm doing.

Melanie: Thank you.

If you're not following Kia, I
don't know what you're doing with

your life, but you should she's
probably, I guess we've been fine.

I've been following you.

Maybe it's been 10 years.

Kia: Yeah.

Melanie: One of the best, one of the
best, so highly recommend Christine,

any parting thoughts before we go.

Christine: Uh, no, you just
open up a whole other episode.

I feel down the road, this
whole intersection of education.

Uh, as somebody who grew up 12
years in Catholic school, as you

were talking, I was like, first
they're going to do the CRT thing.

And what next in terms of education,
when it comes to our children

and health and our views on these
issues of living with dignity.

So thanks Mel.

Melanie: Oh, don't worry.

The education episode is coming.

They're burning books.

We got to do it like we it's 20
22 when they're burning books.

So that episode is definitely coming.

Thank you so much, Christine and Athena.

Athena: Lots to process and
think about on this episode?

So thanks everybody for that.

Yeah, I think we're going to continue
to need to see that, at the core

of what the common threads that a
lot of these issues have is this

continued oppression of the other.

So this idea that critical race theory
is somehow challenging or making

people people feel uncomfortable.

Only people who are unaware of it
or support it still in some weird

way should feel, uh, comfortable
about these kinds of conversations.

So shedding light on that.

just recently again, Amir lock, we
still have the police killing people.

we had a lot of, I think,
zeitgeists going on.

I think a lot of people were had eyes on
this concept of police brutality and the

lack of accountability in law enforcement.

And I feel, names have been red and.

We still, haven't seen a lot
go down in terms of actually

addressing that across the country.

So again, whether it's policing women's
bodies, whether it's policing our own

homes, we need to continue to shine
the light on issues and circumstances

that in the larger scheme of thing
affects all of us as Americans trying

to make a better society for ourselves.

Melanie: Especially if we're going
to talk about valuing life, right?

this has been Resistbot live.

I want to thank everyone for joining us.

If you want to know how you can
volunteer or donate, you can go to

resist dot bot we're rolling out a lot
of new features for our monthly donors.

So I'm hoping that you joined just
resist dot bot even five bucks, five

bucks a month gets you a host of things.

I would actually run out of time.

Going through the list of things that,
that you receive as a monthly contributor,

but this is something where we're doing
at work, we are making sure that we

connect With legislators with senators.

When you write these letters,
when you write to a letter, you

are going to receive something
back, it is received by a person.

You are going to get a response.

They have to respond to you.

So I don't want anyone to feel like
we're telling you to shoot this

letter, and then send it into the void.

This is going to a person who is basically
your employee . So, I don't want any of us

to forget that these people work for us.

So make them earn their check.

so if you want to know where
you can go to resist, dot bot.

There's also a weekly blog.

Uh, Susan who's usually with us.

there's a blog on resist bot.

We have one every week that corresponds
with our podcasts, our weekly podcasts.

So I highly recommend that
you check out Susan's writing.

She's amazing.

And she always, really does
a deep dive into the topics.

It give you a greater understanding.

You can subscribe to the podcast
by going to Resist bot dot live and

wherever you find all your other
podcasts, that's where you can find us.

So you don't have to be chained
to one particular podcast network.

If there's, I don't know.

What to avoid for reasons.

So you can go to resist and find us.

Thank you.

Athena gave us a great segue onto what
we're going to be talking about next week.

We are going to get into what
defunding the police actually

means and why it's a good thing.

So I hope that you join us next Sunday
at 1:00 PM, and I'll see you then.

Thank you.

Outro: Resist bot live originally airs
as a live stream every Sunday at 1:00 PM.

Eastern on Twitch, YouTube, Twitter,
and Facebook, and is brought to you

by the same folks behind the chat bot.

If you haven't used resist
bot before, it's simple.

iPhone users go to resist dot
bot on the web and tap the

imessage button non iPhone users.

Open your text messaging app
and propose a new text message

for the phone number type 50409.

In the message field type resist,
or any of the keywords you heard

on the show, you can also direct
message resist bot on Twitter or

the telegram app for a printable
keyword guide and more resources.

Visit our website at

Our website has a complete
guide to creating robust public

policy or voter turnout camp.

And we're here to support your
activism, email

If you need help, getting started
resist bot is a nonprofit social

welfare organization built by volunteers
and supported by your donations.

You can donate on our website or
email volunteer at resistance, but if

you want to join our team resist bot
live is moderated by Melanie Dione.

Our regular panel includes Athena Fulay,
christine Lu, Susan Stutz, and Dr.

Joseph Coohill.

Thank you for listening.