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Host Daniel Scharff sits down with R&D Radio host and food scientist Adam Yee for a special mini episode previewing Startup CPG's first-ever Founders & Formulators event—happening July 12th in Chicago at the Palmer House Hilton, the day before the Institute of Food Technologists (IFT) annual convention.
With a room full of formulators already heading to Chicago for IFT, Startup CPG is seizing the moment to bring them together with emerging brands for a speed-dating style matchmaking event. Whether you're still developing your product, struggling with a specific quality issue, or just want expert eyes on what you've built—this event is for you.
Adam brings his perspective from both sides of the table—as a food scientist, independent formulator, and former brand founder—to break down how to make the most of five minutes with a formulator, what questions to ask, and how to find the right partner before you even walk in the room.
Listen in as they discuss:
- Why Founders & Formulators exists—and why there's nothing else like it in the industry
- How formulators think about evaluating a product: vibes, questions, and tasting
- What brands should bring to the event and how to get the most out of every conversation
- How to use the Startup CPG Product Developer Directory to research and vet formulators ahead of time
- The difference between hourly vs. project-based engagements—and why deliverables matter more than anything
- Why personality and passion are just as important as technical skill when choosing a formulator
- What makes a great formulator-founder relationship—and how to avoid the most common pitfall
🔬 Startup CPG Product Developer Directory: https://startupcpg.com/product-developer-directory
Don't forget to leave a five-star review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify if you enjoyed this episode. For potential sponsorship opportunities or to join the Startup CPG community, visit http://www.startupcpg.com.
Show Links:
- Transcripts of each episode are available on the Transistor platform that hosts our podcast here (click on the episode and toggle to “Transcript” at the top)
- Join the Startup CPG Slack community (35K+ members and growing!)
- Follow @startupcpg
- Visit host Daniel's Linkedin
- Visit host Adam's Linkedin
- Questions or comments about the episode? Email Daniel at podcast@startupcpg.com
- Episode music by Super Fantastics
Creators and Guests
What is The Startup CPG Podcast?
The top CPG podcast in the world, highlighting stories from founders, buyer spotlights, highly practical industry insights - all to give you a better chance at success.
Daniel Scharff
Welcome to the Startup CPG podcast. We're doing a mini episode today because on July 12th we are launching a brand new event format called Founders and Formulators. This is your chance as a brand to get in front of a bunch of very cool formulators who can either help you bring your product to life or. Or they can give you a bunch of really good feedback on your product. Or maybe you just have a specific question like how do I improve the shelf life? Or I'm running up against this quality issue. Either way, you're gonna wanna be there in the room. We're doing it in Chicago on July 12th. It's because it's the day before the Institute of Food Technologists annual convention, which means a bunch of those formulators are gonna be in town and this is your chance to get to meet them.
00:51
Daniel Scharff
I'm really excited that on today's podcast I am interviewing Adam Yee. You know him as the host of our R&D Radio Episodes. He is a food scientist and he's also worked on the brand side. So he's going to provide both perspectives on why he thinks this is a really cool event and how he would make the most of it. And then also we just have a good general discussion about how to work with food scientists, how he would use our recently released database to find the perfect partner to work with on your product, and a bunch more. I hope you enjoy it and I really hope to see you at that event. If you want to check out the link, it is in the show notes. All right, here we go.
01:32
Daniel Scharff
All right, Adam, my friend, you have now shifted from podcast host back to podcast guest for one special bonus episode. I'm very happy to have you here because you are the expert on this topic and we, as probably a lot of people know, are doing our first ever Founders and Formulators. So we're really excited about this event. It's happening in Chicago the day before the IFT Institute of Food Technologists show happens, because a lot of food technologists, which means formulators, product developers, are going to be in town. So let's take advantage. So on July 12, at the Palmer House Hilton, one of my absolute favorite hotels in the world, we are going to be doing this really cool speed dating type event.
02:11
Daniel Scharff
And the purpose of it is, okay, if you're a brand, walk in there, maybe you're just still trying to launch your product and you can go and find your formulator. That's awesome. There are going to be a ton of them in the room with different specialties. Or maybe you have a product and this is the tough part, get them to rip it apart, give them your product. It's such a cool opportunity to have somebody who is very technical actually either just give you general feedback or maybe you have a specific question for them. Like, I think it's good, but I'm trying to improve my shelf life. Right. Something like that. So I'm really pumped about it. Can you just tell me, like, how do you think about this kind of event, even from a product developer's standpoint, which you are.
02:47
Adam Yee
Yeah. I've been talking to your team a lot about how to talk about how formulators can benefit and also how can founders benefit. And I would say, like, networking is really hard for food scientists. Like, even though we're going to this national show called ift, the Institute of Food Technologists were literally, I would say it's the top food science nerd show that happens every year around this time. We thought it'd be a great idea if food formulators are already there looking for great ingredients and great solutions to pair up with the founders in the area. And I think this is a great opportunity for Denta Network, not only with other founders, but also with other formulators too.
03:23
Daniel Scharff
Yeah. What a good time. I'm just so excited about this venue as well. We just had our KEHE grocery run in the Palmer House Hilton as well. It's such a historic, beautiful place, downtown Chicago. It's gorgeous. I can't wait for people to see it.
03:36
Adam Yee
I can't wait either. Wow. Yeah.
03:38
Daniel Scharff
And so, man, I was just reflecting on this because you and I have been in this industry for a minute now, and I think when I worked at a huge multinational cpg, I didn't think about it this way, but at the startups that I've worked at, you can give everything and we can help everybody with everything that we can, meaning, like getting into stores and getting investment. But the end of the day, if your product is not good, it's not going to work out. And you might waste five years of your life desperately trying to build something with all of your talent and investment that just might not ultimately hit because the product wasn't good enough.
04:16
Daniel Scharff
And so we do the grocer runs, we do the founders and funders event, but for me, this is actually going way back to the beginning and hopefully setting people up on the path to success by giving them a much better weapon to fight with a much better product. What do you think? Because, yeah, you've been in this industry for a long time as well, like just working on that specifically for brands.
04:36
Adam Yee
Yeah, let me think. Seven jobs, two founded startups, like two other. Just as a member of startups from biotechnology to protein powders, I've done a lot and I've seen a lot of different ways to commercialize a product. And now that I help other founders just kind of start with just an idea. Like there is a common thread which basically formulators have a knowledge that is pretty hard to communicate to founders. And sometimes we do have to hire food scientists to kind of figure out to work with the founder to bring a product to commercialization. Because if you've been listening to the R and D radio episodes, that's kind of what we do. We try to translate what you want in your kitchen to essentially a factory that can then be produced in the shelf that's not only safe but also delicious.
05:22
Adam Yee
So what I see here is that there is kind of this tricks of the trade that we as formulators and every formulator does have a trick of trade that we can really share with founders that the clients I work with are just enlightened to hear about. A lot of things that we can do is like look at a product and ask a series of questions and say how we believe we can improve the product. And some are really specialized in and some are just like very enthusiastic about the category as well.
05:51
Daniel Scharff
Give me an example of that. That's really cool to hear you talk about it that way. So like you go up and there's somebody sampling a product and what are those questions you might ask them in order to give them some feedback? Do you need to like actually turn the thing around and see the ingredient label or is it really just from your experience trying the product and what you know about the composition of it and the processes that are used to make that kind of food product?
06:14
Adam Yee
Yeah, so what I like to do generally is just talk. I think vibes is really important, like understanding if the formulator and the founder have a good vibe, like are they passionate about what you're doing? Do they care what you're doing? Because I've had some clients that told me like, oh yeah, my past food scientists didn't really care what I was doing and I, that's therefore I wanted to work with you, for instance. And I do think there is a vibe depending on the product, depending on the person. I do think that's actually really important. So, you know, get to know them a little bit. Are they doing this as a side hustle? Are they doing this like as a full time thing?
06:45
Adam Yee
And then after that, they hand me the product, and I look at it a little bit, and I talk about it, like, what was the idea from the product and what was kind of the inspiration for the product? That's really important, too. And after that, taste it. And when you taste it, you can get a lot of feedback from the texture, from the flavor. We generally will also question, like, how you are planning to sell this. Are you planning to sell this? Like, let's say I was handled like a liquid product, like a milk, And I said, like, okay, are you planning to sell this as a milk? How do you plan on selling as a milk? Are you planning to sell it, like, without refrigeration or with refrigeration? Have you explored looking into a powdered format for this drink as well?
07:21
Adam Yee
So we'll just ask these questions, and I think what's great about this event is that you're going to get a lot of really good perspectives from a lot of great experts. And I think when you hear those collective perspectives, it becomes really aligning at where you should go next with your product.
07:34
Daniel Scharff
Gosh, I like that answer a lot. You're so good at this. I was expecting you to be like, yeah, I'll just look at the ingredients and then be like, did you think about doing this? But actually, you gave such a thoughtful, strategic, holistic answer that I think it really shows how long you've been in the business and that you really understand it's not just about a technical question from somebody who has, like, just goes deep one skill set. It actually takes that holistic understanding of what is the product, what's the strategy? What's the marketing of this? What are you trying to do with it? Before you could actually even get to answer like that. I don't know why Ryan reminds me, like, my parents are both psychiatrists.
08:08
Adam Yee
That's even. I want to go, yeah.
08:11
Daniel Scharff
Some people could guess that, but I. I'm fine, though. Some people will just, like, ask them, like, hey, okay, what do you think about this? Like. Or, like, can you diagnose that one celebrity? Like, yeah, like, you have to ask a lot of questions, really actually understand full context before you do something like that. So I really like that super pro answer from Adam.
08:30
Adam Yee
Okay, thank you. I try to be.
08:32
Daniel Scharff
Let's see if you do as well on the next one. No. Okay.
08:35
Adam Yee
All right.
08:36
Daniel Scharff
And I feel like we're really privileged to get to invite all of these formulators to the event. We went through this very big process of building the first ever database of all of the product developers out there and we'll put it in the show notes here, reminder to everybody. It's a free resource that we built and it's so that you can get in touch with the right person. And there's a lot in there. The management consultant in me is obsessed with just let's put in all of the central effort. So this is a great tool for everybody. So it's not just a list of people. It talks about what they do, what are their product specialties, what are their capabilities, what are the different kinds of things that they actually do? Do they like working with startups or not? Because they don't all.
09:13
Daniel Scharff
Some of them only work with bigger companies. Right. I think that was your feedback to get that in there. Okay. And then are they a freelancer maybe cheaper or an agency, maybe more expensive, but also they can have a fuller service operation. What are the projects they've done, what are the customers that they've worked with, if they're able to disclose that and then obviously that good contact info, including where they're located. Because my dream is for people to find exact. Right. Maybe even within driving distance, because it is such a joy to get to do this in person if those vibes are right, as you mentioned. So, yeah, just a reminder to everybody that's out there. And that is really like a lot of how we're sourcing these experts to come to the event.
09:50
Daniel Scharff
So we're really excited to be getting all of the brands together with a bunch of those formulators and make some great magic happen. So tell me how you would approach this event if you were a brand. Adam. So you walk in the room, we've got a bunch of formulators there. You can see ahead of time kind of who they are and what some of their stuff skills are. Are you going in, let's say you have a product. Like, how are you even going to try to focus them on the issue? Let's say you have five minutes with a formulator and you want to get as much out of them as possible to potentially improve your product. How are you going to try to talk them?
10:21
Daniel Scharff
How are you going to try to convey a bunch of information that they might need in a short amount of time and get them focused on the thing that you need them to help you with right away? Although probably a lot of them are open to follow up? Compost.
10:29
Adam Yee
Yeah. Talking with your team, we're planning to have handouts to kind of bubble up some questions that can be useful for both the founder and the Formulator. And I think that would be really helpful to kind of direct how you would answer these type of questions. Because dealing with a food scientist, some people have never talked to a food scientist. No one really knows what I do generally even like in parties or mixers or whatever. Right. So it is a field that has a lot of really cool information. So I would say first kind of do your research. Every consultant should have their website up on the formulas of founders event. Do your research, understand kind of what they are. Some have an episode on R and D radio.
11:04
Adam Yee
That is, we seem to get a lot of positive responses when people listen to the episode and decide on a formulator because the personality does show. And then I would say, like, in terms of a brand perspective, you know, go with a challenge that you have. And I think every formula there will have answer to that challenge. And I think as a good scientist, when you collect data, you then correlate to answer as you collect more data. So let's say, for example, a shelf life could be challenge that you have. Like, I have high mold count on a product and. Or this cookie gets too soggy when I leave it for like three months. A formula will generally ask you questions, and then you would answer them, and then through that inquiry would give you answer.
11:49
Adam Yee
And sometimes that answer might be an ingredient, it could be a packaging, it could be a protocol in retail. Like, every food scientist will have answer for that question. Really? Because we as food scientists follow a basic law of nature, though we do all handle it pretty differently based off our expertise in the industry.
12:07
Daniel Scharff
I'm really excited about this event. Adam, thank you so much for being part of our team and working with our team to try to make it as good as it can be. Because obviously you go very deep and you've been an independent food scientist working with brands, and you've been on the brand side very heavily as well. So you really understand what is in people's heads and hearts as they're going through this process. But I'm really excited about it. And just to put it out there into the world on this podcast, I really believe this can be a landmark event for the industry. There is nothing out there helping brands connect with the right formulator. We do not have that event in this industry that has this kind of a matchmaking. I want to do this product.
12:45
Daniel Scharff
I want to devote my life for the foreseeable future to building this dream. Where can I find the right person to make it for me? There are things out there for finding ingredients, finding Buyers, we've done a really good job, I think events finding investors for your early stage project, but not formulators. And so I really hope that this will just continue to grow over the years and be something that people look at as that is just where you go to find the formulator. And I believe that it is going to be so well received by brands and also by formulators who we really love and support and appreciate coming to these kind of events.
13:23
Daniel Scharff
Like you said, like you don't always get to run into them at events, but they're just as eager to network and they're showing up with the intention of giving you their expertise at the event. Obviously you can hire them as well. Maybe you will find the perfect person to work on your dream with.
13:37
Adam Yee
You find your match.
13:38
Daniel Scharff
Yeah, pair up with. Let's go right off into the sunset and yeah, I'm super excited about it. Honestly. Really proud that we've been able to find so many matches through the database that we've built as well. I mean, I know because you're one of the people listed in the database as well because you are an amazing podcast host for us and do the newsletter, but obviously you do other stuff with your time as well. And you are a freelance food scientist. What have you heard about it? Because you're on the receiving end and you're friends with all the other people on there. What are you hearing about the database?
14:07
Adam Yee
Yeah, I think a lot of people have been getting inquiries, I'll say that. You know, it's funny, Rachel Zemser, who's been on the R and D radio podcast says like, because her name's on the top, she gets a good amount of inquiry, which is funny. And we also see a lot more like people looking down the list because I'm on the bottom actually, because umayworks is a bot. Is you. Right. So it's like on the bottom. But they still find me, I think because I generally say I focus on a certain like, type of startup. So they are looking through the list, right. Which I think is great. And they are getting inquiries. I'm getting inquiries and I'm also getting. I'm also closing now a lot of startups, which I think is really great.
14:43
Adam Yee
And I do think that the list is a good understanding of like what is truly out there. And I do think the podcast, which always welcome formulas to be on it. Just email me@adamstartupcpg.com I think sharing their personality and the way they do things is really enlightening not only to like the Founders who are listening and the brands that are listening. But also to me, actually, like, it's really cool learning about how other food formulators are handling and working with clients. And I think that's also been something that I find really good. And, you know, reconnecting with them is also super fun as well. A lot of them are people I've known once or twice.
15:21
Adam Yee
And so I do think, like, sharing their stories and how they approach problems, because there are a lot of problems in how we make a food product, I think is really fun.
15:31
Daniel Scharff
That's great. I'm so glad that you have already gotten numerous clients, it sounds like, through the database. I really love it because a lot of the food scientists are so passionate about the work that they do. And I do think also sometimes people in those positions are. It's kind of word of mouth and like, project to project for them if they're not part of an agency or something. And so it's so great when they have these massive skill sets to just help them find the perfect match. And it can be really great for the brands, obviously, as well. And it sounds like maybe you're thinking about renaming your company to aaa, UMU Works or something to get up to the top.
16:04
Adam Yee
There are so many companies. Apparently Jeff Bezos made the Amazon because it has an A in it. That's what I heard.
16:10
Daniel Scharff
All right, well, okay, that makes sense to me. Maybe I was going to say, like, I know it can get you to the top of the list, but. No, it's alphabetized. That's what it is.
16:17
Adam Yee
No, don't worry. Listen, if people want to find me, they can find me, right?
16:20
Daniel Scharff
We'll give you his address, everybody. Okay, last question for you here. Let's say you are a brand using that list. There's a lot in there. Like, I hear what you're saying about Vibes first. How would you use the actual resource that's there and look through the list and decide who to talk to? How many people to talk to? Would you try to send them your product first, like all that stuff? How would you, like, really select and negotiate terms with the right formulator for your project?
16:46
Adam Yee
Yeah. So here's what I also learned just through talking to a lot of formulators, even when I had to make my own business, is that we all are doing things pretty differently, I would say. And there is actually a black box in terms of how consultants work or formulator consultants work. And I think that's really interesting. So I do suggest really talking. And also I do think location is really important. And I do think how they communicate project deliverables is actually really important too. So I would. Some people do hourly, some people do a project based. I think that's really important to vet out and understand your budget. For example, I do project based because I want founders to really budget out how they're going to work with a formula.
17:28
Adam Yee
For instance, I've been talking to a lot of people and some people do that and some people don't. And I think their expertise on a certain product category is really important. For example, I don't touch drinks. I've never made a liquid drink product, so I don't want to do that. So I'd recommend others. And generally most consultants do recommend people as well. And I think that's also something to keep in mind. What is their expertise? What have they worked on in past projects before that can help you at your specific time?
17:56
Daniel Scharff
That makes a lot of sense to me. Yeah, I mean, I think especially about like just even understanding how they work because you mentioned just specifically the kind of fee base. But any other examples of like, what could be really different from one formulator to the next?
18:09
Adam Yee
Yeah, I do think deliverables and how we talk about deliverables really does matter between food scientists and I think we are being hired to solve a technical problem. And what does a technical problem look like when it's completed? I think is really important. Some formulators based off essentially hourly, and that's fine. Some foam formulators based it off of, let's say, product iterations. So how many iterations does it take? How many product samples are sent back and forth? Some are kind of work in a different method, but we all have a certain set of deliverables we have to give to you. And I do think, like, if there was something I would itemize and write down and compare, it would be the deliverables and how they are priced. And what is the value of that deliverable to you at that time?
18:53
Daniel Scharff
I think that's a really important answer and I hope everybody really hears that because that is, I would say, the one risk area for founders working with formulators, especially independent ones, is the formulator feels like the project is done and the brand is not because it's your baby. And like you. Yeah, you're going to give this to me. But like, wait, it's not. No, like that's not as good as I want it to be. Well, how clear is that? Is it clear if the formulator in that instance needs to do another run on it or are they going to feel like, no, it's complete. You asked me to do that thing and I did that thing. So I totally agree with you. The more that you can spell that out, the better in the contract. Just so it's clear to everybody.
19:30
Daniel Scharff
And you don't get in these spats because those spats are so nasty between two small companies and like no one's going to really go hire a big time lawyer for that. You're just going to be really pissed about it.
19:40
Adam Yee
Yeah.
19:40
Daniel Scharff
So my hope is that people can be really clear about the deliverables like you mentioned so that it reduces the chance of that happening. So very well put. Yeah. All right, I'm gonna wrap us up here, Adam, but I'm very excited to see you, of course, soon at a bunch of our events and especially at this founders and formulators. The first of its kind, but not the last. Only the beginning of connecting all of the exciting brands out there with their dream formulators. And from now on, then we'll have nothing but beautiful products with perfect shelf life and no quality control issues ever.
20:14
Adam Yee
There you go. I do wanna say one thing. Working with the team has been amazing. I would say you have one of the, probably one of the best well run team I've ever met and everyone has been super supportive, super great and they invite me to free events. So I've been in Asheville, I've been in Boston, I'm going to a fancy food show one of your events and now I'm going to Chicago based founders of Formulated event. So and I do think like some of the impacts for the podcast and the newsletter, people are asking questions about things they don't know about and I love answering them. So really appreciate being on the team. Daniel, thanks.
20:46
Daniel Scharff
We appreciate you. We're just scheduling events around your travel schedule so that we can hang out with you. But I really appreciate those words about my team. I think we're extremely lucky. I think part of just the joy of what we do attracts great people. They're very talented and they work really hard to bring everybody together and deliver real value to the whole industry. And we have a lot of fun doing it and it's a really confident and hardworking team and a lot of fun to be around. So I really appreciate that and I know I can see the huge impact of what you're doing as well. And I especially love the newsletters for everybody who is subscribed to our email newsletter.
21:21
Daniel Scharff
Who gets to see Adam's R and D newsletters that come out are just so well written and researched, and they're such great topics. I love it. Just really interesting, compelling stuff for anybody in this industry to check out. So thank you, my friend.
21:36
Adam Yee
Yeah, no problem. I love writing them. As someone who just likes data and expressing data in fun ways, for me, it's an awesome way of, you know, teaching food science to other people. It's. It really is a passion project of mine to do that.
21:48
Daniel Scharff
All right, well, I will wrap us up here. Thank you again, Adam. It's been quite a nice journey with you here ever since I was on your podcast back in, I want to say, 2018, I think.
21:59
Adam Yee
God, that's such a long time ago. Yeah.
22:01
Daniel Scharff
My first ever podcast guest appearance. And look at the monster that you've.
22:06
Adam Yee
Unleashed with this podcast. Yeah. Yeah, that's awesome. No, it feels great. And again, I always have to say this, like, well, yeah, Bill Daniel is very impressive. I'll say this in every podcast I'm on here.
22:16
Daniel Scharff
Thank you, bro. We're much stronger now that we have you also on the team. So let's go. All right, bye, everybody. See you all at Founders and formulators. All right. Well, my friends, we've now arrived together at the end of another episode of the Startup CPG podcast, the top globally ranked podcast in cpg. As you may know, we're not just a podcast. We're a complete community of brands and experts, and you should join. You can sign up @startupcpg.com you'll then get an invite to our online Slack community. You're going to hear about amazing events near you, all of our special opportunities to get you in front of buyers, investors, brands, and more. It's a free community. So what are you waiting for? I will see you there or on our next episode. Bye. Bye.