We Got Next

We talk about the importance of air conditioning, Fili learns that motorcycle drag racing is in fact a thing, and the Golden State Valkyries start the season strong with a three-dimensional offense (YAY!!). Also, are the WNBA rules changes on “physical” play trying to reduce player injuries or is it a racist dog whistle of more sinister motives?

3:08 Dystany Spurlock and Motorcycle Drag Racing 

9:30 PWHL Finals Game 1 – Montreal vs Ottawa

11:19 USWNT Head Coach Emma Hayes on reporters needing to stop covering women’s sports from male gaze

12:39 Link between ACL Tears and hormonal fluctuations during menstrual cycles

25:18 Sheila E! 

32:14 Johannes Sideways Fade 3 

46:39 Dawn Staly Droppin' Knowledge. Article. Video. 

Creators and Guests

Host
Filiberto Nolasco Gomez
Raised in a Mexican working class enclave of Eastern Los Angeles, I spent many hours hooping with the homies in public parks all over Montebello. Read more: https://wegotnextpod.org/hosts
Host
Michelle Hatfield
I’m a miserable childless cat lady from Central California by way of Virginia with some MidWest influence. I’m a women’s sports fanatic. I’m an activist, YIMBY, Golden State Valkyries Founding Guard member and season ticket holder and occasional runner who works for social justice, equal pay, and intersectional liberation. I’m a former journalist now focusing on advocacy communications and storytelling. Read more: https://wegotnextpod.org/hosts

What is We Got Next?

We’re fans of the women’s game – the athletes, styles, moves, sneaks, and memes. We approach this podcast as fans and social justice advocates. We will uplift and center those who identify as women, and who are changing the game, on and off the court, the field, the pitch, the pool, and more. We will especially uplift those who identify as women of color, and/or gay, femme, queer, non-binary, and transgender. We uphold workers over corporate greed, inclusivity and accessibility over exclusion, and equality over supremacy.

This is a safe space where we will learn and grow together as a community rooted in joy.

Michelle:

Welcome, Bienvenidos to We Got Next, a podcast for fans by fans, where we center athletes who identify as women, femmes, and thems, and who are changing the game on and off the court, the field, the pitch, the pool, and more.

Filiberto:

So today, we have a lovely Pinot Noir Blanc from Roche Winery and Vineyards, and it's from their Carneros Field.

Michelle:

It's supposed to be a nice drinking white for the the summer. You don't have to have it with food necessarily. You can kind of sip on it on the patio.

Filiberto:

And for those of you that have never enjoyed a Sacramento summer, it is hot. Mhmm. It is muggy and uncomfortable for the most part. There's like a week where it's really nice. There's a week where I'm like, wow.

Filiberto:

This is amazing. But for the most part.

Michelle:

But at least we have air conditioning here for the most part. Whereas, with climate change, there are some areas in California that, were did not have the heat they're getting. They're close like, when I lived in San Jose, they're closer to the beach. So a lot of the older stuff in San Jose was built without AC, and it can be kinda miserable.

Filiberto:

Oh, the same is true for my sister in Ventura on the Central Coast. Like Yeah. None of those properties were designed to need to deal with anything above 75. So as soon as it cracks that, they find out there's no insulation, and AC would have been nice. It's But only like that for, like, five days, but it's increasing every year.

Filiberto:

Yeah. It was never like that before. For the most part.

Michelle:

Exactly. But I, I do appreciate that about the Central Valley.

Filiberto:

Well, Michelle, what do you what notes are you getting from this lovely Pinot Noir Blanc?

Michelle:

I'm getting some grapes. Oh. Just kidding. Like, the tart grapes. No.

Michelle:

What am I getting? I'm getting a little honeysuckle. I'm getting a little, a little floral, little lemon.

Filiberto:

Oh, yeah. A little citrus in there. Yeah.

Michelle:

Like, tangerine-y.

Filiberto:

Yeah. Almost like a plum.

Michelle:

For a white? That's interesting.

Filiberto:

A little plummy Mhmm. If you will. Michelle, what's going on in the wide world of sports?

Michelle:

Oh, that's a throwback right there.

Filiberto:

Yeah, I know. Right? Y'all remember that? If you all remember that reference, you should probably get a colonoscopy or start thinking about scheduling it.

Michelle:

We went there. You went there.

Filiberto:

I went there. No, you didn't go there. You were an unwilling participant.

Michelle:

I know. I observed you going there. So yeah, some really cool things happening this week like aside from the WNBA. So this one took me back. So there's a woman named Dystany Spurlock.

Michelle:

She used to drag race motorcycles. But this is like she's kind of

Filiberto:

Wait. Hold on. Drag race motorcycles?

Michelle:

Yes.

Filiberto:

You can do that?

Michelle:

Yes.

Filiberto:

I've never heard of that. Can you put a video in the show notes about that?

Michelle:

Yeah. Let's do that.

Filiberto:

OK. I don't yeah. I've never heard of that. Yeah. That sounds terrifying.

Michelle:

Yes. So, like, they have, like, their drag races with, like, the funny they used to some of them are called funny cars.

Filiberto:

I remember that.

Michelle:

Yeah. But they actually use motorcycles too, which to me is way scarier. They're both scary.

Filiberto:

No. No. Motorcycles are way scarier.

Michelle:

There's no protection. Right?

Filiberto:

Right. And this this again, going back to this wide world of sports concept, like, back in the day before the NFL just started dominating everything, you can see it like random sport. I remember doing that on Saturday and Sunday mornings just watching the most random sports ever. Yeah. It's great.

Filiberto:

Yeah. Can't do that now. It's hard.

Michelle:

Well, she's definitely making the rounds and it's like it it's brought me back to like my college days. A certain someone in my life was really into NASCAR.

Filiberto:

Oh.

Michelle:

And so

Filiberto:

Are you a NASCAR bunny?

Filiberto:

Is that what they call it?

Michelle:

Gross.

Filiberto:

Is that a real term?

Michelle:

I don't think anyone's ever used that term at all.

Filiberto:

It just happened on this podcast.

Michelle:

But so, yeah, it was like every Saturday or Sunday, there was a race somewhere and it's like five hours of them, you know, going in circles. So I got to know a little bit about NASCAR, about the personalities, but this is twenty years ago. So I haven't really kept up with it. But they are getting a little bit more diverse. We you know, they're finally are like drivers of color in NASCAR.

Michelle:

They're diversifying the kind of cars they allow in. They used to be kind of just like, just American built, like Chevy, Ford, Dodge. But then they've been using like engines or other parts from like Toyota cars or others. So it's like kicking and screaming diversity, but it is happening. They've also had some women drivers have some careers there.

Michelle:

But yeah, Dystany, she's been kind of like in different racing circuits, she's and there's there's, like, this minor league for NASCAR, the main, the main event. So she's gonna be racing they kinda call it it's like ARCA Menards series.

Filiberto:

Oh, like, the Midwest grocery store.

Michelle:

Yeah. Well, is it a grocery store? Is it like

Filiberto:

a Oh, you're right. No. It well, it's both. It's it's like if Home Depot and Yeah. Vons or Bel Air had a baby

Michelle:

I've never

Filiberto:

seen the groceries,

Michelle:

but I've been there for,

Filiberto:

like, home improvement. They have a lot of, like, grocery. Like, yeah, not like a full on groceries. They don't have, like, produce, but they have, like, food items.

Michelle:

Mhmm.

Filiberto:

So a lot of people do their food. Some people I knew when I lived in Minnesota, lived in Minnesota for a decade, folks, would do their food shopping there.

Michelle:

Okay. But it

Filiberto:

and stuff.

Michelle:

They have a lot of separate, like, minor league things before you get to, like, the big show. And so she and then part of that, you do a qualifying race to kinda see seeding and stuff for when you start the actual race. So she just did, I think, one of the qualifyings and she was she did well enough. She will be in like the main minor league kinda system race. I believe it's gonna be this weekend.

Michelle:

So that's like that's awesome news. She's raced I think like trucks before, like stock trucks. So she's kind of been around the culture, the atmosphere, and she's just, you know, trying to make a name for herself and jumping around. But I mean, it's just great for people to be able to look up to like not only woman, not only a Black driver, but a Black woman driver. Think it's just really awesome kinda like breaking those barriers.

Michelle:

So it's it's good for the kiddos to see so they can be it someday. So it's really cool. Rooting her, rooting her on this weekend.

Filiberto:

And Dystany Spurlock, if you ever want to be on a podcast, we'd love to have you. Yeah. If happen to be listening. And we'll throw in some detail in the show notes just so you all can visualize what this is and what this looks like with this unique sport. Very southern sport, too.

Filiberto:

Very much in the South.

Michelle:

Yes. They've come out I mean, they do they races here like randomly in Sonoma Speedway.

Filiberto:

Sonoma Speedway. Yeah.

Michelle:

And then they I think there's a Vegas one. They do one in Long Beach also, I think. So they've been expanding over the last decade or so into outside the South. They've always been in New York. So there's there's some different races.

Michelle:

I know you you have family members who are really into F1. So it's two very different types of racing.

Filiberto:

Yeah. My sister got really into, her and her husband got really into F1 over the pandemic because they they watched the Netflix show. So they were that story about people watching the Netflix show. Then she got the app and get all the analytics and information and everyone's good looking and there's a lot of money and everyone's fancy.

Michelle:

They have gorgeous accents.

Filiberto:

Yeah. It's like the Bollywood of sports Yeah. Is what it sounds like from what I get told.

Michelle:

Yeah. No. That's really cool.

Filiberto:

I don't get it. It's weird to me. I drove a, an all-electric car for a while and hybrids and plug-in hybrids. So, yeah, combustion engines, spectacles do not mix. I used to work for auto workers.

Filiberto:

I guess I have a little bit of connection to that. But, yeah, combustion engine spectacles, I don't understand.

Michelle:

Something else we're keeping up on is the Professional Women's Hockey League started their finals. We're recording this on May 15. So they had their game one last night, which is kind of exciting. It's it's against the Ottawa Charge and the Montreal Victoire. I have a horrible French accent.

Michelle:

I cannot roll my r's. So hopefully, I pronounce that kinda close.

Filiberto:

Also, it's actually in Spanish too. Yes. Exactly. A ailment.

Michelle:

I'm more upset about my inability to roll r's in Spanish than I'm about the French part. But You're shit straight, woman.

Michelle:

Like, put some respect on that.

Michelle:

But, like, as I'm watching these two Canadian teams when a very French Canadian team go at it, I'm like, man, I can't pronounce any of their last names. Mhmm.

Filiberto:

That's okay.

Michelle:

And in fact, when I was writing my notes, put some of these phonetically so I can actually pronounce them correctly. But Montreal has a lot of great players. They have a goaltender that's just been like lights out. Desbiens. I think am I pronouncing that right? Anyways, so we've got Montreal and Ottawa going at it in the finals. It's a five game series, so, you know, whoever wins three.

Michelle:

This is kind of a back and forth game. I cannot believe like, I watched a lot of NHL a while ago when I was living in San Jose. But I can't believe, like, Montreal was down two to one, like, in the third. And, like, literally with two point four seconds left, they score to tie it and force overtime. And I've never seen I've seen, like, maybe one other game where a goal was scored that late and, like, saved.

Filiberto:

And it wasn't just like a slap shot. Sorry. It wasn't just like a slap shot from afar. There it was like a scrum for the putt.

Michelle:

Yeah. Which is usually how it gets in there. Right?

Filiberto:

But the clock kept going. So you're like, oh, this is gonna end or something's gonna happen? Like yeah.

Michelle:

Well, I think that's what happened with Ottawa's defense is, you know, you get the first shot, doesn't go in. There's gonna be a scrum. People will be chasing for it. And so I think some of the defenders just thought time would run out and just kind of thought they were safe and then it got poked in.

Filiberto:

They lost track of what was happening. I mean

Michelle:

Yeah.

Filiberto:

It was hard to follow.

Michelle:

Yeah. So that was just like phenomenal. And then we go to overtime and Montreal is able to, get a goal in like two or three minutes in.

Filiberto:

Yeah. Like seventeen twenty or something.

Michelle:

At least they're not like playing a whole extra period. So that was cool. But yeah. So Montreal's kind of playing from behind, you know, a little bit of that game. So it was just really awesome for them to kind of be able to notch that win.

Filiberto:

Well and just from what we watched too, it's just an epic game one. Yeah. And you have to just kind of applaud that. Yeah. Like Yeah.

Filiberto:

It's exciting when it's a good game one.

Michelle:

Both goaltenders were amazing Yeah. In that game.

Filiberto:

So we'll keep an eye on that.

Michelle:

Yeah.

Michelle:

Just let you know what's going down.

Michelle:

So they kinda play every other day. So game two is on the sixteenth, game three the eighteenth, game four the twentieth, and then game five. They get a little bit of rest if it goes to game five, and that will be played on May 23. So the last piece I wanted to mention for this week is the US women's soccer national soccer team. There was a kind of a video going around for the coach Emma Hayes.

Michelle:

Having some comments is kind of like how people have to if you're covering women's sports, it's new for a lot of reporters or other people involved in just women's sports in general, that you have to kinda get away from that male gaze. Way that you kinda have, you know, if you're a journalist, the way you cover women's sports. If you're a trainer, the the way that you get women athletes ready for games and train them and get strength and other things even like down here like nutrition, like you've got to approach it differently. Because these are definitely different types of people, their games are gonna be played a little differently. They have different types of skill sets.

Michelle:

And so she was just kinda and one piece that's come out about this is the there's an ACL study that women's soccer is gonna participate in. Kinda look at. They've had a lot of ACL injuries recently. And so is it like something with the grass or is it a certain way that the women are kicking the ball and making contact? Is it the type of cleats they're wearing?

Michelle:

So we're gonna do do a study about that.

Filiberto:

Well, I remember we talked about this a long time ago, but there was a study that indicated that women are at a higher risk of ACL tears during specific phases of their menstrual cycle.

Michelle:

Yes. Yeah. And I think that's gonna be part of the study is trying to figure out

Filiberto:

has to be.

Michelle:

Yeah. Is trying to figure out kinda what that difference is. But it's but it's a great example and I think kind of the coverage of that, people are starting to think like, oh, like there's different, there's different ways and like, you know, if you're if you're someone who's again, if you're like a trainer bouncing from like a men's team to a women's team, it's gotta be you're gonna have to be different with your approach. You're gonna have to like if there are even education classes out there or training classes on on what the differences are and how you kinda have to tweak your approach.

Filiberto:

You can't impose normative male standards on a woman's body. Exactly. Then you can't

Michelle:

just like Vice versa.

Filiberto:

Yes. Those that as well.

Michelle:

But But most

Filiberto:

But there's a power dynamic that needs to be recognized.

Michelle:

Exactly. And most of the resources historically have been centered on male athletes. And so that's why it's kinda like they kinda came first because of that, because of the sexism. Right? And that's where people, you know, invested resources.

Michelle:

So it's it's kind of like and I think Emma was talking about it a little bit, too. It's like this goes not just to like the ACL injury issue, but also the way reporters cover sports, too. Like you might not be asking the same types of questions or taking the same types of photos from the same type of angles that you would other people. Because again, the the games are played differently. These are totally different people.

Michelle:

So I think it's like it was a good it was a cool video to like see someone talking about it and trying to engage that larger conversation about how you approach that. And it's something we learned as journalists is you're gonna have some type of biases, right? You have to like, some of them will be implicit, some will be explicit. You have to kind of acknowledge those and you have to work kind of against that and make sure that you're treating everyone fairly and giving them the opportunity they deserve when you're writing about them or, you know, taking photos or video of them. And so I think I think it's just a really good conversation for people to kind of have that moment to like the self reflect.

Filiberto:

And the other part of the journalism piece on that, too, is that we're not trying to quote people so that their perspective reinforces the way we're trying to write. We're trying to let people determine the way they're gonna be represented and the way they can represent their concepts, worldview, etc., and then shape the article around that. You know, it's a very different approach.

Michelle:

Mhmm. That's one thing I think social media is you know, there's a lot of bad that comes with social media. But I think

Filiberto:

Yeah.

Michelle:

One of the good things is people who haven't always had, haven't been allowed to have agency over their story or their branding or whatever. It's allowed them to take control of that away from these white male dominated industries. And get to like show their personality or kind of just like, let fans or others see their perspective before it's put through this like white male lens. And so I think that's been like one of the benefits and the the powerful ways that social media can be used for good.

Filiberto:

Well, mean, absolutely for me, I would have never been a journalist if it wasn't for social media. Like, I didn't go to journalism school. I wasn't interning. I just developed my voice on my own terms online and sort of developed my professionalism and my awareness that way. Yeah.

Filiberto:

And I did become a professional journalist. I did it full time for four years. But, yeah. No. I mean, having a, this is one of the things I talk to people about as a communications specialist and activist, social justice person is it, the reason I started blogging and and working my angles was I hated being an activist and writing press releases begging for the LA Times to show up, knowing that they would write a shit article, complete shit, about our labor movement thing or fighting for car wash workers in LA or whatever the hell it was.

Filiberto:

So seizing the means of media production was really important and speaking truthfully from our own term. Even this podcast is the same thing. We get to speak, thoughtfully and, you know, from our worldview. Mhmm.

Filiberto:

So the season has begun for the Golden State Valkyries.

Filiberto:

We got to watch three games consecutively over a short period from May 8 to May 13. A lot of highs and some devastating lows. Devastating lows.

Michelle:

The highs were higher, though. Let's be real. The two games they won were amazing.

Filiberto:

I'm not saying they weren't. I'm just saying. I have to acknowledge that. There were some lows in there.

Michelle:

Mhmm.

Filiberto:

There were some lows in there. Where shall we begin, Michelle?

Michelle:

Let's just go chronologically. I think just the way we've experienced it. I think May 8 was our our first game. That was kind of the the opener for the season for a few teams. So it was a Friday.

Michelle:

Valkyries played Seattle in Seattle. And, you know, as is typical from the Valkyries for last season, they sometimes have slow starts. They don't necessarily have the best first quarter. But they kinda clawed back as a team. And then we have Janelle Salaun's coming off the bench, and she's providing just, like, some really great energy.

Michelle:

And then Veronica Burton's just always amazing as kind of, like, the the captain or point guard.

Filiberto:

And watching Janelle Salaun move and shoot, it's just so it's just so gorgeous. Her shot is incredible. Yeah. And she works her screen. She's obviously a very intelligent basketball player, high IQ, but just that textbook three point shot Yeah.

Filiberto:

Her form is amazing.

Michelle:

Well, I think also like she's I've noticed it's early, but I've noticed compared to last year. And, you know, she may have been a rookie in the W, but she's been playing in France competitively for a bit now, as they do in France. And I just, but it does feel that she's, you can tell she's not a rookie this year. Like with the W, she's it feels like she's got a little bit more confidence with her and like a lot more fire. And she's being a little bit more celebratory when she does well or kind of pumping the fist or like, let's go.

Michelle:

Like, I just see more of that, like, animation from her this year than I remember last year.

Filiberto:

Yeah. Definitely thinking about the first game last year and the first game this year for the season. A lot more confidence, a lot more comfort, a lot more, like, not just intention, but, conviction. There's just a lot more conviction in the passes and the shots, everything. It just was Yeah.

Filiberto:

They knew what they were doing. They knew where the other player was going. Like, it was really, really fun to watch. Yeah. It made me think delusional thoughts about what might happen this year.

Filiberto:

I'm not gonna name them because that's just silly, but I got a little delusional getting a little too excited about what was what I was seeing.

Michelle:

Yeah. But, they just had like really great I just noticed they had like really great defense Mhmm. With a small ball. I will say for Seattle, Flau'jae. I'm gonna keep talking about Flau'jae because I'm still gonna be bummed she's not with Valkyries.

Michelle:

But also just loved watching her Mhmm. In college. I think she's a great player. She's a starter for Seattle, which is fantastic. She also had a great first non-preseason game.

Michelle:

Seattle had a lot of, like, fast breaks early. And so I think Nakase, Coach Nakase did a good job of adjusting for that.

Filiberto:

And when you say small ball, what do you mean? You mentioned that just now.

Michelle:

Yeah. Just like having smaller players, like shorter players in there.

Filiberto:

More, more guard centric.

Michelle:

Yeah. Giving their bigs a little bit of a rest. Yeah. Yeah. And it's like this is a really cool stat, but seven Valkyries players had at least one made three pointer, which it's been a while since I've heard that number.

Michelle:

So that's a great stat, great way to start the season.

Filiberto:

Mhmm.

Michelle:

We did have a few injuries in that game, however. It looked like Tiffany Hayes I forget which finger was it? Pink yeah. Was her pinky. Yeah.

Michelle:

Yeah. She might have tweaked when the knuckles or the pinky there. So she's been out for a few games. And then, Ceci Zandalasini took like an elbow to the head. Yeah.

Michelle:

And it kind of really knocked her. So she I think she played a little bit, which is kind of concerning. She shot her free throws, but then I think eventually went in for concussion protocol. Next game was Sunday, May 10, Mother's Day. So there's a lot of that visual happening that day.

Michelle:

So we were actually at that game. That was the Valkyries home opener. And they were playing Phoenix. So Phoenix was on the second night of back to backs. They, their first game the night before was in Vegas.

Michelle:

So it was kinda the face off of the last two teams standing last season. Phoenix dominated the dominated Vegas. So I was kinda worried like, oh, crap. We have to play them the next day. They will be on a back to back, so that could be good for us.

Michelle:

But I was I was a little worried because last year, we did not beat Phoenix in four tries. So that was all kind of in my head. I was a little concerned, but just flat out impressed with the game that Coach Nakase and the players put together. I think Laeticia Amihere had just great defense. She was kind of in charge of guarding Alyssa Thomas.

Michelle:

Valkyries had another slow start in the first, but I think you had players like Amihere , Kia (Kaila) Charles, just showing phenomenal growth. They were like the team had 10 steals. They had 38 points in the paint. I can't remember the last time the Valkyries had that many points in the paint. It was just really great.

Michelle:

Last year, I think they were this for me is the big question of the Valkyries this year is last year, they shot the three a lot. It wasn't the best percentage in the league as far as made shots.

Filiberto:

And it became predictable without a viable inside threat.

Michelle:

And that's my point is that the team was very two dimensional because they could not get in the pain as often as they needed to to kinda spread out the defense between the perimeter and inside. So it's early. There's only three games so far, but it looks like they've kind of found with the hap, the help of Gabby Williams and others. It looks like they can, actually score from below the bucket, which is really nice to see.

Filiberto:

Well, and really impressive too because they don't really have like a strong back to the basket player. They don't have anybody that that, you know, takes in an entry pass and works their defender and

Michelle:

then Right. Or can get the rebound and go right back up.

Filiberto:

Like when they get to the paint, it's all layups, It's all slashing. It's all, like

Michelle:

Yeah.

Filiberto:

Just gorgeous movement and screens and all these off ball screens and all these things going on. So when it happens when it works for them, it it's beautiful to watch when it's really rolling. Yeah. Doesn't always happen that way, and we'll talk about that in a second. But, yeah, it's when it's when it works, it's when it works, it's like, oh, shit.

Filiberto:

They could beat anybody on their best day.

Michelle:

Yeah. The Valkyries' largest lead in the game was 18 points. The bench had 36, which again you have Janelle Salaun coming on and and doing great. So, just overall great performance. The Chase Center was rocking.

Filiberto:

Yeah. Let's not ignore that.

Michelle:

Sold out. Woah. Very into the game the whole way down to the final buzzer. Just very loud in there.

Filiberto:

So I think this is the thing that gets overlooked when people talk about the Valkyries' environment. Like, everyone talks about Balhalla, which I still don't think was a great nickname, but whatever. It's there. I'm not I'm not gonna change it.

Michelle:

It's won me over.

Filiberto:

My perspective isn't gonna change it.

Michelle:

It's growing on me.

Filiberto:

I know. You didn't like it either.

Michelle:

I did not.

Filiberto:

But the thing that people ignore that you can notice just sort of sitting there and just kind of talking to other people a little bit and just seeing how people respond is how well informed and invested people are. Like, this is a very basketball knowledgeable crowd. They know what's happening. They cheer at the right times. They get frustrated at the right times.

Michelle:

Yeah. No. The fans are great.

Filiberto:

They're really committed. Yeah. And it's just really nice to watch. And there's a lot of you know, the thing about it too is that it's a very multigenerational crowd. Like, there's a lot of, like, mother, daughters, grandparents, kids.

Filiberto:

Like, there's a lot going on. It's really nice.

Michelle:

Yeah. And also just, like, wanna touch on the halftime show

Filiberto:

Oh, yes.

Michelle:

At that game. So I kinda got aged a lot by my younger sister and then your sister who is a tad older than me.

Filiberto:

By months. It's not months.

Michelle:

I know. But I'm really annoyed because I'm like, our ages aren't that far apart. And like, they had no idea who Sheila E. was. And I was like, what is wrong with you? And so she was there.

Michelle:

They gave her a jersey and then she performed at halftime. So was super excited. I think we got up to like go get a drink or go to the bathroom and then like, I was like Yeah. Hurrying you back. I was like, I'm gonna go back to The States.

Michelle:

I wanna see this.

Filiberto:

How do check this out?

Michelle:

They're not putting it on the screens in the the lounge areas. But yeah, I know like so many people stayed for that halftime show, too. So it was just really cool. Lots of energy. Just like love, you know, the performers that the Valkyries are bringing in.

Michelle:

And you could tell like they're trying to like raise that bar from last year, which was great. Not even like not just with like what's on the court, but also like the other aspects, which usually I don't really care about. But I think the Valkyries are doing a really good job of trying to hit all those points for like the different types of people who come to the games and like the experience they wanna have without like being too over the top or annoying to other people who, you know, it's not a huge thing for me. But I just think it's just so well rounded and I had such a blast watching Sheila E Was great.

Filiberto:

Well, it's an interesting position too. Right? Because it's an expansion team. They don't have a history. So what I think they've done really intelligently is not only tap into the Bay Area basketball history and sort of draw from that, but it just general Bay Area just vibes.

Filiberto:

They're really, really trying to capture some of that. Yeah. They had a Favianna Rodriguez do some artwork. She was at the game last year. So they're like just in very small but very big ways.

Filiberto:

They're paying a lot of attention. So congratulations to whatever initiative made that those things happen or continue to make those things happen.

Michelle:

But Yeah. And keep doing it. Yeah. Like, I know you you you probably hear a lot of no's before you get a yes as far as, like, just availability or artists that can fit it in their schedule or their artistic kind of

Filiberto:

I mean, they had Angela Davis.

Michelle:

Vision. Yeah.

Filiberto:

Last year.

Michelle:

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, they Dawn Staley even stopped by, got a larger applause then Steph Curry did at that game, which I was super excited about. I was like, these are my people to like, give her the flowers that she completely deserves.

Michelle:

So, yeah, just just keep it up. People are noticing the hard work that are going into these games. Yep. And then the last game we want to talk about, was three days later. So it was kind of, you you had like an extra day of rest.

Michelle:

But however, the Valkyries played Chicago, which is gonna be interesting. Chicago had a lot of changes, brought in a lot of key players, lost a few. So it's kinda like, how is that gonna come together on the roster?

Filiberto:

A lot of controversy with their owners and the way they spend money and the practice facility not being finished when it was supposed to be. Yes. A history of ignoring players. So yeah. Chicago's in some Yeah.

Filiberto:

In some, has some issues.

Michelle:

So yeah. I would say both teams, neither team had the first half that they wanted. Shooting was very cold for both

Filiberto:

The first quarter was good for the Valkyries. That's that was it. Yeah. But then after that, it just kinda

Michelle:

Even then like, they may have had a lead but their their shots were not great. They were missing more than they were making.

Filiberto:

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Michelle:

And, like, it just felt like Chicago's game plan was to just feed Cardoso down low. And she's just such a big and tall force down there that she can just get above our defenders. But then on the other end, she can do good at taking up space defensively and and kind of take away that paint for us. So it was kinda like the old Valkyries from last season. They just couldn't do anything in the paint.

Michelle:

So it was really frustrating then made it easier made it easy to guard them on the perimeter. Kayla Thornton struggled. I don't think she made a shot

Filiberto:

No she did not!

Michelle:

And you could tell by her body language she was getting very, like, mad herself or frustrated. And so, like, I think that just had an impact as it came the game kept going. And I I know Coach Nakase told her to keep shooting, but it just wasn't working for her. So, you know, just reading that body language again, she just was very upset and that isn't, you know, gonna be a good game for you.

Filiberto:

Yeah. And I think at that point, somewhere in the second quarter, we were both like, are they tired? Yeah. Like, they look tired. And we looked at the schedule, and we were like, well, the last game was May 10.

Filiberto:

It's kinda and they've had two other games. They're all kinda close, but not that close. So, like, we just it was odd to see. It was odd to notice.

Michelle:

Yeah. They're I think that's one of the reasons their their shots weren't going in is their legs are tired, their arms were tired. And it's only their third game of the season. They had, like, at least an extra day of rest. So it was kinda like that was weird.

Michelle:

And then you listen, you we watched, Coach Nakase's postgame press conference and she kind of like confirmed that. She said she was kinda saying like along the lines, I've got a lot of players who love basketball and so they come in on days where we're kinda like, hey, we're gonna take it easy, we're gonna go slow. But they're still in the gym, they're still shooting balls. And she's like, maybe we need to be better at just saying no. Like, we're locking the door, can't come in.

Michelle:

We're not even gonna watch film. Like, take that mental break, that physical break.

Filiberto:

Yeah. She literally said go to the beach. Like, she told her players go to the beach. Look at some water.

Michelle:

Exactly. Go to a museum. Something. Something.

Filiberto:

Something nourishing.

Michelle:

Yeah. So it was one of those games where it's like, I hope the Valkyries don't regret losing it. You know, because we saw that last year. They lost a few games they should have won, and so that affected their seeding toward the end for the playoffs. So let's just hope they kind of, like, learn from that being, that early.

Filiberto:

Yeah. And it wasn't just a Kayla Thornton either that had a rough day. Salaün was also really off too. So, you know, if it was just one player having a rough night shooting, that's one thing. But it was team wide.

Filiberto:

Like, was just a general issue.

Michelle:

Yeah. Yep. And then, like, just one other game that I just really stood out to me over the last week was the May 12 Portland Fire versus New York Liberty game. Like, they just Portland had a really good game plan of having Emily Engstler cover Breanna Stewart. Engstler was getting a lot of blocks, just some great defense.

Michelle:

Breanna Stewart, one of the best players in the league ever. She didn't get her first points until four minutes left in the second, which is amazing. And it was kind of a back and forth game. Like, both teams went on runs. And it was just a great end to the game.

Michelle:

Like, Johannes for the Liberty just had and we'll put this in the show notes, but she had like a minute thirty left of a back and forth game. She had this, like, perimeter shot, three pointer that she was shooting like, she had the momentum from running and she was shooting across her body. She was not she was squared away from the basket.

Filiberto:

It was almost a fadeaway, but it wasn't. Yes. Because she was she if it fadeaway if it was a fadeaway, she would just gone back, but she was, like, still flying to her left.

Michelle:

She had her, like, late. Her knees were up in the air with her.

Filiberto:

It was like a horizontal fadeaway Yes. Somehow.

Michelle:

It was I I watch a lot of Warriors basketball with, like, a great shooter like Steph Curry. I've never seen something like that from the arc. And it went in and she kinda she's running down the court, like, haha, just proud of herself for like, everyone like, her coach is like, I cannot believe that went in. Like, everyone in that stadium was just like, what did we just see? Like, it was an amazing shot.

Michelle:

I've never seen something like that. It was fantastic.

Filiberto:

Well, then I saw a compilation of her having done that several times.

Michelle:

Yes. No. It's it's absolutely something she practices. Like There's just definitely. It's like a signature move for her, I guess.

Michelle:

A signature shot. It's wild. And then a lot a lot of y'all have seen the last possession for Portland. It was their second game at home. They lost the first one.

Michelle:

Their crowd was rocking. They wanted to win. And after the time out, I don't know how many seconds left, like, eight or ten seconds they had. Bridget Carleton had been shooting amazing in that game, so that was they drew up this plan. She shot it from the three, did not go in.

Michelle:

Sarah Ashlee Barker was told just crash the board. And I think what happened with Liberty is they just assumed that's their last shot. It didn't go in. So their defense someone was boxing out Carla Leite really well. But the other Liberty defenders didn't really box out anyone else on the other side.

Michelle:

So Barker comes in, grabs the rebound, goes back up, and it goes in, like, right like, right for the buzzer. And they win the game, their first win at home as an expansion team. So now Barker goes down in history as having that huge save and win for them. I watched that last possession possession like 50 times. It was just so

Michelle:

It was so gorgeous, so amazing. Barker had, you know, she mentioned after the game she had lost someone close to her the day prior. So just like a lot of emotions for her. So it was just like just really great to watch and see her her teammates come pile on her on the floor.

Michelle:

Even their coaches were just like hugging and celebrating. So it was just like really great to see the fans get to have that and enjoy that moment.

Filiberto:

Well, appreciate her being vulnerable and naming that too. Just helps to understand what was happening.

Michelle:

Yeah. So many people have noticed this, have commented on it, but we all knew coming this season that the WNBA wanted to kind of decrease some of the physicality. That physicality is this big word that was bandied about in the offseason . Has a lot of meaning for different people. But we've all noticed there's a lot of foul calls.

Michelle:

It's stopping momentum of the game for a lot of players. Scores are higher because some, you know, you're gonna back off on your defense if they're calling fouls, also teams are just shooting more free throws. So you you're seeing a lot of 100 plus point games. Watching the Valkyries game, the you know, in person was difficult because there were some obvious calls. They weren't like, you know, screens or just knocking people over that weren't being called, but they were calling other things that might be points of emphasis, just there's not as much contact.

Michelle:

So it's just kinda weird, like, where is that line?

Filiberto:

It just felt really uneven. And there's always been a history of not great officiating, but them trying to call more fouls just means that there's more bad officiating. Like, it's just not working right now.

Michelle:

And I do wanna put a note in for the refs because I think a lot of what's happening is they're getting a lot of mixed signals from the league. And we also have keep in mind, as this league's growing, trying to become more professional, treat people like professionals, the refs are not paid a lot. And to the point where a lot of refs are refing the NBA, the MNBA, I should say. They're refing the WNBA.

Michelle:

They are refing both women's and men's college basketball. Some of them are refing Unrivaled or Athletes Unlimited. These are a lot of different leagues, a lot of different rule books to keep track of.

Filiberto:

Even a lot of different styles, composition of players.

Michelle:

And even if like, oh, and Unrivaled's not playing right now or college, so I can focus on these two or three leagues. It's still a lot to keep in touch, like to keep a track of,

Michelle:

especially in the leagues changing the rules so often or the points of emphasis or areas of emphasis so often. So I don't wanna put this squarely on their refs. I think a lot of them, most of them are doing the best they can.

Michelle:

They're just not really given as much clear direction. It's mixed. It changes so often. I think it's hard for them. What I will say is, I think we have to be very clear about what we mean by by physicality.

Michelle:

I think there's a difference between being so physical, you're injuring people. Like, the way Alyssa Thomas was playing last season and the way her physicality basically injured Napheesa Collier in the finals. I think that's what should be targeted as far as, making sure people aren't getting injured. We're not ending people's careers or drastically impacting their careers. I think that's what they should be focusing on.

Michelle:

But I don't, if the goal is to take the defense out of the game, I think that's a completely wrong call. Defense wins championships. I know it's entertaining to watch people score. But I think just as many fans love seeing the competitive defense, the way, you know, you steal the balls or you block them. Some of those are great highlight reels.

Michelle:

Those are just as entertaining to me as some of the baskets that are made. So I wanna be I wanna make sure that we're not becoming the MNBA and we're totally taking defense out and it's just watching people like run track up and down the court. I don't to me, that's not entertaining. One of the reason people love the WNBA is because it's a more, like, kind of folks on the more traditional idea of basketball and that skill set. And I think we should do what we can to maintain that.

Filiberto:

I think fundamentals rather than tradition. But And Dawn Staley has a lot to say about this in her book and in her public appearances that I'll get into later. But absolutely. And there's a there's an important I'll talk about this in a second. But when we talk about people of color, we talk about code switching in the ways in which a lot of us survive and get through white spaces.

Filiberto:

But there's a lot of code switching with white people too. And I think this physicality language is an an example of that.

Michelle:

And so for for those of you, like, there's different points of emphasis on foul calls or just, you know, refereeing.

Filiberto:

Just for context, where's that coming from? So this is something that the league does or

Michelle:

Yes. Okay. They kind of So in the

Filiberto:

summer they or the winter

Michelle:

I don't know if they meet with like owners or general managers or something. They kind of like, we'll just we'll

Filiberto:

They do. The head coaches and stuff. Yeah.

Michelle:

They'll do a debrief of their prior season and and some things that, you know, they'll go back over the the complaints from coaches and their post games or during the games. And they'll review kind of what should be points of emphasis for the next season and for this season. Those areas include freedom of movement. So it's making sure if you're bringing the ball up the court that someone's not standing right in front of you. Like, if it's being passed to you, you need to be able to land and not be knocked over.

Michelle:

The offensive defensive three seconds violations. So if you're in the key on defense or offense, like for defense, you have to actively be defending a specific person. You can't just sit there with your arms up. Like, you have to be moving around. They've also increased fines and suspensions for flagrant and technical fouls.

Michelle:

So those are some things that players just have to like know about, contend with. But those are some areas the league is telling the referees we want you to focus on really seeing this and calling it when you're in the game.

Filiberto:

And so I think that's what we've been seeing in the first couple of games or the first weekend is maybe some not confusion, but just not being precise in trying to incorporate these, quote unquote, points of emphasis.

Michelle:

And I think some of just comes to your training too. Like, who put together like, if I'm a ref, I wanna see examples. So take some film from last year. Show me Like, for example, we want this called this year. Like, I just don't know how much time and efforts being invested into that training for the refs.

Michelle:

Like, that would be another big question for me is, again, not to defend refs because, you know, but you you have to help set people up for success to do their job well. And I'm just not sure that the league and historically, the league hasn't done that. So until I see it, you know, I don't know if that's happening.

Filiberto:

Yeah. Just trying to understand what they're dealing with. And if anybody knows, plea please put that in the comment section on the Instagram page.

Michelle:

Yeah. And I think just kinda like on the up and up, I think a lot of players they're, you know, they're making their experience known with this. But I think also some are just leaving that room that, hey, it's early in the season. You know, the refs do get these kind of like new points of emphasis and other direction are being given from the league. So let's give them some time to kind of adjust to that.

Michelle:

And so there are players that understand that adjustment period that's needed. So it's kinda like, hey, I'm not gonna be as loud. But if you're still doing this in 10 or 15 games, we need to really start having some conversations.

Filiberto:

And I think we are gonna see some adjustments. So it's something to keep an keep an eye on too.

Michelle:

Hopefully.

Filiberto:

Because everyone can understand and recognize this is too messy. And when officiating starts determining the outcome of games, that's where it becomes real problem too.

Michelle:

So for our last segment, we're gonna just kind of talk about what's really, really annoyed us this week or we wanna vent about something or wanna have a nice call in or interruption. So mine which I have titled I'm a stop you right there. For this week, any of you who have purchased the League Pass are probably having the same issues I'm having with it. When I use it on my TV, I'm having to like log in like every day.

Filiberto:

Every day. Every Time

Michelle:

Which gets a little annoying if if you have a long email address and or a very long, password. This is a little irritating.

Filiberto:

And and just so we're clear folks, like, there's not a game every day, but we watch every day.

Michelle:

Yes.

Filiberto:

And we use the League Pass. It's a great app. It's a great price. Like, we actually want to use it, enjoy using it, have a history of using it, and they're making it harder.

Michelle:

Yeah. And I will say there are times when I'm on the go, not at home. And so I am using the app on my phone. And obviously, there's more content on there because it's an it's an app. But you can watch the games on that as well.

Michelle:

I have not been asked to log in, like, at all. So it's like really weird. The clarity of the games, it's on a much smaller screen obviously, but the the clarity of the games is better. It's just that I can't see it as well. But it's just weird how like that experience is much better.

Michelle:

It feels like they are investing in that, which I get. But like, I gotta be able to also watch it on the big screen so I can just like catch the action a little bit better and take like better notes. And it's just it's really problematic. I'm sure the W's heard about the complaints and they're working on a solution. But let's just make sure that we're investing in like all of our entertainment and all of our experiences.

Filiberto:

Yeah. Because I think that's the unfortunate thing that happens as the league is developing is people are having a gentrified experience. If you have access to Amazon Prime, you can watch some games that other people can't. It's also that aspect of it too. If you tend to watch video more on your phone, you have an advantage.

Filiberto:

Like, it's the experience is way too bifurcated, if I can use that word correctly.

Michelle:

I think you did. Good job.

Filiberto:

Nice.

Michelle:

What about you?

Michelle:

What's your what are you gonna talk about this week?

Filiberto:

Mira homies.

Filiberto:

One of the things I've been thinking about a lot is this conversation around physicality. So one of the things that BIPOC folks, black folks, brown folks, you know, all the other folks of color think about a lot is how we have to code switch when we're interacting with white people or in white work environments, the way we have to change our accent, the words we use, all those different things. But we don't talk about how white people code switch in order to conceal their intentions or conceal their bias or conceal their prejudice. So I think this conversation around physicality is a very good example of how white folks code switch to conceal what their actual intention is.

Filiberto:

And when we talk about physicality both in the WNBA and in college women's basketball, it tends to be a real, real anti-Black, sentiment statement, dog whistle, whatever you wanna say. And Dawn Staley, that legend of college basketball and WNBA and whatever else she's ever done, I don't even know. I don't even know to what extent she's like she might be a legend in ping pong. I have no idea.

Filiberto:

But I assume that she is because she's that kind of person. She talked a lot about that as well. She talked a lot about how in I can't remember. I don't remember the year, but Lisa Bluder. Is that correct?

Filiberto:

Is that right? She talked about playing against South Carolina Gamecocks and saying that it was like fighting people, drunk brawlers.

Michelle:

Mhmm.

Filiberto:

And Dawn Staley had to get on that mic, and we'll put the video in the in the in the show notes. We talked about like, no. No. You cannot use that angle. You cannot say that we're thugs because that was said often.

Filiberto:

She sued other coaches for saying those things and won that lawsuit. So we have to really take seriously that when they talk about physicality, they're also talking about protecting certain types of players. And those players are white.

Michelle:

Who played for Lisa Bluder? Caitlin Clark.

Filiberto:

Caitlin Clark.

Filiberto:

So one of the things that is behind this too is that they

Filiberto:

one of the things that's hard to watch about the WNBA specifically and their content is they overemphasize white women players.

Michelle:

Who make up twenty, twenty five, maybe 30% of their actual players.

Filiberto:

Right. So Paige Bueckers doesn't have a great game, but they overemphasize her highlights and things, it's not Paige Bueckers's fault. Like, I got a lot of homies in Minnesota, so I'm not gonna be here talking shit about Paige Bueckers. But it's the way she gets treated represented, you know, just sort of put out as the artifice of the league. Whereas black women dominate.

Filiberto:

Black women are what bring this league and what makes it beautiful, interesting, you know, they bring their IQ to the court every day.

Michelle:

They founded this league.

Filiberto:

They founded this league. This league sits on their backs, like a lot of parts of American culture or US culture. And so they're making rules to benefit the play style of white women and to criminalize the play style of black women playing good defense.

Michelle:

Mhmm.

Filiberto:

That's really the unfortunate thing here. And I just you know, and because there's so many journalists that are really attached to the league that have come at it from a white male gaze in particular, they're not talking about this. In fact, they're supporting this narrative. They're encouraging it by not talking about the contributions and achievements and just exceptional play of black women and often just overemphasizing the mediocre play of white women.

Michelle:

MmmmHmm. But I think something that we're forgetting too is there there is there's always been a leap between college and the WNBA. And so how certain players deal with that leap, they've got to like expand certain areas of their game. They you know, some of them might still be on the tail end of their puberty years. Right? So they're you know, they try to do strength training, but they just can't quite put that muscle on until they get into their mid twenties.

Michelle:

Right? But so what some players have done like Paige Bueckers, she put on 15 pounds in the off season of of muscle. And so that's kinda how you combat some of that physicality. Cause like when we mentioned that word, a lot of it's just like it's a lighter person with less muscle being moved around by someone who just has been in league, has put on that muscle. So it's like there are ways to kind of like adjust your style of play and be able to compete.

Michelle:

White women have done it before. So like, I don't understand why we need to adjust the whole league's rules and style of play to adjust to a few people right now. Read between the lines there. But that is something that I think we need to have more, like you said, journalists or even fans to be a little more vocal about that. That's not weere we want our game to go.

Filiberto:

Yeah. And we think about the league too. There's maybe a what is it? A 130, 140 roster spots?

Michelle:

Mhmm.

Filiberto:

You're talking about the best. Yeah. The best of the best. You're not talking about, you know, UConn playing one of those minor colleges and beating them by 40 points. You're not talking about Iowa, again, playing some nonconference Midwest school that can't keep up with them.

Filiberto:

Like, you're talking about the best of the best, bringing their best every game. Yes. It's a physical game. They're fast. They're strong.

Filiberto:

Their IQ is off the charts. Like, you gotta step up to it. Yeah. Not expect it to bend to you. And that's the white entitlement that is really showing up right now, and that's really unfortunate to see.

Filiberto:

So that is one of the you know, we're fans of this league. We're fans of the Valkyries, but we also are not gonna ignore the injustices and the complications and the way the league is fucking this up and the way the Valkyries sometimes fuck this being owned by a billionaire and all those things. We don't ignore that. This isn't about escapism. This is about enjoying what we see on the court every day, every time we get a chance to go to a game, but also being critical of what we see the other parts that we also see, and these are the parts that we're seeing.

Filiberto:

The way the league is using, white code switching to ignore the fact that they're just trying to restrict the excellence of black women.

Michelle:

MmmHmmm. Yeah. We can be part of this. We can help build the the league, the, you know, women's basketball movement that we all want and deserve, and we're gonna we're gonna do that together.

Filiberto:

We're gonna

Michelle:

build it together.

Filiberto:

Absolutely. We are.

Michelle:

Thanks for listening and building community with us. Make sure you're following us on Instagram at PodWeGotNext , and subscribe at wegotnextpod.org.