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Join James Petrossi in 'Leave the Feed: 30 Days of Disconnect' as he interviews creators and mental health advocates about their journeys, the digital quagmire, and tips to create a healthier relationship with social media.
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James Petrossi: Hello and welcome to Leave the Feed 30 Days of Disconnect. Today is day 19 and a very special guest, my lovely wife, Samantha Petrossi. Samantha, welcome to the show
Samantha: James. Thanks for having me.
James Petrossi: Samantha. You're a strategist and expert in Human Insight and you've been studying humanity through culture for years now. How did your journey start and where are you today?
Samantha: I didn't know strategy existed as a profession and when I was a young kid, all I knew was I was really curious about the world around me. Like I would go to the library and take out books on psychology. A lot of times business psychology, which was an early interest of mine from a young age. I thought maybe I would explore the realm of or psychology.
My dad's a therapist, so [00:01:00] that kind of made sense to me in the early days. But as I grew older, I got really into fashion as just a way of self-expression and understanding the world around me. I think at the time there was so much to be learned from the way that people dressed and they were called to different styles and self-expression. Also seeing through the times, like what people chose to wear as a reflection of where we are as a society. I always found super interesting. So I studied that in college and I thought I wanted to go into fashion journalism. Ended up in fashion pr as it turns out, fashion PR isn't as deep as, maybe I had hoped it would be. it was a little bit more about going to parties and getting people into fashion week and all that good stuff, which was like a really fun first type of job, but. It wasn't exactly what I was interested in, so I was seeking this like deeper understanding of the human experience. But I also had a real love for business and entertainment [00:02:00] culture.
So I ended up at an entertainment agency, called Endeavor, where we were basically helping connect brands with cultural properties and that gave me more of. Understanding of how to actually learn the discipline of strategy. Even though I was always doing strategy in different aspects throughout my career, that was like my first real strategy role. And it was really interesting because we were at the forefront of culture, so we got to understand the shows that people were watching and the people they follow. So it expanded my world much farther beyond fashion, which I loved. and then from there I actually got more into the classical advertising space where. I was working at ad agencies. I moved to Austin, then I moved to LA more recently working for a top agency in LA and I love strategy. I mean, it helps me understand the world around me. I feel like it's a 24 7 job because you're always reflecting inward about why you do the things you do, and then you're also [00:03:00] looking outward to try to understand the world around you.
And that's the stuff that I would be doing. Like that's what I would be doing for fun. So it's really cool that I get to do that as a profession.
James Petrossi: I love the idea of using strategy and becoming a strategist to look inward and also look outward and define that balance. And I'm curious, like as a strategist, as someone who's been deeply ingrained in culture and bringing. Culture to life through brands, through partnerships, through different types of activations and storytelling.
How have you seen the social media landscape unfold, and how have you seen that unfolding impact the ecosystem of culture?
Samantha: It's really interesting because when I first. Got into this industry, social media was just starting. I remember when Instagram first came out and it was all about how to create this perfect grid and this aspirational imagery. And then when TikTok [00:04:00] came out, it introduced this whole new level of chaos and it was basically the opposite of Instagram and that people didn't wanna curate this perfect world.
They just wanted to like let it all out. I feel like we're still in that era now of TikTok, and TikTok has really dominated the landscape in a way that none of us could have predicted. I think what's interesting for brands is when I first started, it was about helping brands break into an influence culture, and now I feel like it's so hard for brands to keep up with where things are going and to actually like insert themselves in a meaningful way because it's one thing for a creator to create some type of viral content.
It's another for a brand to try and do that. A lot of times it doesn't feel authentic. So I think that's really the trick of like where we are right now with working with brands and social media is how do you engage in a way that's like actually authentic to your brand? That doesn't just try to on to where the trends are going, but actually like has a unique voice within this landscape.
James Petrossi: And what's it been like with your [00:05:00] own social media usage and adoption during this period? You know, when did you adopt, how did you adopt, and how do you use social media today?
Samantha: I was an earlier adopter of Facebook, I guess. I don't think I ever really participated in MySpace, but Facebook was at the time, a closed circle of people that could only apply who were in college. It wasn't this like wide open world, it was truly a way to get to know your fellow classmates. And so that I found interesting and that was actually like a useful tool at the time. It also just wasn't that addictive. It was more of a thing that you would clock into once a week just to see if anyone had uploaded new photos and then you'd clock out. You weren't really tempted to endlessly scroll. I think the Facebook didn't even have a feed at that point, so it was more about truly getting in touch with. People directly and going to their profile, reaching out to them. Like, that's how I met my roommate at the time. We connected on Facebook and we got to talk a little bit [00:06:00] before we met each other, so it was really more of like a one-to-one communication tool. And then I, I adopted Instagram when it first came out, but what I didn't love about Instagram was I felt like I was walking through the world thinking about how I could capture. A photo, like, I'm like, would this make a good photo? You know, when you're on vacation you're like, would this make a good photo? I didn't love how that was constantly in the back of my mind when I was doing experiences. So I stopped using Instagram probably like, I dunno, six years ago at this point where I just stopped posting.
And I'll still log on occasionally just to see, you know, what's going on with people in my life that I haven't talked to in a long time. But. It's very occasional and I never post. So I think over the years I've definitely grown more cautious of how much I use it and why, because what I don't personally enjoy is just endlessly scrolling through different people's posts and content. [00:07:00] I find that to just not be a rewarding experience.
James Petrossi: It brings us to today's discussion, which is really about, you know, surviving or thriving, and I feel like sometimes in this world. We can feel like we're all alone. And it could be you in a room with an ambition or a goal and feeling, how do I achieve this? I feel like I have the weight of the world on my shoulders.
It could be the feeling of isolation from endless scrolling and just feeling like all these people are doing all of these awesome things. I don't measure up and it's causing me anxiety and depression. And you know, we're in this section on reconnecting with loved ones and how important it is to have that network of people behind you, those friends, those families, that inner circle.
But sometimes before we can even get there, we really need to do some work on ourself to make sure that we're available for those people we're available. To have those connections. And I'm [00:08:00] curious, from your own expertise in the wellness space, what are your practices that help you stay grounded, that help you stay present and available when you work with creators in your business, when you're at home, when you're with family, and when you're with friends?
Samantha: I definitely am a bit more of an introvert, so I need a lot of time to myself, and something that helped me was just doing a quick meditation in the morning before I leave for the day. I'm not perfect at it, but I've definitely gotten a lot better at making time for that in the morning. I feel like it's helpful in just noticing any tension that's in your body and releasing it. So, you know, for me, sometimes I'll wake up with a feeling of anxiety or like my thoughts will start running about everything I have to do that day. So just taking five minutes in the morning to just sit with yourself is really important. I also am really huge on working out, and I do that probably four days a week at least. [00:09:00] for me that's just a way of like getting out all the energy from the day and releasing it. It's almost like a good sauna, which I also do the sauna. it's a way to kind of purge any weird energy, anything that happened so far that day or if you wake up in a weird mood, it's like great to just go work out 'cause it can kind of reset your mood entirely. And then also getting outside and taking walks, I feel like is really important and something that I don't always get to do during the day. But when I do and I just take like a half hour break to a little walk around where we live, it completely resets me. So I would say those are the main three things, is getting a quick meditation in, in the morning, out or sauna. ideally both, and getting outside and taking a walk. And I find that I do those things alone, I'm able to just be more present for people in my life and able to [00:10:00] give more energy to them because I feel like my batteries recharged. It's really hard to be there for people when you're super busy and just running around and you haven't done those things for yourself. You just feel like depleted and, and like you have nothing left to give. So I try to prioritize that.
James Petrossi: And then when it comes to the relationships themselves, how do you manage the relationships between. You know, your close network at home and your close network at work, and then friends, because as we're navigating these different environments, we need to have presence with each other, but we also have to have an, an understanding that these people are going through their own challenges, their own life, and to make space for ourselves to connect with someone else and to make sure we give them space.
It's a tangled mess sometimes in there. And I think for a lot of us, it's hard to understand [00:11:00] how do I even manage these relationships, these close ones. You know, it's easier if we're online, right? All you have to do is hit a like button, a love button, make a quick comment, and you feel like there's that connection.
But when you're really working to foster. This true support network, you know, how do you make it happen and how do you make sure that you're able to give that space to other people?
Samantha: Yeah, it's interesting. As you get older, I feel like your network of friends becomes a lot smaller I'm okay with that personally because I just don't feel
James Petrossi: I.
Samantha: have that much free time and energy to dedicate. I think friendships take a lot of work and so you have to be ready to give that time. So, you know, I have like a handful of good friends that I keep in touch with fairly regularly, but when I say regularly, it might just be once a month where we reach out over text and we have a text exchange or. A few times a year that we get on the phone together. So it's not super frequent. A lot of my [00:12:00] friends are back east. A lot of my friends that I still have in my life are old friends from like 10 plus years ago. So it becomes harder to maintain those relationships. But I think. Setting a reminder, whether it's just a mental note or an actual reminder in your phone to reach out to people, I think can be very helpful just to keep track of those relationships.
Because if you don't, sometimes a whole year can go by and, and not because you don't love each other and miss each other, but just because you're both really busy. So I think that's one thing, is just reminding yourself to reach out, even if it's just a simple text and. Also, I mean, I think I'm a pretty good listener and people often call me to talk through things.
So being a good friend when people need you, which can sometimes just mean listen and being there for them in a conversation. So that is often like the role that I play in my relationships. And then for family members, it's kind of the same thing [00:13:00] where you have to just make a constant effort to reach out because everyone's busy.
I think not taking things too personally is also a big part of nurturing relationships, and if you don't hear from someone or they're not showing up for you in the way that you want them to, remembering that it's not something against you, it's just. the most important character in their own life, you know? So that's really, I think, been the big learning for me is to not take things personally and also to not be afraid to make the effort I have. For example, standing phone calls with my parents, like once a week, just so that we have time to connect with each other because my schedule's so busy that it's hard for me to just answer the phone if they might call on a random day. So that's helpful. And then being there for the really important moments in person. Like my, my family had a big reunion recently and I made the effort to come out for that because there were people that were gonna be there that I hadn't [00:14:00] seen in 10 years, and I might not see them for another 10 years.
So finding those in person moments where it's really important for you to be there for people, I think is another aspect to nurturing those relationships. Because the reality is if you don't see people in person, it's really hard to maintain that connection. Even if it's infrequent, making the effort every once in a while is helpful.
James Petrossi: Yeah, making that effort is so important. I think there's two things we're talking about when we think about making that effort. It first is the effort that we make for ourselves. How are we nurturing that inner experience economy, whether it's through exercise, meditation, journaling, anything that helps instill that sense of self-love and self-worth.
Sometimes it's extremely important for creators, right, to find that self-worth outside of the numbers, to find it in the natural environment, and then making that space for. Loved ones, friends, family, and making sure that we create moments [00:15:00] where it's more than just a digital, like it's more than just a thumbs up.
It's a real positive, authentic connection. And what I'm hearing from you is that like it's a delicate balance, right? And you gotta make sure that you protect your own energy. But the only way that you can get more energy is almost by reaching out to these other people because. They fill you with a sense of worth that you can't get when you're alone.
Samantha: For sure, and I also think there's to reevaluating the relationships in your life every so often, because what you don't wanna do is be in a situation where you just have these people from. Lifetimes ago that have followed you for whatever reason, but you have no similar interests. You can't really connect on anything they're bringing you down in some weird way.
So it's okay to also say, this relationship isn't for me. I think doing bit of an audit because everyone grows in different [00:16:00] directions and like that's okay. Sometimes people are just meant to be in your life for. Or a reason is that, is that the saying reason of say so I, I think there's also no harm in reevaluating your friendships and deciding that certain people don't need to be there anymore.
James Petrossi: And extending that audit to your digital relationships. You know the people that you're following are the people that show up in your feed. Are they there because they're so bizarre and strange and otherworldly that you can't pull your attention off of them? But is that. Same destructiveness causing you distress like as what they're doing in their life and the destructive behavior innately causing you distress.
Or who are the people in your feed that are bringing you joy, that are bringing you laughter, and that that's really hard to find that balance because things are popping up all the time that. Or out of our control. And I think it's just so important that we try to [00:17:00] make like some sense of like, how am I managing my digital environment?
How am I managing my physical environment, and how do I make sure that I actually feel like I have not just 10,000 a million followers, whatever it may be. But I actually have like. A true support network around me, and I am a beacon of light in that support group, right? I'm not just asking for things, but there's a natural reciprocity that's happening inside of those relationships.
And I'm curious for you, like when you are able to strike that balance between the inner experience economy and the outer world and friendships. What does that reciprocity feel like and how does it propel you further in life to have that support, you know, inward and outward?
Samantha: Yeah, it feels energizing when there's reciprocity for sure. And you feel like there's a network of people that are carrying you in a way. [00:18:00] And if you don't feel that reciprocity. It's okay to vocalize that too, if you feel like your relationships are only going one way, but you value those relationships, you can be honest and say something, what's the worst that can happen? You know, I think we feel, we get like really freaked out about these things and I've done this before in the past where I've vocalized to someone that, hey, I feel like when we get on the phone, you know, it's just a one way conversation. They're all like, oh my gosh, I had no idea. I'm embarrassed. They just, a lot of times people just aren't aware and it's okay to call out the thing, and that kind of honesty is what leads to good relationships, and it's okay if they react in a weird way.
It's more about you expressing yourself and it off your chest and not just sweeping it under the rug because it's gonna come out at some [00:19:00] point. It's better for you to just be honest. So I think if there's not that reciprocity, I would just encourage you to vocalize it if no other outcome than just to get it off your chest.
James Petrossi: You brought up a good point about these relationships. Take work takes vocalizing how you're feeling. It takes nurturing to find that reciprocity and it doesn't mean that a person that relied on you yesterday you might rely on tomorrow, right? There's always this give and take. I think for. A lot of the people listening they might be Gen Z and they might say, Hey, like, you know, my world's different.
Like I have all of these relationships that I have to manage and I might feel overwhelmed in that. And as we look to this section of the book, which is about reconnecting with loved ones on this journey, and what is your hope or your encouragement for anyone out there that might be saying, you know. [00:20:00] I have all these connections.
I have family I know that cares about me, but I'm sort of isolated in this world, and I might not even feel like I'm at a place where I can actively identify, these are the relationships that I need to work on. I might feel overwhelmed with the relationship with myself, like, where do I even get started?
How do I begin to make myself available and present? To identify and nurture this inner circle that's gonna be so important for the future of my wellbeing and, you know, my ability to create and make money doing so.
Samantha: Yeah, I would definitely say quality over quantity is a good first rule of thumb. If there are people that are on the fringes, whether that's digital relationships or people you know, in person that aren't in that inner circle. It doesn't mean you have to cut them out of your life, just don't spend your attention on them and attention is so valuable. For example, you mentioned before that there's people that have [00:21:00] of followers and maybe they're following thousands of people, what percentage of those people do you actually admire and enjoy or you just hate following them because you don't like them and you wanna see them fail and you're hoping that they'll post something that will make you feel better about your own life?
You know, I think like doing first that kind of assessment of. Who are the people you're keeping in your life, whether it's digital or in real life, and do you truly have love for them? Are you just keeping them around for another weird motivation? And sometimes we don't realize that we're doing those things until we actually ask ourselves that honest question. So I mean, I know people that follow people that they don't like. So the question is, why are you doing that? You know, why are you inviting that negativity into your life? Or maybe it's not that you don't like them, but they're people that cause you jealousy or some other kind of pain. it's an ex that you're following, like, why are you following them?
You know what I mean? Just, it's just a share of consciousness that you don't need to [00:22:00] occupy. So I would say first focus on that inner circle and weed out those people that you're keeping in your life for another. that's not for your higher good. And if you're confused about who to keep in that inner circle, just sitting with yourself and asking yourself, how does this person make me feel? And really listen to that feeling that comes up for you. You might start to feel a little queasy or anxious or elated. Joyful loving. Like those are very different emotions and I think that will be a good guide to help you understand who is actually in your inner circle. And then next is setting up some kind of a system so that you can maintain, touch and contact and take it personally if, that doesn't go both ways at first, setting it up into such a way where you feel like you're reaching out regularly or you're showing up in person in a way that. [00:23:00] Makes you feel good. And then finally, if you're not feeling that reciprocity, being honest and vocalizing that and sharing what you need from that relationship. And then it's up to you if that person can't meet your needs, whether it's friends or family, it's up to you if you wanna continue putting in that energy. but always keeping in mind that like things aren't personal, people are just wrapped up in their own lives. So I think those would be the three recommendations that I would have for people to nurture those relationships and also getting outside of your screen and into real life. think the things that fill my cup so much are those IRL connections.
For example, sometimes I go to a book club and there's always different random people that show up to that. And it's interesting because the people that show up, you're like, I would never choose to cross paths with you, but here we are. And isn't this like [00:24:00] interesting? There's a element of serendipity that happens when you put yourself in a real life situation. And so how do you get outside of your comfort zone and just start showing up to things that can strike up a new friendship or a relationship and. It doesn't have to be such a controlled environment where you know exactly what you're walking into. do you push yourself to just show up to a thing and strike up a conversation with someone and see what happens from there? And I think especially with a younger generation and dating, that can be so hard because everyone's online dating. But I would just encourage people to get back out there in real life and just talk to people.
James Petrossi: Yeah, that's great advice. I mean, especially when we think about those friends, right? And that circle family members, you know, family members are sometimes a little bit more. Tried and true and you, you know, who's gonna be there for you and you know who you're gonna be there for. With friendships, we start looking at, you [00:25:00] know, leaving adolescents to early adulthood, you know, that transition from high school to college, and sometimes we hold on to the past, sometimes we move forward.
But as we progress through life into these different life stages from, you know. Early adulthood to middle adulthood when we start to get into our late twenties and thirties. You know, there becomes a time where we almost go through this like shedding of friendships and that shedding isn't something we need to do all the time, but we have to be conscious that as we are getting older, we can't hold on.
To everything and every one. And when we try to, we sometimes just get those surface level interactions digitally, and we might feel like we know the person, we might feel like we know what they're going through, but we're just seeing snippets. We're seeing highlight reels, we're seeing an emotional post.
But if we were actually to pick up the phone and talk to that person, what would the nature of that relationship be like? So [00:26:00] critically important that we make sure that we understand. There's expansion periods as we're younger, but to embrace the contraction periods as well.
Samantha: for sure. Think about all the different phases you go through in life. In college, for example, you may have your party friends, but then as you get a bit older party friends don't have as much relevance, then you're forced to understand, is this someone I'd actually wanna sit down and have just a coffee with and not be going out with?
And what would that conversation be like? I know for me personally, like a big thing that I look for in my new relationships is just a curiosity about world around you and, and spirituality and because, just because I love talking about those things and I think that search for more like-minded people. There's a lot of people that aren't interested in that, and that's okay. You know, it just doesn't mean that that's necessarily people that I wanna choose to be my longer term friends moving forward. [00:27:00] But then there are some people in my life that I still dear and that don't have those interests, but because we have so much history, because really there for me and I'm there for them, it's a really meaningful relationship. So. There are people that are worth keeping around for sure, that you have history with, and that's important. But when you think about the new friends that you wanna keep in your life or acquire in your life, try to think about the values you have and what's important to you and who you wanna invite into your world.
Because our energy's so precious, and I think there was a, I don't know who said this, but. Basically you're the sum of the five people that you hang out with the most. So who are those five people? And I know for me, like you're one of those five people, which is probably why our minds meld a lot and we have a lot of similarities.
But these people do rub off [00:28:00] on you, right? Whether it's physical connections, your digital connections, you become the product of those connections. So being really mindful about who you led into that, that inner circle. Because that's who you become.
James Petrossi: Well, thank you so much. This has been so insightful, so wonderful, and it's so nice to know that I am one of the people in your inner circle.
Samantha: Yeah.
James Petrossi: Well, thank you. I appreciate you Samantha. You've been an absolutely phenomenal guest, and for those of you listening, please sure leave the feed with a friend. Don't be afraid to disconnect and have an epic day. Thanks again, Samantha.
Samantha: Bye.