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Men Talking Mindfulness is a weekly podcast on men’s mental health, mindfulness, meditation, overall wellness, and leadership, hosted by retired Navy SEAL Commander Jon Macaskill and Stanford University Ambassador of Compassion Will Schneider. New episodes every Monday.
This show is for men who are doing fine on paper and know something is still off. Leaders, operators, veterans, tradesmen, dads... anyone carrying real pressure and tired of pretending it isn’t there. Every week Jon and Will sit down with psychiatrists, performance coaches, combat veterans, authors and everyday men to talk honestly about what we are all dealing with and what actually helps. Stress, sleep, anger, loneliness, focus, fatherhood, faith, testosterone, grief, burnout, and the daily practices that help a man come back to himself. No posturing. No lectures. Real conversations, real tools, and a mindfulness practice you can actually use.
Past guests include Jocko Willink, Mark Divine, Howard Behar, Rich Diviney, Dr. James Doty, Steven Pressfield, John Eldredge, and Dr. Mark Gordon.
Jon served 24 years in the Navy, 17 of them as a SEAL, and now teaches mindfulness and meditation to leaders in construction, engineering, manufacturing and defense. Will has taught yoga and mindfulness in New York City for nearly two decades and strips the fancy words away so the practices stick. Together they co-founded Focus Now Training and the Awareness to Action community.
If you have been told to meditate and never understood why it should matter to you, start here. Mindfulness will not make your stress disappear. It changes your relationship with it. That is the whole game.
Find the full back catalog, show notes and ways to work with Jon and Will at mentalkingmindfulness.com. Join the community at awareness2action.com.
Hey guys, we have a favor to ask before the show begins. The algorithm, if you follow a show, will deliver you the best episodes from that show very prominently in your feed. When we have our best episodes on the show, the most shared episodes, the most rated episodes, we would love for you to know. A simple way for you to know that is to hit that follow button. Also, it's simple and easy and it's a free thing you can do to help us make the show better. We'd be hugely grateful if you could take a minute on whatever app you're listening to right now and hit that follow button. Thank you so, so, so much. Now back to the show. All right, we're doing something a little bit different today and I'm just going to start out by asking my brother Will here.
Will, how are you, brother? You know, I'm doing all right. I'm doing all right, you know? Yeah. Yeah. And I know that's the standard response, right? When you ask a brother, that's, that's normally what you're going to get. But I want to know more, man. How are you doing? I mean, I tell you, I've never lived such a full life than I have ever in the last, like since mid July until now. Like, it's been, yeah. You know what? That you've never lived such a full life. People are going to hear that and they're going to think, oh, great. Will's living this happy, hunky dory life.
Explain more about what you mean by that word full right now. Well, some of it is happy. It's a full spectrum. Like I've, you know, I mean, honestly, without getting into too, too many specifics, just to like honor. There's a lot of family shit going down right now. And, you know, I just want to respect my, my parent or my family, where they are, what they're doing. But I thought like this might be a good opportunity just to talk about how, you know, when, when shit goes down, you know, how do you show up? And, and it's I'm pretty shocked at how I'm managing things right now. You know, and the full spectrum is like, you know, I have, you know, the love of my life. She's been away for like four months or actually just for three months or three and a half months.
She just came back to town. It's great to see her. It's great to be here with her. It's great to, you know, rediscover that relationship since she's been away for so long. And, you know, she's such a wonderful woman and I get to, you know, just, just have these wonderful, just wonderful time with her. But at the same time, almost like, and the pendulum kind of swings the other way, you know, my father is not doing well at all. You know, we actually, sadly, we might lose him in the next few weeks, which is, which is just, you know, I mean, I, this is the fucking time that you just, just dread, you know, I've a time that I've always kind of dreaded is like kind of here. And at the same time as that's happening with my father and my family, you know, I have my brother, sustained a massive injury, which is going to keep him down for probably a year or more.
And, and then managing all of that with my older brother as well. So it's like, it's just been a lot. I mean, it's been a tremendous amount of travel going back and forth, you know, I live in Pennsylvania. And, and just managing, you know, all the responsibilities of what needs to be done. You know what I mean? It's just like, I was just thrown all this stuff and you never really prepare for it, but it's like, here you go, figure it out. Yeah. You've gone into go mode, fix it mode, admin mode, right? And a hundred percent at the same time, you have this mix of emotions with, with your girlfriend being back in town and you've got the other side of the spectrum. You've got some pain, some sadness.
Mm-hmm. And you're probably pretty stretched thin too, right? Like, yeah, I don't want to put words in your mouth. What, what, what do you feel on that? Well, it's like, it's amazing what happens when, when something happens like this with your family, like how priorities, you know, shit that doesn't matter, stuff that is just bullshit, a waste of time, just immediately evaporates, like evaporates. Honestly, like until this moment, like I feel very charmed. I feel very lucky. Like everything is just cruising along. Things are going well. I'm traveling. I'm doing this. I'm teaching. I'm in New York. I'm having fun. You know, like great friends, you know, the show, like everything we're building here.
I'm just like, I'm living in a great groove. And all of a sudden it's just like, bang, like, here you go. Here's life. Here's real life. You know, I mean, that's all real too, but it's just all this creativity and fun. And, you know, so it's been very different. And it's amazing, like how things are also immediately prioritized for you. Like I need to be there for my, for my family to be there for my mom, who's like now in a, in a, in a, in a kind of more of a compromised position because, you know, my dad's not around as much right now because he's, he's in a facility. My brother's not around either. He's been living at home with my parents for a little while. And so he's not there. And now I'm like managing things, you know, me and my brother are doing a lot of things.
And, and but also it's like, we have a lot of work we're doing with, with the show, with Awareness to Action course, with, you know, I was, we're down in North Carolina teaching at a conference, you know, I'm, I'm heading out to actually Stanford this weekend to go speak, which I'm really excited about, like other great things that are happening. So it's just like this full spectrum of experience. And now it's just like what, you know, time is so limited. That's another thing I'm really finding. It's just like the time that a lot of this takes is just, it's in every, the priorities just come into play, just what's, what's needed, what's not needed. And just making things happen, you know, but also it's like, there's this, you know, this, this service that's kind of woken up, but just like, I need to be that guy.
And it, and it's kind of feels good in a lot of ways to be able to show up for people like that. I mean, even though it, it, this is so much of this is very heavy and disheartening. But it's just amazing to kind of wake up a side of me that I didn't, I kind of, I guess I knew was there. But at the same time I'm happy it is, you know, you said, I need to be that guy. Say more about that.
Well, the guy that, yeah, I need to be that guy to get shit done. I need to be a guy that's like Johnny on the spot. I need to be the guy that's like being the advocate. I need to be the guy that's like standing up for people that I love in a great way. I need to be the guy that needs to like to, to really push sometimes like dealing with like healthcare companies, you know, they, they really don't give a shit. They really don't care. I mean, all the, I got to say all the health professionals in the health system, spot on. They're great people, really great people. And their hands are tied, but we're in this like, you know, healthcare system, like some call it the sick care system. It really is because they just want to keep you sick and they just want to keep money flowing. But you got to really fight.
And that's just really disheartening for me because like, you know, a service oriented guy in a lot of ways and I'm generous. I want to help people and to have it like the exact op, you're in a system that exact is, that is exactly the opposite. Just like it adds a level of frustration that I wish wasn't there, but it is, but that's like, all right, well, I got to be that fucking warrior, you know, for them. That's another way I'm showing up for them. Being that guy, you know, driving all over the place, just driving, driving, driving so much, so much driving. I live in New York. My family's like three hours away, you know, hospital visits, you know, coordinating with different family. I got to be the guy that's like coordinating with, Hey, it's like, you know, this is what's going on over here.
This is how to get in touch. This is where to go. Like, you know, so many different phone calls from so many different people saying, Hey, let me know. I can help. What do you need me to do? You know, connecting with people that I haven't talked to in a while, you know, and just, and just taking it all in. And it's so much at once sometimes. So, so much at once, especially when kind of the initial hit and you just make it work. You just find a fucking way to make it work. So right now your role has kind of switched from being the son or one of the three sons in the family to being the provider and protector, or at least the protector in a sense. What does that role cost you? And specifically, what does it cost you when the thing, whatever it is that you're working on, the fixer, right?
You're the fixer. Maybe that's a better word than the protector. When that thing can't be fixed. What's that costing you, man? It's, I mean, it's, it's just, it's, it's been, it's just been hard. It's been heavy. You know, it's like, I, I, I, I mean, what is costing me? It's, I don't really feel like that is costing me. You know, I mean, honestly, I don't feel like it's costing me much in the sense of like, it's not even about me anymore. It's not. You know, that's where it's not even fucking about me. It's like, it's like, what do they need? What do I need to do? I mean, yes. Like I have responsibilities with our business, with the, with the life I have in New York. Like one thing that I've been really kind of battling with, with, with just a massive time consumption with what's going on in the family right now is not trashing my fucking business that I've been building for like 15 years.
You know, and that's, I mentioned to protect, that's where I, where, where I'm trying to be the protector, but also be, you know, the guy that's trying to be really flexible in the sense of like having great conversation with you. It's amazing. Like how many other people that we've people that have kind of plugged into the business, many, many people, friends here in New York that are, are, that are just really good friends of mine in my network. And now just people are showing up in that regard as well. So I'm trying to just, just assess, like, what needs to get done, what's moving the needle forward, what's the priorities of what I need to do with the business, scheduling, you know, making sure that happens.
And if it can't, it can't because the higher priority is take care of my, my people, take care of my family. And, and then as far as whatever they need, it's whatever they need, you know, I mean, and if there's bullshit in that area, whatever, you know, stuff that isn't important or isn't priority, then I'm just like, you know, I gotta, like, I can't do everything. I just can't do everything, you know? So, yeah. Yeah. So that, that leads me to my next question, you know, realizing that you can't do everything. What do you tell yourself when, when you have to put something down? I'm doing the best I can is what I say a lot of the time. So that's a bit, that's a big mantra between my brother and I as well, because it's not just me doing this.
My big brother, he's, he's, you know, he's, we're, we're taking on the burden together and it's not even a burden. That's a bad word. That's not the word we're doing what we need to do together. The responsibility we're doing, we need to do together. And it's actually helping our relationship, which I really, which is great, you know, and, and just strengthening it. You know, I feel like we're, you know, we were really close as we, when we were younger and, you know, like we, we, we followed different paths. We live different lives. Like we are close, but this is like, I feel like we're almost in the fort together. You know what I mean? Like when I, when we were kids, like 10, you know what I mean? Yeah. You remember the fort?
Yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly. You're in the fort. Like, you know, it's like you're riding the bikes, you're doing a thing, you know what I mean? Like whatever it is, you're just, you're, you're, you're chopping the wood. Like we used to chop a lot of wood at my dad back in the day and a wheelbarrow and stacking the wood and bringing the wood to the basement. I feel like it's like kind of that again, in some regards, and we're finding a way through it together, but it's like, the stakes are fucking like, you know, the stakes are, it's not, the stakes are not like, you know, like just going to get yelled at by dad, but not whenever doing this a certain time or whatever. Now it's like, fuck, I mean, people's lives and people's, you know, timing is so important with all this.
So, yeah, I'm sorry, what was the, what was the, what was the, what was the kind of, I feel like I'm not answering some of the questions. No, man, I was just saying, like, hey, all good. Like, I mean, this, even the way that you're answering the question shows where your mind's at, right? Your mind is on so many different things. And the question was like, like when you do have to put something down, what do you do? And you said something about sharing it with your brother, right? Sharing with your other brother. So yeah. What do you tell yourself? Yeah. Doing the best. I'm just, I'm doing the best I can. And day to day, literally it's day to day, moment to moment, because things, you know, especially in the beginning have, have, there's so much input, so much information coming in from where doctors, healthcare, you know, family, nurses, what I, I mean, every part of the system as well as every part of the system.
The family. So it's like, and then, you know, just taking, you know, listening to people's advice and opinions and like, just like, and not, you know, just, just being calm, present, good natured, well-meaning, but knowing that, you know, but there's no, but it's just like, it just, but staying, keeping top of mind. It's like, what is needed right now? What is the goal? And then how do I accomplish that goal? Is, is a lot of it. And it's just literally, Chris and I together, my big brother, it's like day to day, moment by moment. And we're, and literally, we've said many times to each other, which has been really nice to, to, to hear from him. And, and for me to say to him is like, we're doing the best we can.
Cause it's like, nobody prepares you for this. Nobody fucking prepares you for this. And like, you know, I've had thoughts about, you know, making YouTube videos or like, or something like make, we have our podcast and be like, you know what? Like I could just go do a fucking master's course at this point in some of this shit because it is like, it is, it is, you know, deal with my power of attorney. I fucking need a good power of attorney. You know what I mean? Like I, like, well, and then, oh, just navigating how to put that into play. It was just like, oh my God. People still fax, Jon, you know, that here's a little rant, you know, people still fax, you know, and you just can email something like, no, you got to fax it. Like who the fuck has a fax machine?
It's 2026. They're like, oh, oh, we don't, we don't fax. I'm like, okay, great, great. Thank you for putting another obstacle in my way that I need to solve, which, and those days, those times, those hours, those, you know, cause the business closes at a certain time another day, you know, it's, it's just the frustration, Jon, and some of this stuff is, is real. It's very real and hard. I'm feeling it. I mean, I'm, I'm feeling it. I saw how you lit up there, right? And, and expressed your frustration in, in the, the healthcare space. And, you know, you express your support for those in healthcare, but also the administrative side of it and the financial side of it. Don't give a fuck, dude. It's all about the money.
And then the faxing instead of emailing, I saw the frustration. I felt it. Yeah. Yeah. That's just awful. That's kind of leads me to my next question is, is guilt anger, numbness, the urge to fix. It's all these emotions coming up for, for you. What's what do you say is showing up the most? I mean, frustration at the same time, you've got the love, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I know. I mean, it's like, yeah, it's, it's like, I mean, frustration, a lot of it, you know, and it is, is probably one of the big, is the big emotion in a lot of ways. And then there's the sadness and like, you know, and, and, and the confusion and I don't know. I mean, I'm at a loss for some of the emotions. Cause I just, I've never been in such a situation that requires so much. And, and like, and again, full spectrum, it's like it at this, where I am right now, it just hits every, every, every fucking emotion.
Like literally, I think it's like, I don't know what else it can be unless someone, you know, came and fucked me over. That's like, that's the only thing that'd be left. And the frustration, the anger, the sadness, the love, the support, all that you're feeling, what's that doing to you physically? Is it affecting your sleep? Is it affecting your fuse, right? Do you have a shorter fuse or are you dropping things here and there? I mean, what does that look like? Well, I'm definitely, I'm surprised my sleep hasn't been impacted as much as I think it would be. There seems to be some nights that, you know, that maybe it is impacting it, but it's just like, part of it is I just want to get into the day.
I just want to be able to get stuff done. Like a great example is like, you know, as all this is going down, you and I have a deadline. I'll kind of tease a little bit. Like we're going to be in Mindful magazine, you know, and I'm very excited about that. It's coming out in January. And we have to write like for the second time. So yeah, first time, first time in the electronic version, second time, this is going to be in print. This is in motherfucking print, which is great. I'm very excited about it. Cause it's like that magazine. I see it in my, in my parents' grocery store, which is awesome. So maybe we'll be on the cover, you know, and I want to honor that. I want to honor us. I want to honor the voice that we've created, the platform we've created, you know, so it was, you know, there I'd have to take, like, this is actually could kind of maybe a way to frame so much of what's going on. And it's like, I'd have to get up really early and I usually do anyway.
And I would just at least give myself like 90 minutes or two hours just to sit and write and just to work on this piece. And cause we had a deadline too. So that was, you know, helpful, the deadline. But also it's like created a sense of urgency and a little bit of stress, but like, I would just, I would just do it, do it, do it, do it. And then, you know, I'm home a lot with my mom during this time. And I would just actually, I'd enroll my mom. I'd read it to my mom. Yeah. And I was just like, she'd, she'd input and help me a little bit, you know? So that was a nice little connection, me and my mom. Like, cause she, you know, she, she does consume some of what we do, but they actually hear it in our voice and that kind of stuff.
Like I thought it was a really nice moment. And then the literally that would be, and it's like maybe 7:30 in the morning. And then it was like till fucking nine o'clock, 10 o'clock at night. It was just like, just being that guy, being that guy for the family, being the go-to guy, being a fixer, communicate. Yeah. All the stuff that I just talked about earlier had to happen when I'm in New York. It's weird when I'm back here. Like I kind of like, I'm in the zone, you know? And, you know, there's still a lot of phone calls, not so much now, but in those first, like six weeks was, was two months was intense. And we're in a different place right now as a family. It's like October. So it has been a little while since things, things have changed a little bit.
I mean, I guess I was kind of, I was, I'm surprised, Jon, honestly, I was surprised I wasn't more stressed out. I wasn't more overwhelmed. I'm surprised I didn't have a fucking panic attack or, or whatever. And I really, I, you know, I, this, this all the work that I've done on my own journey of meditation and yoga and mindfulness has, it's like, it's worked. This shit works. And it's like, I talked to a good friend of mine the other day. He goes, no one gives you a manual for this shit. And I was like, yes. And the manual that should be given is like, find your calm center. Cause that's the only place you can work from. That's it. I mean, that's it. What does that look like for you, man? Like, like when are, when are you turning to that?
I mean, clearly we are Men Talking Mindfulness. You have a practice of your own. You teach yoga. Yeah. But in this specific, let's say Will prior to the proverbial stuff hitting the fan versus Will now, what are you doing differently? And what are you falling back on that is helping you through all this, through this? Well, definitely when things get really like, you know, I feel sometimes when I'm about to boil over, you know, like a pressure cooker, you got to let out the steam getting in a gym and really doing a sweaty, hard workout. That has been very helpful, like very helpful. Like, you know, just getting that energy out. I mean, because it, you know, the body is a house is the way one of my teachers like to explain it. I appreciate this metaphor, you know, and this house, you can hoard a lot of fucking trash in it, a lot of trash.
And if you don't, if you don't let that trash out or you don't let the steam out, you know, open the windows once in a while and like air it out, it just, it could just get really ugly. And, and that's, I don't want to be that guy on the other side of that. Of, of like building up the pressure. So, you know, and you know, like, I mean, as, as many of you probably do, and I'm sure it's, it's a case for almost all of us. It's like family knows how to push buttons. Family, you know, knows how to, I'm not saying anything to anybody, you know, they just, they just, they know how to, they're not even like trying to push the buttons. I'm probably pushing the buttons myself, just, you know, whatever, just by past habits and experiences, stuff like that.
But like, it's a, you got to get out, you got to get that energy out. So going to the gym, breath work, meditation, I try to get into the sun every day. Like my parents have a great like sunrise. So I just want, I just go in the sun, do some movement, you know, find my breath, sit in meditation, visualize a good day and really, and just try to stay calm. Just stay calm. Really, really, really calm as much as I possibly can. So, yeah, impacting, like it really hasn't impacted the way I eat. Like I don't stress eat, but thankfully, cause I mean, I probably put on 20 fucking pounds at this point. You know, it, it does impact when I do go to sleep, when I do eat sometimes. But again, I'm doing the best I can just day by day.
That's it. You said staying calm, right? And in this storm that life is thrown at you, if someone just came up to you and said, Hey, Will, stay calm. You know, that's not going to work. Right. What do you see as the difference between regulating your emotions and suppressing them?
Well, being aware of them at first, you know, is, is, is, is like Mindfulness 101, be aware. Right. Yeah. So that's helpful to be aware and then having tools to release them or outlets, you know, that I just mentioned a bunch of those you know, and, and being unregulated, like I'm glad I'm not that person. You know what I mean? I kind of see it with certain people in my life and it's not pretty and I'm just like, but then dealing with that, then that's another thing. Then trying to like being a calm person, trying to stay, you know, calm, steady, and ready, you know, staying that way. So I can rise to whatever the moment's going to be. Cause it fucking was, it's unbelievable how it changes, but also staying calm so I can make good decisions in those moments.
And also prepare myself to make good decisions. AI has been great help. I'm not going to lie to you. You know, just processing all this information and capturing all this information and help me like understand the different medicines and, you know, ins and outs of this and that. And like, whatever. So just like, that's been a really another great resource that's, that's helped me just to whatever research things and find things out and like help me process some things when I, whenever I need it. But that's who I am and then working with personalities that are not the same people that don't organize the same way I do or, or have the same level of calm. It's like, that's another fucking level of mindfulness that really, you know, managing and being and, and being nimble in your relationships.
It has been that, that's been a real fucking big challenge, real big challenge. I want to push you a little further on that regulation versus suppression question. You said the difference is awareness, and I do believe that you need awareness to regulate. But would you say that people who are suppressing their emotions are not aware of them? Because there's plenty of times I'm aware of my emotions, and I'm not great at regulating them in a particular instance, and I am, in fact, suppressing them. I'm aware of them, though. Would you say there are times when you are regulating them, and then there are times when you're suppressing them? And how does that feel different? Well, I guess, you know, regulate is a big word, right?
I mean, or it's like, it's kind of like, what is, you know, so I can regulate in the moment as best as I can, realizing like, oh, dude, like you're acting from frustration, or you're being impatient, or you're controlling a situation. So I was, I might still act from those places, for sure. But then, at the same time, it's like, then I'm, you know, that's when I'm trying to calm down and show up the next moment differently, or, you know, apologize if I need to. You know, so it's not like it's all like, oh, I got it all covered, and I'm being this, like, perfect fucking student man, person. I'm walking through, like, this state of Zen. No, dude, I mean, not yet. Maybe when I'm fucking 90 or some shit, you know what I mean? Like, be the Zen master.
So my sword definitely comes out, and it can be really sharp, you know? But it sheaths a lot of the times. So I thought. Let's talk about that. Yeah, well, I'm not saying, so sometimes I don't regulate as well as I would like to, but I think it's also, like, we just had Vaisesika, yeah, on the show, talking about life as a classroom. And it is. So that's another way that I'm kind of processing all this and trying to show up those next moments that when the frustration or whatever, whatever those things I just talked about are there, trying to be better, at least 10% better, you know? Let's talk about, you said, there are times when your sword comes out. Yeah, right. For sure. One, what does that look like?
And then two, you know, how do you, how do you put it back? And how do you mend the cuts that that sword may have made, whether that was a cut in you or a cut in somebody else? What are you doing? What are your practices? Well, usually it comes out, I guess, when it comes out is, you know, certain people, you know, certain people that I'm very close with, certain people that add a level of frustration that, like, it just, like, it comes from almost a place of, like, how can you not know this? You know what I mean? Or it's like, why is it so difficult for you to understand? Or it's just like, you know, how is this not clear to you? You know what I mean? Where it's just like, for me, something seems very obvious, you know, but for them, it's just that it's not understood, you know?
So, so you could be an asshole, you know? And I don't like being that person. And I just don't, I mean, it is like. What do you feel that when you're, when you're experiencing that, that frustration because somebody told you to fax them something instead of emailing them or like, where are you feeling that? Where does it show up in your body? Definitely my, my face, you know what I mean? It's like, it's somewhere deep where it's just like, it's like, what kind of like the attitude or the energy is like, why are you a fucking idiot? You know what I mean? It's just like, or don't you know, like, you know, you know, like, don't you know what I'm going through here? So I played a victim. You know what I mean?
The compassion ambassador. I'm being real. I'm fucking being real. You know, it's like, you know, it's like, I know, I know. I mean, I don't know. It's like, I'm just like, it's like, it's like, you're human. It's a spectrum. It's a whole spectrum. But then it's like, and then you hear the fax thing again, you know, and then you already have like, and then from another company. Right. And I'm like, oh my God. You know, so you're able to be like, you know, how do you manage that? You know, how do you ask a better question and maybe send it in a way that's not, I'm not faxed. You know what I mean? You know? So I mean, so I, and then the cuts, it's like, that's when I, you know, that's when I apologize.
That's when I'm like, I'm sorry, mom. This is, you know, dad or whatever, like whomever. It's like, this is really hard. And like, I've never been through this. And like, so I'm sorry I've taken out you or, or even like on the phone with the fax person, like, look, I know you're just doing your job. This is just a very frustrating time for me or a very difficult time. And I just, I'm sorry that I'm taking some of this frustration. I've said that many times to many different people, to many, you know, I want to be, well, that's another thing. It's like, so then maybe the compassionate ambassador comes out, you know? In a sense of like, just like being real with people is, and, and, and have, and that genuine, and that authenticity is very, very helpful, helpful. And it really usually mends the conversation or mends the relationship after it kind of be so vulnerable and, and put kind of people, put yourself at people's feet.
Like, I'm really sorry, you know? Yeah. Yeah. And what does that take? You know, one, awareness, like you talked about before. And then two, humility. You have to be able to, I mean, ego can be a big thing that causes problems, right? We, we spoke about that yesterday with David, David Meyer. And, and then three, compassion. That, that's the, the action arm of all that is taking that step forward. Be like, Hey, you know what? This is, this is, this is both compassion for the person that you're speaking to and compassion for yourself, understanding why it is that you're acting out. Right. Right. Yeah. Right. Right. Right. So you talked about breath work, talked about the gym, touched on journaling in the morning, right?
A little bit briefly anyway. If you had to keep two practices for all of this or highlight two practices that are key outside of the gym and outside of breath work what would you say those are? Yeah. Well, one I didn't add and one that'll be on that list. One of the two is being with your friends, being with people that really care about you. Cause like, there's many times like, you know, I'm very blessed also that I've learned through this, that I've really such an incredible core group of friends and any one of them. And you're, you're part of this, Jon, you're part of this group is just like, they would just do anything. So I have a lot of great friends here in New York. Like, Hey, let me take you to dinner.
Let me, let's go out to the sauna. Let's hit the gym. You know, let's just meet for coffee and just holding space with another person, you know, during this time. And, you know, whether I'm telling a story or working through frustration or, you know, those things I talked about earlier, like, so those relationships are very, very, very powerful. And, and like, so I won't, I won't say a specific practice, but what I will say is, is you need to release that tension in your body, whatever that looks like. And it could be, you know, it could breath work definitely helps. I think it's a combination. You got to honor the body. You got to enter, honor your energetic self, which is, which is your breathing.
And I think it's really important to create a see the mind that gets clouded and cluttered with the, just ever, all the emotional stuff that, that could bring into, you know, the realm of the body and your energy. And then, you know, meditation is, is just so helpful in the sense of like, just understand that the moment is the only thing that matters. You showing up, you know, the best you possibly can and just stay calm, stay calm, stay calm. So whatever it takes to get to that calm state is what's fucking needed. Cold plunging. I don't, you know, you know, a lot of saunas and stuff like that I've definitely done, you know, and just like, also, it's like the energy is also, that's why the friends are important and people you love.
It's just like talking about it has been a great way to just get it out of my mind, you know, objectify it a little bit so that I, when I engage with it again, I'm more precise of what I need to do. So you've got your friends, but then what you're saying to your friends, let's talk about asking for help from your friends. How much have you actually been able to ask for help? I'll give you a great fucking story. Because everyone during these times, everyone during these times are like, let me know what you need. Let me know what you need. Let me know what you need. And that's, I'm glad you mentioned this, Jon, because this is the one thing when I cry, it's when somebody takes action. This is the most beautiful thing that I've experienced in all of this.
It's a story. My dad was like, moved from one hospital into another hospital. And the hospital is like an hour away from where my family lives. So it was like a bit of a haul. There were a lot of family like around, you know, where my dad was originally in the hospital and the nursing care facility. So lots of visitors, lots of, lots of company. He's not so lonely. You know what I mean? It's like, I was happy for him. I'm here, you know, like, not all the time. I was there a bunch. But when I'm not here, I'm like, I just want, you know, who wouldn't want to see a friend, a family and friendly face, right? So my dad gets transferred to get more testing and do more this and do more that and look for more help or whatever.
And, and he was like an hour or so away. And we got, he got there like on a Wednesday or something like that. And, and we called a family member that was there. And, you know, Mike is great. Like shout out to my cousin, Mike, like he was able, he just showed up. We asked him like, Hey, my dad's over there. You kind of live in the area. Can you just stop by? He showed up, loved hanging out with him. It was great. I felt so good about the whole situation. The next day, nobody's around. I have another friend that I grew up with, like literally across the fucking street with as a kid. He was like my best friend. He's like, we're still close. My best friend until we're like 20 or something like that.
It's from six to 20. We're like fucking [inaudible]. And we're still really close. And we had talked a little bit, like maybe a week earlier when my brother went into crisis and stuff like that. He was just like, anything you need, anything you need. And I knew he was in this area. And I just, I was like, Hey, send him a text. And I was like, Hey, if you can, you know, my dad's in this place. I don't know how close you are. I know you're kind of in the area. You know, if you can just stop by and see him, like, I think it would just be, it would be great. If you can do that. I sent him a text. He goes, I'll see what I can do. Okay. You know? And then like, yeah. An hour, hour later, I just sent him the address in the room just cause I didn't follow up with that. You know, it was like, and then three hours later from that, he goes, I'm walking to the hospital now.
Beautiful, man. And I was like, and it was like that, like that level of whatever it's doing to me right now, like that level of, of humanity was like, is, is the thing that like, that I have, that it just gets me right there right now. And, you know, he followed up with a conversation, and, and I just felt so good that people do that. Like that, that was something that, so it's, it's amazing. Like the humanity and the heart that comes through people in these kinds of circumstances. And that's one thing that, you know, I, I just, you know, like I didn't expect it, but you never really think about it. And then it happens. You're just like, people are fucking beautiful, Jon. You know, and I, and I think it's like, it's a tribute to my, to my dad and my family and what we've built and who we are, you know, and that, and that, and that, and that comes back when you need it, you know? Yeah. Yeah. Well, thank you for sharing that brother.
I could clearly tell it, it touched you. And, and it's, it's beautiful to know that you have a friend like that. You asked, you asked for help. What did that, what did that asking for help feel like? You know what? I, again, it came back to like, I need, I gotta do this. It's like, what's needed. It wasn't about me. It wasn't about, it was just like my, I'm thinking of my dad. I was like, how do I get him someone? How do I get someone to him? You know what I mean? And it's just like, you know, you just move hell or high water. Cause it just, it doesn't matter what you need to do. It just does not fucking matter. You just do it. You just do it. And, and you know, and it's just even, and you just, you just do it.
You just do it. And if, and if that's not the right person time, they're not, you know, out of touch, you just find someone else, you know? And you just, and it's amazing if your mind just really opens up to like, what, what's possible, what's possible. Okay. Like what's possible. And it's just like, it's, it's really amazing. Yeah. Like. And how your mind can really be such a resource because it's just like there's fucking levels of care and love and connection. I didn't even know it was really inside of me. I had no idea. And then it's just like when you're in it, you just go right to that place. And everything, all my energy is just thinking about that. And it just worked out. Or else it worked out a different way because I wanted to get that need met for my dad.
It was beautiful. And that's what you did, man. And you did it. You did it well. And then you had a friend who was willing to help. And you probably have many, many friends who are out there willing to help. They don't even know that you need to help. And this is for you, Will, and for those listening. When you are in those hard times, you have people who want to help. It's almost like it makes them feel good, right? It gives them an opportunity to pay you back for everything that you've ever done in their lives. Not that everybody is indebted, but what I'm saying is it gives them an opportunity to do something. And it makes them feel good. So let them have that opportunity by asking. You know, your friend probably felt great about doing it, but then you felt great having it done and your dad felt good having it done.
So again, for those watching, you know, clearly Will's situation is anecdotal, right? It's, it's his situation and it's unique in certain aspects. But you can probably see yourself in this situation or in a similar situation or you can see similarities between your situation and what Will has going on. You know, listen to what Will has said about what has helped him reaching out to people, some of the practices, getting into the gym breath work, surrounding yourself with friends, taking it one step at a time, apologizing, knowing that you're doing the best you can, right? If you are in fact doing the best that you can. So, I mean, honestly, I don't know a way to wrap this one up, brother. I just wanted to, to talk with you, have an open, honest, and vulnerable conversation with what you've got going on.
I know our listeners have things going on in their lives. We're all spread thin. We're all being pulled in so many different directions. And it's critical to know that you're not alone. You're not alone in that you're, you're not unique in that. I don't, I don't want to burst your bubble. I mean, none of us are unique in that we have struggles in our lives and that's a good thing, knowing that we're not alone in that. Not only are we not alone in, in having struggles, but we're not alone in, in our own struggles. We can reach out and get support and tap into our friend network. So yeah, Will, I'll leave it to you to any closing words, brother. Well, no, thank you for this, Jon. And, you know, we went back and forth before we hit record.
It's like, you know, like, oh, making this a content piece. But I look at this as an opportunity to really help to teach from our own experience. Cause and you know, I really want to honor, respect my family and I love them dearly. And obviously I'm doing anything that I possibly can for them. And I don't want this to be, yeah, I don't know. I think it's important for people to hear this and how, you know, and I'm no saint, obviously I'm no saint, you know, but like how this work really begins to show up and it's really surprised me. It's really, really, really surprised me how it showed up. And, you know, so anybody that like is looking this direction and they haven't, you haven't started taking action to just be more mindful.
And it's like, you know, like I'm telling you, I'm telling you like, and I hope this, this is not going to be your circumstances someday, but, or even if it's half of these circumstances, like you're going to want some practice, you're going to be, want to be skillful. I'm telling you. It's like, so get on it. You know, and, and, and, and do the work because the work will pay off. You know, it's like, you know, it's just, yeah, it's, and it really, it makes a big difference. Not just for me, it's not even about me. It's just like the ripple effect around, you know, like what I'm, here, I'm talking to me. It's like, it's like the ripple effect of it makes a huge difference. And, you know, and it's just, it's just everything that we preach, everything we built, you know, has shown up in this, and, and I'm still doing the best I can. Would I do things differently?
Some of them, absolutely. You know, but I didn't even know the fucking arena that I'm playing in. Sometimes I'm just showing up completely vulnerable, completely naked and just, and just, and just showing up. That's the thing showing up. What do I need to do and sitting, being present, you know, and taking the circumstance and then processing whatever it is, and then doing the best I can to move to the next step, the next step, the next step, the next step. That's all you can do, man. And it's like, it is like, it really is moment to moment. And that's all I really have to say. So if you're listening, you know, start doing something to become more mindful because you're going to, you're, you're going to hear that if you hear this and you don't, you're going to be like, oh fuck, I wish I would have done something.
So yeah, that's all I got to say. Yeah. And, and also, you know, reach out to us. Yeah. We, we may not be able to respond directly, but if we, if we can, we will. Yep. And if not, we can put you in touch with some resources that may be helpful for whatever it is that's going on in your life. We are here. Yes, we're a podcast, but we're also here as men supporting, supporting whoever it is. I don't want to just say men supporting men. We are here supporting men, but we're here supporting whoever our listeners are. So thank you all for joining us. Will, thank you for being so open, raw, vulnerable. And, and yeah, I love you too. That's, that's all I got. Yeah, same, Jon. Thank you for this. I appreciate it.
And thank you for listening, everybody. Thank you. Take care, everyone. Bye-bye. Hey guys, it's Jon real quick. Before we get back to the show, everything Will and I make for you lives in one place and that's on our website. MenTalkingMindfulness.com/linkinbio. We have the overall website, but this specific link, MenTalkingMindfulness.com/linkinbio has all the things, or you can just text MTM to 33777 and we're going to send it straight to your phone. Start with the free awareness self-assessment. It takes just a few minutes and you'll walk away knowing where you stand and where to start with growing and improving your awareness. You can also find our free app and our newsletter built to give you tools you can use that same day.
And our course and community, Awareness to Action. It's linked there too. A2A is where this show turns into practice. It's real training on the gap between what happens to you and how you respond alongside this community that's just growing every day, every week. We've watched it change how people show up at work and at home and for themselves. And it's real practical stuff that you can use every day. So that's MenTalkingMindfulness.com/linkinbio or text MTM to 33777. All right, back to the show.