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This is your go-to podcast for all things marketing, branding, and customer experience. We’re bringing you honest and fun conversations with bite-sized insights. Hosted by BrightSign’s CMO Brian Rowley and Head of Integrated Marketing Laura Smith, you’ll hear from industry pros, creatives, and innovators about what’s actually working in today’s evolving, digital-first world. No fluff — just real insights on how brands are connecting with audiences and driving growth. Tune in for fresh ideas, big thinking, and all the tips you need to take your marketing game to the next level.
A lot of times people say like, oh, consumers can't focus. I don't know that it's a matter of focus. We're just probably more selective around what deserves our focus. Welcome to Prose + Comms: Engagement, Unplugged.
Brian Rowley:I'm Brian Rowley.
Laura Smith:And I'm Laura Smith.
Brian Rowley:And today we're actually talking about Attention Recession. And so consumers have more content platforms, subscriptions, notifications. And I think more than ever, Laura, and I think you'd probably agree brands just keep competing for their time more than they ever have before. Would you agree?
Laura Smith:Totally.
Brian Rowley:Yeah. And I think as marketers, like the whole brand visibility doesn't necessarily mean anyone's actually paying attention, even though they might be showing up. So today we're asking, is awareness still the biggest marketing challenge? Or has the real battle shifted to earning and keeping people's attention?
Laura Smith:Okay. So to kick us off, think about the last twenty four hours, Brian, and what competed hardest for your attention? All the things that were getting in your way that you were trying to manage?
Brian Rowley:I mean, there's so many of them, right? Like, I mean, obviously email because we're constantly in front of that. We work. We work, right? We work.
Brian Rowley:Know, teams, I'm always getting pinged on teams around stuff.
Laura Smith:I mean... You're horrible on Teams though. You're better off just staying off.
Brian Rowley:All right. Well, that's nice.
Laura Smith:Think...
Producer Joey:Can we dive into that
Brian Rowley:a There's little Joey. Go ahead. Let's talk about that a little bit, Laura. Just kidding.
Laura Smith:Let's go. Let's do it. Feedback is a gift.
Brian Rowley:Says Bob Osman. I'm not so sure I'm agreeing with him right now. But go ahead. Sure. Let's talk about Teams.
Laura Smith:Well, Teams, I think, is one of those... It's easy easy to be distracted because it's like even if you're in your email, like, there's just the immediacy of, like, like, someone asking you a question, so that'll always kinda catch my attention. Like, if something pops up. You, the other hand, sometimes it will wait, like, a day before you actually look at my message. So I know that I could just text you, though.
Laura Smith:Right? So there's other methods to get to you. But I think Teams is that thing that just does... People are expected to respond to it more quickly. And so I think my automatic reaction is always like, go to the Teams if it's...
Laura Smith:My notification pops up.
Brian Rowley:Yeah, I think where I get mixed up is there's obviously a lot of group teams channels or chats that we're involved in. And so sometimes I don't pay attention because those are firing off and it's not stuff that I need to. So sometimes it gets to a point where, like, it does lose my attention because I'm like, okay, there's a lot of... And no disrespect to folks that use it to communicate every day, but I'm like, there's lot of nonsense going on over there. So therefore, like, I'm not gonna pay attention.
Brian Rowley:But that said, I, you know, we get a lot of them. I think text continues to be sort of for me, the one thing that I do tend to react to because when someone sends me a text, I'm like, okay, they actually really do actually need me. But then, I mean, I don't know, what about you? What are the things that have had your attention?
Laura Smith:I think that like teams, like I said, definitely. Email's just automatic because I feel like it's just part of our everyday, but that doesn't... I was saying, like, I just got back from vacation, and yesterday I felt like I was all over the place. I was opening an email, starting to respond to that email, then a Teams was coming up, and then, oh my god, I have to do my tasks. And I was like, I can't even complete one thing.
Laura Smith:It was like total ADHD moment. But I'm like, I can't complete, like, one thing, and I feel like I have so many things to do. And so it does... Like, it really was a moment of, like, I have... I don't know where my attention's going and where should it go, and then trying to step back and say, like, what's the priority?
Laura Smith:But I think Teams definitely catches my attention. And then text and group chats for sure, I think, is a lot of them, especially if at, like, the mom ones and the school ones and, like, sports ones, and it's just so many that, like, it's... Wow. It's overwhelming. It can be very, like, overwhelming at times.
Laura Smith:And then I think, like, any, like, notifications. Like, I think I'm probably better off shutting off notifications to some degree. But if something's pinging, like, I'm the person that cannot have one red item on any one of my apps. So I gotta look at all that stuff.
Brian Rowley:You can turn
Laura Smith:that off,
Brian Rowley:you know, so you don't have to see that.
Laura Smith:I know. But I know I'm like I'm like a lunatic on that. So I just feel like it is is a lot. And even like, you know, it's funny because I'm totally into this Lindsay Clancy story out of Massachusetts, whatever. So it's like whatever.
Laura Smith:But like
Brian Rowley:Don't worry. Are not going down that road.
Laura Smith:We are not going
Brian Rowley:down that path.
Laura Smith:Oh my god. The jury just came back so they they can't do it. We're not going there. Go
Brian Rowley:ahead. Talk about Anyway distraction.
Laura Smith:Right. Okay. So... But, like, I'm watching... Like, I'm watching it, like, at night and, like, watching the YouTube, like, the day...
Laura Smith:You know, of the daily clips, whatever. It's like the ads come up. And I think when I was, like, prepping for this, I was thinking, like, do I pay attention... You know, the skippables. And I'm like, am I...
Laura Smith:Yeah. They force you to pay attention for five seconds. But, like, am I really being sold on something? Like, no. I'm I'm I'm completely ignoring that, waiting to get to the content that I wanna get to.
Laura Smith:And that's a marketers... Mean, this is like... We're... We buy YouTube ads, and so we know that people have a hard time. I just don't think that's gonna make me buy something.
Laura Smith:I'm just like, I'm trying to get to the content, so you're in my way. And so I don't allow that to, like, distract me, I guess. Whereas some people that could be something that they find to be.
Brian Rowley:But I guess I guess the other question though around this is, you know, some of them we actively choose to engage with and others just find us, which for me, that's those are the ones that I think are like more problematic. Ones that like, there's nothing worse than like, I got a text yesterday that was like, oh, you know, I texted you the other day and you still haven't donated to my campaign. And I'm just like, yeah, well, I didn't respond to you because I'm not gonna respond to your campaign or donate. Right? Like, so why would you keep sending me text messages?
Brian Rowley:Like, I didn't re... Respond the first time. What's different about this one other than now you're shaming me for not doing something that you wanted me to... You you know, like, it just doesn't make any sense.
Laura Smith:But I think that brings up a good point because we're marketers, and that was obviously a marketing outreach, and we have our own team and efforts that support multiple marketing outreaches. And so it's like as marketers, as brands, we spent years really working on publishing more content more often, more touch points, and more emails. It's like, get in front of the customers fast, fast, fast all the time. Be top of mind. So did marketing, like us marketers, collectively create some of this noise that we all have to still break through.
Laura Smith:We're doing it to ourselves.
Brian Rowley:I know. But top of mind and top of mind for a second are very different things. Right? So, yes, you got my attention for a second because I looked to see who was texting me, but I immediately hit delete. So you didn't get my attention.
Brian Rowley:You got it for a second, enough for me to be able to go delete. Right? So so I think there's a little bit of a difference there.
Laura Smith:Well, I think it's just the noise isn't going away because, you know, now with AI and the more content, more content. So I do think we, like, maybe the younger generations may have an easier time managing all of it, and they're just raised on it and, you know, it was... They were kind of raised in this messy content world. Whereas we now have to adapt to it because it is... You know, I have so many friends, so many people I follow even on Instagram.
Laura Smith:It's like, is it our age? Is it something happened where it's really hard to keep focus on certain things when there's so much going on and surrounding us. Like, just like when you're watching TV, are you scrolling on your phone?
Brian Rowley:Always.
Laura Smith:Me too.
Brian Rowley:Always.
Laura Smith:And Travis gets so mad at me because... Because I'll be, again, watching the Lindsay Clancy trial while you were watching a show. And...
Brian Rowley:Is he mad at you because you're scrolling or you're mad at you because you're watching the Lindsay Clancy Both.
Laura Smith:Both. He's like, enough already.
Brian Rowley:Fair enough.
Laura Smith:But it's like, you know, you're doing that because we can't... Like, I don't wanna just focus on the TV. Like, I wanna like, okay, I'm gonna shop at the same time or I wanna respond to an email because it's at my fingertips, and I can do that. So we are... We're we're we're, like, we're we're creating our own mess, if you will, because as marketers, we're doing this.
Laura Smith:We're shoving a lot of content and a lot of communications in front of people on a regular basis because that's what we're told we're supposed to be doing because people... Need to surround the consumer, the customer, whomever, the buyer with your story at all times.
Brian Rowley:Yeah. I mean, I'm notor... Like, I lay on the couch at night and watch TV. And I like literally my phone is in my hand. Like it's just it's terrible.
Brian Rowley:It's it's but that said, right? I mean, how much of what I'm actually doing? And I think this is a brand conversation as well, right? Like you can reach millions of people, right? But how many of them actually notice you or remember it, something that you're saying, right?
Brian Rowley:So like, I'm sitting there, I'm watching TV. I mean, I have a good understanding because it's a show that I'm interested in, not the Lindsay Clancy trial, but something else. But so when something gets served up to me, maybe for a minute, but if you asked me like two hours from now, like, oh, what was it that you responded to while you were sitting there? I wouldn't be able to tell you.
Laura Smith:Right. Well, that's... Think that's, again, it goes into our distracted brains. You know, I think attention is... Like, I don't...
Laura Smith:Like, what would like... What would make you personally give a brand more than a few seconds of your attention?
Brian Rowley:If it was a brand that, like, I was loyal to, or if it was of a topic at some point that, you know, of interest, you know, I mean, we do a lot of prep for this. And, you know, it's a lot that's done prior to, you know, like, what are good topics for us to cover on here? What are things that resonate, you know, with the audience that we have? So, I mean, you know, for me, I think relevance is and I go back. It's the same stuff over and over, right?
Brian Rowley:It's that relevance. It's it's it's all about like, is it a brand that I like that I follow that I'm interested in? I mean, to be honest with you, is it someone where there's controversy out there because you love to, you know, pay attention to some of what's happening there? But I I think those are the things for me. How about you?
Laura Smith:I feel like it's probably a common consumer mindset. Like, if I want it, if it's something I want or it's something that I have interest in, then I'm gonna respond to it. Like, I just think about getting served. Like, doesn't have to be a brand necessarily. Maybe it does turn into a brand.
Laura Smith:But like, if I think I'm thinking on TikTok and if I see enough of something that like, Oh, this product is great and blah, blah, I'm like, Okay, I'm going to buy that, because it's actually something I like to buy, like makeup or lip gloss or whatever it could be. A new pair of shoes or bag. Those are things like you're speaking to me. I am a female who purchases these things, and whether it's the right time, which I need them or not, I don't know. But I'll react to it because it's like, Oh, that makes sense for me right now in the moment.
Laura Smith:And I think that's where it could be a brand new brand, honestly. And I might be like, Oh, well, I'm feeling like this is like speaking to me and it really feels like I could use this and I wanna try it. What's the harm in two click in purchasing this? So I think there's a little bit of that, like that selfishness of like, Okay, if it speaks to me and something I would maybe want or have talked about, because obviously the phone hears you, then it resonates. I think because we're in this world, I think of like, you know, if there's like a funny ad that really is like kind of catching on and people are talking about whatever, I'm like, okay, like, let me dive in further there.
Laura Smith:Not to say I may buy it, but I might. It just be top of mind.
Brian Rowley:I feel like a lot of times people say like, oh, consumers can't focus. I don't know that it's a matter of focus as much as it is. I think we're just probably more selective around what deserves our focus. Like, I mean, I think that's what it really boils down to. You're not going to pay attention to something that is of no interest or something that might be interest to you three months from now.
Brian Rowley:You worry about that three months from now. Don't don't borrow problems from the future. Right? There we go. Another one.
Laura Smith:Oh, Bob. Yeah. I think though, it... As a marketer, though, I think it does beg the question, and, this is super relevant for us right now because we're in the middle of running a targeted paid campaign, which is all about awareness. So yes, you still have to pick a KPI, which is very much about, like, how many new eyeballs are seeing this content and telling our story because that's the goal.
Laura Smith:But then, of course, you want, like, oh, but we got engagement. Oh, people are clicking. Oh, people are, you know, like, clicking onto the website or clicking and watching the video for longer. So we do still want, like, impressions or eyeballs aren't ever enough, I don't think. So that goes to the point of like, okay.
Laura Smith:So you can be in front of a lot of people, and you can tell your story to millions of people. But what percentage of those people actually matter because they're actually gonna do something to engage with your brand? And so that's where I think it's understanding and choosing as marketers, like, what are we gonna measure it on? Because right now, we're we're gonna optimize towards awareness. That's what we're trying to do, but we're gonna get really excited when somebody's engaging with it because it feels like it's not just in front of their eyeballs.
Laura Smith:They're actually showing us they're interested.
Brian Rowley:So so let me ask you this. I mean, do you think AI has made the problem worse by making, like, unlimited amounts of content?
Laura Smith:Yeah. I think it's just... I think
Brian Rowley:the
Laura Smith:world we live in now is everything's content, content, content. So... And it's been like that for a while, but AI only just made that more so. So I feel like, yeah, I don't think it's going to slow down. I think it's...
Laura Smith:If anything, it's going to be more and it's how do people manage their attention?
Brian Rowley:Yeah. I think a lot of times, though, for me, especially with the AI generated content and it's getting, in some cases, more and more difficult to be able to spot it. Some places it's apparently, I mean, it's just it's out there and it's obvious as can be. But I think, I spend more time like researching like, I read this or I saw this, like, let me go see if it's real. And then I go searching a million different places to see if I can find it somewhere else.
Brian Rowley:Right. I mean, and so I think even like even brand, like positioning of stuff, you know, like there's things that you find, especially on TikTok, I find that like, there's a lot of stuff that's advertised there and you're like, can I go find that somewhere else? Or if it is something that is of interest. So I mean, does, I guess, get some of your attention, but I'm not sure if it's for the right reasons.
Laura Smith:Okay, I think we should dive into our rapid fire. Joey?
Brian Rowley:Let's do it. Let's do it. Alright. I got I got
Producer Joey:a list of marketing tactics here. I'm gonna read them off quickly, and both of you can tell me if they are something that keeps your attention or they lose you. Alright. Here we go. Forty five minute branded webinar.
Producer Joey:Lose me. Probably would lose me. Personalized retargeting ad.
Brian Rowley:That might get me.
Laura Smith:That'll get me because it's it's retargeting based on my behavior. So, yes. I... It knows I like something.
Brian Rowley:Yeah. Exactly.
Producer Joey:Thirty second product demo.
Brian Rowley:Thirty seconds you can get me.
Laura Smith:Yeah. Especially if it's a product I need to know more about, and it's thirty seconds. Absolutely.
Producer Joey:A founder talking directly to camera on Linkedin.
Laura Smith:Yeah. Don't know why. I mean, unless I cared what he had to say... They had to say.
Brian Rowley:Absolutely. No chance.
Laura Smith:Probably not.
Producer Joey:A brand podcast?
Laura Smith:Hell yeah. Absolutely. Of course.
Brian Rowley:Oh, yeah. Absolutely. Welcome to
Laura Smith:Prose and Comms. Engagement, Unplugged.
Producer Joey:A weekly company newsletter.
Laura Smith:Absolutely not. Is it from my company? Or is it from like a third party company?
Producer Joey:Any company. Third party.
Laura Smith:Probably not.
Producer Joey:No. A five second unskippable ad. Oh, my favorite kind.
Brian Rowley:Okay. So here's the deal with this. If it was a five second ad, yes. The fact that it's unskippable drives me insane.
Laura Smith:Well, know, but that's what you need to do. And... But I will say, like I just said at the beginning, like when I'm...
Brian Rowley:Sorry. What
Laura Smith:you to do?
Brian Rowley:We have
Laura Smith:to buy those kind of things. But for me, like I said about my, you know, Lindsey Glancy watching, I don't pay attention to them. So no, I'm not I'm not... I'm like waiting for it be over so I can get into my content.
Producer Joey:An educational long form article.
Brian Rowley:No. I think it depends on the moment and what it's about. Because yes, I have. Mean, it's something that's Long relevant form,
Laura Smith:I can't.
Brian Rowley:I'll I'll read. I will. I mean, I'll I won't do the TLDR type thing, but I mean, I'll like might run it through an AI model and give me like a summary or something of it, but I will engage for sure.
Producer Joey:A brand that's jumping onto a viral trend? Never.
Laura Smith:I feel like I watch it because I wanna see where this is going. Like if it's that viral and like how does someone take it to like a funnier level or do they take it to like an inappropriate level? So I would engage. I like trends.
Brian Rowley:Anytime someone You already answered. I know, but anytime anyone's jumping onto something, I'm just like, ah, come on.
Laura Smith:But you got to watch it because you got be like, where does this go? How bad does this get? You know? Oh, that's... Can listen
Brian Rowley:to you, miss doom and gloom. Let's just see how bad
Producer Joey:What you're describing, Lauren, is we... It's called hate watching.
Brian Rowley:Exactly, Joey. For all your hate watching. Brand got your attention.
Laura Smith:I
Producer Joey:got one more for you and it's a TV or streaming commercial.
Brian Rowley:I don't pay attention to any commercials.
Producer Joey:You're on your phone.
Laura Smith:I don't think I mean, I don't know. I shouldn't say that because I feel like sometimes I do.
Brian Rowley:Commercials? I think that was like the best thing that ever happened to TV.
Laura Smith:So some of these platforms though, unless you're paying like the extra $50 you get these look at commercials. So I still get them in some of my streaming platforms.
Brian Rowley:Pay the extra 50.
Laura Smith:It's It's well worth fine. Sometimes it's good time to get take a break, get another glass of wine, you know. So I would say, I don't like act on them, but I'm not. I'll watch it.
Brian Rowley:That's a very long thing. Yeah. Was simply
Laura Smith:Long answer for a very simple thing.
Brian Rowley:Yeah, it does.
Producer Joey:It depends too, right? It depends on the commercial.
Laura Smith:It does. Some of them really funny jingles, Benjamin likes to like, know the jingles? I'm like, okay, I'll listen to this one because
Brian Rowley:that's I don't think not a good that
Laura Smith:at all anymore. Mean, I'm buying something because I watched a commercial. Not anymore. Think that's how it used to be.
Brian Rowley:Yeah. I think that's where the influence is coming for sure.
Laura Smith:I think you're doing that on social media.
Producer Joey:Commercials are just keeping top of mind for you, really. And then action is probably taking place from social.
Brian Rowley:Yeah, social ads are, yeah, I get lumped in all the time for sure. I mean, this is an interesting topic, but I think to be honest with you, we've lost people's attention. We're gonna wrap this up. I think that the reality of this is, you know, I mean, obviously we all agree, there's a million things and different ways and tactics that people try to target our attention. But I think people need to be mindful of that.
Brian Rowley:And I think they also need to understand the relevance that they have. We're just a perfect example of all the distractions that we see in the course of a day and the things that we really gravitate towards. And we're not alone. I'm sure there's plenty of people who are listening who have the same reaction. So for those of you that are listening, we appreciate it.
Brian Rowley:If you like what you heard today, be sure to follow us.