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We sit down with the cofounders of Gopher founders, John Newberry and Tom Livolsi to talk about how they created an app to resolve some of the issues they saw in the gig economy and help their users get anything done or delivered with full transparency. The only limit is your imagination.
Get unstuck. Tell a better story, and have a good answer to the question "What are you doing today." GWDS is about two guys, Josh and Joe, who set out to do stuff and interview people that have started a business, quit their dead-end job, launched a non-profit and more. GWDS is for makers, dreamers, inspiration seekers, starters, and doers. Do the stuff.
Joe: Excited to be back today, where we
have some really cool guests, we would
talked to John Newberry and Tom , who are
the co-founders of this app called gopher.
That we're going to talk about,
Josh: Once you've been up
there, I have just finished a
successful month of pumpkin sales
here in apex, North Carolina.
Joe: Your family grows pumpkins right
Josh: long time since 1976,
Christmas trees, pumpkins and
certified organic produce.
Joe: A little bit of confession from jail.
I I work out with my personal trainer on
the way to where your pumpkin patches and
stop at the pumpkin patch with a cigar.
So that's good for your
John: health.
Yeah,
Josh: she was that band influence
Joe: I thought about the craziness
of what it must feel like to be upon.
A lot of fruit and
vegetables have utility.
Like I wonder if they just sit around and
going I got to feed Tommy at least in the
Josh: right hands, a pumpkin can be
used to the max, but in most hands
it's just carved and discarded.
And it's funny because we have all
the heirlooms chopped into pieces, sat
Joe: on and then put it on the
porch to rock more than the other.
Pumpkin's not to screw with people.
Josh: Oh, I saw ingrown man jumping a
wagon when he was afraid of my puppy.
John: And I tell you that story,
Josh: I saw a grown man jump into
one of our wagons because he was
Joe: afraid of right.
You put out like, so just to set
the scene, Josh puts out like radio
flyers and wagons that are like
utility wagons that you might load
up with stuff to put to the beach.
And these are so that you can
put your wet, your pumpkins that
you buy in them and take them to.
Yep.
We have
Josh: thousands of pumpkins
rotating coming through and we,
I'm big on wagons and aesthetic.
And the wagons I prefer are
the altering radio flyers with
the wood walls on the side.
Yeah, one day I was there.
I was all by my lonesome with my puppy.
Kelly is her name.
She's five years old, but she's
a small to mid-sized brown.
She's a registered English
Joe: field.
I think that your dog looks
exactly like Kramer from Seinfeld.
Oh my God.
The hair on top is crazy.
The dog is super sweet.
Like it'll run right up to you
and stop and sit down and they'd
be like, okay, pet me now.
And it just wants you to pet it for
a couple of minutes or a lot of times
I'll stop in and she'll see me and then
she'll go tear it off because she's
going to get her toy, show it to me like
Josh: at she's the ultimate.
Yeah.
She's the ultimate greeter.
I call her the pumpkin queen.
We literally have reviews.
Oh, yeah.
Oh sweetest.
Joe: Sweetest.
Does it?
It sticks
Josh: around.\ Some
people don't like dogs.
This guy must not have liked dog.
This guy, meaning the guy
that jumped in the wagon.
Yeah.
This guy did not like dogs.
He saw Kelly coming towards him grown.
Ass man jumped in a wagon and made
some sounds like little screechy.
Sounds
John: like it.
Joe: His mind is this will let me
escape the dog when he jumps in a wagon.
. Josh: That's a highlight
of my last few days.
Thank you very much.
Joe: All right.
Love to be the guys who do stuff
podcast, the show where you get
down, stuck telling their story and
have a good answer to the question.
What are you doing today?
I'm here with my cohost, Josh.
What's up everyone.
And we're very excited.
We got the, are you guys
the co-founders of gofer?
So go ahead and just introduce
yourself one by one to our audience,
John: please.
All right.
Hey everybody.
My name's John Newberry.
I'm the acting CEO and
co-founder of gopher,
Tom: Tom co-founder of gopher as well.
Thanks for
John: having this one.
Yeah, no doubt.
Joe: And we're excited to
talk to you guys about it.
I've heard of gopher before, just like
in the ether you guys have been around
now for a while, but I would love it.
If you just break down real quick, if you
don't know what gopher is, what's gopher.
John: Gopher is an on-demand
marketplace for services.
We've got it.
We're a dual platform.
So on one end, the gopher request
app is where you would literally
request any help that you need.
And on that app, you get to make
an offer for how much do you think
is fair for what you're asking for?
We go for we'll then broadcast
that request out to a network
of gophers on the gopher go app.
And they'll see with full transparency,
how much they're going to make, what they
need to do when and where, and if it works
for them, the two are broken in the app.
The work is done very quickly.
And the gophers paid immediately after
everybody's happy, not like that easy.
Tom: Yeah, this whole thing
started to parlay on that.
It started, we saw a big opportunity,
a lot of the gig economy apps
like Uber, even, they were
really empowering the company.
They were empowering the
business with gopher.
You can literally request
anything, whether it's alcohol,
tobacco, rideshare, a lot of home
services, deliveries, things like.
And the beauty of gopher is that you, as
the requester, you set the value, right?
You think you put out a number
of what you think it's worth
for someone to do that for you.
And then it also empowers
the gopher themselves, right?
So a lot of gig workers, they
basically get told, Hey there's
something in your area that needs done.
Do it with gopher.
There's a notification that goes
out, like John mentioned that says,
Hey, here's what needs to be done.
Here's where they are.
Here's how much you're going to make.
Do you want it or not?
And empowers them to decide whether
it's worth their time doing or not.
And obviously, we have some significant
updates that are getting ready to drop
that we are more than excited about that.
We'll include a little bit more
of a negotiation component to it.
John: Okay.
Joe: Yeah.
So I love the idea.
It feels very fair across the board
where sometimes you get up, you ever
done a ride and it feels unfair.
Like I went to a U2 concert in Ohio.
And we tried to get an Uber after
the show is like $148 to go like six
miles, nothing you can do about it.
What are you going to do walk.
John: So that's why we're creating
equilibrium between supply and on-demand.
Yeah,
Joe: I'm curious as to what's
some of the popular requests,
cause you can do, basically you
open up the app and it's great.
What do you want to do?
Like I got the app open
right here, request type.
Is it a delivery or an Aaron
or is it service or labor?
Those are two very broad categories.
And then you just say what is it,
describe it, how much do you want to pay?
And then put it in your location.
And it goes into your platform.
What are some of the common
things that people ask for?
I have to imagine it's
John: alcohol.
For sure.
Delivery is the most.
Large apart, because that's
what we started rolling out.
It gained much more popularity with
its horizontal nature down the road.
Yeah.
But yeah, definitely.
Deliveries, alcohol, tobacco, food,
groceries, convenience store deliveries.
And then you've got your home services.
I needed a TV hung up.
I need a fan installed whether it
be electrical plumbing and then
you get rides, moving junk removal.
It's extremely popular.
And here's why, so if you have,
a bunch of garage clutter, and
you want to call somebody to come
pick that up, go online right now.
And you're going to get an
estimate of 1 75 to two 50.
They got to fill that cube truck up.
That cube truck plays.
It pays a fee to get into the
dumps and so on and so forth.
Yeah.
These are the
Joe: guys like junk luggers
and all the trucks in the area.
John: And so you've got
somebody in your native.
That's got a truck that
could use 40 or 50 bucks.
Nobody's minimums be there in 10
Joe: minutes.
I think if you're the guy you're
the gopher, then you're like, maybe
I want some of this crap, this
guy's throwing away the bonus.
John: No doubt.
I hear that all the time.
Yeah.
That could be considered bonus.
I don't care where it goes.
Just get it out of my house.
Yeah.
Tom: There's, that's another really
cool thing about this whole process
has been to see just how broad it is.
So on another application, a shameless
plug here, I own another business
called CTS and we do voice and data
cabling, audio, visual security
systems for commercial offices.
And the reality is I love my team.
I love them, but they're on a
job site and they need a $5 part.
Historically that means two
guys hopping in a van smoking
cigs on the way to supply house.
And I just lost two hours of
labor and progress on the project.
So now.
With gofer, our operations manager,
he just gets a notification from
the field, says, Hey, I need
this J hook or whatever part.
We'll put a gopher request out.
And for 20 bucks, someone will
go to a supply house, pick it up
and drop it off at our job site
John: so
Joe: that you don't lose pain.
Two guys, no smoke for 20 minutes.
That's right.
John: That's exactly right.
There's a gas station.
Yeah.
Tom: I mean it's every day it
seems like there's something new,
but John has a pretty cool list
of some very unique, I'm not sure.
Say for
John: radio.
Yeah.
We wouldn't even talk about that.
Cause those ones get they get next.
But a we'll tell you this.
This is by far the most unique one, a
guy says he has a request to come take a.
Beat up bunny to the Raleigh
emergency wildlife rescue
facility, wherever that is.
And so basically his dog, he had
a birthday party for, I think
it's six or seven year old.
It's on Google as far as a review.
So you can check it out.
But yeah, so he's oh my gosh,
my dog mangled up a baby bunny.
I, when am I going to do here?
And so he called gopher to ask somebody
to come pick up the bunny and take
it to this facility in which he did.
He got somebody to accept it.
It was for like $30 or something
like that save the day at the party.
So the kids weren't freaking out and
it didn't end and so on and so forth.
And then, followed up and said
that, yeah, the bunny survived.
They put it back out.
Yeah.
That's
Joe: crazy.
I have to imagine you guys can feel
a little good knowing you're probably
cutting down on drunk driving.
If there's a lot of alcohol being
John: delivered yeah.
And
Tom: ride sharing, it's yeah.
There's a lot of positives, man.
It's all about convenience and.
Yeah, giving people the opportunity
to, it's the definition of
fair market value, right?
So when someone sends out a request
for anything and the gophers, get
it, they have the opportunity to
accept it or make a counter offer
and say, Hey, I'm not going to do it
for 20 bucks, but I'll do it for X.
So it's the only app that exists.
We have a real opportunity in
the gig world to really flip
the script on all of them.
So yeah, this update that we're
patiently waiting for apple
to get their stuff together.
Joe: I have to imagine too,
that there's a ton of money.
If let's say I bought something off of
AHPRA offer up or Facebook marketplace,
and then I didn't want to go get that.
And I didn't want to pay them their fee.
Cause sometimes people are like,
yeah, I'll bring you my couch.
I'll charge you $150 an hour.
It's okay, your couch is $90.
It's
John: yeah.
Exactly.
They are they are a part of
several requests offer a let
go marketplace, even next door.
They want, somebody is offering
something like, gosh, I got a car.
I can't pick that up, but I
really want that go for it.
Make a fair offer and see what happens.
And then the gophers do have
an opportunity to counter to.
For whatever reason somebody offers
something, that's probably a $50
project and offers 25 and then
50 people go, I'll do it for 50.
Then they have an opportunity to edit
the request and change the amount.
Yeah.
It goes, that's not a real time feature.
So when Tom's talking about the updates,
it's talking about enhancements that we
have learned over the last two years that
are very important to people and that
are going to be extremely relevant and
getting this thing, to the next level.
So a live counter offer, there are
so many times where literally $5 goes
from one personnel are interested
in doing it to a hundred people, $5.
And sometimes people just
don't know what is he?
I'm like, I do it for that much.
So let me offer this.
And everybody else is no, we wouldn't.
But they're not upset that
they have to pay $5 more.
They probably would pay $20 more.
We're just trying to do that in a
way, whereas you're not hung up on
negotiations and you get it right.
And then we will continue to compile all
that data of these spending behaviors
and preferences and so on and so forth.
Try to educate our users to
understand what the true market
value is because I've myself through
this process done lasted again.
And my discovery.
So let's say you're out doing, go
for I've definitely done kind of the
co-founder I've done over 500 requests.
No, not go for other gigs
with other companies.
Okay.
Yes, absolutely.
Shamelessly.
Because I want to know.
So when you pay company X $100 to
assemble a small little piece of
patio furniture, I got paid 40 bucks.
That's where's that 60 at?
Yeah.
How do you justify taking that type
of margin from the worker you can't?
And so if you used our app cost you $2,
1 99 cash at $2 and make a request and
then a small percentage, 80% of the fee.
So if you paid a hundred dollars,
you're gonna pay 10 bucks.
And if you reduce that down,
you can obviously let's try to
compare this example that I did.
So if you paid a hundred dollars, then
that worker's going to make over 90.
Joe: Yeah.
I know if I were to use a service
like this, like I recently was one of
the people frustrated at Chick-fil-A.
Cause you feel like if I'm going to hire
somebody, a gofer or somebody in the gig
economy, I would like the majority of the
money to go to the person that I'm hiring,
as opposed to funding an organization.
And that thing, that's why
Chick-fil-A got in trouble.
Did you hear about that lawsuit?
They were basically charging more for
food without really disclosing it.
If the food was delivered.
So fundamentally Chick-fil-A was
charging a premium to get your food
delivered that Chick-fil-A kept
instead of passing it to the people
that were delivering this stuff.
And my kids use this all the time.
Like they'll get a number one
from Chick-fil-A they'll get
it delivered to the house 20
John: bucks.
Tom: Yeah.
Fortunate part, a lot of
the food delivery, right?
So that's obviously a big vertical
that we're going to be focusing
on down the road because the,
all of the current apps, right?
So the door dash Grubhubs, et cetera.
They will take your existing menu, mark
it up and then charge a commission to the
establishment to use them with gopher.
It benefits the restaurant, the
worker who picks it up makes
100% of whatever the offer is.
So it, we really are all about the
business, getting more food out of their
kitchens without hitting them with some
type of commission or marking up their
their food to, to hurt them more and
putting more money in the gophers pocket.
John: Yeah,
Joe: I'm of the mindset.
If, if you need to raise your prices.
But don't just raise it on delivery.
John: There's a lot of benefits to,
I've got five kids in my household, a
blended family here, and needless to say,
we're going to order some fast foods.
Usually the kids are creatures of habit.
They want the same place.
You go online or stand not
online on the, on their app, and
then you order through there.
So you're gathering
rewards points like crazy.
And then you just use a go to
go pick up a military paid for.
So the restaurant got their full
margins and we love doing that to local
businesses because some of them have
opted out of these relationships with
third party delivery outfits because
they have to do one of two things.
They have to pay a significant
commission depending on the volume.
And in some cases they might
raise their per item fees to
offset whatever these costs are.
Nonetheless, they're given two
different experiences and nobody wants.
You want to have a brand.
You want to have one, mantra that
you're going this is what you get
with restaurant X all the time.
And that's not the case.
If depending on what third-party,
you're going to and the type
of volume do you do, we work.
Some of them don't even know, we would
like to change that, but they don't even
know that gopher's being used to their
establishment several times because
the person that's coming in and saying,
I'm here to pick up a order for John.
Great.
Here you go.
And boom, they're off to the races.
So they're getting it so fast
because it's not going through this
dispatch process of order comes in,
call the restaurant, see if they can
fulfill it, then locate a driver.
See if the drivers ready
driver says, they're ready.
Now go back to the restaurants.
They go ahead.
And so on and so forth, whereas this
thing's already done restaurants, got
their focus, cook this food as fast
as I can, and then simultaneously
the gophers on the way to go get it.
So it's, you're going to
pay what you want to pay.
I don't want to say necessarily you're
going to pay less, but you're going to pay
an all-in service fee for this girlfriend.
Go get your food that you wanted to pay
Joe: exciting about bids too.
Ah, we'll do it for this to
see if he can get away with
it and then realize maybe not,
John: you know what the good
Tom: part of that is, the data that
we're collecting behind it, we'll show
you, Hey, you put an offer out of $5
and all, this many gophers looked at it.
This many gopher said, I wouldn't do
it for five, but I'll do it for X.
So it literally is setting
the fair market value.
And one more thing on
the food delivery stuff.
A lot of the.
The marketing for lack of better term,
some of these third-party apps will say
zero, $0 delivery fees, blah, blah, blah.
But all they do is they blend that
cost into the markup of your food.
So it's another thing that
gopher doesn't death doesn't do.
John: Yes, full transparency from
start to finish in every single thing.
And so the front end user knows
exactly how much they're going to pay
for whatever offer they want to make.
And then the gopher only
sees what they would make.
I They, frankly wouldn't care how
much somebody paid for, whatever
before, but what is my involvement?
What do I need to do?
And what's going in my pocket.
And they know that every single
Joe: time for somebody in the gig economy
to have that kind of flexibility it
seems like it would be fun there's a
lot of weird stuff I could do today.
I might deliver some guy,
some beer, I might fix an
electrical outlet and I might,
Tom: and you get paid instantly too.
That's that's one of the.
Biggest different differentiators.
So as soon as a gopher request is
initiated, it goes out to all the
gophers, want to go for, accepts it.
Money is put into escrow and we
use a third-party payment platform.
So we never see anybody's financial
information that's by design.
But as soon as that gopher accepts
the request, money is put into escrow.
And as soon as that is marked
completed, money is instantly
put into the gophers account.
So as opposed to a lot of the all of the
other apps out there, you don't have to
wait a week to two weeks to get paid.
You get paid instantly.
John: It
Joe: was a quick sense of
the size of gopher right now.
What's your service area?
How many orders do you see.
John: Yeah, so right now we have
15,000 downloads that have used
the app and it's right around half
and half gophers and requesters.
That has been an all 50 states.
Again, not again to your users,
but like I was talking with you
earlier, we haven't really done
any significant marketing at all.
Until we feel like we have the app that
you've asked for, over the last two years,
we've, accumulated a lot of requests and
gotten a lot of feedback, sometimes harsh
feedback, but that's the best feedback.
And and now we are about to
unleash a series of 18 months
worth of enhancements that we know.
Will benefit everybody we'll make the
front end user experience easier with
more options and more understanding of,
how you can really benefit from this.
And as far as the gophers go, we
will let go firs establish themselves
on this marketplace, pretty
significantly, unlike anywhere else.
Like for example, if you're a delivery
driver, you don't really have a say in
anything that you do, you are getting a
request that they have given you, right?
And you're in a rotation pecking order
and all these types of things with gopher.
When we introduced select my.
You may have used somebody and
you're like, thanks so much.
I really like your punctuality and you get
exactly what I liked, the way I like it.
And so on and so forth.
So you can use that same delivery driver,
anytime you want provided that they're
available, but you can request for
them to be available on the platform,
whereas that's not available anywhere.
So that can be used for ride,
especially, some people like to have
multiple different rides and have
multiple different conversations.
And some people just no,
I'm like that person.
And that's who I want.
Every time I'm in the car.
Cause they don't say anything or
they say exactly what I want to hear.
I don't know.
But we want to be, we want to provide
that type of opportunity for workers and
I just use delivery for an example, if
you've got a handyman that you've used
and then you've got other handy projects,
then that can be who you request.
So we want to do.
Try to provide this marketplace for
services that allows the people that
don't have to pay a ton of money to
put themselves out there on Google and
other platforms or some of the service
platforms like I'll just keep names
out of it, but that don't charge you
for leads that aren't really leads.
Look, there's some of our
maintenance people, aren't the
best salespeople on the planet.
And so Hey, I got your name.
I saw you on a roof, so it doesn't
mean they can't capitalize on it,
but if I see it differently and I
say, wow, this guy has done 20 of
these all five stars, fantastic
ratings, testimonies, and all that.
We'd like to provide that
opportunity for you on the platform.
So people can see that.
And then that's how you get selected,
not how much money you paid to place
yourself on Google ads or whatever.
Tom: And he knows interesting
early on when John and I first
started down this road, there were
a couple of pretty big milestones.
We're indicators to us that,
Hey man, we got something here.
This is legit.
John: This is real.
Joe: And what was the timeframe that
you guys were getting started on it?
Oh
Tom: man.
Two and a half, three years
ago now idea started on a golf
course, like most good ideas do.
It was just something that he and
I both we chewed on for awhile.
We vetted it.
We tried to punch holes in it and we
kept coming back to the same place
of, man, this is unique and I think
there's a lot of benefit to this.
We started down this really exciting
path and getting it off the ground,
which, as any startup knows, that's
a job in itself, the last 18 months
talking about the numbers were it's odd.
Like all these people that we talked
to about fundraising and investment
and things like that, there's
almost this level of arrogance with.
Yeah, you have to have 50,000 users
before we'll even talk to you.
We are trying our best.
And I know this sounds crazy.
We're trying to keep those numbers
in somewhat of a containment, right?
Because what we don't want to do
is have everyone in their mother
download the app right now,
because it's not to John's point.
We've made enhancements that we've
learned people like, and don't like
so early on, most people are trying
to get acquisition, get as many people
on as you can, where we have been very
intentional and deliberate and how many
people we expose to the app, get the
feedback, do something with the feedback.
Now last 18 months.
And these enhancement that John,
I can't praise John enough for all
the work that he's done, but we
are chomping at the bit for these
these enhancements that come out.
Because as soon as that does.
Then we're actually going to do
our first marketing campaign.
John: Yeah.
And we're talking geographically when
we're talking about contain we would love
to have 10 million users in this area so
that we can service this area and, just,
but right now this is our area right now.
It is.
Yeah, absolutely.
So from now, until the balance of the
year, what we're going to focus on
Raleigh and really servicing this area,
the best that we possibly can while the
enhancements that we have down the road
are totally built to scale so that, we
can't support all of these other areas and
give them the same benefits that we would,
here, but over time, we've learned what
areas that we need to focus on to do that.
And I think that we've
got that nailed down.
We feel good about it.
And now it's just go time for our
Tom: developers.
Josh: Is there a real gopher
in the works, in the vision
that can be in, go to events.
I want to see the gopher kids
will pose with the gopher and
John: go from no that's right.
We just can't fit with the body right now.
It's like, what's your body?
Are you going to go for them?
You
Josh: don't know what it looks
John: like.
Dumb.
And your dad, a gopher, your COVID
goals, just coming out of COVID yoked.
We don't know yet, but we definitely
want it to be noticeable and fun, but
yeah, that's that mascot is definitely
something that we hear all the time.
The
Josh: character is on par with
the growth of the company that
there's new things coming out.
They're really foundational things.
And under the surface, we don't
know what the gopher looks
like, but we know it's exciting.
And it's
Tom: covering.
John: Yeah.
So what
Joe: motivated you guys , the idea
came at the golf course, but what
made you excited about pursuing it?
Like why was this a good idea for you.
John: What's the Y
Tom: Timing, just like anything else.
Timing was good, John and I have I've
worked together in a professional capacity
for three years now, but before that,
very good friends and, with any successful
organization, you've got a mix of people
that are, I know I can speak for myself.
I surround myself with people that are
really good at what I am really bad at.
And, John and I, we just coming from
two different trains of thought,
I'm the loose cannon, I'm the, like
I got the ideas and I've vomited
out of the mouth all the time.
John is very meticulous and, he's
the dot the I's cross the T's.
And when he and I both chewed on this
and chewed on him, both came together
and said, man, this is, we got it.
We have to move forward with.
That was really exciting.
That was really cool to be a part of, to
take something that started as an idea.
And even now just to think there's 15,000
people out there that throughout the
country, every state that have taken
something that he and I came up with
and saw an opportunity for and use it.
The, why was the potential down the
road too, because of gig economy,
this, especially during COVID every gig
economy and the workers, we just keep
seeing things about, all these people
that are finding ways to earn a living
and, Uber drivers and things like that,
that don't always necessarily get taken
care of and thought of, and with this,
it, it really does check all the boxes.
It's a win-win for the requester
because I'm getting what I really
don't want to get out, go out and do,
or I'm not able to get out and do.
And the person who accepts it
clearly thinks that this is a.
Offer of their time.
The combination of those two things
and just the state of how the gig
economy is now, and a lot of people
agree with us, that there's a real
potential to scale this thing, pretty
Joe: large.
Yeah.
And I wonder if that jobs report, they
came out with all those disappearing
millions of jobs that everybody just quit.
I wonder how many of them are
thinking sounds pretty good,
Josh: because at our core,
we want to do something.
We want to have a purpose,
you can only lay around so
Joe: long, yeah.
I applied to be a Uber driver forever ago.
Cause I was like there's
probably evenings.
I'd rather go have a conversation in a car
than watch another episode of Seinfeld.
So that sounds good.
But the hurdles were like crazy.
I had to carry their phone
with me and all that stuff.
And I was like, oh, that's a lot of work.
And I don't even know
if I'm going to do it.
But I would like the option.
Yeah.
What does it look like to be a
John: good.
So for them let's use that for
an, as an example with Uber.
So if you're, taking an Uber request
for 30 days it cost the rider $30.
What's that work are going to get, it's
going to be closer to 15 than it is 30.
We all know that.
So with gopher is going
to be way closer to.
And so what's the difference is that
we're not taking a ton of money that way.
We're not going to be the, get
rich off transactions organization.
We've got lots of other I don't want
to call it tricks up our sleeve because
it's definitely thought of the structure.
Yeah.
But we definitely wanted to
go in a different direction.
We wanted to inspire people to
our platform because it's going to
be one of the most fair earnings
sites or platforms available.
There's also, some other differentiators
in that if I'm an Uber driver or Lyft
driver from what we've heard from them.
So I don't want to speak anyway on behalf
of their company or anything like that.
Just people that have worked for
them that also do go for runs.
They have no say in rides that they
take, and sometimes they're frustrated
because there might be a surge increase
and they didn't see any of that
surge increase so on and so forth.
So with gofer, they will always know.
I need a ride from point a to point
B and it's for $30 that $30 will
be in their checking account two
minutes after they've dropped that
person off and select the complete.
Obviously we get that part, but so now
apply that to every other type of gig
out there, full transparency, clear on
what the expectations are of the user.
And then once the job is done, you're
rated both people are rated actually.
So the user's rated as well as the gopher.
We'd like to do that for someone,
quality assurance we, by no means would
allow anybody to stay on the platform
that keeps getting one-star reviews
because they're out of control when
something's dropped off or if someone's
in their house and so on and so forth.
So we want to make sure that everybody
feels safe and fair on the platform.
Joe: Why is there a bite out
of every one of my tacos,
Tom: this guy
John: cereal taco eater.
Joe: I was actually just trying to
think up jokes a little bit like
the funniest things I could imagine
putting out there I need a pair of
pants delivered to the bathroom of the
Mexican restaurant on the corner of
John: closed.
I need clothes from target.
I've already looked on target.
I've already put them in the car
and I'm playing basketball at
one of the gyms in Charlotte.
It's a
Joe: solution to your buddies
running off with your clothes.
Wow.
Frick I'll use the
locker phone call go for,
Tom: or a good
Josh: metric
John: or just general guys packing.
Oh, I forgot this and this.
Yeah.
Tom: I have no idea where my cell phone
is uses somebody else's find my iPhone.
I need to go for, to go pick
it up and bring it to me.
John: I left my wallet.
So
Joe: yeah, that happened to, yeah, just
like very needed items at the moment.
Like I need two liters
of oil over here, please.
John: Yes.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Ran out of gas, 20 bucks, plus the
cost of the gas cheaper than AAA.
Oh, interesting.
Didn't have AAA.
Tom: Yeah.
That's another whole market that,
again we're going to attack, the people
that don't have the AAA or things
that Hey, car broke down, change my
John: flat
Joe: tire.
Yeah.
Most people would rather pay for
something when they need it than
pay for something that they might
be able to use at one point.
John: Exactly.
Yeah.
Joe: You mentioned, we
want it to be fair.
Had you guys worked gig economy before and
John: no, I didn't.
I was in the fitness industry.
I know that's
Tom: hard to believe.
No, it's I started down the
path, John and I would just.
I think from two totally different worlds.
And I think both of us have
an entrepreneurial spirit.
And this was a, we'd kicked
a couple of ideas around.
And I think we both knew that we were
going to be really good business partners.
Just trying to figure out what
was the one, what was the one idea
that we were going to see through.
That I had a lot to do with the Y and
obviously we want to be billionaires
John: well for me, but anyways,
the I've been very familiar with
the gig economy, way back in LA.
They had, dabble with the idea of
delivering some convenience store
stuff like in downtown Hollywood
and west Hollywood and so on.
And so for, I think it was called
pink dot and yeah, it was crazy,
outrageous expensive, but it was,
Hey, there's no other options.
When more of the, recognizable companies
came in and you just compare how much it
would cost to go get that mail yourself.
Versus to have it delivered.
It's man, there's just
such a disparity there.
Like it's just a little bit too much.
And I just don't see it ever going
back, once you're a public company
and once you're starting to make
these types of margins, like nobody's
going to go, you know what, let's
just go ahead and reduce all our
fees and that's going to be awesome.
We didn't, we wanted to come from
a completely different place with a
completely different model that literally
just put the empowerment on the user.
Like how much would you pay for it?
I know you don't like to pay what
you have to pay in other places, but
how much would you pay for it if you
just needed somebody to go pick up
this or do this, or what have you.
And then the workers totally appreciate
the fact that they are getting paid
with a full, transparent model.
They're not dependent on, tit
baiting or any of that type of stuff.
This is your full offer, which you can
call it a tip plus a service plus whatever
you can call it, whatever you want to.
That's the total amount that
you're going to receive.
And you don't work for gopher.
Those are not our employees.
I want to make sure that
everybody's clear about that.
Gophers are independent contractors.
They're hired by the
requester for that second.
And that's that.
They don't necessarily, it's a big
key difference between monster train
Tom: Uber.
We are
John: a relationships 100%.
And, but we're going to give you
as the worker, the opportunity to
enhance your reputation by showing
all the things that makes you a viable
worker for those particular jobs, I'm
licensed, I'm bonded, I'm insured.
I have these credentials,
there's my background check.
All of that.
We want to provide that.
We want to be the ultimate
marketplace and you can't call
yourself the ultimate marketplace.
If you don't provide those
types of things, towering folks.
Exactly.
So let
Joe: me ask you, could somebody
put a request out for day laborers?
Say you run a landscape company
John: Every day.
That's somebody
Tom: to come.
So
Joe: personally,
Tom: Personally I was selling my house
and had a business trip that took a
little bit longer than it should have.
And one of the requests from the
the real estate agent was that I had
new sod installed and I put a gopher
request out and had my entire yard sign.
With day laborers.
It ended up costing me about
half of what it would have from
a quote that I got from it.
Joe: It could be the app that like,
replaces cause I know guys, like when
I need something, I know a guy who
knows people, so I'll call the guy.
Like I needed, I got a ditch that
I needed dug in my backyard and
I'm like, I'm going to call Joe.
He knows guy.
And then two people from the
neighborhood show up with shovels
and the things getting done.
But if you don't have a
John: guy yeah.
Go for our war room is 27 whiteboards
with just, gosh, you'll go crazy in there.
It's like a beautiful mind.
Yeah.
Although neither of our minds are
beautiful, but that is something that
we're looking at to think about like
gopher pro where somebody that's the.
Contractor S but not really a contractor,
but he has somebody that he knows
personally and has done jobs with it
as landscaping that does, home repairs
that does this, that, and the other,
then they would be able to be on the
platform, brokering these types of things,
would obviously have to enhance the
technology to be able to accommodate that.
But that's something that
we're looking at as well, too.
Joe: The idea for your or room
of the honeydew gift card.
Yup.
That's the things that my wife always
asked me to do that take 20 minutes
then, like I would rather go for it.
Go for any of that.
Tom: Yeah.
You asked the question about why, and one
thing that we haven't touched on, that's
pretty important too, is just economics.
So the marketplace as a whole.
It was starting to shift
towards a gig model.
And so from a dollars and cents
standpoint, when we have something
that we feel pretty strongly
and not just us, we've done, we
did a lot of market research.
We hired a company to do some
market research for us beforehand.
And, the unanimous decision is
that, we have something that the
gig economy as a whole is a massive
marketplace and it's relatively new.
And just like anything else the
economics of it, there's things
that are starting to shake out.
And what gopher does is really solve
for a lot of the issues that the gig
economy, which is, again, a massive market
has been pretty clear and vocal about.
That's another way, it's a real
opportunity in a relatively new.
Market to disrupt.
Joe: If you had to encapsulate it
and go for had a secret sauce versus
kind of all the other similar gig
economy, fueled app platform things,
what do you think the secret sauce is?
John: So far it's been our users
because that's, every single pivot
that we've made, hasn't been real.
We came up with another great idea.
It's man, our users are
steering us in this direction.
That makes perfect sense.
And we tried to put together the
blueprint, the best that we can.
And as we've, come along 6000%, I didn't
finish that earlier question back, but
we've had 6,000 transactions so far.
So with those transactions we're getting
more and more closer to what people want.
And I say, I think that's our
biggest, ally, if I were talk about
what mentor in the past has really
helped, pave my way through this
process, it'd be learning how to use.
People as your collective mentor and
they will always point you in the right
direction, especially the people that
tell you what you don't want to hear.
I try to myself every single week talked
to at least two people that I listened
to two people, because we can all talk.
But if you're talking about
your business, they're just
going to, oh yeah, that's great.
All fantastic.
But yeah, you give them one
and let them give you nine.
And man, sometimes it's just brutal,
but that brutal honesty then tested
with your users and you find,
man, that is just so powerful.
That's been the secret sauce so far.
The next thing is w you know
what Tom and I are going to do is
bring more people onto gofer to
fulfill roles that are, beyond our
capabilities to do humbly speaking.
At least we're aware we know what we have
and we know that, it's going to take some
fantastic people to help get us there.
And that's what our next project.
. Tom: That's one of the one of the things
I was going to say about why this has
worked and why it's going to work is
John and I both realized that this was
something very unique and something that
could turn into something pretty massive.
And we also both realize that our
job is to get it to a certain point
that we can hand off to, other
people that have C-level experience
to take an app and scale it to the
size that it's capable of doing.
There's no ego, it's we both
understand what our strengths are
.
As soon as we don't bring value to
the equation and that's when we want
to make sure that it's in good hands.
So
John: for dear life with whoever
decides to take over branding, cause
he's got the gopher tattoo on his leg
Josh: to all our listeners.
We are seeing it now.
Oh, it is real right
Tom: above the cowboy.
John: There is no
Joe: plan B there's an
extreme cost of you and that's
John: an eight inch right there.
Joe: A real pain of a font change for you.
Tom: I get asked the question all the
time, like who would have goober dude?
I'm like first of all if I thought
that it wasn't going to work, I
wouldn't have started it, yeah.
But some of those questions, what
if you changed the font, man?
I don't care.
This has been.
John: Regardless.
That's the G that's the
Tom: go for man?
Joe: Like how the taco bell logo used
to look when it first came out, it's
still a bell, but it's just not the,
Josh: I just keep imagining this,
like the gopher character in a
multitude of vehicles, but you
never see the bottom of them.
And he pops up in people's yards.
Don't nobody knows.
It's the great mystery.
Yeah.
Joe: It's like the bottom half of that guy
on that, a home improvement show with Tim
So you're in a smaller market and which
means you have the opportunity to learn?
What are some of the things that,
what are some of the pain points
that you guys ran into and the
lessons you learned from them?
John: Let's see operationally getting
somebody who joins your platform
based off of the criteria that
you've put out there to educate them.
On what we'd hope your expectations are.
That's the most difficult.
And so I see for, I see
an ad to become a gopher.
Oh man.
I love every single thing I'm seeing here.
So I see a request come through and I got.
And I'm so passionate about it,
but I forget to tell the person
that I just accepted their request
that, Hey, I'm on the way or on is
they didn't have it at this store.
I'm going to go over here and
just communicate along the way.
So sometimes we've had the greatest
intentions just kinda missed that.
And so that's some automation fixes
for us that, very simple, but yeah,
we don't want to do the automated,
what we see when I want automated
prompts to tell you to communicate
the way you speak to that person.
Whereas I'm sure you've used all types of
delivery services and so on you get that,
that, that message is not coming from that
Joe: driver.
How many times my daughters have been
standing in front of the door waiting for
their Amazon book with this neighborhood?
It's not crying.
John: Yeah, I would say
Tom: for me to answer that question
the lessons learned early on
when we were collaborating and
brainstorming on how we wanted the
app to work and what we thought.
And by we, like our small team, what
we thought would work and some of the
things that we decided not to spend
money on early on, because again
we self-funded this so far early on
now we have a group of investors.
Every dollar, just like any
startup is very important.
And some of the things that we spent
money on early on that we thought
were going to be, just awesome ideas.
It turns out once to John's point,
once we got it out in a use case
and started studying and getting
some analytics back, they weren't.
We had early on the development there
was some things that we would definitely
change but as with any business.
But I think looking back on things
now, Some of the decisions we
made on things to spend money on
earlier than, or later than we did.
Joe: In hindsight, could
you have saw that comment?
Cause I think like anybody that builds a
user platform, like Facebook got started
to rank the hotness of college girls
and that's not what it is right now,
averse, whatever that's going to be.
John: No, that's a good question.
And we definitely don't want to round
up for ourselves in reflection and go,
oh, whoa could have saw that coming.
One thing that, I know I personally,
because I'm absolutely wrapped up
in this thing every single day right
now would be with the development
piece to, have asked more questions.
How significant is the actual tech
stack part of, this idea and it is.
Wildly more important than I had.
It's like the whole idea.
Absolutely.
And also like when you're communicating
your idea and, to a developer we
could have been much more clear look,
this is what it should look like.
This is how it should feel.
This is how our users should respond.
This is what the finished product
looked like, along the way.
And, we didn't necessarily, and when
I say we it's, of course it is spelled
I, but didn't do necessarily that
due diligence right off the bat and
that due diligence has now been done.
And I feel it could have benefited us.
And it matters the most today.
But it did probably, set us a little
bit back, several months that's a big,
Joe: and I think everybody learns it
in their own business in their own way.
I know for me with websites, I thought
I was selling a product, a website,
and it turns out it was actually
selling a process of here's how.
Bill w I'm selling an experience,
which is really what people are doing
when they're getting a gopher there.
They're experiencing not having to go do
this thing themselves using your plan.
It's not like they're not
really buying a six pack.
They're using gofer for the
experience of man, somebody
went and got me the six pack.
Sure.
It's a whole different thing,
really, when you think about it.
And I think that's the nature of the
user-driven the users will let you know,
like you mentioned earlier, they'll let
you know what the right thing is the
exciting part about that is it could
pivot some user three months from now
could come up with this great way to
use your platform and tell six people.
And then they tell six people
and they're like, man, this
is what the platform is now.
John: 15,000 users later, that's
more or less how it has become.
Yeah.
It's from that.
One of the most humbling and inspiring
things is that, like I mentioned
earlier, there's a rating process
at the conclusion of a transaction.
Are you, our blended user rating is 4.98.
Wow.
You rate me, I rate you
afterwards thousands and
thousands of transactions, 4.98.
And I don't want to make excuses for the
ones and twos, but I know all of them.
I've been involved.
I have talked to every single transaction.
If you use, go for, Hey, good to
talk to you again, because I am, I've
reached out to you and have committed
to making sure that if it's a five, then
even though there's not a six, we'll
try to make that rating that great.
And if it's a one, then we will
do every possible thing that we
can to avoid that in the future.
And but again, the fact that it
is where it is right now, and we
have so much of a better product to
deliver to you is pretty inspired.
Yeah.
Joe: Tough with the reviews because
people write the dumbest reviews
that aren't related to your.
Cause I always go right to the one-star
review when you're on whatever.
And you're like that's not even
what they were sounding like I was
looking at chairs before we started.
I wanted to buy some new chairs,
got a squeaky chair and it's got a
one-star review for these chairs.
Everything else has five stars.
These chairs are great.
And then this one guy's Hey,
you didn't pre drew my holes.
John: I'm out.
We've got one on apple that
says this is an Android.
Yeah.
Tom: That's what I was going to say.
A lot of the, a lot of the ones there.
Yeah.
A lot of the ones and twos are, of course
that's the nature is to look at those
first because I don't know why it's
like some deep human things you just
want to see what are they mad about?
And with governor, it's like some of
the stuff's like user error, one, a lot
of them like, oh, I accidentally hit
John: one star.
Joe: Yeah.
I'm thinking about how I could use the
platform to motivate my own children.
To be like, Hey Hey, if you
could go rake the lawn and I'm
like, oh I just paid that guy.
40 bucks could have been yours.
Yeah.
Tom: Yeah.
Every time there's a a request
that comes out for, take a mattress
to a dump or something like that.
I'll text my son and a couple
of his buddies from, yeah,
he's a senior in high school.
Hey man, look, this is the quickest 50
bucks you're ever going to make, go do it.
And if they're not quick
enough that bang it's gone.
The average gopher request in this
market and our pilot is like, what?
10 seconds?
John: And
Joe: so what is your, what's your
area size specifically in our area?
So you carry Raleigh, what is it?
Yeah.
You
can
John: just call it the triangle.
Sure, absolutely.
Yeah.
Tom: It can be downloaded
anywhere obviously, but like I
was in Charlotte yesterday for
work and a request came through.
That's the coolest part for me.
I John is definitely a needy 24 7 in
this and he doesn't always have a.
The time to stop and smell the roses
sometimes because he's just so involved,
like he's managing the developers,
everything, but what's cool to me
is when John he'll send me like a
screenshot of some random part, small
town USA, and someone's downloaded the
app and submitted a go for a request.
And it's just, that's the cool part for me
is like, how did this person hear about?
And it's the cool part,
but it's also oh crap.
Like we gotta get these
enhancements out quick.
Yeah.
That's growing
Joe: what's what systems or
processes do you guys wish you
would have put in place in her?
John: Oh boy.
Let me start with that.
Joe: When people just answer I wish I
would have put systems and processes
John: in place.
Yeah, no, so back to the development
piece I wish that I would have known
what I know today then, so that I would
have known when to check in during any
given sprint or, Say that, Hey, we've
got a deadline here for the next month.
All right.
It's a weekend, how are we doing?
What does it look like?
How can I help what additional information
do you need so on and so forth.
Whereas, if it gets to one, to the
end of that month, and you're like, oh
boy, that's nowhere near what I was.
We were hoping w where it would be.
And so I think that today, what we have
in place is actually a daily check-in.
And yeah, that's a half hour of
expense that, we're absorbing, but
we're getting through things at a
much greater rate than we were before.
But again, it was, part of
that whole learning process.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Tom: Same.
I would say knowing now
what we know would that.
It's a very convenient
answer, but it's very true.
There was some things early on we have a
different relationship with a different
developer now, but knowing what we
know now, I think we would have changed
some of the processes and some of the
deliverables from the developer to us
John: problem is we just really didn't
know how to communicate that because we
didn't know even a language we don't know.
Yeah.
That's we have all the intentions
of the world to give you this end
product, but just skipped right over the
beginning, but we made up ground quick.
There you go.
Joe: If you've been listening and
you're like, man, I should try this out.
And you're in the triangle.
It's the gopher request app.
You can download it off of your app store.
Just go ahead.
I created an account.
I was going to be sneaky and have
somebody go for something, but then I
got wrapped up in the conversation and
forgot, but that would have been a cool
John: moment.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Tom: We've done it before,
so there's two apps, right?
So if you want to make money doing
the request, go to go for go.
But if you want to request something,
it's go for a request just like same as
Uber drivers log into a different thing.
But we've used that several times
where we've been at an investment
pitch or something like that.
And we'll ask some, just
subliminally, just skipping over man,
John: what do you
Tom: guys want?
Something to drink?
He has.
And then John will start talking
and I'll get on my phone.
Boop.
And then 12 pack notes.
What that it's happened.
John: It could have been a real
Joe: let down in my particular
building, which has no signage on it.
And it's very difficult to
John: buy.
I'm sorry about
Tom: that, man.
I was a little flustered
John: coming in, man.
I was like, there, go for span.
They'll find it
Joe: everywhere.
And I liked that.
I also really like the idea of it.
I think that's something that Josh and
I just personally like I like the idea
of doing something as opposed to sitting
around and I would find it enjoyable
especially so my last level, my last
position that I had before I started
my business, I was like C-level and
a manage a lot of people for somebody
that's been in that position just to
do something that's not crazy hard
is like therapeutic, like I would
just like to go, yeah, it's Saturday.
Somebody wants me to spread.
John: All right.
Yeah.
Why not?
Joe: That's not bad.
And then I'll use that and whatever,
buy some cigars and advice and people
over and that'll make a day out of it
Tom: because kids, man, college kids,
they want that beer money for the weekends
cross a couple of gopher request, Tuesday,
Wednesday, Thursday all works out,
John: especially the easy ones.
Obviously I'll introduce myself,
to whoever I do a go for request
for and what do you do there?
And I'm like, I'm the CEO.
And then they freak out and I
was like, it's really, I don't
look at it like that at all.
I'm like, I want you to understand
that you put out a request for a 12
pack of beer and offered 15 bucks.
I was already at the store
and I'm already coming.
Live right around the street.
Wow.
So why wouldn't I do you a solid,
I'm not immune to money, right?
Sometimes it's even way more than
that, depending on what time of night.
And so just thinking if we get enough
people on the platform that are in those
types of situations, like things are going
to get done a lot faster than they're
really not any sweat off anybody's back.
It's not like installing a fan.
I was already there.
Yeah.
It's a
Tom: community.
Joe: I'm just seeing like episodes
of sitcoms in my mind of if I needed
to impress somebody, I would hire
a gopher and have them come and
pretend they recognize me and give
John: me, Hey man, do that is money.
We're watching
Joe: Seinfeld right now in Georgia stands.
Couldn't prove that he knew
any black people, his friends,
John: well,
Tom: not quite as dramatic as that, but
we had somebody Put a gopher request
out to have someone come stand in
handout, Halloween candy, because they
were too lazy to do it themselves.
John: And you know who you
are, you know who it is.
Don't you?
We talked about him earlier.
Oh really?
Tom: he's a big old fella.
That's a great use of it.
Joe: I think it's a really
cool idea for a product.
And I think it's a great way
for people to earn extra money,
especially as a side project.
I think people might find very in very
cool ways to use the platform, because
I think everybody that's trying to make
money as an entrepreneur in the gig
community is looking for that opportunity.
That feels fair.
Is that worth it?
Do I have to overpay?
And a lot of the big guys or companies,
it's a pay to play to get seen.
It's a pay a premium to.
For finding you the work.
And a lot of that feels
unfair in the gig economy.
You found the work while your platform
did, but that's still does that mean that
should be like that's people complain
about I think in terms of the app store
from apple is going to take 30% of your
transactions and the people that made
the games are like, that seems high.
You didn't do anything.
Like I did
John: all the work.
Yeah.
We'll hope that inspires people.
What you just said.
And I'll just tell them straight up.
You don't need to try to circumvent
gopher to try to use any type
of principles off the platform.
We will hear everything
that you have to say.
If you have ideas, we want this
thing to evolve something crazy.
Like we want everybody that's out there
grinding right now, that's trying to
compete against the bigger companies and
that, are trying to establish themselves
as a hard worker, a good worker.
What have you we want to help in any
and every possible way that we can.
Tom: Yeah.
And with the, you touched on
something earlier, that's a
really important moving forward.
And I think another wave of really good
timing, the great resignation, there's
more people are quitting their jobs right
now, because whether it's because of, some
type of political mandate and things like
that, that are finding a lot of people
unemployed and unsure, Even if it's in
the interim, this provides an opportunity
for people to make quick, easy money.
And it also solves for, the requesters
to, sometimes it is a convenience
base, but also, it's practical to,
like in my application from a business
standpoint or, another example
is there's my, my girlfriend has
medicines and things that need to be
delivered to her mom like every week.
And it would take her an
hour and a half to do it.
So she, every week she sends a
gopher request and usually the
same person now it's it's almost
like they're waiting for it.
And so it's it feels good from a business
owner standpoint, we are doing something.
With nothing but good intentions.
We really are providing people,
especially when COVID hit, we we're both
from Holly Springs and there were some
restaurants that got hit really hard.
And one of the coolest things that
we, we were able to help them keep
food coming out of their kitchen
and Keno, keep revenue coming in.
We really do feel like there's it's a very
gratifying thing that we're doing here.
Joe: I like that.
I'm
John: going to go for something.
Go for it.
Go for it.
Need it.
Now.
Go for it.
Go for it.
Joe: Go for it.
Thanks so much guys for coming.
John: This was fun.
Awesome.
Tom: Set up here.
Anybody.
I'm going to tell them a lot of my
business
John: friends appreciate
Joe: that since I don't have a sign,
that's the only way people now I'm
John: never going to leave.
Tom: I'm never going
to live that one down.
I drove right past this place,
like 10 times got lost at perfect.
We enjoyed
Josh: watching you from the window.
Thanks for being on the show guys.
No, thank
Tom: y'all.