Build Your SaaS

The whole team is on the show! Jon, Helen, Jason, Josh, and Justin are on the mics to discuss our recent team retreat to Nashville, Tennessee. If you're wondering what a retreat looks like for a remote team, you'll get a lot out of this episode. We also reveal some of our exploits in Music City:
"Going to a Tiki Bar is usually a mistake."
Highlights
  • (00:10) - Welcome
  • (01:15) - Highlights of our retreat in Nashville
  • (13:00) - It's not easy to get everyone together
  • (20:31) - Our schedule for the retreat
  • (26:42) - Electrolytes are a good idea
  • (32:08) - Things to improve or tips for other teams
"For 51 weeks, our small team works efficiently. Our team retreat week is a culmination of celebrations, milestones, birthdays, and holidays we might have missed. It's special to condense these moments into one week and see everyone in person to celebrate our achievements from the previous year." – Helen
Links:
Takeaways:
  • The city you choose for your retreat will significantly influence the team's productivity and leisure activities.
  • Be intentional and set aside time for planning and product discussions.
  • A retreat is a great time for a remote team to celebrate milestones and achievements.
  • Have a balance between work activities and fun activities.
  • Simple activities like games or cards can be as fulfilling as fancy events.
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  • Austin Loveless
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  • Dave Giunta

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Creators & Guests

Host
Jon Buda
Co-founder of Transistor.fm
Host
Justin Jackson
Co-founder of Transistor.fm
Editor
Chris Enns
Owner of Lemon Productions
Guest
Helen Ryles
Customer Success at Transistor.fm
Guest
Jason Pearl
Engineering & Product @ Transistor.fm
Guest
Joshua Anderton
Marketing Engineer at Transistor

What is Build Your SaaS?

Interested in building your own SaaS company? Follow the journey of Transistor.fm as they bootstrap a podcast hosting startup.

Jon:

Hey, everyone. Welcome to Build Your SaaS. This is the behind the scenes story of building a web app in 2023. I'm Jon Buda, a software engineer.

Helen:

I'm Helen. I'm Head of Customer Success.

Jason:

I'm Jason, and I'm a software engineer.

Josh:

I'm Josh, and I'm marketing engineer.

Justin:

And I'm Justin Jackson. I do product and marketing. Follow along as this motley crew builds transistor.fm . We got the whole team on the show today. First time we've ever had this many people on any episode of Build Your SaaS, I think.

Justin:

But we just, recently got back from our 2nd ever team retreat, and we went to Nashville, Tennessee. And, I thought last year we did a kind of an update episode, and I thought we'd get everybody on the mics and do another kind of review of the team retreat. It's also just a chance for us to talk about kind of what we're thinking about and working on and working towards here at Transistor. So why don't we start off by just sharing some highlights. What were some of your highlights from the retreat this year at Nashville.

Justin:

Helen, did you have any off the top of your head?

Helen:

Yeah. I mean, we did lots of things over the week. But I think for me, the highlight was kind of spending time together. It was our priority to get together and spend time together. So when we did things like playing cards and playing games, I think I learned more about all of you, in those kind of couple of hours than I have to know the entire past year, really.

Helen:

So it was very telling, some of you. Some of you, the way you play games, it's, it's, very interesting.

Justin:

We we played a a card game called Cheat, which I had played before, but I'd forgotten it. We had, like, we rented again a a big common meeting room, like a penthouse, where we could all go in, and it had a a circular card table. And, yeah, there's a game called cheat where you have basically lie to each other. And, that was fun. That was fun to see everyone's different lying technique. Helen was doing something shady on her side. She had a system.

Jon:

She was an experienced player.

Helen:

It didn't work, though! I only won one game, so I think Jason was the Cheat winner there.

Justin:

That's right. Yeah.

Jason:

Okay.

Justin:

Jason ended up winning a lot of those those, those cheat games.

Jason:

Yeah. I'm good at cheating.

Justin:

My favorite is, like, everybody has a look when somebody calls them on cheating, And they have cheated. Everyone has a look. Just getting to see everyone's little look, like Jon's little smirk and, you know, every every everyone basically has a smirk When when they're caught, that was one of my highlights too. The the, we played card games, and we played some Jackbox games on, the Nintendo switch. Yeah.

Justin:

I think just the simple stuff sometimes is is the best time. You you do get to know people quite a while when you're playing cards.

Jon:

Had had to engineer some some, HDMI and USB-C dongles together to actually get the switch to work.

Helen:

Yep. We have a photo of that somewhere as well.

Justin:

That was funny too. Yeah. We had we had to switch, but we needed to dock it, but there was no no outlet. And so Jason, with, like, we had piles of pillows. We had multiple cables.

Justin:

We had, HDMI cables and power cables stretched to the limit so that we could

Jason:

It definitely it definitely looked like a fire hazard.

Josh:

Right. Yeah. Yeah.

Justin:

It it was fun Hearing people laugh, like, laughing together, I'm also thinking of we went out to, Grand Ole Opry, but there's a stand up comedian. And, Josh, you were just losing it behind beside me. You were laughing so hard at that that stand up comedian that they had. He's he was he was really funny.

Josh:

Yeah. He was hilarious.

Justin:

But yeah. Just laughing with folks is, a highlight when you know, you you get to chuckle in, Like our weekly team meeting, we get to chuckle a little bit, but all out laughing. That happens at team retreats. Anyone else? Jason, you have any highlights?

Jason:

Yeah. I mean, I agree with the game stuff. That was pretty fun. Grand Ole Opry was, I didn't know what to expect. I've I've, like, heard it mentioned, but it was, it was pretty cool.

Jason:

It's like a variety show almost. I I had no idea. So it was pretty cool seeing that. Everybody everybody there was very serious. It was a very serious audience.

Justin:

Yeah. Well, except those crazy Canadians that kept Screaming out during, Keith Urban.

Jon:

Yeah. It's rowdy rowdy Canadians. Right.

Jason:

The rowdiest of all.

Jon:

Had too many Molson's.

Justin:

I was surprised too because I didn't know what to expect. But, yeah, the the show was so well put together. Like, they've been doing that show since 1925, And you could just tell they know how to put on a good show night after night. Yeah.

Jon:

That was that was recorded for radio too. So I guess Maybe you can hear us cheering

Justin:

or laughing. You might you might if you listen closely to that episode

Jon:

Or or groaning at the one guy who we didn't like.

Justin:

Yeah. Yeah. There's well, You guys didn't like him. I I I have been singing that song nonstop. That that song by Michael Ray became kind of an inside joke for us because he's got he's got a few lines that we ended up, referencing a few times.

Justin:

Still got too much Kentucky in, like, Tennessee, But I'm working on it. That became a little inside joke for us.

Helen:

There's Such catchy tunes that you can't help but keep singing it for weeks afterwards. So

Justin:

Even the bad country. Yeah. Even the bad country.

Jon:

Most of it was good country, though. I was that was I was pleasantly surprised. I also didn't know what to expect. That was that was a lot of fun.

Justin:

Yeah. Josh, how about you? You're a music guy. Was there any highlights from Grand Ole Opry or the the music you saw that seemed especially great.

Josh:

I was at yeah. I was actually gonna say the, the Food was

Justin:

Oh, yeah.

Josh:

The highlight, Rachey. Talk about the food. Wasn't it was like everywhere we went, the the food was just fantastic. It's like and the coffee too. I mean, I, I think I got, like, a shirt or a hat from, like, every coffee shop in Nashville, which Didn't seem like it was gonna be a lot at first because, like, usually, like, most cities usually have, like, you know, a few good coffee shops.

Josh:

But But, yeah, Nashville, I was, there was, like, almost every block, there was, like, a really good, like, 3rd wave Coffee shop.

Justin:

Yeah. Totally.

Josh:

So, yeah, that that was, that was cool. But, yeah, the music The music music was, incredible. Like, I've I've been there once before, and it it wasn't nearly that great. Like, on that main strip with Broadway, There weren't that many bands playing this time. What was it like, there's probably, like, 20 or 30 bands at any given I've

Justin:

tried see, I've tried to this to other people too. So Broadway is the main it's the main strip downtown Nashville. And the best way to describe is is kind of like, Times Square in New York or, What's the main strip in,

Jon:

You think Bourbon Street?

Justin:

Bourbon Street. Yeah. That's the one I'm thinking of. So it's just crazy. And I I this is probably not the most, the it felt like a red light district for music because you're just, like, walking down this main strip, And there's just open windows with bands playing all along, and they're basically playing cover songs trying to get you to come inside each bar.

Justin:

Right?

Jon:

And each bar has multiple floors, each with a different band.

Justin:

Yeah. Like that Yeah. That honky tonk. What's it called? Honky Tonk Central we went to?

Justin:

Like

Josh:

Oh, yeah.

Justin:

Every floor had a different band, and, Like, we'd go up. And I'm I'm, like, into music, but, Josh, you're a musician. So you were always, like, like, just losing your shit over Some of these bands, like, that one guy was was doing slide guitar with a beer bottle, which Oh, yeah. Which he says is really hard to do?

Josh:

Oh, it's really it's really hard to learn slide, like, with a regular, you know, with a regular Sliding tool or whatever they're Yeah. Not sure what they're called but Yeah. That was incredible. I'd. That part was, like, that part was insane to me.

Josh:

It was just, like, there's just so many musicians. You start to kinda go like, like, like, if you're just comparing them to each other, it just seems like, oh, yeah, this one this guy's okay. Yeah. But it's they're all world class musicians. And then you, like, go to the Grand Ole Opry, and there was, like, some of these some of the people that got up there We're in their forties and fifties and they had just been, like, added to that the, you know, the Grand Ole Opry family.

Josh:

It's like there's all these people, like, 100 and 100 of these, like, fantastic musicians that are just there, like,

Justin:

working

Josh:

their butt off trying to Yeah. It's pretty pretty incredible. And if it and apparently, if it doesn't work out, they go and start fantastic restaurants and coffee shops.

Jon:

That's what I've

Justin:

They just retired.

Josh:

What I've observed. And do something else really creative.

Justin:

Yeah. There was that one who is that one guy that Was, I'm just looking for his name now. I've actually listened to him a few times since Grand Ole Opry, but he was his story was so compelling because he'd been working his whole life to get that stage, and we got to see him up there the first time. It it kinda show like, because we are in the Entertainment business, like, podcasting is an entertainment form. And for me, it was just Wild to see all of these performers in a different discipline.

Justin:

They're in music. And just to Make, analogs to podcasting like the how you how do you stick out when you're just one band on Broadway, And there's, like, whatever 30 other bands playing that night. The idea of, like, working really hard at something and getting really good at it, and that Still not being enough. Like, you that's that's, like, necessary, but not sufficient to make it. And then, And just how some of these stages are end up being so important.

Justin:

Like, if you if you're an independent artist and you get on the Grand Ole Opry stage, that's like That could be your ticket. That that might be the the break that you need to get a bunch of people listening to you and, you know, touring touring more often and getting more fans and all that. So yeah, that was that was interesting for me to think about all that while we're there around so many performers. In in Montreal, the it's just Montreal was where we went the year previous, and, it's just a different city. But this was Such a performance town.

Justin:

Everybody there is, like, trying to make it. You know?

Helen:

Yeah. Yep. Yeah. These guys place play for hours as well. We, like, Walk past a bar, and then come back past again several hours later.

Helen:

The same musician has been playing for hours and hours, so they Yeah. Clearly putting their, reps in and playing every night for multiple hours at a time.

Jon:

Yeah. It is really wild. It is hard to it is hard to explain to people, I think. It's like you, The first time we walked onto Broadway, it was just like a cacophony of you hear you hear all the music at once, and you're like, how do I even decide what to play or what to listen to? Yeah.

Jon:

A friend of mine that used to live there describes it as Nash Vegas Yes. Which seems appropriate.

Justin:

It's also kinda like the strip in in Vegas. Yeah. It's just Pandemonium and lots of bachelorettes and just lots of people there to party and, you know, it's it's a interesting place. What what about you, John? What were some of the highlights for you?

Justin:

Yeah.

Jon:

I mean, similar to Helen, it's just hanging out with everyone in person. We don't get to do it often enough and, just getting to know each other a little better every time we hang out in person is always always a fun thing and getting to spend, you know, some Focus time talking about the company itself and where it's headed and how we wanna work together and what didn't, you know, what the next year looks like. I think those were definitely the highlights.

Justin:

Yeah. If anything, every time we had this feeling last year too, It's it's hard to make it happen. Right? It's hard. It it took a a while for us to plan this, this retreat, and, It takes extra time out of our regular schedule.

Justin:

We have to pick a venue. We have to book the hotels. We have to book flights. And then we have to basically leave our homes For a week, which is a a pretty big ask. You know?

Justin:

Like, it's it it costs us something to be there. On the other hand, it feels like, man, we you could almost Do it twice. Right. Just because being together is so, special. And I think working on the Internet, the same disconnection we see in the culture at large, like people, you know, just Barking at each other on Twitter and everything.

Justin:

That does also extend to teams too. You know, it's just like when all we're doing is chatting to each other on Slack. And then we have one meeting a week that's like a video call like this. All of the moments those little moments that you would normally get in an office where you're getting Coffee together or you're talking by the water cooler, like, all of those memes about office life. There's disadvantages to office life, But there are some advantages, and you really get a sense of that when you're together.

Justin:

You get the sense of, like, oh, wow. Like, you get all these little pieces of People. And, I think it I think in a way, technology does kind of dehumanize us in a way. And then when we're together, it's like, it's a humanizing experience just to be together with each other.

Jon:

Definitely.

Justin:

My highlight well, one of my highlights was I've always wanted us to do a photoshoot. And this year, we made it happen. We we went on I should get the name of this. Is it just called Photowalk Nashville? Photowalk Nashville.

Josh:

Yeah. I think so.

Justin:

And, I think most of their business is just doing bachelorettes, and she said she gets some teams, but I think it's that's the minority. This we showed up not knowing what to expect And, basically, a bunch of repressed nerds showing up for this photo shoot, and we We get there, and there's the first thing I didn't realize she would have this, but we show up at, a makeup store. Right? And the There were 2, like, photo booths inside the makeup store. That's how we started this photo shoot.

Justin:

1 was like this futuristic neon thing, And the other was the Taylor Swift room. Oh, and then there was a flower wall. There was three things. And this whole experience was just A riot to me. Just getting us all in she would, like, pose us and then, you know, Kind of chied us to smile and and do different poses, and I just thought it was hilarious, the whole thing.

Justin:

And something I think we'll always remember. It was an experience in of itself to, you know, have her take us to all these places. And then she took us to all these places in Nashville. All these famous murals and stuff that we posed up against. So that was That was pretty fun for me.

Jon:

It was fun. Got a nice nice tour of 1 of the newer neighborhoods, I think.

Justin:

Yeah. Yeah. And the

Jon:

I think it was. Right?

Justin:

The The neighbourhood was really cool. It had just been kind of redeveloped. And we got all these great photos of, Of us in, like yeah. I think the Taylor Swift room was my favorite. She was like, she was like, how many of you wanna get into the Taylor Swift room?

Helen:

We were all like, yes. We will.

Justin:

Yes. Yeah.

Josh:

Yeah. The whole thing kind of felt like, it reminded me of Silicon Valley, the the TV show when it was like one of the early episodes where they're showing, somebody was having a party and they had Kid Rock playing, and it was just like this really weird kind of like Context for for that, you know, it it just sort of felt like, it felt like that. It's like we're a tech company. And it was, like, the it was, like, it was almost more appropriate that it would be more awkward. It just because of how It was just yeah.

Josh:

I just thought that was fun. I really enjoyed it. It was it was great.

Justin:

Like, okay, guys. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Josh, work it.

Justin:

Work it. Good. Jason, come on. Come on. Put your hand on your hip.

Justin:

It was it was hilarious. Yeah. And she took us all over. And we got all these great photos now too.

Helen:

Yeah. We all warmed up to it by the end by the, end of the session. We were all professionals by the end.

Justin:

Mhmm. Professional, professional models by the end. Yeah. I I would actually really recommend this if I think I'd like to do it again. If you can find a photographer in the city you're going to with your team retreat or, or if these photo walks are a thing in other places where Someone just kinda tours you around.

Justin:

You get to see some of the city. She tried to point out, like, interesting things about the city And then recommend different places we could go after. And now we have all of everybody got, headshots done in various places. We have all these really fun, team photos, and it was also nice having someone else direct us. I think, You know, that's that's not something normally you get.

Justin:

I think for in Montreal, we convinced someone to take a photo of us, and, it turned out fine. But it was nice having all these. We've just got all of these photos that once I get all of your approval, we can use in marketing, Social media.

Helen:

Let's see about that. All these all these things.

Justin:

I'll try to maybe I'll put some of these in our, we'll have our episode art will be an approved photo from From the photo shoot. Any other highlights you think we should, bring up or other other things that were significant That, we haven't we haven't mentioned yet.

Jon:

I think Justin's fear of birds.

Josh:

Oh, that was fantastic. I'll make sure I get a clip of that, to, for the for the second episode.

Jon:

Dustin for a long time. I had no idea. They're just terrified of birds.

Justin:

I don't like birds. They're like little demons. They're little evolutionary demons that have just persisted. Who do you think killed the dinosaurs off? Do you think it's any accident that the only things that remain from that time are birds?

Justin:

It's gonna happen. They're just plotting their their next move, and there there were some crazy birds there. I that that There was, like, these trees filled with these little demons. And then all of a sudden, a bunch of them flew over me. And, Josh has it on video.

Justin:

We'll get Chris to put it in. Yeah. I mean, it it feels to me like I'm just trying my peers to Stop. Oh my god.

Helen:

I also, I bought a, like, a screen print of a poster, and it does have a bird on it just to just to remind me of our time in Nashville and and your screen. So

Justin:

Awesome. That's great. That's just that's just great. We can briefly describe our schedule because I think folks always wanna know kinda how we how do we do these retreats? How much do we work together?

Justin:

I think there's a there's a tension here, which is we you wanna get a little bit of work done when you're on these retreats, But, too much, and you kinda miss out on all of those little moments we just described. You get those moments when you're not Staring at a screen, you get them when you're kinda out experiencing life or sitting down and playing games together or going to a nice restaurant. Our schedule is pretty similar to Montreal. The one difference is we had one less day this year. Last year, we flew in on a Sunday, And then we flew out on Friday.

Justin:

Most of us did anyway. And this year, we all flew in on Monday and then flew out on Friday. So Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday were kind of our full days together. And then, we kinda had Evenings and mornings, Monday and Friday. But, generally, we would wake up 9 AM ish, meet at the penthouse suite, kind of 10 AM, 11 AM ish.

Justin:

Work together for a little bit, have a group discussion for 1 to 2 hours, have lunch, go out, walk, explore, nap, Go for a run, workout, and then we often I think every night we went for dinner together. Is that is that right? Yeah. We always went for dinner together. We also often have lunch together.

Justin:

And then there would be an evening activity where we would either go to the Grand Ole Opry, or just Go out, hang out, explore the city, together. So that's kind of the the general schedule. Any comments on that? Like, what how did you guys feel about the the schedule? I kinda missed having the extra day, but I also liked that We weren't gone as long.

Jon:

I thought Yeah. I think it worked out pretty well. I think the one thing I noticed in the difference from Montreal, it seemed like we did less Work work? Like, I feel like in Montreal, we would we'd kinda meet up in the morning and we'd be doing like a little bit of Work as in, like, sitting at a computer and

Justin:

either Yeah.

Jon:

Coding or doing customer support or whatever. It seems like we didn't do that, which isn't really a Bad thing, but, there's like a tension where you're taking time off to hang out with Everyone, but you're not doing work, and so you're like, I don't know, there's like a little bit of stress involved to some extent to It's really like, oh, I'm falling behind or I'm missing something or whatever, but, maybe that was just me. But I think it worked out pretty well.

Josh:

I that's where I was I went to WeWork every morning. That was he got some and I felt, like, a couple hours in every morning, which was, which was nice. They had they have, like, a really good view At the location there. But I I, yeah. I think otherwise, like, it felt like it went by really quick, because the the planning sessions were really good, and it and it but it was, like, oh, yeah.

Josh:

I guess we only had, like, we only had 3, like, because there was because of the way that it, And they were and I think they were, like, really effective, which was and, yeah, I realized that after, I think. But but it but it was nice. I think that Having some free time to kind of unwind in the afternoon was really helpful. I think the only other Retreat that I've been on like this was it was years ago, but there was, like, a a more of the group were extroverts, and so it was just, like, It was just, like, go pretty much all day long every day, and, and those those can be a little bit tricky. So it was nice That, it really felt like a balance kind of, I didn't come back like, didn't come home, like, exhausted, you know.

Josh:

Yeah. Like, it was like we did a lot, But it was it was nice that there was some some balance there.

Justin:

Yeah. Yeah. Any Helen, Jason, any thoughts on the The schedule?

Helen:

Yeah. I think it worked well. I think with me coming from a different time zone, I was kind of naturally kind of waking up a little bit earlier. So I felt like I was able to get a few things done before we were able to meet him in the morning, which was kinda nice to feel like there was something done in the day before we were discussing, The year as a whole or what we're gonna do next, in the next quarter. So I think it worked well and we then we kinda just sort of naturally moved on to lunch, and we still discuss things at lunch.

Helen:

You know, you can still have it kind of a productive time just being in the same room, talking about things, and Carrying on the conversation that we started earlier in the morning, in front of our laptops, and I carried that through to lunchtime, and I think Ideas come out a little bit better when you've got that kind of freedom to move things over rather than having to come up with our answers and suggestions within a particular hour. It kind of Blood throughout the entire day, really.

Justin:

Yeah. That's a good point. That that's the other disadvantage of of remote work is that You have, like, typically set meeting times where it's like, okay. Every Thursday, we meet and we have a schedule, but it can't last too long. Basically, everything in remote work has to be scheduled.

Justin:

You have to say, even if it's just like, Hey. Do you wanna jump on a call right now? It's still like, okay. We're we're we're we're doing this thing that's a little bit unorganic. You know, it's it's still Feels like this timebox thing, like, we're gonna be on a Zoom call for a little bit.

Justin:

And when you're on those treats and you're just walking around. Jason, you're really good at this. You bring up things while we're walking around. Like, what about this? And, we should think about this.

Justin:

And Ideas do kind of come out more organically when you're just spending time together?

Jason:

Or or when you have an old fashioned.

Justin:

Or yeah. An old fashioned. Okay. Let's briefly talk about booze because I definitely had too much Kentucky in my Tennessee. I the last night I think we I think we need to well, I I at least need to modify my approach next year.

Justin:

But Friday night became a bit of a debacle for myself, and I think everybody was feeling it Saturday, but I was really bad. Friday, We had a good time. Right? So

Jon:

Thursday. Thursday.

Justin:

Thursday. Thursday, we had a good time. So Thursday, We woke up. We went on that we had brunch or something together, I think. And then we went on the photo walk.

Justin:

Right? And then after the photo walk, we had already booked this amazing restaurant for 5 o'clock. So we knew we had a early dinner. And we thought, okay, well, we got some time. Why don't we go there's all these beautiful rooftop patios.

Justin:

So we went to rooftop patio. We had a few drinks there. Then we went for that amazing dinner. That place, Husk, that was I mean, we had 2 kind of amazing, like, memorable meals there, and that was that one was incredible. Mhmm.

Justin:

Just I think we can all agree. Was that that would have probably been was that your favorite of the 2, Jason, or did you like the other place better?

Jason:

I like the other place a bit better. Husk was awesome. Yeah. They're both great. One kitchen.

Jason:

What was the other

Josh:

Yeah. Kitchen 1 or 1

Justin:

Yeah.

Jon:

One kitchen. Placement.

Justin:

Anyway, we went to Husk, and it was again incredible. We had and they have incredible drinks. And so we did that. And then we're, like, trying to decide what we wanted to do because it was still early. And I don't even know how we ended up at that tiki bar, but I think the tiki bar was where was mistake number 1.

Jon:

Tiki bars seem to be usually a mistake.

Justin:

Yeah. Maybe we we just need a blanket policy. No more tiki bars.

Josh:

Oh, man. I now I'm remembering all this. Because that because that was the and then the waitress suggested a place on the strip, so we went back to Broadway after.

Justin:

Went to, like, a honky tonk and Listen to music. Now if you look at the photos, we are having the best time. Like, we are all hanging out. We are all listening to country music. You know, it's it it's a good time.

Justin:

After the honky tonk, then we we'd we'd gone to a few Speakeezes Speakeasies in Montreal, and we thought, oh, maybe we should go to Speakeasy. And then I think that was mistake number 2 was going to that Speakeasy after

Jon:

That place was strange.

Josh:

You have the shining?

Helen:

That was a creaky bar, that one was.

Josh:

That was awesome.

Justin:

There's, like, a a shining themed speakeasy in the basement of this hotel, and, we did not need to be there.

Jon:

Next year next year, we we hand out we hand out drink tokens to everyone, and you only get so many during the week.

Justin:

Yeah. Yeah.

Jon:

You can spend them wherever you want.

Justin:

Right.

Josh:

But that's it. I'm glad I had a burger at the

Justin:

Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The There.

Josh:

At the At Roberts?

Justin:

Yeah.

Josh:

Was that yeah. Roberts.

Jason:

Yep. That was smart.

Josh:

I'm really thankful for that. Yeah.

Justin:

That might have saved you, man. That was like, anyway, I I I woke up the next day, and we're all texting. And I think Jason's the first first one to make in that that joke of too much Kentucky in my Tennessee, but I'm working on it. Because we were all not feeling great. Right?

Justin:

We're I mean, Helen, you were you were you had been more restrained, I think. You were doing okay.

Helen:

Yeah. You guys started at 3 PM. Yeah. I waited until 5 PM. So you guys you've peaked a little bit you've peaked a little bit early.

Josh:

I think I did wait too. Yeah. There's

Justin:

Yes. I I woke up, and I I felt I I went through the whole night feeling fine. And then as soon as I got out of bed, I was just basically sick. And I was sick that whole day. I was supposed to have a flight out that day.

Justin:

I had to reschedule it. It was not fun, and I do not wanna repeat that ever again.

Jon:

You have learned your lesson.

Justin:

I learned my lesson. I I don't even know if I can drink. Ever since That I even the thought of booze just makes me, I can't even do it.

Josh:

After the the podcast movement trip, I, I I realized the value of just like I think I've had either a Gatorade or a water basically like, on me, basically, the entire Yes. Trip in Nashville too, that helped.

Helen:

Oh my god. Because

Justin:

Yeah. That was the Electrolytes is the key.

Josh:

Learnings from Denver. Right. Yeah.

Justin:

I mean, there is a broader discussion here about booze at company events In general and I think it is something we, in general, wanna be careful about. I I definitely we we we were having a good time, but, Yeah. The some some guardrails would be nice for, oh, the other thing is we had a keg in our penthouse, which which just meant there was, like, kinda beers kinda always around.

Jon:

Yeah.

Justin:

So But

Josh:

I think for the most part throughout the week, everybody was pretty like, There was really just the first night and the last night where there was there was a bit more. But, But yeah. Yeah. It was

Justin:

And, I mean, it is we we did have

Josh:

That last thing was big.

Justin:

Sometimes it's nice to have a good time. Just not too much of a good time. Okay. So that's that's booze, that's schedule. I wonder if we have any advice for ourselves for next time, ideas for next time, and any other tips we would give other teams that are thinking about doing a retreat.

Justin:

So anything we wanna improve for next time? Any tips, we can do for, other teams.

Jon:

Yeah. I don't know. I think maybe the only thing I could think of about, like, things to improve or tips, We didn't I don't think we went as in-depth on some stuff as we did last year.

Justin:

Mhmm.

Jon:

Like, as far as planning goes, like, we planned some we planned, like broadly what we wanna do, but we didn't really go too in detail. And like there's only so many times you can get together in person and really discuss stuff and Yeah. Kinda get down to the nitty gritty, and maybe having one less day affected that, but maybe having a kind of a better sense Before you get there about what to talk about and what to plan. Yeah. Like, we we knew we wanted to plan The next quarter, but possibly having that stuff determined before you come so we could kinda get Maybe into more detail about some of the features that we wanna build and and things like that, might be good.

Jon:

And we did talk a lot about, You know, maybe we adapt our our weekly meetings to be more product focused and and plan things out more regularly. Because we don't do it We don't do that particularly very often. It's, like, actually planning features out altogether. But I think I think there's something to be said for Talking more about those things in person.

Justin:

Yeah. I agree. Yeah. And it it almost felt like it having that extra day, that's that's the challenging part because On one hand, it felt great to not ask people to be gone from home for too long. But flying in on a Sunday and having Four whole days, I think is nice to just give us more time.

Justin:

But we were pretty this year, we were definitely a little You're right. Like, we had more, less time, like planning and working together than we had previous, and we could probably Build more of that and be more intentional about it. Jason, Helen, Josh, any other I should just go one person at a time. Jason? Yeah.

Jason:

I'm pretty much with with John. Just a little bit maybe more formalized, scheduled for the planning sessions.

Justin:

And, Helen, Josh? I'm sorry. Helen?

Helen:

Yeah. I think, for retreats, the city that you pick makes a big difference. So, The quieter the city, they're probably more productive as the team will be. The more fun the city, the more the team will feel like they want to kind of go and Not miss out on things and experience, the place, and what it what it has to offer. I think what was really helpful for us, we kind of collectively made a list of things that we would like to do before we went.

Helen:

Mhmm. And made a list of things that we would like to do before we went. Mhmm. So especially if you're going to somewhere that there isn't a particular person from the team that knows it well, It's useful to have everybody's input on the things that they would like to see and make sure it kind of, the trip It's kinda catered to, you know, everybody's interests really, which I think we did really well.

Justin:

Yeah. I think that's a good point. The the, the city you pick matters a lot. And one one bit of feedback I got from somebody on Twitter, I think, is we've we've, we've only done this twice, but we we tried to pick great cities that, you know, had lots to do. But, we tried to pick A a midway point between basically the UK and BC and then Illinois.

Justin:

Us in BC and then Helen in the UK kinda Fly about the same amount of time, and then Jason and John had a quick, a quick jaunt. And that's a good way to do doing that. There's Tool I can put in the, in the, show notes, a a location finder. Discover the optimal location to meet with your remote team, and You can have put in everybody's original city, and, they'll figure out kind of a a range of places you can meet. The other idea is that just going somewhere really amazing, you know, some teams always choose somewhere tropical Just because it's beautiful and, it's it's worth, you know, going somewhere that's just beautiful and gorgeous and has nice beaches.

Justin:

Other teams have chosen what we've done, kind of cultural hubs like Montreal, New York, Paris. I've I've heard of teams going there too. The activities that you do, it's like it's fun doing some things that are memorable, like Grand Ole Opry. But I think also just thinking, like, we had an incredible time, as we mentioned, playing cards, playing games, And I think that night where we we drank too much, if we'd gone bowling into the arcade, that might have been a better choice than than the tiki bar. So even just doing simple activities, it it's not like you have to do something crazy and, You know, go to the the the, an exciting show every night or whatever.

Justin:

Sometimes just saying we're just gonna sit around and, play some games, play some cards, watch a movie. Movie's not as good because you're just all watching, but I think you can have simple activities that I'd

Jason:

be fine making I'd be fine making bowling a standard,

Justin:

Just a standard activity. Yeah.

Josh:

Yeah. Great. At the an escape room would have been awesome too to just to see how everybody does Under Pressure and, like, working together on it. That would have been,

Justin:

Yeah. We've done escape rooms at, MicroConf, and that ended up being a big hit just because it is, Yeah. You you get to see more of people's personalities again when you're all doing an activity like that.

Josh:

I, I think that having that Having that one room where we could all, like, was basically just that we just left it open and everybody would just, like, wander in throughout the day, Just to be able to, like, just sit and chat randomly and and stuff. And then, of course, where we had the sessions and everything, that was really nice. That would have been really I can imagine, like, without that having to, like, go somewhere else out, like, off, you know, somewhere outside of the hotel and find a place to, Look, either do it just like at restaurants and hope that it works out, you know, or actually have somewhere you'd have to go separately would have been, yeah, Far less convenient. So that was I definitely think that that was, something that I'd Yeah. Highly recommend for for other companies.

Justin:

And this is, this is interesting because We could choose somewhere that's, less exciting in terms of culture and events and restaurants and everything. And, For example, I know some teams that have just gone to the mountains, and they've just rented a big place. And there are a few things to do in the The place you're staying, like, you know, maybe there's a pool table, and cards, and board games. And then the outings end up being like a hike. And so it's, you know, less going out on the town and more just like, hey, we're gonna today, we're gonna do this hike in the afternoon.

Justin:

And then in the evening, we'll have, I've been on retreat where we hired a chef, and then the chef just came in and and, You know, cooked at the place we were renting. So that could that could work well as well just to, it would be a totally different feel, But I think that that could be equally good just to have, it simplifies some things, you know. Yeah.

Jon:

That'd be interesting. Yeah.

Jason:

I think that'd be awesome.

Justin:

Anything else? Any other tips or advice we would give to other teams doing remote retreats or other ideas we wanna think about for next year?

Helen:

I think we Need to come up with a a a system of how we pick where we go next.

Justin:

Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And, Again, it doesn't always have to be, I think, meet in the middle.

Justin:

Meet in the middle is nice, but I think, there are other ideas of, Like, we could do one in Europe, for example. We could do one somewhere tropical. We could do somewhere mountainous. There's other ideas there that I think could work could work well.

Josh:

Yeah. I liked the the idea of a, going somewhere like Europe where there's more, options for train, like, to do to be able to get on a train and have, like, a few hours or whatever, where we can actually be working on something while we're going somewhere too.

Justin:

Oh, I love trains, so I'm all I'm all for that.

Jon:

Give Helen the hour flight instead

Justin:

of Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Eventually give, give Helen the the shorter flight.

Justin:

Cool. It is invaluable. It was It was really nice being with everybody. And again, I think we had the sense when we're there together, that It did feel like I I got to look at everybody and just feel like it's amazing that we get to do this. Like, I just feel fortunate to Work with such great people and the fact that we get to work on this great product and the fact that we have amazing customers.

Justin:

That's the other thing we didn't do this year that I kinda missed was, last year, Helen and I went and met with some customers. And that was, One of my highlights from Montreal. I just didn't make it happen in Nashville. We just looked up who's kind of around and and, organized some of that. But, Yeah.

Justin:

I just felt really fortunate to be there. I think we all had that sense. Hey? Just it was just nice being together and Felt it felt great.

Jon:

Mhmm. Yeah?

Helen:

Yeah. I think, 51 weeks of the year, we're kind of very much Head down, doing work in the most kind of efficient way we can as a small team, and I think this kind of week is like A culmination of all the celebrations and things that we don't necessarily get to do, whether it's people's birthdays or holidays or just milestones within the company, that it's nice to kind of Get to do that even if it is all condensed into 1 week. I think, yeah, I think the rest of the year, we we kind of work efficiently as we can, And, then it's nice to get get to see people in person to celebrate what we've achieved the per prior year.

Justin:

Mhmm. Yeah. And maybe we we could be even more intentional about that, about Celebrating milestones. If we're meeting once a year, that's the time to celebrate the number of years, different team members have been on the team, things that we've released, other milestones, that, we could celebrate. Sometimes just being intentional about those things and even just naming them In a group can be really helpful too.

Justin:

Cool. Alright, everyone. Thanks for being here. And, John, why don't we take this opportunity to thank Our Patreon supporters.

Jon:

Yeah. Thanks as always to our Patreon supporters for helping us out. We have Pascal from sharpen.page, Our friends at rewardful.com, Greg Park, Mitchell Davis from recruitkit.com.au, Marcel Falais from wearebold.af, Ethan Gunderson, Bill Condo, Ward from MemberSpace, Russell Brown from photivo.com, Avendra Sasse, Austin Loveless, Michael Sittver, my brother Dan Buddha, Colin Gray and Dave Junta.

Justin:

Junta. That would be that would also be fun to get some of our long running Patreon supporters Out to the next one. We gotta have Ajunta Ajunta fly in. Dan Buddha fly in. If we do it in the UK, we can hang out with Colin Gray.

Justin:

He's technically a competitor. He's still supporting the show on Patreon. Thanks, Colin.

Jon:

Oh, yeah.

Justin:

Michael Sittber's been around for a long time. Austin Loveless, Evander Sassy, Russell Brown. A lot of these people have been around a long time. Yeah. Well, maybe that's how we choose our next, retreat location.

Justin:

We just, where where's Junta live these days? Can we can we expose that on the show?

Jon:

Near Chicago.

Justin:

Oh, I guess Chicago. There we go. We'll just, we'll just do our next one in Chicago.

Jon:

There you

Justin:

go. Alright. Thanks, everyone. We'll see you next time we release the show.