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Ari Block (00:00)
Mostly I give softballs to our audience, but I feel like you can deal with a hard ball, no pun intended.
athletes get hurt, right? This is a difficult part of the journey. But there's also a silver lining here. Tell us more about your perspective about injuries.
Thomas Baker (00:12)
Absolutely.
I think with injuries, it really gives you a chance to develop skills that you never believed you had. when I fractured my hip, just, I had to change up everything, my approach to everything. I couldn't really do cross country or track after that. it helped me besides just physical therapy, it helped me really focus on flexibility. And I felt like I could take that to other sports. And I was always big on agility and
strength but flexibility plays such a huge aspect into agility and I just felt like that injuries always kind of helped me understand, wow, I can't use this part of my body. I didn't realize how vital that actually is to this sport or to my everyday life. mean, filling a cup of water with a broken shoulder, it's not fun. And I mean, I need water to stay healthy and alive. So I got an appreciation for the fact that my body
really important, even though I don't treat it like it is all the time.
Ari Block (01:27)
I think that's so funny how, from a human condition perspective, we don't always appreciate the things that we have until we lose them. Sometimes temporarily, but sometimes permanently, That's so interesting. And when you say agility, is it mental or physical or maybe both?
Thomas Baker (01:37)
You
Yeah,
yeah, so that's a great point. I think when you start off, feels like it's trying to grasp what you're doing. It feels like a mental agility, but then once you develop those skills enough physically, it becomes muscle memory. So you never really think about it. So I feel like it's, it's physical agility, but then once you hurt something, like when I hurt my hamstrings, then it's that mental agility all over again. It's just the fear of, I do this again? And then trying to get back into it is
It can be a nightmare because you second guess yourself and you question, can I do any of this? So it's building up everything
Ari Block (02:30)
And it's not just yourself who have gone through these injuries. Your athletes get
Thomas Baker (02:36)
Absolutely.
Well, I think with youth, the danger of it is you feel unstoppable no matter what, but that's not how the human body works. well, I shouldn't say unstoppable. You feel invincible. growing up as a Jackie Chan fan, like I proved he wasn't invincible, but he was unstoppable. He would take the shots and he would keep moving and he would find a way to persevere. And I think
physical endurance is just so important. So when I see a kid injured, just try to, a kid or I mean, an adult, I mean, when I coach adults, especially, I feel like they have a better grasp of it. But I try to slow them down, take it step by step because when you get injured, sometimes that adrenaline is so high, you just, you don't even feel it and you just want to continue playing. And I think it's just so important to, to not stop cold turkey, but slow down. And you know, if you slow down, you're still moving.
And that's really what's most
Ari Block (03:39)
That's funny. One of the reasons you mentioned Jackie Chan as a side note, you know, the thing when people say Jackie Chan, immediately the thing that I think about is how he punches somebody. And then the next thing is like, he's like, my hand hurts. that, I mean, that sense of humor, and humanity in, know, no, I'm not, you know, invulnerable.
Tell us about what that looks like as a youth coach. Kind of what's your day -to -day look like and let's talk about competitions as well and events.
Thomas Baker (04:12)
Absolutely, absolutely. as a youth coach, mean, you really have to make it so engaging for the kids. it feels like your day, you're always adapting your own day. you never make a set schedule for yourself because kids can lose interest in any sport very quickly. And you just want to remind them that they have so many physical skills that they can offer and that they can also develop. And we try to bring it in those games. it's a lot
introductions into new games that they've never heard of, even new games that maybe I heard of a week ago. And it's, what I like about coaching too. I mean, it makes you a better athlete because you have to understand these games well enough to teach them to kids. speaking to kids as a group, I try to teach them. It's so important to work as a team, but I want them to know that there's a focus on them individually. I think with,
being a youth coach, it's just trying to factor in not just everyone's needs but everyone's desires because you're playing sports because you want to not just because you need to and you know, it's very important
Ari Block (05:17)
Right. Right. What does that look like? How do you balance the teamwork and individualism
Thomas Baker (05:24)
I think to bring the balance to it is just to help the kids realize that, you know, they're complementing each other. So that's the individual aspect. It's like, they're not countering each other. And it's like, this accomplishment is for the team. It's not just for you. let's drive it home. Let's work together. I think that's really
what's most important to me because I want these kids to feel like one student offers something different from the other student. It's so important to have that individual style to any sport you play. I I think about the athletes I love, they're much different. They might have different struggles, they might have different strengths. I mean, my oldest brother, he's very flashy with hockey. My younger brother, he's more about the defensive end, but when they play together,
I mean, it's like they're unstoppable. I feel like I'm Pavel Datsuk and Phil Kessel. I just think it's really important to remind the kids that don't get too caught up in yourself because it's so important to focus on your team because your team is going to be looking out for you when you feel down.
Ari Block (06:37)
And you know, talking about feeling down, kids are real people, as us all, and have real lives, and sometimes things aren't the best.
Thomas Baker (06:43)
Absolutely.
Ari Block (06:50)
When real life spills into sports, what does that look like and how do you support the team or the individuals,
Thomas Baker (06:56)
sports kind of epitomize just the difficulty of life. And I'm grateful that right now with coaching, the Olympics are going on because I feel like that's a showcase of just how difficult life can be and what they endure. I feel
It's just so easy to get discouraged, but I, it's, think when you feel like you're losing in life, it's so hard to focus on your sport, even though that's where you want to be most because it's your safe haven. If you lose a step, it doesn't mean that you're done for it. It doesn't mean that you, can't bounce back. can't roll with the punches. So I think that, I try to offer that insight to the kids, to adults that I coach. And I feel
More often than not, see it with adults that I have coached before. It's just, you just feel like you, you've kind of reached rock bottom and the sport can no longer do it for you just because your life is in a very unpredictably confusing time. And I think it's just, you know, we all slow down in the sports we love, but then we can pick up, can, we can increase. And I think it's just reminding yourself that you still have it. You, you know,
beyond just the drive, it's like you've dedicated so much time. There's the skills will always be there. That muscle memory will always be there. And sometimes you just need to clear mind.
Ari Block (08:21)
Have you seen this additional aspect of her life, sports? Have you seen that actually help them get through difficult times?
Thomas Baker (08:29)
I've had friends that I've worked with where it's like if they have addiction issues or it's just they're going through depression,
be having that camaraderie. It's that's just so special about camaraderie. mean, it's friendship, but it's a connection on a deeper level where those people will always understand what you're going through. And, you know, your struggles in the sport, you feel heard without even having to say a word to those people who are on your team in that sport, because they suffer the same struggles and you overcome, you overcome them together.
I was facing debt issues and it was, I could see with my own life that just signing up for Jiu Jitsu and taking on that challenge just really, it helped me face a lot of fears
and insecurities because I mean, with my dad, felt like I, it's just, it was a constant struggle and I felt like I couldn't really face any part of my life. I mean, everything kind of felt terrifying and I felt like being in these situations where you're physically and mentally tested, it's, and I mean, it's a sport that can be expensive, but really all you need is just another training partner. You don't need a ball, you don't need a net, you don't
the gi that looks like a pajama suit. mean, really you can train with whatever you need. And I think that just, that helped me out so much because it just felt like, I could apply this to anything. And I feel like I can overcome anything now. And losing, you constantly lose when you start in that sport. And it's just such a great learning curve. At least I believe so. mean, just constantly losing,
dealing with even more so a constant encouragement from everyone you train with. It keeps you going, keeps you so motivated.
Ari Block (10:23)
I see children that lose their shit when they quote unquote fail. But that's not what happens when we see these martial artists kind of go through that process. You're losing all the time. You can't lose your shit. And in fact, I would argue you learn something more.
Thomas Baker (10:38)
just feel like there's just such a great level of calmness where it's like the calmness
It brings such a confidence with no arrogance. And I love seeing that. I mean, I feel like when you lose to that degree, you don't feel like you're losing. It's just on a physical level where you're being tested, but you don't feel like you're being broken. And I think it's just so important to feel it because mentally you just always feel like you're overcoming. I feel like with, with children, it's a little more personal. I've noticed, mean,
I was coaching Jiu Jitsu and I mean, if they lose to an adult, it's not the end of the world. If they lose to someone their own age, it's, we're signing a treaty for World War III or something. But I mean, it's just, I feel like on an adult level, it's just so much that the adults get out of it. I mean, I've lost to men much older than me and it's just, that inspires me because I feel like all
all the people I look up to, all the celebrities I look up to, at least in the sports and acting world, they're the old men. It's kind of like the fear of the old men in a world where men die young. mean, even the fictional characters like Indiana Jones and Batman, they're breaking everything, but they're also kicking butt everywhere they go. it's just being a young guy losing to the older guys, it's just, it's so helpful. It's so inspiring. And I think just the wisdom you get from
the older gents, it's something so special and they've been through it and they walk you through it and they just, they understand where you are because they were once in that position and it's just, I love that with martial arts. I've never really felt that with any other sport.
Ari Block (12:32)
Is there, when you're on the mattress, right, Randori, is there a, is it just everybody on their own trying to win? Or is there a sense of learning together or almost mentorship on the mat? What does that look
Thomas Baker (12:47)
it's nice
put yourself in a tough spot right off the bat. And I love that with a Jiu -Jitsu. And I think that's just, we can get that in our gym so easily. You can just constantly put yourself in tough positions on purpose. My instructor does that to me all the time. He'll give me so many advantages and he's developing his game and he's reminding me why he's much better than I am because I always think I'm going to win from those spots, but then I lose very quickly and
The intense roles are so important too. And I think it's just, it's just so important to, to go through all those sort of, modes, every, every class you're there if you can. And I mean, sometimes if you're, if your body's hurt, that's what's so helpful about the flow rollers. You, can relax a bit. And then if you're feeling on top of your game, you can really test yourself because you'll have the intense roles. I try to get all of that in with every class and it's
Such a rewarding experience.
Ari Block (13:50)
I love this concept that you're talking about of kind of learning self -control and a sense of calmness through martial arts, which might be counterintuitive to some people because hold on, this is a form of violence one might argue, incorrectly I would say, but through it you gain mastery and self -control. who do we say are the most dangerous people on the
Thomas Baker (14:12)
I used to be one of those dangerous white belts.
Ari Block (14:14)
So it's funny because that's saying which is I've noticed everybody has it almost, but it's exactly that, right? It's the people who have the least amount of self -control that, you know, I've gone into Randovri or fights, so to speak, with, you know, black belts or brown belts. I've never been afraid. I've never been afraid that I'm going to get hurt. But going into
White belt? I'm on my guard. I'm like, this is basically, know, I might as well be, you know, on the street with a gangster, like this is real. So that, that, that sense of self control actually is incredibly important. And, and I would argue that you can see that transition, right? You start off as a white belt and as you progress, you gain more and more self control. And I would even argue that that self control transitions into real life. And I've seen that happen with my son.
Thomas Baker (14:44)
Ha ha
Ari Block (15:12)
throughout his journey, which I think is quite incredible. I wanna shift to a little bit of a topic. When you look at your students and yourself, what's the proudest moment that you've seen your students overcome in their athlete journey?
Thomas Baker (15:16)
Amazing.
when their egos just diminish rapidly. I love seeing that because it's, I love when kids are confident. I do love it.
just love when a kid kind of starts to find their place and they build true confidence, not the insecurity that comes with cockiness. I think it's just destroying those egos. It's just something so amazing to see. And then I feel like for the more
humble students, which fortunately I have many humble students, it's just seeing them fall and get right back up. mean, it's, I don't know anyone who likes falling. I don't even think stunt doubles like falling and that's what they get paid for. So it's, I love seeing that, that perseverance. It's just so special to see and at such a young age and I really try to encourage them that, you know, it's okay to be hurt.
They're tough and I know that they can get back up.
Ari Block (16:33)
there is a difference between true confidence that office often comes with humility. And I don't have to call it fake confidence, which is actually maybe overconfidence, which actually sometimes is a symptom of lack of skill and lack of ability.
Thomas Baker (16:52)
We see it so often and again at the adult level, especially in a martial art jujitsu, it's so common. mean, we will see young men walk onto the mats feeling unstoppable and then just
It feels like they're full of rage, ready to hurt someone. then they get stopped with these. And I think it's just such, it's an invaluable lesson for them. And just that calmness, really, to me, the calmness, it's almost like something you see an expression on their face. It's just that they have that experience. They've endured, they still endure. they not only are they used to it, but they, they brace themselves for it. It's, it's just amazing to me.
So I agree with
Ari Block (17:41)
I remember my many, many, years ago, my one of my first white belt experiences, and we were practicing basically grips and throws. And I was that white belt and I came into it, know, zero to 60 and 3 .5. And I landed on my backs, you know, like, like it threw the air out of your chest, right? You know, you know that. And I was sure this guy was going down. didn't think it was going to be
Thomas Baker (17:57)
Ha ha
Ari Block (18:11)
And when I caught my breath and he gave me my hand, helped me get up, he said, hold me like this. And then he said, put your leg over there and try again. And instead of it becoming ego, it became this like, this almost mentorable, teachable moment where he showed me what to do. And this kind of ego of, you can't, like, you lost, as opposed
No, here's how you get better. That was such a pivotal point for me because it taught me how you can be in this environment of so -called very energetic conflict, almost violence. But you have a very soft and kind mentoring relationship where both sides are improving the other. And that was such a mindset change for me. So I kind of changed something in how I saw the world at that
Thomas Baker (19:11)
I love that.
Ari Block (19:11)
Now, you coach, you do martial arts, but you also do marketing. you actually,
Thomas Baker (19:19)
when When I started
with the coaching background, my boss learned more and more about my interests and my background in school because as I spoke with you, being a huge fan of Jackie Chan, you, I mean, it just drove me to sports. It drove me to mastering the fall and film is an art, just like sports are an art, I mean, film, it's that visual art that always drove me.
And I felt like if I could combine sports and that visual art, I'd be complete. So I think with that marketing background, I went to school for communication with video production and another background, a minor in graphic design. I think just trying to really, you know, I'm not putting all my eggs in one basket, but trying to be ambitious about everything that really sparked my interest. I feel like
That's so important to me. I never wanted to be one of those individuals who's just so drawn towards one thing because I feel like when that starts to calm down or slow down or you lose interest, you feel lost because you've never searched for all your other loves. I think that marketing background, I love being able
to do the marketing. I mean, I say that until I have a tight deadline, then it's not so fun. And then I kind of wish I could get back to the sports. but it's just such a fun.
Ari Block (20:45)
Ha
be doing anything else but this right now.
You know, we had that when I was studying many, many, many, many, many years ago and you're crunching for a test. You're like, I will do, I will wash the floors right now. I don't want to do that. Look, I think it's kind of inspiring that people, that you have found two passions to chase. And I used to tell people when I was young and stupid that, you need to know what your plan is. Like you have to have a plan. You need to know what you're doing.
But as I matured, I figured out that that isn't necessarily true, that there are so many amazing people that didn't have a plan and had this incredibly amazing journey. So I've learned that there's many ways to reach whatever are the goals that you're searching for.
Let me ask you one last question for both athletes and young adults and children. Based on everything that you've learned and done throughout your career, what is the one piece of advice that you would give to our audience?
Thomas Baker (22:02)
never underestimate people. I feel like it's so important with sports. I mean, I just feel like in life, I always hear the term.
competitive. I don't like how it's abused now. It's like, it's competitive in the workforce. It's competitive to get this job. It's competitive to get on this team. It's a team. You're there to work together. It shouldn't be competitive. You're working together. You're collaborating with each other. So I feel like we're trying to establish camaraderie, not competition. I know competition is important and it can be a driving force for anyone.
That's, I mean, that's just how you establish this unhealthy mindset of winning. And I feel like it's just, don't underestimate people. I mean, on a personal level, when, when I was, I mean, all throughout middle school and high school, I was, I was a pretty thin kid. mean, people thought I was fast, but they didn't think I had any strength. They didn't really believe that I, you know, I could offer much to sports. And I feel
all they were doing was giving me an advantage because they got so on their heads that I couldn't accomplish anything that it makes you a sleeper because once you make one basic play, one simple play, it messes with everyone's mindset. like, whoa, he can actually catch it. He has thumbs. I mean, they just question everything. it's, you just, you're ruining your,
self, if you're underestimating people and you're also kind of, you're completely insulting them. And I think it's just so important with sports and with life, encourage people. not going to tell someone who's never ran, you want to do a marathon? Yeah, do it tomorrow. You'll have a lot of fun. mean, obviously you have to work towards it, but if you want to do that, I think it's so important to just encourage people. The human body is amazing.
the mind is even more incredible and what people can overcome, people can achieve. think it's just so important to remind that and we're all starting somewhere. don't factor in your age. Don't over push your durability. Don't over exert yourself. I really think that's the big issue. mean, with age, you might slow down, but that's not always the case. Tyrell Owens is
schooling 17 year olds on routes. I mean, he's 50. So it's just important to remember to not over exert yourself. If you're tired, take care of yourself, but believe that you can do it and bring that sort of belief to everyone else. It's so important. Never underestimate anyone. Don't view them as competition. That would be my advice.
Ari Block (24:58)
Thank you so much. What an absolute delight. And the subtext is that I think a lot of the advice and the journeys that you've spoke about today, they're applicable to everyone, not just to athletes. And I think everybody listening can hear that and can speak to them in their own journey. Wonderful. What a pleasure.
Thomas Baker (25:00)
hey, Harry, thank you so much.
You know how to flatter me, so thank