Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
Welcome to All things… Episcopal where we talk about anything and everything related to the Episcopal church. This podcast was designed with young people ages 18-39 in mind and a place to learn more about The Christian faith with the Episcopal lens.
>> Clare: Hello, everyone. Welcome to All Things Episcopal, where we talk about anything and everything related to the Episcopal Church. This podcast was designed with young people in mind and as a space to learn more about the Christian faith with the Episcopal lens. So, in traditionally Episcopalian greeting fashion, the Lord be with you. Hey, friends. Today on the podcast, I am joined by one of my new co hosts, Haley, and two other young adults. One is from the Diocese of West Missouri, and the other one is from the Diocese of Kansas. Glenn Green attends Church of the Redeemer in Parkville, Missouri, and she is also a young adult, um, who serves in leadership there, but also, um, also serves on the youth leadership team at Redeemer as well. We also have Mason Weber, who is a young adult and attends St. Paul's in Manhattan, Kansas, which is part of the Diocese of Kansas. Bun Mason, welcome to All Things Episcopal. Hi.
>> Mason Weber: Hi. Glad to be here.
>> Clare: So, before we dive in, I was hoping that each of you could share a little bit of your story. Um, how you found yourself among a bunch of contrite misfits known as the Episcopal, um, community, um, some of your interests and potentially an unfun fact about yourself. So something that is not super interesting, but still interesting. Who wants to go first?
>> Glenn Green: I can. This is Glenn. I am, um, a cradle Episcopalian, which means I was born and raised in the Episcopal Church. Uh, however, with that, I grew up in a multi faith household with my aunt being Jewish and my father, uh, being agnostic and not going to church at all. Um, so I grew up getting to choose between going to the Episcopal Church or going to temple, or just missing church and watching cartoons on a Sunday morning. Um, which led to a lot of questioning of my faith and growing desire of figuring out what I actually believe. And as I grew up, I church hopped a lot, especially in college, and just realized that the Episcopal faith is really what I believe. I like our liturgy, I like our theology, and it is just a very comfortable church for me that I call home. And I guess an unfun fact about myself is that I play bass. And a lot of people don't know that because I don't tell people things that happen prior to my adult life. And so that's always a fun little tidbit about myself that I forget not everyone knows.
>> Clare: I love that you just shared that. That's fantastic. Yeah. Mason, what about you?
>> Mason Weber: Yeah, um, I grew up in a Christian household and a lot of different denominations. Um, every time we moved, we went to a new church, so it was kind of all over the place. Um, but definitely in middle school and high school, I started having questions, wanting, uh, to be more serious about my faith, and people couldn't give very good answers. It seemed like the adults didn't really know why they believed what they did. That made me kind of suspicious. I also, unfortunately, got shamed out of a youth group or two for being lgbt. And so it's like, all right, let me look other places. So I became agnostic for a while. When I was in college, I was still agnostic, and I started studying world religion and. Which is extremely interesting. Once we got to the section on Christianity, I felt like, okay, I can, you know, come back to this with a more fresh perspective. I know more now. I'm kind of away from some of the emotional baggage of it, and I really fell in love with it. It made so much sense. I was like, I need to know more about this. So through learning more about church history and, like, early church theologians and things like that, I was like, I need to know more about sacramental churches, about, um, more liturgical denominations. So, a lot of prayer and books and, uh, Reddit forums, I ended up here. Interests, fun things about me. I'm about to go back to college, actually, to study social work, and I like playing video games. It's pretty basic, but very fun. An unfortunate fact about myself is none of the cats that live in my apartment are mine. And so when I move, I don't get to take any of them with me.
>> Clare: Oh, we mourn with you. That's a sad fact.
>> Glenn Green: That just means you have to get a cat of your own at that point.
>> Mason Weber: Yeah, that's the plan. We'll see.
>> Haley Cobb: Oh.
>> Clare: Now, Haley, I know that you shared a little bit of your story on our previous episode, but, um, since you're still new to the podcast, would you mind sharing, like, the Cliff Notes version of it real quick?
>> Haley Cobb: Yeah, absolutely. I, um.
>> Mason Weber: Similar.
>> Haley Cobb: Then I'm in a cradle Episcopalian. I've grown up, um, in the Episcopal Church my entire life and in the Diocese of West Missouri my entire life. I was raised by the, um, youth program in West Missouri and am now involved, uh, with the youth program at Christ Fiscal Church in Springfield, Missouri, and also on the diocesan level with children and young adults. And I'm loving it. So that's a little about me.
>> Clare: And I love getting to work with you, Haley.
>> Mason Weber: It's.
>> Clare: It's fantastic. And Glenn, and then occasionally with Mason at camp when. When I'm hanging out with my Kansas folks.
>> Haley Cobb: The best.
>> Clare: Um, so very much like our last episode. We're an Even split between those that have been raised in the Episcopal Church as well as those that have found a home in the Episcopal Church, which I think is fantastic, because all four of us, regardless if it was finding a home or being raised, um, in the Episcopal Church, we find so much beauty in this community that is equal parts reform and little Catholic. See, so what for you all, first, makes you want to stay in the Christian faith at a time when we see this almost like a mass exodus of people who are like Gen Z and millennials leaving the church? Um, and then second to that, um, what makes you stay specifically in the Episcopal Church? And I know you have kind of slightly touched on that, um, before. Um, so, Haley, if you don't mind starting us off, that'd be great.
>> Haley Cobb: Yeah, I love this question. It was a great reflection, you know, as I kind of prepared today and thought about it a little bit before this, um, great reflection on these things that I don't always take the time to think about. Um, but the Christian faith, I think I've continued to stay in it and come back to it. Um, it's been. It's something I lean on as, like, a foundation of hope and understanding throughout many chapters of my life. You know, throughout all the chapters and writing, all the different ways of life, um, and faith being, you know, an intangible thing that can get swampy and messy. All the times, for myself included, it's been coming back to the Christian faith. And staying connected to my faith in that way has been a real source of peace that I really haven't found anywhere else or in the same kind of way in any other places in my life. So I think the Christian community, that's what's kept me here. That's why I stay here throughout it all. It's, um, definitely a choice to stay too, like you said, as there's kind of a massive differing of, you know, faiths or like, leaving the faith. I think it's.
>> Glenn Green: It's.
>> Haley Cobb: It is really a choice. It's not always easy, but for me, it's always been kind of natural and the foundation of who I am. And similarly with the Episcopal Church, um, I think it's the community, the people. I think about a lot of the people in my life and the memories I've made, um, in the Episcopal Church, uh, and I'm better for all of it. And so I think I stay because it's made me who I am in many ways and also has enhanced my life in a lot of ways and continues to do that. And you know the magic of our tradition and liturgical common life, uh, gives us that, ah, yeah, like common language. Anywhere I go. There's been so many times I've run into other Episcopalians that yeah, you, you already have these little things that you can connect on and I just, I value that community so much. Um, and it's, I mean it's supported me as I've explored my faith and provided me with resources and again, that tradition to you know, build on as a foundation. So it's, I continue to find a home here and all the different chapters of life and love it.
>> Clare: I love that so much, you know, because it echoes this theme of you can't be Christian alone. While your faith is your own, you are shaped by those around you.
>> Glenn Green: Mhm.
>> Clare: But also the liturgy. The liturgy, the work of the people shapes us collectively together. Um, yeah.
>> Haley Cobb: So yeah, as I think about, as I think about it, I think like, you know, the closest thing to like faith being tangible is like worshiping with one another. And I m specifically love that so much about the Episcopal Church. It gives us those kind of tangible, um, things to share together. Yeah.
>> Glenn Green: Yeah.
>> Clare: Glenn, what about you?
>> Glenn Green: This is such a fun question. Mostly because I've been through some journeys. I would say why I stay in the Christian faith, uh, is truly because I have seen and experienced like God's work in my life. And I went through a point, I call it my job year because it was one really bad thing after another and it just kept piling on. My sophomore year of college and at that point I was part of three different denominational student ministries and uh, working at a church camp and everything. And it just, my community fell apart everywhere except for the Episcopal Church. Um, and it got to the point where it was like, I know God's real and I know like God is here working somewhere, but man, this sucks. Like Ross form. And I sat there at like 11:30 at night one night after a worship service in a Methodist slash non denominational uh, student ministry. And I sat outside and was like, I don't even know what my next steps are because I'm really tempted to just walk away and leave the church because of how bad that year had been. And I was praying about it and God was like, go back to the Episcopal Church and be with a community that takes care of you and you'll be fine. And it was really hard to come back in and like go to my friends who knew I was in three, uh, in two other student ministries and just lean on them in all of the drama and Chaos that was going on in the non denominational faiths. And they took care of me. Like they prayed for me and they pretty much were like, God's got this, but we got you. Uh, and so that was really nice. Um, which leads to how I stayed in the Episcopal Church is home for me. I'm very traditional. I like my real communion. Give me wine every Sunday, not once a month. Not grape juice, not Hawaiian bread. Like I need the real bread with the real wine for me to know that like the Eucharist and Jesus is there. I'm also a really big person on doing the confessions of sins. I, uh, love confession every week it's a reset for me. And so between the community and the liturgy and the consistency of the Episcopal Church is why I stay. Because I've moved. I think this is my fourth state I've lived in. And everywhere I go, the Episcopal Church is relatively the same. We all have the prayer book, we all sing the same songs from the hymnals. And so it just is so nice to be able to have that consistent traditional worship.
>> Clare: I love that you threw in the elements of the Eucharist and how that's the great unifier.
>> Glenn Green: It matters.
>> Clare: It does, it matters. Um, I had a couple of friends in seminary call me the Eucharist girl.
>> Glenn Green: Mhm.
>> Clare: Because some of our listeners may know this. I was originally discerning in the Presbyterian Church usa, and then I had received Holy Eucharist for the first time in like 500 plus days. Hm. And the last time I had received before August of 2021 was the day of my wedding, which was an Episcopal service. And there was just something about hearing the College for Purity that, you know, starts the service and then you hear the epiclesis over the elements that are later consecrated. And it just makes it that much more reverent. Mhm. And unique in the sense of it's this beautiful mystery that binds all of God's people together, um, regardless of gender, socioeconomic status, language, you know, sexual orientation, whatever it is a meal to celebrate, to remember and to reconcile and make us all whole. So I love, love, love that you brought that up on so many levels. I could go on and on and on about that. So I'm going to digress. Mason, what about you?
>> Mason Weber: Somewhat similarly to you, Glenn, I, uh, definitely stay in the Christian faith because I have experienced God's presence before. I definitely did as a kid or in middle school at least. But I was really struggling to kind of like understand what that really meant. And even through the entire time that I was agnostic. I never became atheist because I was like, I know there's, there's something. I just don't know what it is necessarily. And, But I was holding on to this experience that I had when I was going through a very, very, uh, hard time in, I think freshman or sophomore year of high school. And I was like, I know that God was taking care of me in that moment. Like, I felt it, I prayed, and he was there. And so that has to mean something. And that's what I was just searching for, what that meant for quite a few years. When I was looking into Christianity again and the sacraments and everything. That concept was so wild to me because I grew up in churches that, uh, didn't um, have sacraments. It was just memorial ordinances. So he still did communion, but it didn't really mean anything. It was kind of just a memorial of the Last Supper, like from, um. And when I went to a holy hour where you meditate on the Eucharist and what that means, I had never done that before. And that is the time that I felt God's presence in that same way again for the first time in years. I was like, this is real. This is something important. I can't ignore this. And the next time that I felt that way is so pretty soon after that experience, I started, um, taking confirmation classes to get baptized at the Easter vigil. And so right after I got baptized and I took communion again for the first time. Honestly, I think that experience comes like, changed my life. I was like, this is where God has been leading me. This is where I'm supposed to be. So I guess that kind of fills in both why I'm here in the Episcopal Church and Christianity in general. But I think more than just that, just the way that Jesus just is now he loves us and how he is not really like, he doesn't settle. He's like, no, you can always be better. You can always take care of yourself more. You can always take care of other people more. And sometimes the more is actually less. It's, you need to back off yourself, you need to relax more. And just that. And how people's faith have inspired the biggest, like social movements throughout history. And as, ah, someone going into social work. I learned a lot about the history of social work and human rights movements in the United States at least, but also in other places in the world. And the leaders of all of these movements stay strong because of their faith. They know that they have to do it because in their baptism they promise to respect the Dignity of all human beings and to spread the gospel. And I just can't ignore that. So I have to be here.
>> Clare: I love that you touched on baptism, um, and the baptismal promises that not only are made for us sometimes at infancy, but also, um, the ones that we make, um, as adults, consciously. I've said this before, that being a baptized Christian means that there's a social implication to the Christian life and we have to think about that in order to uphold those baptismal vows in our day to day life. Uh, I think frequently about. I'm really terrible about this. So. Talk about confession. Like Glenn mentioned a few minutes ago, I am notorious for using Amazon for almost everything. Like, books are really bad, but sometimes, like, if I have to buy something in bulk for church, it's less cost. But I'm not thinking about who am I purchasing this from? Are they using ethical business standards? And if they aren't, then am I actually breaking my baptismal vow by not honoring the dignity and humanity of every human being like you said, Mason, or seeking to serve Christ in all persons? Because I'm looking to make sure that I'm, you know, more or less a good steward of money. Yeah. To get more at a lower cost. But what is good steward in this case? Is it I pay a higher Pryse for better business practices or something else? So I, I appreciate you bringing that up. I, I think it's, it's one worth considering for sure.
>> Mason Weber: It's a daily challenge.
>> Clare: Oh, my gosh. Is it? Especially during holiday season. Yeah, the holiday season.
>> Haley Cobb: Um, it shows up in so many ways. I feel like I'm gonna be.
>> Clare: Oh, one of that. Yeah, like 100%. You know, we just talked about, um, you know, confession and changing the mind of sorts. Um, and because I'm a church nerd, um, probably amongst fellow church nerds right now, I took a look at the lectionary readings for this upcoming Sunday. And while there is this unofficial theme of peace, I oftentimes wonder what is the true peace that we're talking about? And I think it requires us to repent of sin in order to get the true peace, which is Jesus Christ, to change our ways and say, yes, I choose to give my heart to Christ. Yeah. So welcome to my little TED Talk on that one. So thank you both for all three of you, I should say, um, for sharing about that. So I met Glenn and Mason about a year and a half ago. Uh, Glenn at a youth event and Mason at Mega Camp. Although, Mason, do you remember meeting me at Mega Camp two years ago? I don't know. You were swamped with some small children.
>> Mason Weber: When I met you the second time, you seemed really familiar, but I couldn't quite place where you were from. So sort of, I, I can completely.
>> Clare: Understand that because there are a lot of people at Mega Camp, hence the name Mega. All that aside, um, about six months ago, uh, Glenn, Mason and myself, we were on retreat and we got to chatting during what was supposed to be a 30 minute lunch break and then turned into a 90 minute conversation about our experiences as young adults, um, within the Episcopal Church. But more specifically, it was a conversation about, um, our experiences with evangelism, hospitality and formation within the Episcopal Church. And one of the things that came up was how the church can be more invitational or hospitable to those that are seeking a new church home. So even though we are almost evenly split between cradle Episcopalian and those that found a home in the Episcopal Church, I'm curious for, well, all of us here, what you would recommend that church leaders or churchgoers, be it ordained or lay, consider doing as it relates to being invitational and helpful to newcomers. So, Glenn, I'm going to ask you to start us off on responding to this question. And then Mason and then Haley.
>> Glenn Green: This is such a hard question only because every church is different and every person wants to be welcomed into church differently. However, I am a firm believer, especially in the post Covid era, that the barrier to entry of the Episcopal Church is kind of hard due to the prayer book itself. And as much as I love the prayer book and I love the Book of Common Prayer like it is, it is my favorite, it is the greatest tool. Uh, however, if you're not a cradle Episcopalian and you walk into an Episcopal Church on a random Sunday and you get handed a pamphlet and go and sit in your pew and dependent on the church, everything's either in the pamphlet or you have the numbers and no one tells you anything and you're like, where do I go? What do I do? What is this red book? What is this blue book? Um, and some churches do a really good job at explaining what all of the books are in our pews. Some not so much. But I'm, I'm a firm believer. If we just got back to working solely in the Book of Common Prayer and having the priest or whomever is leading that Sunday, uh, say we're starting on page 355 in the red Book of Common Prayer. Everyone in the service knows where we're starting. It also clears up if we're doing right one versus right two during the seasons. Because lots of people get into automatic, oh, this is what we say, and this is how we do. And we switch the rights during different seasons. And half the church is saying the correct thing and the other half is not because we're good old Episcopalians. And again, I love it. So that barrier to entry could be fixed by just talking about where we are in the service. In the book regarding actual welcoming, I have learned that we get so excited when we have new people that we're kind of overwhelming, and that it's like, oh, my gosh, new person, let us introduce you to the entire church right now, which is wonderful, but overwhelming. So I think having just a strict set welcoming team could be super helpful and especially during the piece, go up, introduce yourself, welcome them into the church, and then let them come to others instead of dragging that person along to every person in all of the pews. Um, because that can be very overwhelming for a lot of people. And so, yeah, I think that is my advice to leadership and becoming more hospitable and creating less barrier to entry.
>> Clare: Making notes now?
>> Glenn Green: Yeah.
>> Clare: Since I'm on staff at a church right now, you'll do grace. Well, thanks for the vote of confidence.
>> Mason Weber: Mason.
>> Clare: Uh, what about you?
>> Mason Weber: I have a couple different ideas about this. I think in the first place, being a little more vocal about the opportunities that people can get involved in is really important. As much as Glenn was talking about the barrier to entry in the service itself, a lot of people have a even harder time breaking the barrier, entry into the church community. And I think dragging the people around and being like, oh, be a part of this. Meet this person, this person can also be really overwhelming. But having it just be more known and more often talked about, the different ministry, internal ministries and small groups, Bible studies, that type of thing. But also, and especially the outreach groups and programs that you have going on. If you run a. A free meal, if you do a clothing drive, if you maybe there's a lot of members of the church that are on the board for community organization. Those, I think, are all really important things for people to see. One, that they, uh, are able to be a part of the community in a meaningful way. And two, that the church cares about the community and is living out what it's saying, practicing what it's preaching. But on top of that, I think we cannot put all of the welcoming and inviting on the clergy and on the welcome team. Those are very important positions. According to statistics, over 83% of people that join a church join because they were invited by a friend. If you're invited by a friend, you already have somebody there to explain the service to you, ask questions to. They know your comfort level, they know what you're interested in. People Episcopalians, in my experience, but also lots of other people terrified of this, hate inviting people to church, don't like talking about it. In this discord server that I'm in. Someone once said, you know, Anglicans really hate talking about being religious churchgoers and we need to knock that off because we are if, ah, we think that this is so important to us and it's impacting and changing our lives in the way that, that we do share when we're talking about it. And when we're in these communities, in these conversations, we want other people to be able to experience that too, if they want to. And it doesn't have to be that scary. A lot of it is just about being more casual about the fact that you're Christian and that you go to church when it just comes up in natural conversation. A lot of the time, just what did you do on the weekend? Like, how's your family? Like, oh, you know, last night I went to this church event. I actually was really surprised and very excited that a lot of churches that I visited in the last, uh, this fall during their stewardship campaign, instead of talking about how to get more involved or donate or anything like that, actually had people give kind of these like elevator pitches of the Episcopal Church of different people from the congregation going, how would you talk to your friends about why you think this church is important? Why do you think your faith is important? Why do you think this community is important? Because people are going to believe you a lot more than they're going to believe a clergy person about why church is important. And I just think I've been invited to a lot of things. Everything, uh, that I've gotten in, most of the things that I've gotten involved in have been because someone has invited me to be there. And I wouldn't trade that for anything. So the average listener listening to this Episcopalian podcast, you can do it.
>> Clare: Yep.
>> Mason Weber: Thank you. That's my TED Talk.
>> Glenn Green: I love it. I think.
>> Clare: Mhm.
>> Glenn Green: Episcopalians are so afraid of evangelism because we see how harmful it could be and we just want to separate ourselves from that, which we do in our own way. But we went too far in that pendulum swing where it's just like, God loves you, but we're going to love you from over here and not invite you to our church. Even Though it loves you. In my experience, from what I've seen, and I'm guilty of that as well, where I sit there and I tell my friends, like, yes, I go to church. You don't have to come with me, but the door is always open, but you don't have to come. And it's like, well, I had a friend recently who just straight up invited herself to church with me. She texted me Saturday night and was like, I'm coming to church with you tomorrow. And I said, okay, that's fine. And sometimes, like, that should not be. What happens is you should invite your friend instead of having them invite themselves. Uh, and I think it is just because we want to be known as that safe space and not the we're going to shove our religion in your face kind of people. But that's also how we lose out on the opportunity of bringing people in, which is unfair to them. Like that, yes, the church needs to grow and everything, but, like, we need to show people that there is community that wants them. Um, there.
>> Clare: Yeah, it's. It's the great. Yes. And yeah. Yeah. Haley, what about you?
>> Haley Cobb: Yeah, just thinking about what you both shared, and it's that, you know, that line between active and overactive evangelism, like, how do we find that balance and find what, you know, share who we are and what we're about, you know, without overdoing it or however you might want to call that. But I really loved Mason, what you were saying about don't be afraid to share, like the ministries and fellowship groups and other things that go on outside of maybe the four walls of your congregation and things like that during service. I had the thought, like, it's okay for announcements during service to not be 30 seconds. Like, just look in your bulletin. Like, I encourage people to stand up and share, you know, about your different ministry groups and things like that, because even if most of the people there hear about it all the time and know what's going on the Sundays, that somebody new is there, or, you know, it's. It's always good to share about it and sharing your passion and updates. It doesn't have to be some grand announcement, you know, but just sharing that it's there. I. I love that. And I think that that is that, you know, seeing where people are plugged in in their passions, just even if you're sitting by yourself in a pew, for me, you know, that, that, that. That thought creates a really welcoming environment because it makes it easier for others to see how they can get plugged into, to that community. Um, I also think, you know, remembering in that same kind of thought, remembering that not all like newcomers are going to be comfortable in the space right away, like in the actual space of the church. And so you know, we'll want to obviously greet them and welcome them and be welcoming in that coffee hour at lunch, but you know, provide other spaces, whether it's fellowship groups or those ministry meetings, like outside of the four walls of church again and think outside the box for those fellowship things. Because I think being in community in other ways, once people start getting plugged in, could be really helpful and beneficial to, you know, get to know people in a more casual sense and get to know what the church is about and why people, why, why people choose to stay in the Episcopal Church and why they might want to also. That's a lot of rambling. I have a lot of awesome thoughts going on right now because this, I just, this is a great question. But yeah, I think just providing lots of opportunity for people to get plugged in with all areas of church and ministry wherever you are, it's a good first step.
>> Clare: Amen. Amen on um, that one. Yeah. I think there's something special about participation to what you were saying Haley, that we have to participate and that is part of continuing with the apostle, uh, the apostles teachings. It's not just the sacramental part of our faith that there is a participatory element to it. And it also brings to light especially for those that are like church skeptics that might be coming into the church for a class like Mason mentioned earlier about world religion. Someone might be doing a field ed experience and looking at different religions or different Christian denominations. If it's more ecumenical or intra religious, um, experience that talking about the so called secular opportunities like clothing closets or um, Habitat for Humanity, things like that, that the church is involved in actually highlights the church doing good rather than just we are people who follow a set doctrine. And this is our, for lack of better words, like code of life. Um, this is the code we live by. Um, not to sound like a character from Pirates of the Caribbean, but more to the point though that the church does extraordinary work along with the secular community. And it only makes for a stronger community when we recognize the why for um, why we're doing something. So for the four of us, I would venture to guess that it is because of our love of Christ that we get involved in, you know, social outreach things or we find a particular reason for um, being involved in a justice ministry or justice and reconciliation, something of that sort. But for someone who is non religious, it doesn't take away from their participation in that same thing. It's just a different why. Um, and that why I think is for me the beauty of the diversity of the kingdom of God. So, so as individuals that absolutely love the church for all of its beauty and its quirks, what are you all craving when it comes to your spiritual lives? Um, what do you think you need most right now to grow in your spiritual journey? And I like asking this question during Advent because it typically is a quieter time, a more reflective time, kind of similar to Lent, um, but it's a little bit shorter. So Mason, would you be willing to start us off and then we'll go Haley and then Gwen for sure.
>> Mason Weber: I think for me right now I am um, craving some more like intentional Christian community and like conversation, maybe reflecting on something together. My church does have a weekly like tuitive ena group which is wonderful but I currently work during when it is and so I haven't been able to and I really, really miss it. I just think having that group like that or like life groups or any of those other type of groups for me at least are so important. To be able to talk with people about the things that you're going through in your life and have people one have people be able to pray for you, but then also to be able to talk about it in kind of a Christian perspective is a pretty unique thing that is sometimes hard to get outside of those groups.
>> Haley Cobb: I was uh, had a very similar train of thought, Mason. I mean I think that when I think about what I could use and need most right now, it's that time and space with I think specifically young adults too. I've to build community and have open and honest conversations about, you know, our experiences, how God's showing up in our life, our faith journeys and things like that. I feel like I've got a glimpse of what that's like. We have a growing young adult community at Christchurch specifically, but also in the diocese. And I've the more time I've spent around people like all of you wonderful other young adults like walking similar and also very different journeys. Just those conversations and that low pressure time to just chat and maybe even weave in and out of those deeper, more spiritual conversations to also just building relationships with one another. I think going, yeah, exactly what you off what you were saying Mason, is what I'm craving right now, even more of it.
>> Clare: What about you, Glenn?
>> Glenn Green: We are all on the same page truly. And I am in the Same boat as Mason. Our women's Bible study happens in the morning during the week and I'm at work and it's really hard missing that because I love Bible studies. I love getting together and like sitting around a table and just talking to others about what they see in the word of Christ and what's going on in their lives and just that real, true community outside of the actual worship service and being able to build those relationships and get to know everyone in your church on a much more relaxed level. So yeah, just the ability to have different adult formation, learn about one another's journeys. And I will never say no to more young, uh, adult events because I love doing stuff with other young adults. I like my kids, but man, having a conversation with another adult is so nice.
>> Clare: I hear you. I hear you like the three of you. I too crave that. And that sounds kind of ironic considering I work in church and I'm discerning to ordained ministry right now. Because some people might think, claire, how much more church could you want? All of it, right?
>> Glenn Green: Yeah.
>> Clare: All day, every day. No, I, uh, was actually reminded of something that my professor for discipleship information said my very first week of seminary like three years ago. She said, your first responsibility is your Christian life. The second is, is to your call, be it, you know, church leader as, you know, a, a lay person or church leader as ordained person. Um, but your first call is to your Christian life, your, your bapt, your baptismal life. And while some might think it, it would be hard to lose sight of that while discerning, because you're around scripture all the time, you're having these meaningful conversations, having that space to dig deeper into the wonder and curiosity of a spiritual life.
>> Glenn Green: Mhm.
>> Clare: When you are not the primary facilitator for it is completely different. So right now I'm discerning to become a member of Daughters of the King. And that has been so life giving for me because I am not responsible for facilitating that at all. I am simply there to be nourished as a baptized Christian. And I'm finding that it's enriching my life like tenfold. Um, and it's helping me understand, interestingly enough, a little bit more about my discernment to ordained ministry, um, and reminding me of that first call to my, my baptismal vows and the baptized life, um, which I think is pretty cool. So, yeah, I'm, I'm just like all about church right now, but at the same time taking a backseat to the facilitation of developing a spiritual Life, so to speak, for someone else to grow, rather, I am growing, if that makes sense at all. It makes sense.
>> Glenn Green: Totally.
>> Clare: Yeah, yeah, yeah. So for any of our listeners, or even, like, the three of you, if you decide, you know, hey, I might be a vocational deacon or, hey, I'm thinking about, like, ordained ministry, make sure you find, like, a small discipleship group, um, that you are not the primary facilitator of, um, so you can be nourished in. In a different way, and I'm happy to be a conversation partner with you at some point.
>> Glenn Green: As the cliche goes, you cannot pour from an empty cup.
>> Clare: Exactly.
>> Glenn Green: You have to be poured into.
>> Clare: Very true. Very true. So I wonder kind of what Glenn was saying. You can't pour from an empty cup. Slightly different, but similar thought. What do you find kind of funny or strange about the Episcopal Church? Like, however you want to answer that. And, um, Mason, if we can start with you again, I. I'd love. I'd love for that to happen.
>> Mason Weber: I think one of the most kind of funny and interesting thing that I've experienced that I first thought was maybe just a local thing, but as I've met more Episcopalians from different places, it kind of is a wider thing that people are a lot more willing to have deep conversations with you about theological differences than they are about service style. People will die on the hill of right one or right two. But if you want to be like, I'm really struggling with this theological concept all day, we can talk about that. No hard feelings. Very different from the churches I grew up in.
>> Clare: Very true. Glenn, can we start with you? Yeah. Can we continue with you?
>> Glenn Green: That's so funny that you say that, because I am one of those people that will die on that hill sometimes. I grew up going to a very low church. I did not know chanting and singing of prayers and incense and all that jazz was a thing until I had gone to a winter summer camp, uh, winter summer camp, a winter retreat at a different Episcopal church. And they started singing their prayers. And I was like. I was 14 or something at the time. And I was very confused, uh, because I had spent the first 14 years of my life not singing. And I was sitting there, like, talking, and everybody was like, la, la, la, la. And I was like, okay. And coming to the, uh, Diocese of Missouri, I learned very quickly that there are chants. You cannot find a church in the Diocese of West Missouri that does not chant at least one prayer, uh, in their services. And I find it so funny how consistent we can be when it comes to the Book of Common Prayer. We're all reading from the same book. It's all the same prayers, how it's said, how it's sung. There are infinite numbers of ways to go with it. I also find it hilarious what the Episcopal Church considers modern music and what music can be used in the church. As someone who spent, uh, a lot of time going to non denominational worship services that were like singing songs on the radio. And I, I am a lover of the hymnal, give me hymns all day, every day. But there are some churches that are like, yeah, we use modern music and the songs 30 years old. And I'm like, that define modern guys. Like, sure. And so having those conversations of, um, where do we modernize the church and where do we keep with tradition is always a very funny conversation to sit and listen to at, ah, any Episcopal Church you go to because everyone has an opinion and it's great.
>> Clare: Yeah. Oh, so true, so true. I think, I think the thing that I find funny, having spent time in, in a different denomination and specifically, um, a parish that I would probably identify as low church, because I would say that there are some high church, Presbyterian Church, USA parishes, but the one that I was attending was pretty low church. And now that I'm back home in the Episcopal Church, I would argue that my liturgical style preference is broad to high. And so when I think about that in relation to where I recently came from and came home to the amount of vestments that we have in the Episcopal Church, it's like almost like a liturgical fashion show. Um, they're so pretty.
>> Glenn Green: They are so pretty.
>> Clare: I am not like, disputing the beauty of it, but I can only imagine for someone that is either new to the Episcopal Church or is not coming from a liturgical background, how strange it's got to be to see a person wearing like a colorful poncho with like four different things underneath, like on top of their street clothes. I think that that's got to be a pretty strange or funny thing and, or funny thing to experience. So yeah, just thinking back on that and how they change according to the liturgical season and then, you know, kind of what Glenn was talking about a few minutes ago, the things that we kind of nitpick over that we find such deep meaning in, like blue versus purple or I should say like an indigo ish color for Advent, like how there are very strong feelings about that.
>> Glenn Green: I am one of those people, truly. I came from a, uh, purple background for Advent, ah, like an indigo ish color, and came up here and it's blue. And I'm like, what is this?
>> Haley Cobb: Yeah.
>> Clare: And see, I feel the same way, like with indigo and. Or like dark purple.
>> Glenn Green: Yeah.
>> Clare: Um, so I'm curious, like, Haley Mason, are your vestments, ah, at your parishes, like, blue or like indigo, dark purple for Advent, if I'm remembering correctly, they're.
>> Haley Cobb: Not like a deep indigo. They definitely. I think they lean more blue.
>> Clare: Okay.
>> Haley Cobb: I also have the worst.
>> Glenn Green: Is it a dark blue or like a powdery blue?
>> Haley Cobb: Oh, definitely darker.
>> Glenn Green: Okay.
>> Haley Cobb: Also, if I'm getting this completely wrong, then who knows?
>> Mason Weber: But, yeah, uh, my. My church does that bright royal purple roulette, which is beautiful. But I think I was visiting in Nebraska somewhere one time where they had that bright pastel blue. I'd never seen that before. I was like, what is going on?
>> Clare: Yeah. When I got to the cathedral my first year, I think that was fall of 21, like October of 21. And by the time Advent had rolled around, when I saw the vestments come out, I was like, that's like Smurf blue. Yeah.
>> Haley Cobb: Uh, pastely blue would definitely come for a loop.
>> Clare: This is interesting. Okay.
>> Glenn Green: Yes.
>> Clare: Because I had only ever seen like that indigo, dark purple color. Um, um, so that was a whole new ball game. And I was like, what is this? But, um, yeah, so I. I think that there are some funny and strange things about being an Episcopalian. But with that being said, it's. It's all about learning, right? Like, learning what. What customs or social norms. Liturgical norms, I guess, will be part of you, like a parish's practice. So I love.
>> Haley Cobb: Oh, sorry, Claire. I love thinking about that question, though, like, through the lens of youth. We just did like an acolyting refresher course. And some of the questions they ask, you know, if they've not been around it or just. They're just so honest and open in the questions they ask. It's like, reminds you of those maybe funny or strange things that just become second nature, um, after a while. But then especially these first time acolytes asking questions about, you know, things in the liturgy that you're like, okay, yeah, let's dive into this. That is probably a little bit different for you. Or, you know, very. It's. It's part of the tradition, but it's not. Doesn't come. Doesn't come like, naturally to them yet. Or they're like, asking the why, Which I think is great. But yeah, definitely brings up some of those things.
>> Clare: The more asking why I am here for.
>> Haley Cobb: Yes.
>> Mason Weber: Which is.
>> Clare: Which is all part of learning Right.
>> Mason Weber: Before we moved on to the last question, I wanted to shout out the Diocese of Western Kansas. Real quick for the greatest quote that I've ever seen on a church website, which is, what should I wear? Whatever you're comfortable in. Some people have a Sunday best that gives them joy. Some people wear jeans and a T shirt. The priest has to dress basically like an upholstered chair. And Jesus wore sandals.
>> Clare: 1. To our siblings in Western Kansas, we applaud you for.
>> Haley Cobb: Very well done.
>> Clare: Yes. Um, I love the humor and the education all at the same time. That is great. That is great. So with any time that we're learning about something, hopefully it will provoke new thought. And with that, I'm curious, if you all could learn about any topic in relation to the church, what would it be? And, Haley, if we can start with you, that would be great.
>> Haley Cobb: Totally. This was one of those questions that I'm like. It's, like, so broad that I don't know what my answer would be. But some of our conversations today got my wheels turning. I think. You know, there's lots of things as a cradle Episcopalian that I've grown up with and grown to, like, love and know about our liturgy in the community, but maybe don't know the why behind going back to that why question. So I'm always like, I would love to deep dive into specific chapters of the church's history and their, you know, our relationships within the Anglican Communion and our dias, like our diocesan history and things like that. That definitely comes to mind. But, Glenn, um, you mentioned chanting earlier as, you know, one of the. A little bit ago. And I think that music and the history of music in the Episcopal Church and just the church in general. I am not a musician at all. I don't have a musical B.O. in my body. But, uh, it fascinates me and I love it so much. It's one of my favorite things about our church. And so I would love to, like, do a little deep dive on the history of, like, music and the hymnal and chanting and all of those kinds of things that's got me. Got my brain, my wheels turning. During our conversation today.
>> Clare: You have my wheels turning, which is potentially dangerous, that I'm thinking about this, like, in the middle of Advent, thinking, hm, Kenny could come on. And then Luke, who's the organist.
>> Haley Cobb: I know.
>> Clare: Well, music.
>> Haley Cobb: Yeah.
>> Clare: So cathedral.
>> Haley Cobb: Yes. I should. I was gonna say I should mention that.
>> Glenn Green: Yeah.
>> Haley Cobb: Kenny K. Back at Christchurch. He's, uh, the director of music and youth ministries. So, like, I work very closely with this director of music, very talented and we have wonderful choirs and I love soaking all in, but I'm like, I have no. There are so many things that just go over my head that I just, you know, love the, uh, beauty of the music. But yeah, I'd love to learn more.
>> Clare: Same Z's friend. Same Z's Mason. Uh, what about you? Any topic that you could learn about?
>> Mason Weber: For sure. I think with me going back to college pretty soon, getting back into social work, I have been really interested in because I believe in my intro to Social work class, I had mentioned this earlier. I believe we touched on how it was a lot of Christian societies and missionary societies that began social services in the United States. And so I think that would be super fascinating to learn more about how these organizations got started, what they did, how it changed the whole culture and, and then how that relates to, you know, modern charitable work and the things that the church does now.
>> Clare: I like it. I like it. I'm thinking like Dorothy Day. Yeah. Glenn, what you go.
>> Glenn Green: I think truly a topic in relation to the church. I would think just like how we can work with other churches together, like really branching out. Yes. To the lay community, because that's very important. But like churches, Big C as a whole are diminishing. And if we want to broaden our reach, we need to work together. M and so. So we can work hand in hand with the community around us.
>> Clare: I like it. I like it a lot. I'm always team, interfaith, ecumenical. Yeah. Like cooperation. I'm here for it. I'm here for it. I don't know. For me, I think would be fascinating to learn more about would be like, how AI is impacting our faith. And um, you know, because we have things like chat GPT and people are using that for everything. So it's almost like, well, if I can just ask chatgpt something about faith, then I don't need to go to church because it's. It's a hard and fast answer. Um, which is. I mean, that's very much generalizing there. But I. I think the concept still applies that we're so hungry for a quick and easy answer for things, but that's not how God designed us to be. And there's a reason why there's a revealing, uh, in small parts and it's not done in one fell swoop. You know, the journey from the incarnation all the way to the resurrection. It's approximately 33 years and then some. So, yeah, I think AI in its relation to the church and how we're grappling with. We're still grappling with science and faith, um, and how we make space for both and say actually they're complementary. So, yeah, I think that would be it. Well, friends, we have come to the end of our conversation. Haley Mason, Glenn, thank you so much for sharing your stories, your wisdom, your insight, your energy. The church is better for it, and I love you all, like, you're just fabulous human beings.
>> Haley Cobb: Got you. We love you.
>> Glenn Green: Yes.
>> Clare: Thank you for.
>> Mason Weber: Thank you.
>> Clare: Uh, so before we go, because we are a people of the prayer book, and we love a good prayer, I thought I'd close this out with the prayer for young persons found in the Book of Common Prayer. It can be found on page 829. Um, for our listeners, if you want to open it up there, or for those of us that are on the call right now that want to read along. The Lord be with you and also, also with you. God our Father. You see your children growing up in an unsteady and confusing world. Show them that your ways give more life than the ways of the world. That following you is better than chasing after selfish goals. Help them to take failure not as a measure of their worth, but as a chance for a new start. Give them strength to hold their faith in you and to keep alive their joy in your creation through Jesus Christ our Lord. Amen.
>> Haley Cobb: Amen.
>> Clare: Um, all right, friends, be well. Go in peace, and have a wonderful Advent. Hey, friends, thanks for listening. Please like and subscribe and leave a review wherever you listen to podcasts. To learn more about All Things Episcopal on the Diocese of West Missouri's communication Pages, please visit DIO westmow.org back. And in the Diocese of Kansas, please visit edokformation.WordPress.com All Things Episcopal Podcast All Things Episcopal Podcast is a production of the Diocese of West Missouri and the Diocese of Kansas, an association with Resonate Media.