257: Why Afroditi Quit Upwork After Hitting $100K (Part 2)

What happens after you hit $100K on Upwork? For Afroditi, it meant finally stepping away. In this second half of our in-person interview, she shares how she scaled her freelance business, raised her rates, and built a system that brought clients to her. But she also reveals why she chose to leave it all behind. From pricing mindset to proposal tips and her 2025 pivot strategy, this is an honest look at what growth really takes.

In Part 2 of our conversation with Afroditi, we pick up after her rocky first year and dive into how she built a stable, high-paying freelance business. She talks about growing from $15 projects to $70/hour clients, using Upwork to teach herself strategy, and why she ultimately chose to leave the platform.

Resources:
Afroditi's Upwork Profile
253: Tabitha’s First $1K Month (and Why She’s Quitting Her Day Job to Go All In on Freelancing)
256: From $15 to $100K: Afroditi’s Fashion Freelance Journey on Upwork (Part 1)

About Afroditi:
Afroditi is a fashion technical designer who earned $100K on Upwork while living in Greece. She now helps early-stage brands with tech packs and development—and is shifting her freelance business off-platform to gain more control.

Connect with Afroditi:
Follow on Instagram
Connect on LinkedIn

Download my Freelance Price List just for fashion (it’s free!): sewheidi.com/price

Creators and Guests

Host

Heidi Weinberg {Sew Heidi}

Heidi (aka Sew Heidi) is a self-taught freelance fashion designer who built a six-figure business without a degree, portfolio, or industry connections. After years of burnout in the fashion industry, she went freelance—and never looked back. Now, she helps other designers ditch toxic jobs, land better clients, and build flexible careers they love. Through her podcast, courses, and resources, Heidi has helped thousands of designers take control of their fashion path and finally get paid what they’re worth.

What is Fashion Designers Get Paid: Build Your Fashion Career On Your Own Terms?

This is a show for burnt-out fashion designers (and TDs, PDs, patternmakers, textile designer and beyond) who want more flexibility in their career while still doing work they love.

You'll learn how to build a freelance fashion business, so you can do the work you love on your own terms. Freelancing in fashion is the only way to get freedom in your day (instead of being tied to a desk).

Whether you want to earn extra money on the side, fund your fashion brand, or replace your salary, the FDGP podcast will help you get there. Listen in for actionable tips and strategies to kickstart or grow your career as a freelance fashion designer, build your confidence, and create the life you want.

Hosted by $100k+ fashion freelancer Sew Heidi, the show features interviews and strategy sessions with successful freelance fashion designers from around the world who've ditched toxic fashion jobs and taken control of their own destinies. This is the only place to get REAL insights from REAL freelancers who have built REAL careers on their own terms. (Formerly the Successful Fashion Freelancer podcast.)

Heidi [00:00:00]:
What happens after you hit $100,000 on Upwork? For Afroditi, it meant finally stepping away. In the second half of our in person interview, she shares how she scaled her freelance business, raised her rates, and built a system that brought clients to her. But she also reveals why she chose to leave it all behind. From pricing mindset to proposal tips and her 2025 pivot strategy, this is an honest look at what growth as a freelance fashion designer really takes. You're going to love this episode. Let's get to it.

Heidi [00:00:27]:
I think at a $15 an hour, $20 an hour, like you can attract. I know I've experienced and other students in our program experience. You attract clients that don't wind up respecting that.

Afroditi [00:00:39]:
Exactly. Yeah.

Heidi [00:00:40]:
Yeah.

Heidi [00:00:41]:
Okay, let's rewind a little bit. Like talk to me about your fashion career before October 2019, when you jumped onto upwork and your life.

Afroditi [00:00:55]:
Okay, so fashion was not my first degree. I used to be a musician and I was in my 30s and I was working as a cello teacher. I'm from Greece. So during the recession years, I was left unemployed. Like many other people, I was part of what is called the brain drain. So that was a way where mostly educated people left the country to migrate to other countries. So that's roughly a little before that was when I started designing. So I studied fashion design as a hobby.

Afroditi [00:01:42]:
It was intended as a hobby. But since I was left unemployed, it kind of evolved into a new career shift. It was my door to leave the country and look for a better future. So that's how I ended up in London and I started my bachelor's there in fashion design. I started a good total of four years. So it took me four years to do a career shift, a full career shift from where I was from cello teacher, from cello teacher to fashion designer before. So the year before 1919, I was trying to break into the fashion industry in my 30s, with no experience, but still at an age where I cannot afford to lose time. And I made the decision to go back to Greece because I was in London and I was depressed.

Afroditi [00:02:51]:
So I had to go back to protect my mental health. This wasn't a logical decision necessarily, and I was aware of that. So in order for me to survive mentally, I needed a plan that actually made sense because me being back on this country with the low wages and not being able to even get a paid job wasn't sustainable. So that's why I was looking for a solution. The only job I was able to get. So I tried to work On. So I did an internship, a long one, mostly unpaid. And then I.

Afroditi [00:03:35]:
I think you said.

Heidi [00:03:36]:
It was a year, you mentioned.

Afroditi [00:03:37]:
Yeah, it was a year.

Heidi [00:03:38]:
Yeah.

Afroditi [00:03:38]:
Which is normal.

Heidi [00:03:39]:
And what kind of. In fashion?

Afroditi [00:03:41]:
I was in a studio, so I was doing crafts. There was an amazing designer who did all those handmade pieces. That's why I said that I couldn't get hands on design experience. I was doing embellishments, pattern making, sewing, all those type of things. And after that, I tried to. I briefly went into a fashion brand as a designer that only lasted, I think, a couple of months. The environment was so toxic. I was offered a job.

Afroditi [00:04:10]:
I admit it. I was offered a job there. I just couldn't take it. I had to leave. I couldn't survive the environment. It was six days a week, 10 hours, shouting. And I couldn't do it. So I left.

Afroditi [00:04:28]:
I was offered and I didn't accept the position. And then I went into designing costumes. Not designing, but making the costumes on the Greek National Opera. So costume.

Heidi [00:04:43]:
You were like physically sewing them.

Afroditi [00:04:45]:
I was physically sewing them and I was making patterns. And that was a huge school for me. I gained so much experience that I came to appreciate later in life because at that point I thought that it was not related to design. And it's true, it wasn't. But I ended up being a tech pack designer, not a designer.

Heidi [00:05:08]:
Yeah.

Afroditi [00:05:08]:
And all the knowledge that I. That I accumulated for construction and I took apart so many, so many garments and I did three things and I. I made custom for so many different body types. Over turned out to be so valuable in the end.

Heidi [00:05:28]:
Yeah.

Heidi [00:05:29]:
Okay, so how long did you. And so that was for the Greek National Opera that you. I mean, which sounds like. I feel like you play it up to like no experience, but I don't know, now that I learn more about it, I'm like, that sounds pretty phenomenal. How long did you work with them?

Afroditi [00:05:47]:
I only lasted a year. Again.

Heidi [00:05:49]:
Okay, Again.

Heidi [00:05:50]:
What happened after the year?

Afroditi [00:05:52]:
I quit because. Great question. It was a combination of being a very difficult working environment and me feeling that I'm not on the right path to end up where I need to be.

Heidi [00:06:11]:
Where did you, air quote, want to end up?

Afroditi [00:06:14]:
I wanted to be a freelance designer and I had somehow to gain design experience.

Heidi [00:06:21]:
Okay.

Afroditi [00:06:23]:
So I quit. And I was very lucky because after I quit, I was offered a teaching job that I kept until last year.

Heidi [00:06:33]:
Okay.

Afroditi [00:06:36]:
I also have a teaching background, so my master degree is on education.

Heidi [00:06:41]:
And you had been teaching cello prior.

Afroditi [00:06:44]:
And I was actually given the Opportunity to shape a fashion school program in the way that I thought it should be and teach other generations and maybe create some better opportunities for them. So I was offered this position by an amazing Greek designer. Can I mention?

Heidi [00:07:06]:
Sure, yeah.

Afroditi [00:07:07]:
It's Romina Caromanea. And she trusted me with this position. I went as a student to her. That's how we ended up collaborating. And this was the base for my freelance career because she gave me a job that was part time, but it was financially stable and gave me free time to build my freelance career on the side.

Heidi [00:07:40]:
Okay.

Heidi [00:07:41]:
And that teaching that was here in Greece?

Afroditi [00:07:44]:
That was in Greece. That's the only. The only job I got in Greece after. After my shift.

Heidi [00:07:50]:
Okay. Okay.

Heidi [00:07:52]:
So then you were teaching fashion and technical design.

Heidi [00:07:57]:
Okay.

Heidi [00:07:58]:
And building upwork on the side.

Afroditi [00:08:01]:
Exactly. That's how I do.

Heidi [00:08:03]:
Okay. Okay.

Heidi [00:08:04]:
And you. So right now it is May 2025. So in 2024, you quit the teaching?

Afroditi [00:08:14]:
I think it was. Yeah, I think it was that year.

Heidi [00:08:16]:
Okay. Roughly. Okay.

Heidi [00:08:19]:
And how come you quit the teaching?

Afroditi [00:08:24]:
Great question. I felt that I couldn't do all of it. Of both, the freelancing and the teaching is one of the most noble things that a person can do. I truly believe that. But it requires such a big part of your soul. You cannot say no to a student. I couldn't. I couldn't say no to a student.

Afroditi [00:08:49]:
I was feeling their anxiety and their pain, and I wanted to support them. So it can get really overwhelming. And I wanted to do both. Right. So I don't want to be mediocre at any of those. So I kind of planned my exit. I didn't quit in the night. I had discussed this upfront and I planned my exit.

Afroditi [00:09:12]:
I find someone else. I felt actually left something behind me. And I still communicate with my students all the time, so I'm there for them. Teaching doesn't really end with graduation.

Heidi [00:09:30]:
Yeah.

Heidi [00:09:31]:
That's amazing. Okay, so you left teaching so that you could. You just felt. It sounds like you were just stretched too thin to try to do both and do a great job at both.

Heidi [00:09:43]:
Okay.

Heidi [00:09:44]:
And so 2024 sounds like it was an amazing year. Like, you had some big growth in your freelance business. Like, was it your best year to date?

Afroditi [00:09:54]:
Yeah, it was my best year today. And I think what happened is that one of the brands that I was working for at the time, it was a startup, but they grew.

Heidi [00:10:04]:
Yeah.

Afroditi [00:10:05]:
I'm so proud of them. Can I say the brand?

Heidi [00:10:08]:
Sure.

Afroditi [00:10:08]:
Slouch Potato.

Heidi [00:10:10]:
It's an Australia Slouch Potato.

Afroditi [00:10:12]:
Yeah. It's an Australian pajama brand.

Heidi [00:10:14]:
Yeah.

Afroditi [00:10:14]:
And they grew so much that they got a licensing agreement with Warner Brothers.

Heidi [00:10:19]:
Oh, holy cow. That's amazing.

Afroditi [00:10:21]:
I'm so proud of them. Yeah. So that resulted in so much work.

Heidi [00:10:27]:
Yeah.

Afroditi [00:10:27]:
And that's why it was a good. I also had another amazing startup brand that I was working for. I didn't launch, so I'm not gonna say your name yet.

Heidi [00:10:35]:
Okay.

Afroditi [00:10:36]:
And I also had a couple more. They were all amazing clients. Amazing brands.

Heidi [00:10:41]:
Yeah.

Afroditi [00:10:42]:
So much work, so much growth, and that's why it was a really busy year for me.

Heidi [00:10:49]:
And did those clients all originally come from Upwork?

Afroditi [00:10:52]:
Yes.

Heidi [00:10:53]:
Okay.

Afroditi [00:10:53]:
All of them.

Heidi [00:10:53]:
Okay.

Heidi [00:10:54]:
At some point, do you take them off the platform and you just start working directly?

Afroditi [00:10:58]:
No.

Heidi [00:10:58]:
You guys always stay on you because you. The first things you said in the interview, you read the upwork terms and conditions.

Afroditi [00:11:06]:
Yeah. You should read the upper terms and conditions.

Heidi [00:11:08]:
I have mixed feelings on staying on the platform.

Afroditi [00:11:11]:
I understand. I understand why. So the reason. So Upwork actually let you go out of the platform after a certain amount of time or if they buy you off. So that's the proper way to do it.

Heidi [00:11:27]:
Okay.

Afroditi [00:11:28]:
I choose to stay in the platform because they have made so many things simplified for me. I work in a different currency. I didn't have any system, any contract system up to this year.

Heidi [00:11:41]:
Okay.

Afroditi [00:11:42]:
There are so many things that upwork is doing for me, and I was just comfortable staying there. Plus, AppGur has a great policy. It sounds like I'm advertising them and I'm really not. So many complaints.

Heidi [00:11:56]:
I know, because you commented on my.

Afroditi [00:11:58]:
LinkedIn post the other week.

Heidi [00:12:00]:
Maybe we'll get to that.

Afroditi [00:12:01]:
I have many complaints from the platform, but they do one thing really well, and that is what they say, an hour worked is an hour paid. So. And the client does have the option to not pay you for your work. And again, like I said, upwork is not the best and fastest way to do things, but it does offer some mental help. So if you're not the kind of person like me who struggles to ask for a payment and send an invoice and tell them, you know your invoice a little late and can you please pay your invoice all those things that I still hate doing, you won't have to do it on Upwork.

Heidi [00:12:42]:
Yeah.

Afroditi [00:12:43]:
So that's the reason that I never moved my contracts out of it. It was just comfortable for everybody, at least for me, for them as well. They knew if you invest the time to learn the platform, you have your contracts in there. It's okay. Most people don't mind. Now, I do have contracts outside of the platform, but I didn't find them on upwork. So what's against the rules is to find someone on upwork and then do a contract outside of the platform.

Heidi [00:13:14]:
Right, right.

Heidi [00:13:15]:
Okay.

Heidi [00:13:16]:
No, that makes sense. Why you, why you stick there? So 2024 was really great, and now 2025, you've told me, is not going so well.

Afroditi [00:13:27]:
It's not.

Heidi [00:13:28]:
Talk to me. What happened? Where are you at? What are you doing to resolve that?

Afroditi [00:13:31]:
Okay, so what happened is that. So the way I've been using upwork, I didn't want to burn myself out with looking for work all the time. And that I think is true. Not just for upwork, though, for freelancing in general. The ultimate goal is to have the work coming organically or building trusting relationships with brands that will keep giving you work. So that is kind of where I was. That changed because I only had a few clients. I didn't have the time to have more because I was invested in them.

Afroditi [00:14:09]:
I didn't have one, but had, like, few. And during the same time, I stopped working with all of them.

Heidi [00:14:16]:
Oh, they just all stopped at the same time?

Afroditi [00:14:18]:
Yeah, they all stopped around the same time.

Heidi [00:14:20]:
Okay.

Afroditi [00:14:22]:
And what happened is that I had to replace them. And this is not the first time that happens, but when I had to replace one project, it might take a month or two or three to place it. And like I said, upwork is a huge pool. It does take time to find the right person to work with, especially when you aim on the highest hourly rate and highest budget and more serious approach, being a startup. So it would take this amount of time to replace it, to replace one, but if I have to replace four, five, six of them, obviously it takes a long time. But the thing is that when this happened for the first time in my life, I decided to view this as an opportunity because, and I know we've talked about this again, you and I, I kind of knew that I should get out of the platform. It was time for me to do that leap of faith. I was so scared to do it for so many years.

Afroditi [00:15:31]:
Me feeling inexperienced all those years and that I don't have so much work experience. And I never put the effort to do it because it does require effort. You have to. I learned upwork so well, but there are so many other things that I didn't know how to do. Didn't know how to do a contract, how to prepare a proper Proposal or how to transfer funds outside of.

Heidi [00:16:05]:
Get paid.

Afroditi [00:16:05]:
Get paid.

Heidi [00:16:06]:
Yeah.

Afroditi [00:16:08]:
And all of them seem. Oh, the most important one, how to find clients outside of upwork. Let's see. Huge question mark for me still. I didn't work on LinkedIn. I didn't have a portfolio. I don't have a website. There's so many things that I don't have.

Afroditi [00:16:26]:
I started with the least possible effort, like you said. I took your advice too literally, and I stayed there. So I kind of felt it was time to start building those things from scratch. And so when this happened, I decided to view that as an opportunity to move out of the platform. I mean, I'm not abandoning it, but I would like to slowly not rely on it.

Heidi [00:16:55]:
Yeah.

Heidi [00:16:56]:
How is that feeling? Like, uncomfortable or.

Heidi [00:16:59]:
Yeah.

Afroditi [00:17:00]:
Yes. And so scary. Yeah, so scary. But less scary than the first time I did it. Yeah. So, yeah, I learned from my mistakes. I think my biggest mistake was that I didn't want to ask for help, actually. So I was part of this community, and I never interacted with anyone other than to offer help.

Afroditi [00:17:27]:
I never asked for help or I was always. I didn't want to ask questions. I don't want to sound stupid. I don't want to reveal that I don't know something. And I'm trying to get over those things now.

Heidi [00:17:43]:
This is within our community. Within the FAST community.

Heidi [00:17:46]:
Yeah.

Afroditi [00:17:47]:
Yeah. Interact a bit more. Take the time to build some things up, and also, most importantly, get out of my comfort zone.

Heidi [00:17:58]:
Yeah.

Afroditi [00:18:00]:
Because I'm gonna say it's really uncomfortable.

Heidi [00:18:02]:
Yeah.

Heidi [00:18:05]:
I mean, I see. You know, just in the last few months, I've seen you, seen your face. You're posting on LinkedIn. You came to our live event the other week for the first time in five years. I've been holding these live events, and they're free for fast students. And you came and I saw you at the event, which was so lovely. So I see you taking these actions and putting yourself out there. I mean, I think Upwork is an amazing platform, and it can build and you can get clients, and it does take care of a lot of things for you.

Heidi [00:18:48]:
But I think to some extent, too, you become. You've built your business on rented land.

Afroditi [00:18:56]:
Exactly.

Heidi [00:18:57]:
And you're now beholden to their algorithm. And I know you have some frustrations about the platform now, and I don't know how necessary it is to go into those right now. I'm not sure if it's really that productive.

Heidi [00:19:11]:
But.

Heidi [00:19:13]:
I mean, if you were to look back and maybe give Your younger self, Some advice, maybe someone who's. Cause you're not the first person who I've talked to who's very comfortable on upwork, but I think maybe in the back of their head they have that nagging feeling of like, oh gosh, this could all break and I don't own any of it. I haven't built an air quote network or like, I don't know, you know, even a website to some extent maybe that you've built up some traffic to over time perhaps, or, and arguably even LinkedIn is rented land and any of these platforms are. But if you could maybe do it over knowing where you are at right now, if you could look back two, three, four, five years and maybe make some shifts, what do you think you would have done differently?

Afroditi [00:20:06]:
Oh yeah, that's a great question. So I would, I want to say that I would have shifted away from the platform sooner.

Heidi [00:20:16]:
Okay.

Afroditi [00:20:18]:
But again, I wasn't there mentally. So this is sweet spot on where everybody's journey is. If I was advising a younger version of myself, I would probably tell them to not use upwork at all. And the reason. So yeah, so the reason is that if for upwork to work it actually needs a big investment of time and effort and frustration. Remember how I told you that the first year? So being exposed to that rating, to that crazy client demands, until you reach a point where you can actually select the clients to work with, the platform is so over saturated and it's not an easy platform, honestly, it's not easy to make this work for you. So I think I'm torn between I don't know if I would have shifted earlier or not using it at all. Because if you take the time to invest in it, I actually feel that this time can be better invested somewhere else.

Afroditi [00:21:24]:
I just didn't have the resources back then. I would say that the biggest mistake I made is that I had the opportunity to build a community and I didn't do it. So this is definitely something that I would change much sooner. And I actually have a good tip. Even for upwork to work, if you have a community, many freelancers have an upwork profile. It's not bad to have your profile set on there. It doesn't actually mean that you dynamically interact with the platform. You can just have a profile set on the platform.

Afroditi [00:22:04]:
Upgroup has a feature called decline and defer.

Heidi [00:22:07]:
Decline and defer, yes.

Heidi [00:22:09]:
Okay.

Afroditi [00:22:09]:
So if a person gets a job, invited to an interview because you don't have to bid always, sometimes you get invited, you get found.

Heidi [00:22:21]:
Right.

Afroditi [00:22:23]:
If you have a big network, everyone who gets an interview, this is not related. I get a lot of interviews that are not relevant to what I'm actually doing and I don't want to decline them. It feels such a waste. So what I do is decline and refer. So now that I have all this big pool of other freelancers I know, and sometimes I might not even know the person I have referred, people I found on LinkedIn, on my network, in my LinkedIn network, I can search them by name on upwork and can find their profile. So if I read someone's profile and it's a swimwear designer and I have slightly interacted with this person on LinkedIn and I've seen their work, I feel like they're great freelancers. I Googled, not Google. I put the name on the upwork platform and if they have a profile, it will appear.

Afroditi [00:23:13]:
So if I have a decline project, there is this option, decline and refer.

Heidi [00:23:17]:
Decline and refer. I said defer earlier. Refer. Sorry, refer.

Heidi [00:23:21]:
Yeah, gotcha.

Afroditi [00:23:22]:
So I'm actually referring this other person in my place and they get a direct interview. So someone who asks who starts an upwork can even start this way by having a network, it's so much easier. And I didn't know back then this is the one thing I would change if I was giving advice to my younger self.

Heidi [00:23:42]:
So when you say building a community, I think you just mean making more connections with other freelancers, whether that's through our FAST community, whether that's through LinkedIn, wherever. Building a community and connecting with more freelancers and then collectively, and I know this happens inside FAST all the time, people trade. Not trade clients, but like, oh, this isn't quite right for me, but I know someone. Here they are.

Afroditi [00:24:08]:
Exactly.

Heidi [00:24:09]:
And there's a huge referral space within, I think within any freelance industry.

Heidi [00:24:17]:
Okay.

Afroditi [00:24:17]:
Yeah, exactly.

Heidi [00:24:19]:
So just the sheer tip of, like building out that network and those friendships and those relationships with other freelancers could have made a big difference.

Afroditi [00:24:30]:
Yes, of course. This takes time to grow.

Heidi [00:24:32]:
Sure.

Afroditi [00:24:33]:
That's why it's something that I would change going back. I think it would have grown now. I would be in a different place if I did it. So instead of investing all this time fighting alone, this is the number one thing I would change. Make some good friends in the industry and meaningful ones. Not just. Yeah, you know, adding them on a social platform. Chatting with them a little bit.

Heidi [00:24:58]:
Yeah.

Afroditi [00:24:58]:
Get to know them.

Heidi [00:24:59]:
Yeah.

Heidi [00:25:00]:
So is that what your main focus is right now, 2025? Like building out those Friendships and relationships.

Afroditi [00:25:06]:
Not the only one.

Heidi [00:25:06]:
Okay, what else?

Afroditi [00:25:08]:
So I'd like to educate myself on the things that I don't know, and that is how to, to contact potential clients outside the platform, how to speak to their language, because I managed to understand the upwork type of client. But I think it takes some extra effort and time to understand a different type of client. So I'd like to educate myself on that. Build a website, build a better LinkedIn presence, connect with more fellow freelancers. Those are my main goals.

Heidi [00:25:56]:
Okay.

Heidi [00:25:57]:
And I think you said you're going through the FAST program now, you bought it in 2020, but by then you had gone through my book and you had put in so much work and you had kind of figured things out and seen success. And I think at one point in, I don't know, 2021 or 22 or something, I remember at some point you told me, heidi, I've never actually gone through the course. And so I think you said, now you're 2025 going through for the first time.

Afroditi [00:26:21]:
Yeah, I completed it.

Heidi [00:26:22]:
You completed already? Okay.

Heidi [00:26:24]:
Okay, great.

Afroditi [00:26:24]:
I'm rewatching stuff, so I'm there, but I'm trying. So the first thing I did was to attend the FAST calls.

Heidi [00:26:31]:
Yeah.

Afroditi [00:26:31]:
Just to feel part of the community.

Heidi [00:26:32]:
You've been going to the monthly calls.

Afroditi [00:26:34]:
I went. Well, I will go next month as well.

Heidi [00:26:36]:
Okay, good.

Afroditi [00:26:37]:
So change the mindset.

Heidi [00:26:38]:
That's what I'm trying to do. Yeah.

Heidi [00:26:42]:
Your growth, both professionally, personally, like your mindset has been. I mean, I feel like I've been watching it from up above, from this, like really high level view. I haven't known intimately all these details that, you know, you've shared over the last couple days we've been spending together and in this interview. But from afar, I feel like I've been seeing this journey unfold and over five years, five, six years. I think that's important to point out is that all of this stuff, on the surface it can sound like instant, but it takes so much time and there's so much personal and professional development along the path and ups and downs and failures and successes. And I think that's really important to highlight.

Afroditi [00:27:31]:
Yes. Thank you for saying that because in any case, I wouldn't want to make it sound easy. I think I had some of the, the slowest, the slowest growth plans in the community. Yeah, it took time.

Heidi [00:27:47]:
Yeah, it's amazing. Well, congratulations for everything you've built. And now in a way, you're just continuing to learn and grow and it'll be exciting to see where you're in in another one, three, five years from now.

Afroditi [00:28:00]:
Yeah. Thank you.

Heidi [00:28:01]:
You're welcome.

Afroditi [00:28:02]:
Thank you for everything else. You know. You know how grateful I am to you. You're the reason that everything started. You were my inspiration.

Heidi [00:28:10]:
Yeah.

Heidi [00:28:11]:
Well, thank you. You've put in the work, though. I've seen you hustle and work, and if I could go back and tell my younger self something, it would be to accept Afroditi into the beta. Because I, you know, back then, I. I truly felt that to freelance, you should have some experience first. And I realize it's a very chicken and egg type of situation, but I had a pretty rigid mindset of, like, nope, this is only for people with at least, like, a few years of experience, because that's what you need to get the freelance success. And I have since changed my mindset because I've seen multiple women go through our program and get success without the initial air quote experience, Some with even less experience than you had. And it takes a tremendous amount of work.

Heidi [00:29:12]:
But I believe now that it is more about the person and their drive and their determination and their work ethic than it is about this air quote experience. I mean, Tabitha who. Yeah, we'll reference her podcast. We'll put her podcast in the show notes. You guys should listen to her episode. But she hustled and she built her freelance business with no experience. She also came from a teaching background.

Afroditi [00:29:39]:
Yes, exactly. Ironically, she was also the first person in the community to refer me to clients.

Heidi [00:29:46]:
Amazing. Amazing. Listen, I'm so inspired to hear your journey, and thank you so much for agreeing to come on the show live.

Afroditi [00:29:57]:
Live? Yeah, from Greece, of course.

Heidi [00:30:01]:
Thank you, Afroditi.