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Calabrio Shorts is a fun-sized podcast that covers all sorts of topics around the contact center industry. No topic is off-limits as we cover frequently asked questions, industry trends and definitions, and yes, we will have fun doing it.
QM Calibrations- Definition and Best Practices
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[00:00:00] Dave Hoekstra: Hello everyone and welcome to the next edition of Calabrio Shorts. We are super excited today because we have an amazing, fantastic guest joining us today. But we gotta talk about what our topic is the topic, of Calabrio shorts. You know, we always try to keep it really focused on a specific area of workforce engagement management, you know, contact center information.
[00:00:22] Dave Hoekstra: And today's no different. We are gonna be talking about calibrations in the contact center, right? The process by which we calibrate our quality process amongst everyone. And here with me today, I've got a really great expert on the process of calibrations and QM here. It's DaNeece Sheldon. DaNeece is a customer success manager here at Calabrio, but more importantly, she's been doing this for a really long time across many different Industries and contact centers, and I think she brings a wealth of knowledge.
[00:00:51] Dave Hoekstra: So we're super excited. So DaNeece, first of all, welcome. And second of all, tell us a little bit about how you got into this process and tell us, give us a little bit of background on DaNeece Sheldon.
[00:01:01] DaNeece Sheldon: Sure. Well, Dave, first of all, I'm excited to be here. Thank you so much for the invitation. So, throughout my career, I've been in customer service or customer experience.
[00:01:11] DaNeece Sheldon: Literally since I would say my early twenties, I won't tell you how old I am, but just so I've
[00:01:16] DaNeece Sheldon: been here, here for a while
[00:01:16] Dave Hoekstra: So, so, so three or four years, right? Three or four years.
[00:01:19] Dave Hoekstra: Yeah, exactly.
[00:01:21] DaNeece Sheldon: So been there for a while, but throughout my career, one of the things that I've noticed is, That because I'm always in that realm of customer support or customer service.
[00:01:31] DaNeece Sheldon: I quickly moved up within the ranks to leadership and that leadership role took me directly to customer experience and quality supervisor as well as some performance management consulting. But the biggest thing I would say was QM. And really speaking to the experience of the customer.
[00:01:49] Dave Hoekstra: That's great. And so, you know, throughout those years you've obviously gotten some good experience and, you know, we can talk QM till the sun comes up, right? Totally. But to focus specifically on this, I'm gonna, I'm gonna play the foil here and kind of say, so tell us about what is a calibration?
[00:02:05] Dave Hoekstra: Like, what's the point.
[00:02:06] DaNeece Sheldon: Well, well,
[00:02:07] DaNeece Sheldon: Dave, before we get into what is calibration, can we take it a step back and talk about why we need it?
[00:02:14] Dave Hoekstra: Yes, absolutely.
[00:02:15] DaNeece Sheldon: Yeah, so, so I would say I, there's a ton of reasons why, but I'll give you my top three. One is to improve accuracy of the evaluations. Two is because there are multiple users.
[00:02:28] DaNeece Sheldon: And when I say users, I mean, evaluators and it's really to assess their performance in scoring. And then lastly, it is a fantastic leadership resource or tool. So I think when we look at it from that perspective, that's the why. And then if you wanna take it just a little bit forward, then we'll get. To the what?
[00:02:48] Dave Hoekstra: Well, let's talk a little bit of the mechanics of the why, right? Because I do understand like it's important to have everybody on the same page, but what's the real problem that calibrations solve? What do to getting to the heart of the matter. Let's put it in real world terms.
[00:03:01] Dave Hoekstra: What are we solving here?
[00:03:02] DaNeece Sheldon: We are solving for equity and fair. Okay. And or the perception, if you will, of fairness. We are trying to have a resolve for a group of people, let's say mainly leadership or a quality team that may score different ways based on how they may feel.
[00:03:22] Dave Hoekstra: Interesting. So are you saying human beings don't always feel the same way about things?
[00:03:27] DaNeece Sheldon: Oh, I feel one way about you. I'm sure your wife feels another way, right?
[00:03:30] Dave Hoekstra: That is right. That's right.
[00:03:31] DaNeece Sheldon: Yes. So because of that equity has to be involved in that really does take for one's evaluators, of course, to be on the same page. And it's a lot of other moving pieces. But the biggest part is that the equity may not be there or the perception of fairness may not be there.
[00:03:49] DaNeece Sheldon: And because of that, a calibration is
[00:03:51] DaNeece Sheldon: needed.
[00:03:51] Dave Hoekstra: Okay. All right, great. So we've covered the why, what, you know, what's the reason a calibration exists, and so let's talk a little bit about what exactly a calibration is. . So, I mean, let's get to the mechanics of it a little bit. So pretend like I've never even really heard of QM.
[00:04:06] Dave Hoekstra: Let's start at that base level and then talk about what a calibration is.
[00:04:10] DaNeece Sheldon: Okay. So I'll give you just a basic definition. Quality management or calibration is a quality management activity, and it allows for all to be on the same page. And so we, when we look at it from a call center perspective what that really entails is you've got a group of ones who need to be scored, right?
[00:04:30] DaNeece Sheldon: Dave has a team. This team needs to be scored. It's a team of 10 people. Well, DaNeece is not the only that is scoring this person. I have a QM team that is scoring Dave's particular team. So with that in mind, how does DaNeece's team, which is quality score, Dave's team, in an equitable manner. Okay. And so what that is, oh, I'm sorry, go ahead.
[00:04:55] Dave Hoekstra: No, I was go, I was, all I was thinking is, so for example, you and I take the same exact call , and we score it . And what we want is both of us to get the same score, right? And not, we are not the recipients of the score. We are actually doing the scoring. We're grading. We're grading the test, as it were.
[00:05:11] Dave Hoekstra: Right. When you're in junior high and you take a test you're working off the same answer key. So it is fair and equitable, but when you open it up to subjectivity, there's a very good change. It's kind of like the difference between if we are grading an English paper, right?
[00:05:26] Dave Hoekstra: Two people read the paper and one person may think it's the best piece of literature they've ever written, and another person may think it's a flaming hot garbage, but but it's the same paper. So how can we make sure that process is equitable across. Does that sound accurate?
[00:05:41] DaNeece Sheldon: Yes. So Dave, you brought out a really good point about that because regardless of how well a form is formulated or crafted, there's always gonna be differences in interpretation, especially when you think of subjectivity such as tone.
[00:05:54] DaNeece Sheldon: Right? That's a huge deal. And I know I'm kind of going off to the left, but tone is so subject. That it requires one to have, if you will, a meeting of the minds to really understand if this particular tone was good or was it bad. Does that make
[00:06:09] DaNeece Sheldon: sense?
[00:06:10] Dave Hoekstra: Yes, absolutely. I mean, that basically sounds like the conversations between my wife and my daughter.
[00:06:15] Dave Hoekstra: Right? The why are you being so mean? What are you talking about? I'm not being mean. Your tone of voice was so awful. No, it wasn't. I wasn't, you know, Right. And that kind of thing. So, alright. This is starting to make a lot of sense. . So maybe let's walk us through what a typical maybe, you know, a typical calibration process would look like in a QM team.
[00:06:34] Dave Hoekstra: Kind of how would you approach if you were asked by a QM team to help them kind of. The idea of calibrating, where would you start and, you know, what kind of what kind of walk us through the process you might
[00:06:47] Dave Hoekstra: walk them through.
[00:06:48] DaNeece Sheldon: Sure. So the first thing that I would do, because a call center has a number of teams, the very first thing I would do, especially if the QM team is rather new or this.
[00:06:56] DaNeece Sheldon: Processes is rather new let's take out a test team, right? So we've got 20 teams within a contact center. Let's actually start on one team just to get out footing, right? So I take this one team that has 10 people, and let's just say my team has, you know, five people. Let's choose one or maybe two. To score. We all scored.
[00:07:22] DaNeece Sheldon: And in Calabrio it's a very easy way. You choose the contact that you like to calibrate, you mark it for calibration, and then everyone scores it. Once my team, the QM team has scored it, what I now have the ability to do is go into reporting andlook at that particular calibration score for that contact.
[00:07:44] DaNeece Sheldon: And not only can I see the score, I can see the score for everyone.
[00:07:49] Dave Hoekstra: Okay? So we all go in, we take the same exact call or contact or chat or email or whatever the case it may be. We all take the same one. And in a vacuum, not talking to one another we all score it, right? We, so you and I should not discuss this as we go through it because the goal is to get an objective measurement of what I would've scored this had I not received any external influence to it, right?
[00:08:16] Dave Hoekstra: And so whether that's two people, or six people, or 10 people, then we're able to look at who score. The call at what level and compare those scores. And I think I know the answer, but tell me what we're hoping to see.
[00:08:32] DaNeece Sheldon: We're hoping to see everyone almost. I know. We won't see, just so we're clear. We will not see everyone have the same score.
[00:08:39] Dave Hoekstra: Okay.
[00:08:40] DaNeece Sheldon: That very seldom happens, but what we're hoping to see, if there is a variance, a very small variance. So if Dave, you scored it at a 90 and I scored it at an 85 and then someone else scored it at a 72, well that's a huge gap there and that's a huge variance. Now we need to understand why did someone else scored at a, you know, 75 or 72 and I did one thing and you did something else.
[00:09:04] DaNeece Sheldon: And then that really takes on a whole new conversation because some of those things are subjective and some are objective meaning. Some of those things are definite, some of those things are not.
[00:09:15] Dave Hoekstra: And it really helps underscore the importance of as objective as possible. Evaluation form questions as well.
[00:09:22] Dave Hoekstra: Correct?
[00:09:22] DaNeece Sheldon: Yes. Yes. It's, I'm sorry,
[00:09:25] DaNeece Sheldon: go ahead.
[00:09:25] Dave Hoekstra: I was gonna say, so it's easy to say, like, for example, the question, did they say the customer's name twice? , one we're all gonna agree on, but what's an example of a, what's an example of a question that we might not agree on?
[00:09:37] DaNeece Sheldon: An example of a question we definitely will not agree on is, was the agent welcoming and friendly?
[00:09:43] DaNeece Sheldon: Okay. That's something that Dave you and I might go toe to toe on. However, another question that may have a challenge is did the agent do everything they could or did the agent maybe not only did everything they could but exhaust all options to provide the remedy or the
[00:10:02] DaNeece Sheldon: resolve.
[00:10:03] Dave Hoekstra: Okay. So kind of a first call resolution style Yes.
[00:10:06] Dave Hoekstra: Question or something along those lines. Okay. I'm starting to pick this up now. Let's say we've gone through this process. We've all scored the call. We've looked at the calibration. We've realized that we're, we have some gaps. What's the next step from there? How do we get on the same?
[00:10:22] DaNeece Sheldon: Sure. The next step from there, instead of looking at the subjective ones first, I will look at the objective ones first. Why? Because typically there is a repository of information that will either say, yes, DaNeece did it, or no, DaNeece did not do this. So, as an example did the agent collect the address, name and phone?
[00:10:44] DaNeece Sheldon: At the first opportunity, right? Or for verification process? Well, in my repository or in my knowledge base, it tells me, okay, you need to do this, and this in order to get the name that you know. So either I did it or I didn't. Very objective, right? Did we put notes in the account? Very objective.
[00:11:02] DaNeece Sheldon: Did, either I did put notes or I did not. So I would start with the objective ones first because that is pretty much cut and dry when we get to the subjectiveness. That's where the challenge comes in, and you can certainly see and understand why it may be a challenge because one. I'm looking at it, or the QM person may look at it from the perspective of, well, this is how they always sound.
[00:11:28] DaNeece Sheldon: But new eyes and ears may come in and say,
[00:11:31] Dave Hoekstra: they kind of sound
[00:11:31] Dave Hoekstra: like a jerk.
[00:11:32] DaNeece Sheldon: They sound like a jerk. Right. Not only that, the response from the customer is one that tells me that this was not very welcoming.
[00:11:40] Dave Hoekstra: Yes. So we can probably list off a million different ways that these could be subjective, but I think it's important that.
[00:11:48] Dave Hoekstra: Everyone know you're not gonna be able to avoid the subjective questions in your QM and evaluation process. If you get to the point where you have all objective questions, you're probably not evaluating the right things. And, you know, we want to try to make as many of those questions objective as possible, but it's generally, you can't ask somebody.
[00:12:05] Dave Hoekstra: What the definition of empathy is. That's a subjective question that that really a lot of people have trouble defining or even recognizing empathy when, whenever we do it. , but that's something we all talk about as a really key component to a good customer experience is empathy towards their situation and understanding what's going on.
[00:12:23] Dave Hoekstra: So this is why. Going back to original conversation this is why calibrations are so critical, is because if I'm an agent and I'm scoring poorly on a call and I'm consistently scoring poorly, and then I switch teams, and then all of a sudden my scores go up by 30, 30 points, there, there might have been a problem with calibration.
[00:12:46] Dave Hoekstra: Right? And really understanding and. Would you say this is kind of the whole goal that we do? Going back to your equity question. This is why we do these, right?
[00:12:54] DaNeece Sheldon: Yes, you're absolutely correct, because we want it to be equitable. The other piece is when we look at the the process from a holistic 360 perspective, not only does it help the agent, but it also helps leadership and then senior management, right?
[00:13:07] DaNeece Sheldon: So the agent. For lack of better terms, they're getting this score. And if they're scored by someone else, let's just say they were scored by Dave this week and then next week they're scored by someone else. You kind of want the same thing. You want that equity. . So, I would say two things. It does, it builds morale when we're all on the same page.
[00:13:28] DaNeece Sheldon: And then two, it keeps the integrity of the process intact.
[00:13:32] Dave Hoekstra: Wow. That's, those are two very positive things that we definitely want to get out of our contact center process. All right. So as a final thing here, if you were asked to come in and kind of consult with a team that's wanting to get started in the calibration process, what's maybe a tip or two, something that they could that they could really focus on to get started?
[00:13:50] Dave Hoekstra: You already mentioned like starting with a small team. What are some other things that maybe. Just right off the bat, they could potentially focus on to really get the ball rolling.
[00:13:58] DaNeece Sheldon: I would say one for each meeting or each, when you're starting out and you have that meeting, I would say set the tone right.
[00:14:06] DaNeece Sheldon: The tone of the meeting is not to be disparaging, but it's really to look for opportunities where we can re. Quality. Right. Okay. That's the first piece. The second piece is encourage ones to get involved. It's, this is not only a QM thing, but it also is leadership as well. When leadership is involved, you see things begin to flourish.
[00:14:31] DaNeece Sheldon: That's another piece. And then another one is once you actually have the meeting for calibration, discuss those variances, but discuss it in a manner where you can understand a different view point. And you can understand a different perspective. It leaves everyone with their dignity. And if you sit in a circle like manner, it really encourages conversation and discussion versus, you know, rows, if you sit in a circle light or a U shape, it really encourages discussion around what really happened within the contact.
[00:15:04] Dave Hoekstra: Right. Because the goal of this is for us to all be on the same page, not for someone to be right and someone to be wrong. Yes, exactly.
[00:15:12] Dave Hoekstra: Exactly. But
[00:15:13] Dave Hoekstra: would you say that in the end we, the buck does have to stop with somebody ?
[00:15:19] DaNeece Sheldon: I, Dave you're right. As usual. You're right. It does have to stop with someone.
[00:15:23] DaNeece Sheldon: So, but can we do it in a manner, can we share these thoughts in a manner that says, well, I'm not gonna beat you over the head with it. It's here in our knowledge base that we should do this in this particular way. So, it really lends itself to also the process. What is the process and did the agent follow the process?
[00:15:42] DaNeece Sheldon: Does the QM evaluator know and understand the process, and then they can mark it accordingly?
[00:15:47] Dave Hoekstra: Okay. Final question. What is a good cadence for a calibration? How often should you do them? How many should you do? What is what in your experience? What's what's the right number
[00:15:59] DaNeece Sheldon: in my experience? Depending on the department.
[00:16:03] DaNeece Sheldon: So as an example, you may have a sales department, you may have a customer support department, you may have a tech support department, and so on and so forth. Two to three per department is really good. And then the other piece is biweekly tends to do very well. Okay. When you're first starting out, some have done it weekly.
[00:16:24] DaNeece Sheldon: I've been on teams where we've done it weekly, and then within, I would say four to six weeks, we are within a seven to 10 point variant. Which means now I can, instead of doing it weekly, now I can break it out to biweekly.
[00:16:37] Dave Hoekstra: So the answer is two to three contacts. Calibration every couple weeks is a pretty good cadence to be Yes.
[00:16:47] Dave Hoekstra: In. Do you do two to three all at the same time?
[00:16:51] DaNeece Sheldon: Yes. So those, that's actually done. In that particular meeting, and again, when you're first starting out, it may take about an hour to go through them because we're giving ones the opportunity to voice or express their concerns as to why they may have marked something yes or no or n/a right, so that those first few weeks.
[00:17:11] DaNeece Sheldon: It may be certainly an hour, but as you move on and you begin to see that variance lesson even more so, and your QM team understands, your supervisory team or your leadership team understands the process and what we're doing. And if we need to, we can also restate the purpose. Of calibration.
[00:17:30] DaNeece Sheldon: Right? The goal is not to beat you over the head. The goal is to really come to an understanding and have equity across that particular department, keeping in mind that there are different departments depending on what company you're
[00:17:40] DaNeece Sheldon: with.
[00:17:41] Dave Hoekstra: I love that you just keep coming back to that word equity because it's such a great way.
[00:17:45] Dave Hoekstra: It's, we're trying to make things equal and fair is really what the whole goal of this is. And you know, if you're an organization that isn't doing calibrations, there's a very good chance that someone is being. Either poorly elevated or lowered based on some external factors that probably shouldn't.
[00:18:01] Dave Hoekstra: And it's a really great process, and that's why we wanted to have this discussion. All right. So as the as the final part of each of these episodes, one of our traditions is kind of to give you the final say here. So if you had one final thing to say to anybody who was really reaching out about calibrations, what would it
[00:18:17] Dave Hoekstra: be?
[00:18:17] DaNeece Sheldon: Can I give my top three?
[00:18:19] Dave Hoekstra: Of course
[00:18:20] DaNeece Sheldon: okay, cuz you said one, but I wanna make sure. So the first one is just start, do it. Just simply start and once you start you'll see that it's not as hard as you think. It's very easy. The second piece is be inclusive. Please invite your leadership, invite senior leadership, invite those who are team leads to really come and see and understand what calibration is.
[00:18:44] Dave Hoekstra: Oh, that'd
[00:18:45] Dave Hoekstra: be fun. That, sorry that, that would be fun to like have the CEO in to do a calibration. Yes. That, that, yes. That's such a great way to include and make people aware of what's going on. Okay. Sorry, I interrupted your third tip
[00:18:56] DaNeece Sheldon: there. That's okay. Exactly cuz we want awareness on all levels.
[00:18:59] DaNeece Sheldon: Right. So it's a fantastic way. And then last. Commend when someone does something fantastic. You've heard it in calibrations and I can't believe they did a fantastic job. This is a new policy we just came out with. Commend, of course, give critical feedback where necessary, but always commend. It builds morale and it helps the agents to see that they are appreciated.
[00:19:21] Dave Hoekstra: Wonderful. Well, this has been absolutely enlightening and I feel like such good information for so many different groups out there. So, I, I will say thank you to DaNeece that the time she has spent with us has been enlightening. And as always we aim to give great information here on Calabrio Shorts
[00:19:38] Dave Hoekstra: and this is no exception. So, DaNeece, thank you for joining us. I really appreciate it, the time. And for those of you who are listening to us, we always appreciate that you spend a few minutes with us on The Calabrio Podcasts here. So from me, Dave Hoekstra and DaNeece Sheldon, our wonderful CSM and QA and calibrations expert, thank you so much.
[00:19:57] Dave Hoekstra: As always, if you have more question. About the calibration process, QM or anything to deal with contact centers. We at Calabrio here, love to have these kind of discussions, so reach out to us @Calabrio.com. We'll be glad to spend some time with you and give you some information, probably more information than you would ever care to know.
[00:20:14] Dave Hoekstra: So, DaNeece, thank you again.
[00:20:16] DaNeece Sheldon: Thanks for having me. I really appreciate the
[00:20:18] DaNeece Sheldon: time.
[00:20:18] Dave Hoekstra: Absolutely. And from the Calabrio Shorts team here at Calabrio, thank you so much and have a great rest of your day. We'll talk to you soon.