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Dan Hope and Andy Anders of Eleven Warriors bring you inside the Ohio State beat every Wednesday with a podcast covering everything you need to know about the Buckeyes.
Note: This transcript was AI-generated and has not been edited for errors.
[Dan Hope]
Welcome into Real Pod Wednesdays. I'm Dan Hope, joined by Andy Anders, as we are now one month away from Ohio State's season opener against Akron at Ohio Stadium on August 31. We are just one day away from Ohio State's first practice of preseason camp at the Woody Hayes Athletic Center.
So, football season is very much upon us, Andy, as the Buckeyes preparations for a 2024 season are about to ramp up in a big way tomorrow.
[Andy Anders]
So much of the summer is just speculating what the team could look like, prognosticating about what needs to be addressed in fall camp. Now you get to actually address these issues and figure out what the identity of this team is, as we'll talk about later with this Ohio State team. That's what fall camp is for, and we get to watch practice a couple days this week.
I'm excited to get out and get eyes on the roster for the first time since the spring game, and I think we're going to learn a lot in these first couple weeks about where Ohio State is at and key areas it needs to address as it gears up for a title run here.
[Dan Hope]
The good news is, for Ohio State, is I feel like we do already know a lot about this team. I mean, we know the defense should be loaded. I mean, if you look at what they were last year defensively, you look at all the talent they brought back, and then, oh yeah, you add Caleb Downs to that equation.
The defense should be the best in the country. You think back to the last few years, even going into last year, because of the issues they had defensively in past years, it was, will the defense be better? Will the defense be better?
That was the big story around going into preseason camp last year. The defense obviously proved itself last season, and now we're expecting even bigger and better things from that defense this year. The skill positions, we expect them to be very explosive at running back of Travion Henderson, Quenshawn Judkins, wide receiver with Emeka Abuka, Jeremiah Smith, Carnell Tate, Brandon Innes, G.
Scott leading a talented group of tight ends. And so, there's a lot of things it feels like, nothing is truly known until the games actually begin a month from now. But there's a lot of things that you do feel good about with this team already, even though preseason camp hasn't started yet.
Now, with that being said, there are still some important things that this Ohio State team needs to accomplish in preseason camp, questions that need to be addressed over the next month for this Ohio State football team to be in position going into this season to do what it should be capable of doing this year, which is not just beating Michigan, not just winning the Big Ten, but it's winning a national championship.
That's the goal for this team. All the talent that it has on this team, that has to be the goal and the expectation, and Ryan Day said it last week at Big Ten Media Days, that all starts with having a productive month of August in preseason camp. And I think certainly when we look at what is going to be in focus here as practices start on Tuesday, it certainly starts at the quarterback position.
And this is very similar to last year. We talked about the defense was a question last year, but it's not this year. But there were two other big questions at this time last year.
It was who's going to be a starting quarterback and how's the offensive line going to be? And those two questions are very much still the big questions for Ohio State going into this year's preseason camp. It always starts at the quarterback position if you don't have a firm starting quarterback, and Ohio State doesn't yet.
Now, we both think that most likely a month from today we're going to see Will Howard take the first snap for Ohio State's offense against Akron. But we also talked about it a lot during the spring. We came away from watching a lot of those practices going, I don't know about this.
We weren't seeing the kind of passing that we're accustomed to seeing at least two, three years ago when CJ Stroud was Ohio State's starting quarterback. We know that he has a lot of experience. We know he's been successful at Kansas State.
We know he can be that dual threat with some ability to run the ball. I think the big question for Will Howard going into this preseason is now that he's been on campus for over six months now, now that he has had time to throw a lot more of Ohio State's wide receivers and build chemistry with them, will we see a more consistent passer in preseason camp? You talked about the fact that we're going to get to see the first couple of practices for the Buckeyes.
What do you need to see from Will Howard in those practices to come out of it feeling better about him than you did coming out of the spring?
[Andy Anders]
I think medium to deep accuracy is my number one concern with Will right now from what we saw in the spring. Look, a lot of it, I get it, new receivers, you have to develop chemistry with guys, but in these practices, I think it is important that he shows a progression. He's going to take more steps during fall camp.
That's undeniable because, again, you're still developing chemistry. It's different when you put on pads, throwing the ball, catching the ball, getting open. All that's different with pads on.
We're not going to see him with pads on these first couple of practices. But what is that chemistry looking like, just even in a 7-on-7 setting when you're throwing against a defense without those pads, and fitting the ball into certain windows down the field, pushing the ball vertically, and showing some arm strength? Because I think that's really where Devin Brown looked better than Will, again, is in those medium and deep accuracy areas, and maybe even having a little more zip-on throws down the field.
So those are the things I'm mainly looking for from Will in these practices that we get to view. I think you just want to see him separate and take command of huddles, take command of the offense, take command of the position in general early on in fall camp and claim it as his own. Because you don't want this quarterback competition to drag out as long as it did last year.
I really think it was a disservice to Kyle McCord, who, yes, had his issues on the field in that Michigan game, especially when people look back, not to say that he was going to be some superstar Heisman contender if he was named the starter day one of fall camp, but I do think the fact that it played out a couple weeks into the season hindered his confidence a little bit, hindered his command of the offense a little bit, hindered his chemistry with key weapons a little bit. There's just little setbacks that you cannot quantify. You don't know exactly how much of an impact it had, but I think it's pretty undeniable it at least had some impact in the early stretches of the season and then as you build toward later.
So I think Day has said, obviously, pretty much every quarterback competition he's had that they want to name a starter quickly, but they need to, I think, place an extra importance on that last year, this year, rather, based on the results of last year and kind of expedite that process so that whether it's Will or if Devon is able to pull the upset here, that guy develops real chemistry and command within the offense.
[Dan Hope]
Yeah, I think that's a really good point because the schedule does set up similarly to last year where you could let the quarterback competition play out into the season. You start out the year with Akron, Western Michigan, and Marshall. So you could let the quarterback competition play out into the season.
You don't necessarily need to know who your quarterback is for week one just in terms of winning week one, in terms of winning week two and week three. Really, you're not going to face a major test until that Oregon game week six, maybe Iowa week five, but you have some time to work through the kinks, which is a good thing, but I agree with you, but I think the fact that that competition did bleed into the season last year, I think that did play a part in some of the struggles we saw from Kyle McCord because I don't think he had as much time as he could have used to really settle in as that starter before the degree of difficulty started to ramp up. And so I think to that point, let's say Will Howard goes out this week, next week, first 10 days of practice, whatever, and he looks great, then you should name him the starter and move forward.
Like if Will Howard can go in there and take command of that job and show he's the guy, then end the competition and name him the starter and coalesce around him. I think the question becomes if that doesn't happen, because I think we'd both agree it's far more likely that Ryan Day is going to name Will Howard the starter after two weeks of practice than he's going to name Devin Brown or Julian Sayan the starter after two weeks of practice. It's still theoretically Will's job to lose.
Like you, I don't rule out Devin in that competition because by my eyes, at least on the practices we saw, I did think that Devin was better this spring than Will, but Devin's also been in the system for two years. Will was in his first spring as a Buckeye. And so now that Will's had more time to acclimate, you would expect Will to be better in preseason camp than he was in the spring.
He has to be better. If he's not, then I think you start getting concerned about the quarterback position in Ohio State this year. But I think what everyone is hoping inside the Woody Hayes Athletic Center is that Will will build off of a spring.
He will make strides in August, and they will go into that first game on August 31 feeling confident that Will Howard is our guy. If not, then things could certainly get interesting. But I think without a doubt that is going to be one of the number one things that we are watching here as preseason camp starts along with your favorite position, the offensive line.
[Andy Anders]
Yes, I think for me that's where my eyes are going to be at the most because how do certain key guys on that line progress, not just the position battle at right guard. I guess there's some work that Carson Hinsman is getting at center too. Ryan Day did say Seth McLaughlin will be the center.
But in his press conference, initially he had said that Carson and Seth were both working at center and guard. There was that whole thing at big 10 media days. But the right guard competition is obviously, I think, the top position battle outside of quarterback that has to play out in fall camp.
But it's also just seeing how those key other pieces progress. Can Donovan Jackson have more consistency? He struggled in early parts of the year at times and obviously had the slip against Michigan, which weighed heavier on him than anybody.
You feel for him in that moment, but it happened. There were moments where Donovan Jackson didn't look like the all-American talent we know he is last year. There were moments where he did, absolutely.
But there were moments when he didn't. Can he develop that consistency? Can Josh Fryer prove himself against speed rushers off the edge?
He was a fantastic run blocker last year, one of the best in the big 10, honestly. But in pass protection, while he wasn't necessarily a parking cone out there, when he faced real speed off the edge, and in particular, the Missouri game and some other moments, he didn't show the foot speed, the lateral movement, or the technique that he needed to prevent major lapses. When he didn't have good reps in pass protection, they were really bad reps.
That is where I think there's a discrepancy, even between what his PFF grade was and what he was as a pass protector. Because when he had lapses, they were major. It usually led to a sack.
He's well aware of that issue. I have said in the past I'm not sure how fixable it is because he just doesn't have the same foot speed and lateral quickness as other premier offensive tackles. But he has slimmed down some in the spring and summer here, trying to add that back.
It's definitely an issue he's aware of, the staff is aware of. So how can he address that? And then I think even more than quarterback, on the offensive line you need to establish that starting five.
Figure out that right guard spot and establish the starting five as soon as possible because that position more than any other chemistry is vital to the success of it. And you even saw it last year, the offensive line had to gel over the course of the season. They didn't even look good until the back half of the year.
And then obviously the Missouri game is one of the worst I've ever seen from an Ohio State offensive line. But in the second half of the season, they started progressing because they started gelling. So you need to figure out that right guard spot.
That needs to be expedited even more than the quarterback. So can key pieces keep developing? Throw Josh Simmons in that mix too and figure out that right guard spot quick.
[Dan Hope]
Yeah, it'll be interesting to see how that plays out, how long they let that drag on. As we talked about last week, it feels like Carson Hinsman's probably going to enter preseason camp in the pole position for that right guard spot. The way that Ryan Day has talked him up, they always talk about your best five on the offensive line.
It would seem right now like Carson Hinsman is in that best five along with Josh Simmons, Donovan Jackson, Seth McLaughlin, and Josh Fryer. So assuming Seth McLaughlin can lock down the starting center job, you would think that right now if you're penciling in a starting lineup that Carson Hinsman would probably slot in at that right guard spot. I think that's definitely still in pencil rather than pen.
I think we saw some good things from Tegra Shibola at that right guard spot late in the spring, and he spent most of the spring at right tackle. So I think if he gets a real shot to compete for that right guard job, I certainly don't rule out the possibility that Tegra could end up beating out Carson for that spot because physically you think of what a guard should look like. I think Tegra's got that body type with the power and explosiveness that he has.
So I certainly think Tegra, assuming he gets a full shot to really focus on right guard and competing at that spot in preseason camp, I think he can be a factor in that competition. You don't rule out Luke Montgomery either. I think early in the spring we thought Luke Montgomery was going to end up being that right guard.
It seemed like he lost some momentum late in the spring, but it's worth keeping in mind this is still a guy who's in his second year at Ohio State. So the possibility for him to make a big jump from the spring to preseason camp, that's certainly possible. And if he can show some of the things that got him on the field last year as a freshman, if he can build on some of those things in preseason camp, you can't count him out in that competition because he might have the best upside of that trio just in terms of his athleticism that he brings to that position.
So it's going to be an interesting competition there, but to your point, much like we talked about at quarterback, I think if somebody starts to separate in that competition, that's really what they're going to be looking for. If nobody really stands out and locks it down, that competition's probably going to lead up to game week. If somebody starts to separate in those first couple weeks, then they should start giving that guy the bulk of the first team reps and really try to coalesce with that starting five.
Again, I think this is a position where we talk about a forgiving early season schedule. This is a position where you're certainly glad to have that, but you also want to start a lot stronger out of the gates than you did last year. And to your point, we've talked so much about the right guard competition because that's the one position that's open, but it's not just for right guard that needs to be better.
All five spots on that offensive line need to be better than they were last year. Donovan Jackson needs to be that dominant player. I mean, there's some people who called him a preseason All-American.
He's got to play like that because he didn't last year. Even though he was a first team All-Big Ten, I think he'd be the first one to tell you he did not play up to his standard last year. So he needs to be that dominant guy as that leader of that offensive line.
Josh Fryer, we've heard so many good things about him this offseason in terms of how he's changed his body, how he's improved going into his second year as a starter. There was talk about him potentially moving to guard. It seems like Ohio State is firmly committed to keeping him at right tackle now.
So now he's got to prove that that improvement over the offseason was real. Josh Simmons, he's got to get more consistent. I think we saw some real growth from Josh Simmons in the second half of last season, getting better as a run blocker, cutting down on penalties.
His upside is huge. He has the upside where he could be, legitimately, he could be an elite offensive tackle. He has that kind of upside, but he's got to play to that ability now.
Now it's go time for guys like Josh Simmons and Josh Fryer. These are guys who could be their last year of college football. They've got to put it all together, and whoever they do put it all together at such an important position like offensive tackle could ultimately make or break this team's national championship hopes.
Across the board on the offensive line, like you said, you could argue it's even more important than quarterback in terms of needing to build cohesiveness with that unit over the next month and needing to see some real strides. They're not going to win every rep because they're going up against Jack Sawyer, JT Tuomoloau, Ty Leak-Williams, and Ty Hamilton in practice. There will probably be clips that come out at some point where a guy gets beat.
You have to expect that's going to happen sometimes because they're going up against a really good defense, a defense that we think is going to be the best in the country. We need to see them hold their own. We need to see them be able to win some of those battles.
For whoever's at quarterback, behind that first-team offensive line, for that offense to be able to win some of those battles against the defense, to be able to move the ball down the field and put together some good drives when this team is doing teamwork and practice. If we can see that, then I think we'll have very good reason to be very optimistic about this team because we know how good this defense can be.
[Andy Anders]
Right, and to borrow the old classic tired football cliche, iron sharpens iron. If the offensive line can rise to the occasion and challenge Ohio State's defensive line in practice, that's going to be the best indication we can have that they're going to make strides this year. I think it's definitely going to be an impetus on the defensive line, too, to push that, to challenge the offensive linemen, to get them better because you're going to bang hands with each other for a month in practice and that's how you get toughened up and ready to go win football games.
The only other position where there's a real battle going on in this fall camp, I think, is Will Linebacker. That's the only question mark on defense is who's going to fill that spot. And C.J. Hicks and Sonny Stiles, we've talked about all the talent they have, but there's still question marks around both guys. When you talk about Sonny Stiles moving from safety to linebacker, we both have said that it's, we think, the best fit for his skill set. Some of the struggles he had in the open field last year, but was really a menace when he was in the box. It made sense to move him from safety to linebacker.
And C.J. Hicks has the five-star pedigree as a recruit, but last year before the season, entering his second year, we heard Jim Knoll say that he was going to be unleashed and he never was. We never really saw C.J. come in and make an impact. He struggled the few plays he got in in the Cotton Bowl.
You get the sense that the physical side of it has always been there with C.J. It's learning the position, it's the mental side, it's all of those things that need to take another step here if he's going to claim that wheel linebacker spot. But there's a good chance we see both guys used in the defense. Maybe when you go to a 4-3 package, as we've seen Ohio State do in the past, maybe you could use Sonny as kind of a chess piece, like a heavier nickel against certain fronts, I think.
You could move him around a little bit, just play him across the field. Both those guys would be fantastic rushers off the edge. Not that I expect either of them to bring the jack position back, but that you could definitely play some odd fronts, bring them off the edge.
There's a lot of ways you can move them around the defense, so there's a chance both of them play. But who can claim that spot, and is that guy going... Both of them are 5-star recruits.
Is that guy going to look like a 5-star recruit? It might be hard with all the other 5-star recruits around him on that defense, but are they going to have that impact and be that thumper, that space sideline-to-sideline wheel linebacker that is so vital in the Jim Knowles defense?
[Dan Hope]
Yeah, I expect both of them to play a good amount. I expect both of them to have roles in this defense. I think that makes this competition a little bit different than, say, the quarterback of a right guard competition, because in those competitions, you're going to have a winner, a guy who's going to be the starter and play most of a snap spare, and you're going to have a loser who might not play much at all.
So I think this competition's a little bit different in the sense that I do think there's going to be roles for both of those guys. I think the question is, how big will the second guy's role be? If the guy who's not the starting wheel in the base defense, how big can that second guy's role be?
And so both of these guys for sure want to be that starting wheel linebacker, but they've also said they don't necessarily view it as a competition of each other because they think there are different ways they can be utilized in the defense. I think with Sonny just having that safety background, I think there is a lot of different things you can do with him. Like you said, maybe we see more free linebacker looks this year based on just having a guy with Sonny's skill set who can be that nickel replacement kind of guy.
I think there's an argument for there to maybe be packages where it's CJ and Sonny are your two linebackers on the field because they're both so athletic, what they can do maybe in a passing situation, a coverage situation. I think Cody Simon's not going to leave the field much because I think he is the leader of that group and he's going to be kind of a new Tommy Eichenberg of that group in terms of being that play caller. You'd imagine he's going to be the green dot guy calling out plays there from that middle linebacker spot.
So probably not going to leave the field a lot, but I do think there could potentially be a CJ-Sonny package that we see worked in there on the defense. I think going back to CJ, I think the question still remains of just how much does this coaching staff trust CJ? Because to your point, we know he has the physical ability, but we haven't seen him play much.
I don't think we're going to necessarily know exactly what the roles are going to look like for those guys and how playing time's going to shake out until the games actually start, but we saw CJ take a lot of those first team reps at will in the spring. I think if that continues to be the case in preseason camp, then that will be a very good sign that CJ is trending toward actually playing a major role in the defense this year. But hearing what Ryan Day said on CJ last week at Big Ten Media Days, he had a lot of positive things to say about CJ, yet you still get the sense that they still want to see a little bit more out of CJ in terms of his consistency, in terms of his discipline, to know that he's a guy that they can trust to be that every down linebacker.
[Ryan Day]
Particularly CJ, every spring in the season, he just doesn't get on the field. What have you seen from him that makes you think he's ready? Well, we're going to have to see consistency, but we saw more flashes of him showing up at the ball in the spring.
But like you said, it's got to be consistent, because as a linebacker, you can have two or three bad plays that can ruin your whole afternoon. So there's a level of discipline that has to be there. Every year you grow up more and more, you get more and more of those reps.
You see things. It slows down for you. I think it's slowing down for CJ.
[Andy Anders]
I think we saw it in spring practice when we watched CJ, too. He did flash in the times we were there, but it's exactly what Dave said. It's consistency with CJ, and you need to be dependable as much as anything else at that linebacker spot, because you're the guy that's there to clean up on running plays when the defensive line's job is to set up the linebackers to make the tackle, usually.
That's how defenses work. You need to know exactly where your zone is on a passing down. You can't bite on a play fake and get out of position and get fooled by a misdirection.
These are the things that I think CJ can fly around and make plays all over the place. He needs that consistency like Dave said. He needs that dependability down to down is the most essential part of this, I think, for him.
Now, that's defense. I think, again, we have the least questions about this defense. In any defense, I can really remember going into a fall camp since I've been covering the team.
It's so well-established who the guys are, who the pieces are. This offense is in a position now where it's trying to find an identity, and that's another thing that Dave said will be a super crucial part of preseason camp is establishing that identity.
[Dan Hope]
Just focusing on the here and now, whatever biggest things you feel like you guys need to accomplish here over this next month so that when you get into this season, you can be ready to achieve all those goals.
[Ryan Day]
Got to establish our identity on offense. What exactly are we going to look like? Does everything have to be decided going into the Akron game?
No, but I want to really get a feel for it. I have an idea, but I think Chip has great ideas and has such a library of different things that he can do. What is the right thing for where we are based on the players that we have?
We also need to establish a physicality, get that callus and get that armor that's built up going into the season. I think the camaraderie is there. I think the leadership is there.
I think the chemistry is there. I think we just need to dive into the scheme. I think the coach has got to do a great job coaching and making sure that we're ahead of everybody else in the country.
[Dan Hope]
It'll be interesting to see what does that mean in terms of what establishing that offensive identity could look like. Again, this is something we're probably not really going to get an answer on until the games actually begin because they're not going to show a lot during the practices that are open to media and fans. But what are the factors that they will be looking at in order to determine what their offensive identity will be?
I think certainly two of those big factors are going to go back to the positions we already talked about. It's going to be the development of quarterbacks and the development of the offensive line. Ryan Day has said repeatedly they plan to use the quarterbacks more in the running game this year.
I think that's going to be a factor in this team's offensive identity. I think when you think about adding a running threat at quarterback and pairing him with a running back tandem of Travion Henderson and Quenshawn Judkins, you would think that this team is built to have more of a running identity than maybe we've seen from a lot of Ryan Day's previous teams. Again, you've got what I would consider the best running back tandem in the country.
Now a lot of it is going to come down to that offensive line. Can they move people in the running game? Can they impose their will on defenses?
We're not talking about Akron and Western Michigan in Week 1 and Week 2. We're talking about Michigan in the final game of the regular season. When you're playing against those big games, those matchup kind of games, can that offensive line move people on the ground?
Can the Buckeyes impose their will? Can they run the ball consistently and effectively? I think that's where things should start for this team because we don't know how good Will Howard is going to be as a passer.
We just don't know that right now. Now with that being said, when you have Emeka Abuka and you have Jeremiah Smith and you have Brandon Ennis and you have Carnell Tate, you've got to use those weapons too. I think the ideal thing for this offense is you want to be an offense that can lean on your run game.
You can move the chains on the ground. You can wear people down if you're run game. But then you also want to be able to hit that deep shot.
You want to force defenses to bring more bodies into the box that gives Jeremiah Smith that one-on-one matchup on the outside that you can exploit and throw a deep ball for a touchdown. You want Jeremiah and Carnell to be as good as everybody's thinking they're going to be so that Emeka Abuka is getting a lot of favorable matchups in the slot and he can do a ton of damage in that short to intermediate passing game. So all the elements are there, especially in terms of your weapons, to where you should be able to be a very dynamic, multidimensional offense.
But so much of it is going to go back to, one, can the offensive line bully people in the run game? Can the offensive line be consistent in protection in the pass game? And can Will Howard or whoever the quarterback is take advantage when he gets those one-on-one matchups that he can exploit to hit deep balls through the air?
[Andy Anders]
Yeah, the running game certainly at least needs to improve off of last year when you talk about having the lowest average yards per carry since 2004, and I think a lot of that does go back to the offensive line. Travion Henderson having some injury issues kind of early middle season, but he had some big games down the stretch. You have the best running back tandem in the country, I think, for sure.
We've talked about that a lot. The underrated element of this is what Chip Kelly has done in the past to elevate offensive lines that might not have been as good run blocking as they were, getting the most out of them. I think when you look at the talent that he's had at locations, whether it was UCLA, whether it was Oregon, he's been able to elevate what those offensive lines can do on the ground through all the different motions and shifts, and the way he runs the ball, and the way they teach it, and the way they're able to instruct.
I think that's going to help elevate this run game. And Will Howard, whenever you have a rushing threat at quarterback in a spread offense, it just creates a little bit of hesitation for opposing linebackers. Do I play the running back or the quarterback if they've shown that quarterback running threat?
So just having Will Howard enabling him to pull the ball on a read option and pick up 15 yards, that's enough that you're going to freeze those linebackers. All that you need is half a step for Travion Henderson, and all of a sudden a 3-yard gain is now a 7-yard gain. Or that 11-yard gain is now a 50-yard house call.
These are the kinds of things. It's very small manipulations in football, especially in the running game, that make a huge difference. I think those two elements, having the running quarterback and Chip Kelly, are what are going to open up this ground game this year.
For me, it's also why deep accuracy is the No. 1 thing I'm looking for from Will Howard, to your point, because when you add that vertical stretch to a defense, then it becomes much easier to run the ball too. They're going to have playmakers they can get out in space horizontally.
They're going to be able to stretch defenses that way with all the weapons at receiver and the speed they have. Can Will Howard have that deep ball accuracy if he's the starting quarterback or if it's Devin Brown, whoever it is? That vertical stretch to a defense is also really important for running the ball.
And like you said, when they load up the box, having the ability to take that deep shot and connect. So you need that element of it too to help open up the running game. But for me, I do think this is going to be a run-driven offense.
I have high expectations for what they can achieve, even with how much of a step back the running game took for most of last year. And kind of to that point, you know, Day also said that the Buckeyes need to establish a physicality, get that callus, and get that armor that's built up going into the season. And I think a lot of the subtext there is, like you said earlier, you go back and you look at these games, the narrative about Michigan has been, you know, Ohio State's had the more talented teams, Michigan's out-toughed them in a lot of years.
And I think that, you know, maybe last year Michigan did have, it was probably a real matchup game where they had similar amounts of talent that Michigan team last year was really talented, Conner Stallions aside. But the physicality and the toughness is just, again, it's something that's been worked on in this program for a couple of years. Can you deliver on that expectation?
The defense did last year. The defense proved it was tough. The defense proved it could get the job done.
Maybe not as much in the second half against Michigan when you talk about the four scoring drives, but, you know, they got worn down a little bit in that game. And the offense gave seven points to Michigan. And it was really their only game the entire year where you sit back and you say, okay, the defense played a part in Ohio State struggling.
This year, now you have to get that physicality up front. And Will Howard has also said recently, you know, he's tired of hearing how talented Ohio State is. They need to go out and prove it, need to go out and out great guys and out tough guys.
And they've worked on that this off season with Coach Mick. They work on that every off season with Coach Mick, but is this the year we see that take shape? And, you know, it's one thing to talk about toughness, talk about physicality, make it an off season emphasis.
It's really, you could only show it on the field. And that's when you find out how tough you really are. Because, you know, when you get hit in the mouth, you have to respond.
They're not going to get hit in the mouth the first like five weeks of the season, but you have to respond when you do.
[Dan Hope]
Yeah, certainly that, you know, toughness, physicality narrative, whether it's accurate or not, is just something that's going to linger until Ohio State gets that monkey off its back and beats Michigan. So it's no surprise that, you know, this is a preseason point of emphasis for the Buckeyes. If they need to be physical, they need to be tough.
Now there's a balance there in preseason camp, because really if we're being, you know, truly honest and boiling this down to its simplest form, if we're talking about the most important thing for the Buckeyes in preseason camp, it's to get through camp healthy. With all this talent you have, you don't want any of those star players we've talked about to get hurt during camp. So that's really the most important thing for the Buckeyes.
That's honestly a matter of luck more than anything else. But, you know, that's obviously something that they're going to balance in terms of how many hits do you want Travion Henderson and Emeka Buka taking in preseason camp? Probably not a lot more than they need to.
But at the same time, you do need to tackle in preseason camp. You do need to have hard days in preseason camp because you need to steal this team for the challenges that are going to be coming, particularly in a season that could go 16, 17 games. You need to make sure this team, not only has the physical stamina for that stretch, but the mental fortitude for all the challenges that could come.
Because as good as we expect this team to be, it doesn't mean everything's going to come easily. There's going to be challenges for this team. And so you want to put them in situations here in preseason camp where they have to overcome challenges and they have to kind of, you know, steal themselves mentally for when those challenges do come during the regular season and the postseason.
And so that's certainly going to be a point of emphasis for Ohio State in preseason camp. I think, you know, going along with that, developing depth is obviously going to be an important thing here in preseason camp. Ryan Day's talked about it all off season.
You know, we feel like we need, you know, three guys at every position because of that potential for a 16, 17 game playoff run. And so, you know, depth is going to be really at all positions. You're always looking to build depth at all positions.
You know, we already talked a lot about the offensive line. Certainly that is an area where, you know, depth is going to be an emphasis as well, not just figuring out who that starting right guard is, but, you know, figuring out who that third offensive tackle is, you know, figuring out, you know, who else can step up off the bench if needed. That's going to be a very important thing here in preseason camp.
I think, you know, defensively, I think the big depth question is it's safety. We know, you know, Caleb Downs and Leif and Ransom should be an elite tandem at safety, but, you know, we've seen Leif and Ransom have a couple of season ending injuries, who behind them can step up if needed. We think Malik Hartford's probably the next guy up off a bench.
We saw some good things from him last year, but we also saw some, you know, signs of his inexperience last year. So he, after missing the entire spring with an injury, he's going to be a guy to watch this spring in terms of can he solidify himself as that next man up at safety as someone they can trust if they need him to come in off the bench and who else can they count on? They brought in Keenan Nelson Jr. from South Carolina. We heard Ryan Day talk up Jalen McClain again at Big Ten Media Days. I think he had the kind of spring as a freshman where he could potentially see some early playing time, much like Malik Hartford did last year. Jaden Bonds, who's another guy, even though he didn't play at all last year, got a ton of first team reps this spring and seems to be making a move toward getting some playing time this year.
So they've got some bodies there. It's just a matter of who can they count on at that position if they need someone to come in.
[Andy Anders]
Yeah. And the offensive line, I mean, offensive tackle depth is a real concern. I mean, you're one injury away from, you know, Tegra Shibula could slide out to tackle if he's playing guard in fall camp.
That's probably your top option. But then it's like, who else? You know, George Fitzpatrick and Zim Mahalsky have not really made any noise.
Zim Mahalsky was supposed to be involved in the tackle competition last year and faded before spring ended, it seemed. And we just haven't seen anything from him and George Fitzpatrick. I mean, they've liked some of the progression they've seen from him, it seems, this spring.
But if he's called upon in a game, is he going to be ready to protect, you know, the blind side or front side of Will Howard or Devin Brown? These are questions that you need to try and work on and address really on the offensive line. I think that's a tip-top concern in terms of depth purposes.
You know, running back's another position where with T.C. Caffey going down, you have two freshmen racking up Travion Henderson and Quenshawn Judkins. We've talked about the importance of James Peoples developing and trying to establish himself as a third running back as an option if one of those guys gets hurt as a freshman. But you also look at Caleb Downs as an emergency option.
That's been brought up, obviously. He's focusing on safety this fall. And you might have some gadget plays, even, that you could experiment with him in the offense.
But if worst case happens, is that an option that you can feasibly look to? So getting those freshmen ready is going to be really important at running back, just in case you need them. Travion Henderson, the last two years, has had some sort of injury difficulty.
So we've seen it plenty of times at running back for Ohio State that depth ends up being very important, and they don't have a lot of it behind the two superstars that lead the position this year. That's going to be really important through fall camp. Dace also talked about receiver depth being a question mark behind that top four.
Trying to establish Jaden Ballard is a guy that really needs to, if he's ever going to make an impact at Ohio State, he needs to take a step this year. We've talked about that all offseason with him. It's going to be hard with these other four guys, but if we're seeing Jaden Ballard make an impact, I think that at least gives you confidence and you have a fifth guy who you could bring in if a couple guys are out and contribute.
And then Bryson Rogers, I think, is the other name you look to there.
[Dan Hope]
We're going back to the running back depth. I continue to say that I don't know that classifying Caleb Downs as an emergency option is really an accurate depiction of what we could see from him on offense this year, but I'll be interested to see. I highly doubt we're going to see it in an open practice, but do we actually see Caleb Downs practice on offense at some point?
Do we see Brandon Innes or Emeka Abuka line up in the backfield at some point? Again, probably not something they're going to show us in an open practice, but I think now we're at the point of, okay, we've talked enough about that. Now, if we see it, cool.
If not, then it's probably something to throw him a back burner. We'll get to see, and there's always going to be surprises here in preseason camp. There's going to be something on Thursday that we're going to see out there.
Somebody's playing a new position or somebody's in there with the first team unexpectedly. There's going to be something like that we're going to see on the first day of practice that's going to surprise us. So while we do feel like we know a lot of the answers with this team, it's going to be interesting to get back out there.
It's been over three months since this team was last on the field, and so I'm sure the coaches have cooked up plenty of new ideas for what they want to do going into the season, and it'll be interesting to see during those first two days of practice, which we will both be at, along with other members of the Ohio State media contingent, we will see how much looks the same as it did during the spring. And we do know those first couple practices, they're not going to show us everything. Ryan Day already said last week, they're going to probably have multiple fields going during those first few practices, try to get everybody as many reps as possible, which is a good thing because we'll get to see a lot of different guys out there getting work in, may not necessarily know what the depth chart's going to look like coming out of those first two practices, but we'll see what looks different than what we saw this spring and what looks the same.
And we'll certainly have a lot of coverage of that to come on 11warriors.com.
[Andy Anders]
We've been covering some basketball too with these commitments that have happened here, and I just want to talk about here, because I think backcourt depth, super important for Ohio State after the Taysen Chapman injury, and getting Quest Glover from Kansas State and not even needing to put him on scholarship is I think a great piece for that depth. Now, he didn't play last year because he was injured all year, but Kansas State had real plans for him in the offense, and I think some people are sleeping on what Quest Glover can provide. Just what he showed at Samford in his two years there, averaged 19 points a game in 2021-22, 4.4 assists that same season. Production dipped a little bit the next year while he was at Samford, and like I said, didn't play last year, but he's a guy who's got some quickness at the guard position, got some distribution, and that experience is valuable when you talk about providing depth in a one-year rental role like he'll be because he's only got one year of eligibility left, but you only had three true guards left on the roster, and Adibor liked the mix of ball handlers they had at other positions, guys who could run the show, so to speak, in certain settings, but getting Quest Glover was important, and I think that the addition that kind of got me more excited, though, was the one that happened on Tuesday, Croatian center Ivan Djogovin. The N is silent.
It's N-J-E-G-O-V-A-N. Learn the name because I think this is a guy who has a lot of upside, and he might not show at year one. It might take some developmental time, but the thing is, again, he's from Croatia.
He's been playing in the top professional league in Croatia. You don't know exactly. You're playing a huge mix of guys, like literally ages 16 to 40, and you don't know exactly what level of competition he's going against, but led his pro team in blocks per game with 1.6 and in rebounds. He has a three-point shot as a 7-1 center, like a really nice stroke when you watch it on tape, and only attempted 16 threes with his team, KK Bosco, this past year, but in other leagues and other settings, he has shot the ball consistently and made it consistently even. So you talk about a 7-1 big man with a three-point shot, legitimate three-point threat, and great defensive and rebounding skills in that Croatian league. You just wonder how the talent level of the top level of Croatian professional basketball translates to Big Ten basketball, right?
And how does that happen? So I think there's a real lot. I think this is a really nice international find for Jake Niebler, like could be a little bit of a gem, even if it's down the road.
I'm not sure what the impact will be this year, and you have Aaron Bradshaw already at center. You have Sean Stewart already at power forward. You have Devin Royal at power forward.
Austin Parks to give you some depth. You have pieces already in the front court. He doesn't need to make an impact this year necessarily, but I'm really excited about it.
It's like a cool, like, okay, this is like 7-1 center with a three-point shot from Croatia. This is pretty fun. It's a fun roster that Jake Niebler has built in certain areas, and I'm just excited even to interview him.
Like, how good is his English? You know, like, let's, I want to talk to this guy.
[Dan Hope]
Yeah, I mean, I think honestly, for me, with both of these guys, it's a lot of unknown about what these guys will actually do this year for Ohio State, what their roles will look like for Ohio State. I mean, you're adding both of these guys in July for a reason. Like, it's not, you know, there's, you know, you don't necessarily expect guys who are late additions to your roster at this stage in the game to be guys who are going to play major roles for the Buckeyes this year.
And I don't think that's really the expectation for either one of them, but at the same time, I think for adding two scholarship-level players to your roster in July, even if one of them isn't actually on scholarship, these are two good additions for late July when a lot of teams' rosters have already been set for a while. To be able to get both these guys, you know, late in the summer, I think are two quality additions for Jake Diebler. You know, Quest Glover very much is a short-term guy.
And again, this is a move that realistically isn't happening if Tyson Chapman doesn't get hurt. That's the reason why this move is happening. The wheels were already in motion for Ohio State to sign Ivan Jagovin before Tyson Chapman's injury.
And that's why Quest Glover isn't getting that last scholarship is because they had already decided they were going to use that last scholarship on an international big man to add some depth to the frontcourt. And so they figured out a way to make it work where they could get both of those guys. And the way they're doing it actually makes sense because with the settlement that just became finalized last week, next year, Ohio State is going to be able to have 15 scholarship players in basketball.
And so Ivan Jagovin, you know, I look at that very much as a move for the future, but he's a guy who's going to be one of those 15 scholarship players next year. Quest Glover, a six-year senior, he's in his final year of college basketball. And so I think they didn't want to sacrifice adding a guy that they think has long-term upside over the next four years just to add a depth piece for one year.
But they still needed that depth piece that they're getting in Quest Glover. And, you know, to your point, he had a lot of success at Sanford. Now, Ohio State's track record with guys who were really good mid-major players hasn't really been great in recent years in terms of a transfer portal.
So that's kind of why I'm going to wait and see with Quest Glover. Now, the good news is, you know, this is a guy with a power five pedigree. I mean, he started his career at Florida.
You know, he's always had that kind of physical skill set that you'd look for in a power conference guard. And if he hadn't gotten hurt last year, may have played a significant role at Kansas State. So I think, again, for a late July addition, I think this is a very quality addition to be, you know, the fourth guard this year to add some depth at that position.
I don't think he's, you know, coming in to take minutes away from Bruce Fortner, Meachie Johnson, or Juney Mobley. But I think he gives them, you know, somebody else with a veteran presence who can contribute there. Whereas without adding him, they were really going to be in a position where they could have been, you know, one injury away from a real problem in terms of guard depth.
So I think, again, for a late July addition, a high-quality addition, getting Quez Glover through the transfer portal. And then I think, you know, if Ivan Djigovin, again, you just don't know. Like you said, you know, it's hard to know how is a guy from the Croatian League going to translate to playing in American college basketball.
But, you know, he has played against adults. You know, he's played on professional teams before. And so this is very much, you know, an upside, long-term kind of play.
I would be surprised if he played much this year. But you never know. I mean, you never know.
I mean, after losing Felix Akpara, you added Aaron Bradshaw to give yourself a big man this year. But they don't have any other proven big men besides Aaron Bradshaw, really. You know, Austin Parks has been on the team, but he didn't play much last year.
And so Djigovin will have a chance to come in and kind of compete for that backup center role. You know, we might see Sean Stewart get some minutes up the five as well. But, you know, there's certainly some minutes up for grabs there at that center position.
We'll see how far along Djigovin is to whether he can be a factor in that rotation as a freshman.
[Andy Anders]
Yeah, I think you hit the nail on the head with all of that analysis. And, again, I think the roster strategy of versatility, of, you know, valuable winning experience was kind of furthered with Djigovin. And, again, I'm just interested to see what even in year two it'll look like for him because he's got four full years to develop his game.
And, you know, I think there's a real chance Ohio State got a bit of a steal here in late July. And that's, like you said, it's just the value of these additions is the fact that you got players of, like, a solid quality at least, a promising future piece, and a guy at guard who's got enough experience that you feel comfortable with him in a backup role if, you know, someone goes down. That's really good to add in, you know, the last week of July for a basketball team.
Like, you don't see additions happen that late very often. It was, they were two valuable additions, I think, one for the future and one for the present depth for Ohio State. And now the roster is set, and this is, you know, we're fully focused on football, really, this time of year.
But now Jake Diebler has his team completely constructed that he's going to try and go out and win some games with in his first year. And you have a pretty difficult non-conference schedule that was released this week, or over the last couple weeks, really, with five power conference opponents. So they're going to get tested early.
They might have some lumps. There's a lot of unproven guys on this team. Even Aaron Bradshaw is kind of unproven right now.
He played a limited role at Kentucky last year. Sean Stewart played an even more limited role at Duke. So some key contributors to this team are untested guys, and they're going to get tested early.
Then how does it play out? Are we going to see a new story in January from the last few under Chris Holtman, where the teams just seem to disintegrate once that section of the calendar hit? January, February, awful basketball.
What ultimately led to his firing? Is it going to be different? Can this team develop and gel and then be competitive in the Big Ten come those first couple months of 2025?
[Dan Hope]
Plenty to be excited about with his Ohio State basketball team. There's a lot of unknowns with this team. Not a ton of returning guys.
Obviously a new coach, but I think you can see the upside across the roster, and now bolstering that depth. I think you feel like the pieces are there where this is a team that should, at the very least, be able to get back to the NCAA tournament and be somewhat of a contender in the Big Ten. We will begin to see how all of that plays out on November 4 when Ohio State opens its season against Texas.
Still a few months to go on that end until we start Ohio State basketball season. So Ohio State football certainly going to be front of mind for many Buckeye fans over the next few months, but we will continue to cover developments on the Ohio State basketball side as they happen, though. We do now know that the roster for the 2024-25 season is set for those Buckeyes, and so we will look forward to seeing them take the court in a few months, but we will look forward to seeing the Ohio State football team get back on the practice field tomorrow.
And so make sure you stay tuned at 11warriors.com for lots more coverage of Ohio State football as preseason camp gets underway this week, and we hope you'll join us again for another episode of Real Pod Wednesdays next week.