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Patent Pending Made Simple is a podcast for inventors who are looking to learn more about the patent process
Hey, Jason, welcome to the
startup sidebar podcast.
I'm really excited to have you here.
Summer.
It's a pleasure and an honor to be
here with you and your audience.
I'm excited to be here as well.
Wonderful.
On this podcast, we usually talk
about legal matters, but I think
this is legal adjacent, right?
And these are all the kind of nuts
and bolts, boring, blocking and
tackling type of items that startup
founders and entrepreneurs had to
deal with, so I'm excited to have you.
Oh, that's great.
And I used to work in contracts
in aerospace and defense, so I'm
not scared of a little legalese.
It's fun.
Legalese is so much fun, right?
Absolutely.
Love it.
Love it.
And it's, it comes up all the time, right?
And especially in dealmaking, it's a
really important part of understanding
and being able to structure good deals.
So excited to be here and be able
to talk with you and the audience
through startups, legalese, exit, M&
A, all that good stuff this morning.
That's wonderful.
Yeah, can you give us a little
bit of background on yourself
and we'll go from there?
Sure.
Sure.
So my name is Jason Brown.
I'm an MNA advisor and business broker
based here in San Antonio, Texas,
actually office, not too far from summer.
I have been doing this for the
past three years on my own, working
corporate merges and acquisitions.
Before that, I spent some
time working in startups.
So I have a perspective and
a view and working with small
technology based companies.
My focus today is really on helping
small business owners prepare
for and exit their businesses.
And I also work with buyers to help
them structure their thoughts and
their plan around acquiring businesses.
That makes a lot of sense.
And I think that's exactly the
reason I wanted to talk to you.
Most people are building startups
to exit at some point, right?
You could have a family business
or a lifestyle business where
you don't intend to exit.
But I think some of these tips that
we're talking about here are going
to be helpful to those folks as well.
I think these are.
Pretty universal business principles.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
And I come from this school
of begin with the end in mind.
So Stephen Covey, for those who are old
enough to remember is a key principle in a
business that you're running and operating
regardless of if it's a lifestyle
business or a high growth tech startup.
And so excited to share some thoughts
around what you need to do to prepare
your business in startup space to
be prepared to sell to be attractive
to to buyers because while I'm sure.
We all love the journey.
We're all working towards that end goal
of having a successful business that
we can turn over to the the next owner.
Yeah, that's exactly it.
That's a great overview.
And let's just jump right into it.
What is the first tip that you'd
want to share with the audience?
Absolutely.
So regardless of whatever business
you're in or you're building it's
really important to have a vision and
clarity more than one or two pages in a
pitch deck around what is the exit for.
And I'm a firm believer that you
need to have some various scenarios
that you build into that plan.
There's always a base case, right?
And so you're going to grow your business.
And there's somebody out there who's
going to find what you're doing valuable,
and there may be an upside case, right?
You may be the next unicorn,
but there's also a scenario in
which there's a downside case.
And so what happens if you
don't get the product market
fit that you're looking for.
What happens if you're not
the key strategic cog in
a big company's portfolio?
What do you do then?
And how do you build your business
to be attractive and valuable?
To buyers that fit those
different sets of scenarios.
It's really important to think about
and to have some clarity on as you
start and embark on the journey.
And while you're going along,
continue to check in to see how are
you building this business really
to meet the needs of a future buyer.
That makes sense.
And how does that work from a kind
of a nuts and bolts perspective?
Do you.
Typically, or do you recommend
startup founders have this
in a document somewhere?
Is it more informal?
How would you formalize this?
Yeah.
So I think it starts with strategy.
And I do think it needs to be
written down in a document and
it's a living document, right?
So it's not a static
piece that never changes.
It's something that you're going
to go back to in a startup.
You're pivoting constantly.
You're learning constantly where and
how you provide and deliver value.
It's constantly evolving as you go
through different phases of the journey.
But keeping an eye to who does this
matter to, not only from a customer
perspective, but also from a future
potential acquirers perspective.
So I think about it, even if, again, the
pitch deck to me gets simplified into one
or two pages as to what is the exit and
a lot of times I think that's just it's.
There's not necessarily
a depth of analysis or a
strategy that goes into that.
And so I recommend that there's
a several page analysis that goes
into what makes sense and why.
And as things change in the
marketplace, that's going to evolve.
Talking to those potential acquirers
and understanding where their
strategic roadmap is leading.
It's getting helpful to inform what
actually They're looking for and
are you in line and aligned with
that and the degree to which you're
not then it's shifting, right?
It's understanding that today with
the solution that you're building
for whatever problem You're trying
to solve the actual person that finds
that valuable in their portfolio may be
different tomorrow than it is today So
again, I think it's a living breathing
document and it's through conversations
and doing analysis and keeping, keeping
in tune with where markets are going.
That informs what that potential exit
plan looks like for your company.
Makes a lot of sense.
I do something similar on
the patent side, right?
Often when clients come to me, they
think, yeah, we're getting a patent.
And, it's a check Mark, but the
first conversation that I have is.
Who's going to find these
patents or pieces of IP valuable.
So this is what we do.
And maybe we should refine this based
on my conversation with you here.
But what we do is we say,
okay, who are the most likely
acquirers of this technology?
And can we build a piece of
patent or a portfolio that is
complimentary to that business, right?
That will allow them to say,
Hey, this Fits a strategic need.
This patent portfolio fits a strategic
need or a hole in our IP portfolio.
So it becomes much more valuable and
strategic for them to acquire it,
or they want to keep it out of the
hands of some of their competitors.
So we think about what is that piece of IP
or that portfolio that is going to fit a
strategic need for a potential acquirer.
We also think about the technology curve
of how the industry is going to evolve.
Usually startups are.
In a fast moving space.
And usually the solution that they have
is suboptimal, relative to the incumbents.
But as the technology evolves and grows,
we'll become optimal, or maybe better
than what the incumbents are providing.
So we think about that trajectory.
And then we also think about, in case
the company goes into bankruptcy.
So I've had this happen to a couple
of my clients where the company, the
startup went into bankruptcy, but their
patent portfolio got acquired by other
companies and it is, Something you don't
really want to think about necessarily
as a founder, but in both of those
scenarios, the founder had invested a
lot of their personal money into the
business and getting the patent portfolio
acquired was the difference between,
walking away with 0 versus walking
away with, some money in your pocket.
So those are the three things that we
think about, but it seems like these
conversations need to happen pretty
regularly and maybe on a more formalized
business sense than, what we're
doing necessarily on the legal side.
And I think you're exactly right,
sorry, because it's not only your IP,
it's really where's the value created.
So I had a recent conversation with a
very large multi billion dollar company.
Really around understanding
what is their strategic roadmap.
And they shared that there was a smaller
company that they acquired because of
the IP that was within the company.
And so if you don't have IP,
the process is still the same.
What is the value that you're creating?
And is it differentiated?
If you are a me too, if your solution.
15 solutions to what to the problem that
you're solving and anybody can do it.
I think there's a more fundamental
question to ask and answer in your
business, but assuming that you do have
a unique value proposition, the question,
same question, who finds it valuable?
What does the technology
roadmap look like?
I think you go through the same
process, whether it's IP or not.
If the startup fails, is there something
here that is going to, that somebody will
find value in and how do you monetize that
so you can recoup some of that so I think
you're spot on in the steps that you take
and the case I would make for all startup
entrepreneurs is that's a process that
you should go through, whether or not
you have IP or not, because it's really
around where and how do you create value
and how do you extract that value in
different scenarios as you move forward?
You're spot on and providing very good
counsel to your clients on that front.
I appreciate that.
The other piece that I think was really
interesting in your answer is to have
ongoing conversation with potential
acquirers or just industry players.
You just never know who is going
to find what you do interesting and
who's going to have a strategic need
or an immediate need for what you do.
Yeah.
I think that's really good advice as well.
I think Startup founders should
be doing that all the time.
Absolutely.
And I've sat in the seat.
So I've worked on an innovation
team in a very large property
and casualty insurance company.
And so I was doing a consulting
project with them, right?
Large companies.
So they make this make by decision, right?
Do we innovate internally or do we go
out and acquire and both of those Need to
align to some sort of a strategic vision.
So i've sat in the seat of okay This
is the capability that we need to
be successful long term does it make
sense for us to do it internally?
So we're going to go out and
scour the marketplace to identify
Where is there a solution?
So imagine if you're involved in those
conversations consistently and you have
visibility and an understanding across
whatever sector or industry you're
in, where are things moving, right?
Where are there issues and problems
that they're going to be looking
to solve for their customers?
And how is it that you can help and
position your business to be that
asset that's going to be most valuable
to helping them solve what's usually
a much larger problem in terms of.
Of scale.
And so from that seat, it was
interesting to see how we went through
and evaluated different companies.
And those companies, again, we
knew what we were looking for.
And those companies that, that
fit were the companies that
got put onto the game board and
assessed for potential acquisition.
And so building those relationships and
understanding whether it be internal
VC groups, whether it be innovation
teams, other business development folks
within the companies in the space that
you think are going to be exit targets.
It can be a huge advantage.
Again, as you're thinking about how you
serve your clients or how you create
value with your clients to start to
build in an alignment with who your
ultimate acquirer is going to be.
I've also been on those internal
teams that have been challenged with
building organic new opportunities.
And it's not easy.
And I think that's the
competitive advantage that,
that startups have in the space.
Much more nimble much, much more adept
at identifying what's going on in the
marketplace and figuring out how to get
product market fit, figuring out how
to do that initial scaling that bigger
companies are just not equipped to do.
Or it will take them twice
as long and cost them twice
as much or two times as much.
Yep.
That makes a lot of sense.
So we didn't talk about this as a tip
for startup founders, but I'm curious,
if they are talking to somebody like
you in your previous position, how can
they have a more effective conversation?
My, my guess is that you want to
just gather as much information
about the company, right?
As possible, what are they
interested in and what are strategic
objectives and milestones for
them, just so you can direct them.
Your conversation that way, but do you
have tips for talking to somebody like
yourself in your previous position?
Absolutely.
So it is about creating value
and immediate value, right?
And so part of it.
Is being able to understand who their
customer is, who their end user is.
It's particularly in our situation,
it was trying to build deeper
relationships with customers and clients.
And so having someone come in and be able
to take a meeting that can demonstrate
how they've done that with their own
clients to be able to speak the language
of those folks that you are talking to
that were potential acquirers and to
show insight that they may not have,
I think this is the biggest thing.
If you can bring insights.
Into their customers that
they don't currently have it's
huge value in the interaction.
So Everyone's busy.
Everyone has a lot going on And
so the question is am I going to
take a second meeting if the first
meeting didn't prove to be valuable?
So in every interaction is what are you
bringing to the table to deliver value?
And so if it's you've done a hundred
customer interviews You've got ten
thousand customers and here's some
really unique customer insights Thanks
That you can bring to the table that the
potential acquirer would find valuable.
That's how you become
a person of interest.
That's how you become a person
that delivers value just
through the interactions.
And I think that also plays
into the overall assessment.
So understand customers.
Understand business models.
So the degree to which you can
understand how they're trying to
make money at what they're doing and
providing that value independent of
an acquisition gets you more airtime.
It gets you to be relevant into the
conversation on an ongoing basis.
It makes them almost
want to call you, right?
That's the goal.
They say they're trying to understand
what's going on with the customers and
how to make their customers happy and
solve more problems for their customers.
And so if you can help deliver.
We talk about information being currency.
You oftentimes as startup owners, the
startup founders and owners are closer
to the customer than the big behemoth out
there, who's going to ultimately acquire.
You have boots on the ground and knowledge
and insights that they don't have that
can be potentially very valuable for
them and also help them connect the dots.
So that'll also help them understand
how your solution is The understanding
of the customer and their capabilities
can all be tied together to deliver
more value for everybody involved.
Figure out how to deliver value in
every conversation that you're going
to have, otherwise you're not going
to have very many conversations with
those individuals, cause they're very
busy and a lot of people who want
to get into the office to see them.
That makes sense.
This is really good advice and I'm glad
we got into it because, when my team
talks to prospective clients, for example,
we try to have this metric, internal
metric in your head that you should be
delivering an insight every minute, right?
Because prospective clients, don't have
the time and often talking to a lawyer is
burdensome more than interesting and fun.
So yeah, this is what we do.
And this is the advice that I, I used
to work at a big firm and that I used
to give junior attorneys all the time.
I was doing patent litigation.
You are often dealing with,
10 million plus litigations.
And you usually have a hundred
million pages of documents to
review in these litigations.
And for a junior attorney to add value
to that litigation where the partners
are usually doing strategy work and kind
of high level testimony and depositions.
So how can a junior person add value?
And I think it's by knowing
all the documents, right?
If you can provide insight into kind of
the paper level of the case, then you get
more airtime with the senior people and
you get more insight into strategy and you
can get invited into those conversations.
There's a lot of the same concepts there.
And I do it in my business.
So most of my work is with small
and medium sized businesses.
Jason, so what is the second tip that
you have for our startup founders
who are thinking about these things?
Absolutely.
So there's a question in the startup
world as to how do you grow, right?
And so do you grow organically?
Do you go out and acquire more customers?
Or do you grow inorganic
or even how do you start?
So I think one of the big
questions is how do you grow?
Inorganically, which is through
acquisition, or do you grow organically?
So you go out and invest and
you are the person that's
driving sales and the company.
I think there's a case to be made
somewhere to consider inorganic
growth and even from the beginning.
So if you have a great idea about how
to go to market and tackle a problem
in a new way, I think there's something
to be said for going out and looking
at potentially acquiring a business
that's operating in that space.
Particularly if you don't have deep
industry knowledge and experience,
and if you're having trouble
or challenges around financing.
So if you can go and buy a business in
the space, lots of financing options for
that'd be another conversation for another
day, or we can go deeper if you'd like.
But you now have cash flow from
an existing operation that can
fund the innovation that you're
looking to bring to market.
You now have connections with
an existing customer base.
That provides you insights as to
how you can best deploy and develop
the solution to the problem that
you're looking to to bring to market.
And so I think it's an important
consideration for startups
both at the initial stage.
And as you get into your business
as to does it make sense, just like
the corporations do to go out and
acquire, is there enough synergy
value there by synergy, combine
the one plus one equals three.
Value that it makes sense to go out and
find and acquire a merge with someone else
in the marketplace to give you strength.
We all know that as you scale the
business becomes more resilient.
So the smaller you are,
the more challenging it is.
It's artists get to your first
million artists to get to your
first X number of customers.
And so I encourage startup
founders to consider.
Inorganic or acquisition as a means of
getting into a space and as a means of
generating cash flow versus having to go
out and raise capital and having to spend
time that could be spent on developing
your business really around capillary.
That's a big part of the startup
experience is making sure
that that you have funding on.
And so that's a really interesting
alternative way to think about
and consider funding your business
also means that potentially
you end up holding a lot more.
The the equity, the ventures, the
risks gets you further along the
road to having a stable business.
That's pretty cool.
I'm sure a lot of startup founders
haven't thought about this.
I have a couple of questions
maybe from a macro perspective and
maybe some details if that's okay.
Absolutely.
When startups are thinking about this in
particular, Are they thinking about, or
do you recommend that they think about
this kind of vertically or horizontally?
How should they, prioritize
maybe these opportunities or what
should they be thinking about?
I know you mentioned
cashflow being important.
But yeah, what are some of the metrics
that you would look at and think about?
Absolutely.
I think it starts with customer, right?
Because most times startups
are solving a problem.
Customer acquisition is not
cheap in many cases, right?
And so if, and it has to be complimentary.
So whatever solution you think
you're bringing to solve the problem,
you want to look at a customer.
And so can you get into a business
that's serving the same sets of customers
understanding the existing business model?
And can you keep running
that business model?
And is it somewhat complimentary to
whatever solution that you're planning?
To break.
So having a solution or serving a set
of customers in two different disparate
spaces is less attractive of an option
than if you're a potential bolt on.
Opportunity to an existing problem
that this business is solving.
So I look at it at
first the customer base.
So you want to be serving the
same sets of customers as we
talked about before a lot of time.
That's what whether it's B to C or B to B.
A lot of that value is understanding and
having a relationship of how you create
and extract value with that customer.
And so being able to align yourself
with a business that's playing
in the same market and again, has
a complimentary business model.
That's where I think it starts.
Cashflow is it's, and that's becomes
the financing side of it, right?
So you can typically get a loan
for 10 percent of the value.
If there's real estate involved,
you can get a longer period of
time, but again, you can then use
the cashflow from that business to
fund and finance the innovation that
you're looking to to bring to market.
But it's just less risky.
So we talked about before the downside of
you've built a company, you have IP and
you go into bankruptcy as the downside.
So we look at the downside.
If you go in and you were to acquire an
asset that's a line as the innovation that
you're bringing to market doesn't work
and your fallback position is, not you're
bankrupt but you've got a kind of core
business asset that will continue to run.
And again, this allows more flexibility.
What's the next problem you can solve
using the cash flow from the business,
but it doesn't get you overextended.
So especially if you're early and
depending on your ability to capital
raise and the options you have for
financing, this could be another way to
get into the market and to really drive
your solution into the marketplace.
That makes a lot of sense.
What I tell clients from an IP perspective
is maybe somewhat similar, we always
talk about, building the most strategic
or the most valuable patent possible.
And and maybe we should include some
of these metrics, but we always think
about who owns the customer relationship.
Usually those patents tend to be the
most valuable because they usually can
have the most kind of price flexibility.
The further you are away
from the customer, the more
commoditized you can get.
And the closer you are to the
customer, the more differentiated
your product can be.
So we always think about this as,
let's look at the chain and in,
in getting market to the customer.
And where do we fit in?
On that chain and then, how can
we occupy the most valuable or
important portion of that chain?
But what you're saying, I think,
is also in addition to that, also
think about horizontally as well,
as, as opposed to just vertically.
Yes.
But aligning yourself to the customer
is probably the safest way to build
a model around all this stuff.
Absolutely.
It's critical to the lifeblood
of the company, right?
And as the customer.
Okay, very good.
Go ahead.
Yep.
Oh, sorry.
Go ahead, Jason.
No, I was going to say, to just echo
your point of, being tied to the
customer is super important, especially
as their needs consistently change.
And being able to adapt to that and
continue to create value for the customer.
Those are the folks that extract value.
The majority of the value
from the the relationships, a
hundred percent agree there.
And that's also a challenge, right?
From my legal perspective, it's
pretty easy for me to keep a few
of these priorities straight.
But for business owners, it's okay,
you're thinking about acquisitions
and talking to companies as we talked
about in our, in your last tip while
also aligning yourself to the customer.
It's tricky.
And but something that I think
successful startups have to navigate.
And I think that leads to the next
thing that I would encourage, and
it's really about building the team.
No one person can go out there and
be a superstar in all these various
elements and aspects of the business.
And so it also devalues the business.
So if you're the only person
that's able to navigate all these
different conversations and different
value levers within the company
it inherently limits the value.
It, the company becomes too
closely tied to you as the founder.
And so the question becomes,
how do you minimize that as
a risk to, to the business?
And I'd argue it's building
the right team, right?
That's you bring in the right folks
that have the skillset to be able
to tackle these various challenges.
You build company based on the
people independent of yourself.
Also putting in the right systems and
tools and processes as that time comes.
I get it.
Startups are extremely,
it moves really quickly.
And so things are changing fast and
you don't want to spend a whole lot of
time investing in, in really putting
hard wires into the the business.
But it's really important
to think through.
How are you going to do that?
Because it always be fast.
And at some point in time, you do
need to have the right players.
Things are going to scale
within the team, right?
It's when you have five people,
it's easy to manage, right?
You guys can all have conversations
as the teams quickly expand.
How do you ensure
consistency and messaging?
How do you ensure that each person that's
touching the customer is projecting the
company in the right way and that the
customers having the same experience
with everybody throughout the company?
So I think these are also really important
things for founders and any business
owner really to be thinking about
is how does the organization achieve
its objectives independent of you?
So you have the vision, you understand
what all the pieces need to be but it's
super important to bring on the right team
and to make sure that the communication
channels are there such that the team
understands what needs to be done.
And also figuring out when and how
do you plug in the right structure?
So that way, if any one person
is not there it gives the company
a fighting chance at survival.
Super important.
It can't be done alone, right?
I think that's what I want
everyone to take away.
Think closely and carefully about
who you're bringing in and how you're
building the culture within the team.
Because if I want to buy a business,
that's the first thing I'm looking at.
Not the founder unless the
founder is staying on board and
if founders stay on board, great.
But it's the rest of the team, right?
Who's on this team.
And is that a team that
I want to play with?
And that I want within the
broader context of our team.
So always encourage founders to
spend the time to build out the team.
And download knowledge, figure out how
to get all of that knowledge and the
learnings that they're having and all
of the permutations and adaptations
that the business goes through.
How do we create institutional knowledge?
I think that is part of the IP, right?
That's part of the intangibles of the
company, figuring out how you capture
that, bottle it and ensure that that's
going to continue to to be something
that an acquirer can benefit from.
Is as an important part
of the equation as well.
That's music to my ears.
Jason, I wish all my clients would
come and talk to you about this.
We talk a lot about value capture and
from an IP perspective and how can we
use that to add value to the company.
But the other important
piece of that is how do you.
de risk your business, right?
Not from your perspective, but
from the perspective of a potential
acquirer or a buyer, right?
Cause when you see your
business, you may see all this
opportunity and growth potential.
But when a buyer sees your business,
they're just looking at a bunch of risk
factors and they're seeing how they
can manage those or minimize those.
That's right.
That's right.
And as I had a conversation recently with
a gentleman looking to buy a business.
And it really is.
How do you look at the opportunity, right?
Your business through the lens of
the buyer, because the buyer was
essentially deducting from the
value everything they would have to
invest in the business to make it
deliver on what the expectation is.
And so I think the more that you
can build into the business that the
buyer doesn't have to write when the
buyer says, okay, I see that this
person has layered in all of these.
Pieces that we've talked about.
They've got diversified customer
base, really close, tightening
relationship with the customer.
They built out their IP portfolio and
they brought in someone like yourself to
make sure that that's fully protected and
they're going to be able to leverage that.
They've built a team and the business
isn't reliant upon The the founder, maybe
the founder is looking at what's next.
The team is dealing with what is the
buyer then looks at this and says, okay,
I come in, I'm getting something that's
already creating and delivering value.
And they're thinking about the next step.
Versus how do I just maintain and
manage what's there and a degree
to which a buyer is having to
maintain and manage what's there.
And they're going to have to invest
to get it to the next step as well.
They're going to deduct
on the value, right?
And so you're going to extract less
value if they've got to go in and
put in a lot of these these pieces.
And I talk to business owners
about that all the time.
The destination is where
the destination is.
There's steps that it takes to get there.
Please don't expect to extract, the
top value for your business if you
haven't done the work to get it there.
Whoever does the work is the one that's
going to ultimately extract the the value.
And so hopefully the audience here is
taking away tips that will allow them
and enable them to go ahead and put
these pieces in place hard as it may be.
Again, I don't I don't minimize the
amount of effort when you're putting
in long hours working every day.
To keep things moving.
It's not an easy thing to do, but that's
where the value is created, right?
It's, if it were easy, everybody
would be doing it and and it wouldn't
be as valuable but spend the time to
invest working on your business, to be
thinking strategically about how to,
Move your business to the next level
in addition to the ground game, right?
Which is how do you create value
for your customers and deliver and
extract that value building out the
business is super important if you
want to ultimately be able to exit.
And get full maximum value.
Otherwise the buyer is going to
say, I've got to do the work now.
So I'm going to give you a discount
on what you think it's worth.
Because I'm not going to
pay you for the potential.
I'm going to actually pay you for the work
that you actually put into the business.
And that's a really big distinction
that I have that conversation.
A lot of times it's potential.
The fact that we can both see
the potential the last two
people see potential, right?
It's those few special people that
are able to execute and put the pieces
in place to be able to bring that.
Potential to reality that extract the
most value in any business transaction.
That's a really good point and
a really good one to leave on.
I think, the ground grain that you
talked about is important and I
think it's table stakes for startups.
And.
But it's the mind part of this, right?
The mindset or the thought
process around this.
Cause you, when you're building a product,
you've got to think about your customers
and really put yourselves in their shoes
when you are having these conversations
about acquisitions you really need to
put yourself in the shoes of the buyer.
And then, obviously when you're
building the product, you've
got to, Also put yourself in the
shoes of your employees, right?
That's, I think what makes it hard, right?
It's a, it's a process of taking yourself
out of the equation in some way to build a
great team, build a business that's viable
and valuable to acquirers and a business
that delivers value to the customer.
Cause that's what starts the whole thing.
So I, I think that's a really
good advice to think about.
And I taught, I, I have a seven year
old daughter that I talked to about
this the other day where, you know,
Hey, the process of becoming an adult
is to think more about what other people
want, or other people are thinking
about and less about what you want.
So I think it's tough but
a good advice nonetheless.
Oh, I absolutely, I appreciate that.
I actually had an opportunity
to talk entrepreneurship to a
fourth grade class last week.
And we did talk about mindset, right?
Because there's.
There's the only thing we can
really control is ourselves.
And it's really super important as
you're going through the journey
as a business owner, as a founder,
there's a, to your point, a lot of
pieces that you're juggling is to be
self aware of where are you strong?
Where are you not strong?
Where do you need to put effort
into continuing to develop?
Not only for what.
The business and the stakeholders need
today, but what they're going to need
tomorrow and so recognizing that you
and your development is also a key
critical part of the overall equation.
Lots of ways to do that, which we, we
can talk about another time but also
putting that on the list as investing
in yourself because there are a lot of
people dependent upon you understanding
where everything needs to go.
And so taking care of yourself and
making sure you're investing in yourself.
Okay.
I think is another key takeaway
I'd like to leave with everyone.
It's important for the overall
success of the of the venture that,
that you're at the top of your game.
That's really cool.
I am really glad to have you on
this on this podcast with me.
I think this is some really
interesting, we've covered nuts and
bolts all the way down to mindset but.
Or all the way up to mindset.
So I had a lot of fun talking
about these things with you and
I'm sure the audience did as well.
Jason, if anybody wants to reach
out to you to talk with you further
how can they connect with you?
Absolutely.
So happy to to chat.
I enjoy business in general.
Best place to reach me is via
email Jason at PGP advisory.
com.
Or you can check us out on our
website, which is PGP advisory.
com.
I can also be reached via
telephone 2 1 0 5 8 0 4 1 7 8.
Please feel free to reach out.
Happy to answer any questions
that you may have and wish you
the best of luck in your journeys.
Summer, thank you so much for having
me on really enjoyed the conversation.
And yeah, love being in this
space and sharing tips on how we
can all be successful together.
This is very cool.
I'm really grateful to have you on and
I'd love talking business and strategy.
So this is really fun.
And we talk about this
offline all the time.
So I think it's valuable.
And important to put it out there and
let other people in on the conversation.
So thank you again, Jason,
really appreciate this and
hope to do this again soon.