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Taking the Hire Road is a podcast dedicated to providing tips to help manage the driver recruiting process while addressing the ongoing challenges related to the driver shortage and driver retention. Hosted by Jeremy Reymer, Founder and CEO of DriverReach, this bimonthly podcast shines a light on the challenges that carriers are facing and aims to help companies hire quality drivers with greater efficiency.
[00:00:00] Jeremy Reymer: Hey there listeners. I'm Jeremy Raymer welcoming you back to Taking the Higher Road. For this episode, I'm going back into the archives to pull out one of my favorite conversations, showcasing the industry's greatest challenges. Whether you're hearing this episode for the first time or revisiting it, I hope you were able to take away some insights.
[00:00:16] Jeremy Reymer: Thanks for joining. Let's get into it.
[00:00:18] Jeremy Reymer: Welcome to Taking the High Road, a special show dedicated to the trucking industry, specifically at the confluence of recruiting, retention, and compliance. In the fourth year as the host of the show, I bring over two decades of industry experience, both on the carrier side as well as the vendor side.
[00:00:39] Jeremy Reymer: Each week, I interview industry experts and thought leaders who bring their insight to the driver lifecycle as we discuss the industry's greatest challenges. I always appreciate your feedback, good or bad. Don't forget to leave a rating and a review. I'd also like to thank and highlight the show's valuable sponsors.
[00:00:53] Jeremy Reymer: Their dedication and commitment to the industry and to the show is greatly appreciated. If you're interested in being a [00:01:00] sponsor of the show or joining me for an interview, please email Jeremy at takingthehigheroad. com. This week, I'm thrilled to have back on the show a very dear friend, an amazing and passionate industry leader who was recently recognized as the 2024 influential women in trucking, Tracy Rushing, executive director of safety and recruiting for RE Garrison.
[00:01:21] Jeremy Reymer: Thank you so much for joining me and welcome back, Tracy.
[00:01:24] Tracy Rushing: I'm so glad to talk to you again.
[00:01:26] Jeremy Reymer: Well, since you joined me last year, uh, you've continued to learn, to grow, and, uh, and to be recognized by your peers. I'd love to hear what motivates you to be a great leader and, and also to be a destination employer as you often refer to Ari Garrison.
[00:01:40] Jeremy Reymer: I'd love to, uh, To hear what's being, you know, what being recognized as the 2024 influential woman in trucking means to you. Perhaps we can also talk a little bit about our shared passion for Project 61, the recently launched movement to address the industry's unspoken epidemic. And since you recently attended and spoke at DriverReach's regional user conference in Atlanta, [00:02:00] perhaps you can highlight, uh, your opening presentation.
[00:02:02] Jeremy Reymer: And then lastly, we'll answer a question. During our newest segment of the show, industry health. I think we can get to all that today.
[00:02:09] Tracy Rushing: We can try. We've had a busy year. It sounds like
[00:02:12] Jeremy Reymer: it has been, it has been, but that's okay. That's how we like it in trucking.
[00:02:15] Tracy Rushing: We do. Um, we've had a great year and the last week being that the driver, each conference kind of got me back down to, you know, off the travel road, back with my team, back with my driver, each friends, um, talking about the thing that matters and that is how do we keep our drivers working and how do we keep them rolling and then One of our new passions to talk about is how do we keep them doing that and making healthy decisions.
[00:02:40] Tracy Rushing: So last week was a lot of fun. Um, some great industry partners came together in Atlanta to, um, talk about how we're, how we're using the driver reach tool and, and how that's making a difference and kind of smoothing the road out for the recruiters, which, you know, we laugh and say that our whole industry is, is expected to be kind of the, the invisible [00:03:00] superpower, right?
[00:03:00] Tracy Rushing: That brings us everything that we need and want and leaves it right where we need it and want it. And by the way, do that without any interruption to the, to the rest of what's going on in the world. And, you know, I think we lose sight of a lot of the times what the role of the recruiter is and all of that.
[00:03:14] Tracy Rushing: So it was really good to focus on that work group.
[00:03:18] Jeremy Reymer: Yeah. Yeah. I want to unpack that some, but even before that, you know, uh, when we spoke on the show last year, you provided two amazing soundbites, in my opinion, you know, one, it was that, that reference to that destination employer, which I was like, remember, if you recall, then I was like, wow, I've never heard anyone say it like that.
[00:03:33] Jeremy Reymer: And I get what you're saying. And wow, that's That's powerful. And then two, uh, that there are, there are two types of people there at RE Garrison. And, and I don't want to steal your thunder. So maybe if you could share with the audience, like what, what two types of people are at RE Garrison and why that mindset can set a carrier apart in terms of just being a destination employer.
[00:03:53] Tracy Rushing: So I agree there are, we do say that there are two employees, two types of people who work within our company, whether they're contractors or [00:04:00] W2 employees. To fill a role at RE Garrison, you will either drive the truck or you will support the person who drives the truck. And we've kind of spent some time this year thinking about, you know, how that does set us apart.
[00:04:14] Tracy Rushing: Um, and I'm, I'm really proud to say it's set us less and less apart because I think some other carriers have kind of adopted that mentality of every position outside the cab of the truck has to be focused on supporting what happens in the cab of the truck for, for all of us to be successful. Um, And, and ultimately to make, make all those superhero moves that we need to make to put everything that we need and want where we need and want it type and seamlessly.
[00:04:41] Tracy Rushing: And I think what I've. Been so proud of this year is to see the alignment that was really born of us. Just making that commitment that if I'm an accountant, can I support the role of the driver? If I'm a custodian, can I support the role of the driver? And, and ultimately, yes, those are the jobs that [00:05:00] we, we have chosen.
[00:05:01] Tracy Rushing: Um, some of us may feel like that our hands were forced to some degree, but those are the positions that we feel every day and to know that. That has come alive at Garrison this year, to see, you know, someone who may never have thought that what they do every day, or more importantly, what they don't do every day, how that would impact the cab or the truck, create an irritation, though it may be minor if it happens every day in a row, it's not going to stay minor.
[00:05:31] Tracy Rushing: And so I think that alignment that's been born of that, of Are we talking about the people in the cab? Are we talking about the people outside of the cab? And then how do we keep all of us focused on improving the job and the cab? And, and then the by product is all of our jobs are improved also, because we have a greater sense of purpose.
[00:05:51] Tracy Rushing: We have drivers pushing us to make better decisions about how we do our jobs. And it's really exciting. And, and I think that [00:06:00] commitment to those are the two roles that we offer, right? To the employed. United States of America, we offer two roles, drive a truck, support a person who drives a truck. But because of that, it is a destination employer.
[00:06:13] Tracy Rushing: We are a destination employer because when you can come in with that simplified alignment of, I have to go through change management, or I have to take on this new task, or I have, ultimately it's going to positively impact the cab of the truck or have the cab make a more positive. I'm a more positive outcome that those challenges are going to be eliminated.
[00:06:38] Tracy Rushing: It is a destination employer. It's somewhere we choose to be. Um, and, and knowing that no one's going to get it wrong on purpose. We're going to make intentional decisions about improving the life of those drivers. And that's what I think sets us apart as a destination. And our drivers know that, right?
[00:06:56] Tracy Rushing: Like we may not always make a decision that's going to be [00:07:00] fun. Um, so we try our very best to have fun, um, that it is from, from an us being intentional about. We want you to feel watched after, and we want you to return as good or better than you left. And it's been a really exciting year to see those things come alive.
[00:07:18] Jeremy Reymer: Well, for, you know, you had said earlier that, uh, more and more companies are, you're noticing more companies sort of adopting that mindset, which, while that. That's all good news, right? At the end of the day, that's great for the industry, it's great for the driver, and it's, and it's, and it's what you're all about, and look at it, you're, you're already having the influence that, that, uh, you know, being that influential woman in trucking, you know, affords you.
[00:07:40] Jeremy Reymer: Now, uh, you, we, you talked a little bit about speaking at our, our regional Conference, which thank you for that. Um, as the founder of driver, each, uh, it's an honor to, for you, you know, to be a customer, to be able to work with you. Uh, the, we, you and I both realized technology alone is not going to get the job done.
[00:07:57] Jeremy Reymer: You still have to be a good company with the right people, the right [00:08:00] attitude. And, uh, and in your presentation, you, you talked about like running a best in class department and, and emphasize the importance of. Relationship building and, and how that, how important that is in recruiting as well as, you know, fostering real connections with drivers.
[00:08:15] Jeremy Reymer: Could, could you just share how focusing on those personal connections with drivers can, can directly impact recruiting and retention and, and how technology can play a role in making those relationships more effective.
[00:08:27] Tracy Rushing: Absolutely. So to me, the technology is a tool in our toolbox, right? And, and we, we say, you know, our, the technology partners that we partner with, they're not truckers, right?
[00:08:40] Tracy Rushing: Maybe initially, but we need to teach them about trucking so that they continue to develop those products that make it easier for us to service our drivers. From the recruiting office, that's our welcome mat. That's our very first interaction that you're going to have. But more importantly, I think for us, when we [00:09:00] make technology choices is the technology is what the driver is going to touch first.
[00:09:05] Tracy Rushing: And so we want to be sure that it lends itself to helping us build those positive relationships, um, for gathering as much information as we can to build healthy conversations. Out of before we ever pick up the phone or before we ever start to type that first email is that, um, we've gotten good information, reliable.
[00:09:26] Tracy Rushing: It's easy to access. We can reference it quickly and then we can share it internally, which is more important because who's going to remember, I mean, you know, we all measure length of call, some things are never going to go away in my mind from a recruiting desk, but you know, they spend a lot of time on the phone and they spend a lot of time in written communication.
[00:09:47] Tracy Rushing: And having a tool that helps you remember the human is. Invaluable to us, and then two, what if you're not here tomorrow? What if Jeremy recruited driver and [00:10:00] you're not here tomorrow? Does the technology help me pick up where Ari Garrison left off? Are we one of many? Are we, and we kind of adopted that for women in trucking this year, but I think that's so genius is, are we one of many, is whoever you get on the telephone with us or whoever responds to that written communication going to be able to follow that conversation, that's where the technology really helps us.
[00:10:23] Tracy Rushing: As a department to say, you can balance your work and your life because we have some things in place to make sure that there's minimal impact or minimal interruption to what you've already started to build. And for us building that relationship, knowing that we can set an expectation and satisfy you in that.
[00:10:47] Tracy Rushing: And two, can we ask you? You know, these are some things that are going to make you be successful at RE Garrison and if you can't do these things, or if they're outside of your personal alignment, we're not going to be able to [00:11:00] satisfy you, driver. And so, being able to make those decisions in full confidence early on of, We want you to be successful, but not everyone will be successful here, um, is, is very important.
[00:11:12] Tracy Rushing: And I think, I think our recruiters kind of develop that, so it's been one of the largest struggles I've watched a group of recruiters have to go through, but I think that's what the new generation of driver, um, they, they need. Is for you to say you have choices. We're 70 percent contracted fleet. We're growing that contracted fleet more and more is we are, we are a choice.
[00:11:36] Tracy Rushing: We are a trucking choice though. We believe we are the best trucking decision you will ever make. The truth is, is that you have a choice and we want to be the choice that you choose if we can align. And so I think that's what our recruiters have them. been really proud of this year is that they've been able to come, come together and train on one platform.
[00:11:58] Tracy Rushing: That's been a, [00:12:00] been a big difference for us too is that, um, kind of our internal restructuring because we have a tool that allows them to train. Inside of one platform, that's new for us, newer for us, and that they're not having to learn four or five platforms to get a driver from first contact, the seated truck, it's one platform.
[00:12:23] Tracy Rushing: And so they, they have a lot more time on their hands because they aren't, they aren't manipulating technologies and, and dragging information manually back and forth.
[00:12:32] Jeremy Reymer: Well, kind of one of the things that you talked about, uh, and I think you talk about all the time is when you are leveraging technology, um, it enables you to be more human, to engage more, have more one on one and the, and the technology is not replacing the human, it's just replacing some of the functions that the human is spending time doing and enabling them now to spend more time one on one time with drivers kind of To your [00:13:00] point, which I think you, you said that, uh, very, very well in, in Atlanta and I think was the star of the show, uh, at least, at least, you know, from all the feedback that I've heard so far.
[00:13:12] Jeremy Reymer: So really appreciate that. And, uh, and grateful for that insight.
[00:13:17] Tracy Rushing: Thank you. It was a lot of fun.
[00:13:20] Jeremy Reymer: Now, I know, um, what I really want to talk about is, is, you know, you and the recognition that you recently earned, you know, first of all, how does it feel to be recognized by your peers as the 2024 influential woman in trucking?
[00:13:36] Tracy Rushing: It's surreal. Um, you know, that you hear people answer that question and it's so eloquent and then I say it, it's like, you know, a mouthful of bubblegum balls. It's just, you know, Ellen and I, Ellen Voy and I talked about this and I said, you know, really thinking about it for me, it makes me so proud to look at some of my [00:14:00] industry friends that have been in these seats as long as I have to say.
[00:14:05] Tracy Rushing: You know, those really tough uphill battles that we fought, good job. To, you know, we've done it well. Um, and none of us have done it alone. And I, and I surely wouldn't want that to be their perception is that, you know, I'm towing a rope by myself, but to know that the 29 year ago version of me, the, the world was, is wide open now to, to have thought 29 years ago that.
[00:14:36] Tracy Rushing: There would be females at every level of the organization, not only filling those roles, but thriving there. Our CFO is a female in our industry. Our compliance manager is a female in our industry. So blessed to be a part of RE Garrison where our maintenance director, our executive director of maintenance is Karen Hubbard, and [00:15:00] she manages so differently, and there are so many Other opportunities for that work group because she can, has been able to grow into that position and it just makes me really proud.
[00:15:17] Tracy Rushing: Um, it makes me really proud to, um, represent women in trucking. That's an organization that I've been proud of for a long time and, you know, to be recognized by that industry as an, as an anybody. Makes you feel like a somebody and they do a really good job of empowering us to feel those roles and, and to know that we, we are our biggest challenge.
[00:15:40] Tracy Rushing: Like Tracy is Tracy's big, biggest challenge and that the industry has, has worked very hard to create places for me to be successful. Um, so it, it means to me that. That we've, we've done a lot of work and it's been good work. So that that's what it means looking back.
[00:15:59] Jeremy Reymer: Well, since [00:16:00] you were, uh, since it was announced and recognized at, uh, women in truckings accelerate conference in Dallas, you have been extremely popular on interviewed nonstop articles about you on the radio and so on.
[00:16:12] Jeremy Reymer: What, what does this recognition change for you, uh, if anything? Going forward,
[00:16:19] Tracy Rushing: I'm a very little, um, because there is work still to be done and, um, It's been a lot of fun to make new connections in new ways. I had no idea that I loved the radio shows so much, but I've caught myself listening to the radio shows more and, and hearing it, hearing it from, hearing about our industry from other sources that.
[00:16:45] Tracy Rushing: Weren't things that I did every day. I've had drivers who I've heard their conversation say, Hey man, do you hear that on this radio or that radio? And maybe I will say, I heard that radio show and had those new connections. It's, it has, it has been a busy two [00:17:00] weeks, um, but it's been very exciting and, and a good spend of time.
[00:17:04] Tracy Rushing: It's brought our team so much closer together because. You know, I don't, I don't work alone. I work with a really great team of people who, our, our chief concern every day is how successful one another can be, and that's a beautiful place to get to live and work when your work family, your trucking family is as excited about success as you are and me, their success as well.
[00:17:32] Tracy Rushing: So it's, it's been a good two weeks. We've had a lot of fun.
[00:17:35] Jeremy Reymer: Well, I love, I love your humility. I know that it's not going to change much, except you are, you're more empowered. People are looking at you more, and that's great because you have an opportunity to, to be even a greater influence than you have been all year long.
[00:17:47] Jeremy Reymer: And, and for that, I'm really excited. I know if we can. Let's talk about Project 61 because as you probably, uh, recall earlier this year, I told you that, you know, my heart was being pulled towards [00:18:00] addressing this, you know, the trucking industry's, you know, this greatest epidemic, in my opinion, uh, and the fact that the average life expectancy of a CDL driver is just 61 years old.
[00:18:09] Jeremy Reymer: And your response to that conversation was a big motivator for me to get started. Why, why is Project 61 such an important movement to you?
[00:18:19] Tracy Rushing: There's no one thing, but at the, at the root of it is. It's not just a job that I have to do. This is truly my mission field to, to see, you know, the majority of the people that have poured into my life for 30 years and my family's life and my boy's life, to not have a life expectancy of over 61.
[00:18:46] Tracy Rushing: And we live in the United States of America, and we have a population of people that. We could not survive without the thing that they do, not that we have not done a [00:19:00] better job of saying, we need to help you create opportunities to lengthen your life. Um, it's still, I take it so personal that one, that it was a statistic that I had not.
[00:19:13] Tracy Rushing: I've been exposed to, but then to, to know the thing to do and not to do it. That there's that's outside the realm of possibility for me because one, and we were laughing about it. We had Thanksgiving with my family this weekend and I was looking around the table. And I thought, how many of us would not be here if we didn't live to 61?
[00:19:37] Tracy Rushing: Who would fill these seats? People who probably have no tolerance for us, right? Like we're a big dominoes playing family and like to have to reacclimate yourself to a, to a whole social circle because your people won't be here after 61, like it's not okay. And there are, there are things that we can do.
[00:19:56] Tracy Rushing: Um, and so I'm, I'm so excited. [00:20:00] About what happens next and, you know, I had the opportunity for you to share a message with me that came after the radio show this weekend where a driver messaged in and said, I heard about this on the radio and I need to make a better choice. And I thought, if I don't do another thing like that was enough, I was so excited about that.
[00:20:20] Tracy Rushing: Um, because it, it like. They are busy. Their hands are busy. Their minds are busy. Their bodies are busy delivering America. They are moving our country. And we have time to be a remedy. And we should be a remedy, even if it's an educational resource or just bringing awareness to the fact that you can do nothing.
[00:20:45] Tracy Rushing: You could do nothing and here's what's coming, or you could do a thing or two things and collectively we will do many things to, to know that our industry has just come [00:21:00] alive behind knowing that this is a statistic and that we are not okay if our driving population does not live past 61 years old. Um, you know, I thought it was kind of, um, I thought it was a poor response the first time I heard it in reference to revenue.
[00:21:19] Tracy Rushing: And in reference to the industry and its economic impact, but looking at it from the outside, if that's all you have, but like, if you're not a, if you're not a heartstrings type person, like me or you, if that's the only, only driving force, we make a huge investment. Our drivers are our largest investment.
[00:21:41] Tracy Rushing: Could you imagine buying a new truck and trailer and not doing a preventative maintenance on it in some kind of a routine? No, no one in our industry would be fine with that.
[00:21:53] Jeremy Reymer: No, I think the parallel is spot on and you know, it's one of those statistics that when you do talk to people [00:22:00] about it, they'll generally say if they hadn't heard it, they might say, yeah, I, that makes sense, but sadly.
[00:22:08] Jeremy Reymer: I feel like we all just, it's, it's uncomfortable. So you just look away and, and we can't do that. And it's too big of a deal. It is the most valuable workforce in America, in my opinion. And so it's something that it means a lot. And there's a ton of work to do by the way, you know, obviously. You know, the goal of Project 61 is about raising awareness, about educating all stakeholders, especially drivers, and then providing them with resources to enable them to make the necessary changes so they can alter that life expectancy trajectory.
[00:22:37] Jeremy Reymer: But I don't want to put you on the spot, but I do, I'm just curious in your mind, like, what do you think maybe is some of the lowest hanging fruit? Uh, I like that it's fruit, right? That's good for you. Uh, in order to help move the needle when it comes to improving. Driver life expectancy. Any, any, any thoughts on maybe some of the easiest things that we can do, or one thing?
[00:22:57] Tracy Rushing: One thing that we're going to be pushing [00:23:00] at Garrison, and I'm excited that our driver engagement team has had so much buy in, is to move. Right, like, are you motivated outside of reasonable expectations? Can you move more? And to, to know that when a driver is at a dock, right, like when they're delivering freight, they are safely parked.
[00:23:22] Tracy Rushing: And so they can get out and move, um, and, and saying like, that's your best choice. To get out of the tractor and move around, um, I, I started, I heard a conversation Friday before I left town for the weekend and they were saying, how many times do you have to lie around one of our trucks and trailers to go a mile?
[00:23:42] Tracy Rushing: And one of the drivers answered immediately and was like, and I do that. And I'm like, you know, the conversation clearly went to, well, you know, how did you. How do you get yourself to do that? And he was like, immediately turned his phone around and he was like, this is my dog. And my dog's been on the truck with me for, [00:24:00] I don't know, five or six years.
[00:24:01] Tracy Rushing: I just heard it passing. And he was like, and, and there's no one to take care of him. So I'm going to get out, move. And he was like, and he goes with me. And then, you know, it's a, and he told the whole story and I thought, you know, everybody has a why. And, and I think that just get out of the truck and move, try to recover from sitting for so long, um, I think we'll be.
[00:24:22] Tracy Rushing: What Garrison attaches to so quickly because one, it costs the driver nothing and we're, you know, all things aside, there's work to be done in many areas of our industry. Um, and there are people passionate about all those things, but when we talk about truck parking and we know that that's already impacting the net pay of our drivers.
[00:24:42] Tracy Rushing: For us to say, we want you to do this to be better and we, and it's going to cost you like we can say, you can get out and move and it's, and it's not going to cost you anything. Um, So we will start there. Um, it makes the most sense for us, and because at all of our terminals, We know [00:25:00] that our drivers have access to dog parks and healthy food choices while they're there.
[00:25:06] Tracy Rushing: And so getting out and moving makes sense, but we'll start there.
[00:25:10] Jeremy Reymer: Yeah, I love that. And it's an excellent point because almost everyone can do it. Uh, and, and it's, and it's free. And in fact, you feel a lot better when you do it, you know? So, uh, this is probably, that's probably a good segue into this, uh, the show's latest feature segment called industry health, where I ask a guest a question tied to You guessed it, health.
[00:25:32] Jeremy Reymer: Um, and the question is, and this is spot on kind of what you were just talking about, but how do you get drivers to embrace health and wellness programs in order to improve their lives? That's the why part, right? How do you connect those dots? What are you, what are your thoughts there?
[00:25:48] Tracy Rushing: So I think one of the things you'll see that at Garrison this year is what's your why.
[00:25:53] Tracy Rushing: We did that kind of initiative several years ago around seatbelts. And who's your why, what's your why [00:26:00] around seatbelts, but driving them here. That's the MO of Garrison is we are a community and we've adopted that as a core. It's one of our five core values. And so our leadership has intentionally said, you know, we expect you to value your community, whether it's a driving community, your family community, your personal community, um, to say, determine your why.
[00:26:22] Tracy Rushing: And maybe. You're not in a great headspace and your why is harder to determine. Can we help you with that? Can we, you know, can your operational safety support person, your driver support person, you know, we, we're very fortunate to be for, be partnered with Corporate Chaplains of America who are on, at all of our work locations and say, you know, let's determine your why.
[00:26:44] Tracy Rushing: Because then the what makes sense. If your why is predetermined, then the, then the what is whatever it takes. Right. So, um, I think that we will be driving towards, um, what's your why. Who's your why, and, and [00:27:00] then we will help you with the what's right. Like we project61. org has, it's going to have many, many, many resources and things that, you know, we're not going to think about, I mean, from a safety perspective, um, that, that I wouldn't think about, but we have so many friends and industry friends who will help us, um, point our drivers in the right direction.
[00:27:20] Tracy Rushing: And to have a, have a healthier mindset. If, if you've got your why. At the front, then you are less and it makes a difference for all the decisions that you have to make every day. You want to make safer decisions, more economical decisions, better health choices. So I think determining our why is going to be at the front of everyone's mind this year.
[00:27:41] Jeremy Reymer: Yeah, I think that's an excellent way to start. Well, certainly the end this year and start the new year is what really matters to you and then be more intentional about, you know, addressing that. And I always, I'm always remembering conversations always in the safety circle about drivers will say, here's why I'm operating safely, why I'm [00:28:00] patient in the truck amidst all these, you know, four wheelers that are driving me insane and, you know, why I'm really focused on being safe and it's a picture of their granddaughter.
[00:28:12] Jeremy Reymer: In the dash. I mean, if that's that driver's why, and all of us are going to have something maybe a little bit different, could be, it could be a grandchild, could be a child, could be spouse, could be a dog, right? Whatever it is. What is it that says, Hey, this is worth living for. Take care of yourself. We want you here.
[00:28:30] Jeremy Reymer: Stay with us. So that's a, it's a powerful message. And, uh, and I appreciate your input on that. Uh, Tracy, time always flies. It goes by so fast. I really appreciate you joining me. I'm, uh, I'm honored to be your friend and so greatly appreciate your passion for making this industry a better place.
[00:28:48] Tracy Rushing: Thank you, Jeremy.
[00:28:49] Tracy Rushing: It was fine.
[00:28:51] Jeremy Reymer: And thank you for taking the higher road with me once again, special thanks to the sponsors of this show. We really appreciate you. If you're interested in being a sponsor or joining me for [00:29:00] an interview, please email Jeremy at taking the higher road. com until next time, thank you for taking the higher road.