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Diagnosed with Complex Trauma and a Dissociative Disorder, Emma and her system share what they learn along the way about complex trauma, dissociation (CPTSD, OSDD, DID, Dissociative Identity Disorder (Multiple Personality), etc.), and mental health. Educational, supportive, inclusive, and inspiring, System Speak documents her healing journey through the best and worst of life in recovery through insights, conversations, and collaborations.
Over:
Speaker 2:Welcome to the System Speak Podcast, a podcast about Dissociative Identity Disorder. If you are new to the podcast, we recommend starting at the beginning episodes and listen in order to hear our story and what we have learned through this endeavor. Current episodes may be more applicable to long time listeners and are likely to contain more advanced topics, emotional or other triggering content, and or reference earlier episodes that provide more context to what we are currently learning and experiencing. As always, please care for yourself during and after listening to the podcast. Thank you.
Speaker 1:Okay, guys. I have to tell you this story because it is so, so classic. There are lots of us that on any given day function really well. There are lots of us on any given day who over function. Right?
Speaker 1:We're famous for that. There are also the days where functioning at all feels impossibly hard. And if I can just suggest within the context of any privilege of even me living in The States, there is such thing left. The most dysfunctional that we look is at the DMV when we have to go get a driver's license. So since we moved, I had to go get a driver's license.
Speaker 1:The Department of Motor Vehicles. Y'all, I can't even. My last epic journey of this was when my name changed, which was a big deal last year. But now since we moved, I had to go get the new license here. And for it to be a day when I have enough time off work and I am functioning well enough to get myself out of the house, and I am functioning well enough to gather all the required documents, and I have money enough at the same time to pay for the license and can get an appointment to get into the DMV and all of that happening at the same time, it is like waiting for the stars to align.
Speaker 1:I can't tell you what a big deal it is. On top of this, my children, the triplets specifically, have been working for the last year, two years on learning how to drive. Now y'all, that is scary for the most of no matter how excited anyone is to learn how to drive, that is an epic, epic thing. And for me, because of trauma and deprivation, I did not get to learn in the normal kind of way or on time. So I have that context to even pass on to my kids of, like, we're not worried about a timeline.
Speaker 1:We are worried about safety and learning and having good people to help teach you. I can teach you some things. You will learn other things from other people, but it is a big deal. The triplets specifically, who were four when we started the podcast, by the way, are now not only old enough to be getting their license, but it's been about a year of working really hard, not just at being able to be ready to drive, but also being able to pass the written test and things like that. Because we have two parts.
Speaker 1:We have the written test, and we have the driving test. And the triplets are all on IEPs. We're working really hard, and it's been two years of studying for this test. It is such a big deal for them to reach this milestone and to have themselves ready. In addition to this, they do not have driver's ed at school like they did when I was in high school.
Speaker 1:I took driver's ed in high school long before I ever actually got any opportunity to learn how to drive or practice driving or have any access to a caregiver long enough for someone to help me learn how to drive. It was just one of those things that fell through the cracks. So I've worked really hard to make sure that the triplets have access to a plan that we can work towards, and that they have enough support and enough practice to be able to reach this milestone. I cannot tell you what a big deal it is. Some of the places that they lived, you can start learning at 14 or even 12 because of rural areas and tractors and things like that.
Speaker 1:Other places you have to wait until you're 16. There's a whole range of different rules depending on where you live. And we have taken advantage of being able to be in different spaces and to have extra time to practice. It has been a lot, but the time is here for our oldest to actually go get the official driver's permit, including passing the first test. So, to go to the DMV, not only for myself, but also for a child who then has paperwork showing an adoption.
Speaker 1:All of this is a lot, and it's an example of some of the pragmatic ways that trauma and deprivation show up impacting those developmental milestones that are not about being little bitty children. Those are absolutely valid, but I also just want to give a shout out to middles and teens inside, outside, who have different experiences that also impact and delay their care in ways that we don't always talk about. So while it's happening in real time, I just want to acknowledge it and include that as part of the experience while also showing how it can be different even when circumstances are difficult. All of this is super activating to me, even though it's just about driving. Maybe the last decade of the podcast with all the side jokes about my driving, this really is part of it.
Speaker 1:And maybe there's some shame there. So maybe I'm needing to address it just for myself more than it being anything interesting for you to listen to. But it's really a source of deprivation and part of why it's such a big deal because it's literally a developmental milestone that I had no one around to teach me. So I want to make sure my children have really good support and also their process of learning how to drive is super activating to me, not just because I'm anxious about them being safe and out on the road. There's that, of course, that's very natural for most parents, those of us who are caring about our children.
Speaker 1:And also, there's the layer of my mother was literally killed in a car accident. So of course, there are those layers, but there's also my own trauma and deprivation around circumstances in which I learned to drive, which there are more to that story that I'm not talking about today, but I am talking about in therapy. So even before we get to the DMV, there are these three layers of trauma and deprivation that I'm already having to tend to internally just to get us in the building. On top of that, it's just the matter of functioning, of having all the right paperwork and all the right places and making sure that we get there with everything we need on the same day and at the right time, which is not my skill set either. I have so many things to offer the world.
Speaker 1:There are so many things I am great at, being on time or driving. Not top of the list. Okay? So I take my oldest child and myself to the DMV with my giant stack of all the paperwork, and I am working through all the background noise in therapy so that we can get through the process at getting their license and my license. My child is officially in the driver's ed that now apparently is just community based, at least here and this last several places we have lived and where Nathan and the kids lived.
Speaker 1:Instead of it actually being at school or one of the classes, it's either through school people, but after school, like after hours, or it's community based where you have to go through someone else, or it's a private place in the community. It's all about the same price, and I've worked hard to be able to do that. The triplets have to go one at a time, which is actually appropriate because of ages, because they're not actually triplets, right? They don't actually have the same parents biologically. So they're about two months apart, each of them.
Speaker 1:So we're just going in order. And this is the first one who gets to go, and we are walking in together. A two year journey, my own trauma since I was that age, the loss of my mother, my mother having died in the accident, and trying to function while still recovering from the overwhelm of the chaos of the move. It's a lot, y'all. But here's the thing.
Speaker 1:We live in the cutest small town ever, and they have their own DMV. And for weeks and weeks, I was tracking, trying to get an appointment, trying to get an appointment, trying to get an appointment, and I could not. And finally, someone at the driver's ed school just told me, just go. You don't have to have an appointment. Just go.
Speaker 1:And I was like, no. Because I'm a rule follower, and online it says you need to have an appointment. They're like, no. They don't really do appointments. So I just went, and it was true.
Speaker 1:You just take a number old school. There was no appointments to be making. I don't even know what that was about or how anyone could get an appointment or if they were really just going that fast, but you could also get in line. I don't know. So we just took a number, and we waited.
Speaker 1:While we're waiting, I am having the debate internally of whether we should let our child go first. And I'm saying child, but they're almost an adult now. Right? Like, they are turning 17 this summer. And and so, like, part of us are like, we need to make sure that their needs are met.
Speaker 1:That is what is most important. But also, I'm part of this is like, we should go first to model how it's done and show them that it's okay and not a big deal, And back and forth and back and forth and back and forth. Could not decide what to say when we get up there, and I'm sure this is just where our anxiety is, like, looping. Right? And so we go up.
Speaker 1:So when our number is finally called, the two of us go up with our stack of papers, and both of us are very nervous. The lady sitting at the counter where we get called is not happy about her job. Now, these people go to work every day and have to deal with people like us, right? And how there's not many people who are just like, I cannot wait to go to the DMV today. So they are dealing with all of these big feelings, the requirements that have to be so specific because this is about identity, so that makes sense, and they're just doing their jobs, But it is not a job where they get appreciated all the time.
Speaker 1:I am sure. And, also, this person was done. They were done for the day. They were done for the week. They were done for the year.
Speaker 1:They are done with their career. Like, they are so over it, and that was the immediate vibe we got. And I was like, this is not gonna go well. Me walking into that vibe does not end well. And so the first thing that she says is, why are there two of you?
Speaker 1:And I'm thinking, wait. Are you talking about me? I was already so confused. And she's like, no. No.
Speaker 1:No. Why are there two of you? And pointed to me and to my child. And I was like, oh, I we just moved here. We're new.
Speaker 1:I'm so sorry. We're learning how to do it. We tried to follow the directions. We have all the papers, I think. And could you please?
Speaker 1:And so I need to get my license, and this one is ready for their permit. And we have all the documentation from the driver's ed school as well, which is here how you get your permit. You have to go through the school. So the driver's ed school, which is not at the school or part of the school, it is a different school only for driving. It's a whole thing, right?
Speaker 1:So I have untangled this. Here I am, the both of us, And the woman at the counter is like, if you have two people, you need two numbers. And I was like, oh my goodness. And so my child started to leave to go get another number. The lady was like, no.
Speaker 1:You stay. She goes. And she sent me away to go get the other number. So I had to walk all the way back through the people to go get another number and then walk through, and she's like, you can't come back if you just you have to wait your turn. I was like, I am happy to wait my turn, and, also, you have called my child's number, and I am here to help my child.
Speaker 1:And she said, before I even did anything else, she's like, if your child is old enough to drive, your child is old enough to do this by themselves. I was like, well, okay. So I just stepped back and let my child do it, which was great. Right? It's good practice, except also my child is deaf and could not understand the lady who did not wanna look at us and did not want to slow down everything she was saying she was saying so fast.
Speaker 1:So she would say something that was a question, but it was like a series. Could it be this or this or this? But she was saying it so fast, we couldn't tell what the choices were. And so we're trying to interpret for each other. We're trying to untangle.
Speaker 1:She's not gonna write things down. She's not gonna slow down, and she's getting mad at us for not understanding. Y'all, it gets so bad that at one point at the end when we're when you get your, what is called an endorsement, which is like an extra thing that gets added to your license. And for us, it's an ear with a slash through it, which is super aggressive by the way. It means our ears don't work.
Speaker 1:It means we're deaf, and so to get this little extra endorsement that on our license that says we are deaf. They were also trying to add to my child's license the endorsement of a developmental delay of a developmental delay. Now we can talk about that. There's IEPs, and yes, there's a little bit of that. And also it does not impact driving and is not related to driving.
Speaker 1:My child does need the endorsement for deafness. My child does not need the endorsement for developmental delay. Just because the lady won't slow down what she's saying, it was brutal. It was a whole thing. And also trying to educate my child about when is it okay to advocate for your rights and when do you have to jump through the hoops of a system?
Speaker 1:And the nuances and complexities of that, of like, you're right, you're 100% right. How she was talking to disrespectful. You're right that how she was treating us was not appropriate. You're right. You're right.
Speaker 1:You're right. And also, you have to get your permit and we have to turn in the papers for the permit and. We could, like, walk away and try again another day with someone else. That's a choice that's valid. And also, if you want to get the number of drives you're required to finish before you go to Oklahoma, then we have to do this today.
Speaker 1:We cannot leave. That is not a choice that you have if you are choosing to get your drives in with driver's ed before you leave for the summer. And they can do that on Zoom whether they're with me or whether they're in Oklahoma. But part of the class, obviously, is, like, driving in person together with the instructors. Right?
Speaker 1:And they cannot do that without the driving permit. And so to finish the class, the instructors have been very kind to move my child up in the driving hours portion so that they can finish the class on Zoom, but get their driving hours in before and after the trip to Oklahoma. So it's been a whole thing that we have had to navigate, and they have been very kind about it. But to make that plan work, they have to get their permit today. And so we have to just jump these hoops if that is what you are wanting.
Speaker 1:So when to intentionally fawn, when to comply for safety, like please, when we are at the DMV and the sheriff deputy is walking back and forth behind the counters, this is not the time to escalate things with the lady behind the counter who already hates her job. We just have to do our best, and it was a struggle. Things did not get better when all of us got activated by my child's paperwork. I knew all of the reasons that this appointment would be hard for me and I would be processing my stuff. I did not expect adoption trauma.
Speaker 1:Y'all adoption, adoption is always a trauma. Adoption means trauma has happened. We have to be really careful that we are not colonializing kids or adult adoptees where we think, oh, this is better for them. I love my kids. They will forever be my kids.
Speaker 1:And also I am their second family. Some of them, their fourth or fifth or sixth family. They will always, always have their first families. And it's so important that we maintain that in all of the healthy ways we can, which gets tricksy, especially as they have entered teen years about how much they're going to negotiate that, how much they want that, how much they don't, and it fluctuates. Our job is to support the children and focus on that, right?
Speaker 1:But all of this gets activated. But adoption never happens without loss. So even when adoption is, Okay, this is great. I'm glad you are in a safe family because kids need to be safe, that does not undo the trauma and grief and separation and all the things that happened before they ever even came to us, or in an ongoing systemic way, when some of their families are doing really great now, and also we can't just send them back, Right? We're not allowed to do that.
Speaker 1:We cannot do that. There's the whole attachment of what is best for them, even aside from legalities. Adoption is always trauma. I just want to be clear that I understand that both in respecting the experiences of my children and in my own lived experience. So I love my kids.
Speaker 1:I have been honored to raise them. I am honored to know their first families, and also paperwork is a nightmare. So this lady behind the counter was super confused because my child had adoption paperwork and a new birth certificate that showed my name because that's what they do. At least in the state where we adopted the children, after adoption, they issue a new birth certificate with the adoptive parents on the birth certificate. You all this is wild to me that this is a thing that happens.
Speaker 1:It feels like erasure to me. I did not birth these children. I don't know why it's required because every single, like, formal kind of identity, like when we got their passports even. Right? That requires all of the paperwork, including the adoption papers.
Speaker 1:So there's no point in the paperwork of these children that it is not clear they are adopted. So I don't understand the reason for issuing a birth certificate that says I birthed them when I did not. I love my children, but I did not birth them. Like, there's no part of the narrative. Like, there's no part of the narrative about these children being unwanted.
Speaker 1:Their first families want them. I love them too. There are so many people. There are so many people that love these kids. That is good and wonderful.
Speaker 1:There is nothing outside of colonialism that re there is nothing outside of colonialism that requires a new birth certificate to be issued. I don't understand that. Even when I take them to other countries for visits, even if we were not in political crisis, even when I take them, their passports are sufficient. I do always carry their adoption paperwork. In case I do always carry the letter from Nathan, just in case they have never been asked of me.
Speaker 1:The passport has always been sufficient. So this whole thing about why they reissue a new birth certificate, it makes no sense, and I find super offensive. The lady behind the counter was utterly confused by it. And I don't blame her. I don't blame her.
Speaker 1:But she had to get a supervisor who had to get a supervisor who had to talk to the sheriff's deputy, and it was a whole thing. But we navigated it. We got through it. And my child also passed the eye test, which was huge, not because she has glasses or something, but because she has had eye surgeries. This is not something we talked about on the podcast, it's one of the things going on in the background.
Speaker 1:This particular child, because of their trauma and the way it impacted them physically, they have had eye surgeries and will need more eye surgeries. And we are hoping that they get to keep their eyesight, but we don't know. It's been a whole thing. So the two of us have a lot of lived experience together between our ears and our cochlear implants and our eyes, all for different reasons. And also the DMV is one of those places where it's like, okay, how much am I going to be able to function in real life?
Speaker 1:So right now they can see well enough to be driving and also there's a lot of anxiety about it. So for them to get through the eye test at the DMV was a big deal. For them to get their photo taken was a big deal. I don't know if you know about this, but this is another example of foster care, trauma, adoption trauma, is that foster kids aren't allowed to have their pictures taken. So they can't be in yearbooks.
Speaker 1:They can't be on school websites. They can't be like, there's all these rules about taking pictures of foster kids. And so even this moment to be like, okay, you're adult enough. We're going to take your picture in public. A big, big deal.
Speaker 1:Their first experience with this was when we got their passports before. And so, I mean, they've done it twice, right? Because I took them to Africa and then also the passports we got last year. And so this is really like the third formal time of getting their picture taken in this way. They did great.
Speaker 1:They passed all the things. We got the piece of paper, and they went and sat down. And then we had to go sit down to wait our turn again. It's always super fun to be with one of the kids one on one because it's such a completely different dynamic. Every week, we do one on one dates and take turns rotating who gets the one on one date, and I love it so much.
Speaker 1:So extra time with just one of them is so sweet and tender, and it was a lovely little visit we had together again. And then when my name got called and then when my number got called, we had to go back to the same lady again. So I said, why don't you just stay here? And you can play on your phone. I could see them.
Speaker 1:They were in line of sight. They're fine. And I which is a big deal for me, right, to not be overly protective, a small, sweet town, safe people. There was not a busy waiting room by this time, and they're almost 17. So, literally, they are okay to be away from me for five seconds while I'm up at the counter, and I can see them.
Speaker 1:Right? Like, settling those little ones inside who worry about them and wanna keep them safe. So I go up to the counter. I go through the whole ordeal, and then at the very end, there's, like, one paper I'm missing. Like, I actually have the paper, but you have to have two of those papers, like, about proof of address.
Speaker 1:I had brought the one that it said online, but you have to have two kinds of it. And so there was nothing we could do at that point. So we left. They came home and showed off their permit. We're all super proud.
Speaker 1:Everybody was excited. The kids were wild, and so they were playing. And so I was like, okay, I'm gonna get this other paper. And I had to go back again to the DMV with the correct papers. I got someone else who actually was very kind.
Speaker 1:They knew some sign language and I had all the correct papers. So I was also making their job easier. Like if I don't have my correct papers, that is on me. That is not the fault of the people behind the counter. Right?
Speaker 1:So it was such a smoother transaction, though, but it was such a smoother interaction because we could communicate with each other. And it was such a metaphor for me of like, no matter how much you want to be with someone or to have a certain friend or to have a certain ship or to make a voyage or to like make something work, sometimes you just can't. Like, they have to be able to communicate with you and you have to have all the right paperwork. Those are the rules of a successful ship at the DMV. Right?
Speaker 1:But it was such a it was such a fascinating experience where we were there for almost two hours struggling with one. And then in the different scenario, it I was in and out in, like, ten minutes. It was amazing. So to go from you're not listening to me or being kind to me or treating me respectfully or communicating in a way I can understand or receive, and I don't have what you need, And the dramas and intrigue and epicness of all of that in this simple scenario of just getting a license compared to, oh, you are speaking my language, and this is accessible and I have what you need, so I'm fulfilling the requirements and I'm able to perform what you need. And so I'm able to give you what you want from me.
Speaker 1:And it all worked out very smoothly and quickly. I was like, This is an example of that baseline, which is why I'm sharing the whole story, because it's this example of the baseline where when we are safe enough and accommodated enough and have our needs met and are responsible for ourselves, then all of the people and all the ships showing up in healthy ways for themselves and each other, it is smooth sailing. How easy is that? So, like, healthy, secure attachment people are walking around with this all the time where that is their experience of life. Whereas those of us with trauma and deprivation, where the baseline is we are not treated well and we don't have what we need to do the things, Life is a struggle.
Speaker 1:Life is a struggle and takes longer and doesn't go as smoothly. Like, life is just hard. And it was such an example of how we are just facing all of this all of the time, which is different than I'm failing life or why can't I get it right? Or why doesn't this work out the way I want it to when it's what I want so bad? It doesn't matter how badly you want your driver's license.
Speaker 1:You have to be able to pass all the tests, jump through all the hoops, and have all the right documents to be able to get it. And it doesn't matter how much you know or can control things or talk at people. If you don't speak in a way they can understand or is meaningful to them, if you don't treat them in ways that are good and kind, if you don't treat them like they matter, or give them the information that they need. I don't know. It was just an intense afternoon and gave me such perspective in a super normal way just about life.
Speaker 1:So I know a DMV story isn't the most exciting, but it was really meaningful to me in those ways, and that's why I really wanted to share it. Also, I just wanted to encourage anyone out there who themselves does not have their license. You can do this. You've got this one document at a time, one step at a time. It's possible.
Speaker 1:It was also not lost on me as protests are starting around the country again a little more of how difficult it is to have proper identification. When for me, who was born here and my children who were born and adopted here, when it's that hard for us just to get proper documentation, and it makes sense. Other people struggle too, regardless of what their paperwork is. I just wanted to normalize that even aside from the other context, even aside from all the other issues. I guess maybe just in a way of confronting tropes about people being lazy or not following through.
Speaker 1:I've lived here for almost six months, and it took me that long to get it done for myself. And I already had one from where I lived before. My child has been trying for two years to get theirs. Even had one in the state before, but that didn't work here. And so it's just hard.
Speaker 1:And I think we forget that sometimes. So as part of having compassion for ourselves and others, I just wanted to share about our story. Thanks. And how trauma and deprivation made a hard thing harder, just for context, even if it wasn't dissociation specific. Because I think sometimes when politics get rough, we dissociate from compassion, and that's not who we want to be.
Speaker 2:Thank you so much for listening to us and for all of your support for the podcast, our books, and them being donated to survivors and the community. It means so much to us as we try to create something that's never been done before, not like this. Connection brings healing. One of the ways we practice this is in community together. The link for the community is in the show notes.
Speaker 2:We look forward to seeing you there while we practice caring for ourselves, caring for our family, and participating with those who also care for community. And remember, I'm just a human, not a therapist for the community, and not there for dating, and not there to be shiny happy. Less shiny, actually. I'm there to heal too. That's what peer support is all about.
Speaker 2:Being human together. So yeah, sometimes we'll see you there.