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Conversations about Creating a Culture of Activity: Profiling the people, places, programs, and policies that help to promote a culture of activity within our communities.
Note: This transcript was exported from the video version of this episode, and it has not been copyedited
00:00:00:01 - 00:00:21:26
Esther Walker
I love this photo that you're zooming in on here is, you know, we talk a lot about this, the the benefits, not only the physical health, which I think a lot of students learn about in school, but they don't always create that solid connection between being active and their mental well-being. And so one of the key, you know, activities we do it with our teachers, but we also, you know, have the teachers do it with their students.
00:00:21:27 - 00:00:42:04
Esther Walker
Is this concept of what will you override? Not necessarily that we are all trying to escape something, but really connecting that feel, feeling that when you get out on a bike, you know, even as an adult, sometimes the day you just kind of melts away, you know, whatever you are worried about, kind of goes away for a bit and you're able to come back with a clearer mind.
00:00:42:05 - 00:00:42:20
Esther Walker
Hey everyone.
00:00:42:20 - 00:01:11:09
John Simmerman
Welcome to the Active Towns Channel. My name is John Simmerman and that is Esther Walker, executive director of the Outride initiative, founded by Specialized Bikes. And we're going to be talking a little bit about this program and what they're doing to try to better understand the impacts that cycling has, emotionally and mentally on the brain, and also what we can do to get more kids riding more often.
00:01:11:10 - 00:01:29:14
John Simmerman
And spoiler alert, they are also going to be expanding into older adults, too. So we're going to be talking a little bit about that. Before we dive into that conversation, I just want to say, if you're enjoying this content here on the Active Towns Channel, please consider supporting my efforts by becoming an Active Towns Ambassador. Hey, super easy to do.
00:01:29:15 - 00:01:51:14
John Simmerman
If you're here on YouTube, just click on the join button right down below or leave a YouTube super thanks or navigate over to Active towns.org. Click on the support tab at the top of the page and there's several different options, including becoming a Patreon supporter. Okay, let's get right to it with Esther Walker.
00:01:51:17 - 00:01:55:13
John Simmerman
Esther Walker, thank you so much for joining me on the Active Towns podcast.
00:01:55:15 - 00:01:57:19
Esther Walker
Yeah, thank you so much for having me, Esther.
00:01:57:19 - 00:02:31:03
John Simmerman
We've been trying to, get this done for some time. We first met at Velocity in Ghent in Belgium a couple years ago, and, I'm absolutely delighted to have you on the podcast. We're going to talk a little bit about the Outride, project and the, the great work that you're doing. But before we do that, I'll just take about 30s to, you know, share a little bit about yourself and how you got inspired, to be doing work in this arena.
00:02:31:06 - 00:02:54:12
Esther Walker
Yeah. Thank you so much again for having me. My name is Esther Walker. I'm calling in today from Santa Cruz, California. I'm the executive director at Outride, and we are a nonprofit organization that really aims to empower all people to experience the social, emotional, and cognitive benefits of cycling. And we know, of course, that cycling has so many benefits for our physical health.
00:02:54:15 - 00:03:11:26
Esther Walker
But a growing body of work really shows how it can also benefit our mental well-being, our brain health. And so what about at Outride? We really, you know, take what the research is telling us about movement and well-being, and put it into action through our school and community programs so that more people can experience those benefits.
00:03:11:29 - 00:03:31:14
Esther Walker
And we really believe that, you know, the bike can be a really powerful tool to support well-being. And we're working to make that, possible for as many people as we can. And over the past, you know, just over ten years, we've we've reached over 420,000 youth with programs in almost every state. And we still have a lot to do.
00:03:31:14 - 00:03:35:01
Esther Walker
But, you know, so excited to be working with our team to do it.
00:03:35:03 - 00:03:51:28
John Simmerman
I love it, I love it. What is your background? How did you, like get engaged in doing this? Is there like first, what is your background in? Second, how did you get engaged? What was the origin story of you starting to do work in this specific field?
00:03:52:00 - 00:04:12:25
Esther Walker
Yeah, I think it's, you know, it's really interesting if I go way, way, way back. I'm originally actually from North Dakota. My mom was there for grad school, and then, you know, she moved back home to Canada, where most of my family is. So I went to college in Vancouver, British Columbia, before heading down to San Diego to pursue my PhD in cognitive science.
00:04:12:27 - 00:04:34:15
Esther Walker
And really, from that, I'd say my background really stems from these kind of two parallel tracks that really ran alongside each other for many years before they finally converged at Outride. So I would say on the one side, I was really deep into cognitive science and psychology. Fascinated by how people think, you know, they make decisions, understand the world.
00:04:34:17 - 00:04:56:00
Esther Walker
And really that idea that, you know, how we move through and experience our environment actually shapes how we think. And so after pursuing that pathway for a bit, you know, I found myself wanting to try something different, went into the world of industry, still had this interest in research, and then on the other side, completely separate. I just I had this growing relationship with the bike.
00:04:56:00 - 00:05:17:18
Esther Walker
You know, I like so many people I rode as a kid. But it really came back into my life. When I moved to San Diego for grad school. I needed a way to get around. I really missed movement and I found myself commuting by bike. You know, there's I actually often can find the coaster, that beautiful train there and and my bike, because I didn't have a car when I first moved down there.
00:05:17:21 - 00:05:40:24
Esther Walker
I was naively shocked to find that Vancouver, had a great public transit system. I assumed that most cities would. I got to Southern California and it was a rude awakening. But it really gave me that love of the bike. And so, you know, from there that gave me really opened the door to join the UCSD Cycling Club, then the local San Diego, bike biking club.
00:05:40:24 - 00:06:09:08
Esther Walker
And I led a women's team for many years, eventually really built a whole community around riding. And so I think based on all of that, you know, I could really see the power that cycling has, you know, in terms of building confidence, creating connections between people and a really strong sense of belonging. And it was a great way for me to connect, as I'm sure you know, with people that I may not have met otherwise if I had just stayed in my grad school bubble.
00:06:09:10 - 00:06:31:26
Esther Walker
We in our, you know, club had people, you know, from 8 to 80, all backgrounds. And it was just an amazing way to connect and really then, you know, again, these are kind of parallel. And then finally I came across one day this job description at Outride. I first came in actually as the research manager, and that allowed me really to combine these worlds.
00:06:31:28 - 00:06:56:13
Esther Walker
So again, here, you know, really actively involved in the club, you know, being part of not only commuting, but, you know, the velodrome community, which is also huge in San Diego. And I realized I could actually use my research background, to understand the impact that, you know, movement has on our cognition, on our well-being, while also drawing from what I had experienced, being part of that cycling community.
00:06:56:15 - 00:07:16:15
Esther Walker
And so that blend, ultimately seeing that science in action and the impact it can have on so many communities, really, you know, motivated me in this work, really kind of diving into that, you know, looking into cycling's impact on how people feel, how they think, how they connect. And really kind of that continues to drive a lot of my work today it out.
00:07:16:15 - 00:07:17:00
Esther Walker
Right?
00:07:17:03 - 00:07:25:16
John Simmerman
Yeah, yeah. What's fascinating too, and I think we have a picture of, a photo here of you as a lab rat. Literally as a lab rat.
00:07:25:17 - 00:07:29:02
Esther Walker
Yeah, exactly.
00:07:29:04 - 00:07:52:23
John Simmerman
Oh. Wait, I got to pull it up here. There we go. Now, that makes more sense. Yeah. There. There we go. Sorry about that, folks. I'm looking at it, but you couldn't see it. You you knew what it was? Yeah. I mean, that's fascinating stuff. Okay, so most of my research, you know, back in the day, back in grad school and everything was very much on human physiology, was really on disease prevention.
00:07:52:25 - 00:08:16:26
John Simmerman
But a third of my coursework in graduate school was more along the side, along the lines of public health and health, behavior change in the psychology of health, behavior change. You don't have to go very deep into that to realize, and you start understanding some of the the psychosocial aspects of physical activity. And you touched upon several different things.
00:08:16:26 - 00:08:44:12
John Simmerman
And I'm sure we're going to dive a little bit deeper into that. But yeah, that mental and and, and and sense of well-being and social aspects of activity and cycling is really profound. And so it's really interesting that you all are like doing specific research on cycling and that impact that it has. What's the origins of outright?
00:08:44:12 - 00:08:50:13
John Simmerman
When did these start like thinking, oh, we needed like really be diving deep into this stuff.
00:08:50:15 - 00:09:04:24
Esther Walker
Yeah. I mean that's a it's a great question. And like you said, there's, you know, a continually growing body of work diving into that side of cycling and outride really got started. Because Mike Sinard, who is actually the founder of Specialized Bikes,
00:09:04:26 - 00:09:07:16
John Simmerman
Is that the focus we have? Is this mind that is the father?
00:09:07:16 - 00:09:35:00
Esther Walker
Yeah. Oh, yeah, that is Mike. Yeah. And so, yeah, I mean, a little I mean, this must have been in 2012, you know, before we were officially formed, we at the, got started because, you know, Mike, has ADHD and he noticed that, you know, when he went on a bike ride, he noticed how much better he felt mentally, physically, you know, when he rode his bike, especially managing, his symptoms of ADHD, his attention, his focus.
00:09:35:03 - 00:09:53:17
Esther Walker
And he really wanted to know, you know, if I'm experiencing this, you know, can can others, you know, benefit from this as well? So he backed some early studies and they were really promising a couple of pilots at schools, really looking at kind of the impact of the program on focus mood. And the students really loved participating. The teachers loved it.
00:09:53:20 - 00:10:16:03
Esther Walker
And what they found is that it wasn't just the kids with ADHD that benefited, but the whole class could. And that's ultimately what led to our first program area, which is writing for focus, which has grown into a full school based cycling program, now reaching over 400 schools. And Mike Earley is still one of the biggest champions of this work, along with the specialized team.
00:10:16:06 - 00:10:31:07
Esther Walker
But we've really grown, you know, really to understand that, you know, the impact that we want to have, we can't do it alone. So really understanding kind of the barriers and facilitators that lead to continued cycling and and working kind of in a much larger coalition as a result.
00:10:31:09 - 00:10:51:04
John Simmerman
Yeah. And we're we're here on the landing page for the, the mission and what you all do, and we've mentioned, you know, spent several times specialized, but we didn't really pause to like, acknowledge that that's a bike manufacturing company. Is the bike company that's that's behind this.
00:10:51:11 - 00:11:10:16
Esther Walker
Right. For sure. And, you know, I think, you know, so some people may be on the pessimistic side, may say, okay, well they just want to, you know, sell more bikes or but I think ultimately it's that it's, it's a win win situation for everyone. And I think actually to their benefit, they've actually encouraged us to say, hey, you know, this this is good for all of us.
00:11:10:16 - 00:11:33:29
Esther Walker
It's good for society. Of course it's good for their company. But they've also said, you know, if you want to work with our competitors, no problem. Really, this is a mission that all of us should dive into. And, you know, if you have a world in which, you know, specialized and track could collaborate, you know, Shimano and Sram, these industry giants, all with the purpose of getting more people engaged in writing and healthy in their community.
00:11:34:01 - 00:11:35:24
Esther Walker
It really is a win win.
00:11:35:27 - 00:12:01:14
John Simmerman
Right? Right. When we look at, you know, specialized I mean, again, this is one of the biggest and most successful bike brands that are out there. You'll see you'll see the bikes out in the tour de France. You'll see them in the Olympics. I see them here in Kona every year at the World Championships in Kona. Our local specialized dealer is, bike works here.
00:12:01:14 - 00:12:25:20
John Simmerman
A good friend of mine, Grant Miller, and his wife, Janet Miller, are the owners. And, it's it's one of those iconic brands that are out there. And I like the fact that you said yes, they're they're open for for this research to go on and, and take place in a and be brand agnostic. You can work with other bike brands.
00:12:25:23 - 00:12:33:03
John Simmerman
And I think that's really important to understand that. Yes, there's competition, but at the same time everybody benefits if more people. Right.
00:12:33:05 - 00:13:01:23
Esther Walker
Exactly. Yeah. And I think, you know, there's some interesting projects that have emerged over the years because, you know, you know, Trek has obviously Trek Foundation, they're building trails. We work on programing side. You know, so many, you know, amazing companies diving into this work. And so, you know, we really try to figure out how can we all work together with our strengths to really help kind of build up those broader ecosystems rather than, you know, you know, worrying about competition on the business side?
00:13:01:23 - 00:13:13:17
Esther Walker
All of us on the nonprofit side really kind of put that aside and say, really, you know, what are we trying to achieve, achieve and move forward? And that's to get more people access to riding safely in their communities.
00:13:13:20 - 00:13:35:09
John Simmerman
Yeah, yeah. Oh, I want to follow up on that. In particular. And then we'll dive into grants and research and the sorts of stuff that you guys are doing there by saying that, you know, I've had conversations both with John Burke, the president of, of Trek, as well as, Will Adams, Butler, Butler, Adams. I always get that mixed up.
00:13:35:09 - 00:14:05:02
John Simmerman
Sorry. Will, the CEO of Brompton Bicycle and about the fact that, the bicycle brands really need to be also thinking about how do we make it safer for people, more people, to be able to ride so that it's not just us, you know, furious. And, you know, I almost said Fast and furious or, you know, more accomplished and brave, cyclists that have been out there, you know, doing quote unquote, battle on the roads.
00:14:05:04 - 00:14:27:25
John Simmerman
I mean, it should be an all ages and abilities type of network like we saw in Kent, that they had been working on, to encourage more people to ride it. Can you speak a little bit about what you know, that specialized does to help, you know, promote and and encourage, communities to create safer places to ride, to?
00:14:27:27 - 00:14:47:10
Esther Walker
Yeah, I would say, you know, in addition to obviously kind of being a huge supporter of our work and particularly our school program, they've actually, you know, over the years invested a lot in our community grants as well. And so these are grants that we, you know, the writing for focus grant is a school grant, you know, includes, equipment, curriculum, etc..
00:14:47:12 - 00:15:11:28
Esther Walker
We also have our community impact grants and these, really, empower a wide range of initiatives on the local level, you know, from building a local, helping to build a local bike park or, you know, pump track, you know, maybe it's a connector trail. You know, maybe it's, you know, a mechanic's training, all sorts of different programs, really, with that understanding that, you know, introducing safe cycling is one piece of the puzzle.
00:15:12:00 - 00:15:30:28
Esther Walker
But, you know, we need safe infrastructure. We need equipment. We need, you know, positive, role models and mentors. And again, I think so they they have invested a lot there. And I think at the same time, this is where, you know, working with other organizations has been so important because we recognize that we can't solve it all.
00:15:31:00 - 00:15:43:19
Esther Walker
But how can we empower people to, you know, really, you know, think about the impacts that these cycling programs are having in their community that they can share with their council and, you know, representatives to to push for more of that local infrastructure as well?
00:15:43:26 - 00:16:12:17
John Simmerman
Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's a good point. And I did see that, you know, a lot of the supporting organizations that you have, as part of this unit, you know, include, you know, organizations like, I think I see, let's yeah, yeah, the League of American Bicyclists is down here and a few others organizations, people for bikes. So, again, of a wide variety of different organizations, but all of them are again working hard in the background within their own missions.
00:16:12:17 - 00:16:23:07
John Simmerman
And oftentimes that also means trying to encourage safer, more inviting places for all ages and abilities to to get out there and ride more frequently.
00:16:23:10 - 00:16:45:11
Esther Walker
Yeah, for sure. And I'd say, you know, we work closely with people for bikes and, you know, understanding their initiatives as well as, the league really to, you know, say, how can we better connect? You know, we have this amazing network of schools, community partners. Do they know what's available, for resources in their community? Can we help them connect to their local coalition, really to kind of collaborate on, on different projects?
00:16:45:11 - 00:16:51:24
Esther Walker
So I think there's just, you know, so much room for, for collaboration there, that we've only just got started looking into.
00:16:52:01 - 00:17:21:11
John Simmerman
Yeah, yeah. Good stuff. Right. Let's get back to the research and what we're trying to figure out. You and I discussed just before we hit the record button that, this reminded me a little bit of Doctor John Randy's, work and the classic book that he wrote, spark. And he was one of the first individuals to really be, like, honing in on the impacts of physical activity, and the impacts on the brain and ADHD in particular.
00:17:21:11 - 00:17:43:05
John Simmerman
That was one of the, you know, the conditions that he was very, very, focused on. In fact, his previous book was all about age, ADHD. Talk a little bit about the the research that you all are doing. And, and, you know, all that good deep and, you know, fun stuff that is research when you're doing this kind of stuff.
00:17:43:12 - 00:17:48:10
John Simmerman
And this does take me back to my, exercise physiology lab right here.
00:17:48:12 - 00:18:06:02
Esther Walker
Yeah, yeah. And and now this this, you know, there's a lot of contraptions going on here, but, you know, it's it's really, really exciting work. And this is actually a picture from one of the early studies with, with, clever, a collaboration at Stanford University and what, you know, really engaging them. They were they were interested in.
00:18:06:02 - 00:18:29:23
Esther Walker
Okay, we know that there's an emerging body of work that's showing that cycling and physical activity are beneficial, you know, particularly for use with ADHD. But, you know, there's many other, benefits that come with it. And so they were really interested in understanding not just doing a snapshot, you know, before and after you go for a ride, but what is actually changing, you know, well, you go for a ride.
00:18:29:23 - 00:18:55:08
Esther Walker
And so really, they worked on some really incredible technology to be able to capture kind of those changes in the brain while somebody was riding, you know, under different levels of, you know, intensity. And I think, you know, if we were really to boil it all down, you know. Exactly. You refer to John Reidy. But the impact of cycling and physical activity, particularly, you know, when we think about it, you know, things like attention and ADHD.
00:18:55:10 - 00:19:19:04
Esther Walker
Really, they've delved really deeply into this concept of executive function. So that's our, you know, ability to, you know, ignore distractions, hold things and memory, you know, focus. And so a lot of this work really looks at how, you know, engaging in different physical activities, particularly when they're cognitively engaging. You might think about, you know, avoiding obstacles on the road, things like that.
00:19:19:06 - 00:19:41:13
Esther Walker
Ultimately result in these great benefits to executive function. And so, you know, what Stanford has, has found over the years is that while it can vary by individual, research has really shown distinctions in how the brain processes information, you know, and how that might look different in someone with ADHD compared to those without. And in some cases, this may be overactivity.
00:19:41:13 - 00:20:00:06
Esther Walker
In some cases under activity. And going for a ride, can really help balance out that and result in, you know, better focus and attention. And so that was some of the early work. And I think, you know, based on that, and I think I have a screenshot of the various studies over, over the years as we've really kind of expanded.
00:20:00:08 - 00:20:23:27
Esther Walker
Okay. We've seen okay, we know this is beneficial. But we also we're getting a lot of feedback that, okay, yes, it's good for my focus, but it's also, you know, building my social, circle. It's, you know, helping my mental well-being. Hey, I'm actually motivated to ride outside of school. And so we've worked with a number of partners over the years to really explore some of those different, layers of impact.
00:20:23:27 - 00:20:46:17
Esther Walker
So not just attention and focus, but also, you know, mental well-being. Also kind of thinking about, okay, if you're introduced to riding during the school day, do you want to continue beyond that? And then also looking at kind of the what's really important to us is learning from this data. So constantly evaluating our school programs, our grant programs, and seeing are they working?
00:20:46:19 - 00:21:01:17
Esther Walker
If not, what do we need to change? And if so, you know, how do we dive deeper into that? And so this is just, a snapshot of some of that work, but it's been really cool to see it emerge over the years and how people have have built on it.
00:21:01:19 - 00:21:40:17
John Simmerman
The other book that, you know, this kind of reminds me of in terms of the, the, the, the challenges that we face, especially with the youth, is, Jonathan Height's most recent book, the The Anxious Generation. And, and really the emerging body of evidence of the negative impacts of, you know, kids, you know, on, on their cell phones, you know, we've got these magic devices now that are in our back pockets that, you know, a decade ago weren't as common and weren't having as much of a negative impact on children as they are now.
00:21:40:19 - 00:21:59:21
John Simmerman
This has got to be an interesting sort of corollary of, you know, when we can get the kids, you know, off of their screens and, you know, out in nature, out there outside in on a bike and doing things. There's got to be just some profound impacts. But that's got to be really, really hard to study at.
00:21:59:21 - 00:22:08:21
John Simmerman
That level. Much more so than, you know, brain activity and other stuff that's going on in a in a lab condition for sure.
00:22:08:21 - 00:22:32:25
Esther Walker
Yeah. And this is something too, that fascinated me in, in grad school. Right. Was that transition from the lab out into the, you know, so-called real world? And that's why, you know, we we do constantly do a lot of evaluation work with our schools is to tap into exactly that, you know, what are the factors that are contributing to, you know, positive student outcomes within a school environment, you know, within different individual level factors across students.
00:22:32:28 - 00:22:57:27
Esther Walker
And I think what's really interesting is that when we, you know, in contrast to this, you know, the brain activity side, when we ask students, you know, what do they like about biking? You know, a lot of really powerful themes emerge around, you know, just being outside. It's it's always shocking to me how many students just said we got to go outside because, you know, they've been used to sitting at a desk for for eight hours.
00:22:57:27 - 00:23:27:18
Esther Walker
Or maybe their PE classes were always stuck inside the, the gym. And so being outside that access to nature, a lot of them mentioned that they enjoy the freedom. It's a unique activity and that they don't feel the teacher hovering over their shoulder, because they're able to, you know, exercise a little bit of independence. And I think on top of that, again, in contrast to where, you know, so much is on online in terms of their social interactions, they're, you know, we've all experienced this.
00:23:27:18 - 00:23:53:18
Esther Walker
You go out for a bike ride with a few other people, you're next to someone maybe you haven't met, and you strike up a conversation. And these say exactly that. Same thing is I was able to ride with someone I've never talked to in my class and maybe never would have. And so I think can be such a powerful activity to really instill that love of kind of, you know, that connection between how I feel and being outside in nature.
00:23:53:21 - 00:24:02:24
Esther Walker
But also that independence that so many, you know, we work with middle school alert schoolers mainly, but so many of them are craving that freedom and independence.
00:24:02:26 - 00:24:25:29
John Simmerman
Yeah, yeah, it's it's such a good stuff. You know, I was just in, Bentonville, Arkansas doing some filming, there and meeting up with, a fair number of city staff, including the director of Parks and Rec, David Wright. And then also they had a chance to interview the mayor and walk around and ride around that city.
00:24:25:29 - 00:24:56:18
John Simmerman
And what was really, really profound about the impacts there in Bentonville, what they're seeing is the engagement of the youth because of the integration of a lot of that mountain biking trail network that they have, and then they've got many schools that are actually connected with shared use paths and pathways. And to the side of those mountain bike trails, a little, little singletrack trails that the kids can ride on, right to school.
00:24:56:21 - 00:25:16:27
John Simmerman
I mean, what a great laboratory in and of itself, of a city that, you know, has committed to, to doing this, we've got to be seeing hopefully in the in the future generations there in Bentonville, we should see some, you know, profound impacts. I was noticing it just in the number of kids riding, number of families riding to.
00:25:16:29 - 00:25:46:06
Esther Walker
Yeah, for sure. I mean, I think you're tapping into that exact, you know, piece that's so important is that, you know, okay, we have the program, but then you also then need that supportive environment and infrastructure around it. And I think what's been really cool to see is that, you know, a lot of the schools we work with are in, you know, lower income communities, you know, they may not always have safe infrastructure, but they they get started in whatever, you know, environment they have, whether that's parking lot, you know, some do have access to beautiful nature trails.
00:25:46:08 - 00:26:04:24
Esther Walker
But really the idea is to empower them to really experience, you know, learning how to ride. You know, they may not necessarily all like it, but at least they now have that skill. And this actually the one you just saw there on the baseball field is interesting because the students actually got involved and say, hey, we want more places to ride that.
00:26:04:28 - 00:26:23:02
Esther Walker
That baseball field wasn't being used and they were able to, you know, work with the the teacher in the community to design a trail around the school and include some fun features there. So that's been really cool to see how, you know, different schools, you know, they get started and they're like, okay, how can we adapt this to our setting?
00:26:23:04 - 00:26:39:15
Esther Walker
You know, many now have, you know, taken on building trails around the school and then again, also creating that push, you know, if they are surrounded by major highways, you know, how can we say, hey, we want more safe places for these students to practice this activity? Who can we push on to make that happen?
00:26:39:17 - 00:27:01:26
John Simmerman
Yeah, yeah. The reason I pause on this particular, still shot, you know, as a part of this B-roll image on this video is earlier we were referencing nature, and and I think that's a really, really important, you know, point is to, to to point out, you had mentioned earlier, just being outside, being able to get outside.
00:27:01:28 - 00:27:32:24
John Simmerman
And, and I think there's also a difference between being able to just get outside and feel like you're on a, a paved playground type of thing. You know, the basketball courts, you know, that, you know, a typical outside, you know, in the school environment versus getting truly outside. That one clip that we saw earlier of some single track through the forest, this one where they're, going through a forest and over a bridge, that's important to truly getting some nature fix.
00:27:32:26 - 00:27:57:27
John Simmerman
Again, tapping into you know, the past work by Richard Louv. And the last child outside. Is that what it was? And nature deficit disorder. So incredibly important to, you know, engage our youth and get them well, engage everybody. I mean, we're focused right at this moment on youth, but I think it's beneficial for us all regardless of age, to be able to get out into nature.
00:27:57:29 - 00:28:24:00
Esther Walker
Yeah, I mean, that's a really good point. And I think it's actually points to some other work we're doing with some research collaborators looking at what different schools in our network have access to in terms of nature and how that maybe impacts the student experience or not. So, you know, stay tuned on what we find there. But I think what's also interesting is that, you know, some of the schools we work with, again, they may not have a beautiful trail right outside, but maybe it's something they build up to.
00:28:24:00 - 00:28:47:24
Esther Walker
So, you know, they learn on their, you know, blacktop, you know, within their school grounds. And then they're able to either do a escorted ride to a local trail network, maybe most of the students have never seen before or organize a field trip. And I think we we get a lot of feedback from teachers, you know, saying that they've really been just shocked on how many students have never been to their local parks or trails.
00:28:47:27 - 00:28:50:16
Esther Walker
And this really kind of opens that experience for them.
00:28:50:19 - 00:29:10:23
John Simmerman
Yeah, yeah. Now, earlier we were talking a little bit about the studies and the, the, the research that you're doing, and I want to pull up this image that you have here that you sent my way from the research summit. I was really wanting to go to the research summit. It was in the summer, right. Like July ish.
00:29:10:25 - 00:29:11:09
Esther Walker
Yep. Yeah.
00:29:11:10 - 00:29:25:28
John Simmerman
July. I was in northern California, but because of, my mom's 80th birthday and some other travel that I was trying to do, I wasn't able to make it to the summit, talk a little bit more about this research summit. What's what's going on here?
00:29:26:01 - 00:29:48:09
Esther Walker
Yeah. So the research summit has, you know, been, you know, slowly gaining momentum every year since since we got started. And really it all came from the idea that, you know, hey, all this research is happening, but we don't want it to live behind some black box or, you know, academic paper paywall. At the same time, we're working with so many community partners that are also learning things in a different way.
00:29:48:11 - 00:30:15:19
Esther Walker
Maybe it's not formal research, but, you know, they're out there in the field experiencing it. And so really, it's kind of provided us an opportunity to bring together, you know, researchers, but also practitioners, educators, community leaders, to really come together and learn from one another. So researchers can present the latest research, what they're finding, and then the teachers can talk about, well, how do I translate that into what it looks like at my school, where I have these types of barriers?
00:30:15:21 - 00:30:33:13
Esther Walker
And really kind of coming together to put that research into action, because there is often so much a disconnect there. And so really, it's a, it's a wonderful way to, you know, introduce them and provide them with that research background, but also give researchers insight into, you know, what it looks like out there in the world.
00:30:33:16 - 00:30:51:19
Esther Walker
And a lot of the, the teachers, actually, that are coming to teach the program for the next round are in attendance, and they're actually able to take that back and say, hey, I can use this content for my grant applications, for advocating for, you know, more safe writing in my community, etc., to share with their administration.
00:30:51:21 - 00:30:58:20
Esther Walker
And so it's a really great way to kind of bring, you know, so many different, you know, fields together that don't always communicate.
00:30:58:23 - 00:31:20:04
John Simmerman
Yeah, yeah. Now you and I met again, at velocity in, in Ghent. A couple of years ago. A couple summers ago. And, I know that the Urban Cycling Institute has, like, a research, cycling research thing that they pull together every year. Is that something where you guys might be able to present some of your research?
00:31:20:04 - 00:31:33:17
John Simmerman
Or have you already done that in the past at, the urban cycling? I don't remember the official formal name of their research gathering that they do each year. Is is that something you've done before and plan on doing in the future?
00:31:33:19 - 00:31:53:16
Esther Walker
So yeah, the Urban Cycling Institute does does great work. And I know they I think it's called the Cycling Research Board annual meeting. Yeah, yeah. And we haven't presented our work there in the past. However, we did have, Lauren, who's on the research team at Outride, attended that that last meeting, over the summer. And she really, really enjoyed it and came a lot.
00:31:53:21 - 00:32:01:11
Esther Walker
Came away with a lot of, you know, inspired ideas. And so I think it's definitely an area we can think about, engaging more in the future. Yeah.
00:32:01:14 - 00:32:25:28
John Simmerman
Yeah. That's, I think that this is like an area and especially when we can get research coming in from multiple locations around the globe. It just makes it even more impactful in terms of, you know, what's out there and the impact that it has. Let's let's talk a little bit about what's new for your organization. What are you going to be looking at in the future?
00:32:26:01 - 00:32:45:18
Esther Walker
Yeah, I mean, I think there's two two interesting pieces. One is what actually you just mentioned, which is learning from, you know, what are other countries doing? You know, what are the challenges they're facing, you know, how have they approached it? And really kind of pulling together our knowledge. And so we have been exploring some different international collaborations.
00:32:45:20 - 00:33:03:10
Esther Walker
You know, whether that's, you know, school based or, you know, doing kind of more, specific research activities, all with that idea of how can we both share our knowledge but learn from what's being done. And the other is, you know, we've we've spent most of the time today, talking about youth. You know, that really has been our focus.
00:33:03:12 - 00:33:26:21
Esther Walker
But, you know, as we've continued on this work, we've we've really, been seeing a lot of work around, not only working with youth, but actually older adults and, you know, just, you know, adults in general. And the reason is that, you know, older adults are in another key transition point in their lives that can really deeply impact their physical, social, emotional well-being.
00:33:26:21 - 00:33:33:21
Esther Walker
So retirement, loss of routine, social isolation really can all be hey.
00:33:33:27 - 00:33:36:29
John Simmerman
Are you talking about me?
00:33:37:01 - 00:33:56:04
Esther Walker
Talking about all of us? Yeah, I'll get there. And and I think really, you know, for all of us who have been cycling for so long, we know the benefits. But reintroducing cycling, really can help adults and older adults maintain that mobility, that independence. And there's so much amazing work on, you know, the power of it.
00:33:56:05 - 00:34:22:08
Esther Walker
It has to enhance cognitive function, delay cognitive decline, reduce loneliness. And so it's an area that we are excited to grow into. We'll still focus on all of our youth programing, but this expansion really helps us to apply that same evidence based approach to another really important part of life. And maybe down the line actually, really looking at ways to foster that intergenerational, connection as well.
00:34:22:10 - 00:35:04:06
John Simmerman
Yeah. No, there's, there's so much exciting stuff about, you know, the impact that riding a bike has on, you know, well-being. As you know, everything from the physiological side down to the, you know, emotional side and the mental side, and, you know, and just, you know, even stuff like thinking about the impacts some of the early studies that have been coming out on the impact of riding a bike with somebody with Parkinson's and being able to, like, calm those tremors and and being able to actually ride a bike and actually feel like they have so and so, there's all sorts of magical stuff that's going on when one rides a bike, and then
00:35:04:06 - 00:35:38:08
John Simmerman
being able to maintain one's sense of balance and proprioceptive, aspects of of being able to get out there. So I think there's some really, really powerful stuff that we can learn, of what impacts riding a bike has as we're getting older and we're starting to see more and more older adults, myself included, who are looking at that opportunity to use a little electric assist and an electric assist with maybe a cargo bike to be able to do more errands and trips without getting in a car.
00:35:38:11 - 00:36:17:20
John Simmerman
Because, you know, every car trip that you're you're not taking, you know, that's one less car out on the road and one more opportunity for you to get some fresh air and get a little bit of physical activity in. And that's one of the things that we are seeing in Europe is we're seeing, an incredible uptick in older, older adults, getting an electric assist bike or cargo bike and getting more trips and doing continuing, like in the case of the Dutch, they may be just continuing their current activity, but feeling like, you know, being on a just normal bike was starting to be a little bit of a challenge for them.
00:36:17:20 - 00:36:28:09
John Simmerman
They feel like they can keep their way of life going and that that, you know, typical, you know, pattern of behavior. They can keep it going.
00:36:28:12 - 00:36:47:02
Esther Walker
Yeah. I mean, I think that's a really great point. And a lot of the groups that we've been in, you know, talking with about learning about what they're doing for programing are using, you know, e-bikes or a combination of, you know, non e-bike and e-bike, for exactly that reason. You know, maybe people have specific heart rate limitations.
00:36:47:04 - 00:37:10:17
Esther Walker
You know, or, you know, other considerations, that don't allow them to, you know, pedal as intensely on a standard bike. And so the e-bike has really opened up that world for them. And, you know, they still are getting the, you know, physical health benefits from it. They're still moving. And, you know, there's been a lot of interesting work actually showing you you also are getting those amazing mental well-being benefits as well.
00:37:10:19 - 00:37:18:19
Esther Walker
And so I think it's just so important to really kind of think about, you know, ways to keep engaging people across the lifespan. Yeah.
00:37:18:21 - 00:37:30:03
John Simmerman
This graph that I just pulled up, I'm not sure. Oh this is students. Okay. I, I wasn't sure if this was the adults or if this is a students. This is a students. Since I pulled it up. You're going to have to talk about it. Sorry.
00:37:30:05 - 00:37:54:01
Esther Walker
Yeah, yeah. You know, we can circle back. And really this I can think back to kind of the research summit and, you know, sharing some of that data back of what we're learning from our school programs. And so this is an example of just, one school. The the data can vary widely by school. But this is the type of data report that each school will get back after participating, you know, each semester in the program.
00:37:54:03 - 00:38:11:10
Esther Walker
And it can be really helpful for them to just understand, you know, hey, what what is happening with our program, what's effective, what's not, but also for them to share back with their community, with, you know, parents, with the administration to really understand the changes that are happening. So again, like I said, this is an example of one school.
00:38:11:12 - 00:38:29:21
Esther Walker
But I would say maybe what's surprising for a lot of people is that on average across our schools, we see that combo red and gray Barr either not knowing how to ride or not very confident, average of around 20% by middle school, which, you know, a lot of people are surprised by, some schools that's up to 50%.
00:38:29:23 - 00:38:54:21
Esther Walker
And so really kind of speaks to the importance when we're really trying to increase access to cycling is, you know, the importance of these school based programs where we provide all the equipment, a standard curriculum. You train the teachers so they're all able to kind of go through that progression and not assume that they've been, you know, learned at home or from parents who themselves may not feel comfortable letting their, you know, kids ride out on the street.
00:38:54:24 - 00:39:26:10
John Simmerman
Yeah. Here's a snapshot of what you mean by providing that equipment. There we go. Yeah. Fantastic. And it would be interesting. It'd be fascinating to see, too, if we did it. Once you start getting more engaged in the programing for adults, whether you start to, you know, look at some of this very same data and saying, you know, okay, before a program or, some sort of intervention, you know, how confident and comfortable are you, you know, riding a bike and then, you know.
00:39:26:10 - 00:39:28:29
John Simmerman
So yeah. Anyways.
00:39:29:02 - 00:39:30:03
Esther Walker
Exactly. And I.
00:39:30:03 - 00:39:31:25
John Simmerman
Think data.
00:39:31:27 - 00:39:53:21
Esther Walker
Well and it's, it's just can be so useful to say like, hey, how are how are we doing. Right. And, and what might we need to do differently. And also recognizing that again, we work in so many different settings that you know, from, you know, super urban environments to rural to suburban to towns and recognizing that, you know, we provide a structure, but we may need to adapt it for each individual setting.
00:39:53:23 - 00:40:18:01
Esther Walker
And so I think we're thinking about that same approach working with older adults is that there's actually already so many organizations doing great work. We don't necessarily want to rebuild the wheels, so to speak. But really, how can we collaborate and help them, you know, amplify that? Those programs, you know, give them opportunity to collect that type of data and really scale that programing so more people have access to those types of programs.
00:40:18:03 - 00:40:30:12
John Simmerman
And speaking of which, you know, some of the other types of data that you did collect with the students, I could see this also being very helpful data to also, with the adults and the older adults as well.
00:40:30:15 - 00:40:52:25
Esther Walker
Yeah. And I think one thing actually, that, you know, many people listening might be interested in is that that that last pink bar, it is consistently the lowest on our, charts here. However, I think there's a huge opportunity there because when you actually look at the we also collect data on who is actually riding to school. It's often for most schools, 0 to 2% very low.
00:40:52:27 - 00:41:08:04
Esther Walker
But the fact that there's interest there, even 16% and then growing to 25% is like, okay, there's an interest there from the students, you know, how can we now help make that happen, whether that's through infrastructure or, you know, more education etc.?
00:41:08:06 - 00:41:40:15
John Simmerman
Yeah, yeah. And for the listening only audience. Yeah, that that pink bar was, writing to and from school and this is an interest survey. And then your point is that this is the interest. So there is that interest, the actual numbers of, of kids being able feeling like they're able to do that. And I could totally see that for, you know, for, for working aged adults, you know, that could be or, you know, interest in writing to and from work versus, you know, at versus actually doing it.
00:41:40:19 - 00:42:10:01
John Simmerman
And then for older adults, adults who may have been or maybe retired already, it might be interest of riding a bike to and from, your, your, your normal places for hanging out, whether that's a third place or errands or stuff like that. So yeah, good stuff. I love it, I love it. Is there anything that we haven't yet discussed that you want to make sure to, to leave the audience with about the program?
00:42:10:04 - 00:42:29:00
Esther Walker
Yeah. I mean, one thing, one thing I, you know, we haven't yet mentioned is that this this program is a is a grant. So, the writing for focus program, like I said now in almost or over 400 middle schools across the US and Canada, eligible to, you know, public middle schools and our actually our grant application window is open.
00:42:29:00 - 00:42:49:19
Esther Walker
So if you are in middle school, teacher, wanting to bring, you know, bikes to your school, to your community, this grant is a great opportunity to do that. We provide the fleet of bikes, helmets, teacher training, which I think we saw some pictures earlier of, you know, them coming out to California, giving them a comprehensive experience through the curriculum, riding together.
00:42:49:22 - 00:43:19:04
Esther Walker
And really to kind of see how this can, you know, impact your school and student engagement. So that application cycle is open. So be sure to visit our website if you are interested and learn more about eligibility. The other thing is I love this photo that you're zooming in on here is, you know, we talk a lot about this, the the benefits, not only the physical health, which I think a lot of students learn about in school, but they don't always create that solid connection between being active and their mental well-being.
00:43:19:06 - 00:43:46:09
Esther Walker
And so one of the key, you know, activities we do it with our teachers, but we also, you know, have the teachers do it with their students. Is this concept of what will you override? Not necessarily that we are all trying to escape something, but really connecting that feel, feeling that when you get out on a bike, you know, even as an adult, sometimes the day you just kind of melts away, you know, whatever you you are worried about kind of goes away for a bit and you're able to come back with a clearer mind.
00:43:46:12 - 00:44:13:25
Esther Walker
And the middle schoolers we work with, you know, one, I love how they're always so honest. So you can trust that their their surveys, they will tell you how they feel. But they put some really insightful, you know, information on, on this content and I think really can give, you know, students the way not only to talk about their feelings and how they're connected to movement, but also gives teachers insight into the emotional needs of the students and really create empathy.
00:44:13:25 - 00:44:27:05
Esther Walker
There. And so I think, you know, of course, we know that the bike can't solve everything. But really, it can be a powerful tool to build that awareness and connection between movement, getting out there in nature and how we're feeling.
00:44:27:08 - 00:45:08:28
John Simmerman
Yeah, and I love this too, that interaction with asking, you know, the, you know, prompting the kids to share, you know what will you out. Right. What what are what are the things that come up and the fact that to your point, so many of these things are so profoundly in, in, in profound and insightful, reminds me of the conversation I just had in, in the previous, one of the previous episodes during the season with Maura Mincer, with the growing a Boulder program in Boulder, Colorado, where they're they're actively trying to get, you know, engage the youth opinion about, you know, what they think of their environments and, and what they would
00:45:08:28 - 00:45:21:16
John Simmerman
like to see different. And so, we can learn so much just by listening to our youth and not just assuming they don't have anything to contribute, because they're obviously thinking quite profoundly about things.
00:45:21:18 - 00:45:42:23
Esther Walker
Yeah. And I mean, I think exactly to your point there, I think I maybe shared a couple examples, but one of my, you know, again, like I said, when I first started at Outride, I came on as the research manager, and one of my favorite tasks and, you know, still is, is, reading the student open ended responses in the surveys, because they are so honest.
00:45:42:24 - 00:46:02:13
Esther Walker
You know, what they like, what they don't like, you know, can you change the weather for me? Can you do this? But there's also really, you know, deep information there about, you know, things we should think about as a community. You know, it may seem obvious, but, you know, asking them, you know, what might be preventing them from wanting to translate their interest in writing to school to actually doing it.
00:46:02:15 - 00:46:34:14
Esther Walker
You know, we'll hear things like, well, you know, if only I was able to ride to school without the fear of being hit by a car. Yeah. They're like, I like the program. I like the program. Because at school, I don't feel that fear. Right. And so it's it's there at that. And then also, you know, hearing from them just how the number of, you know, quotes we get from students, you know, in those surveys about how they're able to just feel free and get their mind off of things because, you know, there's so much going on in the world that it provides, you know, that that moment of of, you know, release and
00:46:34:14 - 00:46:39:03
Esther Walker
you know, clarity and just joy that they may not otherwise escape from.
00:46:39:06 - 00:47:02:26
John Simmerman
Yeah, yeah. And here is that graphic, reinforcing that the the applications are no. Now open for those grants. So again folks, I'll have the link in the show notes, below. Be sure to pop on over to the website, click on that. And get your applications in. If, you so choose. This has been fantastic.
00:47:02:29 - 00:47:06:22
John Simmerman
Any final, final thoughts that you'd like to leave the audience with?
00:47:06:24 - 00:47:23:06
Esther Walker
Yeah. I mean, I know you just shared the application and and the website, but I would also say that, you know, I think the best way to get a feel for, you know, kind of what's happening with across the school network, is to, you know, take, take a look at it in action. And one way you can do that is head on over to our sites Instagram.
00:47:23:06 - 00:47:44:29
Esther Walker
So instagram.com/outride and you can get a lot of videos of kind of the, the student perspective, the teacher respective and across all different settings. The other would be that if you're really interested in more hearing more about kind of the research side and, you know, even from the program side is on YouTube, we have all of our, you know, Historical Research Summit videos.
00:47:44:29 - 00:48:03:14
Esther Walker
So you can go ahead and check them out there. And I would just say, yeah, thank you, John, for the opportunity to join here and for sharing, you know, letting us share a little bit more about out. Right? I think, you know, it's been really incredible to see, you know, the kind of ongoing support and excitement around getting more youth writing.
00:48:03:14 - 00:48:36:18
Esther Walker
You know, we see that in things like, you know, the bike bus and the amazing work that of course, is doing. But as I mentioned earlier, we're also part of a much broader coalition, the Youth Cycle Cycling Coalition, which actually, people for bikes is really helping kind of glue together. Really with the idea that, you know, it takes many organizations, you know, from local to national and everything in between, to really make an impact on really trying to get more people riding, not only for the benefits, but also, because it really creates, you know, connected communities.
00:48:36:20 - 00:48:59:01
Esther Walker
And, and so, yeah, that's, that's what I'll leave us all with. And you to go ahead and check out the other great organizations that are involved in the work, really with the idea that, you know, riding a bike shouldn't just be, you know, necessarily at school and then you stop. But how can you actually create lifelong pathways for participation, from youth all the way through, older adulthood?
00:48:59:03 - 00:49:19:12
John Simmerman
I love it, I love it, and I and this, you know, warms my heart to see that, bike bus world is right there, prominently located, of course, coach Sam Balto has been on the channel multiple times here. This is good stuff. Yes, I love it. And the National Youth Bike Council. I've had Joshua funches on before.
00:49:19:13 - 00:49:40:04
John Simmerman
This is good stuff. So yeah, plenty of opportunities, I think. Is there a, other than just applying for the grant, what other suggestions would you have of what you know, anybody who's tuning in listening to this or watching this, how they can get more engaged and involved in their own communities?
00:49:40:06 - 00:49:59:28
Esther Walker
Yeah. So I would say, you know, there's also opportunity to stay up to date with, you know, what events we're putting on through our newsletter. You can sign up, for that on our website. And, you know, we also have a map there. The wiki has one. Two. Yep. That's the newsletter. The wiki has a national programs map.
00:49:59:28 - 00:50:15:19
Esther Walker
We have one too. And so, it'd be great to see, you know, if there's a school in your community and you have skills you want to offer, you know, a lot of them really are excited to have local volunteers, whether that's, you know, maybe wanting to start an after school club or support with, you know, bike maintenance.
00:50:15:21 - 00:50:38:17
Esther Walker
So there's lots of opportunity on the school and community side. And then on the research side, we also have, what one of my colleagues has put together, called the research pool. And really, there could be anyone from just interested in staying connected with both researchers and, you know, community, organizations and schools. To those who really actually want to, you know, drive the research forward.
00:50:38:17 - 00:50:43:18
Esther Walker
So that's an initiative that people can sign up and and get connected there as well.
00:50:43:20 - 00:50:49:29
John Simmerman
I love it, I love it. Where can people connect with you?
00:50:50:02 - 00:51:09:20
Esther Walker
Yeah. So they, I, I am on LinkedIn, so you can find me either through, you know, the outright page there or, you know, my personal, LinkedIn. So happy to connect there, answer questions. And then, of course, you know, you can always reach out to, the outreach team at hello at Outride because, we are all monitoring that.
00:51:09:20 - 00:51:19:18
Esther Walker
So, you know, we love to hear from you all. And, Yeah, really, you know, I love hearing what people's ideas are and how we can help, you know, work together to put those into action.
00:51:19:21 - 00:51:26:18
John Simmerman
Yeah. Yeah. This is fantastic. Esther. This has been so much fun. Thank you so much for joining me on the Active Towns podcast.
00:51:26:21 - 00:51:28:06
Esther Walker
Thank you so much for having me.
00:51:28:08 - 00:51:44:19
John Simmerman
Hey, thank you all so much for tuning in. I hope you enjoyed this episode with Esther Walker. And if you did, please give it a thumbs up. Leave a comment down below and share it with a friend. And if you haven't done so already, be honored to have you subscribe to the channel. Just click on that subscription button down below and ring that notification bell.
00:51:44:24 - 00:52:02:21
John Simmerman
And again, if you're enjoying this content here on the Active Towns Channel, please consider supporting my efforts by becoming an Active Towns Ambassador. Again, super easy to do. Click on that join button right down below. Leave a YouTube Super thanks or navigate over to Active Town Site or click on that support tab at the top of the page.
00:52:02:25 - 00:52:25:11
John Simmerman
There's several different options, including being able to make a donation to my nonprofit advocates for Healthy Communities. Or you can become a Patreon supporter. Patrons do get early and ad free access to all this video content. Again, thank you so much for tuning in. I really do appreciate it. And until next time, this is John signing off by wishing you much activity, health and happiness.
00:52:25:14 - 00:52:45:04
John Simmerman
Cheers! And I just want to also say thank you all so much to all my Active Towns ambassadors supporting the channel financially via YouTube super thanks to YouTube memberships. Buy me a coffee, Patreon and making donations to the nonprofit again. I simply could not produce this content without your support. Thank you all so very much.