This is the Executive Connect Podcast - a show for the new generation of leaders. Join us as we discover unconventional leadership strategies not traditionally associated with executive roles. Our guests include upper-level C-Suite executives charting new ways to grow their organizations, successful entrepreneurs changing the way the world does business, and experts and thought leaders from fields outside of Corporate America that can bring new insights into leadership, prosperity, and personal growth - all while connecting on a human level. No one has all the answers - but by building a community of open-minded and engaged leaders we hope to give you the tools you need to help you find your own path to success.
Executive Connect Host (00:01.526)
Welcome to the Executive Connect podcast. I'm excited to welcome Erica Anderson Roney here with us today. Welcome, Erica, and thank you so much for being with us today.
Erica Anderson Rooney (00:48.365)
Hey Melissa, I am so thrilled to be here. I'm so pumped to be talking with you and have this conversation because it is super important, super timely, and so needed in today's world. So thank you for having me.
Executive Connect Host (01:04.942)
You're very welcome. I'm just going to jump right in as I normally do. Erica, you have been speaking just as you said about breaking glass ceilings and escaping those sticky floors in corporate America. Can you share a little bit about what that means to you and why it is such a focus for you right now in your career?
Erica Anderson Rooney (01:25.586)
Yeah. So first of all, let's just really high level talk about glass ceilings and sticky floors because I'm sure a lot of people are like, I have heard glass ceilings, right? That is what women, marginalized groups and communities, it's what we bump up against in corporate America. It exists in society. Does it hold women back?
Absolutely. I'm not about to turn this into a political podcast, but we've had two women run for president and we've had no women be a president. So do they exist? Probably, right? Now sticky floors though is probably where you're like, what in the world does that mean? And I'll give you what the definition is and then we'll talk about the backstory, but sticky floors is my word for the limiting beliefs and the toxic behaviors that keep you stuck.
And how I kind of came into this body of work was that I kicked, I crawled, I climbed my way to the top. It was not easy, it was not graceful, it was really fricking hard. And as a mom with two little kids, I was constantly up against challenges. I was bumping up against the glass ceiling when people were asking me who was babysitting my kids when I was going to work events. Spoiler alert, their father.
the other parent, right? I was bumping up against it when I was expressing my expertise in my area, but they were still accepting the white man's reasoning for things that had nothing to do with the topic. It was just his whim and his desire. So I was constantly up against these glass ceilings, but I was able to get into the C-suite.
Executive Connect Host (02:59.834)
you
Erica Anderson Rooney (03:02.036)
And I was able to do that because I looked very, very deep within. And I said, what is within my control on this climb to the top? How can I get there? Because Melissa, I looked at the data. I saw that there was a pay gap that was so wide it was going to spend 132 years. And I said, there is no way that I'm going to wait for equal pay. Like, absolutely not. So I became the breadwinner. I was out earning people.
and I was doing all these things, but it was really hard for me to get there. And so that's why I really threw myself into this concept of glass ceilings and sticky floors, because until there is true gender equality in the workplace, until the systems really change, which as we know, take decades and generations, we have to be able to do what is within our control.
to get into the top, to shatter those ceilings. And I also want to say, it's not necessarily a corporate ceiling that I'm talking about because we all place these self-imposed limits over our heads, whether or not we realize it, right? I can't do this, or I'll never be C-suite, or...
I'll never get that kind of promotion. I'll never make six figures, whatever it is that you're sitting on. Like we put those ceilings in there. So how can we dig into those sticky floors and get unstuck to shatter the glass ceiling? And that's really kind of how all of that came together. It's what it is. And you know what? If we want to close the pay gap, if we want to obliterate the confidence gap, the mentorship gap, the broken run, the glass clip, the glass ceilings, we got to start with ourselves.
So that is glassy, luscious, floors.
Executive Connect Host (04:38.782)
Yeah, I love it. Outside of, you know, the mother, I agree definitely with the mother piece of it. And the pay definitely. What are some other kind of sticky floors women are experiencing right now in the workplace?
Erica Anderson Rooney (04:55.56)
There are so many out there, but as you've said, I have my own podcast. It's the Glass Ceilings and Sticky Floor Podcast. And the last question that I ask every single woman is, what is the one piece of advice you would have given your younger self? And the majority of those women all answered the same. And that answer is, I wish I knew my worth.
And so when we talk about like what is going on in the world today, I think this concept of worthiness and being enough as you are, not having to compare yourself to your next door neighbor or someone else in your company or what you're seeing on Instagram and TikTok, those are the sticky floors that just are prevalent over time. And that is the one that I see rearing its ugly head time and time again.
Executive Connect Host (05:46.35)
Yeah, I agree. think there is, I hear that a lot from women myself. You know, it seems to me a lot of women right now are stuck. I've seen a lot of very high performing, high executing women at Fortune 50, 100, Fortune 500 companies stepping back, starting their own businesses because they're really sick of the sticky floors. And for those women that are kind of trying to decide between
you know, getting unstuck and doing their own thing and pivoting and the ones that are kind of pushing through the sock to then hoping that something happens on the other side. What are some actions that you feel they can take today or take away today to help them make those decisions and actually get unstuck?
Erica Anderson Rooney (06:34.65)
Yeah, so it takes a while to really get unstuck, right? And in the book, Glass Ceilings and Sticky Floors, I have a science-backed four-step framework that really helps you identify and uncover what those sticky floors are because honestly, sometimes they live in our unconscious and we don't even recognize that we're experiencing those sticky floors. And so the four-step science-backed framework helps you recognize and then it helps you pick your pivot.
And we can go into that, but I also have some very actionable things that like whether or not you want to go into that whole four step framework or not. Like one thing that I ask everyone to do is take one brave fight a day. Because typically when we are stuck, we know certain things that we could do, that we should do, that may work, but we have this fear of trying. We worry about what other people will think. We fear rejection. We fear failure.
So I came up with this concept of take a brave bite a day because how do you eat an elephant? One bite at a time. And number one, I think that's the stupidest thing ever, but it works and it fits. How do you become a brave person and you take these actions that you need to take to get unstuck? You take one brave bite a day and it doesn't have to be.
big thing. You don't have to go to your boss and ask for a huge promotion. You don't have to say, know what the brave fight is to completely quit my job and start my own business. No, no, those are big big decisions that you need to think about, right? But when we're talking about one brave fight a day, you do something small that just moves the needle just a little bit because when you take those brave fights, whatever it is, you are actually expanding your comfort zone every single time and
That's the magical thing about your comfort zone. Like it can continue to grow and you can be so much more brave, so much more courageous, so much more comfortable and less stuck if you take those brave bites. So when I'm working with my coaching clients, if we have someone who struggles to ask for help and so then they have this whole perfectionism thing weighing on them, they're not asking for help, I'll say, what is one thing you could do today that would set you up for asking for help?
Erica Anderson Rooney (08:46.468)
And they immediately usually jump to, have to tell my boss I need to get 15 hours of work off my plate. OK, if you're ready to take that jump, let's do it. But sometimes it might just be putting the calendar invite on your boss's calendar that says, hey, touch point, I want to talk about my workload.
because now you have set that in motion. Sending a calendar invite wasn't so crazy scary, but you've set it in motion and you've put something in motion that is really hard to undo, right? You can't go back to your boss and say, no, no, no, I didn't mean to send that invite. Like they're gonna know something is up. So sometimes, like for me, when I wanted to start my podcast, I sat on that idea for a year, but I had so many sticky floors. Nobody's gonna wanna listen to me. People are gonna wonder what I'm doing. They're gonna think I'm crazy.
fears that I had and you know what I did? I sent one email to 10 women in my circle who I know are my biggest supporters and I said this is the thing I want to do I want you to hold me to it and once I click send on that email it was like well now I can't undo that they know I've been wanting to do this so sometimes it's something easy something simple and then you get the ball rolling and you start showing up
as a more brave and courageous person and someone who can more easily snap out of those sticky floors of fear and rejection and worrying about what other people will think.
Executive Connect Host (10:02.622)
you
Executive Connect Host (10:11.306)
And you have accountability partners, right? You have people that are going to hold you accountable to doing that thing that you said and taking one brave bite at a time. And I love that you said that because I think that's an important piece, having somebody to share your sticky floor with, but then somebody actually to help you through this sticky floor and be your accountability partner because
You're right, you're kind of slowly expanding how you do it. And I find sometimes the stronger that muscle gets, at some point you're ready to make that jump and kind of jump deep end, the deep end of the pool to achieve whatever it is you're trying to make a decision. And I you know, I love that you've been called a C-suite whisperer and helping a lot of executives through that transformational journey. Do I stay? Do I go?
and I want to talk a little bit, what it takes to succeed as an executive and a C-suite woman these days. know a lot of times I know myself, I've been posting a lot about, you know, my family, what it looks like. you know, and, and I think sometimes we make it seem easier, because we want to be accepted and kind of like you were saying in the beginning, I'm doing the moming, I'm doing the executive, I'm running here, I'm running there.
But I want to talk, you know, some of those critical mindsets that executives need today to really, you know, be all in at their job and be all in at their home. So let's talk a little bit about that.
Erica Anderson Rooney (11:49.338)
When you ask me this question, the very first thing that I think about is vulnerability. Because when I was a C-level leader, I always felt like I had to have all the answers. And as a mom, I always felt like I had to do all the right things. I had to show up at all the school plays and just be there for drop-off every single day and pick up. And you put these societal expectations about what you should do, how you should be acting, how you should show up in the world.
And the truth is, it's not a one size fits all answer because your life is different from mine. My needs are different from yours. My family is different from yours. My work life is different from yours. My dreams are different from yours. And so when you show up with vulnerability to say, I'm struggling right now. I have too much on my plate. My kids are driving me bonkers and I can't focus on this project right now, right?
That allows you, number one, to show up and be human. And especially if you're a leader, your teams need to see that because they are also going through it and probably without as many financial resources as you. If you were the leader, you're probably making more money than they are, especially if you're in the C-suite. So show up with that vulnerability.
to show that you've got a lot going on, you've got a life out of work, and sometimes those work lives cross paths and it's not balanced at all, it's tipping both ways. And so when you show up with that vulnerability and you ask for help and you lean into those moments of messiness, other people end up stepping up to help you, and then those same other people who are on your team, who are in your company, they then feel comfortable coming to you.
when they have issues. And then you're not letting all these things go in the undercurrent and create toxic cultures and overworked individuals. I always encourage my executives, number one, show up with vulnerability. Number two, be humble and have humility because I think so often we have this air about us when we're in an executive position that we have all the answers and we know what we're doing. And guess what? You're not in the weeds. You don't know what's going on down at the line level anymore.
Erica Anderson Rooney (14:02.068)
So really be curious and ask people what are their needs, what's going on, what do I know, what do I not know, and lean into that because being curious about what's going on is huge. And then I would say, I think the last thing that is so, so, so important is to remember.
that you also have to take care of yourself, right? And that's not one that's often included in like, do executives need to do this day because it's so outward facing, but especially as women in C-level positions, you have to create space.
For you, you have to have quiet space to decompress. You have to have quiet space and quiet time to dream and be the visionary. And I know those aren't like typical answers, I think. know, usually you're thinking like resiliency and adaptability and you know, all of that. But for me, that's what really makes a great leader.
Executive Connect Host (14:59.33)
Yeah. And I think when you're vulnerable, you're human, right? Like so much of corporate now is transactional. We come to work, we do these tasks, we go home. And I think when you're vulnerable and you let people lead things or projects or bring their ideas and strategies, you're having that kind of human centric approach and hearing them and letting them bring their strengths and their voice to work. And I think
You know, a lot of times I also love empathy. think empathy is a huge thing in the corporate world these days. People have, you know, they got to get their kids to school, there's traffic, they're communing. They got a lot of things going on and being empathetic to their needs and really where they are and their journey is really important these days. I think that's a skill that most leaders need today. I want to...
kind of talk a little bit about empathy and get your perspective on how it's perceived in the workplace today. I know for me, a lot of times, if I'm too soft on employees, I'm not doing a good enough job as a leader. And if I'm too tough on employees, I'm being too aggressive. So I know for myself, I've found a lot of times empathy in the workplace working in male dominated fields, it's been considered weak.
or not a good leader by letting people show up late to work or cutting out early to get to their kids sporting events. I want to kind of get your perspective on what it means to be an empathetic leader today as a woman.
Erica Anderson Rooney (16:34.62)
my gosh, it just means to be human, right? And like, that's what it means. And we do struggle with it in the workplace, right? Because some people do think it's too soft and this is gonna be my chief people officer background coming in, but the world is not black and white. It is filled with shades of gray. And this kind of ties into like that vulnerability piece that we had.
But if you can express the vulnerability and you receive this empathetic response from your team, guess what? You owe them in return. You owe them some empathy. You owe them some grace because there is no difference between that person who is trying to get their kids to school and they're throwing French toast at them while they're running out the door and water bottles are flying and homework is lost. You're doing the same thing. You're having the same struggles. And I'll tell you, like I had this one really powerful kind of light bulb aha moment that came to
me by accident and it was in a moment of vulnerability for me where as the
as my Gen Z team taught me this, I was having a bit of a menti bee one day because I had so much going on in my life. I had just all of this stress that I literally had to step away from work for the day. And I had a lot of big meetings going on and I reached out to somebody and I said, I am struggling. I do get anxiety and depression from time to time and this has been too much for me. So I'm going to step away today. I will be back tomorrow.
You know, we kind of did some things real quick to make sure things could keep going. And later on that day, I got a text from someone on my team. And I, because I was so open, I just said, I have to step away. Like there was no excuse. Like there's a kid's concert or I have a doctor's appointment, which let's be clear, I spent years lying to people, telling them different stories of what I thought was acceptable than what was actually going on in my life, right?
Erica Anderson Rooney (18:27.036)
And what I mean by that is like, if I had to leave early for a kid's soccer game, I'd say I have a doctor's appointment because that was acceptable, right? But you're not cutting out. You're not cutting out for a doctor's appointment, but you'll cut out for your kid's soccer game, right? What's the difference? You're just not there. But so this woman on my team reached out to me and she said, thank you so much for sharing why you were not able to work.
This second half the day she said I too struggle with anxiety and depression and I have had days where I found it really hard to get out of bed, but your openness Makes me feel like I can show up like my whole self and it wasn't but a month or two later where that same person was having a really hard day and she sent me a message and she said I hope you don't mind. I'm gonna be off-camera today. I'm working from my bed because I just don't have
the will to get up and get dressed and do all the things. And I told her, you take your time. Don't even come to these meetings, right? We made other arrangements. But the point of that story is to show you that when you show up with that vulnerability and your team gives you empathy, they then come back to you with opportunities for you to also be empathetic.
And that is when you need to lean into that most. Because when she came to me with that truth bomb and a very vulnerable moment, I could have responded like, okay, just be off camera. Or, nope, get on camera, figure it out. We have these three meetings. But instead, I knew that like, hey, that could be me, that could be 10 other people on this team. Life is hard. We don't have to make it harder than it needs to be. And that's why think empathy, like you said, is so important.
Executive Connect Host (20:04.334)
Yeah, and I think about like when you said that I think think of the culture you're building. You're building a very tight, strong, transparent, truthful, collaborative culture. And I think, you know, I hear that that's a focus for a lot of companies these days is building a culture that is all in showing up to do the job. And I know you have
being a cheap people officer, you have a lot of experience in building cultures for companies. And so I want to get, I know culture since the pandemic has been a main discussion point in a lot of businesses just because everybody's either remote or in the office or hybrid. And so I want to get your perspective on what are some of the most important aspects of culture today for companies.
Erica Anderson Rooney (20:34.547)
Mm-hmm.
Erica Anderson Rooney (20:57.1)
my God, I love this topic of culture because it has shifted so much since the pandemic, right? Like, let's just flashback to pre-pandemic.
my role was to be an engagement manager. Engagement's like not even a thing anymore. Now it's all about employee experience and everything else. And so it has just shifted massively from like, let's make sure we have monthly birthday parties and we're celebrating your work anniversary and here's like a kickball tournament and a chili cook-off to things that actually matter.
in the culture, such as collaboration, which I think is one of the biggest things. You know, we mentioned earlier, if you're up in the C-suite, you do not know how people, you know, who are entering into your company as an entry-level person are living their day to day. You don't, you are so far removed. You know, so collaborating.
Curiosity is a big thing in cultures that thrive these days because everything is changing at such a rapid pace. We cannot be knowledgeable in all of the things all the time. But guess what? You can't have experts all around you all the time. So get curious and lean into that. And then I would say too, the other biggest thing about culture, which is going to be a hot topic is
Diversity, equity, and inclusion, right? Like that is under fire right now with everything going on. And if we do not have diversity of thought, if we do not have diversity of life experiences, we are gonna continue to see the same stuff, just a different day.
Executive Connect Host (22:32.63)
Yeah, and it made me think when you were saying that, I think about the positive experience you have had on that employee where you see her and you understand her and she's validated for her situation and where she is. And I think about, you know, what kind of manager, what a great manager you are for doing that for her and really seeing her. So, you know, great job on that. I wanted to talk.
a little bit about companies that don't have a great culture and they're struggling to get people all in, not leaving early and doing their best work, whether they're hybrid remote or in the office. What are some of your suggestions on what organizations can do to rebuild a toxic culture?
Erica Anderson Rooney (23:22.808)
Well, the first is actually going to kind of have to do with the little thing you said, which is cutting out early. Unless you are a shift worker, like you are on the manufacturing line, you are working in a cashier, you know, or retail and you're waiting for the next person to relieve you, no job should care about when you are showing up or when you are leaving and your job
should be outcomes based. It should not be times based. And I'm tell you why. Because I can get so much more done than the average person in five hours. Right? So does that mean for the rest three hours of the day? Like if we have an eight hour day and I get my 40 hour week job done in those five hours, I just have to sit there for three hours? And do what? Do more work? Are you gonna pay me more? Or can I maybe leave because I finished my job?
Companies that have toxic cultures need to shift from this butts in the seat mentality, nine to five working, to outcomes focused. And you need to hire for the job. And if that person can do the job and they can get it done in 20 hours, but it takes that person 40 hours, you're still paying them the same, you're getting them the same outcome, my butt doesn't have to be in seat till five o'clock. And I will tell you, I worked for a company one time where...
They really did have that butts in the seat mentality. And I was a new mom. I was so stressed because, you know, when you have these babies, you have like one hour of a day with them if you are working, right? Because I would have to work till five. I'd have an hour commute, pick up my kid from daycare, and then it's bath.
dinner and bed and that's it. And so I would try to sneak out a little early just so I could get 15 extra minutes or miss traffic, right? And somebody made a comment to me that people were noticing I wasn't there till five o'clock. And so you know what I did? I sat in that chair in front of my computer and I scrolled through People Magazine and Facebook for an hour every single day.
Erica Anderson Rooney (25:21.938)
And that's what I did with my time. It wasn't productive. It didn't add anything to the company culture. It made me upset and resentful and it took away time with my family. But because I had to be butt in the seat to make some other people happy, that's what I did. And those are the types of toxic cultures that really just number one, breed inequity across the board, but.
It keeps it stuck in that toxic place because it is such an old archaic way of looking things. So that was a very long-winded answer to say shift from butts in the seats and transactional work to outcomes focused work and you are going to see your culture have a massive shift. So that should be step one. And then step two should be go on that listening tour.
and actually talk to people about what the problem is. Because the decision makers at the top are living in such a different world, they really don't know. And if you're listening to this and you're at the top, let me tell you, as someone who's been at the top, you don't know. You have to do the surveys, you have to ask the questions, you have to spend a lot of time.
listening to your ideal client, which is your person who's doing your job. I'm not talking about the client who's buying your product. I'm not talking about your customer. Your ideal client avatar is your person because without your people, you have no product. So that, thank you for coming to my Ted Talk.
Executive Connect Host (26:46.866)
And that's a really good point Yeah, that's a good point because how you treat your people is how your people are gonna treat your clients, right and if Right and if you're you know treating them like that They're not gonna be it's gonna be a whole downhill spiral from there But I think one point you you mentioned now how awesome would it have been if your manager said?
Erica Anderson Rooney (26:54.578)
Damn that, right?
Executive Connect Host (27:09.848)
Hey Erica, why don't you cut out at this time? That gives you an extra hour at home. Would you come in a little bit early? You would have no, it would be music to your ears, right? For you to, for them to make adjustments for you and to accommodate you. And I think that's the other side of it too, is accommodating the needs of your employees. If it's something as small as leaving an hour early to get, you know, out of track of it and you've done all, you've had all your KPIs and you're on.
know, you're on goal or quota or whatever your whatever your KPIs are, it's a huge value add to employees to be seen and heard and, and or maybe it's the other direction showing up late so you could take your kids into school. think you're right with the butts in the butts in the seat mentality and which kind of leads me to my go ahead, good.
Erica Anderson Rooney (27:55.592)
Well, yeah, and I'll even say too, I'll even say too that yes and, because I even noticed a little bit with your mentality, you said, yes, you can leave an hour early, but come in an hour earlier too. No, no, no, no, no, no. Then I'd be spending my 7 a.m. scrolling TikTok and People Magazine. The question from leaders should be, are your KPIs met? Are your objectives done? Yes?
Guess? Cool. Do what you want with the rest of your free time. And that's why people love remote work, because nobody sees what you're doing, right? That's not a bad thing. You have to set up the tools and the systems to monitor and make sure that everybody's hitting their goals and their targets. Absolutely, absolutely hold people accountable, right? But accountability is not me sitting on a computer scrolling TikTok.
Right? Accountability is hitting my goals and my deadlines. Same thing on the flip side, right? Your leaders expect you to work overtime and stay late when goals are not met. Right? Often without any other compensation, especially if you're an exempt employee. So you're going to expect me to stay late if things aren't done, but I can't leave early when everything is done. Riddle me that.
Executive Connect Host (29:15.298)
Yeah, that's a really good point. think a lot of times, you could be the most overachieving person and you could hit all the metrics and a lot of companies are going to want you to do more and more and more because nothing is ever enough, right? They want you to keep pushing more and more and more. And I think that kind of goes back to having a voice like what you were saying at the beginning and knowing your boundaries and enough is enough. And sometimes it's unfortunate that companies keep pushing, pushing the
Basically people further than they want to go and they end up leaving because really great talent is hard to find that someone like yourself that can get something done in five hours versus eight is very valuable to a company versus somebody that's not all in and it's taking them longer than eight hours to get things done. So it's really unfortunate and I want to switch gears a little bit. I know
something I struggle with personally as a very ambitious woman and a mother is balancing those two things and balancing my passions as a woman, as an executive with, you know, being a motherhood. And so I want to talk about some of the challenges and rewards of both being a mother and being an executive and maybe some insights that you could share with our listeners on what that looks like for you.
Erica Anderson Rooney (30:40.836)
my gosh, this is a whole, we could have 16 hour conversation on this, but I think this question number one, it's very personal because what drives me may not be the same as what drives you or other women. And actually I was just having a conversation with my next door neighbor who was the breadwinner and an engineer for so many years and then stepped away to be with her kids more.
And it's a personal decision. It's a choice you have to make. You know, have to recognize what lights you up, what drives you. And for me,
Feeling as if I was doing something outside of the home was something that really like motivated me and I loved what I do. I love what I do, you know, and I love my kids too, but like that being a mom doesn't fulfill me completely, you know, it fulfills me. It makes me feel like the that is the most important role that I have but I get
and fulfillment and passion from all of these other things that I'm doing and if I didn't have that I don't know necessarily what kind of mom I would be. You know? And so this is very very different for everybody but what I want to say is that if you believe at this point, this moment in your life, wherever you are in motherhood or not, the choice to stay home is the right choice, then make that choice if you can. You know? If you believe the choice is to work part time.
Do that. If you just want a low pressure job just to do something else but like not be so high stakes, do that. Like it is very personal to who you are. But what I would say, and there's so many debates and books and philosophies on this work-life balance thing is that I am a firm believer that you can have it all. You can have it all, do it all, and be it all, right? You just have to define what it all looks like for you.
Erica Anderson Rooney (32:35.9)
And that could be a plethora of things. But once you redefine what it means to have it all, and you're not operating off of the old 1950s white picket fence, 2.5 kids and a dog kind of mentality, we're talking about today's it all. And this takes a lot of deep inner work to be like, actually really matters to me? Is it status? Is it pay? Is it doing meaningful work? Is it being home with my kids? Is it volunteering at my kid's school?
You have to make those decisions. Volunteering in my kid's school is not a passion project of mine. That does not light me up. I will happily send in the paper plates. No problem. So know what lights you up and know where you want to put your focus on. And so for me, I really found a very, very...
big component was that I wanted to show both of my children what you could accomplish when you went after your dreams. And for me, I felt like I'd be doing them a disservice if I didn't. And you know, I'm also in the gender equality space, so we're always talking about like what girls can do and how girls can do just as good, if not better than boys, you know, and all of these conversations. And so for me, it's like, well, I gotta walk that walk too. You know, I need to show up.
But you have to do it in a way that is meaningful to you. And what happens is you get stuck in the rat race of corporate America, chasing every promotion and accolade and salary increase that you can. And if you're like me, you may find yourself at the top of the ladder, very successful, great career, great money, and you may find yourself really freaking unhappy. And I share that because what decision is right for you today?
in motherhood and in your career may not be the right decision for you in a year, in two years, in three years. And it can change and it can shift. And so be flexible with yourself, right? Be flexible with...
Executive Connect Host (34:30.542)
you
Erica Anderson Rooney (34:37.596)
where you want to put your priorities, right? Little babies, they have different needs than 16 year olds and 17 year olds, you know? And those 16 and 17 year olds, they have different needs than grown married children, but you are always going to be a mother, you know? And so all of that is always going to change and just give yourself grace, be flexible with it.
and really think about what does it mean to you to have it all? And if you can answer that question, you will know how you need to show up in motherhood and how you need to show up in a career.
Executive Connect Host (35:13.003)
Yeah, I find for me being similar personality, it's a scheduling thing. And it's a planning thing a lot of times, putting things on a calendar, scheduling it out. You know, I've had 15 to 22 hour work travel days. And then the next day, I'm, you know, spending more time in the morning with my kids or cutting out early to kind of put more energy back into the family. And so I do love that you said that I think
I don't subscribe myself to the analogy you can't have it all. I do like you believe that you can't have it all. You just have to decide what it all is. like I know the way I see, you know, family and work is it's, it's, it's, I'm a better mother. I'm a better leader and executive because I'm a mother, because I have to be more focused and scheduled and plan and better because like you said, I have to get things done in five hours because
Oftentimes as women, we have not only just the kids, we might have our immediate family. We have more than just our careers. have women are typically always the caretakers a lot of times in the family for extended and aging parents. And so I think it is a scheduling thing and a planning thing. Like you said, my three-year-old needs very different care than my 14-year-old.
really asking my family too what they need. And really the other side of it, I would say for women is, know, asking your kids how you're showing up and how you are to them. If you're really strung out with your job, working a lot of hours, you're gonna be short tempered with your kids and you have to decide if that's something you want. And so a lot of times I ask for feedback with my kids and I say, you know, how has it been the last few weeks that have been stressful and
And get their buy-in with it and share, I'm going out of town for work for a week, but I'm going to cut out early on Friday and come get you early from school and we're going to do these other things. So I think, you know, to women out there that are kind of struggling with that, you know, kind of suck, asking for feedback for your husbands or your partners or your kids and seeing what they think of how you're showing up or your friends, like you were saying, right?
Executive Connect Host (37:38.254)
10 accountability partners. And so I want to talk kind of a little bit, one kind of final question I want to talk to you about, and it really kind of ties back to motherhood too, but I feel like a lot of women are just absolutely and completely overwhelmed with everything, whether it's their job or their family or politics or the economy or inflation, they're just really.
Like you said, having a hard time getting out of bed. And so I want to get your advice to those executive women that are really looking at themselves and their future and trying to decide what their career growth is going to be. And maybe just any advice you'd offer them on how to get out of those sticky floors.
Erica Anderson Rooney (38:29.34)
Yes, well number one, and I say this on my podcast all the time, but girl, get you a therapist because everyone needs a good therapist because, here's why, if your shit isn't hitting the fan today, that is the best time to be in therapy because now when you were in a good place, you were gathering all of the tools and the skills and everything you need to know for when it does hit the fan, and it will hit the fan because that is life. So number one, get you a therapist. But then number two,
This has been the biggest thing for me in my journey and in just figuring it all out all the way up to the corporate ladder, traveling international, having babies and then leaving to do my own business. Right? So like that's a whole 16 lives in a couple short years is find a friend, find someone in your network who is on that same path as you.
Because when you're having those bad days and you need to go to somebody to talk to, they can understand you. And I'll tell you this, as a C-level leader, my husband was not a C-level leader. So he could not understand the stresses that I had. He couldn't understand why I couldn't just let it go. And he also couldn't understand the stresses that I had of being a mother who was in the C-level who was being asked to travel internationally all the time.
So I went out and I found myself some other moms with kids about my age in C level positions who were doing the damn thing. And I could connect with them. Number one, they could help me with tips and tricks and all that good jazz. But just having someone there to say, yeah, Erica, sometimes it really does suck. Sometimes it is really hard. It makes you feel less alone. And then you're also looking at them and.
I know for me, I never recognize this in the moment, but as I'm having these conversations when I'm in those places, later I'm able to reflect back and say, okay, they get it, they understand, they've experienced it, and guess what? They've gotten through it. And so I can get through it too.
Erica Anderson Rooney (40:34.844)
So the biggest thing, especially women, especially mothers, is a strong support system, a strong emotional support system. Because again, you are that person that is constantly pouring into everyone's cup. You need someone to pour into yours. And even if you gotta go ask that person to please pour into your cup, you still gotta do it. So therapy and a great support system outside of that.
Executive Connect Host (41:00.49)
I love that you mentioned that and I think that's a really good point is having a board I call it a board of advisors for different pieces of my life if I need if I have financial questions about part of my life I have somebody to go to it's like you said if I having mom issues I have a different friend I asked those things and
So I think you're spot on with that. Having friends and your ride or dies in your life are very important if you're an executive woman and also a mother. I think if you don't have a board, you should start working on that now. And definitely having someone to talk to you about the stresses versus doing it at your job or at your home. And then I also say journal.
Writing, writing some of your goals down and thinking through things on paper. I don't think a day goes by that I don't start my day on paper and thinking through what I need to accomplish. you know, there's been months, Erica, where I've had the same thing on my to do for like a month, because I just really didn't have, you know, the mental, the mental strength or capacity to handle it. So
Journaling is also another, I think, really important thing to get things off your chest and on paper. Thank you so much for being here. I really appreciate you. I know you're really busy and I want to just get any final thoughts or anything in closing that you want to share with our listeners.
Erica Anderson Rooney (42:29.93)
my gosh, my final thought, and this is how I end a lot of my podcasts, is to just stop putting ceilings over what you believe is possible. And it's time to start smashing through them. We all have those limiting beliefs. We all have things that we do, like Too Much Wine on a Wednesday and doom scrolling TikTok. we don't need to do all that, y'all. We don't need to do that. But we do. And it's part of who we are. And so recognize that.
But to answer that question in the very beginning about what sticky floors women really struggle with the most and knowing their worth is just know that you are enough just as you are. And you are unique and you are so special. mean, think about it. There are 8.3 billion people in the world, and every single one of us has a unique fingerprint on each one of our fingers. That is not by accident. We are here to be unique and authentic and to go through life together like this. So.
just shatter those ceilings that you're placing over yourselves and believe in infinite possibilities because when you truly start to believe that, you start to see that.
Executive Connect Host (43:38.486)
I love that. Thank you so much for sharing that with us. And thank you so much for being here with us today, Erica. That's the Executive Connect podcast.