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A podcast that holds horror to standards horror never agreed to. Hosts Jeremy Whitley, Ben Kahn, Emily Martin and guests watch, read, listen to, and check out movies, tv shows, comics, books, art and anything else from the horror genre and discuss it through a progressive lens. We'll talk feminism in horror, LGBTQ+ issues and representation in horror, racial and social justice in horror, disability and mental health/illness in horror, and the work of female and POC directors, writers, and creators in horror.
We're the podcast horror never agreed to take part in.
Ben: Real quick, what did
y'all think of the movie?
Did you like it?
Emily: I did.
Alicia: if you say you
didn't like it I don't know.
I, I think I won't understand
anything about you.
Ben: it should have been there,
but it just never quite clicked.
Alicia: I thought this
would be like a home run.
Ben: It should have been.
Alicia: Okay.
Emily: liked it.
I did like it.
I, I was laughing out loud
Jeremy: Good evening and welcome to
progressively horrified the podcast where
we hold order to progressive standards.
It never agreed to tonight We're
talking about the new And wonderful.
Film from, uh, Zelda
Williams and Diablo Cody.
It is Lisa Frankenstein.
I'm your host Jeremy Whitley and
with me tonight I have a panel
of cinephiles and cnobites.
First, they're here to challenge
the sexy werewolf, sexy vampire
binary, my co host Ben Kahn.
Ben, how are you tonight?
Ben: I was expecting the
Beetlejuice influence.
I was expecting the Heathers influence.
The American Pie influence
took me by surprise.
Emily: I am so happily
innocent of that film.
Ben: Well, both Lisa Frankenstein and
American Pie, Uh, the plot hinges on
trying to lose your virginity before
a arbitrary ticking time clock.
Emily: Okay.
Jeremy: And, uh, you've already
heard them, the Cinnamon Roll
Sino Bites Arcos, Emily Martin.
How are you tonight, Emily?
Emily: Do, de de de de de de de, de.
We sort of have a Trent watch.
I'll explain later.
We have an
Jeremy: a Porky Pig Trent watch and
Emily: it's
Ben: To
Emily: like barely a Trent watch.
Jeremy: Trench watch.
Emily: De de de
Ben: to to to to to Reznor.
Emily: Ressner watch.
No, I mean it's, definitely, I'm
seeing, I'm looking at you Zelda
Williams and Diablo Cody and I see you.
However, I will say that I didn't
see The entire film relied on the
virginity thing, but there was
definitely a turning point in this
movie where they're like, you know,
Jeremy: There's some choice
Needle drops in this film.
We've talked a lot about needle
drops in the last few months.
it's rare that it's been wave of
mutilation we're talking about.
And, uh, I love a good, I love a good
deployment of wave of mutilation.
Emily: yeah.
And this was actually
an accurate deployment.
That was a 1989 track from the Pixies.
Jeremy: Yeah, and, and accurate to what's
happening in the movie at the time.
Ben: I'm, I'm, I'm, a bit of a
minority report situation tonight.
I don't think I enjoyed the movie as much
as y'all did, and I, not as much as I,
Hoped I would or was expecting to all the
a lot of pieces are there But it but a few
things didn't quite come together for me.
Jeremy: I think it took me a minute
Ben: are purely subjective
Jeremy: think it took me a minute
to get on the level of this movie.
I think I wanted, or was
expecting something a little
more like Jennifer's body.
In the, just like, I don't
know if it's the mean sardonic
sense of Jennifer's body.
But like this movie does some nice
things, I think updates some of the
formula, you know, in an interesting way.
We'll talk about that.
I definitely enjoyed this one
Ben: what one of the strengths of
Jennifer's body is its tone is consistent.
It is late.
It is a laser focused movie tonally This
movie, I feel like, bounces a little
bit around, like, it takes a little
while to lean into the black comedy.
Jeremy: When it leans, it leans hard.
Emily: sure
Ben: yeah, like, I feel like it was
a little, it was a little uneasy,
like a little, it wasn't quite as
consistent tonally, and I don't feel
like it ever quite landed comfortably.
It got better as it went along and
leaned more into letting Catherine
Newton just go fucking insane.
The more balls to the walls Catherine
Newton got, the better the movie was.
Emily: Literally.
Jeremy: Yeah.
I think, um, so this, like we said,
this is directed by Zelda Williams
and it's written by Diablo Cody.
Catherine Newton is, is the star,
but I think some of there's like some
difference makers in this movie, uh,
Liza Silverano, who plays her sister
Taffy, uh, really shines in this.
She's the piece that isn't in like
a Jennifer's body or something
like that, but they're like, Hey.
Uh, what if she had a sister that
is Legit a good person, maybe not
the smartest person, but like is
really is trying to like make this
weirdo feel loved and at home.
But also the rest of the world sucks.
Because we have an, an outstanding bad
step mom performance by Carla Gugino
Ben: Oh, Carla Cugino, holy shit.
Carla Cugino, who clearly fasted
a week before walking on set
because she ate all of the scenery.
Carla Cugino is Amazing, like, oh my god,
a hairline of, no one coddled me when my
father, when my dad blew up in Da Nang.
Holy shit!
Jeremy: Yeah.
And, uh, I, I was actually, I was
pretty happy with the performance of
Cole Sprouse feeling like he's kind of.
channeling the monster
from young Frankenstein in
Ben: felt he was underutilized.
Like, I didn't, like, I feel like you
can still do play with, like, grunts
and expressions, but I don't feel like
he really, you know, compared to, say,
like, um, Daniel Radcliffe in Swiss
Army Man, like, don't, like, I felt a
little, he was a little underutilized,
and I didn't like his sideburns.
His sideburns bothered me.
Jeremy: it's a double edged sword,
I think, because like, part of the
reason that it works for me is that
he can't talk for most of the movies.
So, so much of it is Katherine
Newton talking to herself, and like,
she does this performance so well.
She plays this like, character who is
just like, Doesn't talk to anybody,
but like, sort of superimposes
this romantic image onto this, you
know, Frankenstein like creature.
Just to like, have somebody to talk to.
Like, she just decides that he
is whatever she thinks he is.
So like, she can talk to somebody about
all this shit that's messed up about her.
Ben: And again, the more they lead
into her just being absolutely
bonkers, like, the better.
Like, I felt like that was when the
movie clued in and keyed into its tone.
Like, when she's apologizing to
her sister, like, in the car after
some, like, some light axe murder.
It just takes a while for
the movie to get there.
Also, I really do have to, uh,
highlight, Liza Sober Soberano.
She is fantastic.
And it this is the part that's a
little subject that's just not a little
subjective, that is purely subjective.
Unfortunately, just like, a good chunk of
the humor just kind of didn't work for me.
Just really didn't get much of a
reaction except for all of Taffy's lines.
All of Taffy's lines made me laugh.
She had some absolute incredible bangers.
Like, you don't have to worry
about anything because your
mom's already been murdered.
Emily: there's a lot of shit.
I mean, half of the dialogue,
I feel, was a reference to
Ben: I called a psychic hotline
and she was actually Jamaican.
Another fucking banger.
Emily: I mean, she was
talking to Miss Cleo.
We all know that, right?
And I mean, I don't know,
Ben: for you youngins who
need to know about Ms.
Cleo, I don't feel like explaining it.
There's gotta
Jeremy: I'm sure it's on the YouTube.
I mean, there's a,
Ben: look at Ms.
Cleo.
Jeremy: There's a whole
documentary on Netflix now.
Emily: yeah, look up the Miss Cleo
fraudsters, you'll figure it out.
I don't think she was actually Jamaican,
but, you know, her character kinda was.
I don't know where, I don't,
all I remember is that she's fun
to watch at one in the morning.
Ben: I think another I hate to be just
denying, cause like, there's plenty
about this movie that is fun, and I
would love to highlight it, but Some
things that didn't work is I didn't
feel like Lisa had a lot of agency,
or especially early on in the movie.
you know, if this is a Frankenstein
story, one thing that to me really,
really sets it apart from any other
Frankenstein story is that there is never
a conscious decision to create life.
That she does not, that
happenstance brings him back
to life that she then doesn't.
That she then also isn't the
one to start the killing spree.
Cause I love Catherine Noone.
I would have liked to have seen
more agency from Lisa in the
first two acts of the movie.
Jeremy: I feel like there's a lot
that's said in, like, Lisa has this
line where right after, uh, the, you
know, the creature shows up where
she's like, oh, I didn't mean that
I wanted you to come back to life.
I meant I wanted to die.
And I think that's like a real, like,
Either, I think at that point in the
movie, either you're, you're with it or
you're not, like, it's, I think the, the
sort of defining, this isn't Frankenstein
movie I think the problem with me, if
I have a problem with this movie is the
title, uh, which is just just a gimmick.
It's just a gag because Lisa
Frank, Frankenstein is a
fun gag for like, oh, it's.
this, you know, super girly
80s Frankenstein movie.
It has very little to do
with the movie itself.
Like, I think it sets it up for,
to be something that it isn't.
Ben: Yeah.
And we also
Emily: Science for Girls, like
it should, that's, that's what it
Ben: that would have been better.
We also just watched another modern
update on Frankenstein Angry Black Girl
and Her Monster, and I love that movie.
Emily: this movie is not commenting on
anything really, except for, there's
a couple lines in it where I'm like,
okay, all right, I mean, you know, just,
sure, but where, you know, there's,
I'm happy that those lines are there,
they're very, like, and winners don't
use drugs in a little bit of way, but
not that this movie is against drugs.
Jeremy: no, I mean, she's
the Sally Ride of drugs.
A line that did make me laugh
maniacally when she said it.
Emily: yeah, this movie, like, it's
not a Frankenstein movie it's not a
commentary movie, it's dumb, and fun,
and it referenced a lot of things
that, like, sometimes some of them
were a little bit much for me, but
I, I was here for the whole ride.
Ben: so I feel like, as like, this
movie suffers from a misleading title
and also from misleading trailers,
because the trailers definitely made
it seem like the romance between,
uh, Lisa and Cole Sprouse, was gonna
be like really front and center,
Emily: Mm
Ben: and for like the first hour
twenty of this hour thirty five movie,
she's mostly just after this like, you
know, like, school editor guy, and I
get that, like, having another love
interest there, like, you know, love
triangle, teen drama, killing, killing.
But that, she, that, that Cole
Sprouse isn't the overt object
of like, romantic interest.
Until, like, the very end of the movie,
like, what I thought was going to be
the whole movie, it was just like,
Nope, we're in the last ten minutes
of the movie and they're in love now.
Emily: yeah, that was an unusual
presentation of that, because I was,
because the, the poster of the movie is
them in bed together, so I was assuming
that, you know, there was more like, I
was getting my boyfriend's back vibes,
Ben: Yeah, this, again, this set up
being like, Oh, she's alienated from
the living, like, you know, Beetlejuice
style, she, Very, you know, Mary
Shelley, You know, Byronic Hero is
longing for this long dead person.
And I thought that was gonna be
the whole trigger for the romance.
So that there is this whole other guy who
is still the primary love interest for
the vast majority, like almost the whole
movie's runtime was just like a decision
that really just threw me off instead of
having the, like the relationship between
Catherine Newton and Cole Sprouse, just
as this over having this more of an overt
romantic focus throughout the movie.
Emily: yeah,
Jeremy: I feel like this is
evolution of, of the monster of,
Cole Sprouse's character over time
Ben: Oh, every time, yeah,
I love the tanning bed.
I love attaching parts to him and
he just gets Cole Sprouse ier every
time he goes in the tanning bed.
Jeremy: Yeah, like, he is what
she needs throughout the movie.
Like, first he's just a companion, just
somebody to confide in, and then, he
gets the ear and can hear her, and then
he gets the hand and can touch her,
and then, um, you know, we, we all know
what happens at the end of this movie.
So like, it's you know, it,
it goes in steps of like,
when she's ready, he is ready.
So like, I think like, she's trying to
make this thing work with this boy who
like, I don't really have any chemistry.
She, he never seems interested
in her but like, she
Ben: Oh, he is leading her on like crazy.
He is
Emily: which the,
Ben: completely leading her on.
He bastard, man.
Emily: Michael Trent.
Ben: But yeah, he's no fucking Trent
Crim independent, I'll tell you that.
Emily: Yeah so do we want
to get into this recap?
Because I've been, I have a
lot of, I, a lot of my opinions
are expressed via recap.
So, yeah, so we have this movie.
It starts out with this this adorable
little corpse bride, uh, animated sequence
which is, I guess, about the corpse.
He's,
Ben: cute, I liked the
little animated intro, yeah.
Emily: that was very cute.
But the movie itself, it's 1989,
Lisa Swallows is a goth, but she's
in a small enough town that she
doesn't know how to find the black
lipstick, so she's also dressed by
her, uh, yuppie stepsister Taffy, who
is the best, and did nothing wrong.
Ben: In terms of Black Lives Against
the World Not Existing, We had
this, I don't know Carla Gugino
has the slides like, Well, or did
you enjoy being the hot topic?
And she definitely like, And
she definitely name dropped it
like it's a Marvel hero that's
gonna show up in a future movie.
Emily: yeah, that's, I mean, that's how
I, I had to rewind it, because I was
like, did she just call her a hot topic?
Ben: Yes, yeah, she absolutely did.
Emily: At this point, though, she has
barely been Hot Topic but we'll get there.
We'll get there.
So, Lisa Swallows, she's in love with a
corpse and she has some emotional baggage.
Apparently her mom was killed by Jason
Voorhees or Michael Myers or somebody,
you know, that doesn't really matter a
Ben: No, no, never
Jeremy: me, that the rest of
you guys thought that this
was gonna be plot relevant.
Ben: Of course!
Emily: I
Ben: What movie has ever introduced a
not plot relevant axe murderer until now?
Jeremy: I'm not a plot relevant axe
murderer who wears a mask and got away.
Emily: yeah.
Yeah,
Jeremy: like I, considering the speed
with which her dad gets remarried
afterwards, I was like, Oh, it's
either her dad or the stepmom.
Ben: Okay, I absolutely thought
it was the dad at first, But
then they reveal who the dad is?
You And it's the fucking guy
from Stranger Things, AGAIN!
We just fucking saw this guy
playing the exact same fucking
dad in Assassination Nation!
Jeremy: he is, he is even
less here in this movie.
Like, and I think like they, I
think they cast him because they
were after a feeling, right?
They were like,
Emily: a vibe.
Jeremy: We want detached dad
who is just like, yes, honey,
Ben: I've ever seen.
Jeremy: Yeah.
He's just, he's there to
say yes, hon, whatever.
Okay.
And like not take, like
specifically not take an active
role in his daughter's life.
Especially like, Since he very
much should be in this case.
He's the only like birth parent she has
left She's in a Cinderella situation
here except her dad's not dead.
He's just
Emily: he might as well be.
Jeremy: absent while still being there
Emily: Yeah,
Ben: at least 60 percent of this man's
Lifetime screen time has to be spent
reading a newspaper and not paying
attention to his fictional kids.
Emily: the dude who played Lurch had
more variety in the characters he played.
Yeah, most of his characters were
tall and silent, but like, Lurch had
a different silhouette than like, Mr.
Hom.
Ben: For the record though, to the actual
actor Joe Krest, nothing but respect.
Fucking get that money.
You have a thing you are good
at that is clearly in demand.
Emily: hope he's okay with it.
Ben: yeah, get that dolla
dolla bill Joe Krest.
Fucking nothing but respect.
Go off you inattentive king.
Emily: Yeah, go off as much as you can.
Anyway, so we have Lisa.
Lisa, the emotional baggage.
Taffy wants her to just fit in.
She cares a lot about her.
For real though and uh, we also find
out that Lisa Swallows is into one guy
and his name is Michael Trent, not to
be confused with Michael Trent Reznor.
In fact, this man, this character
has more riz than I'm sure Michael
Trent Reznor did at that age.
For more on that, hit me
up on Blue Sky or Discord.
Anyway, so,
Ben: Or just find Emily's Teenage
Trent Reznor fanfic on AO3.
We won't tell you where to find
it, but you know it's there.
Emily: it's not on AO3.
Yeah,
Jeremy: channel, baby.
Emily: yeah, if you know, donate
to our Patreon if you want that.
Ben: it is in the deep dark sea,
it is in the web one, the archives,
Emily: it's in the deep web,
Ben: relics of the internet of the bygone
era, the byzantine empire of the internet,
oh that was our child, our teenage dumb,
Emily: Listen, Wayback Machine.
So anyway, speaking of the Wayback
Machine, Lisa gets dosed by
some sort of psychedelic by the
Transfollo Darksider, Tamera.
And then her nerdy classmate Doug,
who she was in lab with one time,
Ben: oh I hate
Emily: her.
Yeah, he's, he's really like
here to represent the nerds
upon whom we must have revenge.
she escapes him and finds herself in
her beloved bachelor's grove in the
the safe company of her dead crush.
Now, several needle drops and one
totally wicked dream sequence later,
this dream sequence fucking kicks ass.
Like, Billy Corgan wishes
Jeremy: Yeah, we got the voyage to the
moon is very heavily referenced in this
movie In a way that I did not see coming.
Ben: did we properly
establish that Doug, the
Jeremy: Or a trip to the moon.
Ben: Like, it is full on sexual assault,
he is Doug the sex criminal nerd, and what
happens to him should have happened to all
the characters in Revenge of the Nerds.
Emily: yeah,
Jeremy: he finds her already, like,
having a bad trip and is like,
Oh, let me help take care of you.
And then is like, let me
put your hand on my crotch.
Oh, once we've started, we can't stop.
Like, you can't just, like, blue ball me.
And, you know, she runs
away from that one.
But, uh, yeah, that, that
fucker deserves to die.
Emily: yeah, so, uh, don't worry,
Jeremy: came back to die
later, I was like, Oh, good.
Ben: Oh, his death scene is one
of my favorites in the movie.
That I love.
Emily: bless.
Ben: Again, when the movie is going full
on, Jennifer's body meets Heather's.
Like, that's it's sweet spot.
It just doesn't spend enough
time in that sweet spot.
Emily: there's a lot
of spots in this movie.
So anyway, several, so after our needle
drops and our dream sequence, we see, we
get to meet the rest of Lisa's family.
Her dad is a pushover that
is consistently on Valium.
As we have said, Stranger Things dad looks
at a newspaper through his glasses and
doesn't give a shit about anything ever.
her stepmom is a New Age
Republican psych nurse.
She is the worst.
Ben: Apollo Gugino is
the best in this movie.
Emily: she is like the,
like the evil Sally Field.
Like, she is the evilest Sally Field
that you have ever seen in your life.
Jeremy: I mean, she pops up, she is a
nurse and she pops up in full on nurse
ratchet cosplay at one point, like.
Ben: It's great.
Emily: So, later, uh, Lisa encounters
the dreamboat Michael Trent at her work,
which is at a clothing shop under quote
unquote Wayne, who is the worst dude ever.
This man also, I'm sad this
man did not get harvested.
Ben: The casual sexual harassment and
tasteful Duran Duran ladies on the wall.
Emily: Every shop that was
not, like, a computer store had
Patrick Nagel on the wall in 1989.
This is true.
I was there.
I can tell you right now, any shop
that has to do with anything to do
with fashion, Patrick Nagel everywhere.
Okay.
So, uh, we find out that Lisa is
a vegetarian amidst a bunch of sex
jokes while her family gets ready
for a late night showing of Look
Who's Talking, solidly defining
when our movie is taking place.
While the family is out, Lisa
is attacked by a muddy intruder,
igniting all sorts of traumas
about her mom's unfortunate demise.
But, fortunately for Lisa, she is savvy
enough to recognize that the intruder
is a zombie and harmless, not the
axe murderer that was never caught.
This will probably not
be brought up again.
Um, yeah,
Ben: won't.
That axe murderer is just there,
presumably axe murdering to this day.
Emily: yeah, which is like, you know,
surprising that she turned around on
zombie intruder so quickly, but once he
was on that shoe phone, she was like, Oh
no, this guy isn't here to X murder me.
Um,
Ben: went on to be Adam Brody's
dad and Jennifer's body.
It's all one shared universe.
Emily: I believe so.
So anyway, yeah, it's the
corpse she was fighting over.
It has been reanimated by a drunken
wish and magical ball lightning.
Lisa is not as enthused about
it as she thought she would be.
Still, she does her best to take
care of Edward One Hand and they
play dress up and listen to post
Ben: Oh, I love the montage.
We get There's such like,
zoom mech us ness about it.
Like,
Emily: Oh yeah,
Ben: chase.
Like, it's not a scary chase scene.
It's a shenanigans filled chase
Emily: is, this is
absolutely a shenanigans
Ben: Cole Sprouse wears, like,
Puts on zombie makeup and dresses
in a pretty pretty princess dress.
I like that.
He, which he should have kept on.
We should have gotten zombie
princess Cole Sprouse.
Emily: I kind of.
Thought that he might be gay, but, um,
spoilers, he's not gay, as far as we know.
He might be
Ben: He's bi oh, yeah,
of course, he's bi ronic.
Of course he's bisexual.
Emily: Right,
Jeremy: Byronic bisexual.
Emily: bisexual.
Byronic
Ben: where like, it's that like, I don't
know, just like the, that dark dandiness
that just screams goes both ways.
Emily: Yeah.
So, yeah, despite the smell,
uh, Lisa can successfully hide
him from their, her family.
But her mom is the worst, again,
and blames her for the damage of
the house intrusion, or invasion,
well, you know what I mean.
So anyway, apparently the corpse
groom is good at accidental makeovers,
and avoiding being seen while Mr.
Magooing around the house
with the despicable Janet.
Ben: the corpse pride influence is all
over the fucking place in this movie.
Emily: Yeah, Janet, dammit, Janet,
yes, everything in this movie is a
reference, and that's okay to me.
But continuing on so Lisa has this,
uh, new look and she is slaying
with her skeezer pirate dress
that, um, the corpse groom told her
to wear with his gesticulations.
And later she thanks
him over some trolleos.
How can she ever repay him?
Maybe fix his hand?
Well, Taffy says you shouldn't try to fix
a boy, it's better to accept his flaws.
Taffy, I hope that you live a long
and beautiful, happy life, and you
don't need this baggage at all.
Ben: I worry about how many dating
tips Taffy takes from Cosmo.
Emily: I think that Taffy, like, in
her mind, you know, once she realizes
that an IP is, you know, that she's
not a fucking indigo child or whatever,
you know, once she goes to college,
she's gonna be like, she's, she is
gonna become a civil rights lawyer.
That's who Taffy is gonna be.
Ben: But did we get the scene of,
uh, Cole Sprouse putting a worm in
Carla Gugino's soup or whatever?
Cause that's one of my favorite exchanges
in the movie, where the fucking, like,
door to door salesman, like, Like carpet
shampoo guy knocks on the door and
she goes you could eat off my carpet
and he responds with is that an offer?
Emily: yeah that was part of the Mr.
Magoo shit that Corpse
Groom is doing around the
Ben: casual Carla Gugino Cunnilingus
banter needs to be spotlighted.
Emily: is, this is not the first time.
In the Look Who's Talking scene,
she talks about cheerleader
moves and things like that.
There's a lot of sex jokes.
I mean, I'm trying not to get
into, much into the minutiae, but,
you know, the dialogue is good.
I really love the dialogue in this movie.
Anyway, so as Dead Byron and Lisa
are talking she has to put him
away quickly because Nurse Ratchet
Janet is here to be shitty and call
Lisa a hot topic and abuse her.
Lisa's gonna be institutionalized,
but what's this?
My boyfriend's back and
he's killing my stepmom.
Lisa is saved.
Janet is buried in Disney's
Ben: No, no, no.
No, she is not buried
They do not bury her.
They just dump her body in an
empty hole and walk the fuck away
Emily: buried?
She is below the
Ben: that is dumped.
Buries implies that there
is something on top of her
Emily: I think there
Jeremy: throw him in his empty grave.
Ben: Yeah, like, how did they think
they wouldn't be caught just throwing
bodies in an empty hole in the ground?
Emily: I, you know, there's a lot that
trauma can do to you, and also being
dosed by like, a weird psychedelic beer.
Like, I'm just saying there's such
thing as magic ball lightning that
makes your wish come true, I don't know.
This is like, weird
science level bullshit.
Uh,
Ben: that's the tan.
That's like the magical tanning bed.
Emily: well, yeah, I mean, but the,
there was magic and weird science
because they used, you know, they had
the doll and then they gave her Houdini
powers somehow with the internet.
Thank Christ this movie
doesn't have internet in it.
Okay, so they, Janet is, okay, left in a
hole in Disney's Adventureland, my bad.
Dead Byron gets a new ear
with a cool diamond earring.
He is also further rehabilitated
through Taffy's terrifying tanning
bed, which has got some sort of wire
short that nobody seems to want to fix.
Um,
Ben: restores Cole Sprouse's, skin.
He gets more Cole Sprouse y every time.
If you're wondering, though what does
tan Cole Sprouse look like, don't worry.
The tanning bed can work some
miracles, but not even it
can give Cole Sprouse a tan.
Emily: well good, because I I mean, he,
Jeremy: He goes from undead to
Byron over the course of the movie.
Emily: yeah, he goes from undead to, like,
Ben: The best this tanning bed can
do is make him still very pale.
Yeah, it's consumption, yeah.
Emily: So, um, further emboldened
by her weird science, Lisa takes
out her revenge on the nerd Doug.
Now supplying Dead Byron
with a brand new hand.
Um, also he's
Ben: I like how Cole Sprouse throws
an axe to hit him in the back of the
head as he runs, as the nerd runs away.
It is comically long how long
it takes that axe to hit him.
Emily: Oh yeah,
Ben: through the air for so long.
Emily: yeah, that's like the first
scene in Natural Born Killers
level bullshit, and I love it.
Um,
Jeremy: I really do enjoy what is it?
Catherine Newton yells in this
scene, she cuts off his hand.
Ben: I told you, well she
Emily: I told you I'd hold your hand!
Ben: Yeah, she sets up a one
liner about holding hands.
Jeremy: And then cuts off his hand and
yells, I told you I'd hold your hand.
Ben: and again, that's what I'm
saying, I feel like, I like that
moment, but I feel like, That would
have felt more meaningful if there,
If the romance between her and Cole
Sprouse had been more front and center.
Like, if she was going into it
more now with the aspect of,
like, Now I will be able to hold
hands with, like, my boyfriend.
Emily: Yeah.
Yeah.
Like, she's treating Cole Sprouse
like her gay best friend a
Ben: Yeah!
Yeah!
Emily: is why I thought
he was gonna, like, not
Ben: the fact that he's got the one
earring doesn't help that dynamic.
Especially, especially in the 80s.
Emily: Yes,
Jeremy: With the, with the
diamond studs that we find out are
already promised to, uh, Taffy.
Emily: She'll get one.
That's
Ben: Look, she learned how to
do a back tuck, and that's a
back tuck, and that's a big D!
Emily: Yeah, that is a big D.
We'll talk about the big D later, but the,
so, a few more doses of UV radiation and
this dude Dead Byron might start giving
Tim Curry instead of Meatloaf Eddie,
which I'm, I agree about the sideburns.
The sideburns were unfortunate.
He needed to, like, trim,
Ben: Yeah, yeah.
Also, absolutely fucking love
the, uh, Rocky Horror reference.
Masterfully done.
Emily: Thank you.
Well, they said Damage Anna
earlier, so, like, it was kind
of a, you know, it was rote.
So Lisa and Frank, they play Mario
Speedwagon together and then Frank
starts feeling stinky emotions.
And we find out that also Lisa's
really not good at obfuscation,
and this is pretty consistent
through the rest of the film.
And this
Jeremy: I really appreciate the gag
of every time he cries it smells
terrible, like every time there's
an emotional moment there's a
reason for them to like break the,
Emily: They have to break the
te the actual, like, mood.
Ben: Well, they bring it up twice,
and I thought it was gonna really
come up in, like, a plot relevant
way at the third time, and then it
didn't really come up a third time.
Emily: I kinda like it
on an allegorical level.
But, you know, This movie also,
too early, and not California
enough to use the term hella.
And I'm Calling You Out
movie, that is my one
Ben: movie not respecting the
chronology of California surfer slang.
Emily: It's skater slang.
Jeremy: So wait, what
did she say hella about?
Emily: It was, she had a, that's true,
skaters are the surfers of the street.
Um, so, She had a doll
that was like, hella nice.
Jeremy: so the doll is named
after Catherine Newton's actual
dog, is, it's like a, a thing.
like chronologically I should say
it doesn't make sense, but her dog,
Catherine Newton's dog in real life
is named Starlight Rosebud, hella
good boy gonna need a big bank.
Ben: That's adorable!
I love that!
Emily: okay.
Now I'm okay with it.
Ben: Based I know that's wonderful.
Emily: I am back on
board on this long board.
Okay.
So, janet's disappearance is starting
to alarm the Laffy Taffy family
while Frank Ferter gets Lisa off
with her quote unquote back massager.
Or maybe she gets him off with it.
It's kind of unclear.
Either way.
Lisa is now determined to lose
her virginity to Michael Trent.
Riz.
We, uh, see amidst the fallout of
the disappearances, Janet and Doug.
Lisa acts entirely suss.
She has no idea how to
like keep this on the dl.
She's interrogated by the police,
Tamara, the other dark sider.
Is trying to rat her out.
Meanwhile, the real term editor of this
story has learned to drive a manual
transmission after beating a homophobe
to death with the Cyan and Magenta Club.
Yes, the club used to
secure steering wheels.
You remember those?
No?
That's okay.
Ben: I love how the kid is just
like yo, thanks for beating up
my grandpa You're a real one.
Emily: yeah, the kid, uh, watches,
Frankenfurter walk, like, drive away.
And is like waving and clapping.
Um,
Jeremy: love that, uh, that
she points out the gag with the
club when she gets in the car.
Catherine Newton is like, why
is there blood on this club?
You know it's not that
kind of club, right?
Like, throws it in the backseat.
Ben: I do love that implication
that the issue isn't the murder.
It's that he used the wrong kind of club
Emily: I mean, she's on a, in such
a different level than everything
else that I appreciate her.
I mean, like, the club almost
seems like I, you know, if it
was me, I wouldn't point it out
because I feel like it's there.
Ben: moments again.
What I like in this movie is when it goes
full on With it's like, pop aesthetic,
like, gory black comedy, like again, the
scene, like, we get, there's a great shot
of, it's them in the car, they're covered
in, like, you know, splash of blood.
And they're in front of, like, this
big, low angle shot, big, imposing
house that's, like, broil, like, is
hot pink, like, bubblegum pink house.
And it's just, there's times where
it's, like, it's like this movie is,
like, close to getting Super Saiyan, but
Krillin hasn't exploded yet, and so Goku,
like, we get the flashes of the Super
Saiyan, where it's, like, It's like,
and I'm not, and I know this is Zelda
Williams like, first movie, I think it's
a really well done movie, especially
for a first time director, I think
there's a lot of great style and voice
but I, I wish the movie had been able to
like, maintain those consistency, like,
those aesthetic highs and that level of
energy that it does at its best moments.
Jeremy: I feel like we didn't talk
about Zelda Williams at all, right?
Like, wait, we mentioned her name.
Emily: a director.
Yeah,
Jeremy: she, I mean, she is,
so she's the daughter of Robin
Williams, if people didn't know that.
Um,
Emily: right.
Oh, my God.
Jeremy: she's also, I think, relevant
to people who listen to this podcast,
Kuvira, uh, from The Legend of Korra.
Um,
Emily: Yes.
Ben: I think she did, I think she
did a really good job directing this
movie again, the performance she got
out of Catherine Newton is fucking
spectacular a lot of interesting shots,
like a great eye for it, again, very
excited to see where she goes, like,
directing more movies in the future.
Emily: Oh, yeah.
I, I remember hearing that she was the one
who directed this movie that she was, you
know, the, of the Robin Williams family.
So thanks for bringing
me back to, speed there.
Jeremy: her other credits also include
being in the UNICEF Imagine video.
So, you know, just throwing
Emily: also in a Nintendo ad.
Jeremy: Yeah
Emily: do, do learn to drive,
I think, from the same, like,
weird satellite projection that
taught Michael Myers how to drive.
But despite Lisa telling him that
this is all his fault and blaming him
and, you know, basically just being
a bitch to him, he does drive her.
So, uh, to her Michael Trent booty call.
And he starts just gesticulating
that maybe she shouldn't do that,
but she's like, you're not my real
dad because you have too much to say.
She doesn't actually say that.
That would be funny though.
Anyway, but what's this?
Michael Trent has been banging
Laffy Taffy the whole time.
He can't have a girlfriend
cooler than him.
You tell him, Lisa, but
seriously, don't blame Taff.
She did nothing wrong and as
a literal angel protects her.
And,
Jeremy: screamed speech she has about
like you like cool stuff and independent
movies and like all these like neat music
and stuff but you can't have a girlfriend
that likes all of that stuff because
that's not what girls are supposed to do
is I feel like very It's very prescient.
I think it's a hard, I think that's
hard to nail down in a thing like
this, but, is, is a very real thing.
Emily: it is so real.
And, yeah I'm looking into the internet.
And, uh, you know who you are because
I have met a few of you out there.
you know, yeah, I listen to Coil.
Jeremy: Yeah.
They gotta be special.
Yeah.
Emily: Yeah.
Ben: Yeah.
Emily: anyway, uh, yeah, so
this is, this is upsetting.
Lisa's upset.
Taffy's upset.
Michael Trent's like, but, well, it's
not going to work out between us.
Um, but Lisa is pretty aware.
But what's this again?
Here comes Corpse Husband to
defend his honor, her honor.
Except, no, actually, he is here
to claim his final missing piece.
Good job, Pets Tino.
He cuts Michael Trent's dick off.
And I was scream laughing this whole time.
Lisa's experience with Axe
Murder gives her the, the
experience that she needs to help.
Taffy through this trying time, uh, she
Ben: does well with the pillow.
The pillow is surprisingly good
defensive score against axes.
Emily: yeah, she, uh, Dead Byron
tries to cut her, and then Lisa's
like, absolutely not, not in a
million years, why would you think so?
And then, you know, she Pulls Taffy
from this scene, and Taffy is acting
about as traumatized as probably Lisa
should be throughout most of this movie,
which I, I love that element is that
Taffy is like, like, so traumatized by
all of this, and, you know, I can only
think that Lisa is like, okay, I've been
through, I've done it, I've done the
killing, I've done the I've, my mom got
murdered, now your mom is murdered, it's
kind of my fault, but, you know, it's,
look So, she expresses her love to Taffy
and explains all these things about how
Taffy is cool and, goes to apprehend
the Herdead Twink in Bachelor's Grove,
leaving Taffy in the car, who ends up
wandering like the second victim of
the Bob in Twin Peaks the first season.
Look it up.
So, she was gonna axe Dead Byron a few
questions, but instead she realizes,
but he's hot, and now she wants
to sue him before she's arrested.
But unlike the
Ben: That's where the American
Pie influence comes in.
I mean their limit was just before
prom is over But again, we have
a lose before very lose virginity
before ticking clock goes off.
Emily: yeah, and but just now she
realizes why dude cut Trent's dick off.
Even though she has some pretty
cool things to say about gender and
dicks and how they're not important.
The dick is the least important thing.
Ben: Yeah That was great,
especially for the 80s good for her
Emily: I mean, this, she was
saying Hella, so I, you know, this
is, this is the 1989 written by,
Ben: We here at progressively horrified
condone murder, but never transphobia.
Emily: that's true.
That's very true.
Especially of Doug.
Ben: Yeah, fuck you Doug
Emily: So, anyway, also this dude
just threw a cop into an open grave.
I'd be swooning.
Jeremy: I love that.
Like they don't actually kill the cop.
He just grabs the cop
and throws her into the
Ben: That was so funny, that
I love, that was delightful.
Emily: she kinda did a death rattle while
she was in there though, like, I feel like
she, she kind of, expired or something.
Maybe she didn't actually die,
Jeremy: give us any detail on that.
I mean, it could, she does
get pitched six feet down.
So, you know, maybe she's, maybe she
just decides to stay there for a bit
Emily: yeah, she might just
Ben: Definitely, uh, got
the wind knocked out.
At the very least, wind
knocked out of her.
Emily: Yeah, if I, if a corpse just
threw me into a great open grave
Jeremy: be like, you know what?
Fair enough.
Fair enough.
Emily: I'd be like, all right, I'm
just gonna wait, see how this goes.
If it starts, you know, starts
raining dirt, maybe I'll do something.
Anyway, so one rainbow thread
surgery and UV zap later.
Lisa and Frank get married with a trolleo.
and bone down to Robert Edward O.
Speedwagon.
Ben: I like the JoJo reference.
Emily: yeah, thanks.
I mean, that's the only thing
I think now of when I hear
Ben: I also, I heard REO Speedwagon
and I'm like, Oh, you mean Robert E.
O.
Speedwagon of the Speedwagon Foundation.
Emily: there's no other
Speedwagon now that matters.
Um, sorry, the band, REO Speedwagon.
Um,
Ben: just the shot of her you know, Sewing
the dick back on because we did get a line
where she says like I earlier in the movie
where Taffy's saying like hey, you'll take
out some like bruises on your knees and
Emily: oh yeah!
Ben: and I was like, yeah me too
Emily: Yeah, it happens to the best of us.
But,
Ben: And I just felt like that was a now
that was a moment that got its payoff now
as she read as she Sews the dick back on
Emily: well, that, that moment was Like,
suddenly very kind of intimate and how
awkward it was, because, Frankenfurter was
standing there and kind of looking away
and posing like he was on, like he was
Ben: given some Christian Bale
in American Psycho energy.
Not actually.
Emily: yeah, more, more like,
Ben: looking at it, just like looking,
just like being proud of himself
while an intimate encounter happens.
Emily: Yeah, he's looking discreetly away.
Ben: it's not actually American Psycho.
Emily: Yeah, he's not, he's, he is kind
of being, uh, old time, he's being very
like old timey British about anyway, so
they go to the moon and put that rocket,
Ben: trying to do a British accent.
I don't know if it would have
been good, but it would have
been fucking spectacular.
Emily: Yeah, I feel like they're
supposed to be in Wisconsin, despite the
Bachelor's Grove being in like the fucking
Everglades or some shit, but I don't know.
I just know that, that Janet was supposed
to go to Milwaukee and she never did, um,
because she died cause she was shitty.
So, anyway then Lisa has
only one choice, I guess.
She just decides to zap herself to all
the hell with the Kiss of Life suntanner.
Oh, and it catches fire.
That's rough, buddy.
But that's okay because Dad's on
Valium and Taffy's gotten over it
and they have come to her grave.
Many, some time later, to leave Cyan
and Magenta Roses there, but it's okay
because of course Lise is reanimating.
Ben: This?
Emily: Frank is finally serving some of
that Percy Shelley shit with the poetry
and everything, and, uh, you know, they
Ben: Can we just reflect that this
dude, that the dad lost his wife,
two wives, and a daughter, in like
a six month time span, unaffected,
Emily: Yeah, he just wants
to go to Fuddruckers.
Ben: Dude wants to go to Fudruckers.
Emily: I think he's just on Valium.
Like, I think he's just been
on every, like, he's just,
he's Prince Valium right now.
Ben: Like, are the Quaaludes gonna
just run out one day and this man is
gonna have the most, like, fucking
grief induced breakdown ever in 1994?
Emily: probably I don't know, maybe, maybe
he's like, secretly BTK, I don't know,
Ben: he's just like, well, let's
knock out, like, the rest of our
feud, like, our graveyard tasks,
and then, ooh, Fudruckers time!
Emily: yeah, I, so anyway,
Jeremy: look forward to, you know?
Emily: yeah,
Ben: Is this the peak masculinity
that all those fucking male
influencers are talking about?
Emily: that's what they will get,
Ben: Is this what they're trying to be?
The dad from Stranger Things?
Emily: that's what they will become,
if they keep on their fucking, I mean,
the only way to pick up women now,
you guys, gotta get in that bear suit
Ben: Get to Fudruckers.
Emily: get to Fuddruckers, put on a
bear suit, Sit in the house and wait.
This is a midsummer joke.
Anyway
Jeremy: I, I got it.
Emily: thank you.
Ben: I don't know why, but I
thought this was Five Nights at
Freddy's, and I'm like, okay, I get
it, we all like Matthew Lillard.
Emily: That's true.
Jeremy: Who doesn't like Matthew Lillard?
Ben: love how that movie acts like there's
any mystery to the villain when we already
know that Matthew Lillard is in the movie.
Emily: yeah, I love how that movie
exists as well as Willy's Wonderland.
Like, there's any anywhere to
go from Willy's Wonderland.
Ben: I really feel like that's gotta be a
double feature for us one of these days.
Emily: I just, Willy's
Wonderland is better.
Ben: Then let's just do that one, then!
Emily: Yeah, Willy's
Wonderland is like, watchable.
Like, the Five Nights at Freddy's
is fine, but like, Willy's
Wonderland is actually, you know,
Ben: Good.
Jeremy: Like, the director of the
Five Nights at Freddy's movie has
said like, Hey, we're like, doing
this to set up to do more movies.
This is like the origin movie.
And I was like, you don't do the origin
movie for something like this first.
Like,
Ben: just do.
No, look,
Jeremy: the movie.
Ben: a protagonist be
asleep for half the movie.
Emily: unless Willy's Wonderland
is the episode 0, and then Nicholas
Ca Silent Nicholas Cage Angel
shows up to save everyone, but
that would be like, you know,
Ben: Anyway, this movie at the end, like,
again, like, I do enjoy we get a little
bit of Kostra, I mean, like, he's totally
normal now, and I'm not sure, like, I
feel like part of what was fun about the
approach to this movie was, like, ooh, Oh,
like a Frankenstein that's really evoking
this, like, this is like, it's an updated
modern Frankenstein, but a monster that
is Lord Byron and, uh, Percy Shelley,
Jeremy: Yeah, like it's for,
it's for the Shelly girls, right?
Like people who,
Ben: I don't feel
Jeremy: who grew up loving
Mary Shelley and like
Ben: I don't, yeah, and I don't feel like
that kind of, The Shelly Frankenstein boy.
I don't feel like we got
the full execution on that.
You know, the guy who will
recite you poetry, but then also
then like, rip a cop in half.
Emily: yeah, I feel like
there's more to be said.
Ben: We do get some great piano scenes.
The pi you know what it is, the piano
scenes definitely have the right energy.
the when they're doing REO
Speedwagon together, that was
good for their that like, that's
a good scene in that dy dynamic.
Or developing the relationship.
Emily: well also, girl is going off, and
you can tell that she's having a good
time, and that's one of those things that,
like, yeah, it's always great to see a
movie where an actor is really going off,
and everybody seems to be presenting.
And I think that's why, the dead
boyfriend is so, like, frustrating
for you, I think, because, like, he
could be presenting to you a lot more.
Um,
Ben: want him to be kinda at the
energy that Catherine Newton's at.
Emily: yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
So,
Ben: at least matching it
in a more complimentary way.
Emily: yeah, he was very passive
Ben: Yeah, that, that's
what it was, that, yeah,
Jeremy: Well, I feel like,
Emily: being the, the guy
Ben: Despite killing, despite doing
a lot, a lot of killing, yeah.
Jeremy: I feel like they're making
a little bit of a statement in this
in that, like, She is in such a bad
place at the beginning of the movie.
She is miserable, she's having a terrible
time, her life is awful, and all she
really needs is this monster who would
just listen to her, like, you know, she
starts getting better as soon as she
has this, you know, mumbling one handed,
you know, monster who's just like there
and able to listen to her and, and
like, just reinforce her in some way.
Um, that's all she really needed.
She just didn't, she wasn't
getting that from, you know,
Taffy's trying to make her better.
Stepmom is, is awful.
And dad is just sort of like there.
Ben: What if the real romance
was the therapy along the way?
Jeremy: yeah, I mean, I, I think like,
I really feel like that is a lot of
this movie is, is like, hey, like she
can come of age, she can get better if
she just has like somebody to be there
and listen and care for her and like
Taffy's, I think Taffy is legitimately
trying to do her best, but she is also
a kid and has no way out of no idea how
to like, be there for this other person
when she is all the way inside her own,
you know, reality and head as well.
Ben: What I do like is that
Lisa is legitimately psychotic.
Like, she never stops being fun,
I never stop rooting for her.
But I like that she does cross that
line into like, Oh, you are legitimately
bad shit, like crazy and violent.
And and I do, like, really
appreciate, like, that energy.
I forgot where I was going when
I started this shit, I'm sorry.
Emily: It's all good.
I was I was gonna say I do
like the fact that she is kind
of not all about the romance.
Like, she is mostly, like, she's
not quite committed to the romance
Ben: she just wants the big D.
Emily: She wants the D, but like, she
likes Michael Trent, sure, and she
doesn't really act on it until she
realizes that she, you know, when her
makeover is like, oh, I could, people
actually notice me with this makeover,
you know, that I, I can actually be
Goth when she finds the black lipstick.
Like, I
Ben: the looks are amazing.
She has, like, uh, yeah,
I love all of her outfits.
Jeremy: She goes full Lydia by the end.
Emily: yeah,
Ben: Oh, that's what it
Emily: Deeding all over the place.
Ben: the better she gets mental health
wise, the worse she gets morally.
Emily: And, like, the
more fashion she gets,
Ben: yeah, well that just goes,
I mean, look, we know that from X
Men comics, like, you always get a
hotter costume when you turn evil.
Emily: Yes,
Ben: That's just the Madeline Pryor rule.
Emily: but, like, she's still
the protagonist, you know?
This isn't Lily and the
Legend situation, although,
Ben: I love how, this is where she's
rising, like, that the walls are
closing in, and she's just like,
Well, I only killed that guy because
it felt so good when helping you
when you killed that other person.
So this is really you your
fault I killed people.
Emily: that, I mean, and the fact that
she was bitchy like that, like, I was
kind of wondering if this, things were
gonna stay on board with her and I did,
Ben: unbalanced that I like,
that's the level of like black
comedy unbalanced characters.
I'm like now this is what
I'm like, yes this I like.
Emily: yeah,
Jeremy: trailers, I think the one thing
the trailer does really right is that
it calls it a coming of rage story.
Um, which I'm like, yeah, that's
like, and I think to some extent
that's why I didn't think that all of
us would agree that like, that last
half hour is like dynamite, that's
really when it kicks into full gear.
And I think part of that is like,
that first half hour is functionally
the world shitting on her.
Until like, the monster comes into
her life and she, you know, is able
to sort of like embrace the embrace
this anger she has over just like
the fact that she's just been getting
constantly kicked while she's down
the whole first half of the movie.
Emily: yeah,
Jeremy: And, you know, that last
half hour she's able to just, they're
like, okay, yeah, it's it's actually
fine for her to murder everybody.
She doesn't have to feel bad about anybody
that, that she hurts in this movie.
You know, sure it is psychotic, but,
uh, especially that guy's hand that they
cut off, man, that guy had it coming.
Emily: yeah, Doug, no one's,
Jeremy: Nobody is mourning Doug.
Emily: yeah, so, yeah, a lot of
interesting concepts, well, not concepts,
a lot of interesting commentary in the,
I know I said this movie was without
a lot of commentary, and it mostly
is, it's not about commentary, but
it, does have its moments where, you
know, Mom, you're a psychiatric nurse,
should you really be saying loony bin?
And seeing how Taffy can divest
herself of her mother, even
though she loves her mother.
Like, Taffy is so accepting of people, and
Ben: Taffy has that gremlin where she's
describing her mother to the police,
which is a whole great bit like where she
goes into like insane levels of detail
and fawning flowery description of her
mother, but then at the end, uh, oh, We
don't hear the other line to the phone.
We just heard cheerfully go.
Yeah, she's a bitch
Emily: she's a bitch, you know?
But it's like,
Ben: that that made me laugh out
Jeremy: that scene is great.
And her, her talking about
her mom's hair in that scene.
And she's like, you know, you know, like,
Ben: Oh the color of a Labrador's
Jeremy: of a Labrador when
Ben: hits it just right
Emily: You see those chocolatey tones?
And there's a bit of red.
Ben: She she has brown eyes, but
she wears green contact lenses
because she thinks it makes them pop.
Oh,
Emily: yeah.
White diamond perfume?
Yeah, she's a bitch.
Yeah.
Jeremy: God, I hate the smell
of white diamond perfume.
Emily: I don't know.
I don't know what the
smell is and I'm happy.
Jeremy: I used to, uh, when I was young,
I went to a church where, uh, the pastor's
mom used to wear just, she clearly did
the same thing that the grisette mom
does here and just walked through a
cloud of it before she went somewhere.
And it is of such an offensive quality
as to like, have made my eyes run and
my nose bleed, you know, just like,
Emily: maybe I have smelt it,
but I just did not know who dealt
Jeremy: smells like what you
imagine Elizabeth Taylor smells
like offensive to the senses.
I, so, okay, question here, I think we
talked a lot about, sort of around this,
but do we think this is a feminist film?
Emily: Yeah,
Ben: yeah I mean
Emily: would absolutely say so.
Ben: like it's a Diablo Cody movie.
I mean, like I said, this is a this feels
like a deeply personal coming of age
story About a fucked up girl embracing
just how freaky her freak can be.
Emily: Yeah, she is
Ben: I think is an important story
for everyone of all gender identities.
Emily: Yeah.
Jeremy: This is perhaps one of our most,
Ben: do not
Jeremy: women's wrongs, uh,
Ben: I mean like this teaches
the important lesson of do not
fucking suffer nerds and their
creepy attitudes towards gender
Emily: Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
Also, you know, we deserve our revenge
on the nerds from Revenge of the Nerds.
Like, we do, we need to exact
our revenge upon those nerds.
In ways that are maybe even, you
know, in, in my humble opinion,
more grotesque, you know, but again,
Jeremy: just want to, I just want to
do a podcast where we watch Revenge of
the Nerds, but not like this podcast.
We just need a podcast.
It's just called like, fuck this movie.
But we just watch movies that we want
to, that we want to say, fuck this movie.
Ben: I'm down.
I'm in.
Emily: I mean, okay,
Jeremy: feel like it would, it would
mean watching they slashed them again.
Ben: Oh, no.
Emily: we already did, I think we
did, like, that and old, like, I
think we did our, we did our time on
Ben: fuck I think a good chunk
of our they slash them episode
was us saying fuck this movie
Emily: Yeah,
Jeremy: I made fun of they slashed
them at MomoCon twice this weekend.
Ben: Amazing as well you should
Emily: Yes.
Ben: as well as it deserves.
Fuck they slash them.
Fuck that movie.
They see we're already,
Emily: we don't recommend that
Jeremy: Fuck that movie.
Emily: that movie,
Ben: this movie?
Emily: yes.
Do we want to talk about
anything else in this movie?
Like race?
Jeremy: I really wish this movie seems
like it should have something to say
about, LGBTQIA stuff, but it doesn't.
Ben: doesn't.
It doesn't.
That's why I'm mad.
I'm like, you can watch this movie,
you're not gonna have the worst time,
but you'll probably have a better time
watching Heather's, doing like a Heather's
and Jennifer Boddy double feature.
Emily: Yeah, Jennifer's body
actually has things to say.
Heather's has things to say,
although they are not explicit.
But Heather's is a foundation upon
which, you know, the LGBT expleticity,
explicitness in Heather's is pretty
firmly in that foundation, buried
about as deep as Winona Ryder
Ben: I mean,
Emily: balls knocked at her face,
Ben: look, let's be honest, Christian
Slater probably was a lot of guys gay
awakening in Heathers of that era.
Emily: I mean like you
Ben: It was like, Heathers and
Keanu Reeves in Point Break.
Emily: listen I have a little
film for you It's called my
own private, Idaho watch that
Jeremy: time I think about Point Break,
I just think of, Have you ever fought
two guns whilst jumping through the air?
Emily: I never fired a
gun until they had gone,
Jeremy: Yeah, uh, but yeah,
this movie has not really much
to say about race or class.
Um, unfortunately, I feel like
it's, it's there to be talked about,
but they don't don't really do it.
Uh, race is weird in this movie.
Ben: Happy is Native Hawaiian,
but that's also just one line...
Jeremy: yeah, I think she
said she won like Miss Pacific
Islands or something like that.
Ben: I mean, the actress is Filipino, I
believe, but Taffy is We don't know, and
we're not sure if Taffy knows either.
Again,
Emily: Taffy is Taffy, and at
this point, she is her own being.
Ben: Liza Soberano, fantastic in the
Emily: Yeah,
Ben: She was the comedic powerhouse
of the movie in my opinion.
Emily: she is something that I
aspire to be, except not really
Ben: I too aspire to be a teenage girl.
Emily: I mean, if you're a teenager,
You know, it's okay to be a cheerleader,
and I think that, I think it's okay
now, like, I don't think people
give a shit that much anymore, but,
Ben: No, like now our cheerleader
movies are like super intense sports
movies produced by Elliot Page
Emily: yeah,
Ben: starring DeVry Jacobs.
Emily: Yeah, it's important we don't
judge people by their, you know, how
poppy they are, because, you know, I
had a cheerleader friend in high school,
even though I was like a stone cold goth,
and, you know, I was not probably based.
Or, you know, however
the kids would say it.
However,
Ben: You'll always be
based in my heart, Emily.
Emily: thank you.
I mean, I was, I grew up in the 90s.
There was, there were some issues there
and, you know, it, it was a hard time.
Ben: I came of age in the 2000s, in the
most objectively cringed decade we've had.
Emily: I think there have been
cringier decades, like, you know, but I
Jeremy: is cringy in its own
Emily: yeah, every, every decade has its
own specific cringe, but I just want to
say that I had a cheerleader friend and it
was because of her good grace that I was
able to get my Terrifying analog horror
Nine Inch Nails video, speaking of Michael
Ben: Hell yeah.
Emily: the, Tony, if you're out there,
I remember you fondly, I hope you're,
thriving, and I'm glad that I wasn't too
fucking cringe myself to avoid talking
to a cheerleader and being friends with a
Jeremy: So, hold on, hold on, hold on.
You have a, you have a
cheerleader friend named Tony.
It's not Tony Basil, right?
Emily: No.
Jeremy: Of Hey Mickey.
Uh, and that vampire movie we watched.
Ben: I, I truly do wonder how much
Emily: Holy
Ben: It On had to do to change
people's perception of cheerleading.
Emily: Holy shit.
That never even occurred to me, Jeremy!
Jeremy: you just said a
cheerleader named Tony and I was
like, You mean like Tony Basil?
That whole video where she's in her
Emily: Was she did I get blessed by
the goddess of base cheerleading?
Did she appear to me?
Jeremy: Sounds like it.
Ben: I mean, I'm not sure how you
exactly would have gone to school
if a woman born in 1943, but
Emily: she I mean, did
you see her in 1989?
real, though.
Jeremy: Yeah, she played a
cheerleader in her own music
video when she was 40 something.
So, um, in her, in her own high
school cheerleading uniform.
Before then playing a hot mom vampire
in, uh, what, what was that movie?
Emily: Rockula!
Ben: oh, right.
She's the mom in Rocula Yeah
Jeremy: Oh,
Emily: Oh, Rockula.
Jeremy: to Lauren Hightowsen
for bringing us that movie.
Emily: Yeah, for real.
Speaking of shoutouts, yeah.
Ben: oh Love right now.
That's the recommendation go watch Rocula.
Emily: That movie is,
Ben: my serious recommendation is So
there is actually another supernatural
romance movie to recommend, and that is
Warm Bodies, a movie from 2013 starring
Nicholas Hoult and Teresa Palmer.
Emily: oh
Jeremy: knew this was going to
be your, I knew that was going
to be your recommendation when
we finished watching this movie.
Ben: Yes, yeah!
Jeremy: It's like time for, time for
Ben to recommend Warm Bodies again.
Emily: are we recommending,
Ben: I recommended Warm
Bodies a few times now?
Jeremy: I think so.
Yeah.
Ben: That's fair.
Emily: You can recommend
it as many times, you know.
Jeremy: Ben, ultimately, do you
recommend this movie or are you
still on the fence about that?
Ben: I don't know, like, probably not.
I mean, like, it's far from,
it's not a terrible movie.
I wouldn't even say I disliked
it, but, I mean, I don't know.
think there's funnier movies,
I, I think there's, it didn't
fully come together for me.
There, there's a lot I like, there,
there's a lot of pieces I like here.
there's just some, like,
structural and plot issues that
I, that just didn't quite gel.
Again, like, I, anyone who says,
I love this movie, I would, my
reaction's like, yeah, totally.
I completely understand why.
There's just a few, too many things
that didn't quite come together for me.
Which is a shame, because I really,
well, I thought this was going to be a
movie I was going to, like, unabashedly
love, but, uh, It just never quite
fully clicked for me, unfortunately.
Emily: I have been there.
And I kind of, I, I really do
appreciate the division of of
opinions that we have here.
Because, You know, I saw this
movie and I was like, why is this
51 percent on Rotten Tomatoes?
Why is this certified rotten?
And, you know, and then I watched movies
like, you know, I saw Psychogorman.
Psychogorman is a totally different
Ben: Oh, anyone who gives a
negative review to Psycho Gourmet
is just objectively wrong and
should be launched into the sun.
Emily: Yeah, like, I was
Ben: That's how we're
gonna purge the species.
Just get rid of everyone who
doesn't like Psycho Goreman.
That's our,
Emily: on a rocket.
Ben: stage of human evolution.
Psycho Goreman fans only now.
Emily: Yeah, there's some, like,
Psychogorman is another recommendation.
I recommend, I would recommend this movie.
It's fun but, I mean, I think that, like,
the Gen X, this is a lot of Gen X and Gen
Y talking to each other, and, you know,
and Gen X being like, hey, Millennials,
and then also, hey, kids, hey, fellow
kids, you guys like hyper color?
You remember 1989?
You don't, but it's mystical time
where everything was pink, maybe.
That is another thing that I will
be with you regarding this movie.
I was expecting more Lisa Frank.
I was expecting more saturation,
more, like, hyper color jaguars and
Ben: Okay, I wasn't sure if that was just
like, I wasn't setting my TV at the right
settings, but yeah, it wasn't quite as
bright a movie as I was, like, literally
bright as the title was gonna imply.
Yeah.
Jeremy: there's a reference
somewhere in here to John Waters.
Oh, the
Emily: the flamingos?
Jeremy: the police officers are named
Officer John and Officer Waters.
Um, but like, missing some of that,
like, John Waters, you know what, but
I'm a cheerleader, is what it's missing.
It's a little bit more of that aesthetic.
Ben: Yeah.
Oh God.
The aesthetic of, but I'm a
cheerleader would have worked really
like a more eighties update to, but
I'm a cheerleaders aesthetic would
have worked really well for this.
And again, I think it kind of needed that.
Like, I think the contrast, that
level of color and artifice against
the you know, the gore would have
helped, uh, the tone of the movie kind
of come a little clearer into focus.
Emily: yeah, something a little
bit more in, uh, sissy, uh,
Ben: yeah.
Oh, that's another, honestly,
that's another recommendation.
Like, I know we've talked about it
on the show and we loved it, but
yeah, Sissy fantastic movie, Sissy.
Yes.
Jeremy: of this movie, and I said
this to Alicia after we watched it
last night, is I'm really tired of
movies being set in the 80s that
don't need to be set in the 80s.
Like this whole like 80s aesthetic of
just like we put everything there and
we it allows us to talk about issues
that are still present without dealing
with the fact that they're still present
in a way that like I really don't
need and I feel like the Lisa Frank
thing that you're talking about is, I
think, a tie to the 80s quality of it.
And the Lisa Frank gag of the title
does not appear anywhere in the movie.
There's nothing Lisa Frank related.
In fact, I know, like, the Lisa Frank
people are notoriously litigious.
So, like, I think, you know,
there, I would have loved for it
to be either leaned harder into
or pulled away from entirely.
I just don't feel like as, as somebody
who's seen every episode of Stranger
Things, um, I am just, I'm, 80s nostalgia,
especially in horror is getting old to me.
You know, if you want to, if you
want to say something about the
way things are, maybe 40 years ago.
Emily: Yeah.
And if you want the aesthetic, like,
if it's about the aesthetic, then
just go whole hog with the aesthetic.
Like, make it, you know,
make everything drippy.
Fuckin go full Panos Cosmatos.
And, I mean, like, if this movie
was about a girl who was really into
cutesy things, but she wanted to,
like, make her own boyfriend, and he,
like, basically looked like, He was
entirely made of the crazy half of Two
Face in the Joel Schumacher Batman.
That is the movie that I was expecting.
You know, I like this movie, fine,
but like, this, that, you know, the
fact that she is trying to make a cute
boyfriend and he ends up goth because
he's dead, and then she's like, oh,
okay, I'm gonna accept my goth boyfriend
because, you know, I tried to make him
this thing, and now he's goth, and so
now I have to like, figure out accept
the gothness of it all or something,
I don't know, or just fucking do weird
science, but with girls, and have it, you
Jeremy: Yeah.
I mean, that was clearly the most,
like, The thing that most influenced
this movie is probably not as much
Frankenstein as Weird Science.
Um,
Emily: Yeah.
Jeremy: I mean there's a level of
like, the main character in this, Lisa,
has a Tina Belcher level of horniness
that like, I appreciate and I would
like for them to kind of lean into.
Um, and I, I I feel like they
do by the end of it, but like,
it's a very gradual process.
Like I, yeah, I do like this.
I mean, I would recommend it.
it's one of those that like, you can't
help but kind of workshop because some
of it is like, it's just a little,
it feels like it could have used one
more pass at the scripting phase.
Um, just to be like, hey, what, what
is it we are trying to say here?
But yeah, I mean, I'll take a movie
that's a little unbalanced over something
that's not trying to do anything any day.
Um,
Ben: sure.
Jeremy: uh, Emily, did you say
what your other recommendation,
Emily: oh yeah, if you like cyan and
magenta, if you like dead twinks.
Jeremy: Who does it say?
Wait, who doesn't like saying dead twinks,
Emily: at the same
Ben: Who doesn't like dead twinks?
Jeremy: Your violence
may vary on dead twinks.
I don't know.
Emily: yeah, but, uh, Dead Boy
Detectives, I finally gave it a stab,
it's, uh, it's lovely, it's cute
Ben: Oh, that does have dead twinks.
Emily: it's, it's basically, the name of
the show is the Dead Twink Detectives,
like, you watch it and you're like, yeah,
Jeremy: more twink than they are boys.
Um,
Ben: definitely, the dead 19
year old detective definitely
hits a little different.
Emily: yeah, then the dead 12 year old
detectives from Sandman and Doom Patrol
and all that kind of shit I like it,
Ben: I started it, I was enjoying
it, I need to keep watching it at
Emily: Yeah,
Jeremy: Them being 19 does allow
them to lean a little more into the
obvious queer relationship on it,
Emily: yeah, this is very gay.
Ben: your lead actors can work
full day, can film full work days.
So that's a plus when making a series.
Yes.
Emily: Yeah, they don't make any, they
don't try to, like, obfuscate the fact
that these are adult actors as teenagers.
Like, there's a couple times
where I'm like, okay, I
Ben: your dead 12 year olds aren't
going to be looking very 12 by
the time you get to season 3.
Emily: yeah.
So, you know, Dead Twink Detectives, check
it out, it does what it says on the tin.
They're, one of them is New Wave.
And the other one is,
like, I have never seen.
I have never seen an old wave
since fucking Oscar Wilde.
I have never seen a boy
from the teens of 19s.
Like, I have not seen a World War I twink
serve so much cunt as this little dude.
Like, this dude is an uptight oof.
You okay, Jeremy?
Jeremy: Not an inaccurate description,
just not one that occurred in my mind.
Emily: I was, yeah.
Jeremy: Yeah.
my recommendation, uh, I went to MoMoCon
this past weekend, uh, which, you know,
there's plenty of great things to have
recommended about MoMoCon, but in doing
so I decided to, uh, put my Hoopla app
to good use and download an audio book
of a, a book I've had for like a good
year now, and I've been, uh, meaning
to read that being Gideon the Ninth
Emily: Uhhh
Jeremy: which, uh, have,
have the two of you read?
Gideon The ninth?
Emily: I have.
Ben: haven't.
I've seen all the I've seen
lots of fan art, though.
Jeremy: One thing I appreciate about
Gideon the ninth that was not made
clear to me previous is that the main
character, uh, the eponymous main
character, Gideon, is an absolute herbo.
That she is just there, there's so
much of this stuff that is like,
it is very heavy fantasy sci-fi.
There are a lot of words.
The first time you read them, you're
gonna be like, what the fuck is this even?
And it helps that Gideon, who is
the, you know, it's told from like
a close third person perspective
from Gideon's point of view.
is also dumb as shit.
Um, and she is just like, there's so
many points in this movie where her
like, her thought process going on in
the background is like, there's some
sort of conversation about necromancy
and she's like, and Gideon is like, But
that conversation was really annoying,
so Gideon stopped paying attention
and started thinking about swords.
And it's, it's like, it's very
specifically like herbo, female himbo
energy, not like bimbo energy, which has
a certain like femme pretty quality to it.
It's very like, a dumb hunky
energy of just like, and Gideon
was thinking about how much fun it
would be to punch somebody, right?
Like, I really appreciate the the quality
of having a main character in a, a story
like that, that is just, it's just a
little dumb and a little annoyed by all
of the bullshit going on around them.
It's like, it's like if Lord of the
Rings was told from Pippin's perspective.
Um.
It's just, it just has that sort of
quality of like, Oh, she's a little dumb.
Okay.
That's fine.
Um,
Emily: she fully has a line that's like,
while you were doing such and such I was
studying the blade, so, you know, that's
just to give you an idea of the tone
of this volume, which, it's great, it's
like, it's, you know, space necromancy
and gay and bones, lots of bones.
Um,
Jeremy: space necromancers and does
involve a plethora of death traps.
Um, which who doesn't like death traps?
Ben: Right.
Jeremy: Nobody on this podcast.
Ben: Oh, big def Trapp enthusiast.
Emily: Yeah.
Uh, I like Death Trap, but
mostly when the bass drops.
Jeremy: So yeah, so I, I do very much
recommend getting in the ninth, but
also the hoopla app, which if you have a
public library near you, there's a good
chance that they have a, like an option
for you to have hoopla through them.
And you can just download free
audio books of a lot of stuff,
including fairly recent and popular
stuff like you get in the ninth.
So check that out.
Hoopla rocks.
Emily: Yes, support your local library,
or else I will send dead, evil dead
Lord Byron to cut your hand off.
Jeremy: Yeah, it is a cool way to support
your library while also doing audiobooks
because you can't, it's difficult to read
a dense sci fi fantasy novel while driving
seven hours to Atlanta but it's much more
fun to listen to one while you do it.
Emily: Absolutely.
So go team!
Go horror team!
Ben: We did it.
And folks,
Jeremy: Yeah, that wraps it up for us.
Do you guys want to do, I was
trying to tell people where, where
we can, they can find us, or?
Emily: I'll say megamoth.
net and Ben is at.
Ben: uh, at Ben the con on, uh, Twitter,
uh, Ben Con comics on Instagram, blue Sky.
And make sure to check out, uh, Mr.
Muffins, uh, my upcoming
graphic novel from Onie Press.
Emily: I'm so stoked for that.
Ben: Thank you.
Emily: those two, like, hunky, you posted
a picture of those two hunky characters
that were like wrestlers or something?
Oh no, that was from, that was not from
Ben: Oh, no, that's from, uh,
oh, that is from Trans Foria.
My, an, uh, an anthology, a
Trans and Non-binary anthology.
That I, uh, contributed a story to
about how JoJo's Bizarre Adventure
helped me realize I'm non binary.
I don't know if it'll be out, if it's
still up when this episode comes out,
then, uh, check that, then check that
out, uh, it's currently on Kickstarter.
Emily: nice.
yeah, the quirky book looks really
good, and I'm really excited.
Y'all are doing great books about dogs.
Thank you.
Jeremy: It's just, it's
dog, dog comic time.
Emily: Yeah,
Jeremy: You know, us, Tony Fleece out
there with the dog, with stray dogs.
There's a lot
Emily: well he's also got the cat one now,
Jeremy: yeah,
Emily: so, you know, we'll,
big cat meow meow, I'll do
big cat meow, I'm claiming it.
Um,
Jeremy: right.
Yeah, as for me find me on Blue Sky.
I'm trying my best to not
be on Twitter anymore.
So, Blue Sky, it's just Jeremy Whitley.
Or you can find me on Tumblr,
Jeremy Whitley as well.
Or just JeremyWhitley.
com if you just want to
see stuff I'm making.
And, uh, yeah, as this comes out, we'll
be It should be a couple weeks away
from navigating with you, which also
comes out the week before we will be at
FlameCon in New York City, which we're
doing a live progressively horrified at.
So come join us, see us and
our friends talking about scary
movies and probably, I assume gay
stuff at this panel at FlameCon.
That's what we're going to be doing.
Um, Thank you as always for listening.
This one was a ball and, uh, join us
next time and until then stay horrified.