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If you've ever been on a dating app you know that hiking can be one of the top activities most people enjoy. It may not be for everyone but what if you have ever wanted to take up hiking and are not sure how to start this is the episode for you! Today Vanessa talks with Danika Jensen a UNLV alum and hiking enthusiast who shares her tips and tricks to getting started and some of the best spots to hike near Vegas.
Ok, But Seriously airs Tuesday evenings 6-7 pm on 91.5 KUNV The Rebel HD-2.
Ok, But Seriously airs Tuesday evenings from 6-7pm and gives you the information you need in the way you want. Vanessa Lauren, UNLV broadcast major and Vegas native, talks about her passion for people, history and storytelling. Join her as she breaks down all of the serious topics in a non-serious way. If you are looking to learn and laugh this is the show for you… seriously.
0:00:00
Broadcasting live from UNLV KUNV Las Vegas. We are 91.5 the rebel HD 2
0:00:06
Hello everyone. Welcome back to okay, but seriously the show where I Vanessa Lauren your host talk about some serious topics But in a non serious way you're listening to listener supported 91.5 the rebel HD 2 on KUNV or the broadcast service out of UNLV So thank you so much for everyone who listens and thanks for tuning in tonight. Last week, I talked about pandemic depression. I think that goes hand in hand with physical health. So today we're going to talk a little bit about physical health, which I'm not an expert in, but I am curious to learn about outdoor activities is not something that I'm very big on mostly because I just can't do them, but I have a friend in studio today. So Danica is here, and Danica, the way that you and I, first of all, say hello.
0:00:58
Hey everybody, and hey, thanks for having me, Vanessa. Yeah, so I love the way that this topic came about,
0:01:04
because we know each other through a mutual friend. We do, yeah. And we were talking, and I said, oh yeah, I've got this radio show I gotta go do, and you're like, well, what do you talk about in the radio show right and I was like well kind of anything and then that led us down this path of me saying like you were like I you know I'd love to come in and chat with you and I was like well what are you passionate about and you said hiking yes and then I got so excited because as I mentioned in the intro there I am not a hiker so I don't have a lot of experience so today I'm really curious to get your opinion. I'm going to preface this everyone with the Danica's not an expert. Nope, I am not an expert. I just play one on TV. But you are a hiker. I am, I am, yeah. Okay, so let's talk, let's like, I guess, start at the beginning. Well first, I also want to let everyone know you are a UNLV alumni. I am, class of 2007. Congratulations. Thank you. And what did you major in when you were here?
0:02:04
So I majored in criminal justice and I have not used it since.
0:02:07
Oh no!
0:02:08
But it's okay, it's okay. I mean hey, life takes you in different directions you least expect so I'm not sore about it
0:02:15
at all. Is this one of your first times back on campus since 2007 or do you come back often?
0:02:20
No, I've come back for taking walks around campus. I think I've come here for a couple of shows at the Performing Arts Center a few times. So yeah, and then also for getting my vaccine.
0:02:30
Yeah, but you said this building you've have not been in?
0:02:33
Never been in, no. Never got to see it being built, never got to go or never really was in the area to go near, you know, in it when I was, you know, off campus and when I graduated. But yeah, this first time.
0:02:44
Well, welcome to Green's Sun Hall where all the fun happens and TV and radio. We're happy to have you. When you told me you were a criminal justice, now the criminal justice department is in this building as well.
0:02:55
Yeah, yeah.
0:02:56
The classes and all that.
0:02:57
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
0:02:57
So, yeah.
0:02:58
So I was like, oh, you should know the building, and then you're like, yeah, I live in here. So, I learned something too.
0:03:04
It's all good.
0:03:05
Okay, so let's talk about your hiking experience. I guess, start at the beginning. When did you first start hiking?
0:03:11
Well, so I've been in Vegas since about 2003. I moved here with my family because I had graduated high school. Not in Vegas. I moved out from Houston, Texas.
0:03:22
Oh, wow.
0:03:23
Yeah, not in Houston.
0:03:24
Not in Houston?
0:03:25
It was just too big for me.
0:03:29
Okay.
0:03:30
Okay. But that's one of the things I love about Vegas, kind of a side note, is just it's such a big little town. You know what I mean? Yeah. Like, I run into people in areas I never expect to. It's no exception from the hiking community, but I'll get to that a little later. I moved here for college. It was actually while I was in college that I got started in hiking. Prior to that, I used to live overseas for about 10 years. I lived on an island in the middle of the Pacific. Very small, 2 1⁄2 miles long, a quarter of a mile wide. So from a very young age, I was very much an outdoors kid. I was kind of in between. I loved being outside, but I also liked being inside reading. But then, if I wasn't doing that, I was outside.
0:04:14
I'm fixated on this island life you had.
0:04:16
Oh yeah, for sure.
0:04:17
I have so many questions. How did that happen? And is it like the movies? Is it glamorous? Did you lay on hammocks every day? Where did you live exactly?
0:04:27
Well, some of that's true. Some of the hammock part is true, but not every day. No, my stepfather had gotten a job to go to this military base that we'd never heard of. So the island is called Kwajalein, and if you've studied World War II history, it played a really huge role in that time period. There's a lot of World War II wrecks and relics and things like that. There's a lot of memorials to people who died while serving in the war out there. But going back to your original question, like how do we end up there? It was basically we moved. We didn't expect to stay there for more than a few years, but we ended up staying 10. So I pretty much grew up out there. I was, yeah, I was just turned five the month before we moved. And then yeah, we were out there for a few years. It was wonderful. It was like, you couldn't have asked for a better childhood because it was relatively safe. My parents could basically tell my sister and I, yeah, go wherever, just come home before you need to go to bed. And we were like, okay, cool. So we could swim, snorkel, run around barefoot, go to the beach, go to the pool. We did adventures and going to neighboring islands like through speedboats and stuff with the family or friends or whatever. I mean it was it was nice. Was it like a pretty intimate community? Yes, you know very very small very small yeah they're like we practically knew everybody. I'm picturing Moana vibes right now from you. But yeah kind of yeah but maybe not that maybe not that like lax but not that lax but you know yeah it gave me it really instilled in me a sense of community that I take with me even coming to the States because I think, this is an even broader topic, but in talking about community, which hiking is a community, like I've made friends through a community that I'll have forever and I'll cherish, but in tying it to this, living on the island, I think gave me an idea of what community really is. And no matter where I go, no matter how big of a place I end up going or how small, I'm going to keep that with me. I'll know how to engage people, make friends, build a community in whatever passion I'm currently invested in at that time.
0:06:39
You've got the island mentality. I do.
0:06:42
The city living.
0:06:43
Yes.
0:06:44
I love it. I love it.
0:06:46
The urban island girl, basically.
0:06:47
Yeah. Okay. You came out here for college and then you said you started hiking in college.
0:06:54
How did that start?
0:06:56
So I was, well, let's see. I don't really need to mention that part, but I had met somebody who at the time, a significant other, who said they liked to hike and that's where I started getting into it. There was a community group, you may be familiar with a website called Meetup.
0:07:13
Yeah.
0:07:14
Yeah. Yeah. So Meetup was sort of in its infancy around that time, like 2005. It was a website that not many people had heard about, but there were lots of communities and lots of clubs and groups of people starting things for different hobbies. And there was one that said, the Las Vegas Hiking and Outdoors Meetup. So it was quite a mouthful. There was only a few hundred people in that group. and I went with my significant other at the time to this camping trip that was happening and it was a fair amount of the people in that group that was camping at Mount Charleston, or some of them were admins or organizers in that group and then that's where I had met them and they're like, oh, have you hiked much, have you camped much? I'm like, well, I did camping on Girl Scouts but that's about it, but I've always loved being outside but I've never really hiked, but then I really started to get my education, so to speak, in hiking and camping and I got to see all these amazing places. Death Valley, Goldstrike, Hot Springs, which is local here, by the way, and I've done it like seven times. It's one of my favorite hikes and highly recommended as a good beginner sort of scramble. Say it again, what is it called? Goldstrike Hot Springs. Okay. It's down almost like you're heading to Boulder City. Okay. It's past Boulder City, actually. So it was after meeting those people in that group, and then they started growing and growing and growing from like 300 to close to several thousand people. But it was there that I did kayaking, I got into not just hiking, but kayaking, camping, a lot more, learning what scrambling was, trying indoor rock climbing, which I never thought I'd do.
0:08:49
What is scrambling? I don't know what that is.
0:08:51
So scrambling, essentially, so when people think of hiking, they primarily think of flat trails. Yeah. I mean, yeah, when you think of hiking, that's what you probably think of, right?
0:08:59
Yes, I think of that, or I think of like Mount Everest. There's no in between.
0:09:03
Well, exactly, like, woo! Yes, so scrambling is more or less, if you have a trail that is not necessarily flat, but it has like rocks and boulders that you kind of have to, when I say climb, I mean loosely like go around or get on top of, and you're kind of using your own body weight to get on top of those boulders and rocks because you're not on a flat, sandy dirt trail. That's what scrambling pretty much is.
0:09:31
So it's kind of like the adult version of like kids on a playground that are climbing up that circle of dirt thing that we don't know why it's there.
0:09:37
But with more rocks.
0:09:38
Yes.
0:09:39
Exactly.
0:09:40
A lot more serious than that. A lot more serious, but it's fun. And I mean, there's what, and I really don't have too much knowledge about this, but what I do know is that when it comes to scrambling, there are class levels of scrambling. Oh, wow. Okay. Yeah. So you could have like, oh, it's not very high, but you still have to like, you know, climb a little bit, but then you could get to like class four or five, which is like exposure where you don't really have anything around you and you have to be extremely careful. But then again, that's more for once you get to an advanced level and do it a lot more. But that's what scrambling essentially is.
0:10:11
Okay.
0:10:12
In layman's terms.
0:10:13
I'm sorry, did you say that you have done that?
0:10:15
I have, yeah. Many times.
0:10:16
Many times. And that's here locally?
0:10:18
Yeah, you could go to, Gold Strike is probably the best example I can give of where you could do scrambling. Because the first part of that trail starts off as sandy, relatively flat dirt trail. Then at a certain point, you start seeing these giant boulders that you have to go around or climb on top of or go underneath, depending on what you decide is your comfort level. And then that one does involve some ropes. And by that, I mean, usually somewhere between four and five feet that you have to scramble down. But I would say the best way to understand a lot of the main trails in the valley is to just do your homework, go online. There's so many websites, so many blogs that local hikers and experienced hikers, I should say, have written and talk about what to expect for the most part on these trails, give or take weather conditions and things do tend to alter trails somewhat.
0:11:15
So you can go home with at least some basic knowledge.
0:11:17
Yeah, absolutely, for sure. That's awesome. And I mean, unless you're an experienced hiker, the one biggest tip I can give is if you're a beginner, never hike alone. Never hike alone. Try to get someone to go with you if you can.
0:11:33
Now that you would think that that's common sense, and if you're just joining us tonight, welcome to OK But Seriously. I'm Vanessa and I'm sitting here with Danica Jensen. She's a UNLV alumni and a hiker. We're talking about hiking and outdoor activities. So if you are just starting, let's go there. If I'm just starting, which would be me because I've done like zero things, what are the things that I would just need to start?
0:11:57
That's a good question. A buddy. Yes. But above all else, if you are a beginner hiker and have never hiked before, start small. Start with the smaller trails in town. There's a few that I can recommend that are great for those who are just getting into hiking and just building your skills from there. One of them being Railroad Tunnels, which is also out slightly past Boulder City. It's actually on the way to Gold Strike Hot Springs. It's actually in the Lake Mead National Recreation Area. It's completely flat. It's got an amazing history because, again, it used to have railroad activity going on. Actually, if you take it all the way to the end, you can get to the parking garage of the Hoover Dam.
0:12:40
Wow.
0:12:41
The parking garage.
0:12:42
I know, the parking garage. These are views you can't pay for, ladies. No, you can't pay for those views, and you also can't pay for the views you'll see when you look out towards the lake. It's gorgeous. Because you go right past Lake Mead, the sunsets are incredible. I've done that hike a few different times and it never gets old. Wow. You know, and me even being an experienced hiker, like sometimes you need to stop and smell the roses sometimes. Yeah. So you're dropping all these different hikes and things. I'm sure. How do you find these places? Go online, just Google it, like just say, hikes in Las Vegas. I mean, the top three places that people, I think, are able to find hikes are Lake Mead, Mount Charleston is absolutely the most popular place to go, and it's right now probably the best place to go. Because it's hot.
0:13:28
Yes, so that was gonna be another question. So right now, if you're not in Vegas, and you're listening to this maybe on the podcast, we are in a heat, heat wave. We're about to hit record numbers coming up here in a couple days. So, or we hit record numbers, I should say. So when it's hot like this, hiking is a good thing to do.
0:13:48
It is.
0:13:49
Why?
0:13:50
It is just, I mean, well, I mean, why wouldn't you? I mean, you were talking about mental and emotional health the previous week with your last gasp, I believe. And so I feel like hiking ties into that very closely. For me, you know, especially in the summer, like maybe a lot of people are going on vacation so you may not have as many friends who are around to do things with, or I mean, again, the heat wave, you may have to kind of adjust your lifestyle just a little bit because of the heat, but it doesn't mean you can't stop. I mean, actually it opens up more possibilities and probably inspires you to go out of town and go hiking. Like figure out, hey, go to Arizona, go to Utah, Zion.
0:14:30
Yeah, it's only a few hours away.
0:14:33
Only a few hours away. I mean, Vegas is really an epicenter of anything outdoors. You got Arizona to the south, you got California to the west, you've got Utah to the north. Heading to the east, if you are feeling adventurous, you could head to New Mexico or Colorado, you know, so you've got options if you're willing to expand your horizons And you're willing to take a chance and and if you happen to find wonderful friends that are just as adventurous as you
0:14:59
You've got plenty of options and plenty of opportunities for adventure. Yeah, that's what you and I think we need to remember Like geographically we're in like a pit we are we're in the desert So it's low and when you go hiking you're going up. Yeah, so the elevation is going to make it cooler and all of that. If you didn't know that, you're welcome. I've now educated you in some way. What would you say your favorite thing about hiking or just outdoor activities in general
0:15:27
is?
0:15:28
I think just the freedom. I think I just feel more free when I'm outside, to be honest. You're sitting down. I work in an office job. I mean, I work from home, but previously prior to the pandemic, I was working in an office. And, you know, as much as I do love my job and, you know, I'm thankful for it, I just, you know, sometimes you're just like, oh, there's just so much going on. And plus your personal life, there's always stuff going on during the week. Like for those who have families or have, you know, pet responsibilities, things like that, or just anything in life, you just, you hit a critical mass. Someone once told me, like, if you hit your critical mass, you got to find some way to just de-stress and just decompress. And for me, being outside could be as simple as taking a walk around my neighborhood. But if I'm able to get people together, or if, as an experienced hiker, I have gone on solo hikes myself, just being outside, it's just, I let my mind go. I just kinda let everything from the week or just life in general just kind of just melt away, literally melt away. And so for me, being outside is just a way to just connect with you get grounded. Yeah, there's been like a lot of research done about the topic of grounding, where people are being encouraged to like actually like walk barefoot on the ground in a you know, in a as long as it's not hot, you know, burning your souls. But but just, you know, getting back to just getting back to where we came from. We're that kind of creatures. We actually were nomadic. We used to be nomadic. We loved being outside. That's how we lived. And so there is that special connection to nature that I think all of us have. And it's just, you've got to get in touch with it sometimes or you're going to go crazy.
0:17:05
I know. I'd agree with that. I'm not a hiker, as I've now said like five times. But on a serious note, I went on a six-month-long mission trip where the only type of transportation we had was a lot of walking So it wasn't necessarily hiking but it was a lot of outdoors activity and there's something about Just being outside in nature and like all of a sudden you just feel so small You just recognize that like the world is this ginormous place and you're just this smaller person It kind of makes your worries a little bit smaller. Yeah, you know, you're like, okay I'm so stressed about whatever it is. If you're a student, it's an exam. If you're an employee, it's your boss on you. Or if you're a parent, it's your kids. There's always something. But when you're just standing there and you're like, wait, my worries are so small, the world is so big. So I totally hear what you're saying and I agree to that. My thing, the reason I'm a little hard to jump on the hiking is the actual physical strain it puts on your body. But it sounds like there's options. You don't always have to be going like...
0:18:06
Hargayle.
0:18:07
Yeah.
0:18:08
Yeah. You could be doing some little easier hikes. And right here in Las Vegas.
0:18:12
Absolutely.
0:18:13
Which I love.
0:18:14
Absolutely, yeah. You have tons of options. Like you don't always have to be gung-ho. And I mean, I've done everything from railroad tunnels to a 21-mile hike on Charleston that, yeah, was all one way and I mean I've done Telescope Peak and Death Valley which you know can be daunting like it's all it's mostly uphill and then you get up to the the top of the peak and it's like you're at 11 10 to 11,000 feet and it's it's real and yeah it's insane. Has there ever been a hike that you couldn't finish? Yes there was actually. I do hope to go back and complete it. I will preface and say that when I did it, I was not in as good of hiking shape as I am now. But I was just starting to get back into it and I was with some friends. It was just... so I'll... let me explain what happened. So I had just... I had started hiking back in 2005. I was with the group I mentioned earlier, the meetup group. It started to get to the point, unfortunately, where the group was getting so big that it was hard to go and attend events because they did put a cap for safety, of course, but then it came to a point where life just happened and I kind of took a hiatus and it wasn't until probably 2000, well, three years ago, actually, yeah, about three years ago that I decided I wanted to get back into it. I hadn't done it in a while. I had just kind of gone through some major transitions in my life, getting a new job, ending a relationship, and then also moving into a new place. So many things happening at once that I wanted to get back to something that I knew was part of me, and that was hiking, being outside. I hadn't done it in a long time, and for my health also, because I wasn't as active as I used to be in college a few years after that. So I went and met up with this group for one hike. I met a couple friends, and then we never, I never went with that group again, because I had found this core group of three or four people that like to go hiking and go camping. So fast forward about a year or so, and they wanted to do this hike in Baker, Nevada. And by the way, for anyone who doesn't know, we do have a national park in this state. It is Great Basin National Park. It's about four to five hours drive, give or take, north of Nevada. It's in a small town called Baker, not Baker, California, by the way, Baker, Nevada. There is a Baker here. There is a hike there that, correct me if I'm wrong, and for those, if I get this wrong, please don't judge me, but no, I believe that one of the tallest peaks in Nevada is there. It's called Wheeler Peak. So I went with a few friends. We were going to go. We went Fourth of July weekend. And we camped up in, I guess it's called Wheeler, Upper Wheeler campground. It was gorgeous, gorgeous, gorgeous. Had a creek running through it. And we decided to hike Wheeler Peak. And I had not hiked very much in a while prior to this, but I was like, you know what, I'm going to do it anyway because I need to get back into shape. I just, I was like, I have to do this and I'll do what I can. I didn't know what to expect. So when we get to, we hike, hike, hike, hike, hike, it's like, it starts out pretty level and it gradually, gradually, gradually gets about, to get higher, higher, higher, it's more uphill. It was definitely taxing, I mean, even for me at that time. And then we get to this level area where before, yeah, so we get to this level area and then there's this one last, I can't even tell how high it was, but it was like an exposed pinnacle point, I guess, of scrambling. By that point, that wasn't the part that bothered me, it was the elevation. I was starting to get elevation sickness. So that was primarily my reason, but then in looking at that pinnacle, I was like, oh guys, I don't think so. They're like, no, it's fine, we'll go do this and we'll come back for you. I'm like, okay, that's fine. So I sat there. I honestly felt so bad that I didn't do that little pinnacle because I was like, why did I quit? And I felt so bad, but I was like, you know what? I'm going to come back here and do this again. But in that moment, I was just like, oh, I'm so, I was tired. I was just like, I was done. But I was just mostly like combination of I'm tired, but I'm like, I wish I could have just stuck it out and had a celebratory beer at the top, you know? Because a few of them brought a beer with them, you know, to drink in celebration. But I did it and they're like, we don't judge you, it's fine. And then I was like, you know what, I'm coming back and someday I'm going to go back and do Wheeler again and I'm going to do that pinnacle and I'm going to buy myself a shirt at the gift shop that says I completed Wheeler Peak. But that, yes, that is the only hike to date that I did not fully complete in my mind.
0:22:50
So.
0:22:51
Well, and it, you know, but it's also a good thing because like, you have to know your body. You have to know your limitations.
0:22:55
And that is another tip is to please, like if something just does not, if you are not ready for something, don't force yourself to do it. You know, start small, build your endurance, build your strength. There's no shame in doing that, honestly. Like, that hike was an exception because I was like, hey, I didn't really know. I just kind of went with some friends. But it was after that that I'm like, okay, I got to start small. And it wasn't until about another year later during the pandemic that I really started to get back into it after that point. So my friend that I had gone hiking with in the year prior had moved away for a job opportunity. And so during the pandemic, a lot of people either were kind of like uncertain about like what to do, like, can I go outside? Like, you know, a lot of people were kind of, there was uncertain, unprecedented times. But I was like, I gotta get outside. I can't stay inside. I can't do this. I'm not going to stay indoors. Like being outside is the best thing you can do right now. But I didn't know any of my closer people that were either available, you know, due to time constraints or other reasons. So I was like, okay, I got to find another option. I need to find another outlet. It wasn't until I hopped on Facebook and realized I had joined a hiking group about four or five months prior, but had never done anything with them. So I decided, you know what? I'm gonna go and just see what happens. Yeah. Sure enough, I went on this. It was a very easy hike in Red Rock called First Creek Trail. Also another recommendation for an easy hike for those who are just getting into it. It's highly recommended and beautiful. And I met a core group of people, some of them were admins of the group, some of them were just people who were brand new or had, you know, been in it for a while. I met them and from that point on, I was hiking every weekend, at least once. And this was through the pandemic? This was through the pandemic. And to be honest, hiking is, I truly believe that hiking was what got me through the pandemic.
0:24:49
Yeah, because you make up a good point. Like each of us had our own struggles with the pandemic.
0:24:53
We did, yeah.
0:24:53
Plenty.
0:24:54
I, my struggle being an extrovert was that I couldn't meet new people.
0:24:58
Yeah.
0:24:59
So that was really hard. But for you, like you're saying, outdoors brings you happiness and it brings you like, so it was like a struggle, but you found a way to still make that happen. That's awesome.
0:25:08
Yeah.
0:25:09
You mentioned the community and I want to talk more about the community, but we're going to toss it to break real quick. So if you're listening, thanks for tuning in. You are listening to OK But Seriously. I am Vanessa Lauren. I'm sitting here with Danica. We are going over hiking and outdoor activities. We're gonna take a break, and then when we come back, we're gonna talk about the community, and then we're also gonna play a little trivia game. So don't go anywhere.
0:25:31
We'll be right back.
0:25:33
All right, welcome back, everyone. You're listening to 91.5, the Rebel HD2 KUNV. We're listener supported, the broadcast center out of UNLV. I am Vanessa Lauren. You're listening to OK But Seriously, and tonight I'm talking with Danica Jensen, a UNLV alumni and a hiking enthusiast, I guess we'll say. She's not an expert but she has experience and we've been talking, she's been telling us her story about how she got into hiking and some great local spots around town. So if you missed any of that be sure to check that out on the website the episodes go up on the website and then in podcast form later on so you can get all that for right now we're gonna break down like she's gonna talk a little about the community and then from there we're gonna play a trivia game yeah yeah so let's talk about the community sure what's your favorite
0:26:20
thing about it oh man I mean just everyone's so supportive. Everyone just wants, I mean, safety is a huge thing, especially for, there's a huge element of risk in going hiking, because it's not always gonna be controlled. Even on the easiest trails, there's still an element of risk. Like if you went to, say, railroad tunnels, you could still run into small wildlife. You just never know what's gonna happen. Or heat stroke, things like that. I mean, there's just so many things to consider. So you could be on the easiest hike in the world and still have things to keep in mind. So with that being said, I'd say that the fact that the community is very supportive and looking out for you, that's one of my favorite things. And you could say, hey, I want to do this trail, but maybe I want to bring a pet, or maybe I have kids that I want to bring with me, you know, or I have family in town that maybe they don't do as much hiking, but I'd like for them to still experience something I love, where should I go? And what's the weather? Maybe they've still checked the weather, but things can change from day to day. So the community that I've been on has just been so supportive and informative and just giving advice, but understanding that you make your final choice. You make your final decision, but you do it at your own risk.
0:27:38
You know, just, yeah, it's just been, I think it's just the looking out for everybody, honestly. Okay, now someone like me, if I was going to take up hiking, I would just go out there and just walk around and be like, hi, I'm Vanessa, who are you? But I don't think everyone's like that. So, seriously though, like how do you get connected with the community? You mentioned Facebook earlier.
0:28:01
Yes.
0:28:02
Are there any other ways? Yeah, Facebook, I mean, it's probably the biggest one right now. A lot of groups are forming of various sizes and sometimes they're focused on maybe catering to the senior group, the active 55 and older. Then you have strictly just for women or people who have children or people who have pets or in a certain age category, or then there's just some that you're like, hey, we just love hiking, or camping, or, you know, there's so many options out there on Facebook that if you were to just search in groups, you would have no, like, no trouble finding something that works for you. And the great thing about it is, is it's all, you know, free, it's just, you know, really all you're spending is the cost of gas and on your own gear, really. Okay. Outside of that, I mean, Meetup, while it's probably not as popular as Facebook is now, it's still an outlet for those who maybe want that more structured environment on Meetup where you have to RSVP and actually show when you say you're gonna do it, but Facebook is a little bit more, little bit more relaxed in that respect. But I mean, honestly, or if you just have other friends of friends, like mutual friends, just like, hey, do you know anybody who loves going hiking? Or, you know, if you go to the university here at UNLV, I'm sure there's plenty of outdoor groups and who, I believe there was, there used to be like an outdoor adventures group that would go and do little planned trips and things like that. And, you know, if you travel out of state, find out if there's other hiking groups that you can connect with while you're traveling and you don't even have to do it locally so there's tons of options. That's a good point.
0:29:42
Yeah. Yeah.
0:29:44
Because you've done some stuff outside of Canada.
0:29:45
I have. Plenty, yeah. Yeah.
0:29:48
So that the community is obviously everywhere. Very expansive. Yeah. You'll have no trouble finding somewhere, some group that is willing to go with you, honestly.
0:29:56
So this kind of pulls me to my next question. I want to talk about common misconceptions. Yeah. So right now during the break I was telling I was telling Danica like hey, what are some common misconceptions? She's like well, what are some misconceptions you have me because I'm not in the community So one of the things that I fear is like being a beginner and also not being at my physical peak I am worried that I will like bring a group down Like is that something that is in that community where they kind of get annoyed at beginners? I
0:30:29
wouldn't necessarily say that it is a common thing. I will just say it's definitely a concern and it's just something that the community will definitely advise you like, hey if you're just getting into it, know your abilities. You know if somebody shares information about a hike they're organizing, please read and understand all the details before making your choice. Just know that there's a certain difficulty level. It could be beginner, it could be medium, or it could be super advanced. Of course, if you're just getting into it, don't try to do 12 miles in a day. Start small, know your abilities, and if you don't see anything that's to your liking, then organize something yourself. You know, there's no, yeah, there's no problem in trying to take ownership of something. And you know, if they say, if you want something done, do it yourself. Yeah. So if there's other people that you can see, like ask like, hey, are there any other people who don't hike as much, but want to get into it? I'm thinking about putting a hike together and start collectively organizing something and take ownership of it, like run with it, you know? But I really wouldn't say there's no judgment. It's just to really just educate yourself and remember that you are responsible for your own safety. Even if you're on an organized hike, nobody can fully look out for your own safety except for you, you know? But if you are on an organized hike, there is a absolutely a level of responsibility on whoever, I've led hikes as well. And I personally take it upon myself if I can, and I usually do, I will go out and scout the trail first so that I know what I'm doing. So yeah, and I do that because it's an activity with an element of risk. And if somebody gets hurt, it's on you and them. It's on, you know, everybody together, you know, no one gets left behind. Everyone stays together as much as possible. If you are gonna be staying behind, like give someone a heads up, like make sure that they know where the end point is if there is, and just know that, do they have all the right equipment? Like do they seem like they're seasoned enough that they could still make it in some way? But I will say no one ever gets left behind. In all the hikes I've ever done, everybody looks out for each other. Everybody, you know, just knows, like, hey, I know what I'm getting myself into. This is where we're starting. This is where we're planning to get back to, especially if it's an out and back kind of situation, or if it's a loop, knowing, you know, just do your research, do your homework, be informed, like, educate yourself before you do it, you know?
0:33:09
Okay.
0:33:10
Yeah. Yeah, that makes, and that's kind of, I think, with anything, right?
0:33:12
Absolutely, yeah.
0:33:13
Like, it's, but that's good to know, because, like I said, it's one of those intimidation things It's like I don't want it like it seems like such a community that knows what they're doing you it feels like everyone knows what?
0:33:22
They're doing I will say not everybody knows what they're doing. I will say that for sure Yeah, not everybody. I mean, I don't even always know Everything I'm doing but I do my best to educate myself and learn from everybody that I'm hiking with I mean, there's always something to learn no matter how seasoned you might be, but I will say that if somebody just does not take at least part of the responsibility for their own safety, then you need to stop and assess. Like, you have to. Like, everyone, we're individuals, we're taking the risk of doing something that could potentially hurt us. But this is not to scare anybody, but just be smart, like, have some understanding of like some basic, like take enough water, take enough food, you know, dress the right way, like understand the weather. And again, if you are just starting out, do not hike alone. Like I have, I will say I've hiked enough where there are some hikes that I've done plenty of times that I could do by myself. But there are still some trails that I'm like, no, I'm not 100% on. But there are also some great apps that you can download that you can also, I forgot to mention that of course, AllTrails is a great app, popular app that you can look up hikes, find out like based on difficulty, length, how much time, people can leave reviews on the trail to give you an idea of maybe the trails changed in the last few years because of weather conditions or things like that or just, you know, the environment changes all the time. So definitely check out AllTrails. It's a great app. I use it and I've used it to track my hikes so that if there's one I want to do again and lead, I already have it available to me.
0:34:54
Oh, smart. Yeah.
0:34:56
I've heard of it.
0:34:57
GPS.
0:34:58
I've used it. I've used all trails. And the cool thing about all trails is that it does even just like literal parks. It does. Like your average park that's in the middle of the city. Yeah. So if you're like me and maybe you're like, listen, I want to go outside, but I don't want to like scramble up a mountain or whatever, you could still use all trails to find the very easy, child-friendly type.
0:35:19
Absolutely.
0:35:20
We have so many parks here, so many that are gorgeous and that have great defined paths and they're very kid-friendly, pet-friendly. I've taken walks around my own neighborhood and that's how I tend to stay in shape in between hikes is just simply taking a walk, just getting outside. Start small and just build up, you know? There's no harm in that.
0:35:42
You said earlier, you said take water, food, and um... Good shoes. Good shoes. Okay, good shoes. So I want to talk a little bit about gear. Yeah. Because that's another, I guess, common misconception is I feel like I have to spend all this money to get all this fancy stuff.
0:35:55
No, not at all. So I guess the first question is, what are like the essentials that you need to have gear wise? Great question. So absolutely, I mean of course water. Have an easy way to like carry water with you. If you're doing like probably a super flat hike, just a water bottle is sufficient because you can just hold that and you don't have to like you know just if it's a really flat trail I mean a water bottle is okay just make sure taking enough. Generally from what I've been using as a rule of thumb like you know at least I mean depending on the length I would say maybe at least a couple liters You know if we're doing like maybe a few miles two liters should be good, but always it's good to bring more Have at least if you have like a backpack something to carry like you know so you're not holding in your hand all the time Definitely a good something to carry your water something to carry your food You know protein you know have good jerk you know jerky is a great snack, fruit, granola, anything that's going to give you quick energy, but also protein is good for sustainable energy. So jerky is a really good, I have that and some granola with me on every hike I go on. Okay. So definitely good, lots, plenty of food, plenty of water, something if, ideally, if you can, like a backpack, you know, there's, you can find one as inexpensive as like 15 to $20 on Amazon that has like a bladder that can hold all your water and such. And then even just as important as those is good shoes. You don't have to spend a fortune to get good hiking shoes. I can guarantee you that. You can find a decent pair between 50 and 100 that you can find on Amazon. You could go to REI, but personally I go to Amazon just because it's cheaper. But REI is not bad. I swear it's not. I've gotten gear from there before, but you definitely don't want to wear just sneakers, even on the flattest trail because you want something with good enough traction even on just your regular old dirt, sand trail. So these would be like branded as hiking shoes? Primarily, yes. Okay. Yeah, hiking shoes, you have your low cut, which is like just below your ankle, you have your mid cut, which just about covers your ankle, and then you have your high-cut shoes, which are basically boots that cover your ankles, which by the way are good to have because it is snake season. Just putting it out there.
0:38:10
Oh, fantastic.
0:38:12
But in the, oh, let me just say this, in the 18 years I've lived here, I've seen two.
0:38:17
That's more than I've seen, Danica!
0:38:20
No, but honestly, they're more afraid of you than you are of them. If you do happen to come in the vicinity of one, just leave it alone, honestly. Like, that's really all you need to do. Like, I mean, sure, like you don't wanna, I have heard of some stories where people have accidentally almost stepped on one, but I never had. Yeah, it's rare though, but like, primarily they come out more when it's, you know, I mean, right now it's hot, but like, yeah. But if it's cold, like, yeah, they're not gonna come out. But that's just something to keep in mind though for safety. But you know, it's just good to cover your ankles. You know, wear long pants if you can or just something to cover your ankles, especially if you do come across any wildlife. And also just brush cactus, things like that. But yeah, good quality shoes with good traction that fit you well. And if you are not sure about your fit, REI is a good place to go and they will help you get fitted for shoes. Oh nice. You don't even have to like buy your shoes at REI, you could just get fitted, try on a couple brands, because not all of them fit the same. Sure. I can say that because I used to work at a shoe company. So you know, get fitted, it needs to be comfortable, it needs to move with you, and it needs to have good traction because you know, you just never know. Like yeah, you could trip on a, you could still trip on your seat on the trail, it has happened, trust me.
0:39:39
That's me go into REI and get your Beyonce shoe fitting Yes, and then walk away. Yes, that's what we learned tonight
0:39:46
But you don't have to spend a lot of money to go hiking. No good to know and just like any hobby You build you you advance and upgrade as you go sure as you start getting more experience, and you start maybe doing more moderate to difficult trails, then you can upgrade. You can upgrade. Upgrade, get better shoes, get a better camelback, you know, all of that stuff.
0:40:07
But just to start, basically you just need the shoes, the water, the treats. The last thing I want to talk to you about before we get into our trivia game, if you're just joining us, this is okay but seriously, I'm Vanessa, I'm talking with Danica here tonight. We're talking about hiking, and I would love to hear about hiking etiquette, and then I want to talk a little bit about safety.
0:40:32
Absolutely. So one of the biggest things about, or I would say probably the primary etiquette on trails is the right of way. So kind of think about it as if you were just driving on a street, right? So you've got, you know, you have people stopping at, say, like a four-way stop, like who's gonna go, who's gonna go? You know, generally it's gonna be, it's usually the person to your right, usually, from what I understand. But if you're on a trail, at least in my experience, if somebody's coming up the trail and I'm coming down the trail, I will stand to the side and let them pass first. Because they're just starting, and it's like coming down, you're generally going, you know, the elevation's coming down, right? So if somebody is coming up and they're like, oh man, like, am I almost there? It's like, no, I'll let them pass. I'll stand to the side of the trail and I'll let them pass first. You know, again, right away. I feel like it's the right-of-way rule is probably number one. Outside of that, I mean, just if you feel like somebody is, you know, maybe a slightly bit of a faster pace than you then move to the side if they're coming up behind you.
0:41:39
So similar to driving?
0:41:40
Yep, similar to driving. Yeah, I would treat hiking the same, like very similar to how you would be on the road.
0:41:45
Just don't cut anyone off.
0:41:46
Yes, do not cut anybody off. Yeah, and then just, you know, if you see someone with pets, someone with kids, like maybe, you know, let them pass before you. Like, you know, just the golden rule.
0:41:56
Now this kind of segues into the safety thing because yes, there's like the actual physical safety which we've kind of touched on.
0:42:02
Absolutely.
0:42:03
You told us about the snakes and the boots. But what about the safety of, I'm not single, I have not been single for a long time, but I have had a lot of single girlfriends who go on the dating apps and it's like the number one thing every guy puts on their profile that they hike. So if I'm a girl and I'm going out on a hike with this guy, was there any like things that I can put on my phone ahead of time just in case something gets weird like I want to talk about like the safety of hiking with people even
0:42:31
if you're in a group and you don't know them very well. Yeah I would say let somebody know where you're going, let them know how long you hope to expect to be out and if they don't hear from you by a certain time then then get worried. Okay. I mean I think just like anything else like if you're gonna be be out somewhere especially somewhere with very little to no reception. Or you can, I believe, was it, Facebook has a location feature. You know, there's also just, like yeah, give them the name of the trail you're going on, let them know, you know, what time you're leaving, what time you hope to be, like just, yeah. Just those, the basics of safety, yeah. And I mean, I know you just mentioned that people do sometimes go on, you know, dates, or hikes as dates. I will just say, do it at your own risk. I am not going to advocate making that probably a first date activity. If you can, I would say go with a group, every single time. Go with a group of people that, maybe bring someone with you if you'd like. Bring another friend, somebody you know that gets you comfortable with the group. Although for in my case, I just went alone, but we did a very easy trail and it was in the daytime. But yeah, I would say follow the golden rules of safety that you would probably do in any situation, not just for hiking and being outside.
0:43:49
And then once out on the trail, whether you are on a date or with a group or maybe even just a friend, let's just say me and a buddy are going and we're both not that great experienced and we run into some kind of trouble, is there any sort of lingo within the community or is there anything that I can like, I don't know, like a number you can contact or does that
0:44:10
vary everywhere you go? To be honest I really don't know about any like lingo per se when it comes to you know being in an emergency situation. I mean bottom line is I know of some friends of mine that I have hiked with have brought walkie-talkies with them. Just staying close together, don't try to branch out from the group even regardless of your ability. Like stay with the group, especially for the person who's leading it so they know, okay, we had this many going in, we have this many coming out. You know, have your emergency numbers, like bring a flash, you know, bring multiple sources of light, bring a flare, bring first aid. I mean, all of that I think is pretty standard for safety. Absolutely, yeah.
0:44:55
Yeah, no, 100%. Okay, so now we're gonna spend the last couple minutes playing a trivia game, which Danica did not know. She sat down and I was like, guess what? I have a trivia game. So, thank you for joining us tonight. If you are just joining the end of this conversation, we are talking about hiking and outdoor activities and Danica has shared a lot of tips so you don't want if you want to go back and re-listen any of this please do it's on the website at the Rebel HD too and it's also going to be on the podcast forum. So trivia game so my first question really light-hearted question how many people go missing on hikes in America every year just take a guess. Wow. Oh, I bet it's pretty high. I'm gonna say 50. Okay, so this was account in 2020. You're saying 50 people go missing? Yeah, every year. Okay. It's 600,000. Oh, wow. But okay, not not to freak anyone out. It's 600,000. But it's the article I found was talking about a majority of them are found a good high Percentage are very so these aren't people who like go missing and then just never ever be seen again. No, no
0:46:11
For my yeah, I've heard of a lot of people being found. Have you ever gotten lost? I've had a brief feeling like I was but it was extremely brief Okay, so no not completely lost. No, but like maybe off trail, but I wouldn't say completely lost, no.
0:46:31
I was telling you when we originally talked about this topic, my story, so I'll just share it with the listeners real fast. So I, when I came back from my mission trip, I was like in that mind space of, oh yeah, I've been outside for six months, I can do all things. And I have a friend who is a hiker and he asked me to go along with him and his family, his mom and his mom's friend. I was like, oh, I got this. And he was doing, I don't know what it's called, but it's the Mount Charleston hike. It's the one that goes like, it takes 12 hours to get to the top. And then it's like- Charleston Peak, yeah. Yeah.
0:47:05
It's a big one.
0:47:06
I don't know. I'm like, yeah, let's go. So we woke up really early, got out there like five in the morning and just the four of us. I made it from the car to like the start of the path and was like I can't do this anymore. Like what you were talking about earlier where you felt overwhelmed and you were at the top like by the pinnacle. I felt that in the parking lot.
0:47:24
Oh my goodness.
0:47:25
Yeah, it was not a good time. But basically I turned to my friend like I'm so sorry but I don't want to drag you guys down like I can barely handle this. I'm not going to make it 12 hours. So I'm going to turn around and go back. And he was like, Are you sure you're just going to be sitting there? I'm like, Oh, it's fine. I've seen Rocket Man. I can keep myself entertained. So I went back down and I sat in the car, just minding my business. About six, seven hours later maybe, I get a Facebook message from him. And he's like, hey, I need you to call me. So I somehow get ahold of him and he's like, we're lost, we've lost the trail. And I'm like, oh man. He's like, I can't get ahold of anyone else. I think just because I was so close in cell reception because I was at the bottom of the mountain Yeah, so he's like I need you to give me all the instructions. He knew what to do. He was not panicked He was like I need you to contact the Rangers and dada So I ended up contacting the Rangers and at the end of it all hits fan all the family comes up They ended up helicoptering them off the mountain Because they could not find the family got dark and he had a flashlight what you were just talking about And that's how they located them. I did not get lost, but he did. Jared, hello out there. He got lost and I saved him. That's the story. So bring a friend that doesn't like to hike that can sit at the bottom of the mountain and just wait for you. I'm just kidding. So okay, next trivia question. How long, we talked a little bit about this, how long can someone survive in the wilderness? So the rule of threes.
0:48:51
Yeah, so I've heard this before. From the smallest number to the biggest number, I've heard it's three minutes without air, three days without food. I recently learned this and just found this out before this show. Three hours without shelter, and then three weeks without... Three minutes without air, three days without water, three hours without shelter, and three weeks without food. That is all correct.
0:49:17
Look at you.
0:49:18
Yeah.
0:49:19
Yes.
0:49:20
So, yes, the rule of threes is three minutes without air, it says, or if you're in icy
0:49:25
water.
0:49:26
I guess icy water changes all of this. Oh, everything, yeah. Definitely. So, like, the people of the Titanic, this doesn't apply. This did not, yeah, they did not. Yeah, three minutes without air, three hours without shelter in a harsh environment.
0:49:38
Very harsh, generally.
0:49:39
And then it says three days without water if you're sheltered and there's not a harsh environment.
0:49:44
Primarily, yes.
0:49:45
Yes.
0:49:46
And then the three weeks without food if you have water and shelter.
0:49:49
Yep, exactly.
0:49:50
Three, three, three, three.
0:49:51
Yep.
0:49:51
Okay, and then my last question for you today is, do you know, I have the top five toughest hikes in the world.
0:49:59
Okay.
0:50:00
Do you think you can name any of them?
0:50:02
I could probably take a guess. Pacific Crest Trail? No, these are all like in different countries. Oh, okay. Well, I'm gonna guess probably Mount Everest. Yes. Mount Kilimanjaro? Yes. Okay. All right. I don't know if this is... Go ahead. No, no, go ahead. I was gonna say I don't think this is a hike, but it's pretty close. I was gonna say Machu Picchu Probably not though not on here, but yeah, I know I know what you mean But yeah, definitely Everest for sure definitely Kilimanjaro, and I've known people who've done Kilimanjaro before really yes I had some friends who did hike Kilimanjaro, and yes, they came back unscathed, but they said it was it was a little Yeah, it was brutal. Yeah, okay, so for the listeners out there
0:50:44
I have the list and a couple little stats about them.
0:50:49
Yeah, please share.
0:50:50
Okay, so number one is obviously Everest, so I just took that one right off.
0:50:54
That's the pinnacle right there.
0:50:55
Yeah, we know that. But next is actually one, well, not in the continual states, but it's in Hawaii. So Kalula Valley in Hawaii, it's an 11-mile trail. It says that it sits 4,000 feet above the ocean. No way. Which sounds very beautiful, yeah.
0:51:14
Yeah, I'm going there.
0:51:16
I know. It sounds good, right? Yeah. Okay, and then the next one I have is the Dentis Circuit in Patagonia, Chile.
0:51:26
Oh, okay. Cool.
0:51:28
Does that sound familiar? Vaguely. Okay, so it says it's really remote, it's high, and it's an unsupported route on a desolated island, and it has harsh, extreme weather conditions. So it sounds lovely. It does, super lovely. But of course all of these are like the views though, the views are amazing. It's all about the views. Right, all about the views. And then the next one is the snowman trek in Bhutan. Have you heard anything about this? No, but I heard of, I know Bhutan, but not that. So this is, it's a 20-something day walk, continual, and walk continually and it stays above it stays 4,000 meters above sea level and the highest it gets is 5,300 and something so it's pretty much impossible
0:52:15
in the winter according to the website. I'd say that. You know there's one that that's I haven't heard it yet but there is a hike slash long walk in Spain that I'm surprised hasn't made the list it's called I think El Camino or the Camino Real, I think it's called. I might be getting the name wrong, but they've actually made a movie and documentary about it. Really? Yeah. And that's one that I've been told, like, that's one that's on for the bucket list,
0:52:38
for sure.
0:52:39
Okay.
0:52:40
Okay. And then we have Mount Kilimanjaro, which you talked about. That's in Africa. It's 36 kilometers, and it's beautiful landscapes and forests and waterfalls and all that and I'm sure your friends can attest to that that it was indeed beautiful. Oh yeah. Did they train for that before
0:52:56
they went? Oh yeah they did. They trained right? Yes they definitely trained. They did a significant amount of hiking and plenty of altitude training which you do need for something like that. Yeah. And that's something that I think is incredibly important if you are starting to build your skills in hiking is is get as much altitude exposure as you can especially if you are going to do Charleston, anything that's going to have a fair amount of elevation, you definitely want to get your body used to that.
0:53:22
That makes sense. That makes sense.
0:53:23
Yeah.
0:53:23
Okay. And then the last one, I'm going to do my best to pronounce this right. It's a Kakuta track in Papua New Guinea.
0:53:32
Never heard of it. No.
0:53:33
So this is, it says it has World War II history and it's where the Japanese and the Australians fought on the front lines. So it's pretty hostile and remote and it's pretty much all just the wilderness is what it said on its website. So I'm like, interesting. But again, these are like most difficult. These aren't like the most popular. These are like the things that if you were to do it, it takes a lot of training and a lot of patience and whatnot.
0:54:03
So-
0:54:04
Bucket list hikes. Yeah.
0:54:05
Things that I'll never do.
0:54:07
Okay.
0:54:08
It's been so lovely talking with you.
0:54:11
Likewise, dear.
0:54:12
I appreciate you coming in and talking about all these things. I would love to leave our listeners with a couple of, if maybe they're not, maybe they're not nature people or maybe they just can't, you know, there's people who just don't, aren't able bodied to do these things. But you can still learn things about hiking and being outdoors. So we were talking about some of the movies and shows to watch. The one you were telling me about is with Reese Witherspoon. What was it called again?
0:54:39
So there's a movie called Wild, where this woman's mother passes away and it inspires her to do this backpacking trip across the country and find herself and understand who she is after the death of her mother There is that documentary mentioned about that Camino Royale longest one of the longest trails in Spain There's tons of in the others survivor man. I mean yeah, I wouldn't say they're necessarily hiking specific But they're just just being outside in general you know one of the shows you and I have in common that we watch is alone Yes, I am familiar with that one. Yeah. Explain what alone's about for people who don't know. So it's been a while since I've seen it, but from the concept I understood it was you place people literally just solo in the woods and they are given like at least a couple of you know extra supplies, but not many and they just literally survive on their own. They're they're out there. Nobody else is around. They have a camera and it's all self shot and yeah they're just you get to see what it's like being out in the woods nobody else around. It really is wild. It is literally wild.
0:55:48
As someone who works in production and TV you see things like Survivor and you know that like there's a crew.
0:55:56
It's scripted.
0:55:57
Yeah and you know that there's like if there's a crew there's like a tent of food a mile away. Sure, sure. Like there's, not to say that it's not, you know, hard sometimes, but this alone is, it's shot completely on their own. And I remember the one episode I watched, the guy was bailing, because if you're competing for money, they're competing for like $100,000. And the thing about it is there's like, say, 10 people competing. You don't know the status of the other nine. Nope. So you don't know if you're outlasting everyone and you're the last one, or if there's still 10 people in the game. So it's very interesting. But the one I watched, the guy was like talking to himself, trying to keep himself like entertained. And then he started like talking about his wife and he caught himself.
0:56:33
He's like, wait, nevermind.
0:56:34
No, I love you. I'm so sorry. And like backtracked all his words. It's really entertaining. Oh yeah, definitely.
0:56:40
Yeah.
0:56:40
The other one that I just started watching for anyone interested is, would you survive? Oh, okay. Would you survive is real stories. They're like those reenactment. Yeah type of stories Mm-hmm, and it it's kind of interesting because it takes two things it takes the story of the person who did survive Yeah, and they retell it But then it also educates you on like what you what you could do if you were in the same situation So it's like educational and entertaining I guess certainly yeah, yeah
0:57:10
Just about anything from other people's experiences, good or bad, you know?
0:57:15
That's right.
0:57:16
All right, well thank you so much, Danica, for being here. Thanks for having me. And for all the listeners, thank you for tuning in tonight. If you missed any parts of any of the episodes of OK But Seriously, you can head over to therebelhd2.com. We have full episodes on there, and then they get posted as podcasts later on that you can listen on Spotify or any of the places you get your podcasts, just look up OK, But Seriously. And of course, I would love for you to listen live so you can call in and chat with me if ever you feel prompted. I'm here every Tuesday night from six to seven, and you're listening to the 91.5 KUNV, the Rebel HD 2. I'm gonna get you back to your music. I'm gonna get you back to your music. Have a good night.
Transcribed with Cockatoo