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A new D&D podcast from a Christian perspective.
Tony Benda 0:19
Hello, everyone. Welcome back to dungeons and disciples. My name is Tony Benda
Josh Shaw 0:23
and my name is Joshua Shaw. Welcome back.
Tony Benda 0:26
And today we are doing something a little bit different. We usually, well, I'll say this, we've been going through all the different types of character classes, 13 of them, 14 of them. I don't remember the number, but we're more than halfway there. Point is you need a break, that's right. And so like every refreshing thing in life, we have a new guest with us today. This individual hails from Montana, is part of an incredible show and a group of people that we've come to know and love. Their podcast is lorehaven hearth and Seth, would you like to introduce yourself?
Seth Burnham 1:01
Yeah, I'm Seth Burnham, and like you say, I live here in Billings, Montana, fellow Marine like Josh, served in the military, I guess Semper Goby like you. Yeah, awesome. And we love your show too. We had you guys on or had you on Tony last night. And it was, it was awesome. It was a lot of fun,
Josh Shaw 1:25
yeah, and that was a blast to say the least. I want to talk a little bit so like and we can hear from all perspectives here. So what is the importance of collaboration with others, especially walking into, um, our shows here, and especially how they advance the gospel?
Seth Burnham 1:40
Yeah, that's an interesting question. I wasn't, wasn't, wasn't prepared for that one, but I would say that I brought this up last night with Tony when we were recording our show. It's pretty amazing that about the same time lord Haven and dungeons of disciples started with the same with the same philosophy, like, yeah, we enjoy fantasy and we see the importance of storytelling as a as a means to spread the gospel. I mean, storytelling is the way God did everything. He wrote a whole book. That's right, that's right. Like, it's pretty amazing that he, he has given us this gift, He's created us in His image to also want to tell stories. And that's, that's basically the reason why we started our podcast. Originally, our show was called Faith fantasy and fairy tales and that, you know, that was with, I started it with my little brother, Monty. He's actually your guys's age. He's about eight years younger than I am. And we, like, we grew up playing all the like balders gates and all these different things, and we saw, like, the enjoyment that you could have in it, but also the redemptive part of storytelling. Yeah, in our last episode, I don't know if you caught this, Josh, you kind of referenced it, but we're trying to make good great again. Yes, like, yes, there that we truly do want to see that the good guy wins, because that is the ultimate story. It is the conquering of evil, the conquering of our sin, the conquering of the of the enemy, Christ conquering in victory on the cross. And that's really where you know it was. It was for my heart just draw. I was drawn to that. I think the Lord did a lot of work in me to say, I love these games. But how can these games point me and everybody that we're playing with towards Jesus? You know what I mean?
Josh Shaw 3:51
Yes, that's great. That's so beautiful, and especially when it comes like to the the reason why we collaborate, because even here at dungeons and disciples, one of our big things that we wanted to do early on was, as we started the show, we wanted to build a community. I mean, because that's what, that's what Jesus did, coming right off the bat. You can start the Gospels, this beautiful story by Jesus coming onto the scene and bringing people into the mix. I mean, I was actually just reading John chapter one. How he, you know, John the Baptist, you know, says this, behold, this is the son of like the Son of Man, and this is the man whose sandal not worthy to untie. And from there, two disciples went to go grab Simon, Peter, who Jesus called Cephas, and then Philip, who was also in the same town as Andrew, and Peter, went to go grab Nathaniel. And just this beautiful building of community in that essence. And I think the beautiful thing about collaborating, and just for the folks at home, why we continue to do this, and why we want you at home to reach out to us and reach out to Lor Haven and just become a part of this community, because there is something so beautiful about teaming up together for the gospel in a community that. Needs the gospel, you know, and we're gonna see that in I just in this time. We just need it so heavily,
Tony Benda 5:06
well, even just scripturally, back that the Bible specifically talks about a two stranded chord, A chord of what, three strands, two strings, a chord
Josh Shaw 5:14
of three strands. He's not a broken Ecclesiastes saying
Tony Benda 5:17
he knows scripture verse. Love it so.
Seth Burnham 5:20
And that speaks to one of my favorite books of the Bible, and one of my favorite chapters in the Bible is Colossians three and the unity that you find within the church. So it's it is amazing that God has put on your hearts and our hearts at the same time 1000s of miles away from each other. That's right, basically the same goal and mission. You can see that the Lord's hand is on it, because it truly was, uh, kind of a miracle that we all we started at the same time. It's pretty cool. It
Josh Shaw 5:52
is cool. But before we get more into lorehaven, uh, Seth, we have, we have the standard that I feel like Tony, we haven't done in quite some time. It's been, right? It's been a while, and it's, I've been listening. It's my favorite. I know. Well, guess what? You get to participate. That's right, all right. So for the folks at home that maybe, kind of maybe started in season two, maybe haven't seen this before, we love here on dungeons and disciples to rule personal character stats. Now us all here, nerds, we know we're kind of talking about but we can know that the stats here are strength, charisma, constitution, wisdom, intelligence and dexterity. And for those at home, we're gonna have Seth from 1000s of miles away. Beautiful roll 46 he's gonna drop the lowest, and then he's gonna add up the final three, establishing his score. And those are beautiful dice. And at that point, Seth, you we can actually do all the roles if you want. You can announce them to our to our viewers here, and you can, like, if you want to write them down or whatever, and you can assign them. Once all the roles are completed. Don't feel like you need to assign it on the spot. Well, I
Seth Burnham 7:04
gotta say, I was really excited about this portion of the show because I really wanted to roll these specific dice for you guys. And I even have my note taking device, right? Yeah, I'm ready to do this.
Tony Benda 7:16
Let me go. Are there any significance to this specific paradise or this set of they look
Seth Burnham 7:22
really cool. These are the ones that my wife bought me. Love it cool. Oh, that's beautiful. Here's the six on the
Josh Shaw 7:29
Oh, that is so cool, fantastic. Yeah, the listeners are like, what
Tony Benda 7:35
I may have to do a screen grab or two of this recording.
Seth Burnham 7:38
That totally fine. Yeah, that'd be great. So, yeah, that's, that's the only reason I want to roll these ones.
Josh Shaw 7:43
So that's awesome. Well, just know, Seth, that as we do this, you can take this whatever way you want. You know, you can get deep into testimony with this stuff, or you can just play it as a joke. You know, whichever one you feel like doing honestly up to you at this point, whatever, whatever builds the best lore. You know, I'm saying I like Right. Dang it. Poor joke. I'm sorry that was just poor. That's poor. All right, Seth, go ahead and roll. And then just announce everybody what your roles are. All right, first roll,
Unknown Speaker 8:15
I do too. Ouch.
Josh Shaw 8:19
That's not the good. It's not, it's not, it's not as bad
Seth Burnham 8:21
as I thought. I rolled two ones on that, yeah, okay, it was still an 11. So that's not
Tony Benda 8:26
bad. Okay, it's above average. That
Josh Shaw 8:28
is above average, technically, 20 rolls of four that we're gonna really get fancy. Oh,
Seth Burnham 8:34
he dropped it. Oh, but I'm keeping it, because it's a five, I'm keeping that so that one's a 14. Love it. Do
Josh Shaw 8:41
we officially recognize that DND does not count dice dropped on the floor? Or do we not say anything? Do I say? Do we cut
Tony Benda 8:50
that out of the five Seth is a well knowledged individual. This is for personal character. This is gonna need it. I'm gonna need it. No, he's a five and six in my book. Oh, all right, per dice, per fifth, that's a 15. That's a 15. Folks, way to go.
Seth Burnham 9:10
I'm like, staying above average on this one. We're doing good. I'm surprised I haven't
Josh Shaw 9:15
rolled a three yet. Well, you had ones already. So, I mean, yeah, exactly,
Seth Burnham 9:21
speak, too soon. Seth, that would be a nine,
Josh Shaw 9:26
a nine, okay, all right, listen the humble, the humble shall be exalted, and the exalted shall be humbled. Amen.
Seth Burnham 9:33
Well, I'm about to be humbled. Let's see we got a 10, okay?
Josh Shaw 9:43
As Tony would say, That's commoner status. Hey,
Tony Benda 9:48
sometimes we're not all exceptional and everything,
Seth Burnham 9:53
okay? Oh no,
Josh Shaw 9:56
please say, please say three. Yeah, right.
Seth Burnham 9:59
Know It, it's just another nine,
Unknown Speaker 10:03
still, okay,
Seth Burnham 10:03
yeah, so we got an 11, a, 14, a, 15, a, nine, a, 10 and a
Josh Shaw 10:10
nine. I would take those stats. That's still pretty good. I would take those
Seth Burnham 10:13
stats, I mean, they're not horrible. They'll be okay for level one, for sure.
Josh Shaw 10:18
All right. Now here comes the fun part. You can assign them to whatever care, to whatever one you want. You can start highest to low or lowest to high, whichever you feel like, but just go for it, brother. So
Seth Burnham 10:30
everybody that if you if, if you're a listener to lore Haven, hopefully some of you guys out there will, will check us out. But I would always throw myself as probably very highly charismatic. Okay, 1515. Is probably my highest role,
Tony Benda 10:46
I see.
Seth Burnham 10:49
And, you know, just a little bit of background, like, I, I love church. 100% my favorite thing during the week. 100% My wife has to, like, boot me out of the church, because I'm, I'm there. I'm talking the whole time. Yeah, I have probably 900 friends at church, you know, I'm, I'm there because I do love the people of God it they are my brothers and sisters. They are my family, and I love to be there and so and as it is interesting to me, because regularly I get asked to, you know, preach or ask for advice or whatever, and that's why the next one, I would say, probably is a that 14 that I rolled. I probably say wisdom. Wow. Okay, yeah, I, I not. It's this is not to, like, toot my own horn by any means. This is kind of judging from external sources, my family and my church family regularly coming to me for advice and asking, you know, what's you know, and in lots of situations, whether it's marital, marital strife, or whatever, they're constantly coming to me for things which I absolutely love now. Yeah, do I want to be a pastor? No,
Josh Shaw 12:11
don't interesting? Oh, that's so much work. Okay?
Seth Burnham 12:17
It's not because I wouldn't love the people and love the work, and it's not even because I haven't sought that particular office at one time. The reason I don't want to be a pastor is because of the current stage of life. I have seven kids at home, and most of them are very young.
Josh Shaw 12:37
Please pray. Please pray for this man, listeners, because I have two, and I battle constantly with them, seven, right?
Seth Burnham 12:47
I have eight children, and I have seven at home. So it's just, you know, I it's not, it's not where I'm at right now, moving on, I would say that like I'm a fairly strong person, at very least, constitutionally, like the difference between strength and constitution, I sometimes doesn't, doesn't get blurred as much as I think it should. There is Jim, Jim strong, and then there is strong, right? Yeah. And I would say strong. Strong is your constitution, Jim, strong is your
Josh Shaw 13:25
strength, right? Yeah, that's good. That's a great way to put it. And
Seth Burnham 13:29
so I would probably throw in my next highest, which is only an 11 in in constitution. Okay, um, intelligence. I am average, so I'll put a 10 there, and then nine dexterity, I can't do a back flip, so I'm going with a nine right there.
Josh Shaw 13:52
That's the sole determination. He said that I can't do a back flip. So this is why it's the lower terminators cannot. So if you could do a back flip, would it be like an 11 or a 14, if you could
Seth Burnham 14:02
do a backflip, I think 1112 would be you'd be able to do it. Okay, I've tried. I've tried. I almost hurt myself really bad, so I won't do it anymore. I do see that the wrist is recovering. Well, though, yes, it's that. It was actually my thumb. I'm sorry. Okay, here. And yeah, it is actually, I appreciate that it has been recovering a lot. Our church is really amazing. We have a lot of healthcare professionals at our church. The guy, one of the guys that took care of me, my physicians assistant, he was there. He's actually the one sewed it up, so the scar looks really nice. That's incredible. One of my, one of my really good friends, wives, is a occupational therapist, so all of the therapy that I've been doing, I've been doing with her, which has been really, really worries, that's awesome, I'm actually getting my dexterity back,
Josh Shaw 14:54
and he still puts it at his lowest.
Seth Burnham 14:57
So praise God for that. And then I. You know, my other one would be like, you know, I've still got a nine, and I still got strength, so we'll just throw it there. And that's only because I can't go to the gym and, and, you know, push pumps the iron right now, 300 pounds, like everybody else, like ever, like you guys, right? Yeah, exactly like me. No way.
Josh Shaw 15:21
The beard puts it at a 14 automatically. It automatically just makes you look stronger, like, well, straight up, that's
Seth Burnham 15:27
my racial right there, right
Unknown Speaker 15:32
by Rachel.
Seth Burnham 15:34
That's right. I'm a bearded man. That's my racial status. That's right.
Josh Shaw 15:41
Beard applied makes gives me plus five automatically. See, see, yeah, there you go. Well, Seth, thank you for that. That's I'll always that's one of our favorite skits to do. That is just such an awesome thing to hear. I had fun with it. That's awesome. All right. Seth, here comes the fun part now. So we do have a couple of questions. So I know we've started briefly talking about lorehaven and how we just talked about how just, even just together, between our shows how our missions and visions very much aligned at a much needed time. And first of all, I think it's incredible that the same time that the Lord was just laying this on our hearts is the same time the Lord is pressing you guys to lean in to that similar mission. So I we want to hear about it like you are here as a representative of a show that we absolutely love and adore. I just am. So I'm I'm just, I get excited when the show, when you guys New episodes come out, because I just get to drive to work and I just get to listen to nerdy stuff. And folks, when I say nerdy, I mean, I thought to myself, I'm, I'm a decent nerd. Like I'm, I'm sort of there I listen to to to Lor Haven hearth, and I'm like, I I gotta get my game going. I got, I got somewhere else to get to go to so exact. So we talked a little about about how the lore aspect into it. But what exactly is this show? Like, how did like, who came up with this idea? How did it evolve? Just give us all the details about it.
Seth Burnham 17:16
Well, I think you'd have to have a little bit of backstory. Just about me. I love fantasy. Absolutely love fantasy. And I absolutely love science fiction. My little brother Monty and I, I would point your guys as listeners to our show zero. We, we like to call it in in season one, it's a story. Storytelling philosophy, great episode. It is great episode. Y'all, yeah, it was our very first episode, and it was me and my little brother, Monty, and we were just talking about, essentially, the reason we wanted to start a podcast, the the our our enjoyment of of Dungeons and Dragons, of Halo, Star Wars, Star Trek. I mean, anything you could think of that's nerdy. We really, really enjoy it, right? I've read, I've read books and books and books and books and books drizzle or novels. I've read every single one of them. I'm a huge, huge, huge original, Extended Universe, Star Wars fan,
Josh Shaw 18:25
amen. Brother Amen.
Seth Burnham 18:27
Like legitimately, I love these stories, and I and I see a through line through all of the stories, either a good overcoming evil, which is the norm, right? And that is, and that's because that is the story that God has written on everybody's heart, or be the glorification of evil. And that right there is the exact same story. It's just the corrupted version of it. It's the corrupted version of it because of sin. And I see it every single time I read a story, I'm like, Oh, I love this story. And I Oh, that was kind of a cool use of magic. And oh, I see where they were. They directly ripped out of something that was sinful and evil right there. And I understand why. Because, because, as a Christian, I can actually see the real reasons for for those corrupted souls and things like that. So it just, I love fantasy. And so my little brother and I were like, hey, you know what? Let's start a podcast. It'll be the two of us, and we'll just literally talk about all the nerdy things, and we're gonna try to, we're gonna, we're gonna take it back. We're gonna take DND back. We're gonna take Star Wars back, back for the glory of God, for His Kingdom, because he is good and God, and He is deserving of all of the glory, Amen, that's powerful, basic, basically, that is the reason we started faith fantasy and fairy tales. I kind of like the the 3f or F, F cubed, or whatever you wanted to, whatever you want to, agree.
Tony Benda 19:59
Question,
Seth Burnham 20:01
yeah, exactly. It worked out really well. We changed our name, mostly because, after our first season, my little brother was part of I keep calling him my little brother. He's actually taller than me and weighs more than me.
Josh Shaw 20:17
My little brother. He's
Seth Burnham 20:18
way bigger than me, my younger brother, Monty, unfortunately, had a season of life where he had to step out. We had already brought in Morgan as our producer. Morgan is a great, great, great guy. I go to church with him. He is actually at our church in here, here in Billings, just an amazing, talented producer, and I Yes, he is, I can't gush over him enough. I really do appreciate Morgan a lot. So yeah, and I get to do that right here. I won't do that on our podcast, because I don't want him to get a
Josh Shaw 20:54
big head. So yo, we love you, Morgan.
Seth Burnham 21:01
But Monty had to step away. And Selena is actually Morgan's sister in law, and he's like, we, I literally just started playing DND with Morgan, and it's, we're playing 5e but it's his home brew world. I had just, like, maybe two, two sessions in with them. Selena. Selena. Selena plays the same game, and we just had chemistry in the game. And she's like, are you guys gonna continue the show? And we're like, I don't know. I don't I'm not gonna do it by myself. Yeah, and I maybe Morgan can fill in and be Monty for me. But, you know, I, you know, just the dynamic might change there, and Morgan's already got a lot of extra duties, and she's like, Well, can I try my hand at it? And I was like, Well, sure, let's try it, you know, let's try it. And so I think our first episode, the two of us together, was the Feywild, and it just, it just worked. It worked really, really well. She would she did an amazing job. Selena is a lot of fun to talk to, a lot of fun to banter with. Yeah. We always come at every episode with, like, completely different
Josh Shaw 22:19
notes. Yo. I love that about y'all, especially last episode, she was like, this is my opinion. Like, this is mine. And you guys, like,
Seth Burnham 22:28
those are opinions.
Josh Shaw 22:30
She always says, That's not what I got.
Seth Burnham 22:36
So even our episode last night, we ended up and we went unhinged last night, like, like, might as well throw out the script kind of attitude. I mean, it was, it was a good time, but last night it was just the same thing, same thing. And we, I was like, well, she said, she says to me, Well, my credibility is out the window. And I said, well, right there, from now on, I'd like to have like, a Wilhelm scream, you know, every time somebody's credibility goes out the window, because that sounds like a great thing, a lot of fun bring people in. But anyway, so it worked out really well for us. And you know, we really love what we're doing. We really get deep into, like, the the planes, I would say that there is deeper levels of lore, but stuff that people don't get, and especially little tidbits where people are like, Oh, I didn't know that about, about, you know, mechanics. That's kind of a cool, cool thought that you could have what is called shift spice in limbo. That's an idea that I'd never thought of as a as a DM, you know? Yeah, so just, it's a lot of fun for us, and we like to try to wrap up every episode at least a little bit with what, what parallels do we see in the Bible or in God's creative work. You know, where can we? Where can we parallel the Christian worldview with some of these fantastical worlds that we play in or we're reading about? So, 100%
Tony Benda 24:20
Yeah, yeah. That's, that's some of the stuff I find the most fascinating is, like the parallels. Because, I mean, that's similar to what Josh and I like to do is we like to find the DND parallels with the biblical truths and all that kind of stuff. But I love, I'll just, I'll just throw my little two cents in here. I love the what's the word I'm looking for? I love how you guys try to figure out how the word is supposed to be said. The discussion of how to pronounce a word is, like, some of the best portions of it.
Josh Shaw 24:50
Yeah, I think it's just so raw, like raw and real, like you guys do. I mean, from my perspective, it sounds like you guys do a ton of preparation. Oh my gosh. Like just, just a ton. And I guess that's my next follow on question. So as listeners start to come in, so why the planes? Why start with that? That's, that's what I want to know. I was just getting on board with, like, any lore, of any lore you could have started with. You said, you know, we're gonna do the planes,
Seth Burnham 25:23
yeah, we're gonna throw people a really big loop. Well, I would say, because a lot of people, when they're when they're building a character, there is a whole lot of sub lore that that goes behind each character, like for me, I had a I had a character that was an Ara cochra. For those of you out there that have listened to our podcast, I've talked about him. He is one of my absolute favorite characters of all time. He was a ericocra, Hex blade, warlock Samurai, you know, yada yada. He's a really awesome, awesome character, very, very low wisdom, I think as what I think is wisdom, super, super low, but hilarious and fun to play, but I have no idea, like, even, even his name is, you've already of a car, but I had no idea what the wind Dukes of a car were. And
Josh Shaw 26:21
so, okay, I was like, All right,
Seth Burnham 26:26
it's me typing really fast on my keyboard. What is a Ka and then I was like, whoa. This is cool stuff that nobody ever reads. Yeah. And so I was like, this is compelling for me, and I really enjoy it. Plus, each plane elicits a different response from me, whether it's visceral hate for it, like the hells and each one of the hells, each one of them, has a different aspect of vileness to it, yes, yes, that it brings about in me. And I'm like, okay, and there's reasons for that, right? Like, none of us like to be betrayed, and that was the subject of Gehenna last night. None of us want to use other people for our own gain. At least, I would hope not, right. Like, yeah, yeah, but, but that is something you find in the hell. So that elicits an ick factor, if you will. Let's Yeah, that was Selena's tagline for it. And then the and then the heavens. They're they're so the one that I really enjoyed talking about was bitopia. But the heavens are so broken and not really real when it comes when you consider the heavens. So even those like the they don't elicit peace in my heart when I think about them. Yeah, so there's something to talk about them, right? Exactly, getting to talk about them from a biblical perspective, and hopefully kind of opening up people's understandings of those planes. So, yeah, it was kind of a weird shot in the dark. But I also was like, it's interesting for me, and if it's interesting for me, I hope there's at least one other nerd out there that might think it's fun. Yeah, there you go.
Tony Benda 28:17
And I'll even add that you've saved me a ton of time and research that, you know,
Josh Shaw 28:21
but in all genuineness, they still have some to do. I didn't even think about that until I really started listening. It's like, you're so right, like we just build character backstories, and there's even deeper lore to those backstories that, I mean, someone took the time to write them because it felt important, and if we took the time to just dive into that we could have so much character base. And I love that. And by the way, the con the conversation of bitopia, was awesome. Yeah. Oh, thank you. So cool. I mean, just to hear, Oh, dude, it was so it was awesome. I loved it. I loved every second
Seth Burnham 28:57
of it. And and to parallel that, with my philosophy on the Bible and as a Christian, if you don't have all of the context of Scripture, then it's really hard to understand why Jesus had to die on the cross, right? Yes, it's really hard to understand what the church age is. It's really hard to understand why, why God reveals throughout, in, in, in time. Yeah, his word, right. I was reading this morning in Exodus, chapter 28 I think it was specifically about the priestly garments that the Aaronic priesthood wore. And, oh yes, like these. This has a lot to do with what we are seeing in the newness of creation, in Revelation and and you don't see that unless you have the entire story, unless you have the entire context. There was a plan for the beginning, right? Yeah, exactly. Well, there's a plan for the from the beginning, for every one of our characters. Oh, yeah. Whether, whether we. Realize that or not, you know?
Josh Shaw 30:01
Well, I think it's you bring up something so vital, and I just know what you're talking about, just because I got through Exodus, is that, I think sometimes we can take, it's kind of like backstories, right? We take that concept of, okay, this is the big overarching narrative. These are the big overarching stories that we see in the Bible. But then we miss the fact that okay, because what you're talking about there is that Moses was on Sinai, and he said, Guess what? I'm actually giving you the command to build the tabernacle. Everything within the tabernacle, in its intricacies, is for a purpose and for a reason. Yeah. So he does. So he puts those things in there, even, even, like, the Book of Leviticus, some people will claim it is boring. I think it's such an interesting degree because, like, because it's in, like, genuineness, because it is an entire nerd. Josh, yes, George, it's because it's the book of like this. Listen, the book of Exodus ends with Moses building the tabernacle. It's done. It's done, bro. And then God says, You can't enter. So then Book of Leviticus starts with, this is how to live a holy life. And then Numbers, chapter one, verse one, says, And when Moses was able to enter the holy of holies. So there's, there's purpose in the detail.
Seth Burnham 31:21
It's context, it's context, context, context and and that is part of the reason I wanted to start with, like building it kind of like God did. And I'm not, I don't want to, I don't want to liken myself to God. But sure, he built a he built a plane to play out all of his story. Yes, and the planes are played the stories are played out on the planes.
Josh Shaw 31:43
Yes, yeah. So then my next question, maybe without spoiling too much, because we definitely want invites listeners there. So obviously, I'm mostly curious how, how long can we expect the planes to be talked about? And maybe what's next?
Seth Burnham 31:59
Well, last night, we talked about the beast lands in Gehenna. We have one more to release, one more that we've recorded that needs to be released, and then one more to record and release, and that'll be on Elysium and Hades, and then we're going to have a wrap up. We're going to we're going to do a wrap up episode, just to kind of cover, not so much like recover everything. We'll just summarize a little bit, but also try to open people's eyes to why it is important and basically you've already kind of let the cat out of the bag with the question of why the planes, right? We we're not going to answer answer that question at the beginning of the season. We wanted to answer that at
Josh Shaw 32:53
the season. That's good. So then after the planes, what's next?
Seth Burnham 32:58
Yeah, that's a good question. So we've been talking about that. There's a there's there's things in the works. We do have some other side projects too. Morgan and Tony are working on some stuff, which I'm pretty excited about. That. Oh yeah, Morgan told me only a little bit about, and it's pretty fun. We we as a group, have started doing a lot of research and work on another project that will be it'll be released under the same publishing label, you might say, but it'll be separate from lore Haven. But in season three, we're probably going to do something with either the races or personalities, and a couple of personalities in the in the first season, those you guys can go back and listen to we did Morgan Kanan, we did drisda worden. Oh, yeah, both of those episodes were my favorite episodes from first season Morgan Kanan, especially because, like you guys already mentioned, I said Morgan Kanan Morden, kind of like different times, every time I said the
Josh Shaw 34:13
board name Morton
Seth Burnham 34:14
kind Mordecai, so many times. But both of those episodes were just a lot of fun for me. I relate a lot with both of those characters. And in fact, Dryden is is like a hero for me, and I love him. He's great. Those of you that have read the drizz door novels, they are amazing, and he has a redemptive story, which is really, fun to read. So so it there's a there's a little likelihood that we might go that direction with personalities, because there's so many cool personalities have been written about that we'd love to cover that other people. You know, when you're writing a or playing in a campaign like Storm kings thunder, you might get reference. From these different people or personalities, but have no idea about who they are, right? And to make them a little bit more, what's the word great? I guess you could say, you know, just, just kind of put them on display a little bit, which is, which is the whole thing. So, yeah, and then ultimately, put Christ on
Josh Shaw 35:21
display. That's right. Amen. Tony, any last minute questions for lorehaven heart specifically before we move on?
Tony Benda 35:30
Oh, man, I don't think I have any other specific questions. I mean, we can go on. We could seriously all night just on these topics we've already started mentioning. Yeah, I it's cool. I'm just excited for what's next. It is so cool. I've, I've been grateful to sit and learn at the feet of such DND
Josh Shaw 35:48
scholars. Oh my gosh. I would, I would, I would say D and D scholars is probably right there.
Tony Benda 35:54
Like, I right now, like, I'll say I didn't even know who dressed Jordan was before I listened to your show, I like, I didn't, either I had no idea I didn't. And you've prompted me to start to want to, like, find the audio books, because I'm an audio book person, and just, I get it, you know, just, you know, chip away at those, those types of books, and really just learn the lore and just be a better D and D player because of it.
Josh Shaw 36:21
So Seth for the for the listeners of dungeons and disciples, Where can we find you? Platform wise,
Tony Benda 36:27
we are
Seth Burnham 36:28
on all of the major podcasting hosting sites, Apple podcasts, Spotify, podbean, Amazon music, so cool. You can find us there too. So basically, anywhere you find podcasts where we're on them right now, we also have an Instagram right now. At, yeah, I should have that in front of me, but Laura, underscore hearth. At, Laura Haven underscore hearth. So yeah, it's we're just barely getting our social media out there a little bit better. Yeah, I'm not a social media guy, so we needed somebody to curate that same brother exactly. I don't, literally, I don't have any of my own like I don't either I, I deleted them all because I could not. They're, they're not for me. But anyways, so we just had Selena start curating that we we do need to set up a email too, that will be a future project. So when we have that, we'll share it with you
Tony Benda 37:28
guys. That's fantastic. And we'll be putting all those socials, all the the tags and stuff in our show notes as well. Yeah, I I'm good on my question portion. How about you,
Josh Shaw 37:39
Josh, I'm good. Listen. I go. I run off the script. So, I mean, let's just be honest.
Tony Benda 37:44
Yeah, Josh is a script follower, but
Josh Shaw 37:47
I but we cannot end this time just simply talking about just our show, your show. We're here for the meat and potatoes, right? You know we're saying, Well, that's what we do here on dungeons and disciples. I know that's what you guys do over Laura Haven Harv, so getting into it, if we're gonna talk about lore, y'all, we gotta talk about parables, the lore, the allure, and I'm gonna spoil it with you, because even though the listeners, you already know the show title just because you listen to it, but I really felt at this time when I was praying through it and trying to figure out, you know, as you're here talking about the Show, and what we want to talk about biblically. This subject came to my mind, called the mystery within a beautiful subject that just talks about parables in that regard. And in Matthew chapter 13, verses 10 through 15, because the first question we have to ask, therefore, because maybe we have some listeners that don't know what parables are, or when we talk about this beautiful storytelling, we're we're not sure, so let's define it and have this kind of conversation. I found in Matthew chapter 13, verses 10 through 15, it says, And the disciples came to him and said to him, Why do you speak to them in parables? He answered and said to them, because it has been given to you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven. That's powerful, but to them it has not been given. For whoever has to him, more will be given, and he will have abundance, but whoever does not have even what he has will be taken away from him. Therefore, I speak to them in parables, because seeing, they do not see, and hearing, they do not hear, nor do they understand. And in them, the prophecy of Isaiah is fulfilled, which says, hearing, you will hear and shall not understand, and seeing you will see and not perceive. For the hearts of this people have grown dull. Their ears are hard of hearing, and their eyes have closed, lest they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, lest they should understand with their hearts, in turn, so that I should heal them
Seth Burnham 39:58
absolutely rich.
Josh Shaw 40:00
That's powerful. So then the open question, therefore, is, knowing the context of these scriptures, why did Jesus use parables? Question for me, this is for this is for all of us. I told Tony the car. I told Tony the car. I said, Listen, we're going off the cuff. I wrote one question, what's up to us now?
Seth Burnham 40:18
Well, I want to jump on it right away, because the the the context of him speaking to His disciples as basically alone, away from the crowd at this point, and the disciples are confused. Why is it that we understand and why? Why is it that you're explaining that these parables to us? Because he does, if you, if you read other places around the around the parables, he explains the parables to His disciples, but he doesn't explain them to everybody. And you can see that there is a, there is a level of judgment on hardened hearts. So the very last line that you read there, which, again, this is, this is going to go back to our previous discussion of context, right? Um, it says, lest they should understand with their hearts and turn so that I should heal them and that turn right there is turning away from what they currently desire and turning to Christ. In the Old Testament, you find the Israelites were complaining a lot on their 40 year, 40 year journey, as I would probably, especially since it's only a couple of 100 miles, and it shouldn't take 40 years, but whenever, um, it was their own fault that it took that long, right? Yeah, and so they are complaining and railing against God and angry with God's Messenger, the one who is who was sent by God, Moses. And they're, they're constantly throwing a big, giant, two year old hissy fit, you know? Yep, pretty much. And God says to Moses, I am going to send serpents to bite them and harm them and judge them, and it's going to suck. Essentially, this, this is not gonna be fun. It's good. It's not gonna be fun, but I want you to place on a pole raised above. And Jesus references this in the book of John as well. Yes, that just like, just like Moses raised up the serpent in the desert. So shall the Son of Man be raised? That's John chapter three. Yeah. So Moses raises up a serpent on the bronze serpent, not a real serpent, a bronze serpent that he had cast. And whoever would turn and look at this would turn essentially turn from their grumbling and complaining and their sin and turn to look at the salvation that God had offered would be saved. And that's essentially what Jesus is saying here Jesus is saying, the reason for the parables is these are much like a judgment of snakes. It's going to be painful, and for them, they will be struck by the serpents and by the words of the of the Creator of the universe, or they're going to turn from their wicked ways, and they're going to turn to Christ, and that's when they will be healed. That's awesome. So that's, that is my that's like, I love this verse, and I love what Jesus is doing here, yes, because there is a true understanding that we have to repent from our sin and turn from it and turn to Christ with the arms of faith. So, all
Josh Shaw 43:45
right, Tony, what do you got? Scholar,
Tony Benda 43:50
I think Jesus used parables specifically for people like me who have an intelligence of like three. You're allowed to laugh. You're allowed to laugh.
Josh Shaw 44:01
We have biblical scholar and truthful comedian say, I know smart
Tony Benda 44:10
now I think, I think it helps for the layman, definitely, to understand as well, because we can, we can take that deep dive and talk about the context, and go back to Moses, and I see you're even pulling things that I wasn't even connecting previously in my head. That was powerful, and I love it. But seriously, like, I still consider myself a layman half the time with, well, actually most of the time with all this, like with the theology stuff, because I'm still learning every day I have, I have an eternity still to understand the true scope of the gospel, as we all do, and that's what's cool, is that like for those who follow and you know, get to heaven, we can ask all these questions, I hope, and hopefully, seek these answers, but no for real. I think parables were very relatable, and that's what makes that period of time very interesting, is because. Jesus made himself, you know, 100% God, but he was also 100% man. So he, we can relate to him, in a sense, and then pursue Christ likeness through following Him and through, like the understanding of the Scriptures, at least in modern days. And, yeah, I just, I think of it more from the layman's perspective.
Josh Shaw 45:20
I look at their right in the beginning of the verse again. Also very profound biblical wisdom from you just relating it to the book of Numbers. I believe it's numbers right that you're referencing, yeah, yes. So I love right in the beginning. I mean, they're just so real. The disciples are real, and they're authentic. And they say, Why are you speaking in them in parables. And Jesus looks them and says, because it has been given to you, the mysteries of like me, right? They were following him. They're in the midst of Jesus. They've been given the mysteries. And even we can see just the the worldly side of the disciples, like you've been given the mysterious things of the word, you're walking with the living word, and you're still not following at the same time, I almost love the fact that the parables force us to make that choice, just like the serpent you were talking about this it was, it was either you're gonna get bit by a snake or you're gonna look to this, to this snake and be healed, Right? It's almost like, as the parable is spoken, it's okay. I can either just say I don't understand it and turn away, or I can say I don't understand it. Let me lean in closer. I love the story of Moses because it even talks about when Moses was in his dark time inside of Exodus. It said that he was spending time with God like a friend, right? Like, like, intimate. And in fact, we're on the right here, for those that are listening, we're going to Gen, Gen Con convention, 2025, and indie tomorrow, actually, so jealous. It's good. It's gonna be sweet. I'm excited. It's my first time. But we were just on the we were just in the car. I was talking with our friend Mitch, and he was just like, Listen, I'm hungry. I don't understand, like, parables. And he would, he would talk to me about these parables that he's not understanding. And in my mind, I've studied them. I mean, I went to school to for the for Bible, for biblical counseling, and but it was so pure to see someone who didn't know. And in my mind, it's like, I know what that parable means, like Jesus explains it, but to him, he's just a new we would use the term Baby Christian, but I would just say child in the faith of like Josh, I don't understand what this meant. And when I described it to him, oh my gosh, it was to see the beauty is like, as a dad to see my child, like, explain to him, like, something gets so basic to me, like, why? That just makes sense. But to my child's like, oh my gosh, this is life changing for him. Just to describe that parable was so life changing, it's like he was like, Oh my gosh, I understand Jesus in a new way. And the beautiful part is that as we turn to Jesus, it I mean what it says in Matthew, chapter Matthew, chapter five, verse six, those who hunger and thirst shall be satisfied. Right? As we hunger and thirst for that this, we're just going to be continuing to be satisfied, but it's almost going to make us more and more and more hungry, because my pastor says all time is like Jesus desires to bestow wisdom, mercy, grace, understanding, but it's up to us to walk to him and to seek those things. Right?
Seth Burnham 48:39
So it's, it's at that point we finally see that Jesus is better than everything in every way. Yes, another reason that Jesus spoke in parables. It's right, actually, in the the scripture that you referenced, it said to fulfill scripture. Yep, yeah. That's the that is one of the main reasons that that often we can gloss over, or that we can we can take and be like, Oh yeah, it's to fulfill scripture. Well, what does that mean? You know what I mean? Like, if he's fulfilling scripture with his words, and he is, he is doing everything that the Old Testament and all the prophecies said that he would be doing it's validation to his ministry and to who he is. So that's a that would be another aspect of the reason why he he was using these parables as validation for his ministry, and to say, I am the Son of God. I am the true and living creator god. That's who I am. Yes, sir, that's that's what he was saying when he said it.
Josh Shaw 49:52
I love that. This is good. Any other any other comments before we move on to the to the real fun part, we. We've been we've been having fun. I mean, I've been having fun, but this is, this is where the rubber meets the road at this getting better this, oh, this is gonna get good y'all because, listen, we did any, any other comments before we move on, we're looking good. All right, gentlemen. All right. So here's the, here's the meat and potatoes. All right, we describe parables. We've understood the parables. We understand what, where Jesus is coming from. We all agree that lore, parables is understood this deep context. Understanding is so vital to our walk. So we get to practice a fun exercise completely on the spot. This is going to be great. So each of us, for you listeners, we we're going to start with Seth, because biblical scholar over here, we have we, I need to hear what he has to say. It's gonna be great. Oh my goodness, it's gonna be great. So we each are going to exchange our favorite parable. We're going to read it aloud, and then we're just going to converse about it. We're just going to see what the Lord has in store. Maybe we talk, and maybe one person has one understanding another person has another. All as Jesus describes parables to for the fulfillment of him and for for us to open our ears and our hearts Listen folks. Sometimes we may I may not understand one Seth may understand something. It could bounce back and forth. But all this is for a unified understanding of the parables, and to know, for you listeners at home, it's okay to not understand a parable. I promise you, it is okay I don't understand everything. Tony said, we're still, we are still continuously trying to be sanctified and to learn the things of Jesus. So as we do this, folks, this is just a real life perspective of genuine exchange of how we just interpret these parables and what we and where we see. So we're gonna start with you. Seth, your favorite parable and why? Well,
Seth Burnham 52:00
you You did ask me to read the whole thing is that what you want? Because I do have it pulled up.
Josh Shaw 52:04
I'm cool with it on down. Let's do it all right,
Seth Burnham 52:08
um, so my favorite parable is it's one that is extremely well known. I actually call it by a different name for for a reason that I'll get into after I read it, but it is the parable of the prodigal son, and it is an amazing, amazing tale of redemption. But I'll just, I'll just read it, and then I'll, I'll give my three cents of a word that that that really matters about it so. And he said, There was a man who had two sons, and the younger of them said to his father, Father, give me the share of my property that is coming to me. And he divided his property between them. Not many days later, the younger son gathered all he had and took a journey into a far country, and there he squandered his property in reckless living, and when he had spent everything, a severe famine arose in that country, and he began to be in need. So he went and hired himself out to one of the citizens of that country, who sent him into his field to feed pigs. And he was longing to be fed with the pods that the pigs ate and no one gave him anything. But when he came to himself, he said, How many of my father's hired servants have more than enough bread, but I perish here with hunger. I will arise and go to my father and say to him, Father, I have sinned against heaven and before you, I am no longer worthy to be called your son. Treat me as one of your hired servants. And he arose and came to his father, but while he was still a long way off, his father saw him and felt compassion and ran and embraced him and kissed him, and the son said to him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and before you, I am no longer worthy to be called your son. But the father said to his servants, Bring quickly the best robe and put it on him, and bring a ring and put it on his hand and shoes on his feet, and Bring the fattened calf and kill it and let us eat and celebrate for this, my son was dead and is alive again. He was lost and is found, and they began to celebrate. Now, his older son was in the field, and he came and drew near to the house. He heard music and dancing, and he called one of the servants and asked what these things meant. And he said to them, your brother has come and your father has killed the fattened calf because he has received him back safe and sound. But he was angry and refused to go in. His father came out and entreated him, or begged him. Pleaded with him, but he answered his father. Look, these many years have I have served you, and I never disobeyed your command, yet you gave me. You never gave me a young goat that I might celebrate with my friends. When this son of yours came who has devoured your property with prostitutes, you killed the fattened calf for him, and he said to him, Son, you are always with me, and all that is mine is yours. It was fitting to celebrate and be glad for this. Your brother was dead and is alive. He was lost and is found. That's powerful. Jesus knows how to write a good story.
Josh Shaw 55:45
That's right. Amen, brother.
Seth Burnham 55:49
Legitimately, this story is such an amazing story. And the reason I prefaced it by the way, I said I usually call this by a different name. Most people know it as the prodigal son, but I call it the prodigal sons, just one caveat, because there are two sons that are essentially have a broken relationship with their father, the first one willfully right. The first one willfully says, I in this day and age, basically saying, Give me my inheritance. Is saying, I want, I wish you were dead, give me what I would get if you were dead, so I can go enjoy my life. Yeah, I don't want anything to do with you. That is the story of the Christian. Yeah, that is the story of every believer. Because every single person that goes out and sins is saying, I want to squander that which God has given me for my own glory. I want what I want, not what God wants for me. And so he goes out and he enjoys this raucous living, this, this evil, this evil living that we would say, it's disgusting, it's gross, it's sinful, is what it is, and all of it is this, this picture of a destitute, corrupt human being, so much so that he is even willing to bring himself low enough as a Hebrew Israelites were not even allowed to be in the same area as pigs, let alone eating alongside them, and he has brought himself So low and hates himself so much that that he's starving, but he has nothing, and he's brought himself so low. And he realizes, remembers and says and turns from his filth and the filth around him, and he turns and he says, My father has everything I could ever want. Should I return to Him and be, at least be a servant, a slave under my father? But that's not the father's attitude. In fact, he indignantly, not indignantly, without dignity, runs, gathers up his robe and runs to see. In fact, this is a picture, ladies and gentlemen, of God the Father waiting and watching. He saw his son a long way off. You don't see someone a long way off, if you're just going about your daily life, that's right. He was waiting for his son, and the son returns with a with complete humility, says, I renounce my old life, and I want what you have, oh Father, to forgive me. And the father says, Sure, I forgive you, but I don't just forgive you. I restore you.
Josh Shaw 59:00
Come on. I redeem
Seth Burnham 59:02
you. I change you back from destitute and decrepit and corrupt to a full, complete son,
Tony Benda 59:14
new life,
Seth Burnham 59:15
new complete life, exactly, but that's not where the story ends. The story goes on, and I'll get to the context of it after this. But the story goes on to talk about how the other son, the older of the two, is essentially, and I will say the word appropriately here. He's indignant. He's angry at his father. He's angry with them, not because his he has not enjoyed the blessings of being in his father's house, but because he actually did want the same thing his brother wanted, but unwilling to show it. Wow, if you read closely, he says you never. Never gave me, even a young goat to enjoy with my friends. He never says to get to enjoy with to celebrate with you about your wonderful blessing that you have given to us as sons, to celebrate your existence or anything like that. He says to celebrate with my friends so that I can go off and go do my own thing. Anyways, yeah, wow. That's the that is the heart of anger towards God say, living a life of, Oh, I've followed every single rule and every single law, and yet I am not accepted. Then screw you. That's except, essentially what he's saying. Context? Well, the context is you have people who are destitute, the prostitutes, the tax collectors, all of these people that were coming to Jesus, who absolutely found redemption and had turned from their sin, but the Pharisees of that day, these legalists that that all they could see was, oh, I have done everything appropriate and proper while all I did was hang burdens on other people, self righteousness. It's a wonderful story for me, and it's a balancing act for Christians. This story, especially for Christians, is something that we should remember. Who was I? I wasn't the son that was obedient. I was the one that ran away. Okay, that's who I was, but I don't want to become the son that is obedient and still not have a heart for God. Wow, yeah. God is who I want my heart for that my heart wants. I want to be changed completely into new life, new creation, so that my heart is to love God with everything that I
Josh Shaw 1:01:56
have, total submission,
Seth Burnham 1:01:58
total complete, release of who I was and acceptance of who God is giving me to be. So there you go. That's my that's my two and a half cents. Take it with for what it's worth,
Josh Shaw 1:02:14
I I'm not gonna lie, I never considered the other side of the other son. Like, yeah, kind of like we were talking about earlier. Like, I think sometimes we focus so much on, like, when I say the prodigal son, I think common Christian lingo, we can say, Oh yeah. I mean the bits about the story about the son that ran away, he found himself, went back to God. God accepted him, and, you know, but we never, I've never heard someone even remotely discuss the other son. And I mean honestly, the thought when you were talking about that came to mind is when a group of Pharisees came to Jesus, and they said, look at all the things we've done for you. Look at all the prayers of all the people we healed. And he looks at them and says, Depart from me, for I never knew you. Right? And what's beautiful in that story too is that even though we see that legalistic mindset of the Son, how accepting the father is still right, like
Seth Burnham 1:03:24
he shows, he shows, he shows even a gracious heart towards the son who is angry with him. Yeah. That shows a gracious, gracious heart to the rebel and to the one that is angry.
Josh Shaw 1:03:36
That's just that. That blew my mind. I mean, wow, wow.
Seth Burnham 1:03:44
It's all God's work. It's all God's word. That's
Josh Shaw 1:03:48
for real. But, like, just it. I that's what I love about, you know, being 1000 miles away meeting people like you, you and the rest of the crew is just like, you know, we help each other see these beautiful things. I mean, that was my conviction. I mean, Tony, do you get anything from that? I certainly hope so. Because my brother, there
Tony Benda 1:04:07
was a stirring right here my chest. It's, that's fantastic. No, it's, it's interesting to put ourselves in the perspective of because I think Christians can fall in, and do fall in one of each of those categories, whether we care to admit it or not, and we have to be very careful sometimes on how we how we go about our day to day. Yeah, it's, it's humbling, I'll say that, yeah, because we could call it the indignant behavior of someone else too, and I was mentioning in the car ride about the speck and the plank in the eyes. And it's just we can easily call out someone else's indignant behavior, but we also have to be careful about ours if we're not paying attention to it absolutely. So that's awesome. That is beautiful. Thank you for that
Josh Shaw 1:05:00
perspective. Yes, 100% I know I gleaned from it. Tony, what you got. I hope you could match that.
Tony Benda 1:05:08
Well, I'll take, I'll take your two and a half cents, and I'll invest it into the parable of the talents. As my Bible says here, I see
Unknown Speaker 1:05:19
what you did there. I see what you did there.
Josh Shaw 1:05:22
Unplanned, unscripted.
Tony Benda 1:05:25
What version Do you read from and study from?
Seth Burnham 1:05:28
Well, typically the the English Standard Version I have. I have pretty much every version of the Bible at my house, but typically an English Standard Version. Yep. Cool.
Tony Benda 1:05:40
That's usually my go to as well. Josh is an NAS, no, no, you're
Josh Shaw 1:05:44
loving, I'm loving New King James. Yeah, I just, she
Seth Burnham 1:05:49
just likes the language. It just, it just
Josh Shaw 1:05:51
stirs my soul to its core. My father in law gave me a really old Bible, yeah, and he had it that was in a New King James, and there's just something about it. I yeah, I'm not, like, a weird, weirdo, like, oh, it's only King James Bible. No, I'm not that way. The church I worked with just, yeah, just a nerd.
Tony Benda 1:06:10
That's it. The church I work at is an NASB type church. So it's really, it's very cool, like to hear that different translation in perspective on that same scripture that I've read in ESV 100 times or NIV, you know, and 100 more times anyway. So Parable of the Talents, I will start by reading it as well out of Matthew 25 starting in verse 14, for it will be like a man going on a journey who called his servants and entrusted them his property to one he gave five talents to another two to another one to each according to his ability. Then he went away. He who had received the five talents went at once and traded with them, and he made five talents more. So also he who had the two talents made two talents more. But he who had received the one talent, went and dug in the ground and hid his master's money. Now, after a long time, the master of the servants came and settled accounts with him, and he who had received the five talents came forward, bringing five talents more. Saying, Master, you delivered to me five talents here I have made five talents more. His master said to him, Well done, good and faithful servant. You have been faithful over a little, I will set you over much, Enter into the joy of your master. And he also, who had the two talents, came forward saying, Master, he delivered to me two talents here I have made two talents more. His master said to him, Well done, good and faithful servant. You have been faithful over a little, I will set you over much Enter into the joy of your master. He also, who had received the one talent, came forward saying, Master, I knew you to be a hard man, reaping where you did not sow, and gathering where you scattered no seed. So I was afraid, and I went and hid your talent in the ground. Here you have what is yours. But his master answer him, You wicked and slothful servant. You knew that I reap where I have not sown and gather where I scattered no seed, then you ought to have invested my money with the bankers. And at my coming, I should have received what was my own with interest. So take the talent from him and give it to him who has the 10 talents for to everyone who has will more be given, and he will have an abundance, but from the one who has none, even what he has will be taken away and cast the worthless servant into the outer darkness. In that place, there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. So this one is a little bit darker in the end, the happy ending, like everyone thinks parables may or may not be, I think this one's, I don't know this one could be like a challenge to me, primarily because I've always looked at it as a from like, the actual word talent. I feel like I have been given many things with ease. I was always a good test taker, so I always got good grades because of that. I'm a multi instrumentalist. I do my instruments fairly well. I'll say I enjoy doing many things, and I feel like I do them fairly well. And I feel like I relate to this one specifically, again, because of that challenge, like I don't want to be at the end of my life and say, What did I do? Did I invest the five? Did I invest the two, or did I bury the one? Ooh, I don't want any part of me to be hidden. I don't want any part of me to be, you know, buried so far beneath the surface that I'm not investing that into God's kingdom. Because there are people who are excellent with, you know, the five that they're given, or the two that they're given, or even the one that they're given. But. They choose to invest even that one, but for that slothful servant, I don't ever want to be called slothful. I have always been. I feel like I've always been a very diligent and hard worker. I Josh could probably attest to my a member to my work schedule. He knows that I am non stop and my wife will,
Josh Shaw 1:10:20
you know, working in the car on the right here. Okay,
Tony Benda 1:10:25
okay, working for five minutes. Yes, I feel he was texting me too. Prepping a little bit for the episode makes it easier. And then for those who know, Planning Center out there for a church life, Planning Center can be a bit of a challenge. But anyway, there's a story behind that, but I am a workaholic, and, you know, sometimes to a fault. And my wife is very patient with me, I will say, for for most of that, I I just have a hard time with, again, that slothful personality, the the not being able to give back to the Lord what he's so diligently and like, graciously given me, because we can relate. Well, I'll just say this. Christ gave us everything on the cross. God gave us everything on the cross, and for me to walk this earth and not be willing to give everything. And then some like, shame on me. Like, that's just my basic thoughts on it, but I don't know I I want to hear that well done, good and faithful servant at the end of the walk.
Seth Burnham 1:11:28
I think we all should, right? Yeah, should all we should all want to hear that. I don't
Tony Benda 1:11:33
want to hear the Depart from me for I NEVER KNEW YOU portion. And I feel like that's almost like those two scriptures are hinting at each other with you know, this one person that decided not to reinvest what the Lord has given him. I a little bit of background about me. I've been in ministry in some capacity. I'm 32 now, a little a couple years younger than you Seth, I've been in ministry for, I will say, probably 22 years. And I know that's a very odd thing to say, but when I was 10 years old, I was in my kids church and youth group, helping with like the computer slides and, you know, turning the microphones on and doing setting up chairs, like all good Christian boys should do at some point in their life, if you're not in a church and setting up, setting up chairs and taking them down for church at a young age. I don't know if you grew up in the 90s, but now it's just I've been, I've been in a ministry capacity, whether volunteering or now, I guess job wise, I'm in ministry. Now, what's the word I'm looking vocationally for the last four years, maybe six years, if you count the Chicago stuff. But yes, I've been, I've been involved in ministry in some capacity for the last 20 plus years. And that's not to pat myself on the back. That's because, like, I think when I was younger, I read this and this almost like lit a fire under me to make sure that I'm not the one that had the one talent and didn't give it back to God that has been my my lifelong challenge is to give it all back and for the glory of the kingdom, kind of like a for fun side note, one of my human, fleshly, lifelong desires would be to obtain an EGOT. So an Emmy, a Grammy, an Oscar and a Tony. You are Tony. Well, I know I'm a Tony, but you've already accomplished Tony. You're right. That is weird. It is a very odd thing. So there are people that have gotten the P God, which is a Peabody or Pulitzer, plus an EGOT. So Emmy, Grammy, Oscar, Tony. So Tony award is for musicals and theater and stuff like that. An Oscar obviously, for film, Emmy for television and a Grammy for music. So there are things that can layer, and you can get two in one, depending on what it is like, if you have a movie that goes to Broadway, that type of thing. But that's a fleshly desire in a sense. And I've always thought, how cool would it be to write something from a religious perspective, from a Christian perspective, and to broadcast that and let my EGOT shine for the Kingdom. I mean, there's a little bit of selfishness in there too, but I just want to give it all back. And I think, and I think that's one way I can contribute is by, again, not by works, because it's not what this is about, but by relationship. And I think obedience. I think the Lord has laid some projects on my heart, and Morgan can attest to this with the project we're working on now. He's laid stuff on our hearts for reasons, and I think it's to advance the kingdom and to glorify Him in the process. And yeah, I think I'll just wrap it there, because I just want to give my talents back. So
Josh Shaw 1:14:47
that's good. Yeah, I I just the Scripture came in my mind in Philippians, chapter three, verse 13 and 14, says, Brethren, I do not count myself to have apprehended. But one thing I do for. Getting those things which are behind and reaching forward to those things which are ahead. I press toward the goal for the prize of the upward call in Christ, Jesus, bro, I just keep pressing, bro, that's, that's powerful. That's a good pair. That's, that's good, yeah, amen,
Tony Benda 1:15:19
Josh, what is your favorite parable?
Josh Shaw 1:15:21
So my favorite parable, I have personal context, his historical context, and then I'll read the parable itself. Go for it. So I was, I went through the book of Luke recently. I mean, absolutely powerful, powerful stuff, powerful story in that and I ran across a scripture that absolutely rocked my socks off. And at this time, Jesus was moving into part way through the ministry where he was about to go into Jerusalem to basically do a one on one boxing match with Pharisees Sadducees, and then die on the cross. But in this time, he just says this one phrase to the disciples. He said, Let your waist be girded and your lamps burning. He continues to say, and you yourselves be like men who wait for their master when he will return from the wedding that when he comes and knocks, they may open to him immediately. And as this as it continues on, Jesus finally enters into Jerusalem. And the parable here, in this comes from Matthew 25 it's the parable of the 10 virgins, and it is an absolutely powerful parable because it follows along the same context of Jesus talking essentially about the coming of Christ before he dies on the cross. And it goes like this. Jesus says, then the kingdom of heaven shall be likened to 10 virgins who took their lamps and went out to meet the bridegroom. Now five of them were wise and five of them were foolish. Those who were foolish took their lamps and took no oil with them. But the wise took oil in their vessels with their lamps. But when the bridegroom was delayed, they all slumbered and slept, and at midnight, a cry was heard, Behold, the bridegroom is coming go out to meet him. Then all those virgins arose and trimmed their lamps, and the foolish said to the wise, Give us some of your oil, for our lamps are going out. But the wise answered, saying, No, Les, lest there should not be enough for us and you, but go rather to those who sell and buy for yourselves, and when they went to buy, the bridegroom came, and those who were ready went in with him to the wedding, and the door was shut. Afterward, the other virgins came also, saying, Lord, Lord, open up to us. But he answered and said, Assuredly, I say to you, I do not know you. Watch, therefore for you know neither the day nor the hour in which the Son of Man is coming. I get extremely convicted about that personally, because I often walk this life, and I wake up every morning asking myself, Lord, what can I do for you today? Like, Lord, how can I be moving to your word? What can I do? What do you will me to do today? How can I serve you the best? And I've been in my own testimony. I've been in that place where I feel like my oil is just gone, like my cup does not feel like it overfloweth, you know what I'm saying, like that cup sometimes just feels dry. And I read this parable one time, and it and it closely tied with Luke chapter 12, and it to honestly tie really close, closely to the principle of just walking in excellence. And I've really been honestly convicted about that recently, about walking in excellence. I i often so so I so often feel like the foolish ones that are trying to stand and wait for the Lord, but my lamp is burning, but I'm not carrying any oil with me. You know? I'm saying like we're doing, I'm doing good right now. I'm, I'm moving, and I'm, I'm getting to this place, but all the while, sometimes I feel like the disciples, when they went to Jesus for the Garden of Gethsemane, and they say, and Jesus is praying, and they come back and they're just sleeping, like you're close. Can you not watch for even one hour? Right? Yeah, right. Like you're close, but you're not awake. Like he talks so much about that we just talked before the episode with the parables like, lest those should hear, not hear, or less, those should see, not see or be awake for that. And it's such a powerful parable. Because it's it's a daily reminder to me to stay awake, to keep my waist girded and to keep my to keep my lamp burning, like when my cup doesn't overflow with I know that even from the psalms that David's like my cup overfloweth. Right? So I want to it. It just drives me to this place of saying, Lord, how like fill me so my cup can overflow, because I can't do this by myself. Like this is not on my own strength. This is not of my own will. This is not of my own accord. But this is this parable just constantly reminds me to just to just continue to look to him and just say like, Lord is my oil? Is my cup overflowing? Am I? Am I walking into this life? Do I have enough oil? I My pastor said this and spoiler for I'm not sure what order this will be released, but if this one goes first, whatever. But my pastor said to me, in a mentorship time, I told him about my own personal struggles, and he said to me, he said, Josh, you can let things get to you, just don't. Don't let them get in you. Yeah, like, you can the things of this world can bother you. It's, it's okay, like, it's okay to be bothered by those things, but when you let them get inside of you, it takes you away from the place that Christ is trying to take you, and the truth remains. And I think I'm learning this a lot in my life, that Christ is coming Christ is coming back. Christ desires to come back. Christ wants to bring his children to them. And I think we all can coherently agree whether you're a prodigal, whether you're trying not to hide or waste your talents, or whether you're trying to learn how to keep your oil lit like Christ is coming, and he desires to run to us. He desires to use us, and He desires to walk in that excellence. And I, I love this, just this conversation of sharing these three parables, because we can see how they're different, but they're similar, like they're so similar in the fashion of the bridegroom is running to us. The bridegroom has given us so much. The bridegroom wants us to just be filled and to use our talents and our feelings as he ran to us, to run to others, through our podcasts, through our shows, to do that for the world. And I ask myself all the time like, and I've been truly convicted of this recently, like, Lord, what do I need to be doing for you? And where am I? Where are the areas of my life where I'm not honoring you in that like, like, Dude, I love playing Rocket League. Oh my gosh, I love Rocket League. But like, okay, but rock, but Rocket League just does not honor my time with him. Like, I could be dude. I could spend 45 minutes on Rocket League and accomplish, you know, five win matches and two losses and maybe ranked up a little bit. Or I could spend that 45 minutes in a in a growth with him, in conversation, in my secret place with him, because Rocket League is not going to enhance or put oil my lamp, but, but being like David and going to the one because he he being filled with the Spirit, said this, from whom my cup overfloweth could actually speak the rest of that Psalm, and from a place of understanding and truth and brokenness and brokenness, that's so good. And it's like, I the foolishness is saying I got a lamp, but I'm not gonna put oil in it. I've got the word in my hand, but I'm gonna let it sit on the shelf and just collect dust. I have the ability to go to church today, but I just don't feel like it, because I don't want to be uplifted. Because if it's not even about the uplifting from the pastor, my goodness, you go to your church to be with the body, and you will just see someone that just comes to you. Maybe you're having a bad day, and you go into the house of God, and one person hears from the Lord, allow somebody to live and work the blessing to say, Man, I think Seth needs a hug today. And you walk up to you, and you walk up, and you walk up and you say, and you just give him a big old hug. And you're like, why'd you do that? I'm having a crappy day. And you can, they can look upon you and say, The Lord prompted me to the Lord spoke through that. Why? Because they kept their oil in the lamp and they've got extra in reserve to fill. And that's I want to live my life. I've heard this said time and time again. I want to live my life from a place of. Overflow, yeah, that's where I want to be. I don't know if y'all ain't got anything on that parable, but Amen, it's
Tony Benda 1:25:07
powerful. That's good. Amen,
Seth Burnham 1:25:10
I would, I would just add to it there. The very end of the parable is, it's, there's a sense of finality, right? Yeah, missed opportunity. Eventually, the the the doors will be shut. Yep, don't miss your opportunity. Don't miss your opportunity to be Christ to other people, don't like you said earlier, Tony on the parable of the talents, don't squander what you've been given. And what's the greatest thing that we've been given. We've been given the gift of eternal life that's right through, right through Christ, Jesus. Don't squander it. Don't squander it. There is a time where where we will not be able to invest that any longer, he he's coming back, there is a time where there's a finality and there will be an end. That's right, yeah,
Tony Benda 1:26:05
this side of heaven is finite, yep, amen.
Josh Shaw 1:26:11
Well, y'all, what an episode.
Unknown Speaker 1:26:16
Pretty great. I've
Josh Shaw 1:26:17
been convicted. I'm not gonna lie. I've got some my own convictions running, and I'm excited just for my own secret time with the Lord through
Tony Benda 1:26:23
that yes, hands down one of my top three favorites, easy. I'm not gonna say what order, this has been great.
Seth Burnham 1:26:32
Well said. Number one,
Josh Shaw 1:26:35
thank you so much. Thank you so much for coming on. I know this has been a scheduling nightmare.
Tony Benda 1:26:42
Oh, my goodness, like anything DoD related,
Seth Burnham 1:26:45
yeah, exactly. You beat me to it by one second.
Josh Shaw 1:26:51
Like any good campaign or one shot, this has been a significant scheduling nightmare. But again, thank you so much for just being on with us, just talking about lore, Haven, hearth, like we here at dungeons and disciples. Support you. We pray over this Yes, and we are so excited to do more collaborations, more fun projects, I guarantee in the future for both of our shows. This is not the last we will be on with you guys. This is not the last we will have you guys with us. I mean, maybe there's some live gameplay in the future, who
Seth Burnham 1:27:26
knows, but it's fun. Tony. Tony already mentioned that last night.
Josh Shaw 1:27:35
That's called, that's called, that's called confirmation.
Seth Burnham 1:27:38
That's Providence, my friend.
Josh Shaw 1:27:41
But you know, we will that. We will tag the show at the bottom of the section, at the rest of our social so that way we can get some love and life over to Lord Haven hearth. We know you all will head over there, because if you want to be a real DND nerd, you will, you will go listen, there is no option. There is no option. You don't have a choice anymore. You've invested this far. You will go invest in them.
Seth Burnham 1:28:04
You guys have been gracious, amazing. We love you very much over here. And I just thank you so much for for having me on tonight. Awesome. Maybe in the future we'll have to, you guys will have to have Morgan or Selena. That'd be
Tony Benda 1:28:17
great. Absolutely, yeah, that's definitely gonna happen. Nerds. Well, we'll again. Seth from Tony. You've heard it from Josh, but thank you. It's been great. Those listeners out there, you guys can find lore Haven hearth on Instagram now, which is awesome at lorehaven. Underscore hearth, and we'll have that in our show notes. I think you said Facebook as well. We'll get that in there. Tagged, not yet, but we're working on that. Fantastic. We'll get that in there as soon as it is posted. And our socials are at dungeons and disciples on Facebook and Instagram, that's the word and spelled out, dungeons and disciples. And our Gmail that you guys can email us at is dungeons disciples@gmail.com without the and that time, dungeons disciples@gmail.com we are always excited to see people emailing us and responding, and it's a blast. So thank you guys, for those who have reached out. Thank you also. Shout out to those who have commented on the fact that the audio quality in our last in one of our previous episodes, it was real subpar. It was rough. We used just, just say it for what it is, brother, we used a certain service that wasn't my favorite thing. So thank you for those who commented and have actually been diligent to listen and understand the qualms of recording sometimes. So we are striving to always improve. So thank you for that excellence, my friends, excellence in everything we do. Well, Josh, I'll let you close us out.
Josh Shaw 1:29:52
I actually would love to invite Seth to close us out to this episode.
Seth Burnham 1:29:58
I will graciously accept. It, yes, you
Josh Shaw 1:30:01
didn't have a choice.
Seth Burnham 1:30:04
It's already written in the script. All right, well, Heavenly Father, we thank you so much for tonight, for the awesome discussion, Lord God, for the camaraderie, the unity that you bring in brothers across across 1000s of miles speaking over the internet. Lord, it's been an amazing time, a blessing to my heart I play. I pray that it will be a blessing to the listeners, and that the investment that we have put into tonight will glorify Your name, bless your church and draw others to Christ. Yes, pray this in Jesus name,
Josh Shaw 1:30:46
amen.
Tony Benda 1:30:48
Amen. Awesome. Thank you, listeners. We'll see you next time