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Matt and Sean talk about a computer with a microchip on its shoulder, in Star Trek: The Original Series Season 2, Episode 24, "The Ultimate Computer”
Matt and Sean talk about a computer with a microchip on its shoulder, in Star Trek: The Original Series Season 2, Episode 24, "The Ultimate Computer”
- (00:00) - - Intro
- (03:19) - - Viewer feedback
- (05:41) - - Today's episode
- (12:33) - - This time in history
- (19:26) - - Episode discussion
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Creators and Guests
What is Trek In Time?
Join Sean and Matt as they rewatch all of Star Trek in order and in historical context.
Sean Ferrell: In this episode of Trek in Time, we're talking about the AI revolution. Yes, I know it sounds like I'm talking about current events, but I am. I guess we'll get into it as we start our conversation. Welcome, everybody, to Trek in Time. This is, of course, the podcast in which we watch all episodes of Star Trek in chronological stardate order. We started with Enterprise, we moved our way forward, and now we're in the second season, almost at the end of the second season of the original series. We also take a look at the world at the time of original broadcast. So we're currently talking about March 8, 1968, as we talk about the original series episode. The Ultimate Computer. This is the 53rd overall, the 24th of the second season. I'm Sean Ferrell. I'm a writer. I write some sci fi, I write some horror. I write some stuff for kids. And with me, as always, is my brother Matt. He is that Matt behind Undecided with Matt Ferrell, which takes a look at emerging tech and its impact on our lives. Matt, how are you today?
Matt Ferrell: I'm really good, and I gotta bring something up. Sean.
Sean Ferrell: Yes.
Matt Ferrell: I finished Alien Earth.
Sean Ferrell: Oh, boy.
Matt Ferrell: Have you watched Alien Earth?
Sean Ferrell: I am. I believe I'm about halfway through. I don't know exactly how many episodes there are in the season, but, yeah, we've been watching that. And, I mean, the cycle of good television that we're in is exhausting because there's too much good stuff to watch. So there is the Pit, which we are so good. Pretty close to finishing the first season. I will admit, when it came to the Emmys, I was rooting for Severance. But I'm not sad that the Pit won. It is strangely, a throwback, I think, to 1990s television. It feels very 90s to me in the way that the episodes are structured and the way the storytelling is done. Great show. But Alien Earth, we just watched the episode where they give you the flashback to what happened on the ship before it gets to Earth.
Matt Ferrell: Yeah.
Sean Ferrell: And I'm just like, this is like. This is Ridley Scott's Alien.
Matt Ferrell: This is like.
Sean Ferrell: It's so well done. I'm really, really enjoying it. It's got.
Matt Ferrell: It gets. It gets better. It gets. It gets better. By the end of the series, Sean, the end of the season, I was, like, standing on my couch going, I love this show. It's like. It's so. It is the. It's like movies are like short stories and TV shows are like novels.
Sean Ferrell: Yeah.
Matt Ferrell: And so this is kind of like taking the original Alien and making a novel out of it.
Sean Ferrell: Yeah.
Matt Ferrell: And it is so good. It is so fantastic.
Sean Ferrell: Yeah, so well done. Anyway, so on we go now to talking about this week's episode. As I mentioned, we are going to be talking about the Ultimate Computer. This one was directed by John Meredyth Lucas, story by Lawrence Wolfe, teleplay, I was very excited to see the teleplay was by D.C. Fontana. But before we get into that, we always like to take a look at what you had to say about our previous episode. So Matt, what did you find in the mailbag for us this week?
Matt Ferrell: Well, last week we talked about the episode Patterns of Force, which we both liked and were shocked at how resonant is between 1960s and 2025. In a kind of sad way that resonated in the comments. We had Dan Sim saying, so sad. This episode hits so hard today. Shaking my head, yeah, yeah, yeah, Dan. And then Mark didn't have wrong answers only this week, but Mark had a very nice long comment about agreeing with the modern day analysis and had this great kind of like rundown of how there was also this kind of like anti communist theme and talked how Star Trek resonated with creating kind of philosophical discussions in his family and said the other thing is that this episode was still thought provoking then like it is now. You guys got real introspective. But then again, my mother, who rarely watched an episode of this with me, actually started up a philosophical discussion with me instead of just saying nothing like she did with most of the other episodes she happened to watch back in the 70s reruns. So it's like, you know, an episode is kind of hitting a. Hitting a mark when even somebody who's not told the end of the show, you end up in a big philosophical discussion.
Sean Ferrell: Yeah, yeah, important episode.
Matt Ferrell: We also had, yeah, it is. Steve C. Photos wrote. Great discussion as always. I had the same emotional reaction to this episode as you both did. Thank you for not shying away from having this discussion. I felt almost guilty that I was happy to hear about 1968 in historical context instead of 2025, given what happened back then. Star Trek at its best has always been a window into what we could be if we got our act together. Let's hope it doesn't take 200 or more years to get there. 100%. Steve. Yeah, we talked about like I recommended the Lazarus Project I had mentioned in the episode, that TV show and the dude, the dude A wrote. Thank you so much for recommending the Lazarus Project. By episode three, I was hooked and watched both seasons. Yeah. That's what I'm talking about. That show gets its hooks in you deep, and then you want to just, like, steamroll through it. It's a really fun show.
Sean Ferrell: Good recommendation. Thank you everybody for your comments, as always. They are greatly appreciated. So that noise you hear in the background, this is always a weird transition because suddenly Matt's room starts looking like a disco is going off in the background. Like he's sitting there at a desk, and meanwhile, somebody's roller skating around a rink just off camera. No, it's not a roller skating rink. It's the read alert. It's time for Matt to tackle the Wikipedia description. Good luck, Matt.
Matt Ferrell: Okay. A new computer system causes havoc while being tested aboard the Enterprise. With most of the Enterprise crew deboarded, a new M5 multitronic system is installed to test it. To test if it can control the Enterprise and manage operations on board. Dr. Richard Daystrom has built this M5 unit and will oversee the test. The way this whole thing is written is really odd, Sean. Yeah, I miss AI again. Everything goes as planned as the M5 unit completes the demonstration tasks. But somehow the machine begins gaining too much control of the Enterprise, which starts to worry Spock and Kirk. When Kirk says he wants the M5 to let go of some of the controls, the machine begins to see. What? See that as a threat. And starts locking out all manual controls. This becomes a problem because the next task is a mock battle with three starships which the M5 thinks are actual attacks the M5, loads the torpedoes, and destroys an unmanned freighter in a battle exercise. This whole thing. Sean. Yeah.
Sean Ferrell: Told you.
Matt Ferrell: Good luck.
Sean Ferrell: Good luck. And they aren't even sentences sometimes. No.
Matt Ferrell: In a battle exercise, it kills all crew aboard USS Excalibur and seriously damages the USS Lexington. Dr. Daystrom tries to talk to the M5 but becomes mentally unstable, so Spock puts him to rest.
Sean Ferrell: The irony is that AI would write this better, but it is about AI run amok.
Matt Ferrell: I know.
Sean Ferrell: So here we are in this terrible loop.
Matt Ferrell: I know.
Sean Ferrell: Then it's like this paragraph has been written by a committee, and that, quite literally, is what Wikipedia is. So.
Matt Ferrell: Yes. Then Kirk talks to the M5 and makes it understand that it was designed not to harm humans, a rule the M5 has broken. By attacking the USS Lexington and Excalibur, the M5 realizes that it is. Its understanding is still weak and destroys itself. Kirk, Spock, Uhura, Scotty and Chekov retake control of the ship and return safely to base. That was an adventure, Sean.
Sean Ferrell: Yes. It was, wasn't it? I'm glad we were all here to enjoy it with you. Episode number 24 of season two, as I mentioned before, directed by John Meredyth Lucas, story by Lawrence Wolfe, teleplay by DC Fontana and I really feel like. You can see, you can feel DC Fontana's presence because everybody, every line of dialogue in this one is good. Like this episode, just from a conversational dialogue and plotting perspective holds together so lovely. DC Fontana, the mother of Star Trek. Original air date March 8, 1968 and guest appearances include Barry Russo as Commodore Robert Wesley, William Marshall as Dr. Richard Daystrom, Sean Morgan as Ensign Harper, Frank Da Vinci as Brent, Eddie Paskey as Leslie, William Blackburn as Hadley, and Roger Holloway as Lemli. And just want to point out that two things. William Marshall as Dr. Richard Daystrom. We'll talk about this more, but Dr. Richard Daystrom. The Daystrom Institute continues to be an element in Star Trek that is referred to throughout all Star Trek. Here it is. The starting point is this episode, but every episode or every series at some point is mentioned. Well, according to the Daystrom Institute, blah, blah, blah, which I find fascinating because he has a mental breakdown here and is responsible for the death of hundreds of people in a poorly conceived use of an artificial intelligence that he designed. And yet somehow the Daystrom Institute is still viewed as this wonderful source of learning. And I'm just like, okay. And it's what I find fascinating about that is this is where it started. It's not like they made this episode later and people were like, wait a minute. Aren't they kind of retconning that he was a bad scientist and did this terrible thing? No, this is the story. And then future writers were like, you know what we should do? We should call it the Daystrom Institute. Yes. In honor of him. Exactly. Yes. Wouldn't that be great?
Matt Ferrell: Yeah, I think it really works.
Sean Ferrell: I find myself really on the fence about it. Also wanted to point out William Marshall. I love his performance in this episode. He is so good. It is this super. He's got this Shakespearean gravitas about his performance that really works for me. And I just wanted to share a little bit about him. William Horace Marshall. He was born in 1924. He was an American actor, director and opera singer. Listen to that voice. I don't think there's any surprise that the man could sing opera. He played the title role in the 1972 blaxploitation classic Blacula and its 1973 sequel, Scream Blackula Scream. He has appeared as the king of cartoons in the 1980s television show Pee Wee's Playhouse and he was Dr. Daystrom in Star Trek. He also had a role in Bonanza. He was 6 foot 5 and was known for his bass voice. I think, correct me if I'm wrong, if he had been born 20 years later, he would have had a career where he would have been a leading man in something. This guy just, he just reeks of talent and charisma and gravitas. And I just feel like the timing was just off for him career wise. For somebody who has this level of gravitas to end up being basically in blaxploitation films as one of the key roles that he's played, it's. There's always the positive, the negative. Blaxploitation films helped enter the conversation around black performers and stories and actors, but also they were exploitive. So it's a double edged sword. So I just wanted to point out how much I enjoyed his performance. Before we even get into the context of the show itself, and as always, we take a look at the world at the time of original broadcast. So here we are, March 8, 1968, five days after our mother's birthday. Yes, Matt, the song remains the same. It's Love is Blue by Paul Mouret. Take it away, Matt. Excuse me everybody, I have to wipe a tear. Because of Matthew's always stellar rendition.
And at the movies, people were still lining up for Guess who's Coming to Dinner. And on television we've been talking about since the beginning of the podcast, we were taking a look at what were some of the top rated shows on television. We were talking about what were some. When we moved into streaming versions of Star Trek, we talked about what streaming shows were popular at the time. But it occurred to me last week as I was putting together the show notes, we hadn't talked about the direct competition, not what's the best show that was on during the year that Star Trek season two was on, but what were the shows that were literally head to head against Star Trek and last year, last week we talked about the show Hondo, which was a very short lived show on NBC. It was canceled by the end of the year 1967. Well, what replaced it? That's right, Matt. Operation Entertainment. Do you remember that one?
Matt Ferrell: Nope.
Sean Ferrell: It premiered on ABC in replacement for Hondo on January 5, 1968. This is one of those TV shows. This is one of those pieces of entertainment that makes you think were people working behind the scenes to create a kind of propaganda. Or is it just somebody looking to take. Take an angle on something that other people hadn't taken? Like, this was a show produced by Chuck Barris. Best known probably for his being the host of the Gong Show. But he was. He had a bigger career than just the Gong Show. He was involved in a lot of things. He was also a songwriter. So, like, he was a very interesting figure. And I'll talk about that more in a minute. But the point of this show, Operation Entertainment. Was literally filming and broadcasting shows. That were being performed for military camps in different locations. So it was like variety shows, live variety shows. Think USO shows. So the show was produced and created by Chuck Barris. And it first aired January 5, 1968. Louis Armstrong was a performer on the pilot episode. Each week, the show was filmed at a different military base. And had different host. The show's regulars were Jim Lang, the Terry Gibbs Band. And, I kid you not, the Operation Entertainment Girls. So they would go to different military bases. They would do these variety shows that would be USO, USO style. And they would film it. And this is in 1968. And I just want to underline that for a moment. Because I'll get to the why. I want to underline that in a minute. But for people who don't know about Chuck Barris. He was kind of a wild card of a man. If you've ever seen clips of the old Gong Show. It was obvious things were being smoked and drunk in the background. Because the things that were coming out on camera were. Sometimes eyes weren't really open. It was. There were lots of things that half masked.
And lots of comments that just made people giggle. For reasons that were not readily obvious to the audience at home. But in 1984, Barris wrote an autobiography called Confessions of a Dangerous Mind. In which he claimed that he had worked for the CIA as an assassin. In the 60s and 70s. In Southeast Asia, Latin America, and the Middle East. And then. I don't know if you remember this, Matt. George Clooney made a movie. Do you remember that?
Matt Ferrell: I remember him making a movie.
Sean Ferrell: No, George Clooney made a movie about this book. He turned this book. And it stars Sam Rockwell as Barris being an assassin for the CIA. He did book tours, he did interviews. In which he claimed all this was genuine. And then it was about. I don't know, after the movie came out, it was like 2012, 2015. He was like, no, I never did that. That was all made up. So basically, he wrote a novel. Really interesting guy. Kind of a weirdo. Always kind of fun, but just really, really out there. Finally, what was in the news on the day of original broadcast? Well, we see, as we would expect in 1968, March of 1968, a lot of the same headlines that we've seen in the past, including reportage around Vietnam, criticism of the war, and here's why I wanted to highlight the taking a USO style tour to military bases and broadcasting it as entertainment into people's homes. When here on the front page of this New York Times, you get the Khesanh and Dienbienphu: a comparison. It is an article depicting the dangers of two different regions in the Vietnam War, including a photograph showing a helicopter with the caption beneath Marines take cover as a helicopter prepares to land at the Khesanh garrison. North Vietnamese gunners open fire whenever a planar helicopter approaches the US outpost. And immediately beneath that is a sub article, US dead in war at 542 for the week. There was an ongoing counter going on in which in one week the exact number that the US government was admitting were killed, reporting were killed was being put on the front page in the New York Times. And at the same time, Chuck Barris was putting a USO style tour into people's homes called Operation Entertainment. Yeah, a really strange bifurcation of popular culture. The dying on the one side and then the Operation Entertainment girls on the other side.
So again, strangely reminiscent of some of the bifurcation that's going on in our culture today.
Matt Ferrell: Yep.
Sean Ferrell: On now to our discussion of this episode. I don't remember which one of us launched into last week's episode. I think it was me. I guess it was me. So I'm going to invite you to start us off on this one. We have the introductory opening scene of what I like to think of as Star Trek's Mission Impossible Music at the beginning, it's that dun dun, dun dun dun, dun, dun dun dun dun dun dun. Like something is about to happen, Something critical is about to happen. And what is it? It's the Enterprise arriving at a starbase. Yeah, that music for this moment. Okay, whatever. They show up and they are told, okay, you're going to have to disembark 90% of your crew. You're going to leave a skeleton crew behind and you're going to do that because we have a special test coming up of an artificial intelligence. They don't really use the term artificial intelligence or AI. They just keep calling it M5. But what a weird episode. We talked last week about like, wow, the timeliness of this we're talking about, you know, this episode in which they discover a planet that is operating under a Nazi regime. And talking about it in a 2025 context. It's really kind of weird. And then I started watching this episode and I was like, wow, now we're going to be talking about AI and talking about it in a 2025 context. That's really kind of weird. Like, okay, this is why Star Trek continues to resonate. They talked about things that kind of matter, no matter when you watch it. So, Matt, jump off for us into your analysis and some plot summary of this one. How did you feel about it? How did you think it landed?
Matt Ferrell: This episode has problems for me. There's things that happen. You just set it up. Get to the starbase. We want you to get, like, 80% of your crew off the ship so that we can do this test. Why? Why? Everybody could have been in there. It didn't matter. You could have had the entire crew there. It didn't. It didn't make sense why they had to empty the ship out. So I was kind of like. But it's like, whatever. You're trying to do something for a plot purpose, whatever, just kind of roll with it. So there was weird stuff like that. But the thing that really resonated with me is what you just talked about, how, like, last week, it was like, holy cow, that. That plot just, like, feels like it was written for today. And this is the same thing. The entire thing about Kirk going, AI has taken my job.
Sean Ferrell: Yeah.
Matt Ferrell: The entire episode, I was like, good Lord. They were talking about something that is, like, happening right freaking now. Like, it's not science science fiction in the 60s, it's reality today. And we're struggling with this today. And it feels like this is a Black Mirror episode. Almost like, you know what I mean? It's like, it's. Yeah, what the hell? It's like D.C. fontana, man. Like, I'm putting her, like, more and more, I'm putting her up on a higher and higher pedestal. Like, anytime her name is in the credits, I lean forward.
Sean Ferrell: Right.
Matt Ferrell: Every time. And my first note in my notes, Sean, when I started watching this episode was DC Fontana, exclamation mark. That was the first thing I wrote. Like, all right, here we go. This should be fun. And it was. It was absolutely fun. You brought up how you enjoyed what was William Marshall's performance. I did not. I did not. He was great. Gravitas. Big guy, commanding presence, beginning. And then by the end, when he's completely lost his nut, he's great. And everything in the middle is like, why are you making these decisions in your acting performance? Makes no sense. Like, there was so much in the middle that was, like, dissonant scene to scene. And it felt like it wasn't his fault. It felt like it was the director's fault. So I'm not blaming him.
Sean Ferrell: Yeah.
Matt Ferrell: I'm blaming the director because holy crap, Sean. There's this one sequence that is horrifying. They're trying to shut the computer down, the M5 down. And Captain gives the order to go shut it down. And Scotty and his helper go walking over to the wall.
And Scotty goes, go for it. And the guy steps down and goes, tick. And a gigantic laser beam comes out the wall, and the guy vaporizes. And I was like, holy crap. And everybody in the room goes. And what he does is just goes like this weird. Like, I just watched a man vaporize in front of me. Now, yes. By the end of the episode, we know he's become disconnected and he's completely lost touch with reality.
Sean Ferrell: Yeah.
Matt Ferrell: But in that moment, even somebody with that thing happening to him would have been, whoa. You know what I mean? You would have been shocked. Maybe you don't have empathy for the guy that had died. Fine. But holy crap. Jeez.
Sean Ferrell: Ooh.
Matt Ferrell: Ah. There was nothing. And so it was moments like that that just made me not like his performance. And again, I don't think it was his fault. I think it was the directing in those scenes. Because the next scenes he's in, he had a reaction that I would have expected in the scene after that. It was a reaction I wouldn't have expected. It was like. It was very inconsistent in his transition. It was not very even. And that, to me, is not the actor's fault. That is the director not keeping the actor going through. It may have been the way or they filmed the scenes. You know what I mean? Like, they filmed it in different. You film things out of order. So maybe he was doing a type of performance in one situation.
Sean Ferrell: Or maybe they didn't get the right take and they used a different take that. Correct. Maybe they were just like, oh, we gotta use this other take. Because he wasn't looking the right direction on the previous one. So, like.
Matt Ferrell: Yeah, so because. Because of the inconsistency, the explanation as to why he's doing, his character's doing what he's doing, and the way he's reacting to the way he's, like, talking about the M5 and, like, why they're not. Why he. Why he seems to be dragging his feet to help.
Sean Ferrell: Yeah.
Matt Ferrell: And all that kind of stuff. It doesn't resonate with me. It's like it's. It was. Kept pulling me out of the moment, which kept knocking the episode back as far as how good I think it is. So as far as the plot and what the episode is saying, what D.C. fontana wrote, I think is spectacular. The execution is where I kind of did not enjoy it. Yeah, completely.
Sean Ferrell: I think you. And I see it in exactly the same way. But I embrace all of that for the campiness of it, because I'm seeing all the exact same things. And where you're like, that doesn't make sense. I found it to be deliciously goofy and leaned into it. So it was like the elements of, you got to get all the people off your ship. Well, of course they do. Instead of just telling people, all right, everybody, report to your stations, but don't touch anything. Monitor the situation and let us know if you see anything that's unexpected. Like, that would have been the approach that would make more sense and provide more like. Then imagine if you had the moment where you heard is like, sir, I have people reporting from all over the ship that they have received orders to go to their quarters. And it's M5 is beginning to shuttle people out of sections and turning off power. And it's like, this system is starting to endanger my crew. Like, what is happening here? Like, people have been ordered back to their quarters and the hallway. The hallway power has been turned off. Like, things like that could have been happening. That would have fit within, as you're pointing out, the logic of the situation more. But like, it's also.
Matt Ferrell: It's. But it's also the other captain of the Lexington. Like, there's. There was moments.
Sean Ferrell: I love how ridiculous the response from the commodore is. Yes.
Matt Ferrell: Well, when he. When he. There's a sequence where he was like, the Enterprise is completely like Kirk is. They're just flying blind. They can't talk to them or anything. And the captain's like. And the Enterprise keeps refusing to contact us. Yeah, permission to destroy them. And I'm like, what the hell? It's like, he probably would have been saying, the Enterprise. For some reason, the Enterprise is no longer responding. And we have concerns that they have may lost complete control of the ship. Do we have permission to destroy them if we need to? It's like, that would have kept it more in line with what actually ends up happening at the end. When that captain then uses his human intuition of, like, the shields are still down. I don't think that's a trap. I think it's Kirk trying to communicate with us. It's like it would have. It would have tied into it more neatly than what they did. So it's almost like that mustache twirling.
Sean Ferrell: Yeah.
Matt Ferrell: Boom, boom, boom.
Sean Ferrell: Well, he makes the great statement of, what the hell is Kirk doing?
Matt Ferrell: Yes. It's like you're testing the M5. Why was it Kirk's fault? I loved it.
Sean Ferrell: I loved it. It was like, all right, Jim, you're going to have to get 95% of your people off that ship. I don't want to do that. You're going to have to do it. Those year orders. We're testing out the M5. My regards to Captain Dunsel. Dunsel. Well, that's what we call a thing that's no longer serves any purpose. So Kirk is a Dunsel at this point. Hmm. Okay. What the hell is Kirk doing? Like, you literally, that's the entire point of what you're doing.
You set this all up, and now you're saying, like, what the heck is. Is Jim Kirk doing? And I'm thinking about all those people who are going online, going into Reddit forums, going online and saying, like, I am being told by my manager to teach this AI how to do my job, knowing that it's because they want to remove me from doing this job and seeing stories where people are saying, oh, our CEO of our small company fired our entire customer service team because they thought AI could do it perfectly and the AI cannot do it at all. And the CEO is now, like, what happened? Who did this? And I'm like, oh, so people do act like the Commodore. Like, we're going to put this AI in charge of the show. What is Jim Kirk doing? I loved it. It's ridiculous. And I think that what I like about this episode, and I give this episode very high marks. I do. I like it very much. I liked it as a kid, I like it as an adult. And I think the reason I give it such high marks is plot point wise. There are moments of ridiculousness, but the context of what the heart of the episode is actually asking is so timeless. And it's the questions between safety and willingness to accept a certain amount of risk and the human effort in a thing remaining human only as long as humans are involved. Daystrom has a great turn of saying, well, the point of this is humans shouldn't just be data collectors. We should be doing better things. And on the flip side of all of that is Kirk saying I wanted to be out here to do this thing. And it's that there is that tension. We're seeing it currently right now where people are saying, AI is going to take my job. And people who are developing AI seem to be largely saying, yeah, but it's only going to take the jobs nobody wants to do. And it's. The response is really.
Is that really what it's being used for? Is that really the potential of it? These are important questions and we're wrestling with them on a daily basis. And I found this episode so strangely perfect for the moment of just, yeah, like, why should humans be bothered to go out into space and explore when we can send a robot to go do it? Like, yeah, really, like, it's fascinating. Fascinating. Or as Fox said in this one, it is interesting.
Matt Ferrell: Interesting, yeah. The other thing that I thought was interesting, I don't know if this sparked in your mind. Did you watch this series Picard?
Sean Ferrell: I have not watched all of it, but I did watch the first couple seasons. Yes.
Matt Ferrell: Okay. Because the final season, season three, dealt with this. There's a movement to put a computer controlled AI system in charge of coordinating all the ships with Starfleet. That's part of the season. I won't say any more than that, but I thought it was weird when that popped in my head as I was watching this, I was like, okay, they did this in 1960s and hundreds of people end up dying because of this foolish thing. And you need humans, you need intuition. You can't take that. And then Picard, which is dealing with the same exact topic written obviously just a couple years ago, does it again. And I do not recall in that series them ever bringing this up. Like, didn't Daystrom try this back in Stardate, whatever? And it didn't work very well. That doesn't come up. And it's just like I just remembered that this is a trope. This is a idea that has been rehashed again on recent Star Trek. And I think this one does it better. I don't want to go into details why, but it's like, I think this does it better. This is more succinct. This is more to the point. And it does in one episode. It gets a really strong point across that several episodes of Picard did not do as well. So I thought that was fascinating.
Sean Ferrell: That is interesting.
Matt Ferrell: Interesting.
Sean Ferrell: As Spock would say, it's interesting. From this one. I just want to point out also this one, as I mentioned briefly, DC Fontana's script in this one. I love all the little conversations between all the different characters. Kirk having his, like, am I really just worried about my role? Is this just me being afraid? In his conversation with McCoy and McCoy defending, like, you wouldn't be human if you weren't having this kind of response. Like, that's the entire point, being human. All the little jibs and jabs that go between McCoy and Spock in this one where Spock, she writes, Spock in this one so perfectly because he presents, because of his Vulcan, this as if for 90% of the episode, he's like, yeah, a computer would be better. Until you get to that moment where he's talking to Kirk and it's just like, yo, clearly this is not a good idea. And I was like, what fantastic writing. Because it is logically consistent for him. It is not simply a switch from a character because the writers wanted there to be tension. His response to all this is he is neutral in assessing, can a computer do this? And then when it comes to voicing an opinion about, is it a good idea to do this, it's like, oh, absolutely not. You need a human in that chair. And he's effectively saying in that moment, because. And this is one of those moments where I'm like, I feel like Strange New Worlds has yet again done another great job.
I feel like the resonance of Spock, how flat he is presented in the original series, benefits from Strange New worlds, giving him a little more latitude with showing some more emotionality, because we're seeing a Spock at that stage, the earlier stage, who is testing the waters of, should I lean into my human background a little bit more? And he's trying to figure out whether that works for him or not at some point, and I'm hoping in a future season of Strange New Worlds, they do have a moment where Spock does more fully decide to say, like, I'm embracing the Vulcan ness. But in this moment, I felt like here was one of those little cracks where he's talking in abstract terms with Kirk, but he's also talking personally to Kirk. He is saying, you need to be in that chair. This is not about whether AI controlling a ship is a good idea or not. It is about, are you okay? And I believe that you belong in that chair more than any AI deserves to be in that command position. So I just wanted to say how much I enjoyed the dialogue and writing. It carries so much for me. And I also really enjoy Daystrom's breakdown when he is reassuring the M5 and he's just like, oh, great, I'm great. I love that he's lost it. He's just like, they talked about us behind our backs and they. They laughing at the boy genius. And you just as that's being. As that is being said, I'm like. And it's probably not true. Like, the performance does a great job of. He's just unhinged enough that you're like, okay, this may just be paranoia. That has never been true. People may not be talking about him in those ways at all. And the writing of that, again, she does such a good job in this episode with all these moments. So another element of this that I just wanted to point out was the current. I'm watching the updated special effects version. So it's the remastered version from a few years ago.
And there are probably people in our audience. There are people out there who are like, no, you should be a purist and you should watch the original broadcast version. But I really like what they've managed to do with this. The space battle sequences of this are top notch. They're gripping. The pursuit sequences where the Enterprise is coming back around to finish off other Federation ships, the destruction of the unmanned freighter, all of that's great. The one that really got me was the. As you brought it up, the engineering officer who gets fried at the station.
Matt Ferrell: It is shocking.
Sean Ferrell: It is so bam, he's just gone and it's whoa, whoa, whoa. Like, there's just a little wisp of smoke that goes up from. From where he was standing. And if I remember correctly, the original version was a lot more like he gets hit by a beam and then starts to brightly glow. And then it just fades and he's gone. But this is like somehow more tragic. And so I really. He vaporizes. He vaporizes.
Matt Ferrell: This one, he vaporizes. But it's done in. This is why I love this special effects version updated is they've done it in a way that still feels true to the 60s.
Sean Ferrell: Yeah.
Matt Ferrell: Even though it's using modern technology of the early 2000s. So it's like, it's. For me, it's a chef's kiss. It feels natural, what they did. It doesn't feel like Star wars where they put, you know, Han Solo walking on Jabba Hutt's tail sequence. Like, holy crap, that was bad. This is really well done. And that vapor, the way he vaporizes. I remember the original one like you just described. I think that's exactly what it is. It's like this one is more horrifying.
Sean Ferrell: Yeah.
Matt Ferrell: But it's not radically different, but it's just oh, man.
Sean Ferrell: Yeah, they did a good job of recapturing the spirit. Yeah. So, Matt, if there's anything else you wanted to mention, now's your shot. Because in a moment, we're going to close that door on you.
Matt Ferrell: That's right. Well, the only thing I want to say is I sound like I'm harsh on this episode. I like this one. I liked it as a kid. I liked watching it now. I was fully entertained. And goofiness aside, I think it's a really good story. It's worth and how prescient it is for even today, keep blowing my mind.
Sean Ferrell: So, listeners, viewers, where do you land on this one? Did you enjoy it the way we did? Its campiness and all, Just take it all in? Or was there something about this that just didn't land with you? And where do you land on the prescience of this, the AI ness of it? Do you think that this is a good parable for us to be paying attention to right now? Let us know in the comments. As always, the comments are a huge part of our discussion. And you're commenting, you're liking, you're subscribing, you're sharing with your friends. Those are all very easy ways for you to support the podcast. And if you'd like to support us directly, you can go to trekintime.show. Click the Become a Support button. Not only do you get to throw coins at our heads and help us make this show, but you will also be signed up for our spin off show, Out of Time, in which we talk about things that don't fit within the confines of this program, such as longer conversations around shows like Alien Earth or the Pit. We hope you'll be interested in checking that out. Next time will be two weeks from today. We will not be recording next week, so this coming episode will be Omega Glory. We hope you'll be jumping back into line with us two weeks from now to talk about Omega Glory. And as always, wrong answers only. Jump in the comments. Let us know what that one will be about. With a title like Omega Glory, it could be about anything. As always, we thank you for your time. We thank you for watching and listening and we'll talk to you next time.