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If you think outbound is dead, you’re either lying or you’re bad at it.
Quotas keep rising, your people are grinding, and the pipeline isn’t growing. It’s an equation that drives you mad. While everyone wants more opportunities, only a few know how to build an outbound culture that delivers.
I’m Todd Busler, former VP of Sales, now co-founder of Champify, and I’ve spent my career sharpening how to build a company pipeline that’s self-sufficient.
On this show, I’m talking to sales leaders who have cracked the outbound code. They’ve built an outbound culture beyond their SDRs and scaled repeatable systems that drive real pipeline without relying on hacks.
We’ll break down the winning plays, processes, and frameworks behind growing that outbound muscle to help you get results faster.
No fluff. No hacks. Real strategies from real people who have done it so you can stop guessing and start opening.
Sarah Kiley (00:00):
One of the biggest trends that we're seeing right now is really honing in on that ICP and focusing on segmenting across their customer base. And when they think about segmenting customer journey, that's oftentimes done for an efficiency play.
Todd Busler (00:21):
Everyone wants to build stronger pipeline, but only a few know how to make it happen. If you're listening to this show, you know outbound is not dead, you just need a little help building a system that actually works. Well, you're in the right place. I'm Todd Busler and on this show we're breaking down the plays, processes and frameworks behind Repeatable Pipeline growth straight from the people who've built it. Let's get into it. Hey everyone. Our guest today is Sarah Kiley. She spent a lot of time leading sales organization and nonprofit orgs selling to government and EdTech. She's recently taken over as the Chief Sales Officer at ChurnZero, and what I found really interesting in this episode is she talks about how she made the transition from a primarily inbound heavy sales org to building an outbound culture. She also has a unique vantage point into what's happening across the customer lifecycle with some of the fastest growing B2B companies using ChurnZero every single day. This is one you we're going to really enjoy. Give it a listen, give it a share, give it a comment. Let me know if you have any feedback. Enjoy. Sarah, how are we doing? I'm really pumped to be talking to you.
Sarah Kiley (01:33):
Good to see you. Thanks for having me today.
Todd Busler (01:37):
Yeah, let's dive right into it. Sarah, I've been following your journey about six months in at ChurnZero. I think your background's really fascinating and I'm excited for you to share some of your learnings, challenges, what you're seeing in the market. You've been in sales leadership for a while, explain the background and what I'd like to learn is kind of the logic behind making the move to the Chief Sales Officer at ChurnZero.
Sarah Kiley (01:59):
I feel like it was almost a kismet moment when I stumbled across the ChurnZero Chief Sales Officer opportunity in LinkedIn. I found it, they didn't find me and I couldn't apply fast enough and I'll tell you why. So I came up through sales. I started as a BDR at a big organization at Oracle across my sales career. I held individual contributor roles in a lot of markets. I sold federal government nonprofit B2B. Ultimately, I landed in the EdTech space and that's where I rose into leadership. And in that rise into leadership, I moved into a role called general manager, which basically had full customer lifecycle responsibility. And my CEO said to me, I want you to develop a center of excellence around this new trend called customer success. I said, interesting. We don't have a retention problem. We had best in class gross revenue retention.
(02:52):
But as I started to peel back the layers of the onion, I started to appreciate, oh, I really don't have an easy way to get a sense of the health of my customers. And a couple of people in the team that would go look in the back end of the product, look at our support ticketing queue, they would go around all of our different systems for our bigger customers and try to get a sense of what's really happening here? What can we expect in the QBR? They going to come happy. Are they going to come mad at us? What's the state of this partnership? And so as I was exploring what are best practices? What are we doing today to retain and grow our customers, what should we be doing as we create this center of excellence? I met ChurnZero at that time several years ago.
(03:36):
I was so impressed with the technology they had built to make it easy to get a health score on a customer to make it easy to create and drive plays based upon things that were happening within your customer base. Unfortunately at the time I walked away saying, oh my goodness, I'd love to turn that system on, but we are nowhere near ready because I don't even know how to make a health score. I don't know what data would go into that. And so I went away and I did a bunch of work in my Salesforce in Tableau and pulling things together. Fast forward to the next stop in my journey and I was at an organization, a software company that had ChurnZero deployed and wow the impact, it was really transformational in the way that they were able to drive efficiency and the way that they knew where to be when to be and how to show up for their customers in really meaningful ways.
(04:31):
And so as I was looking for my next opportunity, that's where I saw the ChurnZero opportunity pop up just in LinkedIn and I thought, wow, I've lived the challenges of the buyers that ChurnZero is dealing with and wouldn't it be a really special opportunity for me to be able to share firsthand what businesses face the challenges they face and the impact that I've seen that a platform like ChurnZero can drive as far as helping to turn your numbers to best in class from a retention and a growth perspective. So I pinch myself, I know it sounds cheesy, but I pinch myself because it's such an incredible opportunity for me to now lead the sales organization that's interacting with my peers on a daily basis and having these conversations and the vast majority of people that we're talking with are not at a dissimilar stage that I've been. And so we can have some really meaningful conversations and really connect with them in a pretty unique way.
Todd Busler (05:30):
It's such an awesome story being able to say, look, I evaluated this, I use this. Right, I've seen it firsthand. It's a compelling story for sure. Sarah, you mentioned experience selling to nonprofits, to selling to government. I know you spent some time selling to education, it ChurnZero is very B2B focused, a lot of high growth companies. What's been the biggest challenge transitioning back to the pure B2B, what skills have transferred over very easily or what has been different for you?
Sarah Kiley (05:59):
I think this is, we're leaning on the core fundamentals of what excellence in sales looks like has really driven an impact for me in stepping into this role. So the fundamentals of connecting pain to value do not change from one market to the next. It's the nuance of the market. And so again, studying our ICP to know who are we best serving in the market when we get into those organizations, who's a part of our buying group, what are the typical pain points that we see that our customers have that we're able to effectively solve for, and what's the value that we drive when we do that really well? Great, so take that, study that and then deploy that across your core sales best practices and fundamentals. And on the other side of the buying cycle, let's learn what are the nuances to procurement in a small business versus an enterprise level organization?
(06:56):
And there are nuances in that across different size. B2B companies just as well as there are nuances in procurement in the federal government space, the state and local space, K-12. So it really certainly was a little intimidating to think about shifting markets, but really leaning into the fundamentals of what are we here to do? We're here to find people that are experiencing the pain points that our customers also experience, help them to understand if the value that we drive is something that would be impactful to them, and if we keep that at the core of what we're doing, the rest should fall into place. So it's been a pretty easy transition into this space.
Todd Busler (07:35):
Especially coming with the background again as the evaluator and the user and like, look, you live and breathe this stuff regardless of any subscription oriented business you're in or really any customer oriented business. One thing that's really interesting to me, Sarah, is when new leaders step into roles and churn, zero is a somewhat mature company already right now you're six months in past the okay, find all of the cobwebs and booby traps and see what's happening. What did you walk into and what were the top two to three changes you prioritized and how did you approach that?
Sarah Kiley (08:09):
I think that's a really wonderful question and something that I'm sure most people in my shoes are also trying to be incredibly thoughtful about because you're right, I stepped into a pretty mature organization that was having some pretty incredible growth and great growth trajectory. And so not to say that there aren't problems that we were trying to solve, but I think one of the most important things for me in coming into the organization was to be a really incredible listener to try to understand across my sales organization and then cross-functionally how we interact with other departments. What's going well, what's not going well, and how has the organization thought about the things that they'd like me to prioritize as far as accelerating the momentum and growth of the sales team? So said really specifically, we need to turn our account executive team, our sales team in particular from a team that historically has been largely an inbound team to an outbound team, a team that is consistently running an outbound play generating pipeline and progressing that pipeline.
(09:19):
And that was not a muscle that had been built and developed over the years, thank you to marketing for being able to generate so many incredible leads for a number of years, but we now need to make that pivot. And so that is one of the top priorities that we have. I think a fast follow to that was making sure that every rep knows what the right process is to win and how do we make sure that we are really clear in outlining the playbooks and the processes for them to follow clarity in that sales process, best practices, not that the team hasn't been successful, but we have a lot of formal process on the customer side of our business. We don't have as many formal playbooks and processes put into place. And so that was one of the other top two priorities.
Todd Busler (10:10):
I want to dig into this a little bit because a lot of orgs hit this point where, hey, they catch some product a fit, they have happy customers, marketing is driving some inbound. You have reps that are typically really skilled at win rate, right? Taking leads and going convert them to customers. Tactically, how did you approach that, right, because to do that, well, it's part operational tooling systems, it's part do we have the right talent? It's part cultural of like, Hey, the mindset and DNA of this organization's changing, what were the order of operations or how did you even go about, it's a big hairy problem or a big hairy challenge?
Sarah Kiley (10:47):
No, it is a big challenge and I wanted to make sure that I was minimally disruptive to the progress and the momentum that was going on while I was assessing how are we going to tackle this and we did. It is a people, a process and a technology play in getting this right and technology doesn't fix a broken process if you just get the next shiny tool out there to drive the right sequences and automation. If you don't have the right process going into that, you're not going to be effective. And so one of the things that I needed to study was what were we currently doing? So we were doing some outbounding from our sales team. We were not very effective in doing that. And so working with my leadership team to dig in to understand if we set the right expectation and we get the reps to own and understand why it's important to prospect, which is a whole other thing we could talk about, what kind of processes are we asking them to follow when they do prospecting?
(11:54):
And that was pretty broken in the organization. And so we had technology laying on top of a process that was largely running one play out to the market, and so we were not driving the impact that we needed. We were asking reps and holding them highly accountable to a set of metrics. We were asking them with those metrics to run a process that was pretty broken. And then we had a tool for them which appeared to not be delivering results because the process we fed into that tool wasn't working. And so we also have an SDR organization as a part of our sales team, and we have a newer leader in our SDR team and we were seeing some increased momentum from our SDR organization. And so I went and dug in with the SDR team to understand what are they doing, what's working for them, and where can we take some best practices that are happening in prospecting today and deploy them more broadly across the team.
(12:56):
There was also a bit of a disconnect between sales and marketing. I'm sure you've never heard that. And so we needed to figure out how we were going to collaborate together as we're both out in the market and what's the right approach to that. And so that was how do we tackle how the organization is presenting itself in the market, how we're prospecting, what those plays and processes are. But I think also in prospecting, you never want to land in one place because you always need to be listening and iterating and pivoting and figuring out what the right hyper-personalized approach is to meet people at the right time, in the right way so that if they are facing one of the problems that you solve, hopefully you're top of mind for them.
Todd Busler (13:42):
Have you had to make big adjustments to compensation to drive the right behaviors? And secondly, you mentioned changing the culture of like, Hey, ownership around pipe gen. Is there a specific percentage of a source pipeline for a business of your scale or that you're driving the organization too? I'm curious, and if so, how you kind landed on that?
Sarah Kiley (14:03):
We have a really incredible marketing engine and our marketing engine drives between 60 and 70% of what we need from a pipe perspective, and so we need to make up 30 to 40% of that across our sales organization. I'm a big believer in call it sales, math, call it whatever you want, but sales math in a way where I like the individual contributors to build their own math based upon the quotas that we've designed. So at a macro level, we create our financial plan. Our financial plan informs where we land from a quota perspective. Knowing I think it's always important as a leader to understand how you landed on those quotas, how informed those are based upon what we see in the market based upon what we see historically. And then I think tying the focus of attaining the quota to some personal goals at the individual contributor level has proven really successful for me throughout the years.
(15:00):
And so getting people to be a little bit vulnerable and divulge, is it that big vacation? Are they trying to buy a new washer and dryer? Are they saving for a down payment on a house? What is the thing that you're driving towards personally as you think about your earning potential and as you think about hitting that quota, and then how do we back ourselves into what we need to be doing on a daily and weekly basis to hit the right milestones to achieve those goals? And so it's less about being dictorial and saying, oh, it's 50 calls. Is it 50 calls? Let's go figure out if it's 50 calls. How much pipeline do you need to build? We have folks working in very different markets with small businesses, with enterprise businesses, different deal sizes, different win rates, and so helping them to have visibility into the math that we know what our average deal size is, we know what our win rate historically has been.
(15:59):
We know what our sales cycle is and we're not there yet at ChurnZero, but in the past I've been able to use a sales velocity metric to help reps to understand what is the right lever to pull against? What am I working on from a skills perspective? Am I trying to move my deals faster? Am I trying to swim upstream so that I can more likely than not meet and exceed the goals that have been set for me? And so that's where I've created a really simple worksheet that people can use to start to document goals and work on that math.
Todd Busler (16:37):
Hey, listeners, interrupting the podcast for a quick 20 seconds for a Champify plug. If you've been getting value from our content via webinars, podcasts, stuff I write on LinkedIn, I hope you understand that we think about and take pipeline generation very seriously. If you're listening to this podcast and you do care about figuring out outbound, figuring out how to be more creative to prospect into your top accounts and win more revenue, at Champify, what we do is turn your entire company's existing relationships into new revenue. Champify's AI finds your highest converting revenue opportunities from former customers at new companies to previously lost deals ready for a re-engagement and turns them into repeatable pipeline engine at scale, all within your existing workflows and low learning curve, which means high adoption. We're generating 20% of pipeline for companies like S and P Global and working with some of the largest, fastest growing B2B orgs in the world. If you're interested in what we do, we have a compelling offer for people that are listening to this podcast. We'll go through a data test, we'll go through a closed lost audit and we'll show you the potential pipeline opportunities you have within your existing systems. Email sales@champify.io and mention this podcast and we'll present you with a compelling offer. Enjoy the rest of the show.
(17:53):
Yeah, I think I call it a recipe card. Love it. The sales match, right? You want to enable the rep to be able to say, Hey, here's a handful of different paths of levers you can pull. I'm telling you the facts and what you need to do to act on that. I'm always blown away by organizations that don't have that built out because I think it's really hard to look your team and eye and say, here's what we need to do without being to explain some of the numbers behind it.
Sarah Kiley (18:18):
Yes.
Todd Busler (18:20):
One thing that's really top of mind for me lately, especially as I talked to tons of VPs and CROs, I mean this is adding on all the AI and learning we're all doing together and collectively, but how a lot of the things you just mentioned, right? You talked about talent, you talked about compensation, you talked about different sales metrics, talked about tooling process. How do you go and make some of these large changes without overcomplicating things or shocking the system with too much change at once? How do you approach that delicate balance?
Sarah Kiley (18:53):
Yeah, that's something that I think about every day being new in the organization is again, I don't want to disrupt the momentum that we have. I want to be really mindful of the culture that's been created in the organization that people know and love at the same time as coming in to do the job that I was hired to do. And so one of the things that I found to be successful at ChurnZero and successful in the past is certainly getting buy-in at the right level. Sometimes that's just a frontline sales manager level. Oftentimes that's down into the individual contributor level on the changes that we're going to make. The reason for those changes and the impact many people are really focused on, again, their ability to hit those personal goals that they have and how is change going to impact either accelerate or decelerate my ability to hit those goals. That's another reason why I like to do that exercise is because we can directly relate the things that we're doing back to the individual's ability to meet and exceed the goals. I also did a listening tour when I first got to this organization, I did it in my last company as well, and I asked three questions of everybody. I met with everybody in my team and said, what's going well? What's not going well and what are you hoping I'm going to do now that I'm here?
Todd Busler (20:14):
What was surprising in that?
Sarah Kiley (20:17):
What's surprising in that oftentimes for me is little bits of culture that pop up things that are really special to people that they love about the way that we interact with each other on a day-to-day basis. Also surprising in that can be maybe the quick wins or the things that people are incredibly frustrated about that maybe they've never voiced. It's not for lack of the organization being able to help to solve for that, but it's a new person, a little bit of an unknown entity, so you feel maybe sometimes a little bit safe saying, oh, you're new here. Okay, I'll tell you this thing, right, this little thing that's been challenging or bothering me. And so trying to listen to what we were hearing to then also inform the changes that we're going to be making. And so when I stepped into the organization, we had two sales teams.
(21:08):
Each of those sales teams had SMB, mid-market and enterprise reps in them. I mentioned before, we didn't have a lot of documented plays and things we were running. We didn't also have a lot of specific coaching by those individual markets. Really hard to spread yourself from an enterprise conversation to an SMB conversation. And so we had some things happen in the organization and it was a time where I said, oh, here's the opportunity. We are going to divide our sales team by market and we are going to start to create and be really thoughtful about how we serve each of those markets. And that connects really nicely with the work that marketing is doing and with the work that our friends on the customer success side of the business are doing. And so that's one of those changes that definitely some of what I heard and that listening tour is going to be solved for, and now having a really market specific focus in these teams, and I think it's just going to help us to solve for overall our growth trajectory targets as well. And so challenging to come into an organization, challenging to know in your interview process, here's the things you need to fix and solve for, and then the way in which you execute that is really critical so that you're earning trust and credibility while you're doing that instead of burning that trust. Yeah.
Todd Busler (22:38):
It's amazing. I had the head of enablement from Brex on and he talked about it seems so simple, but doing that listening tour when you're new, there's often little things that you can do to earn the trust of the team to unblock major friction points, to just address things that are like, wait, why do we do it this way? And a lot of that are simple changes that end up being super impactful, but with tenured leaders, there's things that kind of just keep getting pushed to the side.
Sarah Kiley (23:05):
Yes, I think that holds true and giving people more of a voice and more of an ability to share what they think is going particularly well and what they'd like to see more of also gives an opportunity to focus where you're spending your time and energy and how can you drive impact and how can you make sure that you have the right level of visibility into the overall strategy of the business and how each individual is impacting that, I think is also pretty important.
Todd Busler (23:36):
That makes sense. I saw a post, yeah, Sarah, about 300% pipeline growth. You talked about some of that went into it, right? But what part of the playbook or the changes that you brought in had the biggest impact there? Was it as simple as, Hey, we weren't doing a lot of prospecting activity and now we've turned that up, or did you find some kind of early fire and you were able to put the gas on?
Sarah Kiley (23:58):
That was a really special thing that we did at my last company and was really exciting growth. One of the keys to the success that we had, there was something that I mentioned briefly, but we were very iterative. And so when we thought about outbounding and we were building more in a bigger outbound team, we didn't focus on a breadth and depth of running every possible play that we could. We were AB testing and tried a few things, and when we saw success, we doubled down where we saw a lack of success. We were pivoting. And I think one of the keys to where we saw success was we were leaning into our customer base, I think more than we ever had before. We had uncovered in my listening tour, and not only internally, but I also do an externally listening tour with a set of customers uncovering some really special value that we were bringing to these customers.
(25:02):
And so connecting what I'm hearing in this listening tour, what's oftentimes maybe slightly missed in a case study or something that anecdotal feedback that you can connect while this is real value that we're bringing, how do we leverage the network of customers that we have today to get the birds of a feather that like to flock together in their particular area in the market, whether that's geography, whether that's size of organization to accelerate our momentum in those areas. And that's where we saw a lot of success where we said, sure, you could listen to us, but why not listen to your peers that you look to for other things anyways and let us help tell the story of your peers and see if that can resonate and see if that drives additional interest. And that was incredibly successful for us in building that momentum. And the other part of it was we figured out and we did our homework, we created our recipe to what you had said,
(26:12):
And we continued to raise the bar. We didn't rest when we met goals. We said, oh, that's exciting. We were able to meet that goal. How far do we think we could stretch? What other area do we think we could tap into at that organization? We ran a lot of events. We ran a lot of events, but had very little pipeline attribution. And so that was another area where we said, Ooh, there's a real opportunity here. Let's reimagine how we think about events. And I would say that was almost a 180 in the event bucket, the impact that we were able to drive there. And so we had these little pockets focus areas that really helped us to accelerate the momentum.
Todd Busler (26:56):
Awesome transition. Sarah, you mentioned kind of birds to the feather, which a combination of kind of customer marketing referrals playing in specific geos or territories or submarkets. A common trend I'm hearing now from a lot of, well, I think are some of the best sales leaders out there, is that pipeline is becoming a lot more of a team sport, right? It used to be, Hey, marketing on your island, people doing prospecting now, not only marketing, field marketing, SDRs, overlays, whatever that may be, but also the role CS teams and account management teams are playing in pipeline development and their pipeline generation. What are you seeing in terms of some of the best ChurnZero customers that are very pipeline obsessed organizations? What role does some of these post-sale team play in this motion? I think you have such an interesting, a vantage point seeing all their customers.
Sarah Kiley (27:44):
I love that question. I just had a conversation with one of our enterprise customers here at ChurnZero about this exact topic, and he said, Sarah, when I talk about the impact that ChurnZero has in the organization, I don't really talk about the impact in the lens of customer success. I talk about the impact in the lens of the financials that we drive for the financial organization. But he said one of the single best things that we do with the ChurnZero platform is through our marketing organization. We have no other tool that will give us the level of granularity and insight to segment down to a very specific set of customers and target them with a very specific message. And so we can get very granular in knowing what buttons they push in our platform, what run rate they have, depending upon the different type of tool that you have, what birds of a feather group are they in and what do we have that maybe they're not aware of and they don't know about that could really drive an impact in this thing that they do pretty frequently in our platform.
(28:49):
And he said, this is the number one most valuable resource for our marketing organization is the ability to drive very targeted to the theme of hyper-personalized campaigns. There's such an opportunity as you think about segmenting your customer base, focusing on that ICP and looking to drive growth opportunities within that ICP. As you continue to develop and add products and services into your suite, knowing exactly the profile of the customer, the nature of the customer, the state of that customer, and being able to drive the right message based upon those things has been incredibly impactful in driving growth and driving net revenue retention. So that's really what we see from a best practices standpoint is look, we have tools that integrate into products so that you can surface messaging as someone is live in your tool. I think that's pretty standard and a lot of folks are doing that.
(29:51):
But then the ability to say, oh, I know all of these things about my customers now I know their health, I know how they're utilizing. I know what they're asking about. I know what's top of mind for them. I know what our shared success goals are based upon all of those things. I can truly meet that customer where they are. They feel like they really know them. I know what their business is facing. I know what they're trying to solve for. I know what their board cares about. And to drive into that message and say, I know these are your priorities, we also can help you in this area, has been incredibly impactful. And so that's really one of the things that we're seeing that is really helping to drive revenue for organizations.
Todd Busler (30:39):
Do you see a lot of your customers, because I'm sure we talked a little bit about this before we hit record, the chief customer officer typically being a heavy buyer of ChurnZero, but now CRO is getting more and more interested because the customer journey matters more. A lot of people are running into some renewal pressure that retention's become challenging in a lot of organizations. Do you see a lot of your customers have pipeline targets for some of those post-sale organizations? Is that common? I'm curious what you're seeing there.
Sarah Kiley (31:08):
It is common and the compensation models that exist on that side of the business vary. And who owns responsibility across a CSM? An account manager? An AE varies across our customer base, but we 100% are seeing overall revenue goals and then within the team pipeline goals associated with driving additional revenue out of that customer base. And I think as more we are talking to more and more CROs who came up through sales who are focused on hitting revenue growth targets that have been identified from their board and looking at where can I drive that revenue? New logos is what they've came up knowing. And so understanding the potential to drive out of the customer base I think is really a new avenue for many of these leaders and saying, oh, that's an untapped potential where we enter slightly different than we do at a new logo. We can enter super hyper-personalized based upon what we know about them. And so the potential there and the ability to assign a set of your revenue target into the customer base is definitely more and more common.
Todd Busler (32:25):
Makes a ton of sense. Sarah, last question I have for you. Again, I think your vantage point into tons of B2B companies right now is fascinating to me. What are other themes or maybe non-obvious things you're across your customer base in terms of what's happening in the renewal landscape, expansion, churn, anything really jump out to you? In terms of things that have been surprising?
Sarah Kiley (32:51):
One of the biggest trends that we're seeing right now, which I bet a lot of people that are listening are also focused on this in their business, is really honing in on that ICP and focusing on segmenting across their customer base. And when they think about segmenting, when you think about your customer journey, that's oftentimes done for an efficiency play. So we're not going to assign a dedicated customer success or account manager to every customer. We want to drive some more efficiency in our smaller customer base, higher touch in our bigger customer base, and then how do we then evaluate and assess what our retention goals are, what our growth goals are, what our pipeline goals can be associated with that. I was surprised to see on this side of ChurnZero that most of the organizations that we talk to have never invested in a platform like ChurnZero before.
(33:49):
Most organizations are running their customer growth and retention strategies out of their CRM and cobbling together different solutions like I did before. But I guess my perspective in coming into the role was, well, most people have probably adopted a solution like this by now. But in fact, no, there are people still living in spreadsheets and Tableau and really doing a lot of pretty manual work. And so seeing the impact and now having this cohort of the market and these birds of a feather drive impact through using a platform like ChurnZero or one of the others in the marketplace is really exciting and really powerful. When you think about what you can do, when you can segment your customers, how you can be intentional about resourcing that core of your ICP and making sure that you are spending the right amount of resources to grow and retain them is something that I'm hearing at conferences, at dinners, after conferences. It is really a big focus area for people getting that ICP and segmentation, right, and making sure that they're meeting people on the right way at the right time and leaning into efficiencies where they can find those.
Todd Busler (35:07):
That makes sense. And this is awesome. I appreciate you sharing. I think there's a lot to learn from this just in terms of what parts of your experience translate over how you approach some of the problems from first principles, how you're really focused on what changes you can make and how quick do you approach them. And a lot coming back are like, look, different markets, sales is kind of fundamental. People have pain, you have value. The better you can connect the two and be top of mind when it matters, good things will happen. So I'm rooting for you as ChurnZero is on their pipeline journey and heavier outbound motion, and I appreciate you sharing some of the insights with the audience.
Sarah Kiley (35:42):
Thanks so much. I appreciate the time today. It was good to talk to you.
Todd Busler (35:45):
Take care, Sarah. Likewise.
Sarah Kiley (35:45):
Okay, take care.
Todd Busler (35:49):
Thanks for listening to Cracking Outbound. If this was helpful, let us know by messaging me, Todd Busler, on LinkedIn and share this episode with a friend that you think will be interested. If you want more resources about building and scaling all things outbound, you can sign up for our newsletter at champify.io/blog.